#Pathfinder

1 messages · Page 58 of 1

sinful gyro
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Which just feels bad

limber comet
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As one of the players, I had a good time

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Aim felt a lil underwhelming, especially when up against precision immune enemies

sinful gyro
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I think the main thing with aim is that it's not a check to do

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So it's a very free thing to do, and as you level more stuff builds off it

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But because it's a free thing to do, they don't want it doing too much

warped orbit
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Especially since basically all the Operative metastrikes Aim for free

trail nova
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That's for Infinite, the CUP to FCP was effective immediately.

warped orbit
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And they have some pretty good feats

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There's IIRC one that just unconditionally inflicts Slowed 1?

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If you hit, naturally

sinful gyro
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Well the condition is you have to be unnoticed or they have to be friendly to you

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But sure

warped orbit
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Not the stealth subclass one

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That one I have very little faith for

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I meant a feat later

sinful gyro
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Oh my bad

warped orbit
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They also have a pretty interesting feat that lets them turn hits into crits against prone enemies

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Could be huge with ally support

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Operative overall seems really strong

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Especially with Hair Trigger existing as it does currently

trail nova
warped orbit
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They also basically get Flurry edge at higher level for some reason?

trail nova
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1e ability

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It was "theoretically best DPR in the game, very rarely actually functional"

limber comet
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Sniper ignoring volley is quite decent

rustic cape
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Played a soldier in Rance's game, enjoyed it a lot

sinful gyro
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Soldier does seem solid from level 1

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As does op

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Healing from mystic seemed real good

warped orbit
rustic cape
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Your turn has a pretty clear action loop at first level, but it's a good loop and I suspect it will expand with leveling

warped orbit
rustic cape
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And you have very good odds of accomplishing something

warped orbit
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it's less bursty than Healing Font, but practically so much more available

rustic cape
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Soldier's gonna be real fun for dealing with hordes, I think

warped orbit
rotund geode
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What weapon did you use for your Solider?

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My ideal Soldier weapon is the evil violen

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Because I’m dramatic and edgy

sinful gyro
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classic machine gun I think?

rustic cape
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Action hero w/machine gun

rotund geode
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Epic

rustic cape
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I do think the various fighting styles will also feel noticeably different

sinful gyro
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Yeah, the melee and armor ones seem like different playstyles for sure

rustic cape
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"I need to position intelligently for my cone to do what I want it to do, but I'm probably better w/primary target" also seems different from the "I can fire bombs willy-nilly" style

warped orbit
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Bombard seems very good to me yeah

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mainly because they apply Suppressed on a successful save too

rustic cape
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Bombard is gonna play nicest with the widest variety of parties

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Action hero is, perhaps ironically, I think gonna be the thinking man's soldier (this is not self-praise, I discovered it along the way)

warped orbit
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Auto fire seems a little harder than area I think, yeah
to aim

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especially since Action Hero makes your cones huge

rustic cape
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The combat also feels meaningfully different than PF

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I'm not sure I can explain it

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It's a different mouthfeel

sinful gyro
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This will help auto fire a lot to I think

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warped orbit
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side note, this feat seemed kinda insane to me at first glance

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rustic cape
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Oh my

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That is nice

warped orbit
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-20 ft speed is brutal, especially when combined with difficult terrain
which you also have some ways to make

sinful gyro
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Shot on the run basically says "oh yeah if you had trouble positioing your area fire, take a free stride"

rustic cape
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Yeah

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I have to read the further soldier feats but my impression is that they wind up having a pretty strong and varied toolkit

sinful gyro
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Ye

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Lot of CC and options for a demoralize build to

warped orbit
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they have a lot of "auto/area fire with upside" metastrikes

sinful gyro
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And movement options for you and allies

rustic cape
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Almost ... caster-style martials?

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If that makes sense

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Like they're martials but the things they do are somewhat caster-y

sinful gyro
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I dunno if I'd call them a caster, but their weapon stuff cares a lot about battlefieldcontrol

warped orbit
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Armor Storm also has some interesting resistance based tanking possilities

rotund geode
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Its kinda important when Starfinder has 2 casters

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To have a lot more castery stuff in martials

rustic cape
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It also plays to the strengths of the particular fiction

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It's hard to justify a martial controller/defender in fantasy

warped orbit
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I do definitely wanna see how Soldier handles in a fight with a lot of weaker enemies

sinful gyro
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I do love how armor storm can just like

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Walk into the middle or a room

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Point RPG at their feet

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Fire

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And it just works

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Or you can walk up to someone, grab them and fire an explosive at point blank range

warped orbit
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yeah it's hilarious

sinful gyro
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Mixing it with disarm, grapple, shove trip etc is a genius move

warped orbit
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Soldier also has an interesting capstone at 20
they can take any two 2a metastrikes, and smush them together

sinful gyro
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Ye

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That's neat

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But I do wonder

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Do the two capstones sorta do the same thing?

warped orbit
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ish

sinful gyro
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Option 1: Take 2 actions to do two Area Fire effect attacks.
Option 2: Take 1 action to do 1 area fire effect attack, then take 1 action to do 1 area fire effect attack

warped orbit
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since Living Typhoon only reduces the base Area/Auto Fire in cost

sinful gyro
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Option 2 gives you the flexibility to do 1 action area fire, then a 2 action or 2 more 1 actions

warped orbit
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Living Typhoon gives you overall action flexibility
Hybrid Technique lets you stack more effects

sinful gyro
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Option 1 seems better if you're always gonna do 2 area attacks with option 2

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Cos less ammo expended etc

warped orbit
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speaking of their metastrikes, this one also seems pretty good
you can just absolutely cover the map in difficult terrain

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sinful gyro
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Bro you ripped up my pdf

warped orbit
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team up with a Witchwarper buddy and no one is moving anywhere

sinful gyro
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Combo it with this

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warped orbit
sinful gyro
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I think Terror-forming is forced to resolve first

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But still

warped orbit
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Hybrid Technique to combine this one and Terror-forming

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sinful gyro
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Ye was just gonna post that

warped orbit
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speaking of, Witchwarper also seems pretty good

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four slot caster, decent focus spells as far as I could see
and the Quantum Field gives them some good 1a stuff to do as well

rustic cape
sinful gyro
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I still gotta read into them

rustic cape
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Expend 2 per target

sinful gyro
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Yeah that's the big balance factor

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Moment you left that place though, you could of gotten like 500 rounds of ammo no sweat

rustic cape
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1-action reload is gonna be the best choice for a lot of action hero soldiers

sinful gyro
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So the reloading becomes the tax

rustic cape
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Well, it's not running out, yeah, it's the action cost

sinful gyro
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And compared to Op, you don't get free reloads I think

rustic cape
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I took a feat that reduces 2-action reloads to 1-action

sinful gyro
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That helps for sure

rustic cape
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And it is good that I took it

warped orbit
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that feat seems very essential

rustic cape
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I think for action heroes it will be

warped orbit
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since from what i saw the majority of eligible weapons for Soldier have Reload 2

rustic cape
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I'm less certain about area fire specialists

turbid dagger
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I've not dug around too much- theres a way to speed up reloads, but is there like
An upgrade that lets you increase ammo capacity

rustic cape
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It is kinda interesting because it sorta gates those weapons to soldier

warped orbit
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unclear

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in some of the earlier field tests, ammo and expenditure went up by tiers

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but that doesn't seem to be the case anymore

rustic cape
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Like you can technically use a machine gun as another class, but at least at level 1, you probably shouldn't

warped orbit
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there is also this feat helping Auto Fire out

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turbid dagger
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That is very nice, yeah

rustic cape
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That's good, yeah

turbid dagger
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Cuz the magnetar rifle appeals to me but lord is its magazine teeny tiny
If you want to autofire and also primary target shoot somebody, you can only target 2 people per autofire
Cuz its magazine is 6 and targeting 3 people would instantly deplete it

rustic cape
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I think there's also a level 1 feat that lets you switch weapons as a reaction

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So you could just fire and forget

warped orbit
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when someone moves into melee with you, yeah

rustic cape
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Ohhhhh okay

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Did not remember it right

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I do kinda have questions about melee soldier

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I'm not sure about it

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But yeah, my experience was good

sinful gyro
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I'd really like to see a melee soldier

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If /when I run again I may put in some mandatory class choices

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So i can see them all in action

warped orbit
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for me personally, I'd probably go Bombard with a Stellar Cannon if I played a Soldier

sinful gyro
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Worth remembering you can convert grenades into 1/day items for cheap

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So there could be some fun grenadier builds

warped orbit
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oh Machine Gun has 20 ammo, that's very nice

sinful gyro
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And yeah weapon mods are a whole thing I haven't looked at yet

warped orbit
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think that probably makes it the pick for anything Auto Fire based

warped orbit
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a few are different though I think

sinful gyro
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I'd imagine more would interact with ammo and magazine size and such

limber comet
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I mean honestly them being runes but scifi is...fine? Overall? I'm more interested in how the upgrade system works, like taking one weapon through an entire adventure path or smthn

vast burrow
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They removed Social Purview from Vigilante????

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Oh what the hell man

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Wait, nevermind, it's been turned into a Skill Feat instead

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False alarm

warped orbit
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okay looking through the upgrades in the playtest, there's nothing that interacts with ammo

sinful gyro
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Shame

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Maybe more in the tech book

warped orbit
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always the possibility for something later, yeah

limber comet
trail nova
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Dual Class Operative/Action Hero Soldier seems very funny in a very strong way.

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But also quite fun. You just get to run around with a machine gun, your operative subclass of choice, and have fun.

trail nova
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Hmm. Reading Operative, it feels like Aim is both an action tax, and not that critical. On the one hand, you need to do it each round to get the bonus damage. On the other, you've got the best proficency track avalible, and can probably just coast by with critical hits.

warped orbit
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ehh, it's kind of a tax, but it also is just more or less free damage

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like, if Rogues had an action that said "1a, you get Sneak Attack against this enemy for the rest of the turn" ranged builds would get a lot of use out of that

silver geyser
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With the prevalence of guns, the 3rd-action problem might be a bit more of a thing.

warped orbit
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also almost all the 2a Operative metastrikes include a free Aim

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there's also one that's Stride and Aim IIRC

trail nova
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Yeah, Mobile Aim. Seems good. I also like Peek, though I have no idea how good it will actually be.

warped orbit
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I think cover will be a much more common factor

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so it could be pretty good

turbid dagger
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Mobile aim seems nice but also
When ALL the operator attacks have aim for free in them I worry it wont get much use

warped orbit
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I think it might be more useful for Striker

sinful gyro
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I don't think you need to aim all the time especially at low levels

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But its a good free 3rd action and at higher level it starts to interact and do a lot more

warped orbit
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until like 5th level, you probably don't care too much about an extra d4

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but by then you should have tools to make it easier anyway

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it does also reduce cover bonus, by quite a lot later

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at high level you can basically shoot into Greater Cover unimpeded if you Aim

turbid dagger
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At level 4 you get to upgrade it to d6, and you've probably gotten something that gives it to you for free by that point too?
Whether than be mobile aim or a metastrike

sinful gyro
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Ye

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Then you just end up aiming while doing other stuff

warped orbit
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when you Aim, you can deal 1-4 bleed on a crit

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amazing

trail nova
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I find devestating aim weird becuase I'm used to 1e, where that sort of dice size increaser mostly sucks

warped orbit
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Devastating Aim isn't like, amazing I think

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but it's fine

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I'd probably still take Hampering Shot most of the time

upbeat ridge
rapid wagon
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thoughts on the use of the Sentry dedication on a Champion of iomedae?

rotund geode
upbeat ridge
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Yeah

rotund geode
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Of like a cowboy showdown between the two

upbeat ridge
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They’re similar but I feel like gunslinger has more support options and operative is a bit more selfish

clever cobalt
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Operative is the Cooler Gunslinger

upbeat ridge
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Will be interesting to see how aim pans out with the action economy of pf guns

rotund geode
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Gunslingers are Cowboys
Operatives are Call Of Duty Protagonists

upbeat ridge
rapid wagon
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i went truth and lay on hands

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and justice

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i figure flashing shield works

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what does positive damage get changed to in the remaster?

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as well as good damage?

warped orbit
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positive is vitality damage

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good damage is spirit, sometimes only to unholy

solar tendon
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good damage is kinda a case by case basis

rapid wagon
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i like the flavor of the sentry archetype and narratively my character is a paladin of iomedae who worked for a knightly chapter that guarded a pilgrims road in ustalav

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so it feels

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fitting

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but i wonder if its not just better to keep the flavor and go straight paladin

echo briar
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Questions from my campaign: is getting milk from an awakened cow more or less weird than milk from a normal cow?

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And does this answer change if you can talk with the non awakened cow?

solar tendon
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definitely more weird

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the second I think is normal amount of weird but milk is kinda just weird when you think about it

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(so I don't ;P)

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although speaking to animals in general kinda raises. questions

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often

echo briar
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Is it more or less ethical if the cows consent to being slaughtered?

sinful gyro
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I think it's only weird to our cultural standard

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So if the cow doesn't find it weird, it's only weird if you find it weird

surreal basin
stuck bane
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I mean there’s a difference between talking to a cow and talking to an awakened cow, it’s not a bg3 speak with animals situation

rapid wagon
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so at level 9 if im making a character at that level i should have 2 10th level items and 2 8th level items?

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but i could take lower level items and fill those slots up?

sinful gyro
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Wrong table

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You want this one

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The table you posted is for loot gained as you level

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The one I posted is for starting gold for new characters

upbeat ridge
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yall probs noticed this but i think its cool: for the six sf2e playtest classes, we have one for each KAS

rapid wagon
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and for any character im making at said level, i can take magic items of a lower level and just eat up a slot for a higher level item?

upbeat ridge
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also: i feel like guardian being KAS con would be cool

rapid wagon
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like taking a basic magic item as a 4th level item, i can have that eat up one of my 6th level slots?

sinful gyro
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If you want

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I'd probably just use the total gold and just pick out items and gear

rapid wagon
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i was thinking, i cant get a +2 sword yet but i could get a +1 striking sword which would not be a 6th level item

sinful gyro
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Cos the moment you go into town, you can in theory just sell all your loot for gold then buy all the things you want

rapid wagon
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and then get a level 6 rune

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or something like that

sinful gyro
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Sure

rapid wagon
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am i right when i see that there arent any basic magic shields

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so a +1 shield would cost me a potency rune on my item budget if im using the permanent item list?

warped orbit
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what do you mean by basic?

rapid wagon
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so there are basic magic weapons that are a single leveled item

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like a +1 Striking longsword would be a level 4 item

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or a +1 resilient full plate armor would be a level 8 item

warped orbit
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shields use reinforcement runes, but you're mostly looking at specific magic shields

rapid wagon
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ok

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so is the paladin ability to give any shield he has reinforced good?

warped orbit
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though for any non Sturdy shield, you'd probably also want an appropriate reinforcement rune

rapid wagon
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its effectively free money right?

warped orbit
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yes

rapid wagon
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thats the one im taking instead of the sword one, feels like a hard choice

warped orbit
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if you take the new Blessed Shield or what it's called

rapid wagon
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yeah thats the one

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now that the core 2 is out im finally building my paladin of iomedae for 2e

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and so im trying to pick my items

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figure picking a regular steel shield and magically giving it reinforced and making it +1 or something would be good?

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but i guess i cant do that?

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any recs for shields if taking a generic steel shield isn't the way?

warped orbit
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shields don't have potency

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the 'basic' shield is basically Sturdy shields

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which just have increased hardness and HP

rapid wagon
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oh wait

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so if i get a sturdy shield lesser

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i give it reinforced too, just natively?

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cause of blessed shield

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that seems neat

warped orbit
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well they don't really stack is the thing

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Blessed Shield is most useful for saving money from having to rune up your other specific magic shield

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since a lot of them don't have amazing hardness and HP

rapid wagon
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ohh so if im rocking blessed shield

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i should look at some other stuff?

warped orbit
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if you take Blessed Shield, you should look around for a specific magic shield with good utility, yeah

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since the free reinforcement rune will ensure it keeps relevant in terms of stats

rapid wagon
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im looking at spell guard shield

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seems useful to be able to block spells

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though im unsure what the circumstance bonus that i get form it is

warped orbit
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Spellguard is good, yeah

warped orbit
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Spellguard makes you gain the +2 bonus from Raise Shield on saves against spells as well
and you can Shield Block damage from spells

rapid wagon
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spellguards seems flavorful for a iomedaian paladin sentry

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block them necromantic magics

warped orbit
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it's a solid choice, yeah

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one you can look into later is the Clockwork Shield, which gives you an extra reaction to Shield Block for a minute once every hour

rapid wagon
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i figure im alright with +1 resilient full plate as a baseline

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then gotta pick a rune on my sword

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i think we talked before about what might be flavorful for a prison wardens sword since keen is beyond my reach currently

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trying to pick between authorized, called, or fearsome

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any opinions on if shield of the spirit or lay on hands are the better choice?

warped orbit
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Lay on Hands is very handy to have generally

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especially for out of combat, depending on how much healing you have for that in your group

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the Shield one is a bit more specialized, in that it's a deterrent to attack you or adjacent allies

rapid wagon
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yeah thats fair, i went with lay on hands as a bit of a default since i had it on the pf1e version of hte character

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ive been sitting on the fence about taking the sentry dedication, GM has already OK'd it

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but the alternative is getting myself smite, which lets my mostly defensive build kind of steroid damage a bit

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but sentry is kind of literally what my paladin was as a character

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his background being a paladin who worked for a chapter of knights that protected a way shrine and pilgrims road from undead and bandits

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oo ok spacious pouch type 2 is a shoe in for a good level 7 item

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bag of holding gone in pf?

warped orbit
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They're useful to have for carrying around a lot of stuff

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Retrieval Belt is also a useful item to have, for making it easier to draw consumables

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Though being sword and shield already complicates that

rapid wagon
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yeah, i figure i wont be doing too too much of that

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but can drop my shield in a pickle to do other things

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if i absolutely must

surreal basin
warped orbit
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I'd also say look into skill items for important skills

rapid wagon
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ive got one last level 7 item to pick, im looking at the climbers rope greater, the travelers any tool, an onyx dog figuring (its not level 7, i just like it), Ring of sustenance, cloak of feline respite, lesser cloak of illumination (i dont have darkvision)

surreal basin
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Cause bag of holding is super duper Phil

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*ogl

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As a name

rapid wagon
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skill items?

warped orbit
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Oh, and I just remembered you can get a Shield Augmentation if you don't care about striking better with the shield

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Can add some tags to a shield

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Shove and Trip for maneuver tags IIRC

rapid wagon
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oh that sounds cool

warped orbit
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Putting Disarm and Trip onto your shield can give you some extra options

rapid wagon
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is it still a thing to be able to put a shield sconce on my shield?

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if i wanted to put a sun rod or torch in it

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cause i cant see in the dark

warped orbit
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Shield sconces are a thing

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Don't remember if they're attachments or something else

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You can also get a Wayfinder though

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It you need hands free light

rapid wagon
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hmm, its uncommon but its also level 2, im sure my gm would be fine wit hthat

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but im not a member of the pathfinder society

surreal basin
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Also oh the access requirements, especially those ones, can be waived really easily

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They’re more for society play

rapid wagon
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ok this is what im lookin at
+1 Striking Longsword - 4th level (taking up one of my 5th level slots)
+1 Resilient Full Plate - 8th level
Spell Guard's Shield - 6th level
Fearsome Rune - 5th level
Spacious Pouch Type 2 - 7th Level
Rope of Climbing Greater - 7th Level

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Fearsome going on the longsword

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Seems fitting for the warden of a maximum security prison would have a fearsome blade

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(Im recreating a magic sword we found early in the adventure)

echo briar
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I feel like with how ranged focused SF2 is, they should make the brutal trait player accessible

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Because while in PF2, dex would have been much worse than str without finesse, in SF str seems like a struggling stat

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Plus, “giant machine gun that has so much kickback that controlling it is more important than aiming it” feels like it should fit nicely

rustic cape
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That's already kind of a thing with autofire

echo briar
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So why only go half way?

surreal basin
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I genuinely think they must have an internal rule that it’s not allowed

echo briar
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They added it to the kinetisist play test

surreal basin
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Ye and then decided not to add it to the full game

echo briar
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because everyone wanted them to attack with con

rustic cape
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And I think that's wise

echo briar
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Finesse exists though

surreal basin
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That’s not

rustic cape
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I said cautious

surreal basin
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He’s just saying cautious

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Yeah

rustic cape
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I didn't say it's nonexistent

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Thief also exists

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But Thief is also the only thing like it that exists

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As is Soldier gets Con to shoves and intimidate at level 3

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And can use it for armor strength requirements

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And auto-fire/area-fire lets them circumvent the need for Dex to a degree

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But there's still benefits for Strength and there's still benefits for Dex (esp. primary target)

echo briar
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Does earth exist as a normal part of the galaxy in starfinder, or do you still need baba yaga to go there?

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Is baba yaga still alive?

trail nova
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IIRC the Golarion galaxy isn't the Milky Way, and extra-galactic drift travel is... challenging, so you still need an alternate route. We haven't seen Earth, and I don't know the status of Baba Yaga, but I could see either being true. (She did probably either dodge the Gap but just isn't telling, or is rather peeved.)

surreal basin
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Yeah earth is very far away

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Uhhh

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It’s like 2100 on earth rn I wanna say since there’s like a vaguely 300 year gap

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Between pathfinder and starfinder

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And it’s the 19…40s? In pathfinder earth rn

trail nova
sinful gyro
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Earth exists in the universe, I'm not sure its in the same galaxy

trail nova
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So... 800 to 1000 year total? We don't know how long the Gap exactly was.

limber comet
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Earth is in another galaxy yeah

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Past the Fray

surreal basin
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Yeah it’s a very long distance

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And you can’t use magic (of player facing levels) to get there really

limber comet
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You'd literally have to go through the Dark Tapestry to get there

wooden orbit
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Kinda surprised whenever I looked at Starfinder on StartPlaying that nobody has ran Mechageddon yet

limber comet
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Gosh

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I'm so hyped over the future for Finder games

sinful gyro
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Ye starfinder is gonna be so fun

limber comet
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I really hope that starship combat still has "roles" with basic actions, and then unique actions each class can take

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I think that'd be cool

upbeat ridge
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Has paizo mentioned they’re gonna do more eratta for sf2e playtest or is this what we’re getting

surreal basin
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I think they’ve said we’re getting uhhh

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Errata for stuff that’s wrong or mistakes but not balance errata

upbeat ridge
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I see

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solar shot not counting as your solar weapon for the purposes of proficiency or core crystals feels a bit odd

warped orbit
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it does in the Foundry module at least attack with Str apparently

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but not getting at least potency from your crystal is weird yeah

upbeat ridge
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Odd, since it say ranged attack for it

warped orbit
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yeah it should be Dex as written

upbeat ridge
#

It shouldn’t be using str

warped orbit
#

though it's good that it doesn't

upbeat ridge
#

Yeah

#

You do add your str mod to the damage like a thrown weapon I think

#

But you use dex to attack

#

Oh it scales its damage with level though right?

warped orbit
#

yes

upbeat ridge
#

I feel like it should get potency tho

#

Since there are orbital crystals that buff it

#

Or just take out the dice scaling and have it benefit from core crystals full stop

#

Well, it gets 5 dice by lv 20 so I guess it’s supposed to scale like a kineticist blast

warped orbit
#

Kinet also has Gate Attenuator though

upbeat ridge
#

Yeah exactly

novel jacinth
#

'cos high-level operative gets some pretty bonkers mobility by the looks of it

warped orbit
#

the mobility they get is kinda nuts

novel jacinth
#

yeah

#

like

warped orbit
#

at high level you can like Stride 90 ft in one action

novel jacinth
#

straight-up a skill just called 'Parkour'

#

where you can just Stride over obstacles without taking any kind of hindrance to your movement, IIRC

#

and they get a couple of skills to move after attacking or after an enemy misses them

#

am very excited. we're gonna be taking a break from our Season of Ghosts campaign to play Cosmic Birthday for a little while, tomorrow

upbeat ridge
#

i guess you could make a "solar shot amplifier" item that functions like a gate attenuator, but requires the potency crystal from the level before to use and has the cost of that crystal deducted from its price

craggy thunder
upbeat ridge
craggy thunder
#

Well all right then!

novel jacinth
craggy thunder
#

lol fair

warped orbit
solar tendon
#

cute!

sinful gyro
#

So folks

#

I got this monday 12th off work I think

#

And I got the 15th and 16th off

#

Anyone wanna like, do all of Cosmic Birthday?

upbeat ridge
#

Hmmmm… perhaps

#

How long is the adventure?

sinful gyro
#

Aproximately 3, 4h sessions

#

maybe a bit longer

upbeat ridge
#

I see

rapid wagon
#

Looks like our party party transition to 2e in Carrion Crown is gonna be 2 fighters, a Ranger, a champion, and an oracle

#

We have the meat

#

We're thin on magic though

#

Guess we're gonna beat the fuck out of most problems

#

Guys we should be scared of big bad casters with auras

#

And will saves

limber comet
#

Should I keep Vy

#

Or would you like a new Guy™️

sinful gyro
#

Well let's see if it happens first

upbeat ridge
#

yeah

sinful gyro
#

And then see who we have

upbeat ridge
#

my partner might be interested

sinful gyro
#

I'll try and pull it together this week

#

Nice

limber comet
#

If we need more people I might have some folks who are interested

#

But I'll wait on you :]

sinful gyro
#

I'll get something more solid tomorrow

fast hill
#

I wont be able to join

#

got a session on the friday

limber comet
#

Thinking about Astrozoans

solar thorn
#

My players encountered ||Belcorra|| for the first time and bro she boofed it

#

I rolled 26 on 11d6 damage videogames
players thought they were going to get wrecked and instead got a fireball, as a treat. they still ran because they were really worn down, but bruh

#

I checked the math and that is literally a < 1% damage roll

vast burrow
#

You can use Ranged weapons with Swashbuckler FInishers right? You just don't benefit from Precise Strike?

barren cipher
#

i don't think so no, unless the finisher trait has been updated

vast burrow
#

Dang, only weapons that benefit from Precise Strike

#

Welp, there goes my Pistolero with Swashbuckler archetype dreams

#

Ah well, there's still plenty of abilities that key off having panache that aren't finishers

#

Like Derring-Do, which is actually like a really damn good feat if you don't have to worry about finishers

fossil temple
#

Sems my group will have Pathfinder in the menu , but now we have foundry!
Any foundry add-ons you guys recommend for pathfinder?

rustic cape
#

Foundry for PF2e has tons of support

#

I’ll ask my gm

fossil temple
#

thank ya
One of the players of the group wanted to try and run Lancer (first time GM) but got intimidated, so he will run a Pathfinder 2e module to get the hang of things

#

Yeah boooi time to play my Merchant Smuggler Goblin that I been waiting for

rustic cape
#

“mods i would consider vital are quick insert, pf2e workbench and pf2e toolbelt. Companion Compendia and Exploit Vulnerability are needed if someone is using those mechanics”

barren cipher
#

the people cry out for dice so nice

limber comet
#

Speaking of companions

#

Mechanic is probably gonna be the companion class huh

trail nova
#

It always was, though Exocortex was also pretty cool.

limber comet
#

Think they'll merge it so you don't have to pick?

rapid wagon
#

is there a limit to how often i can use retributive strike?

#

as a champion?

#

aside from normal reaction limitations?>

warped orbit
#

Nope

rapid wagon
#

i realized just now that i have a lot of competing reactions for my turns

#

which is probably not great

warped orbit
#

So if you get extra reactions, you could use it multiple times

rapid wagon
#

oh is there a way for me to get extra reactions?

warped orbit
#

There is a feat that gives you an extra reaction just for Shield Block, and I think you're close to that if you're 9th

rapid wagon
#

oh yeah i didn't get it because i went sentry dedication

#

which im somewhat on the fence about

#

flavor is good and it gets me reactive shield

#

as well as some flavorfull iomedaen paladin defensive stuff

#

but i give up quick raise shield and possibly smite

#

or some other champion ability

#

lastwall sentry* i think is the name

barren cipher
#

giving up quick shield block is a hard sell to be honest

rapid wagon
#

think its fine to have all those reactions or would it be wise to cut down on em, since ill be wanting to shield often means ill likely not use em all all that much

rapid wagon
#

i went sentry for the flavor

#

Narratively my character was a shrine sentry for a chapter of the knights of ozem that protected relics housed there and safeguarded the road for pilgrims

#

around the gallowspire

#

so it felt on brand

#

but i could absolutely just keep the flavor and take normal champion stuff w/o the dedication

barren cipher
#

if you don't have free archetype i think either of the level 8 lastwall sentry feats is a hard sell

#

you can take the dedication, nobody's making you take subsequent feats every level

rapid wagon
#

thats true

#

i thought flashing shield was fun since we're in carrion crown

#

but niche otherwise

#

i just know we are absolutely guaranteed fights with more undead

#

its not hella strong, but its a free action for more damage

#

that has no save

#

its competing tho

#

with quick shield block, second blessing, or smite for me

#

or even shield warden

barren cipher
#

yeah it's ok but like

#

especially if you go the shield warden and shield of reckoning route

rapid wagon
#

ive pretty much built the classic paladin, with a big shield, a longsword, and the justice cause; i figure maybe... mechanically i just stay champ and take the features from there

#

instead of taking the dedication at all

#

unless my GM is down for letting me have it for free

barren cipher
#

reactive shield and a free skill advance is not bad

rapid wagon
#

think its worth dropping inspiring reslience on the grounds that my reactions is kind of saved for shield blocking as often as possible?

barren cipher
#

divine health is also likely to be good

rapid wagon
#

this is where im at

image.png
#

and i took blessed shield and lay on hands

#

at 4 i was also looking at resilient mind, mercy, and sun blade

rustic cape
#

Personally I like reach weapon Paladin

barren cipher
#

if you're in justice it's also really really hard to not take nimble reprisal

rapid wagon
#

hmm, the step is the most relevant part for me, being that i wont have ranged weapon out really

#

i think nimble reprisal is real good but i dont know what id want to give up

#

inspiring reslience maybe

#

the domain spell for truth is useful for me outside of combat

#

and then maybe quick shield block instead of flashing shield

barren cipher
#

defensive advance is also really good at 1st

#

stops your turns all being 'raise shield, stride, strike'

rapid wagon
#

hmm

barren cipher
#

you'll do a lot of that otherwise

rapid wagon
#

i AM on a bit of a budget shortfall there

#

i dont feel a strong desire to ditch the domain thing, though i may switch it to sun

fossil temple
rapid wagon
#

im thinking swap inspiring reslience for nimble reprisal, drop sentry dedication for shield warden, and instead of flashing shield, take quick shield block

#

that way i can always have my shield ready

#

i can defend myself or an adjacent ally, since im rather protective

#

the only thing is if I use shield block i cant use retributive strike

#

which is a bit shallenging

#

challenging

#

seems better off using retributive strike actually

#

if its for an ally

#

smite be worth my time

#

looking like this atm

image.png
barren cipher
#

shield warden is really only there for the level 10 feat

#

battle medicine is a struggle to use, your hands are gonna be full all the time

#

i'd use your generals for like fleet and toughness and such

rapid wagon
#

oh thats true, i could just use normal medecine to heal outside of combat

#

ok

fossil temple
rapid wagon
#

swapped battle medecine, i think its pretty functional now

#

swapped it for toughness

#

character's MO has been being very hard to kill this far into the campaign

#

feel like im hella hella invested in having my shield raised, but i guess thats not at all a bad thing

#

since i went blessed shield and all

barren cipher
#

intimidating prowess at 4 instead of intimidating glare is a good bargain for you

rapid wagon
#

why so?

barren cipher
#

it gives you +1 circumstance bonus

#

you can take both but usually just prowess is enough

#

your level 8 skill feat can also be battle cry

rapid wagon
#

solid point, though i think ill stick with glare cause it lets me skip theauditory trait and take no penalty for them not understanding me (and for me its a flavor choice)

Does battle cry need prowess first?

barren cipher
#

intimidating prowess also lets you avoid the penalty for not sharing a language

rapid wagon
#

ah id need master in intimidation

barren cipher
#

unless you're using a fortress shield or something i don't think you'll get much if any use out of hefty hauler

rapid wagon
#

i was pretty much right at the limit of my encumbrance with full plate, a longsword, a dagger, some arows, and a potion; thought it did help to stuff more things into the spacious pouch

barren cipher
#

that doesn't sound right to me, let me check

#

also incredible improvisation kinda needs untrained improvisation to be any good

rapid wagon
#

i didn't see a lot else i wanted there tbh, maybe group aid or cooperative soul?

#

i guess i could take multitalented to get the sentry dedication anyway

#

or general training i guess is always good

barren cipher
#

multitalented only gives multiclass dedication feats unfortunately

#

general training can be pretty useful yeah

rapid wagon
#

skill training over hefty hauler?

#

though also just being able to carry a bunch of crap doesn't seem the worst

#

(im using a spellguard shield if thats any help)

barren cipher
#

i'd usually take quick jump or something

#

group coercion

#

powerful leap is pretty good too

rapid wagon
#

theres a bit of irony, im pretty sure coercing people in general goes against iomedae, but i get the bonus feat of being good at coercion cause i took the guard bg

#

which ill prolly never use

#

i guess i could coerce evildoers

barren cipher
#

'desist from your wrongdoing or i will smite the living shit out of you' seems on brand

rapid wagon
#

yeah thats true

#

instead of appealing to their better nature, appeal to their sense of self preservation

#

a paladin of redemption might then later take them into custody once ive apprehended them

#

im generally playin the kind of paladin that wants to put people into a legitimate justice system rather than go about killin when it can be avoided; so group coercion may be useful to get people to cease and desist

#

i thought about taking the sentry dedication archetype feat that lets you avoid the penalty for nonlethal attacks

#

but alas

#

its quite hard to fit sentry into this

#

thanks for your input btw!

#

looking a bit more cohesive?

barren cipher
#

yeah archetypes are sort of difficult to get going if you have decent class feats and no free archetype

fossil temple
#

That's why my group always play with free archetype

#

It's really Hard to justify not picking a class feat over an archetype feat

barren cipher
#

it's not exactly what i'd do but you're going to be fine yeah, i would certainly consider retraining something to get the shield warden + retributive strike reaction at 10th

#

and you can always retrain stuff later if you find you aren't getting any use out of it

#

oh, i checked bulk - weapon, shield and full plate is 6/9 bulk so you have loads available

rapid wagon
#

If it helps the party is looking like it'll be 2 fighters, a Ranger, an oracle of life, and me

#

if it were you, how would you line up for teh shield warden thing?

#

and whats the 10th level one you mentioned?

barren cipher
#

shield of reckoning

rapid wagon
#

ahhh

#

ok

#

yeah i think maybe retraining AFTER i hit level 10 might be worth

#

since shield warden isn't as good as quick block before i have the option of reckoning

#

cause combining both reactions sounds sick

sinful gyro
rapid wagon
#

and very on brand

barren cipher
#

i would reorganise your feats to make retraining easier then

rapid wagon
#

oh?

barren cipher
#

i think the most likely candidate for retirement would probably be deity's domain

rapid wagon
#

mmm yeah i figured it might be, i want to see how well it works out for me in narrative first

#

as im the party face, it can help when the people i speak to are very convinced regarding my convictions

barren cipher
#

i would have thought that would go to oracle

rapid wagon
#

the player is a lot less of a cat herder than i am

#

im sort of the impromptu party leader

#

which i guess works for a paladin

#

One fighter is going to be a bit of wild card, one fighter is likely to be phoning in their play, the ranger is new but going to be much more present than other members, and the oracle is generally going to be present

#

pre- transfer to 2e, they were a shaman

#

and are our healer

fossil temple
sinful gyro
#

Just press a button to find anything ya need 😛

barren cipher
#

don't try to spread yourself too thin, is all

rapid wagon
#

def, i think rn its like one or two abilities and being a master at diplo and an expert at intim

#

i dont want to over specialize either, so that i can be more participatory in non combat situations

barren cipher
#

i guess you can deemphasise athletics a bit compared to usual, although it'll always be useful for getting around until you can reliably fly

rapid wagon
#

soft goal is be a bulwark, a beacon, and a leader in combat; be a pillar, an example, and a negotiator out of combat

#

im the shield between regular people and the evils that assail them; but im also a leader and advisor when the smiting is done

#

do i use strength or charisma as the stat for my focus spells?

#

charisma right?

#

also do circumstance bonuses stack?

barren cipher
#

charisma yeah

#

they stack with bonuses of other types but not with themselves

rapid wagon
#

as a note, defensive advance and quick shield block seem to be a bit redundant

warped orbit
#

You mean Reactive Shield?

rapid wagon
#

nah i meant the one that gives me a free reaction on my turn specifically to raise shield

#

since defensive advance also combines raising my shield, striding, and striking

#

it would take me 2 actions to stride and strike and my shield would be raised effectively for free

worthy stump
#

that is Reactive Shield, yeah

#

would be mostly for situations where you can't do Defensive Advance for whatever reason and don't or can't spend actions raising normally

#

like being grabbed or immobilized

#

so a bit redundant for the most part, yeah

rapid wagon
#

ah i was thinking about shield block, which is not

#

that lets me do a shield block while keeping my reaction

worthy stump
#

quick shield block is always amazing, yeah. just straight up an extra reaction

rapid wagon
#

for me it means i can retributive strike more often

#

whic is what i want

#

i didn't take smite, so i have no damage steroid

#

so im relying on getting some more hits in more frequently with retributive strike i think

limber comet
#

Is ranged investigator viable (dumb question)

barren cipher
#

yes

limber comet
#

I am just considering Investigator in sf2e VERY heavily

barren cipher
#

not sure what the exact situation is in remaster for melee but apg investigator was an awful lot safer and more viable at range and i don't think it's any worse now

echo briar
#

SF investigator is going to be much better than normal investigator because you can get an full auto weapon

#

Investigators need non attacks they can make when DaS is low, but are not given any reliable options in class

barren cipher
#

the new skill check option is pretty decent

#

machine gun might be a little bit cosy, magnetar rifle is probably a good pickup if you can somehow find your way to it

warped orbit
#

just get a shortbow and you're good

#

oh in SF
yeah probably works better, since you have a variety of good guns available

rustic cape
limber comet
warped orbit
#

works just fine, yeah

#

DaS works with all ranged weapons IIRC

tough perch
#

from skimming over the playtest, the only pf2e class i think feels a little invalitaded by being ported over to sf2e is gunslinger

#

everybody else still have their niche safe

#

the ones that are completely averse to ranged, like barbarian and swashbuckler, might be a little worse off but doesn't look too bad

#

i kinda want to play a 9mm thaumaturge

barren cipher
#

i think rocket launcher thaum could be quite competitive as well actually

#

proficiency might lag a bit too much though

craggy thunder
#

Investigator with an assault rifle

#

oh look, a metaphor for militarized police

limber comet
#

Most investigators I've seen in play ditch the police

#

Because their justice isn't...well

#

Yknow

rotund geode
rapid wagon
#

vesk barbarian might be fun

#

so whats the soldier do now?

craggy thunder
craggy thunder
warped orbit
#

Focuses on AoE stuff yeah

craggy thunder
#

They're a martial that, as far as I've seen played, is reliant on forcing saves!

#

Which I actually think is super fun

clever cobalt
#

They get Legendary Class DC

carmine egret
solar tendon
#

omg literally

rustic cape
#

Soldier is really cool

clever cobalt
#

I do think a Thaum with Starfinder weapons could be neat

echo briar
#

For sf2, I hope they give us weapon creation guides, or even player facing rules

#

They clearly have a formula, I reversed engineered one for pathfinder that one of the devs said was extremely close, but they won’t tell us

#

But SF seems like thematically a much better place for those rules

craggy thunder
#

So I'm making a Dragonblood character on Pathbuilder and I have no idea what any of these dragon types are lmao

#

Like what's a fortune dragon lol

#

I'm sad Crystal isn't seemingly an option given this is my Seath the Scaleless reference character

echo briar
# craggy thunder Like what's a fortune dragon lol

https://2e.aonprd.com/Monsters.aspx?ID=2945

Adult Fortune Dragon - Monsters - Archives of Nethys: Pathfinder ...

Fortune dragons have the innate ability to draw upon the raw magical energies that surround them. They constantly use these magical energies to empower their magical abilities and even their bodies, as the energy can heal wounds. A fortune dragon has a typical build for an arcane dragon, but their bodies sport a striking feature: their treasure....

craggy thunder
#

Huh

#

Cool

turbid dagger
#

Yeah with the OGL stuff the chromatic/metallic dragons are out

#

There is now, iirc, two dragon types for each tradition of magic for the 'classic' dragons

craggy thunder
#

Ye

#

Though

#

Crystal doesn't seem like it'd violate OGL

#

Since it's a specific primal dragon type and not like

#

a subgroup of dragons like in D&D

turbid dagger
#

Yeah, I think only those two groups of dragons are gone

#

The Imperial and Elemental dragons are still around

#

(Does this mean primal dragons outnumber all the others?)
(Yes)

surreal basin
#

They’re gone but still usable

#

In the sense that nothing about the metallic or chromatics are mechanically disallowed

uneven wren
#

been looking through the starfinder 2e playtest

#

its actually a PF2E campaign setting

warped orbit
#

Only for the playtest presumably

barren cipher
#

yeah i can’t imagine that will persist through launch

warped orbit
#

The proper release will be self contained I'd assume

uneven wren
surreal basin
#

Yeah they’ve specifically said it’s not an expansion to PF2E

uneven wren
#

In what way?

surreal basin
#

The balance is different

#

Between the two

#

Any starfinder ranged weapon would blow a pathfinder one out of the water without contest

#

Flight is also a big one

uneven wren
#

So the reason it's not an expansion is because players can't port one thing into the other without the GM allowing it

surreal basin
#

Pretty much yeah

#

Despite the community REALLY latching into the compatibility

#

I highly reccomend that any gm heavily consider the implications

uneven wren
#

luckily I run a starfinder campaign not a pathfinder one

clever cobalt
#

Yeah the guns in SF blow the ones in PF out of the wayer

#

Not shocking but

solar tendon
#

the main difference is that starfinder made mechanical advancements in a similar vein to pathfinder unchained, while starfinder 2e is explicitly building on the same foundation as pf2e

surreal basin
#

I just see a lot of people like

#

Assuming that they are intended to be played interchangeably

#

Which I feel a mistake

solar tendon
#

although it's not entirely wrong to call it an almost entirely content level difference? but it's a far more extensive difference that any other setting product I know of

#

and there are plenty of companies that produce many games that only have content level differences

surreal basin
#

They are compatible but separate like the Vampire the Masqurade and friends games

solar tendon
#

I think it's definitely gonna be closer to the world of darkness level of compatibility than like, ffg star wars compatibility

#

i.e if unrestricted it's really not gonna work out

surreal basin
#

Oh hey world of darkness that’s what it’s called

uneven wren
#

it's a pf2e campaign setting but watch out!

surreal basin
#

It’s almost exactly like WOD imo

solar tendon
#

hopefully though games with significant crossover are at least gonna be possible

#

while I hear that trying to play the wod supergame is a fool's errand and just play urban shadows for your own sanity

surreal basin
#

Absolutely yes

#

You can do some crossover is the thing

#

For WOD

#

Just not EVERYTHING

solar tendon
#

(for reference of the other end of spectrum, the three ffg star wars 'games' are literally just three options for core books and characters of a similar xp level and equipment budget are gonna be similar enough)

trail nova
#

God, fuck. I need to go work on being insane and either moding spheres of power into PF2e/SF2e, or going the really weird route and making my own science Fantasy game off of WOIN with Spheres inspiration.

surreal basin
#

I have absolutely stealing some stuff from the starfinder book for my setting

#

Because my setting has future tech ruins

trail nova
#

(I like like... 75% of PF 2e, but can't stand Vancian and think 3-action economy is a bit of a mess/martials sometimes feel like they lack a bit of spice.)

uneven wren
trail nova
#

I think it's better than SF 1e, but I think it still strugles a lot with the price it puts on movement.

#

Movement is usually not a great third action, which means any movement you need to make is often interpreted as action denial, or as a big action advantage if given freely.

ocean cobalt
#

the fantasy flight star wars have some different auxiliary rules between books right? i only ever read the one but i remember the jedi one having a light side/dark side system and saying that the bounty hunter one didnt

silver geyser
#

Yes, they do have some different rulesets.

#

Because being a space outlaw cares about different things than being a insurgent military or religious/magical order in hiding. 😛

ocean cobalt
#

personally i could take or leave pf<->sf compatibility, i wish it were a little less of a priority than it seems like it is

ocean cobalt
silver geyser
#

Ehhhh. I like the compatibility.

#

It allows for some fun and funky things.

#

It also means you can slap PF monsters straight into SF.

sinful gyro
#

Yeah, once the full book is out next year, you can never have even heard the words pathfinders and you can run starfinder fine

surreal basin
#

Oh hey it’s COOL im just like

#

I think people should be very cautious about allowing it

#

For me it’s like….. a step above rare lmao

trail nova
#

I think the biggest thing the the insistence on compatability I'm worried about is the impacts on general tools. Stuff like flight access or vacuum/toxic gas resistance. Pazio seems to really think that "CO2 planet" should be a challenge.

surreal basin
#

Yeah? Why don’t you like that out of curiosity

limber comet
surreal basin
#

Mostly anything from starfinder into pathfinder

limber comet
#

I feel like putting some pf2e classes in sf2e would be fine and wouldn't hurt the balance

#

Ah yeah

surreal basin
#

The other way around seems fine

limber comet
#

I agree

sinful gyro
#

I'd make them rare both ways

#

But rare doesn't mean like, banned

limber comet
#

I think what they're shooting for is pf into sf

sinful gyro
#

It means I gotta think about it and plan for it

limber comet
#

Rather than the other way around

sinful gyro
#

I think it'll be very interesting when we get a Iron Mountain adventure in pf2e

#

That'll come out after Starfinder

#

As opposed to Starfinder coming out after sci fi stuff in pathfinder in 1e

surreal basin
#

Yeah like

sinful gyro
#

They could just drop starfinder stuff directly into pf2e then if they wanted

surreal basin
#

I’ve just seen a lot of people act like the two flow freely into each other lol

limber comet
#

It does take a bit of legwork yeah

#

Not a huge amount though

#

And you should always ask your gm

sinful gyro
#

Yeah like, you can probably drop a Vesk into pf2e no problem

#

But other ancestries? Ehhh

limber comet
#

Barathu moment

#

And skittermanders

uneven wren
#

I mean

#

pathfinder has those wood and stone guys

#

that have the like orb of stars in them

limber comet
#

Conrasu

uneven wren
#

those always seemed like starfinder to begin with

novel jacinth
#

Me, an android, crit-successing on a thievery check to ||stop the elevator|| in Cosmic Birthday, as the party Pahtra is trying to bother my character while they work: (Swivels my head in a circle while working to stare at them from behind) Please stop that. (Swivels back and finishes)

limber comet
#

Or aeon related

uneven wren
#

As far as I can tell this and

image0.png
sinful gyro
uneven wren
#

are the same image

sinful gyro
#

I meant more from a feat/build perspective

#

For ancestries

#

Like lore wise sure you can have flying jellyfish in pf2e who cares

#

Just that design wise I think Vesk fits better than other ones in pf2e

limber comet
#

Design and vibe wise yeah

#

I'm always a bit hesitant regarding aliens on Golarion, even with Numeria being a thing

trail nova
# surreal basin Yeah? Why don’t you like that out of curiosity

I think in particular, while SF 1e Enviromental Protections were probably too good, I think these are a step in the wrong direction - Pazio shouldn't be trying to force obstacles like toxic gasses, at least short term. I'd maybe mind less if the game assumed that you needed the rebreather for underwater or space and just made it cheap, but as is it's really weird. At the same time, they didn't really alter most of the "I leave the envi protections up for days at a time", you just upgrade the max length less frequently.

Flight is whatever, Pazio seems quite willing to make it cheaper

#

But like.. "1 hour of holding breath" being a 9th level android feat does not make me confident.

limber comet
#

Then like, put it in the feedback :p these things are liable to change

#

I do think it needs some heavier pressure put onto it but androids in pf/sf are a bit more organic than other robots

barren cipher
#

some level of environmental protection appears to be built in to almost every armour

trail nova
limber comet
#

There's gotta be a sweetspot

echo briar
#

I think they should make environmental hazards more focused on "don't damage the suit or you die"

#

Like in combat, whenever you get crit, you get a penalty based on the type of environment until you repair your suit

frozen hatch
#

So I am very excited for what I now have in my possession with the other parts coming in soon. This is my next great big idea and will likely (97% positive) be the next pathfinder related campaign I run.

e9854a26-b75f-49bb-bbfa-9c6ea0c71224.jpg
#

In the GEARS OF REVOLUTION adventure path for the ZEITGEIST campaign setting, your characters serve in the Homeland Constabulary of the nation of Risur, protecting the country and its citizens from foreign threats lurking within Risur’s borders. During missions of espionage and assassination, your duty will be to root out hostile spies and pursue international conspiracies. As you learn more of your homeland’s own secrets, however, your loyalties may be tested, may even be turned, and you may find that it is you whose hand controls the gears of the turning age.

The ZEITGEIST setting is a step away from traditional fantasy. In many parts of the world, day to day existence is much unchanged from how folks lived centuries ago. Fey trickery, prowling monsters, and roaming brigands pose as great a threat as ever. Priests and druids offer guidance, and it’s possible to live all one’s entire years without seeing a steam engine.

Yet though this is a land born from magic, a revolution of ironclad industry is reshaping nations. Railroads slice through the countryside, driving horrors from their wilderness lairs to new urban labyrinths. Heroes and scoundrels stroll smoggy streets in top hats and tails, battling with pistols or enchanted arcane fusils. Printing presses publish philosophical revolutions and conspiratorial ramblings, inspiring fresh frights to prowl the shadows between gas-lights under skies darkened by soot and steam.

Every nation is at an inflection point, every ideology is vying for influence, and your adventures will shape the spirit of the new age: the zeitgeist

clever cobalt
#

How is the setting/module?

novel jacinth
#

sniper operative is really fucking funny

#

I just did 42 damage on a single crit

clever cobalt
#

What levrl?

limber comet
#

Ik you're playing Cosmic Birthday so please no spoilies :]

#

Thank ya 💙

novel jacinth
#

Wasn't planning on sharing any, as you can see up above I did spoiler the one plot-relevant thing.

novel jacinth
clever cobalt
#

Nice

limber comet
#

I know but just like,

#

Bleh

#

Trying to cover my bases is all

#

Sorry

novel jacinth
#

I mean I get it but like. There is a pretty standard no untagged spoilers policy for new release stuff on the server and I try not to be a dickhead about breaking it.

#

Anyways yeah, operative is really fun already

wooden orbit
#

They’d fit in perfectly

#

🥺

clever cobalt
#

Witchwarpers have cool fluff

surreal basin
#

i mean they seem conceptually like a less disruptive one compared to liek soldier

#

like

clever cobalt
#

Unfortunately I'm a martial enjoyer PensiveCowboy

limber comet
#

I mean you can still play a soldier in pf2e

#

It just limits your options HEAVILY

surreal basin
#

you would have to do melee

limber comet
#

Yeah

#

Which is a cool concept tho

clever cobalt
#

Or be from space

limber comet
#

Or live in Numeria

surreal basin
#

well but even then youll run out of ammo withot some serious narrative contrivence

#

and idk if soldier would really fit the existing pf2e dynamic

clever cobalt
#

One dumb concept I had for a character and/or game was basically "a spaceship gets shot through time due to Drift shenanigans and ends up in ancient Golarion"

clever cobalt
#

Are any of the classes good with melee anyways

surreal basin
#

th operative and soldier subclasses seem fine

#

none are melee focused other than solarion because ranged combat is the default in sf

limber comet
#

I mean the melee soldier could probably fit as like the stereotypical dwarf with a big fucking weapon in heavy armor

surreal basin
#

just like melee is the default in pf

limber comet
#

Solarian does GREAT in melee

clever cobalt
#

Mhm

clever cobalt
novel jacinth
tough perch
#

haven't played yet but from what i see i really like the way sf2e is being balanced

#

so far

#

it's not concerned on what pf2e is doing, but is landing in somewhat the same ballpark, powerwise

#

i kinda want some material focused on crossover

#

like, scifantasy animal companions for people to play a ranger

#

or a "its probably a good idea to raise full casters hp from d6 to d8"

#

but like, as a secondary thing instead of a full rulebook

limber comet
#

I mean tbf most basic animal companions work with reflavoring

tough perch
#

sure it's not essential or anything

#

but i'd like some stuff like a headcrab pet

#

but animal companion is the first thing i thought of

#

could have a sorcerous bloodline or witch patron

limber comet
#

I mean some specific character options for pf2e classes would be nice

upbeat ridge
#

theyre saying "yeah you need pf2e core for this so we dont have to re print all the fucking rules this playtest document is over 250 pages without it"

limber comet
#

Huh?

upbeat ridge
limber comet
#

Ahhh gotcha

upbeat ridge
#

but yeah

limber comet
#

Right gotcha

#

Yeah they're doing a gm, player, and alien core for sf2e

upbeat ridge
#

yeh

limber comet
#

I do hope sf2e ALSO gets an npc core

#

Probably won't

#

But it would be handy

#

Even as a through and through player, having an npc book makes it easy for me to build a backstory

tough perch
#

it's possible

#

if sf2e is successful enough

limber comet
#

I mean I guess they'd wanna get a few more aliens into the mix beforehand lol

uneven wren
upbeat ridge
#

yeah its like

ocean cobalt
#

what's the difference between alien core and npc core

upbeat ridge
#

literally the same base rules and numbers scaling

limber comet
uneven wren
#

Ah good that clears things up

#

Me at the gathering

#

"this is NPC core"

ocean cobalt
#

i think in starfinder they can get more flexible w that

#

if barathu are any indication

limber comet
#

Ah pff maybe

#

I was moreso referring to the collection of statblocks found in like Interstellar Species in 1e

ocean cobalt
#

wait like specific individual people?

limber comet
#

Nah, but it's like "this is an astrozoan spy statblock" or "a kalo paladin" or whatever

ocean cobalt
#

yeah i mean i dont think see any reason for that to be separate from the monster manual type thing in 2e

limber comet
#

Because pf2e is getting an npc core

#

Lol

ocean cobalt
#

i assume in 1e it was like that bc they were built using the pc creation rules but in 2e thats not the thing

ocean cobalt
#

guess im still sort of at a loss from what differentiates that from alien core 2 tho

limber comet
#

Well a monster core type book can have npcs, but an npc book doesn't have monsters

#

Like, your glass serpents and ferrofluid oozes

ocean cobalt
#

this is true

#

my thinking was in starfinder theres just so much more variety to the stuff you can talk to and get a response from that for those purposes basically everything is an npc

#

but i guess there are still like space animals n shit

#

wampas, etc

#

oh to respond to class discussion earlier i think envoy and both casters would fit really nicely in pathfinder

limber comet
#

There's a Lot of monsters in starfinder 1e lol

ocean cobalt
#

mystic has the sorcerer issue of "this is flavor that could be done so much better by a class dedicated to this specific thing" but mystic is sweet enough for that not to matter to me

#

genuinely i think my favorite -finder class in the whole thing, barring maybe summoner

tough perch
#

i get the confusion, barathu looks like something that'd be in monster core

#

but barathu npcs would be npc core

limber comet
#

Tl;dr if it is a playable ancestry it's going in npc core

#

Though I suppose the next book is probably going to be a "tech core" or something

#

Considering technomancer and mechanic are coming

#

Mechs getting put back in so soon would be really funny

novel jacinth
#

Okay yeah, no spoilers, but Cosmic Birthday has me hooked.

#

The system itself is a blast to play with.

limber comet
#

I'm excited to hopefully continue

#

Rance was running me and a few others through it

novel jacinth
#

Playin' it with my weekly online group myself

fossil temple
#

Why this is hilarious

image.png
limber comet
#

Me when I see Chilchuck

upbeat ridge
#

the consensus is that operator is really good right?

#

hair trigger seems buuuusted

#

i feel like it could be not overpowered if you cant use it on someone thats benefitting from any amount of cover

limber comet
#

Operative is quite good

upbeat ridge
novel jacinth
#

I haven't got hair trigger yet but like

#

yeah operative is fun as hell

upbeat ridge
#

well...

#

it would unload your gun

novel jacinth
#

sniper at 9th with their enhanced exploit seems silly. you basically get a free attack reroll if you miss your first shot.

upbeat ridge
#

christ

#

gunslinger wishes it was this

novel jacinth
#

the text is more or less that when you miss your marked target for the first time, you negate your MAP penalty for your next attack and ignore the unwieldy tag on your sniper rifles. in practice it is basically a reroll.

warped orbit
novel jacinth
#

yeah I get that one

#

reload being an action is a little weird, it feels like.

#

hard to say completely yet because I've only played a few encounters

upbeat ridge
#

arent there not any area weapons in pf rn? that soilder could use

novel merlin
#

there are no area weapon in pf2e

upbeat ridge
#

yeah

novel jacinth
#

with how compatible pf2e and sf2e are meant to be, I could see just reflavoring something from sf2e to work in pf2e's setting

upbeat ridge
#

i thought i heard theyre adding some in the tian xia player guide

upbeat ridge
#

mechanically/balance wise though? might take slightly more work

#

but it is good that theyre making the pf classes unique

#

its cool that commander is basically prepared and envoy is spontaneous like casters with thier abilites

ocean cobalt
#

do any of them need reflavoring particularly

upbeat ridge
#

not much at all

ocean cobalt
#

mystic n witchwarper are just "druid to the left" and "wizard to the left" as presented by the lore and envoy and operative are "guy"

novel merlin
#

Going pf > sf seems pretty fine but I think a lot of the sf > pf classes are absurdly good at ranged stuff like nothing in pf

upbeat ridge
novel merlin
#

Especially if you're using actual sf guns

upbeat ridge
#

i would assume anything from sf in pf is like

#

a tier above rare

#

and, im not about to say that operative is better gunslinger but its really good

#

but gunslinger has a bit more team support

ocean cobalt
#

operative feels like more focused gunslinger yea

novel merlin
#

I mean its "ask your gm" just like anything above uncommon rarity the same way "can I have a sword that deals fire damage base" is something you can ask your gm about

ocean cobalt
#

operative is the fighter with guns to gunslinger's gunslinger with guns

upbeat ridge
#

yeah but im sure that operator will work with pf guns just fine

ocean cobalt
#

does operative get reload bonuses

#

feel like gunslinger would be. not nerfed i guess

#

but like stiffed with starfinder guns bc so much of the gunslinger's shit is trying to make the reload action good

novel jacinth
#

I don't thiiiiink so, it just gets stuff to make reloading easier.

#

like 1st level gets you mobile reload that lets you reload and then get a free movement, and 16th level just straight-up lets you reload as a free action.

ocean cobalt
#

ah of course lol

#

hm that one operative subclass getting hair trigger for free does kinda free up your level 2 to do archetype stuff

#

assuming hair trigger stays a) at all b) as a feat and c) given to that subclass free and that archetypes look anything like pathfinder archetypes lol

tough perch
#

i think archetypes staying the same is a safe bet

tough perch
#

a sniper gunslinger could feel good with an assassin rifle