dark miku is fucking peak
#POKÉMON CENTER
languid lichen
dark and ground are far and away my favorites
ghost and fighting mikus are my second set of picks
near flower
YES A FELLOW GATORHEAD
placid hull
Does anybody have cool mythological names for a Golisopod
south laurel
Beldum!
pliant violet
bedlum
fickle thicket
Pop quiz which one of these is psychic and which is normal
pliant violet
wrong channel gk
torpid escarp
Pop quiz which one of these is psychic and which is normal
normal
and i think the first one is the psychic one
round perch
red rampart
near flower
omg
sandile!
languid lichen
placid hull
new pixelmon successor?
It's better tbh, all the pokemon stuff is integrated into Minecraft, you have to craft your own pokeballs and such
Which actually gives copper a use!
languid lichen
you could/had to do that in pixelmon
outside of multiplayer servers and/or iirc some optional settings
placid hull
I heard it wasn't as integrated as Cobblemon
Plus the 3d models of Pixelmon are just. They take me out of it lol
south laurel
god damn it I snrrrked
fickle thicket
man now I gotta watch that video again
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTQn3sRhdF4 there it is
placid hull
trail bridge
I was today years old when I found out about the Ultra Beast trailers Pokemon Go did
placid hull
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zI88M3q3SE&list=PLvyyScTn93OBVCL8ZYwXe7rmTexK2r...
Genuinely unsettling, jeez
azure crane
blissful needle
trail bridge
SUPREME DEFENSE
trail bridge
languid lichen
yeah, they all die to choice band landorus-therian
also i mislike the use of "regular" as a label when it probably means het by context
but probably isn't definitely so hey
red rampart
That's the joke yeah
languid lichen
<- too autistic to be sure
but i should probably give lancer server more slack than that
trail bridge
Oh! Sorry
near flower
the basis for that meme is also ancient
like early 2000s
so 'regular' was the term back then in... i think JP spaces? nowadays 'het' is indeed used instead, for reasons that are obvious
blissful needle
placid hull
But my lord, there is no such force!
Sauromon:
red rampart
Do they have a friend that knows heatwave? I think that would solve the problem
arctic dagger
Hello I'm here to recommend people play Pokemon Reborn again
It's great if you can handle all the trauma
blissful needle
first moments of the game is the game telling you you are going to a region forsaken by god and everyone else
a train explodes
and then "go your merry way"
arctic dagger
It is in fact an edgy fan game
For me the amazing parts was more.... Eighteen gyms, all Pokemon up to gen 8, all normal possible starters plus Porygon, Eevee, and Vulpix iirc
All gyms are six Pokemon that have real strategies
Fully customizable difficulty, I basically turned off IVs and evs for instance
Difficulty is set to be hard at base assuming you use items sometimes and aren't doing a nuzlocke
No big changes to Pokemon or
Movesets
But has a somewhat complex location system where the field you're in can change a lot of moves powers and effects
And pretty much everywhere has some kind of field by default and moves can change them
For instance if you're in the water field and you use sludge wave it can covert it to the toxic field
Grass can be set on fire, which can then be snuffed out, going from grass to fire to ash fields
So managing the fields becomes pretty important
But the UI is good on helping you on what moves are better or worse or can change the field
By the end of it I was looking up competitive strategies to be able to get through the elite 4
Because they're using competitive strategies on you
I ended up catching most of the Pokemon in the game just to have more options to tailor my team to big fights, treating each one like a puzzle
That said, it is an edgy fan game. It has a lot of content warnings, but I think it's mostly decent writing at least.
wispy yarrow
Radical Red is still my preferred romhack
manic kindle
the more romhacks i play, the less i care about stuff like "all pokemon available" stuff, since i care more about meaningful pokemon placement / sensical placements
as far as original stuff goes, Pokemon Dreams and Pokemon Gaia are real standouts for me for the enjoyable story/pacing, and Pokemon Unbound and Inclement Emerald for the difficulty challenges, and then the funniest one i've touched is Pokemon Elite Redux which is "what if pokemon had 4 abilities like a fire emblem character" and its very goofy
Elite Redux also has my favorite quality of life changed for 'difficulty' hacks, which is just:
You'll get a new Candy Box (unlimited rare candies) so you can switch teams often to try out new strategies. Rare Candies have Gen 8 mechanics, which means you can evolve at the Level Cap. You can either level up to 4 levels at a time or jump directly to the current Level Cap to save time!
arctic dagger
Yeah, Reborn has that too basically
Well, I think it's... After the first gym you get it?
The big ones I don't like is when they're "difficulty hacks" but only if you're playing nuzlockes
manic kindle
i dont mind if thats the selling point / "this is a nuzlocke game"
pliant violet
it's hard but it doesn't feel bad for losing?
like hard romhacks i still feel bad about losing pokemon or whatever
emerald rogue i just sorta shrug and keep tryin to do my best
arctic dagger
Yeah
The hard romhacks that you're supposed to nuzlocke but it doesn't make you nuzlocke also feel like
Ok but why
I also really dislike the ones that do things that break the rules too hard I guess?
Like level 100 magikarp kind of deal
I want to lose vs things I could theoretically do
And also when I don't lose vs things like "This pokemon randomly happens to have sheer cold"
pliant violet
i like when the games are harder but in turn give you more tools
the drayano rom hacks do that well
torpid escarp
Elite Redux also has my favorite quality of life changed for 'difficulty' hacks,...
Elite Redux sounds incredible holy shit
arctic dagger
as far as original stuff goes, _Pokemon Dreams_ and _Pokemon Gaia_ are real stan...
I'm doing Unbound right now amusingly.
Been fun so far, although the story has been ehhhh
mellow robin
as far as original stuff goes, _Pokemon Dreams_ and _Pokemon Gaia_ are real stan...
pokemon gaia fan spotted
I loved that one
manic kindle
Its a fun one
pliant violet
I’ve not clicked through but if it’s not gladion imma be disappointed
arctic dagger
Very cute
manic kindle
Twitter
iron lake
@tardy folio tbh
tardy folio
woah charizard if awesome
south laurel
Squirtle line is my fave there
iron lake
all of these are good yeah
manic kindle
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1115790083828756581/1221530145873985647/n...
you did good work with these
south laurel
Not my work
Actually I should post the artist, right? Lemme find them
https://www.reddit.com/r/fakemon/comments/1blv2jw/the_starters_of_the_rebooted_kanto_region_who_is/ This was the source of the person who linked them to me
umbral hound
https://x.com/ZephyrBreezy/status/1771878949011726435?s=20
There is a certain art to winning (or at least placing high in) video game tournaments while dressed in extremely silly ways.
placid hull
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1115790083828756581/1221530145873985647/n...
Oh this is really good, the Char line is actually significantly more appealing here. Charmander still being in the egg adds 2 million more percent charm
manic kindle
https://youtu.be/ppyM6EWkn4k?si=ZlIkqsvmQj2MSdxV
I really appreciate niche videos like this. Love to hear about the intricacies of RBY NU tier shifts
eager vine
which design variant looks best, chat
south laurel
fickle thicket
this week's episode really has everything
arctic dagger
Beautiful.
pliant violet
Might actually use it now
snow cobalt
red rampart
🥺
snow cobalt
i did not know about bidoof day but now it has made me happy
south laurel
https://vxtwitter.com/hsinhsung9487/status/1774488764078870978
@pliant violet
Oh wait you already saw
Sorry for the ping I didn't scroll down
south laurel
:D
round perch
south laurel
soft isleBOT
south laurel
“I just wanna play with Masquerain”
soft isleBOT
VGC is also fun for this
we built a team around Umbreon in the SwSh days and had a lot of success with it even though it was very much an off-meta pick
snow cobalt
niiiiiice
soft isleBOT
Snarl/Protect/Wish/Foul Play, don’t remember the hold item
Might’ve been Sitrus Berry
manic kindle
its truly great that there is a time and tier for your blorbo to have a solid niche
umbral hound
https://www.tumblr.com/ouroborosorder/746678937736953856/god-competitive-pokemon...
but, yeah, exactly. Smogon is the format where you can play whatever pokemon you want without worrying as much about it being the strongest. VGC is the format where a lot of pokemon are basically unplayable. And... you can use pokemon in higher tiers if you want to. Most people kind of act like you can't in practice, or act like the gulf between tiers is enormous, because that's the easier way to teambuild... but it's only locking out the too-strong pokemon.
manic kindle
You have to go into it understanding that you are likely making a meta call that can/may make your team weaker, and if you accept that, you can do anything
The most important thing that can be hard to learn in pokemon is role compression / niches
umbral hound
yeah. WolfeyVGC did a whole video about winning with your faves, and he said something which honestly applies to most forms of creation (teambuilding, deckbuilding, writing, probably more): if you want to do something unusual, lean into that and figure out what it's best at. Don't just make it a worse version of something good.
For instance... I have not built a VGC team ever, I don't think? And it's even less likely that I've played it? I might have at some point, though. But my favorite pokemon is Sableye.
Sableye has Prankster. So do Tornadus and Thundrus, and they also have better stats, and arguably a better movepool. So the question at this point is: what can Sableye do better than them? And the answer is that it's natively immune to both Fake Out and Prankster Taunt, so if you give it a Focus Sash it's basically guaranteed to get at least one move off. Then that move can be Quash, or Will-o-Wisp, or even a weather setting move.
And being a slower prankster weather setter means being able to win weather wars, although that's... not especially a thing anymore.
snow cobalt
Lillie!!!
soft isleBOT
Her!!
south laurel
Lillie was good
soft isleBOT
We loved Sun/Moon. They're our favorite of the 3D games. 
Excellent characters.
south laurel
SuMo was great
soft isleBOT
(we also shipped her with the female PC which was fun)
pliant violet
USUM are better games in terms of gameplay imo
just a shame about... the story changes
pliant violet
(we also shipped her with the female PC which was fun)
official name is Selene
south laurel
USUM are better in terms of gameplay but worse in almost every other respect
south laurel
For me the ultimate indictment of USUM was removing the scene where you befriend your starter
Like
Why
Why do that
Was this scene too fun and involving?
pliant violet
nah the major issue is the way they changed the lusamine stuff to me
she was too forgiven
but alola has ya boy
so perfect games
red rampart
(we also shipped her with the female PC which was fun)
I mean who didn’t tbh
soft isleBOT
There were so many good characters in SuMo
soft isleBOT
Our boy!!
ReggiesWarOnEverything (He) ↩️
south laurel
He’s extremely well developed
Unfortunately messing up the Lusamine plot messes up his story as well
manic kindle
Let lusamine be an extremely evil vtuber mom she deserves it
round perch
(we also shipped her with the female PC which was fun)
Twitter
pliant violet
selene's bit is she's an archer
soft isleBOT
Yesss, we follow this artist!
Croft : He/They : ACAB ↩️
red rampart
soft isleBOT
pliant violet
i've never pictured umbreon with fur
it and espeon have always been like hairless cats in my mind
think it's the texturing
umbral hound
thinking about how if you describe the end of Scarlet/Violet, it sounds like something out of an unnecessarily edgy romhack.
like, every part of it.
umbral hound
||You battle against a robot copy of the professor, who's also the parent of one of your friends (although the original is dead), in order to shut down a time machine. Said professor uses a full team of pokemon from the distant past/future (depending on version), all of which are special versions of other pokemon, and you can't have possibly seen or fought any of them before unless you did multiplayer.||
snow cobalt
This is
Incredible
umbral hound
||Oh, and the AI Professor asks you to shut down the time machine but is programmed to try to stop you if you do. And then, once you beat their full team of six pokemon, the AI Professor personality gets shut down to run the Paradise Protection Protocol, where they send out a seventh pokemon and also lock all your pokeballs so you can't use your team. And once you beat them, they realize that they'll keep automatically restarting it as long as they're around and so they get into the time machine to travel to the distant past/future forever.||
(oh, for bonus points: prior to the endgame, nobody knew that ||the professor had died and been replaced with an AI copy they had made||, including ||their own son||.)
arctic dagger
I think it was pretty strongly implied that were very not ok and had been injured?
umbral hound
It was reasonably implied that ||the professor had been seriously injured||. But nobody knew that ||the professor was dead, since the AI just... pretended to be them.|| Meaning that ||Arven thought their parent had kind of just abandoned them, since the AI Professor was physically incapable of leaving their lab.||
Also, just for bonus points, ||glitchy text|| because why not.
snow cobalt
wild
umbral hound
Lemme see if I can find the thing I'm looking for.
red rampart
thinking about how if you describe the end of Scarlet/Violet, it sounds like som...
Is it pulled off better than an edgy fan game?
umbral hound
It's pulled off well.
Oh, yeah, one other thing just for sheer Power Move Energy: ||all the AI Professor's pokemon are stored in Master Balls. At the start of the battle, one falls out of the time machine, and the professor catches is and rests it on their palm as it shakes. Then they're standing on a tower way above you and drop the master balls down. Everything about it is just so incredibly wild.||
Even the game mechanical dialogue is different:
snow cobalt
scarvi really cooked huh
umbral hound
It really cooked. The DLC were a bit less good, narratively, but, but... they were still good? It's just that the main game was great.
The main game had character-driven storylines with characters who interacted with each other and had personalities, and then the DLC kind of returned to a standard "drive around your emotionless protagonist-bot and watch as people call you their friend" style.
red rampart
They did have ogerpon though so they have to be peak
umbral hound
I want to post some frames from the start of ||the second phase of the fight|| which I think I have to split into two posts:
Keep in mind that it's flickering through all of these frames in pretty rapid succession. (I'm not doing ever frame, but most of the changes at least.)
trail bridge
BUT HAVE YOU SEEN ||AI Sada has no intention of fighting anymore||
Oh you already posted it 👀
umbral hound
and there isn't really anything particularly relevant after that point.
There's more ||generic text glitching|| but not a ton else.
Keep in mind it goes through all those in about 5 seconds, with some extra flickering.
Romhackers have to work with the tools available to them in order to do edgy stuff; Game Freak gets to just make their own rules and break them whenever they want.
trail bridge
also I love how for the fight the music was composed by TOBY FOX
umbral hound
Honestly? I'm kind of annoyed that the Indigo Disk ||let you talk to a version/memory of the Professor and then they get kind of redeemed||.
azure crane
The entire area is a masterpiece.
umbral hound
It really is. Honestly? ||The walk down Area Zero|| simultaneously highlights how good the character writing can be, and how... absent the player character is from that writing. And it has to be like that; the entire point of the Pokemon games is that it's your Pokemon journey. They need to have a protagonist who's totally generic.
arctic dagger
I understand scarvi had problems on release but there was so much of the Internet mad at it, machinable I'm like "I'm pretty sure this is the best main Pokemon game ever made actually."
arctic dagger
I actually didn't even like b&w story that much personally
But I know it's generally a fan favorite
I'm a big Emerald Top Tier human
trail bridge
Emerald is great
umbral hound
And the "triple storyline" thing is good, but it's also another case of Pokemon taking two steps forward and one step back. It's great writing. Also, it's impossible to have Team Skull interact with any of the gyms in any way, or say a gym leader or Team Skull boss go "oh no, what's with the giant pokemon around here causing problems". So Team Skull... they don't do anything really bad, because they can't, because you can't have them interact with any other part of the game since there's no guarantee any given thing has or hasn't been done.
arctic dagger
Yeah I do think the three parallel paths was pretty whatever
umbral hound
It's kind of notable that all they do is skip school and they don't really cause problems or anything, but they're just... siloed off by necessity, and it hurts their narrative power.
arctic dagger
Also the whole "we were just as bad as the bullies for fighting back" thing makes me furious tbh
umbral hound
Siloing allows the game to be less linear in some ways, but... yeah, it isn't great. The issue is that you can't have a story with a series of linear events and have a world where you can go whenever you want, wherever you want.
umbral hound
Also the whole "we were just as bad as the bullies for fighting back" thing make...
I thought the entire point was that they weren't, but they got punished as badly as the bullies for fighting back, anyway.
arctic dagger
I'm a big proponent of open worlds are overrated
They did but then at the end Penny is like "we were being evil too"
umbral hound
Open worlds are overrated, but they feel like a good tonal fit for Pokemon in particular, since it's supposed to be a journey of exploration.
arctic dagger
Eh. I don't think any of the earlier ones needed it.
The issue imo is that I think an open world Pokemon game sounds cool but it can't really have the way a normal Pokemon game works
umbral hound
They did but then at the end Penny is like "we were being evil too"
I didn't remember it quite like that? Penny (which, by the way, is technically a spoiler, but it's a spoiler that isn't hard to guess and one that everyone knows by now anyway) seemed to want to be a martyr, but doesn't say she (or Team Star) was as bad as the bullies or did anything particularly wrong, besides skipping class and grand larceny.
Which is, admittedly, a hilarious sentence to type.
arctic dagger
Hmmm I thought I remembered it like that but I can't find the quotes I was thinking of offhand
umbral hound
Yeahhh I saw that in the trailer and I don't like it.
earnest nacelle
I do! I love Megas.
umbral hound
I like almost every individual mega, but I dislike the mechanic of mega evolution, if that makes sense?
earnest nacelle
Besides with all the BST 680 shit they've been pumping out Megas are just ok now
trail bridge
Mega Flygon...
umbral hound
Megas are set up as this kind of "super mode", but outside of very few circumstances, there's never any thought you need to put into when or how to use it within a match. They're usually just a stronger pokemon which can't hold an item and you can only have one of them on your team.
earnest nacelle
True
I can only think of Mega Sharpedo and Mega Gyarados
(Why Mega Gyarados gets Mold Breaker is confusing to me.)
Also did they get rid of EQ again? Huh
I saw Lando-T sets mostly run Earth Power now
umbral hound
It also preemptively discourages any of those pokemon ever getting an actual evolution. Which is sad for my scrungly Sableye, who has an excellent attacking movepool and basically no stats to speak of, period (and Prankster, at least).
arctic dagger
I can only think of Mega Sharpedo and Mega Gyarados
It's important for mega slowbro
Since he loses regenerator
So the decision on when to mega is really interesting
You can also do some fake outs with mega altaria
Where opponents can end up targeting dragon/fairy pretty differently than dragon/flying
Mostly it's relevant on defensive megas though
I seem to remember it's relevant for mega Venusaur too?
Yeah having chlorophyll or thick fat can really matter
The issue is that the strongest megas were mostly hyper offense
And those all you just hit the button for more stats
umbral hound
On the special side, Sableye gets:
- Shadow Ball
- Power Gem
- Snarl (meaningful for doubles)
- Icy Wind (see above, although this is more of just a utility move to begin with)
- Hex
- Dazzling Gleam
- Dark Pulse
- Energy Ball
- Giga Drain
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Nasty Plot
arctic dagger
It has real problems hitting steel for even neutral iirc
umbral hound
On the physical side, Sableye gets:
- Shadow Sneak
- Knock Off
- Shadow Claw
- Zen Headbutt
- Low Sweep
- Brick Break
- Fire/Thunder/Ice Punch
- Drain Punch
- Poison Jab
- X-Scissor
- Poltergeist
- Lash Out
- Throat Chop
- Gyro Ball
- Bulk Up
umbral hound
It has real problems hitting steel for even neutral iirc
Steel does not resist Ghost or Dark, I'm fairly sure.
arctic dagger
umbral hound
Mega Sableye goes up to 85 in both attacking stats, which is unfortunately still not good, but it's almost (not quite, but almost) okay.
Scroll down.
umbral hound
fair.
arctic dagger
I still think it's hilarious they nerfed steel type resists but in return gave it good offense vs the best type in the game
Poor psychic mostly just being fairy but worse
umbral hound
...I wish there was a Special Flying move. Like... a half-decent one, with decent distribution. There's Hurricane, which is good in rain but unreliable otherwise. There's Air Slash, which has decently good distribution, but half the pokemon that get it aren't even Flying-type. And that's kind of it.
Okay I'm vagueposting about Tornadus/Thundrus/Landorus/Enamorus. They literally would run terra flying terra blast. ...on a related note, I wish Springtide Storm would have perfect accuracy in rain like all of the others.
arctic dagger
Air slash is good lmao
Honestly I wish more types had power more like how flying does in survival
Special
80ish power with minor upsides or more but unreliable
I think all the 100/100 moves are bad for the game
Let alone the like 120/100 and stuff
Flamethrower vs fire blast is an interesting decision
But the only way you ever make an 80 power physical ground move and see it used is if people don't have access to earthquake or it does something actually nuts
Grumble grumble back in my day you had to set up to one shot people
Damn kids need to get off my lawn
fickle thicket
best story since B&W
sada and turo aren't named after plants, literally unplayable
pliant violet
Oh no one mentioned the theory that’s also possible
The portals aren’t to the past or future, they too perfectly mimic the books and the Pokémon from the past don’t match our understanding of ancient Pokémon
The portals are either to an alternate reality or bring forth what is believed to be on the other side of them
fickle thicket
but they they still aren't named after plants
manic kindle
The portals are either to an alternate reality or bring forth what is believed t...
I like to think of them similar to how the Unown worked in the Entei movie
umbral hound
Don't worry; the other professors still are.
yeah, I think the "alternate timelines" thing gets leaned into, in a section that really doesn't work with anything else in canon.
manic kindle
I'm of the mind that pokemon canon is not something to take seriously beyond each games individual canon
umbral hound
S/V has a book in the library which was written by a SwSh character, I think.
...the Pecharunt add-on content feels too... meme-y? Like, canon Nemona liked battling, fanon Nemona was obsessed with battling, and in the add-on she's lowkey obsessed with battling?
It does basically confirm that ||Penny's dad is Peony||, though. ...and also feels a "screw you" to everyone who theorized about ||Pecharunt controlling or influencing Kieran|| by very directly and dramatically countering that.
umbral hound
Yes.
It does mean that ||Penny and Bede are cousins||, I'm pretty sure (I'm not certain if ||Rose properly legally adopted Bede|| or not)).
pliant violet
it also means that ||penny has a sister||
||who her dad seems to care a lot more about||
umbral hound
If not for the aforementioned book, I'd almost wonder if ||Peonia was Penny||. But I suspect it's not an issue of ||his not caring||, so much as that ||he was sort of smothering both but (tearfully) let Penny go off for her education, whereas Peonia happened to be there. The difference in treatment was just based on who seemed to be in the same region with him at the time.||
round perch
I mean, Penny didn't exist at the time.
umbral hound
yeah. But I think that's getting watsonian vs doylist.
Unless you mean Penny hadn't been born at that point? Which is... possible; we don't know how long the gap between games is.
round perch
I mean Penny didn't exist as a character or concept at the point of cloud tundra. So probably what you were originally thinking.
round perch
yeah. But I think that's getting watsonian vs doylist.
Also I don't know what this means
umbral hound
Watsonian analysis means the Sherlock Holmes books were written by Watson. Doylist analysis means the Sherlock Holmes books were written by Arthur Conan Doyle.
Basically, you're offering a Doylist explanation (based on the context of the real world, outside the game) whereas I was offering a Watsonian anlysis (based on what was happening in-universe).
snow cobalt
Stepnist analysis (the Sherlock Holmes books were written by me, I determine reality via my perception of it)
round perch
Also I meant to respond to Reggie's message.
umbral hound
You're trying to answer the question "why did Game Freak do this" and I'm trying to answer the question "why did Peony do this" and neither's wrong.
...oops. Sorry.
umbral hound
...I do like how, in the DLC, it justifies and foreshadows ||Kieran having a Master Ball with which to capture Terapagos|| by ||giving you one as the Blueberry League champion, and saying that's the prize for becoming a champion — it only makes sense that a former champion would have one, too||!
Also, two more thoughts on Kieran:
- I am entirely convinced that his ace mon being ||Tera Fighting|| is the result of a typo somewhere. ||It being Fighting type makes absolutely no sense, and would, I think, make it the only pokemon in the game who terastallizes and doesn't have a move for its new type. And it makes no sense defensively. If it was Tera Fire, however, it would lose its weaknesses to Ice and Fairy, and get STAB with its Flamethrower.||
- ||Every trainer will, eventually, trade you a special pokemon. Kieran gives you an Applin. Which makes sense given his ace, but... we do know that, at least in Galar, giving someone an Applin as a gift is considered to be a declaration of love. And he isn't from Galar, certainly... but it's somewhat implied that the protagonist is
although how Kieran would know that is unclear.||
red rampart
Also, two more thoughts on Kieran:
- I am *entirely* convinced that his ace mon ...
That last bit is just making me go
umbral hound
Tera Blast
I forgot he had tera blast. ...being tera fire would work much better for an expansion about strategic depth in battles, though.
Tera Fighting keeps the fairy and flying weaknesses from the base form, and gives super-effective damage against... ice, and steel? (And Rock, but that was already weak to Grass.) Ice and Steel are also both weak to Fire, which turns the Ice 4x weakness and the Fairy 2x weakness into resistances.
eager vine
That last bit is just making me go
mfw the timeskip au comics
arctic dagger
I don't get it?
red rampart
The tweet he’s quoting is in response to this, I’m assuming he lost to rotom wash in a world championship
manic kindle
his rotom missed multiple moves in a row
and it cost him the game
he just has That Luck
arctic dagger
Gotcha, RIP
umbral hound
...what do you think the time difference between SwSh and SV is?
eager vine
not much
arctic dagger
Could be simultaneous TBH
eager vine
for what it's worth it was implied that penny was in galar not very long before s/v began
fickle thicket
realtime to the second
mellow robin
hard to tell without a world map but probably about an hour assuming they mimic the real world spain / britain
umbral hound
Could be simultaneous TBH
You know how Sonia was working on a book in SwSh? That book's in the library of the academy. So they're not simultaneous.
umbral hound
I wish the little post-Indigo Disk thing didn't try to ||make the Professor more sympathetic. I think it was fine having them be... not a monster, but also just not a good parent outright. Also the implied time loop stuff was unnecessary and dumb.||
I'm also remembering how (at least in Scarlet, which is the only one I saw stuff from directly), ||when you meet AI Sada, she just outright says "I'm a machine" and talks in a very... mechanical, straightforward, disaffected way. But once Arven shows up, she switches over to a more "human" speech style and being more emotional and saying she's proud and such.||
||And... I think that it's a conscious decision to do that. The AI professor is fundamentally not the other. But at least acting like a substitute for Arven, and offering him that bit of affection, even if he also knows it's (arguably) ingenuine...|| 😭
pliant violet
||My argument is the ai is a better parent than the real professor||
umbral hound
Honestly? I kind of agree. This is quickly drifting towards ||definition of personhood and degree of personal agency|| questions which I don't know how to get into. But... yeah.
To quote the character in question: "||What? Was preserving the time machine truly all the Professor cared for?||"
The other thought is that... well, the ||AI duplicate|| thing of course complicates the situation, but what does it say about a character when ||they can die, and nobody even notices for literal years?||
snow cobalt
||I'd definitely be more likely to think "huh, they've been acting really weird and out of character lately" than "they have been replaced by a robot clone"||
umbral hound
Arven doesn't ||call out the AI Professor as acting unusual until they start glitching. Which sort of implies one of the following:
- The real professor was always that disconnected and disaffected when talking about anything that wasn't their specific interest at the moment
- Arven doesn't have enough else to compare the behavior to.
- Arven's gotten used to the AI Professor, and just assumed this was how they talked now. ...and how they treated him now.||
And you're not wrong about that, but the fact still remains that ||100% of the Professor's interactions with other people were ones that the AI could convincingly fake and that weren't in person.||
The third of those points made me realize something horrifying. Imagine that you're Arven. ||Your parental figure has always been somewhat distant to you. Then something happens in Area Zero which he doesn't know the details of, involving a pokemon which was possibly notionally entrusted to him (it depends on when Arven gets Koraidon's/Miraidon's pokeball), and suddenly they go from occasional contact to basically no contact, and treating him just like any other student rather than as their actual son.|| How would you take that?
It really depends on when Arven got Koraidon/Miraidon, though. ...and by extension ||who gave it to him||.
He's surprised to the the legendary out and about... but he already had their pokeball before then. Actually, the wiki does more clearly explain the situation:
||One such Pokémon was Koraidon/Miraidon, which the professor brought to the lighthouse for safekeeping, instructing Arven to keep it a secret. However, multiple people ended up witnessing the Legendary Pokémon attacking several wild Pokémon, and the professor was forced to bring the Pokémon back to the Zero Lab. Arven would end up not seeing his parent again until the ending events of the game, causing him to blame and loathe the Legendary Pokémon for taking his parent away from him.||
Yes, he would absolutely ||blame the Legendary||. But there's also a very clear series of events here, based on the information Arven knew:||
- He was given a pokemon and told to take care of it and keep it a secret.
- He failed to keep it a secret, and people found out.
- His parent took the pokemon away from him, bringing it to their lab which he can't visit.
- At some point relatively soon thereafter, said parent completely ceases all in-person contact (of which there was very little to begin with) and starts treating him dispassionately and impartially.||
Now, we know why these things happened. But for Arven? Especially depending on how many years ago this happened? It would make a harsh kind of sense for him to assume that ||his parental figure abandoned him as a direct consequence of his mistake.||
I really wish we had at least some clue of the timeline at play here.
||"...That's the first time I've even heard herS/hisV voice in years, you know?"||
Quote from Arven, for which there is no good explanation.
||"Used to at least get emails sometimes. But even those stopped a couple years ago."||
Again, core question: ||did this stoppage occur before or after the professor's death?|| And, ||if the professor was killed in a territorial struggle between the two legendary Pokemon, how long was the gap between bringing the weaker one back there and the fatal accident? Or was it right before the events of the game, and that's why the legendary flies out immediately?||
umbral hound
Ohhh no. I thought of another reason Arven might not notice anything unusual: ||Even before the Professor's death, a nontrivial number of his interactions were with the AI to begin with.|| Although that fails to explain ||contact being cut off||.
umbral hound
Ten years before the events of Pokémon Scarlet and Violet, Professor SadaS/Professor TuroV started an expedition into Area Zero, setting up the Zero Lab.
Well, that sure is a fixed timeline. Also, some lore seems to imply that the professor ||died immediately before the game starts (and then there's a several-month timeskip before the Great Treasure Hunt)||.
umbral hound
And that has even worse implications (which don't match the above list of events and are bad in their own way)! Since it implies that ||the death of the professor isn't when they cut off email contact with Arven; it's when they resume contact with him (through the player).||
Oh! I had always wondered why some of the Area Zero pokemon were in there. As it turns out, it contains specifically White Flower Floette (white flowers, especially chrysanthemums, symbolize grief and are used in funerals) and many pokemon with designs based on moths (a symbol associated with death).
fickle thicket
hard to tell without a world map but probably about an hour assuming they mimic ...
heh
umbral hound
"The Way Home as katabasis" is not a take I was expecting to have, but it sure is a take I've been thinking about now. (You could try to connect the Area Zero pokemon to various psychopomps, too, but it would be extremely forced.)
Typically katabasis (in many versions) involves the abandonment of someone, typically due to the rescuer inadvertently breaking an oath (frequently an oath to not look at the dead person) and/or the dead person having already eaten the food there. And although they don't know it, The Way Home is fundamentally about ||an attempt to venture beneath the earth to find a dead person and retrieve them, only to discover that this task is impossible||. ...that might also be why there's specifically four waystations, and why in the fourth one ||the Professor died||: four is traditionally associated with death.
you could try to stretch the parallel further, but, nah.
soft isleBOT
feels weird Gen 2 OU doesn't have the item clause, though it's reasonable given how few hold items there are in gen 2
it's like "you get Leftovers! You get Leftovers! Everybody gets Leftovers!"
arctic dagger
I forgot gen2 had items TBH
soft isleBOT
most of them are pretty useless by the time you finish the third gym or so
manic kindle
its like... MiracleBerry, MysteryBerry, Leftovers, and then maybe a damage boost item but Leftovers in Gen2 is just too good to not take it
sometimes someone will try to randomly cheese you with King's Rock
soft isleBOT
we've been figuring out the team that our gen 2 OC would run which is why we're looking into this in the first place :P
manic kindle
Id love to see it once finished!
soft isleBOT
oh sure, we think it's about done anyway
-
Snorlax @Leftovers (F)
Curse
Double Edge
Sleep Talk
Rest-
Typhlosion @Leftovers (M)
Fire Blast
Dynamic Punch
Hidden Power Grass
Earthquake -
Umbreon @Leftovers (F)
Charm
Pursuit
Toxic
Rest -
Suicune @Leftovers (X)
Surf
Ice Beam
Rest
Roar -
Skarmory @Leftovers (F)
Whirlwind
Drill Peck
Rest
Curse -
Jolteon @Leftovers (M)
Baton Pass
Agility
Sunny Day
Thunderbolt
-
Sorry for the formatting, this is copied from our editor and it does this kind of indentation automatically
putting together an even half-decent team was kind of hard with the goals of having Umbreon, Suicune, and Typhlosion on the same roster
arctic dagger
Double edge over body slam on Snorlax surprises me
soft isleBOT
Double-Edge gives it better wallbreaking, and you're gonna be resting a lot with a RestTalk set anyway, so you don't care that much about the recoil
azure crane
Also, Gen 2 didn't have the ridiculous power creep of later generations. 130 in an attacking stat was as high as it got for anyone not named Mewtwo, but defenses were generally the same.
manic kindle
Its very interesting to see the different gen tier/metas develop
CurseLax remains a very scary guy from that era, terrifying power there.
azure crane
I found out that Belly Drum doesn't have a special message when used by a Contrary Pokémon.
D:
soft isleBOT
We'd never considered Belly Drum on a Pokemon with Contrary before! 
There should totally be a special message.
south laurel
Gen 2 is pretty interesting
pliant violet
genuine 2
fickle thicket
genuine: 2 is pretty interesting
south laurel
Genuinely
red rampart
We'd never considered Belly Drum on a Pokemon with Contrary before! <:buralaugh:...
Malamar used belly drum!
…why did you do this
soft isleBOT
we wonder what Gamefreak would have to do to make Flareon a seriously good Pokemon
arctic dagger
New ability
soft isleBOT
there's always the temptation to give it Drought or something ala Politoed though Weather's long since had its day
yeah that's what we're thinking
it's got most of the good physical damage moves
arctic dagger
It needs lower sp atk
And better speed too
Its defense stat is really low
If you swap defense or speed with sp atk
It becomes a good pokemon
But atm it's weak to ground/rock, two of the biggest physical attacking types
With low defense
AND low speed
Which just isn't forgivable
If you swap sp atk with defense it becomes the regional entei but worse probably
Which isn't a terrible place to be
soft isleBOT
Funny idea that they shouldn't actually do: give it Huge Power.
arctic dagger
If you swap it with speed it becomes a pretty good Flare Blitz, although it probably needs a steroid better than agility and a better ability than Flash Fire
Guts is kinda terrible since it can't be burned
soft isleBOT
yeah both its ability options are terrible
arctic dagger
So you deal with poison I guess?
Not great.
And takes the item slot
I'd consider giving it Fluffy
If you go the Defense route
Double damage from Fire Types is fine when you already resisted them
And then it's a VERY bulky physical wall vs a lot of stuff
soft isleBOT
Fluffy actually kinda fits with all the fur its got too
arctic dagger
That said IIRC most depictions of it in anime and stuff tend to have it as more offense and speed
THan defense
It doesn't LOOK like a physical tank
I could absolutely see it being a fire type speedy wallbreaker
If they did +Def/-SpAtt/Fluffy I'd probably make it a regional variant that looks a bit different
But I don't think they'd ever do regional variants of Eeveelutions
Be an interesting thought experiment to make them for all the types though
You're allowed to swap two stats and give it one ability, and then it probably gets a secondary type?
soft isleBOT
It would be cool if they did a regional variant of Umbreon that makes it Poison type, like it was originally intended to be.
arctic dagger
Hmm
umbral hound
Wasn't flareon notorious for not having a movepool worth beans?
snow cobalt
flareon was the only fully evolved fire type that could not learn solar beam
if i'm remembering the comic correctly
umbral hound
yeah, but... there's this guy who does a series of things that are each titled "the <x> theorem" and they're stuff like "why offensive stats aren't everything - the tyrantum theorem" or stuff like that, I'm pretty sure the Flareon Theorem was an episode about how movepool is important.
here are all of its non-Fire-type attacking moves, with the good ones in bold and the kind-of-okay ones in italics:
- Swift
- Covet
- Quick Attack
- Take Down
- Double Edge
- Tackle
- Smog
- Bite
- Last Resort
- Mud-Slap
- Facade
- Stored Power
- Dig
- Body Slam
- Shadow Ball
- Hyper Voice
- Giga Impact/Hyper Beam
- Tera Blast technically
- Weather Ball technically
- Endeavor
- Scorching Sands
- Alluring Voice
- Double Kick
- Flail
That's more than I was expecting, honestly. It has... moves which are... kind of coverage!
Though many of them (Scorching Sands and Alluring Voice in particular) are from newer generations. Also Trailblaze which I apparently forgot to add. So, uh.. never mind, it's got some moves.
Unfortunately many of its coverage moves are special and it's primarily a physical attacker. Just when I was thinking it was doing well.
If you want physical coverage, there's... trailblaze, for boosting an already-low speed, and... uhhh... not much.
near flower
flareon has had the same problem since its inception all the way back in gen 1: being a pokemon with a high attack stat and no great way to utilize it
gens 1-3: all fire moves are special, flareon's atk stat is pretty much useless
gens 4-now: theres exactly one (1) fire move that is physical, worth using, and not exclusive to other pokemon (flare blitz) (unless they introduced another 80+ power phys. fire move in swsh that i wouldnt know about because i didnt play those games)
manic kindle
Flareon's Guts is actually a fun niche in ZU
Makes them a very solid status blocker
Flare Blitz is still king because 120bp before STAB/boosts is nuts
arctic dagger
flareon has had the same problem since its inception all the way back in gen 1: ...
I mean at the time it was much better, since Shadow Ball was a physical attack for instance, and Hidden Power (Whatever) was considered agood move./
Eh, Fire POunch isn't awful IMO
Heat Crash is good too.
Situational though
Obz wouldn't be good on Flareon
Given Flareon has DOuble Kick, and Blaze Kick isn't a signature move anymore
That would make sense IMO
You kinda don't need anything but Flare Blitz though to be entirely honest.
The big problem is... What the fuck else do they do? XD
Facade/Guts is of course funny, but it's not STAB and it doesn't use Guts great.
It doesn't even get Crunch, just Bite
umbral hound
Yeah, that's The Flareon Problem: it simply does not have enough moves.
arctic dagger
Lesse... Trailblaze/Facade/Flare Blitz/Temper Flare maybe? Bring a choice band or scarf?
umbral hound
Why Facade?
arctic dagger
Trailblaze it should be noteworthy is super effective against all of its weak types
Because if you're running Flareon rihgt now you're probably doing Guts
And so it'll be 140 power?
umbral hound
Right, but how are you getting a status on it?
manic kindle
Flare Blitz, Facade, Superpower, and Quick Attack are reliable
umbral hound
It can't use a burn orb. It probably doesn't want to use a toxic orb.
arctic dagger
Swaps
manic kindle
Toxic Orb
arctic dagger
You don't use one IMO
manic kindle
Toxic Orb is its best in slot in ZU
arctic dagger
You run a band or scarf and hope to swap into something that statuses you
umbral hound
Ouch. I mean, that's how it is sometimes.
arctic dagger
I mean we were talking about it not being a good pokemon as the reason for this convo
XD
manic kindle
Rapidash getting Swords Dance and Heavy Duty Boots is the real killer for its niche
arctic dagger
If we do the defense swap and Fluffy, it can learn Curse
So we probably do something like Curse/Flare Blitz/Rest/Trailblazer
Pretend to be a weird Snorlax
umbral hound
...weird.
arctic dagger
Trailblazer and Curse together is uh
Obviously weird
But you need coverage SOMEHOW
near flower
I mean at the time it was much better, since Shadow Ball was a physical attack f...
i forgor about fire punch... too bad flareon aint got hands ✊ 🔥
arctic dagger
XD
Could just do a Cursetalk set
Curse/Rest/Sleep Talk/Flare Blitz
Oh hey actually, that'd be HILARIOUS
Keep it with Guts
Sleep Talk/Rest with Guts
XD
"Hello I am asleep and so I KILL YOU HARDER"
red rampart
Why is competitive pokemon so much fun to watch 
https://vxtwitter.com/playpokemon/status/1776560848531579022
eager vine
what do we think chat
trail bridge
ah, a classic
olive kayak
What I thought for some reason was "there should be an alternate forme ferrothorn that is filled with bees"
then again I'm the type of wacko who retires from competitive to nuzlocke Too Many Types.
trail bridge
🤔 there should be a pokemon thats just a hive of insects, like Wishiwashi
but it'd invalidate Vesipiquen
arctic dagger
She's already invalidated
trail bridge
😔 poor bee
trail bridge
azure crane
It can't use a burn orb. It probably doesn't want to use a toxic orb.
I've thought about running Tera Normal Flareon, to boost Facade and be able to be burned.
umbral hound
Oh that's spicy. And extremely, extremely weird.
manic kindle
near flower
snooting it up
fickle thicket
I keep finding it funny that box legends gradually got more and more godlike until gen 7 said "oh these guys are just from out of town actually"
languid lichen
it def peaked with gen 4, there
gen 6 was slightly less grandiose
and gen 5 was mostly just super powerful aliens
and then that was gen 7 too
manic kindle
rayquaza is my friend
languid lichen
I mean Rayquaza is also an alien isn't it?
n
groudon and kyogre are creators of earth and sea, and rayquaza was made to mediate them
and to protect the earth from extraplanetary threats
thematically, they represent the atmosphere vs groudon & kyogre's lithosphere and hydrosphere
deoxys is the extraterrestrial legend from that gen
manic kindle
and rayquaza has major beef with deoxys he was throwing hands immediately in oras and the movie
fickle thicket
and gen 5 was mostly just super powerful aliens
would you believe that I fully forgot about 5
what do zekrom and reshiram even do
manic kindle
snow cobalt
Thematically they become representations of ideals vs truth due to their mythological association with ancient Unova
south laurel
The problem is of course that in the narrative ideals and truth don’t mean anything
The difference between Black and White is that in one N stands with ideals and in the other he stands with truth
They are treated as interchangeable
This bothers me
More than it really should
arctic dagger
I always kinda figured it was pointing out N's philosophy was kinda dumb
More than anything about the legendaries
umbral hound
Except that it's supposed to point out that your actions represent the other one.
It's supposed to be an ideological conflict, except any set of actions could represent either side. N is treated as totally reasonable.
manic kindle
there is no right side when it comes to Truth vs Ideals
trying to find a right side is how you end up with Kyurem 😭
arctic dagger
I feel like "N is treated as totally reasonable" is a wild statement about Black/White
fickle thicket
Thematically they become representations of ideals vs truth due to their mytholo...
yeah I know what they represent but I'm kind of lost on what they actually do
aside from being high BST pokémon
languid lichen
nothing
snow cobalt
They're Excalibur
snow cobalt
The emblems of kingship and heroism
fickle thicket
like the way that kyogre creates the ocean or palkia governs time or yveltal casts die on everything
languid lichen
they're just power incarnate
fickle thicket
the wolves
fickle thicket
2 too? Aren't ho-oh and lugia specifically ruling class?
and also lugia protector of the oceans, which I guess kyogre can't do
languid lichen
ho-oh and lugia are just Legendary Creatures
lugia is a monstrously powerful aquatic pokemon
that "protects" its oceans
languid lichen
ho-oh is the boss of the beasts because it created them
snow cobalt
Lugia's relationship with the birds is more tangential
languid lichen
resurrected dead things and turned them into the three beasts
lugia just seems to keep the birds in line
not "be there to keep the birds in line"
languid lichen
and then in unova, the nameless dragon was just powerful
fickle thicket
necromancer
languid lichen
extraordinarily so
and two brothers argued about definitions and interpretations of the same ideal, so the dragon split itself in half to represent both of them
kyurem is the husk of the dragon, zekrom and reshiram are the brothers' companions
fickle thicket
and two brothers argued about definitions and interpretations of the same ideal,...
simp behavior
manic kindle
yeah I know what they represent but I'm kind of lost on what they actually *do*
...
they used to be a part of a Complete Being of Immense Power, and then they got split into 2.5 creatures
umbral hound
Alright. I should rephrase: I don't think N is completely reasonable. But the narrative sets it up as an ideological debate, where each side has at least some validity to their arguments.
manic kindle
It makes sense for N to think he's right up to this point, he's been set up to be a cult leader and raised in a very specific way to make him an extremist on his Pokemon freedom views
snow cobalt
Very funny to make an ideological debate the central conflict of your game. with a silent protagonist
umbral hound
Even funnier when the rival represents one of two ideologies which you're establishing as opposites, but have determined that you must be able to use the exact same dialogue and events to represent either side.
snow cobalt
I really do love Gen V
but. yeah.
manic kindle
i always read it as "there is no meaningful difference, the brothers were huge goobers"
arctic dagger
That was my take
languid lichen
i always read it as "there is no meaningful difference, the brothers were huge ...
this + N was raised by a cult in total ignorance
with an extremely cultivated understanding of the world
and is just maximum conviction with zero experience
the dragons respect and respond to conviction
and are there to be power behind it, not any kind of idealogical righteousness
earnest nacelle
I don't think we're ever supposed to take Team Plasma's words in good faith at any point in the game
Remember, Ghetsis makes that Freudian slip in his very first speech.
Something like "It will give me power - I mean the Pokemon power"
I liked original Sun/Moon story better :V
soft isleBOT
they were cooking when they wrote Sun/Moon
earnest nacelle
Yup
Also Nemona and Arven are definite upgrades to your cardboard cutout friends in XY
Although I do appreciate them trying to give you more of a background than in RBY
round perch
The show proves Plasma wrong on a few levels top, with a lot of pokemon choosing their trainers.
The games don't get the opportunity go into detail about how people treat pokemon. At least not in gen 5.
I think Plasma would have worked more in Kalos, when mrga evos were introduced, alongside of the concept that it hurts your pokemon.
arctic dagger
Incorrect!
There's no indication in Kalos it hurts your pokemon
It's only in later gens that's talked about at all
Not until XY even IIRC
fickle thicket
Also Nemona and Arven are definite upgrades to your cardboard cutout friends in ...
man, wasn't that something
"this guy is so bonkers cool, let's give him a super cool nickname!" and I'm just
I walked fifty meters to meet you for the first time
two minutes ago
round perch
Not until XY even IIRC
Uhhh... isn't Kalos XY?
arctic dagger
Sure.
It was post the OG games
I think it was the Ultra Sun/Moon dex entries that had like, all the horrifying detail stuff though?
round perch
Okay, fair, but my point is that Plasma would work better in a mega evo centered region/story. But also probably in a spin off.
Spin offs are allowed to he weird and I imagine you can do a lot of different stuff with mechanics and the plot.
azure crane
Yeah, I remember a lot of the Pokédex entries for megas were like, "This Pokémon is in a lot of pain and is hyperviolent!" And then Mega Altaria's says something like "Mega evolution gives it confidence and it's the life of the party."
azure crane
Pinsir is like, "Whee, I can fly now!"
And the Slowpoke inside Mega Slowbro is just chilling.
arctic dagger
Yeah, meanwhile the dex entry for mega pinsir is like "IT IS DYING AND SLOWBRO IS BEING CONSUMED ALIVE" or some shit
Lmao
I kinda just ended up those as being alola being jealous of kalos having cool megas or something
When all they had was Z moves
XD
azure crane
Also, remember Pokedex entries are written by 10 year olds. See also the Cubone skull thing.
red rampart
Looking at some of the mega entries and like... you're telling me this thing causes people to die of shock? It's adorable!
arctic dagger
I mean
It's supernatural fear aura
It doesn't matter what it looks like it's Dark Energy/Magic
But yes I also doubt that
I just think "It's cute tho'" is a bad reason
XD
fickle thicket
I always took the SM/USUM dex entries as rotom taking the piss
cerulean dune
Yeah, I remember a lot of the Pokédex entries for megas were like, "This Pokémon...
Mega Salamence's Sun/Moon entries feel like someone managed to sneak them in:
south laurel
I've heard there were specific people who disliked megas on the dev team for SuMo? Might just be a rumor tho.
olive kayak
I think it's more the revolving door gimmick thing just started getting out of control around SuMo, a new gimmick sells more than the old gimmick repeated, and the culture at gamefreak/tpci really started to shift towards short view pushing vs quality around that time.
At this point it's hard to call them anything but a shovelware farm, and I hope they get their act together.
Pokemon is too big to fail so I'm pretty sure at SOME point they'll catch themselves and release something as good as gens 4 and 5 again.
south laurel
I mean SuMo was really good
USUM sucked in terms of story changes but was mechanically fine
olive kayak
SuMo was undercooked and USUM was kinda the 1.0 version, and honestly even still missed a lot of the beats we were teased, like the whole Po Town arc. I still liked them, I generally put them as the last good ones, but they really fell short of what was promised and USUM was honestly the last straw for me, after playing it I was done. That was the "we finished your game", on the same level as Platinum but far, far moreso.
round perch
I kinda feel like the Alola region was smaller than other regions.
Maybe it was the island hoping.
torpid pivot
I loved Alola tbh, but I'm biased toward the comfy aesthetic (And the best Evil Team we've had in years )
pliant violet
it's ya boy
languid lichen
destruction in human form
pliant violet
fwiw i disagree with the pushing vs quality narrative
olive kayak
Team Skull is definitely the best evil team
olive kayak
fwiw i disagree with the pushing vs quality narrative
go for it, but play scarlet and violet first
If you have, and you think the number of sev 2 bugs are fine, idk. I guess I hold them to a higher standard.
red rampart
Scarlet and violet are pretty well liked around here
olive kayak
Gotcha.
pliant violet
sev 2?
i played them and had a good time
not my favourite but still enjoyable games
and i'm a big fan of SWSH so
olive kayak
severity 2, impedes production or blocks user experience; softlocks, crashes, missing entities, exiting mandatory battles, those kind of issues; they were very bad on launch
That was my big problem with SWSH and especially SV
pliant violet
and i had none and no one i know had any
eager vine
samesies
olive kayak
Did you get it on launch or a rev 2 copy?
Rev 2 was pretty good
launch was super broken
we got it on launch >_>
pliant violet
i got it on launch
olive kayak
Well, I guess you guys managed to dodge everything. That, from what everything I read about the commonality of the issues, is kind of impressive.
I still hope game freak puts some effort into improvement, addressing tech debt, and moving away from a pushed release cadence, but I think they will because the whole industry is starting to trend back that way
I think the Age of Arena is over
or at least ending
GGG almost going bankrupt is definitely the canary in the coal mine.
pliant violet
and again disagree that it was pushed
red rampart
GGG? Age of Arena?
olive kayak
That's fair. I wasn't working there for SV, I got out of tpci a long time ago
olive kayak
GGG? Age of Arena?
Grinding Gear Games and a common term in the game dev industry for the buggy, rushed releases. The Elder Scrolls 2: Arena in 1997 is considered the historical landmark for the industry starting to do that.
and gotcha on liking SV around here, I mean yall can like what you wanna like
I speedrun Castlevania 2 who am I to judge
soft isleBOT
We hadn’t heard about GGG almost going under
Moogle King of Space ↩️
olive kayak
Yeah they had a spending crisis last year
buncha layoffs and offshoring happened
They've stabilized, but they're really leaning on POE2 for their valuation at this point.
If it flops as hard as a lot of people expect it's goodbye investors. Personally? I'm actually optimistic, but it depends on what they do. I keep hearing "Dark Souls meets Hades" and given how Sanctum is in 2024, that is concerning because they showed they understand neither
On the other hand that's the POE1 team, maybe all the people who get it are on the POE2 team
azure crane
I played Scarlet. I had one crash and a couple of times where I was stuck in a jump for a couple of seconds before being put back.
tardy folio
I had like no standout issues until a WHILE into postgame. Common handheld mode win
torpid pivot
I didn't encounter many issues but do feel like there's some clear like.. I'unno. They're shakier than other 'main' franchises by a wide margin
Next pokemon should just be an Octopath Style 2.5d, the crunchy pixels rarely betrayed
tardy folio
I'm still a little iffy on an HD2D Pokémon. They could just do something like bw but with higher res environment models and i'd be satisfied
... oh that kind of is hd2d huh
manic kindle
I moved Scarlett/Violet off of sd onto switch memory itself and stopped having issues at launch
Also.
olive kayak
yeah gens 4 and 5 were "HD2D"
I kinda liked how many stylistic elements gen 4 borrowed from ragnarok
RO is a big nostalgia trip for me I loved playing pokemon in a similar art style.
south laurel
Platinum is probably my favorite game in the franchise, really
SuMo coming in a close second
manic kindle
Pokemon Red is still a perfect video game to me, and has been since I was 6 when I got it.
round perch
SS, SuMo, Platinum
olive kayak
Platinum is still my fav as well though HGSS and BW2 are both close. I've also warmed up to Emerald a lot more after a couple nuzlockes.
manic kindle
Emerald has a very nice gameplay loop
olive kayak
Yeah. I don't like how much backtracking there is before fly, but that's my only gripe. If fly were placed more like it was in gens 1 and 2, it would be much smoother gameplay.
I think that's the only thing I would change about Emerald, is Fly from Wattson
manic kindle
I love backtracking in pokemon honestly, i like the meaningful journey and in rse you at least get a full loop to do it
You do the left side as a circle then the right as a circle
round perch
What do y'all want in the next games?
manic kindle
What do y'all want in the next games?
More of the same, mostly. If it aint broke
languid lichen
the ability to kill a charizard with my hands
olive kayak
the number of times it turns into "go back to mauville or slateport to get X" though really makes me wish for fly earlier. It depends on how your playthrough goes admittedly. I'm playing a pretty brutal romhack right now and oh GOD was there a lot of loops
home stretch though, time to die to elite 4
manic kindle
Yeah im only judging vanilla emerald
round perch
I just want a comfy region.
olive kayak
I mean that can also happen in vanilla, just less likely that you'll do more than a couple loops around
but maybe you want to get the flutes or pick up a game corner TM before flannery
round perch
Mayne give me a farm.
olive kayak
Bringing back the farm woudl be cool
round perch
Pokemon farm simulator should be a thing
olive kayak
That'd be a good game. Stardew but with pokemon battles? Yes.
manic kindle
I would play a Pokemon Concierge spinoff
snow cobalt
Pokemon farm simulator should be a thing
the Wii had Pokemon Ranch
olive kayak
Biggest thing I want: better fundamental focus, less centralizing new gimmick. We got megas, z moves, dynamax, tera, I want a generation that's NOT focused on that as a change of pace. Bring back one or more of the old ones, sure, but I don't think yet another gimmick focused playthrough is great.
round perch
Palworld but actual Pokémon.
olive kayak
I suspect we may see that
round perch
I hope
manic kindle
If only i could kill palworld forever
languid lichen
this but for pokemon
olive kayak
I mean, it's a DQM survival game. Pokemon's the new kid on the block there.
Can't hate on more monster taming games getting big and giving TPCi something to strive for.
I wanted to do something like this a long time ago with the Enemy Territory mod Rocket Elite
manic kindle
I dont care if its big i just actually hate palworld on its own merits
olive kayak
Oh I really hate survival crafting games too lol I just don't care if other people play it
They are SO not my genre.
round perch
I would live a pokemon filled with tons of good content. Something as big as HGSS
languid lichen
unfortunately, too many people bought swsh for that to happen
wispy yarrow
Reminds me of that one post
How lots of fans want a Pokemon game with so many regions, but only the original 150 or just the generation they grew up with, but not the stupid ones, only the cool ones, and the cool ones from the recent generations can stay
to be clear: I also want a big sprawling Pokemon game with neat stuff, not mocking you or anything
manic kindle
Im happy idc about others
wispy yarrow
I mean same
fickle thicket
At this point it's hard to call them anything but a shovelware farm, and I hope ...
didn't they release a statement on trying better in the future? I think shortly before indigo disk released?
arctic dagger
I would also caution us about being just like, overly negative. I know a lot of people who think Scarlet/Violet is some of the best pokemon ever made.
It certainly had a bunch of issues on release but
It has some super cool designs, a lot of the characters are really cool
snow cobalt
I would also caution us about being just like, overly negative. I know a lot of...
it gets pretty tiring when a pokemon thread turns into ways we wish Pokemon was different
arctic dagger
Yeah exactly.
fickle thicket
What do y'all want in the next games?
It's high time to update the core gameplay loop. It was designed for a game that hasn't existed since gen 6. (why is PP still in games without dungeons?)
And I'm not saying that that's a bad thing, but I am saying that this mismatch is holding things back. Can't innovate and not innovate at the same time.
The gen 7 trials were a great start.
That, and polish. Nintendo mainline-tier polish. I want to see Pokémon be given the care and attention it deserves. It's kind of embarrassing that new snap is still the best looking Switch Pokémon game.
arctic dagger
I want Scarlet/Violet's love for the companions, but with a more linear storyline. I want a reason to go do all the gyms again after I go through the main game, with both trainers and gym leaders that are actually somewhat challenging. I want cool new pokemon, which seems like a given at this point.
I want weaker pokemon than the paradox/ancient pokemon stuff.
2-3 legendaries on release, not like 15 legendary tier pokemon
I want more updates to older pokemon that can't keep up anymore
fickle thicket
I liked ORAS's legendary presence. Something to collect in postgame.
If only it had, you know
arctic dagger
No, what?
fickle thicket
the wholeass postgame that they took out
arctic dagger
Ah yeh.
fickle thicket
and not just took out but what was up with that "battle frontier project" thing???
arctic dagger
I loved the gym designs in Scarlet/Violet
fickle thicket
like sure if it isn't in the game, it isn't in the game
arctic dagger
As a note
fickle thicket
big whoop, I don't cry over spilled milk
arctic dagger
Those should def keep going
fickle thicket
but that's just rubbing in your face that you could've been playing emerald instead
arctic dagger
Uhm, give me more Nimona-type rivals, where they're just happy to be here.
I know rivals like Silver a lot of people like, but I'm super eh on them personally.
I don't like it when people are mean.
XD
fickle thicket
Personally I loved the trials
especially in USUM, where they provided some serious difficulty spikes
teamwiper ultra necrozma my beloved
languid lichen
Uhm, give me more Nimona-type rivals, where they're just happy to be here.
i mean, that was biancia, and then all of the gen 6 rivals, and then hau, and then hop, and then nemona
snow cobalt
lov hau
languid lichen
actually, i forgot may/brendan and then barry
literally every gen after 2 has had a minimum of one happy idiot rival
arctic dagger
Uh, I remember finding the X/Y rivals kinda annoying
fickle thicket
shoutout to calem/serena who, I'm not sure how you're supposed to interpret it, but seem to just get seriously depressed over losing to you over and over again
round perch
They need to offer us difficulty settings...
fickle thicket
They need to offer us difficulty settings...
seriously
shit, and some actual scaling too
fickle thicket
it's fine that the exp share is mandatory now; scale the game for it
round perch
I think we need more fresh blood in GF.
fickle thicket
(shoutout to XY being scaled for neither)
personally, I genuinely think GF itself is a bad idea at this point
arctic dagger
GF?
round perch
Monolith
arctic dagger
Nah some of the game design choices are juiced
...Not all of them.
DEF not all of them
But some are cool AF
Character writers are great
fickle thicket
Nah some of the game design choices are juiced
it's mostly GF's dev design choices that are just untenable
snow cobalt
I think "game freak should no longer exist" is leaning back into the tiring kind of negativity
arctic dagger
Like, dude took over the internet
fickle thicket
and leadership and management
arctic dagger
XD
round perch
I don't think they shouldn't exist. There needs to be some newer voices in the room. Maybe collab with other Nintendo studios.
fickle thicket
if they didn't have pokemon in their clutches they already wouldn't be existing anymore
red rampart
So about not turning the pokemon thread into complaining about pokemon
fickle thicket
proved as much with Town
round perch
They made gigabreaker which I remember hearing was good.
fickle thicket
maybe that's not the name, googling it returns a bunch of not Game Freak
wait I can just google them instead
round perch
I'm excited for ZA
fickle thicket
giga wrecker alt?
round perch
Yeah, Giga Wreaker might be it.
Finally getting, a city based RPG sounds fun.
fickle thicket
75-67-67-62 on metacritic depending on platform
which is, admittedly, better than little town hero
(64)
round perch
I think I'll get SV sometimes soon.
red rampart
Same
wispy yarrow
I want more games like Pokemon Colosseum
Give me a more tailored experience honestly
I also enjoyed getting to play a former member of a given Team
snow cobalt
Colosseum 3: N Is the Protagonist Now
wispy yarrow
lmao
snow cobalt
It would be thematically appropriate! Him being my favorite is entirely coincidental, obviously
snow cobalt
shout-out to DPP being when Pokemon Special/Adventures needed to start getting really creative with its protagonists
"they will be a comedy duo and also bodyguards"
near flower
all i want from a new pokemon game is for feraligatr to get swagfully buffed (which it deserves for being best mon ofc)
i want to see feraligatr at world championship
i want #GATORSWEEP to trend worldwide
i love my blue buddy
wispy yarrow
Exceptionally valid
eager vine
one lesbillion cheers erupt from the audience
olive kayak
caught up on the thread: I agree that focusing on the positives of pokemon is better and there's definitely a lot of that, and if you don't like what game freak is doing in the modern games we can be positive about pokemon romhacks and fan games
cos man, this is a GOLDEN AGE for fanmade pokemon right now
there are some really great games and if you have never played a romhack or a fan game, you're totally missing out
(anything by Drayano is god tier)
manic kindle
I would like to see more people play Pokemon Dreams.
olive kayak
also omg I would love a Colosseum game with N as the protag
that sounds like a GREAT game
I actually haven't played Dreams yet!
it wasn't on my immediate list because I'm a difficulty junkie
manic kindle
Dreams is just my ideal little Pokemon romhack that actually plays like a Pokemon game.
Its not a difficulty hack, or a nuzlocke hack, or a 10,000 pokemon on route 1 hack
olive kayak
❤️
manic kindle
Its just... a little Pokemon game with a story.
Also one of the main rivals mains a Dunsparce, so mad respect.
olive kayak
I like the Drayano hacks because they play like Pokemon games but have the difficulty of a challenging JRPG. Not kaizo hard, just like...dragon quest 3 hard.
gotta love the dunsparce
manic kindle
Pokemon Gaia is the other one I like to recommend for being spot-on on Pokemon flavor.
olive kayak
that one I have been told to play a few times
definitely going to take both of those recs when I need a break from whatever the hell I'm doing to myself
I mean right now I'm hardcore nuzlocking Too Many Types >_>
My partner dared me to do it
<_<
I have made it to Juan and I still have something resembling a box, I think I'm doing pretty well 😛
tbh, ninjask and haxorus are online now so hopefully I can just substitute baton pass cheese everything >_>
manic kindle
Gaia is fun and a little more difficulty/battle oriented but it has one of the best romhack storylines I've enjoyed, with a nice believable villain and an actual use of the Regis.
olive kayak
Nice 😄 yeah I like interesting battle challenges
final fantasy 5 is my favourite FF, for a bit of a reference point, I love it because you can finish it at such a low level by getting clever with the job system, and the game encourages you to do it instead of grinding
I absolutely adore a good puzzle boss
pliant violet
You called the Regi
fickle thicket
https://vxtwitter.com/sailornishin/status/1778794050226720986
is this a male VA?
anyway anime time
trail bridge
no, that's rice
fickle thicket
why is it so yellow
trail bridge
saffron colored, I think
fickle thicket
not that late night
fickle thicket
just the entire fucking leek
trail bridge
that's one of Sirfetch'd leeks i think
burger steak curry
where do they even get the meat for this?
fickle thicket
animals
we also eat the same animals that exist on our world, it's not so outlandish
trail bridge
...are there regular ass animals in the current pokemon continuity 🤔
fickle thicket
besides, isn't there a slowpoke tail curry
trail bridge
i mean yeah
fickle thicket
...are there regular ass animals in the current pokemon continuity 🤔
used to be but they got phased out pretty early on
trail bridge
besides, isn't there a slowpoke tail curry
but thats cause it doesn't really harm a slowpoke
fickle thicket
and even then I believe there's butterflies in alola
trail bridge
🤔
like, look at this Klawf al Ajillo
its made with Klawf Claws, which are also renewable
fickle thicket
gen 10 time for Pattox the renewable meat pokémon
lmao at ||liko rolling up to school with a secret undocumenten legendary pokémon in her bag like it won't escape IMMEDIATELY||
near flower
the pokemon curries are one of the things that make me regret not picking up SWSH
because theyre so cute
and i love JP style curry (and classic curry too of course)
trail bridge
yeah!
fickle thicket
this new OP seems kinda paldea focused. Hope they don't stick around for very long.
trail bridge
sidenote, i'm honestly hungry enough to eat the shed meat of a Veluza
near flower
the curries make me wish so badly the sandwiches in SV werent so...
fickle thicket
pop a joltik in your mouth whole
trail bridge
NOOOO
fickle thicket
lemon fruit gusher
trail bridge
the curries make me wish so badly the sandwiches in SV werent so...
some of the restaurant dishes kinda make up for it, but yeah I want curries back 😔
makes me wonder if there's gonna be a food gimmick in Legends ZA
i mean, there has to be
since its set in a French styled region
and the French are famous for their food
fickle thicket
I don't think game freak has ever let something like that stop them before
near flower
my kingdom for pokemon boeuf bourguinon
fickle thicket
but who was boeuf
near flower
boeufa deez
trail bridge
its so sad Ghetsis died of ligma
fickle thicket
boeufa deez
endless darkness spirit beam - get banished for 10,000 years
fickle thicket
WHERE ARE THE OTHER STUDENTS
near flower
endless darkness spirit beam - get banished for 10,000 years
NOOOOOOOOOooooooooooo...........
earnest nacelle
Endless Darkness Spirit Beam is Normal-type probably
tardy folio
Any #pokémonmastersex players in here?
i need friends. On my friend list
and also i like talking about it
earnest nacelle
I avoid using that specific hashtag
earnest nacelle
I don't play gacha games generally