dark tidings (Darktide for people in the searchbar)

[fierce marten]

Using the elite keystone the doggo is very good at finding specialists and killing them before I know they exist

Very good utility

I like the shield, the alt fire microstun works on bosses

It's a bit slow though to activate

[neat dew]

Trevor gonna be the real mvp of the group

[fierce marten]

I like the arbites grenade, it reminds me of krak grenades but you throw it faster. The grenade ammo is nonexistent with 4 arbites

[drowsy tusk]

im almost downloaded any yall want to do some gaming?

[fierce marten]

I found something to use aquila's on

An arbites helmet that doesnt completely cover the face

[drowsy vine]

yes

i gotta eat first tho

[drowsy tusk]

yibee

[white portal]

oh deara

I think I went with the laezel one as well. not fatalis, not the authoritarian, but the one in between

[drowsy vine]

Maul

[worldly talon]

I've been hearing almost nothing but Mauls and no Fatalists

Which is kind of annoying

(Because I picked Maul)

[white portal]

mood

[fierce marten]

I think I did fatalist, I was sad at least for lady arbites that there isnt a super loud that only shouts

[quiet escarp]

I ended up picking male Authoritarian and I'm kind of loving him. He's actually more like the Judge zealot than he might seem initially

[white portal]

So far I've had one of the veterans vaguely flirt with my mauler

[opaque crown]

I'm enjoying the shotpistol

[regal pendant]

Urgh

Game's been weirdly buggy all day

Must've disturbed some spaghetti code when they pushed the update

[worldly talon]

So far I've noticed weapon skins not showing up in inventory, the inventory randomly deleting my character's skin, and about a dozen 'unknown error' disconnections

[dull parrot]

its also having a big uptick in traffic.

[fierce marten]

Ive seen armless rejects

[heavy geyser]

That one is Kerillian!

[neat dew]

So soo many Arbites.

Marshall Vortern moved the entirety of his forces into space it seems.

[fierce marten]

End of space fiscal quarter is soon, the tithe need to be paid

[dull parrot]

Atoma isn't paying its Taxes?

https://tenor.com/view/angry-gary-oldman-everyone-gif-14317847

[fierce marten]

That's is really why they're here

[dull parrot]

Send in EVERYONE

to be honest if your sector capital was under a siege/insurrection I would be sending in the numbers.

[fierce marten]

That's what the arbites want to do, they want to setup a fortress and turn Atoma into a battlefield and brute force down to the bottom and kill all the cultists in a siege. Grendyl is taking a more surgical strike team method for whatever reason instead of like sending in waves of rejects

Also find planetary governor and get the tithes in one way or another

[signal current]

We’ve been having the issue of our audio breaking which is annoying when we’re doing character creation and want to hear the voices

[heavy geyser]

The Arbites are from Atoma, aren't they? They were here all along. That's their home.

Some admech mentioned exterminatus, which I can't imagine they'd like. I don't recall if that's this story or from one of the Mortis trial vox files I heard last night though

[fierce marten]

No part of arbites lore is they must leave the system they're from to prevent bias

[heavy geyser]

I mean the guys on the ship were stationed in Tertium.

[fierce marten]

Every arbites has 0 ties likely

[signal current]

ooh, new intro cutscene for the arbites

[fierce marten]

Yea I think they begun to setup the fortress

I dont know why they're using the mourning star for I assume another base of operations

[signal current]

Named our dog Godwin since we’ve been on a Anglo-Saxon history binge

[signal current]

Probably

Gives you a place that’s (mostly) guaranteed to be safe

[fierce marten]

The arbites intro didnt have much dialogue for that, it showed arbites just boarding the mourning star

[signal current]

You can pet the dog this is the best $15 we ever spent

[fierce marten]

Its sad you cant pet other people's dogs

[signal current]

Ended up going with female mauler

[worldly talon]

I named my dog Leman

If anybody important asks, he's named after the tank

[sonic elbow]

actually named after the endurance race

[heavy geyser]

its named after the fruit.

[fierce marten]

Legally distinct dog Leman Rust

[regal pendant]

Leman as in the froot

[vapid maple]

Greyndl called them in, that's why the arbites are using the ship as a launch point as she's offering her resources to help them fix the tithing issue

[signal current]

First match

4 arbites

[vapid maple]

It will be like that for a while

[signal current]

We’re not complaining just find it funny

[vapid maple]

The arbites are everywhere, but the marshal of the area called in the force stationed across it's various nearby locations (character creation has a last section where you pick which station your from, with your armor getting a different number) to answer the rogue trader's call

But these guys are not born from Atoma but from other planets around the system

[heavy geyser]

Ohhh right, I must have misinterpreted those stations as locations on Atoma.

I'm from the Bibliocrypt.

we're #libraryboys

[vapid maple]

Some are on Atoma, some are around, its just what the Marshall pulled in to fix the tithe issue

But your character is from whatever you pick on the character creation, which Atoma isn't an option

[fierce marten]

Huh the shotpistol kind of has a decent heavy swing

Not a lot of damage but has strong knockbac

[signal current]

4 dogs just running around tackling people

[heavy geyser]

The shotpistol has a surprisingly complex moveset all around its shield.

They have the push from neutral just tapping the alt fire button, the big swing from holding alt fire, a follow-up shot after the big swing and also a shove from tapping alt while shielding.

[fierce marten]

Does it? I only know about shield quick shove and the heavy attack

Oh I see thats neat

[drowsy vine]

the shotpistol is rad as fuck

[fierce marten]

It really is an all in one weapon. You can melee, range, block, shove

[drowsy vine]

you can even block while reloading and it'll stage your reload appropriately

[fierce marten]

Interesting how does that work

[drowsy vine]

just hold block while the reload animations are happening, it's quite seamless

you can't do both at the same time

[fierce marten]

Also trying to figure out if arbite has class weapon options for killing crushers fast or if I just need to use a generic weapon

[drowsy vine]

the single shock maul works well

[fierce marten]

Oh dang it has like an entirely different animation for it

They cooked with shotpistol

That staged reload is going to be nice

And you can MMB push while holding the staged reload amazing

[signal current]

We do love the fact you can equip a “weapon + shield” option in both slots

Dual wielding shields

[fierce marten]

Even if it was purely aesthetic I'd want the other shield to be on my back

So I looj like a riot turtle

[heavy geyser]

The goblin shark-looking variant of the arbites shotgun has a rending alt fire that seems to do well against crushers.

[fierce marten]

Oh right the brittleness one, but then I can't use the shotpistol

[signal current]

We imagine it’s meant to be the same shield and you’re just switching which weapon you pair it with but it’s still funny to imagine two shields

[heavy geyser]

The other answer is brittleness bite dog!

[signal current]

Oh right, we forgot we need to select talents

[fierce marten]

Dog just solves everything

[heavy geyser]

In the bottom left

d'ya like dags?

[fierce marten]

Ah ok I haven't leveled up that far

Im still pre nondefault ability

8 bleed talent like 3 points in on doggo's attack would be great with brittleness

[regal pendant]

...are Auric Maelstroms not a thing anymore?

Or Auric Heresy for that matter?

Oh, no, Maelstroms still exist, but my question regarding Auric Heresy stands

[drowsy vine]

Auric Heresy, nope

[drowsy vine]

Auric is now a standalone difficulty tier, placed above Damnation. We felt that Auric Heresy fell in an awkward spot compared to Damnation, with the increased mission options per difficulty, we decided it was best to turn Auric into its own difficulty level.

[regal pendant]

Makes sense

[regal pendant]

On that space wizard type shit

[cloud hazel]

apparently you can take the double barrel

and up its ammo to 3 with arbites perks

[regal pendant]

Loch n Load-core

[cloud hazel]

LITERALLY

[brazen fossil]

The +15% ammo round up on the arbiters is really good with a lot of weapons

[drowsy vine]

I've seen it, can confirm

[cloud hazel]

it's the magic number!

[regal pendant]

Of the De La Soul variety or the Schoolhouse Rock variety

[cloud hazel]

how's the judge dredd shottie

[cloud hazel]

both

[drowsy vine]

Very good, it hits like a truck

[brazen fossil]

Swagging tbh

[white portal]

Is the thing that gives you 10% ammo back on kill worth the point (on the left hand skill)

Just cause most ranged weapons worth a darn are like... maybe 5 shot

[sonic elbow]

depends if it rounds up or does some weird thing

survivalist: reworked "saves up" for weapons with small ammo pools and it's still very good on them so I assume they implemented something similar here

if it rounds up it's straight up cracked

[drowsy vine]

Yes it is

it does round up, but keep in mind it's 10% ammo restored from reserve

It's not giving you ammo back

Just reloading you

[cloud hazel]

so

bottomless shotgun?

[white portal]

As long as you kill with each shot

Or a bottomless boltgun

[grave talon]

you got me at shotgun

[neat dew]

Less called them in and more had to acquiesce to Marshall Vortern’s demands since he was out of patience for her agents’ actions. “Y’all ain’t getting shit done fast enough, time for my Arbites to show you how it’s done.”

[shrewd kite]

the amount of damage reduction you can stack as arbites is kinda nuts

also i like that it has skills that reward perfect blocking, not that i know how to do that lol

[marsh gyro]

It's just blocking by pressing the block button within 0.3 seconds of the incoming hit, rather than keeping your block up for a while

[shrewd kite]

oh that's pretty generous

[marsh gyro]

It's super hype to do it to a crusher and also super funny when you mess up and get splattered

[shrewd kite]

although i feel like the right tree arbites wants to use the mace and shield and that has like a delay on the block that i don't care for

[shrewd kite]

wait, you can no-sell crusher hits with the shield? I guess i should have realised something was up when i was comfortably eating the karnaks' pistol shots with the shotgun shield

i feel like the left tree damage reduction aura is less immediately useful than the other two, but idk

depends how well it lets you wade into gunner fire on higher difficulties i suppose

[marsh gyro]

Yeah the shield has a higher minimum block time than like the other melee weapons like the power maul so you gotta commit the block longer - turns out the source code got updated fast this time so lots of good nuggets of info in it

[sonic elbow]

there were already a few sources of no-selling crushers, though they tend to the "questionable investment" side

[shrewd kite]

also like 80% of the players i've been running into (including me) have been using the judge dredd voice lol

[sonic elbow]

I'm very excited to go back to my devil's claw builds after the buffs

[drowsy vine]

you need certain talents to be able to block Elite, namely anything that says "your perfect blocks can block all Melee attacks"

[shrewd kite]

yeah i haven't looked at the patch notes in general at all tbh

anything notable in there for the other classes?

did they finally nerf dueling swords?

[drowsy vine]

By default perfect blocks cost less stamina and I think that's it - Devil's Claw Parries have a perfect parry mechanic built in though

Perfect parry will let you block overheads at minimal cost and do the riposte, where normally parrying the overhead immediately depletes stamina and stuns you

[sonic elbow]

iirc (it's been a while since my clawhead phase) the parry can also be a perfect block if you have sources of that

[drowsy vine]

nah

it has the mechanic built in

[marsh gyro]

Turns out the rending shells on the arbiter shotgun do 12 stacks of brittleness on a full shot (24 pellets, 0.5 stacks per pellet) so you need 2 shells to fully brittle out a baddie

[shrewd kite]

i've been building around electrocution, but the limit of 2 is pretty harsh on the mines

[sonic elbow]

I will never forgive them for psyker smite nodes and shock stick not interacting

okay no I don't feel strongly about it at all

but it could've been a fun build juicing two notoriously eh things

[drowsy vine]

@sonic elbow

[sonic elbow]

I'll get back to you once my suspiciously slow mobile data loads the clip

[shrewd kite]

i do like the female fatalist voice as well, might switch to that if 80% of other arbites are gonna be the dredd voice

[sonic elbow]

Nice

[marsh gyro]

Yeah I'm running female fatalist and it's pretty funny to see fatalist politely jab the other arbites

[sonic elbow]

but what I mean is that if you have talents that fire on a perfect block, a perfect parry will trigger them

[drowsy vine]

no idea!

[sonic elbow]

okay I'm talking out of my ass, I don't see a way to combine timed block effects and devil claw on one character

wonder where I got that from

[distant surge]

is devil claw considered a knife?

[sonic elbow]

...............I think I know where I got that from

kruber's longsword and its central part in my psyche

[sonic elbow]

depends, are you catchan

[distant surge]

[marsh gyro]

No, in the code it's in the folder for "Combat swords" compared to the knives which are "combat blades"

[distant surge]

Right

[marsh gyro]

Hotfix out:
https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1361210/view/520842750961124013?l=english
Of note: Fixed an issue where the 'Castigator's Stance' description didn't specify that it replenished all Toughness.

[fierce marten]

Whoa, so does the alt fire shoot all 3 or 2 shots?

[fierce marten]

Shotgun gamers are so back

[fierce marten]

Absolutely wild, I didn't realize it was per pellet

[marsh gyro]

Yeah and the arbites shotguns have kind of a 9 pellet minimum (different by armor type) so one solid shot and one half shot still hits 40% brittleness

[frank igloo]

oooh this fit is excellent

[spring lynx]

For Arbites I've been using the Mk V Combat Axe for melee. It has Cleave and Strike Down.

Still undecided on a ranged weapon. Currently rocking the Agripina Combat Shotgun

Think I need to get more familiar with the class specific weapons

[marsh gyro]

Combat axe and shotgun is super nice especially with brutal momentum

[fierce marten]

I like the idea of the shot pistol considering how complex the design is, but the other shotgun hits like a truck understandably compared to shot pistol. I never really played Ogyrn so I don't have the habit of blocking for extended periods of time

Melee weapons, I'm not really sure on at all if I want to stick to arbites weapons or go with classic human generic ones

[marsh gyro]

I think it depends if you go middle or right side on the tree

[opaque crown]

I like the shield because I can keep it up while aiming and just block loads of incidental gunner fire

I've been rocking both shields

The flashbang shield is awesome

Kinda wish I had access to bleed, but once I get more impact boosting traits, I'll be a control monster

Then run bonus impact blessing and bonus against staggered blessing

The shot pistol doesn't kill as well as the arbites shotgun for sure, I just like having that protection

[hexed rampart]

https://tenor.com/view/ogryn-stk-goedulf-spin-rotate-gif-5132349500874882306

[marsh gyro]

Shot pistol has like a 3x smaller spread than the big shotgun so it performs nice

2.5 radius compared to 6 radius

[hexed rampart]

I like the arbite shotgun alot but the bolt pistol is fun

[opaque crown]

I'm really split on which ult I want. The bash has a super fast cool down, the nuncio has a laundry list of positive effects, and the stance seems real good for a tank

[marsh gyro]

I've really liked leveling with the nuncio

[hexed rampart]

I'm going to try the stand firm thing to see how I like it.

It's going to take a bit till builds are found and we see more variety

[opaque crown]

the bash has been like... not super flashy, but very effective. You can pretty much bowl anything you want over with it

[hexed rampart]

The lone op seems interesting

[opaque crown]

i did play with a chad of an arbiter who was running no dog, shock mines, and bash, and they were just cruising

[hexed rampart]

That i can believe and might be something I try Eventually

Rn i want specials seeking dog and do dog blast while I bash and shoot crowds

I want to never see a trapper

[fierce marten]

The elite hunting keystone is amazing for this

It'll kill specialists you couldn't see in the horde or around corners

[opaque crown]

i currently have mine focusing shooters

[fierce marten]

Like a bomber that peaked out a doorway entrance for 2 seconds to throw then leave

I'm giving dog a good go, but I think no dog arbites might be for me with mines or grenades. The grenades are just fun but the mines are amazing they last so long you can safely just solo revive or do a puzzle without any support

Like if your teammates wanders off into the next zip code while you're doing the puzzle

[marsh gyro]

Interestingly enough you don't have to take a keystone and I kinda wonder what the default dog priorities are

[sonic elbow]

flashbang shield?

[drowsy tusk]

flashbang shield.

[grave talon]

Blitz moment

[fierce marten]

I think just anything close

It seems to have 2 priorities, elites/specialists in a small radius, then a bigger radius for everything else. If there's no elites/specialists like really close to it then it goes after a nearby poxwalkers most likely even if elites exist in the large radius

Keystone makes it so hound basically ignores poxwalkers and will run through a crowd for elites/specialists instead of whatever is close enough

I'm sure once arbites hype dies down we'll see bubble psykers so I'm not too concerned about gunners. Also if you ping a elite gunner and then emp blitz when the marker disappears you're gonna electrocute the entire pack of gunners probably

Electrocute is strong, it really just turns off enemies for a few seconds and super easy to do

[marsh gyro]

Easy on the nade pickups too, definitely feeling the lack of Vet super boxes leveling the dogtide

[fierce marten]

Yea the grenades are fun to use, but relying on grenade pickup hurts. I'll try a no dog with grenade build to see how it goes.

The mines are probably better for the no dog build though since you don't have dog to protect you just yeet mines

[neat dew]

Lexmate...this is not to code.

[split mantle]

I don't have Arbites, but.. The shotgun feels that little bit stronger now, and pairs well with the 1h chainsword.

[marsh gyro]

What blessings on the sword?

[split mantle]

Don't remember. But it chops through hordes nicely. Also tried another recon lasgun. It had ammo 27%. It promptly had no ammo.

[drowsy tusk]

damn they really brought back nostalgic crashtide with this update lol

[fierce marten]

Yea shotguns are great now

Also some old heavy hitters like eviscerator and devil's claw and tac ax

Eviscerator can finally damage more than 4 enemies in a swing with LMB

[frank igloo]

the shield and maul has an alternative mark btw, if youre not aware
the heavies are a strikedown with the maul and then a shield edge bash, and the lights are 2 horizontal and then 2 vertical (down and up)
its interesting
trying to figure out if i prefer it over the default mark

[fierce marten]

I hope old weapons get reworked one day, the new arbites weapons have quite a lot of unique mechanics for each

[opaque crown]

to clarify the shield and maul combo's weapon special is a conal stun in front of the shield. It charges up during combat and then you can effectively stun everything in front of you on demand

[fierce marten]

Yea theres a little green bar to indicate charge on the shield

Its very brief but strong stagger

[opaque crown]

great for making a bunch of ragers stagger

you can follow up with the bash ult to even more powerfully control them

and possibly in that time get another shield stun charged

arbites lockdown strats

[fierce marten]

It works on bosses too

Break them out of a grappe

[mortal crystal]

I got a gliched character

Apparently, you're not supposed to have this cosmetic on the arbites despite it being equipable yesterday

[fierce marten]

The helmet stays on

[spring lynx]

If it's in the gear list, it's to Code.

[fierce marten]

Not anymore

Oh you meant the ax

[hexed rampart]

I ended up making an arbite that looks like

https://tenor.com/view/go-go-go-war-boys-furiosa-a-mad-max-saga-lets-get-em-mad-max-gif-3449271955709914321

[split mantle]

I know SOF bad but er, I'm playing a 40k game, I can have some leeway to go 😌 over this getup.

[fierce marten]

Sof?

[split mantle]

Special Operations Forces, basically military elites.

[sonic elbow]

Smperium of Fan

[tough compass]

Hmm, how long is the "campaign". I may have made a mistake with agreeing to do it with my Psyker lol

[sonic elbow]

the getup looks very british to me and if any special forces would run with a Yes caliber shotgun, it'd be the brits

[tough compass]

I also feel like they oversold it lol

[split mantle]

Did try running a Recon Lasgun but er, 27% ammo.

Alder (it/its) ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) the getup looks very british to me and if any special forces would run with a Yes caliber shotgun, i…

[regal pendant]

It IS, that hugeass greatcoat cape with the leather robes and the fancy hat is so wizard-y and I love it

[spring lynx]

It's the pinnacle of being incredibly fucking extra, I love it

[frank igloo]

theres at least 16 missions

[tough compass]

So many. I think I'd be willing to skip it if the option to reset remembered all my background choices lol

[hexed rampart]

Many such cases with warhammer 40k

[frigid saffron]

I just learned tech

Ok so- the dog explosion button

last night I learned that it counts as ranged damage

it was brought up in a video like "Oh in a pinch you can use your dog explosion to reload your gun in castigators" and I was like "oh that's fun"

and then I remembered something today

Bolt pistol has these blessings

they apply to the dog

[spiral badger]

holy shit

[split mantle]

How do.. Oh no.

[frigid saffron]

one explosion applies 16 bleed stacks

[split mantle]

Explosive bleed doggy collar?

[fierce marten]

Holy

Instant max bleed doggo grenade? Lets goooo

Get you shredders grenades that barks

[marsh gyro]

Pump shotgun's kind of weird because the special shotgun shells top back up to 6 each ammo pickup so if you prioritize using the special shells first you boost the little ammo pickups from 8-ish a pickup to 14 which is a whole lot more blasting

[fierce marten]

The arbites with castigator reload a portion of magazine on gun kill seems very fun

The infiniite shotgun for the duration

[drowsy tusk]

<@&1042950387478560878> videogame darktide

[marsh gyro]

The curse of being stuck at work strikes again, can tide at <t:1750802747:t>

[fierce marten]

Oh nice now dogs dont target bursters unless you ping it

[tough compass]

I haven't played in forever, so I just recently got to experience the Force Greatsword: I like how it has a mastersword ranged slash ability

[fierce marten]

Its very fun

[marsh gyro]

The secret sauce is it does huge damage under 8-12 meters

[fierce marten]

Wow this one shots ragers

Only the unarmored one

Also one shot most specialists

[marsh gyro]

Still pretty good to get 2k damage off a reusable nade

[fierce marten]

Ye big dognade hours

[heavy geyser]

the new zealot pants have the "change walking sound" tag you see on peglegs but it has two normal boots. Does anyone know what the sound change does?

[distant surge]

i want to pet the dog as the Ogryn

[regal pendant]

...experienced a concerning bug

Completely lost control of my character, she just drifted off to the side and I couldn't move or attack or do anything

[hexed rampart]

Bad news. Jut it would be nice squadmates could pet them

But if enough people want it. They might as it

[drowsy tusk]

I’ll prolly be playing then as well

[distant surge]

me

dog

[regal pendant]

Lmao I named mine Barktide

[vapid maple]

So far enjoying how I can say "cut off his balls" and watch my dog fly at mach 10 into a rager before I explode it

[fierce marten]

Huh shotpistol has Scattershot/Manstopper

Crit and cleave city

[drowsy tusk]

Ticket on the Dog express to castration station

[hexed rampart]

If you follow slaanesh they grow back and like a bundle of grapes

[fierce marten]

You might grow even more than you had before

[hexed rampart]

🍇

[fierce marten]

Also using the shield to tank a sniper then ping it with dog feels good

[lost cave]

Oh something I just learned. If you decide to do the campaign but then change your mind, you can skip it if you use the personality scourge.

[signal current]

God reading this channel can get very confusing at times mostly because we never played the game long enough to learn how to properly build a character

[marsh gyro]

It's easier than it sounds even though there's a lot of moving parts! Ask away if you got questions!

[signal current]

Will do, atm we’re just leveling our arbites and are low enough that it doesn’t really matter what we do

[frigid saffron]

really good at applying bleed stacks on bosses too

[fierce marten]

Damn well I love the arbites guns but being able to have the dog emp bleed a lot and be larger is also very tempting

[neat dew]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/539963966101782548/1387189200520220895/v12044gd0000d1d556vog65o2sba4s6g.mov?ex=685c701e&is=685b1e9e&hm=69b3fa1e484909ebf811c293c9118755e46f3ff0b20c67dcb712ceb9c6725fb4&

[shrewd kite]

just refreshing my knowledge of some game terms, are all of these right:

• impact: amount of stagger per hit
• cleave: how effective your weapon is at hitting multiple people
• brittleness: lasting armour debuff on a single guy
• rending: armour piercing that's applied to your attack only

right?

[drowsy tusk]

https://discord.com/channels/426286410496999425/569311945447178249

join mee

[fierce marten]

Correct.

A random tidbid since it unintuitive, "stagger" refers to the stagger duration.

Fun fact though brittleness behind the scenes is rending as a debuff

[finite nymph]

Savant Psyker seems to get along pretty well with the Lexfolk when not distracted by Saintly Rambling

also has anyone given the Force Greatsword much time, seems neat

[fierce marten]

Is savant psyker the French one that used to talk about being an enforcer

[finite nymph]

Ye

I'd already done Loner and cannot contend with all the Beloved talk on Seer

[fierce marten]

Unsurprisingly since it's arbites week, I haven't seen a seer psyker

I wonder how the fatalist would react compared say the maul

[shrewd kite]

ohhh, i finally get the point of castigator now, i thought it was about wading into melee, but it's supposed to be the 'go apeshit with the shotgun' button

[heavy geyser]

arbites unique guns have very low ammo pools

castigator lets them extend that power beyond 4 or 5 shots

[fierce marten]

Ye ye basically shoot forever mode while its up

[heavy geyser]

if you're cut off from your team by fire you can also walk through it.

[fierce marten]

I only see one CDR talent under arbites but its right under castigator

[heavy geyser]

the charge doesn't seem like it needs CDR

[shrewd kite]

The elite killing capstone has CDR

[shrewd kite]

The charge has a self-regen node on its branch

[fierce marten]

Yea but you cant take the charge talent and castigator

[fierce marten]

Thats the one im talking about

[distant surge]

Btw, can you change a characters name after you create them?

[fierce marten]

Arbites doesnt seem to have wild CDR talents which im fine with, the permanent ability spam is less engaging usually

Yes the barber surgeon guy

[distant surge]

Yay

I think i wanna change my name to Judge Bork

[shrewd kite]

It seems like it has a lot of synergy talents with the weapons, with electrocution and stuff

[fierce marten]

Costs 50k dockets and you basically go through CC again

[spiral badger]

yeah the point of castigation stance is turning briefly into robocop

walk forward and blast, blast, blast

[distant surge]

💥

[fierce marten]

You can spam chorus quite a bit, im guessing they intentionally wanted to avoid yet another ability spam class

[spiral badger]

also i think this breakpoint is consistent, if you aim the mark 8 shotgun on a dreg gunner slightly down so the head occupies the top of the circle and the bottom is on the chest

[fierce marten]

Every talent in arbites synergizes so well with the others in the tree

[spiral badger]

it will one-shot them

don't center the head

[shrewd kite]

they have low magazine sizes but they have pretty deep reserves, especially with the +25% talent

[distant surge]

I like the arbites shotgun and revolver

[fierce marten]

Arbites feels like the youngest sibling of darktide, everything they learned from base 4 they put into arbites and the whole arbites class is very nice and has strong buildcraft flexibility since the shape of the tree is so nice

[spiral badger]

this pleases me greatly because I love shotguns and I hate dreg gunners

[shrewd kite]

btw i bet the crusher goes crazy on melee arbites

i kind of haven't loved the shield mace so far honestly

[fierce marten]

Crusher alt melee counts as electrocution

They changed that aspect with arbites in mind

Also since it electrocutes the stun is like 2 seconds which feels long

[shrewd kite]

does it have access to the +damage to electrocuted now?

[spiral badger]

the shield mace is basically just the ogryn shield

like, down to the attack patterns

it basically has a different special attack and that's about it

[shrewd kite]

yeah but it doesn't seem like it has the pure reach + damage of the ogryn shield, at least in my experience

idk, maybe i gotta experiment more with the alt mark

[spiral badger]

damage is basically the same, reach there's probably a difference because the ogryn is bigger

[fierce marten]

Special attack being a very brief yet really strong stagger

[spiral badger]

yeah the special is the real juice

staggers in a cone in front of you, extremely powerful stagger that stuns even monsters

[fierce marten]

Yea im not sold on the shield compared to mace

[spiral badger]

and you can do it twice in a row after waiting for full charge

pretty good, but does it make up for the shield feeling kinda meh? i dunno

i'm always a proponent of make 'em dead over defense

[shrewd kite]

yeah arbites mace feels solid in every way, but i feel like i'm gonna end up preferring the crusher long run probably

[fierce marten]

I feel like arbites is the wrong class for that, its extreme CC

But the cc feels good imo

[distant surge]

hows the shield gun?

[spiral badger]

arbites is extremely killy if you set it up right actually

because of their stagger talent

specifically their talent that makes anybody they hit in the head count as staggered

[shrewd kite]

very good at counterfiring gunners at medium range

bit mediocre at other things

but it's safe as hell with the shield

[spiral badger]

without that, yeah, they're more about knocking down than killing

with that talent you get free triggers on everything that is +damage to staggered

even if your hit doesn't stagger

or can't

which makes a bunch of their weapons extremely damaging

[fierce marten]

Its very unique in that its the only weapon that can block, shoot, melee, and has an attack chain

[shrewd kite]

wait, does the bash have a chain?

[fierce marten]

Yea I think when you move the gun sideways you can shoot then do a fast strike that does I assume the samr damage as the heavy attack

Its a very short chain but that light strike is definitely not the one you get from tapping alt fire

Man Catcher and Scattershot seem interesting for fishing specialists in crowds

[spiral badger]

it has surgical too

which is power

[hexed rampart]

anyone still want to play?

[signal current]

We’re gonna take a break after the second time having our game crash mid mission

[white portal]

I am being a criminal

I am trying out dogless

[distant surge]

Get out

[drowsy vine]

Dogless makes the Mines and Impact Nades really juiced

[fierce marten]

Mines especially

A mine every 60 is pretty strong cc, you could do any objective or revive solo by dropping one at your feet

Arbites grenades I find very fun but I feel like they're meant to be spammed in bursts, 4 to 5 isnt as big as mine's 2 to 3

[marsh gyro]

oh dang I thought it gave 60s restores of the nuncio aquila and the charge, I can't read, grenade regen is pretty wild

[neat dew]

So much of what I saw last night was that, or some variation of dark humor involving cops and then there's my RPing ass with the in-universe fitting name.

[fierce marten]

Ye its blitz's, its wild on mines since they last for like 15s

You basically will always have mines when you need it and just to burn in even slightly dicey situations

My favorite is if I hear a burster I toss a mine in that direction and spam doggo until I get burster and its incredbly safe

[white portal]

I just like to throw grenades into big packs of assholes

bomph

[shrewd kite]

tbh the anti-ranged dog seems distinctly less useful than the anti-elite dog

i might try my stonewall build dogless and max out on the mines

[heavy geyser]

anti-ranged dog is really strong when you consider that you can't ping shooters.

[marsh gyro]

Anti-ranged dog has saved my bacon

[shrewd kite]

mm, maybe i'm too wrapped up to notice how useful it is without the killfeed

anti-elite dog goes crazy though

oh right, i just remembered rogue trader also got an arbites

[fierce marten]

Anti elite is pretty good cause it also includes specialists sans burster

Like a safety net, that bomber will not get away, and sometimes it kills a specialist you didnt see off in the distance before it could become a problem

[split mantle]

I don't get how people don't constantly go down at high levels.. .-. It feels like damage is inevitable and if I don't die to chip damage, then I'll get swarmed and smacked down that way.

[regal pendant]

Toughness generation, mostly

[split mantle]

Okay, how do you do that on Vet?

..Found it.

[mortal crystal]

Yep

Vet's best toughness node is toughness on elite/specialist killers
Vet out of the box is one of the better specialist killers
The highest difficulties are so hard because of (among other things) specialist spam

[marsh gyro]

Inspiring barrage blessing can be worth looking at too, as can confident strike

[mortal crystal]

Vet doesn't really get access to Confident Strike IIRC

Inspiring Barrage can be nice, but I generally prefer the oomf of a second damage blessing

[marsh gyro]

I thought shock mauls had it and I'm wrong, oops

[mortal crystal]

Yeah, Vet isn't meant to really be comfortable in melee for extended periods trading blows

[opaque crown]

When you're learning vet, they are very vulnerable I find. It takes more awareness and threat management than most

[white portal]

I swear I struggle with the fact my dog will stick rather close to my side and I want it running into the distance killing for me.

But also I only just got that I can double ping to send my dog into the distance myself

[drowsy vine]

Avoiding chip in this game is basically like Vermintide where you need to get in the flow of dodging + pushing to control a horde, with the added caveat of narrowing your profile against ranged enemies as much as you can

It's a lot to manage but it is possible

[marsh gyro]

Shovels, devil's claws, and chainswords can also blend up an infinite number of melee mooks

[heavy geyser]

good use of dodges, pushes, stamina management and blocking go a long way towards keeping you alive.

How many stamina bars show up when you run?

[regal pendant]

Don't forget shouting

PUT THA KARKIN BOOT IIIIIIIIIIIIIIN

[fierce marten]

Stamina curios is good for all the shove attacks and shoves in general

[shrewd kite]

I try to have at least one +2 stam

[fierce marten]

Slide dodge if targeted by gunners, especially if youre zealot since they take 0 toughness damage from ranged while sliding

Other classes get 50% which is still big

[spiral badger]

stam is super good on arbites in general because they have this node

Walk It Off: Spending 1 stamina replenishes 15% toughness over 3 secconds

aka having a lot of stam and running actively keeps your toughness bar up under fire

[fierce marten]

Arbites has so much regen and TDR proper tank

My favorite is having dog near you, which is basically constant toughness regen cause the range is less than 12m iirc which is a big distance in darktide

[opaque crown]

Also you have two shields which ask for Stam to shield with

[heavy geyser]

Arbites has so much base health and toughness

They eat the top shelf rations

and I guess that's to offset the stamina needs

[frigid saffron]

yeah Dog Explosion Button is fun

[fierce marten]

Good stuff

Basically shredder grenades on legs

[frigid saffron]

nutty bleed damage on bosses too

[heavy geyser]

i realized what the arbites aesthetic is, beyond just "riot cop"

the leg armor, curiass, pauldrons and especially the hinged salet-style helmet, they are "medieval town guard"

[worldly talon]

Medieval Town Guard mashed up with Judge Dredd

[heavy geyser]

a lil dash of robocop in the salet visor

but it makes way more sense why their leg armor looks Like That.

[split mantle]

Like 8-9?

rally ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) How many stamina bars show up when you run?

Also, I started with Vet. 🙃

Stormtalus (Relatable 2) | MSMC ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) When you're learning vet, they are very vulnerable I find. It takes more awareness and threat manage…

[regal pendant]

...why the fuck are silent crushers STILL an issue at this point

This is fucking ridiculous

[spring lynx]

The Arbites capstone(?) that highlights elites/specialists is super helpful for situational awareness

[cloud hazel]

I can't tell if recon lasgun vet is any good but fuck it's funny lol

hold m1 at the yellow zone until it goes away

[spring lynx]

Recon Las that has the stackable burn is very good

Also less intensive on the wrists than having to click for semi-auto guns

[drowsy vine]

yeah thats why i use mods

[cloud hazel]

I assume it'll absolutely crater with Auric mods

but damnation: still scrumptious

[drowsy vine]

nope, recon las is actually havoc viable

[cloud hazel]

On God

[drowsy vine]

with shock trooper its Just Stronk

[cloud hazel]

I maybe just don't have enough mastery to fully kit mine out

is it just headhunter/infernus?

[drowsy vine]

ye

[cloud hazel]

kk

maybe my perk tree just isn't set up correctly then

[drowsy vine]

whatcha got

[cloud hazel]

basically full left side til the capstone cause I don't super love marksman's focus

shock trooper mandatory

i'm assuming deadshot is still cheeks

[drowsy vine]

its good actually

[cloud hazel]

ayo

i'm running rashad just as anti-tank backup but knife or power sword or something would probably be fine as well

i gotta say

40 second marksman's

still pretty good

does deadshot still only work while you have stam or did they change that

[marsh gyro]

Correct, you need stamina, which is where either bottom left stacks keystone or middle tree gold pings keystone are great because they're stamina fountains

[cloud hazel]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I wonder if that's the key

like there's just not enough elites for gold pings to really go crazy on damnation

but on auric the director is just holding your head under the elite fountain til you stop moving

[sonic elbow]

my funni laspistol lorewalk build works on that

[cloud hazel]

I am also significantly less washed than I anticipated coming back from 3 months totally out of the game with unfamiliar keybinds

I nearly died because I forgot I rebound jump cause I was sick of jumping in place instead of dodging

[marsh gyro]

I keep trying to darktide dodge in non darktide games so I know the feeling

[cloud hazel]

alt jump space dash would probably be much worse in deadlock than darktide

but since jumping is 9 times out of 10 a liability in this game it's okay to have slightly weird thumb placements for it here

[marsh gyro]

Power sword is good, chain sword is good, chain axe a middle ground; there's a build can be done with the brittleness stacks on successive hits where you just burn down armor/monstrosities with the recon

[cloud hazel]

unless they absolutely nuked it psword would probably be too stronk to have fun on damnation

[sonic elbow]

imo it's too one-note to have fun in general

[cloud hazel]

power cycler 4 is a hell of a drug

zhwzhzwzh

[shrewd kite]

I never clicked with the power sword for whatever reason

I like the chainaxe on my hybrid vet with boltpistol

[finite nymph]

Power Sword is too locked in on power mode

Also just kind of unexciting elsewise

[marsh gyro]

I kind of like me Thrust and Sunder for the world's biggest singular powered slash and it's not practical because there usually isn't 15 guys in front of you but like 3

[heavy geyser]

the relic blade heat mechanic is a more engaging way to handle power weapons

baby power sword you gotta keep shaking it to get charge out of the battery. relic blade you gotta manage the battery cuz its swollen.

[opaque crown]

I feel like the heat mechanic is kind of a non thing tbh? It doesn't seem like it's really a mechanic that results in any decision making

You can just turn it on, swing till it turns off, wait a sec, do it again

[marsh gyro]

Relic blade does a decent chunk of damage on its own without the power so you can keep swinging, power sword needs like slaughterer/wrath to kill poxwalkers unpowered

[fierce marten]

Usually you turn it off before it overheats if you run cranial

If you forget well it's overheating time

[opaque crown]

And there's no real like... downside to just maxing out the battery I found

[finite nymph]

Also Power sword just feels real small

I know it's the Gladius of it but smalll

[opaque crown]

Like a bit of time passes. So you swing the still killer greatsword for the not particularly consequential down time, until you can turn it back on again

[fierce marten]

Havoc basically has its own balancing and it's unneeded outside of havoc but it won't cleave through hordes without wrath on h40

[opaque crown]

The power sword, ironically to me, feels like action figure big. It's a massive blade proportionately

[fierce marten]

I dislike the vet power sword, having to spam the power on every few swings I'm not a fan of. It's like having a bad battery in a remote I got to shake

[heavy geyser]

its a good skill ceiling. if you want as much uptime as possible you gotta mind your swings and power off where its safe. overheating locks you out for longer than manual control takes to cool off, and you can activate again at 10% bar and have it hit 0% when the power comes on again

[fierce marten]

Relic blade lasts a real long time

It involves a bit more skill cause you don't always need it on, power it off once a horde is thin enough and power on when needed

[heavy geyser]

power off has different limitations and you can pick where to spend your battery and when keeping it off is fine.

[fierce marten]

Being able to gauge when a horde needs power mode and conserving heat bar is something to think about alongside everything else

[marsh gyro]

Yeah now that I know Havoc bumps up stagger thresholds and hit mass I gotta redo my cleave guide because the breakpoints change a bunch

[heavy geyser]

it can't cleave carapace without power on so you don't want it overheated when the crusher brigade rolls up.

[marsh gyro]

I like that the eviscerator buff makes it a pretty good relic blade alternative now

[heavy geyser]

you can just turn it on and cook it and i think thats what Energy Leakage is for but you commit to using a worse version of the sword longer and at worse times

[split mantle]

I wanna see this on p.sword toooooo. :V

rally ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) the relic blade heat mechanic is a more engaging way to handle power weapons

[heavy geyser]

the revamped eviscerator is probably better in that swing and forget niche

[fierce marten]

An annoyance I have around havoc is it's kind of like deathwish/death sentence in payday 2 where there's basically a build for each difficulty and a death sentence build can performance worse on death wish despite it being one level lower.

Auric and Havoc are like that to me, some havoc 40 builds are unnecessary on auric and at times than an auric specific build, yet many creators use havoc 40 as defacto build standard and few are like "here's just amazing auric builds"

[heavy geyser]

if you build for crit and throw perfect strike on it can cleave carapace packs

[split mantle]

Other than the shovel, what makes a good melee for vet?

[fierce marten]

If you lean hard on grenades then knife/dueling sword with uncanny makes the bleed on shredders really strong

[split mantle]

I run krak a lot.

Because God, the ability to just delete 50 billion percent of a Monstrosity's health is.. 😌

[marsh gyro]

Lots of good options in this patch, I like Devil's Claw parries and the Mk5 combat axe is a great versatile one, chain weapons are good, shock maul flings everything around

[fierce marten]

One I don't see often anymore is heavy sword, it's still strong against everything but carapace

And if you're running krak grenades your melee doesn't need to worry about ut

[marsh gyro]

I've been running Heavy Sword Brain Burst Psyker for that reason

[heavy geyser]

heavy sword is a great lawnmower

[marsh gyro]

Really the most noticeable thing on Havoc (besides super shooters) is the huge increase in monstrosities and so on Auric you can get by without being specced for monstrosity booping with the power of teamwork but after Havoc 21 you really need a good way to burn down captains and beasties

[fierce marten]

Also ammo is rough

[marsh gyro]

Yeah -50% at 20 and -65% at 40 means that you functionally need 2 teammates to ignore ammo

[fierce marten]

And havoc mods strongly values preventative support options cause healing is almost nonexistent

I mostly play auric now to have build diversity

See teammates and their odd builds

[dawn totem]

I'm the one lone guardsmen surrounded by cops

[fierce marten]

Military vs cops

[dawn totem]

More than ever the Imperial Guard needs to represent

[fierce marten]

Rejects arent even military, we're paramilitary of Grendyl. They definitely wouldnt take vet back into astra militarum

[spiral badger]

well they probably would

just like

demoted back to private again

astra militarum is always tithing

[fierce marten]

I guess they dont really keep records, you could easily reset your identity and get tithed on some random planet

[dawn totem]

Aren't Guardsmen mostly press ganged into service, depending the planet?

[fierce marten]

Yea heavily depends on planet

But a majority is voluntary cause the 40k propaganda machine is strong

[marsh gyro]

Oh lol turns out per the Steam havoc modifier guides the stagger modifiers in the Havoc aren't active in the code for stagger checks so enemies have had normal stagger this entire time

[heavy geyser]

in darktide lore they frame you becoming a cop as you getting sent to compulsory officer school

i don't know if a backstory option lets you volunteer to be a cop

[dawn totem]

I mean, it's so strong some folks will sidestep recruitment and take matter in their own hands as an act of faith. Which makes Zealots

[fierce marten]

Interesting, it's probably just the fact every horde mob is at least flak armor. Like 40 scab ragers is a lot of hit mass

[marsh gyro]

Yeah it's possible the hit mass buffs are in, looks like the stagger doesn't work

You're right that Scab ragers at 10 mass each add up quick

[fierce marten]

Relic blade's cleave is like a set amount boost in power mode and not always sufficient without wrath

[marsh gyro]

Yeah it's about 11.7 in Power mode base and Wrath can get it to 40-odd

[fierce marten]

If they ever fix hit mass buffs, you'd probably have to run 2 cleave blessings

[fierce marten]

Psyker gets an enforcer option

[fierce marten]

And for the not volunteers they have ways to retrain you, and can afford it since a majority are already stalwart. It's actually pretty rare a guardsman will defect or turn to chaos considering the stupid number of guardsman that exist.

[split mantle]

I actually had someone ask what a "provost" was, because apparently there's a Guardsman line that calls an Arbites that. A "provost" is a military police officer.
..
Do the Arbites fulfil a gendarmerie role?

[opaque crown]

The arbites don't integrate with the militarum in any way, the guardsman is likely relating them to a provost as a familiar thing

[split mantle]

Mm. Because we have commissars, but they're political officers.

[fierce marten]

Probably this, cause the arbites provost is the grand provost marshall and there's like one on the high lords of terra council

It's funny now all the cultists became anti-cop when arbites arrived.

https://www.rxddit.com/r/DarkTide/s/1mqgjiXUc5

I got to say now that I got into the habit of just pinging everything with arbites, dog is so fun I don't think I could do without even if it was stronger. Seeing a brownish blur on your screen disappear into a horde getting get a kill message for a dead specialist is so satisfying

[spring lynx]

Arbites are sort of Interpol?

Planets will have Enforcers and if things get out of hand, then Arbites will be called in.

Their introduction is fitting because it's one of the escalation points before calling in Astra Militarum (even more)/Astartes/Sisters of Battle etc, or you know Exterminatus

[neon nymph]

Yes, also means they can be in denial about this being a 'proper war' and not a 'police action'

Sound familiar, dunnit

[fierce marten]

Considering hive worlds are several dozen billions at least, a few arbites fortresses is not nearly enough for a war

[spring lynx]

Also the mention about the planetary Tithe is a neat bit of lore.

They don't want to scour the planet, they need the resources back on track.

[fierce marten]

They're violent first responders, arbites and inquisitors are usually some of the first to investigate issues on a planet since they can go on a dime while astra militarum needs a lot of time to show up in force

[opaque crown]

planets often have arbites already on planet rather than entirely relying on their own enforcers. They do still make up a minority of the lawkeepers; but Arbites are famous for their fortress precincts

which are purpose build to withstand sieges from citizens

[spring lynx]

I think Arbites do coordinate interplanetarily as well though

[fierce marten]

They do, cause non are from the planet they're on

[opaque crown]

yeah, they're shipped to planet, but its usually not for crisis response as i understand it, but like a service posting

[fierce marten]

The fortresses are like pop up shops, when the tithe or whatever issue is over they take most of it with them

[spring lynx]

I think one of the character options is a Temporary Fortress for the Water Cartel investigation

[opaque crown]

The overall leader of the Adeptus Arbites is the Grand Provost Marshal, who represents the organization on the Senatorum Imperialis and oversees the organization at the Hall of Judgement on Terra. Below him are the Marshals of the Court which oversee galaxy-spanning precincts. Below the Marshals of the Court, the Arbites are internally divided into two subgroups; Judges, who deal with legal matters and the application of ten thousand years of case law and its precedents, and Arbitrators, the militant arm of the Arbites who perform the work necessary to apprehend and punish those who break the Emperor's laws. Senior Arbites fulfill both roles, with Judges getting their hands dirty, and Arbitrators learning to preside over lengthy court trials.

The Adeptus Arbites maintains a presence on almost every Imperial world, headquartered in fortified Precinct-Fortresses also known as Courthouses. The courthouses are equipped to be self-sufficient and to support a complete Arbites army. They consist of armouries, dungeons, barracks, firing ranges, scriptories, archives, warehouses, kitchens, gymnasia and garages. Courthouses are sometimes a world's only connection with the rest of the Imperium.

From lexicanum

seems to me that the arbites maintain permanent presences anywhere they are located

they just dont give a shit about local law or the usual things that would be considered criminal

[spring lynx]

Oh, so the Enforcers report to the Planetary Governor

[opaque crown]

and only care about the things that might effect the tithe

which, admittedly, is a lot of things

but notably, they dont give a shit about a coup unless the coup affects the tithe

[spring lynx]

Yeah, it's a good depiction of the jurisdictional shit show and the squabbling on Tertium

Also, basing it on different Imperial factions deciding to stick their oar in would allow for Sororitas, Mechanicus, maybe Asartes classes if they wanted

[opaque crown]

im resistant to astartes somewhat, but i think if they were given an appropriate amount of gravitas and treatment, they could be cool in darktide as a story element

mechanicus involvement in the manufactorum would be neat

[spring lynx]

Space Marine scouts could be interesting.

I think I'm still a bit miffed at how boring Space Marine 2 was

[opaque crown]

topic for a different channel, but to be honest i was overall happy with it. It didn't take any big risks though

[marsh gyro]

I'd rather see Orks than Astartes because Orks mean more guns

[opaque crown]

I think GSC are more likely, but id love to see orks for a different feeling enemy faction

[frank igloo]

no astartes

please

space marines are so boring for the most part

[fierce marten]

Orks make the perfect horde enemy

[split mantle]

Personally agreed, because then everyone wants Every Chapter™ and.. No. Just no. Though I disagree with Skaian on why, I agree with the thought.

skaianDestiny ↩️

[Reply to:](#1159883850562932826 message) no astartes

Orks are great, but also incredibly dangerous.

[opaque crown]

orks would be... much tougher normal enemies imo, kind of like beastmen in vermintide

[frank igloo]

space marines can be interesting but for the most part theyre not

theres just too much focus on them

in 40k overall

[split mantle]

Maybe gretchins as "troops" with boyz as specialists could work?

[fierce marten]

Particularly Ultramarines

[frank igloo]

such that it drowns out so much of the other interesting stuff in 40k

[split mantle]

I wish 40k had more like, artillery.

Like, for gun artillery you have the Guard, and.. And er.

[marsh gyro]

They do, a lot of it's so artillery it comes from space

[split mantle]

But those aren't minis you can put on the board.

[opaque crown]

i imagine orks as an enemy, you got a lot more like... big/small

so orks would be high density threats, harder to push and soaking decent amount of punishment

and hte the grots and gretchin would make more nuisance enemies

[spring lynx]

I think it is a tricky balance trying to do certain factions right.

Like Dark Eldar would be cool, but technically they'd be sneaky and incredibly difficult to hit, which isn't necessarily fun from a gameplay perspective

Orks could also have Squigs

[opaque crown]

yeah valid, i do think itd be a nice change of pace to be facing some like... fast, dodgy boys

but on its face the game isn't designed for that

[spring lynx]

Yeah

[opaque crown]

orks or GSC would be a better fit for the game's vibes

gsc more easily slot in, i think orks would be a better change of pace

[fierce marten]

GSC would be the most fitting

[spring lynx]

GSC would be a good fit, though technically it's Ordo Xenos.

Would be delightful to have dialogue of inquisitorial agents from different Orders bickering

[opaque crown]

but gsc does have room for introducing some cooler vibes by having unique enemy types n stuff

[fierce marten]

I was wanting an ork game in general

[spring lynx]

Yeah, the escalation from cultists to strains closer to a Broodlord would be sick

[sonic elbow]

eyyy that's what I'm sayin

[fierce marten]

I have tin foil hat theory GSC is on the books as Sefoni mentions a big warp null at the bottom of Atoma

[opaque crown]

yeah i also think there are gsc on tertium

[drowsy tusk]

Space marine 1 lol

[spring lynx]

Darktide would also have a lot of fun with Ork dialogue as well

[fierce marten]

And like the only factions that kind of do that is tyranids and necrons, if its necrons we're over

[fierce marten]

More ork games

[spring lynx]

Morrow would be incredibly tilted if Orks turned up

[opaque crown]

my like "this is impossible, but i want it" idea is fighting expeditionary tau scouts.

kroot troops, tau shooters

[spring lynx]

I'd feel a bit bad fighting Tau

[fierce marten]

I dont even know how much Morrow remembers

[soft summit]

What about those Jellyfish guys

The ones that corrode everything around them

[marsh gyro]

Do you mean the Tyranids

[opaque crown]

It's not like tau are just like all good guys doing good things; they're still propogatin a galactic manifest destiny and are more than willing to kill millions

and put the rest in labor camps

[soft summit]

Nope

Hrud

https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Hrud

[sonic elbow]

I doubt we'll be getting hrud in an official GW overseen game

[spring lynx]

Then we should be clamouring for a Tau character!! /s

[fierce marten]

Tau as protagonists could work

A Tau game that basically doesnt involve humans

[sonic elbow]

no humans? but then we won't make a GWillion bucks from the game

[marsh gyro]

The Fire Warrior 2025 revival

[fierce marten]

Im honest surprised darktide doesnt have an ultramarine for the clout

[spring lynx]

Would be fighting for the niche Space Marine 2 has

Are Ogryn about the same size as Asartes?

[spiral badger]

ogryns are slightly larger

depending on depiction, ranigng to significantly larger

they're also stronger and tougher (baseline, without armor)

the problem is that they are well, untrainable beyond a certain level

[opaque crown]

I kinda reject the notion that Tau don't work as antagonists

[fierce marten]

They're stronger than normal space marines with armor, the wargame stats are armored space marines

The thing is no hostile Ogyrn would get never close to an astartes

[opaque crown]

An Ogryn is strong enough to physically crush a space marine's head through ceramite. A space marine just also happens ot have martial arts training

strength and size not being the end all for that fight

[spring lynx]

Was wondering because you do already have a precedent for player characters that are massive compared to the rest of the classes

[spiral badger]

space marines are on a whole 'nother power scale though

[spring lynx]

So I guess you could implement Astartes, but again it doesn't make sense for them to get bogged down

[spiral badger]

technically ogryns are too

but ogryns are nerfed by being dumb

[fierce marten]

They're roughly the same size on average, Ogyrn can get large than astartes

[opaque crown]

id never implement astartes as playable in dark tide, I'd have them be a story element

[spiral badger]

also i meant that ogryns are tougher than a space marine without armor

[fierce marten]

Salamanders iirc are also bigger than average

[opaque crown]

you'd just encounter their handiwork or speak to one, not play as one

[spiral badger]

their skin can shrug off bullets

[opaque crown]

Though i will say a we as player sput in space marine levels of work

[spiral badger]

with the armor the space marine can take more firepower

yeah but there's a certain amount of non-diagetic killing going on

[opaque crown]

you can also headshot an ogryn and they'll probably not die because their brain is tiny and resilient

[spiral badger]

otherwise most of us have personally wiped out the mobian 6th

since they're a 50k strong regiment

[fierce marten]

Ogyrn also dont have the insane regenerative capabilities and organ redundancies Astartes do, Ogyrn would die to a shot with a bolter

Oh also, plot armot

[spring lynx]

I do wonder when the next story beat for Admonition is

[opaque crown]

ogryns can actually handle getting shot with a bolter tbh; they would just be very unhappy about it

[spiral badger]

it's pretty obvious imo

they were trying to do a sibling ritual

we spoiled it

[spring lynx]

Oh I get that

[spiral badger]

who's the other prominent pair of probably-siblings

[spring lynx]

Uhhh Alpharuis?

[spiral badger]

no, zola and wolfer

still not 100% confirmed but pretty likely

[spring lynx]

My god Dominic Toretto was right, it is about family.

[spiral badger]

and wolfer is about to be "punished" for his failures

so 2 birds with one stone

(also rinda karnak apparently survived our little encounter)

[spring lynx]

Oh, Wolfer got out of the Underhive via the Guard, Zola stayed in and joined one of the Gangs.

Although Zola is her surname name, presumably Wolfer is his surname as well?

[spiral badger]

her brother is named as Tibiron Zola

Wolfer is named as Biron Wolfer

[fierce marten]

Also Biron is the codename her brother used

They never use their real name

Or rather Byron iirc

[spiral badger]

the only people who use Zola's given name in full (Orgustine) are people needling her that they know it

[hushed glade]

Is the Arbites DLC worth it?

[spiral badger]

if you intend to play the class, absolutely

the class is great

[fierce marten]

Class is very well designed

[opaque crown]

im enjoying it

for 11 bucks, you can get a decent amount of gameplay for it

[fierce marten]

Even if it wasn't good, it feels great to play

[spiral badger]

if you don't want to play as an arbites all the rest of the content is free

so don't

but if you do, do it

[hushed glade]

what is the rest of the content if not the Arbites

[fierce marten]

It leans into shotguns, strong strong cc, and being dummy tanky

[hushed glade]

What makes it different from Ogryn?

besides dog

[fierce marten]

Ogyrn got reworked

[hushed glade]

wait, again?

[marsh gyro]

More grenades, more party buff abilities, more emphasis on switching ranged and melee if you like it, more electricity

[quiet escarp]

I would also add that while the Arbites ranged options are also limited they're more straightforward than the Ogryn's

[marsh gyro]

Shield and gun is a cool gimmick

[quiet escarp]

Yeah, and the shot pistol and arbites shotguns are both more accurate than you might expect. You can get good results sniping heads out to midrange

The Ogryn ranged options are all effective but more niche, comparatively

[spiral badger]

Also arbites tanky is more selfish, they dont have specific protect others kinda setups

Their tankiness is in service of them personally going in to bust some heads/ignore melee and shotgun

[fierce marten]

I disagree they got a lot of AoE tdr

[spiral badger]

They have support skills but they're not as actively taunt heavy as the ogryn tanking style

You peel for allies by knocking shit down or telling your dog to bite it

[fierce marten]

They got the speaker AoE ability

Ogyrn doesn't have many talents that makes others tougher

[marsh gyro]

The funky bird is a good buff but it doesn't taunt taunt like ogryn can do

[hushed glade]

Hmmmmmmm

[fierce marten]

Ogyrn has rumbler and strong horde clear when it comes to unarmored enemies.

Arbites is heavy on CC

[hushed glade]

But if I enjoy Ogryn I'll probably like Arbites?

[marsh gyro]

Oh yeah, Arbites is the most Ogryn of the non-Ogryns in terms of slapping around folks with impact and cleave

[quiet escarp]

Yeah, certainly. As a previous Ogryn main it's definitely tied for my favourite now

[fierce marten]

The talent tree is beautiful too

It has so much flexibility and easy to grab options

[quiet escarp]

Yeah, even the option to spec out of the dog is super easy and doesn't cut you off from anything if you're just not interested in managing it

That said, the dog is amazing

[fierce marten]

Both Ogyrn and Arbites has strong elite killing. Arbite's also has strong specialist denial, dog can automatically go after specialists and kill them easily

The class shotguns are accurate so you can hit specialists easily at a distance

[hushed glade]

why would I ever spec out of the dog

Paying 12 bucks for that dog

[fierce marten]

The no dog talent is strong

[marsh gyro]

Regenerating grenades

[hushed glade]

My grenades always regenerate if I tell my team to get fucked

[brazen fossil]

The dog us cool but

[marsh gyro]

You can make the dog a regenerating grenade if you want so you don't even need to go no dog

[fierce marten]

It provides a good number of buffs to make up for no dog

[brazen fossil]

Bolter cop works alone

Seriously I think the bolter is insane on the arbites

[fierce marten]

With castigator stance it fires forever

[hushed glade]

||Castrator Stance||

[fierce marten]

Dog, sic his balls

[quiet escarp]

The Arbites being the best for the bolter feels very fitting to be honest

I think my only complaint with them is that their melee pool feels a little limited

[marsh gyro]

A 3rd arbites specific punch stick would have been nice

[spiral badger]

Their melee pool is super limited yeah, probably because their melee damage options all work off of stagger so a bunch of the weapons would feel like ass

[quiet escarp]

I think another shield and melee option would be nice, though I don't know how you would really differentiate it

[fierce marten]

There's the talent that makes melee weakspot hits count as staggered for talents/blessings

They're very focused in terms of class weapons, very distinct each one with little overlap.

Alhough arbites version of crusher would be neat

[hushed glade]

A sword and shield would be fun for Arbites and Zealot

[fierce marten]

Well arbites whole deal is blunt weapons. What would a sword do different from maul and shield

[marsh gyro]

Smack 'em with the flat of it

[fierce marten]

Power Pommel

[quiet escarp]

Yeah, part of the Arbites shtick seems to be no swords (except the chainsword)

[frank igloo]

Refining that "abilities fall into these categories and pick three for a class" idea

Charge - some form of forward movement
Hide - some form of primarily avoiding damage
Stance - a time-limited buff that boosts your own stats
Shout - a time-limited buff that boosts your team's stats and knocks back enemies

therefore:
Zealot
Charge - Fury of the Faithful
Shout - Chorus of Spiritual Fortitude
Hide - Shroudfield
Veteran
Stance - Executioner's Stance
Shout - Voice of Command
Hide - Infiltrate
Psyker
Shout - Venting Shriek
Hide - Telekine Shield
Stance - Scrier's Gaze
Ogryn
Charge - Indomitable
Shout - Loyal Protector
Stance - Point-Blank Barrage
Arbitrator
Stance - Castigator's Stance
Hide - Nuncio-Aquila
Charge - Break the Line

[spiral badger]

zealot shroudfield looks like a hide but it's actually a stance, imo

[fierce marten]

Its kind of also charge, you move fast and walk past many enemies

[distant surge]

do you think Arbites carry treats for their mastiffs?

[frank igloo]

stance means it something you benefit from immediately on ability activation

[fierce marten]

Isnt that a lot of them

[frank igloo]

i also define charge's forward movement as uncontrolled

should note that

i think you could also make good arguments that nuncio-aquila is also shout, which is why i put the "knocks back enemies" bit because all the other typical shouts have that aspect

[frank igloo]

Stance is supposed to be like immediate stat buffs you get and only you primarily benefit from that last for a certain amount of time. While Shroudfield does provide you a buff it only happens once or is minor compared to the stuff a Stance gives, like Vet, Arbites, or Ogryn

the immediate thing about shroudfield is that you avoid enemy damage by going into stealth

[spiral badger]

the actual purpose of shroudfield though is the massive damage hit you use on exiting

it doesn't last long enough to be used for damage evasion, it's basically a brief aggro drop to reposition for the hit

[fierce marten]

Yea, its a delayed one time buff

[frank igloo]

okay? that doesnt change the fact that it doesnt provide a lasting buff

[spiral badger]

it's different in purpose than veteran stealth

[frank igloo]

its an expression of hide thats more offensive tuned

[fierce marten]

It does provide toughness regen afterwards with talent

[frank igloo]

okay fuck me thenw hatever

im stupid and clearly dont know what im talking about

[spiral badger]

ok there's no need for that

people can disagree on category without it being anyone's Horrible Wrong Decision

[frank igloo]

nah the fucking "i turn invisible and am untargetable for up to 5 seconds" doesnt count for hide, clearly its the single hit buff plus some toughness regen and damage reduction when spending 2 talent points for it makes it a stance

[spiral badger]

again, we can disagree on how categories work without you making it into some kind of dramatic yes-no conflict

[frank igloo]

the primary point of shroudfield is "avoid damage and then hit really hard"

[spiral badger]

i don't have any quibbles withe framework

[fierce marten]

I dont think the abilities fit into clean categories

[spiral badger]

but I think zealot shroudfield is fundamentally different from veteran shroudfield that makes it a different category of thing

[frank igloo]

its still an expression of "avoid damage"

its just in addition to that it has a really good damage buff for a single hit

[spiral badger]

not really, because zealots generally don't use shroudfield to avoid damage

[frank igloo]

they do

[spiral badger]

in practice it's not used that way commonly

[frank igloo]

because they shroudfield to get enemies to stop targeting them or not target them to hit their target

yeah sure you use it to get a big hit in

but the hide enables that

[spiral badger]

in purpose it's not avoiding damage, so I don't think of it in that category.

the purpose of using it is for the buff

[frank igloo]

because they either turn around to target something else or you can rush up to them while theyre unalerted

[spiral badger]

more than the brief stealth

if you removed the stealth component most zealots would still use it in basically the same way

[frank igloo]

it still avoids damage

if it didnt have the stealth component or the backstab buff lasted for the entire duration then itd be a stance

but its primary mechanic is damage avoidance by stealth

[spiral badger]

no, the primary mechanic is the damage buff, because that's how its used

that's where i'm coming at this from, my categories are "what does this do in practice"

veteran shroudfield is all about avoiding damage, its nodes are about adding to the damage avoidance by reducing threat and enabling repositioning

[frank igloo]

and im coming from "how did they design this"

[spiral badger]

zealot shroudfield is all about getting a big whack of damage

[frank igloo]

yeah and its not a stance

[spiral badger]

i disagree, and that's fine

[frank igloo]

if you think that

im disengaging because this has brought down an already ruined day for me

[sonic elbow]

honestly I'm not sure what veteran's stealth is about

[spiral badger]

repositioning for either diving or picking off ranged

because of the threat reduction

you take the threat reduction and move somewhere off angle

and get free time to blast

[sonic elbow]

even in a world where shout doesn't do that for you by putting the enemies on pause, ehhh

[spiral badger]

or you can dive into enemy shooters with it and the threat reduction keeps them from retargeting to you while you stab

[sonic elbow]

it really feels like an ability you have to commit super hard to because you decided to play stealth today goddamit

and not an organic piece of a puzzle

[spiral badger]

what it gives over shout is the ability to reposition completely into a threat

it lasts a long fucking time so you can run all the way over to the shooter line

or to a very off angle position

shout is better but shout is just like, way too good still

the purpose of stealth is quite clear and a good thing to have it's just that shout is some nonsense

[sonic elbow]

I hope they nerf dueling sword and shout in the same patch because I love chaos

[spiral badger]

but yeah basically the idea for stealth is in a complex engagement with a lot of melee and shooters you can bail completely into or out of the fight wherever you want to pop back up

and therefore have an opportunity to clear out a threat you otherwise could not engage without risking getting bonked by other shit

[sonic elbow]

my problem with that is I don't think I know how to consistently pull the exquisite value from that that'd make getting aggro dumped easier to swallow for my team

[spiral badger]

i mean the basic one is easy

melee horde, bunch of shooters in the back

bail out and clear the gunline so your team isn't getting shot

exiting stealth near gunners also suppresses them

so you're actively reducing threat

also incidentally, you can underhand grenades in stealth without breaking it

[sonic elbow]

huh

that's neat

[distant surge]

"The lex is the lex" is a stupid war cry

[white portal]

yeah but the people are dumb as hcek

also I'm trying ranged anti-ranged build

All about my dog taking down ranged while I'm firing a ton as well

[signal current]

Please yes gsc we want more gsc representation

[fierce marten]

Im just an arbites for fun

[marsh gyro]

Shot pistol's kind of tough to use with the bottom middle keystone for weapon swaps because I keep running out of ammo and thus stuck on the wrong set of stacks

[fierce marten]

Exterminator so far is my top pick of a gun, I havent tried combat shotgun though yet

[marsh gyro]

Combat shotgun buffs are kind of weird too because they only buffed the buck shot on each one so the special shells all still have the same issues they had

The new buck shot is super neat for blasting big holes in pox walkers though

[drowsy tusk]

Obv they need to bring back infinite cleave but this time for all the special ammos not just dragons breath

Ngl said as a jolk but infinite cleave slug would go so hard

[opaque crown]

so... the new shotty. am I correct that it effectively has unlimited punch through?

also is it just flat out better than the other shotties despite their buffs?

[fierce marten]

The rail gun

[marsh gyro]

The arbites shotguns come with 5.3 (shock default mark) and 5.7 cleave (rending mark) base, which is 4 poxwalkers base or 2 of most elites and specials. 25% cleave node on the tree gets you to 5 poxwalkers, 3 scab mooks, or 2 non-Scab Rager elites; 50% cleave extra from bottom middle keystone stacks gets you just shy of 10 cleave which is just under power sword territory (scab ragers and maulers have 10 hit mass)

[opaque crown]

I was noticing it just scything through entire crowds

almost effortlessly

[marsh gyro]

Yeah the big spread and minimum pellets per hit help a ton

[opaque crown]

im split on taking theo ther mark with full bore or keeping the duckbill spread shots

its a bit wild that the old lawbringer/zarona has a special shot to fire duckbill but the executioner just lives that life

[soft summit]

Is Lone Wolf worth it?

The no dog option

[marsh gyro]

If you want regenerating mines or grenades you can do it

I don't think it has a direct penance

[sonic elbow]

I'm going to run shredder autopistol arbitres soon as I get back into the game

for The Funny

[worldly talon]

I run lone wolf on my all shields all the time build

but haven't really gotten a good chance to try it

Left Tree Doggo Time is still too much fun

[fierce marten]

I ran lone wolf and stacked attack speed buff and it makes crusher go fast

You swing it so fast and the stagger is incredibly safe you'll never get hit in melee from the front

[regal pendant]

What's the best dump stat on the Arbites maul + shield?

[frank igloo]

Defenses

[spring lynx]

Oh I just realised what this is about now:

[neat dew]

Do tell

[frigid saffron]

OZ being ||Orgustine Zola- or Explicator Zola||

[finite nymph]

Bolt Pistol on a Psyker feels strange, like I should be breaking my wrist

though I guess that's any bolter type on a human

[soft summit]

Zola also mentions her older brother being part of the Imperial Tithe

Plus Zola is evidently desperate to learn more about Wolfer

[neat dew]

After the recent mission involving the ritual...I wonder how long until Wolfer's masters hang him out to dry.

[shrewd kite]

one thing that i really like is that it's easy + valid to take multiple of the passive connection nodes. like I'm running the 10% DR + 10% ranged on my shotgun build

[shrewd kite]

i disagree tbh, i've used the stealth shout on auric damnations (never played anything above that) and it's good for revives, diving gunners, repositioning when you're in the shit, etc.

the usefulness is probably a bit debatable compared to the ranged attack or the shout but it's there

[spiral badger]

no executioners stance is pretty much the worst one

[shrewd kite]

i've gone kind of apeshit with executioner's stance and a bolter tbh

you can keep it running for a minute or more and just delete gunners the moment they spawn

the ranged capstone is probably the most niche though, the extra damage is pretty much only relevant against bosses and monstrosities i guess

[opaque crown]

I think it works prefectly fine, I imagine its much worse on like havoc

[shrewd kite]

i want to try the hellbore again, that's a weapon i've wanted to like since launch

[opaque crown]

i keep trying to helbore and hoping ill love it this time

but i dont

[shrewd kite]

i haven't tried havoc yet (want to get back into it) but i thought gunners were generally acknowledged as the run-enders at that difficulty?

[opaque crown]

its more about how exec stance does nothing to protect you really

[shrewd kite]

ahhh that is true

dare i say it, the smoke grenade might work well with exec stance

[opaque crown]

and if you're in a battle with 2 bosses and 3 assassination targets

i do think thats a fun combo

to make more use of the highlight

[shrewd kite]

a bolter magdump with exec stance does melt monstrosities in my experience, but again, i haven't played anything harder than an auric maelstrom

[spiral badger]

exec stance does nothing to protect you and you don't have the magazine to fight the level of enemy density in higher havoc with anythign except the plasmaa

and if you're running plasma exec stance doesn't meaningfully change your breakpoints

[opaque crown]

like its perfectly fine even into auric, and can be fun

but i think its the other two are on a more strict interpretation, better

[shrewd kite]

auric heresy is kind of my sweet spot for casual play anyway

[spiral badger]

veteran in general kinda suffers as a fighting unit in havoc

the ammo loss hurts them the most

[opaque crown]

shout kinda carries em xD

shout and unlimited nades

[spiral badger]

and they don't really have a good setup for active frontlining

[shrewd kite]

didn't they nerf the regen on the shout a while back? i remember it being pretty ridiculous

[spiral badger]

so you wind up in a support position wiht shout, picking off priority targets, and grenades

[shrewd kite]

like pretty much back to back

[spiral badger]

yes but it's still head and shoulders the best one

which says a lot about how inherently strong it is

[opaque crown]

tbf, thats kind of the vets role, is backline prio targeting

[shrewd kite]

yeah

[opaque crown]

they're not really meant to be a frontline tank

[spiral badger]

like short of taking some amount of its mechanical utility away

[shrewd kite]

well that's kinda the arbiter's lunch now with the left tree

[spiral badger]

see that's the problem

in havoc 30+ there is no backline

[shrewd kite]

and the totally autonomous sniper/bomber killer

[spiral badger]

there's just too much shit happening

you have to be able to fight

and vet is the worst at it

[opaque crown]

dogs better at hands free, but the vet is much much faster at hard dropping threats. Dog will almost never stop a bomber before they throw. If you've honed your sixth sense, you drop that bomber like a sack of potatoes

[spiral badger]

but yeah the only meaningful way to actually like

make shout not the best (without buffing the others to ludicrous extremes) would be to either remove the yellow toughness or the knockdown

[marsh gyro]

I'd rather buff the other two to ludicrous extremes

[opaque crown]

let executioners generate yellow toughness for weakspot kills

[shrewd kite]

i think vet does have a regular toughness regen for weakspot kills skill

[marsh gyro]

Yeah it's top left for ranged weak spots

[spiral badger]

i think executioners would be fine and good again if they just reverted the one change they made to it

[shrewd kite]

the reload?

[spiral badger]

which was removing it automatically reloading you

yeah

[shrewd kite]

yeah i still hate that

[spiral badger]

being able to instantly magdump -stance - magdump would give it a viable niche

[marsh gyro]

Real bolter gaming, gone, like tears in the rain

[spiral badger]

the only reason they took it out in the first place was that was the era where infinite executioner's stance chaining and bolter dumping were like

top tier

and that's just not true

i think stealth is already pretty good and I can't find a way to make it better without going to Silly

[marsh gyro]

If I was making Havoc and king dev for a day I'd make Havoc drop more ammo at higher difficulty rather than less

[spiral badger]

i think it should just have normal ammo! The restriction is already that you have to use so much more of it!

[marsh gyro]

Yeah doing 300% more blasting on 35% the ammo ain't a winner of a math

[spiral badger]

they reduced it to like 50% I think

so it's not as bad as it was

but in return they added like 4x the bullshit

so it's not really much of an improvement