Field Guide to Suldan | Pilot NET | Page 3

icy dove Mar 28, 2023, 4:11 PM

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I think the biggest "I want these, but their locked behind a License that doesn't do much for me" are Kobold Invade Options on a Hacker

hasty pulsar Mar 28, 2023, 4:12 PM

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Mood

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Kovold's techs are very cool but they're 3 levels deep in a license I don't care about otherwise

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Which is just way too much of an ask imo

icy dove Mar 28, 2023, 4:13 PM

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makes me really appreciate the Suldan Specialty Licenses, because I think the Kobold Invades would be perfect for that

ionic badger Mar 28, 2023, 4:13 PM

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Immolate is so sick, but really hard to get yeah

languid cosmos Mar 28, 2023, 4:13 PM

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Folks tried to get Tom to split the kobold invades

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Alas

icy dove Mar 28, 2023, 4:13 PM

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the FLAWs are also really nice.

ionic badger Mar 28, 2023, 4:13 PM

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IIRC the most common suggestion was swapping Ripper and one of the Invades

icy dove Mar 28, 2023, 4:14 PM

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the way it is now it is nicer to build a non-hacking Kobold

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because you can dip the license earlier and go somewhere else

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especially since Kobold isn't that great of a hacker. Good TA and Save, but the low Sensors and Mimic turning off on Tech Attack combined with low HP isn't that great

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still one of my favorite frames to build

nova slate Mar 28, 2023, 11:02 PM

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Random but fun question,
What does a conscript built by each corpostate look like?

amber crystal Mar 28, 2023, 11:29 PM

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HA's probably polished to a shine by the pilot, SSC would have nice paint, IPS-N's rugged, dented, and boxy so it can fold into cargo spaces, and HORUS are probably just civilian models or homemade.

dusk arch Mar 28, 2023, 11:34 PM

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Re: core bonuses and SP, as far as I'm concerned a +SP core bonus is extremely uninteresting but it's also just not very good, because +SP doesn't really equate to any sort of meaningful rise in capability or power beyond a certain point people naturally rise to over the course of play, and core bonuses are the single most valuable limited resource anyone has access to by virtue of having only four of them ever in your entire 12 level career. You can have a million systems crammed onto your mech but at the end of the day you still only have so many actions in so many rounds per scene, and the odds are pretty good that your build is going to be set in terms of the systems you want and can meaningfully use, if you want Asura for your build then you will be able to make the room for it. People already do not ever take Systems investment for the +SP, I am highly doubtful people will be lining up to spend an entire core bonus on that

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"well +1d6 damage is boring too" no it's fucking not, people LOVE seeing big damage numbers, it's one of their favorite things in the entire world, they love it so much they spend hours of their lives theorycrafting builds they'll never actually play just to make the numbers go higher, nobody gives a shit about "my mech can have an extra grenade/mine system I guess"

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ESU has a +SP bonus included in it because I wanted it to do literally anything for someone who took it who wasn't that into hacking, because without it that is all it would be. Core bonuses like overpower caliber get taken by anyone, even hackers. Goblin pilots love overcaliber, slap it on an autopod, done. Support players take it, doesn't fuckin matter. So I wanted ESU to have something, even a tangential something, to offer someone who took it who wasn't going to just be 100% committed to hacking all the time. Do I expect non-hackers to take it? Not really no, but if some one in a million person out there decides to take it for their weird hybrid build or their "doesn't really care about hacking but wants the SP for some crazy plan but I will literally die before I ever put a point into Systems" idea, then it will at least do something instead of nothing

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Or, like, for players who are into comprehensive build respeccing between missions but might not want to mess with their core bonuses, if you want to just leave that stuff alone then the +2 SP will still play a factor, etc

amber crystal Mar 28, 2023, 11:40 PM

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dusk arch ESU has a +SP bonus included in it because I wanted it to do literally anything ...

I actually did take that CB for the SP on an Iskander before I needed the extra invade, so you nailed that down there.

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The invade bonuses on the core just helped made it much sweeter to take Goblin 1 on the way to Gob 2.

dusk arch Mar 28, 2023, 11:44 PM

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there's one core bonus in the game that I would point to as the closest equivalent to "this just equips your mech with a thing from the gear catalogue" and it's the All-Theater Movement Suite which gives you an improved version of a specific high-cost system that can never be destroyed, and to be frank I do not see "or you could spend a core bonus to just get +3 SP" stacking up next to even that in terms of "would a bunch of people line up to take this without something else attached to it"

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anyway, insofar as game designers all bring their own inherent biases into the work they do (as do any and all artists, writers, etc), my personal bias lies on the side of "SP is not enough to carry a core bonus, or even really be that much of a factor unless you go to really high numbers" which is why my stance on ESU's +2 SP is "it's a neat cherry on top"

rotund axle Mar 29, 2023, 12:19 AM

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Welp, got me there I guess

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This really mostly stemmed from a single build(brawler Napoleon) where I tried to fit all TSS and Pesilat systems inside it

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but yeah I guess other than that no other build I have need more SP

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Actually wait I do also have that one high level White Witch but that's probably just me trying to do too many things with it

compact marten Mar 29, 2023, 12:26 AM

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I've only had a player want a +Sp Core bonus because he wanted some SP costing weapons and couldn't fit otherwise.

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'y'sure?' 'yeah'.

rotund axle Mar 29, 2023, 12:26 AM

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Speaking of, is people putting points into systems for SP like that extremely rare?

gentle forge Mar 29, 2023, 12:26 AM

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fighting several dozen conscripts
with sabreur core up
they keep missing me and I keep using the reaction

gentle forge Mar 29, 2023, 12:27 AM

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rotund axle Speaking of, is people putting points into systems for SP like that extremely ra...

it's essentially calculating you're getting more use out of those systems that you would out of the HASE you'd get otherwise

rotund axle Mar 29, 2023, 12:27 AM

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I mean, I might be biased because I make high level builds so I have more points to play around with

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Also the new Armament Redundancy may be skewing my view too

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It's a really good 1SP system

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 12:36 AM

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rotund axle Speaking of, is people putting points into systems for SP like that extremely ra...

I would say it is probably rare enough to be considered an outlier

rotund axle Mar 29, 2023, 12:36 AM

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Huh, alrighty

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 12:36 AM

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and if you go into mech hangar with a non-hacking build with points in systems you are going to be asked why

rotund axle Mar 29, 2023, 12:37 AM

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Oh wow it's that unusual huh

languid cosmos Mar 29, 2023, 12:38 AM

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oftentimes the math just doesn't quite work out in systems' favor

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1 sp is +2 hp from personalizations. 1 sp is 2 systems, but 2 hp is 1 hull

compact marten Mar 29, 2023, 12:46 AM

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+EDef is fun to have too but

gentle forge Mar 29, 2023, 12:50 AM

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rotund axle Oh wow it's that unusual huh

I mean you'll be asked why but "I value this specific system more than +4 HP or +2 heat cap" is a valid answer

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 12:55 AM

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it's valid, but it's definitely a decision that is almost always going to be looked at even non-judgmentally with "why this expenditure?"

gentle forge Mar 29, 2023, 1:05 AM

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and the +2 edef and tech attack isn't entirely useless either

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anyone can fragsig

gentle forge Mar 29, 2023, 1:18 AM

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gentle forge fighting several dozen conscripts with sabreur core up they keep missing me and ...

I got hit by 1 Boarding Leash now I'm at 1 Structure

quaint beacon Mar 29, 2023, 1:37 AM

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if you absolutely, positively need extra SP, yes, put more points in systems, sure, but generally speaking:

the return on investment for SP per points in systems is really, really bad compared to the defensive/utility benefits from other stats
most builds do not need that much SP, and the ones that do can usually cut an extra luxury system somewhere and still be perfectly good
the edefense is kind of whatever but is vaguely nice. it won't stop a dedicated hacker unless you already have horus-tier edef
as a defensive stat against blowing up, engineering is better because it also doubles as an offensive stat (heat-costing gear, overcharging, extra limited systems which are basically all incredibly powerful, etc)

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sure, technically speaking everyone can fragsig, but it'd take a lot of investment to make, like, a caliban or blackbeard's fragsig worth seriously considering

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 1:48 AM

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systems investment imo works well on mechs that might want to splash as a hacker and have a good baseline for it already

quaint beacon Mar 29, 2023, 1:48 AM

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yeah

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 1:48 AM

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I wouldn't necessarily raise an eyebrow at the tortuga player who sank a couple points into systems, but your average HMG everest player probably has better stuff to do

quaint beacon Mar 29, 2023, 1:48 AM

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more or less

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I wouldn't put points into systems just for fragsig on a tortuga or monarch or whatever, but literally all those mechs need to be an extremely potent off-hacker (or even main hacker) is a one LL dip in goblin and now they're cooking

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as oppressive as horos 1 might be in terms of constraining hack design space it sure does making splashing hacking on a lot of builds very simple

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(and also, hey, conveniently, ESU pays for that 1 LL dip in goblin)

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 2:06 AM

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yeah ESU's +2 SP could be looked at as "this gives you room for an invade system"

errant crane Mar 29, 2023, 2:14 AM

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I feel like ESU makes minotaur's metafold maze go from "nieche" to "godlike"

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it gives room for hitting an NPC with that dream wombo combo into metafold maze

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hitting bozo with a puppet systems and frag sig into immobilized is MWAH

rotund axle Mar 29, 2023, 10:54 AM

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Does Gyges give Falling Star Module's attack +1 threat?

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And I guess other threat extending abilities looks at Tokugawa

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 2:32 PM

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both of those clearly specify they give the threat to melee weapons and not just melee attacks, so no

dusk arch Mar 29, 2023, 2:54 PM

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falling star is a non-weapon melee attack, akin to things like improvised attacks or rams, it happens to have a threat but unless it says the magic words "melee weapon" somewhere then things that affect melee weapons won't affect something

slender imp Mar 29, 2023, 7:22 PM

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Pardon, was catching up on the thread - ESU refers to what?

viral wave Mar 29, 2023, 7:23 PM

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errant crane Mar 30, 2023, 12:51 AM

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Can each conscript fire their own disposable PDW, or do they just fire one between the two of them?

dusk arch Mar 30, 2023, 12:54 AM

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Each conscript takes their own full turn, essentially

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Conscripts are deployed in pairs. Each has identical stats and systems, and they both act together on the same turn, one after the other, when activated during combat.

gentle forge Mar 30, 2023, 2:35 AM

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so can the Pesilat improvised attack someone, use the core passive to use Puppet Systems to move them away, and proc its own overwatch?

dusk arch Mar 30, 2023, 2:37 AM

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Sure, it's the same thing as a tortuga using puppet systems to accomplish the same outcome with extra steps

gentle forge Mar 30, 2023, 4:39 AM

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the extra step is a punch

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nice

rotund axle Mar 30, 2023, 5:03 AM

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dusk arch falling star is a non-weapon melee attack, akin to things like improvised attack...

Ah yeah I missed that, thanks

tribal hearth Mar 30, 2023, 1:51 PM

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Hey I have a few questions regarding the rules arround Bolstering. Specificially interactions between the "Systems Optimizer" and "Spatial Threader" systems, the "Superior Logistics" Core Bonus, the SysOp 3 Talent "Agressive Countermeasures" and the Agrippas Packmule Drone :

1."Whenever you Bolster a Character" from the systems, "Whenever you Bolster an allied Character" from the Packmule Drone and "When you Bolster a Character" from the Sys-Op Talent apply to every of the maximum 3 Bolster instances granted by Superior Logistics?
2. "Only one such additional effect can be choosen" is meant for additional effects from the specific system, or all systems like it ? (So only a buff from Spatial Threader OR Systems Optimizer per bolster)
3. Using systems Optimizer or Spatial Threader is something that happens as part of the bolster, not an additional quick action? (This is mostly based on the fact that the usage of them is written out without "as a quick action" and they seem to me intentionally modelled after the way Invade option systems look like (which have the Invade tag, but there is no bolster tag, so they take the quick tech for it as thats whats needed to bolster)
4. While Agressive Countermeasures (Sysop 3) can only be used 1/round, if you apply the same buffs to an allied character via Packmule drone, do they also gain the Agressive Countermeasures ?

If I understand the rules correctly than all of these are correct, but I might be wrong

dusk arch Mar 30, 2023, 2:48 PM

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tribal hearth Hey I have a few questions regarding the rules arround Bolstering. Specificially...

1). Yes, Superior Logistics applies to anything that hooks off bolstering someone in that way, you can use it as a venue for applying additional effects from Sysop, bolster-specific systems, etc
2). Both, basically...you pick only one from that specific system, and you can't pick another effect from either the same or a different system
3). They are additional effects which occur when you Bolster someone, and do not require a separate action, correct. "Whenever you Bolster an allied character, you may choose one of the following additional effects."
4). Aggressive Countermeasures is 1/round, which is a limit that exists independently of however many times you Bolster people, so you can't apply Aggressive Countermeasures to multiple recipients even if you use something like the PACKMULE drone, if you bolster 2 people (one normally, one adjacent to the drone) you have to pick one to receive the Aggressive Countermeasures bonus

tribal hearth Mar 30, 2023, 2:49 PM

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Excellent! Thanks for the confirmation ^^

dusk arch Mar 30, 2023, 2:50 PM

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the last one is a thing that applies to all "X/round" things, there's no real way in lancer to split a 1/round effect into applying twice, if I deal heat to two targets with some effect or ability, I don't get to proc the manticore's charged exoskeleton twice for example as it's still 1/round

tribal hearth Mar 30, 2023, 2:56 PM

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Hm makes sense, thought the fact it copies the effects might get arround it, but it would have been a bit cheesy XD

And how it is all these bolster additions are amazing. Nothing better than a Superior Logistics 3x Spatial Threader synchronisation followed into move, boost and OV Boost for when you need to get the team moving ^^

gentle forge Mar 31, 2023, 12:58 AM

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due to exposed weakness from a scout + exposed from a mirage heatgunning
I have hit a 16 damage conscript PDW shot

gentle forge Mar 31, 2023, 1:16 AM

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and then I hit the 12 damage detpack

dusk arch Mar 31, 2023, 1:32 AM

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that guy gets a promotion

harsh zealot Mar 31, 2023, 2:49 AM

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Have him return as an Operator.

hasty pulsar Mar 31, 2023, 5:41 AM

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I don't know why but the idea that the conscript earned a promotion from that has me cracking up

rotund axle Mar 31, 2023, 7:41 AM

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Shout-out to Shield Array Drone + Drone Commander 1 for being based as hell

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Also Metafold Shunt and Dipping Swallow Module is funny, sure that's 4 heat but are your enemies willing to bet that you won't do it?

tribal hearth Mar 31, 2023, 1:25 PM

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Put that on a Napoleon for 1 Damage and no consequences if you kill

rotund axle Mar 31, 2023, 2:13 PM

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Funnily enough I do have a Napoleon with Reactive Weave and Dipping Swallow

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(Reactive Weave is a slept on system Goddamn)

gentle forge Mar 31, 2023, 6:58 PM

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dusk arch that guy gets a promotion

I think he's sadly not available for the position after hitting the detpack

dusk arch Mar 31, 2023, 11:16 PM

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Oh okay, he hit it THAT way

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in that case: lmao

nova slate Mar 31, 2023, 11:18 PM

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Posthumous promotion

languid cosmos Mar 31, 2023, 11:34 PM

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his child is promoted

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congratulations! for the death of your father, this was his backup conscript mech,

rotund axle Apr 2, 2023, 4:20 PM

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So Kai, how's 2.2.5 coming along?

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New updates, etc.

dusk arch Apr 2, 2023, 5:06 PM

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#1057779385027002388 message

rotund axle Apr 2, 2023, 5:07 PM

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Ah yeah I saw that, was just asking if there were any new developments since then

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Just excited for it

dusk arch Apr 2, 2023, 5:12 PM

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the development is you can click on a link and download it

rotund axle Apr 2, 2023, 5:19 PM

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Thanks for the sarcasm but I'm asking if anything's happened since then because unless the PDF of the original message has been updated somehow it's been a few days

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As I said, simply excited for it, if nothing notable has happened since the original message, simply say so

dusk arch Apr 2, 2023, 5:26 PM

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I mean that version linked there is the latest one. There really isn't anything that's planned in terms of like "there will be a chunk of new content" or anything because at this point I don't think I'm going to be adding anything else

rotund axle Apr 2, 2023, 5:26 PM

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Alright, gotcha, thanks

dusk arch Apr 2, 2023, 5:28 PM

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It's always possible I'll be hit with a bolt of inspiration and a desperate need to wrap something else into it but it would have to be something beyond just "oh I'll throw in another mech" or something, with the alt-frames and the GMS stuff that's been added I feel like it's hit a state of being pretty much done

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right now the primary focus has been on edits, formatting, and general revision, hence the adjustments to layout, keyword bolding, reformatting and rewriting certain elements to be in line with Lancer house style

rotund axle Apr 2, 2023, 5:29 PM

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Right right

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Well, that was actually what I was asking about, not new content but basically how close it is to being complete and state of the art for the alt frames and such

dusk arch Apr 2, 2023, 5:31 PM

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as far as art goes, I don't have any sort of timetable or schedule or plan for it, I commission art based on a "when I feel like it" basis since I'm not actually being funded or anything

rotund axle Apr 2, 2023, 5:31 PM

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Gotcha then

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Well, nice job on it so far mate, excited for it in the future

peak pine Apr 2, 2023, 7:24 PM

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Chiming in to mention I am an avid suldan enjoyer and love the work put into it

errant crane Apr 3, 2023, 10:33 PM

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Is there a specific naming convention for the C&H mechs I'm not picking up? Same way IPS-N mechs are named after naval related things, SSC mechs are moths/butterflies, HORUS are D&D monsters, and HA are military generals and leaders

ionic badger Apr 3, 2023, 10:34 PM

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they're named after different kinds of martial arts and fighting styles

nova slate Apr 3, 2023, 10:35 PM

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martial traditions might also be a way to term it

errant crane Apr 3, 2023, 10:35 PM

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Ohhhhh

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Wait, Sagittarius is a martial tradition?

nova slate Apr 3, 2023, 10:36 PM

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I think it might also fall under an umbrella of "Things used in an arena"

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Sagittarius references the centaur, who with mythologically warlike /shrug

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and archers

viral wave Apr 3, 2023, 10:37 PM

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Archery yeah

errant crane Apr 3, 2023, 10:38 PM

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Cool cool

nova slate Apr 3, 2023, 10:38 PM

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nova slate I think it might also fall under an umbrella of "Things used in an arena"

because being a matador isn't a martial tradition but is used in arenas

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im not sure what kalista is referencing off the top of my head

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talwar is a type of sword

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pesilat is a martial art

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retiarius is a gladiator role/rank

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charioteer was also a role/combat performance in arenas

ionic badger Apr 3, 2023, 10:40 PM

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nova slate im not sure what kalista is referencing off the top of my head

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnis

Arnis

Arnis, also known as Kali or Eskrima/Escrima, is the national martial art of the Philippines. The three are roughly interchangeable umbrella terms for the traditional martial arts of the Philippines ("Filipino Martial Arts", or FMA), which emphasize weapon-based fighting with sticks, knives, bladed weapons, and various improvised weapons, as wel...

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Kalista is a Kali practicioner

nova slate Apr 3, 2023, 10:40 PM

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ah see i suspected it might be kali or eskrima but i wasn't sure

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hmm, what's the kallarani reference?

ionic badger Apr 3, 2023, 10:46 PM

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it's a term for privateers from an old dynasty in the India region

nova slate Apr 3, 2023, 10:46 PM

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ahh makes sense

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so not tied into the arena element

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ty

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i wonder if its too late to start learning escrima at 30

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might be a way to kinda skew into learning a bit more of my filipino heritage

midnight crypt Apr 3, 2023, 10:47 PM

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Never too late mate

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Go out and get it

dusk arch Apr 3, 2023, 11:16 PM

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nova slate Sagittarius references the centaur, who with mythologically warlike /shrug

This actually fooled dragonkid too, but Sagittarius is also the name for a type of roman gladiator

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They did in fact fight with bows, and they derived their name from the mythological figure, but the reason it got chosen specifically is because it references a gladiatorial combattant style

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Kallarani is sort of the odd one out but try as I might, I was unable to source any evidence of anything resembling ritualistic, competitive, or spectacle-oriented naval combat as anything like a tradition or style, outside of occasional apocryphal references to the colosseum in Rome being capable of holding mock sea battles, but never any major details beyond that and it was much more of a "yeah and sometimes they did this I guess"

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Also speaking as someone who took a whopping six months of escrima, it's pretty fun and if you have the chance to practice I recommend it

nova slate Apr 3, 2023, 11:29 PM

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dusk arch This actually fooled dragonkid too, but Sagittarius is also the name for a type ...

I very much enjoy learning this ty

dusk arch Apr 3, 2023, 11:32 PM

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re: kallarani, Alaen is correct, to flesh it out a bit kallarani (and it's unclear to me whether this is singular, plural, or collective, so it may be weirdly named, too late to do anything about it now) were specifically pirates who were captured and then given a choice of either serving in the actual no-fooling navy or being put to death, which I felt was an appropriate name for a mech that was essentially repurposed from piratical origins into something with a veneer of legitimacy

sullen python Apr 8, 2023, 12:56 PM

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does spider mine movement trigger reactions?

dusk arch Apr 8, 2023, 7:44 PM

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sullen python does spider mine movement trigger reactions?

They aren't characters (they used to be drones but that was changed a while ago) so I'm not sure there are any reactions they COULD trigger by moving

errant crane Apr 9, 2023, 1:33 AM

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Does Sagittarius's sensor ghost trait count against aoe weapons?

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 1:36 AM

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If those AoE attacks don't have line of sight to the Sagittarius

errant crane Apr 9, 2023, 1:36 AM

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gotcha, so when sagittarius is hidden, it's basically invisible from all attacks? if I understand correctly.

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 1:37 AM

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"Hidden" and "not having line of sight" aren't really the same thing

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Hidden isn't "you lack LoS to the target" or else you could bypass it with arcing or seeking, Hidden is "you cannot target this character, unless you plant an AoE down somewhere in their vicinity"

errant crane Apr 9, 2023, 1:38 AM

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gotcha

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 1:41 AM

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Sensor Ghost is specifically invisibility against attacks which lack LoS, so that's largely going to affect things like Arcing and Seeking attacks or other sorts of "ignore LoS" stuff, AoEs are a thing which can bypass Hidden but don't have any inherent LoS-ignorant properties

errant crane Apr 9, 2023, 1:41 AM

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ah

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thanks

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 1:42 AM

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a good example of how Hide and LoS aren't really entangled concepts is it's perfectly possible to Hide while out in the open, provided you're Invisible

swift mesa Apr 9, 2023, 1:43 AM

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It's more of a 'Fuck off Arty' defensive technique.

errant crane Apr 9, 2023, 1:46 AM

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Yeah I was just looking at Sagittarius and thought it was the darndest little thing

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 1:46 AM

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the sagittarius already benefits pretty heavily from being able to remain hidden while attacking, it being invisible against attacks while hidden on top of that would make it pretty hard to interact with at all

errant crane Apr 9, 2023, 1:46 AM

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I just have a thing for size 1/2 mechs

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I mean it does need allthe layers of defense it can get, 2 repair cap and 6 health is rough on a striker

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I'm trying to get a buddy to play Sagittarius because I'm going Zheng

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That would be a funny combo

drowsy coyote Apr 9, 2023, 7:48 AM

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Has anyone tried a FEARKILLER Sal with NOAH and ibeji ?

lethal ridge Apr 9, 2023, 11:23 AM

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nova slate pesilat is a martial art

At least where im from silat is the martial art and the pe- prefix makes it "silat practioner/user"

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(Which is In Theme)

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 11:35 AM

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yep

drowsy coyote Apr 9, 2023, 12:15 PM

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Hey Kai question about ibeji and iconoclast 2, that free zap that comes off you when you use an NHP ability, will it come off you and the clone or will you have to pick one

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 4:37 PM

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What does the talent do exactly

toxic crag Apr 9, 2023, 4:41 PM

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excluding you handing control of your mech over to
the NHP as a Protocol, you may immediately create a
Line 3 lightning arc as a Free Action. Characters of
your choice in the Line are dealt 2 AP Energy
damage. Each NHP may only trigger this Action
1/Round.```

devout river Apr 9, 2023, 4:41 PM

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The whole talent

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toxic crag Apr 9, 2023, 4:42 PM

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that's probably more useful lol

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 5:21 PM

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Well the general rule or IBEJI is "if the question you're asking is whether it lets you double-dip on things the answer is no"

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so for the purpose of Iconoclast when it comes time to emit lightning, you're going to have to choose a body to be the origin point

drowsy coyote Apr 9, 2023, 5:32 PM

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Makes sense, it’s what I thought but thanks for confirming Kai

drowsy coyote Apr 9, 2023, 7:09 PM

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So ibeji and prospector are going to be very confusing I think

dusk arch Apr 9, 2023, 7:21 PM

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I'm gonna be honest, I'm not tremendously concerned about that

drowsy coyote Apr 9, 2023, 7:23 PM

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Oh not in a negative sense

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Feels like you’ll get to pretend that you’re an efreet even when you haven’t taken the frame lol

devout river Apr 9, 2023, 7:49 PM

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I don't think it will be too bad as creating the entrance and exit are both part of the same action so I don't think you can split them with Ibeji

drowsy coyote Apr 9, 2023, 8:02 PM

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No but the final level lets you make two tunnels so you can enter one and pop out next to the one your clone made last round

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It’s going to be awesome

devout river Apr 9, 2023, 8:24 PM

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Which just makes it a little easier to set up the tunnel network than without Ibeji

obsidian kiln Apr 10, 2023, 3:44 AM

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How do Echo Cloak (C&H Sagittarius) and Infiltrator 2 work?

Infil 2 states it triggers off of you being hidden at the start of your turn, while Echo Cloak is a Protocol (i.e., start of my turn) that can be triggered when Hidden and then un-Hides me. Thus, this all seems to imply that I can be Hidden at the start of my turn, tripping Infil 2 -> Echo Cloak -> get +1 accuracy and +1d6 bonus damage (though I would not be hidden when I shoot, thus meaning that the Sagittarius's +1 accuracy frame trait doesn't trigger).

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context: I'm working on a horrible 5d6+6 AP turn sagittarius build and I'm wondering whether I need one setup turn or whether I need to get weird with two turns/overcharge/etc

dusk arch Apr 10, 2023, 3:50 AM

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Infiltrator 2's conditional trigger is "When you start your turn Hidden," and does not require you to remain hidden or deactivate if you somehow don't remain hidden, it's just "were you hidden at the start of your turn, y/n" if y then you get Infiltrator 2's bonus

Echo Cloak is a protocol that you can take while Hidden, and protocols are taken at the start of your turn

So yeah, there's no reason why these don't work together in that way. Even if someone wanted to argue about when in "the stack" Infiltrator 2 comes into play, since they're both your own abilities and both happening at the same time (the start of your turn) you would be the one to decide their order anyway

obsidian kiln Apr 10, 2023, 3:53 AM

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Excellent, glad for the clarification. The point-and-click 1 structure deletion button may continue in all its terrible glory.

sinful steeple Apr 10, 2023, 8:47 AM

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yo is there some sort of discord server for suldan-centered stuff

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i got a custom token i wanna post but idk if i can just slam it down in this thread

amber crystal Apr 10, 2023, 10:14 AM

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You can just slam it down here yeah

sinful steeple Apr 10, 2023, 10:34 AM

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aight bet

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size 3 fearkiller saladin

drowsy coyote Apr 10, 2023, 11:04 AM

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That’s so dope

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Mind if I Yonk for my own FEARKILLER

sinful steeple Apr 10, 2023, 3:12 PM

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go right ahead

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i can send you the xcf if you want

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pestilat too!

drowsy coyote Apr 10, 2023, 3:46 PM

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Thanks a bunch

hasty pulsar Apr 10, 2023, 3:47 PM

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Rakshasa also works as a pretty good base for making Pesilat tokens

broken hill Apr 10, 2023, 4:28 PM

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Have a Sagi I made while we are at it.

hasty pulsar Apr 10, 2023, 4:34 PM

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the token I was gonna use for Sagi

queen star Apr 10, 2023, 6:57 PM

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broken hill Have a Sagi I made while we are at it.

May I yonk this for my own use?

broken hill Apr 10, 2023, 6:58 PM

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Sure, it is just a kit bash of retrograde stuff mostly.

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I also made a matched nightingale drone if you want that.

sinful steeple Apr 10, 2023, 8:08 PM

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Thats awesoms

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@dry cipher come post your matador token

dry cipher Apr 10, 2023, 8:09 PM

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E

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matador... matador where did i put him again...

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there you go

tall oak Apr 10, 2023, 9:03 PM

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here's my take on an efreet

dusk arch Apr 10, 2023, 11:33 PM

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These tokens all kick ass btw

compact marten Apr 10, 2023, 11:53 PM

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oh wow they rule

ashen parrot Apr 11, 2023, 12:24 PM

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These are collabs (I only did color and added some bits), but I've got some for the NPCs!

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Termite

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Gladiator (chassis by MrMorphine482)

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Valkyrie

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Sergeant (base chassis by Mr. Subaltern)
Spoilered for Operation Incisor players

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And finally, my favorite of the bunch (which also happens to be the one I've worked on the longest), the Ogre!

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Chassis in no small part thanks to Ta13oo

compact marten Apr 11, 2023, 4:18 PM

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Oh man, they kick ass

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Way better than my clumsy kitbashes I made hah

compact marten Apr 11, 2023, 6:57 PM

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May I use them for my game?

dry cipher Apr 12, 2023, 12:37 PM

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Carrier

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Conscript

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Gladiator

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Nightmare

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Ogre

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Phantom

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Sergeant

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Termite

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Valkyrie

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and I think that's all the sprites I've made for the Hearth-7 server (who uses Suldan)

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There's also Titan but we all know Titan is just a Sirocco

hasty pulsar Apr 12, 2023, 12:51 PM

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dry cipher Nightmare

where did those shieldy bits on the nightmare come from?

dry cipher Apr 12, 2023, 12:52 PM

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hasty pulsar where did those shieldy bits on the nightmare come from?

Gorgon

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hasty pulsar Apr 12, 2023, 12:52 PM

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neat

sinful steeple Apr 12, 2023, 2:32 PM

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dry cipher Nightmare

fuck this guy btw

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Maboi jumpscared my character with that exact token

drowsy coyote Apr 12, 2023, 2:32 PM

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Has someone bother Kai with how ibeji works with the WW lance and pinning spire

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I’m assuming whoever uses the weapon or system becomes the one that’s immobilized

dusk arch Apr 12, 2023, 2:45 PM

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drowsy coyote I’m assuming whoever uses the weapon or system becomes the one that’s immobilize...

-Any sort of self-generated status, condition, or other ongoing effect is shared between the two
bodies. For example, if you use a talent, system, or ability that causes you to become Immobilized
(such as the Crack Shot talent) then both you and the echo are Immobilized, making it so you can't
use an ability like that and also walk around. If you Brace, the ongoing effects of Bracing apply to
both you and the echo. This applies to positive effects as well though, such as the Metalmark's core
power; when active, both you and the echo are Invisible for the scene. Other ongoing effects which
aren't as neatly categorized as statuses or conditions are also shared provided they aren't something
that has specific targeting/area requirements as noted above. An example of this is
charging/spinning up weapons like the Assault Cannon, Leviathan Heavy Assault Cannon, or
D/D288, Crack Shot, Siege Stabilizers, etc.```

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-Hostile conditions and statuses, essentially. One of your bodies being locked on to does not create a
lock on the other. If your main mech is knocked prone, the echo is not also knocked prone. A mech
under the effect of an immobilizing Lock/Hold Javelin can create an echo to move and act, an echo
can continue to attack, use tech actions, and reactions even if the main mech is suffering from
hostile jamming and vice versa. Grappling, which can be done by you or by others, will not cause
you both to become Immobilized if one of you does.```

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📎 IBEJI_FAQ.pdf

drowsy coyote Apr 12, 2023, 2:46 PM

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Oh so if they bonk your shadow clone it would break the status on you both as well

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Cool

dusk arch Apr 12, 2023, 2:47 PM

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likewise, if you use mobius anchor then both you and the other body have to abide by the restrictions or break the effect

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Efreet license) is a hacking ability that Immobilizes a target for an ongoing duration, but instantly
ends if you attack, force saves, or move without teleporting. If EITHER of your bodies does any of
these things, the effect of Mobius Anchor immediately ends. ```

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basically ibeji will not allow you to have your cake and eat it too when it comes to things like that

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but anything imposed by hostile (or I guess even neutral effects like terrain) will not affect both, if someone immobilizes one of your bodies then the other can still move fine

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if one of your bodies is in a patch of difficult terrain, the other won't be affected as such

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etc

drowsy coyote Apr 12, 2023, 2:51 PM

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Thanks Kai that makes it very clear

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Thanks Kai that makes it very clear

icy dove Apr 12, 2023, 3:36 PM

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If Matador and a friend get hit by an AoE Smart Attack, an it still pull the attack towards it and get hit twice?

devout river Apr 12, 2023, 3:39 PM

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My guess based on the similar effect of Camus's Razor from the White Witch is that the AOE would be forced to contain you, which as it already does doesn't do much

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dusk arch Apr 12, 2023, 11:32 PM

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generally speaking as a rule, attacks can't be made to "double tap" someone

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i.e. you can't place two pinaka templates so they overlap a person and hit them twice, etc

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so the same applies with anything that can mess with targeting, if the matador is already being targeted then it cannot be targeted twice

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that said, it doesn't work like camus razor in physically moving the orientation of AoEs, it simply diverts the attack towards it regardless

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so if the matador is nearby, but not within, an AoE that qualifies as something IFF Spoofer could intervene in, you can drag it over to you (the "even if it could not have originally hit you" clause is a good way of looking at it)

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but if the matador is already in the AoE then no dice

dusk arch Apr 13, 2023, 1:31 AM

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1/round, whenever a hostile character targets an allied character within range 3 with a tech action, an attack using a Smart weapon, or an ability which inflicts a Systems save which does not also include the Matador, you may force that attack, action, or save to target the Matador instead even if could not originally have done so (such as due to range, etc). I might adjust the wording along these lines

icy dove Apr 13, 2023, 4:26 AM

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That makes it clearer. I assume the same applies to a Witch using Spread Suffering?

dusk arch Apr 13, 2023, 4:39 AM

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So Spread Suffering isn't really an AoE, it's actually two actions:
1). the primary action to do the tech attack
2). a free action to repeat it
So a Matador could yank either one of those towards it if it was in range to do so. If happened to be the primary target, I believe it could in fact yank the followup towards it as well since it's not all one attack, it's actually two attacks

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if that makes sense

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This is as opposed to the classic example of the pinaka missile which creates one attack that happens to be composed of two AoE templates

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another way to look at it is Spread Suffering is akin to overcharging

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it just doesn't cost any heat but has stricter targeting requirements

ashen parrot Apr 13, 2023, 11:55 AM

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compact marten May I use them for my game?

Wouldn't have shared 'em if otherwise!

rotund axle Apr 15, 2023, 3:11 AM

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Can you be the one to decline Take Your Best Shot or only your opponent?

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IE can you decide to just stop letting them make any more attacks

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 3:30 AM

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rotund axle Can you be the one to decline Take Your Best Shot or only your opponent?

So sort of. How it works is thus:
1). when you first use the ability, the NPC you single out gets a free attack against you, and then you get a free attack against them in return
2). "You may then allow that character to make another attack against you if you wish" so at this point you are the one who is making the choice to continue the brawl, if you wish you can even call it off after a single exchange
3). "repeating this process until one of you has been destroyed or until they decline to attack you any further." however the NPC has the option to refuse taking the attack and continuing the brawl if they choose, which means you can't drag someone into an infinite cycle that ends with them dead if they don't want to

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So at step 2 (at any point following an NPC attack/PC attack loop) you the PC can choose to call it off, but if you extend the offer the NPC can also decline to keep it going

rotund axle Apr 15, 2023, 3:31 AM

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Alright, but at step 3 can you still decide to call it off or at that point is the choice solely up to the NPC?

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 3:32 AM

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step 3 is "you've made the offer to the NPC to keep going, now they can agree or refuse"

rotund axle Apr 15, 2023, 3:32 AM

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Ah I see

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Alrighty, thanks chief

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 3:32 AM

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if you get to that point, you (the PC) have already said "sure, let's keep going" but they also have to agree to it as well, it's essentially a mutual decision

rotund axle Apr 15, 2023, 3:33 AM

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Gotcha gotcha, but you can still decide to call it off on future cycles

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 3:33 AM

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Yeah, the process repeats from the top each time essentially

rotund axle Apr 15, 2023, 3:33 AM

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Gotcha then

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 3:34 AM

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the only time the issue is forced for anyone is when you first use the talent, the NPC can't really decline then or else the talent simply wouldn't work

rotund axle Apr 15, 2023, 3:34 AM

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Mhm

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That clears it up

faint fjord Apr 15, 2023, 6:51 PM

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when you eject as a reaction with kangto endochassis, how does this interact with a mech melting down? does it just not work as its a reaction has has to occur after it melts down with you in it?

devout river Apr 15, 2023, 7:19 PM

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faint fjord when you eject as a reaction with kangto endochassis, how does this interact wit...

It explicity does work, from the PDF

faint fjord Apr 15, 2023, 7:22 PM

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lookit that then

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well, that's more in the vein of "you left behind a mech in the middle of a meltdown timer, as a normal ejection"

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i'm looking more at "the mech blows up with you in it, and reactions happen after the trigger. so if you want to react to the mech's annihilation and that of everything inside of it, while you are in it, it seems like a paradox that doesn't resolve with you leaving it"

opaque crane Apr 15, 2023, 7:43 PM

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Presumably the answer is "assume this lets the thing work" as opposed to the answer where the backup doesn't actually work as a backup.

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 8:12 PM

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faint fjord i'm looking more at "the mech blows up with you in it, and reactions happen afte...

"You may Eject as a reaction whenever your mech is destroyed" implies that it is possible to actually eject when your mech is destroyed

faint fjord Apr 15, 2023, 8:20 PM

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very good

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now, if you had a kangto endochassis in there with you, the only way it's getting out is if you eject which means you leave the mech with it. you can't send an ai out in it right

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 8:22 PM

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Meltdown stuff mainly gets weird when people try to do stuff like cheese the manticore's castigate, which is 100% disallowable

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you cannot use kangto endochassis to have a castigate and survive, if you want the big explosion you have to die for it

faint fjord Apr 15, 2023, 8:23 PM

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oh no, the plan involves you staying behind

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there's no subaltern staying in the mech, it's the nhp leaving it

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i just wanted to see how far the interactions went

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 8:24 PM

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@Kai Tave, Killswitch Gremlin If my AI controls my mech and I blow myself up through castigate the enemies of the godhead of the manticore, can my AI eject and get into the Kangto, controlling it (even though my pilot is gonezo)?```
```Kai Tave, Killswitch Gremlin — 09/06/2022 3:00 PM
The answer to any "can I use your thing to cheese castigate" questions is always, 100% of the time, going to be a hard no```

hasty pulsar Apr 15, 2023, 8:56 PM

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technically, I don't think that counts as cheesing castigate

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you still die, your NHP just gets to survive

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which, I think you could do already?

devout river Apr 15, 2023, 8:59 PM

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The problem is that it means that the player gets to keep playing with effectively a new character immediately rather than having to wait until a new character can be brought in, which is the big downside of using Castigate

hasty pulsar Apr 15, 2023, 9:02 PM

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Ahhh, okay I see what you mean

swift barn Apr 15, 2023, 9:06 PM

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I think narratively you could just boot the NHP into the Kangto
mechanically though, I guess the endochassis would just have to not be there? I guess?

dusk arch Apr 15, 2023, 9:16 PM

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Like the long story short is regardless of however someone wants to spin it, I will never make a thing which then lets someone try to turn castigate into some sort of free ride

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 1:11 AM

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How is Gajasura supposed to be pronounced?

dusk arch Apr 17, 2023, 1:31 AM

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To the best of my knowledge, pretty much how it looks with the emphasis on the second syllable (gajAHsura)

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:14 PM

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Just double checking how OGOUN works. If an assault hits me for 8 damage, and I use OGOUN, it DOES get reduced to 4 damage, correct?

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I'm just a tad bit confused by the bit at the end

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"This reaction resolves after any damage dealt by the effect, but before the triggering condition is applied"

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:15 PM

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it does not apply to the triggering attack itself

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:16 PM

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But at the beginning, it says you gain resistance to all damage including the triggering attack or save

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:16 PM

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basically say you get hit by a Demolisher, and fail the save and become Stunned
you don't reduce the damage you take from that attack, but before you actually become Stunned you can take the reaction and gain the resistance to other attacks until your next turn

languid cosmos Apr 17, 2023, 4:18 PM

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It applies after damage so that it can work off hits that stun you through structure, I believe

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:18 PM

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so I DO get resistance to the damage from the attack, right?

languid cosmos Apr 17, 2023, 4:18 PM

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So if I get sniped, I can ogoun for resistance and all

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OGOUN-Class NHP
3 SP, AI, UNIQUE, HEAT 3 (SELF)
Your mech gains the AI tag and Lord of Iron.
Gain the following actions:
Lord of Iron (Reaction, 1/round)
Trigger: You are hit by an attack or fail a save which causes you to become Immobilized, Jammed, or Stunned.
Effect: You gain resistance to all damage (including the triggering attack or save) and cannot fail Hull or Agility saves or checks until the end of your next turn. This effect resolves after any damage dealt by the triggering attack or save, but before the condition is applied.

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Yes

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:19 PM

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errant crane But at the beginning, it says you gain resistance to all damage including the tr...

oh hmmm
it didn't show that on C/C, mb

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:19 PM

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languid cosmos **OGOUN-Class NHP** 3 SP, AI, UNIQUE, HEAT 3 (SELF) Your mech gains the AI tag a...

So I get perma resistance until the end of my next turn?

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:19 PM

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yes

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:19 PM

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huh

languid cosmos Apr 17, 2023, 4:19 PM

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Yes

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:19 PM

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that seems very strong

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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well it's only if you get CC'd

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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OH

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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the trigger is not any time you are hit by an attack

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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OHHHHHH

ionic badger Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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only if it would cause you to become Stunned, Jammed, or Immobilized

languid cosmos Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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It’s 3 sp, 3 heat per use, and only works on nasty cc effect attacks, yea

errant crane Apr 17, 2023, 4:20 PM

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Okay yeah, I get it now

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my initial thought was that it was that you get hit by an attack OR fail a save that causes you to

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yeah okay

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so it's just an uno reverse button

languid cosmos Apr 17, 2023, 4:21 PM

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My question is if you can Ogoun a Petrify. Since iirc that starts at Slow, but will inevitably immobilize and stun you

nova slate Apr 17, 2023, 4:23 PM

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i wouldn't think so because, despite eventually immobilizing you, it doesn't actually immobilize you on hit

languid cosmos Apr 17, 2023, 4:25 PM

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Yeah, that's the reasonable ruling, and one I would default to. But I also want to ask this probably bad faith question just to see if this odd corner case would work

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Because Petrify is so unique like that

hasty pulsar Apr 17, 2023, 4:38 PM

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You can Ogoun, but only on the turn it actually immobilizes you :V

short flower Apr 17, 2023, 11:13 PM

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quick question. does pariah strain follow the target, or does it only apply to enemies in the burst 2 at time of hack?

dusk arch Apr 17, 2023, 11:21 PM

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lotta questions

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1). ogoun does work as described, it ONLY triggers off attacks or saves which do those specific CC effects. The reason it is worded as it is comes down to the fact that being jammed or stunned (two of the three effects it procs off of) would prevent reactions from being used. It's there to make it clear that the reaction inserts itself in between you taking damage from whatever hit you but the CC applies AFTERWARD, so as not to cause any weird "but how does a reaction take place after you've been stunned" stuff

dusk arch Apr 17, 2023, 11:23 PM

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languid cosmos My question is if you can Ogoun a Petrify. Since iirc that starts at Slow, but w...

2). No, because Petrify is not an attack or save which causes you to become immoblized, jammed, or stunned

dusk arch Apr 17, 2023, 11:24 PM

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short flower quick question. does pariah strain follow the target, or does it only apply to e...

3). Per the core rulebook page 64:
If a BURST effect is ongoing, it moves with the character at its center.

short flower Apr 17, 2023, 11:30 PM

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man I didn't even think of checking if the CRB covered it lol. Thanks.

dusk arch Apr 17, 2023, 11:40 PM

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no worries, it's a reasonable enough question, someone else asked me about it the other day

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Pariah Strain moves with the target and, importantly, you can apply it to enemies OR allies

errant crane Apr 18, 2023, 1:26 AM

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dusk arch 1). ogoun does work as described, it ONLY triggers off attacks or saves which do...

So basically, if I get hit by a demolisher for 15 damage, I can OGOUN to resist the damage and auto succeed on the save? Or is it that I pop OGOUN, roll the save, get stunned if I fail, but still gain resistance to all damage and auto successes on agi and hull saved

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Saves

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And how does OGOUN's auto passes on hull and agi interact with the auto fails while stunned

dusk arch Apr 18, 2023, 1:32 AM

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errant crane So basically, if I get hit by a demolisher for 15 damage, I can OGOUN to resist ...

1). My answer to the first part has been thus:
This is correct. For a matter like this, like "hit by an attack and you have to pass a save to see if you've been stunned," the reaction's validity is going to depend on whether or not that status effect has actually applied. If you're hit by an attack that does not ultimately stun, jam, or immobilize you, then you can't use OGOUN. That being the case, you're hit by this attack. Has it stunned you? That needs to be determined as a component of the trigger, and so the hull save is going to need to be rolled. Did you succeed on the save and aren't stunned? Congratulations, but you can't use Lord of Iron. Did the attack cause you to become Stunned? Condolences, but now the reaction trigger is valid
i.e. if you are hit by an attack which prompts some sort of save versus a thing, whether you can use ogoun to react to it depends upon whether the save is successful or not. If you are hit by a demolisher's hammer but it doesn't stun you, then no dice. If you are hit by a demolisher's hammer and you do get stunned, then you can use it. You can ONLY use ogoun if the attack and/or save would actually cause you to suffer the status. There's no free ride. When you are benefitting from Lord of Iron, you WILL be Immobilized, Jammed, and or Stunned
2). As with all things in lancer, specifics override generals. The general rule for being stunned is you auto-fail hull and agility saves/checks. Ogoun specifically says you automatically pass them. Ogoun overrides the more general rule and replaces it with its own for the duration

opaque crane Apr 18, 2023, 1:38 AM

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On the plus(???) side, you can always choose to fail, say, the Demo Hammer Save to be Stunned.

dusk arch Apr 18, 2023, 1:38 AM

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You could!

opaque crane Apr 18, 2023, 1:39 AM

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(Insert additional question marks as required.)

dusk arch Apr 18, 2023, 1:39 AM

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There might even be compelling arguments for the tactical utility of being able to do this with immobilized, which is probably the "least" punitive of the conditions

errant crane Apr 18, 2023, 1:50 AM

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Honestly could be very nice on the Gajasura for jammed

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Demon's fang is a very nice 1d6+3 damage that can be used while Jammed

dusk arch Apr 18, 2023, 1:52 AM

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yeah, could do that too, or a raleigh or a comet for that matter

errant crane Apr 19, 2023, 3:08 AM

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Could a Gajasura barrage, do attack one from the barrage, killing floor for the demon's fang, and then do attack two from the barrage?

dusk arch Apr 19, 2023, 3:11 AM

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triggered free actions can interrupt other actions, and in fact have to be used immediately or not at all

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this is the same as using Duelist 3 in the middle of a barrage

errant crane Apr 19, 2023, 3:16 AM

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Nice, thanks for clearing it up, I wasn't sure about it since I choose to pop the core. Thanks, makes managing heat and getting max value out of nuke cav a hell of a lot easier with ucomp

dusk arch Apr 19, 2023, 3:19 AM

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Okay wait hold on

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You mean the core power specifically?

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Then no

errant crane Apr 19, 2023, 3:19 AM

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Okay yeah

dusk arch Apr 19, 2023, 3:19 AM

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1/round, if you destroy a character with this weapon you can move up to 2 spaces and make another attack with this weapon as a free action.

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This can be used mid-barrage

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because, and ONLY because, it is a triggered action

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i.e. it is granted as a result of "when you do X, you can do Y as a free action"

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but Killing Floor is not a triggered free action, it's just a normal free action

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you can't use it mid-barrage the same way you can't overcharge to skirmish mid-barrage

errant crane Apr 19, 2023, 3:38 AM

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Yeah alright, that does actually answer another question, and that's if I barrage and slap a dude with the demon's fang and then slide over to another goon, can I hit him with the second weapon that I chose for that barrage

dusk arch Apr 19, 2023, 3:44 AM

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you're always free to target weapons in a skirmish/barrage however you like, and if interstitial movement comes into play then you can utilize it to your advantage

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you never have to "lock in" targets in advance

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this is how Hunter 1 works, you make a leap before you make the attack

errant crane Apr 19, 2023, 3:46 AM

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Nice

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Demon's fang is just the gift that keeps on giving, huh?

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It's hype as hell

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Turn grunts into past tense and at the same time turn them into present tense boost pads

quaint beacon Apr 19, 2023, 3:57 AM

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gajasura is just sick as fuck. love that mech

errant crane Apr 19, 2023, 3:57 AM

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I love how it's somehow more violent and SOMEHOW even stupider at tech attacking

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Than the kalista

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Reliable 4 is so god damn tasty

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 1:38 AM

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my never-ending quest to continue tweaking the saboteur drone continues Choose a hostile mech within Sensors and make a contested check using Grit against the target's Hull. On a success, the drone latches onto their mech and begins jockeying the target, benefiting from your talents. You automatically succeed on all attempts at this check if you Scan the target at any point beforehand during the scene.

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:11 AM

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I love the saboteur drone

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Any plans to modify the saboteur drone's murder ability?

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Because I really like that ability too

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:13 AM

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that got modified a little while back

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:13 AM

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It's very flavorful

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:13 AM

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dusk arch that got modified a little while back

How so?

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:13 AM

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Sabotage: The target makes all checks and saves with +2 Difficulty until the end of their next turn.
Rend: The target must pass a Hull save or become Shredded until the end of their next turn. On a success, they take 2 AP kinetic damage.
Breach: If the target has only 1 Structure remaining, is at 7 HP or less, and doesn't have Immunity to damage, you may order the drone to breach the cockpit and messily kill the pilot. This destroys the target instantly unless it can function without a pilot, and panic causes all hostile characters within a Burst 2 around the breached target to become Impaired until the end of their next turn. You receive a notification when a jockeyed target can be breached, and breaching the cockpit this way can only be done 1/scene.```

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It's now a separate jockeying ability that uses the Enkidu threshold as a trigger and can be used 1/scene without sacrificing the drone

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:14 AM

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Ohhh okay

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So is the 1/mission version the current one, or the Enkidu one is the current version? Because I've got the 1/mission PDF

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:15 AM

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that version that I quoted is current

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there's a 2.2.5 working draft pdf that's been posted here that I'm using to work on layout while also making some mechanical side adjustments

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📎 2.2.5_Changelog.txt

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This is a list of the current working changes

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:21 AM

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Nice!

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:21 AM

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I thiiiiiiiink the 2.2.5 version is also where I added a half dozen GMS weapons as well

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Main Launcher
AP, Ordnance
Range 10
5 explosive damage

MC-ASG Assault Shotgun
Heavy CQB
Knockback 2, Loading
Range 5, Threat 3
1d6+7 kinetic damage

MC-BAC Anti-Cavalry Melee Weapon
Heavy Melee
Accurate, Knockback 1
Threat 2
1d6+3 kinetic damage

MC-DA Apex Nexus
Superheavy Nexus
Arcing, Smart
Range 10, Line 5
2d6+3 explosive damage

MC-DWA Wasp Nexus
Auxiliary Nexus
Accurate, AP, Smart
Range 5
1 explosive damage

MC-LMG Light Machine Gun
Auxiliary Rifle
Range 10
2 kinetic damage```

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:23 AM

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Wait real? Didn't know we were getting more GMS options in a coming update

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That's cool as hell

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:23 AM

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yeah I wanted to add a few things to flesh out some options and playstyles more

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some extra nexus stuff for the comet and chimera, an aux rifle for the reaper dart to make use of outside of oracles, etc

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:24 AM

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Nice, any plans for more mechs? Also, the C&H core bonuses feel a bit specific, was this by design?

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:24 AM

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no more mechs

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at this point I am pretty certain that the mechanical side content is complete unless I somehow get hit with an overwhelming amount of inspiration, and I doubt that's happening

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:25 AM

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Alrigjt

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Alright

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:26 AM

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also I've continued to adjust the core bonuses including in this latest pass, at this point I'm not sure exactly how to make them "less specific" in the ways that are I can only assume being remarked upon

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:27 AM

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This is all just vibes based, but they kind of gave me the vibe of Kai bioplating, where they're a lot better in play than on paper

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Which I thought was appropriate, because, y'know, special solutions for special problems

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:29 AM

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I think some of them are probably a bit more narrow in application but I've tried to give them all some broader effects

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Hypertuned Interface for example now gives some stun mitigation, All-Environment Adaptation is a choose-your-own HASE bonus to checks and saves, Blowout Panels gives resistance to spillover damage, etc

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:34 AM

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Crash bars is the one that really seems specific to me, and I see the changes that have been done to it in the change log. I'm not so sure about the secondary effect being only 1/mission though. I haven't playtested the CB, so it is a gut feeling, but that's the one that stands out to me.

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:37 AM

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1/mission being able to automatically downgrade direct hit to system trauma is trading out being stunned/destroyed for losing a piece of gear, basically

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while it's true it won't do much commuting crushing hit to direct hit if you happen to be at 1 structure, I feel like being able to do this 1/scene would nonetheless be a little too effective in terms of added survivability

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:39 AM

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Would 1/mission ignore the results of a structure check be too busted?

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With a clause that you can't use this to prevent going from 1 structure to 0

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 2:42 AM

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well going from 1 to 0 isn't a structure check, it's just "how you are destroyed if all else fails"

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just ignoring the result might be fine idk

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 2:45 AM

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I feel like it would be nice as a CB for people who really don't like dying on second structure, or getting stunned on third.

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Just a once per mission "ignore a feel bad moment" CB, plus the benefits to flying mechs

waxen cedar Apr 20, 2023, 8:12 AM

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Can't wait for wasp nexus to commit hyper death with gorgslinger

ashen parrot Apr 20, 2023, 12:28 PM

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dusk arch ```MC-AML Anti-Armor Missile Launcher Main Launcher AP, Ordnance Range 10 5 expl...

Honestly very excited for all of these

ionic badger Apr 20, 2023, 1:10 PM

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dusk arch ```MC-AML Anti-Armor Missile Launcher Main Launcher AP, Ordnance Range 10 5 expl...

The Apex still slaps
It's gonna be great at LL0 I think

hasty pulsar Apr 20, 2023, 4:26 PM

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dusk arch ```MC-AML Anti-Armor Missile Launcher Main Launcher AP, Ordnance Range 10 5 expl...

non loading main Launcher
hell yeah

drowsy coyote Apr 20, 2023, 7:41 PM

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Assault shotgun Raleigh will be so fun

errant crane Apr 20, 2023, 11:28 PM

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Is the Macahuitl chainsword similar to Vlad's drill on crit?

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Where if either of the die land on the 6, the bonus damage triggers, and you roll 2 die for that one?

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So long as the two die you get on crit are the base damage die

nova slate Apr 20, 2023, 11:43 PM

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Question were those new weapons as of yet added to the itch lcp or is that pending for now?

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 11:53 PM

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errant crane Is the Macahuitl chainsword similar to Vlad's drill on crit?

As far as I know, all "roll again damage die when you get X result" stuff on critical hits works like the vlad's drill in that you do not pick your pool and THEN overkill procs, overkill procs on EVERY die in the doubled pool whether you want it to or not, and that being the case the same procedure would apply to the Macahuitl as well when rolling 6s on dice in a crit pool

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keep in mind that you can, at most, get a maximum final total of +3d6 bonus damage applied this way when all is said and done

dusk arch Apr 20, 2023, 11:54 PM

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nova slate Question were those new weapons as of yet added to the itch lcp or is that pendi...

not to itch, but there's a test lcp here somewhere

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#1057779385027002388 message

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try that

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note this isn't even "the most current version" because I'm still messing with stuff, but I believe that should have the GMS weapon data

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actually maybe I'll just make a new one, gimme a sec

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📎 Suldan_LCP_2.2.5_test.lcp

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There, that's the actual current working version

dusk arch Apr 21, 2023, 12:16 AM

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📎 Field_Guide_to_Suldan_Text_Only.pdf

dusk arch Apr 21, 2023, 12:16 AM

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dusk arch

dusk arch Apr 21, 2023, 12:17 AM

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dusk arch

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I'm just gonna pin those so I have access to them

dusk arch Apr 21, 2023, 12:17 AM

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dusk arch

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yeah there we go

errant crane Apr 21, 2023, 12:49 AM

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dusk arch keep in mind that you can, at most, get a maximum final total of +3d6 bonus dama...

getting 3d6 bonus damage is still hype as hell tho

waxen cedar Apr 21, 2023, 1:00 PM

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Question regarding Sabreur's Shield Drone - does "granting you hard cover" work for Black Thumb Rodeoing pilot as well or just the mech?

nova slate Apr 21, 2023, 2:18 PM

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From what I can tell it is a zone of hard cover effectively, so I'd presume as much

dusk arch Apr 21, 2023, 11:40 PM

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waxen cedar Question regarding Sabreur's Shield Drone - does "granting you hard cover" work ...

yeah this works, as far as I'm aware there's no rules provision anywhere for "riding on a mech alters the dynamics of cover"

short lake Apr 23, 2023, 1:38 AM

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Hello gamers, a friend of mine has a rules question regarding the Ibeji Class NHP, and how it interacts with Harrier Nexus. Does it trigger twice, or just once?

opaque crane Apr 23, 2023, 1:40 AM

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From what I understand, the rule of thumb is that you're never allowed to double-dip your effects because of it.

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So you could take the action through the echo, or do it yourself, but not both.

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:09 AM

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short lake Hello gamers, a friend of mine has a rules question regarding the Ibeji Class NH...

The echo shares all of your stats, systems, weapons, traits, and abilities
You may take any actions you wish through this echo, except for this protocol, dividing your standard movement and actions between yourself and the echo in any combination you see fit.

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So, by using Ibeji you still only have the same amount of actions as normal (not twice the amount) and you still only have the same amount of weapons, equipped systems, etc

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and it doesn't bypass restrictions on actions either (i.e. you can't skirmish and then skirmish again, you can't use the same protocol more than once, etc)

swift mesa Apr 23, 2023, 2:11 AM

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It's just a second place you can act from, as I understand it, rather than a True New Person.

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:11 AM

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Fundamentally, using Ibeji basically just increases the "footprint" of your mech, correct

short lake Apr 23, 2023, 2:12 AM

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Gotchya, thanks!

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:12 AM

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Now it does create situations where in cases where something is asking for "you" that you and the echo both count as such

#


-It means that both the echo and your main mech are both "you" for anything that talks about "you"
in permissive or restrictive terms. For example, one of the rules in Lancer is that you do not count
as "an ally" for the purpose of things which affect allies, and so the echo still counts as you for those
purposes; you can't use ally-only abilities on the echo, nor can the echo use them on your mech.
There are also some effects and abilities such as the Sunzi's Blinkspace Tunneler which allows
people to enter a portal and emerge next to you, and that would mean they could choose either you
or the echo as an exit point as both count as you and the choice is up to them.

This cuts both ways, however. For example, the Mobius Anchor invasion option (also found in the
Efreet license) is a hacking ability that Immobilizes a target for an ongoing duration, but instantly
ends if you attack, force saves, or move without teleporting. If EITHER of your bodies does any of
these things, the effect of Mobius Anchor immediately ends. Likewise, when you take the Hide
action both you and your echo will become Hidden (sharing ongoing effects), but if either one of
you breaks Hidden in some fashion then it breaks for both bodies, which means that you can't hide
while your echo is just standing in plain sight, you can't attack through the echo while your main
mech remains Hidden, etc. Or if you or the echo move before you choose to fire an Ordnance
weapon, then the opportunity to do so is lost even if you try to fire it through the body that hasn't
physically moved on the map.```

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So if something said "everyone adjacent to you takes damage" then that would apply to people adjacent to you and to the echo, because both of these are "you"

short lake Apr 23, 2023, 2:14 AM

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Like the Balor trait?

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:15 AM

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Yep, part of "The echo shares all of your stats, systems, weapons, traits, and abilities"

short lake Apr 23, 2023, 2:15 AM

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Yesssssss. Good to know.

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:16 AM

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So this being the case, here is how the interaction between Ibeji and the Harrier Nexus would work: the Harrier Nexus says "at the end of your turn, everyone within range 5 who is locked on gets pinged for damage"

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the implicit qualifier there is "within range 5 of you"

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so at the end of the turn, every locked on target within range 5 of either your original body OR the echo will get pinged by the Harrier Nexus, however you will not be able to "double tap" targets who are overlapped between your body and the echo, it's not two separate effects happening, it's one effect happening with a slightly different area

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and this is the same for the balor or anything like it as well, putting someone between you and an echo of yourself won't hit them with double the Scouring Swarm

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There's an FAQ which covers a number of general "what does Ibeji do when X" cases

📎 IBEJI_FAQ.pdf

short lake Apr 23, 2023, 2:19 AM

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Thank you!

trim moon Apr 23, 2023, 2:49 AM

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so, got to run the dueling rules tonight! giving a report as promised.

so the setup, we wrapped up today's combat early, decided to do a bit of post combat narrative. an HA armory admiral and Saladin pilot (Elite Commander Aegis) valiantly tries to defend his troops as they retreat from a failed defense of their capital ship. (pulled some details of the ship's defenses from battlegroup too, as it happens). during the narrative showdown, the general puts up his unused HA Blackwall System, and our Barbarossa player attempts to travel through it and vanishes. The general is then knocked into it by a tempest drone, sending them both into Blinkspace. the two of them duel it out with a pitch black backdrop, trying to return to realspace.

i introduced the dueling rules then rather quickly, and then effectively decided to treat it as a more complex game of RPS using three categories, Aggressive > Neutral > Defensive > Aggressive. i made two sets of three cards to mark which actions corresponded to each category. im posting a picture of the reference cards i made below. in retrospect i don't think i got the categories quite right and should've made more cards, but this is how it read on first brush. i definitely need to sit down with it if there's a chance of using it again

both parties started at 5, the general seized the initiative with Guarded Advance (Defensive) vs a Headlong Charge (Aggressive). soon after the general loses the initiative with his Strike (Neutral) vs Evade (Defensive). it snowballs from there as he never gets initiative back and is piledrove by the barbarossa. she then lost 1 repair from the structure table.

all in all, we had a ton of fun with it, getting to play out a cool mech showdown in the shadowrealm. im still fuzzy on if i got the rules right with the shorthand, before next session i might make some cards beforehand since this was super spur of the moment. love mech duels the the death, 10/10

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please excuse my chickenscratch handwriting and lack of contrast

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:50 AM

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So one thing that MIGHT help is if you grab the "text only" pdf in the pins, idk if you have that or not

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the reason is the formatting is somewhat improved over the 2.2.4 pdf

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the rules are the same, but it miiiiiight be easier to keep track of some stuff, I'm not sure

trim moon Apr 23, 2023, 2:51 AM

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the one i had is the text only version of 2.2.3 actually, now that I've checked

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:52 AM

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ah, well there won't be a lot of difference between that and 2.2.4, it's the text only version that includes a couple of quick summary charts and such

trim moon Apr 23, 2023, 2:52 AM

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oh yeah looking at it now those charts are handy

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yeah i think the way i presented it made it a little hard to properly assess risk/reward of each option so i picked largely by flavor

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some sort of easy to glance at what beats what i feel like would be helpful? unsure

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:54 AM

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It might be, though some of the interactions are hard to effectively summarize. They aren't quite as straightforward as RPS

trim moon Apr 23, 2023, 2:55 AM

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yeah im realizing that in retrospect

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hmmm

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if i end up making reference cards or similar ill def post em here, definitely seems like the play

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 2:56 AM

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I figure cards will be helpful yeah

trim moon Apr 23, 2023, 2:56 AM

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all in all this was sick tho, love it

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ty for making my mecha duels to the death dreams a reality

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 3:00 AM

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glad it worked out, I'm gonna keep tinkering with some of it I think

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it's good to get more feedback on it so thanks

trim moon Apr 23, 2023, 3:01 AM

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errant crane Apr 23, 2023, 3:19 AM

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For the sabeeur, does the bonus damage generated against a character from riposte have to be the first character that attacks you, or do you get to choose when to riposte?

dusk arch Apr 23, 2023, 3:35 AM

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1/round stuff is always at your discretion when to proc it, including "never" if you want to

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if something triggers off of the first X that happens in a timespan, it will have to state as much

errant crane Apr 23, 2023, 3:42 AM

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Thanks, just double checking

final forum Apr 25, 2023, 5:28 PM

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Just wanted to pop in and say I'm really loving Suldan, and really love the mecha. Offering them as options for my game for some new players

Hopefully one day we can see art for the other 3 alt frames so they can shine in all their glory

abstract lintel Apr 25, 2023, 8:30 PM

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Got a rules question, trying to see how The Enhanced Systems core bonus interacts with something from Legionairre

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Specifically, does this:

#

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Count as a Successful Invade for this:

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midnight crypt Apr 25, 2023, 8:31 PM

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Nope

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You didn't Tech Attack the target and hit

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It's also worth noting the large majority of homebrew is not designed to play nice with each other

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It's balanced internally

nova slate Apr 25, 2023, 8:33 PM

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Invade is the base tech attack, and you choose an invasion option after the invasion is successful, so data dart does not have an Invade step, it's a ranged attack instead, whereafter you pick an Invade option. To put it in other words

abstract lintel Apr 25, 2023, 8:35 PM

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That was my gut feeling, but I figured I'd ask.

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Unrelated, I really wish there were anything in the game that gave you any benefit to critting on a tech attack.

compact marten Apr 25, 2023, 8:51 PM

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If you use homebrew together, always use caution

abstract lintel Apr 25, 2023, 11:16 PM

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Yeah, my DM has a very Lax attitude to homebrew. Enhanced Systems Upgrade in it's own is extremely potent. Getting 12 heat on someone before they can do anything is just great

kind trench Apr 25, 2023, 11:19 PM

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Hi! I was looking at the reaper dart, and on the LCP, it says it has evasion 10, but on the PDF it says evasion 8

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which one is it?

dusk arch Apr 25, 2023, 11:26 PM

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kind trench Hi! I was looking at the reaper dart, and on the LCP, it says it has evasion 10,...

Should be 8, it was an lcp error

nova slate Apr 25, 2023, 11:49 PM

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Dart feels very fun with the amr

dusk arch Apr 26, 2023, 1:17 AM

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Speaking of duels, as per earlier discussions on the subject, I think I'm going to make some changes to the offense-versus-defense portion of things to more clearly categorize the various maneuver options on both sides

#

#

The broad outline I'm looking at is:
-Overpower is the high damage output option which can also result in you eating shit pretty hard on a Riposte, consistently higher numbers but if someone reads you it can lead to a big swing
-Strike is a solid option without a lot of serious strengths or weaknesses, but also doesn't excel, it's slow and steady
-Feint causes Riposte to eat shit making it the mind game counter to someone trying to counter your Overpower, but has a higher change of losing you the initiative against other maneuvers

while on the other end of things:
-Riposte is a strong counter to Overpower and can also deal counter damage against strikes, but eats shit hard against Feint, so you need to be sure you've read your opponent
-Guard is a good way to try and bring things back to a neutral stance without giving up a lot of damage except against Overpower, and is a good pick if you read an opponent's Feint
-Evade is about trying to seize the initiative but has no form of counter damage against any of the offensive options

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I'm probably going to continue to mess with things in a few cases

dusk arch Apr 27, 2023, 12:28 AM

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Now that the sun is out at the hatchery and I'm getting exposed to more vitamin D, I'm revisiting some core bonus stuff. A fairly regular comment regarding the C&H core bonuses is they feel a little narrowly applied, which isn't exactly wrong, they're more specialized, but for all that I'm looking at ways to give some of them a little more juice

dusk arch Apr 27, 2023, 12:32 AM

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errant crane Crash bars is the one that really seems specific to me, and I see the changes th...

Provisionally, what I'm looking at is the following:

Crash Bars
You gain Immunity to all damage from falling. Additionally, you may reroll structure damage checks, but must keep the second result even if it's worse.```
Per some comments earlier, I'm looking at Crash Bars as a core bonus that doesn't get a lot of play, so I'm doing two things with it. One, I'm just juicing the fall damage prevention, fuck it, why not, and second rather than a one-off structure damage mitigation tool I'm looking at something more long term

swift mesa Apr 27, 2023, 12:32 AM

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Looks very fun

dusk arch Apr 27, 2023, 12:33 AM

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1/round, whenever your mech exceeds its Heat Cap, you may immediately fly your speed before making your overheating check, ignoring Slow and Immobilize from hostile sources. This movement ignores engagement and doesn't provoke reactions, but you must end this movement on the ground or another solid surface, or else immediately begin falling.```
The change here that I'm looking at is that the movement now bypasses Slow and Immobilize. This makes it more of a useful "get out" tool to reposition behind cover or out of LoS during moments where you might become Exposed, but this ALSO potentially opens it up to the possibility of someone directly using it to bypass those conditions in a more deliberate fashion.

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Autoextinguishers
You gain Resistance to burn, and you and all adjacent allied characters automatically pass all checks to clear burn. ```

This one I'm debating on, extending the auto-clear to allies as well as yourself. The upside is it makes it a stronger support tool without adjusting the self-benefit it already provides, but on the other hand I feel like this could potentially no-sell pyros out of existence in terms of damage threat (or hellfire projectors, etc)

errant crane Apr 27, 2023, 1:23 AM

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dusk arch Provisionally, what I'm looking at is the following: ``` Crash Bars You gain Imm...

I'm liking the change to crash bars here, especially since it gives more support to flying

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And I like the structure reroll stuff for people who absolutely hate dying on structure

errant crane Apr 27, 2023, 3:29 AM

#

How does scrounger 2 interact with tiered weapons

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If I attack with the sword of a tier 2 ronin, do I get 2 attacks?

midnight crypt Apr 27, 2023, 3:34 AM

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Yes

dusk arch Apr 27, 2023, 3:37 AM

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yep

errant crane Apr 27, 2023, 3:41 AM

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https://tenor.com/view/yippee-happy-celebration-joy-confetti-gif-25557730

Tenor

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Yipee

broken hill Apr 27, 2023, 10:43 AM

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I think auto extinguishers is already fine if a little specialized. An accuracy to a check already vastly shifts the math in your favor.

dusk arch Apr 27, 2023, 2:39 PM

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Possibly, I've been going back and forth on it

faint fjord Apr 27, 2023, 2:46 PM

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The automatic burn check extinguishing is cool, I think you should keep it

errant crane Apr 27, 2023, 4:09 PM

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So with the weapon you gain from scrounger, would you ignore difficulty if that weapon had difficulty?

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 12:14 AM

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errant crane So with the weapon you gain from scrounger, would you ignore difficulty if that ...

a salvaged weapon uses only your grit for its to-hit, you can apply accuracy as usual via lock on or shooting someone who's prone etc, but they retain no other to-hit qualities whether that's flat numbers, accuracy, or difficulty from the NPC weapon profile

#

this occasionally makes some weapons a little more accurate, it also makes some of them worse, but you're basically shooting it once and discarding it anyway so I'm not tremendously concerned

errant crane Apr 28, 2023, 12:23 AM

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I mean it fucks hard with a demolisher's hammer

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"gimme the thing, you're using it wrong"

nova slate Apr 28, 2023, 12:36 AM

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I love the talent dearly

#

The concept of figuring out what to do with what you find is great

errant crane Apr 28, 2023, 12:36 AM

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Yeah scrounger is one of my favorite things from Suldan

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Look at me, I am the NPC now

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 7:59 AM

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does the damage bonus from Berserker Drive stack with itself? If you use it multiple times in a scene from UniComp or the Core Battery reserve

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:01 AM

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as written yeah, I'm unsure if this is actually an issue

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 8:01 AM

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probably not

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it's like, two 1/round effects with different values that you can spend independently of each other then?

swift mesa Apr 28, 2023, 8:02 AM

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Core Battery is honestly itself more game warping than anything that connects to Core Battery 😛

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 8:02 AM

#

yeah

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I got it from a random roll lmao

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:02 AM

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gentle forge it's like, two 1/round effects with different values that you can spend independ...

no it would stack

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if you reach the point where you're in a position to do this in a way that stacks meaningfully I feel like you'd have to be sandbagging

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 8:02 AM

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I mean if you could choose to spend them on different attacks

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:02 AM

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yes but what I'm saying is no

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 8:03 AM

#

ah, right

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no I get that now

#

after reading the sentence again

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:03 AM

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yeah, it would still be 1/round, you'd just compile more bonus damage onto that 1/round instance

#

so maybe in theory you could get some ridiculous +8-10 bonus damage hit, but you'd have to have taken 4-5 structure damage and spent two core power in the course of a fight to get there

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 8:04 AM

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right

#

more likely you just like

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use it twice on first or second structure

#

or use it in different fights

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:04 AM

#

it would legit make way more sense to save it to use again later

#

but I'm not your dad, so

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 8:05 AM

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I've never seen you and my dad in the same room so I can't be sure

nova slate Apr 28, 2023, 12:13 PM

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There's also a diminishing return on super stacking damage, generally.

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:09 PM

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Whenever you make an overheating check, you use the following special Overheating Table instead of the normal one.

5-6 - Power Rerouting: Your next attack deals +1d6 bonus damage on hit.
2-4 - Emergency Jump Jets: Your mech becomes Exposed, and you may immediately fly your speed, ignoring Slow and Immobilize from hostile sources. This movement ignores engagement and doesn't provoke reactions, but you must end this movement on the ground or another solid surface, or else immediately begin falling.
1 - Controlled Meltdown: The result depends on your mech's remaining Stress:
-3+ Stress: Your mech becomes Exposed, and you may immediately fly as per Emergency Jump Jets.
-2 Stress: Roll an Engineering check. On a success, your mech becomes Exposed and you may immediately fly as per Emergency Jump Jets; on a failure, clear all conditions which were not caused by your own systems or abilities, and then your mech suffers a reactor meltdown after 1d6 of your turns (rolled by the GM). A reactor meltdown can be meltdown can be prevented by retrying the Engineering check as a quick action. 
-1 Stress: Your mech suffers a reactor meltdown at the end of your next turn. Clear all conditions which were not caused by your own systems or abilities, you may immediately fly as per Emergency Jump Jets, and your next attack deals +1d6 bonus damage on hit.
Multiple 1's - Hyperspec Meltdown: Your mech suffers a reactor meltdown at the end of your next turn. Clear all conditions which were not caused by your own systems or abilities, you may immediately fly as per Emergency Jump Jets, and your next attack deals +1d6 bonus damage on hit.```
Actually I'm so fuckin tired of trying to find a sweet spot for Emergency Reactor Override that I'm just doing something extremely dumb

ionic badger Apr 28, 2023, 8:11 PM

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ooh, spicy

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first glance definitely a lot more interesting than the old one

languid cosmos Apr 28, 2023, 8:21 PM

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oh i do enjoy this greatly

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this would be a lot of fun on the worden i was in for a while

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 8:25 PM

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I may continue to tinker with this one but I'm at the point of "okay clearly small adjustments aren't cutting it"

faint fjord Apr 28, 2023, 8:44 PM

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now this has some balls lol

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 10:10 PM

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is that a core bonus?

nova slate Apr 28, 2023, 10:12 PM

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its a prospective rewrite of one in the suldan book!

gentle forge Apr 28, 2023, 10:17 PM

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oooh, right, that one, I didn't recognize the name

dusk arch Apr 28, 2023, 10:19 PM

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Nobody does because nobody uses it, hence I'm just revising it entirely

quaint beacon Apr 28, 2023, 11:49 PM

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this is spicy

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big fan

midnight crypt Apr 29, 2023, 12:00 AM

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Honestly this fucks

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Big fan of this

swift mesa Apr 29, 2023, 12:14 AM

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dusk arch ```Emergency Reactor Override Whenever you make an overheating check, you use th...

...well, that's real fucking interesting/I like it a lot. Honestly it's one of those 'I'm jealous I didn't think of it first' things XD

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👍

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(I'm kinda tempted to make a Structure-version of it as I've got a core bonus of my own that I'm not happy about in that area)

dusk arch Apr 29, 2023, 12:17 AM

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the key to all my good ideas has been to just get annoyed by something

peak pine Apr 29, 2023, 12:52 AM

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dusk arch ```Emergency Reactor Override Whenever you make an overheating check, you use th...

sorry to be nitpicky but "A reactor meltdown can be meltdown can be prevented by retrying the Engineering check as a quick action. ", just a small typo here

dusk arch Apr 29, 2023, 12:58 AM

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yeah that already got caught in the document/lcp

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and a couple other things

drowsy coyote Apr 29, 2023, 9:40 AM

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If im a charioteer and I overcharge could I technically use spotter three twice in one turn

dusk arch Apr 29, 2023, 9:43 AM

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as far as I know spotter 3 doesn't have any inherent per turn/round restrictions

drowsy coyote Apr 29, 2023, 9:44 AM

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Well that’s cool

devout river Apr 29, 2023, 11:58 AM

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Just remember that it uses your ally's reaction so unless they are a Gorgon you need one ally in range for each use of it

gray thistle Apr 29, 2023, 6:29 PM

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dusk arch ``` Autoextinguishers You gain Resistance to burn, and you and all adjacent alli...

But late to the party, but this one has always been incredibly niche. Rather than focusing more on the burn aspect, maybe it could have a secondary use that's related but more widely applicable?

dusk arch Apr 29, 2023, 6:44 PM

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Having received a lot of feedback from solstice rain I'm more convinced that "a thing that works against burn on an actionless level" is a thing that has more appeal than initially suggested

gray thistle Apr 29, 2023, 6:57 PM

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Oh it's great if there's burn going around, but that's the issue; burn isn't always going to be there.

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That's my only real complaint about it

faint fjord Apr 30, 2023, 12:00 AM

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I am somewhat curious, when you make the core bonuses do you think about what a mech that had nothing but C&H cbs would feel like?

dusk arch Apr 30, 2023, 12:03 AM

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Not so much, or to put it another way I don't really think even core rulebook core bonuses were conceived of in that sense

swift mesa Apr 30, 2023, 12:04 AM

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Yeah, a mech with Nothing But HORUS core bonuses would be in a bit of a weird state.

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After like 2 you're likely finding it hard to find a 'Yes, this is exactly what I need for my build' when you get your next one.

dusk arch Apr 30, 2023, 12:11 AM

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Like I think you can make it work easily enough, it's not that self-comboing core bonuses is bad or restrictive per se (horus does admittedly have the more oddball assortment) so much as I think core bonuses are conceived really as a "take this to suit your particular playstyle" thing more than a "this is meant to be a manufacturer self-synergy thing" though there's obviously some overlap there too

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C&H core bonuses are basically built around "catastrophic circumstances," things that suck which IPS-N and HA don't cover directly, less "oh you're tougher" and more "when this shitty thing happens you can ignore it, mitigate it, or get a better deal out of it"

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This makes a few of them more passive than proactive but "I took 2 structure, rolled snake eyes, and died" is an extremely common tale of woe, to say nothing of losing your favorite superheavy weapon mid-fight etc

onyx oxide Apr 30, 2023, 12:19 AM

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gray thistle Oh it's great if there's burn going around, but that's the issue; burn isn't alw...

In my experience, burn may not be a factor every combat, but when it is, it's nasty enough that being able to get rid of it easily would be much appreciated

swift mesa Apr 30, 2023, 12:19 AM

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It's also something a mech can have a horrible weakness to.

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Auto-end for Exposed Reactor mechs is a godsend.

onyx oxide Apr 30, 2023, 12:21 AM

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And yeah, I don't think I've ever seen a build go without at least one GMS core bonus - it definitely doesn't feel like mono-manufacturer core bonus builds were ever much of a consideration

nova slate Apr 30, 2023, 12:23 AM

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mono feels like a build challenge

faint fjord Apr 30, 2023, 12:30 AM

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Yeah, that's what I gathered too. It seemed like they were about being able to lose well

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Oop, scrolled up

dusk arch Apr 30, 2023, 12:38 AM

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My goal has been to establish CBs that while they may not appeal to everyone will appeal to players who feel that it's worth a core bonus to not have to put up with a specific frustration, because while not everyone hates every particular thing that can occur in the course of a fight a lot of people do have the one thing they really fuckin hate (lots of burn, unlucky structure rolls, weapons/systems getting destroyed, stuns, etc)

faint fjord Apr 30, 2023, 12:56 AM

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I can see that

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I can imagine a high armor player with no engineering finding burn to be the most annoying thing to deal with, more than shredded

compact marten Apr 30, 2023, 12:59 AM

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Not a lot of things DEAL burn, admittedly.

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And the ones that do will 100% get shut down by that Core, so it's niche, I guess?

swift mesa Apr 30, 2023, 1:00 AM

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If you're not super high engineering, you've got to be careful about Burn Dangerous Terrain too (Though I'm not sure how many GMs use that)

faint fjord Apr 30, 2023, 1:04 AM

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There's also merit in a gm being able to say "alright, this next bunch of aggressive deforesters are going to be setting the forest alight, you're gonna be in the thick of it" and there being cb options that strongly fit this niche

nova slate Apr 30, 2023, 1:04 AM

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Especially if you pick a different cb for the mission

faint fjord Apr 30, 2023, 1:05 AM

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I do like niche representation in build options

nova slate Apr 30, 2023, 1:05 AM

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Things having or being niche is great when you have the means to pick them at need

dusk arch Apr 30, 2023, 1:28 AM

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I've had a non-zero number of solstice rain field trip reports of people getting absolutely chunked on by a mix of hives, pyros, and scourers

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if it was JUST auto-passing the clear check I think it'd be too narrow, that plus the resistance plus the ability to clear allies is, I think, in a spot where you're getting a respectable value

swift mesa Apr 30, 2023, 1:41 AM

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dusk arch if it was JUST auto-passing the clear check I think it'd be too narrow, that plu...

It also makes it a nice psudeo-defender trait, sharing it with friends.

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And defenders...well, tend to be the guys who have Lots of Armour and Hate Burn 😛

dusk arch Apr 30, 2023, 1:42 AM

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yeah it syncs well with guardian

compact marten Apr 30, 2023, 1:46 AM

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yeah I dig that, actually.

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the sharing the burn extinguish.

timber turtle May 3, 2023, 2:35 PM

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Suldan feedback:
We finished a mission where I was using Superior Logistics core bonus. I didn't end up using it a ton as I was mostly keeping it for the repair option in case someone's weapon/system got destroyed, and I generally had stuff to do with my actions anyways. I did really like it as a repair option though. A nice insurance policy to have, and I didn't regret taking it by any means as I did end up using it once to repair our Enkidu's Extended Batteries. This was extremely useful since it was near the end of the mission and she was almost out of repairs.

We did have to delay ending that encounter though so that I had time to enact the repairs. I wonder if adding a clause that you can use the repair during a rest if you haven't used it in the preceeding encounter might help with sandbagging? Similar to how the balor just lets you heal to full so there's no incentive to wait around.

dusk arch May 3, 2023, 2:49 PM

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I thought about it but tbh it felt awkward and I don't view it as crucial to safeguard against as the balor's HP regen

dusk arch May 3, 2023, 3:05 PM

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To clarify, by "awkward" I mean the way the Balor gets around it is by having an entire separate trait to compensate for the "we want to delay the fight issue" rather than a simple wording adjustment to its regenerative capabilities

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Also I have some slight concerns that if it ends up being usable even in part during rests that it may encourage some people to save it FOR rests in a psychological sense

broken hill May 3, 2023, 3:21 PM

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The thing is it doesn't say it had to be destroyed this fight, so use it for the other abilities to help prevent destruction, and then if something is destroyed then you know what your first round looks like next fight.

timber turtle May 3, 2023, 4:07 PM

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dusk arch Also I have some slight concerns that if it ends up being usable even in part du...

Fair enough, although that's literally what I was saving it for anyways so that's less of a concern for me but I get where you're coming from 😜

timber turtle May 3, 2023, 4:12 PM

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broken hill The thing is it doesn't say it had to be destroyed this fight, so use it for the...

The issue with strategy is I was mostly keeping it on hand for in case one of my balor ally's weapons got destroyed. I wanted to be able to repair her and bring her back up to full barrage potential in this fight, not the next one

broken hill May 3, 2023, 5:00 PM

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Yeah, better to prevent the destruction through proactive things you control than to worry about a bad structure roll. No reason to get to the end credits with 99 elixirs in your inventory.

timber turtle May 3, 2023, 5:25 PM

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As I said, I had plenty of stuff to occupy my actions though that weren't create cover or ranged bombardment. I took the thing as an insurance policy and used it as such without regrets

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So there was never a time that I was like "Oh I should create smart cover here instead of invading an enemy or applying masspack or heavy gunner"

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 7:34 AM

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Small update of my Suldan campaign: Currently the players are fighting against a squad of Albatrosses that had made a very reckless orbital drop trying to get through the Defense Net to kill one of the players. The Albatrosses ended up triggered a massive swarm of missiles from a killsat raining down on the SIF-controlled town that the players are at.

The players have activated their personal Titan to try to help shoot down the massive missile swarms. most of the Albatrosses are also trying to shoot down the missiles before they reach the objective zone, while trying to kill that said player.

I use a Solstice Rain map and say the Albatross crashed their damaged shuttle into a heavily defaced Emir statue that's too big for the SIF town to take down. This is only the 2nd wave of the missiles coming down toward the objective zone, plus an additional start-of-round Defense Net roll to determine if Javelin Rockets, Atlas Missiles, or more Hound missiles would rain on the map.

timber turtle May 5, 2023, 8:14 AM

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amber crystal Small update of my Suldan campaign: Currently the players are fighting against a...

How do you determine who Hounds go after? And when do they move? End of round?

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 8:17 AM

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timber turtle How do you determine who Hounds go after? And when do they move? End of round?

THey don't go after characters.

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They go straight for the objective zone, 3 spaces at end of the round.

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The objective is to make sure that less than four of them reach the objective zone.

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Or the town's destroyed.

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The Albatrosses didn't want to do that; they had been shooting the missiles chasing after them all the way down, but their leader, a IPSN Veteran Champion Valkyrie, is just too much of a hothead with a hatred for one of the players.

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The player made that character as part of the background and asked for them to go for a direct assault, so I obliged nicely with a touch of Defense Net involvement.

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The reason why it's a mountaintop town is that it's also where there's a radio tower that connects most of Chiraji Mountains' omninode-less settlements, as well as an observatory where they can keep an eye on the Defense Net satellites, so they're as close as they can get to the Defense Net.

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Hence why the missiles are able to rain down on them, homing in on the shuttle. Albatrosses are not exactly known to be sensitive about the local issues.

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Losing the town would be tragic for SIF and trigger a refugee movement, and doesn't bold well for the possible Arclight vs SIF negotiation.

timber turtle May 5, 2023, 8:23 AM

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Would also be a PR disaster for Albatross.
Or rather a worse PR disaster than them causing the problem

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but sounds very cool!

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 8:24 AM

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All this is just a distraction from the players' true mission to chase down a House of Sand defector who connected a huge pirate fleet with the Emirates... while one of the players is also a House of Sand defector. Both of them had unwittingly contributed to the assassination of the House of Glass' local leader, whom the defector player is very fond of.

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All in all, the players are unknowingly dragging their own messes into the already messy as heck Chiraji Mountains.

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 8:27 AM

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timber turtle Would also be a PR disaster for Albatross. Or rather a _worse_ PR disaster than ...

Oh, don't worry, the Albatross' PR department is already ready to spin it as them saving the town from the missiles, and sacrificed their own shuttle to do that.

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The Lich PC that's being hunted has an expanded compartment, and she's arguing with another PC about the morality of rescuing a stranded civilian into her expanded compartment so the Albatross would back off.

This is coming right off the back of the previous fight where the players had to save a bunch of Arclight guards and their family taken as body shield by a Janissary mere hours ago.

storm tartan May 5, 2023, 9:19 PM

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How does this trait work? It sounds like a reaction to getting hit, but it's a quick action?

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 9:21 PM

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storm tartan How does this trait work? It sounds like a reaction to getting hit, but it's a q...

I think that's a LCP error. It's supposed to be a trait, so not even a reaction.

storm tartan May 5, 2023, 9:21 PM

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I see

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 9:22 PM

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It's just something that happens 1/round when Reaver gets hit.

storm tartan May 5, 2023, 9:41 PM

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also holy shit I'm looking over the Sergeant's other optionals now

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fun stuff in there

amber crystal May 5, 2023, 9:52 PM

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Sergeant's one of my favourite support classes for sure.

faint fjord May 5, 2023, 9:53 PM

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sergeant is a bop lol

dusk arch May 6, 2023, 3:54 AM

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every single fuckin time I go to update the pdf with a new set of bookmarks, I get halfway to 2/3rd of the way through and discover some errant layout glitch where the word doc decided to misbehave and I have to start all the way over again

steel wagon May 6, 2023, 7:22 AM

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F

dusk arch May 6, 2023, 7:31 AM

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the good news is that I finally got it to work after three false starts but this is why I'm really getting reluctant to keep working with this frankenstein of a patchwork document

opaque crane May 6, 2023, 7:44 AM

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Giant documents like that really are the worst. Whether it's google docs or Word.

dusk arch May 6, 2023, 7:49 AM

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it doesn't help that I've crudely crammed a bazillion images into it because I'm too lazy to try and learn how to use indesign or something

broken hill May 6, 2023, 3:04 PM

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From my time being forced to write technical documents, I find it is actually best to write and layout each section as an individual document and then merge. Reduces how much any one formatting fuckup can influence the whole document.

dusk arch May 6, 2023, 7:14 PM

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https://kaitave.itch.io/field-guide-to-suldan well at any rate guess what, the 2.2.5 version is now official complete with a revised pdf with art and the 2.2.5 lcp

itch.io

Field Guide to Suldan by KaiTave

A homebrew campaign guide and content supplement for Lancer, the mech RPG by Massif Press

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📎 Changelog_May_2023.pdf

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This version takes the revised text from the text only version, the new layout, formatting, and all the various mechanical adjustments, and folds them into the art-included version, and the lcp version should be appearing on comp/con soon since I've updated the backend

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This version includes the new GMS weapons along with a number of adjustments, mechanics and balance changes, and overall revisions and bugfixes to various things if you were still using the 2.2.4 version, including an overall improvement to NPC coding

compact marten May 6, 2023, 7:53 PM

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Awesome!

compact marten May 6, 2023, 8:15 PM

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Interesting concept on the Kangto Endochassis

swift barn May 7, 2023, 2:25 AM

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Can Scrounger 3 replenish Limited charges of pilot gear?

dusk arch May 7, 2023, 2:28 AM

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No, pilot gear is unaffected by things which hook into Limited weapons or systems such as core bonuses, talents, etc

swift barn May 7, 2023, 2:31 AM

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Aye aye. Scrounger's a bit odd in terms of talents so I thought it was worth asking.

ashen parrot May 7, 2023, 3:08 AM

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On low power rn, but how does the new Unstable Reactor work with Grapple Immobilize? Does that mean the grapplee with UR can move the grappler if ignored?

languid cosmos May 7, 2023, 3:15 AM

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if you are immobilized by a grapple, and you are immune to immobilized or otherwise unaffected by it in some form, you just slide out of the grapple

dusk arch May 7, 2023, 3:21 AM

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Yeah, you only move people if you control the grapple, and if you control it you aren't immobilized anyway

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if you ARE on the losing end of a grapple and gain immobilize immunity all of a sudden then you can just move out of it and the grapple breaks assuming you leave adjacency

drowsy coyote May 7, 2023, 7:49 AM

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I’m very excited for the new GMS weapons

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I wonder who to put the new heavy melee on

gray thistle May 7, 2023, 2:40 PM

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Hydra 👀

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With sabreur 2 for the drone. Melee hydra

nova slate May 7, 2023, 3:36 PM

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i just like how it enables a spear/polearm using everest at lvl 1

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or ll0 i should say

waxen cedar May 7, 2023, 3:48 PM

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gray thistle With sabreur 2 for the drone. Melee hydra

i really like sabreur drone for hydra

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Comet systems too

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esp whitestar signal interceptor with anni nexus

timber turtle May 7, 2023, 5:28 PM

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waxen cedar esp whitestar signal interceptor with anni nexus

Retransmission your Enkidu friend! No escape!

dusk arch May 7, 2023, 6:22 PM

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drowsy coyote I wonder who to put the new heavy melee on

my personal take is that I enjoy it as an option for combined arms metalmark that doesn't have to go deep in blackbeard for the nanocarbon sword

drowsy coyote May 7, 2023, 6:27 PM

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Exactly what I was thinking

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Grab the DSAS and HDA

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Go to town

ashen parrot May 8, 2023, 2:39 PM

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waxen cedar esp whitestar signal interceptor with anni nexus

...that does work, doesn't it...

timber turtle May 8, 2023, 2:46 PM

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ashen parrot ...that *does* work, doesn't it...

Really well!

broken hill May 9, 2023, 12:56 AM

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Yeah Comet and hydra are made for each other, such a beautiful pairing.

dusk arch May 9, 2023, 4:49 AM

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https://twitter.com/Magnus_TheMage/status/1655694069690142720 I figure I'll go ahead and post this here too because I can and because Magnus is such a massive part of the Field Guide going back to the early days, he's opening up for commissions

Magnus🏳️‍🌈 (@Magnus_TheMage)

Opening up my commission list for 2023.

I DO:

MECHS
ROBOTS
CREATURES
CHARACTERS
ENVIORMENTS
AND MUCH MORE

Im a science fiction FREAK, and I've done art for the Field guide to Suldan, and Lancer's Solstice Rain.
#dndartist #LancerRPG #commissionsopen #CommissionSheet

Likes

152

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and that's also to say that we're working on a little something ourselves

swift mesa May 9, 2023, 4:52 AM

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Magnus does great work.

dusk arch May 9, 2023, 4:56 AM

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He does, and his art has only gotten better over the years

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The very first illustration he ever did for the field guide

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which, to be clear, is a pretty sick design still

swift mesa May 9, 2023, 4:58 AM

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He's also just a really nice guy to work with. He put up with me rambling a lot about my Stupid Space Tree Station.

dusk arch May 9, 2023, 5:00 AM

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I guarantee you that whatever you had to say to him was a soothing balm compared to the mess I just dropped in his lap

swift mesa May 9, 2023, 5:04 AM

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But yes. Give Magnus Money. He deserves it and provides great art.

rotund axle May 9, 2023, 4:35 PM

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Oh shit I missed the official release of 2.2.5

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Nice

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Mhm the improved CBs and Shepherd License are so good

rotund axle May 9, 2023, 9:49 PM

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Huh, Weapon Pod still costs 3 SP in the LCP

dusk arch May 9, 2023, 11:41 PM

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that should fix it

📎 Field_Guide_To_Suldan_2.2.5.lcp

rotund axle May 10, 2023, 2:17 PM

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Oh sweet

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Thanks

drifting eagle May 10, 2023, 4:05 PM

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Wait, Kai is still adding content to Suldan?

amber crystal May 10, 2023, 4:06 PM

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Always.

rotund axle May 10, 2023, 4:11 PM

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Pretty sure they've said before that with the addition of the alt frames they're content with the amount of, well, content, in Suldan

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It's now just mostly updates and balancing changes

rotund axle May 10, 2023, 4:12 PM

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rotund axle Pretty sure they've said before that with the addition of the alt frames they're...

Oh and the addition of the GMS weapons too

sinful steeple May 10, 2023, 7:08 PM

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hey whats the interaction between blinkspace tunneler and unbound

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can an efreet just drag the entire team to the other side of the map

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or is that covered by "cant be followed"

devout river May 10, 2023, 9:18 PM

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Using the Tunneler warp is not following the Efreet so I would say it works. Its not that hard to get a mech across the field in turn anyway, especially with it using Sunzi gear

dusk arch May 10, 2023, 11:34 PM

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devout river Using the Tunneler warp is not following the Efreet so I would say it works. It...

Correct, you can do this if you want

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Essentially the conditionals for Unbound prevent you from doing things like either grapple-kidnapping someone while using it or cramming everyone onto an Efreet via MULE harness or something and walking everyone across in one go

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While unbound can potentially cover a lot of ground with Blinkspace Tunneler, the movement that you give allies still has to be a thing that comes as part of ancillary movement, which means that NPCs will be getting to go in between teleports most likely, which means that there's a very strong chance that an Efreet which attempts this trick can find itself somewhere it doesn't really want to be, or the opfor can simply circle back and play whack-a-mole if the PCs try popping in one at a time

gentle forge May 11, 2023, 3:46 AM

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rotund axle Oh and the addition of the GMS weapons too

GMS weapons???

devout river May 11, 2023, 4:11 AM

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Yup, the latest version of Suldan adds a set of GMS weapons

dusk arch May 11, 2023, 4:15 AM

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There's a set of a half dozen GMS weapons, yeah. These are probably the last real "new content" that's likely to be added to the field guide barring stuff like the Emergency Reactor Override change which is so extensive it might as well be new

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I'm very comfortable with the level of mechs that are available and don't feel like forcing the issue just to add more stuff, talent-wise I'm in largely the same boat

drifting eagle May 11, 2023, 4:32 AM

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Well it's a lot of great content. I thought it was gonna be done after those cool non-mech licenses.

dusk arch May 11, 2023, 5:00 AM

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The specialty licenses have been in the guide for a while. It started out with the C&H catalogue, talents, and specialty licenses, then later on the four full frames for the corebook manufacturers were added, then the alt frames, then GMS core bonuses, and now GMS weapons

drifting eagle May 11, 2023, 11:51 AM

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That's why I was shocked that stuff kept getting added. A veritable content machine. TY Kai!

eager cedar May 11, 2023, 9:28 PM

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on the GMS weapons, I feel like the MC-AML doing 5 is a lot when it's next to the thermal rifle as an anti-armor weapon, since the thermal's max base damage is 5 and the cost of it having ordnance is offset by the much larger range. I might be off on that, but that's my gut feeling.

dusk arch May 11, 2023, 11:14 PM

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It's a thing I would be interested in getting playtest feedback on

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coming from my own personal perspective, I've seen a lot of people suggest that this or that thing is overpowered going off capsule impressions or secondhand explanations, and then I've just as often seen that same stuff hit games and I get told "yeah it's fine"

eager cedar May 11, 2023, 11:15 PM

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my other thought here is that maybe the thermal rifle is just not great, especially as a rifle?

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so.

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and yeah, absolutely on that

dusk arch May 11, 2023, 11:16 PM

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No I think the thermal rifle is decent, albeit it doesn't really hook into its talent especially well

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The anti-armor missile does high flat AP damage, and is married to what is generally considered to be the single most punishing weapon drawback in the game with a bog-standard in the middle average range

#

It's entirely possible it MIGHT end up being overtuned, it wouldn't be the first time in the book's history something had to get adjusted downwards, but at present I'm unaware of anyone actually using it

#

so it's a question of "is the high damage worth the hassle of ordnance at 10 range, or do the drawbacks not compensate for that degree of damage"

faint fjord May 11, 2023, 11:35 PM

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GMS weapons huh

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Were these added recently

drifting eagle May 11, 2023, 11:53 PM

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Ordnance is the most bleh weapon tag. Can't even look at weapons with ordnance.

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So yeah, an ordnance weapon does really need to be good.

faint fjord May 11, 2023, 11:58 PM

#

ordnance is an opportunity to make a heavy that can't just be fired four times by a goofball

swift barn May 12, 2023, 12:02 AM

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I genuinely don't place that much weight on Ordnance. I don't tend to OC double fire. I can fairly often just Shoot it. Their stats are solid.

drifting eagle May 12, 2023, 12:12 AM

#

faint fjord ordnance is an opportunity to make a heavy that can't just be fired four times b...

But some of us can't help being a goofball.

dusk arch May 12, 2023, 12:25 AM

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The trick with ordnance is it spoils a lot of stuff in the process. No Skirmisher 2, no flexibility of action order, there's no "move into range then shoot," and while no overwatch or firing at engaged targets is a thing that likely won't come up super often, it's still another set of drawbacks

#

and yes, the inability to do things like overcharge to fire again is a factor, given that overcharging is universally applicable to all mechs and can be considered a default part of any PC's action kit

opaque crane May 12, 2023, 12:26 AM

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And the shorter a weapon's range, the more severe the drawback.

dusk arch May 12, 2023, 12:49 AM

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yep

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ordnance TENDS to come with longer ranges, and while range 10 isn't what lancer considers short-ranged, it also isn't really considered long-range either

#

so it comes down to how well the benefits and tradeoffs play with each other

drifting eagle May 12, 2023, 12:54 AM

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Yeah, there are so many reasons to not use an ordnance weapon, so it has to be pretty strong to make up for those downsides.

nova slate May 12, 2023, 1:00 AM

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once of hte biggest mistakes with new players is seeing ordnance and not knowing

drifting eagle May 12, 2023, 1:04 AM

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Me, wanting to fire the solid core after moving.

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 11:18 AM

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Does the Slipgun break invisible?

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 11:22 AM

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Why would it?

#

You mean kobold’s?

devout river May 12, 2023, 11:28 AM

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ashen parrot Does the Slipgun break invisible?

What do you mean "break invisible"? It doesn't make attack rolls so bypasses invisible as that only applies to attack rolls rather than saves

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 11:34 AM

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Oops yeah I meant the Kobold's invis

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 11:35 AM

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devout river What do you mean "break invisible"? It doesn't make attack rolls so bypasses in...

I think this still answers my question though. If it doesn't make attack rolls then it doesn't count as an attack, no?

devout river May 12, 2023, 11:37 AM

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But you are still attacking with a weapon similar to the Iskander's Gravity Gun, so it does count as making an attack:
https://lancer-faq.netlify.app/#59b686

Is the Gravity Gun affected by Invisibility?[link]
No. The Gravity Gun’s use is, technically speaking, an attack. If your mech is unable to make attacks for some reason, such as being Jammed, it cannot use the Gravity Gun. But the actual effect of the Gravity Gun when you attack with it is one that has no associated to hit roll of any sort, functioning instead more like a grenade or mine, and so there’s no way for it to “miss” like a regular attack would, even if the target is Invisible. This also means that the Gravity Gun does not benefit from anything that would trigger on hit or on crit since it can do neither of those things.

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 11:37 AM

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Indeed

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 11:37 AM

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It still makes an attack so it'd break

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 11:37 AM

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If it said breaks when you fire a weapon it would be different

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 11:37 AM

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I think

devout river May 12, 2023, 11:38 AM

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And as the Kobold's invisibility breaks on "making an attack" then it would count

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 11:38 AM

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Hmm doesn’t say making an attack roll

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Unsure

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You may be correct let’s wait for Kai

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 11:39 AM

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I recall that Kai compared the two before

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Lemme try and fish it up

devout river May 12, 2023, 11:40 AM

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drowsy coyote If it said breaks when you fire a weapon it would be different

"Firing a weapon" would be a less restrictive condition than "make an attack" as there are various forms of attack (ram, grapple, tech attack, etc) that do not use a weapon

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In fact the Slipgun's wording explicitly says that it is an "On Attack" effect

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 11:40 AM

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It does yeah

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You’re definitely correct

devout river May 12, 2023, 11:41 AM

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So if its not making an attack then how does it trigger an "On Attack" effect?

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 11:42 AM

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Found it

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This was on Gate SEC

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 12:14 PM

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Looking at the new GMS stuff and I feel like the Wasp Nexii could end up as just better GMS Pistols? I'll see how it fairs but Accurate + Smart basically means this thing can't miss without Invis/other stuff and 1 AP is pretty good for an aux

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The rest of the stuff looks fine tho. the new main launcher looks baller, thought I'd also see that Superheavy lazor that Kai workshopped a couple months back but I guess not

harsh zealot May 12, 2023, 12:22 PM

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errant torrent Looking at the new GMS stuff and I feel like the Wasp Nexii could end up as just...

GMS Pistols have reliable and threat.

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 12:23 PM

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Reliable matters when a gun has a good chance of missing, this thing doesn't really have that

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and Threat is shrug-worthy imo since it's not a CQB

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again, I'll see how it fairs.

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 12:26 PM

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The Pistols aren't CQB?

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 12:26 PM

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they are. I meant in the context of the wasps

ashen parrot May 12, 2023, 12:26 PM

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Ah alright mb

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 12:27 PM

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surprised to see that there's comments on the new launcher tho. it's ordnance so people won't be willing to use it anyway lol

devout river May 12, 2023, 12:31 PM

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Threat is still relevant for triggering overwatch even without Vanguard 3

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 12:32 PM

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In my experience Overwatches barely ever happen without Vanguard 3

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unless you abuse Puppet Systems

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but yeah I unno, we'll see how it fairs. Accurate nexii are pretty pog

amber crystal May 12, 2023, 1:39 PM

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That depends on your GM I feel

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I'm happy to trigger OW personally because it means they won't be able to Brace if they do.

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 1:48 PM

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Assuming they'll brace. Brace is the mind-killer.

devout river May 12, 2023, 1:55 PM

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amber crystal I'm happy to trigger OW personally because it means they won't be able to Brace ...

Brace on that turn anyway, reactions are 1/turn (unless you are a Gorgon at least)

languid cosmos May 12, 2023, 2:04 PM

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Brace prevents reactions until the end of your next turn

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Oh no I misread

amber crystal May 12, 2023, 2:12 PM

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devout river Brace on that turn anyway, reactions are 1/turn (unless you are a Gorgon at leas...

Yah that's what I meant.

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Trigger the OW, if the NPC survive, punch the PC really hard.

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Most NPCs that I trigger OW with are likely to be melee.

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It's always a fun thing to trigger OW and see if it miss or not.

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 2:16 PM

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If you’re already within 3 to shoot it’s likely you get OW from my experience

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Very few enemies want to stay in bonking range

dusk arch May 12, 2023, 2:33 PM

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harsh zealot GMS Pistols have reliable and threat.

They also deal 1d3 damage

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The wasp nexus, however you roll and whoever you shoot, is only ever going to do 1 damage

#

You can't even really make the "well you could use gunslinger for huge damage" argument since that's every ranged aux weapon in the game

#

The light nexus also does 1d3 damage at double the range

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The wasp nexus is an experiment in seeing just how valuable being able to more reliably proc centimane is. Is it worth only ever doing 1 damage as part of the attack?

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If it wasn't AP then it would be pretty worthless, as enough NPCs have or gain at least 1 armor that it would be ineffective against a serious number of them, which is an issue I encountered with the Harrier Nexus and why its damage ping is now AP as well, so it doesn't lose effectiveness as tiers rise beyond HP scaling

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1 AP is a fantastic damage code against enemies with 2-3 armor but against lighter stuff the value of AP rather than the ability to deal any higher amount of actual damage starts dropping off

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And lastly, Reliable isn't just about missing on the attack roll, it's about Invisible as well, and all the Accuracy in the world doesn't matter to the 50/50 roll

nova slate May 12, 2023, 2:56 PM

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Reliable is about being Reliable, and I haven't taken the time to rep the Reliable Squad or the Reliable Gang recently, but here I am, shilling reliable

#

You know what you do when your reliable doesn't do enough to kill something? You put lock ons on it or hack it till its exposed so 1 of your 3 other teammates can solve that problem, while you keep solving other problems. Reliably

dusk arch May 12, 2023, 3:05 PM

#

yeah it's worth noting that 1 AP doesn't benefit from shredded at all, while 1d3 anything does, another factor

#

this is, like a number of the other GMS weapons, awaiting any sort of proper testing and actual play feedback

#

it's also a weapon in particular that I feel is going to be tricky to adjust since its damage is already at the very bottom of the pile, which means it's either looking at range or tags, and losing either the AP or Accurate tags would, I think, make it particularly ineffective or uncompelling as a choice (1 AP damage Range 5, no accurate, versus a range 10 light nexus dealing 1d3 damage seems like a relatively unconvincing tradeoff unless you just really fucking Bastions)

#

About the only adjustment I can currently see which wouldn't throw the entire thing into a weird state would be downtuning its range from 5 to 3, but until I get some actual playtesting feedback I'm going to leave these as is

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 3:12 PM

#

I did say "I'll see how it fairs" for a reason. Suldan's used extensively on one of the servers I'm in so if any of them will end up dumb then yeag

nova slate May 12, 2023, 3:12 PM

#

Also as a note to my own experience, Reliable just matters. Having a good chance of missing isn't really a strong component of its relevance; just reinforcing Kai's earlier point about it.

That and anecdotally, its ALWAYS relevant when you as a player have a strong chance of missing, regardless of probability

#

(im dice cursed)

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 3:13 PM

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Just get better dice, dummy

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Shrimple fix

nova slate May 12, 2023, 3:13 PM

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its me, im the problem its me

#

😛

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 3:13 PM

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Then get better dice luck

#

sell your soul to RA for it

#

or something

nova slate May 12, 2023, 3:14 PM

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nah, just stack that delicious reliable and act as if all attacks will miss, so im very pleased when they dont!

drifting eagle May 12, 2023, 4:53 PM

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Want to get more value out of your reliable weapons? Just miss! It's easy to do, and free!

nova slate May 12, 2023, 4:55 PM

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I think my first played build was just "oo Kinetic hammer, pistols, assault rifle? I never worry about not having a meaningful turn now!"

drifting eagle May 12, 2023, 4:58 PM

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Always do damage. Makes sense.

quaint beacon May 12, 2023, 5:41 PM

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I'll be real I don't think the gms pistol has anything to worry about from the wasp nexus as long as they're cqbs

#

vanguard is and always has been a turbocracked talent

#

centimane is certainly nice but I feel like a lot of people overvalue it, especially on builds where you're not rocking, like, 17 ST

nova slate May 12, 2023, 5:45 PM

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centimane is very fun because you do the thing and suddenly more things!

#

like a confetti popper

drowsy coyote May 12, 2023, 6:06 PM

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I’m not even a huge centi fan, vanguard is bonkers in comparison yeah

#

Or my one true love, hunter

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 6:08 PM

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I mean yeah cuz Nexii generally can't even use their own talent that well due to being both a crit and a save.

#

and besides just Engi gun (and now wasps) nexiis don't get accurate

errant torrent May 12, 2023, 8:50 PM

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Hey the Commando profile should have +1 cc_accuracy to reaction attacks, right? cuz that's not present in the LCP

dusk arch May 13, 2023, 12:11 AM

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errant torrent Hey the Commando profile should have +1 <:cc_accuracy:683696632906252346> to rea...

I thought it was working but it turned out I'd placed some code in the wrong place, try this version

📎 Field_Guide_To_Suldan_2.2.5.lcp

errant torrent May 13, 2023, 12:14 AM

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Ye it shows up now

chilly plover May 13, 2023, 6:28 AM

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Looking at the efreet's entanglement leash from suldan:
Using interpolate on a distant enemy, grappling them, then choosing to move - are they pulled through space to your position?

dusk arch May 13, 2023, 8:01 AM

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chilly plover Looking at the efreet's entanglement leash from suldan: Using interpolate on a d...

No, because interpolate doesn't move people outside of a melee attack's own particular sort of movement (knockback, for example)

#

Grapple doesn't have a "pull people close to you" clause, so an Interpolate grapple won't pull them towards you. You can make the grapple, you can even hit them, and then since you and the target aren't adjacent to each other the grapple immediately breaks, as grapples do when the participants are no longer adjacent

#

If you want to pull that trick, you need a Nanobot Whip or something similar

ashen parrot May 13, 2023, 10:06 AM

#

As a pilot of the Efreet itself I personally prefer pairing it with Ibeji and the Qublade, using the former to send an echo behind enemy lines to apply Interpolate, and the latter to swap places with said enemy

#

What this strat severely lacks in damage is made up for by both the versatility and the sheer control it gives you. See a Bombard, Spite, or other class that prefers the backlines? Serve it on a silver platter to your buddies back at spawn. Wanna mess up one of the softer enemies with your Deck Sweeper or distract the opfor? You get to do that too!

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Alternatively if you have someone who wants to pop Sekhmet turn one you could apply the mark onto them instead. There's no better surprise gift than a Blackbeard suped up on bloodlust!

arctic void May 14, 2023, 7:03 AM

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hi lovelies. I am seeking a lil bit of advice on running beeg titans because I am unfamiliar with doing so properly, especially with how I'm planning to do it

#

also to my players, everything that follows this is big spoilers. I know you're looking, tempest bride :p

#

to make a complicated story short: I am intending to run a big scary ultra titan with a short-cycle lance. I wanted to know if the titan's innate traits, coupled with the innate madness that is the short cycle lance, meant that it would be prudent to run the titan alone, without any other characters or reinforcements. I know ultras are usually accompanied by other things because they don't actually stand up to a full party of PCs their own, but for this case I was not quite certain and I've gotten mixed up when I've tried to think about it much myself

dusk arch May 14, 2023, 7:09 AM

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Personally, I'm not sure I'd run any NPC by itself completely

#

Pretty much every time someone does this, it results in a fairly sub-par encounter

arctic void May 14, 2023, 7:10 AM

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I see, I see

#

for some additional context: the fight will happen as the climax for the current mission. they're currently at more or less full structure/stress and they have a lancaster with 7 repairs in the fridge to keep them there, but they're down two core powers and their overcharges are universally quite hot

#

they will have at least one combat beforehand, though they have an opportunity to take a full repair at narrative cost before the final clash if they so choose

#

nonetheless, if even an ultra titan with a short cycle lance isn't actually something that'll be super amazing on its own, it sounds like I'll need to figure out some extra spice

dusk arch May 14, 2023, 7:12 AM

#

If the short-cycle lance seems like it might be a little too unpredictable for a mech with a lot of durability if your dice run hot, the Spinal Lance optional could be a reasonable replacement since rather than a recharge value it has loading, and then when it switches over due to Secondary Damage it starts accumulating heat which opens up another avenue for players to mess with it

arctic void May 14, 2023, 7:12 AM

#

so it seems

#

alright; I can do that. also of note is that the map they'll be on is... complicated

#

I suppose that's a bit extraneous to my question, though

#

so: swap out short cycle for spinal lance to maintain consistency, and sprinkle in some extra enemies to make the encounter meatier. with short cycle not being around, that is admittedly more comfortable to do

#

they will be fighting on the back of a flying corvette so I think launch decks with some flying enemies like aces may not be remiss, especially since an NPC may make a cameo to help out with some extra damage

#

in any case, though, I think having my ideas bounced back at me has helped enough to give me the inspiration I need. thank you for listening, and also apologies if I've rambled; it's been a long and eventful day :p

dusk arch May 14, 2023, 7:18 AM

#

no problem

stark hamlet May 14, 2023, 7:45 PM

#

I have a quick rules question about the Comet License

#

For the Harrier Nexus, does Neurolink Targeting also increase the range of the equipment effect that lets you at the end of your turn deal 1 AP Kinetic damage to all targets within range 5 and line of sight that are Locked On?

dusk arch May 14, 2023, 7:50 PM

#

nope

#

that is a separate thing from the weapon's range, which is what neurolink targeting modifies

#

it would have to read "deal 1 damage to all targets within this weapon's range" or something to be modified thusly

stark hamlet May 14, 2023, 7:52 PM

#

gotcha

gentle forge May 14, 2023, 10:36 PM

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arctic void to make a complicated story short: I am intending to run a big scary ultra titan...

if you do want a big giant solo boss, InterpointStation's Behemoth was made for that

#

because it's actually five NPCs in a trenchcoat
(the boss has body parts/modules that take their own turns and can be destroyed individualy)

arctic void May 15, 2023, 2:32 AM

#

neat!

#

hmmm. I dunno if it fits what I have in mind - the titan's secondary damage trait is something that will have narrative repercussions in the fight, although it's not the be all end all

#

something I'll need to think on

#

I'm not quite sure where to track down the stat block for the behemoth, either

#

ah it's a patreon thing. perhaps in time, but it's not comfortable for me right now; I've got no income

#

that being said, thank ya for the recommendation. it's something that I do think I may get mileage out of in the future, even if not immediately

gentle forge May 15, 2023, 11:12 PM

#

cool, hope your bossfight goes well!

#

though for the record, if you wanted something like Secondary Damage, Behemoth has some optionals like Supreme Lord of War and Doomsday Missile that could result in a similar "phase 2" or "massive collateral damage" feeling

remote horizon May 16, 2023, 1:05 AM

#

Does the Gladiator attack auto hit, or is it rolled as a normal skirmish with extra options and conditions?

#

Also while im here, is there a list of things that theres a need for testing with? All my groups use Suldan so I think my players (and when I am a player) would love to help out

#

Found through some lucky searching my answer

dusk arch May 16, 2023, 1:26 AM

#

remote horizon Also while im here, is there a list of things that theres a need for testing wit...

Well there's a changelog in the pins which has the most recent adjustments found in 2.2.5

#

anything you see there would likely be a good starting place

remote horizon May 16, 2023, 1:55 AM

#

Will do! Loved Suldan for a couple years now so it would be great to help out as I can

dusk arch May 16, 2023, 2:02 AM

#

Sure, don't feel like you're obliged to do anything, but I'll happily take whatever you have to give me

#

That goes for anyone else too, if you use some of the stuff that's changed in this version I'd like to know about it

eager cedar May 16, 2023, 11:23 PM

#

the LCP version of the Active Defense System still mentions launchers as a thing it affects

#

question; the ATG Precision Bombs, does the bomb detonate at the end of the movement or immediately?

dusk arch May 16, 2023, 11:42 PM

#

it occurs as part of the move or boost, and the effect occurs immediately upon loosing it

timber turtle May 17, 2023, 10:48 AM

#

Just a heads up that CompCon is now enforcing the requirement for mech gear to have an associated license_id. So when you look in the compendium it will look like this:

#

The equipment is still there, and you can still equip it to characters as per Valk's workaround posted here:
#comp-con message

timber turtle May 17, 2023, 11:32 AM

#

There is a bugfix in the works to address this though so you can also just wait it out 🙂
#comp-con message

timber turtle May 17, 2023, 12:16 PM

#

Fix has been implemented:
#comp-con message

devout river May 17, 2023, 12:26 PM

#

And is still not a full fix

timber turtle May 17, 2023, 1:50 PM

#

devout river And is still not a full fix

If something's not working flag it in the compcon channel! Specialty and normal licenses though are working for me 🤔

dusk arch May 17, 2023, 11:15 PM

#

I'm keeping an eye on things with regards to comp/con, so far people have been reporting that beef's fix to things should be in place, but if anyone continues to have issues please do let me know

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 12:20 AM

#

The new Emergency Reactor Override seems funny on Worden

#

Activate CP, Barrage 2/turn, and get some free damage/movement/condition clearance

dusk arch May 19, 2023, 12:48 AM

#

It's been brought up yeah, I have no idea how it'll shake out in practice. Currently the big Worden build combo is to use Adaptive Reactor and RSU so that you can defray the cost of using the free barrage by tossing your repairs into the furnace, which requires three levels in HA plus at least two levels to grab the Worden itself. Adding Emergency Reactor Override on top of that would also be a three level C&H commitment which puts it at LL8 minimum, or you could swap it for Adaptive Reactor and grab it earlier but that means you're actually at risk of blowing your reactor out

midnight crypt May 19, 2023, 1:38 AM

#

dusk arch It's been brought up yeah, I have no idea how it'll shake out in practice. Curre...

That combo also eats your repairs like absolute candy

#

If a friendly Ronin or Sniper comes out to say hello and structures you you're in deep shit

languid cosmos May 19, 2023, 2:04 AM

#

i like to treat worden as a ticking timer

#

every round we inch closer to the final fight is a little tick and then as soon as the core pops, i'm already planning where i'm going to hide from the fireball i'm cooking up

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:31 AM

#

Oh I just realized that Blade Dancer got an update

#

whenever you would trigger a reaction attack (such as Overwatch), that character is forced to make that attack against you if able
Each time a reaction attack you trigger as part of this movement misses, you may make an attack with an Auxiliary or Main melee weapon against a target in range as a free action, and you may continue to move 2 additional spaces
Reaction attacks against you are made at +1 Difficulty
20 Evasion

#

This is a fun change

dusk arch May 19, 2023, 5:37 AM

#

yeah that was a 2.2.4 change because I wasn't tremendously satisfied with how the capstone was working

#

it was too easy for the GM to simply decline the option

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:37 AM

#

I like it!

#

Pair it with Artemis and casually just get a free attack off every other turn

#

Or, well, even without Artemis it still works well

#

Comes with the increased risk of getting shot hard but fuck it we ball

#

I have learned nothing from the story of Icarus

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:52 AM

#

Blade dancer metal mark is a lot of fun

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:54 AM

#

Holy shit

#

That's

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:54 AM

#

Wait does that actually work? Is it invisible the whole time during the blade dancer movement

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:54 AM

#

That's good

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:54 AM

#

Duskwing too

#

Invisible on its turn

midnight crypt May 19, 2023, 5:54 AM

#

drowsy coyote Wait does that actually work? Is it invisible the whole time during the blade da...

Yes

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:54 AM

#

Unfortunately with MM you can't use its Heavy mount for the extra attack but still

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:55 AM

#

Yeah pretty sure that’s why Kai made it main, aux max lol

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:55 AM

#

drowsy coyote Duskwing too

You're cooking mate

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:55 AM

#

Well thank you, you do want an accurate weapon though for this

dusk arch May 19, 2023, 5:56 AM

#

drowsy coyote Well thank you, you do want an accurate weapon though for this

variable sword

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:56 AM

#

Yeah I was about to say

#

Variable Sword my beloved

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:57 AM

#

Wait I’m a fool, doesn’t blade dancer 2 make all its attacks off 3 accurate ?

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 5:58 AM

#

Only the first one I'd bet

#

If you attack two people off of BD3 you only get +1 Acc on one of them

#

Still really good though

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 6:00 AM

#

I think, you resolve one at a time so it resets but you could definitely be correct

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 6:00 AM

#

Oh right

#

Each character makes a reaction and you make an attack against each of them individually

#

Huh

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 6:04 AM

#

There ya go, be a dusk wing under core, bonk everyone with a charged blade and drop a shadow clone by each

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 9:16 AM

#

Okay weird question, let’s say I’m using gladiator to give my heavy melee thrown.

I toss it at a target, afterwards now I have hunter 1/3 and fly towards the target and I land in the space where my weapon is. Can I pick up my weapon and now be viable for backswing cut ?

rotund axle May 19, 2023, 10:16 AM

#

Brutus Wrecker is also a thrown heavy melee so I think it'd follow the same rules as that

hasty pulsar May 19, 2023, 10:54 AM

#

I think, strictly speaking, that having to do something in between prevents you from backswinging

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now personally I'd let you free action pick it up to backswing because that's cool

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 12:00 PM

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So generally if you have a few triggers you can stack them as you wish. So hunter 3 going off before backswing is all cool. But iirc walking into a space isn’t a triggered action so you can’t pick it up but I’m curious if I remember this correctly

timber turtle May 19, 2023, 1:06 PM

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drowsy coyote So generally if you have a few triggers you can stack them as you wish. So hunt...

It requires a free action to pick up a thrown weapon which isn't triggered by anything. So it can't be done in the middle of a barrage/heavy weapon to backswing/etc.

faint fjord May 19, 2023, 5:20 PM

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drowsy coyote Okay weird question, let’s say I’m using gladiator to give my heavy melee thrown...

No unfortunately, the simultaneity was broken when you took the free action to pick up the weapon

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So the instant passed

drifting eagle May 19, 2023, 5:35 PM

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Wait, blade dancer metalmark with noah? Is that a thing?

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:41 PM

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Slowed

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So not really

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But uhh lord’s stance is it? From the Tblade, the 2 free damage on miss

drifting eagle May 19, 2023, 5:46 PM

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I mean, you just have to have all the movement from your normal speed, surely it's fine and not terrible.

gentle forge May 19, 2023, 5:47 PM

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there are builds that stack up normal speed and then perma grapple an iceout or hive drone and just deal with the slowed

drifting eagle May 19, 2023, 5:47 PM

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Iceout is alright, but the real move is the black ice + scorpion.

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:50 PM

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drifting eagle I mean, you just have to have all the movement from your normal speed, surely it...

The thing is dancer 3 let’s you move for free and that movement is what allows it to keep going

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Loose the movement loose the ability

drifting eagle May 19, 2023, 5:51 PM

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Hmmm, I'll need to keep thinking up the things that will make my noah metal mark good and not garbage.

drowsy coyote May 19, 2023, 5:53 PM

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I think it’s just solid and cool

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NOAH plus skirmish is dope

drifting eagle May 19, 2023, 6:01 PM

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Yeah maybe it is cool enough by itself.

languid cosmos May 19, 2023, 9:11 PM

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gentle forge there are builds that stack up normal speed and then perma grapple an iceout or ...

Not even slowed, just can't boost

rotund axle May 20, 2023, 7:49 AM

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Sharanga Missiles MASS Pack 😌

drowsy coyote May 20, 2023, 7:53 AM

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Teen baan mass pack

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With HG

rotund axle May 20, 2023, 8:17 AM

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With Gladiator 3 you can use DBNO twice in one scene if you take the heat right?

dusk arch May 20, 2023, 8:30 AM

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Yes. Comeback Kid gives you a second way of utilizing your special attack (either as a Skirmish or as a reaction to the designated trigger) and A Card to Play lets you use the attack 2/scene without a restriction on how it's used

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outside of having to pick different options

rotund axle May 20, 2023, 8:35 AM

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Nice

languid cosmos May 20, 2023, 1:26 PM

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rotund axle Sharanga Missiles MASS Pack 😌

MASS Pack Autopod thinkaboutit

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"omae wa locked on"

ashen parrot May 20, 2023, 1:27 PM

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Oh god

drifting eagle May 20, 2023, 1:56 PM

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Does.... does that work?

ionic badger May 20, 2023, 2:01 PM

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Yeah

drifting eagle May 20, 2023, 2:38 PM

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Oh wow. I mean it's a heavy SP investment but dang.

drowsy coyote May 20, 2023, 2:39 PM

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Mass pack emperor 🙂

rotund axle May 21, 2023, 1:08 AM

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drifting eagle Oh wow. I mean it's a heavy SP investment but dang.

So is MASS Pack Autogun, which needs to least two rounds to be more worth it than just Locking On normally and has to hit twice but, y'know, you can do it

nova slate May 21, 2023, 2:31 AM

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micromonarch specialization right? Does it have any incidental combos with the viceroy?

#Field Guide to Suldan