😢
#gtfo-spoiler-chat
tacit summit
frank mauve
Tsk, tsk, Scaler
mossy yoke
@granite sail
granite sail
@mossy yoke
mossy yoke
turbid cliff
that looks like something from DOOM
fierce crag
Nice i hope we won't see this only in D1
honest lotus
Gtfo you get taken down into a system plot twist in rundown 666 the doom slayer will be within the rundown
devout river
ok
mossy yoke
Btw really big leak. ||there is going to be lore in rundown 4||
granite sail
more
atomic escarp
More rundown 4 in this upcoming rundown than any rundown before
knotty sphinx
Something that's going to get warden nerfed
But in all seriousness
Maybe you have to do something to get it unlocked
mossy yoke
Oh fixed my typo. Smh auto correct
atomic escarp
Oh, that makes a bit more sense
knotty sphinx
It makes me think maybe you do something that triggers a lockdown and you're stuck in there until you do an objective
¯_(ツ)_/¯
atomic escarp
I thought you were trying to be cryptic
mossy yoke
Nah wasn't trying to be that cryptic
alpine saddle
yesbutno
mossy yoke
Yes I can say whether it has to do with layered difficulty or not. ||but will I? Hmmm 
||
glacial crescent
knotty sphinx
We'll find out anyways 😄
glacial crescent
"Excuse me but you need to get this 1 use medipack behind a horde of sleepers in a congo line."
alpine saddle
alright alright alright
knotty sphinx
Without triggering them
alpine saddle
will there be Taken in R4 dear drifter
void ravine
This just in: Rundown 4 is ||a work order from the Warden.||
split obsidian
@tacit summit Apologies for my earlier misinterpretation of your video, I'm honestly a big fan of your work and didn't expect a direct solid response from anyone let alone yourself! Truth be told I got mad confused as I've been playing a lot of Duskers lately and I must have got the two mixed somehow 😬 As for the possibility for run downs to occur in different complexes years apart around the globe, that's just gonna disappear deep into the deep recesses of my personal head canon until it's blown clean out the water 
tacit summit
No harm done, it was just a simple misunderstanding after all. I'm just a bit more surprised that nobody thought to tag me in that conversation for clarification. Glad to hear you enjoy my content, and I'm looking forward to R4's lore.
split obsidian
Didn't know you were in the server! Either way I'm very interested to see what direction the game takes. Story is nice but I'd personally like to see more replay-ability like items which can be kept on a successful extract, with more valuable resources becoming more readily available on higher difficulties of difficulty scalability is added.
Motivating more careful decision making and planning in addition to putting more weight behind the prospect of failure as it's no longer just time you've lost. It's items you've found that you could have kept, or gear that you've taken with you
light totem
scaling like people think wont be introduced, but progression all is coming in time
and replayability will increase with R4
split obsidian
oooOOooooh, are you in on these kinds of deets? Either way that is good to hear!
split obsidian
Deets as in are you being informed from higher-ups about the details of the next release
Deets short for details
light totem
the bug hunters are yeah, they know a bit more
split obsidian
Niiiice. Well I'm interested to see what ships in the next update! I'll of course be giving it a good try but it'd take a lot for my current group to be invested in the game with its current gameplay loop.
light totem
mortal granite
frail elbow
invisible scout mom incoming
light totem
armoured scoot
frail elbow
What if instead of 1 spawn it's something like Akira where it just starts consuming everything and growing
split obsidian
Still placing my bets on it being a fog related enemy
livid stone
i mean, the mother is kinda fog related, since it expels fog
queen storm
maybe it will be like the suggestion someone made, where it walks around and gives exhales infection fog
split obsidian
I feel like that's exactly what it's going to do. That or it's unique to fog environments
forest horizon
Can't help but feel like its related to fog just cause of the rundown gif
queen storm
could be normal fog
livid stone
tbh i think that's just using the environment to blur it's body
but you know, you have a point
it could be native to fog
forest horizon
It does seem like too obvious a hint, but we'll see soon
queen storm
the fog was used to hide it
forest horizon
pure speculation, but it could be some sort of high damage, low health enemy
just based on the fact that it looks heavily mutated
livid stone
i mean, we have the titans, hybrids, the mother, they are pretty dangerous and hit really fucking hard
so I'd say while that would be a valid speculation in other games, not this one
forest horizon
All of those have high health
queen storm
I like the comparison between this and #gtfo-chat
livid stone
exactly, they have high health and deal a lot of damage
the titan strikers 24 per tongue and 40 with each melee hit, which can take you down in a fucking second
queen storm
could be an enemy more like the charger
not as dangerous but harder than normal sleepers
livid stone
the titan shooter doing 18 damage if ever shot lands
the hybrid basically being a titan shooter on fucking steroids
and the mother spawning little devils while having the most health over of them all
queen storm
what about big shooter
forest horizon
I would hope that its some sort of scout alternative
livid stone
the titan shooter doing 18 damage if ever shot lands
sane Neon, some scout variant would be lovely
livid stone
there's not much to the titan shooter tbh, so i can't really say anything other than it having high ass hp
forest horizon
The stealth gameplay def needs some sort of something to spice it up
livid stone
it is getting spiced up deffo lol
queen storm
making the scout more erratic would be nice
forest horizon
I'd be behind making a more difficult scout mutation
longer tentacles, shorter interval between scans, etc
Could even sound different or call more enemies than usual
queen storm
maybe it calls a different type of enemy
livid stone
that would be nice
forest horizon
more scouts lul
queen storm
what if it rises fog levels if it's alerted? and you have to fight enemies in the fog
livid stone
that would be cool, but it would be in fog filled environments in the first place tbh
and the next rundown is called "Datacentre"
livid stone
i feel like a fog base enemy would've been more suited to infection
ah, right
pardon me
so is it simply called contact then?
forest horizon
basically
queen storm
yes
queen storm
I mean the vessel didn't really give much away
forest horizon
besides the mother, no not really
queen storm
from the name
livid stone
i feel like this rundown was more furthering the lore itself, and less giving us nee mechanics tbh
new*
subtle vault
🕶️
livid stone
would be nice tbh
wintry marlin
Im not sure why I think chargers are so cool. Maybe its the death sound they make. Or their 'detection phase' sound
livid stone
i think they are cool because of the fucking spikes they have on their body
like, thats fucking beautiful
turbid cliff
Thick edgy goths
nocturne flax
imagine a level with only chargers and shades
@queen storm the "i cant see shit and i cant see them" level
errant vigil
nocturne flax
only people in reddit and steam forums think that
:>
"Biotracker only works on e1"
nocturne flax
Nah
going from discord to reddit and steam its like going from earth to mars to that planet in avatar the movie
kind hinge
set the record straight, why isnt it useless?
otherwise i will continue to think it is
on R2 i might have sung a different tune, but it had no place on R3
light totem
Ok
So it is the only tool capped by the users effectiveness. The better the player is with bio. The better the tool performs
It allows better situational awareness and on the fly decision making is vastly improved
is literally walk hacks
kind hinge
"So it is the only tool capped by the users effectiveness." I disagree, but even if true thats not a reason to take it
kind hinge
what kind of situational awareness are you lacking without it?
light totem
It’s an extra sense you as a player can increase and become more effective
kind hinge
worthless otherwise
tacit summit
it also makes up for vision in poorly lit zones, which are usually where I see a lot of people die. it's very easy for a team of 4 to shoot down enemies when they can see them clear as day, but lack of vision can be deadly
I wouldn't consider myself nearly as skilled with it as I would like to be, but those pings can be life saving if you know how to work around it
hollow matrix
doesent need tool refill to function, saving valuable resources for other tools
kind hinge
bio tracker guy cannot continously tag enemies so you have to be able to survive without it
doesnt help me
light totem
That’s you then
kind hinge
and yeah it takes no tool cause it does noting
atomic escarp
It's useless if you don't tag all the enemies or at least most
kind hinge
id rather have 4 sentries than 3....
devout river
why 4 sentries the sentries are incredibly mediocre
hollow matrix
id rather have 3 sentries with ammo than a spare empty one
light totem
Two foam. A mine and a bio
kind hinge
im not even saying 4 is good, im saying more is better, and sentries actually do something
kind hinge
besides the point though, you dont have to agree, you just have to tell me why bio is NOT useless
devout river
I mean ye bio does too
hollow matrix
ammo does something- gotta have both sentry and ammo for it to be effective
light totem
Literally just did. There is more to it that you have to understand by actually using the tool
tacit summit
it's a difference between playstyles honestly. some people rely mainly on turrets to kill enemies while others rely on kiting and guns to do it
atomic escarp
Everything has it's place in the game, how you use it to it's full effectiveness is what matters
light totem
Of which. Bio is the only tool that can not be used to it’s fullest because of player skill caps
Every other tool has a literal hard limit on its max potential usage
hollow matrix
you can detect things further than you can see on the screen by using your ears, each enemy in range of a tag makes a noise when it comes into range (this also counts for sleeping enemies)
kind hinge
please come up with a list of why its useful and I bet I can counter every point you can make
light totem
-bad at bio therefore thinks it sucks
atomic escarp
I feel that the people who think bio is bad hasn't had a teammate use it properly
kind hinge
ad hominim, that is not a reason to use bio
atomic escarp
I sure don't
light totem
Oof
tacit summit
A lot of the bio uses can be summarized by this: It does what your eyes and ears can't always do.
kind hinge
pizza: no logical fallacies please
kind hinge
well you must be average too because you cant explain to me why it doesnt suck
light totem
Or argued it too many times already 
third time today iirc
not to mention I explained how and you completely disregard it
tacit summit
It allows better situational awareness and on the fly decision making is vastly improved
@light totem
^
hollow matrix
A. no tool pack upkeep
B. LITERAL WALLHACKS
C. extra check for enemies in a room you cannot see cause dark
D. makes fighting chargers easier and shadows MUCH easier
E. makes scoutkilling easier
F. Far increased sutuational awareness for moment to moment decision making
G. a dousing rod for enemies in a zone ( can hear things up to about ~45m)
H. makes kiting easier
light totem
30m and 25 ping max iirc
kind hinge
A: no tool pack upkeep is not a benefit, you don't have to refill the other tools
light totem
What
hollow matrix
what?
devout river
Yes you do
kind hinge
you dont HAVE to
light totem
tacit summit
counter, it means that you have more tool refill for your turrets, mines, and c-foam
hollow matrix
bruh
atomic escarp
Unless you want to fail, sure
devout river
In most levels you use tools enough to the point where you need to refill them
Or just not use them
tacit summit
which is something you said you would rather have more of
light totem
Ez. Quad bio. All at 100%
Ez. Now you never run out of tool
Now to wait for quad mapper
kind hinge
rok3tc4t, thanks for the list, i will be responding but it will take me a sec to type this out
hollow matrix
yeah no problem
kind hinge
scaler: no, taking bio does not provide any more tool refill in the level
you are still limited by the same amount of tool no matter if you take bio or not
kind hinge
scaler, what is your point then?
light totem
You distribute res to 3 tools not 4
hollow matrix
^^
light totem
Therefore more res per tool
kind hinge
you dont have to distribute the res to all 4 tools.....
light totem
The ratio is increased. That’s the point
dusky sluice
The point is if your not gonna be using your tool much you might as well take bio so your still doing something
light totem
kind hinge
your point implies that if my teammate takes that 4th sentry that it means I MUST get less tool for mine
not true
light totem
I’d rather take 4 bio over 4 sentry any day
devout river
Eh
light totem
Sentries are literal garbage
devout river
I do not really see the point in taking 4 bio but one can be helpful
light totem
your point implies that if my teammate takes that 4th sentry that it means I MUST get less tool for mine
Didn’t say that. Only that the ratio is lower
Ratio of refill to tool being x/3 vs x/4
tacit summit
I'll look at it in the inverse way I suppose. Give me a minute to type this mini essay.
dusky sluice
Been out of the loop of this game for a while but have sentries fallen heavily out of favor after the bug fix on the shotgun?
light totem
Tbh not really
atomic escarp
Is bio effectiveness better seen or told?
dusky sluice
I've always ran either mines or bio
hollow matrix
I beleive primer's point is the following:
if: 2 sentry then 100% tool goes to sentries
if :1 sentry 1 bio then 100% tool goes to sentries
kind hinge
how does bio make kiting easier, cat?
dusky sluice
Big floating blip that tells you exactly how they are moving
devout river
I think you can see if enemies are in front of you so you can plan in advance
hollow matrix
fog, darkness
dusky sluice
Fog darkness
light totem
Imagine having wall hacks
hollow matrix
map clutter
dusky sluice
You'd be surprised how gunfire can obscure shit
atomic escarp
Not even blip, if you're kiting them by running laps in the map you can gauge how far they are and how safe it is for you to do the stuff you need I.E uplinks or alarm scans
kind hinge
maybe you guys are bad and are alerting rooms of enemies all the time
light totem
Insert my earlier point here
kind hinge
cause its not not a problem i face
light totem
Riddle me this. If bio is bad. Then why was every E1 solo with bio
calm vessel
bio argument 
light totem
Since you have eyes and ears
dusky sluice
Ngl I have no idea how the meta has evolved in r3 cause i burnt out hard on r2
calm vessel
because it has fog and shadows
light totem
Apparently doesn’t mean anything
calm vessel
its a situational tool like every tool
light totem
calm vessel
that a really rude emote
light totem
It’s the one tool that isn’t situational
calm vessel
it is tho because its a trade off
kind hinge
to quote myself "on R2 i might have sung a different tune, but it had no place on R3"
calm vessel
its a trade off for tool vs ammo and hp. defence for utility. efficiency in this situation vs another one. what would be faster and safer clearing a door with a mine or bio?
youre never wrong? 
kind hinge
neko: at this point you are not welcome in this coversaion, you add notthing but proclaiming everyone wrong. you say you have reasons but you are too tired to explain or something
calm vessel
maybe you don't actually see what the trades off are or understand the other tools and how to play without the bio
kind hinge
so please you shut
calm vessel
theres so many things other than bio
hollow matrix
yeah neko tbh
light totem
Uh hu primer
calm vessel
you literally through out everything other say for your own argument that gets counter pointed
hollow matrix
id rather have a thoughtful conversation than shut emotes
calm vessel
by basic learning of how the bio works and how to learn from that to not needing it
it's a learning tool and a situational tool when needed
calm vessel
well there's high level scans and low visibility maps
if a breach happens its good to catch a flank
there many ways to use bio but theres also many ways to use the other tool that bio can't be used for
light totem
Well whatever. I explained why its best tool. But you disregarded it. So have fun with whatever this is
calm vessel
dude, you literally throw out anything anyone else says that counterpoints you
it's good but its not the best
atomic escarp
At the end of the day, it's an opinion. If you like the bio cool, if you don't cool. Who cares, it's a game. Shut up and play ❤️
calm vessel
and then you toss around the shut emote
hollow matrix
im still interested in responses to my list :)
obtuse surge
hollow matrix
i reupload cause buried
A. no tool pack upkeep
B. LITERAL WALLHACKS
C. extra check for enemies in a room you cannot see cause dark
D. makes fighting chargers easier and shadows MUCH easier
E. makes scoutkilling easier
F. Far increased sutuational awareness for moment to moment decision making
G. a dousing rod for enemies in a zone ( can hear things up to about ~45m)
H. makes kiting easier
I. vision through fog/darkness
calm vessel
a is a trade off for health/ammo which people dont really think of, you lose a lot of defence
but just cause it has all of those options doesnt mean more = better
hollow matrix
you could say you gain that back by knowing where to avoid enemies to save health, and to land accurate shots at range in fog/darkness to save ammo
calm vessel
but theres also pulling rooms
and using a door to clear a whole wave
literally any tool is usefull if you can use it
the argument of best tool is really outdated and dumb cause all it does is make other call each other stupid
hollow matrix
probably lol
calm vessel
and it's just getting toxic cause if you dont use bio you have smol brain
hollow matrix
but I am interested in knowing the biotracker better as an asset
calm vessel
why stealth fog and fight in it when i can blow everyone up?
its good for situations in which its obviously needed
but so are other tools
c-foam stalls insanely hard
you can finish a high class scan and have that wave not come through
and you also have to remember solo is not the same and team play
devout river
The best tool is the friends we made along the way
calm vessel
i am a tool indeed 
obtuse surge
do you need to be filled up
devout river
oh yeah I just called everyone a tool sorry
tacit summit
Like I said earlier, it really just comes down to your playstyle. If you prefer to hold your ground and just blast through enemies, then bio won't be of much use to you.
If you prefer to kite enemies and rely more on your own guns and skills, then people lean towards the bio tracker. That and it makes levels with tons of fog and darkness much easier to deal with.
It's a safe tool pick. Bio will always have uses while things like mines and turrets can become next to useless depending on level layouts.
atomic escarp
😳
obtuse surge
calm vessel
that's why you change tool for the level
that's what situational means...
ofc you can also beat R2D1 without bio
tacit summit
Yes. Don't get me wrong. I'm not arguing for either side in this.
I'm just just stating what it comes down to in the end.
kind hinge
A. no tool pack upkeep
So by this logic if I could take an empty slot it would be better than mines/sentry because an empty slot takes no tool packs
B. LITERAL WALLHACKS
Please explain why I need to see through walls. There are VERY limited situations I even care what on the other side of the wall, and in the rare situations I do I just assume its packed. Knowing that there is nothing behind the wall only helps alleviate some potential stress I guess. However I might concede this reason is on fringe of usefullness
C. extra check for enemies in a room you cannot see cause dark
My default position is to assume there are enemies even if you can’t see an area. So this doesn’t really help my playstyle. Plus there are other ways to tell enemies like looking for heartbeats in the dark, with glowsticks, audibly, or by moving close and seeing them even in total darkness
D. makes fighting chargers easier and shadows MUCH easier
Please explain, I don’t understand how it makes fighting them easier
E. makes scoutkilling easier
Please explain, I don’t understand how it makes fighting them easier
F. Far increased sutuational awareness for moment to moment decision making
Please explain, what situations do I need this for?
G. a dousing rod for enemies in a zone ( can hear things up to about ~45m)
Please explain, does this mean you can hear enemies farther?
H. makes kiting easier
Again, please explain how, I don’t think I would consider a dot appear on the enemy to be easier. Plus doesn’t the dot disappear after time? So really you need to learn to kite without the dot?
I. vision through fog/darkness
This is a repeat of C.
frank mauve
calm vessel
you can also scan enemies with a sentry scan to see if theyre there
theres so much use every tool has
wintry marlin
mad strats
wintry marlin
oh, I thought you could put the sentry to scan and remove before the first shot lol
calm vessel
i just think people arent using their brains properly with everything else by calling the bio giga galaxy brain tool. should only use if big brain!
just cause it doesnt use tool doesnt mean another tool with a starting of 67% isnt good
you have 7 extra mines or more c-foam
even more sentry rounds
two sentries is better than one for a kill box
kind hinge
I dont claim to know it all. The point of this conversation was to learn from others. But certain people did not want to participate in this process and instead chose to levy personal attacks.
rocketcat, thank you for your list, and look forward to your responses
to the others, I encourange you to join your middle schools debate team
tacit summit
Primer, I do have a question for you.
What would be your tool loadout for the first time playing a level?
glacial crescent
tacit summit
going in completely blind.
kind hinge
mines probably? but it doesnt really matter, i'm not expecting to complete the first time
kind hinge
scaler: i assume you meant solo, and also being the first time
tacit summit
should've clarified, I meant your ideal loadout for all 4 people
kind hinge
oh then 1 mine, 2 sentries and cfoam. best all around config that I know of
calm vessel
tacit summit
2 shotgun or 1 of each?
kind hinge
i probably wouldnt get that picky, but probably 1 of each has more use in more situations than 2 shotgun
tacit summit
Thanks. Just trying to get a better understanding of your playstyle and thought process. That's all I have to ask.
calm vessel
rocket cat do be writing a thesis
nocturne flax
Bio is such a good tool
kind hinge
I want to like bio
devout river
Then like it
kind hinge
gimme a reason
devout river
idk
devout river
tbf I will admit I do not think this was the best R for rundown
calm vessel
its does cost a tool slot
devout river
Not a lot of fog/ no shadow/ not a lot of dark places
nocturne flax
can predict situation
calm vessel
and losses defensive value
calm vessel
?
nocturne flax
its suppose to get a tool slot
calm vessel
you can get 67% of another tool
just cause it takes no tool doesnt mean its the best
its balanced around it
nocturne flax
so you can use it once and be done with it, you can easily bring bio and make it 100% effective in a level
kind hinge
burgerking and blackdragon, please see this and only add reasons if not on this list: #gtfo-spoiler-chat message
nocturne flax
bio its the only tool thats 100% effective
unless the range of the ping kind of bugs
calm vessel
or you can just get good enough to not need it when people literally b-hop thtough maps like its nothing
kind hinge
its 100% effective at not helping me with the level, lol
devout river
b-hopping dum
obtuse surge
you can't really say that it's not situational
calm vessel
its situational
obtuse surge
if i get through the alarm without getting hit at all, without the bio tracker
how would the bio tracker have helped me in that case
tacit summit
btw, could this conversation please move to #gtfo-chat? This topic doesn't really fit the spoiler chat.
calm vessel
use it as a second hammer?
obtuse surge
the bio tracker also isn't that helpful for stealth, unless you're the one holding it
or the person holding it is very talkative
nocturne flax
you communicate with your team
obtuse surge
which is kind of just annoying
calm vessel
it's good to determine the amount of enemies
nocturne flax
then is worthless
calm vessel
but that can be easily beat by pulling the room and clearing with a mine : )
obtuse surge
that's something i've mentioned, but the "bio gods" don't agree with that point lol
neko thinks it isn't important at all to talk to your team when you have the bio
nocturne flax
that's something i've mentioned, but the "bio gods" don't agree with that point lol
@obtuse surge dont let the guy with no mic to bring bio then
calm vessel
i dont think they see the value of other tools though
nocturne flax
neko thinks it isn't important at all to talk to your team when you have the bio
@obtuse surge i dont count neko
:U
kind hinge
My idea to make bio worthwhile is to make is buzz for all players to hear when enemies (sleeping or not) come in certain range of the holder whether they have bio equipped or not
calm vessel
turret scan has an audio cue and lights dark zones
nocturne flax
but that can be easily beat by pulling the room and clearing with a mine : )
@calm vessel If you;are a newbie yeah
obtuse surge
also again
obtuse surge
if i get through the room with stealth without bio
without shit going wrong
how would the bio have helped me
calm vessel
its fast and efficient at saving resources
obtuse surge
situational
nocturne flax
if i get through the room with stealth without bio
@obtuse surge you can, but you can easily plana head of it
its suppose to be informational
calm vessel
or just plan on the go
nocturne flax
nope
calm vessel
its an information tool that speeds up your game, but why waste a slot when i have all the time i need
nocturne flax
If we go by that you dont really need tools in every level
calm vessel
unless its heavy fog and pure dark zones along with shadows
nocturne flax
you can easily just do hammer and guns
nocturne flax
but underminding a tool like bio its just stupid
calm vessel
thats the point lol
obtuse surge
yes, because the point we're making is that ALL TOOLS are situational
calm vessel
no one is
obtuse surge
including bio
calm vessel
no one is saying bio is bad
quiet stone
4 bio pls
calm vessel
^
nocturne flax
bio its informational
sentry can only shoot one thing out 30 coming at you
mine: shitty mine placement
cfoam: if the enemy eats enough bubbles
calm vessel
i listed other reason why senrty is good
youre not using it to the fullest potential
obtuse surge
that's not even true
nocturne flax
sentry are good if you'are there for them
obtuse surge
the burst sentry hits fucking everything
calm vessel
and thats why everyone thinks bio is best
obtuse surge
it doesn't kill as much but it softens them up
calm vessel
people are using bio to highest potential but not other tools because they think theyre basic and dont use its other features
nocturne flax
what
calm vessel
sentry has an audio cue and lights up rooms
nocturne flax
look if you use ONLY bio then you kind of stupid
nocturne flax
every tool if you mix and match with it thats where the magic happens
you only really need 1 sentry
exept on reactor levels
calm vessel
c-foam stalls super hard and you can delay
nocturne flax
A3 doesnt count :U
calm vessel
probably more uses for them
obtuse surge
it's alright but it's not the best in every single situation like some people seem to think 
nocturne flax
It is good in every situation
calm vessel
...
nocturne flax
tell in wich situation you cannot ping enemies
calm vessel
some tool would be better than bio in certain situations
nocturne flax
its does one thing and it does it right
calm vessel
who cares about pingin when you dont need pings
nocturne flax
also its free
calm vessel
turrets ping
nocturne flax
more like wastes shots
nocturne flax
free doesnt mean anything
@calm vessel more tool for your other tools
calm vessel
youre not using youre head when you use other tools then
obtuse surge
it's not free, bad wording
calm vessel
yea but other tools come with tool in them 
nocturne flax
8 second cd but still free
obtuse surge
it takes a tool slot and it basically means not getting 67% extra of something else
if you think about it properly
your bio still uses 67% tool
it just lasts forever
calm vessel
its alright some people dont understand value and situation. bio seems like a band wagon at this point because people look over other tools.
you dont need to save tool if you dont need bio and you know how to use your tool. theres way more than enough tool in every level
games built around using your equipment
nocturne flax
Well of course it uses your equipment
calm vessel
just cause it cost nothing to ping doesnt mean you'll have way more tool that you cant use in the end
calm vessel
depends how you use them
its all situational and how good the players know their tools
nocturne flax
asumming all tools are at 0%
what do you mean
if its an alarm it depends on how long it is
lol
not the tool
you can use for example a full sentry ammo in a 2 sequence alarm
calm vessel
an alarm scan? i would use c-foam
nocturne flax
c1 for example
calm vessel
all day
c1, i would use mines and sentry
delays chargers so much
dont even need to use ammo
nocturne flax
if you put a sentry behind the little door it would empty
calm vessel
why behind, let them stack and let a mine deal with it
if theres a hall in the room youre defending you can use sentries to weaken
if theres no door then sentries outside
calm vessel
all how you use them to the most efficient way
i dont need bio when i can see them coming
nocturne flax
you can ping enemies you;are using bio to the best effectiveness there
calm vessel
you dont need to always ping
calm vessel
why do i need to ping if i dont need the pings?
i can see them
i can hear
my turret tells me theyre there
the door breaking tells me the direction
if i get hit thats on me
its not full circle, you just dont see the utility the other tools have and think a ping is way better than defense and natural audio cues you get. theres a trade off for everything and its all situational. and theres no point to go at this again
nocturne flax
everything its situational gg
calm vessel
there you go 
theres no best tool. its just the player that takes every information and strategy around him that truly is the best tool
calm vessel
that doesnt mean anything if i dont need the extra information
im not going through this again
kind hinge
zaddy: totally agree, bio doesnt add any info that I dont already know
visual sinew
So is the warden a person in the shadows or an spirit of some kind?
kind hinge
my guess is the baby is the wardens body or something
nocturne flax
everything was cause by a sleeper in a control room
or a giant glowstick with hands
shotgun sentry with hands
hollow matrix
Ill never forgive the shotgun sentry
nocturne flax
what a broken sentry
light totem
Spitter sentry
nocturne flax
how come you add damage per player in lobby for ss but not for bs
nocturne flax
That's such "bs"
@atomic escarp go home
hearty mountain
any idea if the big momma enemy and the little babies (on R3D1) are gonna be in the next rundown. i have feeling my friends and I wont be able to complete this rundown in time
devout river
Oh well probably not the big boss momma at the end of R3D1
But the normal momma in R3B2 (and R3D1 after neonate)
hearty mountain
okay
they havent seen the one on R3B2 yet but we can do it. if we end up not being able to for whatever reason it would be nice to see them again especially the big one
i like the rundown system but when its hard to meet with friends and complete all the stages it kinda sucks that once they switch rundowns its gone for good cause id like for them to experience it
rich estuary
Guys I completed rundown 4 and can confirm that ||you get a body pillow of D0c when finished||
calm vessel
sacred slate
You didn't even mention the fact that the new enemy is ||giant scout||
timber chasm
Seriously?
livid moat
You open a door and tentacles just spill out of it like spaghetti
atomic escarp
Don't spread information that you know isn't true, the trailer is not out so no one knows.
sacred slate
It's a joke
atomic escarp
^ this is why you don't joke.
light totem
livid moat
One more day and all will be revealed. 👀
timber chasm
I can't wait...hel...p
livid moat
Less than 24 hours remain
timber chasm
Nooooooooooooooo
pseudo pumice
17 hours
knotty sphinx
I may just turn in early today
So I can update right at launch xD
Slam a couple red bulls when I get up and avoid discord
lol
sacred slate
I can joke all I want, no one is being harmed @atomic escarp
burnt goblet
Hey guys one of the new weapons for R4 is ||just ludvigs arm||
rain heron
best weapon lol
rich estuary
Guys we're only getting ||nerf guns|| in rundown 4
rain heron
now seriously talking, imagine some type of weapon with reusable ammo, like a crossbow, per example.
burnt goblet
It would have to be loud Because the devs have said that weapons that can kill enemies silent at a distance will most likely not be added in gtfo
rain heron
yeah
rich estuary
Hammer-toss-o-matic-5000™️
rain heron
lol
burnt goblet
Bruh imagine if you could just throw your hammer at enemies and then use your fists to punch the enemies that don't get hit by your hammer
rich estuary
I can see people doing no hammer runs and yeeting them into the hole you drop in
rare flare
it's actually just a pool noodle
burnt goblet
sees a giant striker
Tosses hammer aside and cracks knuckles
"Alright time to get dirty"
burnt goblet
Yes the emperor protects
rain heron
Onward, to glory!
burnt goblet
I was debating either putting an ultramarine or Salamander as my pfp, went with ultramarine
rain heron
good
limber escarp
Another update, another rundown lost without beating any C level
light totem
limber escarp
Indeed
shy vessel
you didn't clear c tier?
limber escarp
Our group is bad haha
glass sundial
It's nerf or nothin'
shy vessel
glass sundial
0.1 damage weapons confirmed
light totem
It's nerf or nothin'
@glass sundial 👀
shy vessel
how far'd you guys get?
limber escarp
A tier is consistently easy but every b level takes 5 hours at least
light totem
turbid cliff
for most starters A3 was a block
limber escarp
@shy vessel so to answer your question, we can almost always do a and b but never c
shy vessel
how far'd you guys get on c1 :?
livid moat
The good news is
limber escarp
Oh for R3 we just didn't play much
shy vessel
if you're down to go right now I'd be willing to help you get a clear
limber escarp
R2C1 took a looooot of tries but still couldn't do it
lament drift
hopefully several D levels.
limber escarp
Then we watched a video of this other group clearly playing worse (alerting almost every other room and every scout) but still somehow won
@shy vessel can't play right now but thanks
Just need to practice more
shy vessel
press space to win
livid moat
Practice makes perfect! 👍
shy vessel
hopefully you get past c in r4!
limber escarp
@shy vessel are you talking about how jumping is quiet?
shy vessel
you can jump to avoid striker attacks if you're running away from them
during an alarm or when a room is alerted
limber escarp
Hmm that's new info
That's definitely my worst area, not getting hit
I can solo stealth at least a and b but get destroyed with every pack
burnt goblet
Bunny hop during large groups to minimize chances of getting hit. And spray your weapons if ammo is available, as even if you don't kill them you will stagger and interrupt their attacks
glass sundial
On a side note a good way to not get hit is to not run bullpup rifle
burnt goblet
Bullpup is fantastic but not when getting swarmed due to slow reload time
They are getting rid of it
limber escarp
Ha
burnt goblet
New rundown, new Weapons
burnt goblet
So all R3 Weapons get dumped and a new set of Weapons come in
livid moat
Maybe. They’ve brought the Shotgun Sentry over from each rundown even though it’s rundown specific.
burnt goblet
(and tools, yay.)
glass sundial
Weapons listed as "Rundown Specific" are almost always removed at the end of a rundown. There are exceptions, such as the Shotgun Sentry making it to R3 
livid moat
Ayyy
shy vessel
I can't use the carbine, the smg just feels better to use to me
glass sundial
Generally speaking most if not all Rundown Specifics are wiped and replaced.
livid moat
It’s not a guaranteed thing but even then most of the weapons get small tweaks too
light totem
I can't use the carbine, the smg just feels better to use to me
@shy vessel ew
livid moat
So they feel different rundown to rundown as well.
burnt goblet
Carbine>Smg
light totem
^
burnt goblet
Same ammo, better damage, range, ammo usage, accuracy
knotty sphinx
Rundown specific just means subject to change I believe
glass sundial
Spoiler R4 will have the pump shotgun
knotty sphinx
Sometimes they just get modified or removed
glass sundial
Because it's not rundown specific
burnt goblet
Eh two weapons are already revealed
light totem
Rundown specific means they have free reign over whatever happens
Whereas the base guns will remain
burnt goblet
Yea
glass sundial
Yeah ||auto pistol|| being test fired in #dev-leaks as well as the name of a secondary in that clip
burnt goblet
To be honest most of the time the base Weapons are obsolete compared to the rundown Specific weapons
burnt goblet
Yea bullpup blew most weapons out of proportion
burnt goblet
Agree to disagree
light totem
Statistically speaking garbage
glass sundial
You can quickly take out 4 or 5 targets then I can solo C1 before you finish reloading
light totem
Literally has the same damage proportion as DMR
glass sundial
I believe Carbine has the same damage as bullpup, more or less
light totem
The only gun statistically worse than Bullpup is Assault rifle
glass sundial
However one doesn't waste as much ammo, has more ammo, and has virtually no downtime 
Bullpup is fun but the flashlight hurts me lol
burnt goblet
Hopefully the auto pistol Is better then the machine pistol
light totem
It had the second highest efficiency
glass sundial
The soft stagger wave stunlock on MP was busted
light totem
Only marginally behind burst rifle
glass sundial
You could literally soft stagger like 8 guys at once with it lol
burnt goblet
Yea I mainly used burst rifle
light totem
MP was much harder to use effectively
glass sundial
Tap firing headshots also made it quite disgusting
light totem
But remained almost the same in kill efficiency
burnt goblet
I got through all the way to D1 using burst and combat shotgun
light totem
MP gang gang
burnt goblet
My group all used burst other than one guy who used a pistol, but my God he was NUTS with the pistol
glass sundial
R4 having burst rifle would be the dream. Up to this point it hasn't been confirmed if Rundown Specifics can return or not
glass sundial
Burst Rifle and Carbine in the same rundown 
burnt goblet
I imagine every rundown there's gonna be a burst weapon too
It would make sense
Burst sniper please
light totem
Ew
burnt goblet
Give the sniper it's extra mag back since the hel rifle is leaving
light totem
Hu?
glass sundial
Burst snipers are always overpowered lol
light totem
Since when
glass sundial
Or garbage because the rest of the stats that aren't damage are terrible
light totem
@ burst cannon
glass sundial
Burst cannon just needs more damage or ammo, or no charge w/ longer time between shots or reduced charge time
burnt goblet
Well sniper is mainly used to kill giants and scouts if they are not meleeable
Yea burst needs way more ammo
light totem
Well more ammo/ damage will make it statistically unbalanced
Charge would be the optimal tweak
glass sundial
Considering the role it fills as well as the downsides to using it (abysmal flashlight, low TTK, medium reload speed) I think more damage would be fine. Like 7 bodyshots on a frank so you can switch targets to something else if you are skillful with it
Hardly worth talking balance on a Rundown Specific weapon though
burnt goblet
Yea since it's gonna leave anyway
light totem
Yeah
burnt goblet
Tbh I'm more intrigued with these new tool (s)
light totem
Mapper!!!
livid moat
I want the 3d mapper so bad
burnt goblet
They could do like a doom eternal style mapping system where you could download map data from terminals
glass sundial
Mapper bio combo meta when
light totem
burnt goblet
And use terminals go remotely unlock doors that are locked
glass sundial
Your team has to be skilled enough for information to be stronger than raw damage
livid moat
Old trailers had a tool where you’d basically take a picture of a door and the layout of the room would holograph itself out in front of you
light totem
...
livid moat
That’s kind of why I feel like it’ll be a long time until it’s in
light totem
@shy vessel
glass sundial
Oh no
light totem
Website now
livid moat
The tool is kinda redundant with a few playthroughs of the same mission.
light totem
glass sundial
That's what people say about biotracker
light totem
Yeah
livid moat
Biotracker is at least helpful for waves
burnt goblet
Gtg, take care guys
subtle vault
you too
glass sundial
You too 
light totem
glass sundial
Have some ammo for the road
light totem
I found ammo
livid moat
What if there ends up being an “enemy” that causes a bunch of hallucinogenic passageways
It’s like a gateway
So you must pass through it
But if you don’t have a 3d mapper
glass sundial
Dak has some suggestions for the mapper that could make it very interesting would also have excellent synergy with the bio tracker
light totem
Ye
livid moat
You could wander into some grisly stuff.
light totem
If mapper was In For E1, I damn well would have used it instead of bio
livid moat
Now that I think of it actually
shy vessel
wait why am i pinged
livid moat
If it were balanced to not ping movement like the tracker currently does
light totem
Mapper
shy vessel
light totem
Website
light totem
That’s what we say
livid moat
Because they don’t shoot at unpinged invis
shy vessel
place a buncha dots on it
livid moat
Right. Or at best you could flash a room when a wave spawn is but it would only show the location at the time of flash
So it wouldn’t be too useful for active threat monitoring.
shy vessel
light totem
Yup
livid moat
Delicious
glass sundial
Having bio pings then follow up with mapper highlighting them, you could see exactly how many are not pinged
This would help bio fulfill their role of taking out unpinged enemies more quickly and efficiently
Information is a very powerful tool. As you become more skilled with the weapons / melee, information starts to be more powerful than just explosions or sentries
light totem
Yeye
tho my meta mine spots are pretty strong
But that requires extensive knowledge of the game
knotty sphinx
I'd melee more, but I often get hit for 90% of my health by a giant that missed. xD
livid moat
Mine spots directly under your teammates are pretty strong too.
glass sundial
I recommend targetting the giant's limbs with melee
livid moat
Center mass, center mass!
knotty sphinx
I had a lot of giant practice on D1
But sometimes the game just bugs out and you die
glass sundial
While it deals less damage (90% sure limbs have a damage cap, so say if you damage a limb until it's about to break then snipe it, you'll deal like no damage), it guarantees a stun if you get a clean hit and don't have bad latency
glass sundial
I need to actually sit down and test limb health
knotty sphinx
It's just sometimes they clip into stuff, melee doesn't physically hit you and it deals a one hitter.
:x
glass sundial
It's pretty easy to do. Just firing enough primary shots to various limps until they are ~1 shot from popping then blast those limbs with a sniper
Sometimes when you try to mess with franks, you get franked
light totem
Frank the frank
light totem
Franklin removal services? @glass sundial
knotty sphinx
But I never did get around to uploading it with an explanation for new players
lol
glass sundial
Maybe for R4
light totem
light totem
Oh no it’s out
livid moat
In the next rundown. And weapons.
If you go to sleep
It’ll likely be out by the time you wake up
Maybe.
shy vessel
deadly
granite sail
Wtf
atomic escarp
Never mind that gif
atomic escarp
livid moat
A rundown that is 17 A tier missions
All baby difficulty
It’s just a pain to do them all
granite sail
No😎
livid moat
A rundown that is all E tier missions
rich estuary
One mission with tons of optional paths/objectives/extract points
brave onyx
blazing thicket
The entire rundown is one huge mission that takes 8 hours to complete
glass sundial
A1 has 30 different objectives, each that trigger an extract alarm upon completion
atomic escarp
Completes the first alarm aight done, thank you, next expedition
atomic escarp
A1 error alarm when?
warped shore
@glass sundial so we can play it often for diferent endings right?
or must be do all 30 objectives in one run?
atomic escarp
Some objectives are optional, if you want to make it harder
warped shore
ah ok thx
atomic escarp
I'm waiting for an expedition where you can complete the level in complete darkness or do something to turn on the power but it activates an error alarm
Fun
rich estuary
R1C1 was kinda like that
atomic escarp
R2C2?
livid moat
RPG when
atomic escarp
R1C1 was a reactor one
rich estuary
It had no lights until you turned on the reactor
And the lights would go out intermittently
atomic escarp
Oh, I see, yes like that
rich estuary
It was great being the chad with the long range flashlight
atomic escarp
Can't relate, didn't use it enough
rich estuary
It did a lot of damage and had good amount of ammo if you used it correctly
light totem
Smh. Idk I’ve always hated ss. Even back when it was broken OP
granite sail
YESSS
light totem
I’ve been a bio user since the start. 
Burst is better. But still bad
Yeah
Bio>mines and foam> sentries
Or a third option.... hmm
Hel gun sentry when
Ew
Smh imagine unironically liking BC
subtle vault
There cool
atomic escarp
Good addition, hopefully good execution
drowsy juniper
yeah
fallen elm
oh now u tell me ;P
light totem
Reee
subtle vault
Its hot
drowsy juniper
it looking pretty nice
fallen elm
where do i go to see it ?
subtle vault
ye
fallen elm
now tht looks good
atomic escarp
The fuck does that mean
fallen elm
didnt give anything away either
tht looks good ;p
im excited 12 hours and counting
agreeded
oblique peak
arctic bolt
edit: nothing was here lol
granite sail
OHHHH
arctic bolt
Oh ok
granite sail
YE IT LOOKS SO GOOOD
arctic bolt
oh
drowsy juniper
wait really?
calm vessel
it's not out
mossy yoke
alright let's not talk about the trailer please, it's not officially out
arctic bolt
I fixed it :)
calm vessel
atomic escarp
We need to know, how's patch notes going?
calm vessel
it will come out when it does!
subtle vault
I almost posted a pic of the new updated sleeper models
calm vessel
queen nymph
They don’t and they won’t 🙂
calm vessel
would be weird to delay a release the day of
granite sail
i mean i dont think it will but im about to go ask my mom if i can take thursday off
:0
just to play fuckin r4
i have one test, ill just take the class online
and then be "sick" for the rest
quiet stone
Can't wait to tickle more scouts in R4.
quiet stone
They sometimes tickle you but you can tickle them back
nocturne flax
I suck at math
i literally leave work just in time for the release of the rundown
im happy
obtuse surge
hmm
fallen elm
i summoned you :p
obtuse surge
some interesting decision making going on
light totem
i didnt know a 50 cali tickled
Cali...... weird. Who uses an i when saying .50 cal
fallen elm
well im the big dumb
i summoned wesley and got u to syh
😛
point is i stopped half way between actually spelling it out
and just short hand
i was lazy
but wesley we gonna need some maps from the map maker my dude
obtuse surge
