gtfo-lore

[eternal talon]

@faint timber

[eternal talon]

https://www.notion.so/GTFO-Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0

Hi, your most recent video had many critical errors regarding the lore, if you have the time, please give these a read for your research, as you somehow missed all ~130 text and audio logs, which give more detail on most of the topics you theorized about in your video.

[lilac island]

I am very smart

[harsh saffron]

Nice

[eternal talon]

?

i genuinely can't tell if that was intended to be mockery

[strong solstice]

take a guess man

[rocky wraith]

i cri

[brittle sigil]

Lmao I just checked the channel after 1 day and I get this gold mine.

[slender forum]

im new to the GTFO lore but are sleepers above the surface or just in garganta

[harsh saffron]

We don't have any direct mention of them on the surface yet. So it seems like they never left Garganta.

[burnt wren]

Yep. We have mentions of a pandemic of some incredibly lethal virus, but no sleepers. It kills and that's that. It needs something else to make sleepers - something that can only be found in garganta. Presumably the parasite mentioned in a few logs, but no direct confirmation.

They could escape manually of course, but seeing how we are delivered to missions - have doubts. Hard to crawl on sheer steep walls.

The fliers are a problem though... I doubt warden has anything to hold them back.

[fallen gulch]

We may have an indirect mention of them being on the surface in the past with the ancient Mayan Flea Demons, right? No mention of them being on the surface now, but it's possible they were there before or could get up there later

[topaz flare]

well we know some kind of sleeper is on the surface cause of all the lockdowns and stuff

at least thats my theory

[harsh saffron]

Indeed, depending on how you interpret Flea Demons you could have a good point there. Never thought about it like that.

[topaz flare]

tbh in my head this question can answer 50% of the question what is happening on the surface and that question is why are we down in the complex

like whats the big goal

we have work loads yes but they are sending us down to a infested nest like labyrinth for a reason right?

if we can find an answer for that

[somber kite]

Also all those disfigured bodies they burnt on the surface too!

[topaz flare]

we may confirm or theories whats happening on the surface

[topaz flare]

thats not the surface

well we dont think it is

its most likely from flyer life forms or something we haven't seen yet

like a sand digger

[harsh saffron]

There were a few hundred bodies on site when SMC got there. Don't remember if they were disfigured tho.

[topaz flare]

oh sorry by surface i meant EARTHS SURFACE THE ONE THE COMPLEX IS ON

i dont know why i caps locked there lol

[somber kite]

The bodies were there a month after the property was sold, so I don’t think they’d done much construction before that happened (maybe even BEFORE...)

And I’m trying to look for the log that mentions the disfigurement ...

Ooh also, a log mentions that due to the mental effects of the virus, they were putting into place a “mandatory sunlight exposure” which would be a fantastic way to spread it on the surface LOL But I also haven’t gotten far enough in r6 to read more about the supposed parasite, and it being localized in Garganta would make sense 🤔

[harsh saffron]

The log about the parasite was in R5 but they mention the word parasite once in a R6 log.

[somber kite]

Ooh yeah, I vaguely remember reading abt it but I’ll have to go back and check 👀

Also I take back the sleepers on the surface, I found the log I was thinking of (the one with the caller on State of Truth AM) and they became disfigured IN the hole before coming back out...

[burnt wren]

Do we have ANY info on spitters ? At all?

[harsh saffron]

They spit at ppl No, but some theories

[royal mason]

why did all the hundreds of KSOs leave schaffer and abandon garganta during the sleeper outbreak

also did they ever leave their HSUs in deep

[solar nova]

We activate KDS Deep in R5, but it's unclear what it's going to be used for.

[solar nova]

Unknown, most likely BIOCOM made a calculation that the threat could not be contained and looking to retake the complex later on would be more lucrative. Also possible that BIOCOM went rogue, given we know it gets replaced by a different version (the WRDN) at some unknown point.

[royal mason]

@solar nova but isnt wrdn controlled / secretly injected into BIOCOM by KDS?

but yeah that explanation makes the most sense

[finite vine]

iirc there really is not any info that can be used to 100% determine who/ what injected WRDN.

[solar nova]

We don't know who. KDS would be a bit weird, since they run BIOCOM anyway.

Well, indirectly.

And we have logs suggesting weird behavior from BIOCOM that might be the WRDN, and it doesn't seem like KDS staff is in on it.

[keen mantle]

OR there might be some hidden intelligent “sleeper variant” that affects/corrupts electronics or technologies.

Similar to the Technopath from Prey… how it takes control or corrupts anything with an AI or Technology near it

[royal mason]

mfw broom closet

[eternal talon]

did someone say something about a broom closet ending?

That ending's my favorite

[south lake]

I have to wonder if maybe there's a possibility that WRDN wasn't injected (in the usual sense), but instead manifested on its own as a kind of emergent intelligence. It's rather difficult to kill an unauthorized process if it's coming from 'Ring 0', so to speak.

I forget when the log was dated, but there was one that mentioned BIOCOM trying to reroute power without the authorization to do so, and I think Kovac either denying knowledge or saying nothing?

Any case, just a thought that was rattling around in my head. No idea if that's even remotely feasible, just wanted to toss it out there before I lost it.

[solar nova]

Would at least explain why we have next to nothing as a strong alternative rn.

Not exactly a lot of people with the technical knowledge necessary that would want access to BIOCOM in this way.

Could have found a loophole that allowed it to write its own version of BIOCOM, and then run that version in place of itself.

[south lake]

Possibly, though I think an emergent intelligence would act more like a rogue process

Think malware accessing the system VIA rootkit

As anyone who's had or seen one knows, you can't stop a rootkit without a tool specifically for deleting rootkits

But - and I'm assuming here - a machine like BIOCOM probably isn't designed to self-diagnose and repair on the software level, both for security and safety reasons

So if whatever processes BIOCOM runs somehow managed to create a "naturally occurring" (for lack of a better term) machine intelligence, it wouldn't be able to stop that intelligence from taking over, since it would quite literally be the equivalent of trying to repel an invader that's already inside the defensive perimeter meant to do just that.

Or maybe a better analogy would be more along the lines of installing an OS over an existing partition

[floral lance]

This makes me think of how Schaffer mentions in the CX Log putting together a team of specialists. Maybe before everyone got put in KDS/memory wipe started someone with computer skills tried to break into a central facility and created the WRDN as a last ditch effort. Just a random thought from reading what you’re saying. We know people were moving around for a bit when the outbreaks first started in the complex.

[eternal talon]

Given the corpses, his hideout is likely taking place after everything went to shit and before he made his way to KDS deep.

It isn't early on, the state of the place is a train wreck of a broom closet, and on that note, who the hell designs a broom closet with a basement?

[finite vine]

It could also be his hideout after he escaped the warden

[slender forum]

Flea demons are definitely fliers

Fleas dont have wings fliers don't have wings but now that I think about it it's kinda a stretch

Also mayans being in the same area as garganta and earthquakes apparently causing the "disease"

[burnt wren]

Does the game imply that that's what killed the mayans?

[slender forum]

Someone theorized it in a log

[south lake]

AFAIK fliers are a new development, post-collapse.

The log theory was pertaining to the sleepers, I'm pretty sure.

[burnt wren]

Would be weird to call them "flea demons" but I guess I can let it slide.

Most importantly how did they cut out the infestation. Surely the parasite wouldn't stop with humans.

[eternal talon]

remembering the log on that terminal, you are right, skyrope. my bad

it is AFTER he escapes the warden and kds deep, since the log talks about gathering our squad

i had completely forgotten about that

[eternal talon]

as far as we know and from what we have seen, the fliers only get into the facility from destination when we leave a portal to Destination open in B1, so as for what "flea demons" means, my first guess would be something to do with blood for the "flea" part

or something of that nature

[eternal talon]

all we know is that its some disease related to earthquakes in the region

[eternal talon]

yeah that is quite the pickle, unless they only encountered nam-v like we did on the surface that made it out to the rest of the world

i can't possible imagine even getting to the modern day if both the virus AND the parasite got out in the 16th century

at bare minimum both south and north america would turn into a wasteland devoid of all life, and god help it if the spanish encountered the mayans during the time of the outbreak

allthough, it would be probable in that case they'd just all die on the ships long before they reached back to europe

[south lake]

Maybe there was some kind of plant native to the Mayan regions able to be used as a kind of repelling medicine that's since gone extinct

[burnt wren]

I mean, the mayans' disappearance is one of the great mysteries of the real world and I assume GTFO tries to blame it on nam-v. Which means even if cure existed - it wasn't enough to stop extinction. Unless it somehow did both (suicidal sacrifice).

And the most important question remains : how does nam-v interact with flora and fauna outside of homo sapiens. Because mayans didn't exactly live in the desert. If there was an actual outbreak AND it was capable of infecting things outside humans - that's it, game over. The americas would be lost for sure.

So:
A) It wasn't nam-v and flea demons are not sleepers / infected.
B) Nam-v only interacts with humans and run into suffering from success - mayans went extinct before it got to spread somewhere else.
C) Some deus ex machina stoped the infestation, but wasn't able to save the mayans.

[dense saffron]

vanilla

real gamers favorite ending is "the bottom of the mind control room ending"

[rocky wraith]

B, same thing as the black plague, too many died to carry on would be my bet

wanna talk about these three things

First one is most likely an artifact

but the other two are what interests me

Both found in deep cavities

But both of them are flora

as in plants

Why are plants alive all the way down here?

Did the plants come with the egg?

"Deep Reach" is where they were found

any clue the depths that was?

Both in separate cavities

Were they part of the eggs hydroponics?

Potential new biome in R7 with alien plants in the caves?

Does this suggest that NAM-V can't target plants?

[livid grotto]

RyK in the lore channel...

[eternal talon]

gotta remember, NAM-V doesn't cause sleepers by itself, only it AND the parasite. nam-v could truly be the cause, but not the entire pair.

oh nvm i read your post wrong

i agree with @rocky wraith

nam-v is insanely viral and even with 2050s technology and advances in medicine it could only be delayed at best. think about smallpox blankets during the colonization of America and foreign diseases. 16th century Mayans would be annihilated before it got a chance to spread much past the border of the peninsula

[eternal talon]

if these are auto.gen logs then remember, they aren't cannon. they are randomly generated texts.

also mention again the living thistle-like species of plants on Destination

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notobasis_syriaca

by far and away the closest earth plant to those seen on destination

[solar nova]

Why would random generation preclude them from being canon?

[eternal talon]

because of the nature of them being random

random is random

[solar nova]

Okay, but that wouldn't mean they are meaningless, they're probably an accurate depiction of Insight's research records.

[eternal talon]

it brings me back to this old website, through random generation, every thing that ever could be said or ever would be said is stored upon it

https://libraryofbabel.info/

[solar nova]

This is nothing like the Library.

[eternal talon]

yes, but by nature randomness can generate extremes

[solar nova]

They literally have a bunch of text fields and variables they hand-picked.

[eternal talon]

yes, but at that point your questioning single words like plant, leaf, nam-v, esc esc

there is no reliance on that

it's gibberish because everything else in the text can have any set meaning within those bounds

[solar nova]

Okay, but that's something you can discover from the text, it's not utterly meaningless.

We have a bunch of bounds and keywords associated with what they're researching.

[eternal talon]

"biomass sample"
"small shrub" any of the things in any of those texts can be randomly generated into anything that seems major, but is useless because it's just rolling dice.

[solar nova]

I.e. they find a bunch of crystalline structures, metallic structures, and such.

[eternal talon]

as i said, "yes, but at that point your questioning single words like plant, leaf, nam-v, esc esc"

[solar nova]

Yes, they are documenting plants. That's not something we wouldn't be able to deduce just because the logs are random.

[eternal talon]

and the logs don't matter because it's just a dictionary going word by word

[eternal talon]

that's why i'm not arguing that

[solar nova]

Literally said they're "not canon"

Kind of an extreme position.

[eternal talon]

they as logs aren't cannon

think of how many ways you can rearrange a set of words

into something different

the items therein are cannon, but the logs and what they say are not

because it is random

[solar nova]

But they are canonical. They contain information that is representative of what's true in-universe.

[eternal talon]

this is a very tricky topic

it depends on depth

if you go anything past single words mentioned, then you open it up to more and more of a chance of it just being random

[solar nova]

What is a specific combination of key words and ranges that isn't accurate to the game's universe?

[eternal talon]

and i would hope you would agree a random file is not at the same level of canonicity as something written directly by a dev

[eternal talon]

answering that, i would need to know every bound that is possible to generate, and it would depend on how they are coded to be randomly generated. something as simple as like coolbeanz mentioned, plants being down in the inner, or something extreme like that where the depth number is randomly too high, but it would make sense for an artifact depth, it's random. it's so hard to give an exact example without running and reading auto gen logs 1,000 times to FIND those exceptional circumstances

[solar nova]

It's possible they get teleported in and out, but who knows, might just be an exotic plant that came w/ the fossil.

[solar nova]

I don't think depth is a variable. I've already documented all of the ranges and variables I could find on the lore database.

[eternal talon]

the second picture is an auto gen talking about finding a "patch of grass" in an excavation

that is the limit

and even so, it's random, and i don't know why someone would consider randomly generated texts in any context as cannon

[solar nova]

All of the biomass logs involve some kind of plant in "cavity [no.] in excavation deep reach." Grass underground is literally canon, as are bushes, shrubs, flowers, etc.

[eternal talon]

i'd love to have @analog frigate and @subtle verge's opinions on this

[eternal talon]

yes, as i said "that is the limit"

more details that that is when the randomness really starts to take over

[solar nova]

Okay?

You act like the range is really extreme, and you can actually get crazy results.

Do you actually know what the variables are that are used?

[eternal talon]

i've seen crazy results before, it wouldn't surprise me

[solar nova]

Also, that would be more-so dev oversight than "non-canon," my impression is that things are pretty restrictive so as not to be anything that profound outside of general facts.

[eternal talon]

i don't have picture proof anymore,

but i've seen some really wacky auto-gen logs

[solar nova]

Like?

[eternal talon]

like plants with the descriptors of the artifacts in other autogens

[solar nova]

Which variable combinations are really out there in your opinion.

?

They literally have separate templates.

[eternal talon]

i know, that's what i mean crazy results

weird buggy shit that doesn't make sense

though that one wasn't a terminal log, it was on a screen

[solar nova]

I literally generated a fuckton of them when I was documenting this and didn't notice any of them bug out.

[eternal talon]

documenting what

i saw that one in normal gameplay on c2 i think

[solar nova]

The variable options for the two console logs.

Cool, where?

[eternal talon]

it was just before the second generator alarm sequence

i wish i still had the picture

it was one of these that was weird

point being, i've seen them produce some inconsistent stuff before, so i don't think it's a good idea to just blindly trust auto.gens

[solar nova]

I'll believe it when I see it.

[eternal talon]

i don't know what to tell you, i don't have it anymore

[subtle verge]

Hello, I have been pinged. Let me scroll up and read while I'm taking a break from packing.

[subtle verge]

Fill me in on what opinion/take I need to offer? Regarding whether or not the research on the console is autogen or not?

[south lake]

Unless they were incredibly lazy with categorization, I'd argue autogen logs are technically canon, as the developers would still have to dictate whether "topic X" can autogen with "variant line Y", to use an extremely rough example.

That, and to have truly uncontained autogen would be asinine when logs are all we have to go on for lore

Would mean that any log we find on a text screen is immediately worthless and should be thrown out, which is counterintuitive to the intended purpose of the logs

So I'm of the stance that unless and until stated otherwise, they should be seen as "lite" canon

And no, you saying otherwise does not make it so, Frosty.

[eternal talon]

weither you would consider auto.gen logs to be canon or canon to the same level as standard logs

[subtle verge]

Personally: the auto.gen logs are just as cannon as the other logs are. While you can consider them to be repetitive copy-paste logs with how we see them from one expedition to another, they tell us in-universe information regarding happenings in places that we don't occupy.

And it shows a bit of continuity, too, that those auto.gen logs are affecting systems from one subzone to the next.

[eternal talon]

you say this despite the fact that they are randomly generated?

that is the biggest problem with me, it isn't lore given to us by the devs. it's randomly thrown out by a machine each time a level is loaded

and that randomness is cause for uncertainty on how trustworthy these auto.gens are

i'm not saying all are bad,

but that chance is cause alone to be skeptical on their reliability

that's my opinion anyway

[subtle verge]

Define what you mean by randomly generated? Are you referring that they randomly appear on different consoles on a level-to-level basis? For example: if I run C2 twice, there's a chance that they'll appear on different consoles? Or are you referring to something along the lines of: "they're auto-generated via the game engine from an algorithm in the code" or...?

[eternal talon]

the text within the logs is randomly generated.

[subtle verge]

Give me an example of which log you're referring to? Are you saying that the auto.gen log regarding temps is non-canon or is there another that I'm just not thinking of at the moment?

[eternal talon]

it's not a specific log

every single terminal in r6 has an auto.gen

it's a log randomly generated with text that is randomly generated from certain parameters

[subtle verge]

Gotcha. I see what you're referencing, now. Uhh, I'd have to say that they're still canon, even if its gibberish -- like corruption in the system or something. I think those are what I would consider a "bad rabbit hole" anyway. They exist, it's a thing, but it's not worth looking at beyond face value for the time being.

In short: I wouldn't focus on them or use them for any theories/world building outside of "it exists."

[eternal talon]

i agree

it's not reliable enough to use with certainty

[subtle verge]

Back to packing. I'll catch you fine folk later. ❤️ Ping me if you need anything, just expect very slow responses.

[finite vine]

they are not auto gen logs

I guess you could argue that some of the percentages and parameters are auto-generated, but things like "deep reach" are most likely cannon

[eternal talon]

Yeah

[harsh saffron]

Wanted to ask: Is the Santonian website "bugging out" for anybody else? When the terminal window is filled with text all the way to the bottom, it doesn't scroll down automatically, I can't scroll at all or input any other commands after that. Has been like that for a few days.
Edit: Apparently it's not just me ^^

[royal mason]

at this point in GTFO is KDS still powerful and active? how is the surface?

or is all that remains is a redundant AI that keeps awakening legion prisoners to go further into garganta with a deteriorating schaeffer leaving stuff behhind

[burnt wren]

Well, we can neither deny nor confirm. Someone calculated that nam-v should've effectively wipe out most of humanity up to 99%. So for all we know - we are all that's left.

It is unknown what The Warden is up to. Could be he's stuck on old objectives, but there's a high chance its an AI with a will of its' own.
For some reason it is dead set on producing these artificial humans, and it's trying to make sure that sleepers will ignore them. In DX it mentioned "potential to increase specimen masking" (which seems to mean - be invisible to sleepers).
Unfortunately masking didn't help against half-insane Schaeffer, who effectively declared war on Warden.

I wonder if Warden will try to come up with a solution to that problem...
We'll see in R7. Someone will have to make a move.

[harsh saffron]

I'm predicting Schaeffer objectives for R7
already thought that would be a thing in R5/6

[burnt wren]

OBJECTIVE /// OVERRIDE
NEW OBJECTIVE /// UNLOCK ACCESS TO FOOD STORAGE.

WRDN WILL NOT KNOW.

[rocky wraith]

not autogen, they sit on the monitors on D1 and probably other places

Reason I think it's important is that a number of the sample chambers have plants instead of sleepers

Which is really interesting

[solar patio]

Or a conflicting objectives? Imagine if we betrayed the warden and he changed The mission objective to "Eliminate all prisoners" And the started throwing everything he had at us. shutting out power. Opening doors to divert masses of biomass at us. Setting up all jinds of crazy scenarios designed to kill us.

Although that would be pretty final.

Maybe for the last rundown whenever that is.

[harsh saffron]

Oh yeah, something like that sounds pretty crazy for just a "random" Rundown ^^

But definitely cool

[burnt wren]

How about contradicting objectives or objectives that don't make sense

And Warden even getting confused

ERROR: OBJECTIVE UNRECOGNISED

Or you get one objective done and immediately get the order to do exactly the opposite

Like turn something off and then immediately turn it back on

Just messing with your head.

[south lake]

I dunno, I don't think Schaeffer would have that capability. WRDN issues orders via the operator's Stack, which if I'm correct in guessing that means cortical stack, would be extremely difficult to break into without either access to WRDN itself, or the operator's spinal column.

[eternal talon]

Could be something to the extent of ambushing the squad mid-mission and directly removing control somehow in-person, then fighting to one of his hideouts while the wrdn blares alarms and activates security systems as retaliation

Removing control can't be something too complicated since Schaeffer himself broke free seemingly randomly mid-mission aswell

Because his entire squad died, but he never made it to extraction or finished his task

[south lake]

The issue is we don't know how Schaeffer broke free. Given his damaged state of mind, for all we know his stack could've malfunctioned.

[eternal talon]

He talks pretty often about wanting to break our squad free

[south lake]

And trying to access the cortical stack in someone's spine is.. not really feasible if they're thrashing around.

You're far more likely to kill them in that case

[eternal talon]

Hunting and trapping 20 scouts behind a door then opens it when the squad passes by, that'd cause some damage to their state of mind

Constant screaming

/s

[south lake]

There's a reason surgeons immobilize patients before starting spinal surgery after all

Even the slightest twitch could clip a nerve that kills the patient

[eternal talon]

I doubt its related to the neural jack. My best bet personally is something to do with the audio frequencies mentioned in a previous log of being an issue with KSOs

[south lake]

Except we hear no audio tone when orders are updated, and the cave systems would distort the hell out of subliminal audio frequencies regardless

[eternal talon]

That's not what I mean

A specific frequency either breaks it or creates issues with it. We aren't getting orders via sound waves.

from log 8RT-NSA-BUN.LOG

[south lake]

That sounds like they were having operatives responding to "familiar" audio frequencies, potentially drudging up memories that should've been forgotten

I don't know that something like that would work for these four

[eternal talon]

that's mentioned in a different part of this log, actually

[south lake]

Especially since two of them are already incredibly unstable

[eternal talon]

here,

they are different topics

they know the cause of one but not the other

[south lake]

That.. doesn't explain anything, even still.

We don't know what the response was to certain audio frequencies

We can only assume

[eternal talon]

yes

[south lake]

And assumptions get us nowhere if we're wrong

[eternal talon]

i'm simply saying in response to this that it is unrelated to memories coming back, as it's stated separately within the context of the log

[south lake]

Except we don't know that for sure

It doesn't specify at all what the responses are

[eternal talon]

they are separate paragraphs.. it's just standard sentence structure.

i'm not talking about responses to the frequencies AT ALL

underlined in RED, is related to memories resurfacing. the audio frequency issues is underlined in BLUE

[south lake]

You literally just said "something to do with the audio frequencies"

[eternal talon]

they know the cause of RED

they do not for the BLUE

[eternal talon]

as to how schaeffer ESCAPED

[south lake]

If you're gonna start preaching at me again, we're done here

[eternal talon]

you said we don't know how he escaped, i was theorizing upon that

[south lake]

I'm not doing this every time you get a bug up your ass about lore

[eternal talon]

oml really? if you want to go you can go. i'm not preaching, i'm speaking standardized English in a well structured way.

[eternal talon]

you don't want to admit your wrong, but whatever

i didn't claim anything outside of what is directly written lmao

i even posted you underlined copies of the specific log i was talking about

to help you understand

i genuinely don't get your vendetta against me when i say ANYTHING

[burnt wren]

I think it's the attitude

[livid grotto]

GTFO’s lore drama

[eternal talon]

SQ RECORDING SCHFR002 START

This is... my name is Schaeffer. That's- (laughing) That's all I know. (stuttering) I don't remember. (grunting) Focus... Yeah, I know. Yes I know! It's okay. They can't hear me down here. FUCK THEM! (laughing) FUCK THE WARDEN! (laughing) (clearing throat) Call me Schaeffer. I don't know who you are, or if it will ever be heard. I don't know. I'm not going back up. They'll be looking for me, the warden. I must- maybe they think I'm dead! What if they've come for me? What if I'm giving myself away here? What if I- Listen... I was in a group, there were four of us. They're all gone. But I think there are others. Maybe you, if you're hearing this. Maybe, you came after us! Or, before. Or, I don't know. I don't know! But there are signs. I've seen signs. There are others here, I know it. There's blood, fresh blood. The air, it smells different. Something ALIVE was here. Maybe they can help me! Yeah, that's it! But how do I trust them? They... have... to... prove themselves! Yes, yes! They have to go deeper. They have to get me... something... yes... YES! They have to get me something. Not here though. They have to go deeper. Go Deeper. I'll be waiting.

this is all we know about the event when schaeffer broke free of the WRDN's influence

[burnt wren]

But wait

We heard him in DX getting into hsu unit

And he sounded nornal

[south lake]

You know what, Frosty? You're right in that I can go, and I'm gonna choose to do that, because I'm tired of you taking something that should be fun and making it a total pain in the ass by acting like a total gatekeeper.

You don't always do that, but when you do it's extremely fucking irritating.

Later.

[eternal talon]

yes yes, Schaeffer Discrepancy

[burnt wren]

Are we even sure he was part of a squad?

[eternal talon]

i will see if i can find the post

i asked the devs about it on a livestream, they said there is a reason for it, but wouldn't elaborate. i'd have to find it

[harsh saffron]

BX* 😡

[livid grotto]

bit out of subject, but if I remember right in DX hes talking with a creature right?

[burnt wren]

Yeah yeah my bad

In any case that's one hell of a discrepancy

[harsh saffron]

I'm just joking ^^ no worries

[burnt wren]

I believe someone - maybe one of you - mentioned that HSU really fucks with your mind to the point it Replaces your memories with someone elses

[eternal talon]

fuck, @harsh saffron do you remember what the Q&A livestream was on?

i can't remember if it was YT or twitch

[burnt wren]

Was it wiki article or something?...

[eternal talon]

it was the 2nd to last question asked

[harsh saffron]

twitch

[eternal talon]

lemme see if i can try and find the vod and timestamp for @burnt wren

[burnt wren]

Not real need

They said there there's a reason for it, I got it

[eternal talon]

nah nah nah, i found it

[burnt wren]

My phone can't stand twitch anyway

[eternal talon]

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1467429825 @ 50:28

it's not a steam, it's a saved video of the stream

"quick question: the first Schaeffer log was found in rundown 4, but the new logs in 6.5 show he was locked in KDS deep inside an HSU, but WRDN only accesses KDS deep in R5. How did Schaeffer get out of KDS deep for the WRDN to find him sometime before r4, and does it have anything to do with the ancient aliens?"

was the question asked

"well i will never answer things in a chat like this that you could find answers for in the game itself, i can talk about the process of developing the game and the process of writing the stuff, but questions about the logics of the story itself you have to play the game and look for answers and clues, but i mean yeah that was a little bit of a flex of that first like, "i know this stuff and i know about the timeline and i'm trying to put you on the spot here and point out that there is a logical fallacy""

was the response by the game director

but no, it is a legitimate issue in the timeline that we do not have any information about at current

[harsh saffron]

Just say it's clones, ez fix 🙂

[eternal talon]

i swear @subtle verge and others were chanting from the roofs about a month ago that chad theory was confirmed cannon

we also never got that second AMA or the answers to unanswered questions from that stream, sad.

@dull crest what happened to that?

[burnt wren]

Yeah, it appears that dev just redirected it

No real answer

"oh yeah, it totally makes sense, trust me bro"

[harsh saffron]

Would be kinda strange to answer that on stream ^^

[eternal talon]

but yeah, it was a major bit of weirdness that me and punk were talking about a month or so ago

[burnt wren]

I mean clones is literally the only possible explanation here

[harsh saffron]

"Yo, who injected the Warden?"
"Well, that's ez, it was Schaeffer himself of course!"

[burnt wren]

Either that or worse - some time / parallel universe shenanigans

[eternal talon]

neither of us could come up with a way that it would work without either some weird time stuff, or something teleporting his HSU out of KDS deep

[burnt wren]

And I said it before - DONT FUCKING TOUCH THAT.

It's all gonna fall apart the second you open your mouth.

[eternal talon]

my best guess at current, and again, we have basically zero info on this, is something to do with the Allens, since they are the only things we know in lore that do have teleportation technology or anything that could make that happen

[harsh saffron]

I wouldn't say that, but everything I could bring up is just 100% guessing so not really worth it until we have some indicators of what is going on ^^

[eternal talon]

but yeah, weird shit.

kinda weird though, the Schaeffer Discrepancy is kinda the first thing in lore thats unexplained not because its missing logs to clarify or add detail, but because it just doesn't make any sense with anything we have at current, so something major in the lore is probably being hidden for now (living allens maybe?) or it is just a discrepancy and the devs don't want to admit it and will retcon it to being something that makes sense

[subtle verge]

Typing from the airport, so kind of slow, but: my best guess is that Schaeffer was able to get out through some form of ventilation shaft or some service crawlspace or something after searching for a while. I have no basis of confirmation, but that would at the very least explain a way he may have gotten out.

[eternal talon]

don't we hear the hsu closing in the audio log though?

^ i could be completely wrong on this

i'd have to listen to it again

[burnt wren]

That doesn't explain though why he thinks he was part of KSO squad, when in the log he sounded like a normal person with no biocom interference.

[subtle verge]

We do, yeah, but the audio logs in question are when he's starting to become manic/demented.

Or already has been for a while; the ones from R4.

[burnt wren]

Either he's hallucinating and remembering things wrong, or he was talking about a perfectly normal squad, not KSOs.

[eternal talon]

https://www.notion.so/Schaeffer-Origins-Logs-5277cdc6c7b24e02924afbee55be697b yep 100%

you can hear the HSU closing with him getting in it

QTS-BNN-996

[burnt wren]

Btw

Thats bs

Why logs know when to end

[subtle verge]

Out of curiosity: is it possible that he's experiencing someone else's memory(ies)?

[burnt wren]

What was he recording it with? Was there just a terminal next to hsu?

[eternal talon]

i have no idea on that topic

[burnt wren]

Some of these logs sound contrived

[subtle verge]

Something that I've been pondering for a while, since we know that shared memories are a thing, albeit we don't know to what extent.

[eternal talon]

there is one, yes. in the middle of the room, @harsh saffron has a picture

[subtle verge]

Yeah, there's a BIOCOM terminal in there.

[harsh saffron]

Yeah, thought about that as well, after the D1 monologue.

[eternal talon]

it starts to close about 5-6 seconds before the logs ends

[burnt wren]

And why does the log end, precisely?

Who pushed the stop button?

[eternal talon]

i have no idea

[burnt wren]

I mean I can give it a benefit of the doubt that it just does that, for some reason.

[eternal talon]

though he could have had set it to stop when the hsu closed

[burnt wren]

Kinda like terminals reset when you move away.

[eternal talon]

i dunno man

[burnt wren]

But still, it's awkward.

[harsh saffron]

I mean, its 2050-ish I can image a recording system just shutting off after not picking up sound for a few secs ^^

[burnt wren]

It's the video game thing.

[eternal talon]

a lot of the stuff surrounding this entire thing is very weird

[eternal talon]

yeah, that too

[burnt wren]

Everyone keeps recording all these logs and letters and they all just perfectly times...

[subtle verge]

My thought process is that HearSay has a feature where it turns off after either a set amount of time, or when the terminal detects either the "off" command or when it can no longer detect someone near it.

[burnt wren]

Classic video game trope.

[eternal talon]

but yeah, you can 100% hear the HSU closing

so he definitely went in there

[burnt wren]

Yeah, heard that.

[eternal talon]

wouldn't make sense for him to just open and close one while not in it for the audio log, so i dunno

it just goes back to the same discrepancy

[burnt wren]

Isn't it amazing? He effectively just chose one death over the other.

[eternal talon]

him being in the wrdn's hands while the wrdn doesn't have access to KDS deep

[eternal talon]

well he would have died of starvation anyway

[harsh saffron]

A chance of dying over just 100% dying tho

[eternal talon]

the room he is in is a giant pit with only one security door in, or out and a really long corridor

he said he closed the doors and for some reason we don't know he couldn't get them to open up again

[burnt wren]

I mean... Under same curcnstsnces I'm sure we all would pick the same.

[subtle verge]

Boarding the plane. I'll catch you guys in a few hours. Sleeper kisses!

[burnt wren]

Quick sleep in some pod instead of starving on the rocks for days... Brrrr.

[eternal talon]

honestly, i just don't see how the fuck the discrepancy could be resolved without either a: weird warping of spacetime nonsense, or B: the allens have a plan for schaeffer and are doing some funky shit

because as far as i am aware, the HSUs basically make the person inside them in a coma, right?

there is no fucking way he could have just woke up and left, not just because of the pod, but because everything is still locked down when we go there in r5.

[burnt wren]

Well, it's a stasis unit...

[harsh saffron]

I mean, we don't know how the 4 player chars got out either. Could just have been somebody/thing being able to release us 4 and Schaeffer.

But not all of KDS Deep

[eternal talon]

speculative question

[burnt wren]

Don't we literally leave them in the beginning of every cutscene?

I assumed that's what happening during the drop

It forcefully awakes us from the pod and down you go

Fucking sucks. The most rude awakening ever.

[eternal talon]

if it were the case, what would be a reason for the allens to lock him in there to get him to go into an HSU, then to teleport him deliberately to a place where the warden would both find him and use him?

[burnt wren]

Gonna be honest, I've got a bad feeling about this one, chief.

[eternal talon]

this question is assuming it has anything to do with the allens, don't take it as fact

[burnt wren]

The explanation will either be stupid of boring, that's what I think.

But we'll see. Don't fail us, Mr writer.

[eternal talon]

it is quite the pickle to have written themselves into

we will just have to see where they take it.

[dull crest]

On it. Looking like AMA on Wednesday

[cobalt mulch]

<mr burns excellent meme>

[eternal talon]

4, 3, 16, 20 are the numbers i have seen on the date in the connect to rundown screen

also 2020, for some reason

16/20 i just saw

20nul

3/nul20

4/nul20

[harsh saffron]

Don't read too much into it, as far as I can tell it's the same stuff that we had between R4 and 5 😄

[eternal talon]

it is seemingly random

but certain numbers are repeated

i've ONLY seen those 4 numbers in different orders. 4, 3, 16, and 20

or maybe 2 & 0

every generation it is the same length

i just saw a date

fuck its too ast

fast

i saw 4/16/2020, though that date is far past

anything special on that date that happened?

it's definitely the numbers 4, 3, 16 and 20.

and it appears to be the same number of characters

every gen

[cobalt mulch]

ig its just a scramble placeholder

[eternal talon]

those dates are during when r2 was out

i wasn't able to find anything on any of the 10c, GTFO_GAME, or warden twitter accounts

there has got to be something in that cipher

[dull crest]

That as well, we had our Space Event that took alot of time.

[real pewter]

is there any new log in santonian website?

[harsh saffron]

Nope, at least not in the corrupted directory

[real pewter]

ok

[wise sinew]

oh, never noticed. thanks!

[dim scroll]

Without explaining in detail, all the previous rundowns have the same countdown as the current one

[wise sinew]

cool stuff

[dim scroll]

Countdown that'll disappear once R7 is released

[wise sinew]

So it's a code which translates into the next rundown incoming?

[cobalt mulch]

they enable the actual cd time on their servers and the scramble is replaced

[wise sinew]

ohh

cool, thanks

[somber kite]

the lore for this game is so god dang cool I seriously gotta give my compliments to the lore writers 🙏 love how researched and in-depth it all is

Also, How far in the future do y’all think it is during current-game ....

[pine agate]

I think the latest date we've gotten in the logs has been 2063 (correct me if I'm wrong please) so I'd say we're currently somewhere in 2070-2080. Still, I'm not really sure.

[solar nova]

2063 might be the current year, actually, since it appears to refer to objectives we're doing in-game.

So, some time after 2063, but probably closer to then than later.

[somber kite]

ooh cool 👀 👀

[cobalt mulch]

in a few weeks we'll get more breadcrumbs, cant wait

[harsh saffron]

Will we get more than 100 logs in a single rundown? Stay tuned to find out!

[somber kite]

a few weeks? 👁️

[pine agate]

We think so, they've already teased the timer

[somber kite]

ohhh YESS

[fallen gulch]

When did garganta splode?

[quick grove]

Thermal vent ruptured

[harsh saffron]

The energy blast happened on October 13th 2053 if you mean that

[fallen gulch]

Yep, this. Thanks haha

[somber kite]

Does anyone know of anything in terms of the generations (tau, sigma, genesis)? I know the main characters generations BUT ... I’m so curious as to the actual differences in terms of the experiments they used them for

[harsh saffron]

We don't have a ton of logs on the different generations, this latest one talks about them the most I would say:
https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Rundown_6.0_Logs#8RT-NSA-BUN.LOG

This one also mentions them if you wanna give it a quick read:
https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Rundown_005_Logs#56HF2.LOG

Pretty sure there are like 1-2 more that I'm forgetting but those 2 are the ones that that popped into my head ^^

[somber kite]

AH thank you!! 🙏

[rocky copper]

will the warden ever release the prisoners?

[hot burrow]

Probably not

The warden just views them as canon fodder

And does not care about them

[rocky copper]

so when they all done they either die or get put back to sleep?

[dim scroll]

It might be once all of its objectives are done

no one knows what's the purpose of the warden

[burnt wren]

Despite his name Warden was never intended as prisoner-containment program. Its primary purpose was effectively to run a bunch of brainwashed human drones who got their memories wiped so hard that they don't even know what they're in for (and according to some wiki articles I've read they were shocked when they found logs of their initial interviews).

They are KSOs. Kovac Special Operatives. Not prisoners. Brainwashed security personel under direct control of a massive overreaching security AI.

Its' goal is never to keep them alive, just use them to get shit done. If they survive - good, won't have to send a new less efficient squad next time.

I'm assuming that best case scenario is that Warden will just forget about them and keep them in the stasis unit until power runs out. If we'll ever get "free" - it won't be through Warden.

[rocky copper]

isnt the warden an ai

[burnt wren]

Yes, supposedly.

Initially it was called BIOCOM, but then got forcefully injected with the WRDN protocol which is where the new name comes from.

By whom, why and when - no idea, but probably not a good thing.

[rocky copper]

is anyone working with warden like the government or is warden on its own, how is warden getting its prisoners

[eternal talon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfoklUJXb2Q

[eternal talon]

i'd recommend reading the "for dummies" lore document in the pins of this channel.
as far as we know, there most likely isn't a government left.

[rocky copper]

ah ok thx

[eternal talon]

everything except for the "escaping hydrostasis" segment is fantastic @hardy scaffold

well done!

[hardy scaffold]

Thank you! It took me a lot longer to put it together than I would've liked, but I'm happy with how it turned out.

[eternal talon]

the day we learn how he escaped KDS deep and got into the hands of the WRDN is the day a great plot-hole will be closed

[somber kite]

Theres a log that mentions backdoors and overriding code potentially being set up with the installation of biocom, so if that actually exists, THAT might be a way to shut warden down...

[dim scroll]

The main question is why was the WRDN protocol made

Was there an impostor among the devs 😳

[rich blaze]

@random meadow Santonian Website has a way to open old logs so you can catch up :)

[random meadow]

But why no have it IN GAME? Doesn’t make sense that you gotta go to another website to see lore for the GAME

[eternal talon]

i also DM'd him

they just said in the live ama rn that simon would answer questions about the lore on the last ama... he DIDNT

[eternal talon]

some of the lore is exclusive to the smc website, not everything is in-game

as an ambassador, you should have gotten a lore email a while ago aswell.

[harsh saffron]

He did answer lore questions tho

[eternal talon]

the only one was mine afik

and he gave a non-committal answer

[harsh saffron]

there were a few others, answering your question was pretty unlikely tbh ^^
Simon just straight up explaining the lore is something I wouldn't ever expect

[eternal talon]

it's a plot hole tho

at least giving some indication other than "it isn't, trust me" would've been more helpful

[harsh saffron]

I guess

[analog frigate]

they prefer keeping in vague

always

and it's better that way imo

[harsh saffron]

I agree, I wouldn't want anybody just spelling it out for me

[rich blaze]

+1

[eternal talon]

honestly it depends on the game for me, but in this case, i would say keeping quiet when talking about a plot hole probably isn't a good idea

[harsh saffron]

I mean, not everybody thinks its a plot hole.

[eternal talon]

name one person who doesn't

it is a huge issue

[harsh saffron]

Scaler, me

ez named 2

[eternal talon]

scaler didn't mention it at all

and naming yourself as a sole reason isn't very representative

[harsh saffron]

Didn't you mention that part yourself in your response to the video?

[harsh saffron]

I know that was a joke 🙂

And I could name some ppl I play with/talked to, but you don't know them, so it doesn't really make sense ^^

[rich blaze]

Frosty

what is the plot hole ?

[eternal talon]

? he didn't mention it in that part of the video, rather skipping past it? i didn't say it was bad

[eternal talon]

you know this one, the schaeffer discrepancy

[rich blaze]

There's a lot of Schaeffer discrepency, can you specify?

[eternal talon]

the one where he is breaking the laws of time

being in the wardens control in r4 before the warden can access him in r5

we've had many extensive talks about it in here

[rich blaze]

Ok ok

I think there's just an unexplained part that we're missing

it seems weird, doesn't mean it is

[eternal talon]

whatever that piece could be, would have to be huge to the story and have massive implications

just because of the problem it would have to solve in the first place

[rich blaze]

not really, we have not necessarily nailed down all that happened between explosion and R5

Especially since they seem to have reclaimed some parts of the complex after

[eternal talon]

i refer to @subtle verge

we have discussed this topic to death,

and could come to no possible way whatsoever that he could have gotten out

yet he did

[rich blaze]

For me it could be (Not saying it is, but possible Scenario) :

• Explosion, KDS go to KDS deep once evacuation is done
• They ask some KDS at KDS deep to secure some parts of the complex
• Schaeffer is used at that moment
• They lose control again of KDS Deep at some point
• Warden is ">:(" and plans to get it again

[eternal talon]

it's a very fundamental problem, we know for a fact he enters HSU as a ""normal"" person, and in r4 we have a log with him cussing out the warden and his squad dying, then the warden accessing KDS deep being the entire core of r5. problem being, schaeffer in his log describes the room at the veeeery heart of KDS deep

a place the warden could never access at that point because he sets up an entire rundown to get there god knows how long after

[eternal talon]

what? no

everyone in KDS deep was asleep when he got there

when he was going there, everything was already thoroughly fucked

[rich blaze]

That doesn't mean everyone in Garganta is

[eternal talon]

he got himself stuck inside

the doors are still stuck when we have to restore power to open them up

there is no other way in or out

the only logs that really matter for this are the 3 X logs, the Schaeffer2 log in r4, and the entirety of r5.

[rich blaze]

He does not have the clearance

, someone with the correct clearance opened again

then it got locked again when they lost control

[eternal talon]

that is irrelevant, he was there

he records on the terminal in the core

[eternal talon]

no

i don't quite think you understand

[rich blaze]

Source

?

[eternal talon]

the 3 X logsz

the schaeffer 2 log

[rich blaze]

This happened in 2053

[eternal talon]

and this post i JUST made

[eternal talon]

^ this

[eternal talon]

the dates don't matter

it is a FUNDAMENTAL issue

[rich blaze]

It does

[eternal talon]

no

it doesnt

tell me how they could matter in any way at all to the problem?

[rich blaze]

Well, who says we get Schaeffer out in R5

[eternal talon]

schaeffer himself says that the sleepers are everywhere, and all the Kovac soldiers retreated to KDS deep and went to sleep

[eternal talon]

we DONT

BECAUSE HE IS IN R4

[rich blaze]

Indeed we don't

[eternal talon]

you dont understand

the problem

[rich blaze]

I do understand your problem

stop repeating your three same points like I have a reading problem

[eternal talon]

clearly not if you said this

because nobody even implied that

[rich blaze]

• Explosion, KDS go to KDS deep once evacuation is done
• They wrestle back control of KDS Deep from sleepers using out of Site KDS (I'm sure Kovak was fine bringing more)
• They ask some KDS at KDS deep to secure some parts of the complex
• Schaeffer is taken out and used at that moment
• They lose control again of KDS Deep at some point
• Warden is ">:(" and plans to get it again
• R4 happens, Schaeffer is out and KDS Deep is locked again

[eternal talon]

that is very wrong

[rich blaze]

Explain to me why this could not have happened

cause so far you just said it's wrong

I say it's a possible

not a certainty

[eternal talon]

https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=5277cdc6c7b24e02924afbee55be697b

1 second

QTS-BNN first 20 seconds

he also says there is no sign of gunfire or anybody else alive as far as he can tell

in the previous log

PRG-TLX

there are NO KDS LEFT ACTIVE

he says this explicitely

he finds NOONE

[rich blaze]

Yes, not in Garganta

[eternal talon]

???????????????????????

[rich blaze]

there are KDS outside Garganta

[eternal talon]

nope

no no no

nope

negatory

nonsense

give me one log

ONE LOG

[rich blaze]

Oh yeah, I guess Pretoria was a City Inside Garganta then

[eternal talon]

they moved their entire HQ into garganta

very, VERY early on

given he said he had to make a journey to KDS deep (since if he went up a shaft he might fall and alert them), he didn't just stroll for 10 minutes. his entire journey he found NOONE

[rich blaze]

yes

[rich blaze]

issue with Sigma gen. The Pretoria lab is running some tests on our
GOs and our remaining Sigmas to isolate the behaviors you mentioned.```

[eternal talon]

at the very heart of all KDS deep operations, there is NOBODY

[eternal talon]

this says absolutely nothing

what is your point?

[rich blaze]

This says they have KDS outside Garganta

Cause they are running tests on it

[eternal talon]

what's the date of that log?

care to tell me?

[rich blaze]

2052

[eternal talon]

so yes, before they fully moved into KDS deep

so again, ONE LOG

[rich blaze]

Where does it says they moved everything

They just said they allocated 30000m²

[eternal talon]

https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=40aa1780f7f7406d93f07b9f7386d5b5

[rich blaze]

I'm on that log too

[eternal talon]

Kovac will have exclusive administration of the area. No Santonian employees will enter the area without express permission from Kovac. Exceptions will be made for select individuals, to be outlined in the full contract. I would personally be interested in a brief tour of the new location and an informal meeting to further discuss the RISE project, but that would be as a personal favor to me and would not influence any agreement between yourselves and Santonian.

In exchange for this new accommodation, Kovac will expand security duties both in the Garganta facility, and throughout the exclusion zone surrounding Chicxulub. Kovac will provide escort teams to all Santonian mining crews as they continue to excavate and expand Garganta and will provide military support for Project Insight explorations into the Fossil.

[rich blaze]

It just says it's Kovac area

not their main base

[eternal talon]

We expect to have most of the equipment moved from the Belarus facility to storage hangar 3 by next week

https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=37eef44785274dd880a45e2cffe772e1

they are moving EVERYTHING

[rich blaze]

Most could refer to "Most things we want to move"

not "Most of all things"

[eternal talon]

I ran your suggestion past the board, and they have approved it. Santonian
will allocate the requested space for you and have Deep fully excavated by
March. In the meantime, they have room available in the storage hangars so
you can begin moving in equipment immediately. There were some concerns over
your power requirements, but I'll leave that to you to sort out with Clinton.

https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=ecc67f90a11842688575e9380da2213a

[rich blaze]

Yes, that still doesn't say it becomes their main base

[eternal talon]

okay amanes

how about this?

We too have a schedule to keep, and we need to be moving into our new residence by the end of 2052. Work needs to start on the assignment immediately.

https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=6e449bc3e33347a6ac6255af7f4c18f3

there is your smoking gun

if EEEEEVERYTHING ELSE

wasn't sufficient

[rich blaze]

Once again, residence could just mean where they'll go in the complex

[eternal talon]

https://tenor.com/view/drcox-scrubs-head-gif-4862594

[rich blaze]

and Since Piros seems to be the one handling Garganta

[past matrix]

tbh i was kinda under the impression the hangars was where they kept all of their equipment (BIOCOM, machinery, etc); not all of the operatives themselves

[rich blaze]

Hangars are where they put equipment transitory while they're moving stuff to Garganta

[eternal talon]

i can't argue with you

[rich blaze]

Services Offered Hangar most likely refer to the Belarus one

[eternal talon]

you just are ignoring plain text now

[harsh saffron]

@eternal talon It's ok if you are interpreting these logs as "We moved everything/body to KDS Deep" but these logs don*t directly say that.

[eternal talon]

IT SAYS IT

[eternal talon]

RIGHT HERE

[rich blaze]

It doesn't

[eternal talon]

READ

[rich blaze]

Garganta has amenities

so I guess those affected to be on Site to help Santonian would have their "residence" there

That doesn't mean all of them went

[harsh saffron]

I did read that and as I said, it's a valid interpretation. But it's not explicitly stated.

[eternal talon]

no

your talking nonsense amanes

it says it in like 12 different logs

[sonic citrus]

Isn't KDS an enormously powerful company that has dealings with many many organisations? Would it not be strange for them to move their entire base into one clients area?

[eternal talon]

that they plan to move all their shit there

[eternal talon]

they took it over and had martial law declared

[rich blaze]

It doesn't state it anywhere my guy

just your confirmation bias

[sonic citrus]

Just because they made a hostile takeover in Garganta doesn't mean they don't have other dealings going on

[eternal talon]

nonsense

[sonic citrus]

Why would they put all their eggs in one basket

[eternal talon]

you want to sit here and ignore BASIC information

then your not going to do it wasting my fucking time

[rich blaze]

Once again, none of the logs you mentioned

[eternal talon]

because you don't want to like what you read

[rich blaze]

stated that they would move all

to Garganta

[eternal talon]

IT SAYS RESIDENCE

I POSTED THE FUCKING DEFINITON MY GUY

I BOLDED IT

I SCREENCAPPED IT

[rich blaze]

Yes, and it's the residence for the people they'll send there

[eternal talon]

WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT FROM ME

[eternal talon]

NO

THE KSOs LIVE IN FUCKING TEST TUBES

they dont' need houses

they need a warehouse

[rich blaze]

KDS is not only KSOs

say for example Piros

or Lorde

[eternal talon]

EX-FUCKING-XACTLY

[harsh saffron]

Ok, lets stop. #dev-leaks

[rich blaze]

If Piros is assigned at Garganta

[eternal talon]

IT'S MEATY DAVY JONES

[rich blaze]

it's only logical he'd call it his residence, since they're supposed to stay for a long time there with only few topside passes

[eternal talon]

im not going to argue basic shit with you amanes

if you want to ignore the logs

then go do something else

i'm not going to sit here, and IGNORE WORD FROM GOD

[rich blaze]

Idk brother, it's not basic logic, you're skipping hoops to prove your point

[eternal talon]

it says explicitly, no room for interpretation

[eternal talon]

THERE IS NO SKIPPING

ITS ONE FUCKING SENTICE

[rich blaze]

Where does it says explicitly that they move everything and not an substantial amount

[sonic citrus]

this boils down to a semantic debate over the use of the word residence 🙄

[rich blaze]

This semantic debate is the whole reason I say it's not explicitly said

the semantic there has been done for a reason

they never said "Yeah we're all moving in, hello Santonian friends"

[eternal talon]

Santonian will allocate a further 30,000 sqm of space for KDS Deep. This is in addition to the existing area you have allocated for Legion storage and the Biocom installation.

Kovac will have exclusive administration of the area. No Santonian employees will enter the area without express permission from Kovac. Exceptions will be made for select individuals, to be outlined in the full contract. I would personally be interested in a brief tour of the new location and an informal meeting to further discuss the RISE project, but that would be as a personal favor to me and would not influence any agreement between yourselves and Santonian.

In exchange for this new** accommodation**, Kovac will expand security duties both in the Garganta facility, and throughout the exclusion zone surrounding Chicxulub. Kovac will provide escort teams to all Santonian mining crews as they continue to excavate and expand Garganta and will provide military support for Project Insight explorations into the Fossil.

[lilac island]

is there anywhere i can find info on the lore of this game

want to read through it

[eternal talon]

the pins,

[rich blaze]

Look pins

[eternal talon]

we have several summaries, the notion.so timeline, or the santonianindustries website

[eternal talon]

your right, santonian said that to kovac

as posted above

[rich blaze]

Yes, I absolutely agree that they provide accomodations for the contractors from KDS staff they'll have on site (Piros for example, because he's there in 2054). That doesn't state they're all moving there

[eternal talon]

you don't need 30,000 square meters

for 10 buerocrats

what do you think they have?? underground mantions?

that is 322 THOUSAND square feet

that's... INSANELY HUGE

you don't need that for a dozen or even a couple dozen contractors

[rich blaze]

Most of it can be storage space

[eternal talon]

no, it says IN ADDITION

to the legion storage

[sonic citrus]

So are you suggesting that every member of KDS is underground at Garganta, working and living there?

Or commuting into the pit from nearby accomodation?

[eternal talon]

not all, but the overwhelming majority

they moved their entire company there

it's the new hq

i've posted like 10 logs at this point supporting it

[sonic citrus]

I can't imagine why the head honchos and people not getting their hands dirty would move to live and work in a giant hole in the ground

[eternal talon]

to amanes, and he's ingored literally all of them

[rich blaze]

Agreed with Ellda

[sonic citrus]

The conditions are pretty dire for the SMC workers right

[eternal talon]

the entire point.. of garganta, is its off the grid

[sonic citrus]

so why would these people in an incredibly influential company ALL (or nearly all) move there

[eternal talon]

they face no legal repurcussions

[rich blaze]

I'm not ignoring all of them, I'm just saying it's not HQ

[eternal talon]

fuck, they have martial law declared in the yucatan later on

[rich blaze]

They have the martial law in their part of Yucatan, which is an agreement with the Yucatan government

[eternal talon]

that's what i just said???

[sonic citrus]

Do they need to be off grid? The politicos talk about how KDS are into some shady stuff in one of the logs but its not like they need to hide out right? Authorities aren't seeking them out to arrest them?

[rich blaze]

You said all of Yucatan

at least that's what I understood

[eternal talon]

nope

i said in the ucatan

i didn't say all

[eternal talon]

its right here

[rich blaze]

Yes I can scroll up three messages thank you

[eternal talon]

also, i think it might be actually all of the yucatan

[rich blaze]

No

[eternal talon]

lemme check

[rich blaze]

Kovac Defensive Services have a comprehensive contract with both the Santonian Mining Company and the Mexican government that allows Kovac to establish martial law and "administrate punitive consequence" over any person within the exclusion zone.

It's only the exclusion zone

[eternal talon]

yes, but what is the size of the zone

that is what i am looking for rn

[sonic citrus]

Was it not the area inside of Garganta that they sectioned off for themselves?

This is the exclusion zone where an SMC employee went by mistake and was killed?

[rich blaze]

No, there's the Kovac perimeter outside which is most likely the exclusion zone

The KDS only zone is another one

[eternal talon]

this happens alot

at least like 4 times afik

from the logs alone

[rich blaze]

4 times?

I only know of the Igor Rostock incident

there's other incidents where they didn't kill but clearly showed a disregard for Human life

[eternal talon]

hm, i guess not. i can't find a mention of the size of the zone

[rich blaze]

(Like Schaeffer when he meets them, or D3 Log)

[eternal talon]

i'm pretty sure it happens on an audio log aswell

[rich blaze]

Yes

[eternal talon]

please don't make go go fucking digging through them

[rich blaze]

They threatened Schaeffer

BX Log

[eternal talon]

but the entire point of this arguement,

there are no kovac in KDS deep that are awake

when schaeffer goes there,

[rich blaze]

That I can agree

[eternal talon]

he closes the doors

do you remember why?

[rich blaze]

That I can agree, to avoid sleepers

[eternal talon]

there are sleepers infesting the place

yes

so

he closes the doors,

and they jam or something, we don't know

but they wont open

[rich blaze]

It could also be a clearance problem that he doesn't know about

[eternal talon]

he is here

[rich blaze]

I agree

[eternal talon]

we know this for several reasons, but i'm not going to cover that rn

there are only two doors, and one looong hallway here

no other way in or out

until we open it of course

and activate the lift n' stuff

but not the point

[rich blaze]

I also agree

[eternal talon]

so he gets in an hsu

[rich blaze]

so far so good

[eternal talon]

when he gets in an hsu, everything is still closed and stuck

[rich blaze]

We agree on that

[eternal talon]

now i know your probably going to disagree with me in a bit, but just follow along

after this moment, we have no info

[rich blaze]

Agreed on the no info

[eternal talon]

next time chronoligically we hear about schaeffer is the schaeffer2 log in rundown 4

[rich blaze]

in R4C1, yes

[eternal talon]

this is the log where his squad dies, and he says fuck the warden

so he is under the control of the warden at that point

so sometime before r4c1, he made that log, or that log was generated, or whatever

cut to r5.

[rich blaze]

we open back KDS deep in E1

[eternal talon]

the entire rundown of r5, is setting up optimal scenario to activate kds deep

we turn on generators, do other stuff i don't know since i didn't play r5,

but the entirety of r5 is setting up for r5e1

in r5e1, we get to that same room, right?

given the picture is from that level

we enter code into the terminal, giving the warden access to this part of the facility and opening it up to his network

he activates the hsu lift, and we ride it out

right?

[rich blaze]

Yes

[eternal talon]

the problem is

we give the warden, access to kds deep in r5

[rich blaze]

How was he out before we were in

[eternal talon]

we turn the power on,

we open the doors,

we kill the sleepers,

we complete the alarms,

all of it

[eternal talon]

yes

[rich blaze]

Yes

[eternal talon]

it doesn't matter if any kds were left outside or anywhere else in the complex, or anyone for that matter

because of the bullshit we have to deal with to get to it in r5

that is the plot hole

he is out and working for warden before warden has access to it

[rich blaze]

Okay, can I explain how it could have happened?
I'm not saying how it did, just how it could.

[eternal talon]

and nobody else could get there because of schaeffer's bullshit and all the other nonsense we had to do just to get to that mission

i don't remember what @subtle verge said,

since he was talking with me about it when we first discovered this

but neither of us could come up with a reason within the lore we have right now, that explains it

my personal best guess was something to do with the allens or their teleportation tech, i don't remember punks'

[subtle verge]

The only thing I said: he could have found a vent shaft, like he had been using prior, to get out.

[eternal talon]

problem with that, is HSU coma

braindeath, and whatnot

[rich blaze]

Once again, I'm assuming there is outside forces, which you don't agree with, but it's an hypothetical

Between the moment he's locked in and R4C1 (the zone where we have no info)

[eternal talon]

i'm saying, it couldn't be because of the bullshit we have to do to get to it

[rich blaze]

BIOCOM/WRDN uses outside KDS to get back to KDS Deep, with someone with enough clearance to open everything without alarms (Piros maybe?)

[eternal talon]

if someone else, anyone, did, we wouldn't have to do the stuff we have to do in r5

[rich blaze]

Remember that WRDN uses his own access keys and sometimes usurp others to bypass clearances

see the log in DX where it tries PIDs

So they get back to KDS Deep

[eternal talon]

its still infested with sleepers

complete and totally

there is also no power

[rich blaze]

yes can you let me finish

when they go back down, I'd assume they try to get power as critical infrastructure

which then renders the cell thing moot if you have reactors around

So they get to KDS Deep

get some KSO's out but not all of them, Schaeffer is in the group

[analog frigate]

sorry for cutting you off but about the dev leak: it's tentacles of some kind

[eternal talon]

yes, yes, we will get to that in a bit

we were mid convo when it dropped

[rich blaze]

Something happens and they lose control of KDS Deep again

[solar patio]

Thought it was more like spider legs

[analog frigate]

you can see veins and there isn't the normal "keratin" look

[solar patio]

But maybe i'm seeing things.

[rich blaze]

Lockdown happens and KDS deep is back to square one

we have Schaeffer out, KDS Deep locked

[analog frigate]

they don't seem to point in one direction but i see it as well

[eternal talon]

its infested, that would assume the nuclear generators shut themselves off, the sleepers move back in, somehow blood doors become a thing again, alarms for unlocked doors are reissued,

[analog frigate]

more so connect to a central body and then spread out

[eternal talon]

because we find unlocked scan doors in-game

in other levels

but most in kds are still alarmed

[solar patio]

Also there's a little spherical object on the right edge of the screen it seems like

[rich blaze]

yes, which could concur with a reconfinement

[analog frigate]

this?

[eternal talon]

the biggest problem with that, if they had to fight so hard to get it back, why not just turn biocom on then?

give it access

give them thousands more soldiers?

[rich blaze]

Actually Frosty

I may have found something

WRDN attempted to light up all of KDS Deep again in April 2054

[eternal talon]

wdym "light up"

[rich blaze]

It wanted power for it

made the request

Also, I have found that Kovak did not have all KSOs in Garganta

[solar patio]

yeah

[rich blaze]

Look at that log

Subject:

Dean,

The KDS shipment will be arriving this week. This delivery is to be dispatched immediately to our private vault. They are NOT to be delivered to the usual Hydrostasis holding vault. A Kovac representative will meet you at the vault entrance and take things over from there.```

[solar patio]

maybe a head or a week spot?

[eternal talon]

we do that in r5

[rich blaze]

I agree

[eternal talon]

so it wouldn't really be relavant to your theory

[rich blaze]

but

It could have used smaller Electricity requests to light up parts of KDS deep

[eternal talon]

it requests from like 5 generators man

i'm sorry, but there is no way

[rich blaze]

Generator can mean different things

[eternal talon]

that's ALOT of power

[rich blaze]

because 5 generators enough to overload Garganta power lines

we're not talking about our good ol Cell Generators here

[eternal talon]

yes, nuclear

[rich blaze]

That's what I think too

[eternal talon]

they last fucking forrrever

when turned on

so again, why no power still on in r5

we have to turn it on

[rich blaze]

Oh also, opinions on the log I found about outside KDS in 2054?

[eternal talon]

link it?

which one

[rich blaze]

https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=0ed84a108dba43c784b28326e6f6a588

It says there's a shipment of HSUs in 2054

so post Explosion

[eternal talon]

could be a small offsite location, they've got to... "harvest" ksos somehow

[rich blaze]

I don't think there were KSO in those particular HSUs

but there's definitely Kovac that's still outside and alive post explosion

[eternal talon]

manufacturing place then? can't really have a factory underground because of the co2

[rich blaze]

I actually don't know if Kovac create its own pods

[eternal talon]

they do

because they supplied nasa

[rich blaze]

it's Nyxos

[eternal talon]

isn't nyxos a subsidiary?

[rich blaze]

I think they're just a contractor, unsure if they're a subsidiary of Kovac

but they worked with them before and that's why they were chosen to replace the old concrete contractors who asked too many questions

[eternal talon]

anyway, tentacle time

[rich blaze]

I just know they also supply Santonian with drills

[eternal talon]

first impression, 3 possible things

[past matrix]

based on the ama, its probably something in the environment tbh

like tentacles wrapped around the complex

[eternal talon]

1: terraria wall of flesh lookin' thing
2: maw of shu'ma
3: tentacle face mcgee

[rich blaze]

Maw of Shu'ma?

[rich blaze]

Ooooh i see

anyway pretty sure I'm not allowed to speculate about it so I'll dip, good luck guys

[eternal talon]

this is speculation centre

go go gadget theorize

[eternal talon]

why not?

[rich blaze]

I'm under NDA cause BH

[eternal talon]

bh?

[past matrix]

bug hunter

[harsh saffron]

Bounty Hunter

[past matrix]

bishop hunter

[rich blaze]

Who do you think got him in Venezuela?

[solar patio]

oh fancy BH Amanes

Have you beaten R7E1 300 times yet?

[dull crest]

👀

[rocky copper]

wait so is the virus that killed almost all of humanity the same one that makes sleepers?

[solar patio]

kinda maybe.

There's a parasite and a virus that both are related to the sleepers somehow but we don't know exactly how yet.

[rocky copper]

are we the last 4 prisoners or are there more

[solar patio]

There are more.

Light spoilers for R5|| The final mission in R5 took you down to kds deep where thousands of kso's were stored in hydrostasis asleep and waiting|| They were subsequently awaked by the warden and are now in use. theoretically.

[rocky copper]

howd the virus get from the asteroid to the outside world

[keen mantle]

I believe there was a log about that. Regarding like 2 or a team fo scientists who broke the containment/decontamination protocol

[rocky copper]

goofy scientists

[keen mantle]

This does tell that this virus could be airborne, through physical touch, or something

[eternal talon]

it seems the mayans also encountered the virus due to earthquakes in the 16th century, so the virus probably lies mostly somewhere in the outer layer of the meteor

[eternal talon]

this is the log in question if you wanted to read it https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=cca20197c3ab4a7291e4100247b7aa78

[rocky copper]

is the infection gained from funny fog the same infection that killed everyone?

[eternal talon]

there is also a log prior to this one where a doctor tried to examine an artifact by putting it in a crusher... the crusher shattered and he lost an eye. not the most professional work. https://www.notion.so/Timeline-0e93a62e8cfd44b3a36beb4ab245a2d0?p=200adb6b049141309b380926fa1491ae

[eternal talon]

um, we don't know, but no, it wouldn't seem so. @analog frigate has theories on what the fog could be, i think he has a document here about it somewhere, the pins maybe.

[analog frigate]

it hasn't been pinned but i can quickly find it

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PUGP9QcbTQBEJnSwfNI_XdY931Zoeq6fMu8bwn4LJas/edit?usp=sharing

[eternal talon]

when do you plan on updating it daraxus?

[analog frigate]

sometime soon

but i start updating it

then find out there are other things i need to do

and then forget

and it just sits as a half written file until some day i write another paragraph or something

[eternal talon]

The NAM-V virus is described as a parasite that can go through Hazmat Class A suits oof

[analog frigate]

yes that's old information

one of the time locked logs in the santonian terminal

[eternal talon]

i don't know when that was

i only came back to gtfo at the midpoint of r6

[analog frigate]

i think either right before r6 or right after it

[eternal talon]

ah

- ooh, you can write in colors now.

that's neat

- THE POWER OF FORMATTING

[solar patio]

don't let it go to your head kid

With great power comes great responsibility.

[rocky wraith]

Cthulhu time

[royal mason]

which i don’t understand, those suits are tough asf. the best class as well. im assuming they chew through it?? yikes

[subtle verge]

Yeah, the parasites have the ability to chew right through SCBA gear. As someone who works in hazmat/natural disasters, that is scary.

[keen mantle]

Oh big time

The hazmats people would probably need an over engineered hazmat suit stronger than A

[somber kite]

This is awesome

Is the reason our player characters don’t have the virus due to the HSU time?

[dim scroll]

HSUs are somehow delaying the propagation of the virus

[agile plinth]

or hypothetically curing it as it was said that: "nothing survives hydrostasis unless we want it to"

but it's still unknown if that's the case

[celest pagoda]

IT CALLED RISE FELLAS

H O L Y S H I T I AM HYPED

[harsh saffron]

thats a dope picture 👍

[eternal talon]

What is?
I'm confused

[harsh saffron]

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