how so?
#gtfo-lore
analog frigate
we know that NAM-V is a deadly virus that killed the entire world while sleepers could by caused by the virus, but we haven't confirmed it yet so we have separated it into a different thing for now
analog frigate
the original sleepers that were in the cave couldnt be humans
which exactly do you mean?
scenic yacht
the very first sleepers that the miners found while drilling, causing the sleepers to overtake the complex
brittle sinew
have we confirmed that NAM-V came from the meteor?
analog frigate
i don't think we know if sleepers came out first or the workers started getting transformed
analog frigate
have we confirmed that NAM-V came from the meteor?
yes
brittle sinew
okay cool
scenic yacht
"tucked away in an underground system that miners drilled into. Upon this gateway being opened, the sleepers began to attack"
so I wonder if these first sleepers didnt have any human traits to them
since they hitched a ride on the meteor
analog frigate
we can't know unless we go 2k
scenic yacht
interesting, so we likely dont know how the original sleepers look like
because everything we see is derived from humans
analog frigate
well the reason to mutate is normal
it is best to mutate from the species that has already lived for millions (or thousand but still) years on that planet, evolved to survive there and might even be the apex predator
from an evolutionary and behavioral standpoint it makes sense
brittle sinew
does nam-v infect animals?
brittle sinew
if nam-v created sleepers, wouldn't most of the rest of the world have sleepers everywhere?
brittle sinew
well, unless they quickly realized that it was turning people into those things so they killed off anyone who contracted it
analog frigate
they didn't
brittle sinew
do we know much about the 25k survivors, like how did they survive and are they immune to the virus?
analog frigate
no one is known to be immune
the 25k is an estimate of how many would be alive in a mean average of scenarios
it's a real world number
brittle sinew
thats fair
analog frigate
taking into account everything about the virus
scenic yacht
the WHO said that "the virus has currently only been detected in the United States, Mexico and the United Kingdoms, there is a 90% probability that the virus is present in all continents."
analog frigate
yes
then they issued a worldwide statement about it with the alarm like thing
not sure how you call it
when like every channel stops and there is an awful sound that plays to attract attention to the tv and then a warning is displayed
scenic yacht
I honestly don't know how to feel about the "25k humans left alive" saying. Yes it is based off real life but at the same time this virus is entirely alien and we don't know how the outside world responded
there isnt any actual numbers given in-game
analog frigate
we do using the corrupted folder logs and the ones generally found
analog frigate
there isnt any actual numbers given in-game
there is one very important number
its r-naught
r-naught is how many people one person infects
covid is around 5.6
nam-v is 17
which means if one person is infected and the virus starts spreading
scenic yacht
yea nam-v is mentioned multiple times as being the worst virus in human history
analog frigate
most efficiently it will spread to all of humanity within 8 steps
1x17, result times 17
after 8 it's like over 40 billion
by the seventh it's ~6.7 billion
by a best case scenario of spread, within 150 days, 98.7% of humanity is infected meaning doomed to die
brittle sinew
well at some point, the population becomes so low that 1 person is no longer infecting 17 because they arent seeing that many people (or something like that)
brittle sinew
dang
scenic yacht
Yea that is true, it helps seeing the logic behind the numbers. 25k just seems like such a random number to me
analog frigate
i took almost every property of covid and other viruses to see a real-world situation
analog frigate
Yea that is true, it helps seeing the logic behind the numbers. 25k just seems l...
50k is 0.02% of the estimated population in 2050
that's the original number
then we decided to halve it due to a revelation about its spread
since the parasite that carries it, carries it
most animals would be carriers
so 25k is an estimate looking at the data
scenic yacht
Interesting. I wonder how the devs will handle, if they ever do, the outside world and its population
analog frigate
they already have
scenic yacht
well I mean a up-to-date view of the outside, not from old logs
analog frigate
they have
scenic yacht
how so
analog frigate
subtle verge
LMAO. Devs are under NDAs, they can't tell us anything that's not available in-game.
They have all of the lore written, per D0c.
analog frigate
yup
subtle verge
They're just feeding us crumbs as time goes on.
scenic yacht
they have
so somewhere in the game there is knowledge about the outside world?
this rundown?
scenic yacht
oh ok well thats what I was saying earlier lol
analog frigate
ah
subtle verge
This rundown, so far, we have the WHO announcement and then the low-frequency radio interception (which I forget exactly what it says).
Or maybe that radio thing was from R5... I forget.
analog frigate
This rundown, so far, we have the WHO announcement and then the low-frequency ra...
it's just an awareness thing and to keep isolated because NAM-V causes death
scenic yacht
ok well I'll keep a tab on the outside world for now
harsh saffron
Or maybe that radio thing was from R5... I forget.
low frequency thingy is r6
analog frigate
i really am just looking forward to the day when we will find out if NAM-V causes sleepers
analog frigate
low frequency thingy is r6
hi duck
harsh saffron
hihi
subtle verge
low frequency thingy is r6
Thank you, Duck! Hangover brain has me like 
analog frigate
i really am just looking forward to the day when we will find out if NAM-V cause...
it will truly be a marvelous day
scenic yacht
Another question about the lore. In the log EBDT-44-WSX (Found in R6D3) Angela Klein says that they are having issues with "operatives" and that she needs the ID of one to "offline them and research"
robots?!
harsh saffron
the player characters and others ^^
harsh saffron
they just treat them like robots
subtle verge
Yep.
subtle verge
I have a theory on Project Legion, but it's pretty tinfoil hat at the moment with only like 2-3 logs talking about it.
But it does make logical sense, to a degree.
scenic yacht
Thats insane, so the legion people (the player characters) are actually trained and act like robots?!
so much so that one "operative" "went to a storage closet, unlocked the door, waited for 6 minutes inside the closet"
there is literally no self thought for the operatives?
subtle verge
So, here's my theory and hopefully it puts things in to perspective:
scenic yacht
hit me with it
subtle verge
Project Legion is/was a way to create the ultimate private military for Kovac by exploiting the HSUs side-effect of long-term memory loss. In doing so, you can train the most elite army as they wouldn't have any memory of their past lives and potentially remove the possibility to question what is right and what is wrong. They would just be the ultimate soldier: accepting orders without a second thought and completing the mission by any means necessary.
scenic yacht
bro thats the most not tinfoil-hat theory i've seen
thats for sure what they were trying to do!
subtle verge
I jokingly say it is because there's very little evidence outside of the KSO in the closet.
scenic yacht
and Kovac is a defense agency already right?
subtle verge
There's just references.
analog frigate
it is
subtle verge
Yes, Kovac is the #1 defense agency in the global market.
analog frigate
it's literally just called Kovac Defense Services
and they are one of the richest companies on earth
in general
not only in the military market
scenic yacht
In the logs in R5 about each of the characters it shows how they were getting mind wiped in order to be sub servant to kovac
subtle verge
I didn't take it as that, I took those logs as... wiping memories that could incriminate Kovac/SMC.
As Kovac was under intense scrutiny and investigation by the UN at the time.
Though, I could see it that way.
scenic yacht
well hackett had no memories that would incriminate Kovac or the SMC
he did it voluntarily
"volunteered to join the "Legion" program, having his memory wiped and hoping for his personal redemption"
^from the wiki
harsh saffron
well yeah but somebody wrote that after the R5 logs, so it's their guess essentially ^^
might be mine, now that I think about it
analog frigate
rav gave a really good explanation on how hackett lived
harsh saffron
as expected from the worlds #1 hackett fan
scenic yacht
even in the actual voice log Hackett says "so before I cark it (UK slang for dying), I'm thinking this might be a bit of redemption y'know"
^from hackett himself
analog frigate
as expected from the worlds #1 hackett fan
"fan"
harsh saffron
even in the actual voice log Hackett says "so before I cark it (UK slang for dyi...
yeah no worries I didn't mean that was made up ^^
scenic yacht
Theres even more proof to the theory of them training soldiers with Bishop, in the R6 logs bishop is literally on Red Alpha and he is still following orders even over the lives of the scientists "He just repeats his objective: Explore and cover as much ground as possible and wait until Control instantiates a Matter Wave for our return"
the scientist even calls them "Robots"
Bishop is basically Kovac's ideal soldier
Bishop must have been a very important/successful operative seeing as how he was sent to Red Alpha's first contact
AND he was the only survivor
harsh saffron
AND he was the only survivor
scenic yacht
hmmmmmm
bishop is particularly interesting because of that
or maybe he's just Doom Guy
brittle sinew
so what are the chances they use piloted clones? or do we just assume the playable characters are always successful on their missions
or clones in general i guess
harsh saffron
if we have anybody like doom guy, it would probably be woods tbh
scenic yacht
so what are the chances they use piloted clones? or do we just assume the playab...
thats true, in lore are the playable characters just total badasses that do every mission the first go around?
harsh saffron
Clones could still be an option and the whole "memory-loss stuff" is just a red herring to distract from the clones
But i still think we are just too cool to die
subtle verge
or clones in general i guess
While unlikely, there is a chance. However, canonically, we're all DOOM guys with plot armor.
brittle sinew
that makes sense
scenic yacht
yea I dont think theyre going the "Clone" route
brittle sinew
when i first started playing, all the brain upload stuff made me think that the real people's brains/brain memory or interface (idk wording) were uploaded into clones. also made sense to me since they all look the same
like if the real people (playable characters) brains were connected to the clones' brains in a way where it was like the real people were controlling a different body (if that makes sense). It would also save from having to retrain any clones as you wouldn't be risking the lives of those who are trained. (this is just an idea i explored in my mind from when i first started playing the game this rundown and didn't know anything else)
scenic yacht
Avatar stuff
brittle sinew
yeah, that
lol
all that brain linkage stuff that comes up on the loading screen is what made my mind go to that
eternal talon
is dems allens? d1 has me confused from previous lore
subtle verge
They're not aliens in the traditional sense.
scenic yacht
all that brain linkage stuff that comes up on the loading screen is what made my...
In response to that, in the lore it talks about how the cryo chamber screws the long term memory of those in it. There was a rocket to Mars using the Cryo Chambers and it failed due to Human Intervention (likely their minds were wiped). Also all the playable characters (besides Hackett) are forced into the chambers in order to have their mind wiped and be soldiers for Kovac
so its very unlikely that clones are involved in this game
eternal talon
from waay early lore around rundown 1-3, i thought it was established they were subteranian parasites that crashed waaay long time ago with the meteor
but clearly with the... uh, reveal.. unless they are multi-dimentional parasites, i'm a bit confused.
scenic yacht
from waay early lore around rundown 1-3, i thought it was established they were ...
"Originally discovered when mining in the location of the Chicxulub crater,tucked away in an underground system that miners drilled into. Upon this gateway being opened, the sleepers began to attack and inhabit the complex."
they rode the meteor from another dimension/planet and just chilled in a cave
brittle sinew
makes sense, i havent delved too much into lore, that was just my initial thoughts. Also, i thought i read somewhere that the warden is linked into our minds? like we actually can see the maps and such because of something uploaded in our mind. though i could be crazy and it could have easily been in a dream lmao
eternal talon
ah. so the same but more.
scenic yacht
makes sense, i havent delved too much into lore, that was just my initial though...
yes there is an interface in the prisoners
eternal talon
so that means the scientists at the complex have teleportation?
and it's not just some alien stuff?
eternal talon
well yeah, but that's powered with the black crystal thingy
so half-science, half space-voodoo?
scenic yacht
yea I guess an alien artifact or piece of the meteor
eternal talon
interesting
subtle verge
so that means the scientists at the complex have teleportation?
So... teleportation in a very realistic sense. We use the crystals that we find on Red Alpha in the MWP. We have no clear answer for exactly how it works yet, however Daraxus and I talked in great length about it and we believe that there's a few things going on.
eternal talon
still kinda sad we haven't seen any of the tram/train network. underground complexes this big can't just be nothing but hallways. there has to be some kind of network of trams to move workers, ala minecarts or more advanced stuff for/to labs
that kinda stuff would be really neat.
subtle verge
Quantum tethering is a very sci-fi term, however the science breaks down like this: two neutrons are connected by a 'link' which allows them both to be in the exact same time and state as the other, no matter the distance. So if one thing happens to Neutron A, it also happens to Neutron B, and vice versa.
eternal talon
sort of changing the locale mid-mission
subtle verge
And the way we think the teleportation works is through the bending of time and space.
eternal talon
wormholes.
subtle verge
So, to prevent time dilation, the tether is made from Garganta to Red Alpha, which allows for direct, real-time, communication and data transfer.
scenic yacht
well yeah, but that's powered with the black crystal thingy
Dr. Hammerstein says "I believe we are looking at evidence of [redacted]. I am confident that the chambers were been constructed by [redacted], though, as yet we do not know how or why they were made" when talking about finding objects, including the data cubes and the thing in the mwp
so aliens
eternal talon
what are the tumors?
eternal talon
that's kind of always confused me from when they were introduced in r2
subtle verge
A full biology report written by someone with a (near) doctor's degree.
scenic yacht
the birthing sacks
subtle verge
And by Daraxus and others.
eternal talon
the birthing sacks on the ceilings are completely different though
don't look anywhere similar
brittle sinew
oh, the pimples with eyes?
scenic yacht
thats just how it be
subtle verge
Evolution and mutation is a wild and wonderous thing.
brittle sinew
wht infection is being given to us that goes with the infection rate? do we know?
eternal talon
the same stuff that changed the first people to encounter the parasite i'd assume
scenic yacht
going back to Hammerstein finding actual chambers in locations known as "The Inner" wouldnt that mean that the meteor is some sort of vessel rather than a random rock that carried the virus?
scenic yacht
lead researcher and co-founder of Project Insight
eternal talon
what's that.
analog frigate
@subtle verge i think we should add legion and insight to the faq
subtle verge
<@!156901751838998528> i think we should add legion and insight to the faq
Good idea.
eternal talon
faq?
analog frigate
subtle verge
Uhhh one moment, I have my toxic fog theory:
analog frigate
finite vine
going back to Hammerstein finding actual chambers in locations known as "The Inn...
yea there are multiple lava tube like structures in the “egg”
subtle verge
Ope, beat me to it, Daraxus.
finite vine
and i think “the inner” is within the “egg”
subtle verge
wht infection is being given to us that goes with the infection rate? do we know...
Check the doc post just above for our theories on toxic fog. 🙂
scenic yacht
so the meteor is housing an egg with chambers that hold alien artifacts of sorts
eternal talon
so.. the flying things.. were infected..
subtle verge
the pimple things also cause infection right?
Yep!
finite vine
so the meteor is housing an egg with chambers that hold alien artifacts of sorts
yea it seems so
subtle verge
so.. the flying things.. were infected..
Maybe. We don't really know quite yet.
eternal talon
was the meteor a "thing" style scenario, where they tried to escape but were infected on the way out?
finite vine
the “egg” starts at around 2km in depth
scenic yacht
so is the meteor a space ship of some sort then? Maybe the original alien species was trying to flee the infection
eternal talon
^
finite vine
and is 1.5 km deep and 1km wide, like an egg if i remember correctly
eternal talon
john carpenter 1982 the thing
analog frigate
so is the meteor a space ship of some sort then? Maybe the original alien specie...
not likely
analog frigate
it's a chunk of rock that managed to teleport in the inner solar system
eternal talon
not neccessarily a spaceship so to say, but that same kind of idea
finite vine
it's a chunk of rock that managed to teleport in the inner solar system
wdym teleport
there is not really any evidence of that
scenic yacht
it's a chunk of rock that managed to teleport in the inner solar system
how so? Dr. Hammerstein finds chambers in it not natural in formation
eternal talon
it doesn't make sense to view it as a spaceship only when we have no info about these initial allens
they could have just sent a chunk of their planet for all we know
finite vine
true but dr stokes implies an alien race and a spaceship within one of her audio logs
analog frigate
there is not really any evidence of that
not many objects are able to reach the inner solar system
eternal talon
yeah, but i mean not a ship made of steel or metal, but of earth and stone
analog frigate
they either get drawn in by the sun or the gas giants
eternal talon
like the difference between a bow and a slingshot
both do the same thing, vastly different projectiles
analog frigate
it somehow has to have appeared in the inner solar system
finite vine
we have had interstellar objects pass through our solar system
finite vine
it somehow has to have appeared in the inner solar system
no, not necessarily
scenic yacht
is it not entirely possible that the alien race teleported the "meteor"?
eternal talon
that's what i mean
analog frigate
well then how could an object make it's way and hit earth at that angle while everything else in the solar system existed
finite vine
is it not entirely possible that the alien race teleported the "meteor"?
well i mean it is possible, but not a fact
eternal talon
they could have teleported the rock, part of their planet, hoping they could get away with a bit of home
finite vine
the meteor could of just floated into our solar system like any other meteor
eternal talon
or without building a dedicated ship
analog frigate
the meteor could of just floated into our solar system like any other meteor
as i said, the sun and gas giants will pull it further away
the earth's gravitational pull isn't strong enough to enforce anything
subtle verge
Ahh, the liveliest this channel has been in weeks and I'm living for it. 
eternal talon
if they just send any bits of their homeworld, no point and building a ship when it'd just be faster to do the other, especially when potentially fighting an infection where time is very limited
finite vine
as i said, the sun and gas giants will pull it further away
actually, jupiter is the major reason why large meteors don’t hit earth.
scenic yacht
for all we know an alien race with teleportation capabilities wouldn't need a spaceship we are used to. With teleportation they can transport entire areas with ease
analog frigate
actually, jupiter is the major reason why large meteors don’t hit earth.
not exactly
finite vine
not exactly
it “catches” a large amount of asteroids.
analog frigate
jupiter is the main reason why large asteroids we detect don't hit earth
eternal talon
this entirely depends on where it was teleported and with what velocity
analog frigate
yes
eternal talon
who knows they didn't see earth as a viable new homeworld, and just opened a portal and yeeted it through?
analog frigate
the sun takes thousands of hit every day
everything you guys are assuming (not saying is wrong) bases off the fact that they are intelligent
finite vine
everything you guys are assuming (not saying is wrong) bases off the fact that t...
true
scenic yacht
maybe not even the floaty boys
eternal talon
if they are/were intelligent before being infected
scenic yacht
the floaty boys could be the virus too
eternal talon
the infected humans we don't consider inteligent
analog frigate
for anything of such capacity to be done
eternal talon
they probably are the virus NOW
but maybe not when they sent the rock
not entirely anyway
scenic yacht
They would have to be intelligent "I believe we are looking at evidence of [redacted]. I am confident that the chambers were been constructed by [redacted]"
to construct something described as a "chamber"
analog frigate
what log is this
finite vine
maybe the meteor is a giant spaceship
eternal talon
it's quite possible they could have been fighting the infection on red alpha, was badly losing to it, and sent the rock as a last ditch effort to escape, but part of the rock was infected by the time it was sent
finite vine
this is where im getting that the meteor isnt a rock
yep
eternal talon
not entirely a rock. not what i mean
i mean a chunk of their world, with maybe buildings, bunkers, or god knows what in it
im not saying it's just pure dirt
finite vine
also possible
eternal talon
i'm saying they literally just took a chunk of their world, and moved it somewhere else
wouldn't make sense to teleport an uninhabited part of their world if they were trying to escape.
scenic yacht
an alien race losing against an infection so badly that in a last ditch effort they moved an entire piece of rock (maybe planet/moon) and just sent it into our solar system/planet with valuable artifacts
eternal talon
the meteor was nowhere near as big as a moon
scenic yacht
just a part of it that housed important teleportation tech
subtle verge
This is all good and well, but we've had a lead developer in the early days openly state that they aren't aliens.
scenic yacht
their minds can change?
eternal talon
well now we have a new bloody dimention and planet.
so the book's kinda been thrown out
besides, the parasites, no
subtle verge
Whether he means that in a traditional sense or not, Idk. But keep that in mind with what you will.
eternal talon
that rock sat on earth for a VERY long time
scenic yacht
im sure theyve rehashed ideas since then
subtle verge
Probably just as alien as you and I are, is my guess.
eternal talon
an invasive species can become a native one given a few hundred years, that thing's been buried for waaaaay longer than that
it's technicality
scenic yacht
there is like no way they havent changed their minds about "no aliens" I mean look at Red Alpha
eternal talon
^
scenic yacht
who knows for sure though
eternal talon
given that it's two-way, i think time travel is ruled out
time travel back in time is impossible
eternal talon
we went to AND BACK from red alpha
couldn't have gone back, regardless if it was future if it was time travel.
going back in time is impossible.
scenic yacht
well maybe this time travel tech is based on sci-fi
eternal talon
this isn't that far out
if it's using sciency stuff like wormholes for teleportation,
time travel is way more out there than that
scenic yacht
Time travel COULD explain how we get information from the Warden on Red Alpha, the warden is still functioning that far out in time on Earth!
eternal talon
besides, if it was time travel, and it's future earth, why are the allens there? are you telling me floaty bois canibalized for god knows how long just to be there when we went through?
they aren't exactly sleeping in hybernation when we get there
scenic yacht
Like the devs have apparently said, whos to say they are aliens in the first place
eternal talon
i could get, the parasite not being,
from way original lore,
but what kind of animals on earth fly and have 40 tentacles? it's allens.
subtle verge
I mean, evolution can take place, especially over an insane amount of time.
scenic yacht
All im saying is I'm sticking with my Time Travel Theory
subtle verge
No eyes, pale white skin, etc.
scenic yacht
TTT as I'll call it
eternal talon
given it's not a balloon, how would it float?
it bleeds when you shoot it
so it's solid
scenic yacht
gas
scenic yacht
the scientists even stated that the atmosphere is tolerable but longer than 6 hours you'd be burnt!!
eternal talon
it would have to be like 85% gas at the very least
scenic yacht
the TTT is all coming together
eternal talon
and in the future, gravity would be higher
so it would need to be MORE
there is no way
it's a solid thing when you shoot it
heck, it shoots at you
where are those spikes coming from, it clearly has internals
scenic yacht
you keep trying to deny the TTT, let it in
eternal talon
it just can't be.
i'm denying because it's physically impossible
square cube law says that's bs.
physics.
analog frigate
not really
scenic yacht
some thoughts are so hostile to the brain that the brain entirely blocks it out, and the brain tries to reason
analog frigate
i'll leave you two to ponder
scenic yacht
TTT!
analog frigate
it'll be interesting to see what you have figured out tomorrow
scenic yacht
yea basically lol
eternal talon
it would have to either be way bigger than it is to house more gas,
or it would have to not be as solid as it is.
pick one. still impossible.
because it's neither.
eternal talon
square cube law
analog frigate
maybe
scenic yacht
gas and TTT
eternal talon
unless basic fundamentals like gravity are completely different
it won't work on earth
and i mean by less, not more
the earth is getting closer to the sun as it dies, not farther away.
flying animals are hard enough as it is
this thing doesn't use conventional methods
scenic yacht
According to "The Nature of Sleepers" Flyers "are some of the original seeming creatures of V.Multitudinem. As the name suggests, they possibly fly using superlight gas that balances their weight, as to fly using their tentacles" https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HR8ij7DxmU8F-2H4QYqaEnoBQJ1qABHF4l5ml7JTuPI/edit
gas and TTT, baby
eternal talon
superlight gas. tell me, what is more likely?
that that undiscovered gas is on a different planet millions of lightyears away, or on earth?
analog frigate
well cretasium is a new thing we somehow discovered right on earth
scenic yacht
well the meteor did bring an undiscovered metal to earth sooooo
eternal talon
and again, gravity at a certain point it wouldn't matter.
yes.
and where do you pose the meteor is from if it's time travel?
is it from earth?
pro-tip, google steel.
analog frigate
why did you get time travel involved
eternal talon
metals are easier to make than gasses.
scenic yacht
possibly, I dont have all the answers my son. I only try to show the way to the TTT
eternal talon
fair enough, but they did come through
when we got the wave matter
and guess what?
THEY COULD STILL FLY
analog frigate
they teleported in because we left the quantum tether open
so?
gravity is the same on both planets
maybe air pressure could vary
eternal talon
if it was the future, gravity on earth would be different
you are saying my point exactly rn daraxus
scenic yacht
whos to say its not
eternal talon
so they would be evolved differently
scenic yacht
whos to say they didn't
eternal talon
the fact that they can fly in both?
eternal talon
THATS WHAT IM SAYIN
scenic yacht
TTT!
eternal talon
there are way too many reasons it literally can not be
analog frigate
wait wait
eternal talon
both from physics standpoints and logical sense
analog frigate
explain the argument you are having currently
eternal talon
i'm saying red alpha literally can not be the future.
he is saying it is.
he is saying it's future earth.
analog frigate
yes, it's most probably that it's not future earth
scenic yacht
the only thing I havent figured out is the flying meatballs, once I get that ironed out the Time Travel Theory is bulletproof
TTT will prevail
eternal talon
square cube law
gravity
air pressure
time travel being impossible to the past
density
analog frigate
how did this become an argument
eternal talon
all problems that are either impossible or very very hard for you to solve
i don't know.
it just did.
analog frigate
time travel is the most improbable of the theories about red alpha
scenic yacht
all problems that are either impossible or very very hard for you to solve
thats what youll say now
you just wait
eternal talon
well you have a list.
scenic yacht
im about to TTT right now and show yall gtfo will have TTT in the future
eternal talon
you go for it champ.
scenic yacht
TTT!
quick grove
i'm saying red alpha literally can not be the future.
There is no time travel in the game lol its just teleportation
Nothing backs up the fact of time travel lol
quick grove
square cube law
And what fuck does a square cube law gotta do with anything
Red alpha is a different planet
eternal talon
@quick grove i think you are very confused
eternal talon
your backwards.
analog frigate
don't bother
eternal talon
i'm arguing against it being time travel, but y'know, whatevs.
scenic yacht
Why are you saying red alpha is future earth
I was the one that brought up TTT
eternal talon
not like i spent 45 minutes explaining the many ways it's impossible
scenic yacht
time travel theory
scenic yacht
theres no need for documentation my son, you only need faith in TTT
quick grove
You are false my friend
quick grove
theres no need for documentation my son, you only need faith in TTT
No no i don't think i do
scenic yacht
you non believer!
scenic yacht
you know what it may be a bit of memeing but at this point theres not enough info so why not have fun with it
jeez man chill
royal finch
Respect for transformers on your pfp tho.
scenic yacht
thx
quick grove
There is enough info stating that its teleportation
scenic yacht
but tell me this, how does the Warden communicate with us on Red Alpha? Even in the logs no science team could get communication thru or back from Red Alpha. If it was the future the Warden could still be on Earth communicating
quick grove
Nothing makes sense in that sentence
scenic yacht
how so
subtle verge
I think it's important to remember a few things: lore nuts like us have to keep an open mind to the possibility of anything. While there are some things that are very unlikely in some certain scenarios than others, anything and everything can happen within reason. Until we have 100% confirmed in-game documentation.
scenic yacht
exactly
subtle verge
but tell me this, how does the Warden communicate with us on Red Alpha? Even in ...
Dr Durant says it in the voice log, actually. He goes to say that the quantum tether has been cut, and that there is no direct communication to and from because of it.
He then proceeds to list a few reasons why it might have happened.
scenic yacht
quantum is a word used to describe anything these days
quick grove
And when we as players are on red alpha our quantum tether is still there
scenic yacht
that is true, a time tether perhaps
subtle verge
I have a whole theory on why that even happened to begin with.
quick grove
So this is why the warden can still communicate with us
quick grove
that is true, a time tether perhaps
Time tether seriously
That doesn't even make sense
scenic yacht
well in the log with the first visit to Red Alpha Bishop was still following orders from the Warden
subtle verge
Oi, enough. If we're gonna' get salty over a meme or someone else's theory, we might as well leave to cool off for the night/day.
Don't want none of that here, please and thank you.
royal finch
scenic yacht
doesnt make sense?! theres a bunch of stuff that doesnt make sense in this video game
hel revolver only has 6 bullets
but shoots 8?!
explain athiests
quick grove
The quantum tether is a rope a wire that keeps coms open for the warden
You do realise we're in the 2065-2070
scenic yacht
where are you getting that the quantum tether is a wire?
brittle sinew
to be fair, we do have alien tech
quick grove
Tether
quick grove
to be fair, we do have alien tech
Yes
subtle verge
A quantum tether isn't a legitimate wire, it's an explanation for how it works.
subtle verge
It's just a way to say if your ear lobes had a quantum tether, I could put a dot with a marker on your right ear, and one would appear on your left in the exact spot that tether ends, even if the marker never touched it.
scenic yacht
^
quick grove
No time travel
subtle verge
And that would be true if your ears were touching, or millions of lightyears apart.
quick grove
Yes i can because if time travel is a thing why wouldn't people just go back in time to stop NAM V
agile plinth
what's happening again
scenic yacht
what's happening again
lol people cant accept my TTT
quick grove
Because nothing backs it up
agile plinth
lol people cant accept my TTT
that's quite obvious
you are presenting it like religion
believe in it and it will be true
bring factual evidence and people will consider it
scenic yacht
I mean everything thats presented to me hasnt disproven it though
no one can disprove it
and ive said
agile plinth
no one can disprove god or something abstract as well so
agile plinth
and?
scenic yacht
warden would be on the future earth still
quick grove
Warden can communicate
Because of the quantum tether
placid beacon
i gotta agree with draxus and merv here
agile plinth
by gustavo iirc
subtle verge
Again, we can have headcanons, but we can not simply believe one thing and reject all others, and vice versa. That goes against the fundamentals of discovering and gathering ideas for theories and lore.
placid beacon
scenic yacht
the first time it was sabotaged
where does it say that?
agile plinth
durant mentioning why there us no signal
brittle sinew
tbh what say that the tether couldnt be used for time travel though? ( not that i accept it but just actually pondering it as a "what-if)
subtle verge
agile plinth
either a catastrophic failure, garganta is gone or something he completely declines, sabotage
subtle verge
There's my theory on Jansen & Gustavo's feud, which ties in Dr Durant's logs.
agile plinth
gustavo has always had bad relations with SMC and KDS after the whole argument
agile plinth
There's my theory on Jansen & Gustavo's feud, which ties in Dr Durant's logs.
yes ty punk
seeing as he knew he was going to be killed or dead in some way soon
quick grove
Love to see number2
agile plinth
why not fuck their shit up?
quick grove
He lost the tether to garganta hence no coms
But when we as the 4 prisoners go there is no one to fuck up the quantum tether hence coms with warden
twilit girder
Fucking alice not wearing her mask again
subtle verge
As always: if there is anything I'm missing that can relate to that, or if anyone else has any ideas behind it, I'm all ears.
agile plinth
and stokes tried contacting them by utilizing the full system
which got nothing
even though it has apparently gotten something before
so either they somehow had to immediately leave due to sleepers without giving them warning
or someone who knew the facility messed with something
scenic yacht
so the theory is that gustavo didnt want anyone finding out about the bodies so he killed random scientists that knew nothing about the bodies?
agile plinth
this isn't related to the bodies
that was different business
gustavo had sour relations with jansen for other reasons
scenic yacht
that isnt stated?
subtle verge
so the theory is that gustavo didnt want anyone finding out about the bodies so ...
No, the theory is that Gustavo had ties to the United Nations, and had insider information about Kovac and SMC that could have dire repercussions to Jansen and Anders.
agile plinth
and then there is an email asking if jansen wants gustavo disposed of
scenic yacht
so why sabotage a science journey?
subtle verge
So, in an attempt to prevent that from happening, the tether was cut, dooming the scientists and KSOs to their demise.
quick grove
Hence someone cutting the tether connection leaving him with no coms and no way home
quick grove
so why sabotage a science journey?
To kill gastsvo
subtle verge
so why sabotage a science journey?
Because Gustavo was a part of that team.
It makes it seem like a really catastrophic accident, versus calculated murder.
quick grove
See SMC and BIOCOM and Kovac doesn't care about who dies lol
agile plinth
they care about their reputation and revenue
subtle verge
^^^
quick grove
Yep
scenic yacht
So bishop returning alone was NOT a coincidence, likely bishop received orders to KILL GUSTAVO. Either outright OR by continuing his "mission" of exploring Red Alpha
quick grove
Hence time travel is not a thing
agile plinth
and why he just magically appeared back even though everything broke
scenic yacht
that would mean that him returning was planned by Kovac because he would have no known way of returning
subtle verge
Something definitely ties in there, because he didn't answer any of the interrogation questions, and was taken to the Kovac-locked part of Garganta.
subtle verge
To, what I assume, would be to have his memories wiped of the event.
scenic yacht
damn so is bishop that much of a badass that Kovac doesnt want him dead even after all that
quick grove
Yes
agile plinth
huh
scenic yacht
though i mean bishop did live the civil war that was supposed to kill him
quick grove
Wait what
agile plinth
this answers a lot of questions we had before
agile plinth
have we?
subtle verge
Yessir.
scenic yacht
Bishop is kinda badass
agile plinth
my memory is terrible as you know so we probably did
quick grove
We've made these connections before, though.
So time travel doesn't exist?
subtle verge
So time travel doesn't exist?
I think it is highly unlikely, though I am open to the idea of it.
quick grove
scenic yacht
well it hasnt been disproven
agile plinth
it does technically in D4
quick grove
agile plinth
but then doc told us to ignore D4
quick grove
it does technically in D4
D4
brittle sinew
from what i can tell it hasnt been ruled out but doesnt seem likely
quick grove
What you mean
subtle verge
Again: we only have what we're given at the moment, everything is more or less speculation and theory.
Edit: Unless it has been proven with evidence.
scenic yacht
^
agile plinth
What you mean
doc said in the chat to not dive into D4 because it's not tied to lore and is something like a concept
don't remember the exact message
brittle sinew
i think its cool to see the different theories nd flush out the ideas as though that is the truth
quick grove
Yeah but teleportation is more likely than time travel
subtle verge
D4's jumping around portion isn't lore related, however any logs found are.
agile plinth
likely doesn't make one impossible
quick grove
doc said in the chat to not dive into D4 because it's not tied to lore and is so...
Oh
agile plinth
Yeah but teleportation is more likely than time travel
i was replying to this
quick grove
Oh
agile plinth
anyway
scenic yacht
wait i responded wrong
quick grove
Lol go to bed
brittle sinew
lol goodsleep
subtle verge
time to get some sleep
Night, bud! Have a good day at school.
scenic yacht
Yeah but teleportation is more likely than time travel
how so? the devs can make anything possible
there we go
quick grove
brittle sinew
true but teleportation tech would be easier than time travel so that alone makes it more likely
quick grove
I feel like the names matter wave projector and quantum tether doesn't mean shit to you?
scenic yacht
you keep bringing up tether but many people have explained this to you
brittle sinew
i mean why couldnt those terms be used for time travel?
scenic yacht
tether doesnt mean a physical one
brittle sinew
legitimate question, why couldnt it be a matter wave projector and a tether through time?
scenic yacht
that what im saying
quick grove
Us as the 4 prisoners Still have our quantum tether hence the warden can communicate
subtle verge
how so? the devs can make anything possible
I will say this: there have been no mentions of any kind of time warping capabilities outside of what is known in current day physics of time dilation through long distances in space, however there has been talk of quantum entanglement, quantum tethering, etc. I feel like time travel is incredibly, highly, unlikely in this scenario -- I feel like it would be lazy writing, in other words, with current evidence and seeded information.
scenic yacht
quantum tether thru time
quick grove
subtle verge
However, like I said, I'm open to it if it gets fleshed out and ties in with what is currently given.
scenic yacht
honestly it wouldnt be lazy writing. The earth some how, very harshly, turned into the desolate planet we know as Red Alpha now
quick grove
Time travel isn't possible due to literal evidence
scenic yacht
and somehow the warden is still functioning
scenic yacht
Time travel isn't possible due to literal evidence
whats the evidence
dont say tether
subtle verge
honestly it wouldnt be lazy writing. The earth some how, very harshly, turned in...
I would call this bluff, honestly. It's absolutely lazy writing if they go through all of these steps of quantum mechanics/physics and then just say "guess what, time travel!" without any form of fleshing out the possibility.
scenic yacht
how could it not be fleshed out though? Even the quantum mechanics-physics of this game currently isnt fleshed out?
would a simple "hey guys its another dimension" be better?
subtle verge
We've had that discussion before, too.
subtle verge
Some of us think it is interdimensional travel, others think it's just shortening travel from one star system to another.
quick grove
Why cant gastavo not communicate without his quantum tether but when us as the 4 prisoners are on alpha red we get brought back and during the time were there on alpha that tether stays open hence explaining why the warden can communicate
You see it in docs and gameplay
Its simple
scenic yacht
the warden could be easily sabotaging gustavos connection, but the warden needs us to communicate so it allows it
subtle verge
how could it not be fleshed out though? Even the quantum mechanics-physics of th...
While it's not explicitly stated in-game, we do have real-world evidence of the science and theory behind what's given (quantum tethering is a very sci-fi wording, though) whereas time travel is just another sci-fi trope that's only begun through it's infancy stages of real-world theory and rhetoric.
quick grove
the warden could be easily sabotaging gustavos connection, but the warden needs ...
I don't think the warden was present when gastavo lost coms
brittle sinew
im still uncertain what that has to do with ruling out time travel? its called a tether, so it would tether the 2 things between both sides so it wouldnt exactly matter if that was time travel or just space travel
scenic yacht
theres about as much real world science of going to new dimensions as there is time travel id bet
quick grove
brittle sinew
or interdimensional travel
subtle verge
im still uncertain what that has to do with ruling out time travel? its called a...
In current definition, a quantum tether is the connection of two neutrons. What happens to Neutron A will also happen to Neutron B at the exact same moment in the exact same spot. The tether keeps both Neutrons at the exact same time as the origin point, no matter the distance, which prevents any time dilation from occurring to both entities.
brittle sinew
ah gotcha, but it could still be a different dimension?
scenic yacht
this could also apply to time travel tho?^^
subtle verge
this could also apply to time travel tho?^^
Not quantum tethering, as it prevents any time dilation from occuring.
brittle sinew
^
subtle verge
ah gotcha, but it could still be a different dimension?
It is a possibility. We don't really know where to really even start with alternate dimensions other than what very little real-world science understands about it.
scenic yacht
where are you getting the definition from quantum tether tho?! I mean the literal use of QUANTUM is literally just a cheat code to not have to explain
subtle verge
where are you getting the definition from quantum tether tho?! I mean the litera...
It's a part of quantum entanglement theory. It's something that myself, Daraxus, and others have done a lot of reading on.
I couldn't tell you every little intricate detail, I'm just a professional hazmat guy IRL.
Lmao.
brittle sinew
thats fair. i was thinking if they like, redefined quantum tether, like if you could safely time travel becuse you exist as both A and B but through time. like theres something binding you to the present which is what allows you to come back from the future. but if they're trying to base this off of more realistic physics then it makes sense why they wouldnt redefine that for their own purpose. it would be better to come up with a new term
scenic yacht
quantum tether could literally mean anything anyone wants it to mean
subtle verge
quantum tether could literally mean anything anyone wants it to mean
Not true.
There is actual scientific definition behind it.
brittle sinew
but if there is a real scientific definition for it, then that is flse
scenic yacht
there is no scientific definition for "Quantum Tether"
subtle verge
Tethering/entanglement essentially means: that if you know the state of one particle, you know the state of the other while they are entangled.
Don't get caught up on the word, focus on the context of how it's being used.
Tethering is entanglement is tethering.
One and the same.
scenic yacht
exactly, so a quantum tether ,in the context of the game, could literally mean anything
dimension stuff, far planet stuff, time travel
i mean there is a MASSIVE jump between going to a far away planet and another dimension
brittle sinew
but if it actually defined scientifically, and tht stated things cant be tethered through time, it would mke sense to me that the devs would use tht same definition
scenic yacht
link me the scientific definition of "quantum tether"
subtle verge
exactly, so a quantum tether ,in the context of the game, could literally mean a...
Except the game has it's own clearly defined use of quantum tether: connection between Point A (Garganta) and point B ("Red Alpha").
scenic yacht
point A could be past, B could be future
quick grove
i mean there is a MASSIVE jump between going to a far away planet and another di...
Teleportation
scenic yacht
Teleportation
what im saying is yall are telling me that quantum tethering can include BOTH of these VASTLY different scenarios but NOT time travel?
brittle sinew
because in the definition of quantum tethering it specifically rules out time travel
(based off above stated definition)
scenic yacht
you can quantum tether to another planet OR an ENTIRELY different DIMENSION?! but NOT back in time
scenic yacht
makes no sense to me
quick grove
makes no sense to me
Because you don't understand it
scenic yacht
lol even in the article this stuff is still in experimentation
brittle sinew
dimensions could still be on the same time
quick grove
what im saying is yall are telling me that quantum tethering can include BOTH of...
Yes everything that we have stated above rules out time travel
brittle sinew
i mean, all quantum entanglement is going to be experiments
quick grove
because in the definition of quantum tethering it specifically rules out time tr...
Oh nvm cable already said it
scenic yacht
Yes everything that we have stated above rules out time travel
bro where, like actually you just keep posting the same face in chat
scenic yacht
because in the definition of quantum tethering it specifically rules out time tr...
theres no concrete definition tho?
brittle sinew
i mean, have you yourself looked into any articles?
quick grove
Dude everything has been ruled out
scenic yacht
i mean literally the article is talking about experiments
brittle sinew
wtf do you think articles are going to be? experiments are going to define the term before they use it
quick grove
The machine we use in the complex is experimental as everything in the complex is
brittle sinew
and rticles talking about them will use those definitions
quantum theory is just that, theory, but definitions still need to be created so those within tht field cn be on the same page
its how defining anything within any field works
im looking on google scholar as we speak but sadly many things require subscription
scenic yacht
so the article says that the transfer between both particles is "speed of at least 10,000 times the speed of light, possibly even instantaneously, regardless of distance" I mean this is still in its infancy of knowledge in the field
something can go 10,000 times the speed of light which should be impossible but we cant time travel in a video game?
brittle sinew
nd yet, terms still need to be defined
scenic yacht
interesting, like ive been saying this whole time
no actual definition for quantum tether
brittle sinew
yet we are saying that they are defined
scenic yacht
im not
quick grove
The name states it all "MATTER WAVE PROJECTOR"
brittle sinew
so youve read every article and can 100% say it isnt defined?
scenic yacht
the fact that none of us can give a definition tells me it isnt defined
brittle sinew
um none?
subtle verge
Simply because there is a lack of understanding a definition of something doesn't mean there is no definition. The article that I linked is a very layman's terminology, with a basis for it's claim and definition.
scenic yacht
The name states it all "MATTER WAVE PROJECTOR"
matter wave projector, project matter across time
brittle sinew
you were given one and because it doesnt suite your theory you're just throwing it out
quick grove
No
scenic yacht
you were given one and because it doesnt suite your theory you're just throwing ...
whats the definition
quick grove
matter wave projector, project matter across time
That's not how it works
It literally teleported us to red alpha
subtle verge
"In quantum physics, entangled particles remain connected so that actions performed on one affect the other, even when separated by great distances."
There is the definition.
brittle sinew
"wheres the proof" links article "uh, this is new, cant be real"
subtle verge
You're getting caught up on the word 'tether' instead of the concept.
scenic yacht
so where does it rule out particles cant communicate thru time?
brittle sinew
i mean, do you have articles stating it means something else?
quick grove
Because the particles don't communicate through time
scenic yacht
i mean, do you have articles stating it means something else?
do you have articles saying quantum tether cant be thru time?
quick grove
so where does it rule out particles cant communicate thru time?
It's instantaneous
brittle sinew
Quantum teleportation — the transmission and reconstruction over arbitrary distances of the state of a quantum system (google scholar article) for 1 example
brittle sinew
i mean, im at least looking into other articles meanwhile youre not coming up with anything to disprove
quick grove
Another term you don't understand
scenic yacht
time is an arbitrary distance
brittle sinew
time isnt distance?
scenic yacht
days? weeks? months? Years?
how long is something away is a distance
an arbitrary distance
brittle sinew
space vs time, 2 very different things
scenic yacht
arbitrary: based on random choice or personal whim, rather than any reason or system.
Quantum teleportation — the transmission and reconstruction over arbitrary distances of the state of a quantum system (google scholar article) for 1 example
interesting, arbitrary distance
like time
quick grove
It could be instant
brittle sinew
where does distnce = time?
scenic yacht
days? weeks? months? Years?
how long is something away is a distance
an arbitrary distance
quick grove
Anything can be far away but teleportation takes us there instantaneously
scenic yacht
teleporting thru time, as ive been saying
brittle sinew
days? isnt a distance, i can sit in the same spot for an hour and my distance hasnt changes
quick grove
teleporting thru time, as ive been saying
Teleportation through distance
scenic yacht
days? isnt a distance, i can sit in the same spot for an hour and my distance ha...
a day away is a distance away from now
quick grove
Not time but distance
brittle sinew
it isnt, distance is physical time is not
scenic yacht
ever heard of "in the distant future"?
quick grove
scenic yacht
lol there it is
quick grove
This dude been smoking some shit
brittle sinew
ever heard of an idiom?
scenic yacht
literally there is no proof that there isnt time travel involved in this game
quick grove
Distant future hahaha thats the most funniest thing i've ever heard hahaha
scenic yacht
maybe when we get the next rundown/extension
quick grove
Its like i can say my game is going to be the best in the distance future
subtle verge
There is a metric for time travel, however it is hypothetical as of current scientific standard. "Tachyon particle" is a hypothetical particle that always travels faster than light, and simply cannot exist with the known laws of physics.
However, hypothetically, if one were able to see it, you would see it appearing and departing in two opposite directions. According to the theory of relativity, this violates causality, leading to logical paradoxes. (Think Grandfather Clock paradox).
quick grove
Lmao
subtle verge
The Tachyon Particle could be a case for time travel if it exists.
quick grove
ever heard of "in the distant future"?
Nothing makes sense what you just said here
subtle verge
However, for it to be slowed down to the point it becomes the speed of light, it would require infinite energy.
scenic yacht
the reason there isnt enough reason to disprove time travel is because there just isnt enough know about Alpha Red. Ya'll need to take a step back and enjoy some of the different kinda theories for now. Im sure the next rundown will prove me wrong but as of right now its what im believing in because right now the only thing we have is a belief that Alpha Red is another planet or another dimension or even time travel
quick grove
This rundown has already proved you wrong
And so has we
There is no time travel involved
scenic yacht
if you want to believe in that
quick grove
It literal teleportation
brittle sinew
i was enjoying your theory, but the explanation you had wsa kinda explained away, yet you doubled down and didnt accept that
quick grove
But i do have the answer
subtle verge
I'm simply offering what we have been given to work with in-game. As I said before, there is no evidence or mention of any kind of time travel possibility, however I am open to it if it's fleshed out like the rest of what we have is.
brittle sinew
^
and i was finding more about a definition for quantum tether/teleportation/entanglement
scenic yacht
yet there isnt any evidence or mention of another planet or dimension and yet yall believe that easier than time travel
quick grove
Im pretty sure there is
scenic yacht
merv if there was then you couldve found it and disproven me by now
subtle verge
And that's where I end my stance for the evening. Too much drinking last night has me exhausted. I'll catch you all later.
💤
brittle sinew
well yeah, given what we have in the game and the term quantum tether having a definition that accounts for space and not time, makes it seem like the quantum tether is not associated with time
scenic yacht
see ya man
brittle sinew
i havent found nything that rules out time but everything i see talks strictly about space
scenic yacht
there is no where that says quantum tether doesnt include time
brittle sinew
but nowhere does it include time either
quick grove
Teleportation is instant
scenic yacht
yes it says about 10,000 times the speed of light but thats only our experiments, what if we havent yet experimented with time
quick grove
Teleportation is instant tho if you'd like it or not its the truth
quick grove
Why is there needed to experiment with time if they have teleportation to red alpha
quick grove
so you can teleport instantly thru time then
Teleportation is instant
scenic yacht
whos to say they didnt teleport thru time to Red Alpha
scenic yacht
why do you think time travel isnt instant?
you instantly go thru time
literally time travel
quick grove
No
scenic yacht
i dont see the point you keep trying to make with "teleport is instant"
quick grove
If we time travelled red alpha's base wouldn't be operational
It would've been broken down
Nothing in the game suggests time travel
scenic yacht
Red Alpha's base was time traveled too. In the logs it says that the whole base disappeared due to an experiment
brittle sinew
im not saying i rule out time travel, but from everything i am reading, im being lead to believe that the quantum tethering itself is most likely distance and not time( provided they are using the definitions given by peer-reviewed research)
brittle sinew
i mean, its based off science, so that makes more sense then just coming up with your own definition
scenic yacht
If we time travelled red alpha's base wouldn't be operational
From EQQ-RZE-6M (Found in R6B1) " As I understand it, the lab disintegrated. Or something. Apparently, it's "gone"."
meaning the lab couldve been time traveled, thats why its not degraded too badly
scenic yacht
i mean, its based off science, so that makes more sense then just coming up with...
literally quantum tether is based off of science we know as much of as we do time travel
brittle sinew
from what it looks like, the two particles wouldnt be able to exist as the same through time (based off this definition) because they need to exist as the exact same state and particle, but going through time would change that because it wouldnt stay the same across time
quick grove
You could also teleport a lab
brittle sinew
i mean, have you read any of these articles?
i think we know more about quantum tethering than we do time travel
scenic yacht
You could also teleport a lab
yes you could, but you brought up the lab as a way to discredit time travel saying it would be degraded by then
scenic yacht
i mean, have you read any of these articles?
have you? what "articles" look up quantum tether and see if anything comes up
brittle sinew
what do you think ive been doing for the last 30 minuts? have you been looking into it yourself? where do you think i got my definition from?
quick grove
If we time travelled wouldn't we travel to where to where the scientists would have been alive
scenic yacht
ok so after 30 minutes you must have something substantial to disprove me besides these reddit "articles" I find when looking it up myself
brittle sinew
ive only been on google scholar, which is peer-reviewed work
scenic yacht
Lmao reddit
thats exactly my point, cable says theres "articles" about quantum tether when there arent any
quick grove
There is
brittle sinew
literally nothing ive read includes time, if time was a factor as well, they would talk about it
scenic yacht
from the article "there are currently no photon detectors with such a high time resolution available"
not only do we not have the tech for measuring this but what about other stuff
like time travel
quick grove
from the article "there are currently no photon detectors with such a high time ...
Whats that got to do with time tho
We can't messure time travel either
We don't have tech for that as well
scenic yacht
yup so as ive been saying how can we rule out time travel?
quick grove
So the machine we have ingame doesn't explain anything to you?
scenic yacht
Karl Popper Theory of Falsification states for a theory to be considered scientific it must be able to be tested and conceivably proven false.
quick grove
Who the fuck is karl popper
scenic yacht
for example, my theory of TTT can be disproven with ANY example of evidence that Red Alpha is a planet or another dimension
quick grove
Not a name i have heard in the game
scenic yacht
bro this is real life
quick grove
Lmao
scenic yacht
Karl Popper is a real person lmao
quick grove
never heard of him
scenic yacht
ok and?
robust apex
It's worth distinguishing between "confirmed lore" via logs vs "speculative but possible lore", the 25k figure falls into the latter where some people have estimated what they believe the figure might be; it could be higher or lower
brittle sinew
and what have you to back anything up? like you're telling us you need proof but everything we have to back up our claims you just cherry pick and bs away. nothing from the real world backs up your claim about the quantum tethering but what we provided shows that wht you thought (and what i initially thought) quantum tethering/entanglement meant is different. s
lol
scenic yacht
ok well if nothing backs my TTT then disprove it with actual in-game evidence?
like i've been saying, there just isnt enough as of right now
brittle sinew
im off to bed. im not saying that time travel isnt a possibility, but using the quantum tether as an explanation for the time travel doesn't work with its scientific definition
robust apex
R6D4 from memory
quick grove
Lmao
scenic yacht
R6D4 from memory
thx
brittle sinew
lol usque youve got a lot to read through
scenic yacht
R6D4 from memory
devs have apparently said dont look too much into D4 though as it isnt canon
brittle sinew
im off to bed, cya
scenic yacht
peace
quick grove
im off to bed, cya
Bruh you leave me
robust apex
The logs or the cryptomensia sections?
scenic yacht
The logs or the cryptomensia sections?
I think it all
brittle sinew
lol ive already spent way too much time on this, i do suggest reading into quantum theory/entanglement though, it is pretty interesting, wish i was locked out of a paywall for most of the peer-reviewed stuff though
they said the logs were cnon
canon
quick grove
ok well if nothing backs my TTT then disprove it with actual in-game evidence?
How is it possible for the eye things to follow us then
robust apex
Nothing introduced in those logs strictly contradicts anything we have previously
brittle sinew
but the teleporting stuff isnt? or the jumping arounf stuff
scenic yacht
lol ive already spent way too much time on this, i do suggest reading into quant...
ok but how about in-game proof?
brittle sinew
im going based of science and the definitions that already exist though, i doubt the devs would create/change a term that already has an understood definition in research (though i could be wrong)
scenic yacht
im not too sure about the logs all I know is @subtle verge said to not look too much into d4 because the devs
quick grove
Which left a rift open for them to come through
scenic yacht
time rift
quick grove
For fuck sakes dude
brittle sinew
i mean to be fair, idk how to explain the rift for them to come back through either, it legit could be anything as far as i know lmao
quick grove
Nothing this machine is doing has anything to do with time travel
robust apex
lol ive already spent way too much time on this, i do suggest reading into quant...
Virtually all quantum stuff is published on the arxiv and isn't paywalled (https://arxiv.org/archive/quant-ph), also unfortunately quantum entanglement and teleportation don't quite work the way that the game presents them and so I wouldn't advise using real quantum physics as a model for how things in the game work.
scenic yacht
all im asking of anyone trying to disprove my TTT is send me something that explicitly states that the Red Alpha IS NOT time travel
WOW almost like what ive been saying this whole time
brittle sinew
Virtually all quantum stuff is published on the arxiv and isn't paywalled (https...
we were basing stuff off of the definitions of quantum tether that exist in an attempt to say that the quantum tether is likely not through time since that goes against its definition
quick grove
Dude time travel isn't present in this game and it will never be
scenic yacht
we were basing stuff off of the definitions of quantum tether that exist in an a...
"I wouldn't advise using real quantum physics as a model for how things in the game work." couldnt have said it better myself
quick grove
The machine is literally called matter wave projector
robust apex
we were basing stuff off of the definitions of quantum tether that exist in an a...
No reason it can't be time correlated; you can do "time based" entanglement between photons. But that doesn't necessarily imply time travel.
brittle sinew
hazard you only piggyback off what people say when they agree with you, literally confirmation bias. you havent actually looked into anything yourself
scenic yacht
projects matter through time
scenic yacht
hazard you only piggyback off what people say when they agree with you, literall...
and none of yall have disproven me
quick grove
Throught fucking space you dumb cunt its instant
brittle sinew
i mean, from what i was reading it doesnt seem like things could be tethered across time (such as use for time travel)
scenic yacht
ooof insults nice, a good show of winning an arguement
robust apex
However I don't think there's any evidence that explicitly rules out either time travel, planet hopping or dimension hopping (or it's slightly fancier variant in 'multiverse theory')
scenic yacht
wow thank you
robust apex
So they're all currently equally valid?
brittle sinew
yea, im not ruling out time travel, but it seems unlikely that the quantum tether would be what allows for time travel which is all that i was arguing
quick grove
ooof insults nice, a good show of winning an arguement
Its frustrating to explain to you that your theory of TTT is irrelevant to what's happening in game
brittle sinew
hazard has just been sitting here claiming quantum tether has no definition without looking into anything himself
scenic yacht
So they're all currently equally valid?
YES thank you
all are currently valid because not enough proof is given for any side
robust apex
I mean the quantum tether is sci-fi jargon which can do anything the devs want it to do
quick grove
So they're all currently equally valid?
No their not
scenic yacht
I mean the quantum tether is sci-fi jargon which can do anything the devs want i...
thats literally what ive been saying thank you
brittle sinew
i mean it has definition within articles though, so no, it isn't sci-fi jargon
quick grove
So time travel is not in that what your saying?
scenic yacht
cable give us articles
brittle sinew
quantum tether/entanglement
scenic yacht
you always speak of them
brittle sinew
dude ive quoted 2 different articles
quick grove
https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/pdf/10.1098/rsta.1998.0245
Lol
brittle sinew
and linked 1 wtf
scenic yacht
literally havent disproven me though?
quick grove
It has