gtfo-lore

[lost drum]

What does that mean? Will the R8 have levels on the surface? #dev-leaks message

[burnt wren]

Unfortunately not. It already says that in steam when people are in lobby and ready to drop.

The only leak here is that discord will say that too now.

So... Discord integration.

Lame. Literally who cares.

[lost drum]

I'm waiting for the real R8 leaks

[burnt wren]

Don't we all...

[final sentinel]

what

bro the game is built around discord at this point, discord integration is amazing

[burnt wren]

Cringe

In game server browser would be a better use of resources

[raw terrace]

but u cant check if someones, not dropped into a level already ina server browser plus it wouldve had the exact problem as normal matchmaking which is probs wouldnt have been used

actually i guess u could but, i still defend no one wouldve payed much attention to it

[cunning light]

The main issue with a server browser (or matchmaking, for that matter) is that the player base is too small and the number of different expeditions available too great.
If you add to that regions and timezones, it becomes even more complicated to find 3 other players willing to play the same expedition as you, not too far, and at the same time.

[burnt wren]

Just do killing floor come on

[cunning light]

(being Captain Obvious there, I know)

[burnt wren]

Rundown, level, number of players (1/4 etc), host's ping.

Fucking bam.

Some filters of course.

LFG channels are literally that anyway

Just inferior... In every way.

The only down grade would be the mic quality of a discord room vs in game.

[raw terrace]

does it

this is gtfo lore

[burnt wren]

This is perfection, as far as I'm concerned.

[solemn kraken]

#408196129470152706 tho

[lilac island]

oh come on

no it doesnt

it will be so much easier when the game doesn't require you to open up another program for matchmaking

this problem will exist, but by itself it's not a reason not to add a server browser

[willow geyser]

whats a popular lore?

[solar nova]

The state of MM does end up gatekeeping new players for basically no reason.

[eternal talon]

Wdym?

[hot burrow]

I just noticed there is another prisoner id for the characters on the animated pfp

[grim shell]

Definitely recommend checking out the interview in #guides-and-reviews message "wrap up the story in a dark way"

[burnt wren]

Well, that reduces the ammount of potential endings, doesn't it?

1. Alien jar
2. Everyone fails, everyone dies (the anti-climatic ending)

[worthy flower]

r8 everyone dies

r8 ext asspull humanity survives

[harsh pike]

#2 would be an awfully boring ending

[burnt wren]

I'm aware

[harsh pike]

ooo sassy boy

[queen gazelle]

Schaffer eats and kills us

While saying he is the warden then he becomes Pablo

[eternal talon]

#2 is awfully likely (I agree)

[grim shell]

Schaeffer doing us a dang Maddox

[queen gazelle]

Schaffer gives me an integral( not solvable) then tells me it is easy(gone dark)

[low folio]

the GTFO was the friends we made along the way

[lilac island]

ending 2 would be great

same as darkwood

everyone dies

games that didnt give me a satisfying ending always stayed in my mind for longer

[eternal talon]

imho i'd rather take an open ending like halo 3 with some semblance of finality than something that just kills you

its leading into a possible future that leaves you theorizing, without needing a sequel

(damn you 343)

[solemn kraken]

Bungie had a sequel planned already as shown in the extra scene at the end of halo 3 when finished on legendary. 343's halo 4 actually starts with that scene as well. does not take away the fact halo 4 is still shit

[crisp citrus]

You all forget The Good Ending where we beat back warden and hijack the matter wave projector to go to a new timeline and remake humanity using the Ksos

This ending is also the GTFO ending (got the fuck out)

[lilac island]

remake humanity using the ksos.

99% male

maybe 100% male

[burnt wren]

Technically correct.

[solemn kraken]

keep injecting babies with GLP

[lilac island]

what babies

where you getting em

[burnt wren]

But not everyone in KDS DEEP is a KSO. And we know for a fact there are females stored there and there.

[solemn kraken]

There is certainly more than just the 2 as we know warden made at least 23 units

So find em

[crisp citrus]

Bone marrow babies I guess

Sure they'll look like baby strikers

But it's a small price to pay for not being warden exhibition creatures

[solemn kraken]

Ah yeah forgot Elbow is traumatized by R2E1

[lilac island]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/304845361409818625/1065927373129781248/ess84.gif

[past matrix]

which would fit with GTFO

[toxic wagon]

4 vets on any level

[solemn kraken]

pretty much

[solar nova]

Old maybe? But interesting. /

[final sentinel]

Yeah, old but interesting

I really want to see Valiant Chamber

If it doesn’t show up in R8 I might mod my headcanon of it

[plush nest]

i didnt think the facility was that big

[mortal pivot]

You never met Dauda

[half basin]

deepest point 4200m?
when are we gonna go that deep?

[clear furnace]

Fr

Imagine whats down there...

[half basin]

more sleepers

[eternal talon]

An alien ship.

But yes, many more sleepers

[half basin]

wasnt there a log where they were exploring some void cave with sleepers rushing at them almost non-stop? with KSOs defending hammerstein or sth? i believe if that place has been... left alone... the sleepers have probably nested there now too

[eternal talon]

Maybe even ancient Mayan ones

[half basin]

alsoo, wasn't the ship that one void chamber?

[eternal talon]

Noooooo the ship is huuuuge

The void was only ~20 meters across iirc

[half basin]

wasnt that the valiant chamber?

as in, the ship = valiant chamber

[eternal talon]

The ship is thousands of meters across and up/down

[half basin]

might be mixing things up

big ship

i wouldnt say its "just" a ship, it's like a capital frigate, like a star destroyer

if you say it like that

[eternal talon]

Nah, waaaay to big to be a room. It's basically entirely burried. Insight and SMC have been using drills down there to open it up so they could explore further

[eternal talon]

Honestly it's closer to an escape pod than either of those things

[half basin]

okay, but the deepest part they buried to would probably still not be exactly the ship, they probably dug somewhere else too? to explore around

[eternal talon]

Maybe a research ship if you stretch it with the collection Hammerstein found in there of species

[half basin]

maybe a ship that was supposed to preserve their race?

and all the specimen on their home planet?

but got infected

maybe they sent multiple out, this is the one that hit us

[eternal talon]

No, the specimens they recovered were from numerous different species from different universes, and the collectors themselves say them and their ship are in exile

[half basin]

oh right, forgot that part
where was the exile part? was it the dialogue it had with schaeffer in ALT/R6D1?

[eternal talon]

*when talking to alt//schaeffer

[half basin]

ah yea, only listened to it once (still a bit unfamiliar with lore, at that time even more, so kind of difficult to understand it all)

[eternal talon]

One of them, i think there are two, they are on the wiki

[eternal talon]

Absolutely. GTFO's lore is anything but simple

On the contrary -- it's a rat's nest of contradictory logs and information stretching between the freaking multiverse

The writers went clinically insane with the launch of r6.

[half basin]

yea, as you said in your little lore for dummies explanation, multiverse kind of opens up endless possibilities and lots of contradictions

[eternal talon]

Not even referring to that, some of their logs just don't make sense. For example; the schaeffer discrepancy.

In our original worldline, schaeffer entered KDS-DEEP, he locked the doors so sleepers couldn't get to him, but couldn't get them open again. To avoid starvation, he enters hydrostasis.

Jump to gameplay, schaeffer breaks free of his squad the warden assigned him to in r4, yet warden only has access to KDS-DEEP in r5e1 when we lift the lockdown schaeffer caused oh so many years ago

[cunning light]

I mean, our OG Schaeffer got severely impacted by that HSU time

(and quite some time has past since the "event")

[eternal talon]

That was my running theory from ogr6 to alt//r6 when we finally got an answer -- surprisingly from the collectors themselves, which I'm sure nobody expected

[eternal talon]

I don't follow. Hydrostasis doesn't allow time travel, and even so, he couldn't wake himself, as seen with Maddox.

[eternal talon]

Event?

[half basin]

couldnt it be that KDS deep has locked only after Schaeffer went in there?

[cunning light]

2053, the big "explosion" (plasma beams) that burst through the Complex

[eternal talon]

Well yes, that's what I'm saying. He caused it, he says he caused it in the ogr6ex audio logs

[half basin]

ah right, then how was he awake...

that was the question... i got lost in thought

maybe the rundowns happened more in parallel? or R5 kinda happened before R4?

[eternal talon]

Like I said, a discrepancy. It's not possible, poor writing or something we don't know yet that occurred.

[half basin]

i mean, R4 wasn't a lot of "lore" related stuff, it was just "go deeper" with schaeffer coming into play

right?

[eternal talon]

Correct, though I'm unsure what you mean by "happened in parallel".

We play as the same team through the entirety of gtfo's gameplay, including alt, where we find the alt// versions of ourselves dead already.

The entirety of r5 was making goal of breaching KDS-DEEP in e1 possible, so with something potentially time sensitive like that, I'm not sure the warden would have risked it, not to mention the fact he only had 8k KSOs at most to spare prior to opening it, where the other ~24,000 were stored

[crisp citrus]

R8 is us vs 24,000 ksos

The ultimate horde shooter

[eternal talon]

Us vs 31,993 ksos under the wardens control (discounting schaeffer, henrikkson, and Maddox who is dead)

Not to mention, we find tons of dead KSOs all over the place

[crisp citrus]

We fight with the sleepers

[eternal talon]

So he's probably only working with ~10,000 at most

[crisp citrus]

Together infected strong

[eternal talon]

The sleepers aren't working with the aliens, it's just a bioweapon, it infected them too.

[half basin]

R8 will hopefully shed light on this all, i really wanna know how this all ends (and if those conundrums have a meaning/explanation)
i gotta go now though

[eternal talon]

You really wouldn't want to be infected if you knew how that kind of thing works... truly nightmare fuel

It's like the flood but somehow worse

[cunning light]

Being infected is a ticking timebomb

Which really makes you wonder about the disinfect pack and station

[eternal talon]

Well, it's as the devs said themseves... they aren't zombies.

You don't die.

You are conscious as your body is mangled and twisted as a parasite puppets it for (quite literally) all of eternity

[cunning light]

But I will not fall into that rabbit hole, and go sleep instead (not in a HSU, thank you)

[eternal talon]

No "rip", you don't get to rest. Just be hopeful you become a striker of some sort and the parasite severely damages your brain/skull and you cannot bear conscious thought anymore, unlike the snatchers who's heads are 100% intact

The floaters and other destination infected have been so for literally 7 TRILLION YEARS

[half basin]

i cant wait to have a lore video about the entire GTFO lore, i love listening to those (will frosty make one? )

[eternal talon]

I don't plan to. I'm not too confident in my voice and much prefer to do text documents anyhow. R8 is the last confirmed content for GTFO, so maybe someone will make one and I can help with script.

(also: Sector analysis complete. The mass extends 2,215 (+/- 372m) meters from apex to nadir. Width estimate is 1,247 meters (+/- 208m). As suspected, it is largely made up of the newly discovered Cretasium 77a material, and surrounded by a thin membrane of iridium. Further analysis is required to determine if the material composition mirrors the artifacts. The data suggests the composition of the "egg" is not identical to the artifacts, but shares properties. This suggests a similar origin.)

^ this is the dimensions of the ship

[strange cliff]

anyone getting sorcerer 1977 vibes from this lore ?

[burnt wren]

I have no idea what that is

[strange cliff]

its a movie about 4 people with different backgrounds ending up in south america and having to work together on a job for the chance of getting out

[eternal talon]

well we don't really have any "chance" of getting out

we are all thoroughly fucked -- we're infected, and there is no cure

best hydrostasis can even do is clean you temporarily, but garganta is so infested itself that we'd just get intantly re-infected when our pods open

let alone how are we gonna get our pods to a clean place without infecting that clean place

[strange cliff]

yeah i mean the end of the movie was not the whole point, it was more about watching these 4 men who know nothing about each other going through hell

this movie was like e1

[crisp citrus]

we must make an HSU on wheels

[eternal talon]

and who's gonna push it?

[crisp citrus]

the warden

[eternal talon]

the warden doesnt have a physical body.. and besides, anything and everything is infected.

even on surfaces, the virus can linger for months

any unit or robot that moves it is carrying the virus with it and making the entire point pointless

[crisp citrus]

you can push it

[raw terrace]

car hsu

[eternal talon]

then nam-v gets on the outside of the HSU and your just giving the virus a free ride to a new world to infect

you underestimate how thoroughly garganta is infected

even unused syringes have a chance to transmit infection

locked in sealed boxes that have been that way for at LEAST half a decade

which... is another plot hole now that i think about it

though you could always make the case that security boxes and lockers aren't airtight

[raw terrace]

they dont look airtight

more like just, a box

[crisp citrus]

the reason we get infected is the placebo effect

we think we would get infected, therefore we do

[eternal talon]

nahhhh warden scans show infection

"Infection Level High"

this is just in the menu, before even dropping into a level

hydrostasis doesn't cure the virus' progress. it only slows it down

[crisp citrus]

warden is also affected by the placebo

its smart enough to be

[eternal talon]

smart enough but not biological enough?... nam-v isn't that much like the flood

even if the sleepers had the capacity to intentionally try, they'd only be able to infect biocom's systems, not warden itself.

[storm flame]

Didnt the game start screens differ between rundowns?

Meaning that either 1 hour has passed since we got in the pod last time or more time. Thought the lore itself said that the only way to kill the virus was to get in hydrostasis

but theres no specified time to kill the virus, like a salmon, where you have to store it for 2 weeks at -15C° to kill all the viruses that can fuck you up if you consume it raw

[burnt wren]

It's one of those things that lore is not clear enough on or even gives contradicting information.

Some logs say its the way, some say it survives it...

[loud urchin]

I'm fairly certain that for a salmon we'd be looking at other pathogens, not viruses

[storm flame]

i dont even know what a pathogen is, im an illiterate bastard. but im aware that the infection is both a virus and parasyte symbiosis

[crisp citrus]

thats why i said warden is affected by placebo (not really why i said it but it justifies what i said) since the inconsistencies show the warden is equally confused about the virus, cementing that its mind over matter

look at schaeffer

hes a bit crazy but otherwise fine despite being super infected probably

therefore you can outwill the infection

[burnt wren]

Interesting theory, if not for the wiped outside world. The sympthom logs are clear. You spinal cord goes by-by and turns into a soup. Surely there would be mentions of "miracle survivors" somewhere, including facility itself.

[coral gorge]

Yeah i doubt the virus gives a fuck about your will to live

[burnt wren]

Schaeffer still remains one of the biggest plotholes for now. And there's so many potential solutions to his situation that frankly i'd rather not waste time on speculating and just wait for R8.

[crisp citrus]

hear me out

the hsu thing screws with your memory

you forget you are infected/about the virus

therefore you do not think you are infected, which is why you lose the symptoms

[coral gorge]

…

[crisp citrus]

(this is the only way to explain so much nonsense)

[burnt wren]

That is one hell of a wild-ass theory

[coral gorge]

you realise thats not how viruses work right?

[burnt wren]

And there's one log i'd like to point to as a counter-argument

[crisp citrus]

dude we are playing a game where a cool cube literally shifts your frequency (?) to teleport you to a new dimension

wouldnt be too odd

[coral gorge]

But saying a virus doesnt exist when you dont know about it is a whole diffrent thing

basically you just make a shrodinger virus

[burnt wren]

To be fair...

[crisp citrus]

its alien virus

[burnt wren]

Something about nam-v does gives off lovecraftian vibes.

So it could be some space manifestations or lord knows what else.

Its an insane, but a plausilble theory.

[crisp citrus]

too many things are plausible

[coral gorge]

Halo flood sorta deal?

[burnt wren]

Wouldn't be the first time the game contradicted itself either...

[crisp citrus]

only because theres no real uh

solid confirmed info that would clear this up

praying r8 confirms my mind over matter lovecraft disease

[coral gorge]

if they go that way i think ill loose my mind and throw the writers of the biggest skyscraper in sweden

[crisp citrus]

dont say things you are not prepared to back up

[coral gorge]

HA

im prepared to back them up

ill very willingly visit sweden

and ask the writers wtf where they intaking

[crisp citrus]

you have become a threat to the fabled alt r7/8 and r9 update

you must be removed

[coral gorge]

Fuck ALT R7, you aint showing up, not in this worldline!

[crisp citrus]

i cannot wait for the developers to somehow magically tie up the lore with r8

[burnt wren]

The request:
*"Angela,

I don't see how pathogens could be influencing the BAT results to be honest. The assessments are carried out after at least 5 days in HS recovery, and very few organisms will survive suspended animation for more than a few days without a finely tuned external subsistence strategy to keep them alive. When we introduce positive bacteriophages we have to stimulate them constantly or they won't survive even a few hours in HS. This is without considering the counteragents and neutralizers we use in the amniotic plasma.

Any behavioral issues you are seeing are psychological, not biological. Nothing survives HS unless we want it to.

Sebastian"*

The response:
*""Very few".

There are things you don't know that you don't know. I need a complete list of all pathogens you have exposed to hydrostasis. I have a suspicion your list is not complete.

Angela"*

This particular log can be read both ways, actually.

Angela there is saying that the guy is not seeing NAM-V because he's not aware of it.

[crisp citrus]

in a way it supports the insane mind over matter theory

[burnt wren]

But also... The guy could be right. Hm.

[crisp citrus]

ngl

my bs theory i made up has substance

this is truly unfortunate

maybe the "very few" is referring more to organisms than viruses

and hes talking about the parasite

that its kinda preserved with the host in the HSU

so as long as you dont have the parasite, the nam-v cells die in the hsu

[burnt wren]

What they described about how HSU works is that it kills everything inside of it unless specifically finetuned to not do that.

[crisp citrus]

and if you do have it

[crisp citrus]

well what about things inside the things inside of it

[burnt wren]

That's actually what they do with people. The substance inside preserves the body and all the important micro-flora and bacteria in the original state without allowing it to rot and dissolve.

What they're experiencing is that SOMETHING got in and not being outright killed by it.

[crisp citrus]

so maybe its the parasite?

maybe it gets very integrated with the human system so it is treated as maybe gut bacteria or w/e

but the parasite is large enough for the warden to remove in idk surgical procedure same as the biocom chip insertion

the HSU kills the nam-v, warden removes parasites if a prisoner has one

or maybe no prisoner has a parasite cause we have the suits/masks that keep us protected against that specifically

even if it cant guard against the virus, its ok because the HSU kills it

maybe schaeffer has survived so long by getting isolated HSUs

taking them off warden systems

and putting himself inside it for a quick detox then releasing himself

that way he kills off the nam-v infection as he is doing his thing

[plush nest]

I remember reading somewhere that the parasite eats through hazmat suits. I could be just making things up with all the information that I can’t keep straight though

[burnt wren]

"...but parasites are still finding their ways in..." is how its worded

They don't say directly that they eat through, just "find their ways in"

[cunning light]

"With so many mutations of NAM-V being created with each new host, there are potentially millions of strains of NAM-V that no longer require a parasite to transmit.
This explains why Dr. Dauda’s research shows such resilience in the virus. It evolves everywhere, in every way. This virus is an omnipotent force of nature."

"The only method we have found of killing the virus is by stopping the biological functions of the host through hydrostasis (or death). Fortunately, the parasites have not yet found a way into the HSUs. However, after hydrostasis reinfection is possible."

• from log 834-786-872 (Alt://R1B1)

[burnt wren]

That's related to HSU.

We're reffering to them finding a way into protective hazard suits.

[cunning light]

I just wanted to add reference to the earlier convo about the team being infected

Staying into an HSU would cannonically clean you of the virus, but you can still get contaminated again as soon as you get out

[crisp citrus]

Its 100% people going "man this mask makes it hard to breathe, gimme a sec" then they lift up the mask edge for a breather and get infected

[crisp citrus]

So is this confirmation that the HSU process kills viruses, but could likely not kill a parasite

[eternal talon]

not really. the suits described in the log are SCBA level A. If you aren't familiar, this is what those look like:

[crisp citrus]

They are then being goofy and peeling it off for a bit

What size even are the parasites

[eternal talon]

quite big. these are their eggs:

better pic:

[eternal talon]

I should also mention, it's not just breathing. NAM-V Spreads by every possible vector, quite literally (as per dauda's research) everything except the vacuum of space because there is nothing there for it to transmit across. Meer skin contact is a death sentence

[cunning light]

Not a death sentence, but an almost garanteed contamination, that is for sure

[eternal talon]

Well with no cure and very few ever considering or knowing about Hydrostasis, basically a death sentence. Not to mention hydrostasis isn't a be-all-end-all. NAM-V mutates it's host alone as seen with the headcracked corpses. Even if you are jumping in and out of stasis, the mutations will eventually stack up and be fatal.

This gets to the argument of "hydrostasis doesn't cure cancer" so it wouldn't reverse the mutations

As we know Kovac themselves were keeping infected individuals in hydrostasis, "Class-F"

[drowsy roost]

I don't think NAM-V causes the mutations alone, otherwise the logs about the virus descimating the planet might've mentioned the creatures. I think the mutations might be related to the parasites... or perhaps a different more flu-like strain escaped...

[eternal talon]

We know it does because of the CDC and UK logs on the surface in the original worldline where the parasite never got out

Also the corpses in garganta wouldn't have ended up as corpses if parasites got to them, that's how you make sleepers

[drowsy roost]

True, true

[eternal talon]

The mutations just kill you without the parasite

The parasite takes the mutations the virus does and takes them even further, with different strains (breeds) of parasite creating the different variants based on host genetic material to work with (shooters, strikers, chargers, scouts, etc)

[drowsy roost]

I think some creatures did reach the surface based on what the Cuban army said about violent creatures which disappear once killed — and that being something new

[eternal talon]

In the alt//worldline they absolutely did.

[burnt wren]

Yeah, we have that.

[eternal talon]

It's important to recognize everything after r7 is a different universe entirely

We even find the corpses of several of our alt//squadmates

[burnt wren]

Eh

Up to R6 everything was basically the same plus minus a date there and there

Who knows, maybe the UN squad was sent in original timineline too? Warden just didn't intercept anything.

[eternal talon]

In the original worldline we had the WHO team instead

That log is missing from alt// iirc

[drowsy roost]

The daylight mission?

[eternal talon]

Daylight was sent by the UN in alt//

In OG it was the World Health Organization

Both expeditions to find the source of the virus in garganta

Neither made it beyond the surface levels as far as we know

Both likely got overrun by sleepers like the intro to the Resident Evil 2 movie

[lilac island]

frostty

i bring to you news

information

[burnt wren]

Ampt comparison

[lilac island]

valueable insight

[eternal talon]

Though I have to give credit, daylight was militarized so they probably got further

WHO was practically just a bunch of lab techs

[eternal talon]

What's up?

[drowsy roost]

Daylight is only referenced in the alt thought? What logs include the WHO?

[lilac island]

due to a bug i have acquired never before seen footage of what the inside of sleepers looks like

[eternal talon]

In OG//R6 we had a repeating transmission from the world health organization that were going to garganta to find the source

Daylight isn't a part of OG at all

It was first brought up I think in alt//r2

[eternal talon]

Shoot.

Though it probably isn't anything interesting tbh

[lilac island]

i don't have a gun on me

[eternal talon]

I mean post, send it

[lilac island]

i don't have a skateboard to send any tricks

[burnt wren]

Elbow, where is this going

[drowsy roost]

Ah so not in the logs?

[burnt wren]

Just post a screenshot if you have any

[lilac island]

OUPS, all eggs

[eternal talon]

Obtain a mobile device
Open said mobile device
Install discord
Open discord
Enter the GTFO server
Enter #gtfo-lore
Press the + ...

Oh you posted it

I was gonna keep going

[lilac island]

it's just eggs

[burnt wren]

sounds of disgust

[lilac island]

their entire body is eggs

[eternal talon]

It's jiggling

[lilac island]

that's why they get dismembered so easily

[eternal talon]

Like jello

[lilac island]

there's no muscle no nothing it's just eggs

disgusting

so ye

[eternal talon]

Iirc they did used to explode into egg confetti in the earlier versions of the game

[lilac island]

you could make a shitton of omelettes with this

and this explains why strikers just shatter when you sledgehammer them

they don't have organs anymore it's just a bag of eggs

[eternal talon]

Now the question is, since it is using repurpsoed human biomass, is it canibalism?

[lilac island]

yes

but everything is canibalism with more layers

there are so many molecules of humans that eventually the atoms of dead people are gonna find their way into your salmon

[eternal talon]

What like everything is a tiny percentage space rocks?

[lilac island]

or ribeye

[spare birch]

Those always looked like bone fragments to me, not eggs

[lilac island]

they eggs

[eternal talon]

In regards to the innards it's debatable by how low texture they are, but they do have clear visible eggs on most corpses

[lilac island]

Human bones don't look like that guys

(and gal)

They're not round and there's not 13 of them

[eternal talon]

Well yes, but these are nothing like standard humans. If anything I was getting at stuff like tumorous growths/masses

[lilac island]

I don't think so

However

It is immensely surprising that these things can function

[eternal talon]

I wonder if they pop if you squeeze them

[lilac island]

With 50% of their body being eggs

Probably not

They're probably hard

[eternal talon]

Tbf giants can have just bone legs and they walk just fine

[eternal talon]

I meant sleepers

[lilac island]

The answer is yes

Source: it literally happens in game

Sledgehammer their torso, it explodes

Humans don't explode when you hit them with a sledgehammer, they just die because their organs are now a smoothie

[eternal talon]

Well yeah, but I think you'd probably also explode if a drugged up medically enhanced soldier bashed your torso in with a sledgehammer

[lilac island]

Nah

[eternal talon]

KSOs aren't normal people, they be getting drug smoothies constantly

[lilac island]

Do they tho

I remember from logs that the drug smoothie bishop got was to help forget

[burnt wren]

Boosters are canon and the way they are described they're pretty much drugs

[lilac island]

Not to enhance

[eternal talon]

Well yeah. Boosters and the (I forget it's called) during hydrostasis

[lilac island]

By the way

[burnt wren]

Despite what veterans say - canonically we get boosted every mission

[eternal talon]

Shouldn't really be needed for memory loss. That's just a property of hydrostasis itself. See dauda and schaeffer

[lilac island]

What are syringes exactly

[eternal talon]

Boosters

[lilac island]

They said like "give him 2 doses of the serotonin and one of something something

[lilac island]

Yeah i mean made how and by who

[eternal talon]

One is probably adrenaline or something for melee strength, the health is probably some kind of morphine or fentanyl

[lilac island]

But they give you infection

[eternal talon]

Because you are injecting it into you?

[lilac island]

This could be the key to understanding what infection actually is

[eternal talon]

Everything should give infection

[lilac island]

No

[eternal talon]

Breathing should give infection, even outside of dense fog

[lilac island]

No listen the log says clearly that the substance itself causes infection

There was a guy working on it who said he was concerned about ut

[eternal talon]

Also #NotAllSyringes

It's only like 33%

[lilac island]

What

I've never had a syringe not give me infection

[eternal talon]

It's only a ~30% sum chance to get infection on injection

[eternal talon]

Dream RNG unlucky?

[lilac island]

No

[eternal talon]

It's not even 50/50 lol

[lilac island]

I think you're just wrong

About this

[eternal talon]

It's like 1/3rd or less

[eternal talon]

I swear to God check wiki

[final sentinel]

i also have never not gotten infection

It’s always like 6-12% iirc

[eternal talon]

I remember vividly from my copious solo r6b1 runs

[final sentinel]

i mean so do I

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[eternal talon]

The first alarm door room with scout usually spawns several syringes

[lilac island]

Either we or frosty are in alt

[eternal talon]

Same with class 5 room

[final sentinel]

“I2-LP syringes give 5-15% health upon usage, at the cost of 3-10% infection”

[eternal talon]

Inf resist? I'm 100% certain I've jammed and not gotten infection

[final sentinel]

Same with IIX’s

Must’ve been

[eternal talon]

Because I'm CERTAIN I was annoyed by the chance

It always pissed me off and why I stopped using them

[final sentinel]

They don’t always infect you on 2 hits of a syringe

[eternal talon]

Sometimes I'd get infect, sometimes I didnt

I remember doing a run using like 3 syringes and getting no inf in a row

It was that memorable

[final sentinel]

By which I mean you can get a double low roll and not actually breach 10%

Again, syringes give infection, idk what to tell you

[lilac island]

Maybe you just didnt notice cuz it didn't put you above 10%

Or something

[eternal talon]

Regardless, them giving infect isn't to be surprising. You are jamming an open exposed needle into you

[lilac island]

no

the fluid itself is the problem not the needle

[eternal talon]

Nam-v is everywhere in garganta, even not in infection fog

[lilac island]

let me pull up this fckin log

[eternal talon]

Nam-v would never heal you

[lilac island]

EBDT_29FH-011.LOG

[eternal talon]

Besides, isn't there a log of them getting a shipment of those boosters? Ie, outside of garganta?

[eternal talon]

I'm on my phone. Gimme a min

[lilac island]

"Scott,

I’ve managed to increase the duration of the IIx drug effect – it now improves the user’s fast-twitch muscle power for 8 seconds. As you suggested, it’ll come in handy for occasional mining situations where the cables for the pneumatic tools can’t reach. A miner can just take a hit of the FTF booster syringe and smash the rock with a sledgehammer.

I know if the boost lasted longer it would be more convenient, but there are some ugly side effects that start popping up when I try to extend the duration of the effect. Just tell the miners to use the time well.

Regarding the “Injury Infection Liquid Pharmacon” syringe (“I2-LP” for short), the severity of the side effects are seemingly random and I haven’t found a way to get rid of them. I’ll keep working on it."

"Injury Infection Liquid Pharmacon
"ugly side effects"

the contents of the syringe are the problem not the wound

also "seemingly random"

this describes it perfectly

[eternal talon]

**Just wanted to let you know that the wares arrived today. Everything is in order.

Current Inventory control:

Zone 2: Foam test Lab 14 foam grenades 38 foam mines

Zone 3: Explosives test Lab 48 Tripmines

Zone 4: Medical Lab, 52 I2-LP Syringes 29 IIx drug Syrin=/xrg**

2-LP Syringes 29

from outside of garganta

cant be nam-v

MAIL_INV_CNTR-445.LOG

r5c2

so it appears we are at a roadblock. you post a log that says it gives infection, i post a log that says they got a shipment of them so they can't be from nam-v

[drowsy roost]

So I've been editing the wiki a bit and definitely get the multi-dimension thing going on, and get the reasons why ALT is considered a different dimension than OG, namely the State of Truth broadcast... but it's disappointing that half the lore is buried in a wiki because you can't go back and replay those expeditions.

[eternal talon]

so only conclusion? the infection they give isn't nam-v.

[lilac island]

yeah it cant be

exactly

[eternal talon]

er, i should say, only non-plot-hole conclusion

[lilac island]

so infection cant be namv

[burnt wren]

Coin toss

[lilac island]

we can use this second lead to understand what infection actually is

[burnt wren]

We don't have a confirmation either way

One of them Shrodinger's plot points

It can be anything until writer puts it in

[lilac island]

because it's not namv clearly, they would never put that in syringes
and namv can't be dissinfected away

infections is another sickness

[eternal talon]

😭 why is it always plot holes....

[lilac island]

that's what happens when a dev tries to write a book

[eternal talon]

they've gotta have some kind of intelligence over at the 10cc writers division

they've gotta

[lilac island]

this is actually even harder than writing a book because they want gameplay to match

mostly

so it's to be expected

[eternal talon]

if you'd like, you can read the "for dummies doc" in the pins here to get a more digestible plot summary

[drowsy roost]

Oh yeah, read it. I think its more than you can't experience those differences for yourself — unless you were here from the start.

Maybe its a nice reward for those who followed the lore from the game's launch.

[eternal talon]

its a lingering issue from the FOMO rundown format

even with alt//, its just the gameplay. the past lore stays burried

[lilac island]

yeah sucked

hard

i would hope that they have the past lore themselves and will officially release it at some point

incase we missed things

[drowsy roost]

I've just been treating ALT as a retcon... kinda a "we got the gameplay working now its time to populate it with a story"

[eternal talon]

i just like... as we are told, nam-v is EVERWHERE in garganta, not just in infection fog or wall sacks.

its just no fucking sense

[eternal talon]

if it were a retcon it'd be a whole lot simpler

but they didnt wanna throw stuff away

they wanted the story of alt to be quote: "with a twist"

and here we are

[lilac island]

yeah but the incubation period isnt insant

it makes sense for the infection not to be that

i promise

it doesn't have to be namv

this isn't a plothole necessarily

[drowsy roost]

A bit jank... but yeah.

[eternal talon]

i'm agreeing with you. irregardless, i've just considered inf fog to just be super dense areas of nam-v if related at all and they didnt want the floor to be giving people infection from level start

[lilac island]

yeah

[eternal talon]

also, there was that r5 level that you START at max infection

from the hydrostasis pod

but then again what the fuck are the class-f "infected" hsus infected with if it weren't nam-v...

[lilac island]

good point

[burnt wren]

Not from the pod, i think it implies that the level in question is so infected - you get 100% just while going down with the wench lift.

[lilac island]

absolutely

quite the funny level, i attempted it blind first time today and got my head bashed in

being at capped at 15% is... damn.

[crisp citrus]

Maybe the mutations only start after you've had it for a while, so as long as you enter hydrostasis periodically it never progresses to a point that causes permanent damage

Class f might be parasite infected or no point of return infected

[lilac island]

very fair

[burnt wren]

The key is to get through everything loud and violent before your HP gets low enough.

And just fucking eating medkits, of course.

[lilac island]

man honestly im fed up with this game

i bought a new PC to replace my old one

in r5e1 i was still dropping frames and it ran like absolute ass

like ???????

[burnt wren]

Yeah, that's normal.

[lilac island]

that's bullshit

[burnt wren]

You probably havent seen R7D1 yet, right?

[lilac island]

no

[burnt wren]

That level is infamous.

[lilac island]

im honestly not gonna play these levels

until we get an optimization patch

it's not fun

[burnt wren]

With some unfortunate angles i was getting liked 20 FPS or something

I think there's a tear in the mesh and the game renders some things it shouldn/t

Because the angle in question just show me some walls and a corner

Whatever's eating those frames - its not them, im fucking certain

[raw terrace]

it can also b memory leak havin the game like too many runs of a level u start droppin fps

dont u

[lilac island]

it was our first run

completely

i hate when this happens because this game should not be hard to run

it's a bunch of closed rooms and less than 30 enemies awake at any given time

no massive open world maps, no tons of textures

[burnt wren]

I can drop in and find that corner right now

Its like 10 minutes into the level

[lilac island]

i know im being harsh but it is inexcusable for this not to run well on modern hardware

many of my favourite games ran like ass at times and i'm sick of it

especially with a new pc

like come on

[burnt wren]

R1A1: loads in 5-10 seconds, stable 100+ fps through the whole thing.
R7D1: loads for 25 seconds and i get 60 fps by just standing here:

Please forgive me for misusing lore channel for like 2 minutes.

[loud urchin]

Sentenced to 10 years of chimp theory

[eternal talon]

Funnily enough Kovac still considered class-f useful for transplants

Which is... dangerously stupid imo

[burnt wren]

Probably for KSOs exclusively

Keeps them operatives in combat

[tawny peak]

guys i think john schaeffer is the warden

[eternal talon]

He's not.

He's a human, warden is an alien consciousness controlling a bio-mechanical mainframe

[eternal talon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrsZTOP3FBk
good video, but the *worldlines, not timlines, have already merged. we find bishop and dauda's corpses in alt//r6

[crisp citrus]

What's the hidden truth

[eternal talon]

its a video scaler uploaded two hours ago talking about the two *main worldlines, misconceptions about alt//replacing OG lore, and theories on r8

it has several errors like the one above mentioned, but is otherwise pretty good

[crisp citrus]

If my "you can beat nam-v by forgetting you have it" theory isn't there I'll be really unsurprised

[eternal talon]

its not because thats not how plagues work

[crisp citrus]

Start here

It's complete nonsense but it would be far from the most absurd thing to be in lore

[wintry vector]

Is the consensus that the collectors are collecting the virus across dimensions? 🤔 scaler video is hurting my brain

[eternal talon]

The "for dummies" document in the pins here is probably a bit more digestible and has been around for faaaaaar longer

In regards to the collectors, it's currently a debated topic weither they are collecting the virus specifically or species in general

[wintry vector]

That's what I thought. I'm personally on the side it's not the virus but the way he said it in the video was confusing to me.

[eternal talon]

They could also easily just be lying to schaeffer to get rid of him and have no safe worldline to send us to

Irregardless, the collectors we are working with ARE NOT the primary civilization. They are a seperate group that was exiled. They say this themselves

[wintry vector]

That's also a part of my logic right. Like they say they ar3 "collectors" but we don't even know if that word it's self is accurate to what they want or even honest.

[eternal talon]

The word is accurate as that's what they tell schaeffer they are called, it's what they are collecting that is debatable

[wintry vector]

I mean it's the word they used, sure but they could be doing something that isn't accurate to what we are interpreting is meant by someone saying they are a "collector". A hoarder and an mtg player might both call themselves collectors but are doing two different things.

[eternal talon]

The full log is on the wiki if you'd like to pick it apart line by line

All logs are archived there, OG worldline and ALT//.

Even those from outside the game like the SMC website and ambassador emails

I just got a notification about some Projekt Thermonuclear (my mod) stuff, so I gotta scram, but @ me if you have any questions or anything about the lore! I am always around

[wintry vector]

I've read it all, or at least I think I have lol. I was more or less confused that he said that portion like that as the internal logic doesnt make sense to me. So i appreciate you confirming that there isnt a consensus on "what" the collectors are collecting or to what end. I also felt there were a few inconsistencies like the two timelines not having merged yet, but we ran across the og bodies in the alt rundown? But that could have been oversight lol. Otherwise the scaler video was great

Cool cool, no worries. I just finished the video and was rethinking some shit

[coral gorge]

ALT bodies are in R6CX

we play as the OG crew

[lilac island]

is it possible that our bishop is actually one from a different timeline? seeing as he came back from destination with a spare mask that had "his" dna in it

[cunning light]

Those two corpses could have come from yet another membrane, same as the Bishop who made its way back from EF-01 mission in both membranes.
Scaler theory still stands, it is an interesting new take on it.

[coral gorge]

that would be dumb tho

why add yet another team into the mix

especially as it seems like we play as the OG crew

[cunning light]

the "Bishop Mask" incident was already present in the OG Rundown 6

[coral gorge]

yeah

but adding a whole team

that somehow got to the ALT worldline

is a bit too much in my opinion

the theory that the og crew was transported to ALT makes a lot more sense in my opinion

[cunning light]

I do not know... If we as a team have been moving throughout different dimensions / membranes ; it would be fair to assume that there must be at least several others doing the same

Not going to the extremes of the Everything Everywhere, All at once movie with sausage fingers

It is a valid theory

(Just to be clear, I am one of the early adopters of the "OG team moved to a different dimension, but in the past, due to the time running differently in some parallel dimensions" theory)

But that was before we had all the recent lore logs, mostly from Alt://R6, which offer a different point of view.

[sudden quarry]

glad someone else thought this tbh

[harsh pike]

Devs aren't afraid to make the lore even more needlessly confusing

[eternal talon]

There is a log in alt//r6 that says schaeffer watched a team in this exact encounter that got killed. No reason that team couldn't have been ours.

[eternal talon]

If we were playing as a different version of our squad it wouldn't be a continuation of our group's story so they'd (devs) be lying.

[burnt wren]

Unreliable narrator is what they call it.

Then again bots always have the same apparel, so hopefully that's a hint they're the same at least.

[cunning light]

I would honestly have preferred if they had chosen different models for these corpses in Alt://R6CX. It looks as you point out an unnecessary complication.

[burnt wren]

I mean...

They do have access to all these cosmetics

Could've been literally anything else

[coral gorge]

yeah thats what i meant we have to be playing as the og squad

[burnt wren]

So them being recoloured originals is... On the nose.

[crisp citrus]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light-gas_gun
How do the hel guns work???

I'm looking at this article and it seems this thing called a rupture disk is important to the firing of hel guns

But I don't think the ones in game have it?

[raw terrace]

why are u lookin so dep into the gun that looks like a piece of paper cause of how thin it is

i mean idk its 2057

my guess is they found out like how to do it without the rupture disk

[crisp citrus]

The stagger makes sense at least

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combustion_light-gas_gun

Maybe the hel guns are these???

[raw terrace]

well checkin the wikipedia page like on the front

HEL stands for this

hybrid electrothermal lighgas
H E L

[fresh gyro]

Are those letters supposed to be lined up

[raw terrace]

just

badly

if ur on phone

it probs looks like shit

[fresh gyro]

Yea

Word.

[raw terrace]

its just to give the idea

u big boi u can se3e it

[polar pulsar]

Wouldn't a decent escape option for R8 be to go to an alternative dimension where the virus doesnt exist?

With all the dimensional research and traveling going on it might be where we end up.

[raw terrace]

think thats kinda what the warden is sayin in ALTr6

[burnt wren]

Problem is: we are infected already. Virus wins every time as long as even 1 patient zero is possible.

Unless we're taking a bath in a violent waterfall of hardcore antiseptics - PHYSICALLY jumping dimensions changes nothing.

[polar pulsar]

Thought so as well. we need to be fully sterilized. Didnt hydrostasis kill the virus?

[burnt wren]

Unclear and unconfirmed.

[polar pulsar]

I guess the next best thing is to move a neonate to the new location

test tube baby

[burnt wren]

2 possibilities

[polar pulsar]

R8 F1. the worst escort mission in existence

🤔

[raw terrace]

:D

[burnt wren]

Actually only one, 2nd theory didn't made sense

[raw terrace]

i imagine somethin like um r5e1 but with terminal commands that move HSUs around

[burnt wren]

Put everyone into hsu (if they do kill the virus), expuse hsu surface to hardcore disinfection and then throw that into the warp hole praying no trace of namv makes it

[cunning light]

Question is : who stays behind to destroy the MWP to ensure the virus cannot "follow" us ?

[polar pulsar]

schaeffer?

[cunning light]

OG Schaeffer would rather not, maybe Alt:// Schaeffer would

[raw terrace]

woods he b the main one :>

[polar pulsar]

or the hacker guy. hes pretty cool

[raw terrace]

it would actually be so funky of one of the team in the last mission had to die lol

[raw terrace]

henrickson my baby

[polar pulsar]

lmao. im getting l4d2 the sacrifice flashbacks

#killbill

[polar pulsar]

we all die in a last stand situation

the longer we live, the more HSUs get carried over

overload is just going deeper and deeper to get more of them

opening up yet another vault like in R7B3

[loud urchin]

couldn't the warden/entity/whatever do that

or a unit or whatever

I mean it's an alien artefact, who knows if it can be meaningfully destroyed anyway

how tf does the virus even use that to transport

[cunning light]

We know that it broke a hydrolic press

[lost drum]

Has anyone tried naming the story arcs? For example, R6 A1, B1, C1, D1 - Kraken's Arc
AX BX CX - Schaeffer's Arc
R7A1 B1 C1 D1 D2 - Revolution Arc
Just a thought out loud

[cunning light]

Might need to drop it into Mount Doom

[burnt wren]

Nah... We don't really have any use for it.

[eternal talon]

i assume they mean the sleepers, but the parasite can stay for months on surfaces

it can ride the MWP, us, the hsus, everything

hell, even the air

[loud urchin]

but how does the virus travel across dimensions or worldlines or timelines or whatever it is to get a foothold

and then spread to become the dominant lifeforce

[eternal talon]

it got to us via the collector ship

[burnt wren]

Us.

The aliens.

[eternal talon]

by infecting and either killing everything or turning everything into sleepers? this one seems kinda obvious chief

[burnt wren]

Actually that is something that needs confirmation

There is a log describing an exposure incident which could be the official namv first infections.

Which means it's just in the air of the inner.

But also there's a possibility one of the insight workers could get it from specimens they have.

[eternal talon]

not really. "dominant lifeforce" is simply a matter of strength vs numbers. you wouldn't say ants are the most dominant force on earth because they are super weak compared to humans, but elaphants or whales aren't compared to humans

[burnt wren]

Not what I was talking about.

[loud urchin]

I'm a bit lost here

[burnt wren]

Let me find it

[eternal talon]

what about?

[loud urchin]

so the virus came from a ship of aliens who want to collect uninfected specimens

a ship that's carrying around the virus and spreading infection?

I could be reading into it wrongly but that seems very antithetical to me

[burnt wren]

I agree with Pachi there - situation feels counter intuitive.

[eternal talon]

we dont know why they crashed into earth, i doubt it was to collect uninfected specimens. they say themselves they are in exhile

We have been in exile for 2-point zero-6-6-3-8-8-8-5-2 times 10 to the power 15 Seconds. We have been waiting.

[burnt wren]

I don't even wanna math that.

But yes, collectors do not add up.

[cunning light]

655 Million years

[eternal talon]

5.3478689e+19... was about to post. thanks cho

[loud urchin]

yeah according to my maths rn, 65,479,900.88 years

rounded to 2 d.p

call it 65479900 I guess

[burnt wren]

Is ship theirs? Why is it infected, which it clearly is? Why do they want uninfected pure specimens, when they are the reason for infection?

Something's off.

[loud urchin]

yeah no it doesn't feel like it works

[cunning light]

2.066 x10^15 = 20,660,000,000,000,000
divided by 86400 (seconds in a day)
divided by 365
655 124 302 years

[eternal talon]

**VOICE 1
Did you "collect" those creatures?

VOICE 2
Yes. They are the Collection. They are impure. We have been in exile for 2-point zero-6-6-3-8-8-8-5-2 times 10 to the power 15 Seconds. We have been waiting.

VOICE 1
For what?

VOICE 2
In this membrane, a resolution has been determined.

VOICE 1
A resolution to what?

VOICE 2
Conclusion: the Collection cannot be completed. The virus is the primary life force of membranes in which it exists. All will become impure. In this membrane, and all we have traveled.

VOICE 1
This membrane? But, outside of this place, this facility, there may be people working on a cure--

VOICE 2
96.35% of humans in this membrane are impure. The virus is the primary life force. The humans must leave.**

[loud urchin]

like I don't want to believe in the multiple worldlines because it's such a headache

[eternal talon]

^ i'm sure this has one real meaning and we are probably overthinking it

[eternal talon]

oh we are faaar beyond that. there are ~9 we go to in gameplay alone so far

[loud urchin]

breaking news: 70% isopropyl alcohol found to break down the molecular structure of viruses

a resolution has been determined

[eternal talon]

its more bioweapon than virus tbh

[loud urchin]

well if it's biological in nature it can only be made out of so many things

[eternal talon]

its not earth physiology

[burnt wren]

Bigius shrugius

Hmmm

[cunning light]

We are the resolution !

[burnt wren]

I'm getting a vibe there

First of all what "creatures"? It could be Schaeffer is reffering to sleepers, but...

[cunning light]

As per new studies, the Global ice age over 600 million years ago dramatically changed the face of Earth.

hmmmm

[eternal talon]

**Yes. They are the Collection. They are impure. ** -- We have been waiting.
In this membrane, a resolution has been determined.
Conclusion: the Collection cannot be completed.

96.35% of humans in this membrane are impure. The virus is the primary life force. The humans must leave.

[loud urchin]

Even if it is not terrestrial in origin, surely it isn't made out of any elements or molecules that humans wouldn't understand

[eternal talon]

they dont want humans here. they want a world of only sleepers

they are NOT saving us

[loud urchin]

I hate how everything seems to be such a nothing burger

[burnt wren]

I think they are hinting that they are exiled precisely because their collection got the mold, so to speak. So they are trying to get a new fresh one but it keeps getting moldy.

We might be the new collection. Real one, this time.

[loud urchin]

"we have a resolution
our conclusion is we can't complete this collection"

ok, cool, so the resolution is realising that you can't complete your specimens in jars collection? or is it to do whatever other thing

[eternal talon]

it says in plan text they collect the creatures, not us

[cunning light]

Can't they just wait a bit ? After all, we should all get infected / dead soon

Comparatively to how long they have been waiting

[eternal talon]

they are the collection

[burnt wren]

Cho has a point. It doesn't matter.

Something doesn't add up.

[eternal talon]

until you consider schaeffer and his resistance. warden doesn't have control over him

[cunning light]

I honestly do not see why the Collectors would want to help us, but we might as well take any help we can get. We are completely screwed otherwise

[burnt wren]

The mimic started glitching at the end of the conversation and saying random bullshit.

[eternal talon]

and what about isolated groups on the surface?

[burnt wren]

Can we be sure everything it says is a 100% clear coin?

[eternal talon]

stuff like greenland and iceland

[cunning light]

Pretty sure it would be the same for other membranes then, not just ours "OG" one

[eternal talon]

no, but thats the point. its tricking schaeffer to willingly go. it promises a clean membrane to send him to

not a death trap

[eternal talon]

(my head is screaming from this sentence but i cannot say because its spoilers)

fuck i hate knowing more than i should because i cant talk about it

[cunning light]

You should not have peeked under the curtain !

[coral gorge]

someone called upon the dark spirits of d a t a m i n i n g and is now paying the price i see

[burnt wren]

The importance of self denial

[eternal talon]

its not denial. i know exactly what is going to happen at the finale of r8 now. like, no joke

[coral gorge]

damn

[burnt wren]

Not what I was saying

[coral gorge]

I guess frosty is no longer just a lore person but a full on prophet

c o o l

[eternal talon]

usually a prophet can fortell what they know, but in this case i can't because against da rules

[burnt wren]

I should preemptively hide this channel to avoid spoilers now, where before I had to do it upon fresh release

[coral gorge]

The dark spirits have given you the knowledge but you still cant act!

actually

that sounds like the plot of some movie/book

[cunning light]

Do not worry about that Artek, I know what she is not allowed to disclose

[coral gorge]

that the main character can foresee the future but cant do anything to avoid it

[eternal talon]

you in modding server?

[coral gorge]

those regulations cease to exist with the R8 release right?

[cunning light]

No, but I know more than you do, and will leave it at that

[eternal talon]

well yeah obv

[burnt wren]

I think there was a movie with Mr Die Hard in primary role

[cunning light]

I believe there would be spoiler channels or rules to enforce then

[burnt wren]

I completely forgot his name. Statehem? No, that's the other guy...

[coral gorge]

even the goddamn mods are making deals with the dark spirits

[cunning light]

As I recall, there is a two weeks period following the release of a new Rundown, where new content should not be openly disclosed

[eternal talon]

true

[cunning light]

(At least it used to be the case in the past, unless I am mistaken)

[eternal talon]

was the same with r6ex and r7

though i thiiiink lore channel was safe with spoiler tags

[cunning light]

Well, it is bound to contain mostly spoilers, when R8 releases. But still, the most heavy ones should remain spoiler tagged (at least that is how we do it on the french Discord server)

I am quite sure there will be an announcement in due time

[loud urchin]

now I'm wondering if this is because

1. You have access to information most people don't have and are under NDA
2. You're so confident and sure of your prediction that you know think you know exactly what'll happen and you expect retribution for being saying it right now because you'll be right

[burnt wren]

I think she datamined a new tileset / biome / unique room that can only be interpreted one way.

[loud urchin]

she

[burnt wren]

Dammit!

[loud urchin]

wait why is that stuff even in the game

[cunning light]

3. Datamined assets taken from the datablocks, before they were completed / ready to be added to the game

[loud urchin]

I mean maybe if it was an unused asset from before that's being purposed for r8

[queen gazelle]

Data mind! Some funny things

[cunning light]

Let us leave the conversation at that.

[queen gazelle]

you don’t want us talking about the cool thing

[cunning light]

Oh, I want you to talk about all the cool things. Just... Not yet.

[burnt wren]

Yeah, don't.

[cunning light]

When it is ready and everyone has access to it

[loud urchin]

datamined spoilers are eh

like, keep those in your pockets

[coral gorge]

t h e d a r k s p i r i t s

[queen gazelle]

They aren’t even the most accurate most of the time.

[cunning light]

I wish we could get more official leaks though, but that it another story

[queen gazelle]

If they didn’t want me finding it they wouldn’t have put it in my pc tbh

[cunning light]

A new Discord functionality is nice but... Show us something from the game please ! :)

[wintry vector]

👀

[eternal talon]

its not 1. I'm not a part of pre-release testing.
people have just been posting tons of stuff in the modding server's datamining channel recently -- also retribution? thats a strong word

[cunning light]

Mistakes may have been made. It happens.

[eternal talon]

cho is right. there are TONS of things in the datablocks, (not even talking about r8 stuff here, just abandoned/unfinished assets). The devs tend to include stuff in the DBs hidden and update them slowly over time. No idea why. The stuff in question is labeled "r8" in the code so thats why its of note. people are posting more recently there because some of these tiles are being added/updated despite not being in the game yet

[burnt wren]

You can't hear it - but I'm booing

[loud urchin]

Similar sentiment here

Pretty awful that any meaningful discussion or theory crafting is kinda thrown out the window by meta knowledge being out there

And no, that's not an attack on anyone, just a lamentation of the circumstances

[cunning light]

To reuse the game terms, I feel that "impure meta knowledge" does not necessarily need to "infect" unbiased and factual opinion of people who do not have access to it.
I know full well that it takes quite a bit of mental flexibility to keep for yourself what you know, and accept what others can have established based on their own knowledge.

[eternal talon]

i'm not allowed to say confirm/deny anything i know for that reason.

(based on the datamined suff ofc) its not the be-all end all. there are zero datamined logs or anything

[coarse canyon]

https://tenor.com/view/homer-brain-monkey-gif-11098413

I can't handle 9

[eternal talon]

OG, Destination, OGr6D4 1st jump, OGr6D4 2nd jump, OGr6D4 3rd jump, ALT//, (wherever alt//durant went), and the place the collectors want to send us

okay, so technically 8, not 9

+1 from wherver the collectors came from, +~100-300 for each species' world hammerstein recovered from the fossil, +1 if you consider the ef01 platform bishop mask to be neither ours, or alt//bishop's.

[lilac island]

I'm completely fine with data mining for lore because the lore makes no sense

[cunning light]

It is not supposed to make sense until you get the full picture. This is how it has been designed, as far as we can tell more and more

[lilac island]

Cho the only thing with more holes than this game's plot is a pasta strainer

There's conflicting information

[cunning light]

Like a big Scribble.io drawing

[lilac island]

In like at least 3 areas

[cunning light]

But I would agree that there are some plotholes that will be tough to fill

I guess we can see what R8 has to offer in terms of answers for these, THEN question the devs about it if something is still out of place

[grizzled frost]

They kinda forced themselves into plothole land when they went into "multiple dimensions" stuff

[cunning light]

At least it is not time travel !

[grizzled frost]

Since that's pretty much code for "yes we don't know where to go so we just gonna give us lore justification for infinite asspulls"

[lilac island]

• How isn't the earth dead if the virus got out 1k years ago if it's the most infectious and deadly thing ever
• What the hell is Infection/Disinfection
  -What the hell do the parasites actually look like, logs say they're small bugs, in game there are huge eggs and big worms
• How the hell is Scheaffer alive

I don't remember anything else right now

But there's more

[grizzled frost]

TT is almost as bad but at least it can involve some in story consistency if it's closed loop/single timeline

Multiverse stuff is straight up "well there are infinite variations/twists that we can access at our convenience"

[lilac island]

Oh also

Actually nevermind

Doesn't matter

Point is lore is inconsistent

[coral gorge]

for point 1 - mayans were just absolute god gamers

[cunning light]

How isn't the earth dead if the virus got out 1k years ago if it's the most infectious and deadly thing ever
=> When it got out, it was "contained" because of the very limited travel opportunities at that time. The chicxulub area was not as densely populated and victims probably stayed there
=> In our story, it was able to spread because it did not stay contained into the Complex, and got spread by SMC employees having a spring break in Florida despite being sick

What the hell is Infection/Disinfection
=> I honestly have no idea what it represents exactly :(

What the hell do the parasites actually look like, logs say they're small bugs, in game there are huge eggs and big worms
=> There are multiple different mutated forms of the parasite, as stated in a few logs

How the hell is Scheaffer alive
=> OG Schaeffer is dying. He is most likely infected, and is experiencing the effects of the first few stages of NAM-V. I am not sure how he survived that long
=> Alt://Schaeffer, on the other hand, does not sound sick at all. He somehow evaded contamination so far, maybe due to a very good plot armor

[lilac island]

No way. This thing is immortal and travels through any means possible. Water, air, fomiles, blood, anything. It would have began infecting animals then the continent would have died, then the earth. NAMV isn't constrained by what normak diseases are

Also alt and og is too much for my peanut brain

[grizzled frost]

Can't have plotholes if you have so many timelines that it's impossible to follow them all

[cunning light]

Actually you can. The whole infection mechanism is pushing the limits between gameplay and disease reality a bit too much I believe :)

(Well, you always have the "This is a video game" trump card, but still could do with more explanation of how disinfect packs and station work exactly)

[grizzled frost]

Eh, I think this one is pretty all right

[lilac island]

No

It isn't

It's dum

[grizzled frost]

Like you just wash away most of the contagious stuff all over our gear

Which slows it down a bit

[lilac island]

Its in your lungs

Also it's not namv

It's some other mystery illness

But even then it's extremely weird

[grizzled frost]

Well, let's wait for when we discover it's something that we pulled from another universe

[lilac island]

When r8

I need lore answers

[grizzled frost]

We get pulled into alt:alt:alt timeline where namV lost

The End

[lilac island]

And then we infect that timeline too because we forgot to scrub behind the ears

There is no possibility of a good ending

[cunning light]

Dammit Hackett, I told you to scrub better !

[grizzled frost]

No no, that would make too much sense and be a logical explanation, so it can't happen

[lilac island]

Our prisoners can't get evacuated

We can't do anything to save this timeline

The collectors are basically extinct

If warden wins and we get evacuated, cool, we infect another timeline

If dumbass Scheaffer wins, cool, we go outside and die a horrible death from namv

The only solution is a cure kr vaccine or something but that seems to be impossible

[grizzled frost]

That's the issue

Nothing is impossible with multiverse

We can just stumble our way into a place with a cure or where the disease can't survive or whatever

[eternal talon]

We actually just verifiably disproved nam-v is infection yesterday, because of syringes.

[lilac island]

The laws of physics are the same

It's just different events

There are impossible things

[grizzled frost]

Why is that guaranteed? We already know time flows differently, which is a pretty huge difference

[lilac island]

Because if the laws of physics were not constant between timelines then I'm going to hurt someone

[grizzled frost]

Still leaves a lot of room for another timeline where the virus never got out of the facility at all, for example

[lilac island]

Yes

[grizzled frost]

"Oh hey we were trying to warn another Earth to seal the place all along"

[eternal talon]

I agree.

[eternal talon]

To be fair this isn't always the case. Destination time is 85x faster. That's not relative to anything like speed or whatnot, it's the universe as a whole

[grizzled frost]

It gets even worse when we consider that we don't know how to really use the travelling device

Get ready for us to have a "breakthrough" with it

[eternal talon]

Oh no, I need my safety helmet!

[cunning light]

Not in Alt:// ; in this timeline, Destination time is slower, not faster

[grizzled frost]

And oh look at that, wildly different universe with a good outcome

[eternal talon]

Yeah, alt//Durant's team didn't go to destination. They went someplace else, a jungle world

[lilac island]

Quick, order it from the gtfo website

[cunning light]

Unless it IS Destination, but under different time conditions

[eternal talon]

Hahahaha also I'm pretty sure they did at one point used to sell those diapers and barf bags

[lilac island]

They did

There's still a model there wearing a gtfo diaper

Do we canonically wear tidy whities

[eternal talon]

It's the opposite Tho. Jungle world is slower, not faster, and it's not 85x. It's roughly 30-50%

[lilac island]

Jungle world?

[eternal talon]

I don't think they are modeled so who knows.

[cunning light]

See EF-01 mission logs from Alt://R6

[eternal talon]

The ef01 team in alt// didn't go to the deserts of destination. The log describes dense jungle

[lilac island]

uuh

[eternal talon]

Their coords sent them someplace else

Our ef01 took us to desti

[eternal talon]

Ik man, there are almost a dozen of them. The number of distinct worldlines just keeps growing.

(God let you pray we don't get info on the ones the hundreds of specimens in the inner came from)

As Hammerstein says they are all different

[grizzled frost]

And that's the issue
Free licence to asspull anything needed for the plot

[eternal talon]

This is a thing that keeps getting to me that I noticed in scalers new vid too. They aren't timelines. We aren't traveling through time, just jumping between worlds. Making something already complicated unnecessary more confusing. "Worldline" is the standard term for this Ala Wikipedia

[eternal talon]

Ronald McDonald skin when

McChicken sledgehammer

[cunning light]

I mean, in the theory he develops, he speaks of "timelines" because OG and Alt:// stories develop in parallel

So two parallel "timeline" of events we as players get to experience

[grizzled frost]

McDonalds fries so toxic they kill NamV, Ronald ends up being the hero who defeats the sleepers

[eternal talon]

I mean I guess, but we aren't ever going back. It's always a straight line, even if at some points we are accelerating forward faster. By that logic you could make the point astronauts on the ISS are time traveling

Time traveling forward is easy. We are all doing it effortlessly right now

[cunning light]

I do not think he said we would "go back"

[eternal talon]

Going backwards is where you get into the real nonsense and timey wimey nonsense

[cunning light]

In his view, OG plays the events of OG R1=>R7, while Alt plays Alt://R1=>R6 ; both merge for R8

[eternal talon]

I know I'm just saying. Timeline implies time travel with us jumping between universes but that isn't so. It's not technically wrong I guess, but it can confuse people unnecessary

It's the "red alpha" vs "destination" thing

[cunning light]

Maybe just an ambiguous choice of words, then

But he also uses the "Dimension" term

[eternal talon]

In this case it's a synonym for universe as we haven't seen dimensions within these universes

We haven't gone that deep yet down the rabbit hole

[eternal talon]

Eh, regardless we know this isn't true because of the corpses in alt/r6cx.

And this could just be a me thing, but I wouldn't consider that to be an extension of our squad's story if in alt we were just playing as different versions of ourselves

[cunning light]

But if we "jumped" to the Alt:// universe at the end of R7, why did we jump that far back into R1 in terms of events ?

And where are our copycats at that time then ? Sleeping in HSUs ?

I do agree these two bodies gave me a headache. It would have been oh so much better to put "random" KSO bodies in this room

[eternal talon]

Imo, alt could have just been slower. And I know the dates and stuff relatively match up, I mean like it started later. Ala delayed big bang or whatever created that specific worldline

[grizzled frost]

Different universe, different rules
There is nothing that force them to be aligned
On the contrary time flow is the biggest difference between each line

[eternal talon]

Well if we are to believe the schaeffer log about the squad finding a unit in a group of sleepers and being promptly wiped out, that coulda been the alt// squad

Just died a long time ago

But I should mention that we have no evidence that that was our alt// counterparts, it'd just match up with what we see there

[cunning light]

I just don't want to believe our copycats would die to a simple group of sleepers. The Chads cannot just lose !

[eternal talon]

I agree, but you gotta remember in alt// our characters backstories are also different. Our individual player characters are slightly different

[cunning light]

The character story logs are also present in R5A2 and R5A3, so their backstories are very similar between both universes

[eternal talon]

Who knows If it's just the combination of the perfect set of circumstances that ended up with us

Butterfly effect and what not of such minor differences in history

[cunning light]

You can read / listen to them even easier than in the OG versions

in OG R5A2, you had to filter through many log files to locate the 4 relevant ones

[eternal talon]

Well we know something killed them, that's for sure.

[cunning light]

Now in Alt://R5A2 the terminal only contains the 4 characters log

[eternal talon]

And took Hackett and woods.

Left no trace of em'

Maybe they are sleepers now.

[cunning light]

Like... a Snatcher ? :D

He did not get Maddox for breakfast like it did in OG

[eternal talon]

Different schaeffer, wouldn't have the motivation to do so I would think. Only reason he was reviving people in OG was for his rebellion

[cunning light]

Their backstories are identical, as far as I can tell

Dauda's is the one that differs the most

But only the most recent events, when he was put into an HSU

[eternal talon]

Aren't they all slightly more aggressive in alt//?

I'll admit I've not read too much of that recently

[cunning light]

They sound more ... determined. I would not say angry

I just listened to the logs two days ago

[lilac island]

i really think those two operatives schaeffer saw die were alt us so alt hackett and woods could still be alive

his log lines up with the scene

[cunning light]

H9K-HYR-1TE :
Our local chronometers are operating at normal speed but the mission clock, which was tethered to Garganta's quantum frequency, hasn't moved since we got here.
So either we've lost synchronization, or it broke during the jump, or it's running slow. Very slow.

If I understand correctly, Durant reports that their clocks are running fine on "Destination", but the one tethered to the Complex one runs much slower.
This would tend to indicate that time flows much faster on the Alt:// version of "Destination" as well, or wherever EF-01 team got transported.

Source : https://www.notion.so/ab68b94496bd4b27bec291de65ebd510?v=a7a028814a6849d09280534baa3ce443&p=6755872296e746f5bddd1c0fd4254975&pm=s

[crisp citrus]

If alt Schaeffer is working with the warden, he'd have access to HSUs to periodically reduce his infection etc

So that might be how he's staying ok

[cunning light]

I do not know if we can assume that he is "working with the Warden" just yet, but as one of Alt://R6D1 log say :
"I have spoken to something... someone called the conduit, it's a human clone that you helped make and it speaks for the Warden.
I know... I know, but the Warden is not your enemy, it wants to help.
It has a plan for us, for our species to continue but I'm going to need you.
And if you wanna get out of this place, you will need to trust me and do as I say.
I'll have something for you soon. For now just... stay alive. I'm working on a plan."

[crisp citrus]

Idk I always figured he'd hop in an HSU for a little and set it for timed release

To keep himself alive

[cunning light]

That would be quite convenient

But as far as I know, he never got infected (so far)

At lease he does not show any of the signs described in the numerous medical reports of NAM-V patients at various stages

He did make a trip into an HSU in KDS Deep though, and I do not think we have any log of how he got out...

[burnt wren]

Schaeffer discrepancy still alive and kicking

"It all makes sense, trust me bros" - lead writer when pressured on the matter.

[grizzled frost]

"Trust in the multiverse, bros"

[burnt wren]

There is no hopping in and out of HSUs as far as we know. You have to be awaken by someone else. So that's out of the question.

[cunning light]

The Warden could very well get you out of an HSU

[burnt wren]

Yeah, but why would he do that with Schaeffer post escape.

If anything Schaeffer is afraid of climbing into any HSUs because he knows Warden will just brainwash him again.

[tawny peak]

that or starve

[burnt wren]

OG Schaeffer would rather die at that point.

[tawny peak]

[coarse canyon]

wait a minute.... when we jump... we are jumping dimensions, i got that, but we are jumping to alternative "earth" dimensions where time moves faster, meaning that time is also technically in the future, so we are jumping to late stage infection earth sites?

https://tenor.com/view/andy-parksandrecreation-wtf-confused-noidea-gif-4648337

[burnt wren]

That could be one of the possibilities, but no confirmation for now.

That's the thing about multiverse writing - you can say whatever and it can be true.

[coarse canyon]

How isn't the earth dead if the virus got out 1k years ago if it's the most infectious and deadly thing ever

i think the devs were trying to imply that humanity was in a state in that area where it was largely tribal. Its both infectious and lethal, so for the 1/20 that didn't die, they became monsters. Basically the "infection" ran out of steam because it couldn't find new hosts before running out of energy

[lilac island]

It doesn't run out of steam

The parasite keeps it alive forever

NAMV doesn't have any such weaknesses

Then those sleepers and or infected animals would have slowy but definitely infected the continent

[burnt wren]

We still have no idea what Kraken's deal is.

[coarse canyon]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classic_Maya_collapse

This is likely the "historical" representation of what the devs were aiming for

[crisp citrus]

So maybe he goes in and out of HSUs often

But idk writes down important info nearby so he can refresh his memory

[crisp citrus]

He could isolate some from the biocom network

There's tons of HSUs all over

[crisp citrus]

Or it's set for a timed release. The warden is able to wake us up but isn't a person, therefore a computer can wake up an HSU, therefore setting it to automatically open in a week would be possible

[burnt wren]

Hm. The mars mission did wake up on schedule... Or perhaps it was ship AI, if there was any.

Either way no point speculating, we just have to wait for R8.

[crisp citrus]

Bold of you to think r8 will answer all questions

[lilac island]

They better

[eternal talon]

Can't be set like that. You need help being woken otherwise your brian will melt. (Hydrokinetic fluid)

[eternal talon]

OG warden didn't have access to KDS-DEEP until r5e1. Schaeffer is out and about in r4.

[eternal talon]

Big fish

Other than that, I agree

[eternal talon]

Still, without being connected to the warden/biocom, hydrokinetic fluid needs to be administered manually. He couldn't do that for himself.

[burnt wren]

How did mars mission do it

[eternal talon]

They didn't? That's literally why they all went insane?

Same as Maddox

[burnt wren]

Wasn't an implication that they forgot why they were there?

[eternal talon]

Hydrostasis does that, being woken correctly or not

[burnt wren]

The log in question didn't call out the melting of the brain, only long term memory damage.

[eternal talon]

Iirc they lost connection with the ship almost immediately after the people woke up and it sounded bad

[burnt wren]

I guess we can add it to unreliable narrator pile.

[eternal talon]

That wasn't introduced until r6

It is one of the older logs

[burnt wren]

Is it? Off I go to search

[eternal talon]

Hydrostasis is not without its critics. Many have decried Kovac Research's tendency to gloss over the problems found in the recently completed first human trials - namely that participants have suffered some neural degradation and “minor” memory loss.

Looks like they were downplaying the degradation too.

[burnt wren]

R5 - "minor memory loss"

Mars expedition is first mentioned in R6

[eternal talon]

Ye. I just saw that mb

[burnt wren]

I remember it because it was one of my first logs I read in the game itself