gtfo-related-questions

[burnt inlet]

The only meaningful one if I remember correctly

[tiny wyvern]

moth it's the only one that gets it bcs of a bug

none of the other ones can get back damage

(At least that's what I've been able to understand)

[frail heart]

Yes

[burnt inlet]

I thought shotgun sentry still got it

Or smth

I don’t remember

[tiny wyvern]

No it doesn't

Only hel auto does for some reason

[frail heart]

bro is cooked

[burnt inlet]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1276146129372844173/1296985919181815918/ezgif-7-5875e47d1e.gif

I don’t use shotgun sentry enough to learn it’s quirks

[frail heart]

pub

[hoary mason]

It's really good with bio

[burnt inlet]

good at killing teammates

[winter breach]

Good at shooting the dead

[fleet tusk]

guys I had issue where gtfo game keep going back to fullscreen after change to borderless
any solution for this?

nvm found the solution
apparently my Nvidia Setting force my GTFO into fullscreen
just need to change setting in Nvidia setting then fix the problem

[arctic vine]

Do you unlock the next rundown if you join someone else's game midgame?
Like someone is doing R2D1 and you haven't unlocked R2E1 and you joined that someone when they are at the last segment of the rundown.

[thick stump]

every A1 mission from every rundown is unlocked from the very beginning

so you basically can do R1A1 to R8A1

[arctic vine]

oh i meant stage

or mission, not the entire rundown mb

[thick stump]

if you join someone, you can play that stage and if you finish that stage, it will count as completed

[arctic vine]

so that would unlock the stages that prerequisites that stage?

[dapper kestrel]

you get the clear for it if you joined mid game yea. in your example, you still wouldnt be able to choose r2e1 yourself if you dont have a clear in like r2c1 tho

[tardy ingot]

Thats cuz E tiers require all available levels in the rundown to be cleared

[frail heart]

Only your clears affects what levels you have unlocked

[arctic vine]

i see, i think i understand now

thanks

[frail heart]

🙏

[thick stump]

you can just try it out and you will see for yourself, you will figure it out 👍

you won't lose anything about progression, so don't worry

[arctic vine]

only 1 game got to the finale out of 20+ in R2D1 i'm so sick of it aaaaa
alrighty thanks very much

[tardy ingot]

If you ever need advice you can always ask here

[frail heart]

r2e1 is quite a bit harder lol

[arctic vine]

my pair and myself is not prepared but we will persevere!

[thick stump]

R2D1 is just tedious and slow, some crazy people can speedrun it but I am not one of them, so I took like 1,5h to complete it my first time, but the level itself is actually not so hard

[thick stump]

so you are playing 2 and 2 bots?

[arctic vine]

yeah

most of the time

[thick stump]

my first time completing that mission was me and 3 bots, I took very long time but it was easier for me than playing with my friends because they always woke everything up and this costed us ammo and hp, so we moved to another rundown meanwhile I cleared R2D1 someday later alone xD

[arctic vine]

gg lmao, I do think I'm the one who messes up more in our duo

[thick stump]

I think you just need more experience, so it is better to start another rundown and then take it more easy and practice

I did the same, I also played other rundowns because E missions were just too crazy

[arctic vine]

the main issue i think in all our runs on R2D1 is the fog being omnipresent

[thick stump]

the thing is, you can somehow go around it if you do the zones first, which are higher, so the fog is reaching them as much

also if you play with bots, you can command them to go and pick up the cell, because they can dive into the fog without getting infected

[tardy ingot]

1. Fog repellers
2. dont stealthkill enemies in fog ever
3. chose the right route

[thick stump]

what Eva means with 'don't stealthkill enemies in the fog' you can shoot one bullet and wake up the room, close the door, put a mine behind it and just kill them that way

or when there is no door, just shoot down somewhere save

[digital mural]

That

If you feel the room is extremely risky to stealth or to melee kill scouts
Blast your way through

[arctic vine]

i shall be noting these

[thick stump]

also, I am not sure how do you know about R2D1, every single cell you input in the generators, the fog lowers a bit and there is also an extra zone where you have to use a cell but you get a ton of resources and another cell

[arctic vine]

we noticed

[safe cradle]

Wait

did someone ask of R2D1: Statistics?

Nice level

[ocean spindle]

[[R2D1]] statistics

[gray rapids]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/R2D1

[harsh heath]

slendo [no funny version] [Fish] was playing

[arctic vine]

update: we won 👍🏿 i wasn't there for the first 3/4

another question, what are the yellow highlighted stages

[thick stump]

as far as I know lore missions but I could be mistaken

[ocean spindle]

yes story missions

either by logs or things that happen

usually things that happen

[thick stump]

so yellow missions should start with R5, right?

[ocean spindle]

r6

[tardy ingot]

The actual thing they are is:

priority expeditions

Started with r6

[ocean spindle]

:O

[arctic vine]

We should've been doing those instead???

dang

[tardy ingot]

Following them is going to show you the most important part of the story at that point

[tardy ingot]

No

[thick stump]

they are only for the story, not that you should do them at first

[arctic vine]

oh

safe

[tardy ingot]

also, all levels do belong to the story

The priority ones just indicate higher story telling usually

[arctic vine]

i see, alrighty, i'll make sure to inform my team

many more thanks for info

[harsh heath]

Forsaken was playing

[vivid umbra]

How the heck do the bots work???

Like, the communication wheel KINDA works with them a little bit
but mostly doesn’t?

[uneven kiln]

the communication wheel only works for placing/picking up tools and then picking up/placing down objective items, and then follow me (in co op)

in terms of bots, that is

[vivid umbra]

It also works for “let’s go quiet” (i think, could be placebo)

[fathom ice]

na

bots never start stealthing by themselves either

and they also only shoot awake enemies

oh and their shooting is silent so nothing can wake up from it

[uneven kiln]

Adding the follow me to the list (co op only)

[vivid umbra]

That seems.. slightly exploitable

[uneven kiln]

yes, yes it is

bots are incapable of making any noise and are also immune to enemy screams and tendrils

so if you wake a sleeper with a bot near you there's a chance it screams at the bot (yes screams are targeted for some reason) and it will therefore make no noise, room stays asleep

[vivid umbra]

It is now my headcanon that their guns are actually loaded with silent blanks
they just kill enemies by sheer force of willpower and belief.

[gleaming saffron]

wait, really?!!?!!!!

[uneven kiln]

yes

it really should not work that way, but it does

[gleaming saffron]

thank 10 chambers for code slop

at least they didn't vibe code...

[hard musk]

theres a lot of misc jank with enemy/bot interactions

like R6D3
the overload error breaks when bots follow the person going to shut off the terminal, making them nearly guaranteed to wake the cocoon room and wipe
the error in main just a few minutes later does NOT break in the same way, that error will always spawn in the designated zone

in fact, i think R6D3 overload is the only fixed spawn point error in GTFO that breaks because of bots

[fathom ice]

overload error always spawns at elevator

and shadow error only spawns in the same room

or well from there

[grizzled patrol]

untill they stop spawning there and you are fucked

[hard musk]

yeah, that is how it works

but if the bot follows the person going to shut off overload error

the overload error spawns will follow that bot

and not just targeting on spawn

they spawn 2 rooms away from the bot, which causes immense problems

[fathom ice]

yes it targets people IN the zones as well

you just never notice cuz it's one person

[fathom ice]

that is also just incorrect

[hard musk]

i wish i kept a recording, cause it would explain better than words
for D3 ovl, you want the team to hold in B as 1 or 2 people go through C to get to the cocoon zone, and then continue to shut off the error

the error, with normal players, always spawns enemies in A, regardless of which person the enemy is targeting when it spawns

the errors, with a bot or multiple bots, if they all stay with the person holding, nothing goes any differently

BUT
if one or more bots follows the player hunting to shut off the error, the enemies spawning from that error will ignore spawning in A, and spawn 2 rooms away from the bot, from the direction of spawn

[ocean spindle]

well dont let them

[hard musk]

which means if the error hunting play is in B of the zone after the cocoon, the enemies can spawn IN the cocoon room

[ocean spindle]

make the person defending take bots

[hard musk]

yes, i know

[fathom ice]

i just don't believe you

[hard musk]

thats what me and my partner figured out the hard way

[fathom ice]

like i would bet more that something just leaked

[hard musk]

no, its just straight up they spawned in the cocoon room, or in C and ran in the cocoon room

[burnt inlet]

is this R6D3?

[hard musk]

yes

[burnt inlet]

theyre set spawns i believe?

[fathom ice]

yes

correct

[hard musk]

and only with bots following the player going to shut off the error

[fathom ice]

it is set to be elevator

[hard musk]

yes they are

[grizzled patrol]

i can vouch for that. this shit is real

[hard musk]

with normal people, it never breaks

[fathom ice]

my bad chef

[ocean spindle]

why would it do that that sounds weird
im trying in my brain to thnk of a why

[hard musk]

ill try to queue it up and show

IDFK why it does that

its so weird that i promise i couldnt make it up

its the ONLY level where it happens

[burnt inlet]

download replay mod

and send the replay fiile

[ocean spindle]

itis about the onlylvl with set spawns as those that can actively b broken

maybe r7e1 too?

[hard musk]

i dont know for R7E1, havent gotten an attempt past the blood door with 2 bots

[ocean spindle]

its weirdfor enemies to be set for a spawn and have it not be natural

so

funk funk

[hard musk]

its so weird too

because the shadow error in the SAME level

[fathom ice]

don't worry i'm testing the theory right now

[hard musk]

doesnt break

its ONLY the overload error that breaks

[grizzled patrol]

i dont remember if it really was because of bots, but i do remember a run where they were spawning everywhere but the elevator. Holding it was so fucking ass

[burnt inlet]

gtfo is a game without any bugs btw team

[ocean spindle]

if it was a duo could it be cuz of ur friendo standin IN spawn, and shadows being forced onto another spawn?

like standing in the elevator

[hard musk]

i was standing in B

my friend was host and terminal hunting

we tried the reverse and the same thing happened

so client/host doesnt matter

its the bots themselves that break it

[ocean spindle]

ok yeah no its weird

[hard musk]

its so fucking weird

i hate it

it confused me and my friend for so long because we werent sure if it was client or what

we tested what on earth could be breaking it and the only common thruline

was that the person going to deactivate the error, had a bot, and on those runs, the enemies spawned 2 rooms away from them, instead of only A of spawn zone

[fathom ice]

so I replicated the exact setup that you were using and nothing has spawned anywhere except elevator

[hard musk]

thats so weird

well, ill have to try to replicate it then, and if it turns up nothing, then i dont know what was going on

[fathom ice]

like i think you just had a leak and no one noticed it

cuz well you have only one person looking out for smalls

so if they don't notice one small from any wave it's just ggs

[hard musk]

i am certain it was not a leak

the doors were closed and it was not broken when we wiped

i find it far more likely that the spawns broke than smalls teleporting through doors to wake the cocoon room

[fathom ice]

well i was afking in b of zone after respawn with a bot

and my partner was just meleeing for 10 minutes

and nothing spawned anywhere except elevator

[hard musk]

your partner went in through and past the cocoon zone, with a bot?

ill try and get footage

[fathom ice]

no i went in

yes

[hard musk]

I FOUND IT LOL

and i have video proof

for some reason its when host took bishop specifically that it broke

it wasnt breaking when host had dauda, i was hackett, and bishop was my bot

https://youtu.be/Yz7BJDWTOdQ

video starts when host suggests switching bots, so he gets bishop, i get dauda
there are timestamps for when the spawns shift and break, and you can see at those points that nothing ran through A, they spawned in those rooms

my best guess is that the spawns break specifically because its a bot that was assigned to a client?

because i went with bishop in the same run and the spawns didnt break

so it might be that the spawns are based on whichever player character is closest to the spawning point, and if the assigned bot doesnt match who theyre supposed to be with, it causes this?

if i tried doing the same thing with host's dauda it would likely maybe break as well

[fathom ice]

i think it's just host client interaction

and desync

[hard musk]

i have the full run, its def not desync

it only happened after we switched bots

we were in the error for a while

he went with dauda, spawns were fine

i went with bishop, spawns were fine

[burnt inlet]

Average GTFO bug

[hard musk]

and then he suggested we switch bots and the spawns broke instantly

ill upload the full run if further proof is wanted, it def wasnt a freak accident or shoddy connection or anything

[vivid umbra]

Oh also are the bots different in any way?

[grizzled patrol]

Yes

[ocean spindle]

beween them or

[hard musk]

if this means modded or any sort of custom logic, no, this was run entirely vanilla, without any bugfix mods or anything we usually run

we wanted to be certain that this was the game itself being screwy, and not a culprit of any mods

so this is just:
Host: Woods (GhostlyMire)
Bot: Dauda
Client: Hackett (Me)
Bot: Bishop

though, tbf, i think we tested R6D3 overload before we started modding, we started modding because of R6D4 killing one of our runs due to spitterbug causing my game to crash before the final error alarm, and thats when we started adding bugfixes

if it means bots are different from players, yes they are
they cannot wake enemies without directly shooting them, if enemies target them with a scream, the room will not wake, they do not collide with enemies, and a whole host of stuff that makes them both stupid and stupidly OP

[vivid umbra]

Oh no I meant like, between bots
like are hackett, Dauda, and bishop, actually any better or worse at certain subjects? I remember someone saying to give one specific one the biotracker

[hard musk]

nah theres no real difference

[vivid umbra]

(I do apologize, i’m really terrible at phrasing things clearly)

[hard musk]

its just favoritism from personal experience

and preference of voicelines

from what ive been able to observe, all of them have the exact same AI

its just that the different ways they naturally position around other bots tends to put some in better or worse positions than others

dauda tends to run in front of my gunfire more often than the other bots because he's naturally closer to the enemies than the other bots most of the time, for example

[digital mural]

No

They are all the same

[hard musk]

but if dauda, or hackett, or bishop are the only bot, they all behave the same

[digital mural]

We just like to joke one is better than the other and stuff

[hard musk]

yeah

[digital mural]

Somehow in my runs Bishop is always throwing, Duada is glitching himself and Hackett is soloing entire waves

[hard musk]

for me its flipped around a bit

dauda is always walking in front of my guns, bishop always glitches into walls, and hackett either balls out or does nothing

and i do think thats just a result of how the bots are ordered to space out

it tends to put hackett in the back so he spends the least time trying to melee waves and sticking to his guns more

(also he just has some of the best biotracker dialogue)

close runner up is woods for his best line:
"i got dick." when biotrack ADSing when no enemies are around

[normal granite]

My tierlist for bots:
S: hackett
A: bishop
B: woods
C:
D: dauda

[tiny wyvern]

We Must Bioscan!

[gentle forge]

can the hel revolver one shot strikers to the head?

[sturdy glen]

no

[little pilot]

Only with boosters

[gentle forge]

ah ok, couldn't remember

I know that it has pierce but it's only 2 right

[timber shoal]

yes

[gentle forge]

it's tough for me to choose it over the dmr given the increased mag capactity; it seems to me that the dmr is generally more useful but maybe i'm just not using it well

[timber shoal]

2 pen is very valuable

especially since the striker breakpoint is the same

[gentle forge]

does 2 pen mean you hit 2 enemies or 3?

[timber shoal]

plus revo reload is practically nonexistent

[timber shoal]

2

[gentle forge]

the hel rev reload is 2.3, same as dmr

[timber shoal]

reload cancel

[gentle forge]

ah

[timber shoal]

makes it under a second

[gentle forge]

I never do that lol

maybe I should

[timber shoal]

it’ll help if you learn it

not explicitly necessary

but helpful

[runic roost]

ill take 2 kills for 2 bullets on a main over dmf def

[timber shoal]

yeppers

[sturdy glen]

sounds like a certain other gun that isnt hel revo

[runic roost]

isnt double tap better over dmr

[runic roost]

indeed without aiming

[sturdy glen]

this weapon sounds incredibly humble as well

curious...

[runic roost]

an exquisite weapon mayhaps

[gentle forge]

it seems to me that dmr is better at crowd control, more times than not, because guys oftentimes aren't lined up to be able to take advantage of the pen, but with the dmr you have 12 shots and can at least stagger and create more space, but I guess this is assuming regular reload times which is irrelevant to you guys if you're reload canceling

[runic roost]

once you start canceling, you dont stop

[gentle forge]

yeah if the revo only takes a single second to reload that's kind of op lol

[runic roost]

should try yit

feel gud

[gentle forge]

what's the easiest way to perform it?

like as it relates to button mappings

[sturdy glen]

shoving

[gentle forge]

do you just press 3/2?

[sturdy glen]

use your quick melee key

[gentle forge]

ah

and it automatically goes back to your revo?

[sturdy glen]

no youll need to swap back

[runic roost]

is scroll wheel good to do?

[sturdy glen]

but its faster than swapping to a gun at the cost of a bit of stam

[gentle forge]

interesting

[sturdy glen]

I have no idea if many ppl even use scroll wheel period in this game lol

[runic roost]

fuck man even in cs and here I still use scroll ☠️

so better to shove and number key?

[little pilot]

If u switch back to the gun before the shoving animation starts u don't actually use stamina btw

[sturdy glen]

you can get a bit more advanced by swapping to your other gun and just using it instead of swapping back

[little pilot]

The timing is weird and a bit unintuitive but generally as long as u are fast the stamina cost doesn't apply

[sturdy glen]

thats the use case for not shoving

or if you REALLY need stam but thats basically never in regular play

[runic roost]

thats what I do with scroll

[sturdy glen]

yeah thats pretty good then

[runic roost]

fairs

[frail heart]

damn rly?

[sturdy glen]

ADS when swapping to the weapon you want to use will also let you shoot earlier

[little pilot]

Yes

No stamina cost as long as the swap back to gun is fast enough

Easy to get consistent

[runic roost]

now that one I really needa get used to cuz I do not do that at all

but the difference is pre gud

[sturdy glen]

its good in general as well yea

[runic roost]

never get used to the nuclear reactor symbol of a crosshair to jumpscare

[little pilot]

U just need to actually learn to always swap gun -> c -> gun insta rather than just the first half

[sturdy glen]

byeah these are mainly to like, really push your uptime on shooting

[runic roost]

can you explain to me in call of duty terms

[runic roost]

in a pub, ya need everything ya got

[sturdy glen]

lol

[gentle forge]

ok so wait, what's the best way to reload cancel lol

I'm seeing different things here

[little pilot]

Press C, then press 2 or 3 depending on gun u reloaded

[sturdy glen]

if you want to use the same gun -> shove swap back
if you want to use your other gun -> swap to other gun

[gentle forge]

got it

and when do you do the switch?

[runic roost]

or mouse 4

[gentle forge]

like as it relates to the animation

[sturdy glen]

the ammo will update on your UI

[gentle forge]

ah ok

[frail heart]

^

and eventually it just becomes muscle memory

[little pilot]

Reload once and look at top right. When ammo gets updated that's when the gun is reloaded, every frame of animation after can be cancelled

[sturdy glen]

for most guns the timing roughly makes sense with the animation

but its not really a general rule

[runic roost]

in most cases its when youu hear that click in all the guns

[little pilot]

Some guns have a sound that syncs up for example Hel Revo which makes it easy

[sturdy glen]

you kinda just learn it for most guns

[little pilot]

Some guns don't such as sniper

[sturdy glen]

and a lot of guns its early enough that even doing it poorly will be good still

[runic roost]

revolver my king ❤️

[sturdy glen]

the way it works internally is an arbitrary number given to every gun so it doesnt have any real connection to the animation

[gentle forge]

another q - does ads with biotracker do anything or just let you see the screen better?

[gentle forge]

but in effect it does because it's the same every time right?

[sturdy glen]

correct

ig I should rephrase that in the future when explaining

mentioning stamina also feels like a waste of text ngl

no one learning reload cancel is ever gonna need to care about that

[little pilot]

Stamina doesn't get used anyway as long as the swap from shove is fast enough anyway. So it doesn't matter at all.

[frail heart]

tgb stop gatekeeping info!

[civic wave]

functionally no, but you can use it to "break" the swap animation to start your ping sooner

[ionic galleon]

what weapons do I bring against big charger error alarms?

big chargers in general*

[burnt inlet]

Scattergun usually (assuming R5B1), sawed off is fine too

[ionic galleon]

how does error alarm spawning work? can they only spawn in explored rooms

[burnt inlet]

Generally it’s 2 rooms away from your group, however if there’s a ”main” group (ie one with more people) I have found that enemies spawns 2 rooms away from that meaning they can spawn on top of you, @tardy ingot could prolly fact check cuz this is smth I don’t know much in

Also what’s the level?

[ionic galleon]

it was R5B1

[burnt inlet]

🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

Fuck that secondary tho

[ionic galleon]

is it better to do overload first?

[burnt inlet]

But generally I’d say shoot one wave of big chargers then run into zones with ur group

[burnt inlet]

Reactor first

I think sec was the bad part of the level

[[R5B1]]

[gray rapids]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/R5B1

[burnt inlet]

Yes do overload first

[ionic galleon]

gotcha

[prime musk]

enemies choose one player AT RANDOM and spawns enemies 2 rooms away from that players "group".

the "group" of a player is all the players in rooms connected to each other with no gaps

it's likelier for it to spawn on the smaller group because there is a bigger chance for it to roll from the main group

[burnt inlet]

Also @ionic galleon you can pull the ”wrong” error alarm, run to the correct one, enter correct zone and find hsu to have another zone of loot

[burnt inlet]

And you don’t even need to finish scan

[tardy ingot]

If you arent daisy chained then stuff can spawn on top of people (or close) depending on distance

Bigger group only matters in terms of chance for spawn direction

If its

Room - room - 1 player - room - 3 player

Then there is a higher chance for it to spawn on the „1 player“ than on „Room“ or „3 player“

[burnt inlet]

Just do hsu and it cancels both

[tardy ingot]

theres also internal chance for directions, but lets ignore that lol

[burnt inlet]

Note you’ll get more BBC’s cuz it’s double the error alarm

But it’s very fun

[burnt inlet]

Team don’t we love this games rng

(It’s mostly fine)

[tardy ingot]

@ionic galleon to explain a bit

R5B1 you do main -> ovl -> sec

if you want to do PE

[ionic galleon]

Do you have some loadouts recommendations I could use?

[burnt inlet]

But yea I’ve had giants spawn on top of me before

[ionic galleon]

I run hel shotgun + veruta

[burnt inlet]

Sawed off scatter/hel rifle/bc/hel gun for everyone (either one of each or more of hel rifle and scatter)

[burnt inlet]

Veruta into giants moment

Defo have at least one scatter

[ionic galleon]

Are swarms worth shooting at with scatter

[prime musk]

veruta will not cut it for the overload. you need more firepower, which can be found in the guns suggested by moth

[ionic galleon]

or just big guys

[burnt inlet]

Yes

[prime musk]

if you hit 2 smalls or more with scatter it is worthwhile shooting

[tardy ingot]

are you doing it solo with 3 bots?

[ionic galleon]

yeah for now

[tardy ingot]

zed im not sure what optimal gun is for solo/bots reactor tbh

was it hel rifle or burst cannon?

[burnt inlet]

All bots on burst cannon

[frail heart]

bc

[prime musk]

i haven't touched r5b1 reactor with bots, but for r2d2 i gave bots BC and it worked very well

[frail heart]

bots are cracked with bc its wild

they can burst cancel

[prime musk]

for r1c2 i gave them HEL rifle and it also worked very well

[burnt inlet]

@ionic galleon burst rifle burst cannon bots and urself on sawed off and hel rifle

[prime musk]

i think either work, but burst cannon has more going for it

[burnt inlet]

Make sure to stagger BBC’s

[tardy ingot]

i meant for player moreso

Bots obviously on bc

[prime musk]

hel rifle for player for sure then

[burnt inlet]

With sawed off

[prime musk]

i have (true) solod the reactor with both hel rifle and bc, and while i had more success with bc, hel rifle is for sure easier to get value out of and with covering fire from bots the uptime/reload of bc becomes a lot less valuable

[frail heart]

hel rifle is insane for r5b1 reactor

[prime musk]

either way hel rifle will likely serve them better for the secondary objective which i think justifies it enough

[frail heart]

you have like 3 insane line spots

[burnt inlet]

Isnt it two sentries one mine one bio?

[prime musk]

for sure

[frail heart]

4 cfoam

[burnt inlet]

Sniper sentry and burst or?

[frail heart]

sniper sentry

[prime musk]

tbf 2 sniper sentries with bot bio probably just carry harder than any guns choices could but yeah

[burnt inlet]

This is NOT r7d2 speeds

[frail heart]

the best speed

[burnt inlet]

I’ve started appreciating sniper sentry more when I’ve realized it can two tap giants

[prime musk]

like i play some true solo mantle but gave myself triple sniper sentry holding bio and i literally could like

tab out

at times

for extended periods of time

[frail heart]

sniper sentry is very goated

[burnt inlet]

Cheater

https://tenor.com/view/trollface-gif-8242347154758580084

[ionic galleon]

what sentry is best for normal security doors

[prime musk]

worth knowing that sniper sentry + 1 burst cannon burst also kills them (if sniper sentry hits head)

[frail heart]

copypasta 🥀

[burnt inlet]

Burst generally

[prime musk]

do you know what mantle is

it's

R1E1

the reactor with like bbc surge as a reactor wave

[burnt inlet]

Cheater

Cheating in other levels

[ionic galleon]

is auto any good tho?

[burnt inlet]

It’s got some niche uses

[prime musk]

just because you haven't unlocked r1e1 and the four tool slots doesn't mean im cheating

generally any time you consider hel auto take burst, and anytime you want sentry to kill anything but normal smalls take sniper sentry

[winter breach]

The most value youre gonna get from it is the staggers and back dmg

But its not as flexible as burst sentry

[ionic galleon]

How should i position sentries during alarms?

[prime musk]

burst sentry is not flexible team please
it kills strikers, shooters, and small shadows
that's IT

[ionic galleon]

I usually place it near the door facing the rest of the room

[frail heart]

[prime musk]

it has wide applicability because the enemies are very common, but it's very narrow in its target selection

[frail heart]

You have to know how to place/use it properly to get very good values out of the tiles it actually works on

Hel auto can be extremely good tho

But its safer to take burst in most cases

UNLESS you know how to use hel auto

[tardy ingot]

flexible in placement and level selection

Not very flexible in amount of enemy types it covers

[tardy ingot]

Inside your room or outside

In general you want sentries covering an open sightlines where enemies will path, this usually is doors you leave open or somthing similar

[hard musk]

The only level I can think of off the top of my head where you’d want helauto without knowing how to best use it, is R2E1 for the final couple surges

But it’s way more useful once you find good ways to position it

[safe cradle]

R4C2 too

[burnt inlet]

R5B1 so first alarm

[hard musk]

Oh yeah R4C2 PE for sure yeah

But even then I’d prefer cfoam for stalling over helauto

[safe cradle]

Generally I think like this: Surges=HEL - Reactors=Sniper - everything else is Burst

[burnt inlet]

There’s also solo speeds where it at least is used for r6a1, thought this is a niche of a niche

[hard musk]

R5E1 has 2 surges but I wouldn’t say helauto is a worthy choice

[safe cradle]

After trying both I'll say that placing foam correctly on the staircase is harder than placing the HEL Auto correctly, which granted doesn't mean either are incredibly hard to do, just that you've more margin of error

[hard musk]

I guess that’s valid

I am used to foaming so that’s why I prefer it so if someone isn’t, that’s good reason to take helauto

I can agree with that for some cases

[burnt inlet]

Also ladderfoaming is ew

[hard musk]

R4C2’s surges don’t have ladderfoaming

It’s floorfoaming for those

[burnt inlet]

Meant for r2e1

[hard musk]

Yeah

I did use it for my first clear for that level, shamefully, for the class 4 in the fog zone, but not for anything else

[burnt inlet]

Everyone has had their ladderfoam moments

[hard musk]

I just didn’t see that class 4 as a particular problem and wanted more attempts to reach the error

[safe cradle]

you mean the class 4 in the fog BEFORE error?

[hard musk]

Before, there’s no class 4 after

Both after are class 3

[safe cradle]

I usually just place 1 sentry top ladder 1 bottom

and get like 4-5 strikers at most to reach me

[prime musk]

placing a single either burst or hel auto sentry at bottom of ladder properly completely covers that alarm to triviality

[hard musk]

Yeah it’s not a very dangerous alarm

[safe cradle]

out of my 11 clears of r2e1, only 1's ladderfoam and that's enough 🤣

[prime musk]

^ only have one ladderfoamed clear and it's enough

[hard musk]

I mean, i just don’t really like playing R2E1 anymore after it taking 20+ attempts with people that couldn’t play frequently enough to retain knowledge of the level

Had to construct an entire written guide for them

[frail heart]

1 hel auto + 1 burst on the fog surge means you actually fight 0 enemies

its wild

[hard musk]

It burned me out pretty hard and I wanted it done with

[safe cradle]

For sure, solo pubbing Es is kinda hell (I think it was worse before because most of the people who played were new-ish), I know that struggle since it took me a damn week and a half to clear R4E1.

[hard musk]

It’s even worse

These were just busy people that we’ve know for about a year

[safe cradle]

Keep in mind that most people here know AT LEAST 1 more vet to pump the chances in their favour, and rarely go solo+3 pubs

[frail heart]

it took me a week of pubbing r8e2 and i didnt even make it past reactor, then i found a guy who got some of his friends to help me clear it lmao

[hard musk]

They were too busy with other stuff and just genuinely forgot most of the level in the weeks to get another 1-3 attempts

[safe cradle]

Yeah same, took me more or less that

[frail heart]

r8c1 also took me a while i think

[safe cradle]

It's infuriating that I finished reactor basically 4 times but 3 out of those 4 someone woke up the last code room for no reason

[frail heart]

but that was because everyone always thought you had to do the timed sequences one after the other in quick succession

[safe cradle]

yeah that too

[sturdy glen]

the benefits of meta knowledge

[hard musk]

At the rate things were going, we just weren’t even making progress anymore, we would always die to the first surge of the error every time despite getting there in the first 5 attempts

[sturdy glen]

level was better that way

[hard musk]

I was so tired of runs randomly dying in the weirdest places to I just started using best available tactics to try and hold some semblance of sanity

And the run we won, we only barely won

[safe cradle]

I think it's much more lenient today's state of lfg tbh

[hard musk]

At one point, everyone except 1 person was down in the final zone, and the final up had 1% hp lol

[safe cradle]

I usually get at least 1 more guy that is doing R2E1/R4E1 just for fun

[hard musk]

So me saying an r2e1 run being good enough with the least threatening surge being ladderfoamed

[hoary mason]

[hard musk]

Is just me being done with it

[sturdy glen]

somehow reading this is making me WANT to pub

[safe cradle]

It's a videogame you dont have anything to prove eh

[prime musk]

chill lfg for any E tier and make sure you get 3 pubs

it\s like lowkey kinda fun

[sturdy glen]

I havent done it in so long

it was pretty funny when I did it a while ago

[prime musk]

i got it for r7e1 and r5e1 earlier this week and genuinely it was pretty good

[hard musk]

I’d be down to clear it again without ladderfoaming but god I just hate that level so much after dying to the same surge in the same error like 10+ times in a fucking row because our friends couldn’t learn

[burnt inlet]

Tbh didn’t sound like ladderfoam was affecting you that much if you didn’t use it for last surge, plus I’m pretty sure class 4 is reg alarm not surge(?) but might be misinformation

[hard musk]

It wasn’t

[sturdy glen]

there is a class 4 not surge but there is also a class 4 surge

so like half misinfo

[hard musk]

And also I’m pretty sure the alarm in deep fog before alarm protecting neonate is class 4

[prime musk]

moth the alarm sequence is
class 3 surge - class 4 surge - class 4 surge - class 4 - error alarm - class 3 surge - class 3 surge (cluster scans)

[safe cradle]

People usually die in R2E1 at the first surge after the error, that's number 1 reason of death, number 2 is usually simply fucking up beforehand and that's mainly just people not knowing enough to deal with surges in general

[burnt inlet]

Mother 🔥

[hard musk]

the one protecting neo is a class 4 but not a surge

Yeah

[prime musk]

listen im labbing shit and there is currently a mom RIGHT in front of me in e2

[hard musk]

Lmao

[burnt inlet]

This was in fact the one i was thinking you were ladderfoaming

[hard musk]

Yeah it wasn’t that one

[burnt inlet]

🔥

[hard musk]

That one is arguably harder than the class 4 surge just before it

Cause the hybrid can snipe you from fog

[prime musk]

eh if you manage your foggies and don't give the hybrids los it's usually fine

[hard musk]

Yeah

It’s way easier to manage the surge tho

[burnt inlet]

Which one of these is for the optional res room?

[hard musk]

Regardless of skill

None

[prime musk]

moth the optional res room has NO alarm

like please

[hard musk]

Optional res is just a blood door

[burnt inlet]

Gosh jolly I don’t do optional res room

Zed be expecting me to know shit before doing shit

[prime musk]

yes pub

[frail heart]

please moth

get better

[burnt inlet]

Joever

[hoary mason]

what's the achievement

[burnt inlet]

Team I’m just a pub

[prime musk]

i find your lack of knowledge disturbing
please autism a bit more all over gtfo

[burnt inlet]

That doesn’t know the achievement

[burnt inlet]

Nuh uh

My autism is in uhhhh idk

[prime musk]

yes you're in denial we already knew that

[safe cradle]

you speak about autism

I quitted an R4E1 pub right after reactor because I was being micromanaged like no tomorrow

down to where and how I'd place my sentry because God forbid I want to scratch my ass for a wave at code 3

[hard musk]

Being micromanaged after the reactor when you have a billion res is crazy

[safe cradle]

No it was during

[hard musk]

Ah ok

[burnt inlet]

I still remember my first R4E1 lobby, with a vet and a low skilled pub, gosh that was funny but i feel bad for the pub

[safe cradle]

Like

I can basically clear the first 3-4 whatever code waves alone with 1 sentry and my PR

[prime musk]

r4e1 is a level balanced around having 2 players and 2 pubs

[safe cradle]

I should have quitted the lobby after I got told my loadout was "weak" for having PDW/PR

[burnt inlet]

R4E1 is a level balanced around two players

[safe cradle]

It's just

[sturdy glen]

nah they were real for that

[safe cradle]

It's exhausting to be costantly reprimended because sentry only goes in that spot and only after code 5 and leave that ammopack there and why didnt you take the tool in that box and place the sentry here not here

Fuck that shit, finish the level yourself, after reactor it's a cakewalk anyway

[prime musk]

i think pr is a good pick for r4e1. it suffers from usual pr weaknesses but r4e1 FOR SURE is one of the levels where its strengths become apparent and helpful

[safe cradle]

I'm not a sharpshooter but I could consistently land nearly all headshot on PR by standing far, 9 enemies dead is enough and I can just finish the rest with PDW, I was also NOT solo holding

[frail heart]

pr is actually decent on reactor hold

tru and i were testing pr strats for duo at one point

but yeah

[low radish]

Average lobby expirience

PR isn't bad as others are saying

besides like why does it matter what guns you take if you can work with them well enough

as in make them work

[low radish]

NO

MY ENEMY

[frail heart]

mfs be hating on veruta when it used to be classed as a good weapon 🥀

[low radish]

i;m hating on the copypasta

not veruta

I love veruta

how could i not love veruta

me of all people

[sturdy glen]

was also the same time 6000 weapon stats spreadsheets were being thrown around

looks good on the spreadsheet = strong gun

[frail heart]

EVERYONE was saying that

[sturdy glen]

yeah cuz we hadnt fixed the meta yet

/ruined

[frail heart]

still waiting for pubdown scatter

[ionic galleon]

How do I stealth kill the spiky black scouts

[dapper kestrel]

2 people melee the back at once or foam it

[frail heart]

Or you can also shoot it with some guns

Scattergun is your best bet usually

[dapper kestrel]

Ye, good chunk of weapons get the kill, mostly from using back damage

[ionic galleon]

Can I foam it with a full charge cfoam launcher or do I need a grenade

[dapper kestrel]

Idr how many blobs is needed, but I don't think it's a full charge from launcher

Can just full charge if you want to be safe about it

Oh right, if you have a yellow syringe you can one shot them too

[burnt inlet]

Id rather shoot it in its back with hel rifle (as long as its R5B1 ur talking about)

Stagger the BBCs also so they don’t eat ur bots

[low radish]

6 blobs or so

Definitely not a full charge

[low radish]

Veruta...

[keen seal]

4 is enough if nothing funny happens

[tiny wyvern]

Honest question: when is it not funny?

[low radish]

Got it

[visual gull]

do graphics settings affect visibility?

like fog quality or shadows for invisible enemies

[normal granite]

shadow quality and/or resolution can make it a bit easier to see shadows

[visual gull]

so max shadows and contact shadows enabled?

[normal granite]

i just know its easier to see them on max shadows vs lowest

i used to play on a handheld pc so played on lowest and it was very hard to see shadow enemies

now it is quite easy

[visual gull]

is there a level with fog and enemies in it at the very start?

so i can test the settings for myself

[normal granite]

that more so depends on the level

i havent noticed any difference in enemy visibility with fog settings

[visual gull]

sometimes i feel like i shine a light into fog and i just get flashbanged

might be bloom then idk

[hoary mason]

r2d1

[tardy ingot]

if you want an early level with fog and shadows early on then r5d2

But considering how you are likely new. R2C1 is somewhat fast to get to (1 and 1 b tier) or R7B2 (same)

[visual gull]

thanks!

[harsh heath]

Your group is on a 1 day streak! 🔥 Here are yesterday's results:
👑 5/6: @agile field @vivid umbra
6/6: @ocean spindle

[harsh heath]

Forsaken and slendo [no funny version] [Fish] were playing

[agile field]

Man, I threw…

[topaz python]

what is everyones favorite level in the game? Im playing through rn so I havent finished all the levels yet but my favorite is R6D1 "nemesis" and my gf's favorite is R5E1 "KDS Deep". I want to know what levels to look forward to :P

[ocean spindle]

ngl u probs will see lots of r8 answers ksks cuz r8 has super inventive lvls

[timber shoal]

r4e1 is pretty fun, i liked r5c3 and r5d2 a lot :3

[ocean spindle]

but my pick is probs either sumn for r8 or r7c2

[safe cradle]

Depends

R3D1 is very compact and well designed in terms of pacing

R4E1 would be a good contestant for me if it teleported you to beeeg door after reactor

[topaz python]

I see R3D1 and R4E1 mentioned a lot in terms of favorite levels

we are gonna do R3D1 soon! Cant wait

Ive heard R4E1 is one of the hardest levels in the game though

[timber shoal]

yeppers

[ocean spindle]

peppers

[timber shoal]

certainly isnt considered fun bc its easy

[safe cradle]

R2D1 I like a lot but I understand it ain't for everyone

Best non-E reactor perhaps R4D1

[topaz python]

nothin in this game is easy lol! Thats why I love it :3

[tardy ingot]

R3D1, R6D3 and R8E2 are my top 3 pretty much
but levels such as R6D2, R6D4, R5D2 and such are also quite high for me

[topaz python]

Cant wait.

Sounds dope. Yeah cant wait for R3D1

everyones hyping it up so much!

[tardy ingot]

R3D1 isnt necessarily "super special"

its just very compact while offering good diverse encounters

[topaz python]

I liked your stealth guide btw really helped me get better at doing levels

[tardy ingot]

def try to play aggressively rather than cautiously

👍

[topaz python]

yeah!

[tardy ingot]

(I generally support the above statement, but R3D1 is based on it)

[topaz python]

seems like R6 and R5 just are stacked with dope levels

[tardy ingot]

eeeeeeh

R5 is...

very polarizing

it has either rly good

or rly shit levels

[timber shoal]

dodo stealth guide when 🔥 teach you how to wake scouts

[safe cradle]

I'd play the shit more of R5D2 if I had a fixed team tbh

[tardy ingot]

its kinda 50/50 on distribution

[safe cradle]

Like, a lot more

I really like that level perhaps more than any other R5

[timber shoal]

r5 has like 3 good levels and the rest are either forgettable or abysmal dogshit

fire rundown design

[topaz python]

ah yes but everyone has those 3 levels in their top choice tho lol

my gf is hyping up KDS deep a lot so im looking forward to doing it just have a lot of levels to do beforehand

to get to that point

[timber shoal]

i gotta run r5e1 regular once then hop on the fast method

just need to convince someone to walk through the level slow 😭

[sly pivot]

getting a team is like the main challenge of this game

[prime ore]

How many passwords exist in this game??

we been doing

R6BX

and first time saw the like

[normal granite]

A LOT

[prime ore]

parts where you have to get each letter of a password

[frail heart]

713 i think

[prime ore]

we guess worked

[vital yarrow]

R5E1 slaps cause i find it fun and the tiles are cool, second favourite id say R8E1

i really love the asthetic of those levels aesthetically and because the lore relations to previous levels is fucking sick

im embarrasingly turbo hype about levels having connections to previous ones with the locked security doors and stuff in R8

[prime ore]

alot of them

[normal granite]

I think there is a site someone made that has all of them

[prime ore]

first

[tardy ingot]

should be 733 no

[prime ore]

one

we did on 2 letters

and the 2nd one on 3

guesswork seems like a decent strat

[frail heart]

7 something

[tardy ingot]

surely its 7.024

[normal granite]

I think its 733 as well

[prime ore]

https://tenor.com/view/fig-gif-26092737

[normal granite]

I think i also guessed the password in an r8 level first try

I think it mightve been r8b3?

But it was just soup

[little pilot]

it is 733

[prime ore]

wait the passwords are in doors with alarms right

what if we theoretically just guessed passwords WITHOUT opening the doors

will the game let us?

[timber shoal]

for reactors?

[tardy ingot]

r6bx

yes it would

[timber shoal]

oh those too

yeah they’re brute force-able

[burnt inlet]

5 hour clear incoming (that’s the easy part)

[timber shoal]

we should run that back btw

[burnt inlet]

I’m so sleepy rn

[timber shoal]

that level’s fun as hell

[burnt inlet]

Frfr

[timber shoal]

nrn anyway

go sleep pookie

[burnt inlet]

Fiiiiine heuuuuuuuuugh

[thick stump]

there are missions where you have to go through some zone to get 1 letter but you can go and look for 2 up or so and then guess

[gentle forge]

What weapons benefit most from reload cancel and what weapons benefit the least?

[timber shoal]

[[Reload]]

[gray rapids]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Reload

[timber shoal]

this should have a list of all the weapon reloads + their reload cancel times

[gentle forge]

Thx

[timber shoal]

ofc :3

[gentle forge]

The veruta is crazy

1.75 vs 4 seconds

[timber shoal]

yeppers

[gentle forge]

Does GTFO support ultrawide? Anyone play on it?

[normal granite]

@sly pivot

[sly pivot]

works on 21:9

no tweaks or setup needed, just out of the box

[meager nacelle]

Anyone got tips on R2D2?
We've been trying to hold on the bridge but unsure if thats a good spot

[burnt inlet]

Room just below reactor is usually where people hold after it unlocks

[thick stump]

@uneven kiln how does the command go for tips for R2D2?

[sudden nexus]

there isnt an r2d2 one

[uneven kiln]

theres only one for r1c1

[thick stump]

I thought I saw one before

my bad then. sorry for pinging

[uneven kiln]

I'm kind of a risk taker when it comes to R2D2 and I just hold in starting zone while teammates hold bridge

that is until about wave 8 and then I move to that spot

[meager nacelle]

I see. So maybe i should be closer to the start, we've been covering on the bridge exactly on the middle.

[keen seal]

bridge works fine

[uneven kiln]

you know that starting zone L shaped thing with the underside?

[meager nacelle]

Yeah

[uneven kiln]

I sit up there looking at the upper lane looking right at starting room with a hel weapon

it is a very risky very high payoff spot

bridge is otherwise fine

(I do bring a sentry with me so I can reload)

[meager nacelle]

I'll try the L shaped zone with a HEL rifle and see how it goes, thanks.

We've been reliably making it to wave 8

[keen seal]

it is rough and definitely not something you can hold alone

[civic wave]

r2d2 waves are slightly funny

[uneven kiln]

you get pretty amazing lineups there but yeah doing it alone you will die between reloads, so that's why I have sentry and usually 1 teammate floating between bridge and that area to help assist both groups to not get overrun

[civic wave]

my blanket recommendation would be hold bridge or reactor, depending on what you're confident in

the first wave always spawns elevator direction

so you can push up and camp that

but then you spawn push anything else

my inclination if you're dying on wave 8 is to ask how your code search is going

[uneven kiln]

even I myself go back to bridge anyway if I notice waves are spawning from code hunt zones through reactor to the opposite side of bridge

[fathom ice]

omg

[meager nacelle]

we've been doing good on code search, i'd say the scout affected areas are what we struggle on.

[fathom ice]

i watched their streams !!

[civic wave]

because empirically at that point i'd expect a problem with code hunting itself or properly looting the zones

[meager nacelle]

the farthest we got was wave 9 and we died due to lack of resources, we didnt see anything in the last room with fog.

[uneven kiln]

the last room with fog has a buuunch of ammo but yeah you kinda need to punch it in there to get time for it

[meager nacelle]

Since i was afraid to try it and make my friends lose time on it, can a HEL rifle reliably 1-tap headshot scouts from medium range?

[fathom ice]

you have a fog turbine at some point

I think it's in donut shaped room

[uneven kiln]

yes

[civic wave]

you can also pull and shoot all the rooms in fog using biotracker, run to a terminal, and run into walls 10 times over finding your way around

it's what i do

[keen seal]

yes the one you enter for code 5 search (2 scouts)

[meager nacelle]

that one time we got the turbine way too late and we died to timeout/reset wave/lack of resources

we didnt happen to see it until then

[uneven kiln]

in that last room with fog I just pull every room tbh

there's enough ammo in there

there is no scout in that zone thankfully

[fathom ice]

you get foggies in reactor / bridge as well

which is good to keep in mind

but generally you just pull the fog zone outside and kill it there

[meager nacelle]

that's probably what i'll do if i get to that point
I got too many head bumps from crashing into walls inside fog.

[uneven kiln]

that zone is so mazelike and lockers can be in a lot of nooks I'm sure as you saw

bringing repellers from where sky mentioned is huge for buying you time to get and distribute resources in time to get back and situated

thank goodness that fog isnt infectious either

[meager nacelle]

if that fog was infectious i'd probably have cried.

But yeah, thanks for the tips yall, i'll hold on to fog repellers until that zone as well and use them to loot after pulling the mobs out.

[civic wave]

in the original r2d2 the fog was infectious, but you also had a disinfect station in reactor

[meager nacelle]

lord.

[uneven kiln]

adding that to the wiki right now

that's hot trivia

so that means the fog during the first alarm after getting the keycard was infectious, the fog in the 5 scout zone, and then the final codehunt zone

[civic wave]

tbh i can't remember how different the rooms were

if nothing else, the level layout was flipped a bit

they turned left into right in ALT

[meager nacelle]

best bet on the 5 scout zone is just to try to get as many before the trigger right?

[fathom ice]

well yeah

you can shoot through door when it closes

if u wanna kill silently

[gentle forge]

Has anyone else noticed issues when playing in exclusive full screen vs borderless windowed?

[civic wave]

what issues?

[tardy ingot]

code 6 scout zone was massively different, being an open room divider with the terms being super far in

thats the biggest change I remember vividly

[gentle forge]

Like for example, in the menu screens I had this weird glitch where sometimes the screen would flash back to the previous menu I was on

[civic wave]

yea that happens to me sometimes

normally after changing settings

when it happens i press alt+enter twice, puts the game out of full screen then back into full screen

[burnt inlet]

is there a bug where hel rifle doesnt pen as it should?

[civic wave]

due to how the game is coded, there is a limit to penetration independent of whatever number is in the weapon statblock

so yes, really

[burnt inlet]

yea, seems like im only getting double pens when 3 are lined up

[uneven kiln]

tru has a plugin for it, its called PierceBugFix

I don't use it except in modded tho because it makes all hel weaponry A LOT stronger by being more consistent

some modded rundowns literally dont run without it so

I am glad it exists though

this is compounded by "DeadBodyFix" which isnt really a fix so much as it is removing another limitation on hel weapons with enemy corpses absorbing bullets until they disintegrate

[burnt inlet]

maybe i just SHOOT THRU THE FUCKING LEGS HOLY

[burnt inlet]

this looks like the body taking it or?

[uneven kiln]

Böh

I honestly cant tell from this angle

[burnt inlet]

like im guessing the line is where the bullet is

and when line stops bullet stops

[uneven kiln]

you mightve gotten multiple pierces on what appears to be a striker wave fast

which is why the bullet stops there?

[pseudo coyote]

just note that the animation on replay mod isn't synced with what u see in game, so it's not accurate to the actual occurance

the gunshot is indeed accurate (for the recording player), and indeed when the bullet ends is when it stops

Replay actually records the raw raycasts the game does, that's why when there is penetration u see gaps in the tracer, since the game starts a new raycast on each pierce.

The first rays starting position is however moved down to the gun muzzle (on replay side) as all gunshots actually originate from the face, which is why the first ray may be misaligned with others (the end position is accurate)

The vanilla pen limit is 5 iirc.

[burnt inlet]

i see several spots where raycast stops for one enemy, could that be where it got eaten?

[pseudo coyote]

yes if you see multiple gaps in the tracer then that is a clear indication of pens getting eaten

This is most common in giants, they quite frequently eat 2 pens and you see this as 2 gaps in the tracer on replay when hitting a single giant

[burnt inlet]

from what i see first enemy ate three second ate two?

[pseudo coyote]

adds up to 5 so sounds about right

but as mentioned before, pierce bug fix exists to handle this issue

[burnt inlet]

ye

[gentle forge]

If these are obviously bugs, why do you prefer not to use these fixes?

Also, regarding these bugs, did they always exist? Or did Hel weapons behave appropriately in the past and at some point the pen got messed up? Same question as it relates to the dead body fix issue

[burnt inlet]

5 kills in one shot is kinda... insane

[fathom ice]

lowk you rarely get advantage from 5 pen

getting consistent 3 pen is more important

in my experience when you shoot through crawlers it's very hard to hit a lot of pen

cuz you go through a lot of bodyparts on them

in comparison to standing striker stance

[uneven kiln]

Because they super empower some of the strongest weapons in the game to the point where I kind of forget everything but the most oppressively strong ones exist. HEL weapons being randomly held back like this keeps them at least somewhat in line

Piercing regarding bullets only applies to hel weapons anyway

Bullets not being absorbed by enemy corpses before they disintegrate also doesn’t really make sense because you can still lose bullets to the ambient corpses throughout the complex

I’ve used both of these plugins and got bored real fast because it directly affects weapon balance

[gentle forge]

When a weapon has 2 pen, like the hel revo, does that mean it pierces 2 enemies and hits 3 total? Or that it hits 2 enemies total?

[uneven kiln]

Hits 2 enemies total

The Choke Mod Shotgun despite not being Hel is coded to have 1 pen

But it doesn’t pen at all because you still only hit 1 enemy

One could make the argument that PierceBugFix isn’t actually fixing a bug if you pierce through an enemy limb, then their torso, then their leg if you shot them from up a ramp

That’s just piercing the same enemy multiple times in a logical manner

However that also feels kinda bad when you consider the pen values

[burnt inlet]

yea but you dont deal that amount of dmg to it, at least not when its giants etc

[gentle forge]

So when it says “a single enemy can use up multiple of these hits”, it means a bullet passing through the same enemy’s different body parts?

[uneven kiln]

That would be fixing it in a different way, yeah. Like in that scenario you’d do at least 90 damage to 1 giant instead of only 30

[fathom ice]

i think it'd be a cool gimmick

but like pen is as good as it is anyway

[burnt inlet]

so essentially youll lose pen due to it hitting the enemy multiple times yet only deal the base 1 shot amount of dmg

[uneven kiln]

Same honestly

[gentle forge]

And this occurs because the bullet passes through different parts of the enemy?

How does that apply to wide enemies as it says it does “particularly” so in the screenshot above?

[burnt inlet]

idk

[fathom ice]

basically u have a giant

and if you side shoot it

you'll hit two arms and body

which will eat 3 pen

[burnt inlet]

think its cuz you can hit their different limbs and it count as two+ hits

[fathom ice]

but he'll only take 30 damage

[grizzled patrol]

the game checks for pen after certain distance. if the enemy is too dummy thicc then it will be flagged twice

[gentle forge]

Ah ok like if you shoot him in the frontal plane

[fathom ice]

i think some hitboxes overlap as well

[gentle forge]

Ohhh

[fathom ice]

so if you shoot just as it is you have a chance of losing pen

[gentle forge]

So it’s not based on segments

It’s a check based on distance traveled

[grizzled patrol]

no lmao. otherwise Tanks and moms will eat all the pens

[fathom ice]

i'm not sure ure correct

cuz smalls also eat pen

[grizzled patrol]

that were Trus words iirc

[fathom ice]

and they're much smaller than bigger enemies

well I asked tru about same thing a while back

[gentle forge]

Well I guess that kinda makes sense that you’d lose some pen shooting through a dummy thicc enemy

[fathom ice]

yes but

you lose pen even when shooting smalls

[burnt inlet]

i mean we have proof of one striker eating 3 pens

[burnt inlet]

this first pen

[fathom ice]

like i'd assume it happens more to giants

[gentle forge]

So is this a bug or the intended design? Or do we know? One striker eating 3 pen is kinda insane

[burnt inlet]

bug

[gentle forge]

And like I asked before has it always been this way?

[fathom ice]

ye

[gentle forge]

Or did it work properly at some point in the past?

Surprising this was never addressed if it was truly there since the beginning

[fathom ice]

listen like it's VERY underground

like you can always assume you missed or whatever

[uneven kiln]

It’s a very wacky thing overall how GTFO pen works and even still these weapons are all A Tier (minimum)

[fathom ice]

I also think tumors actually eat pen

I think i brought it up

[burnt inlet]

i can test the tumor rn

[fathom ice]

ye go for it

[grizzled patrol]

because of their size yes. but if you shoot into a tank it will not eat all 5 of them

[burnt inlet]

whats tank ID?

[gentle forge]

Do most people run the pierce fix here or no?

[burnt inlet]

prolly not, most people id say dont even run mods

[fathom ice]

correct but if you shoot tank from a side it'll eat up amount of pen same as tumors in line

I think u always spend 2 pen on tank

[timber shoal]

btw moth did you get r3a3 done yet

[fathom ice]

like on e2 i shoot my wave through tank

and i'm very certain i lose at LEAST two pen

just by hitting tank

[burnt inlet]

died last wave last code cuz i got 5 bajillion giants spawning right and in front

[uneven kiln]

nah I dont run piercebugfix personally except in modded rundowns

[fathom ice]

which makes sense cuz i shoot body plus at least one tumor behind

[timber shoal]

yeah thatll happen

unfort tho

[uneven kiln]

With moth and dodos solo successes with hel weapons its not like the weapons really need this fix for vanilla environments

[burnt inlet]

i just quit after that

[fathom ice]

i could see it be great lowk

it's just like level dependant

or like a line dependant

[uneven kiln]

you and zed run vanilla atm right

[fathom ice]

always ye

AND it is fine without it

but if I run modded i do have pierce bug fix ye

[uneven kiln]

yep same

[fathom ice]

and it does feel better

[burnt inlet]

tumors eat pens

[fathom ice]

ye

[burnt inlet]

and its not distance based

[uneven kiln]

Totally different ballgame when you are doing wildly more difficult modded missions

[burnt inlet]

cuz one is super short

and other is long

[fathom ice]

no i just meant modded client

but i don't have it in modded like rundowns

unless it's built in

[uneven kiln]

my bad team i misunderstood

gotcha

[fathom ice]

na it's chill

like

r4e1 hold r2d2 hold r3a3 hold ALL benefit

cuz u literally get 4 to 5 pen a lot

but yeah idk it just doesn't matter if you kill 5 or 3 cuz it's enough either way

[burnt inlet]

yea like i was only really planning on using it for R3A3 solo

"omg hes a cheater"

[fathom ice]

listen

i think dead body fix

is MUCH of a bigger advantage

at least with burst cannon usage

[grizzled patrol]

[uneven kiln]

I noticed this too

[burnt inlet]

average malefic troll moment :3

[uneven kiln]

It makes burst dragging crazy easy

[fathom ice]

no like

you don't even need to drag

you treat bc as pen gun

because you don't spend bullets into dead bodies anymore

[uneven kiln]

That too

[fathom ice]

like you just have a built in hel rifle which is also very good into everything big

[grizzled patrol]

scattergun becomes absolutely braindead with it aswell

[fathom ice]

ye

BUT

it doesn't one shot giants from time to time

for god knows whatever reason

[grizzled patrol]

[uneven kiln]

I guess I should mention what gets listed on the bug wiki page, as in how it’s curated

The plugin fixes a vanilla issue while retaining vanilla integrity to a reasonable degree. So no distinct advantages other than fixing jank (say for example ScoutBombingFix, BioScannerFix, ShooterBugFix, MemoryLeakFix, SnatcherBugFix, etc).

[grizzled patrol]

[[bugs]]

[gray rapids]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Bugs?action=edit&redlink=1

[uneven kiln]

[[Bug Wiki/Tech Support Wiki]]

[gray rapids]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Bug_Wiki/Tech_Support_Wiki

[uneven kiln]

Also mentions anti-exploit ones for people who want those

[grizzled patrol]

i dont think its necessary to say that its a vanilla issue, since it is not the modded wiki

maybe something like "fixing the issue without compromising the vanilla experience" or something in that spirit

[uneven kiln]

That does sound better, I like that

I was just editing that page earlier because Dino pushed DoorEnemyFixUpdated which improves clientside logic especially so that your mines and cfoam don’t get triggered/eaten by enemies on the other side of a fully closed door until the door actually breaks

[grizzled patrol]

personally i dont really care about it since you can play around it, but ig if someone really needs it they can get it

[burnt inlet]

@fringe sparrow

[ionic galleon]

I’ve seen clips of people taking out big monsters with a gun from a different room without waking up the room but I can’t seem to replicate it

[digital mural]

If you shoot while a door is opening/closing you cancel the sound of the gun

If you are far enough it won't wake them up too

[ionic galleon]

Gotcha

Does the bullet landing make sound or only from the gun

[sturdy glen]

closing for regular door, opening for security door

[digital mural]

That

Thanks Chill

[timber shoal]

only gun

also it’s possible what you’re describing is silent shooting if a door wasn’t involved

[burnt inlet]

which is an exploit

[timber shoal]

yes

[sturdy glen]

door close is also generally looked down on I think

dont think too many ppl care about sec door opens tho

[ripe hamlet]

if you can do it with sec door you deserve it

[sturdy glen]

yea I think thats the typical reaction

[vestal crest]

is there a way to fix having the cursor visible on your screen other than restarting?

[ocean spindle]

maybe alt tab does something?

[vestal crest]

nah unfortunately

[ionic galleon]

I hear the wave music still playing but I dont see any enemies. Is there a small guy stuck somewhere?

[uneven kiln]

Yep and it can be due to two main reasons: the enemy failed to find a target or it spawned on top of a random object with a sliver of navmesh on it and in both cases it will almost never do anything unless you go and find it and kill it

[prime musk]

team

is it possible

to scoutbomb

yourself

like i think i just did??

ok well kinda not scoutbomb
like reverse scoutbomb

[uneven kiln]

There’s no real way to prevent these stuck enemies in vanilla but EnemyAnimationFix + StuckEnemyFix ran together (as Host) and you will pretty much never see it again if it bugs you

[uneven kiln]

As Host?

[prime musk]

yeah

[fathom ice]

the tweaker

[prime ore]

what is diminished scan mean