general

[surreal anvil]

good luck

we start

[scenic ginkgo]

@amber sierra need a team?=

im updating right now

[amber sierra]

ALREADY GOT 4

oop sorry caps

[compact kettle]

RAHHHHHHHHHH MY WHOLE GROUP IS ONLINE AND READY LETS GO

WE ALL WOKE UP TO DO THIS SHIT

[frosty imp]

Hm.

[hoary compass]

you woke up to shit pants f

woke mind virus

[compact kettle]

I woke up to have my head flattened by sleepers

Time to be absolutely defeated by hard levels but we all don’t care its time to do this

[pliant eagle]

Wait holy shit

It dropped?????

[scenic ginkgo]

IF SOMOEN WANTS TO JOIN ME

IM MAKING A LOBBY RIGHT NOW

[neat raptor]

my ass needs den of wolves rn

[brave creek]

Okay this is cool and all but why not put this out before the free weekend?...

[neat raptor]

shit looks insane

[pliant eagle]

Bro I'm in the gym PLEASE

[jaunty hatch]

Shit looked amazing

[pliant eagle]

WHY

[kindred garden]

currently watching the game award

[pliant eagle]

[willow ember]

i need a group to play from start to finish LOL

[jade geyser]

HAPPY CHANUKAH TO ANY WHO CELEBRATE!!!! probably just me but I still wanted to spread holiday spirit yknow

[pliant eagle]

I got you...

[kindred garden]

Happy Hanukah my friend

[pliant eagle]

Just let me get out the gym in 30 mins...

🥹

[frosty imp]

Hm.

[austere lily]

lets gooooo babyyyy

[kindred garden]

i'm unable to play anything (i have a hole in my arms that need healing)

[jade geyser]

You too :]
/any other holidays you celebrate if not chanukah

[scenic ginkgo]

I CAN JOIN

[kindred garden]

thank !

[jade geyser]

:D

[hoary compass]

"adjusted" UP OR DOWN?????

WHY WOULDNT YOU JUST SAY INCREASED OR DECREASed

[sand hollow]

Holy hell the madlads I wasn't expecting R8 till next year!

[obsidian glade]

if ur eu im down

[lusty coral]

R8 hype broski, RIP updates 4eva

[willow ember]

Im NA but im awake like any hour LOL

[muted ravine]

where was it announced at the game awards? I think I must've missed it

[willow ember]

like about 30ish mins ago

[muted ravine]

huh cool, thanks

[willow ember]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgnI3q8d-To

[rapid osprey]

...Not happy about the sniper magazine debuff... serially, it was already three shots a reload.

[vocal stag]

scattergun funny

[tranquil rampart]

Is it 2 now?

[warm dagger]

Ain't no way they posted a riddle with /'s as the final rundown announcement

Based

[wary mist]

GAVEL GANG!

[tardy pelican]

R8A1 the big room is mirrored what the shit

[pliant eagle]

My baby knife got killed

[pliant eagle]

Please don't spoil...

[neat solstice]

@stable pivot did ur pc freeze or something

[rugged sonnet]

I guess its time to return

[rapid osprey]

Hopefully that's all they did... if they cut it to one, well... won't be any real reason to use it anymore.

[tranquil rampart]

Bolt action

Take it or leave it

[signal crypt]

no spoiling

[rapid osprey]

Choke shotgun can take a Scout in one shot if you get close enough, or you can foam and smash 'em.

[pliant dove]

I ain’t watching shit lol gonna wait for it to drop

[pliant eagle]

It already did?

[pliant dove]

I meant the rundown

oh I’m high 💀

[pliant eagle]

[hexed bloom]

I Saw Old Hammer Name.

Oh Yeah!

[pliant eagle]

I need to find a group to run it up with

[hoary compass]

matchmaking is fucking popping off rn but not a single person has a mic

literally none

even in "everyone must use a mic" section

[pliant dove]

let’s fuckin gooo grind time bois

[obsidian glade]

i played this game on and off but never properly got into it, found out now the game has story/lore but from what i rmb playing a few missions i dont remember seeing much story/lore (played a couple missions from each rundown p much)

where does the game give you story/lore? without spoilers pls

[little thicket]

Wow they finally added the achievements! Definitely spending my weekend on GTFO lmao.

[flint glen]

sniper my beloved ;-;

[vocal stag]

apparently they gave it more max ammo to compensate

[little thicket]

Did the precision rifle get an ammo bump some time in the past?

I noticed it had more

Oh I see, when R6 ALT came out

[vocal stag]

they buffed it last update because it was arguably the worst weapon in that category

[little thicket]

Magazine size increase

Yeah, it runs much better with the larger mag

At least it better offsets the long reload

[timber ginkgo]

Wait is rundown 8 gonna be the last rundown?

[pliant dove]

yee bro

last one

[vocal stag]

yes they are focusing on the cyberpayday game now

[little thicket]

I'm sure we'll still get patches every once and a while

Until they finally drop it after a few years

Hopefully longer

[pliant dove]

oh yeah theres still gonna be life left

[vocal stag]

I doubt it will be anything substantial though they could keep the game sustaining itself with the modding community

but if they do that it will probably be after r8 hype dies down to not split the playerbase

[timber ginkgo]

Damn

[little thicket]

Oh yeah, modded rundowns are the shit

Wacky stuff right there\

[vocal stag]

gaint generator

[ocean moth]

Den of Wolves trailer give such a hype!

[ebon steppe]

i cant find how to access the las 3 nodes of the page unu , i v dum

[vocal stag]

the wut

[ocean moth]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1818140/Den_of_Wolves/

[vocal stag]

oh that was directed at dusty not you, I already looked at the store page for that

[ebon steppe]

yeah

den of wolves

[vocal stag]

looks like it could be good and they have an open spot with payday 3 faceplanting

[ebon steppe]

and they already giving lots of lore of the get go , just wish i were smart to find whats the answer

[vocal stag]

are they doing an ARG thing for it or

[ebon steppe]

shrug

isnt an arg exactly

just one page with minigame and terminal stuff

[vocal stag]

ah

[tribal python]

Is this the last rundown?

"The Final Chapter"

[vocal stag]

yes

[stuck peak]

r u kidding me they drop on a random thursday

[hoary compass]

for now

[hoary compass]

the game awards were tonight lol

[stuck peak]

forever

🪳

i live under a rock i had no clue

[gaunt bough]

Real quick does anybody know if that door in the tutorial can be opened

[mellow coyote]

GRRRR IT WONT GIVE ME ACHIEVEMENTS i SHOULD ALREADY HAVE GRRRRRRRR

[mellow coyote]

i am going to (s)cream

[dire pivot]

O.o sounds dirty

[robust mortar]

he knows

[quasi salmon]

как русский поставить подскажет кто?

[dire pivot]

xaxaxaxa

[hoary compass]

cyka

[dire pivot]

i dont think i can speak russian here with what i know lol

[robust mortar]

i listened to creamium's insane rant about the lore
he went on for like an hour

[magic cobalt]

why is this soo hard to join a friend

[robust mortar]

the strange thing is
so far he's been actually pretty right

fun game

[vocal stag]

it gives you them when you close the game

well the full rundown completion ones, it never tracked the rest beforehand

[robust mortar]

yup, and that's what he was waffling about to me

[vocal stag]

lol

[magic cobalt]

man 30+ mins trying to figure out how to host and join friends... talk about getting ready to uninstall

[ivory forge]

man I should try to solo this A-ranked map so that I would not burden my teammates

Class-II Alarm Door:

[faint pecan]

Dauda says thank you now : D

[vocal stag]

make a lobby, set the other slots to invite only, invite using steam

or copy the code and send it to people over discord

[potent crow]

rundown 8 is out!! wahoo!!!

[desert flame]

is there only six missions in the last rundown?

😢

[glad rover]

my thoughts exactly

[desert flame]

check spoiler asked same question and got a satisfying answer

[frank bear]

Cant post to LFG :\

[thorny cape]

sorry xD miss xD

[lost mica]

yooo we gotr achievements now

But past rundown completions don't count 😭

[shy sparrow]

wym I opened the game and I got achievements for past rundowns

[wind carbon]

am i autistic im trying to play with a mate but i cant seem to join by the code

the red thing that exists isnt showin

[cloud topaz]

does mate have all the slots players / players+bots?

[wind carbon]

i believe so

he does

[vocal stag]

damn they added checkpoints to everything

[mellow bloom]

Gtfo is basically dead

but im so excited for den of wolves

[mellow bloom]

its dead in the sense that i cant matchmake a game

[fiery urchin]

are they gonna stop supporting the game after this rundown if this is the last one?

[vocal stag]

do it through this discord, the in game matchmaking has always been spotty and the changes this update arnt enough to fix it

[oak plinth]

will be more map like 'ext' or this is the end of their job :0 ?

[fervent coyote]

How can a friend join your lobby? I've tried sending them the lobby id for them to copy and inviting them through steam but no luck

[burnt moth]

So lemme guess rundown 8 is released no more continued support after a month or so ay

[oak plinth]

after a month? xD

they relased x6alt and give us r8 with 6 map

[rough ermine]

The Alt Alt rundowns

[raw lynx]

does anyone know what "hollow point rounds" on the sniper means?

[crystal burrow]

It doesnt go through the enemy

But it does extra to the one you hit

(Pretty sure)

[raw lynx]

ty!

[stoic agate]

Repaired matchmaking after one... year maybe? Global matchmaking is good, but only if we are in the rundown selection. What's wrong with devs? They are killed the game, and that is so sadly...

[vocal stag]

I mean theres more then enough content for it to be a finished game now, just the lack of an actual server browser demands you use discord for matchmaking

[grand marsh]

den of wolves

[stoic agate]

I know a lot of cheap games on the Unity engine with servers browser, why devs cant do it here? That is not so hard, a lot of videos on a youtube about it. Why should I use "Discord" to search for players if such a button should work fine in the game itself?

[vocal stag]

I honestly have no idea

[robust gorge]

I last played GTFO last year and there was 1 run down and some expeditions. I played it again yesterday and holy shit balls, 7-8 rundowns and a bunch of expeditions each? that’s too much content LOL what happened in the past year

[vocal stag]

oh they used to just make the old rundowns inaccessable whenever they made a new one

[stoic agate]

Rundown refresh, thats what

[robust gorge]

Yeah I remember

So they threw that idea out I see

I kind of thought that when I saw all the rundowns

I wonder which one I last played

[vocal stag]

im guessing around the time they started working on den of wolves they scaled down the dev team for this and dedicated them to fixing the old ones

[cloud topaz]

last free weekend was r7

[robust gorge]

No idea but maybe, or maybe not

[vocal stag]

either way it got rid of my main bar to playing the game before which was not wanting to be on a time limit to complete stuff

[robust gorge]

I put too many hours into this game last year

[vague saffron]

Would anyone have any idea as too why my mouse isnt on the screen?

[robust gorge]

Because you smell like beans

[stoic agate]

Maybe now that they have finally released all the maps and lost a bunch of players, they will start fixing and optimizing the search for players?😆

[vocal stag]

I mean its not a live service game so a lot of those lost players are going to be people who finished it

[stoic agate]

Abandoned*

[vocal stag]

true

though they only make money on the initial purchase regardless

[frosty imp]

Hm.

[torn token]

https://youtu.be/KSZ-Qa0ydGg?si=h-CL_jXKXn84mh9D

[naive igloo]

hmm

[glad falcon]

was kind of marketed as live service tho

originally

before rundowns returned

and the on-going funding provided was within that intent

all of said bugs were known since before alt rundowns even started getting rolled out and should have been addressed ages ago anyway

[stoic agate]

yes, that is true, but for what? For playable game? That's so funny 😄

[vocal stag]

when I say live service I mean its not charging itself as one

[vocal stag]

that part is true though idk why it took them so long

[neat solstice]

Why did they nerf hammers, are they stupid!?

They think we wouldn’t notice it because they enabled the older models?

More like rundown 8.0 Schizophrenic

[undone birch]

what?

[glad falcon]

@neat solstice it's literally in the patchnotes

they aren't hiding it

they changed some charge timers and stagger multiplier on each melee

it brings them a bit more in line with eachother

[neat solstice]

This why we can’t have nice things

Make everything bland n generic

[glad falcon]

uh

hammer was just the only melee used normally previously

outside some knife/bat gimmicks

[undone birch]

schizophrenia is when you nerf hammers and they become boring

[glad falcon]

it hasn't changed anything really

https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/493520/view/3873721942748957071

[neat solstice]

It’s changed EVERYTHING

[glad falcon]

patch notes are there btw

nothing is hidden

[neat solstice]

don’t forget what they took from you

[undone birch]

I mean the hammer was reaaaaaally good

[glad falcon]

the most egregious thing is this quirky little symbol they added

[undone birch]

I always return to the hammer because it's just... IT's just great

And maybe that's a problem yeah

[glad falcon]

that redirects to den of wolves

like bruh

[undone birch]

what's that

[neat solstice]

Game is constantly being butchered from skill into a stat based game

[glad falcon]

they may as well say they already completely dropped GTFO by advertising their new game in r8 update

lmao

[undone birch]

I mean tbf that's their right

[vocal stag]

I physically could not use the hammer yet always did fine with the bat even before the stagger buff

[undone birch]

developping a game is MEGA expensive

at some point you can't have a team working on a game with low influx of new players

It still sucks tho

Some bugs I would have loved seeing fixed

[neat solstice]

We were left to die after hours of pain staking Rundowns with noobs 🗣️🗣️🗣️

[undone birch]

Especially the one with checksums

So some people are literally unable to play certain levels in multiplayers

[glad falcon]

they have tons of money from tencent deals o.o

but yes

[neat solstice]

They won’t let GTFO ever grow 🗣️🗣️🗣️

[glad falcon]

understandably they moved on

[neat solstice]

Ok, I need to attend work, adios

[glad falcon]

but the reality is they never made an effort to grow GTFO

[undone birch]

Yeah. Doesn't mean it doesn't suck for us

[glad falcon]

so like

bodes well for den of wolves

[undone birch]

I mean, GTFO was special

They kinda had to re release everything

And that's a lot of time

[wide lark]

Can you play this game with ingame communication now?

[vocal stag]

honestly I feel that would have devolved into a microtransaction simulator

[undone birch]

Couldn't be worse than medieval/space engineers

[glad falcon]

@wide lark been there since rundown 6

the original r6, not alt

[glad falcon]

quite possible, who knows

just gonna see what r8 is like I suppose

already moved on from the game mostly

[undone birch]

I for one think they have learnt a lot from GTFO

And their next game might not be so bad actually

Like there's always stuff to take from that kind of years of xp

[wide lark]

@glad falcon like talking or command section?

[vocal stag]

same, Im not even unhappy with this just getting people to play it with is annoying

[glad falcon]

as in vc

[undone birch]

Errors they wouldn't have made and that got them trapped in this place

[glad falcon]

talking ingame

[wide lark]

noice

[glad falcon]

was added when 1.0 dropped way back

[wide lark]

how's matchmaking tho?

[undone birch]

you don't use it

You use this discord for that

.t lfg

[eternal saffron]

Hello! If you are unaware, we have Looking For Group (LFG) channels to help users group up and play the game. They are located here: #lfg-north-america / #lfg-latin-america / #lfg-eastern-europe / #lfg-western-europe / #lfg-asia / #lfg-oceania / #lfg-africa / #lfg-beginners / #lfg-middle-east.

If you are unsure of how to create or join a lobby, please see the instructions here: #how-to-matchmake.

[vocal onyx]

So can someone tell me how I make a team with this wacky dacky tacky vc thing

[undone birch]

In game matchmaking is almost never used

[vocal onyx]

That they changed

[undone birch]

And so you have enormous wait times

[wide lark]

oops

[undone birch]

So yeah, as far as finding a team/game goes, use this server

[glad falcon]

matchmaking might be decent rn not sure

[undone birch]

Still not enough people use it

[glad falcon]

it is historically awful

[vocal stag]

#how-to-matchmake

[vocal onyx]

Doesnt state anything

[glad falcon]

they changed the matchmake

and didn't update #how-to-matchmake

[vocal onyx]

Its outdated

[vocal stag]

wait fucking

[glad falcon]

so it's literally worthless old info

[vocal stag]

idk someone scream at the community manager until he updates it

[undone birch]

nooo

[vocal stag]

[undone birch]

don't scream at call-e

:'(

[vocal stag]

call-e will be screamed apon

[glad falcon]

🙂

ah he doesn't control those posts anyway

it's ravenna

why is my discord lagging so hard in this server rn jeebus

i'll investigate how it works manic

[vocal onyx]

Aight bet

[vocal stag]

probably the weird vc system

[vocal onyx]

@glad falcon Figured it out

You just join in the "make vc of X" and it'll automake one

[glad falcon]

ah

it uses a temp autobot

I see

not a bad system but it seems to be making the discord MUCH laggier

[undone birch]

you mean like client side?

that's so weird

[vocal stag]

ok I looked into it and the vc system doesnt even automatically show you the channels you need to use it

no wonder everyone is confused

[marsh pelican]

109775241651194620

[oak thistle]

holy shit this is the worst free weekend i've ever participated in

There's no newbie on the discord to do the first stage, the automatic matchmaking puts me with people that go gun blazing and dies halfway

and theres no tuorial on how ot use computers ot clean fog

[rugged jewel]

#lfg-beginners

[gilded raptor]

Did you think we have tutorial back in the day lol

[rugged jewel]

go nuts

[oak thistle]

we didnt, i played the beta

and the tutorial helped absolutely nothing

[gilded raptor]

it only give you a very basic stuff

[oak thistle]

yeah not a single person looking for R1A1

[gilded raptor]

the rest

you have to learn it the hard way

[oak thistle]

cant learn it the hard way, nobody does the first stages despite being a free weekend

[gilded raptor]

like me who died in r2a1 at least 7times back then before I know that I can’t hide from woke sleepe

[oak thistle]

i cleared C level stages from beta

i know a little bit what to do

but i cant find anyone to play with

cz no one looking for the early stages

and automatic matchmaking puts me with people i wonder how they even did clean a stage

by shooting everything

[gilded raptor]

look for the one on the newest rundown

people don’t really play old rundown when a new one just drop

[oak thistle]

doesnt it get difficult the higher rundown?

[gilded raptor]

not really

[oak thistle]

ok cool

[gilded raptor]

A tier is still A tier

[oak thistle]

thats a weird way to do the game eh

i guess ill look for new rundown

[gilded raptor]

just that old one have less mechanism than new one

and tend to be shorter

[steep dagger]

@oak thistle im playing cuz the free weekend. Didn't complete first stage after 5 tries. We can try later, i can't play now

[little egret]

the farther down a rundown you go the harder it is

new rundows just have new and harder mechanics in them is all

[gilded raptor]

yes and no,new rundown have more mechanism doesn’t necessarily made it more difficult compare to old one

[little egret]

for a smooth experience go from rundown 1 to 8 but if u just want to play do it in what ever order

[gilded raptor]

some new rundown A level are even easier than old rundown

[little egret]

i didnt say that it made it harder

just harder mechanices

[gilded raptor]

[little egret]

r1 is hsu or reactor and thats really it

r4 has you running for you life from a take that spawns every 10 mins from an error alarm

[gilded raptor]

tbf r1-2 is easiest compare to newer one yeah cuz they are pretty bare bone

[little egret]

for example

[little egret]

thats what i mean :)

[glad falcon]

r2 harder than r3

but yes

[little egret]

only cause of r2e1

[glad falcon]

yes

[gilded raptor]

but like i said in term of A tier especially A1 most rundown have more or less same difficulty (unless you doing Extras or PE)

i mean,how hard can class 2-3 alarm be lol

[gilded raptor]

i forgot what 2e1 is lol

i cleared all of E tier except for 7e1 cuz that level require both good rng and absolute coordination with everyone know wtf is going on

which kinda hard to find with random lobby lol

imagine your run end just because rng let you have queen blocking the entire door

smh

[neat solstice]

Ok I’m on break

As I was saying

They LEFT GTFO

in ruins

When it still had so much potential

[glad falcon]

I am sure they will refine the unused content for their new game

🙂

[autumn yacht]

[glad falcon]

I was being sarcastic sir

[oak thistle]

Oh that's why they made it free weekend?

Trying to salvage the scraps X)

[autumn yacht]

Yea, bold of u to assume they'll use any of those cool ideas in their new game

Fr fr

[glad falcon]

and free promotion for den of wolves ofc

literally added an icon you can click by accident

promoting new game

[autumn yacht]

Anyway back to Darktide I go, an actual supported game

[glad falcon]

shit is funny af

[autumn yacht]

My dumbass thought it's like a secret for GTFO

not uh, promoting their new game

[oak thistle]

Well I was looking for a free weekend with bustling people

Not a dead game

😂

[neat solstice]

They should sell the whole GTFO project to a passionate developer team

[oak thistle]

And to say I had so much fun in the beta

[glad falcon]

yeah, game was dead ever since 1.0 and they split the team

[neat solstice]

On top of that they have always been hostile to people trying to mod the game

[glad falcon]

literally shadowbanning and witchunting

in the early modding days

[neat solstice]

And even tried sueing people trying to figure out funny integers? For a project they don’t want to be focused on?

[glad falcon]

and breaking into private modding discords to ban on main

actual insanity

[neat solstice]

@storm hazel Where the Hell is OUR ANSWERS!?

[glad falcon]

don't ping him...

[maiden vale]

PING HIM!

[neat solstice]

I want answers, RAAAAA

[glad falcon]

poor guy is gonna get enough flak with non-functioning game and new bugs already

you're just gonna get a generic response that fulfils nothing

it's calle

[neat solstice]

Yes

[odd carbon]

I mean, if you play in freeweek and kinda like the game, the content it has is worth 20-30 euroes easily, it's only a matter on if you like said content to begin with

Playerbase will inevitably dwindle and with GTFO being the game it is, that's an issue for sure

[dense raven]

RAT CHAT

[gilded raptor]

funny enough is how modded runs is much more whacky and hilarious than base game

[split wolf]

to be fair this game sounds hard to monetize

you can't really charge for rundowns since the game is meant for 4 players

[glad falcon]

Ah, I guarantee some simps here would pay for cosmetics

But yeah

It really isn't built for it

[signal quarry]

rundown 9

when

[dapper burrow]

(probably) never

[violet talon]

looks like the new game is connected to gtfo?

seems like some prisoner made it out for some heist

[storm hazel]

What is the question?

[stoic agate]

oh, he is here....

[next narwhal]

Is it absolutely necessary for full party of 4?

[stoic agate]

Are you guys can make something with matchmaking or you abondoned this idea after non alt rundown 5?

[next narwhal]

just curious, first time installing'

[split wolf]

it depends on the level

[storm hazel]

You can fill in with bots

[wind smelt]

hey what fps should i be getting in game? i get around 51 fps tho i meet recommended specs

[storm hazel]

We tweaked it pretty heavy for this release

[stoic agate]

And that was bad idea

[next narwhal]

Bots smarter or dumber than L4D bots? lol

[stoic agate]

Global matchmaking is good, but only if we are in the rundown selection

[split wolf]

they kinda troll sometimes

[stoic agate]

Why are you doing this with game?

[next narwhal]

so about the same, maybe B4B level trolling?

[storm hazel]

Our goal to take away choices that weren't that used and to make it easier for people to find others to play with

[split wolf]

i don't like giving the bots C-Foam because sometimes they throw it on the floor instead of the door (if there's something blocking line of sight)

[stoic agate]

Are you sure about it? On the start a new rundown, a lot of people trying to using it, like now, but... Really?

[glass elk]

so? after this 8.0 update this game gets abandoned?

[storm hazel]

It's not a live service game, so we are not pulling the plug or anything.

[glass elk]

i mean, there will be no updates or anything that will keep players engaged?

[storm hazel]

Sure about our goals? Yes, and we are ofc monitoring the effects of those tweaks. To early to tell.

[stoic agate]

I know a lot of cheap games on the Unity engine with servers browser, why you are cant do it here? That is not so hard, a lot of videos on a youtube about it. Why should I use "Discord" to search for players if such a button should work fine in the game itself?

[storm hazel]

Depend on what kind of engagement you mean. There are now over 80 expedition in the game, with replayability

[storm hazel]

It's not a "press a button" fix, and we have prioritised other things

[stoic agate]

matchmaking is 50% success of the game, why are you dropped this idea?

[glass elk]

new weapons, skins, items, enemies/bosses, gameplay modes

[signal quarry]

weapon customisation

i believe in yall

[storm hazel]

You mean in general? As said, we are monitoring the matchmaking system so we can make decisions based on data rather than feels

[storm hazel]

🥹

[glass elk]

dunno, time trial, pvp :P...

[storm hazel]

We've added (and sometimes deducted) stuff to GTFO for over four years. And kept the "buy once" model all along. At some point we had to make the decision to move on.

[glass elk]

kk :))

[ember sluice]

so Im a silent stalker and like to play without using mic, can I play with ppl here in voice chat? I can follow commands

[stoic agate]

That is funny... After free weekend, the game will dead again, because some people need a matchmaking, but...

[oak thistle]

I came back and did not see much difference from the beta tho. No clear improvments

Why would I spend money when I can't even find people to play with

[signal quarry]

yes

general chat is surprisingly calm

everyone is busy playing

[dire pivot]

its also early in the morning for a lot of people

[ember sluice]

good

help me then, fidesz coloured dog

[signal quarry]

of course, nuts street resident

[ember sluice]

much appreciated

[signal quarry]

come to team 367

[torpid viper]

IT IS THE MORNIN

HELO

[signal quarry]

i wake up in the morning

[torpid viper]

no

[oak thistle]

It's 2 pm

[torpid viper]

i

i slept

until

12

then i woke

[signal quarry]

i slept 5 hours

[torpid viper]

and

now im here

at 5 am

[signal quarry]

dog wake me up he vomited

[torpid viper]

im mentally ok

[torpid viper]

so real

your dog ok?

[signal quarry]

yes

he just eat food

and vomit

[torpid viper]

rip

[autumn yacht]

yeah, in their new game

probably xd

[storm hazel]

No clear improvements since beta? 👀

[little egret]

thats cap

[torpid viper]

probably didnt play

enough

:P

[scenic ginkgo]

this game is so fucking broken

we broke R8C1

so fucking bad

[torpid viper]

the overload thingy?

wait

[scenic ginkgo]

no

[torpid viper]

?

[scenic ginkgo]

we alerted a scout

[torpid viper]

ono

its r7d1 all over again

[scenic ginkgo]

and then all enemies just stood there

they werent moving

they were inmortal

and they just were there

💀

[torpid viper]

lmao

[odd carbon]

Not to burst your bubble

[little egret]

its a new rundown bugs will happen dude

[odd carbon]

But some hackers can do that

[torpid viper]

hm

idk

[odd carbon]

and kill enemy AI with a button

[torpid viper]

it is a scout glitch

it is gardens

[scenic ginkgo]

then we decided to die

and when we respawned

we had to deal with multiple scout waves

• the enemies on the rooms

[normal haven]

hello everybody! I just wanted to try the game while it's free. I want to love it deeply and it runs very well on my machine. however, every time I try to refill ammo (or using one of the tool refill packs), the game just hard crashes. So far I only tried playing the tutorial, and every time I get to the point of filling ammo the game crashes (mostly with the tool refill, but the ammo pack crashes too). I checked online and here quickly but didn't find info. I will try to get on a solo game to see if the game still crashes outside the tutorial - if someone can point me in the right direction (what to check / do), I will be super thankful 🙂

(sorry if this is not the right place to write about this!)

[torpid viper]

try #bug-reporting and #1049599987878723635

[paper glacier]

Is there a way to limit server ping/ Set a specific region for matchmaking or does the game determine that automatically?

[vast crown]

GTFO = Get The F Out

[torpid viper]

there is no server ping

its p2p hosted

so

i think you can control region for in game mm

but dont use it

[normal haven]

I checked on the technical support, didn't see any info on a crash like mine. Should I report it? (btw thanks for answering!)

[torpid viper]

probably yea

[quartz willow]

idk if this would be to much effort, but it would be nice if there is one last big update to open up the game for creating custom level and enemies easier.
there are a ton of people who from time to time could realize crazy ideas

[neat solstice]

Shouldn’t you be representing us as the community manager since we are the community? 🗣️🗣️🗣️

[storm hazel]

In what way do you feel like this is lacking (if that was the question)

[crisp mantle]

hi, is there a discord for den of wolves yet?

[neat solstice]

By being the apologist for the dev team when they have indeed put GTFO on the back shelf🔥

[storm hazel]

discord.gg/denofwolves

[neat solstice]

[torpid viper]

how is that not formatted as a link

wtf

discord being discord

[crisp mantle]

thank you, working on the puzzle right now, amazing stuff

[storm hazel]

We try not to apologise, but to explain our decisions.

[neat solstice]

it’s joeover.

[storm hazel]

Is there anything particular you need more background on?

[pseudo scaffold]

Where beard cosmetic

[torpid viper]

so true

[neat solstice]

I’m starting to think I am talking to chat GPT 😭

[pseudo scaffold]

[torpid viper]

bro gottem corperate formatted ansers

[neat solstice]

Man is on that career politician grind

[storm hazel]

Well, if you actually had any questions I would happily answer them

[torpid viper]

GADDAM

:P

[storm hazel]

Or are you more interested in just saying stuff?

[barren tangle]

this game is insane

i like it

[torpid viper]

:D

yes

[torpid viper]

i do have a slight question though

how were the balance changes decided?

[barren tangle]

bro i'm def buying this shi on my birthday 😂 i really like this game lol

[torpid viper]

player reaction?

or just testing

or both

[barren tangle]

the thing is that it's insane for noobs to get in and such cuz of the immersive ui and how insane and hard it may be xD

[storm hazel]

Nice!

[storm hazel]

Player feedback, usage stats (hello sniper and sledge), experience

[torpid viper]

yea that makes sense

[storm hazel]

It sure is 🙂

[storm hazel]

ChatGPT is good in that way, right @neat solstice

[torpid viper]

lmao

[cobalt shale]

Tell the devs to make the maul one shot everything. It's the coolest weapon in the game and deserves to be the strongest

[gloomy hollow]

Hallo bois, I've been keeping an eye to this game for a while and the free weekend gave me the chance

[torpid viper]

real

[gloomy hollow]

is game gud

[torpid viper]

yes

[cobalt shale]

Game is gud

[torpid viper]

:D

[gloomy hollow]

eyy nicee

fr i watched the bricky vid

[torpid viper]

the content is worth if you like it

theres enough

[gloomy hollow]

this game has me intrigued now

[torpid viper]

for 24???? 25??? dollars rn

[gloomy hollow]

That's a good deal demnn

[cobalt shale]

Pretty high learning curve though. Be ready to lose a lot until you get a handle on it. Then you'll still lose but have more fun doing it

[torpid viper]

the only thing i lost from this game was my sanity

:3

[cobalt shale]

*voluntarily misplaced

[torpid viper]

no

it was taken from me

[gloomy hollow]

lmao

[storm hazel]

Noted!

[gloomy hollow]

I know the game has I believed, peaked player counts right now but is this server still the way to go play with other peeps?

[torpid viper]

yes

mm is a bit finniky

[gloomy hollow]

I'm not shy away with playing with Discord peeps since I've done a bit of raiding in Destiny lol

[cobalt shale]

The discord lfg is the way to go if you don't have a crew

[gloomy hollow]

Ahh aight copy that

[torpid viper]

the endless typing is scaring me

[cobalt shale]

It's obviously text art of the maul

[torpid viper]

fair enough

[gloomy hollow]

Installation's done, hopefully it will work on my machine bois

[gilded slate]

I played R1A1 yesterday as a new player, before the R8 update dropped, and the horde we got everytime during the end seemed completely unfair? Like legitimately impossible to push through, like it's an infinite hard alarm horde... I even watched a video of R1A1 afterwards and there wasn't nearly as many enemies as we got. I got the update afterwards and didn't try again but I did try r7a1 with bots on my own and it was a complete cakewalk in comparison

Skill issue or was r1a1 just bugged?

[torpid viper]

uhm

[barren tangle]

i think that's the only reason why this game hasn gone under the radar in the market.

[torpid viper]

probably skill issue

:P

the enemies build up with time obv

and

also

did you clear the rooms you ran through after

[barren tangle]

besides that it's a really good game. it's actually way better than deep rock galactic in my opinion xddd drg just puts me to sleep lol

[torpid viper]

idk if they spawn more

but

i mean

did you run back

or did you stay and

[cobalt shale]

You probably took a bit too long to get out. Those runs back get bad if you let it go

[torpid viper]

yea

for extract scan its continuous

so

[gilded slate]

Legitimately infinitely spawning even though we cleared every room, we couldn't get out of the room you get the dna from

[torpid viper]

you shouldnt be trying to defend

[torpid viper]

yep

its infinite

until you extract

its an error

so it doesnt end

you can just sprint through it

you dont have to kill them

[cobalt shale]

If the horde got all the way to the room you got the DNA the you definitely took too long to cheese it. You should be meeting a few about halfway

[torpid viper]

halfway is way too far

you should be literally in the class 4 scan room before meeting anything

[gilded slate]

Oh yeah I know it's infinite, but it was constantly massive, as I mentioned it was legitimately impossible to pass through
Meanwhile in r7a1 i took a long ass time to extract (i forgot the pod thing in the room you put it in lol) and was able to go back in and extract without issue

It could've been a time issue though, I'm not sure how much it builds up

[cobalt shale]

They spawn a few rooms away during those so there's usually enough time to get distance before they're on you

[torpid viper]

:P

i can help... soon

if you need

ok maybe not soon

rip

but

...

i mean its def more enemies than r7a1

just

you shouldnt be stuck in that room

seems weird

[cobalt shale]

R7a1 is also in my opinion the easiest A level hands down

[torpid viper]

it is

not even in your opinion

[cobalt shale]

I started on rundown 5 x_x

[torpid viper]

anyways imma

go

black out

:D

[gilded slate]

Enemies constantly came in huge bulks, as soon as we get the DNA we were just stuck in that room

[cobalt shale]

Peace

[gilded slate]

Either way as a new player should i (we) just ignore past rundowns and play the current one?

[cobalt shale]

Going in order is rough, especially when r1... Lacking.... Compared to modern rundowns. I'd suggest cutting your teeth on the early levels from 6 and 7 for a bit tbh

[burnt moth]

what

[gilded slate]

Alrighty, cheers
But yeah it just seems really weird abour r1a1 yesterday. Never read anyone having as much trouble as we did, and any videos I watched of it the extraction part seemed like the easiest thing

[cobalt shale]

Sometimes the dice roll low on your spawns. Odd that they were on you that quick but I've seen weirder

[burnt moth]

This is fucked a non of my achivements are being given to me lol

[torpid viper]

Finish 1 expedition

uwu

Wait sorry

Finish one (1) expedition

[burnt moth]

ok

[ebon steppe]

mornings

[unique trench]

Honey

Howdy

[ebon steppe]

hihihi

[storm hazel]

It's a niche game, for sure

[maiden vale]

Hm.

[torpid viper]

Hm.

[unique trench]

Hm.

[naive igloo]

Hm.

[restive seal]

Hm.

[icy sparrow]

Hm.

[vagrant timber]

Hm.

[lone perch]

Hm.

[cloud topaz]

Hm.

[hoary compass]

.mH

[ember vault]

Hm.

[little egret]

Hm.

[serene marlin]

Any polish player looking for a party?/ Jakiś polski gracz szuka poczekalni?

Can't see any looking for group channel

[hoary compass]

#lfg-eastern-europe

Probably

[slender cipher]

@granite ginkgo sr mate my house lost power already

[old harbor]

hi there

nice to meet you all^^

[naive igloo]

How Lucky am I i have wall terminal

[ebon steppe]

!)

[rugged igloo]

The den of wolves soundtrack is made by Simon viklund

Wishlisted immediately

[vestal escarp]

hm.

[granite ginkgo]

np bro

[vocal stag]

isnt he one of the company founders

[dull jewel]

yes

[pulsar barn]

Hey is the make a group of four not channel not working for anyone else

[signal quarry]

Maybe the bot is overloaded

[timid gazelle]

People

I have a problem

[dull jewel]

that problem being...?

[timid gazelle]

The voicechat

[dull jewel]

.t lfg

[eternal saffron]

Hello! If you are unaware, we have Looking For Group (LFG) channels to help users group up and play the game. They are located here: #lfg-north-america / #lfg-latin-america / #lfg-eastern-europe / #lfg-western-europe / #lfg-asia / #lfg-oceania / #lfg-africa / #lfg-beginners / #lfg-middle-east.

If you are unsure of how to create or join a lobby, please see the instructions here: #how-to-matchmake.

[dull jewel]

honestly using discord or something else is your best bet

[timid gazelle]

How can i get into a vice chat that is like the ones that appear below me?

[dull jewel]

I think the bot might be dead

uhhh

[dull jewel]

try leaving the channel and rejoining, and if that doesn't work, DM @eternal saffron I guess

[floral stump]

how i can crate new channel ?

[grand totem]

How’s rundown 8 ?

[daring kraken]

just join the “create a team of [number]” channels and it’ll make one for you

[raven palm]

idk i haven't played it

[gentle oxide]

r8b4 lvl designers deserve a separate place in hell

[signal quarry]

True true I agree with your statement

[warm geyser]

create team of 4 is broken rn

[frosty imp]

Hm.

[final vigil]

oh, that is unfortunate

[opal snow]

Cerco due giocatori italiani!

Qualcuno può?

[ancient canopy]

The category has filled up but we have made an over flow category that you can join #1182745654066434090 . Unfortunately discord is being a little buggy and wont let me drag it up so it is at the very bottom of the server

[simple isle]

create team of four vc option is somehow populated and didn't move the members to a separate vc. now no one can make teams of 4

[ancient canopy]

the link I sent is for a fresh category which should work. The channel limit for a category is 50 and so the no more channels can be made in the regular group of 4

[simple isle]

i see

[final vigil]

I tried the new thing, people aren't able to join the vcs even when invited

unless that's just user error on my part

also there's a guy playing pubg in #884 lmao

or at least there used to be

[neat solstice]

Pinnacle of GTFO gameplay

[ancient canopy]

should be working now hopefully

there may be a few channels with no user limit so I suggest you rejoin the create channel to make a 4 person vc

[floral rivet]

I'm new to this but I'm having difficulty creating a team of 4, says its full

[frigid harbor]

@vernal crane bump vc

[ancient canopy]

if you check the channels and roles section, there should be a new category called "group of 4 overflow". Try making a channel there as the primary one is full currently

[vernal crane]

https://discord.com/channels/408196129470152705/1182760622010663003

[dull jewel]

.t lfg

[eternal saffron]

Hello! If you are unaware, we have Looking For Group (LFG) channels to help users group up and play the game. They are located here: #lfg-north-america / #lfg-latin-america / #lfg-eastern-europe / #lfg-western-europe / #lfg-asia / #lfg-oceania / #lfg-africa / #lfg-beginners / #lfg-middle-east.

If you are unsure of how to create or join a lobby, please see the instructions here: #how-to-matchmake.

[vernal crane]

He couldnt find the channel, my bad

[rough ermine]

jesus christ. ik its free weekend, but i am not used to so many players

[frosty imp]

Hm.

[proud wolf]

I have fallen in love with the slug shotgun

[frosty imp]

BO2 KSG moment

[neat rose]

Briefly forgot the achievements were a new addition and got the one for failing a run
"Only 0.1% of players have this "

[amber solar]

itll get more players

[raven palm]

i wonder how it counts free weekend players

past and present

[ebon steppe]

aquaaaa

[raven palm]

Dusteee!!!

[amber solar]

u both cutes

[ebon steppe]

how u been doing!!!!

[raven palm]

i been good! work is work, and i am getting a good headstart on spring cleaning'

how are you two cuties? (:

[frosty imp]

Hm.

[raven palm]

and a mayroo too! how do you do?

[frosty imp]

I am doing alright

I forgor how to read manga

[rare reef]

GTFO has gone WOKE

[frosty imp]

uh oh

Are all the sleepers WOKE now??

Have they aWOKEn to kill?

[rare reef]

YES

they should SLEEP not be WOKE

[ebon steppe]

I'm so happy to read that :3 glas ur good

[raven palm]

what about youu Dusty Bun? (:

[tough hemlock]

there is a achievement to kill a scout stealthy (after checking it todays)

[dull jewel]

||spear||

[rugged igloo]

Knife :3

[raven palm]

||nun-chucks||

[tough hemlock]

||||

[neat solstice]

Someone come play R8A1 with me

[rugged igloo]

So anyone looked through the den of wolves website

Because I have

[neat solstice]

den of wolves, what is that a furry convention?

[shy comet]

Does this game not have a server browser? I just have a mathcmaking button.

[split portal]

correct, no server browser, but instead you matchmake for a difficulty tier and it matches you with others in that tier

[scenic ginkgo]

i hate R8C1

[shy comet]

Ten 4. I geuss Ill play while its free and uninstall, please do a server browser? whats the benefit from this vs discord? what about people who dont even have discord?

[scenic ginkgo]

[raven palm]

people w/o discord can play with steam friends, but yes, this discord is mandatory

[dull jewel]

just warning you in advance, matchmaking is hot garbage. use the LFG channels instead.

.t lfg

[eternal saffron]

Hello! If you are unaware, we have Looking For Group (LFG) channels to help users group up and play the game. They are located here: #lfg-north-america / #lfg-latin-america / #lfg-eastern-europe / #lfg-western-europe / #lfg-asia / #lfg-oceania / #lfg-africa / #lfg-beginners / #lfg-middle-east.

If you are unsure of how to create or join a lobby, please see the instructions here: #how-to-matchmake.

[shy comet]

ten 4. Thanks for the info.

[dull jewel]

also make sure you have completed the tutorial

[raven palm]

we cannot emphasize that enough

[shy comet]

I will but wont be afterwards, i kinda need match making lot of my friends dont have discord. But understand, all good.

[scenic ginkgo]

[rugged igloo]

You don’t need discord to play with friends

There’s in game voice

[dull jewel]

If you already have people to play with, you can go play with them without using this server

[shy comet]

ya well being a 40 year old gamer I can tell you so many people ive met in real life and gamed with til this day in a match making system. How do you find new players if they dont have discord?

[cosmic geode]

There’s also a voice command system

[shy comet]

Like im a person that enjoys playing with randoms and teaching new players how to play in person

without a match making system their REQUIRED to have discord. Kinda shutting out the rest of the population in my eyes but its not my game haha, I understand.

example. (Not complaing just giving my point of experience) one of my best gaming buddys I met ina game with a match making system and til this day does not have discord, without a random match making system Id never met him? see what Im saying? How do people without discord meet new people and expand?

[dull jewel]

There is still the matchmaking button in the game, ofc

[rugged igloo]

No one uses it though for some reason

[scenic ginkgo]

it sucks

[dull jewel]

but ultimately - this game requires a decent amount of team coordination to get through even the simplest levels.

[shy comet]

I tried just now, and no one joined.

well one did, but imediately left.

Anywho, thanks for the info!

[undone birch]

Yeah no in game matchmaking isn't used

[dull jewel]

I suppose that the main target demographic for this game is premade friend groups who would be willing to sink hours and hours into trying and trying again

[scenic ginkgo]

this

but in this server is more easy to find randoms who are willing to do the same

another good thing about discord

[lunar orbit]

Very disappointing theres only 6 levels in r8

[scenic ginkgo]

lol

[lunar orbit]

oh?

[dull jewel]

no comment

[scenic ginkgo]

i said nothing

but yeah

[still belfry]

how invite ffriends

[scenic ginkgo]

#how-to-matchmake

[dull jewel]

you can send them invites via steam

[undone birch]

tbf if the UX was clearer this wouldn't be an issue

[scenic ginkgo]

i need people for R8C1

that level sucks

its apprently the skill check of R8

[undone birch]

Thankfully

I have no skill

Whatsover

[scenic ginkgo]

lol

[undone birch]

What can I say, you either have the bitches or the skills

[scenic ginkgo]

i have none

[undone birch]

Some just happen to have neither

KJZFKJFQKBJH LMAO

NOOOO

[undone birch]

CHUG CHUG CHUG

DO IT

DO IT

[raven palm]

its free weekend rn, it is being used, by all the newbies

[scenic ginkgo]

goodbye guys

im drinking all the water

[undone birch]

we have a subway station in Paris called "bleach"

[scenic ginkgo]

Paris? kinda cringe

[undone birch]

with that were me

[undone birch]

Where are you from again

[scenic ginkgo]

Mexico

[undone birch]

when I go out people just steal my phone, not my kidneys

which sucks because my phone is shitty but my kidneys in prime condition

[scenic ginkgo]

sell your kidney

who needs them anyways

[undone birch]

like hello? can a woman get recognized for her value?

[undone birch]

donate 1 kidney and you're a hero

donate 10 and you're under investigation

[scenic ginkgo]

smh

i just dont understand

[undone birch]

IKR

so unfair

just take you for example

While we had this convo, I subtilized your 2 kidneys

See?

You didn't even notice

[scenic ginkgo]

HUH

[undone birch]

Like what is the fuss all about

[scenic ginkgo]

at least give me 40% of the profit

going to main topic

i really need a team for R8C1 main

not overload

[undone birch]

I'm waited for my minions to log in

soz

don't wanna get spoiled

just like you did smh

[scenic ginkgo]

i didnt got spoiled

[undone birch]

no

u spoiled

[scenic ginkgo]

i wish

[undone birch]

:(

i am going to the bleach station now

[scenic ginkgo]

i was reading the achivements for the game

some of them are funny dumb

[brazen juniper]

Hello

[scenic ginkgo]

"complete a b tier without using the flaslight"

"complete a A tier without killing with main/sec weapons"

[scenic ginkgo]

apparently 99% of players dont have flaslight discipline

[dull jewel]

B tier pistols/revolvers only

[scenic ginkgo]

LMAO

[dull jewel]

D tier shotguns only

[digital junco]

That’s solo too

[rugged igloo]

Knife mains do that anyway

[scenic ginkgo]

"complete an expedition marking ALL enemies"

[raven palm]

that one is Hard, like not breathing through your nose for an hour hard

[digital junco]

Unbind the key

[raven palm]

unbind your nose

[rugged igloo]

Just get a friend to be your flashlight

[scenic ginkgo]

someone said that wasnt necesary
mf turned on the flaslight a second after the drop

LOL

[raven palm]

[rugged igloo]

Do a run with battle buddies

[dull jewel]

it doesn't say anything about glowsticks, I suppose

[rugged igloo]

One person uses flashlight one doesn’t

[scenic ginkgo]

its better if no one uses flaslights

[crystal veldt]

r8c1 overload is one of a kind in terms of wtf is going on bro

[dull jewel]

(achievement is for no flashlights. at all)

[scenic ginkgo]

RIGHT

[pale aurora]

hi, how long u guys take to find a team in the flg? because im from latin america, i have created a lobby and waited like 10 minutes and nobody appaers :(

[scenic ginkgo]

Latin America... yikes

[undone birch]

oh no the sound of mouthbreathing was

no

[scenic ginkgo]

you can post in other LFG channels

[rugged igloo]

Wait I just realized, syncing sleepers would be hard without flashlight

[crystal veldt]

depends on the level you are playing

[scenic ginkgo]

but im from Mexico so i might able to join you @pale aurora

[dull jewel]

could try #hc-latin-america as well

[pale aurora]

i am a begginer, so i want to start the first mission i think, that it is the R1A1, im not bad at shooters but i have no one to play with lmao

that sounds so sad

[dull jewel]

play the tutorial first

[raven palm]

i would never, promise

[pale aurora]

i already have played it!

[dull jewel]

congratulations you are doing better than most people

[rugged igloo]

Now solo R1A1 (with bots)

[pale aurora]

lmao, i think i can communicate with some other from usa but they have to be patient with me for the languague

[dull jewel]

but yeah try #hc-latin-america as well, see if anyone local to you is online in one of those communities

[pale aurora]

okay, i will try, thanks for being so nice

[dull jewel]

np :)

[undone birch]

fjfzjqhfv is just

I got startled by hearing my own breathing lmao

[ebon steppe]

hihihi

[raven palm]

hello hello!

[ebon steppe]

hiiiiii

[scenic ginkgo]

that reminds me that yesterday i got scared with my own shadow in GTFO

[undone birch]

DAMN

[scenic ginkgo]

i was going crazy after R8B2

the schizo got me

[digital junco]

[undone birch]

ahah definitely couldn't be me

[sturdy bear]

i love it so much

[rugged igloo]

Anyone else checked out the arg on the den of wolves website

[faint raptor]

Wait, why make an achievement to not use healthpacks on R8D1?

[rugged igloo]

Because it’s difficult

[faint raptor]

I did get the no downs achievement

[verbal acorn]

So how goes rd8 so far

[scenic ginkgo]

R8? kinda epic

[verbal acorn]

Glad to hear ima be starting it soon and going for em pe runs

[scenic ginkgo]

oh boy

you are going to have a wild time then

good luck

[verbal acorn]

I'm a r4 vet I'm prepared

[scenic ginkgo]

when you get to C1 tell me

i need some people to do it

[verbal acorn]

No worries mate hopefully I get no new players in my runs especially with pe runs thay wouldn't be nice one bit

[scenic ginkgo]

i have experience in C1 so that will be a bit useful when you get there

||i totally havent spent 7 hours in total in that level||

[verbal acorn]

Awk none the less I'll learn it v quickly got like 600 700 hours game time. Check points still a thing yeah? Wish they'd remove them

[verbal acorn]

Lol that sounds like gtfo to me