balance-feedback-discussion

[fresh laurel]

I think other dinos being canni shouldnt get debuffs from eating their own kind but instead no nutrients

[sinful cove]

Hotspot syndrome in general

[fresh laurel]

And doesnt help that you could find a random meatchunk and eat it not knowing it was your kind

[sinful cove]

Utah rock was cancer lol but it was fun

[fresh laurel]

Well there was also the swamp hotspot back in update 1 which werent full of body guarding tenos

Utah rock return pls

[sinful cove]

I still have horrid memories because getting nested at rock was one of my first isle experiences

Pack of like 9 gigas came and camped it while j was a juvi and started biting over the edge

[fresh laurel]

Ok now funny idea...

Let utahs push pouncing utahs off them

[sinful cove]

Well, i was new and naive

[fresh laurel]

If a utah is pinned shouldnt it be able to kick the attack off?

[sinful cove]

Utahs should be able to claw at other utahs yeah

[fresh laurel]

I think kicking off would be better imo

With how long you spend trying to claw them then you might die of bleed

Since utah takes bleed bad

[sinful cove]

Well my friend told me at the time that joining the large pack via nesting would make things better than running to them as juvi so i learned the hard way

[sinful cove]

True though who knows how many defensive kicks it would take to also make the other utah not want to deal with it lol

[fresh laurel]

Ngl i like playing juv alone and afk while watching netflix

[sinful cove]

Its what i do now, packs always get me killed

Or i just watch my whole pack die

[fresh laurel]

I mean if someone your exact weight and size is on you couldnt you just push them off?

[sinful cove]

Last time i was in a utah pack j watched them run single file in to a tenonto and get oneshot one at a time. There was just one word spoken, “tenonto” before they all rushed in a neat line to their deaths. This was a few patches ago too and it reminded me why im a solo player

[fresh laurel]

You told me this before lmao

[sinful cove]

Yeah probably though position also matters

[sinful cove]

Its so clear in my head still lmao

It was like some fever dream

[fresh laurel]

With how a pouncing utah is standing and how the victem is pinned you can still use your leg power

[sinful cove]

Just watching them run one by one and get tail slammed in a pile by a stationary tenonto

They didnt even say a word as they died

The only word spoken in the whole encounter was the single “tenonto”

It fela like i was watching bots

[sinful cove]

I could see the pinned raptor dishing out nasty bleed to the attacker and forcing them off definitely

[fresh laurel]

Most utahs i run into are new and thus will run from anything slightly big causing us to never hunt big game rip

[sinful cove]

Sometimes i have adult raptors trying to “adopt” me and a few of them talk like cringy RPers

[fresh laurel]

I remember seeing 4 of my adult utah pack mates run from one carno that was chasing me

Loyalty 100

[sinful cove]

Idk how i even got in to that pack of like 8 or something raptors like, if they were that quick to kill themselves how did they last that long lmao

[fresh laurel]

Raptorgamer69 says will you be my mate uwu

[sinful cove]

I fucking HATE whej they say things like “babu”

[sinful cove]

I actually ran in to that type during legacy

The cat clan RPers playing utah

[fresh laurel]

I remember when one of my pack mates died to a deino they decided to curse at us for not helping them escape deino somehow

[sinful cove]

Lmao

I had a friend actually who was in that exact predicament maybe it was him

[fresh laurel]

I also remember killing a carno with my pack and carno came back as utah to just complain and call us trash

[sinful cove]

He isnt my friend anymore… but he told me that he was fighting a deino and died and his pack didnt help him and he was pissed

So he DMed me about it i guess for what ever reason

[fresh laurel]

Why fight a deino

At least waste its stam then bite its tail or something

[sinful cove]

lol found it. Would be funny if it was the same guy

Yeah im not gonna call out any names but i know you know lol

Personally id fight a deino but

[brittle dirge]

You just can't comprehend their giga brain strategy

[fresh laurel]

nerf ptera dmg

[sinful cove]

Plot twist they were just looking for a way to kill themselves and they found it

[sinful cove]

Nerf pt damage to 2

[fresh laurel]

nerf it so it doesnt 2 shot each other lmao

[sinful cove]

But i like alt pecking other pteras and they have no chance to fight back

lul

Killing the spam calling rock birds is the best way to play pt

As long as pt can still kill other pt fast im fine with its nerfs

lotta raptors i run in to do that lol no stam management present

[brittle dirge]

[hollow canyon]

^

Idk the context but yes, that would make the game much more fun

[wise sparrow]

Diets can work if they didn't feel like they had 3 seconds of planning

[hollow canyon]

So the current growth time of Tenonto for me was about as long as the growth time of Carno prior to the release of diets

it took me 135 minutes from what I can see

I also found the not afk part to be naturally far more boring than the afk part

running forward for 30+ minutes just to get to an area where some specific food item is... is not my definition of a fun and engaging task

[fresh laurel]

i mean if there was a slower growth mechanic for afkers then they could bring it back and improve it a bit while removing growth debuffs on diets

i think diets should feel more optional and not as forced

[rotund basalt]

@prime folio I've grown my Pachy without any issues heading towards the West. Even went very close to the Port which is a very safe place to reach the beach btw Just eat a lot of food at Swamp and you will keep that protein full for a while

[prime folio]

if you are on the west side of the dry river already, it is not a problem to go west

I mean on the eastern side of the map traveling west, or center traveling east

The dry river does a u-turn so it can catch you going north/south around it too. I've learned to avoid it by smalling dead meat and coconuts in an area that is not the coast.

I've got the hang of it now, but that sucked falling in twice trying to figure out things after hours of growing.
At least thin the shrubs on the ledge so I can see it coming before leaping to my death

[alpine plover]

@hushed ibex "pachy cant spam ram as before" That why it was changed, you made me laugh when i read that

[hushed ibex]

Yah Im not talking about its turn radius in that comment, Im talking about allowing it to miss a ram without coming to a complete stand still since ram is such a high risk low reward now

With how its turn radius is rearing the ram, it still wouldnt be able to chain bonk if it could move while missing a swing, if it does get a chain, whatever its fighting is just not trying to move at all

[torpid dragon]

OP carno is even more OP. Gather some statistics instead of making strawpool and adjust balance by votes. Thanks!

[prime folio]

I think carno is supposed to be OP, but they balance by limiting pack size

[sinful cove]

How in the hell is that supposed to make sense

[prime folio]

my reasoning would be that carno packs that are small will make separate smaller groups, groups that fight amongst each other, less ability to see where other carnos are at outside of groups if you do ally with other groups (making it harder to keep track of targets and coordinate).... I'm sure they can balance in other ways, but pack size does matter

not even sure what the pack size is for carno though

maybe they can limit the amount of active live carnos on a server?

I just don't see a carno not being OP compared to others

[sinful cove]

This is not what happens

People do not pay attention to group limits, they all just talk in local or discord

Hard limiting a playable sucks ass and is a lazy solution , proper balance works better

[prime folio]

well then you are screwed by any race of dyno

[sinful cove]

No, carno is the fastest land animal. Things like stego are at least kept mostly in check because they cant force you to engage them

There is a difference between it and other dinos

Plus carnivore tracking is busted now

[prime folio]

I predator that can't catch things seems bad though.

[sinful cove]

You clearly arent getting the point

[prime folio]

definitely am not getting the point, sorry

delete carno from game? or do you have a specific solution

[sinful cove]

It is the fastest land animal, so it can control engagements, and it also now has no melee disadvantage against tenonto. This is an issue for future low mod tier brawlers as well unless it is changed, which it probably will be because the devs are doing a constant back and forth of making animals garbage or op

[sinful cove]

Personally i would have added cerato before carno but its too late for that

[prime folio]

maybe they can add some stam control that lets slower animals disengage if they cannot successfully get a kill in a certain amount of actions

[sinful cove]

???

Nah, they should have just been less extreme in their recent balance changes

This is what the isle devs do, they go too far

They nerf or buff too hard

[wise sparrow]

Or or, hear me out here, I know it sounds crazy, let the animal that is slower and cant really avoid carno in any way have a brawling advantage over the ambush predator

[sinful cove]

Or they just nerf or buff too many things at once

The carno buffs may have been fine, but also nerfing tenonto to the ground at the same time was too far

[prime folio]

so basically make predators always need a numbers advantage?

I'm new back to the game, so you are probably right

[sinful cove]

No, make the predators actually need to use more skill to take on targets that cant run

It should take more skill to attack than defend

[wise sparrow]

No. Just don't let the ambush predator that is twice as fast have a brawling advantage over the brawler herbivore

[sinful cove]

No dino should need a pack to be viable, but some dinos should require a pack to defeat for some predators. Tenonto shouldnt require more than one carno, but the carno shouldnt just be able to go in and casually brawl the tenonto, it should require caution

Animals in its own tier are like the top of carno's preferred target range, so it should require them to use their brain

[prime folio]

close fights are always better and more exciting... makes people pay for mistakes more

[sinful cove]

Depending on the situation

When you dont have a choice and your attacker does, then it becomes annoying

[prime folio]

yeah... I was thinking in a 1v1 situation

[wise sparrow]

There is a difference between a "close" fight. And something running you down at light speed and proceeding to kick your ass nearly effortlessly

[sinful cove]

When your attacker can just fuck off when things dont go their way, but you do not share that privilege, it gets annoying

[prime folio]

so far, I've always just hid and know that I'm dead if they see me... but I see your point with the big Herbas needing a better challenge against Carno

[sinful cove]

Yeah defend yourself against a faster target that is evenly matched in the melee but has the engagement advantage as well. Doesnt sound very thrilling

In the last patch tenonto was a little overtuned, but carno could still kill it 1v1 if it was cautious

[wise sparrow]

Carno got a bit too much but it would have been okay if teno wasn't completely gutted.

[sinful cove]

Now tenonto is undertuned, mainly because its kick is a trash ability and its signature ability has been gutted

[wise sparrow]

Mechanic test utah

[sinful cove]

Yeah

[torpid dragon]

example of utah ability https://www.twitch.tv/grimxd/clip/FunGiftedBisonSquadGoals-HjfH8YUcFynJc-Bj?filter=clips&range=24hr&sort=time

[wise sparrow]

Along with carno having legacy levels of ease feeding itself, herbivores are just unplayable rn. God forbid traversing the entire map for a single food item

[wise sparrow]

Why'd you react to your own post so much?

[prime folio]

maybe they can make the big Herbas higher risk and more reward to where they have problems landing a skill shot, but, if they do, the Herba will be rewarded heavily -- whereas, the Carno has an easier fight but has to remain cautious... not sure how they would do that, but going too far with buffs and nerfs is not the way

I find a lot of devs miss the point when balancing, just changing a few values rather than thinking the fight out and how it should look

I like mechanical changes more than changing dmg or speed values (even if those too need to be adjusted)

[wise sparrow]

Bu- g

DAMIT

[fresh laurel]

or how about this!

increase its range!

😄

[fresh laurel]

back then people still complained about kick being useless or slam being too strong soo.. and i think devs wanted to buff kick but to compensate, make slam more of a support move for kick

i think teno is fine but buff kicks range somewhat or reduce slam stam cost a tad

ik

back then it was just a bad option

compared to slam

maybe before players start calling teno horrible for this balance change how about practicing more with em

teno needs actual skill now

[fallow stag]

Before the update it would take
4 headshots or
5 body shots to kill a carno
Carno just had to ram u and alt bite u twice and your health would drop to 30-40%
Now with the nerf it will take 7 slams
While carno ram and alt bite got buffed
1 ram and 2 bites and your dead

[versed rune]

@prime folio when you say dry river, do you mean the giant ravine that has bushes hiding the top legdes of it?

[fresh laurel]

then dont keep slamming

try using kick more

[prime folio]

yeah... died twice in that

[fresh laurel]

map still has those hidden cliff problems

[fallow stag]

Kick won't do shit carno can lit face tank and alt bite now

[versed rune]

huh, didnt know they added coconut spawns there. but yeah the cliffs hidden by bushes are total BS and need changing.

[fresh laurel]

carno can face tank kick?

someone test that

[versed rune]

people who say "just learn lole" clearly have no idea what a well designed map is supposed to be

[fresh laurel]

v3 map

[prime folio]

I don't think they are supposed to be there honestly... supposed to only be on coasts

[fresh laurel]

[versed rune]

hey man im not complaining, traveling to the coasts is boring as hell cuz its so far and theres literally no one

[fresh laurel]

if they really make pachy have to run to coast for coconuts ima just fall of my chair at that point

[versed rune]

forcing players to go to the most barren edges of the map, how delightful

[prime folio]

the coast is boring gameplay... maybe if they gave more reason for other animals to be there... or maybe once the Carnos figure out that we go there now

[fresh laurel]

coast fun for juv carnis

[fallow stag]

They have to make alt bite and normal bite for carnos a lot slower and nerf their stam by atleast 30%-40%

[versed rune]

wait so i know coconuts spawn on the sides of the map, but do they spawn on the actual beach, too?

[versed rune]

if you want them to nerf carno's stam by 30 to 40% then you clearly have never played adult carno

the thing has asthma

[fresh laurel]

i think since carno can land ram more they could maybe reduce alt bite dmg a bit

carno base bite seems fine

[prime folio]

coconuts are off the beach on some of the palms

[tribal thistle]

dude, the poor buggers, can barely run for any viable portions of time

[prime folio]

also the Human area before you get to the west coast has a palm tree with coconuts, so you don't have to go all the way to the coast

[fallow stag]

Coconuts will be around beach side if u lucky little bit behind old south spawn
Melons are at the back side off swamp
Agave plains with the carno packs

[versed rune]

have carnos been eating each other a lot?

i havent really run into many others yet

[fallow stag]

All servers are full with carnos mass packing from west grassland to center to swamp

[prime folio]

I haven't played some of the bigger Herbas yet to test them in situational fights, but I'm not sure I'd take a fight to a Carno unless I had a big pack of Raptors.... I hope some of the bigger Herbas can defend themselves a good bit

[fallow stag]

Only way to fix this is by buffing utahs tenos and pachys or to revert it like before
Or add another apex carni
Or a new herb like dibble who can smash carno

[fresh laurel]

i would say buff utah but decrease pack limit

utah would still be pretty f'ed if its found alone by a carno

but when i say buff utah i mean make dismount have less end lag or buff utah turn radius to be like update 2 or 3

[fallow stag]

I feel sry for utah players right now its just useless now like not playbl at all

[fresh laurel]

its not useless but just heavily bleed reliant

i would say a way to help it be even better at using bleed is to let it know how much blood a target has left

like you're blood drops becomes darker when you have a lower blood bar

[lusty berry]

I find the people saying they made charge do more damage are funny. They literally made it so even if you don't stun them you still do damage. As for their bite? they got no changes to it damage wise, only a stamina change for Alt bite.. They literally did the same damage as they did before. They just aren't used to Teno not killing in 5 hits with stun on each hit. Teno kick if anything could use a bit of a bigger hit box or something to make it more dependable to hit if anything. But Teno is fine now. Pachy nerfs were needed but I will agree about the diet locations for all herbis should be a bit more.. spread out... maybe an alternative to coconuts would be a thing to add in.. Utah is literally fine, there is no issue with Utah

I do agree about the lower blood thing because they are a bleed hunter with pounce.

[fresh laurel]

at this rate we wont ever have people agree that carno vs teno is fair lmao

[fallow stag]

Lets just say it like thiss

[lusty berry]

For anyone complaining about Carno.. imagine doing this big wind up ram and just because they didn't get stunned? They took 0 damage. Imagine being all this weight, into a horned ram

and do 0 damage when you hit because it didn't cc

[fresh laurel]

i would say wait for a bit more playables before saying carno or teno broken/horrible

carno smaller game hunter and teno kinda does kinda fall into smaller game...

[fallow stag]

Are alll server full with tenos players ?????
Nopeee
Are they full with mass packing carnos yess
WE GOT OUR ANSWER

So shut up

[fresh laurel]

i think its just carno mains testing carno again

[lusty berry]

Thats because you all have a illusion that Carno is broken lmao

[hollow canyon]

where are you getting this info from?

The damage output of Carno hasn't changed

It takes just as many bites to kill a Tenonto as previously

[fallow stag]

Ye but alt bite is faster so faster dmge

[lusty berry]

It's "new toy syndrome" it got a small buff in some manner, and then everyone wanted to try it.

[fresh laurel]

i can avoid carno pretty fine with smaller dinos and if i get rammed that should be pretty rewarding for carno due to it being a ambush move

[lusty berry]

and its costs more stam

[hollow canyon]

I mean 2 alt bites and a charge don't kill a Tenonto

that's for sure

[lusty berry]

Aken is correct, it does not

[fresh laurel]

like when utah pounced worked again

im telling you when something gets a buff in the game rn ppl will try it

[lusty berry]

Like its' fine, if anyone should be hurt its Ptera players

[hollow canyon]

In general I'd really love if we had some test servers or sandbox ones to test it out properly

[fresh laurel]

carno population will die down again

[hollow canyon]

I do think that the general issue is the devs trying to tinker with multiple things at once

[fallow stag]

Nbdy plays ptera plysss

[fresh laurel]

ptera can 2 shot each other LMAO

[lusty berry]

That is where you are wrong Boe, there are a lot of Ptera players because the game is about IMERSION not death match city

There tends to be servers for that

[hollow canyon]

this idea of buffing one animal while nerfing another every time is what swings the pendulum between two animals that were really rather well balanced back in 3.5

[fresh laurel]

3.5 was when interactive water and juvie utah pounce came out right?

[hollow canyon]

Yea

[fresh laurel]

utah was broken

[lusty berry]

Right now, as it seems, they are balanced. A Teno can stun, kick and make a Carno think twice. A Carno can ambush and catch them.

[fresh laurel]

stego was dog water

[hollow canyon]

There are servers for that I'm on Zoo right now but tbh I'm not sure how to get growths atm

[fresh laurel]

if carno lands ram on you i feel like that should decide the fight

[lusty berry]

Stego STILL can one shot a good body shot, but no one is complaining that they didn't get a small damage drop? Why? they didn't stun you for 2-3s to combo kill you.

[hollow canyon]

In general Tenonto also has the option of just escaping via water but

[fresh laurel]

deino

[hollow canyon]

yea

[lusty berry]

To be fair? You are correct Sonic, it should. That shit has a BIG wind up. If Teno let Carno breathe? That is their fault.

[hollow canyon]

I'm going to say that

one thing that's a big oof imo

regarding Tenonto is that... let me check real quick if I'm correct here:

[lusty berry]

Actuially here's something.. Pachy and Carno now have a double edges sword on each other

Ram and Charge now cause damage to each other

[fresh laurel]

teno could possibly swim away too if they are heavily out numbered or might die

[lusty berry]

and likely will stun each other

[fresh laurel]

die to possible deino or guaranteed carno

[hollow canyon]

of course I am - the devs have again tuned down the damage on the tailslam without decreasing the stamina cost

[fresh laurel]

also maybe a way to make ppl shush about carno "folding" teno is to let teno crouch?

[hollow canyon]

Why do they keep doing this? If an attack loses part of its firepower it's only right to decrease the stamina cost

[lusty berry]

I'd say decrease it a little bit. The stam should be because it's a cc with some added damage and yes can break a head

[fresh laurel]

tail slam didnt get a big dmg nerf pretty sure

but i can see where you're coming from

[wintry mountain]

It did not

[fallow stag]

By the time u land 7 hits on a carno your alrdy dead

[lusty berry]

nah it's not a massive nerf, but it should get a light stam decrease. \

[fresh laurel]

teno can beat carno bruv

[lusty berry]

It stuns, so no. Not true Boe.

[fresh laurel]

teno just has to play more offensive

[lusty berry]

It's not a get out of jail free card and that is why you are complaining

[hollow canyon]

I will need to calculate the damage output of the tail at some point but

[fresh laurel]

teno more offensive now than defensive like before

[hollow canyon]

ugh

[fresh laurel]

dont forget to aim at carno head to avoid hitting legs
also test how much utah alt bite does pls...

[hollow canyon]

Yea I'd have to do all that but no sandbox so

[fallow stag]

I dont mind i can wait they will nerf carno to the ground either way
By all the complains about it

[lusty berry]

They won't because people are complaining about nothing.

[fresh laurel]

think its best to see how carno does against more mid tier carnivores

dont think carno gonna be fighting other mid tier herbivores either

[lusty berry]

They literally did nothing to break Carno, they changed the "Standing in place turn speed" and a "SLIGHT increase in turning when Ram" They didn't make them do a full 90 degree turn

[fresh laurel]

lmao exactly

tiny changes and people assuming carno is gonna fold everyone

[hollow canyon]

Yea tbh I've had no issues dodging the charge so far

[wintry mountain]

Just means carno can turn around from a drift quite a bit faster

Making drifting hits easier

[lusty berry]

Again it's "new toy Syndrome" When Deino was put in the game I literally saw so many Deinos that I couldn't go near water

[fresh laurel]

even then smaller dinos if smart wont stay too far from somewhere to hide or jump on

[lusty berry]

To be fair it still doesn't turn on a dime like Utah and THAT means it's balanced

[fresh laurel]

teno can fight back

[wintry mountain]

I ran from four as a pachy

But it's also yknow

[fresh laurel]

i escaped 5 carnos as a utah beat that

😎

[lusty berry]

honeslty? I am glad Pachy got a nerf, it literally would run at everything and not care.

[wintry mountain]

People expecting pachys to brawl carno

[fresh laurel]

pachy is hit and run doe

[wintry mountain]

When that was never meant to be the case

[fallow stag]

I dont mind hitting it 7 timzs but atleast giv a higher defense to herbs then if u are going to nerf some attacks

[fresh laurel]

i heard some people say pachy nerf was too much or not needed

[lusty berry]

so they can tank more? Hell no

[wintry mountain]

Teno got a buffed attack in contrast

[fresh laurel]

stego is defensive herb

[lusty berry]

So does anyone remember cama Legacy? This man expects that

[wintry mountain]

Kick does bleed, comes out faster, does more damage

[fresh laurel]

go play stego if you want more defensive gameplay

teno is offensive herbi...

[lusty berry]

Teno is not meant for that type of play style. Stego is, it's something that you want to stun, kick.. You basically punch them in the mouth

[fresh laurel]

though people are saying kick hitbox is trash soo

anyways game seems pretty balanced rn

juvie herbis just are playing path of titans at this point though

[hollow canyon]

I really wouldn't say so tbh

[lusty berry]

Thats why I said they should make the kick a bit more reliable but nothing so huge

[fresh laurel]

i mean running around like crazy as a juvie herbi and sometimes needing to cross rivers...

while your carnivore counterpart ate a random meal and is watching netflix in a bush

[lusty berry]

Path of Titans.. man.. that shit annoyed me.. getting ran at while I was a juvie by herbies who were near full grown sucked lmao

[hollow canyon]

I know what you meant but... I've started to play Path of Titans lately and it was far more engaging than the juvenile herbivore gameplay

[fresh laurel]

ik

[dusky surge]

Yo did a new frosty post drop

[fresh laurel]

GET THE CAMERAS

[dusky surge]

What a great way to start the day holy shit

[hollow canyon]

really juvenile gameplay in Evrima atm was

how do I put it? 40 minutes of walking and running from one end of the map to another just to sit afk for the next hour and half or so

[fresh laurel]

this aint his worst suggestion tbh

[dusky surge]

still dumb

[lusty berry]

I still say the diet shouldn't be as involved as it is. I think it'll be better once they get carnivore ai up and running

[fresh laurel]

yup

[lusty berry]

Like Velos in Legacy make you run

[fallow stag]

They should just giv tail slam body break dmg so u can frac a leg 😂 👍

[lusty berry]

It does that? I've had a Teno break my Carno's head and body

[hollow canyon]

it doesn't, that sounds like a bug

[dusky surge]

idk how tf that happened because teno does no blunt damage

[fresh laurel]

couldnt afk growing be fixed by giving juvie dinosaurs different niches compared to their adult forms so people feel like they are not playing a worst adult

[dusky surge]

we dont need carnivore AI. We have the power of boars

[lusty berry]

Idk but it's happened tome and My carno mate at the time

[fresh laurel]

also what would happen if diets were more optional but if you tried afk growing for like 10 minutes your growth slowed...

[hollow canyon]

that's really weird if it happens again try to get a recording from shadowplay or something

Were diets even supposed to be the solution to afk growing?

[lusty berry]

I agree with that Sonic

[fresh laurel]

when the boar finds your bush in the forest

[fresh laurel]

probably

[hollow canyon]

I was absolutely convinced that they were merely a method of funneling the players to the correct locations

[lusty berry]

Boar is something lmao

[fresh laurel]

also big question

[lusty berry]

but we need more of those even for adult, then we'll have no boring game plays lol.

[hollow canyon]

I don't believe that to be the case

[fresh laurel]

why did they say diets need gore in order to work with carnivores but didnt release with gore

[hollow canyon]

if devs really wanted THIS to solve the issue of afk growth then honestly that makes me feel really hopeless

[dusky surge]

I see no solution large AI brings that can't be solved through something far better

[lusty berry]

so to this, Cerato in Legacy, thats all I need to say. That is the epitome of this.

[fresh laurel]

or sub rex somewhat

[hollow canyon]

sub rex a lot a lot

sub rex>>>adult rex

[fresh laurel]

different niches right there

[hollow canyon]

Last I played legacy I wasn't even progressing to adult on Rex cause the sub was just that good

[lusty berry]

Yea lmao, like Cerato isn't a different niche but it's just better than the adult.

[fresh laurel]

better bleed moment

[lusty berry]

yep lol

[hollow canyon]

Yea but that's to a large extent cause Cerato's adult was garbage

[fresh laurel]

at least now cera might be a honey badger

[dusky surge]

i dont even think thats a different niche i just think thats the garbage balance of legacy on full dsiplay

[lusty berry]

I still don't know why they dropped Cerato's adult speed so badly. It should be a honey badger.

[fresh laurel]

im saying the difference in sub rex compared to adult rex felt like 2 whole different gameplays

[dusky surge]

i mean... honey badgers don't tend to run very fast, or a lot. When they see a threat they often just bullshit their way through it

[fresh laurel]

cera could try it

[dusky surge]

and they tend to eat shit like honey, which doesn't move

[fresh laurel]

rotten gore

[dusky surge]

so i mean, slowness doesn't sound incorrect for a honey badger, or for cera

[fresh laurel]

i mean cera would just be intimidating enough to make some players not try to bother it when it takes a gore

and cera would probably put a up a good fight with most mid tiers

[lusty berry]

I would like for them to put up a good fight. I just don't want to see Cera end up well.. dying to everything without being able to do much.. again..

[fresh laurel]

question do you guys think current game balancing will stay like this for a good couple updates?

i think game balancing is really good rn

[lusty berry]

I believe so, I think the only thing they need to fix is loading in, and controllers being screwed up.

[fresh laurel]

cera imo should be able to make carnos f off pretty easily

[mighty haven]

@peak pumice what are you smoking sir?

[dusky surge]

cera being able to make carnos fuck off but also not consistently killing them is ideal imho

[fresh laurel]

aye dont bully em, let him have his own ideas and opinion

[mighty haven]

nerf teno??? ITS ALREADY BEEN NERFED DUD

[fresh laurel]

true and cera could escape to water possibly

[fresh laurel]

its been buffed if anything imo

[lusty berry]

because Analog is currently non functioning

[mighty haven]

In what world should carno 1v2 teno and win easily???

[fresh laurel]

anyways should i grow a deino now?

[mighty haven]

nope

[fresh laurel]

seems liked deinos eat good these days

[fresh laurel]

im not gonna start the whole teno is bad or good debate

[mighty haven]

neither will i

[lusty berry]

Look as long as it isn't in a server where Pteras alert a massive group of Raptors to anyone who isn't in their pack and cause a massive hunting party to happen? Go for it

Yes that happened to me and a friend one day.

[fresh laurel]

so uh should i grow a deino now or...

[lusty berry]

^ yes sir

[fresh laurel]

bet

hope i dont get cannibled

[lusty berry]

OH actually Dry river\

Okay so I think they should re add some shallows for juvi Deinos

but keep some dry pathways for all others to walk

What do you think?

[mental roost]

Frosty has graced us again

[lusty berry]

traveling purposes. Small spot to hide and then continue their travels. Just not something for like.. Sub to adult Deinos.

but also be good for drinking for other dinos

it's a thought to not have it be like... pointless is all. and not really it doesn't (or at least didn't) have much for herbis back when it was the shallows.

this is why I suggested for juvi, small dinos they could ambush and large wouldn't bother.

[fresh laurel]

think thats more of adding more hollow logs or mini caves for baby deinos to hide in

[lusty berry]

That too could work, just something to like.. Not look so ugly and pointless.

The reason Oasis was a hot spot was because it also had food for Herbis

[sinful cove]

yooooo more frosty material

[dusky surge]

ikr

[sinful cove]

This dude really said tenonto was OP after it just got neutered

[lusty berry]

again this is a discussion. It's a thought, not what should happen. If you are immature enough to say more "frosty" material. You could find a good rail road spike to suck on. Thank you.

Anyways, as I said. it's a thought and not so much a should happen. But if even small logs would help traversing the lands? That'll do just as well.

Who said it was op? lmao, I never said it was. I said it got nerf BECAUSE it was op, reading must not be a strong suit.

[sinful cove]

Frosty

Frosty also wants tenontos tail slam to be replaced with a tail sweep

[lusty berry]

Oh.. Okay hang on.. then.. I get it.. Okay no so like.. My IGN is Frostbyte115

[sinful cove]

Frosty the icewing

[lusty berry]

People ALWAYS call me frosty so I thought you meant me lmfao, my b

[sinful cove]

Frosty always posts hard stance anti herbivore feedback its what theyre known for

[lusty berry]

More a reason for me to dislike that nickname.. ANYWAYS no that should not happen. Tono is fine

Gotcha, not as common in this server.

[sinful cove]

Teno Isnt fine right now but the thing is frosty wants it nerfed even more

Tenonto is easy for carnos to bully with low risk

In this patch

[lusty berry]

I think it is fine, if it needs anything? Kick buff, least as far as where it hits. make it more reliable. I wouldn't be so opposed in a bit more damage on the kick too but not like.. super high..

We don't need teno tail slam damage again.

[mental roost]

180 N tail slam virgin vs 280 tail slam chad(doesn't hit like wet noodles and doesn't 1 shot Utah according to calculations using 1.5 headshot multiplier damage(420 damage with head shot, so Utah can survive.. Even though I don't mind Utah getting 1 tapped but it makes things a little more fair and also still lets it damage Carno's fine enough).

[sinful cove]

Tenonto tail slam didnt need such a massive nerf

Especially when its replaced with the attack that cant really be used without trading hits

[lusty berry]

I do agree but I would say if they made the kick a lot better? I think it'll be better for Teno.. and What buff? They literally didn't touch ANY carno damage

aside from fixing what could be seen as a bug.

[sinful cove]

Tenonto's slam shouldnt be this pathetic

[lusty berry]

Not enough to make it crazy, it's literally not that crazy.

[sinful cove]

It has a high stam cost and very low payoff

[fallow stag]

the slam should giv a insta kd even to a full grown carno

[lusty berry]

it's a SLIGHT turn on ram, and better out of drag.

Hell no Boe. lmao

[fallow stag]

LOL xd

[sinful cove]

Tail slam should vaporize carno and leave a loony tunes style carno shaped hole in the ground

[lusty berry]

I'll take the hypsi insta kill during the first week of April for 200

[sinful cove]

Yes

Hypsi alien spit

[hollow canyon]

it should have a lower stamina cost, from what one of the QA members said its damage output hasn't been nerfed too hard

[lusty berry]

Imagine instead during easter the rabbits hunt the dinos? And they insta kill with a jump kick

Ptera swoops down to eat a rabit and gets shoryuken'd

[sinful cove]

Maybe hypsi can spray like a firehose out of its mouth and that pressure enables it to fly uncontrollably like a deflating baloon

[lusty berry]

I am shit posting at this point.. lmao. No I agree the stamina should be a lil lower

[sinful cove]

Hypsi has to make gunshot noises too if it does that

[mental roost]

Hypsi pulls a show era Godzilla

[lusty berry]

"King of the Hill"

[thin mantle]

@alpine plover Ight explain why the infinite dodge is a bad idea...

[fresh laurel]

mods will step in and make sky dropping

[dusky surge]

Yea and

It's literally not hurting anyone

This isn't real life it's a dinosaur game, idk, doesn't seem like something really worth objecting to

It's funny, lets dryos do silly shit and hurts literally no one

[thin mantle]

Literally the point

[dusky surge]

That is literally nothing alike

[thin mantle]

Different dino.... plus dryo still has stam to drain... sprinting still exists

[dusky surge]

Dryo's dodge doesn't render the dryo invincible or unable to be attacked

You can still chomp its little brains out

Because it's fun?

Like, dodge already isn't a very good ability

[thin mantle]

I made that suggestion as a temporary method to inject the dryo playerbase with more people until they can figure out what the fuck dryo is supposed to be... dryo basically doesn't exist on any servers rn, at least make it a shitpost that's entertaining to play like hypsi instead of just a worse utah in every conceivable way

[dusky surge]

Not making it cost stam makes it somewhat usable

[wise sparrow]

Eyyyy frosty back with some amazing balance suggestions!

[dusky surge]

love that guy

[thin mantle]

alright.. I would

[dusky surge]

I stand for Ultra Instinct dryo

Dodges every 2 seconds

[thin mantle]

So do I, #makedryofunagain

You must be new, dryo was absolutely incredible in U3

[wise sparrow]

Dodges behind you "heh, nothin personal ki-" dies

[dusky surge]

Could be if they just decided to do silly shit like this. It's literally the least harmful ability to buff in the game idk why you're so objected

Like out of every stat, every ability and every mechanic, buffing DRYO DODGE is the least offensive change they could make

[fresh laurel]

give dodge i frames

[thin mantle]

Ok, well I don't have a defeatist mindset when it comes to an entire playable, which is why I want it to have reasons to be played. You don't have to share that sentiment but many people do

[dusky surge]

i would not even fucking care if they did that

[thin mantle]

at that point why even bother... your stam regen outpaces your dodge cost

[dusky surge]

it's DRYO DODGE

[fresh laurel]

#iframesfordodge

[dusky surge]

literally if people are up in arms about the funny animal doing funny sidestep I'mma lose my shit

[fresh laurel]

bruh even more ppl say hypsi than dryo lmao

last time i seen a dryo was a month ago

[wise sparrow]

"Oh nuuu the small prey meme animal cant have a stamless ability itd be op "

[dusky surge]

Well actually after this update dropped I found a pack of 3 dryos, a teno and a stego

[thin mantle]

Well my feedback suggestion only has 2❌ 's on it rn, so I guess that's 100% disapproval

[dusky surge]

I saw three like 2 days ago

They had private body guards

Yes

Dryo Ultra Instinct niche

[wise sparrow]

I once got cursed out for mixherding with 2 pachys as dryo

[dusky surge]

Ah yes, the most powerful of mixpacks

[wise sparrow]

Granted I had also been harassing some carnos for literally an hour sooooo

[thin mantle]

I will die on this hill.... make dryo utterly stupid fun with various dodge buffs until the ability can be replaced..... or don't.... and we keep ultra instinct dryo

[mental roost]

Y e s!! I've been fond of the idea for awhile. Reward good timing for dodging an attack. Dyro Souls.

[dusky surge]

Dryo should dodge roll

Like roll into a little dryo ball and just go

also i will die on the hill that hypsi has one of the best abilities ever thanks to diets. You can 300% whatever diet you want as hypsi by spit-spam then live the rest of your life never ever thinking about nutrients again

[thin mantle]

Poggers

[fresh laurel]

give dryo a spindash

[thin mantle]

unironically gaming the system by strategically vomitting xD

[fresh laurel]

give dryo insta transmission

[thin mantle]

I thank thee kind soul

Well... that's fair

[fresh laurel]

counter this then

magy is viable and good

[thin mantle]

Unfortunately I argue constantly... but I understand

[thin mantle]

Only if forest foliage is given movement deprecation to it's predators to a significant enough degree that it can outrun them using it that's the only way

[fresh laurel]

also

magy is best body guarder

if it dies on your corpse then gg

[thin mantle]

NOOOOO

Fuck that delete it now

Begone foul demon

[fresh laurel]

dies on utah stego kill

only way to stop is to

pick up magy dead body meat chunks until its gone

[thin mantle]

This sounds like pain

absolute pain

[fresh laurel]

it is

dies on dead utah pile

[fresh laurel]

not the right channel

[fresh laurel]

@half girder ...

they really only nerfed the ram turn radius

and made it so cc doesnt work on tail hits

[dusky surge]

Also idk what immune window he's talking about

[fresh laurel]

me neither

pachy is perfect imo for me

[slim dragon]

Everyone : Herbivore diets are so tedious and unfun !
Frosty the Icewing : Make herbivore diets more tedious and unfun !

At least it's not a stress system suggestion

[dusky surge]

true

[carmine patrol]

Guys I did it

I calculated the amount of damage teno tail does

This time I only landed headshots

and the result was 7 slams to the head to kill a carno

so I was right, teno tail does do somewhere between 180-190

[ocean wagon]

"I got killed by a 30% grown stego as a fully grown carno"

[mental roost]

How is that even possible. You'd have to be face tanking their asses or flanks and not even having tried to charge them or play smart.. They're only around 600kg around that time.. One charge and they're done.

[fresh laurel]

Baka

You forgot to test utah alt bite

You had one job mark

One.

[carmine patrol]

I didn't

[fresh laurel]

What is the dmg

[carmine patrol]

the server went down before I got the chance

[fresh laurel]

Bruh

[carmine patrol]

it's currently up tho so hop in and we can test rn

[fresh laurel]

Ok bet

[fresh laurel]

Name ?

[carmine patrol]

Taco Island

@fresh laurel you in?

[fresh laurel]

Uea

Yea

[fresh laurel]

Think i could 1v1 pachy soon?

[carmine patrol]

sure

[fresh laurel]

Lmao

[ocean wagon]

What’s more concerning to me are the 5 people that green check marked the suggestion

[sinful cove]

I like how we've reverted back to carnorex because every other animal has been made inferior

How do they wet-noodle tenonto and break utah pounce again so soon after their last nearly identical mistake

[keen plover]

Yeah teno is kind of weird rn. Haven't played it- but currently every fight I've had against a teno is easy. Heck was in a pair with my friend and we killed 3 adult tenos in one group and another 5 tenos in another group. I would have been dead last patch with the old damage values

[sinful cove]

i am in no way what can be called a good player, im usually just a troll, but i can easily harrass tenontos and make a lot of mistakes with very minimal punishment as carno, and this is after i also have a much easier growth prcess than the tenonto that im victimizing

[keen plover]

Yeah I would say I'm average but damn is it easy lmao

I made so many mistakes that last patch- would mean death

but tbf I knew I could take those risks so idk

[sinful cove]

theres really no reason to pick herbivore rn unless you either really like the animal itself or you want to play hard mode pvp because your eoutnumbered, outsped and no longer have a melee advantage

or unless you pick stego and have a miserable growth compared to deino who can basically afk instantly

[keen plover]

I mean, teno just needs to be a swamp playable imo or something with water around cause in the open plains like right now...

[sinful cove]

tenonto is pushed in to the open plains for one of its foods and it is also a brawler, so it shouldnt be getting so easily bullied by an ambush predatorin the same tier in a fight

tbh we really shoulda gotten cera before carno so we could have a carni brawler that wasnt the fastedt fucking animal on the map sans ptera who is basically just a paper plane

[keen plover]

Roster is just weird imo. Also teno tail slam damage was too high before idk

Like they wanted small tiers yet have mid tiers and large tiers idk

[sinful cove]

teno slam was a bit overtuned before but the devs did what they always do, totally obliterated the ability instead of properly adjusting it

and then replaced it as the damage dealer with an unreliable extreme close range ability

[keen plover]

Yeah how come the devs always go to either extremes? It's either too high, or too low

[sinful cove]

you basically have to stick your legs knee deep in a carno for the kick to register

[thin mantle]

Kicks primary issue is inconsistency, the combat style isn’t really the issue more so than kick not registering past the knees half the time

[thin mantle]

They perhaps lack the foresight to predict the need for nuance?

[sinful cove]

nah its their shitty habit of 1 big patch every 10498279months vs smaller, more regular patches

[keen plover]

I personally think carno is what it should be. However expecting playables to compete with carno like pachy is kind of unfair

[sinful cove]

so they make a million changes

[thin mantle]

That ironically fits into the category of lacking the capacity for nuance lol

[sinful cove]

yeah pretty much

and they do it over and over lol

tenonto really only needed minor adjustments but they completely changed it, only needed minor adjustments especially because carno also got buffs

they change things from both ends which adds even more to the overreaching of balance changes

[thin mantle]

I don’t really think it’s unfair, Pachy players have this self deprecating habit of being compelled to “finish the fight” instead of breaking the leg and running as they should, I rarely kill Pachys without an ambush if they simply use their abilities as intended

[keen plover]

Sometimes it doesn't fracture their legs though

They just keep on running + bleed is a massive beacon

[sinful cove]

the game likes to say "oh you hit the leg here's body fracture" which barely helps pachy

[keen plover]

I face tanked several pachys this patch and they haven't fractured my legs

[sinful cove]

body fracture is useful to more even tiered fights but carno will still have enough ability to easily kill pachy with body frac

[thin mantle]

If you hit them from the side it almost always causes a leg fracture for me, only if the charge is fully, well, charged tho.

[keen plover]

Issue is expecting pachys to live in the plains is a bad idea but I guess it is what it is for now

[thin mantle]

Yeah, even with body fracture it still has 22ish seconds of sprinting stam at full

[sinful cove]

"only if the charge is fully charged" "almost always" combined, this is super unreliable because carnos just roll up from the foliage often

body frac is still useless to pachy agains tlarger animals, and it doesnt always have the opportunity to charge up its attacks without getting merked in the process, i can just kinda make pachy my bitch now

[thin mantle]

The irony being that pachy’s ability is most useful when it has a ton of room to be used, making the plains a perfect environment for it if not for Carno

[keen plover]

I get that but even then, the plains will always be hell for pachy if it stays as is

[thin mantle]

I think you have some typos here, cuz I honestly don’t know what you’re saying

[sinful cove]

pachy shouldnt have been cramme din to plains with carno and this shit wouldnt have been such a big issue

[keen plover]

And if you play solo...

[sinful cove]

my keyboard died halfway through one sec

[thin mantle]

If Carno didn’t exist no, that’s it’s only issue rlly

[thin mantle]

Lol no

[thin mantle]

Pachy is definitely not an animal designed to be played solo Tbf

[keen plover]

For now anyway

[keen plover]

I can agree to that

However

[sinful cove]

no animal should be unviable solo

[thin mantle]

Yeah… not sure what to do about it aside from wish Carno didn’t exist and build a time machine to inform the devs that adding Carno was a really odd choice balance wise

[thin mantle]

None are, nobody said that actually but I agree nonetheless

[keen plover]

Carno will be dunking on all small tiers they add from now on (which it should)

[sinful cove]

pachy against a competent carno rn just gets walloped. i shouldnt even put competent there because that's something that i am not

[thin mantle]

That’s kinda the issue, 80% of future playables fit into that category (for the Evrima roster specifically)

[thin mantle]

I mean, I guess I can’t sympathize as I’m able to survive Carno attacks as a Pachy in current version. So I can only say you’re wrong by virtue of my own experience

[sinful cove]

then i guess like every pachy i have attacked just happens to either suck or the matchup sucks

[thin mantle]

Most Pachys are really really bad, a lot of people aren’t used to the turn rate nerf on charge so most of the time that I fight Pachys they either miss their charge entirely or can easily be nuked cuz of premature activation

I just got used to it with practice, haven’t killed any carnos since I haven’t had to

[sinful cove]

ive gotten leg fractured a whole maybe 2 times and ive seen them hit what should have been my knee/shin so many times

like it just feels bad

i dont even bother to grow pachy or tenonto after the first handful of times testing them because carno is just easier to grow and has a better payodd

[thin mantle]

Likely latency, what’s your average server ping?

[sinful cove]

my average ping is in the 90s usually

[thin mantle]

Hmm

I average at the 20-40s

Not entirely sure if that has much to do with it but it’s possible

[sinful cove]

i see some servers with that ping projected but they are all dead af

[thin mantle]

Yeah I’m referring to NA1-4 mostly, those are the servers I have dinos on

[sinful cove]

most of the people i have played with on my friends list average at like 100-300 ping but i dont usually fight with them, but i gotta wonder what the average players' ping is

[thin mantle]

I suppose this is more so an issue of inconsistent ability effectiveness despite perfect execution due to performance and locational damage inconsistency caused by the aforementioned issue as well as hitboxes.

[thin mantle]

I’d estimate it’s around the 60-90 range

Anyway gtg, I need sleep

[dusky surge]

enraged frosty

[sinful cove]

These always make my day

Wait… he said a full grown carno charged him, but then afterwards he says it was a sub

[keen plover]

I love how frosty consistently misses. What an absolute lad

[sinful cove]

He never disappoints

[covert cave]

Frosty, my beloved

A shining light in the feedback channel lore

[dusky surge]

he is a blessing

[covert cave]

Has Frosty ever like

Dipped his toes into a discussion channel?

Maybe interact with his adoring fans a bit

Maybe he’s a child

He does have “the Icewing” in his name

[dusky surge]

What, and interact with us lesser squabble? Frosty has far more important things to do than mingle with the riff-raff

[covert cave]

I don’t know if you’ve read Wings of Fire and are doing this on purpose , but that is exactly how icewings talk

Not to be cringe

[dusky surge]

I literally have no idea what you are talking about

[covert cave]

Alright fellas let me lore dump
Wings of Fire - dragon-based book series
Icewing - one of the dragon tribes of the main continent in the book, “Pyrhia”; often very haughty and racist. They use lofty language to preserve their superiority complex.
I related your language to an Icewing’s because of its heightened nature and condescending tone

And now I am certainly cringe

Well shit

In my defense I read that series during my Warrior Cats xD rawr phase in 6th grade, and am now far removed from that crowd

Please I promise I’m not cringe

I have a good memory

[sinful cove]

What did i walk back in to

[covert cave]

I’m not a furry

[sinful cove]

Sounds like something a furry would say

[covert cave]

Damnit

Wait who are we kidding

We play the Isle, we’re all cringe

[sinful cove]

Lies

[sinful cove]

But cool lizards

[covert cave]

Yes

NO

It’s been years since I’ve touched that book

What

I’m not a furry

Please

Indubitably

[sinful cove]

Ew

[covert cave]

Actual stain of an argument

[sinful cove]

Hard to agree with wyatt's whole post just because of that part

[covert cave]

^

I just can’t

One bad apple ruined the bunch

[sinful cove]

If herbis are both universally slower and worse at combat then there’s 0 reason to pick them unless you just like the animal

Even then it isnt much of a reason

What he should have said is carnis should be better at going on the offensive than herbis, which should obviously be true. But at combat in general? Yikes, and i thought he was pretty based, but he wants herbivores to be fodder ig. Not based

[covert cave]

See he’s cringe

[sinful cove]

Shame shame

Buff channel catfish

[covert cave]

Playable catfish

[half girder]

i loooove carno mega packs

i loooove seeing no pachys or just killing them with ease, such a balanced game rn

[sinful cove]

carnorex apocalypse has indeed returned

[half girder]

pachy is perfect imo

pounce is still not fixed too

[sinful cove]

pounce was fixed for a while but they broke it again here

[half girder]

fun factor is gone in this game

"devastating" more like free food lmao

[hollow canyon]

@ancient elm I'd say that afking is exactly the same as before as a herbivore, it just takes longer before you can go afk, but past the point you get to a perfect diet you don't really have to move... at all.

Diets are NOT a solution to afk growing - making juvenile gameplay interesting is.

If the devs do this to stop afk growth they have to stop, because it's failing spectacularly and makes the game more unpleasant to play.

[fresh laurel]

couldnt they just make it so growth slows if you are idle for like 10 minutes?

thats if they are hellbent on stopping afk growing

[hollow canyon]

I have an even better idea

[fresh laurel]

that is?

[hollow canyon]

Utilise this controversial mechanic of defecation to make it so that if you keep on leaving your excrement in the same area you start letting everyone know that you are there

making it easier to track you

Also - sorry but I have a Utah on me it seems so I can't type all the time

[fresh laurel]

that would cause more lag

[half girder]

great idea but yes

[fresh laurel]

i dont we want more lag

so something simple

[hollow canyon]

Would it cause more lag?

I don't think it would be any worse than all the stuff we already have in the game

they want urination and defecation to be in the game - at least put them to some good use

[half girder]

i think a tiny cloud wouldnt be bad

[dusky surge]

isnt that essentially saying nesting shouldn't be added because the eggs would cause more lag tho

[hollow canyon]

Yea, it'd be just something that makes the area noticeable if you keep piling excrement there up

[half girder]

i like that idea

[hollow canyon]

Also - actually as nesting was mentioned, just in the defense of this mechanic and how it could negatively affect it - you simply shouldn't be taking a nr. 2 where you are having your babies

[half girder]

maybe if they made a smaller map and keep the player count at 100 things would be better

[hollow canyon]

...is also a sentence I never thought I'd utter in a 1000 years

[half girder]

slowing growth for being afk doesnt make sense

fully encourage aken idea

[hollow canyon]

In general I view afk growth as a symptom not a problem in itself

[half girder]

i think to unlock skins you should need to travel alot too, maybe travel blank distance as a juvie and unlock a skin?

[dusky surge]

fuck that PoT shit

[half girder]

not really pot

[dusky surge]

if no one cares about skins, no one will do it

[half girder]

just walking aaround

[dusky surge]

or they'll get all the skins and AFK

seems like a weak insentive

[hollow canyon]

Trust me if I could play the game and have fun in it and if that was the optimal way to play the game I'd do it. That isn't the case however. being not fully grown really screws you over here

[dusky surge]

yea, that's what PoT sidequests essentially are

you just walk around

[half girder]

i like the idea, could implement steam trade cards too lmao

[dusky surge]

also couldn't you just walk in a big-ass circle

[half girder]

i mean sure why not

keeps the player moving no?

[dusky surge]

then it solves nothing

it just makes AFK growing more fucking annoying

[half girder]

naw

[dusky surge]

sit at your keyboard and keep walking even if absolutely nothing is happening and you have food, water and safety in your current location

[half girder]

sure

[dusky surge]

that is in no way engaging

[half girder]

im gon afk regardless tho, idc for walking around anyway

[dusky surge]

so why suggest the skin thing lmao

[half girder]

just an idea

free to discuss it lol

but i do really like aken's idea

[fresh laurel]

but who says people dont

[dusky surge]

i just hate the "PoT" style of getting skins. Do boring thing which isn't engaging but keeps you moving, win a cosmetic that is functionally meaningless beyond looking nice

Skins should be earned by surviving to elder and dying of natural old age for example

[half girder]

it is tho..

[dusky surge]

Shit that actually means something

[half girder]

people fighting for quests

[fresh laurel]

but couldnt you theoretically abuse it?

[half girder]

true

but i dont see the devs being dumb enough to able that

[dusky surge]

If the quest is "walk", that isn't a fight, it's a threshold to hold W and walk into a wall until you unlock a skin

[half girder]

i mean why not

[fresh laurel]

oh ho you can abuse lots of things rn

[dusky surge]

because its abusable, shitty and boring

it adds nothing and it makes the act of "earning" skins a joke

[half girder]

not really

[dusky surge]

yes really

[half girder]

u are still spending time playing the game

[fresh laurel]

i think if quests were to get into the game to unlock stuff they should be somewhat more interactive

[dusky surge]

i can weigh down my W key and earn 3 skins by the time I come back from lunch lmao

[fresh laurel]

like win _ amount of fights

[half girder]

hell yeah ,an why not

[dusky surge]

no because i can weigh down my w key and walk into a wall

[dusky surge]

nah, that's implying all animals are capable of good combat, which isn't the case

[half girder]

it woudlnt reg in one area obv

[fresh laurel]

its an example and could be given to certain dinosaurs

[half girder]

then what wave? have sex and earn a skin? tf u want?

[fresh laurel]

what

[half girder]

lmao

[dusky surge]

Elders?

[half girder]

joke obv

[dusky surge]

You know, the thing you get for actually reaching the highest stage in the game

And actively playing it

[fresh laurel]

achieve elder to unlock ___ skin

[half girder]

so you get one skin for that

ok next

[dusky surge]

WDYM okay next, that could literally be it

[half girder]

so one other skin?

[dusky surge]

Random skin each time you die of old age as an elder

[half girder]

booooring

[dusky surge]

And walking in a straight line is amazingly engaging

[fresh laurel]

you just get elder by having consistently all 3 nutrients and surviving past adult right?

[half girder]

ill afk and get the skins ez then

lmao

have my frens drop me food ez elder

[dusky surge]

Can't, elder has specific pre-requisites requiring active play beyond "walking in straight line"

[half girder]

free skin too sheeesh

[dusky surge]

It's harder than walking in a fucking line lmao

As a juvi

[half girder]

it wont be.

[dusky surge]

HOW LMAO

[half girder]

elder gon be ez clap

[fresh laurel]

what if survive for ____ minutes/hours

[dusky surge]

How is the act of fucking walking a challenge compared to surviving till elder

[half girder]

yes sonic thats a simple one

[dusky surge]

then i just sit in a corner, eat turtles and never fucking interact with anything or anyone

ez clap no problemo

[half girder]

i mean survival involves walking no?

[fresh laurel]

but wouldnt there be more ai by the time quest come lmao

[half girder]

so walking equals skins

[fresh laurel]

boar can find you in a bush

[dusky surge]

boar also has a tiny little range of aggression

[half girder]

idk mang, the isle can do so much im so curious!

[dusky surge]

Survival also involves so much more lmao

[fresh laurel]

ai i dunno carno? if its not as broken as before

[half girder]

not really lol

get diet, walk, elder, die

[dusky surge]

if AI carnos fucking spawn and track me down for AFK, that'll fucking suck

because frankly

I fucking hate AI dinos with all my heart and soul

[fresh laurel]

they are a nice counter to afk people tho

like if one happens to spawn near you...

[half girder]

sonic that is very abusable

[dusky surge]

how? they only engage those which engage them. You have to be RIGHT next to AI to engage aggression

[half girder]

for food lmao

ez food ig

[alpine plover]

^ AI dinosaurs ruined immersion

[dusky surge]

also yea all dino AI was was a fucking free food buffet, especially teno

[half girder]

immersion pffff

[fresh laurel]

true...

[half girder]

never immersed in the broken ass game

more funny then scary, and if it is scary its the bugs i lose my dino to

[dusky surge]

sounds to me like you just don't want to play the game lmao

[fresh laurel]

music believe it or not kinda made me want to play the game more

[half girder]

naw 500 hours on this branch says no

[alpine plover]

(I mean tbf why would you play right now)

[dusky surge]

also sounds like you have no idea how elder works and assume its going to be a fucking cakewalk

[half girder]

the music had me dead

[fresh laurel]

the isle soundtrack is so nice that i think it adds to immersion

[half girder]

bahahaaa

[fresh laurel]

combat music could be replaced tho

[dusky surge]

this is one of the better patches they've ever released

[half girder]

cuz it is

[fresh laurel]

so is it get all 3 nutrients and survive past adult or...

[half girder]

trust wave

[dusky surge]

literally what evidence proves this

[half girder]

ill be living proof

first day elder

[dusky surge]

first day elder doesn't sound like a challenge

it's not going to be fucking impossible

it'd just require you to actually play the game and engage with it

[half girder]

engaging in the game is aids rn

[dusky surge]

also i like how you assume food will be easily transported to you as if it isn't going to rot and decay when elders are out

because gore is before elders

[half girder]

trust me dude

[alpine plover]

this game does indeed suffer the carnopocalypse syndrome

hopefully it’ll even itself out once bigger shit gets in

[dusky surge]

bran i can literally do what you suggested but easier tho so idk why you're acting like elder is a cakewalk

elder requires more than just hold W

[half girder]

ofc, gotta press e too lmao

[dusky surge]

all you did was suggesting holding W tho lmaoo

[half girder]

for skins?

[dusky surge]

yes

[half girder]

and?

[dusky surge]

sounds fucking lame

doesn't feel like a reward for me DOING anything

[half girder]

ok wave, i have to kill a rex as pachy to get golden pachy

boom

[dusky surge]

???

thats such a far leap lmao

[half girder]

still lame?

[dusky surge]

just weird

"kill specific animal as specific animal for skin"

[half girder]

i mean why not

[dusky surge]

because that's dumb lmao

[half girder]

unless the skin system will be poopoo

but i think not so

[hollow canyon]

Alright it took only 20 minutes this time

I guess figuring out the optimal way allows to shorten that early migration as a juvenile

I still feel that's too demanding on juvies though

As for that discussion about walking in circles/doing quests/what not

I will say that I vastly prefer doing quests in PoT to having to do... whatever it is diets have me do in TI. The quests are trash but they can be improved and it probably is but a matter of time before they are.

I'd very much like to have this kind of thing in TI but with... more natural quests I guess?

Picking up stuff and carrying some pinecones around is errmmm... let's just call it a tad bit uninspired

but the basic idea is good - you do something and get a temporary growth buff

doing that thing exposes you to encounters and makes you have to remain in a given area which creates competition between animals

[dusky surge]

the issue i have with quests is how the fuck do you do them well beyond "animal eats what it wants to eat". Walking to "x location" and being inspired with sudden growth feels far too gamey to me

[hollow canyon]

easy - you let the community come up with quests - 95% of the suggestions are going to be utter trash, but the remaining 5% could give a chance for something more interesting than walking back and forth.

Just from top of my head we could have stuff like e.g. mark trees in a given area if you're a ceratopsid(or even Carno for that matter)

Also Idk about that feeling too game-y I sure know that the whole diet system feels gamey like hell

the idea that some type of meat gives no protein but gives carbs instead is just some next level garbage that makes me just rub my eyes as how anyone could come up with that

[dusky surge]

While tree marking sounds interesting, I'd prefer it to be tied to a kind of "claim" of land. Perhaps claiming said land and staying/protecting it would grant you a bonus. You don't HAVE to do it if you don't like sitting still, but it would make some animals feel more natural

[hollow canyon]

also the idea that one animal gives some specific nutrient to one predator but not to another

[dusky surge]

Land claims honestly shouldn't do jackshit outside of "animal likes it"

[hollow canyon]

yea something like that sounds neat too

[dusky surge]

Nothing like "this is PROTECTED land NO ONE CAN ENTER HERE or do damage to me while in here" kind of shit

[hollow canyon]

Well I do think that it all should tie down to "animal likes it" which should buff growth

[hollow canyon]

oh gods... no

people should compete over those areas imo

[dusky surge]

Like you can still fucking die in the land, all it does is make the animal happy and thus give benefits

Also I'd really only make some animals "territorial" niche. Some would simply be roamers

Not all animals care about land

But having specific land being claimed and fought over would be interesting, depending on the animal. Honestly, I can agree on one thing, diets should be separated from growth, the stat buffs should be incentive enough imho

People like being strong, that's good insentive

[hollow canyon]

I think that every animal should be a roamer to a certain extent

it's quite simple really - if someone stronger and bigger than you rolls into your area you just leave

[dusky surge]

Also, if land claims created competition, the "claimer" can't simply AFK grow on that land since other creatures would go "wait... I want that land", walk in and fucking gore you

[hollow canyon]

exactly

you can't just sit back on your butt and do nothing

because people will KNOW you're in this area

the fact that you leave your poop all around only makes it worse

but you want to remain there

so this is where survival comes in - you think about whether you want to remain there and possibly get into a fight or whether you'd prefer to get out

you are either punished or rewarded for the decisions you make in a scenario like that

[dusky surge]

Here's what I'd do. Growth speed debuffs for negative diets, sure. But 1-3 nutrients have same basic growth rate, and buffs are received from activities entirely separate so you don't just walk in big food circle unless you decide "me want diet buffs instead". Juvis shouldn't be expected to run to and from everywhere, they should find things that make them happy and use those to boost growth, be it land claims or otherwise. Keep them moving, fighting and playing without constantly looking for the next specific food items

Honestly, diets become a lot more interesting the moments growth has literally nothing to do with them

Like, adult, you want to have good stats

So you look out for diet options

But you can go "meh, I'll deal with just one or two nutrients" and not feel punished

[hollow canyon]

That definitely sounds better than what we have now

[hollow canyon]

and this ^ definitely

Like I mean... I'm not on board with them in general

but

they are mainly cancerous during growth

[dusky surge]

Eh, I think they add something cool. I should be ALLOWED to live solely on agave, just not get the whole group of benefits

[hollow canyon]

Perhaps it's because I think more so about carnivores, I'm going to say it again: meat is meat

[dusky surge]

Especially if land claims became a thing, I'm not going to be able to run around and fulfil all 3 nutrients while also protecting my claim

[hollow canyon]

there are some specific cases where an animal shouldn't eat some meat, sure

but those should be exceptions

[dusky surge]

Ehh. That's not entirely true, meat is meat, but many carnivores can be and actively are picky in nature

[hollow canyon]

Some of them yea

but in most cases it's not like they'd get sick from eating most meat, some of the meat - sure yea

in general those are also quite specific carnivores

I think I've outlined what I'd do about carnivore diets quite some time ago

although it's likely too late for such changes

[dusky surge]

Like, for some examples of "shit that makes me grow faster because me likey do that", deinos/megas basking for warmth makes them happy, rexes and other such creatures claiming and controlling land, raptors being in packs, shit like that. It's like a comfort system but without "me uncomfortable, me weaker for no reason"

because frankly

i hate that shit and think its dumb

[hollow canyon]

If I can't react to someone's suggestion then that means that person has me blocked, right?

[fresh laurel]

to be fair i think deino should have basking give it its 3rd nutrient

[dusky surge]

yep lmao

[dusky surge]

i do like that idea somewhat

[hollow canyon]

Weird, don't remember ever talking to this guy

[dusky surge]

I run on the carrot philosophy, not the stick. Stop fucking punishing me all the time. Diets are fine because the ability to "eat a food" is so goddamn simple it'd literally make you dumb to not do it

Still think growth could be done slightly more dynamically

[hollow canyon]

oh it needs to be a bit more than "slightly" more dynamic

I'm afk again and have been for 30 minutes and this is the more "fun" part of the growth

[dusky surge]

Territories are an excellent example of how to do this. Brawler animals taking over territory fits them well, but if they want to walk around, they can also do that

Also because it's based on natural behaviours of irl animals, rather than "gather pinecones"

Or "grab mushrooms and put them in a big mushroom pile for no reason, then leave"

[hollow canyon]

yea I know those quests in PoT are... ugh

the idea is neat, the actual execution though - really lacking

but that isn't that big of a problem imo, it can be addressed as time goes on

and again - I think this is something where the devs can use the playerbase

make a feedback channel for quests and have people drop ideas there

[dusky surge]

I am very much on the side of "if the animal feels like it wouldn't do this irl, don't let them do it in the game". Player agency is uncontrollable, but adding a mechanic which actively feels unnatural is just shit imho

[hollow canyon]

some of them might be hot garbage but who cares? They simply won't be implemented

[dusky surge]

Stego "fishing" deinos is more the fault of player agency than the devs own implementation, whereas actively adding unnatural and odd quests would feel stupid imho

[hollow canyon]

that's exactly why unnatural and odd quests would be ignored

if there's a good one? It can be picked and implemented at some point

there's no hurry in that

[dusky surge]

It'd be interesting to also see if certain animals can receive certain buffs from certain behaviours. Obviously a dryo won't ever claim a territory on the basis of its entire niche, but something else could be done

[hollow canyon]

Yea true for the most part

Idk but Dryo claiming a territory feels weird

[dusky surge]

exactly

[hollow canyon]

then again it could go after some smaller animals

or perhaps it's more like it could just be hostile to other Dryos but I personally view this animal as a herding one I guess

[dusky surge]

Or deino because it's waterbound/doesn't like people knowing where it is, it'd really not be the best as a territory owner

I'd only give the territorial niche to a few animals

Carno is too quick and hungry to sit still

Ceras and tenos seem far more territorial though, ceras able to survive on a single corpse for ages

[spare badger]

I definitely see cerato, Tenonto, and probably sucho as territory setters
All can easily live in one area and are able to defend their territory from other animals (well they should, but balance in this game has never been the best)

Like, a lone/pair of Sucho's having territory over a certain part of a river certainly makes sense to me

[spare badger]

To an extent. Having things like carno charge, while not realistic, work well for the creature they are going for.
PoT on the other hand... I regret buying the game a bit tbh

[fresh laurel]

how come you regret PoT

[spare badger]

Quests are daft imo

[fresh laurel]

true

anything else?

cus i would say its unbalanced

[hollow canyon]

From what I've been told balance is a complete afterthought in PoT, the devs only touch it when something is ridiculously powerful and oppressive but for the most part they just leave it be.

[fresh laurel]

that kinda isnt a good idea...

[hollow canyon]

But from what I've seen so far it doesn't seem like anything is absolutely atrocious? Maybe megalania is slightly meh and from what I've heard Sarco is kind of really bad

It works fine-ish imo

[fresh laurel]

balance plays a big part on getting your players to keep playing and play the smaller animals

[hollow canyon]

Smaller animals are the strongest ones in that game actually

[fresh laurel]

its more of them adding something big without thinking of something that would contest it

and combat makes it hard to do pack hunts without trading hits with prey

[hollow canyon]

Are you still talking about PoT?

[fresh laurel]

yea...

[hollow canyon]

Because the bigger animals are weaker there for the most part

the best animal in the game atm is probably Deinonychus

[fresh laurel]

how so?

[hollow canyon]

Absurd recovery, bleed on bite, extremely fast, a group of them can bring down most things

you just hit and run and heal up any damage you take with ease while others keep your prey occupied

The small animals are also tanky enough to tank a hit from the really big guys(which I'm not a fan of and hopefully that gets addressed)

[fresh laurel]

opposite from what i seen tbh

but then again its been a while since i played pot

maybe a month

[hollow canyon]

Herbivores are also generally stronger than carnivores, Duck is probably the strongest animal in absolute terms

[fresh laurel]

they kinda should make venom more useful ngl...

its cool but underwhelming since the nerfs

[hollow canyon]

Yea, let's not get too into a PoT discussion though, this isn't the right channel for that

[fresh laurel]

lmao yea

now back to carno infection

[hollow canyon]

Btw I haven't seen a single Carno(or even heard one) since I started growing this Tenonto

[dusky surge]

I keep finding solo carnos a lot, sometimes a megapack in centre

[hollow canyon]

admittedly there aren't that many people on the server but

I found like one fully grown solo Carno

since the patches rolled out

a couple of juvies too

but honestly they are only a ~third most common animal so far?

if even that

Stego was by far the most common animal I've seen so far, followed by Tenonto(hell I even heard one not far from me some 10 minutes ago)

[fresh laurel]

for me its

1. Carno
2. Utah
3. Deino
4. Pachy
5. Ptera
6. teno
7. Stego
8. Dryo
9. Hypsi

[hollow canyon]

I haven't ran into a single fully grown Utah yet

[fresh laurel]

what server you play on?

[hollow canyon]

I've also seen far more Hypsis than ever before

Ermmm... atm I'm on

Official EU 2?

it doesn't have many players though

[fresh laurel]

ooh yea na1 is different

[hollow canyon]

Idk, I haven't played on NA since update 3.5 I think

might give it a shot later

[fresh laurel]

gl with the cannibles and toxics

[hollow canyon]

Idc for any of that

[fresh laurel]

less hackers though ever since anti cheat fix

[hollow canyon]

I typically assume that whenever I get seen I'm dead anyways so

[fresh laurel]

I mean i had cannibles put bounties on me

just for not wanting to join them...