that means
#balance-feedback-discussion
mighty knot
rex
doesnt
hunt
giga
make them a fair fight
fun encounters, problem solved
no need for seperation that literally won't happen
they are carnivores
pex ones
that means to seperate them
you have to seperate food sources entirely
to seperate rex and giga you seperate EVERYTHING
since they are at the top of food chains
not perfectly to benifit rex and giga
seperating them won't work
it causes too many issues throughout the food chain
what causes less issues
"because they are apexes"
they live in literally seperate parts of the world
this island is not a world with totally seperate environments
there isn't a polar area next to a jungle
calm ibex
who knows how the diets are gonna go down with this game though, to me it feels like you have to make AI of every animal which means that ai is abundant, which also means that every single player vs player interaction becomes sport kll and Optional. this idea bores the hell out of me and takes a big toll on what kept me engaged to this game til now
mighty knot
dryo your comparisons are crap
the damn world
xD
if your counter argument is "ok and" I think I won
Your argument died when you compared giga and rex to tigers and polar bears. They live in literally the opposite environments, opposite sides of the world, with totally different food chains, ecosystems, and evolution.
The island is not the world, it's not real life, it has a single food chain, and it is one ecosystem
giga and rex are not big cats
how
invisible walls?
elaborate
sinful cove
Lions and tigers arent in the same environment either lol
They are on different continents
mighty knot
so your saying split the entire map and all the cast into 2 seperate groups
and make it impossible for them to go into theother group without starving or dying of malnutrition
basically will be
dryo the solution isn't to split the cast in half or thirds or whatever
calm ibex
I would like that, but i dont see that ever happening since peeps are fond of their hotspots and action
mighty knot
that's insanely over complicated and causes a plethora of issues for balancing things under giga and rex in the food chain.
sinful cove
Carni diets were said to be more loose than herbi diets so you would not be able to keep rex and giga separate even if you ruined the gameplay for every herbivore to keep them at different halves of the map
calm ibex
we are mostly talking about carnivores though
mighty knot
they are apexes
viscid mica
I feel like waiting to see how diet really works will be better than speculating
sinful cove
Carnivores follow what ever they can kill easily
calm ibex
So they go out to x location to get their diet check and then return back to what ever the hotspot is
calm ibex
^
sinful cove
Nope
calm ibex
You cant make it strict
sinful cove
They will be lax conpared to herbi diets
mighty knot
@alpine plover
What solution is easier: changing diets to force specific movement for every dino and then lock giga and rex to half and half with dinos only in specific areas of the map in different environments; or making rex and giga have an even fight based on skill, and situational awareness
sinful cove
If a rex knows it can shitstomp a giga it will not be stopped by diets if it can take a trip over for some KFS
viscid mica
You have no definitive knowledge of dieting system so yes
mighty knot
trolling
viscid mica
Until you get to play with the system you won’t know
mighty knot
If a rex knows it can shitstomp a giga it will not be stopped by diets if it can...
This tbh
The counterarguments I've seen you make are "they are apexes," "ok and?" "Your source?" "your point?"
none of those explain anything
viscid mica
Ngl thou giga better be able to put up a better fight against a Rex thou
Cuz legacy Rex vs giga is a joke
Rex main over here
sinful cove
I don't think Giga needs to have a fair 50/50 with rex but the weaker of the two should be able to retreat from the other at least, making one of them more mobile without disrupting balance
mighty knot
Terrible balancing
sinful cove
Giga in legacy was totally busted outside of its pairing with rex
viscid mica
Historically speaking a giga would be better
calm ibex
and yet rex was better at every single match up than giga, with the exception of maybe utahs
mighty knot
it ran as fast as legacy utah with a punch to pack too
irl giga literally ran as fast as mdtiers
viscid mica
Gigas would be in larger groups have sharper teeth and are faster
mighty knot
and yeah they grouped up
viscid mica
Thou rexs have the jaw strength and muscle that’s about all they got
mighty knot
google it, check sources, it ran from faster than rex to a lot faster than rex depending on the source
viscid mica
Lol funny
mighty knot
while I do that, explain to me why rex would win and every point give me a source
this isn't what I'm trying to do
it's a waste of time
viscid mica
Gigas have a far better stream lined body and legs and weight actually made it so they could run
A Rex technically could only fast walk or it risk tripping and screwing it’s self
mighty knot
game fun, balance, and development is what matters.
Rex and giga having an even matchup hits all those checkmarks, and your only solution hits none.
yes
viscid mica
If they want to make Rex better fine but gigas better be incuraged to be in larger groups
mighty knot
that's not fun, not well balanced for things other than giga and rex, and would be so much harder to develop and balance
my point stands, none of those checks are hit
viscid mica
This was the case for the most part as Rex are more of scavengers/kill theifs vs gigas being active hunters
viscid mica
Not exactly
Rex would avoid fighting as it stole others kills and used its size to intimidate
mighty knot
This was the case for the most part as Rex are more of scavengers/kill theifs vs...
actually I might agree with dryo recently I think they proved it was mostly a hunter
but it fell back on scavenging when times were tough
viscid mica
And when it did fight they where very smart and picked targets they usually could beat
And what’s yours? Fox News?
mighty knot
let's go ahead and stop this conversation before it starts
viscid mica
Giga skeletons where found it groups the most Rex bones found in one area where a duo
mighty knot
Giga was a group hunter, used it's massive speed for it's size and phyisical power to hunt
viscid mica
Ya
mighty knot
rex was solitary for the most part
hunted in pairs sometimes
if you ask for a source I'll ask for yours
viscid mica
The 2 being male female and the 3rd was generally a underaged kid
viscid mica
Indeed
viscid mica
Giga where epack animals
mighty knot
gigas from the lands would come together to hunt a sauropod
viscid mica
Source?
mighty knot
delete it because giga strong
and then share the kill
and go on their ways
if I recall correctly
viscid mica
Gigas where good pack hunters just compared to a Utah they look like a joke ya but so would we
In terms of instincts it’s meaningless
viscid mica
Moving as a group and fighting as a group has little relevance to intellgence and more to coordination though silent cues
mighty knot
neither rex or giga used their brains for problem solving
except mobility
and that's what you need in a fight with something more mobile than you
Nevermind this
all of it
viscid mica
And your not understanding what I mean
mighty knot
literally the irl stuff means nothing we're talking about The Isle
mighty knot
ziowar I've noticed that
mighty knot
whats up
mighty knot
my opinion on spino is uninformed because you can't inform yourself on something so bent beyond realistic BUT
viscid mica
Deep water swamp lurker
mighty knot
I think it needs not to be an apex hunter
but should be able to hold it's own
user them big claws
viscid mica
Spoon did exist
viscid mica
At least this version is more realistic then Jurassic parks
mighty knot
spino best example
how about this
don't compare to IRL with anything
at all
game balance
fun
development
that matters
mighty knot
doesn't matter whether giga or rex won IRL, they should both have a chance in The Isle because that
is fun
for both parties
viscid mica
True but also not
viscid mica
Sense Rex is only one with leg break
mighty knot
I think they want everything to have it
not legbreak
but capabilty of imparing function via attacks
viscid mica
Ya but if I think right Rex will probably have a much stronger one
viscid mica
Thou I’m legacy it’s leg break made it superior
mighty knot
legacy leg break was bullcrap
viscid mica
Truth
viscid mica
Hahaha
mighty knot
why shouldn't rex and giga have an even fight ingame?
viscid mica
What I’m using to judge/ guess apex’s power is stego
mighty knot
speak to me in terms of balance and fun for both parties, not like dryo did
viscid mica
My goal is that Rex be the strength apex giga he the bleed and group Acro be the sped and spino he the lord of swamps/rivers
And if quetz is a thing the lord of skies
Sense it would at best compare to mid tiers in damage and such
The secret ocean Dino thou
That I really wanna know
mighty knot
Here's how I see it:
Rex and giga are even, the apexes of land, rivals
acro: little giga more bleed, can't hold it's own against rex giga and spino but is still just as good at fighting things smaller than it
spino: Swampy boi, holds it's own against an attacking apex in it's own turf, too far from the water it should loose in a 1v1 to rex and giga, while scaring deinos away and hunting fish and midtiers.
Deino: Midtier hunter, runs from spino, cucked by rex and giga on land but not without giving them a nasty bite first
Quetz: Midtier hunter cabable of doing high amounts of critical damage to apexes, but is paper thin with less health than an allo. A glass cannon with good aim if you will.
for niches on giga and rex I have some idea but they should fight eachother in an even fight, whoever is better and plays to their dino's strongsuits more will win
viscid mica
Deino is a pseudo apex and I feel like that’s where quetz would fall aswell
viscid mica
And agreed on the Rex giga term
Thou gigas are pack hunters
So maybe a little weaker to encourage groups
mighty knot
yeah but it stands up now
viscid mica
Fair
viscid mica
Meh
crystal wharf
@lament cloak fixed your statement
lament cloak
wdym
you can
you dodge in the direction your camera is facing
its a little wonky
and works better while running
but it seemed to work for me
sinful cove
When i did it, it didn't matter what direction my camera faced, it was random
tight pecan
My experience with dryo has also been that the dodge is fairly random.
sinful cove
yeah it's very unreliable
hallow spire
@alpine plover yea right now everything can time there bites right to kill a dismounting Utah I suggest they make the dismount a very fast kick off and out of reach
sinful cove
utahs who manage their stam and dismount voluntarily deserve that ability, utahs who waste all their stam or let themselves get bucked/knocked off still deserve to get rekt
hallow spire
^
rotund meadow
Does anyone have a way to attack a Utah as Ptera without dying to the utah jumping straight up? Ive been trying to bait out jumps or find unique angles of attack but the cooldown on utah jump is pretty fast and it seems to rubber band me back to hitting them if the utah jumps even after i've passed over them on my screen. Right now i just don't attack Utahs as Ptera which might be the intentional design and if its that then im cool with it i just wanted to know if i was missing something. I also tried airbraking to bait jumps but decreases altitude alot also.
novel tulip
Ptera is not for pvp
marble pond
I suspect that the design is intentional, but if you get good, you can bait jumps against inexperienced utahs. But as you said, if lag or FPS drops are a significant factor for you, you should not attempt to hunt raptors.
It's also possible for the utah to jump and bite your beak at the same time as your attack, if you bite at their head, which counts as a headshot and will very nearly kill you.
lament cloak
Does anyone have a way to attack a Utah as Ptera without dying to the utah jumpi...
don't attack utah, I hate how people treat the game as a pvp game where everything has to fight everything instead of a survival game. I really hope they add more consequences for dying
I know there isnt much to do atm but still
marble pond
Dying has the consequence of losing everything you've worked for that life cycle. Seems harsh enough to me. All they need to do is make dinosaurs more unique (perks, skins, nesting benefits) and harder to grow (diets, malnutrition, anti-cannibalism on a per species basis) so that you have a real sense of accomplishment and you won't see your dinosaur as cheap cannon fodder.
lament cloak
diets wont neccarily make it harder, since you will also get growth boosts if you eat the right foods
marble pond
No, they will make it harder. You will not be able to grow faster than you are growing now. The current dinosaurs in evrima all have the "optimal" growth rate. Suboptimal growth rates will be much slower.
And it should be difficult to maintain an optimal diet, since you'll be competing with others of your species.
lament cloak
No, they will make it harder. You will not be able to grow faster than you are g...
all the animals will have base growth times lengthened to counter the growth buffs of eating the right foods, however eating your correct diet WILL be faster than what it currently is
marble pond
I... strongly doubt that anyone will need to grow a raptor faster than 75 minutes, now that young ones can pounce.
In fact, even 5 hours for a grow seems quite short for certain playables. I don't like that most players grow their god tier apex dinosaur in a single gameplay session.
lament cloak
however you are right that it will be virtually impossible to get your diet growth buffs all of the time, so if you are playing right you will probably be around the same speed as growth is now
hallow spire
don't attack utah, I hate how people treat the game as a pvp game where everythi...
Facts unless they just wanna troll, u shouldn’t even be trying to attack things as a Ptera and don’t like it when u die
marble pond
Pteras divebombing other species seems completely fine to me and I have no problem with it, as far as immersion.
The game is ruined for me when my tenonto gets ambushed by a stego/carno pair. Why are stegos helping predators hunt? That's pretty stupid to me.
hallow spire
The game is ruined for me when my tenonto gets ambushed by a stego/carno pair. W...
Yea I hope they do something about that in some type of way my advice is probably go to a server with rules like that tho
marble pond
Rules shouldn't be necessary for an enjoyable survival experience. In fact, most of the rules they come up with hinder my gameplay worse than official servers with no rules.
I'm just waiting to see if having each dinosaur have diets, perks, and eventual wants/needs to tie into the perk system will incentivize people to play together as the same species.
grand carbon
@flint quartz hold alt, whatever direction you are looking in is the direction you dodge
multiple other creatures have similar alt key based abilities as well if you arent aware
hallow spire
Rules shouldn't be necessary for an enjoyable survival experience. In fact, most...
Lmao true I hate some rules on some servers too
marble pond
You'll just have to submerge yourself deep enough, or stop moving if you want to set up an ambush. Hunting as deino is still quite easy if you are patient and know the populated areas.
A massive however-many-tons crocodile moving through the shallows is going to be noticeable.
The same thing would happen if you were travelling at a lower speed, it would just be less drastic. But you'd still disturb the water's surface, and players would still be able to notice you. If you think hunting as deino is suddenly and completely invalidated in most of the river systems, you need to practice more patience when ambushing.
teal pecan
but it seemed to work for me
no it's completly random, I was facing always the same way and dodging to test
alpine plover
And it should be difficult to maintain an optimal diet, since you'll be competin...
Diets will speed up your growth if you are like full diet
If you have like half of your diet be your optimal diet you’ll be normal
But if you don’t reject your diet completely you’ll be in a bad shape, not slower growth
It’s honestly just to prevent afk growers who feed off of ai
teal pecan
@flint quartz what
flint quartz
slim dragon
Probably because of what you posted in balance feedback
teal pecan
cuz you posted smth weird on balance feedback
slim dragon
It's hard to understand to say the least
slim dragon
@obsidian axle Your mistake was to let a tiny Utah pounce you in the first place
obsidian axle
@slim dragon har-har, right? If I played with hacks, maybe I'd see the little bastard in the bushes as he jumped out for me when I was leaving the water from a drink.
slim dragon
Then it succesfully ambushed you
And it was rewarded for it by getting a kill
obsidian axle
There's more to it than "dId It SuRpRiSe YoU?" when it comes to balance. If that was the only logic, then any time a raptor pounces it should get a kill. Gtfo with that stupid train of thought.
slim dragon
You were a ptera tho
You can only be killed when on the ground, meaning around 10% of your lifetime
It makes sense to be squishy, this is balance
obsidian axle
Being squishy is fine. Being squishy to an infant of another species that you are much larger than is ridiculous. It shouldn't be an immediate death sentence if a freshly spawned raptor happens upon me when I need resources.
Also, Pteras CAN be killed in the air. I've had Carnos, Stegos, etc. catch me mid air with bites/hits. Totally fine with that. But living less than 10 seconds with a baby raptor, when I'm full grown, is pretty ridiculous.
The balance should also be if I bite a baby raptor it should die in one hit. Or I should be able to pick them up from my own ambush. Drop them to their death. If they can one shot me with a mechanic, I should be able to one shot them as a FG Ptera because I had to grow to my max to EARN that ability to one shot them. That's balance.
slim dragon
No because you're not a big game hunter
In fact you're not a hunter at all
Utahs are made to kill things bigger than themselves
slim dragon
Not in this game
frosty heron
Is fishing not hunting? Lol
The prey doesn't fight back, so it really isn't
It doesn't even flee
obsidian axle
Again "Baby Raptor", not a full fledged adult.
If we're just fishing, how the hell do we find them without being on the ground. I'm lucky if I see a Deino when I'm flying past.
It's kind of silly to say maybe 10% of my life is spent on the ground. We exhaust pretty rapidly while growing. As a FG, sure, much less time. But I still end up having to eat or drink at some point. All my time spent growing a dinosaur goes down the toilet because some Utah juvie that hits a button and one shots me with no chance of survival?
I affirm once again, it is a balance issue if I stand NO chance against anything AT ALL. If I can't even survive long enough to remove a bucking raptor baby, how the hell is that balanced?
slim dragon
Because your solution to survive is to not get pounced at all. People don't complain that being lunged by a deinosuchus oneshots them, right ? Remember than hypsi and ptera are currently the weakest playables, if a ptera can survive an Utah's pounce (even a baby's, or rather a juvie since there are no babies yet) then what is even its purpose ?
obsidian axle
I don't complain about a Deino one-shotting me because I'm a tiny bird.
Again, if I'm larger than the Juvie Utah, I should stand a chance.
"Don't die." You're right it's a survival game. "Don't get pounced." You're right, but pouncing shouldn't = guaranteed death for a full grown Ptera when combatting a juvie Raptor.
The purpose is to SEVERELY damage the prey. Not One-Shot, One-Kill something. If the prey is already wounded, it should die(as that is within reason).
slim dragon
It absolutely depends on the prey. If the prey is frail enough, then yes, the pounce's purpose is to one-shot it.
lament cloak
I know you said that you bucked but doesn't that make it loose all of its stamina ina few seconds
slim dragon
A full-grown ptera is still a ptera, and if it had more health, it could quickly become way too powerful
obsidian axle
Piggy, a Juvie Raptor shouldn't have a reservoir of Stam to hold a FG Ptera to kill it with NO bites.
slim dragon
Remember you can solo anything as long as you stay in the air
obsidian axle
No, inherently by bringing myself LOW enough to "solo" something, I risk attack. That's responsible for half of how I've died when attacking things much larger than me. I've been eaten by Deinos, Carnos, and Impaled on a Steg's Thagomizers.
lament cloak
Piggy, a Juvie Raptor shouldn't have a reservoir of Stam to hold a FG Ptera to k...
but if you buck you should be able to buck it off
obsidian axle
Not crashing into them, just being attacked.
slim dragon
Ptera=beats everything in the air, is beaten by everything on the ground.
A ptera can kill a deino or a stego without being hit
It takes a lot of time for sure, but it's normal because it's not supposed to
obsidian axle
Piggy RIGHT, I SHOULD be able to. The issue is that the damage from a Juvenile DOESN'T allow me a chance to buck them off. I die before that happens. That's the issue. If I wasn't FG, I wouldn't have a problem with dying. But as a FG Ptera, I should've be a tissue to be rent.
slim dragon
A FG ptera isn't much honestly
obsidian axle
Bubu, again, CAN, but that's if they're AFK or can't time a counter attack.
A FG Ptera should still be more than a Juvie Raptor. That's my point.
A Fresh Juvie Raptor at that.
lament cloak
i sincerely doubt that, I have seen the ptera planes and they have enough health to survive for around 15 seconds of a juvi raptor pounce, that should be more than enough time to buck them off
slim dragon
I can't you for your word when you say a "fresh" juvie raptor. You didn't see it spawn, so you can't really know how big it actually was. It might have looked tiny compared to your ptera, but it doesn't mean much when you're in the middle in a game, trying to do your best to not die.
alpine plover
@winged bison
its intended
obsidian axle
Agree to disagree. I find it unbalanced.
slim dragon
Alright
marble pond
You realize that the "0% growth" utahraptor we have in the game is actually not an infant right?
In the current build, players spawn into the game as juveniles. This is why a 0% pteranodon can take off, 0% raptors can pounce, 0% carnos can charge. The juvenile stage is the stage of life where you just begin to be capable of fending for yourself, without the aid of a parent. Young utahraptors can and should be lethal to smaller creatures - You got hunted. It's just a part of the game. Being hunted because you weren't paying attention and allowed a raptor to get close enough to pounce you is not an issue of "balance."
alpine plover
Guess what, only time ptera gets pounced is on the ground, and the ground is where your vulnerable
As long as you see the raptor first and take off your fine, if you don’t, the raptor is rewarded for staying hidden and out of sight
And it still has to land the pounce with aim
hardy dirge
Anyone else having issues with bucking not wanting to work?
hallow spire
Anyone else having issues with bucking not wanting to work?
Wym
silent dock
@granite gateI tested that with friend, and we stay idle, and still hiting us
hardy dirge
Wym
I was pounced by a Utah as a Tenonto with plenty of stam and bucking decided it didn't want to work.
hallow spire
I was pounced by a Utah as a Tenonto with plenty of stam and bucking decided it ...
😂are u sure you pressed e?
hardy dirge
😂are u sure you pressed e?
Considering I had to look down to ensure I was mid pounce, yes. I was.
hallow spire
Oh then idk what to tell ya lol never happened to me but maybe it is broken
@fervent cedar nah it kinda does make sense seeing how weak and small the pteranodon is compared to everything else even tho it was a baby stego it can still do damage with that tail
little gorge
@past sluice they said that might get added in the future
hallow spire
@mystic valley lmao deinos still have to worry about cannibalism and there is a shallow river where u can drink and deino is meant to make water risky and it’s meant to ambush players who come to water and the bite doesn’t do that much tbh seeing how a Utah could survive 1 bite
mystic valley
ill explain a bit more once ive finsihed, i was going to do multiple messages but theres 6 hours cool down so im putting it into 1 for now :/
hallow spire
Then just edit it lol
sinful cove
deinos don't deal too much damage, they're just too good on land
mystic valley
damn, my message was too long
modest carbon
5 hour growth time better have a bunch of fatty health to come with it
sinful cove
yeah it makes sense that a 5 hour alligator could tank good damage, it really just needs its combat capabilities on land reduced
modest carbon
if its alt bite on land gets stam reduction then boom problem solved ^
sinful cove
deino's health is fine, i wish stego got similar hp treatment too but maybe in the future i guess
take the stamina obliterating cost from stego's attack and strap it to deino's alt bite
alpine plover
I hate that I agree that deino is a bit too powerful, but he used such shitty points to support it
sinful cove
deino is only too powerful because he can spin around like a beyblade biting on land
mystic valley
I guess ill summarise what i was going to say here:
Grab is unreact-able and requires little skill to you
If given the right environment, deinos can grow to adults easily
Fish can be used to get free food and in turn, free growth
Deinos have a surprisingly good bite turn when on land
sinful cove
and can just run down stegos even if the stego spots it in the water and starts moving first
mystic valley
i think thats everything
old hull
when the crocodile has a better all direction attack then stego , fun times
sinful cove
when the crocodile can swing its entire body around in circles spam biting but the stego gets winded after slapping his tail 10 times
modest carbon
grab takes a bit of skill to not be seen before lunging,
you could say that about any herbivore
theres still cannibalism, and you could say that about any ai
as they should, or theyd be ass ridden, just swipe some stam penalty and problem solved
old hull
yep
modest carbon
also gators and crocs and spin around like that. They are pure muscle and made for fast quick, short movements
sinful cove
dont think anbybody is complaining that he can alt bite
the problem is he can just spam it
it should drain stam
modest carbon
yeah it just needs a tiny stam drain and boom its fine
sinful cove
he shouldnt be able to run onto land and brawl like he does
old hull
yep , no stamina cost and the hit marker on that attack is VERY generous , you can be nowhere near the head and still get hit
modest carbon
well, its not like it can outrun you
unless you are a deino yourself
or a stego thing
old hull
doesnt matter , a croc should not be rewarded for being on land
you should be punished for it
sinful cove
making it drain 10% stam or start out at something like 3% and increasing as he spams it, similar to the diminishing returns on jump spamming, could fix it
old hull
just like stego is punished by going for a swim
modest carbon
they shouldnt be 100% limited to water though, they already have a fast water drain
they cant thrive on land but they certainly shouldnt be directly punished for it
sinful cove
you can run from both deino and stego easily, difference is the aquatic animal isnt punished for brawling on land while the land animal is punished for defending itself on land
which is stupid
old hull
the entire point of the croc is too lunge and drown and thats it , doing anything else is stupid and should be punished
you should not be sprinting on land and fighting off packs of carnos without breaking a sweat
sinful cove
the alt bite should be for defense only, but it is being used to brawl
brittle dirge
making it drain 10% stam *or* start out at something like 3% and increasing as h...
I can vibe with a diminishing return on Deino's alt bite rather than something like a 10% drain on stam
Flat out I mean
sinful cove
yeah i think it could work for a lot of attacks to deter spamming while not punishing moderate usage
modest carbon
like the legacy utah jump? where repetitive movements build up on stam costs?
brittle dirge
Exactly
sinful cove
yeah each consecutive jump drained more stam if you spammed it
which is how spamming attacks should work
old hull
that could work yeah
brittle dirge
Maybe not as drastic as that but something is better than leaving it as is rn
modest carbon
very true
sinful cove
it could differ between attack too, some more drastic than others, some veing very mild
depending on the purpose and power of the attack
like say stego gets an AOE sweep, the diminishing return on that would be harsher than the jab but originally they both cost minimal stam
sinful cove
teno has like a 50/50 against a predator faster than it, it is one of the least unbalanced dinos rn, and you wanna nerf it and turn it into fodder?
dense hamlet
I have soloed many and i mean MANY tenos as a solo utah play both before and after update 3. As a utah main i do not see any nerf that would make sense for teno it is fine where it is. It already got an attack speed nerf and that should be it
sinful cove
yeah i swear whenever people have trouble with an herbi they call for a nerf
teno is fine
dense hamlet
Yup if you are easily getting killed by tenos as a utah you need more practice and more “observing” before moving in
versed rune
It's more of the fact that tenonto has basically zero weaknesses while all other playables do.
brittle dirge
a lot of this can be solved by just simply buffing the things that are "bad".
Teno can out stam Carno and basically chase it down? okay, just flip the script and buff Carno's stam so that it can out last a Teno
sinful cove
i mean teno can die to utahs and carnos and deinos
don't want teno getting shit on like stego did after people whinged about it
dense hamlet
It's more of the fact that tenonto has basically zero weaknesses while all other...
I don’t see a weakness with deinos, semi aquatic animal who seems to be stronger on land and that can spin it’s body 360 degrees to attack, played correctly i don’t see a weakness with stegos, carnos are the op land pred after dino lol and utah can basically solo everything if played correctly
I see it more as every animal having it’s own timings for everything
sinful cove
stego is kinda shite and utah always has like one or two issues caused with each patch but carno and teno are pretty balanced and deino is just busted rn
because he can spam alt bite
dense hamlet
Curious to know where stego is shite?
sinful cove
his jab is pretty easy to juke unless you get lucky with lag and snipe somebody, and it drains insane stam
granite gate
deinos can reach through its ass to bite its head hitbox atm
sinful cove
and the deino assshot thing too
granite gate
and yeah insane stam drain on its only attack
stark knoll
stegos stam drain shouldve been fixed this patch
dense hamlet
Yeah well we agree deino is broken rn
brittle dirge
not to mention you have to pray on latency when trying to hit it lol
granite gate
considering its growth is the same as deino's, its survivability is..... far worse. it should be a "do not fuck with if fully grown" creature
dense hamlet
You can jab 22 times
Now if you spam your jab and get juked everytime then yeah shite
sinful cove
deino can spin its whole body around nonstop to alt bite but stego gets punished for defending itself against one of the many megapacks on each active server even though deino shouldnt be fighting on land and stego has no choice
granite gate
idk i havent played stego since before the latest patch
dense hamlet
A mega pack will destroy anything
sinful cove
did they revert the atrocious 10% stam cost?
granite gate
i just think it should be a "absolute non-prey animal" kind of dino....... not something anyone fucks with ever
otherwise there's no point in playing it even when the diet system comes out
grand geyser
@rapid harness you have 1.5 hours LUL
dense hamlet
Stegos stam was a bug
brittle dirge
Deino can stay afk for nearly an hour+ without food what?
dense hamlet
It would use double what it was supposed to
sinful cove
does this guy not know about fish?
grand geyser
Deino can stay afk for nearly an hour+ without food what?
can afk, then eat some fish, then repeat.
brittle dirge
exactly
sinful cove
also people still fall for the fish bait on shores, put an elite fish there and snag some dumb utah that goes for it
dense hamlet
A stego can now run and swipe while bucking also
granite gate
ah pog i guess
dense hamlet
Baiting utahs is really easy now I’ve killed packs of over 5 everytime it’s happened and carno go down pretty easy idk maybe it’s just me, but yeah i don’t go towards deinos cause if the hitbox bug and I’m not stupid 😂 idk i guess i don’t see anything wrong with it right now
granite gate
hopefully they'll make a comeback then
rapid harness
<@!179997538215133185> you have 1.5 hours LUL
nah bro the amount of food you need is a lot too, like small stuff barely fills anything
sinful cove
ok and you're an apex, tough nubs
you clealy chose a bad spot or are on a dead server
rapid harness
define bad spot then
rapid harness
you aint gonna be ambushing anything around there
You gonna have to get out of water and fight
sinful cove
pretty easy, utahs and carnos usually dont hesitate
and deino can just beyblade around with its alt bite rn, grab one and run back into the water
seen it plenty of times
rapid harness
I told you my playstyle is wait and ambush like irl croc and you tell me to go out and beyblade
sinful cove
Yes.
rapid harness
irrelevant
sinful cove
I mena, I guess have fun starving then 
rapid harness
thats why i asked for hunger buff
sinful cove
its hunger drains slow already, it's an apex it isnt supposed to be super easy to feed
bait people by dropping elite fish on the shore, there are a lot of people still falling for it
rapid harness
I see your point too but if an apex have to feed at this rate, its really takes a hit on the ecosystem
imagine this, i need a full carno to hold off my hunger for 1 hour. But the full carno takes 2 hours to grow
sinful cove
eh not really, encourages them to eat eachother too lol
rapid harness
You see the problem?
sinful cove
deino isnt a huge impact on the ecosystem, at least in the forseeable future when there are more dinos and more map
since they are mostly confined to the river and shore
grand geyser
I watched a streamer afk for 1.5 hours then eat a couple of fish and then repeat till adult. pretty easy right?
rapid harness
pretty boring actually thats how i grew all my deinos
sinful cove
if you are able to grow like that
then why ask for slower hunger drain
that makes it even worse
rapid harness
You got anything against deinos? you aggro as fk
sinful cove
????
im not aggro i'm just interested in the reasoning here
its so easy to grow if you dont get munched by cannibals
grand geyser
pretty boring actually thats how i grew all my deinos
then why do they need a hunger buff?
rapid harness
Well firstly if you dont need to eat as much, everything else gets a chance to grow
sinful cove
you already dont need to eat a lot
there are fuckloads of fish and your hunger drain is slow
rapid harness
I told you already, you need to eat faster than your food grows
grand geyser
doesn't matter
sinful cove
the carnos and utahs and even tenos deino usually eats grow pretty fast compared to it
grand geyser
i literally saw 7 fish at the same spot today
sinful cove
especially utahs, 0 loss to the ecosystem if a utah dies
and the pteras that fuck up and fall in the river constsntly
0 loss if they die
rapid harness
pteras and utahs dont fill much of the hunger bar
sinful cove
then eat a lot of em
grand geyser
not much for a deino is like 20 minutes
sinful cove
eat a carno, those things are almost never hesitant to start a fight with a deino
and theres like 20 of them on at any given time in an active server
rapid harness
yes take the W
alpine plover
@versed rune
If teno was balanced around being utahs rival it would be unplayable
its 1 ton heavier then utah
it would get hunted down by carnos
would probably get bitched by ceratos
out of curiosity is anyone having issues getting in the isle
alpine plover
would probably get bitched by ceratos
would get dumpstered by bary
it would just be shit
thats why it was only balanced around utah when they were the only two dinosaurs in the game
teno is clearly meant to be a generalist of course it has no obvious weakness
unlike every other creature, which is specialized
and thats fine
its a generalist brawling herbivore making it shit at brawling defeats the whole purpose of it
also “it should fight carnos if it has to”
carno is the fastest dinosaur in the game…..
How in the world is it a “if it has to”? It HAS to fight carno
like teno has no choice on the matchup
Teno already having bad bleed resistance makes it pretty vulnerable. Teno is in a pretty good spot rn
alpine plover
like teno has no choice on the matchup
why should carno have a equal chance to something it chooses to fight
it’s meant to kill solo utahs and carnos with ease
^
its generous the devs let carno even have a chance against teno
however, a pack of competent utahs can bleed it out. Pack of carnos can overpower it as well
It takes two carnos to reliably kill a teno, which was how it was planned to be.
so the “its utahs rival” thing doesn’t make sense
alpine plover
its generous the devs let carno even have a chance against teno <:TI_HypsiShrug:...
I’m surprised it has any chance at all as a matter of fact
people just dont like herbies being able to defend themselves well
It eats plants! It has to be weak!🤯
teno running down carnos is a issue though
teno should have less stamina, but its tail attack take less stam
that way it cant run down carnos
^
even then, solo carnos shouldn’t even be messing with tenos in the first place
@versed rune
also if tenos stam drain was increased to carnos it would only be able to run for 1 minute while also being 15 kmh slower which isnt fair
It needs a slight nerf so it cant run them down, but making it the same is a bit overkill
alpine plover
even then, solo carnos shouldn’t even be messing with tenos in the first place
yeah but the issue hes talking about is tenos being aggressive and picking fights with carnos
knowing that it cant really escape
so its a issue
for me at least it’s the other way around, not sure why. so many aggro carnos
but yea the stamina thing should be dealt with, can just out endure the carno and kill it
versed rune
<@!210756361955311616>
also if tenos stam drain was increased to carnos it woul...
i didnt say any specific value to bring it down by, only to enough so it doesnt have the ability to chase down a carno
versed rune
what is it at now?
alpine plover
Around 3 minutes
versed rune
that's actually mental lol
alpine plover
Yea teno has insane endurance
versed rune
carno has 1 minute 20 seconds
which i agree with
fits the sprinter archetype
since carno gains back stam fast too
alpine plover
agree
tenos stamina is fine as a concept
Carno getting tired quickly sorta makes sense. Fits with its niche. Insanely good regen too
but it wasnt playtested at least it feels like it
versed rune
to me teno just feels that it has a lot of favoritism put into it that none of the other dinos have. mainly because its a favorite of one of the devs
like its good at pretty much everything
alpine plover
Dyro stego and hypsi got the legacy treatment
it’s pretty much good at everything other than bleed resistance
hypsi still doesnt have growth
versed rune
honestly i still wonder why hypsi is even playable
alpine plover
isn’t hypsi getting growth when nesting comes out?
instead of fixing dyros dodge they buffed its speed ruining its playstyle
versed rune
dryo is lame af now
alpine plover
isn’t hypsi getting growth when nesting comes out?
its supposed to be like any other dino
hypsi should just not exist.
versed rune
i mean not that i personally ever had fun with dryo
alpine plover
its been like 6 months I have no hope for hypsi growth
versed rune
but i can see why the 10 dryo mains in existence are angry about the speed buff
alpine plover
Dryo is absolutely insane right now, pretty sure you can kill sub utahs with them
plus you can outrun utahs so it’s no problem really
I enjoyed dyro because it felt good to juke and bully utahs now I just hold sprint + W and it feels lame
dyro has no predator
it can easily juke carno and just run away from utah
its the best dinosaur in evrima
insanely overpowered
nerfing it’s speed while making its dodge useful would be nice
the time they spent developing hypsi could have been used for kentro
versed rune
or anything else
alpine plover
and we wouldn’t have the balance nightmare that is stego
imo stego and deino came way too early
versed rune
deino was the biggest mistake in the history of mistakes
alpine plover
deino was the biggest mistake in the history of mistakes
bary should have came instead the “testing future mechanics” thing doesn’t make sense
versed rune
update 3 was pretty much just a ploy to get people to play by adding aquatics and flyers without giving a damn about the ecosystem and how it would be affected
alpine plover
deino is so reliant on water that it being overpopulated kills the entire ecosystem
like. we could have had ANYTHING else. but we got stego instead of cera or Kentro.
like youre either at center plains near rivers, or you’re at swamp
god the map is horrible rn
legit 90% of the map is dead space
versed rune
also can we talk about how they removed the shallow area of the south river??
alpine plover
literally just walk in a straight line to center to south
versed rune
they always do this.
they remove things that players like to make the game "more challenging"
but players say "screw that" and abandon the area
alpine plover
also can we talk about how they removed the shallow area of the south river??
Howd they change it? Is it super deep now or just a bit more wide so deinos can swim?
versed rune
then they end up scratching their heads wondering why no one likes the map and they have to make a new one
alpine plover
Super deep
versed rune
Howd they change it? Is it super deep now or just a bit more wide so deinos can ...
super deep ye
alpine plover
that area was awful before this update
versed rune
^ basically
versed rune
so the map meta is literally just center and shallows now. no one goes to south anymore lmfao
alpine plover
I just wanted it to be a bit deeper so adult deinos could swim while exposed
versed rune
deino has fucked the map meta so badddd
alpine plover
deino has fucked the map meta so badddd
and this entire time bary could have been added and would have solved every issue
why did we get deino instead of sucho
mid tier carnivore that wouldn’t be too reliant on water but can still be used to test semi aquatic mechanics
hell I would prefer beipei
alpine plover
why did we get deino instead of sucho
sucho could have been better, or just as bad
versed rune
deino poses a problem in the sense that it punishes players by making them lose hours of progress because they have to seek out an essential resource
its literally resource camping turned into a playstyle
alpine plover
I feel like thats the point its just not fleshed out
versed rune
which is how crocodiles are irl, sure. but in a videogame where you invest hours its more annoying than terrifying.
alpine plover
IRL animals actually learn where the shallow spots are
but in the isle, it was just a huge shallow river
now its just all deep
deinos just cannibalize each other over and over and repeats into a physiological cycle of complete and utter torment
Oh yeah, deino itself is trash to
it’s boring
not only is it awful to play against, it sucks to play AS
You just wait until you die by other deinos
alpine plover
at the very least
because you can actually move
deino could have been fun with good map design
too bad the map is horrible rn
but we all know the isles history with good map design
alpine plover
v3 was better
versed rune
it was just well designed
rapid harness
yes the map..
alpine plover
I would kill for V3 with some incentive to move around
Region two was pretty nice yea
versed rune
v3 was better <:TI_HypsiShrug:696885704524824586>
after playing on four different versions of it over the 5 years of isle's existence i beg to differ
alpine plover
V3 would be great if people didn’t just chill at hotspots
COUGH twins
and if it had some redwoods
versed rune
the thing with region 2 is that the map was so compact and every area was unique
so EVERY area was a hotspot
alpine plover
how many hypsi shrugs are you gonna do dio
versed rune
like you could find people literally anywhere
alpine plover
how many hypsi shrugs are you gonna do dio
alpine plover
<:TI_HypsiShrug:696885704524824586>
alpine plover
like you could find people literally anywhere
thats a issue imo
rapid harness
They make a map with 2 landmass and a river system in between them. The ai and plants spawn alternatively between the 2 landmass. The dinos would also have to cross the rivers ( a small swim) and get food on the other side. Good for diet system to
rapid harness
would be better
alpine plover
and with unique biomes, region 2 wouldn’t work
versed rune
the potential of other players being anywhere is a GOOD thing
versed rune
True.
alpine plover
guys guys. I know how to settle this.
*just don’t make a shit map*
thats hard
spiro is the worst map in this games history
update 2 spiro was honestly fine
alpine plover
update 3 spiro though….. its some of the worst map design ive ever seen
update 2 was more fun
Personally I had no problems with spiro other than the fact that the whole entire map was LITERALLY GRASS
alpine plover
yes
versed rune
if anyone even remembers that map
alpine plover
I would be fine if any old isle map just got imported into evrima
can they just remake all of the maps and everyone will be happy
like who cares about graphics if the game is unfun
alpine plover
it was weird
like
Me either
and why were redwoods removed?
Everyone liked them
Oh yea let’s just delete this perfect map for no reason at all and make a subjectively worse map in the process
versed rune
*objectively
alpine plover
alpine plover
Oh yea let’s just delete this perfect map for no reason at all and make a subjec...
same thing with sandbox dinos
versed rune
terra viate tho
we need that back
also. it feels so wrong seeing grim expanse and stoneclaw in path of titans.
alpine plover
Path of Scam
versed rune
like its genuinely heartbreaking lol
alpine plover
A 9x9 map with 3 unique biomes with jace working on it would be great.
Dondi should stick to working on spero
versed rune
honestly. i feel dondi shouldnt really do maps
versed rune
one of dondi's maps is in primal carnage, forgotten outpost, and it's a literal meme in the community. so.
alpine plover
Ew
that map
jace will single handily save the isle
Hopefully yes
if this game succeeds its thanks to him
Having bad map design does a toll on your game
versed rune
jace is the map design guy right?
versed rune
praise be
alpine plover
From his previous work, im hoping he does a good job
versed rune
what else has he worked on?
alpine plover
but I dont play ark so he might actually be garbage
alpine plover
what else has he worked on?
ark mod maps I think
versed rune
well that answers that
alpine plover
I think he made an ark map once right?
versed rune
ive never touched ark lol
alpine plover
it’s uh. A game yea
it looked pretty but you never know how the map actually plays
versed rune
dont plan to until ark 2. what have people said about his work?
alpine plover
a very not great game
alpine plover
dont plan to until ark 2. what have people said about his work?
they said it looked cool
I guess that’s promising
have not seen a single comment on how it actually plays
so I cant really be hyped
versed rune
ominous
alpine plover
I would have preferred some inland pictures instead of the coast since lets be honest, who goes there?
not sure if it’s just me. But the isle just feels super boring to play rn. like it’s almost dead in a way. but it’s holding on to a thread because big alligator
the isle without deino is a dead game its just true
versed rune
im literally only playing as much as i am because carno is in the game
thats the only thing keeping me interested
alpine plover
carno is easily the most fun and well designed dino
I just feel good PLAYING as it
kinda like pre acceleration nerf utah
the run animation for carno 
versed rune
unlike legacy carno it actually functions like a sprinter
alpine plover
legacy carno just feels like a dumpster on wheels
Bigger wheels
too bad it cant really hunt if it fails a ambush but Im not sure how to fix that
versed rune
also. about time carno gets a hefty amount of bite damage.
alpine plover
Hot take - Carno could use a bite damage nerf in the future honestly
but also get a massive buff to its charge
versed rune
the whole "it shouldnt have strong bite damage" makes zero sense. #1 its a hit and runner, #2 it has a rounded skull
i can agree to that somewhat
alpine plover
I thought carno was more of a small tier hunter
versed rune
the charge should definitely be expanded upon once bigger shit is in the game
alpine plover
kinda sucks at it though….
yea it feels a bit too high rn. Shouldn’t be killing allos and rexes of course. I believe it was described as a small game hunter
plus the charge is good
Carnos max prey in a group of 4 should be maia
feel like thats fair
Maia is a tank so it makes sense
ideally maia would be a tanky cow like dino
versed rune
but when you limit a dinosaur to hunting one specific type of prey then you get legacy all over again
where dinosaurs feel restrictive
alpine plover
but when you limit a dinosaur to hunting one specific type of prey then you get ...
for hyper specialized things like carno… I feel like its fine
to be fair everything in legacy feels restrictive
versed rune
smaller animals should be carnos primary food source but its in the same size range as allo/cera/alberto/bary. i still fail to understand why carno is always the exception
alpine plover
of course it shouldn’t be forced to hunt utahs, let carno have a fair fight with ceras and baries, but its main way of playing should be like a chertah
^
versed rune
thats another thing too, people put dinosaurs into boxes based on real life animals
alpine plover
smaller animals should be carnos primary food source but its in the same size ra...
cera/bary/carno are a tier below allo in size, assuming novas size chart
versed rune
if carno was a cheetah, then that means it needs to be given a heavy turn radius buff
but carno isnt a cheetah
alpine plover
if carno was a cheetah, then that means it needs to be given a heavy turn radius...
like a cheetah, not exactly like a cheetah
versed rune
because if carno could turn like a cheetah it would be OP
alpine plover
allos/albertos/ceratos main strength is that they’re generalist
I think it’s just giving the description of what it can hunt, pretty much the closest thing we have to a cheetah currently, although having a bad turn
alpine plover
allos/albertos/ceratos main strength is that they’re generalist
carno definitely shouldn’t be as “free” as them
its a specialized hunter
I’m interested to see how cera plays out tbh
versed rune
my basic point here is that all the animal analogies are stale. just treat dinosaurs as dinosaurs and unlike any modern animals. sure you can make comparisons but people end up taking it too far and try to fit them into the niches of their irl counterparts exactly
alpine plover
cera should be a like weaker legacy allo
alpine plover
my basic point here is that all the animal analogies are stale. just treat dinos...
agreed
the shrug dio, how many times
carno definitely shouldn’t be anywhere near a generalist
versed rune
i agree
alpine plover
definitely one of the most specialized dinosaurs on the roster
versed rune
honestly the only true generalist mid tier is allo
alpine plover
honestly the only true generalist mid tier is allo
I see alberto as more generalist then allo honestly
allo should be a ambush hunter
versed rune
but the problem with allo in legacy is that generalist translated into being GOOD at everything, not being mediocre at everything
alpine plover
relying on its grab
versed rune
alberto is another can of worms
alpine plover
but the problem with allo in legacy is that generalist translated into being GOO...
thats the issue with it being so big
thats why cera fits the playstyle more
it would actually be mediocre at most things
and im tired of the “generic dinosaur allo” thing
versed rune
like a lot of people will probably disagree but allo should have less bite damage than both cera and carno.
alpine plover
allo should be a ambush hunter that’s mechanics let it be generalist, instead of stats
alpine plover
like a lot of people will probably disagree but allo should have less bite damag...
Hm, explain?
I mean, why does Allo HAVE to be generic? sure in terms in design it’s rather basic but it should be unique in terms of playability
versed rune
Hm, explain?
based on both realism and the fact that carno's whole thing is hit and run and kill as fast as possible. allo is more suited to fighting, and he will probably get a grapple of some sort
alpine plover
cera shouldn’t have a high biteforce imo
versed rune
cera should have an extremely high bite force imo. higher than carno.
alpine plover
based on both realism and the fact that carno's whole thing is hit and run and k...
the “weak bite allo” thing is disproven isnt it?
I think it should, but not too high where it can just one shot carno on the head
alpine plover
the “weak bite allo” thing is disproven isnt it?
Yea I think that was disproven some time ago
IMO a high biteforce on cerato doesn’t make it cera anymore
Cerato to me is a underdog
around 300 or 270 N will work for cera
versed rune
the “weak bite allo” thing is disproven isnt it?
yes but i believe carno likely still had a stronger bite, plus allo will have a grapple or something along those lines. allo is more of a fighter while carno is an assassin
alpine plover
Allo should do insane bleed damage imo
versed rune
and assassin classes need to dispatch things more quickly than a generalistic brawler class
alpine plover
yes but i believe carno likely still had a stronger bite, plus allo will have a ...
Whats the use of being a fighter?
it has to hunt
versed rune
when i say fighter i mean it wrestles shit when it hunts it
alpine plover
agreed then
versed rune
like carno cant do that
alpine plover
I’m interested to see how allos grapple is going to be implemented
versed rune
and it shouldnt do that
alpine plover
I can see allo having a weak biteforce I guess, a bit higher then carno though
I doubt the grab will be THAT strong
versed rune
which is why carno should have higher damage to compensate, both based on playstyle and realism
alpine plover
I doubt the grab will be THAT strong
it should just be another tool in allos kit, not its main move
versed rune
honestly i disagree
alpine plover
which is why carno should have higher damage to compensate, both based on playst...
but isnt carno the fastest dinosaur in the game?
alpine plover
but isnt carno the fastest dinosaur in the game?
I feel like thats enough to compensate
alpine plover
the special ability should always be a priority option
thats a bit boring
this is already a issue with teno
versed rune
if carno doesnt get enough damage then you get legacy carno
hes fast sure
but he cant hunt and kill anything
alpine plover
tenos is able to just spam its tail slam, its other moves are useless
for a brawler, it really doesnt use its other moves to fight
I dont want that for allo
versed rune
tenos is able to just spam its tail slam, its other moves are useless
precisely why i advocated for a cooldown on the tail slam
so you have to combo
alpine plover
precisely why i advocated for a cooldown on the tail slam
to compensate, it should get a buff to its claw attack
versed rune
i can live with that
alpine plover
to compensate, it should get a buff to its claw attack
In terms of raw damage, speed or bleed?
That teno nerf argument was so bad
brawlers shouldn’t just be “spam rmb”
alpine plover
brawlers shouldn’t just be “spam rmb”
they should use their kit to fight, not just a single move
Holy shit
"It should get a stam nerf so it can't outstam carno"
What the hell
versed rune
i would say explain but we're in the middle of an interesting convo lmaoo
so continue, dio
alpine plover
Let’s be civil here
alpine plover
Holy shit
"It should get a stam nerf so it can't outstam carno"
it made sense once he explained it, I agree with him
alpine plover
they should use their kit to fight, not just a single move
Basically, handman allo is just boring
it isnt really a brawler
it just spams rmb
sinful cove
What the hell
they want teno to get the legacy trike treatment 
versed rune
Basically, handman allo is just boring
wdym by handman allo
alpine plover
if you nerf its kit but give it a insanely strong move to compensate, then thats just boring game design
alpine plover
wdym by handman allo
allo that uses its hand in nearly every scerino because its biteforce is awful
versed rune
oh i dont think its biteforce should be awful at all
alpine plover
Yeah no, herbi's need a way to escape confrontation because they're usually prey in most circumstances
If it becomes a trade of blows, Carno takes the cake easily.
If Teno using any of it's actually powerful attacks, it drains it's stamina. Therefore rendering unable to run down the Carno for bloodthirst. While keeping it more defensive in the fight
alpine plover
oh i dont think its biteforce should be awful at all
around 400 or 370?
slim dragon
I heard carno should have a higher biteforce than cerato
Now I'm upset
sinful cove
Yeah no, herbi's need a way to escape confrontation because they're usually prey...
but you see, carno players sometimes die to a teno still so it has to be nerfed into fodder
alpine plover
I heard carno should have a higher biteforce than cerato
Now I'm upset
it should
wh-
slim dragon
Why the hell ?
sinful cove
can't give the carnis any trouble, ya know
alpine plover
ok this is straight up ridiculous
What is Carno's niche again?
Someone tell me
cerato isnt some super big bite dino its a actual animal
sinful cove
they should be allowed to fulfill their jurassic park fantasy of steamrolling every herbivore in peace
slim dragon
Carno has a weak biteforce
Because it hunts small prey
Cerato has a strong one
Because it's a brawler and a scavenger
sinful cove
in all seriousness, when more small game comes out carno should have a rougher time with teno than it currently does
slim dragon
And for the sake of balance, because it can't outrun a carno
alpine plover
Carno is a small game hunter
It can transition to larger prey through skill or numbers.
But it's niche correlates to it's balance
versed rune
allo that uses its hand in nearly every scerino because its biteforce is awful
relative to the current game, id say give allo 300 damage, with a slightly slower bite than carno. to compensate it has a decently higher health pool and overall is more dangerous to things like tenonto in a head on fight than carno is
alpine plover
cerato would ideally use its kit to defend it self and body steal rather then hunt.
Its a scavenger, a roach
A really annoying one
versed rune
and then allo has whatever special ability it gets
slim dragon
How can it defend itself if it can't deal proper damage to the attacker ?
How much biteforce does carno have currently ? 350 ?
alpine plover
relative to the current game, id say give allo 300 damage, with a slightly slowe...
I mean, shouldn’t allo body teno?
versed rune
thats what i mean yeah
alpine plover
How can it defend itself if it can't deal proper damage to the attacker ?
Bite grab attack
Allo should definitely body teno
slim dragon
Bite grab attack
Grab ?
versed rune
like teno should basically bolt if it sees an allo
teno should be able to fight back against allo
but
not effectively
alpine plover
relative to the current game, id say give allo 300 damage, with a slightly slowe...
I like it
alpine plover
not effectively
agreed, this should be the case for cera to
alpine plover
like teno should basically bolt if it sees an allo
I mean if you look at the size differences, if a teno sees an Allo it should immediately run the opposite direction as fast as it can
versed rune
this way allo and carno can both effectively hunt teno. carno has to assassinate it but cant really fight it, allo just overpowers it completely but teno has a change to escape
versed rune
I mean if you look at the size differences, if a teno sees an Allo it should imm...
if isle was realistic teno would run the opposite direction from a carno too lmfao
same with a cera actually
alpine plover
Pretty much yea
versed rune
since cera recently got upsized irl
alpine plover
but this is the isle so
Allo should be around 45 kmh but with bad stamina, if it catches you though, yeah you’re boned
alpine plover
since cera recently got upsized irl
I prefer 1 ton cerato
versed rune
what's tenos speed?
slim dragon
this way allo and carno can both effectively hunt teno. carno has to assassinate...
There's a mistake here
Carno shouldn't effectively hunt teno
versed rune
I prefer 1 ton cerato<:TI_HypsiShrug:696885704524824586>
new cera is like 30 feet long, same as allo and carno, but shorter. hes a tanky manlet basically.
alpine plover
should 4 allos kill a rex?
Definitely, allo should be the bare minimum for apex hunting
versed rune
should 4 allos kill a rex?
i agree here
alpine plover
I feel like a group of allos would be insanely powerful
alpine plover
new cera is like 30 feet long, same as allo and carno, but shorter. hes a tanky ...
Thats why i dislike it removes the underdog aspect
versed rune
to be fair legacy tried underdog cera
it didnt really work out too well
cerato rex is the ideal way to go
just
make it less shit
alpine plover
dondi balanced legacy, hypno/QA does evrima
Legacy Cera just suffered from bleed thats all
so underdog cerato can work
If the bleed change was reverted. Cera would've rocked here and there in the mid tiers
Yeah ideally cerato would be a tank for its size, 2.4k HP with fracture/venom/bleed resistance
but have a pretty weak bite force
versed rune
between allo, cera and carno, carno should focus on offense, cera on defense, and allo on a bit of both.
alpine plover
between allo, cera and carno, carno should focus on offense, cera on defense, an...
I dont see allo/carno/cera as a trio
slim dragon
Remember that Carno/Cerato and Allo aren't on the same power level
versed rune
i just had an interesting idea for cera actually
alpine plover
Allo-high speed and bleed damage but low stamina and relatively weaker biteforce
Allo is just way too big compared to them
slim dragon
Allo is bigger and stronger than both
alpine plover
Allo's a bit too high there
He'd rely on just being a sheer aggresive menace
Bary/cera/carno makes more sense as a trio
versed rune
cera should have about the same bite damage as allo, lets say 300, but have a massive critical hit multiplier to make him defensive
alpine plover
He'd rely on just being a sheer aggresive menace
that should be cerato
alpine plover
cera should have about the same bite damage as allo, lets say 300, but have a ma...
to the head?
versed rune
and if we say allo is above mid tier level, then we get legacy where allo is OP.
alpine plover
what do you mean by “critical hit”?
slim dragon
It will be above mid tier level
versed rune
isles allo is fragilis. he is on the same level as carno, cera, bary, alberto, etc
versed rune
what do you mean by “critical hit”?
i mean headshot yeah
alpine plover
If there's reasonable balance for it
It wouldn't be op
let’s get allosaurus Maximus in here now
versed rune
let’s get allosaurus Maximus in here now <:TI_dondiSmile:588126306743353521>
rage. fury, even.
alpine plover
If you can avoid them before they get close, you can effectively render non stealthy Allo's as harmless
alpine plover
and if we say allo is above mid tier level, then we get legacy where allo is OP.
not really, I view carno/cera/bary as below mid tier, but not small tier
they’re psuedo mid tier
versed rune
cera/carno/bary/allo/alberto are all 30 feet long. they vary only slightly in weight and height.
there is no reason that any of those dinos should not be able to compete with the others.
alpine plover
cera/carno/bary/allo/alberto are all 30 feet long. they vary only slightly in we...
allo is 1 ton bigger the carno
versed rune
plus. this is a videogame.
alpine plover
I feel like that makes the roster a bit boring
versed rune
but it doesnt if they all function uniquely
the more relatively even fights that dinosaurs have against other dinosaurs in the same size range, the more fun the game will be.
alpine plover
Carno shouldn’t just be faster allo
slim dragon
Having Allo not wreck a carno in a fight would be so disappointing
alpine plover
Making them all the same in power level just makes it harder for them to be unique
slim dragon
For me, Allo is like a bigger Utah. Designed to hunt things bigger than itself in packs.
alpine plover
And it doesn’t make much sense
versed rune
im not saying make them the same strength. im saying make it possible for each dinosaur to gain the upper hand on the other.
alpine plover
You could make it work if they have different functions and abilities, while still having them in somewhat comparable power level
versed rune
everyone says that rex/spino/giga should be relatively equal against each other, so the same applies for mid tier carnivores
alpine plover
That's what makes game balance magical
alpine plover
im not saying make them the same strength. im saying make it possible for each d...
I mean for things like teno/allo? sure.
But things like utah/rex? nah
versed rune
You could make it work if they have different functions and abilities, while sti...
this
slim dragon
Carno being able to have the upper hand against Allo is absolutely stupid
versed rune
not...really, no?
slim dragon
It's smaller, faster and will probably have a much shorter growth
alpine plover
everyone says that rex/spino/giga should be relatively equal against each other,...
carno isn’t really a mid tier carnivore
the size difference is massive
more like a large small tier hunter
allo is 1 ton larger
slim dragon
And carno is not built for combat
alpine plover
Allo should be able to mash carnos face into the ground
versed rune
tenonto wasnt built for combat either.
alpine plover
it is though
slim dragon
It is in the game
versed rune
It is in the game
so why cant carno be built for combat in a fictional videogame? you're argument is hypocritical
alpine plover
so why cant carno be built for combat in a fictional videogame? you're argument ...
because it isnt
alpine plover
our carno isnt made to be a fighter, if it was then yeah I would be wrong, but it is
versed rune
everything should be capable of combat in some way or another. combat is the most intriguing thing in this game
slim dragon
Ptera ? Hypsi ?
alpine plover
thats cus the game sucks
versed rune
restricting dinosaurs like legacy did is a horrible idea
alpine plover
the isle is just.
sinful cove
Ptera ? Hypsi ?
spitting on people and nipping at their heels counts as combat, yes?
alpine plover
not a great game.
in the future, ideally combat woudlnt be the only thing to do
so everything being able to fight everything isnt needed
slim dragon
spitting on people and nipping at their heels counts as combat, yes?
You could argue so, though it's not really what I was thinking when I said "built for combat"
alpine plover
ideally the game would be actual survival
and not just a deathmatch game you wait 2 hours to play
it isnt just survival primal carnage
ew
bad game
better then the game we’re talking about now
worried that update 4 won’t even come until the end of July, hell. Maybe even the end of August
alpine plover
unfortunately
diets is the best move in my opinion
its the first step to making the game fun
Depends on the iteration
an interactive map would have been better then pachy, but as a pachy fan I cant complain
like sure diets enforce people to play the game how it’s meant to be played but. think it’s a bit too early for diets rn
versed rune
the description of diets in the roadmap sounds awful. it says that you need to have a healthy diet to MAINTAIN STEADY growth, not INCREASE your growth.
the way they describe it it sounds like diets are going to be an ultimatum, not something that you get rewarded for.
alpine plover
Imagine if you could scratch your horn against a tree as carno for a small growth boost, and because of this a allo knows you’re in the area, now he knows theres some competition near by and plans accordingly
that shit is cool
more options is needed
Combat music when in combat when
alpine plover
the description of diets in the roadmap sounds awful. it says that you need to h...
I mean, im fine with both
versed rune
You shouldnt be punished for not following a mandated diet, you should be rewarded for following an optional healthy diet
alpine plover
You shouldnt be punished for not following a mandated diet, you should be reward...
you should be slightly punished
imo
i would enjoy a growth boost for following your diet
versed rune
but then everyone will scramble to have default growth instead of below normal growth. the last thing we need are longer growth times.
alpine plover
Of course a carno shouldn’t be punished much, he had no choice in following his diet
alpine plover
but then everyone will scramble to have default growth instead of below normal g...
then you balance it
versed rune
instead following a diet should REWARD the people who are patient and smart enough to follow it correctly, not punish you for NOT following it. unless youre eating literal rotting food. in which case you should be punished.
alpine plover
a large plains herbivore like stego should have a punishing diet, if it fails to follow it, it becomes runt stego
meanwhile carno just goes from 1.8 tons to 1.6/1.5.
alpine plover
instead following a diet should REWARD the people who are patient and smart enou...
I mean, why even add it at point
there needs to be some punishment for not being good at the game
versed rune
making players grow slower or weaker than default stats just because they didnt follow their mandated diet is just bad game design in my opinion
golden coral
making players grow slower or weaker than default stats just because they didnt ...
I'd say that's fine, if it can be reversed if you start following diets properly.
versed rune
again you should be rewarded for playing the game as intended, but not punished for playing the game how you want.
alpine plover
making players grow slower or weaker than default stats just because they didnt ...
that’s why it shouldn’t be hard to do for things that can’t easily access your diet, and of course it can be reversed like erik daid
versed rune
i can agree there
alpine plover
Like a trike should get heavily punished for not following their diet
versed rune
but throughout my time playing this game, the less restricted you are, the better
alpine plover
ideally herbies/carnis will have different diet forms
versed rune
because if a game like the isle is too linear and mandated it loses all of what makes it special
thats why most rules servers are ass
alpine plover
I can see that, most of the fun does come from the random shit that happens
versed rune
because they limit you
it all comes down to the basic principal of if you let people play how they want (within reason,) the game itself will construct a healthy ecosystem
golden coral
Yeah but I don't think it's quite the same Rugops
alpine plover
Diets seem nearly impossible for carnivores unless they actually add a.i for juveniles
ideally, diets would be a middle ground between encouraging/punishing bad/good play and also encouraging players to move, which leads to more fun gameplay
they just need to fix the A.I situation
alpine plover
it all comes down to the basic principal of if you let people play how they want...
that didn’t work in legacy
golden coral
Rules are more restrictive in what you get to do, diets are more ingame, like fall damage sort of. Not the best example but still :p