balance-feedback-discussion

[golden coral]

I'm sure there's something that could be worked on to make it more dynamic, and that should go for all things, pounce, grapple, lunge/grab

[onyx wyvern]

Because it's either tree or death

[golden coral]

Yeh, tree locked stego.

Not the most entertaining on my side either

[onyx wyvern]

That's only really for utahs though

[golden coral]

So if you mean stego should require more skill = a better interaction and fight in general, then yeah, I'm all for it :p

[onyx wyvern]

A stego head is way more dangerous to a carno

Yes that is what I meant

All dinos shouldn't just be spam this to win

[golden coral]

Well, carno is bigger and less designed to hunt stegos. Utahs pounce is the big game killer, more or less, even for rexes. Carno is not really designed to hunt a rex or stego, it bowls over small things and keeps them culled.

I'd be fine with utahs being the main stego hunters, with carno in turn hunting the utahs and dryos. And both of them hunting tennos, depending on pack size/opportunity.

[onyx wyvern]

That is true, but I mean current game a carno should never attack the stego head unless its sure it has an opening

[minor phoenix]

Are healthy herbis really designed to be hunted or the weakest in their herd just get singled out

[golden coral]

For now it's fine that carnos can and do hunt stegos.

Cause balance, so stegos should have that to deal with too.

But in the future when we got allos and other big stuff, then yeah, carnos should not be hunting stegos, or anything else big. Not mess with deinos either really :p

[onyx wyvern]

If they would fix the stego tail hurt box a carno could barely kill one

[golden coral]

I'm on the side of stego being good vs small/mid tiers, and weaker vs big stuff, that it mostly just fends off, rather than fights. I know some people tihnk the other side, making stego weak vs small and agile stuff and great vs rexes and other big stuff.

So there's some variation in how stego mains and others want stego to play out :D

[onyx wyvern]

Right now what I do is try and bait it to spam and bite the tail when its returning to its neutral space

[frosty heron]

Thats fixed and 2 Carnos can still kill one

[golden coral]

Didn't they fix that one?

[onyx wyvern]

I mean I can still tail ride a stego to death

[golden coral]

Cause yeah, solo carno taking a stego, I can grant you ,if you're really good. But not by biting my main weapon, that's just dumb xD

[onyx wyvern]

If I fuck up I die but I can still do it

[toxic crypt]

Hrolfr, you seem far from unbiased

[onyx wyvern]

I kill stegos by biting the tail all the time

[golden coral]

Huh, it's so weird that stego can be tailridden in the first place

But as long as it's not just biting them on the thagomizer/end of the tail, it should be able to be countered somehow

[onyx wyvern]

It takes some major dodging skills

[golden coral]

But maybe the stego hurtbox needs a second fix

[frosty heron]

Most stupid shit ever on the game honestly. Ive never used tailbitting against Stegos even on Update 2

[golden coral]

Cause I don't think that's how you should hunt stegos

Get a partner, and hunt the head

[frosty heron]

Where's the skill on that...

[golden coral]

You even got a extra multiplier there :p

[toxic crypt]

I think it should be good against other apexes and bad against smalls. Stego's slow enough that it'd need to fight off an apex, but the smaller critters are of such a low health in comparison that it feels a bit more balanced.

[onyx wyvern]

Because if you fuck up you die almost instantly

[golden coral]

Devs give stego extra head multiplier. Players hunt stegos by biting their tail. xD

I don't know, that seems off to me. I thought they fixed that.

[onyx wyvern]

I'd like to show you what I mean sometime

[frosty heron]

Hard to fuck up tailbitting when you're out of reach my guy, it's the safest way to kill it

[toxic crypt]

I thought they did too

[frosty heron]

And doesn't require any kind of dodging skill, it's free

[golden coral]

Eh, fair. I get both sides, but I'm on the side of stego being good at AoE with its swings, and as such, would just shove the small stuff aside, whereas it would have a harder time fighting off a big thing, so it'd be doing a fighting retreat sort of, rather than stand and fight.

[onyx wyvern]

You arent out of reach, you dont know what I'm talking about bud

[frosty heron]

Then explain yourself because I'm still thinking on the tail hitbox bug

[toxic crypt]

It's not really able to retreat well, judging off of our rex's running anim. Besides, having it bad against smalls makes it huntable by its irl predator.

[golden coral]

Please do. But I think we know what youre doing, if its similar to update 2, and that should have been fixed. Its just a stupid way of how that fight goes you know. You can bait and attack stegos head, as you should.

[onyx wyvern]

When you fight a stego if you stay on its tail while it is trying to stab you, you can bite the tail while it's going back to reset, I'd you do not get out of the way fast enough it can stab you

[toxic crypt]

I would like to casually point out that hrolf claims bias for erik, but hrolf seems to have ignored multiple points throughout the convo

[onyx wyvern]

It's like, stego sipe, you bite after the swipe at the tail and digest before it can reset its attack

[golden coral]

Eh, allo isn't really small? :p Or what did hunt stegos? But I'd say stego can retreat well enough, maybe up turn radius a touch, but it should be able to keep a rex at its ass until the rex either goes too close and take a thagomizer to face, or gives up, and/or outmanuever the stego and actually gets to its head without taking a full swing or two to its head/sides.

[frosty heron]

https://youtu.be/ffELEowX4ok

You mean this?

[onyx wyvern]

Dodge*

[toxic crypt]

Allo's pretty small compared to stego. The lower maneuverability of larger creatures makes them less able to get at stego's head than the smaller and more nimble critters, though.

[golden coral]

Oh I've no doubt I'm a bit biased, but I try to make sure to argue for every playable to be viable and fun. I may disagree on what I think stego should be hunted by, but that doesnt mean I want those critters to get shit on or something otherwise :p

[onyx wyvern]

Simular but hes wasting shots when the tail has swung

[golden coral]

True but in return they can take a hit and keep going. But allo was pretty big? I could have sworn I saw someone in Isle discussion saying allos got pretty damn big. Though maybe that person was wrong. But we know stego isn't that big, it is after all the smallest and "weakest" of the high end here.

[onyx wyvern]

I wish I could just show you

[golden coral]

Record next time!

Always good if you need to prove a point to be able to show what actually went down

[onyx wyvern]

When the tail is done its swing the tail can be bit before it returns to its reset to attack again

[frosty heron]

Yes because what youre watching in that video it's a bug abuse and doesn't require any skill

[golden coral]

Can you bite the tail from behind though?

That's the issue I think, and what has to be fixed

[toxic crypt]

They really shouldn't be comfy taking a stego thagomizer, erik. Isn't the thagomizer longer than a rex skull is wide?
Allo also isn't super big, it's the quintessential mid tier. Perhaps if you went with sauro, but I don't think they are.

[onyx wyvern]

Yes you can still bite the tip at a stupid angle

Which needs a fix

[frosty heron]

We might get surprised that when Allo comes out it won't be the best choice to hunt Stegos maybe because size + agility factors aren't the best, I would be disappointed if Rex isn't able to body a Stego in a 1vs1, unless you commit major mistakes

[toxic crypt]

Rex should def not body stego in a 1v1, stego isn't able to go faster than rex can

[frosty heron]

Because Rex lacks a lot in agility but raw power is way more

[toxic crypt]

Right, but rex's beeg jaw doesn't save it when the stego's thagomizers are stabbing that deep

[frosty heron]

Maybe not body but neither be a 50/50, Rex it's a 8 ton beast, maybe the best way to balance it off its give Rex high headshot multiplier and so the combat relies on avoid being hit there

But if a Rex reaches your head you should be dead quickly

[golden coral]

Oh fantastic. Yeah, that I can't agree with. Sure, maybe it takes skill, I'm not saying you're not a good player, but I will say I think it's simply the stupidest thing to be able to do. It's the main attack, the one pointy end on a stego, and it's somehow viable to attack. I just can't see that as reasonable you know :p

[toxic crypt]

From what we've seen of rex's run, I'm pretty sure it's faster than stego. Stego cannot run from the confrontation, so the raw damage should be in stego's favor

[onyx wyvern]

I mean ya it shouldn't be able to be bit in theory because its spikey

[frosty heron]

That's Rex speed youseen there but not agility, if you're forced to get hit everytime you attack, that shouldnt be the case

Otherwise Stego will always win by playing defensive

[toxic crypt]

Agility doesn't really matter because the rex always decides when the battle starts and when it ends

[golden coral]

Fair enough. I just think they could take a body hit or two and just fight on. In pairs/small pack overpowering a stego. Of course a headshot should hurt like hell, but they also can pay that back, especially with stego head multiplier. You'd have one allo grapple the tail, let the other go ham on stego tiny head or something maybe.

[toxic crypt]

That should be how it works. Stego is an inherently defensive animal.

[frosty heron]

But that's not an excuse if you can't avoid being hit by Stego by the lack of agility

[onyx wyvern]

But their forward hit box makes it almost impossible to hit their head, even if you bait the attack resets fast enough that you will get tagged on the way out of a head bite

[frosty heron]

If you can't avoid hits means you have to be tankier to at least kill the Stego in a 1vs1

[toxic crypt]

Complaining about stego being defensive is just goofy

Stego is defensive, that is its entire game plan

[frosty heron]

Who's complaining? It should be defensive of course

[golden coral]

Eh, like I said, I think there's two "schools of thought" when it comes to stego. I'm simply on the other side of that. I figure the bigger things would still be agile enough + then tanky and powerful enough. Vs a buch of small tiers, which is why utahs are one of the few that can hunt big things, because pounce is designed for that, but otherwise, let small tiers stick with small and mid hunting. (except maybe dilo as well cause venom). Bu yeah no, no bodying things. Stego should defenitely want to avoid/deter the rex, rather than actually get into a fight with it. Walk away and wiggle tail is the order of the day!

[toxic crypt]

Yes it is, because you as the rex again always choose the confrontation

If it comes down to a face tank, the rex should lose

[frosty heron]

Never said it shouldn't, but if you go defensive there should be some counter to it, Rex lacking agility means if you want to get a bite you will be hit always no matter what

[toxic crypt]

if it comes down to tanking hits, the rex should lose

[frosty heron]

And that's a tank combat there, the takiest one wins

[toxic crypt]

Because the rex is the faster opponent

The stego cannot escape, and the rex is always able to just run away from it when things get hairy

[frosty heron]

Then Rex loses the 1vs1 always man

[toxic crypt]

The rex is faster, remember? it can always choose to start the battle when the conditions are right, or just decide not to fuck with the stego

Hell, the rex is always able to, mid-fight, leave

[frosty heron]

Faster doesn't mean more agile, just a decision of running way or chase you, again, chasing you if you can't get hits safely, it's worthless

[golden coral]

Not if you baited properly I don't think. There's also a way or two to basically avoid being hit entirely. And carnos can take those hits, especially if you get a tail hit. Stego isn't quite as good at protecting it's head as you might think, hence the "stick your head into stuff" thing. And yes, thagomizer thorn damage please. I mean ,kentro is coming, and if that does not have it, then who would. Also ceratopsid faces of course.

[frosty heron]

And Rex isn't a bleeder. It won't bleed you

[toxic crypt]

No, again it is faster

If the rex is tankier on top of being faster

what does stego do?

Can it run? No. Can it fight? Not if the rex is tankier than the stego.

It certainly is too large to effectively hide in this scenario

[frosty heron]

But in the other hand if Rex can't avoid getting hit and it's less tankier. What Rex would do? Leave the Stego alone?

[toxic crypt]

Yeah, or just wait for a better opportunity to attack

[onyx wyvern]

1v1 a carno has a tough time biting a stego head, it will die 90% of the time

[frosty heron]

That's stupid, a 8 ton land predator shouldn't flee from a 5 ton herb

[toxic crypt]

It's better for the rex to have to make that decision than for the stego to just be wiped

[frosty heron]

Shants and other herbs like Trike will come to the game for that

[toxic crypt]

1: Who said flee? How the fuck is a slower animal going to chase you?
2: Rex's weight doesn't change the fact that stego's thagomizers are long enough to fuckle every organ in its belly through a swing

[golden coral]

Well yes, but it can be done. And really, 1 carno should not be able to take 1 stego honestly unless that stego lets it. Any more than the carno/deino matchup should be a thing really, even on land it should not be favourable for the carno. And thats with deino being able to nope out, unlike stego.

[toxic crypt]

Stego's thagomizers would be long enough to skewer a rex's skull all the way through to the other side, remember

They aren't small

[golden coral]

What did I miss? :p

[onyx wyvern]

I like how you jump from "well in real life" to "well it's a game and needs balance" as it fits your bias, maybe you shouldn't be calling people put bud

[frosty heron]

Well the weight argument always comes to the balance feedback when people talks about mid tiers, so I'm doing the same all Herbie mains do, and yes I said flee or run away I don't know you took that.

[onyx wyvern]

Out*

[frosty heron]

And you just placed on the table a very stupid herb main phrase "Thagomizers should fuck your Dino" then Rex Jaws should do the same to your Stego man

[toxic crypt]

When did I do that? I brought up irl because it influenced my preference, but the claim that stego should just be fodder for rex is dumb on a basal game design perspective.

Erik didn't suggest stego should be "bodied" by rex

[onyx wyvern]

True in the wild a carno wouldn't attack a stego

[toxic crypt]

Rex doesn't need to run from shit, it controls everything about the confrontation

[onyx wyvern]

You've been doing it none stop bud, but that's fine we are all a little bias :D

[frosty heron]

It doesn't if you can't safely land bites on the Stego

[toxic crypt]

No, I have not. If both realism and game balance are counter to a suggestion, it's an ultra shit suggestion.

[frosty heron]

There's no "better opportunities" only chance it's 2vs1 a Stego and that would be the most stupid thing for a 7 hours grow Dino

[onyx wyvern]

Maybe we should decide if this game should go by the real animal standard or this is a game and should be balanced like a game standard

[frosty heron]

(if the Rex gonna have that grow time)

And probably Rex will have very poor stamina pool which eventually will make chasing worthy

[toxic crypt]

Right, so your logic is that it should ez wipe a 5 hour grow without a fucking care in the world

[modest carbon]

If rex gets 7 hour growth they better put them big ol jaws to work

[frosty heron]

Give him slow trot like Legacy Rex, definitely killable by chasing

[toxic crypt]

Because, again, you're suggesting that it be both faster and stronger at the same time

[frosty heron]

You're not even considering Stamina on the fight...

[onyx wyvern]

Talking realism and then asking for balance because it's a game is very stupid bud. In the wild stuff gets clapped all the time and in stupid ways

[golden coral]

Nor should it in the game honestly. Carno is designed otherwise, so there is that. Leave hunting stegos to allos and stuff. At the very least one carno should not have a good matchup vs a solo stego at all, so 90% sounds about right to me there. Maybe slightly better vs deino, but well, deino has it's own advantages.

[toxic crypt]

Do explain to me how a stego player might handle being attacked by a rex if the rex is both faster and stronger

[frosty heron]

Tell me how to handle if it's weaker then, speed apart because than only helps to run away, faster doesn't mean agile

[toxic crypt]

Uh, not unless it's a huge litter species.

[onyx wyvern]

It dies bud like it would in real life, but again the real life "it would wreck your organs" is fine for you, but the real life that a rex wouod crush a stego head and be done is not fine for you

[toxic crypt]

Faster means you can run around the stego and keep hit and running it until it dies

[toxic crypt]

I never stated that. In fact, the resident stego main makes fun of me for saying rex should crush stego's head.

[frosty heron]

That's agility. Being capable to bait and hit and go to safety, Rex won't be agile enought for that man

[onyx wyvern]

I'd just like to casually point out that herp is just as bias but wants to die on his soap box

[frosty heron]

I highly doubt a 13 mts long 8 ton animal will do what Carnos are doing in today matchup

[toxic crypt]

You don't know shit about me, I have 100% said stego should be 1 shot by a rex bite to the head.

@meager oriole will fucking confirm it

don't try to put words in my mouth

[onyx wyvern]

Now you are back tracking from what you've been saying

[toxic crypt]

No, I'm not.

[meager oriole]

you also said to my face no one cares about the stego player

[frosty heron]

I don't like the idea of 1 shooting Stego as Rex neither

[golden coral]

First of all, one shots are bad in general between similar size/growth times and all

[onyx wyvern]

You said a stego should kill a rex 1v1 how I'd that also possible of the rex can 1 shot it with a head bite

[golden coral]

So neither rex nor stego should one shot each other

That takes away a bit of the skill I think we all want

[frosty heron]

This ^

[toxic crypt]

I said the stego should kill the rex in a 1v1 face-to-tail tank

Stego should be tankier than rex is

Esp for body shots

[onyx wyvern]

What colour is the bike bud, is it purple

[toxic crypt]

If stego is both slower and weaker than rex, it's literal fodder

[golden coral]

What should happen is a stego should want to walk away, swinging its tail to deter the rex. If the rex follows and tries to get around, the stego will stop and turn, keeping its tail towards rex, ready for a more powerful swing.

[modest carbon]

1 shots aren't fun unless there's a large size difference

[onyx wyvern]

If the rex is stupid enough to tail to face tank when it can 1 shot it with a head bite I'd be concerned with the Rex's mental health

[frosty heron]

Consider that Rex isn't a Carno and it might have a hard time going for the head

[golden coral]

Then keep trying to move away, the rex will either give up, get too close and take damage and retreat, or try and go in and possibly kill the stego but die of the wounds. If the rex gets a good ambush, can somehow trick the stego by moving, or otherwise gets a good chomp in on the head, the rex will win, but the stego might be able to struggle and get a few swipes off to make the rex feel it.

[toxic crypt]

isn't carno supposed to be all about being low agility high speed?

Like, to the absolute extreme?

[golden coral]

On the other hand, a rex can take a few hits to it's side, and head. So it's a matter of moving around, as well as baiting. I think it could be done at least.

[modest carbon]

Carno right now is pretty dam agile

[frosty heron]

Carno it's agile, way less than a Utah but still a 1.8 ton fast runner

[toxic crypt]

sad times

[onyx wyvern]

I mean most slower smaller animals are fodder to bigger stronger animals, you know kinda how the deino makes a Utah fodder

[frosty heron]

I repeat, Rex it's 8 tons, it probably will have wonky turning in place and mobility

[toxic crypt]

utah is not slower than deino on land, though

I've seen tenos run from deinos, that's a shit example

[onyx wyvern]

Nor is a crock to a zebra but who wins that fight bud

Croc*

[toxic crypt]

Lets get this straight, the slower animal (croc) is stronger than the faster animal (zebra)?

[meager oriole]

erik we're literally discussing stego v apex balance elsewhere as we speak, so why dont you uh, join that

[toxic crypt]

How is that a good example in your argument for the exact opposite?

[meager oriole]

remember what you told me to tell you, erik

[onyx wyvern]

Because the crocodile is stronger, the rex is stronger than the stego, the stronger animal wins

[toxic crypt]

But the rex is also faster than the stego, which the croc is not

[onyx wyvern]

The carbo is both faster and stronger than a Utah and wrecks it

[toxic crypt]

the zebra isn't made fodder by the croc because the zebra can avoid the croc if it is aware that it is there

[onyx wyvern]

Carno*

[golden coral]

I know and I am :p And yes.. :p But we're both a bit stupid eh :D

[toxic crypt]

It's like trying to say rex should body anky because anky is lighter

Anky cannot run

Anky cannot hide

Anky is fucked if rex is stronger than it

[onyx wyvern]

Anky has armour

[sinful cove]

Utah can also use its superior mobility to climb/jump out of reach of carno

So another poor comparison

[toxic crypt]

Anky's armor isn't super impressive if you actually look at how it works

It isn't a shell

[onyx wyvern]

Nah yall just cant decide if you want real life or game balance until it fits your bias and its sad

[toxic crypt]

Hrolf.

You've flat out ignored erik on multiple occasions in this very chatroom.

That was the first thing I saw when I logged on today.

You might just be the most biased fella I've ever seen on this discord, and I've seen people try to claim trike has five skulls

[onyx wyvern]

Oh no how devastating

I am not bias I'm laughing at how none of yall xan decide if you want the animals to be real or to be game balanced

[toxic crypt]

You 100% are, dude

[onyx wyvern]

And every single one of you want it one way or another depending on how it benefits your dino

[toxic crypt]

My dino?

[sinful cove]

You are very biased and proof can be pulled up easily by searching your history

[toxic crypt]

My dude, I don't even play stego

I fucking main dryo, what in the fuck do you mean "my dino"?

It's simple game design

[onyx wyvern]

Was a blanket term for all peoples favourite dino

[toxic crypt]

The slower thing should be stronger than the faster thing

[onyx wyvern]

Oh but you also wanna preach real life stuff

So again what is it, real life animal or game balance

[toxic crypt]

game design isn't irl stuff

it's game design

[earnest robin]

This same conversation has been going on for just over 2 hours. Goodness gracious 😳

[onyx wyvern]

Oh but you want both

[golden coral]

You have seen what now?!

[onyx wyvern]

I've sat here and watched you throw the animals real life stuff into it to fit your bias

[toxic crypt]

I only got here like 30 minutes ago, so how would that be possible?

[onyx wyvern]

And then now scream it's all about in game balance

[earnest robin]

Because the argument started 2 hours ago, before you got here haha

[golden coral]

Game balance take precedence over realism. That's not difficult to decide on? Realism can inspire, and it should be reasonable and make sense, but game balance first and foremost.

[toxic crypt]

Dude said trike should be untouchable for rex because it has "5 facial skulls" or some shit like that

[golden coral]

... xD

Okay!

[sinful cove]

What the fuck is 5 facial skulls

What does that even mean lmao

[toxic crypt]

No clue ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[onyx wyvern]

Than maybe people shouldn't be throwing in real life shit than

[toxic crypt]

Did you not read what he just wrote

[brittle dirge]

stego vs rex from what I can gather

[toxic crypt]

If the game itself isn't even balanced, the realism doesn't matter.

[onyx wyvern]

Talking about you bud, and your argument that in real life a stego cna this and that

[toxic crypt]

Most of those statements were in response to erik, who was talking about something very different.

The others were responses to the other dude's appeals to rex's weight

[onyx wyvern]

Yall are just as bad as one another but all wanna be "it's not me I'm not the bias one" lol bye kids I have better things to do than talk to hypocrites

[toxic crypt]

You have to be more self-aware than this, holy shit

[sinful cove]

Biggest hypocrite calling people hypocrites, the projecting is real

[onyx wyvern]

You dude, are chill, sorry I worded things earlier wrong but I'm glad we agree that things need a rework

[golden coral]

Hey, don't look at me, I didn't do that. If anything I've argued that it's game balance, and that's why stego isn't as good as it should be right now, and neither is deino. The only time I use that argument is when people go "Deino mouth covers utah, it should oneshot it" and "Yes, but stego thagomizer also goes through carno skull, it does not oneshot a carno" and I think that's fair in that situation :p

Because people do like to use size/irl biteforce and stuff at times, but then that should go for all playables.

[onyx wyvern]

Enjoy your circle jerk

[sinful cove]

[toxic crypt]

Would like to point out that the only time I wasn't responding to you, I was responding to the other dude doing exactly that

[golden coral]

Same to you, maybe we just got off on the wrong foot there. And yes, it's always worth talking about things, and no doubt balance will go this way and that way, before all is said and done, for all playables!

[golden coral]

That one wasn't meant for you, it was a general statement to explain the deino/stego thing I said right before that. I didn't mean that you had said something wrong, sorry.

[onyx wyvern]

I agree we did, I have trouble working things sometimes and because of it I dont get out what I mean and than everyone just frustrated, thank you for not being a dildo and realizing sometimes people misspeak

[onyx wyvern]

You can add me on disc if you want and come play with me and my buds sometime

[toxic crypt]

I'm convinced it's a troll

[lament cloak]

@alpine plover im not entirely sure what you mean by jump out of the water, but gators irl don't weigh 8 tons

you mean like jump out and catch a ptera? because thats already planned

[alpine plover]

yes that is what i mean

[modest carbon]

Imagine doing that to a crossing utah in the air

[sturdy mirage]

Im just gonna leave this here: Stego swung at me 5 times in what felt like 3-4 seconds while standing halfway into the pond, and my adult Deinosuchus was minced meat. Stegos are literally only griefing while we are exploring/testing. I see two problems here, the bigger one of course being the balance issue.

[modest carbon]

[sturdy mirage]

Yeah I was surprised it would mince me this fast lmao

[alpine plover]

why did you go near a stego in the first place

it has giant spikes on its tail

[modest carbon]

pfft

[fallow wagon]

what's the smaller problem

[proud swan]

probably trolls 🤷‍♂️

[sinful cove]

Tip: don't use a 5hr grow dino to explore

[modest carbon]

Facts

[sinful cove]

Especially one thats slow as fuck lmao

[proud swan]

i bet you two are fun at parties

[fallow wagon]

nah you can explore anywhere with Stego

fuckin beast of an animal

imma grow a Steg when Update 3 officially releases and become God

[modest carbon]

Watch out for utahs lol

[fallow wagon]

i really doubt Utah can 1v1 Stego like people are sayin

it's a fucking U t a h

tiny naked lizard breath

you can't just stab it off of you?

[modest carbon]

You'd be surprised

[sinful cove]

You may be in for a shock

[fallow wagon]

or even stab it before it gets a pounce?

or stab it right as it lets go?

[modest carbon]

Good utahs bait and bait and bait

[sinful cove]

The devs love utah so much it can solo stego and deino rn

[modest carbon]

Facts

[fallow wagon]

Deino on land I can get but no way it can solo a Stego

[limber elbow]

a group of utahs is no joke to a stego but a solo utah killing a stego is probably a bad stego

[sinful cove]

Grow a stego and experience

Or a really sly utah

[fallow wagon]

a pack of Utahs yeah that'd scare me but just a lone one

[toxic crypt]

Utah's pounce really lets it punch UP

There's a reason why it's the only small getting strains

[limber elbow]

i never stray from trees when fighting a utah

a stego should use them

[modest carbon]

Pack of anything fast and dangerous is pretty darn scary

[sinful cove]

Like yeah i doubt your average joe potato iq utah is soloing decent stego players

[modest carbon]

Potato iq utah

[sinful cove]

Yes

You know it to be true

[modest carbon]

Potato iqtah

[fallow wagon]

IQ-tah

haha same idea

[modest carbon]

Ayyyyyy

[sinful cove]

Though thats partially because its one of the only 2 pickable land preds rn i suppose

So a majority will be dummies

[modest carbon]

Tips for utah v carno?

[fallow wagon]

don't

[sinful cove]

Jump on a rock and bark at it

[modest carbon]

Pffft

[alpine plover]

utahs have always been braindead, even in legacy

[sinful cove]

True… docktahs taking up like 30% of a server

[fallow wagon]

just go fuckin hunt somethin smh

[modest carbon]

Majority of them just take a few bites and fear death more than fighting

[sinful cove]

I remember the one time i joined a utah group that wasnt at docks and they were… headed to docks

[fallow wagon]

how long did Legacy Utah take to grow again I forget

[modest carbon]

Same as evrima

1.30

[fallow wagon]

really? I coulda swore it was much longer

[modest carbon]

Nope

[sinful cove]

Probably just felt longer because legacy juvie utah was super boring

[fallow wagon]

probably yea

I didnt play much Utah tho tbh

[modest carbon]

Guh legacy juvi

[fallow wagon]

my main was Sucho

[sinful cove]

Legacy juvie utah and galli were peepeepoopoo

[modest carbon]

I enjoyed cera

From time to time

[sinful cove]

I hope evrima galli juvie isnt as bad as the other juvie herbs are so far

[modest carbon]

I hope so too

[sinful cove]

I mainly did cera and carno on legacy

[fallow wagon]

Sucho sucked ass to grow but once you grew just fuckin vibe in rivers and say fuck you to Allo

was fun

[modest carbon]

I also hope it isn't just a memeing kick machine like legacy

[fallow wagon]

it's gonna kick in Evrima

[sinful cove]

I doubt machine gun kick will return

[modest carbon]

Yeah but that spam running kick

[sinful cove]

Preferably it will peck when running and have a cassowary barrage when in walk/trot

[fallow wagon]

definitely gonna be a kick to fear at least

man I'm excited to play Galli tbh

[modest carbon]

I want galli to have some weight

Like muscle feel

[sinful cove]

Same, galli and ovi are a couple of my fave dinos

[fallow wagon]

alotta animals in Evrima feel weightless or at least lighter than they should be due to the animations

hopefully they get better at some point

[sinful cove]

The guy animating rn seems to base a lot off of his emu, luckily galli is just hyper emu so his anims should be good

[modest carbon]

I wanna see muscles bobbin up and down for a heavy look

Not so streamline

Give some oomph

[sinful cove]

Stego doesn't need a nerf at all, even remotely. deino needs better utility in the water

[novel tulip]

I liked the suggestion of adding a water lunge to deino, then making all dinos have their weight temporarily lessened when swimming

[golden coral]

@turbid depot At no point should it be "near 100%" chance of killing something else that grows in the same time you do, like that. Especially not when your attack is pretty much a one shot.

[novel tulip]

So an adult stego can't get lunged if on the shore but if it chases deinos in the water it can be dragged under

[sinful cove]

yeah deino should be able to grab while swimming and terrestrials should have their weights halved or at least a third of their weight removed

if a stego loses a third of its weight i think it becomes draggable to deino unless im miscalculating

[golden coral]

And yes, let deino drown things swimming on the surface. But you need something to fight back against that with.

Otherwise we're back into one shot territory, and that's questionable. But otherwise, even a rex should fear going swimming.

[novel tulip]

Yeah

[sinful cove]

if stego goes swimming it can face the consequences, it curb stomps deinos on land and that's nice and all but deino needs much better advantage in water than he currently has

[golden coral]

As long as it's applied to every other big thing, I'm fine with it. :)

I don't know if I should be offended or entertained by that feedbacks description of stego.. :p

[sinful cove]

What kinda pinecones this boi been seein lmao

“Tiny itty bitty tail”

[golden coral]

Also what kind of cows for that matter? xD

But yes, pinecone tail stego :D

[sinful cove]

The tail is so tiny it shouldnt deal any damage unless it hits your eyes

Don't worry, your scutes will tank this hit

[golden coral]

To be fair, scale can be messed up in this game, it's not always easy to remember how big these things are when there's no human to compare to.

[lament cloak]

ofc, deinos are made of solid steel did you not know that? it makes zero sense why a giant spike would impale them

[golden coral]

Eh, they could do with some resistance, they do have armor sort of.

[sinful cove]

Oh right how could i forget deinosuchus is crafted with pure, redined steel skin and iron organs

[lament cloak]

those osteoderms aren't going to do squat agaist those tail spikes, they might do something against carno and utah attacks though

[sinful cove]

Deino's back should receive a notable bleed resist especially to slashing damage but it aint tanking a stab or a crusher bite ezpz

[golden coral]

I know, just saying in general, maybe deino should have a slightly lower multiplier. Make it a touch more tanky perhaps.

[sinful cove]

A bleed resist on its back and a tail slap would help it be less fodder to utahs and carnos on land at least

[toxic crypt]

What, like some sort of bleed resistance?

[sinful cove]

Though it should definitely still get shitstomped on land by other bigs if it tries to pick that fight

Like 25-30% less bleed taken from hits to its back

[golden coral]

Maybe just a slightly lower multiplier. I don't really know, just thinking that could be a way to just make it a touch more tanky without adding an armor mechanic. If head is 1.5 multiplier, make it 1.3 instead, if body is 1.0, make it .8, if tail is .5, make it .3. I obviously don't know the multipliers, so these are just examples.

Wouldn't save it vs a stego tailhit, but could make it slightly less easy to kill by utahs and carnos maybe. It does already have extra bleed resist after all.

[fallow wagon]

especially weight and force too w/ how the animations in this game kinda are

stuff can feel so light as we play it when it's rly like 2 or 3 fucking tons

humans only know pounds in the hundreds

that tail is jabbing thru so much mass w/ so much force you just can't really comprehend it that well

[golden coral]

True. Weight/size for fall damage. You fall what seems like a tiny bit and wonder why you died, when it was a fair distance, plus the weight.

[fallow wagon]

it's just hard for many people to have a good reference of

which is fair tbh

i often struggle to grasp it too

[golden coral]

It is. We could use some better ways to get an idea of the ingame scale of things. It helped when first person (sort of) was a thing, or when there were human models in the game, but otherwise it's tricky.

[fallow wagon]

Imo the animations are the biggest issue

I'm not tryna diss the animators but the animations very often have an oddly weightless or at least lightened feel to em

they rly need some work

[modest carbon]

lots of dinos that look weightless is a big problem, yes

[dusty fable]

@turbid depot dude a stego thagomizers are over a meter long. That isnt not "itty bitty" and they can swing that with devastating force. In other words. Stego does not need a nerf

[lament cloak]

pinecone

[dusty fable]

You did not need to @ me with that.

[sinful cove]

Pinecone cow

[fallow wagon]

pinecone

[wide tulip]

Deino mains, why are you guys so upset you cant oneshot everything and be invincible

[alpine plover]

Its balanced to be with the current roster rn

But give it 7000 bite force and 13k hp

totally balanced

[wide tulip]

I see these guys crying because they cant 1shot a 100% carno (if you can pick it up you can drag it to the bottow btw) and i'm just flabbergasted

[sinful cove]

people want deino to be water rex or somethin

[modest carbon]

I like it as an ambush predator with a low but still pretty powerful biteforce

[sinful cove]

probably majorly the people who mained rex in legacy used to 1-2shotting everything below apex tier

and facetanking other apexes

[modest carbon]

it keeps deino restricted to water where it belongs

[sinful cove]

yeah its bite aint supposed to be its killing move lol

it's supposed to marinate its victims in that delicious river gunk water

[modest carbon]

as the roster increases I could see its biteforce getting increased slightly as competition is added but rn people are complaining it cant do crap to stego

which like

come on

[sinful cove]

i get the frustration of not oneshotting a utah especially a not fully grown utah, but carno shouldnt just asplode when you bite it

[wide tulip]

i think it's already crazy they can drag a carno

but to KILL it?

[modest carbon]

Right?

[sinful cove]

i mean crocs are pretty strong so it makes sense it can drag a carno, but people wanting it to just bite the poor bastards in half are kinda expecting too much

[alpine plover]

Deino is a strong boy thats true but

[sinful cove]

at the moment there's a huge stretch of river where you can drink with basically no worries of deino lunge too

[alpine plover]

It shouldn't be like the top apex 100% killer pro dono

Dino*

[lament cloak]

alot of people are frustrated that deino gets absolutly bodied by stego, but thats by design. they made stego super strong against deino because that was the only thing that they anticpated was going to keep deinos in the water. no way they are going to keep it so deino gets that destroyed by stego, but people have to realize that the devs knew 50% of people were going to play deino, and that they needed something to keep them in the water

[sinful cove]

it isn't, even with the grab it misses like half the time from what i've seen

stego should stamp deino on land, not to the extent that it is currently obviously but yeah

[alpine plover]

Yeah its hitbox is a bit funky

From experience

[wide tulip]

I mean, a 100% stego can beat a 100% deino, no big deal

I dont mean to blow everyones minds here, but maybe you just dont fight a 100% stego and idk RUN lol

into the water? or, away, because you're FASTER lol

[lament cloak]

[modest carbon]

thats too much truth for a deino players brain, they aren't ready

[lament cloak]

deino players? pfft. these are rex mains

[alpine plover]

deino bigger than stego... so deino 1 shot stego! - a deino player, probably

[modest carbon]

hopefully the devs just ignore all the buff deino nerf steggie complaining and just continue on with their actually good ideas/plans

[wide tulip]

ya i think it's in a good spot

[sinful cove]

Hopefully it doesn’t end up like legacy trike where they listen to the whiners and turn stego into total fodder

[modest carbon]

That would suck

[sinful cove]

It isnt even a steg problem since utahs and carnos are also shitstomping deinos left and right

[modest carbon]

Im glad they stuck with stego first and not something fat like trike

If a deino dies to a steggie unless they are caught off guard on that shallow area its really the deinos fault

[sinful cove]

Deino is bad on land, sure, he should be. The only problem is he should be better in water than currently

[modest carbon]

Make water lunge better = yay

[sinful cove]

People complaining that a stego whipped their ass into the shadow realm on a bank should step back and think for a sec why that happened

[wide tulip]

it's already crazy good in the water

it can oneshot a 100% deino with a grab and drag

I mean carno

[modest carbon]

Thats dam impressive

[sinful cove]

It should be able to grab people while swimming and deal fracture when that comes imo, and swimming terrestrials should have their weight values lowered

But thats basically all

[wide tulip]

ANY other carnivore loses and cant drink if a 100% deino is there

[modest carbon]

the only real thing that needs slight adjusting is hitboxes sometimes but theres no gamebreaking issue otherwise

[nocturne wolf]

I dunno, something needs adjusting with carnos. I don't think they should be able to kill 3x60%+ Deinos, in the water.

[sinful cove]

If deino was better in the water it wouldnt happen

Though honestly, carno is supposed to hunt small game so a minor hp nerf when more small stuff comes could help

[nocturne wolf]

But I think it might have been more to do with the sheer bleed they were dealing, and having to stay under the water and still to keep it from killing you. Only now you've got an oxygen problem, but as soon as you surface, the carno is on you again.

[wide tulip]

ummm, why not? just go in the water and hide

you're not a apex at 60

[nocturne wolf]

See what I just said

[modest carbon]

that is very true, the majority of deinos fat doesnt come until 80 ish

an adult carno should be able to hack away at sub deinos

not like they can outswim you

[wide tulip]

you're an ambush dino

if you're seen you're not ambushing

[nocturne wolf]

Yeah, unfortunately we were wedged into a small river, there was only so far we could go, and if we got on land, we're done for.

I just object to the fact that they're still able to kill Deino in water.

[wide tulip]

it takes 20 or 30 bites for a 100% carno to get a deino

it takes 2 good ones to kill a carno

[nocturne wolf]

It most certainly doesn't.

[wide tulip]

you sure?

[nocturne wolf]

For 100% maybe, but we weren't.

[modest carbon]

Im currently watching a juvi deino get stuck in a hole and its fantastic

[wide tulip]

listen i dont know what to tell you

[nocturne wolf]

That adult carno had me with 5-10 bites, and I was somewhere in the 60-75% range

[wide tulip]

you're a 60%, you're prey to a 100%

that's fair

hide, it's how the game works

[nocturne wolf]

Questionable if you ask me, our deinos were not only bigger and heavier, but had a huge bite force. Carno's got it's hatchet bite, sure. Lots of bleed, but it shouldn't win in a standing bite-off.

[wide tulip]

biteforce isnt everything dude lmao

you hurt more for sure

but you're not mobile

[nocturne wolf]

When biteforces can crush your bones, it kind of is?

You're putting a relatively lightweight, fast predator against a big, heavy crocodillian.

[limber elbow]

bite force in this game isnt meant to be accurate

[nocturne wolf]

No, but it is a question of balance.

[wide tulip]

you're so wrong i'm not even sure what to argue

[nocturne wolf]

Carnotaurus is a pursuit predator, for small game. It should not be able to wade into rivers and kill sub adult deinos.

And most certainly shouldn't be able to survive being bitten by three of them.

[modest carbon]

ok but in adult carno should be able to yeet sub deinos

it is a small game hunter, and sub deino can be considered small

[nocturne wolf]

Our sub deinos were literally bigger than this carnotaur

[wide tulip]

at 60% whats your weight

[limber elbow]

also where were you biting it

[nocturne wolf]

I dunno, my deino is dead so I can't check.

Everywhere, face, body, tail, I facetanked it for a good few moments

[wide tulip]

I mean, you got outplayed plain and simple

[nocturne wolf]

Not really

[wide tulip]

you can hide and ambush but if he's biting you it kinda seems like you werent hiding

[nocturne wolf]

Can't hide if you have no oxygen.

[limber elbow]

tail bites pretty much do nothing btw

[nocturne wolf]

Anyway, talking in circles. My ONLY point is that carno shouldn't be hunting deinos in Deino's element. It's silly.

[wide tulip]

so a carno is so fast you cant move away and get a quick breath?

[nocturne wolf]

Literally yes.

[wide tulip]

mmmmmhmmm

so he's on one side of the bank

you're in a deep river

and he can be on both sides before you can breathe

[nocturne wolf]

It's not a wide river, he made it across easily.

In fact it was the river just after the "deino juvi pond" or whatever people call it now, just before the waterfall

Essentially we were trapped, however which way it went. We couldn't fight, we couldn't hide and we couldn't run. And for three deinos and one adult carno, that's ridiculous.

[wide tulip]

listen man, you're going to keep saying you played it perfectly

[nocturne wolf]

As I said, don't agree with me. Do agree, it's my personal opinion and I can say it; and it's only that carno shouldn't be able to hunt deinos so easily in the water, however which way.

[wide tulip]

i'm going to keep poking holes in your logic

this aint workin

[nocturne wolf]

I definitely didn't play it perfectly and never said I did

You're completely missing my point

[wide tulip]

your point is that a 100% carno shouldnt be able to bully 3 60% deinos

[nocturne wolf]

Bully? Definitely. Outright chase them around in the water and kill them? No.

IN the water, swimming.

I've already mentioned that Aroyef, it's kinda like talking to a brick wall with this guy

[wide tulip]

so you guys would make it so a 60% deino is stronger than a 100% carno

anyone that goes to the river is just dead

[nocturne wolf]

..still completely missing what I'm saying to you.

IN WATER, yes.

[wide tulip]

Carnos cant dive

they're slow swimmers

[nocturne wolf]

They aren't if they get a running start

Deino has to surface for water, for an extended period of time to actually get any sort of meaningful oxygen. In that time, was enough for that carno to literally run us through by sprinting into the water, biting us multiple times and killing us to boot.

[wide tulip]

and instead of swimming away, or running you stayed in the same spot

got eaten

[modest carbon]

If/when deino gets water lunge carnos wont be a problem

[wide tulip]

and said this aint fair

[nocturne wolf]

Chase, you really are like a brick wall

I told you the predicament. We were screwed however which way

[wide tulip]

i play a ton of carno dude the situation you're describing to me doesnt exist

[nocturne wolf]

But we shouldn't have been so easily picked off in water.

[wide tulip]

you're in too shallow of water

[nocturne wolf]

And how do you suggest getting out of said shallow water?

Assumedly, moving to the next river

However we can't outrun the carno, it'll just bite us and we'll die

We can stay in the river, but we'll suffocate because we can't surface, because the carno is literally sat there, camping the surface. When that should absolutely not be happening, it's silly.

Agreed Aroyef

[modest carbon]

Sub deino shouldn't stand much of a chance against carno though

[wide tulip]

size and biteforce arent everything dude

[nocturne wolf]

that statement hurts me.

[wide tulip]

you want to play a set of jaws

that cant move

and oneshot everything

so you dont have to worry about getting outplayed

[nocturne wolf]

It's not outplaying when the carno can stand there, not move, and tank over 25 bites from three different sub adult deinos.

[modest carbon]

you shouldnt be biting something its clear youll lose to

[wide tulip]

it's a survival game

[nocturne wolf]

There was no other choice

[wide tulip]

if you casnt win you run

[nocturne wolf]

I've mentioned the scenario multiple times now, but-

I give up

doesn't it?

Carno runs as fast as deino sprints in water. It keeps up just fine.

On land? Pointless.

I may as well have just rolled over and gave myself up according to your logic.

[wide tulip]

alright, since you're complaining about this i know you havent thought about it

[nocturne wolf]

So much for survival, there was no survival.

[wide tulip]

what if, you go underwater the opposite way of the carno? if he bit you you're fucked sorry bud

there are 3 of you

[nocturne wolf]

Tried that, couldn't go far enough. They caught up just fine

[wide tulip]

either way, keep playing deino, i get a good laugh at murdering 100%ers because yall brain dead

[nocturne wolf]

because being trapped = braindead, yes, absolutely.

Anyway, point being.. Carno is able to kill deinos in water and chase them around in such. It needs tweaking, but neither need a buff or debuff necessarily, just perhaps a reworking of how they interact with water.

I think deinos are quite strong, monsterous even to small things. But they shouldn't be able to be "outplayed" in their own element, that's all I find silly. Though Chase wants to call me braindead for thinking a land animal shouldn't be able to beat a semi-aquatic animal at its own game.

Anyhoo, I'm out. My feedback was given, that's all I came for.

[wide tulip]

the feedback channels are filled with kids wanting an underwater untouchable juggernaught that kills everything

I have to take TWO bites out of a utah?

I have to drag a 100% carno to the bottom? and NOT fight him on land?

[modest carbon]

I cant yeet adult stegos as they pitchfork the water?

[nocturne wolf]

It most certainly shouldn't fight on land. It's too cumbersome

[cedar shore]

Sub deino and carno takes same time to grow. Not sure why you are conplaining that a carno can kill it. Allway stay close to water as a deino, even as adult

If you run into water the carno cant do shit

eh, its close to the same growth and deino reaaly isnt made for fighting on land unlike what many think.

[spare badger]

I think that because it's rex sized ppl think it should play like a rex which it shouldnt

[wide tulip]

Irl crocs lose to lions dog

If they ambush them they get them

Okay

[spare badger]

True

It takes the entire lion pride to scare away 1 Croc from food

Yes

[wide tulip]

Dinos can grab any other carnivore and kill them. Yet here you are saying that’s not enough. You’re not helpless you’re all just incredibly bad.

As a 100% carno I have to run from big Dienos and I can’t drink around them or they will grab me and drown me.

Y’all are just so bad you walk on the land and die time and time again. Or you hang out in the shallows where you can’t run, or you fight stegos

[modest carbon]

theres lots of cannibalism so its not always enjoyable

[wide tulip]

That sucks, but everyone is playing dieno so the rivers and swamps are full

[modest carbon]

true true

[wide tulip]

So you run into more assholes

[sturdy mirage]

There was a lot posted since I gave my feedback tonight, I mainly read that it was supposedly my fault. By exploring I meant to say what a deino is capable off, that’s also what we are testing after all. My initial impression is that you can’t really kill a stego at all as the only „apex“ Predator Ingame Right now. And like I originally stated, I was in a pond, not in the open field. But even then, stego just strikes you 5 times rapidly and you’re done for anyways.

[modest carbon]

If anything stego could get their their attack slowed when swinging into deep water, similar to the slowed movement when you run or trot through water

[fallow wagon]

honestly

I think the best solution for Deino is just more and larger bodies of open water

deeper wider rivers

you only get these issues in the regular narrow or shallower rivers

coz idfk what you could do to keep a Stego as too much for a Deino without allowing Stego to just hunt Deinos down

[alpine sleet]

@alpine plover No, because there is still a reason to canibalize

canibalizm is not healthy for the game

[modest carbon]

Cannibalism is fine for deinos

[fallow wagon]

they plan so that only stuff like Cerato will be able to cannibalize in the future and will add some sorta debuff

[winged moth]

you'd probs find more cannibal deinos are the ones spawning in as stegos also and killing everyone in sight

[modest carbon]

There's times where a pair of big deinos come in and haul anything smaller than them to the underworld

[winged moth]

https://tenor.com/view/yugioh-anime-omg-wtf-cant-unsee-gif-5159766

[modest carbon]

Sad, spooky times

[winged moth]

reminds me when I out maneuvered a big croc in swamp using the logs. XD he couldnt get me ahaha

he was killing all the new spawns around

[modest carbon]

I like to sit on the wall with my utah at that pocket waterfall and watch all the cannibalism

A lot of the times it's either ruthless killing or juvis getting stuck in the rocks

[fallow wagon]

there are some logs in the southernmost swamp small enough for juvies to hide in

but they gotta come up for air eventually so :p

[winged moth]

Oh I ran the hell away when he tried getting into the log, but I survived till adulthood cause I happened to be growing in said log before he came along

[minor phoenix]

Stegs stink pretty hard at defending others

[alpine sleet]

[modest carbon]

[alpine sleet]

it's such a disgusting playstyle honestly

[modest carbon]

I dont like cannibalism if I'm being cannibalized, but I do like watching other people get cannibalized by meanies

[alpine sleet]

can we just earn food by killing something else than just kill a group member

oh

okeh

[modest carbon]

everyone chilling until random pair of big bois come and remove competition

[alpine sleet]

yee

[winged moth]

dietry system should help the anti cannibalism

[alpine sleet]

this one guy killed me when i was getting fud for my group

[alpine sleet]

yes

[modest carbon]

sad

[alpine sleet]

[slim dragon]

Don't worry deinos won't get any penalties for cannibalism

[alpine sleet]

** W W W W W H H H H H H H H Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y Y **

[winged moth]

I dont think crocs are usually cannibals tbh

[alpine sleet]

https://tenor.com/view/no-noo-nooo-noooo-nooooo-gif-5463928

[slim dragon]

Crocs are usually cannibals

[modest carbon]

Crocs are 100% cannibals

[alpine sleet]

the dieno players were prob giga players

and rex

[earnest robin]

Yeah surviving on deino to full adult is tough right now. But I am guilty of cannibalism in legacy 👀 I do hope to see some changes to help juvi deino out just a little bit in terms of playability, but of course it’s also about the player smarts as well

[winged moth]

ah nvm I am wrong, they are huge cannibals XD

[alpine sleet]

in the future when u eat ur own species (apart from cerato) u wil prob vomit and have slower healing for some time

and maybe slower speed

[slim dragon]

Maybe you'll even turn white at some point, which, I admit, would be neat

[alpine sleet]

cerato should be able to canibalize

[slim dragon]

It will be

[alpine sleet]

like in the concept

https://trello.com/c/vKnv40MV/28-ceratosaurus-playable

Trello

Ceratosaurus (Playable)

A stout carnivore, easily recognized by it's distinct nasal horns and it's astonishingly robust digestive system that allows it to feed upon the most putrid of carcasses without incurring any negative side effects.

Labels

Not Started, Playable, Carnivore

[earnest robin]

Is the dev team really going to or thinking about, putting something in game to punish cannibalism?

[alpine sleet]

yes

punch had mentioned it

and i think filipe

[steel hatch]

If I have to kill and eat a small deino to not die of starvation, I'll do it. Nothing disgusting about it. I'm not going to lose my 5 hours deino so that a 10 min one can live.@alpine sleet

[alpine sleet]

yes a baba is expendabal i guess

expendable

[steel hatch]

you have to distinguish between the cannibals that do it for fun and the ones that do it to survive

[alpine sleet]

but when ur adult whos killing othere adults...

i guess

wait

what there could be a system where depending on how much u will eat u will get debufs

[earnest robin]

Ahh I see. I do agree about the whole “if I’m starving I’ll cannibalize” because I definitely do that now in legacy. But that would be very interesting to see how that would play out should it be incorporated.

[alpine sleet]

so if u kill baba at like 2% u will not get debufs

[steel hatch]

kill or eat?

[alpine sleet]

or maybe u will get no hunger?

eat sorry

[steel hatch]

putting a debuff on cannibals is dumb anyway. If you are a cannibal to survive, you should not be punished for it. And if you do it for fun, then you will still kill your own, but not eat them

[slim dragon]

Putting debuffs forces trolls to hunt something else rather than only feeding on their own species

[steel hatch]

if a troll wanna kill you, he will

just not eat you

[slim dragon]

But they need to eat anyway

[alpine sleet]

but why can't u actually earn ur fud by exploring the map looking for fud, instead of eating ur group members

[steel hatch]

so? they will feed on other things AND still kill you

[slim dragon]

But it'll be harder for them since they also have to kill other things

[alpine sleet]

and there are fish on the map too

this isn't just dieno

[steel hatch]

fishes are not always present and not everywhere

[slim dragon]

And cannibalizing means you have to kill something which is probably as strong as you (unless it's a juvie) which will leave you wounded

[alpine sleet]

yes i know but looking can help

[slim dragon]

Not anything can catch fishes

[alpine sleet]

canibalizm is a VERY unhealthy playstyle

[steel hatch]

I agree, but if you have to do it?

[alpine sleet]

dryo ai

[wide tulip]

Dryo ai is not reliable

at ALL

[slim dragon]

Not anything (or anyone) can catch dryo AI either

[alpine sleet]

well, maybe can get fud from the body but u will have slower healing or more water drain

just to make someone think twice before killing there own specias

[wide tulip]

you're an obvious deino main if you say OH JUST GO GET A DRYO

[steel hatch]

Well, I'll rather take the debuff than dying of starvation. So, the killing would still happens

[alpine sleet]

yes

that could work

[slim dragon]

Yes, but you'll look for actual prey before killing your own species if there's a debuff

There's always some people that will be able to troll no matter what you do, unless you outright remove fighting from the game

[steel hatch]

If you're starving and dying from it? I don't think I will look for other things if the first thing I come across is a member of my own specie

[alpine sleet]

i would kill my own specias if i was adult and starving, not when im at 20-30% hunger

like most players who are scared to starve

when they arn't starving

[steel hatch]

No need to remove fighting. Just remove damage from same species

[alpine sleet]

hmmmmmm

[slim dragon]

Then packs get op

[alpine sleet]

yee

it allows people to use hitboxes to block someone in

[slim dragon]

People were already mad about 10% group damage reduction, how do you think they will react if you completely remove damage from same species ?

[alpine sleet]

a circle

[slim dragon]

Plus then you'll die from starvation instead of having the opportunity to eat one of your own species if you have no choice

[alpine sleet]

i think that is fair

[steel hatch]

I'm not saying it should be added btw. I honestly think that being a cannibal is not the real issue here, but as always, KoSing is

[earnest robin]

Yeah I think that may ultimately be the goal. Which I can’t say I’m upset about. Perhaps it’ll encourage a little bit more of “if you’re about to take hunger damage and have no choice, your same species will feed you but you’ll be punished by xyz” or something like that. So you still live for just a little bit longer. I’d like to think that maybe hunting something else will really fill up your hunger more perhaps?

[slim dragon]

Kosing can't really be helped

[steel hatch]

I agree

[slim dragon]

People do it in every single game that has unrestricted pvp

[alpine sleet]

i think that the creatures that should be allowed to canibalize should be.

1. CERATO

2.TROODON

PTERANODON

that's what I think

[slim dragon]

And do you imagine having to challenge everyone to a duel if you want to eat in a survival game ?

[alpine sleet]

maybe all scavengers could canibalize

[steel hatch]

Again, KoSing is considered an issue for some people, but not in my book.

[slim dragon]

Disagree
Cerato, Deino, maybe Carno

Why would troodon, a typical pack hunter, cannibalize ?

[wide tulip]

I think it would work out if you KILL them, you gain hunger. The corpse is worth the same. That way if you're just killing for sport now you have to eat them. If you're at 0 when you do it it's not as big of a deal

[slim dragon]

Same goes for pteranodon, ptera players have literally no reason to go cannibalistic

[alpine sleet]

dieno isn't a scavenger, but troodon and ptera are

[slim dragon]

Scavenger doesn't mean cannibal

[alpine sleet]

ptera is known to be a scavenger

[steel hatch]

More like, if you're at 0% food, you gain 5% max if you eat your own specie. If you're not at 0%, you gain nothing

[alpine sleet]

i mean scavengers have better stomachs then many of the other roster

[slim dragon]

But a better stomach doens't necessarily means that you can eat your own species

[alpine sleet]

allowing them to feed on carcases of their own specias

[slim dragon]

You need specific adaptations for that

[golden coral]

@slim dragon What's the issue of the day here? :p

[slim dragon]

cannibalism

[limber elbow]

Why

[steel hatch]

I would say, victims of cannibalising not understanding that they do it to survive @golden coral

[slim dragon]

The problem of eating your own species is not the quality of food, but that's kinda like inbreeding
You get nothing more to your body (or your offspring) than what you already have

[limber elbow]

Not true tho

[alpine sleet]

maybe u could kill ur own species but gain much less food

[slim dragon]

wdym not true ?

[steel hatch]

cannibalising is only a health issue for mammals tbh, but it's a game

[limber elbow]

Incest lacks genetic diversity and causes health problems  cannibalism still supplies protein and energy needed to live what’s the difference from a carno eating a Utah compared to another carno

[alpine sleet]

cannibals shouldn't be rewarded with food

[golden coral]

I mean, you can deter someone from eating their own kind, with diets and all. But that won't stop someone from killing you anyway. Might mitigate it a little, but I don't think it's going to do that much of a difference. And eating your own kind makes sense if that's 90% of what is around in the first place.

[limber elbow]

Fr u think you won’t get kos for shit and giggles

It’s the isle

[alpine sleet]

u should get debuffs for eating

[steel hatch]

you should not

[slim dragon]

I'm not a genetician so I don't know, but it has something to do with the fact that what you're eating literally has the same genes as you

[alpine sleet]

it isn't healthy for most species

[limber elbow]

Eating the same genes means nothing

[alpine sleet]

plus ur eating dieno organs

[slim dragon]

If it meant nothing, humans wouldn't get sick by cannibalizing

[golden coral]

I guess it'll be less debuffs and more lack of buff. So sure, you can grow on your own kind, and keep eating them, but you'll grow slower and be weaker than someone who eats their proper food.

[alpine sleet]

yeess

[steel hatch]

that's the same tho. Death by starvation or killing your own and survive? option 2

[alpine sleet]

depends

I don't want to wipe 5 hours off some ones growth, i would rather kill a fresh spawn

[limber elbow]

You comparing a species that holds ethics and is intellectual to dinos that have survival instincts, you see how that’s not accurate right ?

[slim dragon]

Ethics don't cause diseases

[limber elbow]

So how come modern animals practice eating one another

??

[slim dragon]

Depends what animal it is, and I'm pretty sure most of them would become sick if they ate too much of their own species

[alpine sleet]

yes

[steel hatch]

only mammals tbh

check Prion on wikipedia

[slim dragon]

I'm pretty sure problems have been reported about chickens getting weird diseases because they were fed with too much food made of chicken meat

[alpine sleet]

not only mammels

[limber elbow]

Humans only get sick from eating the brain of other humans btw

[alpine sleet]

wiki pedia is not reliant

[earnest robin]

Hmm, I think that debate is in a sense more specific to the species. Like hypothetically if modern wolves or lions killed one another you don’t normally see them eat said body afterwards. Other critters normally do. BUT if they’re starving and that body is considered food, I’m sure they’d preferably eat it.

[limber elbow]

Other then that it’s just like any other meat

[steel hatch]

it's realiable when the sources are there

[alpine sleet]

not really

not saying ur wrong, but wiki pedia has a bad track record

of false info

[steel hatch]

I'm not saying it's perfect

[slim dragon]

If a wolf eeats another one once, I'm pretty sure it will be fine. Things will become worse if it reiterates.

[alpine sleet]

is even possible to ask a dev about canibalizm

??

[slim dragon]

You may look for punchpacket if he's in isle-discussion

[earnest robin]

Yup yup. But then there’s hyenas that will literally eat anything. So who knows, maybe it’ll be implemented in a similar fashion 🤔

[alpine sleet]

gtg

and yes i do stand by that there should be debuffs for EATING ur own specias

[slim dragon]

Well bye then, I'm switching to general feedback discussion since people are starting to talk about cannibalism too there

[alpine sleet]

sorry i just like this emoji

[wide tulip]

or, you could just yknow

play on a server that's moderated

[crystal wharf]

there will be some for some species, others, like ceratosaurus, will be able to cannibalize with zero debuffs, wouldnt surprise me if deino also gets no debuffs from eating its own

[alpine sleet]

yes

[slim dragon]

@alpine sleet I should tell you it's wrong to use that channel fro trolling, but I'm too tired to do it rn
So enjoy your upvote

[alpine sleet]

ik

im a mad lad

well there goes the troll post R.I.P.

[slim dragon]

Now you can enjoy your six hours of slowmode.

[sinful cove]

reducing herbi damage each time they kill something screws them against packs

stego is already vulnerable to utah packs

at the moment, deino is being harassed because of multiple reasons
-not enough deep water sources allows them to be camped easy
-stegos can swim across rivers and survive while deinos are attacking them
-stegos can't be dragged in the water due to their weight

these can be fixed without screwing stego more against packs of smaller predators (or packs in general) then it already is

deinosuchus should also be able to deal fracures when this mechanic is added, making stegos not want to tank the hits just to grief landbound deinos

[wide tulip]

you should have to take an iq test before you post in balance feedback

wait, i'm going to suggest that holdon

no one steal that

[sinful cove]

lmao

thas so mean

[stark knoll]

no troll suggestions and no flamebaiting

[wide tulip]

I mean, we wouldnt hear anymore BUFF DEINO

win win

[sinful cove]

dont think they meant any harm they were just making a suggestion, even if it was a bad solution

[wide tulip]

these dudes making some of these suggestions have to be children

[sinful cove]

the buff deino nerf stego suggestions though are pretty much spam at this point

[wide tulip]

MAKE MY SUPER MEGA DINOSAUR THE GIGGA CHAD N MAKE ALL THE ONES THAT CAN HURT IT DIE N STUFF

[modest carbon]

op sheesh whats goin on here

[lament cloak]

honestly the only thing that needs to be changed is that stegos should be able to get picked up while in deep enough water or swiming, this would stop stego from camping deinos. oh and deino should be able to pick things up while swimming

[wide tulip]

nah dude

stegos are slow

deinos arent starving

go somewhere else

[sinful cove]

people think just because deino has a high biteforce irl that it should pop the whole roster like a watermelon

[wide tulip]

not everything is your prey stop being a tard

[sinful cove]

any terrestrial animal should have their weight values reduced in while swimming so deino can drag them in water

but deino deserves to get clapped on land

[wide tulip]

if only bite-force and IQ of players had a correlation I wouldnt have to hear all this stuff

[sinful cove]

people complaining that some stego clapped their ass on land need to stop and think for a second what THEY were doing wrong

[modest carbon]

Even on shore thats still on land

[sinful cove]

it's common knowledge at this point that deino cant drag stego with its lunge so people still trying it and crying that they got wrecked are invalid

its kinda dumb though that steg just sticks its ass in water and swings past his tail hitbox to grief deinos who are just there but a lot of these cases sound like idiots trying to brawl with stegos and getting curb stomped so they come to isle feedback to cry about how herbivores should just die and their water rex should have 20000000 bite force

[stark knoll]

a lot of the legitimate concerns (generally hitbox based) get drowned out by, or worse lumped together with, all the suggestions for "deino bite is one million megatons irl plz make stegos explode"

[sinful cove]

there are genuine problems getting drowned out by children whinging about "stego too stronk" "give deino rex bite force" yes

[frosty heron]

What's the point on making Deino give a fight a Stego on land when Utah and Carnos pack are killing Stegos in the current build

[stark knoll]

[sinful cove]

yeah a lot of feedback totally disregards the fact that carnos and utahs also demolish deinos on land, people just want stego turned into complete fodder

[stark knoll]

thats the whole point of stego tbh; good against big slow enemies, bad against small fast ones

[wide tulip]

1000000000000x this. yall get so mad but you just played it badly.

[lament cloak]

@proud swan wow, those deinos had no chance to survive. they were so blocked in, its not like they could just swim down the river under the solid brown water that makes you practically invisible when not at the surface. wow how terrible

[frosty heron]

And anyways Deino it's an aquatic creature and should be strong on its environment only, if you want a strong land Apex just wait for Tyrannosaurus and Giga to come, even Acro

[sinful cove]

deino just needs more water sources, deeper ones. fish in swamps so deino can grow there and not just be stuck in rivers. swimming grab, fracture.
bam, now deino is better and stego isn't nerfed when it's currently already dying to single carnos and utahs

also if stego really is swinging a few meters past his tail into water that should be fixed but that's obvious

[candid basalt]

its the shallow river. they cant swim

[lament cloak]

yup, the shallow river, its not like that stego is waist deep must be shallow, and if deinos are caught out in shallow water its their fault

[candid basalt]

second half makes no sense. also i didnt even see the stego cause the picture is dark as shit so sorry 😭 but i dont see how they’re necessarily at fault for that

nobody is really “at fault”

shit happens

[lament cloak]

its the deinos fault for getting caught in shallow water, if you want to survive then don't go into the shallow water where you cant swim

[candid basalt]

half the map is blocked off if you dont go down there. maybe they just wanted to explore. not their fault, just how the game works. unlucky

[sinful cove]

if they wanted to explore they should go ptera or utah. the stegos were being dickheads yeah but can't really blame them, nothing else to do right now

kos is the game right now

[novel tulip]

Isn't there another river right near there you can swim down

Like it goes in a fork

[misty rock]

stegos camping in the river breaks the immersion.

[modest carbon]

[sinful cove]

Immersion in the buggy test build

[wide tulip]

I thought crocodile tears are supposed to be ironic, but here we are

[misty rock]

I am not saying it needs to change rn but it would be good to change this situation for more immersive gameplay in the further development

[sinful cove]

You arent gonna stop people from being toxic and camping closed biomes, if you nerf one dino people are mass KOSing with the griefers will just move on to another

It's also pretty ‘immersion breaking’ that juvie utahs are kicking deino ass but nobody talkin bout that

[misty rock]

Juvie utahs were also big problem for adult stegos as far as i remember. I do not know if they fixed that

[wide tulip]

I think the real problem is that you misplay and you come here to complain that something is imbalanced. When all you did was afk for 5 hours and then die to a stego it's not imballance, it's because you dont know how to play.

[sinful cove]

Juvie utah is the apex predator rn lmao

Killing deinos and stegos, juking carnos

[wide tulip]

idk as a carno I always grab them ez pz

unless there is a bunch then i run, because i understand i cant win every fight

[misty rock]

I mean dying to a stego as a deino is hard to do thing but my point was not about the competition between them

[sinful cove]

I wonder how bad utah is gonna be when it can run up some trees and sit out of reach like docktahs

[frosty heron]

The new map doesn't have the same camping rocks from Update 2, at least I didn't found any at the moment, all rocks I've seen are reachable by other playables

[fallow wagon]

can Utah pounce juvie Deinos? If not I think I should have been able to, my Utah kept phasing thru this juvie I just tried to hunt

[dim radish]

To be honest, I don't get the wish to 'nerf stego' at all.
Why would the devs make stego weaker just to buff them later on to not be such food for apexes like rex or giga.

[sinful cove]

Stego also already gets rekt by utah pairs/packs and even practiced solo carnos and utahs, it doesnt need a nerf because of one matchup which is totally fixable without altering the direct stats of either party

[dim radish]

As it was said before, Deino just needs more lakes, deeper pockets and stuff. Because it should get the opportunity to avoid stuff

[cedar shore]

@turbid depot You know the deino has a lunge though right?

[nocturne zenith]

Cant facetank stego as deino please give deino 400000 Newton bite force

[spare badger]

Non

[wheat field]

Mocking pro deino buffers solves nothing

[spare badger]

Deinos going to get a tug of war mechanic as well right?

[wheat field]

later on yes, but they said it is gonna be awhile considering it is a fairly difficult mechanic

[spare badger]

And an arial lunge to get pteras?

[wheat field]

the vertical lunge is confirmed for deino in later updates

[misty rock]

Breaking bones to slow down others would be good when fractures released

[wheat field]

Why do people feel this is a bad idea, it is realistic, if you think a crocodile is gonna sit on his ass and bite you when he can drag you to the depths you are sorely mistaken

[misty rock]

If deino is not gonna get increased bite force at least he should be able to injure small dinos such as utah

[wheat field]

Deino should have a "form" of fracture but honestly we gotta wait till we see how it is gonna work before we judge

[turbid depot]

Yes. But that is while on the ground. My point is if you watch crocs in the wild they bite prey in open water and pull under. It isn't done on land as much as it is in water. So I don't think it's unreasonable to have that feature.

[nocturne zenith]

Never said im trying to solve anything

and what is there to solve?

[wheat field]

Then get out of the balance channel?

[nocturne zenith]

Lmfao ur making it too obivious Croc fan

Got killed by a stego?

[wheat field]

Im floridian i just like alligators in general

Nah haven’t died to stego

Not brain dead like the rest

[nocturne zenith]

i like crocs too,but dont think they should get a bite force greater than rex

[wheat field]

Never said they should either

[nocturne zenith]

Then why are you defending them

[wheat field]

Cause it needs a buff, not 1000000 biteforce but enough

Maybe 600 would be a sweet spot

[slim dragon]

They should get a higher biteforce than rex
But not higher bite damage

[nocturne zenith]

i think they should 1 shot Utah,but thats about it

They dont need anymore strength

[wheat field]

Heres the thing with the isle we measure the dmg in N right?

Deino has the highest biteforce of any dino that has been in the isle

However

It doesn’t have a bonecrushing bite like rex does

It grabs on and doesn’t let go

[slim dragon]

Yes I'm criticizing their damage measurement system

[wheat field]

That’s it

[wheat field]

The isle dmg system is just to basic for dinos like deino

[slim dragon]

It's both too basic, inaccurate and pretty much useless for a lot of dinos

[wheat field]

Doesn’t take into account other factors besides the newtons with is just turned to straight dmg

[nocturne zenith]

it needs to be basic,if biteforces were realistic the game would be 20 times harder to balance

[wheat field]

Because if deino had his bite force he would look at a rex and it would drop to the floor

[slim dragon]

It needs to be not calculated from biteforce

[wheat field]

Based on Isle Dmg standards anyway

Thing is deino has a strong bite for grapples not killing large animals

Directly anyway

That’s why in liking being able to drag animals who try to swim over the waters surface

Or the idea of it rather

[cedar shore]

It has teeth spessificly for grabbing onto animals. The higher bite force helps to hold an animal/dino in its jaws, not for doings lots of damage.

Crocodile teeth arent very sharp overall

Bite force isnt the only thing that should determine damage. damage should be shown om the UI as just «damage»

[vernal sentinel]

yet another feedback post about deino being weak, it does NOT have to be able to win with every dinosaur in the game and it is not even supposed to fight well on land

[misty rock]

yes but i think it needs to be more threatening in the water. even big dinos should not be able to stand next to water and bully them like most of the stegos do right now. people mostly complaining about it. no one wants to play deino on land and hunt everything on sight.

i do not have good suggestion how to fix that issue with the current mechanics however i hope with the fractures, things will change

[vernal sentinel]

Right^

[hallow rose]

my gator cannot 1 shot everything :(((((

[limber elbow]

My gator can’t face tank a stego but still I continue to lunge everyone I see and attempt to ass ride them then complain about it after I die 😓

[misty rock]

i do not see anyone who wants to one shot every other dino as a deino tho. i do not get this mockery thing

[wheat field]

That’s what im saying but people seems to only see one side of the story

[wide scaffold]

why when I try to log in to a server, my game does not log in and this message appears? (I've been trying to log in for seven hours and I can't, I saw a Brazilian streamer that I follow called yoda playing this game and wanted to play too) could someone help me?

[grand geyser]

you just have to be fast

it's because other players are joining right before you, so you have to refresh until you are lucky enough to get in.

[lament cloak]

this should be acomplished by nerfing utah health, its already tanking hits from stego too iirc

[misty rock]

how many tail attacks from head required to get utah as a stego? i think stegos were able to 1 shot utahs in update 2 version of evrima.

[limber elbow]

i think stegos one shot utah except on the tail

[wheat field]

^^^

They do

[spare badger]

I thought it's
1 headshot
2 body shots
7 tail shots

Im probably very wrong

[crystal wharf]

very

utah gets oneshot on the body and head

2 shot on tail base im pretty sure

[rich fractal]

why are people being weird about crocs having damage, people reacted for 3 crocs should run away from one stego even though they have a collective 18 tons of mass over it

[wheat field]

Ain’t it beautiful? Its hard being a deino lover rn

@stone flax stop making the same suggestion, we should wait to see other apexes bite force and base it on that for now 8k and 600N is a good suggestion

[stone flax]

no i refrased some stuff and posted it. im not gonna make it 10 times i just changed it up untill i was satisfied with it

13*

[wheat field]

We just gotta wait for the 1st apex to see how they weigh and how much biteforce they have then we base deino off that

[stone flax]

Elder would work but since elders will be weaker than thier normal counterpart after time that would be weird having a deino that much bigger and yet it will be weaker

[wheat field]

For now, biteforce does need an increase and 600 is a good placeholder for the time being

[strange quest]

i mean reptiles do grow forever so it wouldnt be too weird to have elder deinos be bigger

[gleaming topaz]

100N more won’t do squat all.. needs at least around 750-800n to have a decent chance, Ambush from what is situational and besides that you can’t drag a Adult Stego atm either so.. considering Stegos tail dmg is around 1.2k

[strange quest]

but not by double the size

[stone flax]

@strange quest was dondis ide from the start and i so looked forward for it but it was changed sadly.

[golden coral]

Fix hitboxes, then we can see about damage increase.

[stone flax]

@golden coral oh yeh hitboxes definetly needs fixing

[golden coral]

I still think that's the biggest issue, deino already fourshots a stego on the head, it seems more a matter of how easy it is to land those hits.

[strange quest]

This. I would've gotten so many as a deino if the hitbox wasn't wonky as heck. I can fly right through a baby utah or try biting a ptera seven times before I finally hit it, that's the biggest issue fighting with the deino has

[stone flax]

@pallid palm thing is why would it be op? literally just avoid water and your good. if your not trying to hunt or actively fight a deino as a carno or utah and why the fuck would you.

there is a huge stretch of shallow water so its easy to avoid em just drink there

[golden coral]

Same with the lunge for smaller stuff, seems more like there's issues with landing the lunge and all that, than actually killing stuff. If the hitbox worked properly, I suspect utahs would die a lot easier, even if you don't oneshot their heads right off, since they'll still be very weak after that one shot.

[stone flax]

but yeh hitbox is messy rn

[lament cloak]

the current roster? it would be op for any roster, especially if deinos can just pick things up that are half their weight. do you realize how stupid it would look to see a croc just yoink a stego

[golden coral]

I figure increasing hit damage, while adding a hundred or two is reasonable, is at a risk of "fixing" hitboxes by just giving more damage to allow for the one hit that lands to do stuff

[lament cloak]

not when everyone has to drink

[stone flax]

@lament cloak again. not really op you cant just look at stats and call it op at that size it cant hide everywhere just drink from shallow water its really easy really..

dude there is a huuge stretch of shallow water u can drink at

[strange quest]

drinking at shallow water is even more dangerous though because all the utahs and carnos are there

[slim dragon]

My concern about huge deino isn't that it could become op... But rather that it'd may be unviable

[lament cloak]

so you want everything to drink at the two areas of the map that are shallow...

[wide tulip]

Listen, i main deino. Nothing is OP it needs to be buffed. The other day i died, that's just not acceptable

[slim dragon]

A deino this size would need tremendous amounts of food, so be forced to ambush very large prey

[wide tulip]

I afk'ed 5 hours to grow a full deino, and some guy just killed me?

[stone flax]

@lament cloak dude there is plenty of places. a deino cant be everywhere

[slim dragon]

Current deino is so terrible on land that it can barely move to one water spot to another, if you slow it down even more it will be just impossible

[lament cloak]

have you seen how many deinos there are? isle players will not stop untill there is 1 deino for every other river

[slim dragon]

And increasing its size even more would make it harder ofr it to hide in water

[golden coral]

Not that there should be long stretches of "safe" water anyway really

[wide tulip]

Deinos are so vulnerable piggy. You dont understand. I cant just retreat under the water, it's against my man code.

[stone flax]

@lament cloak dude deinos eat eqchother aswell they cant even trust eachother so random deinos cant be that close. and really again if you find a deino as a pack on land even at that size it can be killed

[lament cloak]

yeah, and sarco got released a while ago in pot, everyone is still playing it. its an apex. a deino for every other river is generous

[stone flax]

@lament cloak thats a whole other game and sacro is weird its can gallop around so it sure as shit is not weak on land

[golden coral]

@stone flax I'm not sure deino needs to be bigger and stronger, what it needs is proper envrioment, fixes for issues, and an abiltiy to grab anything swimming, maybe with what some people have suggested, slowing the grabbed thing down (like how being in deep water slows your walk/run, (and that should really increase cost of attacks as well for that matter for any terrestial at least)), if not dragging it down. So if they grab you when you're far from shore, you'll run out of stam and possibly drown, whereas if they only catch you just when you're starting to swim, or are almost ashore, you might be fine.

[strange quest]

exactly

the deino just needs some adjustments and fixes, then it would already solve a lot of issues

[stone flax]

@pallid palm would like for elders but again elders will overtime be weaker than thier normal counterparts it would be weird seeing a 5 ton heavier deino be weaker than the smaller ones

[strange quest]

and after that it could be discussed if it needs to be buffed or debuffed

[lament cloak]

are you joking, you want a fucking deino to attack shant? im done here no need to argue with legacy rex mains

[stone flax]

@golden coral yeh it sure needs some fixing

i do not want a deino to attack shantu. rex spino shantu giga all those things are gonna be too heavy for even a 14 ton deino too grab so they will be safe from lunge

those dinos are classed as huge. meanwhile stego is just medium but that lil shit is wacking deinos around like nothing

@pallid palm yeh

[golden coral]

Stego medium? It's large, and like acro, up there with being on the apex or close list. As it should be, and might have to be, what with the other big things coming around.

[stone flax]

i dont want deino to be an unkillable powerhouse. what i suggested was make it the size and power it should be and nerf it on land more so its even more limited to water.

better in its own area and even more vurnable on land. but people just read the first 2 lines and go thats op

[golden coral]

If you buff deino to that size, you'll most likely have to buff stego too, or drastically lower it's growth time, if it's going to have a hard time vs the other big things.

[stone flax]

stego medium in my mind. its 4.8 tons i would say large is at 6+ tons

@golden coral i also said increase deino growth time to 8+ hours and keep it weaker untill it gets close to full size

[golden coral]

@stone flax Stego is 6T weight yes. It doesn't have the health to match, but that's somewhat reasonable, stego is not a tanky "apex". But it's defenitely up there in size and weight, and unless you make it run from stuff, it'll have to be buffed to fight them. And yeah, but even with 8 hours, vs 5 hours, for a twoshot, I don't know.

[stone flax]

@pallid palm dude its 4500kg last i checked?

[golden coral]

It got it's weight boosted, hopefully gets some health boosted to match as well, even if should still be on the frailer side for an apex/"pseudo" apex

[stone flax]

a deino attackign and getting wrecked by a shantu i have no problem with shantus are absolutely huge. twice the weight of our current deino but stegos are 2 tons under it

[golden coral]

Eh, current size deino could tackle swimming shant, and it probably should. Allow deino to latch on to a swimming shant and just make it harder to get back to shore. Even a rex or shant can drown.

[stone flax]

that is true but in deep water deino should have the advantage