#balance-feedback-discussion

1 messages · Page 232 of 1

civic moth
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point

slim dragon
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This is for gameplay reasons, not balance. If you are in a world when everything can kill you, then make it so you can at least defend yourself. Running gets boring.

civic moth
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You should have been more aware of your environment since you can flee.

slim dragon
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Every dino's damage is already way lower than it should be irl. Why lower it even more ?

civic moth
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Why do you need to defend yourself when you can flee?

Look at Para in 2018, able to flee and fight. Result : it tracked and ran down and killed Allosaurus, Ceratosaurus and Dilophosaurus.

slim dragon
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You need options

civic moth
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Do you call that balanced ?

stark knoll
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i wouldnt call anything in legacy balanced

slim dragon
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^
Legacy problem

civic moth
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It has been solved by nerfing Para damages and speed

toxic crypt
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A rabbit is still able to bite, despite primarily relying on its sprinting ability

slim dragon
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And I even said that little things being able to deal damage is not a balance problem

civic moth
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But then Para became kind of fooder.

stark knoll
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that means it wasnt solved

civic moth
civic moth
toxic crypt
slim dragon
toxic crypt
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Irl animals feel pain, they can be made to drop something if it hurts enough

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that is literally the honey badger's entire deal

slim dragon
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Rabbits have very nasty claws by the way

twilit marlin
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you see videos of bears running form cats

civic moth
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Ask that to Stoat

toxic crypt
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Honey badgers don't really kill lions, though

civic moth
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They do not

slim dragon
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It has teeth and claws. Dryo has a sharp beak and claws.

toxic crypt
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The lions back tf off because the badgers can turn around in their own skin and scratch the fuck out a sensitive location

civic moth
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Sharp beak? Able to kill a Utahraptor?

Claws?

twilit marlin
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wolverines, similar to badgers kill bears

civic moth
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Wolverines suck

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like

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really

twilit marlin
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they are terrifying and cute

toxic crypt
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"Able to kill utah" as if dryos can kill utahs in anything but the most extreme scenarios

civic moth
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4 Dryos

slim dragon
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Did I said it should be able to kill a utahraptor ? I'm just saying its damage has no reason to be lowered more

civic moth
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4 Dryos kill a Utah

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with ease

slim dragon
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4 dryos killing a single utah makes sense

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They're the same tier

civic moth
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You kidding me right ?

toxic crypt
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Dryo isn't that much smaller than utah though, 4 dryos winning makes sense

slim dragon
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Not at all. If dryo wasn't made for running, then it should take one to kill a utah. Since it's made for running, it takes 4. Seems fine to me.

twilit marlin
#

without pounce i like my chances against 4 dryos

toxic crypt
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And I am wondering where the 4 dryos statistic comes from. Is the utah not moving or reacting at all?

twilit marlin
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id just use alt attack

slim dragon
civic moth
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Dryo is faster now since last patch

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and more agile

toxic crypt
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you didn't answer my question

slim dragon
toxic crypt
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where the fuck is the 4 dryo statistic coming from?

civic moth
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It is

twilit marlin
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if they can drain the utahs stamina they have a very good chance

slim dragon
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Are you sure about that ? Because I haven't seen it anywhere

civic moth
twilit marlin
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id like to test it myself

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ill try and do some utah vs dryo testing when this qa branch goes public

toxic crypt
civic moth
toxic crypt
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It's sounding a lot like you just had dryos biting a utah in a circle

civic moth
toxic crypt
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Also, dryo is 120kg while utah is 500kg

civic moth
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It is just ridiculous and funny

toxic crypt
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they are indeed the same tier, the small tier

civic moth
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Where did you get 120kg ?

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Is it in game mass ?

twilit marlin
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its only two or three bites to kill a dryo

toxic crypt
civic moth
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Oh Nova

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yeah

twilit marlin
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you only need one bite to bleed him out of the fight

civic moth
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some of his are bad like Anky

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Shant

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Giga

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Dibble

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now Dryo

toxic crypt
twilit marlin
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yeah

toxic crypt
civic moth
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Do you know CCM V03 ?

toxic crypt
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He does full on actual research

stark knoll
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thats the biggest anky specimen right?

civic moth
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It is

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10 tons

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estimation

stark knoll
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imo thats way too big for the game

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itd be cool

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but

toxic crypt
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"estimation" is sus as fuck

stark knoll
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it is yea

civic moth
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Been caltulated by TA Holmes

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he's pretty serious

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I mean

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people are arguing for 14 tons Deino as it is the most possible estimation, bone by him.

toxic crypt
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I mean, I don't trust weight estimations as confident as that

civic moth
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also

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for size idea

toxic crypt
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Because just about every weight I've ever seen is a range that varies wildly

ember ivy
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dryo's bite is 75 newtons, utahs is 110. Dryo kills utahs which it shouldnt. At all

civic moth
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Thanks Indo

toxic crypt
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dryo can kill utah eventually, sure

ember ivy
toxic crypt
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If dryo does any damage at all it can kill utah

ember ivy
civic moth
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That's not an actual case.

We're talking about people fighting between each others.

toxic crypt
ember ivy
brittle herald
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With the current attack it has it shouldn't

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It's just a little tiny peck

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It needs to be nerfed

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Not like it needs to fight either now that it is faster then Utah

toxic crypt
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If you have a polar bear vs 5-6 eerily coordinated sheep, I'd bet on the sheep

brittle herald
#

Only thing that it should really fending off is smaller predators like Troodon

toxic crypt
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irl, of course, sheep aren't that coordinated

ember ivy
toxic crypt
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but swarms of dryos would be able to kill literally anything if the swarm is big enough

civic moth
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So would you tell me that Dryo taking down Stego in less than 10 minutes is alright ?

brittle herald
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That comparison holds no ground

civic moth
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^

ember ivy
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exactly narwhal

brittle herald
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The fact of the matter is that the attack should not be doing nearly as much damage as it currently is

twilit marlin
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no where near as efficiently as a swarm of utahs

brittle herald
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There's no need to start bringing in comparisons like that

toxic crypt
twilit marlin
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i seen an ai dryo kill a steggo

brittle herald
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Yes that is a problem

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How is it not a problem

twilit marlin
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it was the funniest thing i have ever seen in evrima

ember ivy
toxic crypt
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Then you're honestly goofy

civic moth
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It means that it is possible against 2 players fighting each others.

twilit marlin
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steggo was afk

toxic crypt
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if dryo does literally any damage at all, it will eventually be able to kill a stego

ember ivy
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so your pinning your argument on "get gud"

brittle herald
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The fact it has the capability to do that is insane

twilit marlin
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the problem there is teamwork not the fact the dryo is too strong

toxic crypt
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for the stego to sit there and let the dryo bite it for ten minutes straight

civic moth
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It means

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it

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can

twilit marlin
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well its not a fact but you know what i mean

civic moth
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in a fight

brittle herald
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Anything can kill anything I can agree on that, just the way it is

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But regardless of that it should not be doing nearly as much damage as it does currently

ember ivy
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mhm

brittle herald
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It is ridiculous

toxic crypt
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Like, are you gonna whine when compy can kill a stego by nibbling at it for 3 days straight?

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It's a goofy complaint

brittle herald
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It's a valid concern

toxic crypt
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it isn't

civic moth
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Why so ?

toxic crypt
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There's not a situation in the game where that is going to matter

civic moth
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There are things that should be simply impossible for game balance sake.

brittle herald
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^

toxic crypt
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If you, as a stego, are letting the dryo bite you, it is your fault

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The stego ends the the dryo in a single swing

civic moth
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Stego should just out heal Dryo damages

toxic crypt
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The stego would literally need to be actively letting the dryo win

civic moth
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that's all

fallen kestrel
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it doesn't matter if the situation never happens the fact that it can is a problem

brittle herald
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It should not be killing that stego just by itself, if it was like 10 then yeah
But a solo dryo should not have that power

toxic crypt
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That is not an issue

civic moth
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But if it can even like that, it means that in a fight it can

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and Dryo even has the agility and the speed to flee

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so Stego can be out powered by Dryo

ember ivy
brittle herald
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It's very hard to hit the swing when you get locked into the animation

toxic crypt
civic moth
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also its attack sucks

brittle herald
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And?

toxic crypt
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If you manage to actually die from that, you're actually stupid

brittle herald
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It should not happen at all

toxic crypt
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Like, the ai are smarter than that

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It's a non-issue

twilit marlin
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in a fight without pounce a pack of utahs struggle against steggo, i dont see dryos being a problem for any steggo

brittle herald
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The damage number is an issue

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It does too much damage for such a minuscule attack

toxic crypt
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I'm sure if a cat nawed at me for 5 days straight it could kill me, doesn't mean the cat's gonna slaughter me

brittle herald
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Again why are you bringing in these comparisons?

ember ivy
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they make little sense herp

civic moth
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Tell me you can kill a lion by slapping your hand on it.

toxic crypt
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Because it's a fucking ridiculous complaint

brittle herald
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I don't see what they have to do with the conversation at hand

lament cloak
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i mean there are parasites irl, and they are tiny yet they still affect giant things, and if left alone for too long they even kill animals, so if you let a dryo keep chomping on you then yeah its going to kill you

toxic crypt
civic moth
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You will never kill it

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lmao

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It will never work

toxic crypt
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You're whining about dryo killing stego over an incredibly ridiculous timespan

civic moth
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10 minutes is not

ember ivy
toxic crypt
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yes, it is if the stego is even at the computer

brittle herald
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It's the fact that it can happen, that is the entire issue here

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It shouldn't be happening

ember ivy
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and it does happen too

brittle herald
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It should not have nearly as much damage as it does and that's just it.

toxic crypt
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The only way it would ever feasibly occur is if the stego player fucking died at the keyboard

twilit marlin
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i have seen it happen, but as i said the steggo was afk and it took a long time.

brittle herald
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It happens regardless of what you say

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It is very rare yes

slim dragon
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This is funny because the original debate was about ptera damage, not dryo

brittle herald
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But it should be impossible

toxic crypt
civic moth
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But it can happen that's all.

lament cloak
civic moth
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It doesn't

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because it is a Stego.

toxic crypt
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If you're afk for 10 full ass minutes and let the dryo eat you, you're at fault

ember ivy
civic moth
toxic crypt
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It takes a single minute to log out

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The stego could fucking safelog in the time the dryo's nibbling at it's toes

civic moth
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No

brittle herald
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Stego can be up and moving and the dryos can still kill it

twilit marlin
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the dryos attack really quickly and the damage calls from the steggo is really loud lol

slim dragon
twilit marlin
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it makes so much noise

brittle herald
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I agree with Ptera as well

ember ivy
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yes, jab doesnt work and the bite really, really sucks and is just a meme

twilit marlin
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its hilarious to see

toxic crypt
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Fuck it, let's bring this into isle discussion because this convo is too bat-shit crazy

brittle herald
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Too much damage for something of its size

twilit marlin
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derail us herp a derp

ember ivy
slim dragon
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he's not

civic moth
ember ivy
lament cloak
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sure, maybe dryo needs a nerf to damage, but anything should be able to kill anything, if you let a dryo chomp and chomp and bite through all the way to the bone, and it kept chomping, you are going to die

wintry mountain
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if you arent built to be punching up you should not be punching up.

civic moth
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Anything shouldn't be able to fight anything.

slim dragon
civic moth
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It runs or hides.

brittle herald
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How/why would it stand and fight a Utah?

slim dragon
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The size difference between dyo and utah isne't even that big

brittle herald
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It can hurt it a little bit sure, but it isn't gonna last at all

ember ivy
lament gale
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it is quite big

ember ivy
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no, absolutely not

brittle herald
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The size difference is enough

slim dragon
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Homalo is a different thing, it's much smaller. But it should be able to fight a velo.

lament gale
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utahs 500kg vs dryo at a measly 90kg LOL

civic moth
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Homalo is 20kg and it will similar to Troodon so 40kg. Why should it fight an Utahraptor of 600kg when it can :
-flee
-hide

brittle herald
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For Dryo though I mostly refer to the attack itself

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The little peck should not be doing enough damage to kill anything its size and up

lament gale
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point is, dryo is FASTER then utah now. swarming a utah and killing it is made much easier now

civic moth
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Dryo is 90kg.

lament gale
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nerfing its dmg literally does nothing to dryos gameplay beyond removing its ability to swarm utahs and murder them

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which

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you really shouldn't be doing as a dryo anyways

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that's not what dryo is for

civic moth
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should not happen

twilit marlin
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easier sure but its not very practical. why would you choose to pack hunt as dryos when you could murder EVERYTHING as utahs?

civic moth
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There are things meant to do X gameplay, some Y.

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That's it captain

lament cloak
civic moth
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play Utah

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do not play Dryo

lament gale
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that's different yeah

ember ivy
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and plus diets

lament gale
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i'd give dryo a stationary kick if i had it my way

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but it'll probably only get a peck, one that it can run and deal 75dmg per with

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AND it's faster then utah to boot

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so

civic moth
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If Dryo damages are of 5, with Utah having 1000hp, then it will need of 200 hits to kill a Utah and not 14 with 75.

lament gale
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it's not like you're supposed to be fighting back against stuff like utah lmao. they made it faster for a reason

twilit marlin
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its got that right click dodge and not a right click attack.

slim dragon
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Dryo damage should at the bare minimum be 25.
Otherwise it just becomes stupidly unrealistic.

civic moth
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It would need of 40 hits to kill Utah, which is okay-ish.

twilit marlin
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i was considering swapping to dryo for solo hunting when they nerfed utahs acceleration. it just doesnt do enough damage to be viable.

lament gale
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i think 20 would be fine for dryo, but honestly i'd base it around mercs n all that

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dryo should be able to kill a human ez

wintry mountain
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damn y'all being generous

civic moth
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Nova, I did ask for 5

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lmao

wintry mountain
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Anyhow, SMalls like dryo whom are not orientated to hit high should have damage balanced around dealing with other smalls. Even dryo should be doing well against something like herrera, which is its size

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However troodon/ovi/etc it would fair far better with

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Same goes for Pteranodon imho

twilit marlin
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you need 3 bites i think to kill a dryo, even if it was 6 bites for the dryo to kill the utah it would still be considerably weaker.

civic moth
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If it was 6 Dryo would be fucking OP

twilit marlin
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what is the dryos pack limit?

wintry mountain
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It's not a matter of how much weaker it is, its a matter of designing animals to be what they should be

twilit marlin
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fodder?

wintry mountain
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How is it fodder when it outspeeds or out manuevers all of its predators.

civic moth
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size difference
attack kind
other stats like speed, turn radius, momentum
dodge ability
high damage output

twilit marlin
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by a narrow margine

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margin*

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significantly less health and damage for what 5-10% more speed

wintry mountain
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and? there's a vast difference between these two animals

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Why does dryosaurus need to be equipped to fight a utahraptor in any shape or form outside of escape

twilit marlin
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the ai dryos exist only as food, the players should not have that as their only purpose too.

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i mean when was the last time you saw a player as a dryo?

wintry mountain
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Your only food if you get caught.

twilit marlin
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it was ok for exploring but now you have the ptera

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sorry bad timing

civic moth
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np

wintry mountain
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That's inevitably going to be an issue for every animal at somepoint

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Comes with the size of this roster

civic moth
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50 dinosaurs

twilit marlin
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yeah once other dinos get released ill be moving on from utah

wintry mountain
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I do not feel it warrants making them capable outside of the role they are intended for

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I hate using the excuse but

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people will play what they want

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someone out there will play dryo

twilit marlin
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once it can burrow it will be popular again

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buffing it until then would be wrong

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the problem is alot of roles are not really filled, you got utah for pack hunting but its also the go to agile solo hunter for the time being.

sinful cove
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isnt dryo not getting burrows back?

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it will be able to enter and possible modify existing burrows from what i've been hearing

stark knoll
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last i heard its still up in the air

twilit marlin
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i saw something on one of the streams, like a whitebox burrow

stark knoll
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yea that was filipe doing some initial testing

twilit marlin
stark knoll
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very very early

twilit marlin
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there is the footage

stark knoll
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and its also likely dryo was just the pawn he used, he couldve chosen a utah and had it work in the editor

sinful cove
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dryo needs its shite tier dodge improved and maybe some goodass night vision, then it will be fun to play as a throwaway troll dino again

twilit marlin
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hypsi is the ultimate throwaway troll

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start 100% growth and that spit

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an annoying 1 call

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perfection

sinful cove
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hypsi spit kinda trash rn too, also its jump destroys its stam just to get to a branch that utah can reach anyway

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hypsi and dryo both need fixes honestly

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hypsis spit is terrible as a defense mechanic that it's supposed to be, it is only good for spitting at unaware players and running away for fun

twilit marlin
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i gotta do some testing with the hypsi

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i want to spint on some pteras and deinos

sinful cove
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hypsi is pretty good for trolling dienos atm form what i've seen

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tho literally anything seems to harass them right now until their mechanics are refined

twilit marlin
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if i can just hit a ptera as its trying to land lol

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it should have enough damage to kill an adult as well

gaunt jackal
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@civic moth i think devs will fix denio collision hitbox and the denio could have used alt lmb

civic moth
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Yeah.

gaunt jackal
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and denios are kinda suposed to be dog shit on land i think

wheat field
gaunt jackal
wheat field
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Yeah but you get the point haha

wraith spindle
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I think Petra matures too fast

sinful cove
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Meh, i mean it's leagues better than dryo while barely taking longer to grow than one but it doesn’t need a growth time increase. Not now at least

wraith spindle
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I think it should tbh, like you said: leagues better.

sinful cove
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Dryo should take less time to compensate, ptera is a piece of paper

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It gets demolished if it is caught, no real need for it to take longer to grow

dapper frost
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the growth time is fine, the problem is the food and water drain on ptera is super slow

sinful cove
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Yeah it is kinda dumb that you can get to adult without eating

wraith spindle
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Idk man. Played today and got to adult twice without any issues. I want to feel like I earned it.

sinful cove
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But that is a hunger problem not a grow time problem

nova olive
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i do agree tho, u shouldnt be able to grow up 100% w/o eating anything. theres a problem w/ just increasing its food drain while it grows tho, which is that with ptera stam as it is now, its not viable to just slam pteras w/ increased food/water drain, u'll have dead juvi/adolescent pteras sprinkled all over the map from trying to find water and not having the stam to get there

dapper frost
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pteras have plenty of stam to reach water sources TI_GarboSquintI can get pretty far even as a fresh spawn

nova olive
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??? i dont know how, i go up as high as i can and can only make it part way up the hill im headed towards most of the time

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and that happens all the way up to sub adult, i hate growing up until i reach sub just because i cant actually do shit

dapper frost
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where are you spawning that you have to go up hills as ptera? I just go over open spaces so nothing can obstruct my gliding

nova olive
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i -

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theres like 5 spawn points

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and most of them are either on the plains or in a forest where u have to dodge trees & rocks and try not to faceplant into hills

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i think theres one where u spawn on the top of a hill and can actually make it a fair distance? but if u die you have to spawn somewhere else

dapper frost
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dodging trees and rocks is easy as long as you arent chasing something or something is chasing you

nova olive
#

sure its easy to steer but if youre out of stam and that rock is higher in the air than you are ur gonna have to land

dapper frost
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I usually spawn at the waterfall with a pond beneath or swamp, there is lot of open space and you can glide for a while also those spawn you near water

nova olive
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oh god and then theres the beach spawn. took me 30mins to find a river from that one 😭

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the waterfall with a pond below it, are you talking about the one on the mountain with the radio tower on it??

dapper frost
nova olive
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i

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i have grown ptera 4x

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and i have managed to miss the best spawn??

dapper frost
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yeah its pretty good, besides the deinos, but it gives you a big drop so a glide down the river can get you super far

nova olive
#

no words. only sadge

dapper frost
nova olive
spare badger
#

@ionic glacier the carno vs teno matchup is entirely skill dependant, and is about 50 50. One kick or tail slam from a teno stuns the carno, allowing it to get more hits in. Tenonto can also escape into the jungle. I do agree that teno should get a slight health buff tho.

sinful cove
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i think the point is it shouldnt really be a 50 50 when one of the opponents can flee and the other can not

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which is kinda shitty

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when more small game comes teno should definitely be a bit more out of carno's league

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the slower opponent should have a direct combat advantage compared to the one who already has a disegnagement advantage

frosty heron
#

The Carno being capable to run away doesn't mean it should be weaker than a Dino, Herbies shouldn't actively chase Carnis, most of time you play defensive and make them run away

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Just make Carnos heal slower

ionic glacier
sinful cove
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who said herbis should chase carnis?

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the carno is the one who chooses if the fight even happens, so he should be the one taking the bigger risk

frosty heron
sinful cove
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you are reaching

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i didnt say teno should be buffed to chase down carnos or something

frosty heron
alpine palm
#

pachies will soon make running away suicide TI_Uhh

frosty heron
sinful cove
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not sure what you aren't understanding here. tenonto should be defensive against carno i never said it shouldn't

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but it should have a better chance in the fight because it isn't the one who gets to choose if there even is a fight

spare badger
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I agree

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If the one who can run is stronger it makes it unbalanced

frosty heron
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Teno has actually better chance defensively than a Carno if the Teno is skilled

spare badger
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Thats y I said around 50 50

sinful cove
#

right now its pretty 50 50 if they both know what theyre doing or are both idiots

spare badger
#

Mr D Bear has an excellent video on the matchup

frosty heron
#

MrDBear makes great videos about matchups, very recommended

sinful cove
#

not saying teno needs an immediate buff, but when more small game (what carno is supposed to be hunting) comes out it should receive a buff then

spare badger
#

That makes.sense, kind of like what they're doing with deino

ionic glacier
sinful cove
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yeah deino should have many of his current problems fixed as more mechanics come rolling out

frosty heron
crystal wharf
spare badger
#

Feb 13 2021

crystal wharf
#

mhm

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player tenonto or carno on the beta, carno got nerfed to high hell and tenonto can actually chose its attacks now

ionic glacier
spare badger
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there a buff/nerf?

frosty heron
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Think there was a player called DRAGONZz which is a very good Teno player. That guy destroyed Carnos like nothing

spare badger
#

Yes I saw that today

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What did they nerf about carno

frosty heron
#

Actually if you think about it Carno right now gets bullied by 2 playables consistently for its size

crystal wharf
frosty heron
#

And yet people still asking for nerfs, people should check what they're doing wrong first

spare badger
#

Ic

hollow canyon
#

Carno's been nerfed since DBear's video. In general that match up was pretty much 50/50 and entirely skill dependent. I've killed every solo Carno I've encountered as a Tenontosaurus, very often actively going after them and hunting them down. With Carno being nerfed now I don't see much of a reason why Tenonto should be performing much worse now.

ionic glacier
#

In my experience so far it is still easy to kill Tenontos with a Carno. However a 50/50 match up would not be fair as Carno can always escape a fight while Tenonto can't. For example: If 2 Carnos see a Tenonto, he is 100% dead. If 1 Carno sees a Tenonto, he might do well in a fight and the Carno runs away and try later or he is dead.

frosty heron
#

Unless you're pretending to say Carno should always go for smaller prey, I mentioned yesterday I strongly disagree with the whole thing of "you shouldn't be fighting this or this" this is a game, not a paleo simulator

sinful cove
#

The point is that teno can't escape and the carnos can though. The outnumbered carno can run off and find something else if it sees a group of tenos, the teno will just die if a group of carnos attacks it.

modest carbon
#

^

sinful cove
#

Carno is supposed to be a small game hunter, whether you agree or not

frosty heron
#

Teno can escape, and use some other tactics like terrain in your benefit, Teno might be slower but on dense forest it's more agile

sinful cove
#

The slower animal should have the advantage if it can not escape

#

Carnos turn is pretty damn good right now so jungle isnt much of an issue for it

frosty heron
#

Utah is slower than Carno and I escape from them all day, all time I mean...

modest carbon
#

utahs arent tenos

sinful cove
#

Utah can also jump on high places, are faster than teno, easier to hide with and more agile than both

modest carbon
#

tenos are slower than utahs and loud as sin

#

they also cannot crouch, and its easy to track a teno down because you can catch up to it fairly quickly

frosty heron
#

I've escaped from stuff as Teno and even had time to regen Stam by just hiding, it's survival common sense

sinful cove
#

You can escape but you kinda have to hope the carno tracking you sucks at it or that you can get a wallow in before they catch up and still not see your fat ass running away

ionic glacier
#

You think carnivores need to hunt so they should have an advantage. I disagree with this as this will lead in everyone playing carnivore as it is the better choice for PvP. Later in the game there should be enough ai so carnivores can't starve to death if they don't kill players.
Teno can escape in the forest, yes. But it is risky to burn your stamina like this also once the Teno is bleeding he can't hide.

sinful cove
#

So you can escape bad trackers

frosty heron
modest carbon
#

same...thing?

frosty heron
#

Would be unfair as fuck if you need to hunt and Tenos would outrun you so of you decide to attack they chase you down to death

sinful cove
#

Carnis already have an offensive advantage in current matchups with their higher speed

#

Uh literally nobody said tenos should be faster than carno or utah

frosty heron
modest carbon
#

what I just said offense benefit and advantage is the same thing

frosty heron
#

After all Herbie mains really want to turn this game into some sort of social game instead on what it should be, a survival game with horror elements on it, imagine being an herb and not be worried about predators

modest carbon
frosty heron
#

I really enjoy play Stego and encounter some cocky pack of hunters try on me honestly, I don't get why people hate that

sinful cove
#

You seem to be misunderstanding, nobody said herbs shouldnt have to worry about predators lmao

frosty heron
sinful cove
#

It is simple balance logic that the slower opponent should have the melee advantage to balance out the other opponent's ability to disengage at any time

ionic glacier
modest carbon
frosty heron
sinful cove
#

Not sure how that's taking balance a bit too far, it is a simple guideline for the roster to come

#

A sort of balance meter between flight and fight

frosty heron
sinful cove
#

It doesnt only apply to herbivores either

ionic glacier
frosty heron
#

Because Tenos as herbs can feed on bushes. Bushes don't run away

sinful cove
#

If alberto is slower than teno then it should beat teno’s ass im a fight that's kinda a given

frosty heron
#

Alright, yet it's too soon to talk and I doubt we gonna have a big theropod added soon

#

The whole roadmap it's small-mid game roster

sinful cove
#

Albert is pretty big too he looks like he'd curb stomp teno so it's balanced for him to be slower and stronger. And ya that prolly will be a while

ionic glacier
#

I don't really mind which diet an animal has. Carnis don't need to kill players to survive. If this would be the case, herbivores could starve them to death by not dying. Then this game should be balanced differently. But this is not the case. Surviving as a carnivore is as easy as a herbivore with ai in the game. So both should be equally good in a PvP way.

frosty heron
#

That would change with bigger predators, best example now it's Deino, big Deinos hardly survive only on Elites and that leads to the current cannibalism happening on the stress test

sinful cove
#

The primary factor leading to mass deino cannibaliam is the fact that like half the server is playing the predator that luves in a specific biome

#

When there's a bigger roster there will be fewer deinos and more not deinos for them to eat

ionic glacier
#

I had 2 adult Deinos yet and i didn't had this problem. Only if many adult Deinos are at the same place. If bigger carnivores are added, there might be bigger ai as well. At the moment actually Dryo ai is kinda broken so you have to kill players as Utah/Carno or find dead players. But this will be fixed.

frosty heron
#

My only Deino had to fight 2 cannibalism attempts and yes I might survived both but at least on the east river there isn't much Elite fish spawns compared to Central, there's neither a big abundance of Deinos there so the solution it's to cannibalize on the fresh spawned babies, might be something related to the map spawns itself more than food source problems

sacred zodiac
#

@wraith spindle why would mud make stam regen faster

crystal wharf
sinful cove
#

I hope that we not only are able to knock utahs off on trees in the future, but also squish and smash them against trees/rocks

dusty fable
#

@ionic glacier a teno can quite capable kill a carno.

ionic glacier
hollow canyon
#

Tenonto also takes less time to grow and it's significantly easier to grow due to the fact that the diets aren't in yet and it's a herbivore, meaning you can technically just sit on your butt in a remote area of the map grazing/feeding on a bush uninterrupted without being threatened by a single player. Tenontosaurus is very likely the most capable all rounder in the game atm, last thing it needs right now is a buff.

crystal wharf
hollow canyon
#

Does the AI still make sounds or do they just stay quiet now?

crystal wharf
#

they make sound, just not very often

gray star
#

Can someone explain why we can swim in the air all along the south of the map?

sinful cove
#

Because this is an alpha and alphas tend to have a lot of bugs

hollow canyon
#

It's a bug, certain areas seem to be treated as water even if they're not. It will likely get fixed. Becareful because you can fall down if you enter an area that the game recognises as normal ground and air.

gray star
#

I mean the specific issue

sinful cove
#

Probably messed something up when they added the new water system

gray star
#

Did they update the map and something broke?

hollow canyon
#

I think it broke in one of the newer patches to the QA branch. It worked just fine before and I started seeing this issue just recently.

gray star
gray star
spare badger
#

Luckily the water glitch was just fixed

late kelp
#

Jokes on you, a new water glitch appeared in the cave

spare badger
#

Damn

alpine plover
#

@spice goblet

Utah currently doesn't have a pounce at younger stages because it was buggy.

#

@inland gust

Why is deinos mass limit a issue? 50% is 4T, literally only 12 dinosaurs weigh more then that........

#

And we can all agree that losing your rex after 7 hours of growing to a lunge that boderline auto kills you would be unfun

inland gust
alpine plover
inland gust
#

Today I hunted for a stego paired with a Deinosuchus. Both full, attacked in turn, both died with 3-4 hits.

alpine plover
ionic glacier
alpine plover
inland gust
#

I agree, but stego absolutely does not feel the threat from deino.

#

He didn’t even get crippled.

alpine plover
slim dragon
inland gust
#

As a result, I was rafting half-dead on the river, and stego stubbornly pursued me. Fearing nothing.

slim dragon
alpine plover
slim dragon
#

But they'd make sense

alpine plover
#

If it has a cool down after it lunges, then its fine.

inland gust
#

I hope. In any case, the jerk must be corrected. It works very crookedly.

alpine plover
#

Turns deino into a no skill dino, even if you mess up all you have to do is press M1

inland gust
#

I think it's not that easy to work.

alpine plover
#

wdym?

inland gust
#

There are many opportunities to make the fracture not so easy.

#

But still. You have to balance a lot. It's not okay. Yesterday I attacked a stego on a full Deinosuchus (20-30% may be smaller in size) and could not kill him with 4 bites, he just ran away. I was shocked.

alpine plover
#

Play like a actual crocodile, drown your prey.

#

Don't play it like a rex.

inland gust
#

Come on. Try it if you have nowhere to rest your paws on the shore.

ionic glacier
alpine plover
inland gust
#

Take the same dash on the surface of the water. It is useless, just acceleration and a faint bite, because of this you cannot drag a floating dinosaur to the bottom.

inland gust
alpine plover
#

Other deinos seem to not have issues with it, might be you not understanding the full mechanics of lunge

inland gust
#

Mde. I cannot stand with my paws on the bottom, because there is NO bottom near the shore!

alpine plover
inland gust
#

I mean, not everywhere.

#

The question is, to keep the target in the teeth, do you need to hold the pkm?

alpine plover
#

how strict are the new group sizes for balance in stress test servers?

#

should we tell when there are like five deinos together?

hollow canyon
#

@ionic glacier Are you talking about Evrima on the public branch or on the QA branch? Because as it is Carno is hardly the best animal on the QA branch. Its stamina has been at the very least halved and its turn has been nerfed. Tenontosaurus is by far the superior animal which is also far easier to grow as AI is nowhere near as abundant or easy to catch as it is on the public branch. So yes - there is a big difference between how difficult it is to grow both animals with Tenontosaurus being incomparably easier due to having much easier access to food. Tenontosaurus can also run down not fully grown Carnotaurs because of its much bigger stamina pool(if you can track them down). Not to mention this was perhaps the most balanced match up in the previous update, now with the changes I'd say Tenontosaurus is by far the best animal in the game. It's the best all rounder because it doesn't really have any bad match ups. It has an amazing stamina pool, it moves around really well. It offers a lot of power for the time you have to spend growing it. If anything the animal might be too good.

raven egret
#

@tall trail The Stench Of Death is a great idea, just wanted to mention that.

golden coral
#

But can it be used offensively to force a herbi to move, is my question?

tall trail
#

Well

#

If affinity is still a thing

#

I remember something about preventative measures under affinity for body guarding as herbs

#

My thoughts were that the devs might have already figured that out

#

@golden coral

golden coral
#

@tall trail Possible. I've heard of that too, and it would still potentially be an issue. Just don't want to see using your own dead body as a weapon or to troll you know.

tall trail
#

Well likeliness is you can’t just use your own dead body

#

Because by the time you’re big enough to go back and drag your body it’s either gonna be eaten or decomposed

#

And if you are big enough to drag it it might be the slow drag

hollow canyon
#

The point is more so to kamikaze into herbivores to force them to move from an area by leaving your body there

golden coral
# tall trail Well likeliness is you can’t just use your own dead body

No but, imagine you're a utah pack, you're hunting me as stego, but I've gotten a good defensive position. One of you try to jump me, gets killed and dropped right there. Another ones does the same, and now there's two dead utahs. Will I now be affected? Do I have to yield my position because of a debuff that would otherwise screw over my combat ability? And could be used to just troll someone, by bringing a corpse and dropping it near a slower herbi. So you drop your utah as carno, so I move away as stego, and you just keep doing that until your body despawns eventually? Or doing so when someone is nesting. There's.. potential issues, is all I'm saying.

civic moth
#

That's the main problem

#

it is fucking abusable

#

by anyone

#

for the sake of trolling

#

or being toxic asf.

golden coral
#

Would not even need to drop the body possibly, unless you can make a distinction between body on ground and body being carried.

civic moth
#

I mean you just drop the body next to an herbivore, it gets a nerf of it and then you could fuck it up.

#

And that's fucking sad.

#

But the thing is that corps guarding is also a thing

#

which is unfun for someone who succeed a hunt.

#

Like you could kill a Tenonto as a Carno, other Tenontos will stay on the body.

#

Maybe the debuff could be slow? Like it doesn't nerf you in the first 5 minutes then you start to slowly be weaker like -10% damages, stamina, higher hunger, higher thirst and then when you leave the body you get back to normal in a few minutes like 2.

golden coral
#

Yeah, it's a problem on both sides. Maybe if grabbing chunks were faster, so you'd be able to take small bites.

civic moth
#

Actually

#

only hunger and thirst are needed

golden coral
#

Problem with the time Baba, is that the carnis will just wait around.

civic moth
#

so the herbivore moves on

#

Carnivore will wait for the player to go away. It won't be weaker but will lose hunger and thirst quicker but it will quickly recover from that.

golden coral
#

Or use their need to drink or eat to get some "free" hits in. Bodyguarding is a problem, but not sure on debuffs being the solution. It should be easier to grab chunks, at the very least.

civic moth
#

Like, it may be a good way ?

#

That too Erik

golden coral
#

Maybe in some circumstances, but see my stego vs utah pack example.

#

They'd just kill by starving/dehydrating then, like how comfort kills in another game.

civic moth
#

BoB

#

:deceased:

golden coral
#

Yeh.. :p

civic moth
#

oh yeah I do not have Nitro on this account

golden coral
#

Hey, it's a legit tactic there, or so I've heard :p

civic moth
#

There is also necrophobia on BoB

#

but

golden coral
#

And back before they changed the carcass debuff, you'd have pteras drop those chicken legs on herbi herds ^^

civic moth
#

people suiciding on other sucks

golden coral
#

Yeh, I know, and originally, pteras did what I just said, that was a good time I'm sure. You'd have pteras bomb herbis with those bits, until they, I think, removed the debuff from pieces at least. :p

civic moth
#

I doubt Ptera should be able to get meat chucks anyway

golden coral
#

No no, just saying in BoB that happened ^^

civic moth
#

I know

#

I play BoB

#

since 2018

golden coral
#

So we know there's some issues in how to solve this

civic moth
#

I only playe it recently because of WWD

#

ye

golden coral
#

Body guarding is bad, but it's tricky to solve in a good way too

civic moth
#

It really is unfortunately

#

like

golden coral
#

And BoB "affinity" is a whole discussion in and off itself xD

#

And it is, so much that just gets ruined cause shitty players

civic moth
#

the herbivore should need to move after a time.

Remember of this mother in Walking with Beasts

#

Also doing a rule of "No body guard" is just dumb. It should be a thing in game that's not abusable..

golden coral
#

Agreed, solutions by rules are.. not very good

#

Should be proper mechanics

novel tulip
#

There was a suggestion that was 10x better where grass and bushes around dead bodies become inedible

#

So herbivores would have to leave to get food at some point

civic moth
#

Then suicide around of herbivores

#

and make them starve

novel tulip
#

Or they can just walk a few meters from your corpse and eat the grass there

#

Instead of having their controls hijacked and their ability to fight compromised

ionic glacier
#

Yes, QA. Let's say for more experienced players it doesn't matter whether you play carnivore or herbivore. For me it is just the time, getting food isn't a problem, even without Dryos. But I usually play in a group with friends. We go to a populated area and kill everything. If someone comes close to our kills we kill it and add him to the food. As herbivore I have to walk far away to get enough food for not having defense reduction. Tho as carnivore you are forced to stay at populated areas or need a bird in your group.

About the match up. For me it is a Carno sided 50/50 but the Carno can run away when ever he wants while the Tenonto can't. The fact that Carnos attack works offensive and Tenontos defensive with stamina drain makes it much easier for the Carno to kill players. But that's reasonable. For both Utah and Carno it is easy to kill an adult Deino on land. Tenonto can't really do this as they can only go in for one kick and can't tailride effectively. That's not what Tenonto is meant to do but I don't see where he has a better match up.

hollow canyon
#

Tenonto can absolutely do this, there are videos of people mauling Deinos on land with it(a number of them have been posted in the isle discussion today). In general, yea the fact that you play in a group and just pile up the bodies of everything in a populated area might make it just as easy to play carnivore and herbivore but the game isn't balanced around people megapacking. It's balanced around each animal being capable of surviving on its own and as it is it's far easier to survive as a Tenontosaurus than a Carnotaurus. There's just no comparison. The Carno can't exactly run away either because you can technically run it down due to your higher stamina pool, if it makes mistakes and runs around you for some time you can just press run at it and kill it if it wasn't unable to deal enough damage to you. Landing a single hit with the tailslam or kick makes it so that Carno has to disengage or it dies the next time it gets hit with either of those two. Matter of fact if it gets hit once you can just run it down and kill it atm due to the difference in stamina(unless you've burnt most of your stamina missing attacks before but in that case that's on you. I've never gone below 1/3 of stamina fighting a single Carno).

Tenonto simply is the best animal in Evrima atm having a 2h growth time. It offers far more power than a Utah, a far better stamina pool than Carnotaurus with a similar amount of power and an easier growth than either of the two aforementioned animals.

#

Also the fact that you say feeding a carnivore is easy right now and then say "need a bird in your group" kind of says it all. Animals shouldn't be reliant on mixpacking to feed themselves and in the future the intention is to discourage packing between different species.

civic moth
#

Big brain time Aken

#

but yeah I agree that Tenonto is pretty good atm.

#

It fights Carno well, has okay growth, has good attacks, powerful crowd controls.

ionic glacier
# hollow canyon Tenonto can absolutely do this, there are videos of people mauling Deinos on lan...

I'm not megapacking, only 2-4 friends. However if Dryo ai is a reliable food source again solo player don't have a problem. You made some good point with the stamina, this update is only here for a week and I'm not into all the details yet. I have to test it out. You only need a bird if you stay out of populated areas tho. I didn't killed an adult Deino yet with Tenonto as I always run out of stamina and the Deino gets away. However maybe I do something wrong.

hollow canyon
#

@ionic glacier It's not a reliable source of food atm

#

Deino shouldn't be allowing a Carno or Utah solo it either

#

It's down to Deino doing a terrible job and not getting back to water when it starts losing

#

I've killed Deinos with both Utah and Carno

#

But it relied on them playing without thinking

ionic glacier
hollow canyon
#

It might be but that's a big "if" as it is saying that growing carnivores is as easy as growing herbivores is just a factually wrong statement.

#

Also do note - there's around 150 AI on a server from what's been shown

#

this AI is then divided into fish AI and land Ai

#

You will simply have less AI now than in the previous updates making the food for carnivores just that much harder to get

crystal wharf
#

not to mention that ai dryos arent just feeder ai anymore, they hide in jungles, and im pretty sure even wallow when being chased

ionic glacier
#

I'm pretty sure they change that. Otherwise carnivore solo would be kinda bad.

hollow canyon
#

They are bad generally though, you can kill them with just about any animal on land because Deino just doesn't do very well while beached.

#

And we can theorise about how the game will be, however what we were speaking about until now was how the game is and I think you can agree that the terrestrial carnivores are harder to manage right now due to not having a reliable food source the way herbivores do.

ionic glacier
#

I was talking about Ai. I think Deino is good for what it is. An animal supposed to stay in the water.

#

But that's an other topic.

hollow canyon
#

As it is - Tenontosaurus is one of the best picks in the game and it doesn't need any buffs.

#

Deino is another topic I think it does fine for the most part although its bite sockets seem to be a bit wonky

#

I haven't played Deino myself but I have been lunged and attacked by multiple Deinos and sometimes the bites/lunges didn't connect when they really should have I feel.

ionic glacier
#

If Tenontos stamina is that much better to chase them down or escape them, but I have to test it. I played 2 Deinos to adult and yes, some grabs that should connect didn't for me too.

hollow canyon
#

Let me put it this way, do you remember how Carno started to breathe heavily when getting tired as you were running out of stamina in the public branch? Now it does the heavy breathing when it's around half the stamina pool, perhaps just slightly below it. That indicates that its stamina is much, much lower than it used to be. Tenonto meanwhile has the longest running time in the game(and I believe it's had it since the release of Evrima).

ionic glacier
#

Well that's a good change then but I have to test it. I didn't had stamina issues on QA yet with Carno.

hollow canyon
#

I didn't have them either aside from one instance where I got chased down by a Utahraptor. I forgot that I have much less stamina now and I can't keep going for as long as I was used to which resulted in me getting killed.

#

I think it's generally a... decent enough change and one I was arguing for as a nerf for Carno

stray cypress
#

@old hull It has a lunge that require you to be touching the bottom floor of the ocean that only works on dinos that are drinking on land if something is swimming across the water deino only has the option of biting it with no ability to grab it while swimming

civic moth
#

Geralt

#

just

#

finally someone who noticed that

#

Thank you

#

why cannot we drag people while they swim ????

#

Almost anything could be

#

and in the current roster actually everything could be dragged to the depths if it swims and a large Deinosuchus is around there.

#

But it should cost hella stamina and slow you down a lot.

#

Kinda like BoB Mosa when you grab huge things like Apato.

hollow canyon
#

Do note - my comment about stamina being exactly 50% lower due to heavy breathing starting at 50% now was incorrect. Breathing due to exhaustion simply happens at 50% for all the animals. The stamina on Carno is still much lower(might even be more than 50% lower) it's just the breathing is not an indication of how much lower it is exactly.

craggy frost
# stray cypress <@267672025261146112> It has a lunge that require you to be touching the bottom ...

it absolutely need the ability to do this, even if you do a sort of sprial leap into a bite to then grab the target, if its small enough you just pull it right under, if its bigger you end up having a power struggle, meaning if the animal has enough stam they can ( slowly have you know ) get to shore with you being latched onto them but would have taken damage and lost a load of stam, if they run out of stam they are then dragged under if the water is deep enough ofc. also having more than one gator doing this actually makes some sense too, can work as a team to take on larger prey items if you are smaller.

#

so not only can you take prey in water far better than what we got currently, right now its horrible, may aswell hunt on land half the time tbh.

#

it means I dont have to see some random ass stego just swim right on into water 0 fear with like 4 adult deinos just attacking doing like no dmg to him.

#

also Utahs really need to not just be able to jump into the water as a 4 pack and destroy 3 sub deinos in water...

#

that shit needs to stop

#

its gotten to the point that I actually dislike playing deino even when I have waited so long to play it...

#

also the Deinos hit box is horrid, nearly any small dino can just run onto your ass and into you mid section meaning ALT bite does pretty much nothing.

#

I know its QA and all, but good lord it feels like legacy again.

spare badger
craggy frost
#

no they just biting it all over

#

front / middle /back

#

legit it did fucking nothing and it manage to not only swim all the way, but it managed to run off too.

alpine shadow
#

I was a 50% deino....and i was chilling in the water and my screen turns black and i died...wtf is that?!

#

my oxygen was also okay... so thanks for nothing -.-

sinful cove
#

lol

limber elbow
alpine shadow
wicked mortar
#

It didn't take long for the players to find choke points and play... Troll

#

Im watching a mix pack of every dino

viscid cloak
#

is grazing broken?

rapid bison
#

@spare quail Dude i'm a 20% deino

mighty knot
#

@fickle totem I agree whole heartedly

fickle totem
alpine plover
#

@craggy frost The Unchained] Dr.Bard#5797

Horrible idea

#

Why should stego lose to deino but also not be able to engage with it?

#

Deino is in full control of the fight, if you die to stego you literally have to go out of you’re way to get hit by it

#

get good. Might sound obnoxious but that’s the real issue here

fickle totem
#

Are you sure about that?

#

I watched a stego walk down into the "Safetypond" where deinosuchus grows

mighty knot
golden coral
#

@fickle totem 5 hour growth. And it's balanced for being a mid tier grab and drown, nothing more, nothing less.

mighty knot
#

Deino cannot 1v1 a stego, and should not

fickle totem
#

And IN the RIVERS kill 5 deinosuchuses

alpine plover
#

Thats good

#

Deino can always just avoid the stegosaurus

mighty knot
#

with the removal of hitting stego's tail, and deino's oversized hurtbox that stego can abuse

#

all the stego has to do is turn away and it wins

wispy cave
#

Will the ankylus break his leg at EVRIMA?

mighty knot
#

your saying that we have to 'git gud' and thats why it's so hard

alpine plover
mighty knot
alpine plover
#

The real issue with deino is that the rivers are awful

#

their just way too shallow

mighty knot
#

yes

#

but at no point is deino in control

alpine plover
#

how

mighty knot
#

on land it's fked

#

with no water to retreat to

alpine plover
#

Just swim away

mighty knot
#

the stego can just run it down and delete it

#

in water, it's not a fight

#

since you can't lunge it

fickle totem
#

And your bite does 5-15% dmg

mighty knot
#

you can't say deino is in control of the fight if there's no fight to be had

fickle totem
#

UNLESS you hit the head

alpine plover
#

so then just make the rivers deeper

#

No need to buff deino

mighty knot
#

then maybe stegos will only get 3 hits on the deino that's already totally submerged

#

by hitting 8 meters above it

alpine plover
#

He already 1 shots the entire cast with lunge ( minus adult stego)

mighty knot
#

instead of the 5 they get now

#

fixing hitbox issues will make it much better

fickle totem
#

What?

mighty knot
#

currently deino is stupid easy to hit

#

I'm speaking from experience

#

I was underwater, totally invisble

#

a stego ran up

#

on the shore

#

not pointed down or anything

alpine plover
mighty knot
#

poked above the water by about a meter

#

and hit a headshot

fickle totem
#

Where in gods holy hell did you find that statistic? That the deino oneshots everythign but the adult stego with lunge?

mighty knot
#

and on land

#

a stego came up

#

I moved out of the way

#

and it hit me from about a meter away sideways

alpine plover
golden coral
#

@fickle totem It does. Grab, and then drown. That's how you do it!

fickle totem
#

Ive lunged a subadult deino in the head and not killed it?

stark knoll
golden coral
#

You don't kill with damage, you kill by drowning

fickle totem
#

Yeah and you cant grab anything above 4 tons

golden coral
#

So you can kill anything except adult stegos

mighty knot
#

Your never gonna kill a deino with lunge

#

the goal is to drown it

#

it drowns as fast as you do

alpine plover
#

@supple pagoda

Your suggestion is pretty bad in my opinion

fickle totem
#

He made it sound as it was damage wise not drowning

alpine plover
#

Having 5 deinos going around shit stomping everything isnt fun

golden coral
#

The only thing that you cn not grab as a fully grown deino is another deino or stego of sufficient growth.

#

Everything else can be grabbed and drowned

mighty knot
#

if they don't run away

#

and right now it's everyone VS deinos

alpine plover
fickle totem
#

IF a 50 kg dog pulls on me 100kg he can pull me down. ESPECIALLY if he has the element of surprise

mighty knot
#

basically here's the situation now, speaking from experience

alpine plover
#

dogs arent in the game

mighty knot
#

2 stegos, 3 carnos, 5 utahs and a flock of pteras

#

VS the 1 adult deino, 1 sub, and 8 juvies trying to vibe in the water

fickle totem
#

That the 50% weight is redundant

alpine plover
alpine plover
stark knoll
fickle totem
#

Its by low point of gravity and stability and element of surprise...

#

Sure we dont

alpine plover
#

its a game

#

Balance > realism

mighty knot
#

if you want realism, Deino bites anything in the head and it basically turns to plasma

#

lmao

fickle totem
#

But in that situation make it drain stamina fast as fuck then?

alpine plover
fickle totem
#

If you want to balance the deino to a point where it is not a guarantee oneshot, make the stamina drain faster based on weight on target

#

Instead of making everything above 50% impossible

alpine plover
stark knoll
#

theres been mention of plans to add a more legitimate struggle system in the future, but well see

spare quail
fickle totem
#

And why would that be dumb? It makes more sense than an 8 tonne prehistoric lizard that could bite a truck in half, do nothing to anything?

#

The only thing a deino does is drag smallfry into water

#

And unable to do anything else?

alpine plover
#

whats wrong with that

golden coral
#

Deino is a very niche playable to be honest

#

You're basically resigning yourself to play a pretty limited and very specific style

fickle totem
#

I agree with you that they should not be something that walks out of water and bites everything to point of extinction. But making it so weak that it cant really do anything is equally stupid

alpine plover
#

When bigger dinosaurs get added, expect a stronger deino

fickle totem
#

How is it balanced that a lone stego can walk in and tank 5 adult deinos and whipe em out without taking 50% dmg from counterattacks?

stark knoll
#

people always misconstrue high biteforce as uber mega damage

alpine plover
#

In the future, Im assuming packs of allos will be the ones punishing deinos on land (instead of carnos)

fickle totem
#

When the deino weighs more and has water for mobility

golden coral
#

That is an issue with hitboxes more than anything else likely

stark knoll
#

crocs have high biteforce so they can grip their prey

#

not to explode them to death

#

bite force isnt exactly equal to damage, even irl

alpine plover
stark knoll
#

tooth and mouth structure plays a big part

alpine plover
#

Personally I think stego should at least respect deino

#

but still win the matchup easily

#

deino should get bodied by apexes really

frosty heron
alpine plover
#

Like it shouldn’t be a fight

fickle totem
#

What?

#

The deino was literally the only threat apexes had?

stark knoll
#

what?

alpine plover
#

Not really

alpine plover
#

maybe even a acro duo

#

Other apexes

fickle totem
#

And a meteor

#

...

alpine plover
#

And hopefully apexes will be hard to grow (which is the plan)

#

so no anti apex dinos are needed

rapid bison
#

But a deino which was shown to fight a rex in the evrima trailer? naaaaah the deino would get bodied by the rex easily it shouldn't be a fight

alpine plover
fickle totem
#

Your argument is "I dont like deinos therefore they should be locked to water fishing"

alpine plover
#

Things can change, that trailer was around 2 years ago

#

And punchpacket recently said deino isnt a fighter

#

its a ambush hunter

frosty heron
#

On the trailer they only roared each other, that's not a fight

alpine plover
#

so yeah, don’t expect deino to have a chance against rex

fickle totem
#

YES! IT IS!. So if it lands an ambush successfully it is supposed to be a THREAT to apexes

alpine plover
#

Thats dumb

fickle totem
#

Im not saying it should be able to fucking fight 24 stegos and laugh about it

#

But with setup it should/Would be able to beat most. Not EASILY. But yes it should have a fighting chance against most

alpine plover
#

A deino trio should be a threat to rex (or duo) but a single deino is smallfry

fickle totem
#

Its supposed to add an element of danger with water

alpine plover
fickle totem
#

Not if you are bigger than 4 tonne

alpine plover
#

ohh nvm

fickle totem
#

It does 5-15% dmg with bites if not hitting the head. At that point it does 25-35% dmg

spare quail
#

i think they need to work on the lunge if you see osmehting easy to catch and u lunge you shoudl hit it not go through it

alpine plover
fickle totem
#

How?, I agree with you that if you setup a proper ambush. You can 1 shout Utah up to carno.

#

(Sizewise)

alpine plover
#

A solo deino shouldnt have a chance against a rex

#

It isnt meant to fight them

#

Just swim away and look for safer prey

stark knoll
#

you can one shot anything up to 4 tons, which includes most of the roster

spare quail
stark knoll
alpine plover
stark knoll
#

ah yea, my bad

#

i think im thinking of magy lmao

alpine plover
#

I wish they kept the downsized deino, current deino is too big.

#

Caused a lot of confusion

fickle totem
#

Its smack in the middle of their size?

spare quail
alpine plover
#

If we go by what the devs wanted (6 ton deino), deinos current spot in the meta makes perfect sense

alpine plover
lament cloak
alpine plover
#

just make rivers deeper

#

boom massive deino buff

spare quail
#

it doesnt really need to be all that deep in the end of they day deno will be just at the top waiting for stuff to drink

alpine plover
craggy frost
mighty knot
tough venture
#

So as much as I like the deino's existence, there is one thing that bugs me about its threat.

If a deino sets a food trap next to the river, then great, you start eating you get punished. It's a good idea in principle. My main issue with this is it takes your eating animation longer to stop so you can run or fly away than it does to be killed.

frosty heron
#

Grab a chunk with G and run away

tough venture
#

lol those chunks hardly fill anything xD

#

but yea..

frosty heron
#

Better than getting trapped by a Deino, if you grab 3 or so a Juvi Utah should refill a good chunk, not sure with Carno

tough venture
#

i was using ptera, the chunks you take off bodies seems to only give you like 5%.

#

so its not worth it

novel tulip
#

What i hate with the chunks is that A. they barely fill any hunger B. The detection for pressing G is so buggy, half the time when I find a corpse and press G absolutely nothing happens so I'm just sitting there spamming my keys open to attack C. When you're the same size as the corpse and older you can't do it anymore

#

I have yet to actually use it because rn its not worth it

tough venture
#

you should be able to decide if you want a chunk or drag the whole body

novel tulip
#

Yeah it should be two separate keys

tough venture
#

OR same key just for one option hold down G, for the other, tap G

novel tulip
#

The same button is cool but in practice it can have a really low threshold and interpret your light tap as a hold and vice versa

#

Like the H key rn

tough venture
#

what about: tap G to pick up body, hold G to rip chunk. longer you hold G gets you a bigger chunk (up to the max you can carry)

novel tulip
#

That could work

tough venture
#

i'll throw it into general feedback i suppose?

hollow canyon
#

I'd be perfectly fine with grabbing pieces of food but tbh my success rate at grabbing things on the QA branch oscillates around 40% atm I think.

novel tulip
#

Yeah its buggy

hollow canyon
#

Very buggy, although it seems like the bodies of things I've killed myself are consistently less bugged than things that were lying around. Might be a desync problem perhaps?

#

I just find it weird that I can still eat them but can't quite pick them up if that's the case.

mighty knot
#

@wide tulip I actually feel like I haven't taken much fall damage at all.

#

I also think that it can go over people's heads how big the animals your playing are

#

and how huge the amount of force they hit the ground with is

rapid bison
#

i remember a video of a hypsi falling down a huuuuuuuuge cliff and surviving

wide tulip
#

Are you a croc?

rapid bison
#

with like 50% hp left

wide tulip
#

I just died on a 100% carno falling into a stream like 10 feet

mighty knot
#

makes sense

#

carnos aren't jumpers

#

aren't meant for landings

#

and are big and heavy

rapid bison
mighty knot
#

how much do they weigh

#

2, 3 tons?

#

plus 20 foot drop

wide tulip
#

then they need to fix the lag spikes or stop ahving the whole map be a huge fucking bait

frosty heron
wide tulip
#

i'm running through bushes till i'm not and dead

mighty knot
#

either way, thats a LOT of force

#

1800 kg falling 20 ft

#

on legs not meant to sustain such falls

wide tulip
#

I mean, it's a video game dude

#

this isnt a realism simulator

mighty knot
#

sure it isn't

#

but does it have to be easier or something?

wide tulip
#

I have no sense of smell, or any of the real life senses that would keep me from walking 1ft and falling off a huge cliff

mighty knot
#

It's realistic where it's at and it's perfectly fine.

wide tulip
#

how close is the water? IDK i just see beads comming at me

mighty knot
#

then be cautious

#

if you don't know

#

be careful

#

move your camera to the ground and make sure it doesn't fall

#

or just pay attention

wide tulip
#

it's my opinion dude

#

I dont care

#

it's boring to die from falling

#

because the map has a bunch of random giant ravines

#

that's my opinion

mighty knot
#

So be it

#

but I don't agree with the suggestion of "don't die of fall damage" in a game like this

wide tulip
#

I didnt say dont die, but cool that you're taking it to the extreme

mighty knot
#

you said it's boring to die from falling

#

I read that as "I don't wanna die from falling"

wide tulip
#

I fell like 10 feet ish

#

and died

mighty knot
#

yes

#

there are no game balancing problems with it in my opinion

wide tulip
#

i survived 3 hours just to run through the wrong bush and die

frosty heron
#

If you don't wanna die to that fall height play Utah 😄

mighty knot
#

Yeah, carno isn't meant to fall ^^

#

Just be more aware

#

if you wanna play big things like that

wide tulip
#

no offence but you have some terrible opinions dude

#

YA JUST DONT DO THE THING THAT WILL KILL U

#

YA JUST MEMORIZE THE MAP

#

just mega yikers

frosty heron
#

It's like people from Legacy back then complaining about losing Rexes to fall damage like dude your a freaking 8 ton beast

wide tulip
#

this isnt a physics simulator

#

it's a video game

mighty knot
#

Correct

wide tulip
#

stop being a sperg and do some critical thinking

frosty heron
mighty knot
#

Chase keep the toxic a little down my friend

#

this isn't a heated argument

#

no need to insult the people disagreeing with you because they think differently

wide tulip
#

how is that toxic

#

what's wrong with being a sperg

#

are you shaming people that are passionate about random things?

mighty knot
#

you said "do some critical thinking"

wide tulip
#

exactly

mighty knot
#

this conversation isn't worth having

frosty heron
mighty knot
#

if you want to play a game that doesn't value realism udou

wide tulip
#

dinosaurs arent real

mighty knot
#

HAHAHAHAHAHAA

wide tulip
#

if this were real life

frosty heron
wide tulip
#

there wouldnt BE dinosaurs

mighty knot
#

WHAT XD

frosty heron
wide tulip
#

are you telling me the bible is wrong?

mighty knot
#

Thank you for that laugh Chase lmao

frosty heron
#

Oh no, Omg not this kind of discussion

mighty knot
#

Dude I'm out I swear to god

#

This is gonna destroy me

wide tulip
#

oh no!

mighty knot
#

on a molecular level

wide tulip
#

dont leave!

mighty knot
#

oh why not

wide tulip
#

you were stonewalled by my bible comment

#

feel free to retreat from my advanced rhetoric

mighty knot
#

because if I reply the way I want too, which is to disagree, it's gonna start an argument

#

one that this isn't the place for

frosty heron
#

Just run away not worth the reply anymore @mighty knot

mighty knot
#

Yeah probably not

#

Ight I'm going with turok

#

cya

wide tulip
#

cringiest shit ever, AHKTUALLY the phyisics check out

#

in a video game

#

with dinosaurs

#

you're probably a blast to watch movies with

#

1/10 i wouldnt watch veggie tales with you

civic moth
#

Croc not able to grab swimming preys is completely stupid. Idk why they didn't put that by now.

#

Hoping that it will be in when update 3 will be officially out.

untold sable
wide tulip
#

I am good

edgy root
wide tulip
#

ACHTKUALLY

#

the VEGGIE isnt directly implied to the main cast

novel tulip
#

Procedural anims on a moving, animating mesh on a server with 100 people on it would cause a new host of bugs and optimization issues

#

Also I cant imagine gluing utahs feet and body onto a dino looking natural unless you just use the current system and slightly tweak it

late hatch
#

Can anyone confirm is deino group limit is actually two? I ran into a group of about 10 today that were a mix of sub adults, adults and one juvi. Ended up dying of starvation because 2 sub carnos cant do anything against a huge pack of gators

#

Felt quite unfair

stark knoll
#

you can gather without being grouped

#

the group limits is a hard cap on the actual grouping system, not a rule

late hatch
#

Ah thats true, didnt think about that

crystal stream
#

@edgy root about ur balance feedback, a sub deino should not be able to kill a full adult carno on land

#

it is an ambush predator

#

instead of being stupid and fighting in an open field (which i've seen and punished them for it as teno, got stuck in a tree and tail slammed it to death) stay in the water and catch it off guard, or if it's too dangerous just stay in the water and eat fish lol

edgy root
crystal stream
#

well then it shouldn't be fighting something it can't even drown lmao

crystal wharf
#

@brittle ice go on

late hatch
#

A sub deino taking down an adult carno in about 10 bites seems relatively fair. If anythi g thats still not enough lol.

crystal wharf
late hatch
#

Honeatly i dont think deinos should be able to drown an adult carno. To me deinos are still a little too op

crystal wharf
#

deinosuchus lunge is crazy powerful, and people want it to play like a rex on land by having it be able to 2 shot the only thing able to kill it reliably

alpine plover
#

Yes, but deino is not a rex

#

it is just a big gator

crystal wharf
#

peoples is dumb soup