balance-feedback-discussion

[tacit chasm]

How about you go back about 30 minutes and catch up

[golden coral]

I figured it was just a fancy way to call someone various curses but not getting moderated, like how you bleep out a curseword or some such in a video

[tacit chasm]

Literally 20 minutes these dudes were talking shi on my suggestion

Then linked me for whatever reason to all collectively talk shi together

[golden coral]

I've read, and they've bascially pointed out that you could have done various other things than what you did, that might have worked out better for you

[tacit chasm]

Apparently they needed to get all 3 braincells working towards a common goal

[vale brook]

when all you do is insult others, you percieve every interaction to be an insult

[elfin night]

Strawman arguments

[dusky surge]

its very fun

[elfin night]

Imagine suggesting someone to just do something to avoid a current issue and they take it as being glazers and wanting the game to permanently have bugs

I just read the newest edit

[vale brook]

oh so now hes just flat out lying.

if you can show me where i suggest that the devs dont fix it i will cashapp you 100 dollars

[elfin night]

Everything who disagrees with the almighty Slappy is just a brainwashed glazer with no critical thought, for He is the bearer of the objective, cosmic truth and only speaks about the tangible reality we can all perceive and understand when our uneducated minds aren’t tainted

[golden coral]

It sounds hilarious if nothing else xD

[vale brook]

because no, i gave you suggestions on how to best avoid the bug until its fixed.

[golden wasp]

@tacit chasm Knock it off

[vale brook]

welcome back spacemew

i thought you stayed in the evrima channels mostly, feels weird seeing you outside of them

[golden wasp]

Just a lot here and there. We tryin~

[tacit chasm]

Avoiding the games intended patrol zone isn't a solution, which is what was suggest by sammy, who has absolutley nothing to do with the game's development. When making a comment to the devs about lighting issues, why should some nobody be telling me that instead of the game being fixed, I should just accept it's trash and get over it? That's dumb af bro

[vale brook]

patrol zones change based on where you are btw lol

if you leave, it changes to be closer to you

so yes, avoiding that area quite literally is the solution right now until it is fixed

[tacit chasm]

And in the swamp, 70% of the entire area has a light defect.

[slim dragon]

Patrols zones aren't a carnivore mechanic either, you can pretty much disregard them as a carni

[tacit chasm]

That covers over half the screen

[tacit chasm]

Whrres the food then? Keep starving to death lol. The game is shite

[golden coral]

See, responding like this, is much better than what was going on earlier. Now there's something to actually talk about. And I'd agree, it's not just "get over it", but it is early access, in development, so "deal with it" is a temporary solution.

[elfin night]

Josh clown reacting the suggestion our boy’s going all out

[golden coral]

It's not saying "it's fine, nothing needs fixed" but just accepting that it'll get fixed, when the devs get to it

[slim dragon]

AI spawns around players, but swamps doesn't have many spawns it seems
Else it's players

[elfin night]

The audacity was funny to me

[golden coral]

And until then, you might have to work around it

[rapid flume]

I like to watch the conversations

[golden coral]

You know, you could play as something else for a little, see where people go, get to know the areas, then go back to deino when you got a plan for it

[vale brook]

i like to imagine islecord is a large building and you're just in a chair in the corner watching and ocassionally going 👍 or 👎

no words being spoken

[elfin night]

Okay, feel free to either consider this or continue calling us glazers without critical thought

Instead of trying to bash your head against a wall with an exigent apex carnivore that needs intensive game knowledge and planning to thrive in all of your spawn, why don’t you start out with something else until you more or less know the ai spawns and what to do in certain situations?

Because I have the strong conviction you are not a veteran player

[hollow topaz]

He’s gone, btw

[elfin night]

Oh wait

I noticed

Welp, he will wallow in his own angst then

[vale brook]

a shame, there was a slight hint of someone reasonable to discuss with last night originally when we were discussing the games development timeline

[elfin night]

Let’s see if he accepts my friend request

[elfin night]

Malders gonna mald

[slim dragon]

Who would accept a friend request from you

[vale brook]

not me

(wait am i already friends with ava lol)

crap

[elfin night]

😔 I know you haven’t

[slim dragon]

It has nothing to do with you personally
It's just that I've had issues in the past with people sending me friend requests, and as much as I may appreciate you, I prefer to keep my friends list limited to close people for that reason

[elfin night]

Okay then

No problem, not like friend list does much anyway

[vale brook]

#balance-feedback message 2 weeks ago i wouldve said this is unneeded but diablo juvie and sub is genuinely still so incredibly slow by the time it reaches 1.5-2 tons. i remembered it being far better than that before i played it recently but i guess it had just been a while

[elfin night]

they get shredded by the few cannis around

and dont even have the good slide

so imagine with a 4-5 ton rex

or an allo on a 1.5 ton dibble because there is absolutely no way allo can't pin a teno

[vale brook]

i dont think they should be faster than rex/allo but they probably should be faster than they are now by a decent margin simply to be able to avoid the ambushes a bit easier

[elfin night]

me neither

[vale brook]

theres no reason for juvie diablo to be as slow as it is and then have juvie trike be speed demon #20

[elfin night]

but at least get the cera treatment of getting most of your speed early

[vale brook]

yah i agree

[elfin night]

since that's still extra distance you can travel

[cosmic pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-star-mmm-cheesy-cheese-cheesy-gif-19257011

🥔 ❤️

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/zoo-lander-owen-wilson-oh-who-is-she-ben-stiller-i-monster-gif-27286094

[elfin night]

I was given the seal of quality

Mr Carno woke canni downvoted my herbivore suggestion

[hasty coyote]

Honestly I think that change should extend to all dinos. While many shouldn’t be faster than adults, they should at least hit adult speed a lot earlier on imo. Especially dinos like cera who are cannibalistic and have to run from their own species.

[elfin night]

And cera does that, yep

But I just think dibble is a special case rn

Since it’s just too slow when it is weak and pathetic

[clear torrent]

The raptor needs a buff, allow raptors to have more stam or reduce stam consumption, nerf dilo speed, making raptors, a fast and a nimble dino slower than a dilo is not good. raptor is one of the only few dinos which are punished for using rmb, Cera abuses rmb, no stam punishment

Why are people not liking this, am i wrong?

[cosmic pelican]

If omni gets more time to stay latched using pounce, it will be able to kill a cera and a carno before it runs out of stam.

Just with the pure dmg, bleed would do even more

[clear torrent]

then how to balance it? cause raptors have very low health and awful lmb damage

one cera charge bite kicks the omni out of the fight, dibble 1 hit, carno 3 hits, maia one hit, what is an omni supposed to hunt?

[cosmic pelican]

Damage pounce already does 1k dmg, omni is not lacking dmg at all

[clear torrent]

u are never on the back to do full damge with so many trees, increase lmb damage then should be the answer, raptor health is 450, dilo is 700 and its faster and does more damage and has almost the same turn radius

[crimson crater]

almost the same turn radius? what

[clear torrent]

its turning ability is almost as good as a raptor

[dusky surge]

it is not

[cosmic pelican]

You can easily kill a dilo with bleed even with a short pounce

[clear torrent]

do u wanna go to an unoffical server and show me how, cause i have fought a thousand times. it has more speed and stam and more damage, if i waste my stam on pounce, i am dead

[cosmic pelican]

Sure, in 20 mins or so

[clear torrent]

ok just tag me here

[crimson crater]

not even close

[cosmic pelican]

Do you know the server norden free admin?

Ill be on the eu one

spawn as a dilo

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-meme-spongebob-screaming-spongebob-screaming-run-away-gif-4374785819174740755

[cosmic pelican]

mhmm -

[clear torrent]

ok

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-eating-potato-kitty-asmr-gif-17215228159060317844

[cosmic pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-star-mmm-cheesy-cheese-cheesy-gif-19257011

[elfin night]

Because you really don’t know how to use omni most likely

If you buff Omni’s stam even by 30%, then it would be able to one shot ceras and carnos

And it is infinitely more agile than dilo. So having an issue with it being 20 CENTIMETERS PER SECOND slower than a dilo is a huge skill issue and L movement

And also your ability does have a big stam cost because it turns you untargetable to your victim and can one shot a third of the roster while also draining enemy stamina and slowing them down

[cosmic pelican]

are you from na perchance? youre getting some insane hits on me

[clear torrent]

yeah na

[cosmic pelican]

yeah I can feel it lol

[clear torrent]

its just not fair,they should reduce speed for dilo, or buff lmb for raptor

[cosmic pelican]

I have 30 ping

[clear torrent]

oof lucky, i got 100

[dusky surge]

raptor's LMB is really good besides a bizarre cooldown

damage wise it's really decent

[clear torrent]

come on they do 65

[dusky surge]

VERY good for their size

[clear torrent]

well i guess if everyone is happy with the current raptor, i might be wrong 🙂

[dusky surge]

raptor is getting buffs to its stam

[clear torrent]

oh that is nice to hear

[dusky surge]

making dilo slower than raptor would be asking to basically just murder dilo too tbh

dilo cannot jump, not does it have remotely good agility or swim speed. its best chance of not dying to a raptor is just going as fast as it possibly can

which is why it's ever so slightly faster

[worthy steeple]

LMAO

thats how i feel fighting flows

[cosmic pelican]

Ill admit I got my ass kicked, but tbf more than 3x the ping diff so yeah

[elfin night]

You can juke dilo even as a pachy or herra 😭 😭 what’s the deal with it being 20cm/s faster than Omni while having less stamina runtime and no jump

[worthy steeple]

rip

[cosmic pelican]

Dear old Flows laughing in the corner with his 200 ping on eu servers

[worthy steeple]

this is not flows, but still a funny clip

[clear torrent]

and dilo dps more, by chance u get stuck on some tree, it gets like 3-4 hits like its nothing, back to red health

[worthy steeple]

so yesterday there was a troodon mixpacking with the omnis on eu4 and i swear to god it came back from the death like 6-7 times, basically every 10 minutes it just comes back, i kill it and then repeats.

then it gave up and started 1 calling for like 30 minutes, thats was insane, i bet that was you.. potato..

[cosmic pelican]

1v1 in the open, omni wins, 1v1 near a forest dilo wins, I think thats fair

But to each their own

[clear torrent]

agreed

[cosmic pelican]

And I also agree dilo is so op, but not via stats, but via venom

[clear torrent]

but once u envomed, dilo can just run in the open and let the clones kill, needs 1 hit at night, 2 in morning i think

[elfin night]

Yeah it is almost twice your size and less nimble

[cosmic pelican]

1 headshot during the day does it too

[elfin night]

If you get stuck is very much your fault

[clear torrent]

bruh im talking about balancing in natural gameplay. you know, nevermind just leave it, i admit defeat

[elfin night]

sorry if I am coming off as dismissive

Like yeah I can get why you’re feeling that way and it’s pretty common for people to feel like omni sucks

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/anakin-panakin-gif-429689948583496685

[elfin night]

But in a vacuum everything is fine really

Its is extremely hard to play solo with it unless you pin or go for things not much larger

Although I think dilo has its issues, but not in speed

[cosmic pelican]

increasing omni speed would also not only affect its matchup with dilo, but completely screw things like maia and carno

[crimson crater]

im seeing so many omni buff suggestions lately

its like theyre a hive mind

[pallid robin]

Make Omni faster

[elfin night]

improve your movement

[minor axle]

Pack mind

[iron tree]

nuh uh

[steep otter]

it already is very fast

[cosmic pelican]

The Nickboay brainrot is spreading

[hasty coyote]

the main issue I see with a lot of omni feedback is that they want to buff its already insane strengths, but do nothing to the insane weaknesses it has (which is the problem).

[urban delta]

i main omni bt they do not need to be faster. they have best agility if the game

[hasty coyote]

Like make scraping not as hard of a counter, but buff bucking in return. So it isnt "hard counter or die" when dealing with omnis

[urban delta]

dilo and carno have horrible turning and slow swim speed that you can take advantage of to escape.

[elfin night]

We should mass report nickboay’s videos

[worthy steeple]

lmaoo

[iron tree]

Omni is doing well

it doesn't need a buff

[worthy steeple]

ill be honest that guy is having some massive skill issues considering he has like what 7k+ hours? at least thats what he says

[crimson crater]

nah hes decent at the game, some of his balance takes aint it though

[elfin night]

He is good with Omni

Just extremely biased because muh favorite dinosaur

[worthy steeple]

i mean, he’s either extremely biased/doesnt understand how balance works/ or actually having skill issues, because as far as i can tell current omni stam is apparently not enough

omni has tons of stamina considering it’s a pack hunter and one of the fastest dinos in the game. most of them just do brainless pounce spam and that never works

[iron tree]

it ain't even a dinosaur

I do short pounces, go in for some bites while regenerating some stamina

if you play omni like that you can beat even large prey solo

[elfin night]

I once soloed a fg cera 😭

It was bad but still

Also almost got a 2.5 ton or so steg if it wasn’t for a herd coming to the rescue

[viscid mica]

@near shore that sounds like a hacker or desync, cera can’t reach that far it’s not a hitbox issue

@elfin night dibbles grow is fine for its size trikes is just way to much power way to fast

@iron tree dilos venom is on and off buggy them being invisible and invincible isn’t intended

@waxen lance it’s more like 80% when you hit 4T

[waxen lance]

yeah thats for on land though, in water its almost to adult

6+ tons idk the exact cutoff

[viscid mica]

true

Ya then like 92ish XD

you go from 2T at 70%-8T in under 30%

[waxen lance]

yeah its ridiculous, grabbing and drowning shouldnt even be an option to kill other deinos

[waxen lance]

yeahh, it needs adjustment

[viscid mica]

Yeaaaaa drowning other water based Dino’s is weird imo

[waxen lance]

literally

[viscid mica]

Oh no I love that growth curve

It’s just designed weirdly

[waxen lance]

well atleast adjustment if the grab stuff is gonna be unchanged

[viscid mica]

It has no self survivability which is highly abnormal

[viscid mica]

Just make it not reduce air from semi aquatics

[waxen lance]

yeah that'd be perfect

[viscid mica]

Make them use left click for things that aren’t other FG deinos

[waxen lance]

yepp

[dusky surge]

Nickboay feeding the hivemind with a new balance take that they will echo in islecord for the next few days

[knotty stratus]

https://tenor.com/view/punisher-no-no-no-tanklorde-gif-13191678230910881285

[iron tree]

I'm aware

[alpine plover]

I wanted to ask why you don't want Dilos to be slower? I mean, they're incredibly strong with their bite and everything; they can kill anything if they want. And why doesn't Dilo have a Utah diet, and vice versa?

[elfin night]

Because dilo has abysmal agility

It doesn’t need to be slower than Omni when they very much are about the same speed

But Omni can break its ankles so easily

Dilo speed is far from being a problem

The venom and the consequences it has in its kit to balance it out, however…

[dusky surge]

also raptor can jump

[hasty coyote]

1:clones are def op, which makes current dilo appear stronger than it should.
2: if you nerf its speed, it will flat out die to Omnis. Its superior dps is only strong because it can stick on an Omni to consistently bite. If Omni was faster, then dilo would not be able to get more than 1 bite at a time. And that’s if the Omni gets hit since dilo’s agility and alts are poor. On top of that, the Omnis can pounce the dilo dealing MUCH more damage with no way to counter attack.
3: dilos only way to escape an Omni is speed. Dilo can’t jump, is bigger so it’s harder to hide, has far worse agility, and has LOUD footsteps. Meanwhile an Omni can use any of those advantages to escape a dilo even if it’s slower.
4: they don’t have each other on their diets because the devs are trying to move away from carnivores having other carnivores on their diets. That way carnivore deathmatch locations become less popular and actually following the herbivores and their migrations becomes the preferred playstyle.

[arctic sigil]

hes mostly right tho

[cosmic pelican]

Hes a nice guy, but his balance takes arent it

[alpine plover]

okay now I understand and everything seems to be fine as it is. Thanks for answer

[arctic sigil]

it has below average stam for a land carnivore stam and has the ability with most stam usage in the game

[cosmic pelican]

Its also the only animal which can deal more than twice its weight in dmg (more than 3x in the ht, since its stam got buffed).

[arctic sigil]

considering every single bush or plant can dismount you mostly provoking a visual bug that makes you think you are still in pounce and getting killed as a result i think its a fair trade

oh also they can dismount you just holding E since buck stam usage got lower its worth doing it too

if you mean doing 3x damage in hordetest with pounce, i dont think thats right bc only basic pounce got the stam buffed if you do bleed or damage the stamina usage is the same

[cosmic pelican]

Small foliage doesnt knock you down in the HT

[arctic sigil]

it got fixed? finally

[cosmic pelican]

I am talking about the no input pounce yes, it does ~1.5k dmg, plus ~4.5k bleed dmg with a full stam bar

[arctic sigil]

but yea its still very difficult to get full pounced unless you get pinned or you are in a open field

[arctic sigil]

basic pounce?

[cosmic pelican]

Yes

[arctic sigil]

without damage variant

[cosmic pelican]

Yes

You can almost 1 shot a stego with it using the bleed

[arctic sigil]

mhmm i gotta test that

[cosmic pelican]

Takes ages to deal the full dmg, since it only does 6dps, but the fact it can put an apex to the danger zone with 1 stam bar only further proves omni is fine where it is

[arctic sigil]

im not asking for a bug

buff*

i didnt try omni in hordetest but a big issue it had was the little bushes being able to dismount you, and the way it hixbox is so big while latching making it more easy to pounce the latched omni than the empty slot and how anything that bites its likely hitting the latched omni even if you aim correctly

[torn egret]

Sounds to me like Omni should be fine now then, If the base pounce is that strong, All be it only useful to the patient Omnis. It's like the left/r click pounces are just to "Speed up" the fights on smaller things.
Nuetral pounce seems the way to go for big things then.
People too focused on "kill in 30 seconds" combat. That's why there are too many Dilos out rn lol.

Hows the Troo feeling for everyone? The new pounce feels great for me but

[hasty coyote]

not to mention, neutral pounce BURNS the target's stamina. So just neutral pouncing and waiting for the target to run out of stam and get pinned is honestly insanely strong.

[steep gazelle]

There are many things about omni that players don't know about and don't use.

Many simply don't know that Damage Pounce is very strong and does 975 damage if it uses all of its stam. Stick it to a dilo in the open, make it slow and voila, you've killed a dilo without any difficulty.

2 using the damage pounce on a Carno/Cera. Many just use the bleed pounce and only use the damage pounce when they can grapple someone

[rapid flume]

I don't see the point in ever bleed pouncing a cera

[warm flax]

my stam got burn out by 3-4 raptor latches on me while I'm playing a full grown deino
I was chasing a cannibal and he called his pets to stop me and manage to get away

[sacred zodiac]

ok so im not crazy, deino is super unbalanced lmao

[rapid flume]

it's not deino, it's omni

[iron tree]

The reason omni ain't taking over is desync

[warm flax]

I didn't even press the buck button or sprint and my stam drain so fast that Im force to give up the chase on land

[elfin night]

And well

I should have said that I genuinely think Shant, spino and cama should all be over 10 hours for sure

Spino maybe 11

[obtuse ocean]

Whats the reason behind the long grows ?

[elfin night]

Making the titanic apexes require actual commitment to grow unlike cera so there’s not 5 spinos in every river

[obtuse ocean]

I mean personally i think trike is crap, dont even feel like an apex. And 5 spinos that close should be fighting over food. Make them hard to survive

I hope you cant just chill in a river as spino, and never move.

[elfin night]

What 😭

Trike with almost 10k health, sparring mode and two shotting ceras is crap?

And also gaining over half of its weight before 40%

[obtuse ocean]

Yea the fact it needs two hits on a darn cera is insane, its an apex. You should not facetank that thing, it litterly says dont facetank me.

And cera is small

imagine facetanking a trike "skill", and still live. I get if your something like allo etc

[elfin night]

I mean, all it takes is a knockdown and another blow to kill a cera lol

You leave it in orange with one blow and if it delivers to you a charged bite while facetanking, then you lose less than 1% of your health

[obtuse ocean]

Well yea thats actually a good point, i dont mean you should just click and dead cera so i get that.

[elfin night]

And honestly stego is one of those apexes that should totally one shot a cera since it focuses on damage

But trike has the defense too. It can afford so many more hits than steg

Potentially, trike has twelve times as much effective health as steg which is insane

3k vs 38k

[obtuse ocean]

Yea pros and cons, i personally tho stego was not an apex. I still get pot vibes from them, where the apexes gets harresed cus they are just so slow and sluggish and even if they hit you. You dont even care. Hopefully im wrong lol

[elfin night]

@leaden shoal was it already confirmed? I'm assuming that's the meaning of the clock

[leaden shoal]

No I don´t think it was confirmed. The meaning of the clock was that that´s a really long time imo, but I didn´t dislike your idea so I didn´t put an x. But yeah for balance wise that time would probably be best though

[elfin night]

I mean

It is a good way to discourage overpopulation if apexes are hard and also long to grow

[leaden shoal]

Yeah that´s true, I just think a lot of people won´t be able to play as an apex or ever really try it if it takes that long. But there are many playables that don´t take long to pick from for people with less time, so it´s still fair for them. Just wasn´t sure, but now I think such long growth times are still better overall for the game

[viscid mica]

@elfin night what is trikes grow rn on good diet

(I grew one over like a week so I don’t know the exact hours)

[crystal stream]

Peak my newest post on balance feedback for some opinions I need to have a counter argument

[worthy steeple]

i don’t think carno should be 1.8t, because it’s really hard to balance something that big and fast at the same time

[crystal stream]

In a world with a 3 ton dibble and huge teno I think it would fit

Dibble was 2 tons max

[worthy steeple]

we got that issue with the maia and it being a herbivore is probably the only reason it’s not getting nerfed

[worthy steeple]

yeah, so? teno irl was like 700kg or something

irl doesn’t matter at all

[crystal stream]

Yeah teno in this game is huge

[worthy steeple]

it’s not just huge, it’s absolutely fictional

[crystal stream]

I don’t think they need to nerf it I jst think the matchup with teno and carnos should have stayed

Plus carnos turn was really bad to compensate for its speed

[worthy steeple]

it’s honestly doesn’t even look like it’s fossil, not to mention it most likely couldn’t kick irl

[crystal stream]

And size

[crystal stream]

Probably lol

But I do think a carno v teno matchup should be in the tenos favor but not like it is rn

[worthy steeple]

i prefer brawler carno, the one we had before had such bad stamina management, also bleed weakness and stuff

with the new one you can fight longer, it’s more fun

[crystal stream]

I feel like that was a good way to balance it for being so big and fast tho

Mb for all the replies btw

[worthy steeple]

tbh 2 carnos vs teno in open field is carno sided, same with cera, it has no chances

[viscid mica]

@tight cove well teno can be easy to actually be really good at 10 now and be able to fight large groups of things or stuff your size you have to be objectively good at teno. Most tenos can’t handle a duo of competent carnos, or even a a half decent group of omnis

[worthy steeple]

maybe, i mean it’s just playstyle you prefer, i like the current carno more, especially after multiple HT buffs

[crystal stream]

True the HT buffs don’t rlly help in my favor tho lol

[worthy steeple]

teno takes a lot of skill honestly…

[crystal stream]

Yeah kinda

Jst spam kicks tbh tho

[viscid mica]

What are carno HT buffs again

[crystal stream]

Tenos on a good place rn I jst wish Carno was stronger so it can actually compete with teno

[worthy steeple]

yes, honestly the current carno is more like rugops? i’d expect them to make carno big and add rugops with the current carno combat system

[viscid mica]

With enough practice, they’re easily avoidable and punishable

[worthy steeple]

but it’s just me guessing

[crystal stream]

You can’t punish teno kick as Carno you can punish tail slam

[viscid mica]

Oh, you think so?

[worthy steeple]

you need a lot of skill to kill a teno in 1v1, that’s for sure, but once there’s 2 decent carnos against a teno.. well it better find something to hide behind, because it’s probably not going to win this

[viscid mica]

I duo hunt tenos all the time as carno it’s really not that hard

[crystal stream]

Yeah I play Carno a lot and fight plenty of tenos and win but a good teno all it has to do if jst keep running at you

[viscid mica]

Unless you meet a teno,, who actually knows what they’re doing

[crystal stream]

And kicking

[worthy steeple]

yeah, but tbf one teno combo and you need to sit to not bleed out LMAO, glad it’s fixed on HT

[viscid mica]

Don’t get hit

[worthy steeple]

real

[crystal stream]

Those tenos have to be rlly bad ngl

[worthy steeple]

not at all, you underestimate good carnos

[viscid mica]

No, combat fundamentals for all dinos are the key to beating tenos

[crystal stream]

I am a good Carno a good teno is insanely hard to fight and way harder than it needs to be

[viscid mica]

Spacing, timing, where to attack and knowing the move said of your opponent are all you need

[worthy steeple]

there’s carnos that couldn’t kill me in 5v1 and there’s a carno that i was sweating fighting against, skill matters so much, especially with the current brawler carno

[worthy steeple]

i mean, all teno needs to do is find a cover and then carno is basically useless

[viscid mica]

I mean your average teno can’t handle two carnos but I do know for a fact that the highly skilled or even top 1% of Teno players are an extremely difficult fight and not worth it

[crystal stream]

Same can be said abt the old matchup

[worthy steeple]

not just teno, any dino it’s fighting

carno is only good in plains

[viscid mica]

The only difference being that you don’t have to have skill to beat that. You can knock over teno with enough time and you can go straight through the body unlike now

[viscid mica]

Not exactly

The only terrain where I’d say, Carno really suffers is up and downhill

[crystal stream]

Nr all a teno had to do is side step and punish

[viscid mica]

If you letting them sidestep you, you’re bad

[crystal stream]

Teno way more agile

So nr

[viscid mica]

You can literally release the charge and change direction quickly

Don’t be afraid to let go of the charge drift and then charge again

[worthy steeple]

i mean, yes? carno is only really effective in open, if there’s rock between you and carno or you’re in the forest carno is a lot less effective

[crystal stream]

Old carno or new carno

[tight cove]

I get what you saying but at the same time I still think teno needs a bit of a stam nerf because it’s still far to easy imo, as a teno you really never worry about running out of stam in a fight and honestly for the most part all you need to do as teno is spam kick 😂

[crystal stream]

You couldn’t do that with old carno

[worthy steeple]

if i’m teno hiding behind the rock well that carno will never catch me

[viscid mica]

New, old you had to commit but you could still cancel charge and evade easily

[crystal stream]

Even now there is a dely and even a semi smart teno can punish it

[hasty coyote]

The main issue with having carno and teno be more even is that you then have to nerf carno’s ability to hunt smalls substantially. So it ends up only being able to ambush smalls and only consistantly hunt dilo, cera, teno and lone galis. Or it becomes absolutely oppressive to the small tiers. I think what we have now is a good balance. A good carno can absolutely shred a mediocre teno, but equal skill, the teno generally wins. Similar thing with cera. And carno can still hunt smalls substantially tiers well without being overly oppressive.

[viscid mica]

They more dumb for trying to take that fight than anything

[viscid mica]

Not if you react quick enough

[worthy steeple]

yeah for sure, but that’s the point, carno can’t be effective there

[tight cove]

A good teno player doesn’t fear a carno duo either

[viscid mica]

Fair I mean I personally think it’s fine sense teno is a brawler and really shouldn’t be worried about stam

[worthy steeple]

well it absolutely should

teno is not autowin, if you just stay in the middle of the plain you will not win the fight easily

[crystal stream]

I’m not trying to be a scum but I fight and 1v1 teno all the time in dm and win and lose it jst feels so unnecessaryly unfair when it was perfect

[worthy steeple]

ofc if carnos are good, if they just charge your butt then you win anyway LMAO

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1232185340425404427/1348207013179686984/IMG_2950.gif

[tight cove]

Against 2 carnos it’s almost guaranteed the teno wins bro if it’s good

3 carnos then the carnos have a chance but your at minimum losing 1 person

[worthy steeple]

it’s never guaranteed

[crystal stream]

2 good carnos can kill teno idk abt a rlly good teno tho because teno has all the tools to be insane

[worthy steeple]

again, i won 1v5 against carnos and i suffered in 1v1, it really depends

never underestimate others skill and especially the power of desync and wild hitboxes

[crystal stream]

Carnos like that are way harder to come by then your making it sound

Only reason why I’m good is because i play dm

And practice a lot

[worthy steeple]

i mean yeah, doesn’t change anything tho

good tenos are rare as well

good players in general

[crystal stream]

Nr

I don’t play teno a lot but one kick and stun puts a carno to yellow so I see no reason why someone would be bad at teno

[tight cove]

True 😂

[viscid mica]

Death match is a terrible example of real combat

Not everyone gonna have full stam full health full hunger best combat perks

I hate deathmatch as examples for balancing

[crystal stream]

That’s why it’s a fair 1v1

[tight cove]

Yeah keep in mind I’m not saying it’s impossible I’m just saying in general a good teno def has the advantage

[crystal stream]

Yeah

Honestly I still think old carnos matchup was still better the only issues I could see is cera and how it gets destroyed by old Carno

[viscid mica]

I’d rather base my opinion off 50 fights in survival than 10 1v1 in perfect conditions

[crystal stream]

True but the combat perks and the full health and hunger go for both it’s never rlly one sided plus you can’t go around killing 60 percent grown tenos as a full grown Carno and say that Carno stronger same with health difference you don’t know if that teno is full health or not so you can’t rlly say it’s a fair 1v1

[tight cove]

There’s nothing funnier that kicking a carno a lot and chasing it down and watching it drop from bleeding out 🤣☠️☠️ teno bleed is nutz

[worthy steeple]

i did that…

[crystal stream]

Only hope carno has to not have that happen is to not get kciked not even once

[worthy steeple]

but that was when i was fighting 2 carnos and 2 ceras mixpack

[crystal stream]

Did you win

[tight cove]

If honestly assume that he won since teno can just avoid the ceras and if the carnos try to fight just kick it 2 times and it’ll run 😂

[crystal stream]

Are tenos faster than cersd

[tight cove]

Yeah

[crystal stream]

Cera

[viscid mica]

I don’t count under 100s unless I’m roughly same size

[crystal stream]

The teno v cera matchups pretty fun

[viscid mica]

.1

[tight cove]

Faster, I think more running stam, and a better trot speed

[viscid mica]

Not exactly cera and teno have roughly same run time

[tight cove]

Yeah I think so too, but it’s still teno sided which honestly is fine

[tight cove]

Ok

[crystal stream]

Yeah teno has a lot of good matchups only thing it struggles with is groups of 2 or more ceras or carnos

[tight cove]

Yeah and against ceras it can just run away and be fine 😂

[crystal stream]

New and old carnos because a lot of old carnos where bad lol

.1 tho

There kinda the same speed and run time

[tight cove]

Teno apparently doesn’t have more run stam than cera I guess it’s equal but teno is still faster and has the better trot speed so most of the time a teno will escape a cera if it wants

AND teno can jump on rocks 😂

[hasty coyote]

iirc teno has slightly longer runtime, by like 30 seconds or so, but both have a very long run time

[tight cove]

Damn 30 secs of extra run time is definitely a game changer

[crystal stream]

I feel like when it comes to the Carno v teno matchup ppl forget how good teno rlly is

[crystal stream]

Omg yeah that tenos gone lol

[tight cove]

Ngl carno just overall sucks rn its really bad

[crystal stream]

lol I jst need old carno and I’ll be happy

[tight cove]

2 carnos can barely fight a small dibble 💀

[crystal stream]

Dibble is not carnos strong suit tho

I feel like teno is the perfect prey for Carno prey meaning it can fight back tho

[tight cove]

Ik but im just saying like carno is just weak af rn

[crystal stream]

I think teno and Mia should be the only two herbies a carno can fight

[hasty coyote]

ok its about 24 seconds more, this is from a bit ago, but I dont think teno or cera have had any stam changes since and it seems accurate. #evrima-sa message

[crystal stream]

Not charging mia tho

Jst biting

[hasty coyote]

maia is gonna be impossible to fight alone, ngl. That stat difference is too great, especially since maia stuns carno

[tight cove]

U need at least 3 carnos to fight a good Maia but luckily most Maia players are trash and Maia is overall kinda complex Dino to handle this is why I can’t wait for the Maia buffs next patch

[crystal stream]

Yeah def in mias favor ive fought an few Mias as a carno and got them pretty low but never killed fully in a solo fair 1v1

[hasty coyote]

like maia can trade bite for alt attack 1:1 and kill a carno with only 1/3rd of its hp missing

[tight cove]

Interesting

[crystal stream]

Old carno would have more health but would still struggle against Mia

[tight cove]

Once they finally fix the stance switching bug then Maia is gonna be a beast.

[hasty coyote]

well its about to become much worse, maia is getting major buffs in the ht, its alts are SOOO much faster. They will trade hit for hit at the minimum if they have even 2 braincells rattling in there.

[crystal stream]

I can’t wait mias my main next to Carno

[hasty coyote]

thats also fixed in the ht

[tight cove]

Really? I didn’t realize they fixed the glitch nice 😎

[crystal stream]

lol yeah the new hord testing changes are going to make it rlly good

I can’t wait

[hasty coyote]

I genuinely think maia will be incredibly oppressive in the right hands.

[crystal stream]

Yeah rn it’s kinda bad but a Mia than knows what’s it’s doing can hold its own

Can’t wait till it’s buffs to see how they preform

[worthy steeple]

yeah..

[worthy steeple]

have you played as HT maia? it’s WILD

[crystal stream]

It tried I grew one but all the servers are empty to fight as it

[worthy steeple]

bad stam is probably the only thing that can stop it lol, which is easily fixable by more maias and tactile endurance

[worthy steeple]

fair

[viscid mica]

Tbh it struggles with groups of anything if the skill level is all roughly the same thou on the lower end it tends to win more

[crystal stream]

True tenos stun helps it out a lot tho

[viscid mica]

100%

I’d say on the higher level is when tenos start to struggle especially if they aren’t a super good teno

[viscid mica]

Don’t think it IS Maia are menaces and with the change too reactiveness and responsiveness in its attacks it can throw hands way better now

[crystal stream]

Anyone can be good enough but it’s a lot less common to see

[viscid mica]

100%

Tbh a lot of skill comes down to knowledge and experience of the basics and not the Dino specifics

A great example is dibble low level of entry skill to be good but also a very low bar for the difference between a good and bad dibble the main difference being basic combat knowledge etc. spacing, timing and all that jazz

[crimson crater]

#balance-feedback message @tight cove how much are you thinking for %?

[elfin night]

Only grew a trike once but it took me on approximately that like 6ish hours I think

so I definitely think it wouldn't hurt to have 2-3 hours more for something that strong

[iron tree]

20%

[iron tree]

We don't know that

We have two fragmentary skulls of diabloceratops

And we can't just estimate its entire size based on a fragmentary skull

[hasty coyote]

ime, theres a very big difference to a good and bad diablo: its ability to cover its flanks. Bad diablos will struggle to cover their flanks, especially when dealing with mutliple targets. A good diablo will be nigh unapproachable to our current roster. Especially once we get predators designed to hunt diablos (other than just omni packs) this will become much more apparent.

[iron tree]

I am able to hold my own against a full cera pack

[viscid mica]

So it woulda been like 10 on bad diet

[iron tree]

There is a room at Highlands

[elfin night]

maybe

[viscid mica]

Basic combat knowledge though not dibble specific

[elfin night]

it's not much more than deino

[iron tree]

I used it to trap ceras to finish them off

[crystal stream]

lol true 3 tons still pretty big lol

[iron tree]

Yeah

[tight cove]

I think at least make the kicks take 5-6% stam

[hasty coyote]

diablo has very unique movement that does not apply to any other dino except trike.

[tight cove]

You can Maybe leave everything else untouched but it would need testing

[hasty coyote]

hence why I consider it a diablo specific skill

[iron tree]

The thing with carno: while I do love my 2t carnotaurus it's not fair at all to make it 1.8t with the current build

[crimson crater]

overkill, 4 - 3.5% would be ideal

[iron tree]

In real life Carno would most likely destroy ceras

[crystal stream]

That’s why they need to scrap all the buffs and give it back to what it was before

[iron tree]

Hell, it was most likely able to have an equal fight against an allosaurus fragilis

[tight cove]

4% ain’t bad

[iron tree]

The only Carno build that could work is update 5 carno

[obtuse ocean]

But it was so bad atleast with the turn, it was fun having a carno chasing you as omni to see when he will give up

[tight cove]

Tenos attacks only taking 2% stam is ridiculous 😐

[crystal stream]

Witch one was that again

[obtuse ocean]

I still today dont know how legacy carno was so good and bad at the same time lol

[crystal stream]

lol yeah that’s how they balanced it tho

[crimson crater]

ima be honest, i agree with you but at the same time i don’t feel like it should be asthmatic. current teno feels so free in the stamina department that it kinda loses the sense of being an animal at some point

[iron tree]

The nesting update

[crimson crater]

definitely too low

[iron tree]

When nesting and skins dropped

[crystal stream]

Could it still knock down teno

[tight cove]

Yeah that’s why at the very least the kicks need to take more stam to use

[iron tree]

If you ambushed it

[crystal stream]

That’s the Carno I need then lol

[iron tree]

Charge wasn't very powerful in terms of damage

It was rather an ambush tool than an attack

[iron tree]

It's my favourite Carno build

[viscid mica]

But the knowledge and understanding of how to and need to cover the flank again comes from combat basics specifically spacing and timing yes it does have to do with dibble abit more directly. It’s not like a new dibble with a lot of talent in dibble will be able to make those calls without the experience of the basics of combat

[iron tree]

It wasn't op either as it was very weak to bleed

Omnis could take it down

[crystal stream]

Perfect in my opinion

[iron tree]

It was

Until 5.5 made Carno terrible again

[obtuse ocean]

I miss legacy carno, i actyally feared it as small dino

[iron tree]

We are not gonna talk about update 6 though

Update 6 was one of the updates ever

[viscid mica]

Carno isn’t that bad once you learn how to properly cycle charge and drift alt

It could use a lil love for sure

[obtuse ocean]

I think its really bad, cus i do understand the carnos charge/drift etc. People also get better at other dinos : P

[crystal stream]

I think you forget how good other Dino’s that can fight carno are

[viscid mica]

I mean if you master them you could easy take in the entire carni roaster as it stands 1-1 and a good portion of the herbis the only one you can’t really take in the under 2T category is a goated teno

[viscid mica]

Not really I don’t have trouble with a large portion of the current roaster

[obtuse ocean]

You meaning 1v1 or ?

[iron tree]

Carno is great in the current ht

[viscid mica]

Yes 1v1

[viscid mica]

What did they adjust in HT again?

[crimson crater]

#balance-feedback message @sweet estuary its noticeably worse than omnis, good agility is also part of its identity

[crystal stream]

Dibble a good Mia cera hell even 2 solos

[viscid mica]

Cera is a easy 1v1

[sweet estuary]

yeah thats true but if it lags just a bit its kinda sucky

[viscid mica]

You shouldn’t be trying to fight dibble or Maia 1v1

[obtuse ocean]

Yea for me its bad then, it should def go for packs. If its supose to be small hunter. They normally dont come in a 1v1 fight. In the open area im talking now, if you start going into some dense area you can be the hunted one

[crystal stream]

Lol nah

[viscid mica]

Skill issue

[crystal stream]

A slightly competent cera can kill a carno

[viscid mica]

Oh ya with some good cycle charging you can wipe out entire dilo and omni packs like they are nothing

[viscid mica]

I’m talking from high experience carno pov not average

Average sure cera wins but from a top of the line point even a amazing cera will lose to a equal carno

[iron tree]

Stamina buffs, agility buffs and they removed the bleed multipliers

[obtuse ocean]

Yea agree

[viscid mica]

Sheeesh

[crystal stream]

Ig yeah

But still need old carno lol

[worthy steeple]

hmm meow meow…

[sweet estuary]

im jus sayin for small tiers the ceras turn radius is alot more than it should be

[viscid mica]

Would be nice but I like where they went

[viscid mica]

Honestly reducing that bleed multiplier is massive for carno sustain

[crystal stream]

Yeah I do to I jst don’t think carno should be the Dino to fill the small game hunter position

[viscid mica]

Aight we carno growing in HT when I have the chance so prolly tmrw night

[viscid mica]

fair ¯_(ツ)_/¯

I think carno fits it well

Stun, fast, has good map control, can easily avoid fights with larger things

[crystal stream]

Rogops would be a great fit

[viscid mica]

Isn’t Rogops like 700-900kg?

[crystal stream]

Rogops is small

And a abelisaur

I think

It’s just a smaller carno kinda like what we have now jst a lil more small

[obtuse ocean]

Im abit worried about the speed, evrima is fast. Fighting 3 carnos in legacy as allo, was easy. But 3 good who understood the range and speed. Was like 10x harder lol

[crystal stream]

Every Dino was slower in legacy tho including the Dino the carnos attack

[obtuse ocean]

Yepp true

[crystal stream]

Honestly they prob won’t change carno I jst hope when the games complete there’s a way to change the balance so we can make carno and other Dino’s how we want

[elfin night]

@crystal stream ur asking for apex carno…?

[crystal stream]

If you want to call it that yes update 5 Carno was perfect in my opinion

[elfin night]

So a carno who has a good matchup against a teno or a cera

Or that it rolls ceras even

While being 20kph faster…

[viscid mica]

Ya then it wouldn’t be good at wiping groups of small things like carnos new kit was built for

[crystal stream]

Cera gets rolled I will atmit but tenos matchup was a lot more fun and fair

[viscid mica]

I mean with how omnidirectional combat is now thou it won’t be as hard as you think

Allo will do serious damage to carno

[elfin night]

How is it not fair now? Carnos can choose to not engage tenos if they don’t want to

[crystal stream]

Don’t forget how bad carnos turning was to

[viscid mica]

Usually for tenos you wanna test the waters see if they panic kick

[crystal stream]

Teno should be something a carno can fight

[viscid mica]

If they do they are free 99 if they don’t they are good save your breath and health

[viscid mica]

They can if they aren’t too skilled

[crystal stream]

Maybe not win every time but still be a tough fight for both

[crystal stream]

True but a average teno will destroy most carnos while only the best carnos even stand a chance

[viscid mica]

Fair

The 1s is always extra hard for defensive brawlers like dibble and teno

[elfin night]

Yeah, and that ain’t good

Carno shouldn’t really be close to a 50/50 or even have the upper hand like at all

[viscid mica]

Tbh currently it isn’t

[elfin night]

And that is good and preferable

[viscid mica]

So I think it’s fine, I mean objectively even 1.8 carno would lose to teno

In the 1s that is

[crystal stream]

Old carno was a 50/50 your underestimating teno

[viscid mica]

Though it would be a far harder fight for teno

[crystal stream]

For sure

[viscid mica]

Only the top tenos would really stand a chance against a solid carno

[crystal stream]

You would have to be good for sure but it’s way better than the 60% win chance a teno has rn

[viscid mica]

Ya but I don’t think that’s the goal for carno and I don’t mind teno having advantage against carno due to current carnos CC (crowd control) capacity

Carnos excel in the chaos of numbers

3rd partying fights of bigger stuff is the way to do it

[crystal stream]

For sure but I might be tripping but teno has it insanely easy when it come to a Dino who’s almost the same size and weight

Well was

[elfin night]

Yup, that ain’t well balanced then

You cannot have a 50/50 matchup with one of the sides being vastly faster than the other in the vast majority of circumstances (no big body of water around)

[viscid mica]

Oh ya it is easy to start but not easy to be amazing

[crystal stream]

Teno is way more agile it doesn’t need to be faster

[elfin night]

Because then carno can force the teno into a fight as it can’t run away nor disengage if things turn ugly. And if the carno starts losing it can simply escape

[viscid mica]

^

[crystal stream]

Carno turned like a fright train and had terrible bleed resistance

[elfin night]

Loses value when you are that long. Carno would just keep hitting it if it tries to run away so it is forced to fight

[crystal stream]

Teno bleed and raw dmg would have a carno rethinking fast

[viscid mica]

^ ya it’s easy to clip hits

[viscid mica]

If they hit you

[crystal stream]

Witch wasn’t hard with old carno

[viscid mica]

But HT carno doesn’t have the same bleed disadvantages

[crystal stream]

Now it’s hard

Because carnos more agile

[viscid mica]

Tbh I’m gonna try HT carno and see what they changed you should too cuz from what I’ve heard it’s a good bit stronger

[crystal stream]

I don’t think it’s anything to crazy

[elfin night]

Carno was in such a weird spot back then

[viscid mica]

Reducing or removing the bleed multiplier is huge

Any increase in speed effects the stun math

[crystal stream]

How so

[elfin night]

You really want that terrible bleed resistance again alongside that abysmal agility, growing in 3 hours and also that pathetically low stam runtime?

All of its stats were gutted due to the charge and being able to knock over a cera or a teno and punish it with massive damage

[crystal stream]

Makes up for it being rlly fast and having stun that’s why it was fair

[elfin night]

It’s one dimensional design 😭 😭 😭

[viscid mica]

Na I’ll agree carno was kinda boring to play

You basically pimp walked the whole map for everything to just not fight you

[crystal stream]

lol your faster you control what fights you or not

[crystal stream]

Ngl I’m kinda dumb what does that mean 😂

[elfin night]

that it just relies on one technique (which by the way is very easy to use) and it is completely helpless in every other field. Zero adaptability

[viscid mica]

until ** ROCKS** decide to exist

[elfin night]

Zero flexibility

it was so aggressively mid

[viscid mica]

Most the roaster back then could just jump up a 2 ft rock and boom untouchable

Carno was for all intensive purposes the land apex

Kinda boring when it’s not what the wanted

[crystal stream]

So carno being able to strictly be able to only charge things smaller that teno it’s still not very flexible

[crystal stream]

They still exist

[viscid mica]

Exactly

[elfin night]

Because there’s also niche and roles. Why would you need to charge at say, a dibble?

[iron tree]

yes

[viscid mica]

Pretty flexible it can handle the low end of mid tiers decently and can easily fight high end small tiers

[crystal stream]

Shouldn’t be fighting dibble in the first place it’s not what carnos built for Carno should be able to fight small teirs and be able to “compete” in creatures it’s weight class

[crystal stream]

What is a mid tier in your opinion

[viscid mica]

Personally I rank them higher but most rank them above 1- to 4T range (me it’s 2-below5T)

But I use what most people do for the sake of my sanity

[crystal stream]

Dibbles mid teir and Carno doesn’t stand a chance and it shouldn’t tenos like semi mid teir and it’s possible but really hard for Carno even tho there in the same weight class

[viscid mica]

By my personal standard, they aren’t, but yes, and to be clear Double’s farther on the higher end of mid tiers by all standards

At no point should that be an easy fight (or even practical) for carno

[elfin night]

Exactly.

Hence why you cannot charge something larger than a teno

[crystal stream]

Ehh Yeah…

[crystal stream]

Why not carnos the same size

If not a lil larger

I also don’t think it should be easy

But not the absolute slaughter it is for Carno rn

[viscid mica]

Dibbles are 3 tons in game they are not the same. They are not in the same combat class. They aren’t even really in the same weight class.

If this game was a one to one realism sure

[viscid mica]

This game isn’t carbon realism if it was stego haters would be far angrier as EVERYTHING would get 1 tapped

[crystal stream]

I’m not saying it needs to be I jst think it would be better more fun for both sides if it was changed plus knock down for Carno was so satisfying lol

And for some realism nerds it would definitely be better

My post is 50/50 rn 😂 the whole isle player base is split

[viscid mica]

Ya it’s a big one

Like they could make it work, but it could end up being really bad for the balancing of the game

I feel like a lot of carno mains will change their mind with the horde test changes as they aren’t that bad and actually help a lot

[crystal stream]

Lol it is a big maybe situation I jst wish the devs would consider it

[viscid mica]

No, I’m pretty sure Dondi said that it’s not happening but we can expect adjustments to its current kit to make it better

[crystal stream]

I hope there’s a way for custom servers to change it because I have a feeling Carno will never change to make it any better after this

[viscid mica]

I think custom servers are gonna get a lot of control so I don’t know if they’ll be able to change any of the specific stats but they can certainly adjust other things

From what we understand, they plan to make each server kind of its own experience

[crystal stream]

We can only hope

[viscid mica]

@odd tree the only thing galli is even partially big enough to fracture is a hypsi lol

[iron tree]

I mean

It could definitely break a raptor's bones in a full sprint

BUT HELL NO!!!

we don't need an unavoidable pachy

[viscid mica]

^^^^

Same reason as why I don’t want galli having bleed pure harassment value is insane

[viscid mica]

@distant prairie maybe reset the timer instead of extend? Cuz adding 45 for every pounce could leave someone envenomates for ages even after winning

[topaz elm]

@steep gazelle carno cant really get up that fast its kinda the nature of its physiology

everyone else has the arms to get up, but being an abelisaur carno cant yk...

@tight cove

same reason as above, he cant really yk use his front half

its all legs

I dont like the stun time either but thats just kind of carno's nature as a creature

[tight cove]

Ok, what your saying makes sense, but in terms of game balance its wild bro, I don’t think any other creature gets knocked down for so long and a bunch of these other Dino’s don’t have good arms either 😭

[topaz elm]

yeah thats kind of the problem Im seeing

cus everybody else might not have good arms, but they have arms they can bend

carno takes 4-5 seconds to get up and thats i think the longest stun in the game

maybe stego is longer

but like its just a weird spot because it sucks for game balance, but theres really also no way to make it work visually

because with dilo, you can speed up the animation
you can make it push itself up faster, etc

carno has to wiggle around a little bit until it gets a foothold to stand on

[tight cove]

All they need is to make it like 1 second faster and that would make a difference

[topaz elm]

@distant prairie every pounce in stage 3 adds a second to the stage 3 venom, like everytime you hear the call being repeated adds a second

[topaz elm]

yeah i see what you mean, i would personally let carno uses its head as a source of leverage
if you are ramming headfirst into 1.3k kg using it to pick yourself up doesnt seem TOO strange

considering you also dont have any arms

[tight cove]

Indeed

[topaz elm]

@odd tree the fastest dinosaur in the game does not need to be able fracture bones for the same reason deinosuchus cannot fracture bones

it just isnt galli's niche

but its also giving a creature that can run 73km/h the ability to fracture bones and thats genuinely a stupid idea

like if everybody could deal injury or fracture maybe not but its just at a point where like what can you do against that

[steep gazelle]

I'm not asking him to get up as fast as Omni, but not so slow that he can be knocked down/stun again right after the animation ends.

[topaz elm]

i think thats more just a problem with how stuns work, since that applies to most creatures

stego, trike, diablo, etc all can get re-stunned prior to getting up

[steep gazelle]

And remember that this is a game, not real life. Basing it on what happened or how it was in real life is fine, but that shouldn't decide the final state.

Balancing should be the priority here

[topaz elm]

and believe me i understand that but theres really limited ways to make that work animation wise

carno physically cant do that, so to speed up the animation they'd have to change it to something else that works

[mint star]

#balance-feedback message a generic islecord feedback message but written by a 19th century Englishman

[distant prairie]

That really doesn't help at all. The issue is that you get the person to stage 3 and 45 seconds (+5 to 10secs for pounces) and then POOF you're magically cured. It makes 0 sense for it to expire like that. If anything fresh pounces would be injecting more venom in and making the effects last longer. Every pounce should be adding 45 seconds to wherever the timer is currently. If you had 20 seconds left in stage 3 and get pounces the timer should go to 1:05. Since the poison doesn't do damage itself it's not overpowered.

[stark knoll]

The venom is what makes you deal extra damage so extending the duration by 45 seconds for every successful pounce would definitely be overpowered

[distant prairie]

Dilo functions that way. Plus are you not stull full of venom? If you ate 10 pounces back to back and won you would get 5min of stage 3 poison. That's not bad for had rough the fight was. You'd be laying down in a bush anyway to heal. Last I checked Dilo venom last about that long with just one bite.

[eager saddle]

That would be a MASSIVE issue too. You can’t outrun it to begin with and now you can never get away from it

[viscid mica]

That is ALOT of venom time you could stack on some of the bigger things

[hasty coyote]

I think just resetting the 45 second duration would be strong enough for troodons.

[distant prairie]

At minimum it should reset the the timer

[viscid mica]

Ya that would be fine by me

[distant prairie]

Anything is better than working it all the way to stage three. Starting to do damage and the prey getting a free reset in the middle of the action for nothing

[hasty coyote]

to be fair, dilo venom lasting as long as it does is quite oppressive.

[distant prairie]

I think its fair if you eat 7 stage 3 pounces. You're lucky to be alive. You'd need to sit 2x that long to heal anyway so it's just an inconvenience. I agree Dilo was oppressive but think of how much work went into that penalty with Troodons vs how hard the Dilo had to work. Either way my original ask was for pounces to reset the 45sec timer.

Prey should have to earn the reset of the fight. It's dumb to have troodons landing a pounce on average 1/15seconds and the damn Dino gets a reset 4 times during the assault.

[hasty coyote]

7 stage 3 pounces is 840 damage, + the other 3 into that state are <1000 damage, so the larger end of troodon's preferred range would still take another 5 or so pounces to kill. Tho I agree troodon could def use a buff to make its venom last longer, the venom resetting mid fight is very rough to deal with. I just think adding a full extra 45 seconds that keeps stacking is a bit too much, especially if you have many troodons. Like 5 minutes doesnt seem like much on paper, but in gameplay its agonizingly long (for context, you can regen from 0 to full stam on most dinos and still have another minute or 2 left).

[steep gazelle]

The Troodon's venom in stage 3 instead of completely leaving the victim's venom after 45 seconds, should go to stage 2 (like Dilo's venom). This would help the Troodon, but it wouldn't be unfair for the victim

[fierce marlin]

@wanton edge can i understand that much hate?

[crimson crater]

#balance-feedback message @weary tartan gastro should go in general and a cool-down on the charge would make it useless

[weary tartan]

gastro is only broken on cera and having a perma charge that does alot of dmg is also unbalanced

[cosmic pelican]

Gastro is broken on anything

[crimson crater]

the charge can be stalled out

[weary tartan]

oh so a carno can eat unlimited amout and heal unlimited amout with gastro?

[cosmic pelican]

Not as fast but yes

[weary tartan]

ye and then they just charge bite gain xd

[cosmic pelican]

Gastro is just an unfair mutation no matter what you put it on

[crimson crater]

ok but with a cool-down its vulnerable and can’t defend it self properly

[weary tartan]

if your fighting a group of ceras and you kill one it shouldnt make the rest be able to heal back to full health

[weary tartan]

ofc you can just need to use your brain once and not just spam rmb and charge at the enemy

[crimson crater]

or anyone with the brain just shifts + W the moment a cera starts charging, nothing can be done about that

[weary tartan]

ok so your just saying cera isnt broken just dont fight it because its too strong xd

[cosmic pelican]

The damage needs 3 seconds to ramp up, you can go in during that time frame as something like a carno to trade hits

[weary tartan]

yeah and then you puke nice trade

[crimson crater]

bro what, i said that a cool-down wouldn’t work on it lmao

[weary tartan]

and then the cera just gastro heals noice

[cosmic pelican]

Dont fight a cera if youre low on food lol

[weary tartan]

they make you puke in 1-2 hits with full food

[cosmic pelican]

Not with a non fully charged bite

[weary tartan]

as i said 1-2 hits

so you cant just trade it because of the puke

you cant really fight long fights because of his gastro + puke

the only thing you can do is run away xd

[cosmic pelican]

Carno needs 3-4 charged bites that arent fully charged, even if the cera has max bile

[weary tartan]

nope needs less

just saying cera has so many passives and skills its insane

like wtf carno has his charge thats it

[cosmic pelican]

A charged bite that just got initiated deals the same dmg as the regular bite, and applies the same bile

[weary tartan]

cera has unlimited gastro + puke + defense buff+ undlimited eating

[cosmic pelican]

So literally yes

[crimson crater]

ok nerf it just not with a cool-down that would make it too weak

[weary tartan]

ye and how then?

cera is already the strongest carni (besides croc)

[crimson crater]

that’s another can of worms, all i’m saying is that a cool-down ain’t it.

[weary tartan]

but why?

[cosmic pelican]

Clunky

[weary tartan]

give it like 2 sec cooldown and no unlimited gastro

[crimson crater]

i already explained it

[cosmic pelican]

Carno and stego both used to have cooldowns on their attacks and it felt bad

[weary tartan]

ye but they dont have unlimited gastro

or make you puke

[crimson crater]

sounds like a mutation problem

[weary tartan]

?

[crimson crater]

“unlimited gastro”

[cosmic pelican]

Just find small chunks of food and any carnivore can have infinite gastro

[weary tartan]

not when your full food

[cosmic pelican]

Even a tiny compy can heal a deino 5% hp

[weary tartan]

oh and you want to be full food when fighting ceras sadge

[cosmic pelican]

You can eat 3 chunks of food safely even when youre full

Or again, eat small chunks lol

[weary tartan]

yeah thats makes it balanced i can heal 15% and the cera 100%

[cosmic pelican]

Mutation issue

Deino can do it too

[weary tartan]

true but no one cares about deino because its in the water

[crimson crater]

bro

[cosmic pelican]

Increase ceras growth time so its strenght is warranted, there you go, problem solved

[weary tartan]

[cosmic pelican]

Juvi and sub cera get dunked on by everything

[weary tartan]

thats such a bad argument lol

"its weak when its little the when its big its allowed to be op"

[cosmic pelican]

Thats literally how apexes like rex and trike are balanced lol

[elfin night]

Gastro is broken on anything bro

It’s just extreme with cera and deino because they don’t vomit and deino can heal up 400hp from a schooling fish

[weary tartan]

do rex and trike have unlimited heal? and no skill charge? puke? defence bonus? Carni muta? Can eat everything they want?

[crimson crater]

trust, its pretty balanced just busted on cera in particular.

[elfin night]

I play it on beipi and teno bro and its crazy to keep sustain and kos😭

[weary tartan]

ye i said nerv it on cera somehow

[elfin night]

Also on omni at times

[crimson crater]

trike can eat everything

[elfin night]

Just remove gastro and slow down cera as it does the charged bite

There, now it’s a solid A tier dinosaur

No need to touch it because it’s good

[cosmic pelican]

Non fg ceras are free food to fgs because theyre so much slower, get knocked by carno charge and teno kick, get grappled by 2 omnis, facetanked by 1 dilo... the list goes on

[elfin night]

Also I guess the vomit on giant animals should be looked at

[weary tartan]

slow down cera you mean movementspeed?

[elfin night]

Yeah so it cannot hit and run as efficiently and can no longer run around hunting big game

Slower and also give it the slide back. Problem solved

[cosmic pelican]

3h growth time cera plz

[crimson crater]

3h is diabolical

[cosmic pelican]

Carno used to be 3h almost

[weary tartan]

im not sure about that... its already slow

[cosmic pelican]

And with ceras current power, it would be warranted

[crimson crater]

2h and 25M is more reasonable

[cosmic pelican]

2h 45m

[elfin night]

2h 30m and maybe we’re onto something

To be fair I think MOST growth times should be increased to avoid this weird situation where omni is just 30 minutes less than cera and troodon is like 30 minutes less than an Omni

In order to show more fairness to the smaller creatures

[crimson crater]

longer than tenos despite being smaller than it

[elfin night]

And then things like spino, cama and shant maybe getting close to 12h

[cosmic pelican]

15 minutes longer than teno shiver me timbers

But in exchange it dunks on everything else in the roster

[crimson crater]

no but for the sake of consistency

[elfin night]

And yes, I know spino isn’t in the same class, but man. No one’s gonna kill a good spino

[keen plover]

@elfin night so real

The grow time difference rn is hilarious. Cerato is 3x the size and is just overall a tier up from omni

[elfin night]

Why does pteranodon grow in half of the time of an HT carno 😭 😭 😭

[keen plover]

It doesn't make sense to me at all

[rapid flume]

I've been thinking about making a suggestion about that

[elfin night]

Honestly

Just disable it on things 3t or more

Since I doubt allo will be dibble sized

[elfin night]

Or give it some wild soft cap

[fierce marlin]

How can a herbivore gameplay be hard?

Fr fr question, It Just sounds that herbs are to strong

[rapid flume]

I was thinking about ramping how ineffective it is, so a 4 ton animal doesn't really have to worry and a 9 ton one is basically unaffected

[elfin night]

https://tenor.com/view/mine-finding-nemo-mine-mine-mine-thats-mine-lulugifs-gif-20827668

[rapid flume]

I think it's okay for it to affect maias, espcially to discourage more skilled maias from engaging

[elfin night]

^Carnis

Carnivores when they see a herbivore 😭

[fierce marlin]

Thats not hard, thats really easy to deal with

[elfin night]

Pachy moment

[fierce marlin]

On evrima, herbivores pose as much threat as carnivores

[elfin night]

Dibble moment when cera megapack

[elfin night]

Which means you’re in deep trouble when you see vastly outnumbered

[rapid flume]

[fierce marlin]

The difference is that the gameplay is super easy and you don't have to put yourself at risk.

[elfin night]

Give it a soft cap then

And we’re good

[fierce marlin]

Thats not hard, It Just sounds like a skill issues._.

[elfin night]

But I don’t think ceras should be causing dibbles to vomit and locking them like that after like…4-5 bites?

[rapid flume]

beat 8 gastro ceras with 2 dibbles

[elfin night]

“Skill issue”

Try growing something like a solo pachy in south plains and surviving for as long as I have

Or being a solo dibble and suddenly stumbling into a group of 6 ceras and surviving

[fierce marlin]

Just get a higher number of diablos

[elfin night]

Lmao

[fierce marlin]

Just dont grow solo, its still much easier than carnis

[elfin night]

You know, not always you’re gonna have a group to crutch on

[rapid flume]

I think we'll see it be more of a problem with ceras doing it to trikes just to annoy them

[elfin night]

And it is also easier to group up as a popular carnivore when 60-80% of a server at a given time is carnivore

[rapid flume]

what do you do if they get more ceras?

[elfin night]

Ceras with infinite normal speed charged bite killing 4-6 ton trikes was so unfathomably cringe

[keen plover]

trike issue if anything

[elfin night]

It was pre sparring when I saw that tbf when trike just sucked

[rapid flume]

continue until it's 20 vs 80?

[keen plover]

Also depressing how badly the ceratopsians turn

[elfin night]

So maybe that’s different with that godly sparring movement

[keen plover]

I mean you can keep up with a solo cera but a pack is still getting you

[fierce marlin]

No, the gameplay itself suggests that you play more with herbivores sometimes, using carnivores it is difficult to have a baby because You always need to move and hunt, the cub will not be able to keep up with you or help you and will only steal food, just like other members in general, herbivores do not have any disadvantages when it comes to walk on herds, they just gain more defense which is the only thing needed

[keen plover]

You can't alt attack in spar mode lol

[rapid flume]

gastro is also a big reason for that

[keen plover]

You turn better in spar, but it's not enough to fend off a cera pack + your attack options are limited

Every fight I've seen is a trike going up to a cliff or something and holding that area down

[elfin night]

Guh

AI is everywhere in normal servers

[keen plover]

[elfin night]

And not like it’s hard to find good in hotspots as a carnivore

[keen plover]

Herbi and carni gameplay is easy. Nothing struggles

Food is abundant

[rapid flume]

carnivores nest more often than herbivores in my experience

[keen plover]

Well maybe not for deino lol

[elfin night]

Facts

And deino struggles because it’s playable garbage

Like if you could play as trash and misery, the closest thing is deino

[obtuse ocean]

Nah,like if they added mud pools random on the map they would be trash. Oh wait

[elfin night]

Deino is ASS

[obtuse ocean]

Where ppl could drink from the mud pools 😛

Just saw they added that lol

[viscid mica]

@tender ermine why remove it when knocked down? The only purpose that would have is to make it easier for some herbis to bully and harass them that’s it

[obtuse ocean]

And now they added sounds to bushes,so now il just walk in the open like an idiot instead. Cant even be stealthy and avoiding stuff etc

[viscid mica]

@elfin night I completely disagree with that 30-30-30 tile grow thing. Like I don’t think cera is actually that good beyond vomit. In a 1v1 I almost always win as troodon or omni against them so I do not think they are objectively “better”

The only growth time issue we have rn is trike which is out growing everything before it’s even 50%

If trike followed the standard for large/apex grow like stego and deino we’d be fine but it doesn’t which is the main issue

Everything else (HT carno is fixed) is fair time for size

This is not legacy there is no “objectively better” as it’s not spam left click (cera is and that’s why it’s very low combat potential)

Cera is exclusively good cuz charge bite is strong and vomit animation locks

@icy blaze he either grazed the tip of your tail or desync and on his end he hit the body

I do agree the tail needs to be removed from acceptable places for pounce to land

[icy blaze]

this

[viscid mica]

Maybe adjust your suggestion as it’s saying the pounce hitbox is the problem when it’s more so what counts as a “landed” pounce

[icy blaze]

it is broken because it always happens that i have problems with raptors and with no other dinosaur.

[viscid mica]

Those problems are either desync (which does heavily effect raptor) and or the tail hitbox counting

It’s not raptors hitbox for pounce specifically that’s the issue

[icy blaze]

its not just ther "desync" its also other issues

[viscid mica]

Like what

[icy blaze]

its always raptors i have this problems with. and it CANT always be the desync because its legit always

[viscid mica]

Like what problems?

[icy blaze]

so one problem is they pounce you from far far away and always hit.
other problem is, you try to jump them as troodon and youre always jumping against them and not holding on to them like it should be. and no its not from the front.
then it also happens that they legit jump you with their butt, like not even turning arround and all of a sudden they catch you.

[viscid mica]

First one is desync related (most people have over 80 ping so what they see and what you see are gonna be different if even by a lil)

That second one sounds like a bug that you should report in #🐞-evrima-bug-reports-🐞 cuz you should be able to latch

I’m not certain about #3 here I’d have to see a video as I’ve never heard of this issue from anyone else

[icy blaze]

well my ping is totally fine, so shouldnt they miss instead? it cant always be desync tho.
i did make several reports already everytime it happens

[viscid mica]

So what tends to happen is this game favours hits over misses and almost ALWAYS counts the hits rather than the misses

[icy blaze]

well doesnt count for me as it seems lol

[viscid mica]

Cuz like your both communicating with the server your communication is faster with the server BUT it is collecting both data and sending its decision out it more often than not will favour any damage or hit rather than calling it a miss especially if the party is slower communication with the server

Basically! Until they can get more stability and significantly reduce the desync (no time soon sense constant updates and additions) it will favour those with slightly worse ping as the communication comes after yours

[icy blaze]

kinda unfair tbh

[viscid mica]

Weird tech stuff that I don’t understand happens in between all that but that’s the plain man’s explanation

[viscid mica]

Oh 100% your suffering from having a better ping XD

[icy blaze]

thats what i say lmao

not my fault they have bad pc or internet xD

[viscid mica]

It’s just one of those things that will take more time than not to fix

[viscid mica]

I mean I’m in Canada in a spot where no server gives me better than like 60? 70?

So not bad but certainly not perfect

[icy blaze]

this is wonderful xD

[viscid mica]

That ping is crazy

Do you live a block away from the server bruh

[icy blaze]

noh i am actually living in a small village and i do not think that there is a server anywhere nearby xD

[viscid mica]

Bro has fiber optics in a village that’s crazy

[icy blaze]

not even

[viscid mica]

Wait are you EU?

[icy blaze]

yeh

[viscid mica]

That explains it yall can drive the length of your country in like an hour that is close lmao

[icy blaze]

nah it takes bit longer

[viscid mica]

Ya a lot of NA play in EU sense no really “good” NA private servers exist yet

[viscid mica]

What country

[icy blaze]

germany

[viscid mica]

Oh like 2 hours and a half accounting for traffic

[icy blaze]

lmao nah from the middle of germany i take like 7 h to get to the top

traffic is always terrible lol

[viscid mica]

So real

I drive out here in Canada XD

You ever seen those videos talking about how long you can drive and still be in the same country XD

[icy blaze]

i think so

[iron tree]

it's truly unplayable now

[vale brook]

#balance-feedback message @tender prairie deino just regens stam in water like all semi aquatics do, but it still regens. it just regens health stupidly slow. resting just naturally gives a buff to healing rates

[tender prairie]

On live it regens hp in water, on HT it doesn't seem to at all; i floated for a good probably 7 mins and was still full red

[vale brook]

well yeah i dont think deino should be healing 1.5k health in 7 minutes anyway lol

unless it is resting

[tender prairie]

It isn't healing any

[vale brook]

just because you were still red after 7 minutes doesnt mean you didnt heal at all, it just means you didnt heal enough to get out of red

red health is between 1%-25% health

which is around 2000 hp for deino

[tender prairie]

It's a baby deino

It's not healing at all in water

[vale brook]

id have to see a deino actually sit in water for an hour and not heal at all before i fully believe that

[tender prairie]

go ahead, i guess

it's HT only mind but do give it a shot, more info is better

[vale brook]

being a baby deino doesnt matter, your health regen is not better as a juvie than as an adult

so it just feels ek

ill test it once HT goes live though

if its still in (assuming it is bugged)

free admin server go brrr

[tender prairie]

HT is live

[elfin night]

But that is completely annecdotal evidence. What if I told you that literally I've only ever seen like 3-4 omnis in my whole life soloing a cera whereas the rest got absolutely mopped even in a group and a handful died? Who would br right then?

We have to be analytical with the numbers too. Cera gets more chances to get a good diet, has much higher burst, the vomit, much better bleed resistance, proportionately equal agility, three times its health and is "just" 7kph slower while being far more stamina efficient fighting...All of that for an extra 30 minutes of growth under the same conditions

[viscid mica]

It’s because omni has a relatively high entry skill to be good and even higher to be great only thing that’s even close or on par with omnis skill potential is teno

[elfin night]

when has it not been completely unplayable as a solo player. In Spiro you also had nowhere to hide during your growth and against cannibals. And well, safe spots existed regardless

[viscid mica]

I don’t think a nat increase is a good fix for that though

[elfin night]

so cera is easier to use and has more raw power in every field except for mobility. Has it easier everywhere else and all at the cost of spending half an hour more which you want since everything is on your diet and there is enough to scavenge more often than not

[viscid mica]

Like sure it has more stats for time but that’s kinda the point?

[elfin night]

what about the second point then? Proposed it as an alternative

[viscid mica]

And like to be fair cera IMO is same weight class just on the high end of it

[elfin night]

so things like ptera dont grow in 60% of the time of an omni

that is SO bad even after ptera rework when it happens

[viscid mica]

TBH PT grow should be like 30 minutes max tbh

PT is u ironically a spectator Dino

[elfin night]

and troodon 40 I think

[viscid mica]

It’s grow isn’t that bad when you think about the value it can do

Like 1 troodon if committed enough can kill a dibble with gold stam management

[vale brook]

espeically now with its stam buffs

[elfin night]

so either make their diet potential so much higher

Or increase all growth times universally

Would rather compensate small creatures actually

Absurd that it is harder for a ptera or troo to maintain a 150% boost than a cera

[viscid mica]

Well, I think you also have to count for the maximum potential of a Dino and the minimum potential

Like omni potential is insane but it’s minimum is god awful

[elfin night]

maybe, there's nuance in that yeah

[viscid mica]

@tender prairie you can sit on the bottom of the water and it heals

You just have to be touching the ground

[tender prairie]

Is that on HT too? I was on the bottom for ages and it wasn't 🤔

[viscid mica]

Well, like if you think about it, cera actually doesn’t have a lot of high-end value skilled players with most other dinos can easily beat cera groups

[viscid mica]

Deino has by far one of the longest heal times in the game it’s there it just takes forever I think the time to heal from red to full is longer than your stomach like almost 2 hours.

[elfin night]

either way

9h rex, 9h 45m trike, 11h spino, 6h 20m steg, 7h acro, 8h 50m giga, 12h 30m shant, 14h cama

[viscid mica]

Those are pretty reasonable thou I’d prefer keeping the semi legacy standard of eight hours for Rex trike and a bit less for giga depending on how strong it is

Ain’t no way my voice to text actually got Rex trike and giga, right

[tender prairie]

So if you go on land it heals pretty quickly, same as you heal in water on live, but if you go in the water on HT it doesn't seem to heal at all; last time I asked about it ppl said it was intended (on HT) so I figured i'd pop it in feedback, b/c if it's intended, afk-sit is bad gameplay--but if it's a bug that's another story ofc

[elfin night]

I think 8 might be a little too low for those two

[viscid mica]

Might be a #🐞-evrima-bug-reports-🐞

[viscid mica]

I mean like eight with good diet

Technically, speaking trike will take like 12 hours if you don’t have any diet

[elfin night]

I would like to avoid disparities with things like rex being too close to acro

[viscid mica]

In my opinion, the biggest issue with trike is its growth curve being stronger than a dibble in almost half the time is insane

[obtuse ocean]

Why boost the time, why not make it harder to grow? So you actually have something to do, instead of sitting around doing nothing.

[elfin night]

since I doubt acro is gonna be on the same level

However, we can agree at least that spino should take the longest to grow in the carnivore roster

[viscid mica]

Acro should be roughly the same time as a stego

[viscid mica]

100%

[elfin night]

both things at a time. hard to grow and skill reliant while also needing to keep that up for a while to reduce luck and randomness playing a part of this

[viscid mica]

If spino anything like it was in legacy in terms of power that time is fair

To be honest, the biggest problem with Apex‘s is the growth curve.

It’s kinda hard to balance when you got a lot of weight power between

The best way to do it would honestly be to split it into three waves similar to legacy, but instead of having a button at a certain percentage, they just gain a lot of weight over like the next four or 5%

A good example is deino you don’t even reach half your weight until like 70% and then you suddenly gain the last 4 tons in the last 30

[obtuse ocean]

Yea but right now its no skill, food everywhere. So instead of time, think it would be better with something else that req skill

[viscid mica]

And since they plan to have multiple growth stages for stuff like trike and Rex and all those other big boys having certain percentages where you suddenly gain a lot of weight in a short amount of time makes sense

[elfin night]

they are not mutually exclusive and apparently rex and other apexes are getting some unique system to be harder to grow and needing skill

[tender ermine]

I don’t think it should continue to get a buff while it’s on its ass. If it gets knocked down it, should be as vulnerable to any oncoming damage as much as any other animal.

[viscid mica]

I mean it still is just less than it would normally be. Again all it does is make it easier to harass as herbivores as rarely if any Dino’s can knock down that size in carni line

It is a pointless change that would simply serve to make being a body camper easier

[tender ermine]

I think it retaining a blanketed damage reduction while on the floor just because there is a dead body nearby is silly

[viscid mica]

Why

[tender ermine]

Because it’s on its ass and in a vulnerability state

[viscid mica]

It’s still fighting to defend that body within the allotted proximity

[tender ermine]

Ain’t fighting while on the ground

[viscid mica]

That makes no sense

[tender ermine]

It does

[viscid mica]

It’s still gonna get up and bite what Evers attacking it

So it’s still fighting

It’s jsut temporarily stunned

[tender ermine]

Yep, and for that time it’s on the ground it shouldn’t get the defence buff

[viscid mica]

Like the match doesn’t in MMA just cuz someone falls over

[viscid mica]

Is it teno or dibble

[tender ermine]

What about teno or dibble?

[minor axle]

Because isle players are unemployed and have infinite time on their hands

[viscid mica]

Your main

[minor axle]

The only exceptions are the devs, who are employed by definition

[tender ermine]

I don’t main any animal, but thank you for making assumptions

[viscid mica]

Your making a suggestion that serves 0 purpose but to make herbivore body camping significantly easier

The only things that can knock down rn are Maia, teno and dibble (stego too but they also tend to 1 tap)

[tender ermine]

I’m making a suggestion based on a gameplay interaction I think would be cool

[viscid mica]

But it wouldn’t be healthy balancing wise

[tender ermine]

I think it would be fine

[viscid mica]

It serves no useful purpose to balancing and would simply reduce cera viability without any good reasoning too it

Just make herbivore camping food way easier just cuz they can

[tender ermine]

Herbi body camping is a blanket problem that would need to be resolved for every carnivore, not just cerato

[viscid mica]

That doesn’t mean you should make it any easier

[tender ermine]

Can’t only be argued for the case of one animal lol

When every carnivore technically suffers from herbie body camping behaviour

[viscid mica]

I mean when that one animal is being talked about for a nerf that would have significant effects on its combat capacity I can

[viscid mica]

Ya but that doesn’t matter thou? Like just cuz everything else suffers from it as much as the next why can’t the “scavenger” get its 1 advantage

[tender ermine]

It still has the buff lmao

It’d just lose it when knocked down

[viscid mica]

Ya know what your right

While were at it stego should get a 2x damage multiplier against stuff smaller than it

And dilo should lose it’s venom for 3 minutes after every kill

And omni should have a 5 second stun after every missed pounce

[tender ermine]

I miss Omni having the recovery on missed pounces