general-feedback-discussion

[dire peak]

Good thinking

[rare fractal]

Deinos are just a frustrating mess honestly, they don't cause fear they just instakill you

[honest sparrow]

Deinos are a jumpscare

And again

Fear is subjective

[rare fractal]

This is, again, a survival game primarily

[honest sparrow]

It’s survival horror, it is supposed to be a balanced mix of both

[rare fractal]

That point has been beaten to death by the devs for the past month

[dire peak]

They do, they make you stop and think about if you should drink, or if its safe to drink. In a way they scare you.

[slow linden]

personally deinos dont scare me but they do stress me out because i feel it necessary to go to shallow water or just not even bother drinking because i dont want to get a mini heart attack hearing a lunge headed my way

I think they do their job well

[rare fractal]

Deinos just frustrate me, you can't decide to not drink because drinking is a necessity

[dire peak]

Exactly. You must drink and you have to take a risk. This should define isle.

[rare fractal]

It's not a risk, you don't attempt anything you either die or don't and it's not up to you

Because if you're just unlucky enough to be drinking in front of one then bam, you just lost 3 hours of progress due to rng

[dire peak]

You can take certain countermeasures, like drinking small bits and move away

[rare fractal]

Drinking animations don't allow for that, you have to stay at the same spot for about 5 seconds regardless

That's enough time

[dire peak]

All in all I take it as challenging. Its not too much, so it improves the experience.

[rare fractal]

It ends your dinos lives randomly, that isn't an improvement

That's a waste of time and effort

[dire peak]

Deino numbers right now are high, because people just want to play the biggest. That is unfortunate.

[rare fractal]

That just lowers your chances of random death tho, it existing at all is the issue. Imagine if the devs made it so lightning could strike your dino at random during storms and instakill you. That is catastrophically bad from a design standpoint

[slow linden]

the deinos biggest issue currently is the lack of dinosaurs in the roster and the bodies of water the map provides tend to be underwhelming so you end up with a lot of congested rivers where you’re almost guaranteed to get attacked by a deinosuchus which removes some of the fear and replaces it with annoyance, so i sort of get where you’re coming from

[rare fractal]

Well honestly I'm moreso bothered with deino mechanically existing at all. Deino has no counterplay, it lunges and kills you instantly through raw damage or drowning and you can't move quick enough to avoid that. So the player is getting punished for performing a mandatory action that has a completely unknown chance of wiping all progress you've made. This is bad game design

Because the primary mechanic of this game requires time investment

Which is growth

[tired tiger]

For my suggestion??

[slow linden]

I don’t mind it’s damage output and while on paper I do like the idea of being able to drown prey after seeing it in game with there being no real counter play I do think it’s not the best outlook currently.

[rare fractal]

It's just that the hunting method of a crocodilian is a very poor inclusion to a survival game.

Because it invalidates anything it is capable of grabbing because everything is required to drink. This would be fine if deinos weren't entirely invisible an inch below the water but they are

[slow linden]

I personally like the hunting style BUT I do entirely agree the way it is right now it’s pretty stupid to deal with because there’s little to no way to actually tell if a deinosuchus was in the water unless it’s practically just showing itself to you.

I was under the impression you’d be able to at least look into the water and vaguely see it, but that doesn’t seem to be the case 80% of the time

[rare fractal]

Oh I like the hunting style too, if every other playable was ai and the only playable in the game was deino I'd have no issue. But it's just needlessly punishing to anyone needing to drink

[slow linden]

Fair enough, I can see where you’re coming from since I myself don’t like how the Deinosuchus has affected the servers.

[rare fractal]

Playing anything terrestrial is just masochist simulator xD

Dondi plz help

[dire peak]

I meant haast adding to the horror aspect

Also imo adding deino might've been a bit too early, but thats just my take

But in general Deino is a solid playable

[rare fractal]

We're moreso arguing deino is mechanically contradictory to a survival game

Well I am

Sorry Pasta

[dire peak]

If there are more waterways and playables, I think deino works

[slow linden]

The lunge is more forgiving of a mechanic if you could actually see the deinosuchus in the first place, which currently isn’t the case, so i’m more in line to say i agree with fluff for now

[rare fractal]

Deino's lunge is mechanical suicide in a survival game and completely invalidates playables below 4 tons

[slow linden]

if you can actually see the deinosuchus and water wasnt just some magical cloak I think it’d be less of an issue because realistically you WOULD see a deinosuchus and it would be more of a “oops, i wasnt paying attention and now i have to book it before i get grabbed”

[rare fractal]

You can't avoid it, you just die. And this game requires you to spend careful time and energy growing a single dino to adulthood and experiencing the mechanics that pertain to that. This can't occur if you play russian roulette every 30 minutes where your death isn't your fault

[rare fractal]

Yeah totally

[dire peak]

Fair point

[slow linden]

The solution to this for both ends is to just make the water itself better

[dire peak]

But as a base idea, deino is alright.

[rare fractal]

How so? Like I don't disagree I just don't know how you define "base idea"

[dire peak]

Semi aquatic that relies on pure ambush to succeed in catching large animals. Spinosaurids wouldnt be able to that.

[rare fractal]

Gotcha

[dire peak]

Also adds to the horror aspect in general, but I get what you mean by frustration. Deino numbers will probably decrease with time though.

[rare fractal]

Water needs to be fixed, it's not the numbers or how common they are it's the fact that your death as a player is rng based every 30 minutes instead of being your fault. Horror shouldn't come at the cost of debilitating the primary function of the game

Which is survival, that is what you do in this game, horror is the intended feeling that the devs would like to provide

But survival is what this game is, that is why color customization, diets, nesting, perks, elders, and a playable roster are included

[limber hull]

Spino having an equal biteforce to a deino lmao

[lavish quail]

i mean its fair enough

[limber hull]

How

A deino's biteforce would be FAR greater than a spino's

By a long shot

[barren zephyr]

yeah, spino shouldn’t have a very strong bite in general, it’s claws need to be it’s main line of defense

[nimble yoke]

I'd make it similar to tenonto and stego, weak bite but a strong alt attack

[still raptor]

For what our Spino is, it should have a strong relatively strong biteforce for what it is. The entire build is more robust than the IRL skeletal, so basing our Spino off of the irl animal is flawed.

Hypothetically Speaking:

If we gave our Rex a 1,000N biteforce, Spino's should be roughly around 750 and Giga being around 875-900 but with the most bleed. Plus given the fact that a Deino wouldn't stand a chance against our Spino. Putting it at equal stats for bite just doesn't make sense.

[stray holly]

I think deino is fine the way it is. If you wanna avoid them just go to the spots in the river that are shallow or where there aren’t a lot of them.

@olive coral would it make sense to have playable dinos spawn in AI herds as well or have specific dinosaurs reserved for AI herds only

[olive coral]

The idea is that the Protoceratops would work similar to the Dryo. Just AI, and only there as a feeder and an aid to newer players. We picked Protoceratops as they were the most common herbivore of the Cretaceous, so they would be a good fit for populating AI.
Herd size would be small with no more than 4 adults and 4 juvies.

[stray holly]

Oh ok. I thought it’d be cool if you could easily distinguish AI from players based on what type of Dino it is, but I guess that’s what farm animals are gonna be for in the future.

[olive coral]

And you wouldn't want something like a stego getting the AI percs of unfoulable detection and guaranteed sniper-like accuracy with its tail. Though, it would be cool to start from the nest from an AI clan, but I think something as OP as a steg or tenno should be player only, or have some massive handicap to its attacks.

[stray holly]

Yeah I think certain dinos shouldn’t have AI variants like you mentioned. I know they gonna bring back Rex as an AI first and I think that’s gonna be a nightmare

[limber hull]

If we gave our rex a 1000N biteforce and spino/giga a 750 and 900, Deino would NEED a biteforce buff. It's an 8 ton alligator, it would have an absolutely insane bite

[still raptor]

Ambush opportunistic predator moment that drowns things half it's size.

And it was implied by the devs that Deino will get fucked by Spino.

[limber hull]

I would put deinosuchus on a level of biteforce which would outpower that of giga and spino, based on skulls alone. Not to mention deino, spino, rex and giga are around all the same size range

[still raptor]

Realism ≠ Balance.

[stray holly]

Then maybe Deino should be classified in the same tier of Spino/Rex/Giga

[limber hull]

I don't think spino v deino should be that favoured for spino. In fact, I'd put deino as the favoured fighter in the water, but spino have the upper hand on the land.

[still raptor]

It isn't.

[nimble yoke]

If only people saw it that way XD

[still raptor]

Deino is a Psuedo-Apex/Midtier at best. Apex in water, midtier on land.

[limber hull]

I refuse to live in a world where an 8 ton gator doesn't have an incredible biteforce. It should suffer in speed and agility, but make up for it in hefty power.

[stray holly]

Gators nowadays are infamous for having insane PSI on their bite.

I think it makes sense that the ancestor they came from reflects that.

20,000 PSI it had that is

But if it’s gonna have that the Spino needs to have something similar

[limber hull]

IDC what they have to do to rebalance deino to account for a hefty biteforce but a deino's biteforce should be close to a rexes in terms of sheer force.

[stray holly]

Cuz a lot of people won’t like this

[still raptor]

Again Realism doesn't equal balance.

[stray holly]

I know it doesn’t

That’s why I said Spino would have to be adjusted to account for that if a deino is gonna be that powerful

[limber hull]

correct, but it feels wrong to ignore how brutal a deino bite was and make it worse than a spino's

[lavish quail]

im sorry but i want my spino to be dominant in the water

[stray holly]

Ok maybe PSI isn’t the thing to go off of 😂😂😂

[lucid mauve]

why talk about balance the spino ? we dont know what pros/cons it have yet

[still raptor]

Again, Deino is an ambush predator that drowns prey half the size of it. It isn't meant to face tank apex creatures on land. Currently, Deino does it's job.

[limber hull]

So do I. But it also has its claws and could be designed to have skills that can dominate a deino in the right scenarios

[barren zephyr]

I would rather not have realistic deino in the game

that thing would be an absolute nightmare

Deino, is pretty fine as it is. Does what the devs want it to do. It can kill effectively so I don’t think it needs any changes as of now

[still raptor]

Realistic Deino would fucking murder Shants. Oh you played a 8 hour creature (hypothetical). It's so fun having a creature that grows 3 hours less than you kill you in an instant.

[limber hull]

oh yea, it's fine as is, no need for buffs

[lavish quail]

scenario my ass the deinos better run from it

its an apex

[still raptor]

Again

[lavish quail]

and it could probably grab one irl

[still raptor]

the Devs have stated that Spino will have the upper hand

[barren zephyr]

As it should

[still raptor]

Deino's best bet is to just swim away.

[barren zephyr]

That fatass is oversized and bulky

[still raptor]

Just step on it lmao

[barren zephyr]

Literally going to be like 10 tons

[lucid mauve]

if you took away bonebreak from rex in legacy, gigas would destroye them like nothing. So power is not everything : P

[still raptor]

Honestly, it's kinda laughable

[lavish quail]

https://tenor.com/view/minhaz-ratul-minhazratul-ratulminhaz-minhaz-shit-gif-17968492

pov

you stepped on a deino

[limber hull]

Spinosaurus should have much more health and speed on land than a deino, by far. If they get into a fight, a spino should be capable of tanking a good few blows.

[barren zephyr]

Spino could probably just tank deino to death tbh

[lucid mauve]

on land deino should be free food for spino, unless its huge skill gap

[limber hull]

Agreed

[barren zephyr]

I don’t see it doing anything to spino on land

[lavish quail]

deino doing shit no matter what

unless your in an ocean

[limber hull]

In water, spino tanks it but takes a fair bit of damage, on land, spino just fucking destroys it

[lavish quail]

then mabye

[zinc anvil]

feel like they will both avoid the fight tbh

[lavish quail]

not really

its free food for the spino

[limber hull]

I entirely disagree with this sentiment

[lavish quail]

deino should start grabbing its shit if there is a spino

[limber hull]

If you really want an "muh apex is unkillable god" play legacy

[barren zephyr]

Spinos will 100% go after deinos and vise versa

[lavish quail]

nah i dont want that

[barren zephyr]

deino will kill subs and juvies for sure

[lavish quail]

i want my spino to win against a overgrown croc tho

[limber hull]

Deino and spino should NOT want a fight. Deino should do enough damage to worry a spino, spino should be able to tank it enough to get the final blows on a deino but not walk out unscathed.

If it's a point where spino farms deino for food ez, then absolutely not a fan

[lavish quail]

i want a fight in water

[barren zephyr]

Deinos could stop this interaction by killing them at a younger age fortunately

[lavish quail]

not on land

[limber hull]

Deino v spino in water should not = spino steamroll. If it's a deino v spino on land, then spino should win, 100%

[lavish quail]

in water i want the spino to think oh shit better retreat and attack again

[lucid mauve]

that depends on the balance, giga vs rex. Easy win for rex. But giga is better overall

[limber hull]

If a spino is hit by a deino and goes "OH FUCK" swims out and is perfectly safe, I'm fine with that. Even better if the deino is dumb enough to walk out of the water to continue and the spino tears him a new one for being so dumb.

[barren zephyr]

Imagine a deino trying to chase a spino on to land

this will happen

[lavish quail]

Spino's reaction to being bit should be in shallow waters to fucking kill that rat

[limber hull]

How fast could a spino swim even? Could it outswim a deino?

[lavish quail]

no no no

like a paddle with speed

like a really fast paddle

like a deino but slower and more majestic

[limber hull]

If rex will be ambush and giga will be endurance, spino should be a brawler. Let the bastard strike fear into anything, aquatic or otherwise, that approaches it. I think the biggest aquatic nemesis of the spino should be the deino tbh, doing enough with its powerful bite to cause some level of concern to it. Makes sure it doesn't just sit in the water to avoid taking on the giga and rex

The spino should, for sure, be the biggest and tankiest apex of them all.

[lavish quail]

am i the only one who thinks bary's should be like little minions to de spino

its weird

bit cooll

[limber hull]

perhaps

honestly, a sucho aint gonna stand up to a spino, neither will a bary. Someone in that water has to, and frankly, I say deino should be that guy.

thats my take on the matter

[lavish quail]

deino should be a bit of trouble

[limber hull]

And I swear to god a titanaboa will do JACKSHIT to a spino and be a laughing stock

[lavish quail]

but he isnt no homecoming hero

he is finna die alone

or out of water

or in shallow water

or if he doesnt have 3 hits in immediately

or if he gets jumped

or if the spino knows where he is

or if the spino isnt low

[limber hull]

Well, no, but a deino being able to punch up a weight class doesn't seem out of place to me. I think a deino's greatest weakness should primarily be the fact that the moment it leaves the water, even for a second, it is waving the "kill me" flag to any nearby apex. What's that, two spinos are now occupying your pond? Well that's just too bad buddy, guess you're fucked. Deino should feel powerful till the moment it steps foot out of that safe water

[lavish quail]

i feel allo could shit on deinos

[limber hull]

If anything is capable of finishing off a deino, especially a spino, there's basically nothing the deino could do to prevent it.

[lavish quail]

if it has the grapple were promised

[barren zephyr]

swim away

[limber hull]

Allo would likely end up dragged by deinos tho in the right scenario

[lavish quail]

i mean

its more than half weight right?

[limber hull]

Is it 4+ tons?

[barren zephyr]

no

Allo is 2.8 ton I think.

[limber hull]

yea nah deino dragging that bitch

Deino should be THE semi-aquatic, shifting more to the aquatic side than the land side. It loves water so goddamn much it will spend all of its time just hanging out down there. The moment it is pushed out of its comfort zone, it should be upset and vulnerable.

Deino's weakness comes from the fact that if something just doesn't walk right into its mouth, it's not getting anything to eat. You see that big chunk of meat right up in the forest next to the river? Sure you can go up there but be ready for a rex to fucking kill you for walking out of your safe place

[lavish quail]

land deino best deino

hide in a bush

with food near

never see it coming

[zinc anvil]

should really think about the future of larger things like rex/some apexs when swimming they shouldnt be able to bite as the croc wouldnt really win

[worn saddle]

That’s why I think that the dev team should have added Purussaurus instead of deino. It is simply larger and provides more competition for the apexes.
While it still cannot solo a spino, it won’t be as easy of a snack as a deino is.

[icy lion]

puru is no longer larger than deino

[worn saddle]

New estimates came out?

[icy lion]

and our spino is much larger and more robust than that

yea, approximately 13.7m and 12-14 tons for deino

[barren zephyr]

Our spino may be overpowered once it’s released

[worn saddle]

Okay, I take my words back then.

[icy lion]

our deino in game is 11.5m

[worn saddle]

Deino is also an apex, I believe.

[zinc anvil]

stat will change as more things get added i imagine same for most things

[worn saddle]

According to The Isle Wiki, at least. I am not sure what the dev’s stance on that is atm

But, if you ask me. I believe that if Deino still qualifies as an apex, it should have a possibility to fight back against a spoon.
Possibly have an upper hand in water, while the spoon has an upper hand at land.

While it may not be realistic, it is a game that does not require realism.

Gameplay is more important, if you ask me.

[zinc anvil]

no matter what happens on dino looks ect the game feels good and fun to play thats all that matters

[worn saddle]

Yeah, so if they inflate the deino and make it larger for the sake of better gameplay, I am up to that. The Isle was never scientifically accurate anyway.

I do not want deino to repeat the same fate as giga in Legacy by being a pathetic apex that all the other apexes just toss around

[lavish quail]

its not an apex tho

no way its fighting an rex or a spino

[worn saddle]

That’s why I said “IF it is an apex”

[zinc anvil]

well as of right now bigger things are not in the roster so we dont really know if the stats on the croc will change or not

[worn saddle]

And “according to The Isle wiki”

[honest sparrow]

depends on what you consider an apex tbh

[icy lion]

the isle wiki is fan made and extremely unreliable

[worn saddle]

Again, I did say that the isle wiki might not be correct. Read my messages please.

[icy lion]

i did, im just confirming your suspicions

[worn saddle]

But yeah, I think that deino might have been nerfed for the time being. Considering the fact that deino had a bite force stronger than Rex, it may get a bone break.

[lavish quail]

isle wiki is dumb af lmao

it thought dryo grow time was 1h 30

[worn saddle]

Rex bite is between 2000-4000 Newtons, while deino had approx 18k

[lavish quail]

game balance

thats all i gotta say

also im pretty sure rex is higher

[icy lion]

it isnt

[worn saddle]

That’s true. But what I mean is that deino may not be able to body Rex (if it isn’t an apex), but leg break should be an option

[icy lion]

i wouldnt be surprised if deino eventually got fractures on its bite

[paper geyser]

i'd be very surprised if deino doesn't get high fracture potential once apexes are in

[worn saddle]

Nope. Deino and megalodon have higher bite forces

[paper geyser]

well megalodon is a shark, that's basically cheating

[worn saddle]

Deino is a croc. But it is smaller, so yeah

[lavish quail]

i dont want a deino 1 shotting my spino

no ty

[worn saddle]

It all comes down to whether deino is considered an apex or not.
If it isn’t, it should just be nasty to deal with so that apexes don’t just eat them as a snack

[worn saddle]

This is not what I mean, hun.

[lavish quail]

well if it does 5x the damage

of a rex

and it hits a headshot

[worn saddle]

I was talking about bone break, not bite force. Ofc if we are talking about The Isle mechanics, that bite force will one shot most dinos

[lavish quail]

it should obviously break bones

[meager tiger]

@barren zephyr why are people upset at shallows but you have have 30 up votes for creek. This community is weird lol

[barren zephyr]

Because it’s a good idea

[meager tiger]

Never said it wasn't

But still doesn't make sense

[fallow vine]

well shallows is neat its just way to fucking long and its dead

[meager tiger]

But aren't creeks sometimes long

[fallow vine]

yes just because some are long doesn't mean they all have to be long

[meager tiger]

What if shallows dries up during drought

[dire peak]

good ideas not allowed, waaaah
~average islecord member

[barren zephyr]

Terror

[dire peak]

fat

[barren zephyr]

Hi

[dire peak]

hi

[still raptor]

Shallows is a neat idea for a creek. However, it isn't a creek whatsoever. It's a river that's a wannabe creek.

[dire peak]

both are good ideas

[still raptor]

This should be in the game though

[barren zephyr]

Please

[still raptor]

When can we get pebbled shores?

[barren zephyr]

we need this

[dire peak]

children in isle update 8

[barren zephyr]

Perfect sucho area

[still raptor]

Sucho is a perfect large creek/shallow river fisher.

[barren zephyr]

Children In haast diet :flushe:

[dire peak]

yes

I mean Crowned eagles do it

:cb

[barren zephyr]

Yooo

[still raptor]

Visited this waterfall in my state before. Really beautiful. I need this in game now

#largerpocketpond

and can we get dams again?

[barren zephyr]

Artificial structures dinosaurs can naturally live in would be really nice

Such as suchos or barys nesting around dams

Or any semi aquatic really

[still raptor]

give me abandon bridges

A bridge like this is more appropriate for AE

still would like to see an AE underground mega facility

RE movie umbrella lab. Just give me some shit like this but on a smaller scale.

[sacred moat]

Hmmm on the topic of deino, I think it’s bite should be reworked. Alligators and crocodiles in general aren’t carnivores that repetitively bite their prey to death. I think it should keep its current lunge as its RMB attack. And for its LMB attack on land it should be changed to a bite that grabs onto the prey and crushes it in its jaws with thrashing. This attack should be stamina based, especially for larger prey since they would be struggling to get out of the mouth.

Example of what I’m talking about would be this clip

https://youtu.be/JAz5zhctK4w

I wouldn’t change the ALT bite because I think it’s pretty good atm

[worn saddle]

Best diet supplement for Russian predatory dinosaurs

[worn saddle]

I think making deino’s bites stronger, yet costly in stamina is a way to go.

[sacred moat]

It would also change the combat a bit instead of just boring face tanking that we currently have

[feral solstice]

I wouldn’t make deinos bite stronger.
Cause then it could probably use its alt bite, which since the bite is stronger, so will be the alt bite, which means it could deal serious damage to stego on land, and even Carno

[worn saddle]

No way can a deino 1v1 a stego at this point.

[feral solstice]

It can 2v1 a stego

[worn saddle]

Yes.

[feral solstice]

Making it stronger could turn it into a 1v1

Especially since alt bite deals more damage

Than a bites

And stegos headshot multiplier is 2x

So increasing bite, means increasing alt bite damage.

[paper oriole]

You already aren’t supposed to spam bite as deino. If you are spam biting you are playing it wrong

[rare fractal]

Kinda sounds like that would make deino even more aggravating than it already is. It already causes random death for any player below 4 tons every 30 minutes

[rare fractal]

With the existence of shallows currently spam biting is really all you got

Ik it’s getting removed tho

[worn saddle]

Stego takes the same amount of time to grow (if not slightly less than deino), yet deino cannot 1v1 it? Not really fair tbh

[paper oriole]

Deino has safe spaces, stego doesnt

Thats the tradeoff

[worn saddle]

That’s also true.

[rare fractal]

Deino is the absolute worst option to 1v1 a stego on the basis of physiology

[sacred moat]

Making deinos bite is the last thing we need tbh, it’ll only encourage it to play like a Rex who has a water safe spot when things are looking rough for it

[fluid trench]

Will pachy and merc come out at the same time or at different times

[paper oriole]

When the huge ass shallows are fixed deinos only threat will be other deinos, thats already largely the case rn

[paper oriole]

Mercs later

[fluid trench]

Ok cuul

[rare fractal]

But why make it even more debilitating to mid tiers and below, it already has complete invisibility when it goes 2 inches below the waters surface

[worn saddle]

The invisibility should be removed too.

*reworked

So you can actually see it coming.

[sacred moat]

Wdym

[worn saddle]

You cannot see the deino under water.

[rare fractal]

Yeah agreed, you should actually be able to somewhat see a deino in water so you don’t lose your Dino to what is essentially rng

[sacred moat]

Well I think that’ll change once there are different “water biomes” in the game. Currently it’s all just all dirty murky water

[worn saddle]

Also true, but we are talking about the current state of the game, not the future

[rare fractal]

Mainly because this is a survival game that requires a lot of time investment from the player to grow a single animal, having a Dino that forces the vast majority of playables to play Russian roulette every 30 minutes is pretty catastrophic game design

[worn saddle]

Tbh, the introduction of Deino itself was a mistake. Even though I main deino atm

[sacred moat]

Same goes with stego

[worn saddle]

Even gameplay wise. You just sit in water 24/7, and kill something once in a while

[rare fractal]

Deino should have been Sucho or Bary, stego should have been kentro

[worn saddle]

Stego is fine, but I think it needs a slight debuff at its current state. Barely anything can hunt it

Apart from carno and deino megapacks

[sacred moat]

When I found out deino was coming to the isle, I think I was the only one who wasn’t hyped because sure it’s a giant alligator, cool! But like…..it’s a giant alligator, they don’t have interesting lives tbh

[rare fractal]

No that’s the issue, almost nothing is capable of interacting with them outside of incredibly rare circumstances

[sacred moat]

^^^^^

[rare fractal]

Plus the way crocodilians hunt is mechanically contradictory to a survival game where players actually play terrestrial animals

[worn saddle]

Tbh, I think that Quinkana or Saurosuchus would have made a much more compelling gameplay style.

[sacred moat]

Why sarcho??

[worn saddle]

Not sarcho

Saurosuchus

[rare fractal]

Yeah why another crocodilian tho?

[worn saddle]

This

[sacred moat]

Oh oh oh

My bad

[rare fractal]

Oh I get it

So basically not a crocodilian at all

[worn saddle]

Because Deino is a crocodilian and I compared it to another crocodilian that would have been better for gameplay

[rare fractal]

Ye gotcha

[sacred moat]

Tbh, that looks like a carnivorous magy

[worn saddle]

Pretty much. Carnivorous tanky creature

[rare fractal]

Carnivorous teno

[worn saddle]

I would say carnivorous anky

[sacred moat]

Cerato would out compete the shit out of it

[rare fractal]

I need Cera in my life😞

[worn saddle]

I am not sure what stats will cerato have in Evrima, but if we compare Legacy Cera to a hypothetical Quinkana

[rare fractal]

Cera will most likely get scaled up because of how powerful Carno is

[sacred moat]

^

[worn saddle]

Cera can outmanoeuvre it, while quinkana will have better armour and bleed resistance

[rare fractal]

Which makes me very (potentially) happy

[worn saddle]

Cera was such a poor lad in Legacy. Even though ceras are one of my fav dinos

It was basically an allo, but a virgin

[rare fractal]

Yeah, their running animation also made it look like they missed the bus

[rare fractal]

Prolly the most accurate assessment of a Cera I’ve heard to date

[worn saddle]

Speaking of crocodilians, I believe that they had spoken of adding a land crocodilian at some point. Not saurosuchus or quinkana

But something else

Let me find the concept art

[sacred moat]

It would get bullied by carno and cera and allo

[worn saddle]

They also wanted to add megalania

[rare fractal]

Postosuchus

[sacred moat]

Land crocs just aren’t that good when compared the the holy trinity

[worn saddle]

Yes that

[worn saddle]

True, but it is a game and there could be a way to balance that.

[rare fractal]

Yeah it’s like adding titanoboa when deino Sucho Bary and spino exist

[worn saddle]

Postosuchus is a poor lad, Saurosuchus or Quinkana can at least fuck something up real bad

[sacred moat]

I have a firm Stan of why sucho should not exist in the game with the current roster

[rare fractal]

How so

[sacred moat]

I’ve said this before, the isle has a shit ecosystem

[meager tiger]

Titanboa should get thermal vision

[rare fractal]

I need to hear this

[rare fractal]

It shouldn’t exist

[meager tiger]

It's slow

Only gets 1 attack chance

[worn saddle]

Titanoboa would be a very shitty animal to play tbh. You just sit in one place, ambush a creature, kill it, eat it and sit in one place again

It is a virgin deino

[meager tiger]

Not if we give it kickass predator vision

Lol

[rare fractal]

It’s relatively large and gets completely demolished by any other water based playable. Plus it’s locomotion is just a terrible mosochistic nightmare to make

[meager tiger]

Like a assblaster off of tremors

[worn saddle]

I’m wrong, they wanted to add rauisuchus

[meager tiger]

Well that's why it needs a something unique

[rare fractal]

Ahh ok

[worn saddle]

Basically a virgin cera

[meager tiger]

Thermal vision

[sacred moat]

Sucho gets bullied by literally every other carnivore in its environment. Sucho is not an active hunter like carno, and can’t reliably hunt other dinos as a main food source.

[rare fractal]

No it’s just a bad idea, it can’t get in the position to hunt anything when the areas in which prey exists are occupied by more powerful creatures

It just doesn’t work

[meager tiger]

Even with thermal vision?

[worn saddle]

Like come on man

[paper oriole]

Palaeophis >>>>> titanboa

[sacred moat]

Titanboa should just stay a meme

[rare fractal]

Yes absolutely, that would tell you where players are, but you can’t go out and track them down because you slink around at 15 kmh

[worn saddle]

Or AI.

[meager tiger]

Lol

Ok you got me there

[rare fractal]

Yeah add it as certified canon fodder

[worn saddle]

I also stand by the point that deino should be AI too.

[sacred moat]

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[rare fractal]

As much as I like playing deino I kinda agree

[sacred moat]

Maybbeeee

[rare fractal]

Unless it’s visibility is reworked

[worn saddle]

I would love for megalania to be playable. Adding some sort of a venomous bite would b badass too

[sacred moat]

Based off how they do their AI now, deino would be meals on wheels

[worn saddle]

In order to ward off the big three, of course.

[feral solstice]

Megalania is confirmed

[worn saddle]

But if I had to choose between Mega and Quin/Sauro, I would go with the crocs. Just so much more you could do with them

[rare fractal]

Well first off, it demolishes mid tiers so that’s out of the question. It also wouldn’t be difficult to make it faster than apexes and in regards to deinos Sucho could just occupy and area of the map with incredibly shallow water levels

[worn saddle]

Ik

[feral solstice]

^

[sacred moat]

Right, I’m not arguing that sucho can’t beat up mid tiers. But sucho physically cannot catch any of them

[rare fractal]

Wait what? You could do more with crocs than you could with a faint moniter lizard?

[worn saddle]

Land Crocs are generally faster and more armoured. Mega only has venom bite that is not even scientifically proven

[sacred moat]

Do you also realistically see a sucho running faster than a giga

[rare fractal]

Oh that is true, unless it was given a water ambush. Kinda like what spino is planned to have

[worn saddle]

But it’s the isle, so why not

[feral solstice]

Essentially how I see it is, Deino occupies the Deeper waters, rivers, etc.
Sucho is the Grizzly bear of Ti, occupying the shallows, eating fish to sustain itself and survive, and the occasional land animal.

[worn saddle]

Pretty much.

[sacred moat]

Right, now with water ambush, deino is the king at that shit. So that’s already two niches sucho can’t fulfill because other bigger carnivores in its environment do it better

[rare fractal]

I actually do, but that’s mainly because irl Sucho was faster than an irl giga

[feral solstice]

Deino is the danger of the deep rivers.
Sucho is the danger of the shallow rivers.

[sacred moat]

Giga trott go brrrrrr

[feral solstice]

Legacy go brrrr

[rare fractal]

Nevermind I fact checked and that is incorrect

🥲

I just love Sucho so much, from a design standpoint that is

[worn saddle]

Sucho doesn’t really need to be a fast runner. I can imagine it hunting fish mostly, bullying juvies and smaller dinos off their food and fucking up mid tiers that try to mess with it

But tbh, I think that the dev team should choose between sucho and bary. Their gameplay will be way too similar

[sacred moat]

Danger to what??? The fish??? The same fish that spino can literally walk over and eat and slap a sucho if it tries to do something about it

[rare fractal]

Yeah that seems reasonable

[rare fractal]

Doesn’t have to be, think of it like saying: You have to choose between Troodon and Utah

[sacred moat]

Sucho is a cool looking Dino, but it’s trash in the roster of dinos we have

[worn saddle]

Tro and Utah will have different gameplay. Tro has venom, for example

But I cannot see sufficient differences between bary and sucho

Apart from sucho being larger

[sacred moat]

Bary is waaaaaaay faster than sucho and can easily hunt the small semi aquatics such as beipi or minmi or fish in general

[paper oriole]

Players shouldn’t be forced to eat cave mineral rocks to avoid punishment, they should only be encouraged to. Mineral rocks are supplemential

If they are forced in to doing it, it isn't “engaging”

[worn saddle]

^

[rare fractal]

I think some players think that More Mechanics = Better Game, which is just so incorrect

[paper oriole]

Yeah there was something similar yesterday with “it's something to do” automatically makes it a better game. It does not

[lucid mauve]

yea same, i feel like its gonna be stressing to play it soon

[paper oriole]

If im forced to go into some cave where i cant see shit just to eat rocks and if i don't i get punished for it, it is annoying not engaging

[rare fractal]

Kinda like how people say that giving a creature an incredibly powerful set of abilities that basically remove the incentive to play other creatures would add to the horror aspect

[paper oriole]

If i can choose to risk going into a cave that may be infested with nocturnal predators in order to give myself a worthwhile bonus then it is cool

[paper oriole]

Yeah some people confuse me with their ideas sometimes lmao. Like how?

[rare fractal]

Like constantly hoping a certain animal doesn’t find and delete you isn’t scary

[paper oriole]

It can be startling (if servers werent 40% deino for example) but not scary

Im not like “oh shiver me timbers!” If a deino grabs me it's more like… sigh

[sacred moat]

Honestly same lmfao

[paper oriole]

Its like rexes in legacy

[rare fractal]

3 hours of growth progress annihilated by the predatory rng log

[paper oriole]

Where it should be “oh shit a rex!” It's “sigh, another rex?”

Thats deino rn

[sacred moat]

Which is why they need to make apexes an actual challenge to grow

[rare fractal]

I don’t mean to commit a cardinal sin, but I think deino is even worse. Because at least with rexes you can just walk in the other direction 90% of the time

[sacred moat]

Truuueeeee

[paper oriole]

Yeah deinos just kinda pop up on you lmao

[rare fractal]

Deino will be at the absolute bottom of the apex food chain don’t worry about that

[paper oriole]

I can usually avoid them because most of them dont watch the water near the bushes but sometimes theres a smart deino

[rare fractal]

And if you aren’t playing an 80%+ stego you just cease existing

[sacred moat]

LITERALLY

[paper oriole]

Play the most boring dino in the game or get oneshot by the aquatic bear trap lol

[sacred moat]

That or I drink at shallows

[rare fractal]

That also happens to be invisible

[paper oriole]

Drinking is basically a minefield if you dont go to shallows

[rare fractal]

Deino to me is kinda like that one suggestion of where lightning could randomly strike and kill your Dino when it was raining

[sacred moat]

Which don’t get me wrong, is a good aspect of horror

But

[rare fractal]

In a survival game it has no place

[sacred moat]

When everyone wants to play an apex that drowns you, it’s just a big sigh

[paper oriole]

I hope we get lore water source variety where theres clear water lakes and streams as well but the murky shitwatwr rivers are just the most common maybe, at the least

So we can choose to take extra time to avoid the invisible crocodiles

[ebon geyser]

isnt that coming in u4?

[paper oriole]

I hope so

Man i want titan lake back

[ebon geyser]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/664914260648001555/872618175261450260/River.jpg look this is a shit river

[paper oriole]

Doodoo

[ebon geyser]

same

[rare fractal]

Well everything has about 30 minutes of water so time can’t really be taken to go get that sweet succulent “Not shit water”

[sacred moat]

Not me thinking that was a dried up river

[paper oriole]

Oh yeah i forget that everything needs to constantly be vacuuming food and water rn

Especially carnis

One utah just eats a whole carno

[ebon geyser]

although from what ive seen most rivers will become clearer

[rare fractal]

A Carni should have to consume 30% of its body weight to go from 0-100

Why must it become a black hole of meat

[paper oriole]

20-30% is the range it should fluctuate between for most

[feral solstice]

Late reply
I was playing DBD

[rare fractal]

Yeah depending on the metabolism

[paper oriole]

Like crocs irl can eat 20% in a sitting, carno is a small game hunter so he should to

[sacred moat]

I guess they did it to help stop giant packs?

[rare fractal]

Like deinos would obviously need less food proportionately than a Carno

[rare fractal]

Oh forgot about that

[feral solstice]

Just because you’re slow doesn’t mean you can’t catch something off guard.
Sucho could hide in a bush and sneak up to you, while getting close enough to accelerate and get the bite.

[paper oriole]

So a deino eating a teno or carno would be like the ideal food size to fill

[feral solstice]

Only when the prey is drinking water though

[paper oriole]

Because theyre basically exactly 20% of its weight

[stray holly]

I’d think a grown carno would be enough to fill up a grown deino for awhile

[rare fractal]

Well yeah but that’s like saying, “you can beat the odds and overcome all your statistical disadvantages in rare circumstances where people aren’t paying attention”

[paper oriole]

Yeah exactly

[feral solstice]

Which is why Sucho hunting land animals would be “occasional”

[rare fractal]

What else would it hunt then?

[feral solstice]

Fish

[sacred moat]

You would rather sucho become a rock sitting in a bush waiting for something to cross by

[feral solstice]

Lmfao

[stray holly]

Dibbles

[rare fractal]

So an animal designed to hunt ai 90% of the time

[feral solstice]

Well duh

It’s Sucho

[rare fractal]

No xD

[feral solstice]

It’s not going to hunt land animals it’s entire gameplay

[sacred moat]

Sucho is literally a piscivore

[paper oriole]

I mean it could hunt the small deinos who hang out in shallower areas

[rare fractal]

Ok I see your point it can be compelling

[stray holly]

I wonder if Alberto is gonna come back.

[rare fractal]

Everything will eventually besides pue

[feral solstice]

No, as I said, hunting on land is occasional

[sacred moat]

What would the sucho hunt then

Other than juvis

[fluid trench]

Id say small flyers(like dimorphodon or baby ptera) that come for drinks cuz like it wouldn't be worth it for a grown deino to waste energy on a baby ptera

[rare fractal]

Sucho? That’s what we’re talking about, plus baby pteras give literally no food to anything

[feral solstice]

Adult carnos?
If it’s claw could stun that is,
Or things like Utah or anything similar

Anything it can get it’s jaws into essential

[fluid trench]

Yh i guess

[feral solstice]

Just not to mid tier

[sacred moat]

CARNO?

[paper oriole]

Sucho can hunt juvenile members of herds coming to drink whose parents are too low tier to fight back against it too

[rare fractal]

How tf are they going to interact in any circumstance

[feral solstice]

Drinking water

Lmfao

[sacred moat]

Deino

[feral solstice]

People will migrate to shallow waters because it’s safer from Deino

[sacred moat]

Moment

[rare fractal]

It can’t get deep enough to ambush with deino being in the game

[feral solstice]

It’s not going to ambush from deep water though

As I said multiple times

[rare fractal]

It would have to in order to get close to them

[feral solstice]

Not really

If you can sneak up to them from the forest

Or through the foliage near the shallow rivers

You should be able to sneak up to them

But then again

Like I said

Again

[sacred moat]

Sucho?? In a forest??

My guy

[rare fractal]

But Sucho is enourmous

Also wtf

[feral solstice]

What, are there no forests beside the rivers

[sacred moat]

Sucho is a spinosaurid

[feral solstice]

And

[rare fractal]

You think herds commonly drink from forested parts of the rivers?

[sacred moat]

It sticks to rivers and other water sources

Not ambushing in a forest

[feral solstice]

Sticking to rivers doesn’t mean not occasionally going into the forest to ambush something lmao

Fuck my English

[rare fractal]

Considering herds stay in plains because that’s just more efficient to literally everyone in the herd, they would never be in the circumstances necessary for a Sucho to get a forest ambush

[feral solstice]

Doesn’t stop it from sneaking up through the rivers foliage.

[rare fractal]

Yes it does, Sucho is massive

Plus at that point it’s basically free deino food

[feral solstice]

Not really

[sacred moat]

Sucho is bigger than acro

[feral solstice]

It can wade faster than Deino

Through the shallow rivers

Deino won’t be able to catch up to it

[rare fractal]

Yeah and as I keep saying, that max speed is 30 kmh

[feral solstice]

So no, it’s not free Deino food

I don’t know where you got that conclusion

But each to their own I guess

[sacred moat]

Okay, if it sticks to shallow water, apex carnivores will hunt them down

[feral solstice]

That’s if it’s too slow

[rare fractal]

Or herbis can just walk in the other direction because Sucho is as fast as molasses

[feral solstice]

That = being seen.

[sacred moat]

Sucho is too slow

That’s the point

[feral solstice]

We haven’t even seen it’s new speed lmao

It should atleast be faster than stego

That’s a decent speed

[rare fractal]

If a herbi has 1 second to react to an approaching Sucho the Sucho starves

[sacred moat]

That’s not really an accomplishment

[feral solstice]

There’s.
Fish.
Again.

[rare fractal]

Stego is a walking execution

[feral solstice]

You two are acting as if Sucho will be hunting on land 24/7

[rare fractal]

So why would it be argued that Sucho could hunt herbis then

[feral solstice]

I’m arguing it’s not built to truly hunt on land, so that’ll be occasional

[rare fractal]

You’re acting as if it’s viable for it to be on land at all

As a predator that is

[sacred moat]

Again, if I’m a spino and I see you as a sucho fishing in shallow water, I will 3 call you out of the area and there’s nothing that you as a sucho can do about it

[feral solstice]

Lol tf. I’m saying it has the opportunity to hunt on land if it has to. Doesn’t mean it’ll succeed.
Quit putting words in my mouth

[rare fractal]

You said Sucho is capable of hunting on land, I’m not putting words in your mouth

[meager tiger]

Sucho is fun, you can out stamina apexes while being huge

[rare fractal]

Legacy

[meager tiger]

Well why not keep it having Superior stamina

[feral solstice]

I never said it was CAPABLE. I said it can occasionally do so. Meaning it’s not built for land hunting, only fishing.
So yes, you are.

[meager tiger]

Endurance carnivore sounds fub

Fun

[rare fractal]

I’m just saying that aspect of its stats doesn’t have corresponding game data

[sacred moat]

Why does it need to be a marathon runner???

[feral solstice]

Why does it matter if it can’t chase things down

[meager tiger]

Laughs in human endurance hunting

[sacred moat]

If it has a massive stam pool, it can chase things down

[feral solstice]

Not really

[sacred moat]

That’s how we humans operate

[meager tiger]

Exactly

[feral solstice]

Things could be gone by the time you run out of stamina

[sacred moat]

Sir

Do you know how early humans hunted

[feral solstice]

Teno exists
Carno exists
Utah exists
Dryo exists

[meager tiger]

Have you not read a history of early humans

Wolves also do this

[sacred moat]

All of these are not in a sucho diet

[rare fractal]

Why are we arguing Sucho will be comparable to humans in regards to stamina

Because that’s insane

[meager tiger]

It's the mechanic

Endurance hunting

[feral solstice]

I don’t see why they can’t be.
Atleast they could be neutral. Corresponding with its ability to occasionally hunt on land.

[sacred moat]

We’re not, we using humans as an example of being able to run down things via having massive stam pools

[meager tiger]

Wolves also endurance hunt

Which is why we chose to tame them

Second best endurance hunter

[rare fractal]

More so because of their capacity to be tamed, but that’s also a good reason

[sacred moat]

No, sucho physically cannot catch any of these

[meager tiger]

If sucho isn't endurance hunter than what else can be

[sacred moat]

You just listed the fastest dinos in the game and said Sucho should be able to hunt them down

[feral solstice]

Physically doesn’t mean mechanically.
If it has decent stamina, decent run speed, etc.

[feral solstice]

Like I said, again, hunting does not mean succeeding

[meager tiger]

Billy are you smol brain. You don't have to be fast to hunt lol

[rare fractal]

Fish

[feral solstice]

It has the ability to hunt them, but only occasionally because it’s not built like a truck to handle chases

[meager tiger]

No fluff what dinosaur should be endurance hunter role

[rare fractal]

Doesn’t even need to exist honestly

[meager tiger]

You're against new noches

[rare fractal]

It’s not incredibly interesting. You chase something until it’s tired and finish it off

[meager tiger]

Niches

Uh I think tormenting my prey and slowly exhausting it sounds more fun than killing it in two seconds

[rare fractal]

Running for 3 minutes then biting

[meager tiger]

Yeah

[rare fractal]

Ok, I don’t think many would find that interesting. Plus it’s kinda unbalanced to whatever you are chasing, they don’t have a chance unless they just get to a point in which you can’t get them

[feral solstice]

Uh I find that interesting.

[rare fractal]

Why?

[feral solstice]

A LOT of people find that interesting

[rare fractal]

Why?

[meager tiger]

I find it interesting

[feral solstice]

Because you’re persistently hunting something down, wasting its stamina?
If it wallows, you may not be able to chase it down anymore, and if it crouches, you’ll lose track of it.

If you trot something down until it gets tired, idk that’s kind of satisfying.

No creature does that so far

[rare fractal]

With the existence of wallowing this hunting method is impossible

[feral solstice]

Not if you can run after them.
If you endurance hunt, you’ll be able to run after them while also conserving stamina. It takes a few seconds to wallow, which means you can catch up to them while they’re wallowing, and if they run after you wallow, they’ll probably have low stamina and try to continue running this time into the forest, so it’s a matter of listening and following until it finally tires itself out.

Not to mention if you manage to bite it, it’ll be bleeding, and wallowing doesn’t necessarily clot the blood so you’ll continue producing blood pools after the wallow buff is gone.

[sacred moat]

It’s not even sucho at this point

[feral solstice]

We’re talking about endurance hunting

Not Sucho

[rare fractal]

Wallowing quite literally does clot blood, it prevents bleeding

Plus this hunting method is only possible if the speed difference between you and the target is like 4 kmh or lower

[feral solstice]

Yes but you’ll still produce blood pools depending on the severity of the bleed, after the mud is gone.

Atleast that’s what I’ve been told

[rare fractal]

That would defeat muds purpose so no

[feral solstice]

What

Oh

[rare fractal]

Fucking auto

[feral solstice]

No it won’t?

[rare fractal]

Wallowing plugs wounds and prevents bleeding

[feral solstice]

You mud up, you lose your footprints and temporarily stop producing blood pools.

That doesn’t stop you from running into the forest

Far

So you can’t be caught

[rare fractal]

It lasts quite a bit, if a creature wallows then the hunt is over

Plus this is all implying that a hit can be delivered to the prey, which for an animal that is intended to be slower than the prey is very unlikely to happen

[feral solstice]

well if you’re an endurance hunter, or any hunter for that matter, you’re going to be ambushing.

[rare fractal]

That doesn’t change your speed, if the prey has 1-2 seconds to react it doesn’t matter, plus wallowing just destroys this again because it stops bleed

[feral solstice]

The point of ambushing is to hit it while they’re off-guard.

If you can’t hit them

It’s not an ambush

Not a proper one at that

[rare fractal]

This isn’t a viable method if the herbivore is paying attention

[feral solstice]

And again, endurance hunting means you’re constantly on the move to chase the creature down. Just because it runs off doesn’t mean it’s not blowing its stamina, and not producing footprints. By the time is reaches a river, the predator is still running after it, so either it’ll continue running away or risk the predator catching up and getting close to it while wallowing.

[rare fractal]

Which is only risked if the difference in speed is very small

[feral solstice]

Just because you’re like 6 kmh slower doesn’t mean you can’t endurance hunt lmao

You seem to have this mindset of “slower means you probably can’t hunt something fast down”

[rare fractal]

When animals can wallow to essentially delete the proof they were ever there, yes

[feral solstice]

Which is not the case

[rare fractal]

No that’s not true, but endurance hunting a creature slower than you in this game is basically impossible

[feral solstice]

And, again, if you’re endurance hunting you will probably catch up to them while they’re wallowing.

[rare fractal]

Probably not you are faster than them

Could an animal that runs 30 kmh catch a teno through endurance hunting?

Just a hypothetical

[feral solstice]

Just because you wallow doesn’t mean the hunts over. It could go multiple ways:

A: The endurance hunter will catch you while you’re wallowing.
B: If you run, it could rely on sound and sight to attempt at running and draining your stam even more.
C: If you manage to get away and rest, you better hope it doesn’t smell the blood pools or listen for you. Then, it’s either it finds you and bites you, or it’ll continue chasing you and draining your stamina.

Oddly enough resting creates loud af noises

Hopefully that’s gone.

[feral solstice]

Depends on the scenario.

If it’s far away from mud then probably.
If it’s near a river then that’s going to be hard but it’s not impossible.

[rare fractal]

Blood pools don’t form after wallowing unless your bleed is so high that it drains fully while standing in 45 seconds. The blood pools will also be gone for some time after wallowing regardless so all it takes is for the endurance Hunter to just not go the direction the prey went in order to lose them.

[rare fractal]

Again, mud deletes the evidence you were in a location for about a minute after you wallow

You aren’t finding an animal after than unless they are in the open

[feral solstice]

You do realize your blood still drains after a few seconds after wallowing right.

It’s just slower

It only clots temporarily for a couple seconds

[rare fractal]

It doesn’t, or at least it doesn’t pool

[feral solstice]

Then you have to rest

[stray holly]

Anyone know how long it takes to grow a carno?

[feral solstice]

Scope almost bleed to death after wallowing

[rare fractal]

?

[feral solstice]

What

I can get the vid if you want

[rare fractal]

Scope?

[feral solstice]

ScopeOG

[rare fractal]

Oh I have no clue who that is

[feral solstice]

Oh damn

Well he’s an Evrima pro

I can give you the channel hold on

[rare fractal]

Gotcha

[feral solstice]

https://youtube.com/channel/UCmBMNjPCw0Z7CkATembNgHg

You can learn some awesome strategies watching him

[rare fractal]

Nice thank you👌

[feral solstice]

Np

[lavish quail]

sticky utah but twitch

poggers

[swift dew]

pretty much

[feral solstice]

Sticky Utah but better honestly

[lucid mauve]

how? his playing in big groups cuddling up. Sticky does it solo

[feral solstice]

He also solos though

He plays Utah which requires packs now

[lucid mauve]

Like you always did, unless your on sticky lvl

[swift dew]

@drowsy sun you do realize evrima has way more mechanics than legacy does right?

also wtf is a body down timer? like stoping the fight when a body drops? or a body despawning?

[dreamy bison]

Pretty sure evrima has only been in development a year, with like 6 people working on it through COVID. Sure it’s slow, but it’s understandable given the situation

[swift dew]

its been in development for 2 years, but only released for 1

[dreamy bison]

ah, still a good amount of work for just a few people working from home

[lavish quail]

bro idk what this mans on about

wtf is a body down timer?

[swift dew]

and the dev team is nearly 20 people, but we do only have 3 active coders and 2 animators iirc

[keen vapor]

That guy is tripping balls lmao

[swift dew]

bruh

[lavish quail]

what?

@static acorn what?

[swift dew]

people checkmarked that "feedback"

[solar peak]

@drowsy sun someone probably already told you this, but legacy has less mechanics than evrima lol, having more dinos that are different only with stats and models doesn't mean it has more mechanics

[static acorn]

What what ?

[drowsy sun]

I mean, at least in Legacy, bodies despawned instead of cluttering up and causing lag. I went aggressive because Ive brought this up before and it always gets ignored and steamrolled. It's one example of a mountain of things that could have been added early on, yet wasnt

[lavish quail]

why did you like that "feedback"

[dreamy bison]

bodies do de spawn in evrima tho

[swift dew]

evrima bodies despawn too...

[lavish quail]

decipher for us

we dont know what it is

[drowsy sun]

Yeah sure, when the server restarts

or crashes

[dreamy bison]

If you sit next to a body long enough it will despawn

[swift dew]

they literally despawn after time goes on...

[drowsy sun]

O.o since when

[dreamy bison]

since release

[drowsy sun]

Lmao

Need to see it to believe it, community servers wouldnt have cleaners if it wasnt an issue

In legacy you can set how long the bodies sit before they despawn. Nothing like that for evrima

[vale pawn]

my fish despawned

[dreamy bison]

If it makes you feel better compies are coming in next patch, which will also eat corpses

[swift dew]

I mean if you're having a deathmatch you arent going to notice as the bodies are pilling up faster than they are despawning, like after grows happen. but on a regular server you usually won't have an issue

[drowsy sun]

That actually does make me feel a bit better lmao. Even with the garborator that is deino, the body lag is atrocious

[hoary dawn]

had me in the first half ngl

[drowsy sun]

Ive seen people drop the game entirely because of lag and inoptimization issues, and sometimes I dont blame them

[dreamy bison]

It has gotten a lot better since the start of the year

[hoary dawn]

oh wait was that feedback serious

[drowsy sun]

Nah I used to stand up for the devs hardcore. But then I learned a bit more about game development.. and the more I did the more I just felt depressed that certain mechanics were completely unthought of

[hoary dawn]

i thought it was a joke when i saw "have less mechanics than y'all did in Legacy"

[drowsy sun]

Ive brought it up several times in that channel.. the aggression was more of a shock value thing so that it would actually get read for once

[icy lion]

dont flamebait

[hoary dawn]

well i did read, but stating something blatantly false right at the start does make it seem like you cant be taken seriously

[icy lion]

i wont remove the suggestion since you're clearly having a discussion now, but in the future please dont make aggravating posts for the reactions

[drowsy sun]

Sorry, I didnt mean to flamebait.. I actually didnt know there was a word for that

[icy lion]

yea its a more recent internet term, it means to bait people into a "flamewar" or argument

[drowsy sun]

In the future Ill be more thoughtful with my posts. They didnt have slowmode on the last time I made said suggestion, and it was nicely worded before

[icy lion]

but like i said, youre totally fine now

yea the slowmode has been a topic quite a few times, but i dont think the higher-ups have any real plans or wants to lower it

[drowsy sun]

No its a good thing, it gives them a chance to read the suggestions before they get lost in scroll

[swift dew]

I think 6 hours is a bit execive, but I remember the update 3 stress test it was so bad

[drowsy sun]

It was horrible omfg

[sturdy widget]

I love it when students roll in and act like experts when they haven't even worked in their field yet. Funny stuff

[hoary dawn]

im doubting they are

[barren zephyr]

The zoo emote

[drowsy sun]

It is super frustrating though for anyone who plays the game, that servers arent able to set their own timers for when bodies despawn. It is a fairly simple mechanic that could have been there a lot earlier

[stoic lichen]

body down timer???

[hoary dawn]

im sure body decay rate is the kind of thing that'll be added with the ui overhaul

[drowsy sun]

I'd freaking hop for joy man, just feels weird that legacy can have it yet we dont yet

[dreamy bison]

It probably won’t be added either, as they wouldn’t add global chat because that’s not what they intended for their game to be like

[stoic lichen]

that legacy can have what?

[drowsy sun]

I dont blame them for the global chat removal, but that in itself adds issues as well

[hoary dawn]

a function that lets server owners customize how long it takes for bodies to despawn on their servers

seems reasonable

[hard briar]

Emerald does have a point tho.... the games been broken ever since the update 17 days ago..... flying dinos everywhere, rubberbanding. admin panel is literally not usable with 80+ player in the server, they did hot fixes to try and fix it then it looks like theyve just given up on it 🤣

[static acorn]

Exactly. It's hard to play on it tbh

[hard briar]

the games literally a magical wonder land at this point

and i see no rush to try and fix that

[hoary dawn]

they're gonna be fixing a lot of the current issues with update 4

[drowsy sun]

It really is.. I gave up to an extent, I just get frustrated lol

[hard briar]

but if a games basically unplayable you really gonna leave it till update 4?

that should be top priority

[hoary dawn]

4 is right around the corner so i dont see why not push out everything together, so much is changing in update 4 that its possible some fixes they have can't just be put into the current version

[drowsy sun]

The whole "maybe" and "soon" thing drives me nuts too.. I appreciate Wolf Quest a lot more for letting people know exactly when updates will drop

[hard briar]

i had to restart my game 8 times today in the space of 20mins due to nothing working, that shouldnt be a thing you just throw to the side. and its not just today, everyday since that update come out the game has been broke

you do know update 4 isnt gonna come until about 3weeks plus right?

[dreamy bison]

no eta because they don’t know how long bug fixes and stuff will take

[hard briar]

the update still needs to go through QA and that will probs last 2 weeks maybe more

[stuck whale]

Games broken, still nearly 7 years into the development.. Fix it

[drowsy sun]

They do know that only hurts them in the end though, right? It's a bit disorganized

[dreamy bison]

philipe said in a stream they had to do a lot of going back on code to implement diets, which presents more bugs sometimes

[drowsy sun]

Oh yeah that's true, it will.. cuz every piece of code has to interact, otherwise stuff breaks

[hard briar]

if your game is that broke that no one can play it without having to go around the entire city getting it sorted and you throw that to one side then theres something wrong 🤣

[stuck whale]

They dropped update 3 and players instantly started having game crashes, they dropped 2 hotfixes after update 3.5 and all of the servers started crashing.. It's super simple really

[icy lion]

if it was simple it would be fixed

[stuck whale]

We've got someone with us that has done an entire recode on a ptera in 3 days with working mechanics.. I'm not sure what's happening

[icy lion]

what?

[drowsy sun]

It's just depressing... it's a dream game, but the inoptimization kills it. And I know it's not simple, game development is really difficult and does take time. What people are upset about are the small things, because if those had been implemented sooner, it might have saved them a lot of trouble down the line

[stuck whale]

Optimise the game, make it so unofficial servers aren't lagging to the point we have to restart every 10k seconds

[dreamy bison]

I’m pretty sure both update 4 and 4.5 are getting their own bug fixes, and their own hot fixes. I dont expect many of the present bugs to persist long after update 4

[icy lion]

optimization is a continuous process that the devs are always attempting to improve

[hoary dawn]

ea games have issues, it is only a matter of time before they are fixed, but rushing bug fixes just ends in more bugs

and hell a lot of the technical issues with the game dont even affect everyone, lots of people can play the game just fine with no issue, it sucks that some people do have these game breaking bugs but in the end all we can do is wait for it to get better

[drowsy sun]

It doesnt matter what server provider we go with, either. Gportal at least lets the chat work, but with PingPerfect chat is impossible whatsoever

[stuck whale]

It sure is, but these lag issues have been happening since update 3, months ago now.. And the unofficial servers are feeling every single bit of it

[paper geyser]

i'd like to remind you that this is an early access game which will have bugs and may not work as intended at times, you were made aware of this on both the steam page and the evrima main menu. Work is constantly being done to improve the game's performance and add new content, which should go without saying

[stuck whale]

Oh for sure Kato, I can agree with that completely.. As I have told hundreds if not thousands of players this past 6 months, but it's coming to the point now that it's beyond just a simple, "The devs are trying their best to get the game as best they can" Whilst we're sitting here on a server that can't handle getting over 10k seconds without a server restart since the last 2 hotfixes

[paper geyser]

there is nothing more to be said

[feral solstice]

Okay for one

No

They have WAY more mechanics than legacy

I can name a bunch of them too

Second, no, it hasn’t been a “long time” since the last update.

The last update was 3.5, which released little over 2 and a half months ago

And guess what

That’s when update 4 started Development

And it’s supposedly bigger than update 3.

So imagine that.
Update 3 took a long time, and they managed to develop an update bigger than that, and took less time to do so.

That’s clearly showing their roadmap is working as they said.

[lucid mauve]

and your happy with that ? update 6 gonna be far out in 2022. You wont even get allo before out in 2023

[feral solstice]

Update 3.5 is an update which I was happy for, yes.

It added QOL improvements

Which we desperately needed

[lucid mauve]

the updates are good, im talking about the speed

[feral solstice]

It’s been like 2 and a half months..

Chill

You want 1 month updates?

[dreamy bison]

Update every 3~ months is a lot better than the 5~ months we were getting pre update 3

[feral solstice]

actually it was more like 2 months but yes

[stuck whale]

So what changed from the no lag servers with update 2 to the server crashes, player crashes, and the dipped up mechanics that have been effected after every update since update 3?

[feral solstice]

Agreed

[feral solstice]

No lag servers?

There WERE lag servers

Hell, there were also crashes

[feral solstice]

They fixed it lol

[stuck whale]

There were lag servers, when you looked at 50 bodies in one area of the map.. Now we can't look at 5 bodies at swamp and 2 at south without rubberbanding

[feral solstice]

What Rubberbanding

Rubberbanding was patched

That’s probably tile lag

[paper geyser]

the speed faster than the majority of triple A studios? The studios with several hundred developers? This pace is phenomenal, the issue is people's expectations being set far too high for a game that is still in early access

[feral solstice]

Tile lag is like rubberbanding but it’s not as severe.

It’s like a breeze compared to actual rubberbanding

[stuck whale]

It's super severe, to the point we can't actually play the game anymore. And admins like myself can't use any admin permissions without severe lag too

[paper geyser]

most triple A games will take anywhere from 2 to 5 years to fully develop with studios dozens of times larger than TI's

[feral solstice]

I’ve ran around the map with severe 10+ bodies scattered around, and even sniffed. There was no rubberbanding

[lucid mauve]

what games? ark last update was more then legacy and evrima put togheter : P So no im compering them. It takes 3 months to add some food/diets

[feral solstice]

I don’t see how I’m not effected by it and a lot of people weren’t, but supposedly there’s still rubberbanding.

[feral solstice]

Arks last update also took like 5 months, keep in mind

[stuck whale]

I was hopeful that it was our server provider, till we changed providers and switched locations 4 times to get the best results.. Still the same, and it all boils down to the game

[feral solstice]

And they’re also, surprise, a triple a company

[dreamy bison]

Ark has a lot of people working on it, probably more than the isle’s crew

[paper geyser]

Essentially any triple A game made in the past decade (bar yearly games) has taken 3 or more years to develop and release. What you're talking about is post-release content updates, which aren't the same as fundamental mechanics being added to a WIP game

[feral solstice]

And fun fact

ARK barely bug fixes their game

[hard briar]

i honestly get what youll are tryna do, its a good game but when the game has been unplayable for more then 17days now and yet theyre still working on other editions to the game instead if prioritising something that is game breaking just doesnt make sense 🤣

[feral solstice]

It’s better to work on other additions instead of pushing back content to fix one little bug, that could cause more damage than needed lmfao

Wait for the stress test

[dreamy bison]

Many bug fixes are coming into update 4 too, not just content

[feral solstice]

That’s when you can report the bugs and they’ll fix it

[paper geyser]

bugs will be fixed together in one patch, rather than dishing out small hotfixes that'll give room for more bugs to arise

[stuck whale]

What server provider do the official servers run on?

[lucid mauve]

3.5 came out 05/29/2021 i belive ? thats almost 4 months to add diets

[paper geyser]

Your point being?

[feral solstice]

You do realize after 3.5 there were a couple hotfixes right

[hard briar]

but its not just a "bug" i dont think you can really call flying dinos, rubberbanding. admin panel taking agers to load, spectate taking agers to work a bug....

that is game breaking

[feral solstice]

What flying dinos though

[paper geyser]

what would you call them?

[stuck whale]

Hotfixes that have destroyed the game since then, 17 days ago like Insanity stated

[lucid mauve]

Point is that you need to understand its not strange ppl are complaining. With this speed its gonna take 3 years just to play allo

[strange wave]

you cannot compare the isle to ark in terms of development speed
because the isle actually cares to fix the bugs the plague the game

[paper geyser]

i don't think it's strange people are complaining, i think it's strange that people expect a studio with 19 developers to work as quickly on a WIP game as a studio with several hundred developers does on post-release content

[feral solstice]

That fact you’re considering the bugs as “destroying the game” is fundamentally flawed. No, they didn’t “destroy the game”. You can still play the game. You can still move around. What makes it so destructive?

And no

Rubberbanding is gone

[lucid mauve]

Noone is expecting that, we are talking about diets and some food. It takes 4 months. If we got 2 new dinos + diets etc. I would understand

[hard briar]

i dont even care about the lack of dinos at this point, the thing that gets me and alot of players is that the game is literally unplayable on most servers... the game crashes. things dont work. and if its that bad whys that not getting prioritised

[feral solstice]

A lot of people have reported that, even YOU admins.

[hard briar]

@paper geyser what server do you play on?

[feral solstice]

He’s legit QA lol

[paper geyser]

it's not just "diets and some food". You clearly don't understand the complexity of adding something like diets, which only serves to further my point

[jovial hazel]

It's already been stated the no-save bug is fixed in update 4. That was said almost 2 weeks ago. They couldn't have put a hotfix in for that? That's just one of the any examples that leaves a bad taste.

[paper geyser]

QA

[stuck whale]

Wait so, because I can ONLY move around, means the game hasn't been destroyed after the last 2 hotfixes? But, the games got more mechanics than Legacy..?

[feral solstice]

The fact you can still play the game normally without being pushed or dragged around by the bugs means it’s not “destroyed”

Sure

[hard briar]

so you play on a QA server when that is up, if youre on an unofficial server everytime you played youd get where were coming from

[feral solstice]

The save bug is game breaking

[dreamy bison]

If it’s all getting fixed why complain, it’s a wip so you know there will be problems. You cannot demand to have shit fixed because you went in there knowing it would probably have issues

[feral solstice]

That’s just about as bad

[paper geyser]

when did i say i don't understand what you're saying? I don't recall even addressing a bug directly

[feral solstice]

The QA server and the officials are essentially the same thing lmao. Ones just for testing and adding mechanics

Oh

And mind you

The QA do play in the public servers from time to time

They know what tf is up

[strange wave]

you do realize they are also working
ptera cling
pachy
entire map redesign
making ~ 20 new foliage models for this one update alone
interactions with all these new foliage things
a shit ton of new ai
new human stuff
improvements to the current animals (thats the most recent patch that came out)
and major bug fixes to all of the above
and probably more

[feral solstice]

^

Remember there are even unannounced systems

Coming with update 4

[strange wave]

yup

[feral solstice]

So chill tf out

[dreamy bison]

Do not forget the 3~ animations for every dinosaur due to bone break

[feral solstice]

Actually

No

[dreamy bison]

That in itself is a lot of work

[feral solstice]

The 40+ animations

Per Dino

[paper geyser]

it's things like these that boggle my mind the most. People vastly underestimate the amount of work and actual content that goes into each update

[stuck whale]

But we can't play it normally? Do you play on unofficial servers? Or just the official ones?

[dreamy bison]

Perfect scenario still takes a long time

[feral solstice]

I play on both

[strange wave]

oh right yeah fractures too
also its like 40 animations, because of the different areas that are fractured, and different fracture levels

[feral solstice]

I can still play it normally lol

I can still hunt shit

I can still eat

I can group

I can drink

[stuck whale]

For a game to have more mechanics than Legacy, it needs to actually work

[dreamy bison]

I mean in a perfect scenario it will take a long time, so you know it will be a while regardless

[feral solstice]

I can jump, run, pounce

[hard briar]

but thats officials? it might not be bad on official servers, but on unofficial its like playing a 2021 game on a 1923 laptop

[feral solstice]

Oh really

Fun fact

People have said the officials run worse than unofficials

So idk what you’re talking about

[tired tiger]

yeh they do

[stuck whale]

I can assure you, they don't

[feral solstice]

Seems to be up to preference

[tired tiger]

i can assure you they do

[stuck whale]

Official servers run like a dream, compared to the unofficial servers

[feral solstice]

Seems it’s different for everyone

[hard briar]

so if thats the case whys it not a priority to fix that? instead of adding headbutting a tree for mango's and coconuts 🤣

[stuck whale]

Hardly mentioning the fact, apart from the official servers, we have possibly the biggest community server on Evrima.. Official servers run like a dream

[strange wave]

you do realize thats part of diets right?

[feral solstice]

Why do they have to delay an update which adds content, which they’re going to release a stress test for you to report bugs and help them fix the game.. over one little bug.

[tired tiger]

none run well for me but official servers are a bit slower

[dreamy bison]

They are coming in the same update as mangos I assume, they do not tend to ignore issues

[paper geyser]

once again belittling an update's actual contents to make it seem simpler and easier

[feral solstice]

^

[feral solstice]

This is a bad development move

If you’re going to stress test an update

Don’t delay that

That’s like

[hard briar]

why would you add more content to the game when the base game is broken tho? thats just gonna add fuel onto the already existing fire 😕

[paper geyser]

y'know, you don't have to play the game. The current Isle sold on steam is Legacy. It is a privilege that we can even play Evrima at this stage. Don't like it? Don't play it. Come back in a few months when there's less to complain about

[dreamy bison]

Because they are also repairing the game as they add new things to it. It’s not like they are adding shit and not solving old problems

[feral solstice]

Well you see, if you use even a fraction of your brain cells, you’ll realize that they’re stress testing the update, which means you can report the bugs and help them fix the game.
Did you know that?

[stuck whale]

7 years and we've got 9? dinos.. Some youtuber just recoded the entire Simpsons Hit N Run game in a week.. We aren't asking for much, just optimise the game

[feral solstice]

Evrima is different from legacy

[jovial hazel]

I thought the whole point of the recode was because the Legacy foundation was fucked and adding onto that just made things worse. I feel like Insanity has a valid point, it seems like they are repeating past mistakes.

[feral solstice]

It’s been almost 2 years since it started development

[icy lion]

evrima has been in development for 2 years

[paper geyser]

two years and we have 9 playables with more unique mechanics than legacy ever had

[feral solstice]

^

[feral solstice]

The whole point of the recode was to get out of the code that a developer sabotaged

[paper geyser]

i can assure you they are not.

[tired tiger]

that is true but legacy has variety currently

[paper geyser]

legacy has variety in models

[hard briar]

that does not make sense at all, if youre a dev of a game that is basically unplayable to the community why would your waste that time adding more content when youre already existing game needs fixing? you do know having a game thats broke is gonna impact the player base? adding more content isnt gonna overpower that

[tired tiger]

yes

[stuck whale]

Legacy has variety in models, more dinos, and still runs amazing..

Not models sorry, mechanics

[paper oriole]

What mechanics lol

[paper geyser]

gameplay is bland and essentially the same for all playables. Though it does come down to personal preference. Play Legacy for now if it's that superior to Evrima

[tired tiger]

yep so in theory better

[feral solstice]

Dude. Get real. There’s a stress test coming. You need to realize that. You’ll be able to stress test and help them fix their game, while participating in the new content.

It’s not hard to understand

[dreamy bison]

They probably already have the bugs fixed in the update, but are waiting until they are satisfied to release it. When the stress test comes out, bugs that are still in the game will be weeded out.

[stuck whale]

Nesting, working admin perms, body despawn times, working stuff

[hard briar]

bruh you all acting like the stress test is in 2hrs

[tired tiger]

if im the right age to do the stress test

[feral solstice]

Nah it’ll be public

[tired tiger]

ok

[paper geyser]

you're acting like the developers are leaving the bugs in for the fun of it

[hard briar]

its already been 17 days since that update that broke everything and 3updates later to try and fix that they gave up

[tired tiger]

they prob are

[dreamy bison]

Bro they are holding the bug fixes for the stress test because it is much easier to manage than release multiple hot fixes

[feral solstice]

No, I’m using common sense to tell you that there’s no point in hotfixing the current build when there’s a stress test coming soon which will help them fix their game while giving us new content.

[worn saddle]

The Isle was recoded 2 times.

[tired tiger]

you do know theres a lot of hate going to the developers for ways they say there not listening to the community at alll

[hard briar]

thats like leaving a house fire burning until it rains because its easier to put out 🤣