general-feedback-discussion

[vestal rune]

@thorny lynx I really like your section on how carrying corpses should work, I like your idea of tapping G to rip a piece of meat and holding G to drag(but instead of adding extra animations, if you hold G on a corpse that is too big to carry in any way you just rip a chunk like you do now), and the math behind making corpse dragging more logical and complex is also quite good. but I heavily dislike the idea of carrying live animals, this can lead to griefing very easily and being able to carry your own babies would make nesting a bit too easy. As for the pinning section, I reckon that could probably work as a special ability like for allo but could maybe be incorporated for all carnis?

[tired wagon]

Salmon fishing spino is lovely in my heart

[robust vine]

it would be cool if a bigger dino could rip a bigger piece of flesh like an entire leg from a bigger body

[vestal rune]

that may be possible with the gore update but idk if it's conductive gameplay wise

[robust vine]

also it would be pretty funny being a juvi and getting snatched by a bigger dino because they wanna adopt you XD

[stable mica]

shit I put that in the wrong chat

[silver zephyr]

@burnt jetty being able to move while you graze is a thing in current evrima

[barren zephyr]

Sniffing while walking for herbivores when?

[burnt jetty]

NO WAY I’ve jus been standing in one place like an idiot

[silver zephyr]

well I wouldnt say you're an idiot but yeah you have

[dense vale]

to the lakes comments thats pretty much all i did in legacy was walk around from pond to pond to see what dinos id run across make freinds/food ect.

if the purpose of now is making water challenging it just dont work in practice. if water is rare and im at one why would i leave and risk my life. rare water promotes camping since its non depletable. and water sources that are small enough to be depleted arent interesting enough to be travel points of interest. so overall i just think more water is better.

[robust vine]

i remember seeing a suggestion about the possibility of drinking from puddles after it rains. id love to see that be added to the game, as well as flooding

[vivid tulip]

Overall my all evrima gameplay was next to water. Why go away if you forced to march back all the time over large distances, slightly more water source s should donthe trick

[dense vale]

i would do more than slightly more water. id rather have water difficulty balanced by thirst depletion than having dead zones on the map

looking at the map maybe 12 ponds mostly between the rivers and ocean so people can leave the middle and explore. then balance by thirst rate if needed

[stable mica]

Honestly I don’t like the idea of water draining to an extent cuz then you’ll possibly have a situation where all the water is nearly undrinkable and it goes from an immersive struggle to survive to just plain annoying when every watering hole is drunk dry

From an idea perspective that’s cool

But from a Gameplay perspective it’s more tedious then enjoyable

[dense vale]

im not sure how it could be. i wouldnt want depletable ponds mean your stuck or screwed when its dry but maybe it could just be a bonus like its easier to travel to the nice ponds area when it rains cause you can drink mud puddles on the way there. but you still could run there during dry periods if you dont get lost/attacked or something on the way.

like rain being an easy migration signal

[cyan flame]

@foggy pivot Global making everyone getting along and being friendly and all that is not really good. Sure, it should be an unofficial option, but it's not desirable for the game, or so it's been said, and so it will if nothing else be modded in (you also shouldn't really be able to just sit and idle and all that, game needs to be cranked up in difficulty and all perhaps). For group, if you're the same species, and you're within hearing range, I should know what you're saying. Simple as that. If you don't want anyone else around you to know, then don't speak, or go out of their range before you do. We will also be getting local range options, such as shout and whisper, so you will have some control over how far your voice goes, if you keep the proper distance and all.

[ruby cipher]

Shouldn’t be modded in.

All they have to do is have it so server owners can enable or disable it for their servers

[foggy pivot]

Why should someone in a completely different pack know something that im trying to say to only my pack? Where is the logic in that

And again, thats how YOU feel. You don't like Global, then turn it off for YOURSELF.

[ruby cipher]

^

In legacy, you could just tab to local and not look in global

[cyan flame]

Because, you're still speaking in the same "language". And like I said, you'll get different levels of voice control. You should not be able to sit right next to me as the same species and say stuff without me knowing, that seems odd, and is probably also not quite how the game should work and feel.

[paper oriole]

Its kinda dumb that you could be sitting 2 feet away from someone of your own species and tell your pack 30 meters away you want to kill them and the person next to you would have no clue lol

[cyan flame]

And I'm fine with global being a server option for unofficials, but the devs are not.

So, modding it is, at least for now.

[foggy pivot]

Okay, well based on everything im gathering is people dislike it because its not realistic? Even though the game is far from realistic. Why are we applying realism to voice if not to everything else?

[silver zephyr]

also imo it makes more dynamic situations, for example if you wanna plot something against another pack you would need to get out range and check to see if any of them are potentially listening in, I do wish the different ranges were in though since idk the range

[cyan flame]

We are applying realism in the way that it makes sense and seems logical. That's not quite the same as game being realistic in everything. We take fall damage, we die if we run out of blood. Stegos don't just float or something. Voice is just one of those things that is applied so it makes sense.

[normal brook]

#makeglobalchatgreatagain

[ruby cipher]

At this point, I’ve been feeling of just giving up on the isle because I’m bored without global and I’m sick and tired of wondering the map just trying to find people.

[cyan flame]

You see those guys go over there and huddle up? Yeah, they're probably up to something, you might wanna be ready and all :p

[silver zephyr]

thats an inherent problem with the game, once again im fine with it being an option on unofficials but the game shouldnt be boring to the point where global is your main source of entertainment

[cyan flame]

I can get that. But it's not the end of the world, there are ways to mitigate this, and make it work and have fun without. After all, people play on officials and those have no global chat. There are hotspots you can go to, you can use ingame calls (broadcast and all) to find people or make yourself known, and no doubt someone will come along. I do understand peoples frustrations, but it's not quite as terrible as people sometimes make it out to be either.

[ruby cipher]

I talk to everyone when I’m playing the game.

It’s lonely and dead overall without

It

[swift dew]

well its not a chatroom, when will people understand this. play the survival game, not the sit around and chat game. because that isnt what this game is

[ruby cipher]

How we supposed to have fun? The admins can’t host events because there is no global chat....

[cyan flame]

@silver zephyr I wish there was some consistency with nametags vs local chat range. Right now chat range is much shorter than name tag range. I wish they added so while in local range, nametag always visible, when outside of it, you can use broadcast to make nametag show up for your group.

[ruby cipher]

I love events but at this rate, they can’t host events. If they did, the constant announcements takes up half the screen and is annoying.

[silver zephyr]

from my experience I've actually heard more than before, before you could send a clear and concise mssage and have it be one and done but without direct communication you may have to use many calls to get a point across

[swift dew]

so the game isnt fun at all if there is no events?

[cyan flame]

You do have discord, that can be used. And surely you have fun without events. You can most likely host events even without global chat, using announcements and discord for it. Though I do quite agree that the announcement thing is taking up far too much screen. My point is that there are ways around, and to be completely like "this is the end" is not very helpful. Is it going be harder, yes, no doubt. Can it be done anyway, yes most likely. All I'm asking for is for people to try and sort things out, instead of just saying it's all shot to shit, if that makes some sense to you.

[ruby cipher]

The server I play on hosts events every week ? I have played the isle for long periods of time but guess what, it had global so I was able to have convos while playing the game. And it’s also so I can try and tell someone that’s not the same species they can’t eat this body. Either 3 call or leave. Can’t say that because no global 🙃

Not everyone has discord tho?

Example: new people who join in as when an event is happening

They can’t ask what’s going on if there’s no global

But I’m done talking at this point. Last time I checked, it’s the players that keep the game going.

[swift dew]

this is the exact problem I am talking about "I was able to have convos while playing the game" im going to say it again, this. game. is. not. a. chatroom.

[ruby cipher]

It’s not realistic at all. We are people playing a GAME

[quartz quiver]

ITs an online game dude, if peeps want to talk with one another who cares, if you dont want to swap to local as you could in V3 and ignore it...

[silver zephyr]

this could be a dumb take but what prevents someone from getting discord? and if your trying to join community servers regardless is it not best to join to get an idea of the rules and other things that happen within it such as events ?

[quartz quiver]

Just because you dont like it doesnt mean others should not have the option

[ruby cipher]

I can say this, and others have said it before in servers I’m in. They will loose players.

[vestal rune]

why should the devs add a feature and deal with it that goes directly against the core principles of their game when it can just be modded in?

[ruby cipher]

All I am saying is they need to make it so the owners can turn on and off global.

[quartz quiver]

Because it CANT be modded in

[vestal rune]

it will in the future

[ruby cipher]

Not everyone wants to play how the devs want us to play

[quartz quiver]

"it will in the future" well you can make that argument in the future then savvy

[vestal rune]

that's true, but the devs don't have to cater to them

I can feel perfectly free to play this game like a battle royale game, doesn't mean the devs should add mechanics to make that an intended gameplay style

[silver zephyr]

I also dont get this, they dont want global, they arent gonna implement something they actively dont want as a part of their game. mods are generally for this kinda stuff (stuff devs chose not to implement and weird shit like crossovers) although I get the complaint since modding is far away off

[ruby cipher]

And honestly, the devs should of never had global if this is how they want us to play..

[remote thunder]

Lol, forcing people to talk in Local so that they don't murder the guy standing next to them... :Laughs in Discord private chat:

[quartz quiver]

This IS a social game, the idea of social games is that peeps like to shock horror, socialise...
so yea put in the option and those who dont want it then turn it off.

[vestal rune]

you might be on to something 🤔

[quartz quiver]

Those who want it got it, those who dont dont

[vestal rune]

this isn't a social game, it's a hardcore survival game

[cyan flame]

They are actually. I would say a bit of the issue here comes from how they handled the start of the game and all :p

[quartz quiver]

no its a social game, hence herd and pack mechanics

[vestal rune]

ye I can get behind that, idk why they added global chat at all

[quartz quiver]

its also an online game since you know, peeps want to play with others

[cyan flame]

And you can play with others.

Others of your own kind.

[vestal rune]

those are compartively minor parts of the game, supplemented by the compartively minor mechanic of local chat

[cyan flame]

You can still be social with others as well, just using ingame calls.

[vestal rune]

local chat allows you to chat with your herd, it's fine

[ruby cipher]

And how are herbies supposed to mix pack and talk when they not the same species ?

[quartz quiver]

As I said if you dont want it turn it off, but you shouldnt deny those who do want it, that just makes you a douchebag frankly

[vestal rune]

they don't

[silver zephyr]

calls

[cyan flame]

Herbs are not supposed to mix.

And they still can, again, ingame calls

[vestal rune]

oh ye and calls, calls are good too

[ruby cipher]

Servers have mix packing allowed....

[oblique fiber]

There are some servers that allow mix packing. It’s causing more issues.

[quartz quiver]

herbs have AL:WAYS mixed pack its called herds...

[cyan flame]

Yes and those servers are bad :p

[quartz quiver]

Literally every server has herds

[cyan flame]

And just because it's always been a thing, does not mean it's good

[ruby cipher]

Devs can’t force us to play how THEY want us to play

[oblique fiber]

Oh, you’ve played them all?

[cyan flame]

We've seen how bad mixherding can be

[ruby cipher]

I love mix packing

[vestal rune]

yes they can, do you understand the purpose of mechanics?

[cyan flame]

@oblique fiber No, but mixing is a balance issue, when done both as carni and herbi. This I do know.

[hybrid matrix]

what are you talkin about???
when has 2 camas, 3 shants, 4 trikes, and 7 theris ever been a bad thing?

[vestal rune]

mechanics are the reason you can't play this game like an RTS, those inheriently force you to play the game the way the devs want you to

[cyan flame]

@vestal rune And this is why they should never have launched the game as a sandbox and all that. We get this.. :p

[ruby cipher]

They will get annoyed about us wanting global back

[oblique fiber]

It works just fine on LFaW legacy.

[ruby cipher]

A lot do

[cyan flame]

@hybrid matrix You're trolling me, right? ;)

[hybrid matrix]

yes

[quartz quiver]

1. mix packing as a carni is usually never allowed (Except scavs), 2) herbs always mix pack because of herds...

[vestal rune]

devs know when criticism is valid or not, they don't just listen to the masses

[cyan flame]

Thought so, but you never do know here ^^

@hybrid matrix I remember the wars, good times, for those who like wargames, not so much for a lone survival player :p

[hybrid matrix]

yeah its hard to see tone thru text

[ruby cipher]

Devs should listen to their players wants honestly

[vestal rune]

they can mixpack, but they don't need to be able to talk with each other, only using calls makes it more interesting

[ruby cipher]

Don’t listen people leave

[cyan flame]

You know, I'm sure someone would say what you did and mean it, so .. :p

[vestal rune]

devs should make the best game, they should take into account what players are saying, but they shouldn't blindly listen to the masses

[quartz quiver]

NAh dont leave, because then these idiots are the only voices the devs will hear

[hybrid matrix]

oh yeah no there r definitely ppl who would be serious about that

[vestal rune]

because guess what? oftentimes the masses don't understand what's best for the game

[ruby cipher]

What’s best is GLOBAL

[silver zephyr]

I get we disagree but I'd like to not be called an idiot for a different opinion

[ruby cipher]

For servers that WANT UT

[oblique fiber]

New players I imagine want help. And if they don’t have the discord link to say this server, how the hell will they ask for help?

[ruby cipher]

It*

[vestal rune]

see that's the thing, global is TERRIBLE for this game, even on unofficials

[vestal rune]

this is a general onboarding issue that will be fixed with tutorials

[hybrid matrix]

so play on a server without global

[ruby cipher]

So? You don’t like it? Don’t have it open. Simple as that.

[quartz quiver]

I will call anyone an idiot who argues for a feature not to be included that other players enjoy instead of arguing to have the ability to disable it (either server or player)

[oblique fiber]

New players are more turned away I imagine after they learn global is gone

[remote thunder]

How is it terrible for unofficial servers, which you don't have to play on?

[silver zephyr]

[cyan flame]

That's a good point. The game severely lacks information and all for new players, and even old ones when it comes to new mechanics. This I hope they'll fix sooner rather than later.

[vestal rune]

I should have been more specific, it's terrible for it to be in the base game at all

[oblique fiber]

So you agree that global should come back? Even for just that reason.

[vestal rune]

plenty of players want shitting and mating animations, should the devs add that?

[cyan flame]

The problem is that it could be argued for any feature, even those that make no sense for the game at all.

[quartz quiver]

If you dont want to be an idiot its real simple to me, argue in favour of maximising player choice instead of player limitation 🤷‍♂️

[remote thunder]

For official servers, where you can get the full experience, exactly as Dondi intended... I agree. But not unofficial community servers.

[vestal rune]

so should the devs waste time on adding a battle royale mode? an RTS mode? a building mode? those are all just maximising player choice

[hybrid matrix]

it should be disabled as the default setting i agree, but it should be customizable like everything else

[cyan flame]

No. I agree that global can be a server option. I do not think global should be where you get help/info, I believe the game should handle that in game in a much better way than it currently does. Dossiers, "tutorials", and so on.

[vestal rune]

unofficial community servers are still playing the game dondi designed, if they want to modify it, mods will be in the game in the future

[arctic nimbus]

What's wrong with just turning off chat in settings?

[oblique fiber]

Majority of players want global back, it should be an option on a server to server basis

[vestal rune]

I don't think this is true, if it's a majority then it's a very slim majority

[quartz quiver]

you are doing what is called a fallacy- taking an argument to an extreme and ignoring the standard. People like having global and group chat, did this game previously have this mechanic or could it benefit from this mechanic? The answer is yes.

[cyan flame]

Nothing really. I'm fine with it being a server option, but the devs do not think it suits the game at all. Beyond that, we're just discussion how the game should be played and all.

[silver zephyr]

I mean it could be majority but we simply dont know

[cyan flame]

I don't think it's a majority, it's probably not even a majority of the discord people, much less the whole base.

[vestal rune]

exaggerating your point to show you the issues with it isn't a fallacy, why should the devs add a mechanic that goes directly against their game's experience just because some people want it?

[oblique fiber]

It should be a server to server decision.

[remote thunder]

Mods are a LONG way off... we know how slow this development cycle is. Waiting that long for something that the devs can just turn on/off, and essentially kills community servers... is ridiculous.

[cyan flame]

Game previously had sandbox, we don't have that in Evrima currently, much to my frustration, and we might not get it any time soon either.

[oblique fiber]

Not everyone likes no global.

[vestal rune]

I swear the devs said they want sandbox to just be a mod as well, so RIP

[oblique fiber]

And from what I’m seeing here, more want it back than not.

[vestal rune]

no global won't kill community servers

[vestal rune]

this isn't necessarily the case

[oblique fiber]

How do you know?

[remote thunder]

lolz... you don't know. You probably don't play them then.

[vestal rune]

because discord still exists, there's no reason no global should kill community servers

[quartz quiver]

No its a fallacy dude, its a badfaith tactic used by idiots with no concept of rationalised positions. So yes you are wrong. And that is why they should add it because some people (probably most) do want it and either actively gain or passively gain from it, a chat is an indicator that the server is active, that is engaging, and it gives people the ability to talk or group up with other players. Hardcore players like yourself will make the game boring for most people

The pursuit of realism WILL come at the expense of gameplay

[vestal rune]

I don't give a shit about realism, everything I've talked about is for the sake of gameplay

[oblique fiber]

Tabbing in and out from game to discord is completely idiotic.

[vestal rune]

this game is a HARDCORE game so it will have mechanics that promote hardocre gameplay and remove any mechanics that discourage it i.e global

[vestal rune]

fairly sure there's an ingame overlay for discord

[quartz quiver]

No you are talking about realism and now you are lying. You are wanting a real experience of a dinosaur, so no chat, no mixing, etc.

And no this game isnt advertised as hardcore

[hybrid matrix]

actually that is wut the devs are aiming for

[vestal rune]

no, I don't want global because it encourages people to sit around and do nothing rather than actually playing the game

[oblique fiber]

Not everyone wants to do that. Global should come back.

[quartz quiver]

you mean like they do now without global...

[oblique fiber]

Why do you have an issue with that?

[quartz quiver]

What do you think happens when they bring back nesting dude

[cyan flame]

The game is meant to be hardcore horror survival yes.

[oblique fiber]

Is it hurting your gameplay personally?

[quartz quiver]

did you actually play V3?

[ruby cipher]

Don’t like global, oh well others do. If it’s an option to turn on and off. Go to a server that doesn’t have global on period.

[hybrid matrix]

except the difference is in a finished evrima theres gonna be diets and stuff, so ur gonna have to move around instead of afk growing

[vestal rune]

wtf I tried to send a screenshot of the isle's store page and clyde said it was explicit?

[quiet estuary]

this has always been the intention of the game

a hardcore survival horro experience

[sterile bronze]

At the VERY least the Devs should add Global back until they’ve fully implemented the admin tools and tickets. Moderation at all is difficult, especially in community servers. Mixpacking and overpacking are rampant rn and there’s no way for staff to effectively moderate their servers.

[hybrid matrix]

this i like

[vestal rune]

above this it says "a world designed to kill you"

[cyan flame]

I personally want that, but it doesn't matter. There's that, and there's hardcore and harsh gameplay in general. But the devs want this to be hardcore, so, no chat and no mixing, no things to make it easier or more friendly. The world is designed to kill you.

[cyan flame]

Read my mind there!

[quartz quiver]

No thats not true, they are going to add variety but you dont have to pursue that variety it will jsut help your breed grow quicker

[vestal rune]

yes, this game IS marketed as a hardcore experience

[quiet estuary]

Which is why they removed global as it takes steps backwards from their intention of a survival horror game

[oblique fiber]

And? Doesn’t mean we can’t have global chat.

[remote thunder]

@vestal rune No Global, with poor admin functions => Hard for community server admins to do their job => No rules, FFA style wild-west => Community servers no different than official ones => Kills community servers. Basically.

[vestal rune]

yes it does, because global chat goes DIRECTLY AGAINST what I just posted

[hybrid matrix]

yeah but if u afk grow then ur gonna take much much longer to grow

[vestal rune]

they're gonna add more admin functions very soon, community servers will likely survive until then

[quiet estuary]

But zorm wouldnt another solution be improving admin communication functions

[hybrid matrix]

hopefully 14 hours for afk growing as an apex

[ruby cipher]

It if went against that, why was it in legacy? #Bringglobalback

[quartz quiver]

Point to me where it says its supposed to be a hardcore experience...

[cyan flame]

And if you don't, you'll grow for ages, and be weaker and less good at surviving in general, cause stats. And miss out on perks.

[remote thunder]

[quiet estuary]

instead of adding global which the developers have mentioned is away from the intended design of their game

Like if admins get a better interface with players than the problem seems fixed imo

[silver zephyr]

steam page description: "Experience fierce open world survival gameplay as you attempt to stay alive on an unforgiving island inhabited by dinosaurs! Hunt. Grow. Survive." one definition of fierce: "having or displaying an intense or ferocious aggressiveness." one definition of unforgiving: "(of conditions) harsh; hostile." not intended to be hardcore

[cyan flame]

Because legacy was all sorts of messed. This game had one direction, and changed it a few times around. Now they want to go back to their original roots, sort of.

[vestal rune]

"The isle: A world designed to kill you" "The isle is intended to be a gritty open-world survival horror game", the "gritty" he is code word for "hardcore"

[quartz quiver]

It says you are going to die and not trust other people- many games online say that. they still have chat features

[cyan flame]

That'll hopefully come with the UI overhaul update.

[quiet estuary]

Yes
hopefully

[hybrid matrix]

read this

[quiet estuary]

but isle devs

[cyan flame]

At least I've heard that it's supposed to come with that.

[oblique fiber]

Lmao you’re blowing smoke bro

[vestal rune]

this is literally right on the store page???

[quartz quiver]

That doesnt say anywhere that its a hardcore dino simulator or words to that effect dude

[quiet estuary]

What

[cyan flame]

@vestal rune I don't think people actually read before they buy..

[vestal rune]

what

[remote thunder]

How long will that take... and it still isn't friendly towards community servers that want that interaction... The devs said they want to give more power to admins, not less... This doesn't do that.

[cyan flame]

It's not a dino simulator no, not quite.

[hybrid matrix]

"kill or be killed" "your mistakes will be punished"

[cyan flame]

Has nothing to do with it still being hardcore and ruthless.

[ruby cipher]

Still. Global should be back in the game period. It is the players that keep it going.

[oblique fiber]

If they wanted it to say hardcore game, THEY WOULDVE PUT THAT IN THE DESCRIPTION

[hybrid matrix]

LITERALLY SAYS "expect no survivors"

[vestal rune]

how does "this game will not hand hold you" and "gritty" and "kill or be killed" not SCREAM "hardcore"

[oblique fiber]

Not everything needs to be walk around words

[vestal rune]

THEY DID

[quartz quiver]

Kill or be kill- LOTS of games say that dude, especially online ones, they still have chat mechanics

[compact hare]

I dont see the word hardcore so its not a hardcore game

[quiet estuary]

Zorm knowing the devs probably ages
But even if this reduces powers in some manner
what if they increase it in others

others which still in the end push the entire direction of the game developers want

[cyan flame]

Fine, it's not explicitly hardcore, it's just a harsh unforgiving survival game.

[oblique fiber]

Lmao stay on official and leave the community servers to their own

[quiet estuary]

I dont think community servers will die in that time
But they will have to change yes

[vestal rune]

erik don't give in to them, what the store page says does heavily indicate it is hardcore

[vestal rune]

I want to leave the community servers to their own, which is why I don't think they deserve their own special mechanics

[ruby cipher]

It doesn’t say hardcore

[quiet estuary]

But servers were going to have to change heavily anyways as many mechanics, such as the anti cannibalism one, will arm rules such as body down

So servers changing isnt a major negative

[silver zephyr]

yes but it says many other things that convey the message of a hardcore game

[hybrid matrix]

do none of u understand what an implication is?

[vestal rune]

you do know synonyms exist right? "gritty" is a synonym for "hardcore"

[hybrid matrix]

this whole paragraph heavily implies that the game is hardcore

[quartz quiver]

Unforgiving is fine, but its not hardcore, and its not aimed to be a singleplayer experience, so they should use tools to maximise player interactivity with one another. And if anyone says mods I will know point blank you are an idiot with no background in any of it 🤷‍♂️
Because saying "mods" has become the easy way to palm something off to other people AND there is no saying nor guarantee this will have mod or moddedserver support

[vestal rune]

the devs HAVE guranteed mod support

[oblique fiber]

Does that affect you personally?

[vestal rune]

also, global goes directly against the point of this game, i.e it should be a mod

[quartz quiver]

No they havent dude. They have said "it might happen"

[vestal rune]

no they've said it will happen

[sterile bronze]

This game is a survival horror game, but it’s not “hardcore” or realistic in the slightest. That argument against global just isn’t valid.

[quartz quiver]

And even then it MIGHT get dropped through the development cycle

[oblique fiber]

Does global affect you directly @vestal rune?

[hybrid matrix]

its not realistic, but its hardcore

[vestal rune]

it is hardcore, it's always meant to be

[quiet estuary]

Mod support has existed in the past, itll take ages though but i doubt it wont be gone forever

[silver zephyr]

#balance-feedback-discussion message the

[hybrid matrix]

im honestly just here to fix the dumb arguments

not on either side lol

[vestal rune]

look at what fulgore just posted

[hybrid matrix]

but this game IS gonna be hardcore

[quiet estuary]

Devs say a lot of things firefish

[silver zephyr]

[quiet estuary]

Pepe the frog emote

[vestal rune]

I'm sorry if the fact that this game is hardcore comes at a shock to you, but this was the vision from the beggining by the devs, the devs have made it clear, and it's been heavily advertised that way

in the future once mod support is added, you'll be able to modify the game to make a more casual experience, but until then, you have to paly the game

[silver zephyr]

funny green frog xdddddd

[quartz quiver]

"at a later date" doesnt mean anything dude. At a later date there will be world peace 🤷‍♂️

[quiet estuary]

No

[vestal rune]

what?

[oblique fiber]

I don’t care that it’s hardcore. There still needs to be a way NOW for new people to easily ask for help.

[quiet estuary]

Cardboard

[quartz quiver]

Hey badfaith arguments can be flung either way

[hybrid matrix]

dude punch literally said modding will come

[quiet estuary]

werent you just before making fun of firefish for that exact fallacy

[oblique fiber]

Not everyone has or wants discord.

[quiet estuary]

Ah

[hybrid matrix]

doesnt matter when it comes
its coming

[quiet estuary]

nvm then

[vestal rune]

I do agree it's a bit stupid they removed global before adding admin support, but for now discord can be used

[quartz quiver]

Yes I was

[oblique fiber]

Not everyone wants or has it.

[vestal rune]

Cardboard do you want me to give a specific date as to when modding will be added?

[quiet estuary]

I think he is saying it will take a period of time so long that community servers will die

[vestal rune]

there's literally a link that proves the devs want to add mod support to the game

[silver zephyr]

I think regardless of global not joining the discord of a community server is a problem, doesnt that tell you all rules and other stuff such as server events?

[cyan flame]

Yes, player interaction, in game, as in, actions. Not talking to each other.

[oblique fiber]

I have a feeling modding will cause issues, as modding does

[quartz quiver]

End of the day I will always argue in favour of mechanics that increase player choice, options, and enjoyment, a global chat clearly has enough people asking for it to put it in

[quiet estuary]

Fulgore, the daily message existed

[quartz quiver]

If you dont want it dont use it

[vestal rune]

but why should they add something that goes against their vision of the game?

[silver zephyr]

did they remove it?

[quiet estuary]

Yes

[oblique fiber]

To keep players and get new ones?

[silver zephyr]

ah, even then thats kinda seperate from global

[quartz quiver]

Show me where they have said that global chat is against their vision of the game

[vestal rune]

you called my exaggeration of adding a battle royale mode a fallacy, but you could use that EXACT same logic to justify a battle royale mode

[quartz quiver]

I want to see a direct statement or where it used in brackets

[vestal rune]

fuck fulgore do you have thew quote?

I know you're a quote guy

punch literally stated it

[silver zephyr]

#401464048610312195 message

[quiet estuary]

Wendigo the entire argument of the game will die because of this one major change has occured before with things such as family share and the forced play of progression

[quartz quiver]

Punch literally stated they dont want global chat?

[cyan flame]

I would agree with you. I'm fine with the game allowing global as a server option, with every other server option possible as well.

[vestal rune]

thanks fulgore

[quartz quiver]

Thats not what it says

[vestal rune]

there was actually another one as well

[silver zephyr]

wait that was in reference to group

[quartz quiver]

Thats relating to the mod tools

[vestal rune]

fuck I'm pissed the discord search option doesn't work

[quartz quiver]

show me where they said that global chat is against their vision

I will even accept a passing statement

[cyan flame]

@quartz quiver #balance-feedback-discussion message

[quiet estuary]

#401464048610312195 message

[cyan flame]

#401464048610312195 message

#401464048610312195 message

[icy lion]

#balance-feedback-discussion message
#401464048610312195 message
#401464048610312195 message

[cyan flame]

#401464048610312195 message

[icy lion]

heres a bunch

[oblique fiber]

Not gonna lie, this game could fail if people decide they’d rather have the global chat and new players too. Devs can do what they want, but in the end, it’s the majority that keep things running.

[icy lion]

id like to also state to keep this conversation civil

[cyan flame]

#401464048610312195 message

Have that one too for extra clarification.

[quartz quiver]

Ok fair one, they did say it, now im gonna say its a bad idea not to bring it back or make it an option

[oblique fiber]

Who’s not being civil..?

[ruby cipher]

Agree with wendigo

[quiet estuary]

Wendigo again, that argument has been used on multiple occassions of similarly large changes

[silver zephyr]

it wont fail, I get the frustration but the game wont just die because of the lack of global, will they lose players? yes. will the game straight up die because of it? no.

[icy lion]

earlier messages got feisty, and this topic gets out of hand quickly

as we can currently see

[vestal rune]

people also complained when family sharing was removed, saying the game would die, ofc it didn't

[cyan flame]

Yes but you're not the majority. A, I doubt you're the majority of the discord people, and B, there's also everyone not on the discord to take into accounts. Similar situations to this one has happened before, with sandbox being temporarily gone, entire game modes changing, and so on. Game has been fine throughout all of that, it'll be fine now too, most likely.

[quartz quiver]

That was me I called someone an idiot, I stand by my statement wont apologise, and I wont say it again unless they say something silly

[carmine path]

Reasons to make Global Chat Optional:
As you can see some servers are having to throw out many of their rules to coexist with evrimas new changes

[icy lion]

additionally i would also like to refer to skysealer's message in here earlier; this is not up for debate. global is not ocming back in any official capacity. it will have to be modded back in. this has been said multiple times by the developers (mainly punchpacket)

[vestal rune]

ah yes, me exaggerating a point to show the flaw in reasoning is a fallacy, but calling people an idiot is a totally legit statement 🤔

[quiet estuary]

He wasnt using the term idiot as an argument

[icy lion]

youre more than welcome to leave your feedback, of course. we will not be removing any posts about your opinions on the removal of global and group chat

[quiet estuary]

so it wouldnt be called a fallacy per say

[silver zephyr]

administration issues can be solved with the admin ticket punch has discussed, I agree it wasnt the best to take it out without giving that option, but once again global isnt needed per say in this regard

[vestal rune]

I mean I wasn't really saying it was a fallacy

[quartz quiver]

You were using idiotic statements and bad faith positions, hence idiot 🤷‍♂️

[vestal rune]

how was it bad faith?

[ruby cipher]

I hate no rules. If every server is like that I would stop playing in a heartbeat

[icy lion]

what did i say about keeping it civil

[vestal rune]

nah it's civil I'm just curious

[oblique fiber]

Whatever y’all. Game is dead to me without global. Peace. ✌️

[quartz quiver]

It is civil, he asked why hes an idiot, I told him

[silver zephyr]

[ruby cipher]

Same wendigo

[quiet estuary]

Also the servers would all change their rules heavily anyways with the upcoming mechanics
So acting like this is a big thing isnt much

[storm vigil]

I wish global could just be made an option. Then everyone is happy

Some servers will have it and some won’t

[vestal rune]

but what was the idiotic statement and bad faith arguement? was it the battle royale comment? because I was just using your reasoning

[icy lion]

insults are the opposite of being civil. both of you drop this topic

[quartz quiver]

the thing is though this games mod support isnt even on the trello roadmap, so you assume either its not coming or its so far away that it is not happening any time soon

[sterile bronze]

Because there aren’t any in game alternatives implemented yet. Makes no sense to remove such a necessary feature with no alternatives. More admin tools are coming, but they’re not here yet. Community servers are suffering already because of the lack of support. If the Devs are going to be so anal about how people play the game, they should’ve just removed community servers along with whatever features they don’t value anymore. It should be an option.

[quiet estuary]

it isnt a nessecary feature really though

Sure it makes things more difficult for admins

but isnt 100% needed

[storm vigil]

Agreed 100%

[vestal rune]

discord can be used instead for now

[silver zephyr]

I agree there should've been an administration tool implemented with its removal

[icy lion]

punchpacket has mentioned that a sort of admin ticket/dm system is being looked into

[vestal rune]

this is an early access game, it comes with its hiccups of you waiting for necessary things, remember when we waited 90 days for evrima to actually be playable?

[quiet estuary]

Lmao

Evrimas launch was a larger flop than the hope trailer

[silver zephyr]

.oO( )

[vestal rune]

not even about evrima's launch, pre update 3 there was a bug that disconnected you from the server randomly

[quiet estuary]

That still occurs

much more rarely

[vestal rune]

inbetween update 3 and the last update was 90 days

[quiet estuary]

but still does

[cyan flame]

New feature in Evrima, utahs can now teleport! We were off to such a great start!

[vestal rune]

oh odd, I haven't experienced it yet, and not on the stress test

[silver zephyr]

I remember the age of teleportahs

[quiet estuary]

I didnt get it on stress test but i got it earlier today

[honest sparrow]

On some servers teleportahs still exist

[quiet estuary]

The Zoo

[vestal rune]

ye this game has a lot of pressing issues rn

[quiet estuary]

Official Na 5

Where is is very laggy

[dense vale]

firsst 2 dinos on evrima was awefull combat, i used to just lay down and let raptors kill my tenonto cause it would take them 20 min to kill me if i tried to resist

[silver zephyr]

oh yeah NA5 was wack

[cyan flame]

I will say I enjoyed being tenno, I thought it was (and still think it is) a cool critter, but.. Many salty times were had cause of "fights" :p

[quiet estuary]

It still is wack

Tenonto way back at the start of evrima was either incredibly op or fodder
never a middle ground

The claw did quite a bit of decent work from what I remember

[paper oriole]

Deino is one of the predators that shouldn't be punished for cannibalizing, at least to a moderate extent

[stable mica]

I still annoying trying to grow 1 for hours only to get eaten by 1 of your own kind everytime

So I can see where people are coming from about the cannibalization issue

[paper oriole]

Also if deinos get punished for cannibalism theyll just kfs which is already common

[stable mica]

Not everyone has 5 hours in a day to grow one over and over

[paper oriole]

Best thing to do is make the juvies more viable

[stable mica]

Possibly more stamina

and better land speed or something

[paper oriole]

Yeah they should have a better dash

[stable mica]

All the juvies in this game are unfun to play IMO

[paper oriole]

Herbi and deino juvies are pretty boring

[stable mica]

They’re just isn’t anything ab them that is enjoyable for a gameplay standpoint

It’s just sit and wait for the fun part of the game

[limber hull]

i like playing juvie raptor because of the ability to hide nearly anywhere. Hiding in the tall grass as larger predators walk over you is really cool to me

[dense vale]

it will mostly fix itself when more/ new dinos are added and not everyone is a croc anymore

[stable mica]

Yes

But even in the long term

[paper oriole]

Yeah utah is bordering on too viable lol

[stable mica]

Juvis are still pretty boring

[dense vale]

long term you have to worry about spinos and what not lol

[paper oriole]

Can hide super easy, powerful as adult, very short growth, double the hp as their weight

[stable mica]

No I mean in the sense after the “new Dino syndrome” is over it’ll just be like legacy where growing a juvi takes 80 years because of the overly long growth times

If I’m going to wait around so long atleast gives the juvi dinos something special

[limber hull]

i play raptor for the cool group dynamics tbh, we still haven't learned how to properly use them so me and my friends often just flee a lot of engagements and play more scavenger

i didnt know he was actually strong lmao

[paper oriole]

When more dinos are released and more map is opened up at least there will be fewer of your own kind to run in to

So less cannibalism

[limber hull]

Aren't they adding diets Patch 5? In that case, couldn't you make it that any creature's diet does not favour it's own kind?

[stable mica]

Yeah

But that won’t stop anybody

From just killing for the sake of killing their own

[paper oriole]

Some predators should be punished hut not all

Well im of the mond that cannibalism should be allowed to an extent for all

But differing between species, but apparently its planned to be punished

[stable mica]

Well if the diet system is based on eating people

Killing your own kind won’t be solved by diets

And it won’t save magy either

[paper oriole]

Yeah KFS already makes up for at least 50% of kills in this game lol

At least

If magy has nothing up his sleeve against larger predators aside from tasting bad he's screwed

[livid igloo]

all they have to do is remove all the shallow drinking spots so crocs can actually hunt and kill things other then resorting to other crocs since all the smart people drink from the shallow spots

[stable mica]

Well there has to be some safe spots to drink

Not every water hole should be a coin toss if you die or not

[paper oriole]

Woodland creeks would still be nice but all those wide rivers should be deep

[livid igloo]

Not a whole canyon for 5 mins of walking of shallow water though

[stable mica]

Having shallow yet drinkable spots rewards the player for exploring the map

With not dying to deinos just Bc you wanted to drink

[livid igloo]

The huge shallow spot covering literally 5 / 10 mins of walking is too big though

[stable mica]

If you know these spots you can take advantage of them

[dense vale]

when theres 10 crocs on the server instead of 45 picking a random river spot isnt all that dangerous to drink

[stable mica]

Then players need to adapt to other players? Even though dieno is a water based predator nothing is stopping you from camping out in a bush and waiting for something small to take a drink and ambush it

[limber hull]

i dont agree with removing shallow drinking spots. Yes, shallow drinking spots are a problem for deinos, but they become competitive due to their inherent safety and larger and more hostile dinos will drive out smaller dinos from the safer drinking spots, which are generally rare to come by. Thirsty dinos will then have no choice but to relocate to another drinking spot where they are potentially vulnerable to deinos

[stable mica]

^

Also they aren’t gonna change the whole map again just so deinos have an easier time when they’re already one of the most dangerous predators in the game atm

[limber hull]

i find that the shallow spots add a cool new layer to interaction. You are more likely to meet bigger land dinos at shallow drinking spots, and more likely to meet deinos literally anywhere else. It creates environments where certain predator types can shine

[paper oriole]

Shallow woodland creeks also just look nice so they shouldn't avoid things like that just because a deino can't fit in it

[stable mica]

They don’t need more advantages already hell the croc punishes you for drinking I feel like there should be some safe areas and you should be rewarded with not dying if you find said places

[livid igloo]

True, they can't drag stegos; half the river they have to walk on and are visable, theres a huge shallow canyon people to drink from, they're a meme to kill if you just stick to their tail and their bite hitbox is a coin toss; they're super dangerous :3

[stable mica]

They can’t drag stego at all I’m pretty sure?

It only goes up to carno for dragging right?

[quiet estuary]

They can unless its over 4 tons

dragging is dependant on if an animal is above/below half your weight

[stable mica]

I think stegos over that treshhold

So

[quiet estuary]

a full steg is 6 tons yes

[stable mica]

Yeah so you shouldn’t even be hunting stegos anyways

[quiet estuary]

Imo of all large herbivores to do well against deinosuchus
the animal with the smallest head shouldnt be it

[stable mica]

Herbivores need some advantages besides just being carnivore fodder

[quiet estuary]

All herbivores in the game right now except hypsi can fight off carnivores

[stable mica]

Like yeah stego has a small head but

[quiet estuary]

Hypsi survives by just being small

[stable mica]

And being like

1 bite

[quiet estuary]

Ehh the lack of food it gives isnt really much of a deterent as killing things for fun is incredibly common

[stable mica]

Well duh

But like

It’s a hypsi who really cares?

The hypsi doesn’t cuz they don’t even have to grow

[quiet estuary]

The people who are bored and wanna kill the first thign they see (which rn on the pretty empty map) is common

[stable mica]

Also since stego is the apex herbivore it should stack up well against the current apex carnivore

[quiet estuary]

For now yes
But imo the headshots from deino should do a bit more dam to steg is all

obviously it shouldnt be fodder

but the animal shouldnt be able to facetank deino without consequences either

[stable mica]

Well who knows it might change

[quiet estuary]

hopefully when things like trike occur it will

[stable mica]

But I think a stego player would be a little upset ab losing half their hp from 1 dieno headshot Bc they just needed water

Also on that note of trike

Trike and stego

Should have passive dmg

[quiet estuary]

No

[stable mica]

If you bite their horns or spikes

[quiet estuary]

oh nvm

yea

[stable mica]

Bc stego dies from carno tail bites

[quiet estuary]

Not anymore

that has been fixed

stego does not take damage on the tail spikes

[stable mica]

Oh thank Christ

Still though

I feel like

If you’re dumb enough to bite them on their spikes or horns

You deserve some self dmg

[quiet estuary]

THey have a thing where if utah pounces a trikes horns itll be impaled
some old phase 2 video

[stable mica]

Oh yeah I think I remember that from a long time ago

Bc in legacy it was very annoying when your main defense could end up being your weakness

All Bc of hitboxes n shit like that

Hopefully when kentro rolls around it has a mechanic like that where you take dmg from biting spikes or something

It’d make it a lot more of a challenge to fight

[quiet estuary]

In update 2 evrima the whole tail bite thing with carno was annoying
But a stego could quite easily just put its tail over the water and its head facing the carnos

then it won the fight if it could just swing in the direction the carnos moved when going for your head

kentro will hopefully be a proper porcupine yes

[stable mica]

Yea

I do worry for the

Perk system in the next update tho

[quiet estuary]

As long as they remain quality of life i dont worry much

the whole gameplay chaning perks should be the hardest ones to get

Like with the junk they are doing with elders

[stable mica]

Hopefully so I hope there’s no Meta combat perks that ruin the flow of the game we have now

[quiet estuary]

If a combat perk exists it should come with a downside

[stable mica]

Like more dmg for less hp or something

[quiet estuary]

Like a good one for carno would be charge takes less stam, but opponents stay stunned for less time or something

no not stat changes

ability ones would do better in my opinion

Since most animals gameplays should focus around their abilities

[stable mica]

Yeah that’s probably the better call

Hopefully all the perks are balanced for each Dino

[quiet estuary]

stat changes just generate metas or bring you chaotic bob scenarios

[stable mica]

And there isn’t one perk that is easily better then the other ones

[quiet estuary]

Knowing the isle devs it wont be balanced

but thats how most new features happen in games

so itll just be a wait n see

[stable mica]

True

[barren zephyr]

these cannibalizing suggestions jesus

[quiet estuary]

Are sad yes

[barren zephyr]

very

[quiet estuary]

Most cannibalism is avoidable

[barren zephyr]

its a survival game, you will get killed by your own species

[quiet estuary]

Deino does have a few issues though
Imo juvis should be faster than adults on land, maybe with like a galloping animation like some modern crocodilians

[limber hull]

crocs have a massive cannibal problem as i've seen, probably because of food issues.

[barren zephyr]

This, I can agree with

[quiet estuary]

but punishments for cannibalism (which for some reason are coming based on the cerato roadmap thing) shouldnt apply to multiple animals, deino being one of them

[earnest gorge]

Dondi once mentioned something about a mechanic to punish cannibalism during a stream ages ago. It was something to do with custom skins for dinos. Something along the lines of dinos that partake in excessive cannibalism would become albino so that others would know. This was like 2 years ago it was said though.

[quiet estuary]

the current roadmap says that cerato will be one of the few immune to cannibalism punishments'

wait a second nvm

I am thinking of the original roadmap

The very shitty one

[vestal rune]

cerato is still intended to be able to cannibalise freely as shown by the concept art

also are you referring to the google doc "dino batches"?

[quiet estuary]

Yes

the dino batches thing had cerato cannibalizing in the animals description

[vestal rune]

ye fairly certain that's still meant to be the case

[quiet estuary]

Most likely

I doubt they would move away from such a thing. Still doesnt make me much of a fan of anti cannibalistic ideas, but its an interesting way to not make cerato the same mess found in legacy

[vestal rune]

personally the way I think it should work is that cannibalism simply won't give any positive diet effects in the diet system, it just purely fills your stomach and not paticularly effectively. The exception to this could be cerato or dinosaurs with a cannibal perk who will gain benefit from eating their own species

[quiet estuary]

That would be better

[vestal rune]

that way, cannibalism is still a valid option, but something you should mostly take if you're in a desperate situation

[quiet estuary]

well not desperate, but not as common as it is now

[vestal rune]

ye pretty much

[quiet estuary]

Im sure when ai occurs though cannibalism will drop anyways

[vestal rune]

what I meant by that is just if there's no better food source around

[limber hull]

see there's also the fact that corpses are left around you had nothing to do with

as a deino, i kept finding babies who had walked too far from shore and kicked the bucket, then the killer ate what they needed and left

so i took them back to my "nesting area" and used them as food for later

people assume the cannibal is the assailant but that sometimes isn't even the case

[quiet estuary]

On the topic of cannibalism
I never understood the real hate of it. Do people commonly just walk up to their own species thinking they will be friendly?

[vestal rune]

deino is a bit of a unique spot in terms of cannibalism, for most dinos you can generally totally avoid it and it's usually your fault if you get killed by your own species, but with the way deino works it's kind of scuffed rn. Juvies simply need more ways of dealing with adults, potentially more underwater foillage would fix it

[quiet estuary]

Like i had quite a few instances in the most recent evrima where juvi carnos would just walk up to me and 2 call and i just insta killed em to swallow em

[vestal rune]

ye me neither, I think there's some concerns over how it affects the ecosystem

happened to me as well

[quiet estuary]

Yea juvi deino needs land mobility imo

[limber hull]

i mean, i find that certain species respond differently. Raptors often welcome new members due to their massive group size, whereas the more independent deino will often be more likely to be hostile

it really depends on how the dino is designed

[quiet estuary]

on the whole mention of group size, personally not really a fan of it

Of all the limitations to remove megapacking seems like one of the worst ways to do it

[vestal rune]

I don't think it should be the sole mechanic against it, but I don't think it should be removed either

[limber hull]

im quite happy with it honestly. Helps define the dino better as either a more social or more independent creature

[quiet estuary]

Like maybe making food less valuable the more people who eat it, or making food just less filling in general would fix that issue

[vestal rune]

but I think the group system needs to be expanded as well so group limits are a bit more advanced, especially once nesting comes around

[limber hull]

i find it quite cool that certain species have certain levels of "sociability" personally

[quiet estuary]

if they keep the thing as well maybe allow juvis/subs to have seperate slots

[limber hull]

agreed. Groups of two deinos when you literally need two parents to raise one child already makes no sense

[vestal rune]

ye, or potentially you could have temporary "family" groups that disband once all the juvies reach a certain age

[quiet estuary]

Such as 2 adult deinos is a full group and you cant inv more adults
But you can inv maybe like another 4 juvis/subs

[limber hull]

family groups sound very interesting

i'd love to see that

[quiet estuary]

and yea when they get too large they get removed automatically

[vestal rune]

so apexes can have 0 capability of grouping normally, but can form family groups if they want to nest

[quiet estuary]

seems like a much less intrusive system then what is currently in

but even then imo all group limits in general need to be increased
At least after more playables are properly introduced

Like if tneo can only have 8 wonder what stuff like para or maia or the commonly thought of "super large herd" animals will have

[limber hull]

perhaps. I do enjoy the game playing into more herd/pack based dinos by modifying group sizes to account for them, I find that mechanic intriguing. I really do wanna see how they manage family groups, and if family will become independent from packs

[vestal rune]

I do feel like maia should be able to have quite large herds, but I don't think any herd should go over 15 members simply from server and player interaction issues

[limber hull]

they really would need to find a fine balance to stop like 4 groups of 2 raptors mating, having 2 kids each and having a group size of like 16

even if half that group is babies that's a LOT

[swift dew]

well the babies should count as extra slots, and when they get older (maybe sub adult) they automatically get kicked from the group

[limber hull]

well yea

until the game deems them self-reliant

(even tho you can make it perfectly fine as a solo baby raptor simply by playing stealthy)

[vestal rune]

I mean I think the juveniles in the game are meant to be self-reliant, it's more until the game deems them too strong to be part of an overpack

[swift dew]

personally I think group limits should be removed entirely (in the future). I feel that the game should be made so its practically impossible to feed too many of a group, for example. if you manage to find a way to feed 50 rexes, you get to have a 50 player rex pack (its just your not going to be able to feed 50 rexes)

[limber hull]

not sure about that

the group limit introduces a unique mechanic of sociability to dinos, which is another key element they had in the time period.

[vestal rune]

eh I think group limits should stay and it should be combined with enviromental factors

[limber hull]

i feel the group limits are currently well balanced to match how the dinos acted with others of their kind

[swift dew]

well I mean, the group limit will still exist, its just it won't be a hard limit, it will be your familly starts to starve to death if you don't split immediatly

[limber hull]

if im playing with a large group of friends, i tend to suggest to play dinos that are pack or herd-based, because those dinos fit best with the playstyle i want to go for

[silver zephyr]

I think group limits should exist but as more soft limits than hard limits, for example if you started accepting more and more utahs above your soft limit (lets say 6) then pack smell will accumulate heavily and other potential debuffs

[vestal rune]

imo the group limit should be the maximum number of species you can have before it becomes a bane on the server(so for a hypsi it could be like 30, a utah could be 10, deino could be 5), and then enviromental factors enforce softer, more ideal group limits(i.e a utah pack of 4)

I like the group limit because it gives you an option to deal with the huge packs via coercion and chaos

[silver zephyr]

what if they made grouping like in evrima launch where you had to 1 call to see other members of your species? in this instance it would just be for groupmates and would have nametags last longe, it would require large groups to make lots of noise to get a barring of who is who, idk though

[vestal rune]

ye I really want this

[barren zephyr]

wasn't a fan of that mechanic
but it wasn't bad

[silver zephyr]

I think the issue was that anyone could see it, so cannibals went ham

[vestal rune]

within like 5 meters you see group names naturally, F calls can extend that range to like 25 mins, and broadcast can be to like 200m. I love it because it gives a disadvantage to group play compared to solo player

[silver zephyr]

just being for your group could be better I think

[limber hull]

i feel that if a player is close to you, it should be immediately apparent that they are a group member, but if they want you to find them or come to them, they will have to make a loud call to potentially attract other unwanted attention. That's an interesting design

[swift dew]

this is actually something I can get behind

[vestal rune]

hell once skin system comes in you could potentially totally remove the seeing tags naturally, although that may not actually work

[swift dew]

it can also add to a sense of tension of not knowing exactly where your team8s are, and it promotes well coordinated attacks

I can also see the drawbacks though

[limber hull]

god i hope nesting introduces the ability to pass down some traits from the parents with the perk/skin system (would be even better if perks both provided potential buffs along with nerfs to counteract them). Unsure how that would work, but having slow and steady evolutional system would be really interesting to me.

[silver zephyr]

idk about there being an immediate radius of where you can see your groupmates but you could have it where the closer a call is made to someone the longer that person or bunch of people can see the nametags

[barren zephyr]

I wouldn't see why not

[vestal rune]

I think until the skin system is added that should be the case at least

[silver zephyr]

like imo it sounds great, generates noise so the map doesnt feel dead + causing a disadvantage to huge groups

giving calls a purpose

[limber hull]

i just like calling because im a dinosaur and i want to make the dinosaur sound

[silver zephyr]

same sometimes

[limber hull]

if i die because i made the dinosaur sound i can live with that

[vestal rune]

you know I've been thinking about this idea, but you know how there'll be seperate local chat ranges? well I think it would be great if the biggest range one used broadcast instead of the F call, and its ranged would be approximately as far as you can hear broadcast(maybe a little further)

[limber hull]

i'd wonder if you could use calling as an ungrouped dino to potentially call over friends to help you (they could cannibalise you but eh). The idea of finding guardians as a baby by calling out could be really interesting to me.

[silver zephyr]

I imagine the chat ranges are gonna be whisper, f call, and broadcast

[vestal rune]

I think it'll be like 10m, 25m, 50m, then maybe like 1000m with broadcast

ye I think it would be interesting if you could use broadcasting as let's say an apex to find other apexes to mate with

[swift dew]

they should probably do a 3m or even less chat just so there is an actual whisper

[limber hull]

3m is very small lmao

[vestal rune]

wait by whisper I thought it was like DMing someone close to you, I think I misunderstood lmao that sounds like it goes against what thedevs want

[limber hull]

some dinos are over twice that in length alone

lots of dinos are

[silver zephyr]

I dont think it sounds to bad, it would be kinda quiet but it wouldnt reach far which can be a good and bad thing

[vestal rune]

ye maybe that could work

[safe ferry]

Opinion: Excessive Deino cannibalizing is a symptom of their overpopulation and will decrease once additional water species like sucho and spino are added, and also when the gator hype dies down.

[vestal rune]

overpopulation is a part of it but also is the fact that cannibalism is too easy rn

smaller deinos have very little option when it comes to dealing with bigger deinos

[merry needle]

do dinos take damg while being help by deino and on the grab part

or only from drowining

[vestal rune]

I swear they take bleed, not sure though

[limber hull]

the issue with adding more piscivores that aren't deinos nor pteras is that the immediate threat of death to the deinos will become extremely apparent. Unless they have a way to determine the arrival or presence of deino, by perhaps also utilising the deinos water sense to feel it approaching, they will become entirely unplayed due to being killed for even trying to drink or feed

[warm flame]

@fringe surge neither alligators nor crocodiles are pack hunters, they're only in large groups during feeding frenzies, you're lucky you even get 2 in a group

[barren zephyr]

@fringe surge

Why are you playing a non pack animal to pack up?

what logic is that

[odd sedge]

But I do think a group of 3 would be acceptable

Or at least for non adults

[odd sedge]

Okay, arboreal oro is great because we need more tree dwelling creatures.

Also no, Hypsi is not arboreal. Just because it can jump and conveniently land in trees does not make it arboreal and it physically won't be able to climb unless they break a few arms, legs and hips on it.

[cyan flame]

@pseudo falcon I think you can change those things around in keybinds, can you not?

[pseudo falcon]

having keys overlap by default is kinda strange, but idk I'll check

not sure, there's a lot of controls that I don't even know what's what

[cyan flame]

I think you can both change the key used, as well as what to hold down to use the same key that is used otherwise.

[willow zealot]

@pseudo falcon Dondi on one of his last streams said that Tenonto may get a crouch

[pseudo falcon]

Oh

weird

[willow zealot]

I think it was because the idle animation was bugging him when he was hiding in a bush iirc

Makes short snort sounds randomly

[cyan flame]

Yep. He realized that idle anims can be a problem :p

Also would be nice with a sort of "stealth mode" for quads, like crouch but well, just hunkering down and leaving no tracks and all that.

[willow zealot]

Imo I'd be fine if ctrl just made Teno lower its neck and limit some movement rather than a crouch

[cyan flame]

Yeah, a sort of "I'm being very sneaky now cause there's a carno close by that I really don't want to be noticed by" :p

[wraith dagger]

Is a new idea being worked up for using scent? Because that's gotta be the biggest FPS drop this game gets

[limber hull]

i do not believe dinosaurs give a shit about the cleanliness of their food

[urban flax]

If animals could't eat meat that was dirty, all carnivores would be extinct today

[azure wadi]

Yeah

[fringe surge]

Crocodiles are the most social of reptiles. Even though they do not form social groups, many species congregate in certain sections of rivers, tolerating each other at times of feeding and basking. ... However, males of all species are aggressive towards each other during mating season, to gain access to females.^ And have you seen them hunting when large herds of antelope/wilderbeast migrate across rivers/marshes? They can and do hunt together, maybe not intentionally, but they do. They are also smart enough to know when migration is going to occur. You also make it sound like it's a terrible thing to want to enjoy the Deino and play with my friends, by questioning me. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[limber hull]

that is entirely true, however, you make a point by saying that they do not form social groups and rather tolerate each other. In this scenario, the low group number makes sense, and rather than increasing group sizes, the developers should be making killing other crocs less commonplace, as they only really hang around each other due to needing to share their given space in the river/lake they call home. This makes the low group size make a lot of sense, and gameplay-wise, allowing a very well synergised group of crocs to exist makes rivers and lakes become far more nightmarish for other players

[minor monolith]

I heard it described as more of a mob and less a pack

they just dont wanna attack another armored, toothy creature

at least, not often

and so just sorta vibe around and if something hits the water, they might chase it together - but not in a super coordinated way

anyways I put my feedback post into the main thread, I really hope the devs consider it or already have similar ideas

[limber hull]

exactly. Crocs in the wild often do indeed live in close proximity to one another, but this is more often due to spacial constraints and they can survive perfectly without neighbours.

[minor monolith]

the real issue right now is the underwater environment is so sparse

[limber hull]

i can agree with that

[minor monolith]

there are barely and hiding places, stealth is wonky, and food is too few

[fringe surge]

I can agree with that actually.

[minor monolith]

the last is probably a placeholder for balance

[fringe surge]

I also agree that there needs to be more plant life growing under water

Even fresh water rivers/lakes/and ponds have seaweed to conseal fish and other aquatic life.

Even mangrove trees would be a good addition in the water

youngsters could hide in their roots

for safety

[minor monolith]

rivers are especially bad

[limber hull]

@minor monolith adding a little more life to the underwater areas would be great. Underwater passageways or caves are some of my favourite places to explore as deino, too bad their presence is few and far between. In fact, I once had to retreat to a cave i was living in after two tonos started harassing me in the water as an immature deino. I was low on stamina and if it weren't for the cave i was living in being quite close, i'd essentially be cornered and would have my stamina and then health whittled down to nothing over time

[minor monolith]

the swamps are cool

and have an okay amount of hiding spots (but stealth is still wonky)

but rivers are so bare

its impossible to hide in them, and if an adult is just sitting there you dont have any choices

you cant run, there are no real alternate paths, and you cant hide

[limber hull]

the river was very shallow and thin, so the tonos often could reach in with their tails for a rare swipe

[minor monolith]

you just see eachother and pray he is amused and not hungry

I added that point to my post, too

the rivers are very plain, with no obvious crossing areas that arent just a bridge

hopefully we can have more challenging to cross rivers with more obvious crossing areas

[fringe surge]

Honestly Tenos should not be going up to a Giant reptile and attempting to kill it, they should be afraid of it, and yet most of the herbi's and other carnivores have an advantage and show absolute 0 fear when it comes to the Deino. It makes this new dinosaur out to be a total joke. :\

[minor monolith]

creating that real and tense "gators are probably here" moment where you have to cross

[limber hull]

i was immature at the time

it made sense that they'd see the advantae

if i was an adult, they would not have been so bold

[minor monolith]

you see if there were enough gators if you attacked one it would probably dive into the water and five more will come investigating the ruckus

then you got real issues

[fringe surge]

I don't know, I kept getting harassed by a pack of young utah's, and even my snaps/hits couldn't convince them to Fing off and leaving me be. It seems like the right click attack fails, even in a direct shot, and the alt bite does little to nothing to capture them or do much damage too.

[minor monolith]

would be really funny if you could "cling" attack with smaller gators

bite and just hold on

[odd sedge]

@fringe marsh how are the new creatures unplayable?
I get it, deinos are shit to each other but that's a general problem for carnivores since there is nothing to do yet.
Diets will help that problem.

But how is Ptera unplayable? That's the easiest to grow

[fringe surge]

Ptera is so easy

[limber hull]

you need to attack when they are unaware. The slower speed of the deino is its downfall, and once it is clear to see, a primary part of its power is gone, which is its surprise element.

[fringe surge]

I love it

[minor monolith]

I had okay luck with Deino but its major issues I listed in the main feedback channel

[fringe surge]

but I get bored with it easily

I like action

[minor monolith]

its okay when you are an adult, but a baby deino is stupid vulnerable

and mostly to their own species

[limber hull]

often i like to find a place to horde fish and corpses as a deino, so i can revisit if a hunt does not go successfully.

[minor monolith]

it makes sense, fish barely spawn

[odd sedge]

The creature is new, everyone is gonna play it now. It's going to get better

[limber hull]

yea if you know where fish spawn you can just survive off them lmao

the game seems to have specific "fish holes" where they spawn very frequently

[minor monolith]

its weird because its not consistient enough

some places spawn a lot of fish, some places dont spawn any, and some a few - but there isnt much way to tell

[limber hull]

im unsure if the fish spawn in the river, follow the current and get stuck in specific places or if they legitimately only spawn in specific locales

[minor monolith]

problem with that pik, is there was one camping the entrance to the west swamp 😂

I literally commando crawled all the way around the chokepoint

and guess where that flat fucker was waiting

...right where I was trying to enter

my luck lmao

so far I have had better (but far more boring) luck in the west

after hours of just swimming in empty as hell rivers

honestly babies should spawn in the swamps

and not in the rivers

where they actually can hide better and there isnt a singular line of travel

the swamps are great for babies but again its hard to get in if an adult is camping the only entrance 😐

but once you get in, lots of cover and places to hide or completely shield yourself from attack

but the rivers are just too bare right now

if they do with the rivers what they did with the swamps, it would be a major improvement

I see lots too but that doesnt mean its a good place for them x3

[odd sedge]

Bruh I see adults everywhere

Can't be that hard then

[minor monolith]

so far ive been pretty lucky with my latest spawn, though there were huge expanses where I traveled and saw no food

I also saw a few other deinos, three did not notice me as I was waiting in a bush - one did but spared me

if that one was hungry, I would not of survived

I have no options

okay but what happens when they see you

because visual distance is the same and they wont always be on the surface

and you can sense eachother at nearly the same range I think?

okay but you arent thinking game design

you gotta consider how current interactions may go and what options the player has in such a lopsided situation

currently there arent many survival options for baby deinos against adults other than "be lucky, pray they dont see you first"

yes but that shouldnt be so obvious or easy

perhaps when we get nesting and adults have to protect their children we will see a higher survival rate

[odd sedge]

Isn't that generally how gators and crocs behave?
If they meet a smaller one of their kind, they're gonna eat it and when they are around the same size, they just vibe

[minor monolith]

yep, but irl there are lots of places to hide

lots of cover

lots of concealment

the issue is when one makes a mistake (usually a panicky youngling)

[odd sedge]

Yeah that's why we need more foliage under water

Problem “solved“

[minor monolith]

okay but again you still have to haul yourself on shore and the water sensing range is about the same

so you could be spotted on the move, or spotted hauling yourself on shore, or going back into the water

you still dont change much other than rolling the dice

underwater cover wouldnt be a perfect counter, it shouldnt be - but its a massive improvement

you can at least totally escape, out of range of attacks

hide in a tiny log and wait for them to leave

the swamps are pretty decent examples

but again, rivers are god awful

[odd sedge]

Well surviving in a survival game shouldn't be handfed to players but they should get the option to help themselves.
Anything after that is just their own mistake and badluck

[minor monolith]

animals are pretty crafty and often have ways of surviving, they should have options

generally what happens is if there is too much competition in an area they move, often they know animals are around far before seeing them

[limber hull]

i mean, to be fair, having underwater cover is great, since you would still have a new issue of drowning. Deinos often forget they can actually just drown, so i've seen a few straightup kick the bucket from thinking they can stay under there indefinitely. The hider would have to move eventually

[minor monolith]

but here you often run face to face into eachother by total surprise

yeah you would still have to eat and breathe

so if you hid in a log you have to move sometime

but adding changes to stealth and cover means a good, skilled survivalist will know how to sneak their way about as a baby

the hard part is being a subadult

[odd sedge]

What about little caverns and lakes that are only deep enough for small crocs but hardly passable for bigger ones

Mangroves!

[minor monolith]

as you grow you get less cover, this is actually good since you are getting big enough to eat others

[odd sedge]

We need mangroves

[minor monolith]

yeah mangroves, grass, and more variation in logs

[robust vine]

Would be cool if there were some logs that smaller Dino's can hide inside

Although, I can see that being abused XD

[minor monolith]

again you still gotta come out to breathe

or eat

so it only lasts so long

so it shouldnt be too bad

its worth trying at the least

but overall its not a very refined method of survival for deinos other than the aformentioned "haul yourself on to shore and hide in a bush constantly"

[limber hull]

id like if there were places that you could hide that massive apexes could just absolutely destroy to get to you lmao. So if you were hiding in a log from a T-Rex, it could just crush the hollow log

[minor monolith]

I imagine hiding in a log from spino

and it just grabbing it

and hauling it on to shore with me in it lmao

or they could attack the logs and break them open

which would make a lot of noise of course

may attract another deino who wants that food too

or if you are a subadult, just a bigger deino 👀

[barren zephyr]

that is an idea the devs are working on

[minor monolith]

good

it helps the gameplay by having the game get more difficult in certain ways as you grow

[barren zephyr]

I believe there is one log already on the map

[minor monolith]

I have seen some smaller ones, as well as some rock gaps only big enough for little deinos

but some more foliage and adjustments to water sensing would be another great addition

(and adding all of that to rivers)

[barren zephyr]

yes

[minor monolith]

after that and some adjustments to fish spawns I think the underwater environment would be pretty good for the current set of features

after that of course we will get small AI creatures to eat as well (I imagine snakes, lizards, maybe other smaller crocodilians) which will be immersive and add more variance to diets (as well as reduce pressures to cannibalize)

[fringe marsh]

It got boring too quick

[rocky aspen]

I want to see more plant variations inside and out of the water.

[fringe marsh]

@odd sedge

Playing as the croc is enjoyable until you group up and a bigger one just kills you al

[odd sedge]

That's a players problem tho

[minor monolith]

its boring and frustrating but we already pretty much mentioned why that is

very sparse and not yet fleshed out foodchains and underwater environment is not condusive to super engaging gameplay atm

I wouldnt take it as super indicative of the final product at all

its effectively a prototype, just released

we are all testing, after all

[rocky aspen]

It’ll all come with time. I’m just happy I get to test the mechanics and what not.

[minor monolith]

its why coming out with well thought out responses and really trying to apply game design theory will help the devs out a bunch

[rocky aspen]

But to be honest, with the game only being beta and it being so broken at times, I don’t waste my time growing things like stego and deino. I don’t want to waste 5 hours growing only to die from being sucked into a cave or smushed between trees.

[minor monolith]

yeah ive done a lot of time just exploring

and trying to do interesting things, and not just go for growth

ive already done that, takes a while - time to try something else

so I went exploring, got lost - died

[rocky aspen]

I think so too.

[minor monolith]

respawn, try going to swamp - the entrance is camped - died
spawn again, try sneaking around - didnt sneak far enough around the entrance - died
went to a different spawn, very crowded and full of carnos at the shore - went down a pretty boring exploration of the western rivers

so far the last one has been successful but its so boring going down long, empty rivers

its still tense, and I pray I dont run into any crocs that notice me

one did, and spared me

but I could of totally died

with no options

[rocky aspen]

That’s the problem with the game at the moment. Your only reliable chance of survival and growing old enough to have some sort of stability and confidence by camping the water. I’ll spend about 90% of my time within reach of the lakes.

[limber hull]

As someone who's worked in development as a lead game designer, i can say for a fact that listing out every reason you see a feature is flawed, rather than simply saying shit like "this sucks" helps devs out a ton in figuring out what needs being looked at. I really like how the game does try its best to create an ecosystem through its playable classes and want to see where they go with it, utilising feedback to better the game as they go

i liked the way you found and drilled down on the specific issue and pointed out key issues

[minor monolith]

generally trying to rationalize why players act certain ways, think about why things happen, and how it can be countered or improved

[fringe marsh]

Still makes it unplayable as you just spawn in to die

@odd sedge game itself is amazing tho can’t wait for it to be finished

[minor monolith]

yeah deino is super rough right now, but it will be improved

the underwater is a super new environment

the sky is obviously not going to have much to do with it, so while its new there isnt too much to change

and for terrestrials there are lots of cover options and concealment

but unless you manage to sneak into the swamps in the southeast of the map, you basically are surviving on prayers as a deino

[limber hull]

i love the fact they went ahead and added an aquatic dino along with an arial dino in the same patch. Shows how they can really make super unique designs and roles for creatures that can operate entirely separately from other dinos

[minor monolith]

possible, but almost suicidally dangerous

they do interact at times ive seen

like how if you use your water sensing boost it blows bubbles, it can look like schooling fish

players have reported using that to bait pteras into lunging range

which is super cool

[rocky aspen]

That is super cool :0

[limber hull]

i mean, a primary issue with the game as a whole is the fact that the game never has creatures move to specific areas on the map. Often times I find certain areas on the map are near entirely desolate and you will not find a creature for miles near that location, which sucks because some of these said areas have really cool landmarks and whatnot. If it were up to me, I'd make spawns even more diverse, since you'll find really only activity near spawn areas

[rocky aspen]

I can’t wait till the deino hype wears off.

[rocky aspen]

Migrations

[minor monolith]

yeah migrations will handle that

[limber hull]

south and centre especially i find are teeming with life, whereas other areas are fucking barren

[minor monolith]

we could also could have carnivore migrations too

now that we have fish and fishers - we could have fish runs 👀

like how salmon work

[limber hull]

migrations? apologies, i'm unsure about this feature, i've only been in this community for a short while

[minor monolith]

or fish will go to spawn and crowd around shallow areas in general

[rocky aspen]

Hopefully just.. something to encourage players to move. But there also needs to be more water or reduced need for water so you can move around the map in search of food without dehydrating to your death.

[minor monolith]

the devs plan to add things that attract players temporarily

effectively tempting (or forcing) them to migrate to those

[limber hull]

forcing i dont like, temptation is better

always give players agency and choice imo

that's my philosophy when it comes to design

[minor monolith]

I recommended adding more shallow tributaries to the rivers

since its really funny how our current rivers are just mud halfpipes

going all the way to the ocean

versus an amalgamation of many smaller tributary waterways

[limber hull]

but more fertile areas of plant life which change over time could be great to help the ecosystem. Have specific areas become "fertile" every few in-game days, then move that fertile area to somewhere which hasn't seen much player activity. The more player activity a place gets, the less fertile it grows over time, so players are constantly chasing that fertile land, the predators are chasing those players and so on.

also seeing a stego migration would be majestic as FUCK

[minor monolith]

yes thats a specific method of migration that ive heard about

[rocky aspen]

They’ll likely tempt players to move to certain places on the map for dietary needs which can in of itself create mini ecosystems. For example, a teno might need to go to the swamp for specific foods, meaning all teno eating carnivores will migrate to the swamp in search of them. Eating the right diet isn’t necessary, however, eating the right foods will increase growth which is encouraging but not necessary.

[minor monolith]

grazing rotation

basically

you coudl do the same thing with fish

when fish spawn

they will go to different areas

[limber hull]

oooh, different environments containing different foods with the diet update could certainly be nice

[minor monolith]

overall I imagine they will add many different things to attract players to different areas

[rocky aspen]

It would be cute if they added in rare sugar canes, beehives or any other natural sweets to make your dinosaur happy in some way. Extra growth, slight stat boost (like a sugar high) just because that sounds cute

I wonder how specific the devs will get with the diet system.

[minor monolith]

animals often dont eat the hives for the honey, turns out

they literally eat the bees

the whole shebang

[limber hull]

rare foods with specific benefits actually does sound sick

[rocky aspen]

Well that works too.

[minor monolith]

but im sure the honey does have some good effects

[limber hull]

imagine a stego kicking the shit out of a tono for a rare fruit

[rocky aspen]

Honey is a natural medicine!

[minor monolith]

its my froot

I found it

and its my favorite color

oh and one other, probably more distant addition to the deino (and perhaps other dinos)

sunning

where you could (given direct sunlight, IE daytime) sun on a special sunning rock

giving you some stamina regen bonuses

[rocky aspen]

Rare food gives herbivores a reason not to mix pack. Makes us greedy. I think that’s a great idea—
Also! Specific diets increase growth so if you’re a stego eating your preferred food and you’re low on stock and a teno comes over and starts eating you bet yo ur ass that teno might get a swatting

[minor monolith]

so you could see deinos all sunning on the shore in the mornings 👀

[rocky aspen]

Please give us sun bathing 🥺

[barren zephyr]

what love to see some kinda off aerodynamics mechanic that allows you to increase or decrease glides / flights etc

[minor monolith]

thermals and cliff lift would be great additions

[rocky aspen]

In the future they’re going to add this

[minor monolith]

nice

[barren zephyr]

ah oke cool

[minor monolith]

im also hoping for a larger, predator pterasaur

[rocky aspen]

I saw on a dev stream them working on the thermal pockets.

[minor monolith]

one that predates on others

[rocky aspen]

I don’t think quetz is a good fit for that role.

Quetzal doesn’t seem like it would be agile enough to catch a pteranodons.

[minor monolith]

or maybe pteras can attack and kill birds in the future?

I wanna see them picking something out of the air is all 😅

[limber hull]

sun = energy makes perfect sense for a game all about giant reptiles (i could dive into the recent scientific studies that prove that dinos are more avian but... nah just let us sunbathe)

[minor monolith]

well even mammals sunbathe

[limber hull]

duuuude, arial chases would be fucking sick and scary as hell. that sounds incredible

[clever urchin]

@chrome remnant Now I'm sure it's pretty late for you but I did see your post about optimization. You currently have a BEAST CPU with a Mediocre GPU. Your next thought might be "You're an idiot it's a 30 series RTX that you cant even buy anymore!", I have an RTX 3070 paired up with a Ryzen 5 5600X and my game runs at over 60fps constantly and I'm having a smooth experience overall. The game doesn't need optimization for your GPU, it needs optimization for lower GPUs for people who didn't buy RTXs and new AMD GPUs. I think in this case you're bottle necking your CPU with your GPU, not to mention you're running at 1440p, try lowering your resolution to 1080p if you want higher frames

[minor monolith]

I imagine a quetz not chasing and maneuvering with a ptera

but instead, diving

like a falcon

hitting it in one, big hit

instantly killing it

then it would land and eat the kill

so it has to pick a good spot to do it

but im not super familiar with how they actually ate

but its one of the most viable ways to attack and kill another flying creature, chasing usually isnt that viable

[rocky aspen]

A high speed chase between two pteranodons is cool none the less.

[minor monolith]

I imagine they might chase eachother for food

oooh imagine if you could knock food out of another ones mouth with a hit?

so you could see them chasing eachother for food maybe?

[rocky aspen]

That would be sick, if you could steal a fish out of another’s mouth.

[minor monolith]

like how birds do it today

[full canopy]

I think quetz should drain almost no stam when in air but the landing/slow descent flying should drain it fast, its well in line with the idea that Quetz flew far but not so frequently. then give it a peck attack that causes decent bleed and let it gallop and it would be pretty cool. just the fact that it would be so massive makes it cool imo.

[rocky aspen]

Quetz is hard to imagine legitimately being a fear unless you’re a juvenile.

If it doesn’t have the agility of the pteranodon, what niche could it fill?

[full canopy]

being awesome

[limber hull]

that was the best response you could've given

[minor monolith]

well similar to a bear but in the air

[limber hull]

i agree

[minor monolith]

you could land and displace pteras from a corpse for one

[full canopy]

like I said. give it more damage than ptera and let it stay in the air for longer and its a legitimate alternative

[minor monolith]

what are they gonna do?

yell at you, thats what

but you are just too awesome to attack

its how imagine the T-Rex will actually work as well

[full canopy]

maybe give it the ability to pick up smaller animals??

[minor monolith]

scavenger and/or ambush predator

BUT im not sure if quetz will be ambush

now that I look at it, it looks like it could scoop up big fish?

it looks like a big pelican in lots of reconstructions

[rocky aspen]

I don’t think that quetz would of been able to sneak up on pteranodon.

[full canopy]

imagine if it could just carry juvies

drop them from a height

then eat

[minor monolith]

well you dont sneak up in a normal way

you attack from unexpected directions

like from directly above, or from the sun

all you have to do is bodyslam a petera

[rocky aspen]

Whats stopping the Quetz from just pecking the juvies right on the vertebrae

[robust vine]

surprise adoption XD

[full canopy]

hecc ye

[rocky aspen]

The shadow.

It’s a large animal.

[minor monolith]

from the air???

the chances of two airborne creatures having a shadow line up is very little

[rocky aspen]

I know.

[minor monolith]

at least at the distances you would likely be circling/stalking

[rocky aspen]

I feel like the only way to successfully pull that off would be for the pteranodon to be relatively still.

[minor monolith]

yeah im sure the chances are very low, but a skilled 'pilot' can do it

[rocky aspen]

Just because the quetz, again, probably couldn’t maneuver that quickly like modern day hawks who use this hunting strategies.

[minor monolith]

more likely would be my former idea, being a good scavenger

or my lattermost, like a pelican

[rocky aspen]

I would imagine something like that yeah.

[minor monolith]

well falcons dont maneuver

you dont maneuver much at 200mph

you become a ballistic object

their goal is not to chase, but to impact their target

killing it with their mass

[rocky aspen]

No, true. But trying to be as accurate as a falcon at the size of a jet is a bit harder. I bet Quetz would also be a loud flier. Especially while soaring towards the ground.

[minor monolith]

they can chase too, but often the cleanest kills that take the least energy are a simple dive

but either way yeah its not easy

[rocky aspen]

It’s possible though.

[minor monolith]

displacing other scavengers from corpses and eating large fish are great options though

like what are pteras gonna do when you decend on a corpse?

especially if you come as a group of quetz

so you can just bully other creatures off of corpses

[rocky aspen]

I can imagine the quetz being a big scavenger, stealing good from pteranodon. If the pteranodon decides to fight the quetz could simply peck the HELL out of it. And it would hurt good..

Quetz can fly long distances in search of unguarded corpses.

[minor monolith]

with the size of its beak im sure it would instantly kill such a light animal

[rocky aspen]

That’s what I’m thinking. the quetz could eat the eggs of pteranodon or the babies because with the size of the beak and the height of the neck, swinging down on a pteranodon might just kill it so it can’t protect the babies only place the nest in a smart location.

[minor monolith]

would be nice if we got smaller islands for fliers

when the map expands, of course

we do have some elevated areas, which also function similarly

[rocky aspen]

That would be awesome. distant islands with Crab Ais, abundant fish. This could be an effective nesting ground, on an island.

No Utah’s or anything can reach the babies.

But quetz might be able to fly over.. :)..?

[minor monolith]

thats what I mean, only fliers could reach it

and aquatics of course

but there could be some elevated areas on those, the prime real estate

[rocky aspen]

Oh absolutely.

Tall rocks for pteranodon to make nests on. Little caves in the side of rocks would be nice. Indents of some sort. Something to allow pteranodon to make its nest in a more reserved area

[minor monolith]

nesting in cliffs would be cool