tbh I'd like the footprints to be mostly ambigious, and you have to guess what dino it is based on footprint size and shape
#general-feedback-discussion
vestal rune
sand dune
yes.
ornate fossil
As long as they're trackable
sand dune
They need to increase the time that footprint stays in the ground. So we wouldn't need to sniff every 10 seconds while the prey escapes to the other island 😆
swift night
even if ther body dont float to shore you can jump to water, grab the body and take it out
and yeah you can oneshot any uta with pounce no mater his age xd
swift night
adult oneshot eachother, its about who pounce better and faster
is more realistic, if you are hidden and some other utah walk in fron of you and you surprise him, he is dead
oneshot
if he surprise you you get oneshoted
its about who ambush who
ornate fossil
Maybe it should depend on the stamina of the two
swift night
in face to fface fight you need the timing and positioning for the pounce, who do its better and with full stamina wions
ornate fossil
If the pounced one has more energy, they could throw off their attacker
swift night
yeah im tlaking both full stam
well itts all about the stamina of the pouncer
no matter the stam of the victim
if raptor jumps into a raptor both being squishy and full weapons, is logic they oneshot eachother
to much damage and no defenses
now i understand why removed ambush buff, the ambush now is the pounce
just try to crouch and get closer to your prey then ambush him (pounce him)
this way you can kill herbs that get away from his herd fast
ornate fossil
I'd argue that if a tired thing jumps on me and I'm full stam I should be able to kick him off
swift night
in the past, ambush only gave you a litle advantaje to bite first, but not really an "ambush"
but you mean utah vs utah=?
swift night
if i jump on you and you not expecting it, and i shred your belly with my claws in 2 seconds when you are still trying to understand what hapened
i dont know what your stam can do
xD
i feel it fair
is a surprise atack not a fight
ornate fossil
I'm saying more stam= physically stronger
swift night
i need more thjan half stam to oneshot you too
ornate fossil
Oh good
swift night
i cant be tired to ambush, pounce consumes a lot of stam
longer the pounce longer the stam it consumes
if i atack you with low stam i will dmg you but will not have enough stam to oneshot you, you will stand up and i will be tired
then you can make a comeback
cause iwill be out of stam
so is risky atacking with low stam
is like you ssaid
sand dune
Wait so you're defending Juvie utahs ?
Don't do it
It's not possible to pounce on it while it runs in supersonic speed
It needs to stay in that speed so instead of decreasing it's speed. It'd a lot more better to decrease their HP a lot.
Until an adult Utahraptor gets able to kill it in 1 bite.
Cool right ? 
swift night
i dont defend them im just saying that an adult utah can oneshot the juvie only using 30% stam pounce, but yeah they are hard to bite xD they litle and fast. but if you aim well the pounce or just surprise him when he is eating, drinking or just walking around distracted. is easy oneshot meal.
they are hard to "chase" but easy to "surprise"
barren zephyr
that raptor is dreadful, horrible xD
brittle ivy
@elfin eagle Converse in here, not in #general-feedback
old seal
@elfin eagle I dont know what the developer want their game to be like. Just wanna show them some people would be happy having an feathered Utah as an option.
zinc fern
@random linden you can get a refund from steam if you’ve played less than 2 hours or had it for less than 14 days
barren zephyr
@nova anchor I think its a neat concept but, I dont know of any dinosaurs that could utilize or fit in using echolocation
nova anchor
I was thinking it might be for something like maybe the Mono? Or possibly herra? Something small that would make Mercs travelling through caves shit their pants :)
karmic haven
I’m glad im not the only one that wants the log out timer back lol
heavy dragon
Okay so I think I cracked the case for why utahs are so op right now but for everyone. Its because of the lag the utahs are just so fast they can literally teleport behind you so maybe this is less about nerfing the speed but fixing the lag and the reason some people don't experience this is because the lag is different on different servers
lyric badger
yup 100% i have been seeing utahs dominate every server i go in
all laggy mofos
eventually it just turns into gang warfare because there aren't enough tenontos
we had the laggiest juvie fight against hollysaurus over a tenonto body, the lag made it unruly. valve pls fix.
languid dagger
@heavy dragon yeah I think they should prioritize fixing the fact that ping goes through the roof when only in combat or near other people it seems
heavy dragon
yeah I was just palying on one of the officials and I couldn't even walk alongside another teno since we were tping all over the place
barren zephyr
how big is the isla spiro map right now please someone?
lyric badger
veeeery
the swamps and spire are small town, just keep running along the beach you will probably starve before you reach the end
see #spiro-screenshots @barren zephyr
covert birch
@ripe hull dondi yesterday onstream said they wont add any other animals ingame before core mechanics shared among all dinosaurs (bleed, grouping, nesting, etc) are complete
ripe hull
pure rain
max probably a month, minimum probably 3-5weeks
lavish gazelle
somber sage
@daring dagger glad to see im not the only person who thought that
oblique dust
5 is over a month
dense wagon
@sand dune juvi utah always dies in 1 bite to an adult. you probably missed the first six bites.
eternal owl
Yeah the hitboxes are a little weird right now
patent flower
yeah a tenonto can kill a Utah pouncing it on its side which makes pounce even more useless added that u even get to 100% growth as a Utah to even be able to use the pounce doesnt really make that any better
agile whale
I actually like that idea of Red or Yellow when someone 4 calls to indicate danger as well. But I think even if the 4 call had those colors, if people prefer to use the 4 call to reveal location over the 1 call then I don't think that adding the colors will change their preference.
eternal owl
@Kaoru it's the hitbox which is kinda broken right now, as you have to hit the exact middle of the Utah to even damage it
You actually one shot juvi utahs
grave karma
@junior crow if you get stuck in a v shaped tree as utah try to crouch and get out
molten tulip
I like the idea of taking longer to actually accelerate into full speed, that could help combat teleporting utahs
so if they stop to spam bite or reposition themselves or something, they cant just immediately get out and have to strategize
carmine kernel
I'd also like to see momentum when coming to an abrupt stop. Feels a bit janky atm with you being able to stop on a dime.
strange wave
turning rapidly around seems to do the trick most of the time @junior crow
junior crow
huh how long do you usually have to go at that for?
kind agate
Eat other utahs then @safe warren
haughty cliff
I love grazing as it is and I definitely hope they leave it exactly like it is, it means you have to search out open areas and stay there for awhile to feed
And I'm enjoying the lack of bleed atm actually, utahs are really hard to hit with the lag (I had a 1v1 utah vs utah and neither of us could hit each other AT all, we both gave up lol) as it is
modern trellis
@haughty cliff yeah, I had the same situation earlier,
without pouncing it’s really difficult to fight other utahs as juveniles barely do any damage to one another, and they are very fast and just overall hard to hit
bleed should be reimplemented for this reason
because if you ended up hitting one, they are injured, and the blood would make them easier to track,
and they would have to rest to stop bleed etc
either that or a system where the more damage you take in, the slower your movement speed is, or something along those lines
like maybe bleed decreases movement rather than damage
and the pouncing is overall just broken for utah 1v1, like the moment I’m pounced by another adult it’s just over
which is dumbbb
haughty cliff
The problem with bleed implementation if teleporting isn't fixed is that they could bleed tenontos (who would then need to rest) while STILL teleporting 😦 It's just a speed + server lag issue I think, at times the pings go up to 300 and hang there
modern trellis
yeah, I’m talking about when that is fixed
it will be eventually
I’d quit the game if the servers were this bad forever
but bleed has to be reimplemented somehow if the attacks just do this little dmg
I’ve been hit by full grown utahs as a baby and I only like screen 1 damage, which makes no sense because irl something that big could pick me up
by bite )
and it’s far too easy to escape like baby utahs are impossible to hit
barren zephyr
I have around 8 FPS no matter what server I’m on. Anyone know how to help it a bit?
safe warren
@barren zephyr new computer would solve that. i bought mine 2 years ago and its still good enough for such games. i run evrima at 60-80fps on epic and 2500x1080
swift night
hi guys, is combatlog solved yet?
ebon lion
nope
languid crown
@modern trellis they can fight back, if you pounce on their head they start attacking back, it also drains their Stam like crazy and if you see it coming it's easy to avoid
mellow seal
@edgy harbor teleportahs
edgy harbor
Yee
mellow seal
; (
swift night
i found that teleportahs happen by lag, ive found a server of my country where i am 34 ping and nobody teleports (60 players)
tight dagger
@kind trout tall grass is for hiding from utahs... How is that a problem xD
try zooming out
kind trout
most of the map is tall grass-- the woods should be enough to hide since its so dense
tight dagger
Just weird, because I haven't experienced this issue myself. But I guess I became used of being invisible
kind trout
It could potentially just me being not used to playing smaller dinos. But I usually don't run into that issue in legacy
(as a small dino)
crude crow
It’s kinda tough to follow juvies in the tall grass which is a good thing. It gives them a way to escape adults so that being a juvie isn’t a death sentence if you happen to be in the wrong place and the wrong time.
honest sparrow
dense wagon
thing is, I have such low graphics that grass doesn't even render in
no juvi can hide from me
dense wagon
adults are typically faster.
you have to sprint occasionally as a juvi to keep up with a trotting adult
languid crown
Adult should be slowed down aswell, make his current speed his ambush
dense wagon
nah
utah run is fine as it is
especially considering pretty much everything also gets a speed buff
carno will be faster
mellow seal
tbh i feel like utah juvi should be slowed a bit and teno juvi should have slight speed increase
slight
not too much but just a lil
dense wagon
I mean
you can't expect it to go fast, it's a galloping quadruped, which is much more exhausting then running as a biped
it's not built for speed, it's built for kicking utah ass
which it does exceptionally well
valid zephyr
@ashen elm I agree completely. Moving stego down to a subadult stenops size seems a really odd choice due to kentros existence.
barren zephyr
@ashen elm I agree completely. Moving stego down to a subadult stenops size seems a really odd choice due to kentros existence.
@valid zephyr I agree with you guys too.
valid zephyr
I'm not sure why we were accused of a 'power fantasy' for talking about large stego too.
are rex and spino mains on a power trip?
barren zephyr
I can't understand that too.
I can't think about realism too much with this game. It was never meant to be a realistic dino game.
we have to make some adjustment to make things balanced.
valid zephyr
also probably best to not use prehistoric wildlife for size charts. they're utterly inaccurate.
this isn't even about realism though. it's realistic for stegosaurus to be much larger. from what we've heard a subadult (sophie) of the smallest subspecies has been chosen.
so not even an adult stego
it's like picking a 0.7 growth rex as the in game rex
barren zephyr
Yes, I can't imagine the isle stego being so smol like that.
valid zephyr
2.4 tons rather than 5-6 tons for adult ungulatus
kind agate
The problem with stego comes when you make it JP sized, it's way too large in the current game even for Ungulatus
ashen elm
Someone accused us of power fantasy for wanting larger Stego? I mean it's a dinosaur game lol it's the ultimate power fantasy to be large.
Still very strange choice
kind agate
I'm entirely fine with both sizes, but the prehistoric wildlife graph you showed also has stego way too big
Our current stego model does match ungulatus more however
ashen elm
I don't think anyone is arguing for JP Stego size. "Ungulatus" which is actually just Stenops now, is fine IMO. It's 6 tons and a big dinosaur.
Though even if someone was arguing for JP Stego, I mean, we already have JP monster Spino so there isn't any excuse there.
valid zephyr
We don't want JP sized stego though?
We want realistic adult ungulatus rather than a sub adult stenops.
kentro makes having a perma sub stenops pointless.
barren zephyr
We already have JP dragon spino guys. Why not big stego?
ashen elm
Plus adding that size Stenops, when both species were lumped, is like adding Nanotyrannus in the game. which is just juvie trex
valid zephyr
yeah prehistoric wildlife should not be touched
it undermines the entire valid larger stego arguement
kind agate
Small stego is stupid but I'm eh on it, I don't play stego enough but I feel for those that do
ashen elm
I think people are upset because the herbivore roster has been stuck with just Trike as an apex for years. Finally get a chance at another big herbivore apex and it gets downsized...
I'm glad Theri's coming and potentially Anky but those are smaller. We'll see if Shant and Cama are AI or playables.
valid zephyr
I'm very concerned that shant and cama are likely to be AI. Anky and stego both being downsized now.
Leaving trike as the only large playable herbivore.
while carnivores get massive rexes, gigas, upsized deino, and spino.
why are herbivores getting large playables removed as options?
ashen elm
I think if they wanted a herbivore mid tier there are already options. Pachyrhino is one
valid zephyr
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/703607900366569492/724018060834635876/The_Isle_Asset_size.png
with brachi, cama, and shant likely as AI, there is a huge size disparity between the large playable carni and the larger playable herbis.
ashen elm
True. I'm still holding out hope we will get larger herbivores than just Trike in survival. It'll be very disappointing if not.
dense wagon
god, I'll miss the days when AI was no bigger then hip height 😭
ashen elm
I mean, same. still hoping for that playable Diplodocid and/or Bronto which is trapped in the basement
languid crown
Now that collision no longer exists there's nothing stopping them doing an apato
pure rain
@dense quail they are a heavy risk heavy reward thing, as if utahs could so easily pounce theyd turn pretty overpowered, It needs to be a very calculated thing
and you cant quite just live on somethings face and or legs because simple logic exists and well, ur gonna get hurt there
languid crown
Even if you land it in a good spot you don't deal much damage, I imagine it will be real good against fast running or trample animals tho
pure rain
Because those attacks werent really damage based, they were bleed based, so for a utah without a bleed system yet, the pounce is more so used to finish off a hurt tenonto for me
or if u are a good pack of utahs against a small herd of tenontos and you can switch with people in and out of the pounces
languid crown
its not worth it against a herd, you can still get hit, your better off using your stam to weave and dart
pure rain
I said small herd, so You could solo one out while getting the others distracted by other teammates or making them simply not notice their buddy
languid crown
you can still get hit, your glued onto a moving object who want its buddies to kick you
crisp elk
Diplodocus would be cool, that long tail would be so lethal.
@valid zephyr didn’t Stego defend against creatures like Allosaurus?
I don’t think it should compete against apexes.
languid crown
they destroyed allos, big herbivores are often alot more powerful then their carniverous counterparts, with the carnivores preying on the weak, young and elderly
your a giant herbivore with a 1m long spikes on their tail, 1 hit and that allo is a 130million year old kebab
crisp elk
Agreed. But does this mean they should be able to compete with top tier carnivores?
valid zephyr
@crisp elk adult stegosaurus were not really hunted by lone allos. They were too large and heavy.
In addition to this, stego is being forced onto an island with large carnivores like rex which are faster, heavier, and more powerful. Many of the top carnivores have even been fictionalised to make them even stronger. So no reason why stegosaurus can't get its realistic max size of 5-6 tons.
rather than fictionalising stego into saying a sub adult stenops specimen 'sophie' is their max size.
languid crown
yeah
crisp elk
It’s impossible to say since they never lived at the same time, but for a gameplay perspective Stego in my opinion should be able to stand its ground against Mid tier dinosaurs, with the ability to run if it needs to.
Kentro would be the smaller counter part defending against Utah’s maybe? Not sure the size differences there
languid crown
thats what kentro is for, Dondi just wants stego because of the Hope trailer and their animation complete
valid zephyr
Keep in mind it's a game. So if an animal is a walking billboard of bright colours which can't hide, is the worst designed animal for moving fast ever, and also can't fight, where does that leave it?
crisp elk
True.
valid zephyr
Adult ungulatus are estimated at 5-7 tons. 'sophie' is a 2.4 ton young stego.
languid crown
damage is also way to superficial, get hit? so what, if your the faster carnivore you can run off to heal before rengaging, so a stego will be left high and dry against faster midtiers if its tail doesnt instant kill or disable a predator for a long period of time
if your attacking with a tail, you have no way to chase down a predator, meaning you cant pursue the advantage, forced always to play defensive to the rythm and pace of the carnivore, this is well and good but it means they can keep coming back and all you can do is to hope you get your hit off and give yourself enough time to heal and recover
crisp elk
I think the dinosaurs like Stego should be heavily skill based, tail attacks should be well placed and take their enemies off the battlefield for a long amount of time. Rather than spamming right and left click until the creature dies.
If you were hit with such force you wouldn’t be able to keep fighting in most cases
valid zephyr
yeah the rapid spam click current stego has isn't great.
crisp elk
As inaccurate Walking With Dinosaurs was, the Anky V T-Tex fight was what I think it should be like.
Trex was left injured really bad.
valid zephyr
quick tail flicks should do relatively little damage, while standing its ground and putting its entire body into the swing should require it to be standing still and use lots of stam.
crisp elk
I agree.
languid crown
a quick flick is still enough to put a utah or carno down atleast for the big ones. A sub ideally should be able to take on a utah or carno with one of its power flicks
modern frost
@wispy tendon Yeah its very confusing I hope they fix it
languid crown
yeah, sub stego (ie sophie size) will be fighting the carno
crisp elk
@barren zephyr I really like that suggestion, it would promote lookouts and better gameplay for carnivores, I do however think some players would absolutely hate that.
At the moment, 1 big Tenonto herd is almost impossible to hunt, even if you do take one down body guarding is still a problem.
mellow vector
If Stego had legbreak that could help- IRL studies of kentro suggest its tail had the force to fracture limbs, much like very large monitor lizards today, on top of bone-piercing and probably slashing
There was a paper, Kentro is badass yo
languid dagger
bruh.. just killed 2 juvie utahs and they both disappeared as soon as I started to eat them
quartz timber
It would definitely be nice to have leg breaking dinosaurs again that isn’t just T Rex
Specifically for select adult herbivores
haughty cliff
Plugged In was absolutely raging in the chat so I'd give him time to calm down before taking feedback too seriously >.<
glossy matrix
lmao
barren zephyr
raging? i submitted my feedback without any rage whatsoever, the hell are you talking about?
finite iron
I do actually agree with you, I think a lot of it though, for most part, it’s the servers we play on, there aren’t enough rules implemented enough to prevent most the things from happening.
mellow vector
The phrasing was relatively hostile, which generally reduces how effective feedback is alas
Contrast e.g
'On the server I play on the tenontos have been grouping up on rocks where the reduced number of approaches makes it impossible for utahs to attack without taking more damage than they deal. Would it be possible to reduce tenonto jump height/increase rock height/disable standing on rocks/insert suggested solution here until there's a dinosaur that can counter this strategy please?'
'The player density is low enough that this has a massive effect on utah's ability to hunt things'
barren zephyr
The phrasing was honest and into the point, not going around with fancy words, i'm done with that. Been playing for 4 years and it's always the same bs.
barren zephyr
It doesn't cost them nothing to set up 2 or 3 rules like in Legacy until they have proper mechanics to counter this kind of stuff. Megapacking, mixpacking, running into the water, ez and simple. They don't care so they won't make any changes but my feedback is there just in case.
glossy matrix
then play on rules servers
barren zephyr
....
glossy matrix
also, running in water is a bug
how tf will they stop people doing that
just make swimming prohibited?
barren zephyr
you know that that bug is fixed right? i've been able to swim since yesterday....
you just don't rock bottom like you did 2 days ago
barren zephyr
try it now then
glossy matrix
mkay
flat whale
i was running through water just few mins ago, there was no update yesterday either
barren zephyr
then it's on your client idk, because i swim since yesterday
either way i'm not even gonna bother to discuss this even further, the feedback is there for them to see if they so desire...end of the story.
mellow vector
The phrasing was honest and into the point, not going around with fancy words
but my polite version was about three times shorter than yours
molten tulip
Imagine being mad when a 3 day old alpha branch of a game is incomplete
haughty cliff
Re: hitboxes, yeah it's difficult to hit on both, biting a tenonto's tail or even hindquarters doesn't work too well--have to aim for the chest; and I've had utahs just not get hit by rear-kicks (sometimes it hits, sometimes not, so maybe just lag)
PluggedIn, it's not fixed--basically swimming works when a server boots up, it seems. Then after awhile it just stops working and -everyone- on that server can no longer swim until it resets
mental sleet
Gay Cherry, they mentioned that the base mechanics are going to be put on before we get the batches.
astral oyster
Honestly the only thing I'm annoyed with is the instant log out 😂
Got snaked yesterday 😆
vast wolf
don't critique the spelling if you cant spell it yourself there sassy.
Beipiaosaurus correct spelling. they just forgot a single o in its name.
vast wolf
those dont work for the first batch @thorn saffron they add nothing to the roster aside from a bully in allo and another tough herbivore with magy. in #roadmap-updates batch B fixes the ecosystem issues we currently have. as carno as an adult checks adult tenontos and dryo along with galli can feed utahs and keep them from starving as much.
valid zephyr
@thorn saffron Magy is not a formidable prey item to allosaurus. Magy is smaller and lighter than tenontosaurus, while allosaurus is 2-3x its mass, taller, and longer. Magy also lacks defensive weapons.
thorn saffron
Smaller than a Tenonto? Huh... really I was going off of this sheet (I dunno how out of date it is) regarding sizes and stuff
https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/isle/images/b/b6/The_isle_magyrosaurus_size_chart.png/revision/latest?cb=20200219133936
vast wolf
dryo and galli are also good fun animals to play as they are "throw aways" fast growth and fast but still able to be killed easy.
thorn saffron
As well as Tapwing's concept art
vast wolf
tenonto is 2000kg rn allo would be like 3000kg or so.
magy will likely be 1200kg-1800kg.
valid zephyr
magy is 1000-1400kg. teno is 2000kg
thorn saffron
Huh... well good to know I suppose
valid zephyr
allos hunted smaller stegosaurus and even younger diplodocus.
both animals which are much larger and more armed than magy.
vast wolf
i think a smaller diplodocus would be like 1000-5000kg
thorn saffron
I would've added Stegos, but Dondi explained in the last stream about needing a balance in the ecosystem and that each batch should help with balancing it in some way or form.
vast wolf
if not more than that.
thorn saffron
I guess I failed in my proposed batch anyways then
vast wolf
i mean stego is just a big ball of nope for apexes.
they can work but not as the first batch.
valid zephyr
there seems to be somthing going on with stego atm. previosuly it seemed to be going to 5-7 ton max ungulatus size. Now i'm hearing from people it's been downsized to 2.4 ton 'sophie', a sub adult stenops.
thorn saffron
It is being downsized - said by Dondi himself on the stream (if I recall)
vast wolf
for allo id put something like para or maia.
valid zephyr
would put it on even grounds with an allosaurus. no clue how it could avoid being instant rex food though
vast wolf
2.4 is not likely for stego.
valid zephyr
@vast wolf you miss the stream?
vast wolf
yes. i don't watch the streams.
valid zephyr
I missed it too, but the people who saw it have been telling me stego got a massive downsize.
vast wolf
massive for this community could mean a ton.
dou could have said downsize and they think it will just become kentro.
stego needs the size as its extremely slow.
thorn saffron
Wait, Plateo is a thing?
vast wolf
thats a large kentro so not likely.
valid zephyr
yeah that was what I said too.
vast wolf
at that point use miragaia.
valid zephyr
makes kentro a better stego.
valid zephyr
bringing it to stenops adult size i'd find wierd. Bringing it to 'sophie' sub adult size I can't see any logic at all.
vast wolf
old stego was like 38 ft long and 4.9 tons.
thorn saffron
A big boi
vast wolf
weight stays about the same size decrease to trikes length.
vast wolf
plateo is not confirmed yet as of my knowlage.
thorn saffron
Didn't Dondi say that most of the old/unused models will be utilized in the game at some point in time?
vast wolf
not sure. kentro and mono are old models.
thorn saffron
Exactly why I considered this
vast wolf
proto might be but were not sure as its not confirmed to be.
pachyrhino is confirmed for near release if not after full release.
thorn saffron
Wasn't Protoceratops confirmed?
mighty girder
Proto 100% is
Plateo is on backburner but I do remember dondi saying majority of old/unused models will be used, but that istn 100% of them. Plateo is just currently in the air
thorn saffron
Yeah
vast wolf
styraco plateo and i want to say titanno? are all things that could come but arent likely.
i still want australodocus but i doubt it will be in.
thorn saffron
Imagine if we get like a Triassic Patch? With Plateo and this boi:
vast wolf
its very unlikely.
thorn saffron
I can only dream
vast wolf
its just slower utah or rugops without any benefit.
at least rugops will be a scavenger/cannibal but we dont know much about ir or many other small carnivores so we will have to wait and see.
glossy matrix
isn't rauisuchus 14 feet long
13 feet
still, rauisuchus could have a distinct niche
vast wolf
dont you dare say semi aquatic.
thorn saffron
And to be fair, we have Deino so an ancient Archosaur like him is EXTREMELY underclassed
And it isnt even semi aquatic
vast wolf
semi aquatics are bary sucho and spino.
glossy matrix
it's an ambush predator that preys on subadult tenonto-sized things
finite iron
Ngl no wonder why they went extinct lmao
glossy matrix
slow speed, but high damage and bleed
vast wolf
its smaller than a utah btw.
glossy matrix
Ngl no wonder why they went extinct lmao
@finite iron how, exactly? they were the top predators of their day, and the only dinos they had to compete with were quite small.
thorn saffron
There's a reason why they lost to the dinosaurs during the Triassic Extinction lol
vast wolf
utah weighs more and is quite a bit larger.
finite iron
Not the Deino
glossy matrix
they can fictionalise it
finite iron
The picture shown above.
glossy matrix
The picture shown above.
@finite iron No, I meant Rauisuchus.
finite iron
Oohhh yeah.
vast wolf
i still dont see it fitting.
finite iron
No the fact that they are slow
vast wolf
will have to wait and see what happens with bary mono and rugops.
if rugops plays like the one from planet dinosaur then ill give it a try for sure.
glossy matrix
I think Rauisuchus would fit
thorn saffron
Rugops... but with a gun
glossy matrix
Utah-sized, but quite tanky
can't run very fast, so has to rely on ambush hunting
i can see it being able to fight 2-3 utahs and come out on top
vast wolf
its like half utahs size btw.
vast wolf
utah is 23 ft and 1100kg irl and Rauisuchus is 13 ft and 550kg
glossy matrix
it's three meters shorter
vast wolf
weight wise its half its size.
glossy matrix
again
vast wolf
in game utah is 700 i think now.
glossy matrix
fictionalisation
they've fictionalised magy a lot to be viable
I don't see how they can't do that with Rauisuchus
vast wolf
they can but we still have to wait and see what mono bary and rugops are like first.
thorn saffron
So in regards to my proposed batch, would it be better to replace Allo with Dilo or what do you guys think?
glossy matrix
dilo
magy needs at least some breathing room before the allo comes and slaughters them all
thorn saffron
Agreed
warped garden
ok
Dondi said allo won’t happen until later cause people tend to form super packs and kill everything
vast wolf
allo just dosent suit the roster until it can be killed.
likely when kentro and sucho are added.
hearty rapids
Sucho killing an Allo? doubtful since Allo is faster and way more proficient on land than a sucho
vestal rune
honestly the map is small enough that the lack of AI isn't even a big deal
warped garden
eh, I rarely bump into anyone with ~60 people on the server, and a lot are in packs, it's be nice to have some small ai
vestal rune
I've encountered alot
steel bridge
dont suppose anyone cares to even mention the fact that every single carni being added to the game (except troodon) can solo the largest herbi (tenoto), while only tiny and fast herbi are being added (except dibble altho still soloable post rework to make it smaller)
vestal rune
the whole reason they're adding carno is because utah cannot reliably solo tenonto
also I'm fairly sure they're still planning to have dibble compete with allo
also idk if cerato would be able to solo tenonto
steel bridge
cera will need a nerf then, its pretty much same size and power as carno without the obscene speed currently
vestal rune
same size and power as carno?
steel bridge
as for dibble, they have said they want it to be smaller, while its legacy version would have no problems with the current list and in fact it would be the current apex. if it gets reworked to be smaller. it will be smaller and slower than all added medium carni
vestal rune
ye but I still think they want it to reliably defeat an allo
steel bridge
i hope so, and yes cera is slightly heavier and more bite than carno
currently
using legacy number
vestal rune
oh, actually didn't know that
steel bridge
carno is just way faster
so you have all these medium tier carnis being added that can all solo the largest herbi currently. which is tenoto. (pending dibble rework)
since we dont know where they will put dibble after they downsize it
i really do hope it can face off against allo, but i honestly doubt it. i think they will put it around 2.5 tons maybe
strange wave
i hope so, and yes cera is slightly heavier and more bite than carno
@steel bridge AJAHAHAHAH
cerato is a fucking midget
its half tenontos size
steel bridge
@strange wave tenoto is currently 2 tons isnt it? cerato is 2.2 tons currently using legacy numbers
unless u have seen new updated numbers for the cera?
strange wave
@strange wave tenoto is currently 2 tons isnt it? cerato is 2.2 tons currently using legacy numbers
@steel bridge legacy number mean nothing
steel bridge
imagined numbers mean less than nothing
strange wave
this does more
steel bridge
ava is bigger than utah?
steel bridge
indeed according to these it does, but if u watched dondi dev stream the road map, he specifically said a carno would be able to reliable solo a ten
reliably*
in open grasslands*
strange wave
well, tenontos attacks seem to be all focus on fighting this its size or smaller such as cerato and utah
steel bridge
either way, lets say tenoto CAN fight off carno and cera. that still makes it the only herbi viably capable of combat against any of the mid tiers planned on being introduced
assuming those graphs are close enough to being accurate
deino, sucho, carno, cera, all far bigger than every other herbi
strange wave
i mean
mighty girder
Im not sure why you think Dibble would be a push over
strange wave
strange wave
doesn't sound like it
mighty girder
Downsize and nerf regardless doesnt mean its going to be a pushover
strange wave
many things are pointing to dibble being bigger than irl size
steel bridge
your own graph says 1 ton
strange wave
either way dibble can crush a cerato
steel bridge
i hope so
strange wave
and hold its own against a carno
steel bridge
and nothing can check the sucho and deino
mighty girder
Deino is checked by the fact that it cant leave the water to hunt
steel bridge
true, but u cant live without water either
mighty girder
Sucho is prob gonna be mainly a fish eater too, its slow
steel bridge
and poor beip
mighty girder
bigger typically equals slower
Beip isnt gonna be a free meal when it will prob be more mobile on land then deino and small enough to hide from sucho. Sure, it will die sometimes but its a small herbivore. Some things are meant to lose and thats why they have speed.
steel bridge
and true, but if thats also the case that bigger is slower. u have these larger water dinos that cant hunt anything cause they are too slow and big and can only survive on fish ai.....not much of an ecosystem there
mighty girder
Im meaning
steel bridge
thus needing a somewhat larger and slower herbi
steel bridge
there are only small herbi
mighty girder
but then its the herbi's fault for not paying fucking attention
People forget we have small herbivores in the current game and they dont get slaughtered
steel bridge
i agree with that, my argument is that big and slow carni need a equivalent herbi
mighty girder
neither will these guys
steel bridge
im not saying they will
im saying there is no offset
big carni, no equivalent herbi
mighty girder
If it gets bad then they will add something as it says in the roadmap
steel bridge
you either run or die only
mighty girder
its not set in stone
it is flexible
"Lastly, not to be the things are subject to change, but we want to make a note that if there’s a clear issue with the ecosystem or roster of dinosaurs where needs aren’t being filled, we will reach out to identify the issues and, if need be, alter the schedule of dinosaur implementation or put something else in entirely as needed if the outcome isn’t what we planned or isn’t benefiting the game environment."
steel bridge
i know
my feedback was simply to point that out
given the graphs and numbers shown above, i think a stego would be a good addition
mighty girder
When sucho/allo are in sure
steel bridge
they have it showing at 2.4 tons ish
its slower and can defend itself against the larger carni being adding
not op
simply ideas/feedback
sucho/deino
those are the batch, allo isnt even mentioned
mighty girder
Deino doesnt need Stego to be added
steel bridge
no reason to have large carni that unopposable
mighty girder
its not a land predator, adding stego wouldnt balance it out
steel bridge
are*
if u have carni that are large enough to be invincible against the current roster of herbi, u need a new addition to balance
strange wave
deinosuchus can't chase a tenonto dibble or pachy across the land
steel bridge
no but nothing can kill it either
strange wave
all they have to do is simply, trot away
no but nothing can kill it either
@steel bridge cannibalism will do them in, without stupid players to feed them they will eat eachother
steel bridge
probably, but cannibalism is supposed to be a bad thing in new mechanics. provides debuffs and all kinds of bad stuff
not sure where the fun is, just sitting in water, literally invincible except to your own species
strange wave
people want to play it, they will if they dont like croc gameplay, they can play something else like sucho
mighty girder
Not every dino is for every person
steel bridge
obviously, but there is no balance for it
my point is literally nothing but one of balance
deino is going to be the only apex tier dino
steel bridge
that will be interesting, i honestly hope they add in apex ai soon, but i really doubt it
strange wave
triceratops has been mentioned as one of the first ai
steel bridge
i wonder how that will work, with apex tier herbi ai. not sure whats gonna kill it. i assume they will fight back?
i mean other than deino i guess
none of the other carni stand a chance against a trike
vestal rune
@fair belfry they finished the roadmap perfectly on time, if you actually read the announcement it says that they had issues putting it up on the website
fair belfry
@vestal rune yes sure 😂
vestal rune
bruh dondi LITERALLY STREAMED making the roadmap the day before it was released
like we saw the finished version before friday
vestal rune
'caus the world isn't a perfect place?
also what delays have they had? they released evrima perfectly within their release window
steel bridge
not sure how its delayed. its literally released
fair belfry
Bruh thats the worst beta ive played in my life
steel bridge
then quit and leave
vestal rune
good for you
fair belfry
#realtalk
vestal rune
I've had more fun with this barebones beta then with legacy isle
steel bridge
ive enjoyed it even with my 8fps bug lol
vestal rune
ye I wonder what the cause of that is, I run the game at over 30 FPS just fine
fair belfry
See even u have 8fps and how can u say its good ???
vestal rune
'caus it's a bug in a beta release?
steel bridge
its because the settings are stuck on epic, even if u change them. it doesnt register the change
vestal rune
it's like complaining that a meal you haven't cooked long enough is too cold, it's literally not finished
steel bridge
lmao
i just dont get how he justifies writing they have delayed the roadmap, when its legit published 9 sections above this one right now
fair belfry
Nah no offense really but thats just awful but good to know you guys still got hope
vestal rune
lol
vestal rune
also how is it awful? that we expect what's basically an alpha to have bugs?
steel bridge
@mellow maple definitely
vestal rune
ngl the main problem with evrima is that they didn't release an official map with names so now everyone calls a rock "buttplug rock"
like I've seen that name on community maps, it makes me want to blow my brains out
mellow maple
community names sometimes actually pain me
steel bridge
lmao, i say "im going to the plug" in chat when people ask where im going
vestal rune
ye the devs also said they hated them, which is why they talked about an official map system
steel bridge
ya that didnt happen yet and by the time it does it will be too late
vestal rune
mhm
steel bridge
we will have vag valley, buttplug rock, etc
vestal rune
"pond puddle"
steel bridge
lmao yes
fair belfry
So where can i look up the roadmap?
fair belfry
Ah ok thx guys
So they just wrote what they are going to add without a date or am i mistaking?
vestal rune
ye
steel bridge
no dates for the specific batches, but it should be at least monthly
steel bridge
i know
fair belfry
I think they should optimize the game first like options and everything in it before they add dinos
steel bridge
but they wont release anky for a looonnngggg time
vestal rune
ye zmaj that's what I just said
they're adding all the core important mechanics before they release any new dinos
says it in the roadmap disclaimer if you want it straight from the devs
steel bridge
hopefully they dont take too long. i have no desire to play as borker or tento
fair belfry
Ah ok i really hope so because for me its really unplayable
steel bridge
id be troodon or dibble from the roadmap tho
vestal rune
I'm way more excited for the new mechanics than new dinos imo
steel bridge
id prefer something chunkier like stego or trike tho
vestal rune
the new dinos are nice but I'd rather have a proper gameplay loop
warped garden
@cyan yew skins will be added
new mechanics will be introduced for the batches i believe, but agreed
lucid pebble
thank you for the explanation paradym. i'll revaluate my thoughts on the topic then.
@fringe sparrow careful pinging the devs, even for compliments, as it is against the rules.
fringe sparrow
I am aware, but it says para is an exception
lucid pebble
oh okay
dusty igloo
In my opinion, there should just be an official map available, but not in game for the dinosaurs. For humans, you could maybe make it a 'Fog of War' style map and you reveal land as you cross it and 'chart it' so to say
But you should have a map in general to know the area and then from that you can learn the connection between the map and landmarks.
I'd actually dislike if they put in a map that shows your actual location on the map live as you play
Or at least it should be optional so it can be turned on or off server-side based on the level of 'realism' a server is aiming at I guess
fierce vapor
If I found a part of ground that sticks straight up like a horn or a pyramid that looks very polygon m, is it ok to take a screen of it and the coordinates of the anomaly?
fierce vapor
TY
worn pulsar
Ceratosaurus might become valuable in the game
They’ll be the predators other than.. y’know
mint urchin
A pounce is not easy nor guaranteed victory; pay attention to your surroundings and trust no-one even if they seem friendly. Don't leave yourself open, face them.
https://clips.twitch.tv/NeighborlyLovelyInternKappaClaus
languid crown
yeah pounce is quite buggy, i landed one on the side of the tenonto and he ran off and i just hung in midair, so he came back around and started beating me up
oblique dust
so the roadmap is great. Seems like things are definitely organized for the next 2-6 months. Problem is no ETAs in the roadmap. still, if we can get 2 dinosaurs a month, then that's a strong start.
bleak atlas
I would be happy if we have all the mechanics till end of August
lucid pebble
yea honestly, my biggest hope with evrima was its capability to streamline updates. really dont want to wait another 4 years to get to where legacy is.
cyan yew
@oblique dust we will get nesting, groups,AI's and nightvision before we ever get a dino if im correct 😄
languid crown
90% of the dev team is having a break, amarok isnt because hes only worked on this thing for 3 weeks now
dondi and punch have done that roadmap on their holiday
serene jasper
It is plane, in the future for the grass to disappear when grazing and not recover until after a very long time or server restart? Because it is good reason for migration.
eternal owl
@sour fossil some dinos are supposed to be cannibals, but there was a suggested system that if you kill another of your species you would become an albino
sour fossil
@eternal owl yeah I see your point =)
going off of my assumption, it should be disable for those dinos (cerato being one of them? not sure)
then again all base on the assumption that corpses inherit a specific dino class
eternal owl
Allos, carnos, and Rexes should not have cannabalism effects. Plus the vomitting when eating your own kind would be bad
It should be when you kill your own kind
sour fossil
well the vomiting would be a repercussion for eating your species, to actively discourage it unless in the most dire situation.
getting flagged just for killing your own kind could cause issues with packhunters ( accidentally killing another in a hunt)
or Challenging for territory
errant knot
^ Exactly, plus if a member is killed within a hunt whats the point in wasting that resource and continuing the hunt on a different animal, needs must afterall.
sour fossil
Im not sure if i follow @errant knot
errant knot
Sorry, I was following on your point from the packhunting. People want to discourage cannibalism but why would you waste what you have
sour fossil
hmm yeah i thought about that and I dont really have an answer for that, but incorporating something against cannibalism in certain dinos would have to come with some drawback in other areas (possibly flagging what species killed and then removing penalty?) but i feel like that would get quite complicated to do
errant knot
People are going to end up killing each other regardless, whether its through realism servers and defending territory/challenging for food, dire desperation and not starving to death, like it's going to happen and I don't think staying alive should be punished per se
sour fossil
yeah I agree, circumstances matter, yet I think it would be good to discourage people from actively hunting their species for food.
e.g Utahs goin the safe route for food by killing juvies or smaller ones, so they dont risk getting hurt/killed because they tried to hunt a tenonto
How this can be achieved and if its even wanted by the devs and playerbase is another thing,
errant knot
Agreed
lucid pebble
@barren zephyr you make a decent point honestly. I really wouldve like some ETA's for what ia featured on the roadmap.
untold canopy
@floral pewter Is what you posted sarcasm?
languid crown
@barren zephyr did you even read the first part of the roadmap?
languid crown
a roadmap was already agreed on before, they are putting in things as we speak, less then 2hrs ago Amarok streamed himself adding in the settings, the reason an exact order has not been given on features or dinosaurs is because they want to read the needs of the community. If a certain area really needs the feature (say combat logging and corpse guarding for example) they will priorities that over the elder system. In terms of dinosaurs its a similar thing, what does the ecosystem need, what will work well. many of these things are done already, the night cycle for example is very easy to implement, its just not being put in to allow them to source bugs easier.
dry notch
Biggest issue with the roadmap is there’s no transparency for actual bug fixes or simple gameplay mechanics (grouping, bleed, lag fixes, etc).
I mean it’s cool to hear about Dino groups being added, but they need to make the current 2 dinosaurs and envrima branch tolerable first.
languid crown
imagine if they had put bleed, nightvision, elders, nesting, grouping, fish, ai and diets all in on release, sure thats alot of content but the bugs that would result would be imense, and sourcing them would be alot more complicated
dry notch
But those mechanics aren’t even on the roadmap. That’s worrying.
Nobody is asking for everything immediately. People want a transparent roadmap of when mechanics will be added, grouping, day/night, lag fixes. That’s more important that simple dinosaur groups, imo.
I can’t even open my Evrima branch. Where’s the roadmap for when that will be fixed?
languid crown
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/401464048610312195/722407689618980974/5f44870fe16aa41804c84ba182005696.png
Dondi #Ghoul06/20/2020
Pulled from what's being posted later today:
I have not labeled these as numerical months or dates, but “batches” of dinosaurs that are designed around each other. These batches are not in a particular release order, but will be selected based on the needs of the game. We will communicate this to you. The plan is to make sure a base dinosaur is feature complete before we begin putting in more that will branch off and share mechanics. This means nesting, night vision, grouping, diets, and anything else shared among every single dinosaur will be in the game before the roster moves forward with dinosaur implementation. If there are delays, we will begin immediate work on the next dinosaur(s) and not wait out until the end of a month to start the next batch.
Lastly, not to be the things are subject to change, but I want to make a note that if there’s a clear issue with the ecosystem or roster of dinosaurs where needs aren’t being filled, we will reach out to identify the issues and, if need be, alter the schedule of dinosaur implementation or put something else in entirely as needed if the outcome isn’t what we planned or isn’t benefiting the game environment.
dry notch
But that’s another issue, they say they don’t want to release tons of mechanics to avoid bugs, but it’s still unplayable for some players.
languid crown
thats why they are fixing the bugs?
you think they release one piece at a time to find a bug, go, "oh well" and keep going?
dry notch
“Fewer things but very very few bugs” was just a lie though.
I don’t understand the argument against people wanting a more transparent roadmap? Like what’s wrong with that?
languid crown
theres like 5 prevelant bugs, graphics, some pounce issues, and apparently a data leak somewhere, but hey thats why they release it like this, to identify the bugs. Much less about the amount of bugs then it is locating them.
its a pattern, it just doesnt have set dates
bugs fixed > new feature > bugs fixed > new feature> bugs fixed, all features in? cool, > new dinosaurs > bugs fixed
and while this is happening the artists will be flat out modelling and animating the next dino batch
this was pretty clearly explained in the stream Dondi did on it, i understand alot of people didnt make it and the thing punch posted was pretty makeshift
he really went into depth with dino choices and such
dry notch
“This was pretty clear in the stream Dondi did on it” you shouldn’t have to watch a non-saved stream for updates on a game that’s being recoded.
A non-detailed plan relieves responsibility of actually having to follow through on promises. There’s absolutely no guarantee any of these changes will be implemented any time soon.
I just want to be able to open my game. I shouldn’t need to download and extract some file linked in a discord to simply open the menu.
languid crown
idk what exactly is next, but amarok is pushing the graphical settings thing to QA today, hopefully we'll get a patch tomorrow
interms of the other bugs we'd have to wait for filipe to get back from his holiday, interms of what feature, we know they are all coming within atmost a month or two from now, what order depends on community response and Dondi's decision based on that community response, so if you think a certain feature should be released ASAP make a suggestion for it to be released ASAP
personally id really like to see stress and combat logging fixed
that would be less then a day of code for 1 developer, wouldnt be too difficult for QA to test with
but we'll see how it goes
dry notch
I’m not even going to comment on devs going on holiday after releasing this mess. It’s just very poor planning to have this be out how many days now, and people can’t even open it.
livid fiber
Yeah but what you want them to work themselves to death? They need a break.
I understand this is a shit time but cmon
dry notch
Go on vacation before the release and be ready to work when you get back.
livid fiber
You say that, but no one is happy, people would complain either way
But yes true Lost, everyone's in disarray
Ah yeah I see ya point.
Lmao.
Yeah nah this is why I'm just gonna go into a comatose state until like next month
See what's fixed and yadda yadda
Yeah have fun 👌🏻👌🏻 I might as well just finally finish Dying Light.
dry notch
Honestly shocked this convo was even allowed to happen.
safe galleon
I think paradym is the only dev taking a break rn
dry notch
Wouldn’t go as far as a ban, but last time I brought up something I was concerned over I got flamed and told “we don’t care about that”. Surprised nobody was rude this time.
languid crown
what was your concern last time?
dry notch
I was concerned about the projected player limit on servers. I know official servers want 50ish players with a lot of AI, but I brought up how private servers may want more and it’s unfair to not design the game with the ability to increase player count and make it playable. Currently 100 players is fine lag wise, but the servers become laggy if given 200. Game should be fluidly able to handle all options of player limit.
languid crown
its logistically impossible to design a game with all options for player limits. as you approach larger player counts the server strain increases exponentially. its much less a game limitation then it is a server limitation and a player hardware limitation. The game and more beefier servers can handle 200 players, but it puts alot of strain on the smaller servers, so you can go as big as you want, just be aware if those players concentrate in a small area its going to lag, and if you go too big server upkeep will be insane. Its a resource managment issue as well as a gameplay design choice. Dondi doesnt want it to be stumbling onto a different dinosaur every 10meters, servers can opt out of that if they want and have more players, but it may not work best with the design choices the devs have chosen
lone pagoda
Agree that stego shouldn't be downsized, there are too many herbis that are free snacks already
barren zephyr
wrong channel to post that...so continuing its only free if you give it for free
not at all..i'm just saying that it's only free food for carns if you don't fight back and try to take them down
Stego is too slow and fat to run away. If they downsize the stego, It's probably gonna be a free food.
listen...i undersand your disappointment, i too agree that stego is small but you have 2 options here with 2 dinos to survive. Run away or fight back.
severe hazel
Stego should be accessible to stronger mid tiers such as allo and Sucho, that’s what it was IRL. So why should it be able to fight off dinosaurs that far outclass it in game. As long as it has other methods of escaping Apex’s it would be fine. Just like they’re making Maggy viable they can do the same for Stego
languid crown
its a fat animal it cant run
barren zephyr
then if you can run fight back...ez 2nd option to survive
languid crown
i dont see much point in turning stego to a spiky midget meat ball when kentro is right there
severe hazel
Maggy is a fat animal that shouldn’t run, yet it will in game. Stego being able to run makes more sense than upsizing it and making it something even further than what it was
barren zephyr
then if you can run fight back...ez 2nd option to survive
@barren zephyr Thats why stego should not be downsize.
languid crown
can you see a stego outrunning a allo?
severe hazel
No, it shouldn’t need to outrun an allo
It won’t need to
As long as it can outrun Apex’s it’s fine
barren zephyr
what was Stego main predator?
severe hazel
Allosaurus
barren zephyr
there you have it..stego is a mid tier then
severe hazel
Stegosaurus and Allosaurus remains have both been found with wounds from each other
As it should be
languid crown
it didnt have a predator, allosaurus didnt prey on healthy adult stegos, it preyed on the juvenile, the sick, and the aged
barren zephyr
Allo can't beat the adult stegosaurus
i once saw a documentary stating that allosauros hunted down big necked guys by bleeding them to death
severe hazel
Oh yes it did, they’ve found allo bite marks on healthy looking remains. No reason as to why I couldn’t have
barren zephyr
They could only kill the sick or baby sub stegos.
severe hazel
Stego has a tiny fragile neck and was also incredibly stupid. With a proper ambush or a pack allosaurus most definitely could and most likely did hunt adult stegosaurus. As the remains have suggested
barren zephyr
severe hazel
Hence why they’ve found healthy adults of both species bearing wounds from each other
barren zephyr
dude allos even hunted down bigger things like sauropods...at least thats what ive seen on the documentary
Allo pack can hunt stego. But can't hunt alone.
severe hazel
You did not just quote a dramatised documentary as evidence did you...
A fanaticised tv show such as walking with dinosaurs is the farthest thing from evidence. They made those to look cool. Not represent historic information
barren zephyr
Our isle is a game. We don't need too much realism
JP monster spino already confirmed but It's not realism
glossy matrix
A fanaticised tv show such as walking with dinosaurs is the farthest thing from evidence. They made those to look cool. Not represent historic information
@severe hazel tim haines' goal was to make an accurate documentary but ok
languid crown
A bite mark on healthy remains means the specimen got bitten when it was younger and survived, if it was devoured it would have gnaw bites all over it and the skeleton would have been scattered
severe hazel
Stegosaurus was an awesome dinosaur. But it was not some un-killable destroyer dinosaur that roamed the world without any fear or worry. It was hunted, it was killed. And it was done by predators far smaller than T-Rex
That’s what every dinosaur movie/ tv director says
languid crown
because its popular for the big carnivore to kill a powerful herbivore, they dont want to film some giant predator chase down a dryosaurus now would they? hardly an epic fight
best time to hunt a stego is when they cant use their tail to hit you, ie when they are weak, ie when they are sick and dying or are too young to be able to properly defend
severe hazel
I’m also more supportive of more mid tier Dino’s than Apex’s. The less apex Dino’s there are, the healthier the ecosystem of the game is
barren zephyr
best time to hunt a stego is when they cant use their tail to hit you, ie when they are weak, ie when they are sick and dying or are too young to be able to properly defend
@languid crown Exactly.
facts or not idk but those Allos are hunting those things
severe hazel
Something like a Giganotosaurus or Tyranosaurus would absolutely walk over a Stego. It lived millions of years apart from them. It never evolved to deal with those kinds of predators
barren zephyr
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1yv7Pi78Og
@barren zephyr They are sauropod not the stegosaurus. They don't even have thagomizers
severe hazel
Buffing the thing to the point of it being able to tangle with Apex’s is just ludicrous. It’s an insane power jump
barren zephyr
dude a sauropod is 2 times the size of a stego and allos still hunt them down it seems
languid crown
large herbivores are apexs, if they want to be that size they need to be able to defend themselves from attack.
and thats a sick sauropod at that, and took 20 allos to kill it
a stego with 1m thagomizers doesnt care what time period your from, a swing from that tail is death
severe hazel
Only if it hits something vital
I don’t think you realise how those tails would have worked. Just because it had 1m long thagomisers would not equate to that thagomizer going to full 1m in
barren zephyr
If stego's thagomizer hit allo that's done.
languid crown
it doesnt need to go 1m, a allo isnt even that wide, it just needs to pierce an organ. it could be done but good luck with a tail like that swinging around
severe hazel
What your proposing would essentially make stego in game not accessible to its own IRL predator
barren zephyr
Our game is in 'the isle' not the IRL.
severe hazel
Guess RIP the mid tiers then. Everybody wants there cool apex dinosaur that can fight off half the server at once
Mid tiers need food too. Arguably more than the Apex’s. Because mid tiers are so much healthier for the game. When has anybody enjoyed the fact that 80% of the player population was Apex’s. Do we want to go back to that do we
barren zephyr
Guess RIP the mid tiers then. Everybody wants there cool apex dinosaur that can fight off half the server at once
@severe hazel herbivore had only one playable apex dude
wasn't Rex for the most part a scavenger?
That makes me sad cause carnivores had two apexes and they are gonna get more after evrima.
languid crown
rex is an ambush hunter and brawler of armed herbivores, ambushes trike and brawls it, ambushes edmonto and brawls it
severe hazel
And the herbivores will have their own Apex’s to accompany them
languid crown
you realise what dondi was suggesting was to downsize stego so carno and cerato could fight it?
barren zephyr
wasnt it to risky for a rex to fight a trike thou? think ive seen something mentioning that, so for the most part rexes scavenge
languid crown
it would get absolutely curbstomped by allo at that balance
severe hazel
Stego isn’t apex tier, I’m sorry but it’s not and it shouldn’t be. Stego is a really cool Dino, and I’m gonna play the crap out of it, I love me my Herbis. I just don’t like changing Dino’s into what they aren’t
Cerato and Carno shouldn’t go near a stego
Even for an Allo the fight should be in the stego’s favour no question
Cerato and Carno wouldn’t stand a chance against a full grown Stego. Cerato was simply to small and Carno didn’t have the right weapons for it.
barren zephyr
Did you finally realize why people are disappointed?
I'm just gonna do some work now. Bye bud.
severe hazel
It’s all in the hands of the devs though. I’m supportive of Stego being the Top of the Mid tiers. Something that can only be brought down by using the right strategy.
flat crypt
One of the big reasons I'd rather stego be upsized than downsized is that we just don't have much in the way of apex herbies. Shants and trikes can both be dispatched with ease by any apex duo. They're still formidable and can still kill, but any apex player worth their salt can bring either down. Hell, a solo giga can kill a cama fairly easily too.
At the very least if stego is downsized it'll need a serious speed upgrade. My problem with a lot of dinos in this game, and currently that includes stego, is there are unwinnable scenarois. I don't mean a 12-strong utah pack vs 1 maia, that's obvious. But in a 1v1, all dinos should stand a chance. If they can't kill (like trikes and shants) they should be able to run away (most mid-tiers) or cripple (anky with bone break), or just outmaneuver (galli vs carno). Stego is screwed against any apex it comes up against, and I worry about the balancing if they made it smaller.
I'm not fully sure how the new bleed system will work, but it'd be nice to have another apex herbi alongside trike that can deal bleed.
IDK. Stego is my 2nd most played dino, and a downgrade isn't the kind of change I wanted to see for them. I'm glad they're getting a revamp because they do have issues, but I just worry still about balancing
Although I do agree they shouldn't be immune to mid-tiers. I mean even now they aren't, in a DM event I had a galli nearly bring me down. But imo they should be able to stand up to the apexes better than they do now.
pulsar lake
@tribal kayak @fallen light
tribal kayak
TreeDino...i don't really care, if they ban people for having an opinion then their are just insecure about their qualities as developers. Plus..i was polite.
pulsar lake
@languid crown
tribal kayak
@pulsar lake ty for the reminder:)
pulsar lake
Np ^^
fallen light
@tribal kayak Being able to use the early access excuse for 6 years must be nice. Oh well. Enjoy guys!
tribal kayak
don't say that out loud. some lurk here
edgy harbor
I think they can call it early access all they want considering it's not a full price game either. No ones forcing you to play/buy it either. If you don't like it just opt out.
sand dune
What you guys about adding Carcharodontosaurus in the game. Personally you might think it's like Giga V2 but I added him some unique abilities which will make it distinct just reply and I'll post my opinions about Carcharodontosaurus.
I'm sure it can be unique
I'm waiting someone who wonders then I'll reply him/her quickly.
vestal rune
I doubt it can be unique, it's very similar to giga
random imp
nah, is the same issue there is with Tarbosaurus and rex. they basically overlap niches
and in terms of gameplay is useless.
have two creatures that play in the same way, or slightly different is also boring.
sand dune
@vestal rune What is your opinion about the Carchar after you read what I wrote.
Please reply after reading the docx file
or else it'd be better to not reply.
real bison
anyone else find the vocal calls travel really far in EV ? probably just have to get used to it. But its like the echo is what determines the distance rather then volume?
all the other sounds are pretty spot on. just the vocals im having a hell of a time figuring out locating them
and judging distance/area
sand dune
@real bison More echoed sound = Further area
@random imp It's not like Tarbosaurus and Rex.
If you read the docx file
vestal rune
it's still just a weird hybrid between acro and giga that isn't really necessary
plus I don't think a bleeder predator should be able to inflict bb
sand dune
Yes then remove the dilophosaurus
What does a dilophosaurus do ?
It's Utahraptor V2
It becomes unnecessary with your aspect
Carcharodontosaurus: Would be something unique and distinct if it would have:
-Less or same hp with Acrocanthosaurus.
-A lot of stamina.
-Pretty dangerous bleeder bite (+8 bleed per bite but Carchar would bite slowlier than Giganotosaurus.)
-Bad health regen (But not the worst)
-Faster than Giganotosaurus and slower than Acrocanthosaurus.
-The weakest bite in apexes (Little bit stronger than Alberto).
-And finally the thing which is going to make him more unique is add him a better night vision than the all apexes.
(So we can have a nice and famous apex carnivore for scarier nights. It might look like overpowered but it would be risky to play in daytime which other apexes or carnivore packs like albertosaurus pack would easily kill it.)
-The another problem is similar appearance to the Giganotosaurus. To be honest if you add Carcharodontosaurus more thin looking body with long legs and triangular shaped small but long head like the picture I put. It would look much more different while Giganotosaurus has more bulky head and body. Also another way to make it even more unique is add a Giganotosaurus’s bite %15-20 bone break chance. It’ll also give a chance to Giganotosaurus to slow the sauropods with bone break.
It's not being hybrid if you consider the night time hunting
Does the bloody hell giga and acro able to hunt in night properly
vestal rune
no utahraptor is a hyper agile pouncing pack hunter, dilo is a nocturnal venomous slower hunter
sand dune
Not venomous
vestal rune
yes venomous
sand dune
V2 Raptor
vestal rune
plus we don't even know if acro or giga are nocturnal, it's possible one of the two will be
vestal rune
like I said, they have entirelly different hunting styles
sand dune
explain ?
Idk but they are both hunting with same style
They are both pack hunters too
fervent plinth
Yeah in legacy, theyre different now and they wont remove it
vestal rune
utahs either try and instantly kill small prey, or join up with groups to pounce on prey to rapidly decrease HP, dilo is a more long term predator which relies on venom to track and wear down their opponent over a longer period of time
fervent plinth
^
sand dune
There is no venom system in the Isle
vestal rune
I wouldn't say dilo is a pack hunter, it can hunt in packs but it isn't really encouraged to
well ye, not currently, in legacy they replaced dilo's venom with really high bleed
sand dune
But in The Isle it's considered as a pack hunter.
vestal rune
but when dilo is added to evrima it will definetally have venom
sand dune
But it doesn't refer to venom**
fervent plinth
There is 100% going to be venom
vestal rune
and it doesn't matter what it is now in legacy, it matters what it's planned to be
fervent plinth
^^^^^
vestal rune
dilo and utah are PLANNED to be very different predators, even if currently they may seem similar
fervent plinth
Utah aggresive, dilo patient
vestal rune
your suggestion for carchara simply isn't different enough from acro or giga to warrant the huge amount of effort to add it
sand dune
It has a night vision like Dilo has
vestal rune
we don't know whether acro or giga will have night vision though
sand dune
The game doesn't have a NV apex carnivore.
vestal rune
plus if the only meaningful difference is night vision then I don't think that's enough
sand dune
@rose stirrupBasket the both creatures are far different
fervent plinth
Dondi would rip you a new one xD hed compare this argument to tarbo and rex
sand dune
And they are planning to add more night vision creatures
fervent plinth
We dont need a nv apex
vestal rune
it is like tarbo and rex
you could say the same thing, give tarbo good night vision and rex not
fervent plinth
NV apex would ruin the point of dilo being a nightime hunter because theyd just kill dilos
sand dune
Why they decide to kill dinos instead of being weak herbivores ?
sand dune
Yeah but dilophosaurus would be able to escape from them
fervent plinth
That would imply that its slower than most planned herbis
tepid gate
Dilo and Utah in the legacy play differently, Utah is an animal that reliably hunts small tiers, whilst Dilo does rather poorly against them, having its best match-ups against animals larger than itself, it lacks the agility and speed of a Utah. You're right however that there's no nocturnal apex carnivore in the Isle - and it's for a good reason, balancing that out would be an absolute nightmare. Some already suggested this niche for the Acrocanthosaurus and it's a terrible idea all around.
fervent plinth
^^
sand dune
Yeah but they would be pretty weak in day time
fervent plinth
So... bad animal
tepid gate
Soooo they would just log out for the day and hop back in during the night?
sand dune
That's what dilos do right ?
tepid gate
And then every mid tier should do the opposite logging out for the night because it's literaly suicide running around when something 3 times your size runs around
fervent plinth
Just a bad idea man
tepid gate
No, Dilo is playable during the day even if it's nowhere near as good as during the night
vestal rune
dilo does well in cover during the day
tepid gate
Dilo's only match ups during the day where it's just outright invalidated are Carno and Utah
Carno - you can get around that by staying in a forest where it can't abuse its speed
sand dune
But Carchar would be weak as getting killed by down tier dinos.
If it wouldn't play carefully
tepid gate
Utah are less likely to risk the fight against you because while they are more than capable of reliably killing you without risking death if they play properly they take forever to heal up after the fight making it not worth it for them
Carch being killed by lower tier dinosaurs does not sound like a good idea, what lower tier animals are you talking about? Suchos? Allos? Acros?
Carch is an animal that is somewhat larger than Acrocanthosaurus
Acro could already invalidate the entire mid tier that's present in the game if it wasn't for the fact that its healing takes forever
tepid gate
Carcharodontosaurus current estimate is 6.4 metric tons in weight, Acro is 6.1t at most
Carch is not that significantly smaller than a Giga
Idk about Acro being more muscular than its other carcharodontosaurid brethren, proportionally this animal is less robust than Tyrannotitan(this is not really the place to discuss that)
Besides Carcharodontosaurus is being speculated to be a skin for the Giga
Matter of fact it has the model in the game
tepid gate
I've read only your suggestion here
sand dune
tepid gate
Yea it's basically the stuff you've written here, I've read all of it
I'm really not clear on some stuff though
You say for example that it would be dangerous bleeder doing +8 bleed per bite
flat crypt
Yeah nah it seems obsolete really. If we're introducing more carnivore apexes I think they need to be truly, distinctly different.
Just making it giga with nv isn't enough, and kinda shafts dilos who's whole shtick is being masters of the night
sand dune
Dilo won't be masters of the night in next updates.
tepid gate
You might either mean 8/100 in terms of total bleed, which is Cerato level of bleed application or 8bleed/3 sec which is the damage that it would do with the bleeding, however this doesn't translate properly because you need to specify which dinosaur this bleed is being applied to
It depends... we're getting Troodon which will be a nocturnal animal, Dilo is still over 10 times bigger than Troodon though
flat crypt
The current 4 apexes all have very different playstyles. Rexes are bruisers who just deal hard damage. Gigas are patient bleeders. Spinos are semi-aquatic tanks, and deinos are aquatic stealth machines
vestal rune
troodon will be nocturnal?
tepid gate
Yes, Troodon is meant to be nocturnal
flat crypt
I believe trooden is planned to be nocturnal? Regardless, that doesn't mean dilo won't be any less fearsome at night
sand dune
It'd nice
tepid gate
In general I genuinely don't see any other carcharodontosaur being added to the game as they are all too similar to the Giga - Carch has the advantage over others because it's more distinctly looking which could make it work as a skin for the Giga
mighty girder
Dilo would still beat troodon I'd think, so technically Dilo is still the "apex" of the nocturnal boys. Its just not the ONLY nocturnal boy now.
tepid gate
I personally think that even adding Acro is pushing it but that's up to the devs
sand dune
Also there is no information about Dilophosaurus was killing it's preys with venomous bite. So The Isle dilo is scientifically not accurate.
flat crypt
Mhh, I'd rather they focus their attention on something totally different
sand dune
No I don't think they are
flat crypt
Oh yeah the whole venom thing with dilos is totally false and came about thanks to JP, but the isle isnt trying to be accurate, its trying to make a fun game
tepid gate
If you're looking for the scientific accuracy this is not the right game for that
sand dune
So Carchar wouldn't need to be %100 accurate
tepid gate
Sure it wouldn't have to be
that's why I like your suggestion of making it a more gracile animal in comparison to the Giga
flat crypt
I still don't see any point to it. I'd much rather more mid-tiers were introduced than more apexes
tepid gate
I'd still see it just as a skin though
flat crypt
The point of apexes is that they're the strongest but by far the least common. Having lots of apexes makes no sense
sand dune
Carchar doesn't need to be an apex
flat crypt
Then it's just another acro
tepid gate
At its size? You would have to downsize it a lot and in that case why add Carcharo and not Eocarcharia, Concavenator or whatever other carcharodontosaurid?
flat crypt
I get that you really want this dino in the game but I just don't think it's a good fit considering the current size of the roster
flat crypt
If there were like... double the amount of dinosaurs having dinos fill the same niche wouldn't be so bad, but currently it's a little pointless
tepid gate
How much would you like to change it?
As in: how small would you make it to be unique?
sand dune
Scarlet
mighty girder
Spinony
tepid gate
Carchar
sand dune
Did you read the docx file I wrote
tepid gate
Concavenator was just my example of a smaller carcharodontosaurid
sand dune
I found some ideas and we're discussing about it
mighty girder
No and I dont plan to because this is an argument thats happened on the discord 27 million times
and the result is always the same
the niches it could fill are full already
flat crypt
I could get behind the concavenator in theory because of how unique looking they are, but it still needs to have a unique enough playstyle
tepid gate
@mighty girder Not really, he's suggesting making it a nocturnal apex
mighty girder
So its giga but active during the night
sand dune
Yeah but underdog like
mighty girder
Doesnt seem that unique
Acro/Giga but you play it most at night
does that seem incredibly unique and worth 7,000 to you
sand dune
They have pretty bad NV though
tepid gate
Think about how much people complain about Dilos right now and imagine what would happen if you had Giga sized Dilo roaming the Isle
tepid gate
It's a hyperbole, I understand it's not literally a Giga sized Dilo
tepid gate
the apexes with the exception of Rex already have a bad hp regen
flat crypt
I still don't think it's worth it dude. Like yeah sure in theory it could work, but I don't think it's unique enough to warrant thought at the moment when there are far more unique dinosaurs that could be implemented instead.
sand dune
So that's why I made it nocturnal right ?
mighty girder
You can play the other things at night too.
tepid gate
I don't know about that, we're getting some animals that seem to fill pretty similar niches, especially among smaller carnivores
sand dune
But you can't hunt
mighty girder
But you can
flat crypt
Apexes are totally viable night time hunters, without a doubt.
mighty girder
You want an apex creature to have a huge ass night vision field with apex level dmg and bleed
tepid gate
That's for a good reason, imagine you're an Allo or Cerato and you have a Giga sized dinosaur beelining at you in crouch in the middle of the night from a distance where you cannot see it
tepid gate
Does that sound fun to play against?
mighty girder
that is not fun
that is awful
herds will be wiped with 0 chance of ever doing anything
tepid gate
No, he suggested making its damage rather low
mighty girder
Dilo does the night hunter big boy job well
flat crypt
The reason dilos having such great night vision works for them is that they're weak. Being able to see prey from far away that can't see them gives them a chance to dip in and out to deal some damage. An apex doesn't need that if it can tank whatever it walks into
tepid gate
Alberto level
mighty girder
without being so big its overbearing
sand dune
Yeah that would be quite bad
mighty girder
Alberto level would still be overbearing though lol
flat crypt
yeah i dont think we need a "dilo but stronger" lmao
tepid gate
I agree, just saying that with the biteforce around the level of albertosaurus it wouldn't necessarily cull the entire herds
But yes, think about the general reaction of the community to the Dilo - most people hate it, if you put in something that's the size of an apex with that level of night vision that's just asking for trouble in terms of balancing
sand dune
It wouldn't hunt herds
mighty girder
You can't guarantee that
tepid gate
Imo Dilo should be the biggest nocturnal hunter
sand dune
They would die.
tepid gate
I mean, no, with Alberto level of biteforce it literally wouldn't cull entire herds unless the herbiplayers went afk
teal pecan
please dont forget about humans, would be truely amazing to throw in the mix on a "hunt and get out" kind of game play
flat crypt
but it would hunt herds lol. you cant just give a dino the ability to wreck a herd and then tell the player "ok dont hunt herds :)"
tepid gate
It would still screw over a lot of mid tier players
sand dune
It would screw over carnis right ?
mighty girder
@tepid gate making it nocturnal means it has a lot of bleed/venom however that works, which means it doesnt need damage
it just needs to bite a lot
tepid gate
It would screw over anything too small to fight back against it
tepid gate
I'm not quite certain what level of bleed we're talking about
stone scaffold
@honest anchor i believe most of the clunkiness with the drinking animations is due to the lack of IK, should be fixed once that's implemented
mighty girder
stronger then dilo
Bleed is being reworked but
Venom I think is gonna be current bleed
tepid gate
8 bleed per bite is the Cerato level of bleeding which is absolutely abysmal
mighty girder
so for discussions sake I guess we base it off of what we have in current game
and say since its nocturnal and bigger then dilo
tepid gate
unless he's talking about 8 bleed damage per second but that depends on what dinosaur it would've bitten
mighty girder
it needs to be stronger then dilo
which means stronger bite
which sounds 0 fun to deal wtih
sand dune
8 bleed damage per sec
tepid gate
To what dinosaur?
mighty girder
yikes
tepid gate
They all get different amount of damage
Some bleed out more, some bleed out less
8 per second is absurd level of bleed btw, that adds up to 24/3 seconds which is the value displayed in the character menu
sand dune
Which dinosaur would be better
tepid gate
Bleed is applied every 3 seconds not every second just fyi
sand dune
to get 8 bleed damage per sec from carchar
flat crypt
i mean theres no real concrete way of putting it. All dinos have different levels of bleed resistance. there is no single "average dino"
sand dune
I really don't know which one it would be
tepid gate
Let me put it this way: if you bite a Rex or Giga that's standing applying 8 bleed/3 sec to a standing Apex is a lot, if you bite let's say a Cerato and apply 8 bleed/3 seconds to a standing Cera - that's not impressive
flat crypt
None of them. Because that's just dilo 2.0 but bigger. No one wants that
sand dune
What if it would apply it to something like sucho or alberto
tepid gate
in general when you speak about bleed you should refer not to the damage being applied but to the amount of bleed being applied
flat crypt
Spinony, I think you need to genuinely plan this out a lot better if you want to convince anyone.
tepid gate
e.g. - Giga does 40 bleed out of a 100 to another Giga(animal of the same weight)
flat crypt
You've flip-flopped on what you want charc to be several times in this conversation
tepid gate
Allo does 25, Rex 10, Cerato 8
sand dune
Ok let's talk about Carchar later ok ?