general-feedback-discussion

[cyan flame]

And prior experience in how well omnis fared before U6, when their magnetic pounce worked just fine

[warped fog]

And it should be more lethal if we plan on giving it a punishment if it misses said pounce

[limber hull]

it really should not

[acoustic yoke]

I really wish there was more benefit to holding onto a dino. If it applied more bleed over time or something to discourage tap pouncing

[cyan flame]

Why, when it is plenty lethal enough? Especially considering that you kind of have to try to miss the pounce in the first place, since magnetic pounce is somewhat a thing still, plus the whole no need to aim the pounce for the flanks even.

You're arguing it's weak, based on, how the players play, rather than what the actual effect of a pounce is? Have you tested the pounce and it's power?

[limber hull]

agreed, it should ramp over time

slowly become more effective the longer you latch

[warped fog]

Because we don’t assume that omnis will always land their pounce

[acoustic yoke]

It's kinda like when lions jump a zebra, they dont treat them like trampolines. They grab on and hold on for as long as possible 😂

[cyan flame]

Considering how easy it is to land... But sure, but even if they miss, the pounce as it is, is still plenty powerful enough. And if omnis struggle handling carno in the current update, with how bad that playable is overall, then that says more about the omnis and their abilities at the game than anything else.

Even if you added punishment on miss, the pounce is already powerful, and very easy to use overall, with little risk when it works properly, so there's really no need to up the power of it, unless they've nerfed it in some way that I'm unaware of

[warped fog]

Well they would be nerfing it by making omnis very prone to death if they didn’t land it

[cyan flame]

That does not nerf the power of the pounce or the ease of use or anything, it only adds the risk of death by missing. You'd have to also actually change the power sufficiently to require a lot more pounces, or make it harder to land, such as making it a requirement to land on the flanks of the target or otherwise fail the pounce, to make the risk of miss be meaningful. Even before, with the full stun, you could survive if you didn't manage to land right in front of the targets attack (at least when the stun was quite short, possibly not when it actually lasted for a bit).

[warped fog]

The power of the pounce shouldn’t be nerfed just the safety of it

[limber hull]

that's exactly what he's suggesting

[cyan flame]

I don't think I ever argued for a nerf to the power, I've only argued that the power is fine and does not need compensation for the miss being more risky or there being more demands on achieving a successful pounce.

As it stands, pounce, when it works, is rather little risk with quite the decent reward

[warped fog]

“That does not nerf the power of the pounce” (implying that’s what’s needed)

[cyan flame]

Hence, the suggestion would be to make pounce actually require some form of planning, skill and timing/aim and so on, such as by making it only work on the flanks of the target (since that's where the omni/troodon is hanging on in the first place after all), as well as some form of punishment on miss so it's not just miss and keep going without any risk of reprisal at all. After this has been achieved, it'd be much more reasonable to then look at the power/stats of the playables and see if there's a need for a buff or nerf, depending on how well they handle the things they should and/or should not.

[cyan flame]

No, that was just me phrasing it badly. That was meant as a response to your statement that it would be nerfing the pounce, I don't consider adding a risk to the failure of landing a a pounce a nerf to the pounce itself, since it's still as easy to use and powerful as always.

I did not mean to imply that pounce needs to be nerfed, at least not for the time being, though it does very much depend on how well things go when/if pounce and assorted mechanics work properly and all that

Since it's hard to judge power when bugs and latency and other fun stuff has the final say on if you live or die :p

[warped fog]

When you pounce. There’s a chance you don’t land it. If you die by not landing it. You’re nerfing pounce. As a pouncer risks dying when pouncing. Hope this clears it up.

[cyan flame]

Well, there's no guarantee that you die if you miss, but yes, I see how you mean, I merely don't quite think of it the same way.

[rare fractal]

Good pounce is way too strong and easy

[azure ruin]

I can see your reasoning. My only hope is that the ceratosaurus doesn't get nerfed to the point where it's just absolutely useless. That's my biggest concern.

I hate that they nerfed the carno's acceleration but people claim it's still viable. I hope that the same can be said for cerato after it's been tweaked!

[limber hull]

carno's accel being nerfed was warrented, but it's not viable

also, i feel like cerato has been ignoring many of its unique tools because its current "endurance run at things until they die" playstyle has been working so well

it's still the most aquatically capable land animal

moreso than even teno

it's hard to compare anything to carno's bizarre balance state because nothing has been butchered quite like carno

[cyan flame]

I would say that won't happen, but to be fair, the balance situation of the Isle tend to go from op to "useless" and around, with it being either carno or omni on top, and now I guess cera would get a turn too. I'd personally change the vomit thing to be a much harsher and long lasting effect, and if neccesary adjust ceras stats otherwise plus adjust the body down buff if needed for the general corpse stealing part (and maybe lower it's capabilities to hunt a bit at that). But we'll have to wait and see, if nothing else, balance will change multiple times yet before we're near the endgame, so at some point I'm sure things will be figured out.

[limber hull]

reminder, cerato has PLENTY of tools in its backpocket that the community have yet to properly take advantage of, bacteria and vomitlock is merely surface level

the fact that cerato can be viable while not even utilising a good chunk of its provided tools and survival strategies is testament to how truly overtuned this animal is

difference between carno and cerato is cerato has lots of backup plans, whereas carno is SUPER straightforward and specialised

so nerfing carno's accel nerfed it hard because it's not like it had anything else in its back pocket to compensate

you could nerf cerato's vomitlock, but it'd still have bleed res, body buff, swimspeed, agility, endurance and close range brawler damage

if cerato has to back off and play more on the defence/side of caution, that's an improvement imho

right now it's too overconfident

[daring rock]

just had a stego half the size of a full grown one take me from full health to dead in three hits. stego needs nerfed

[limber hull]

stegos shouldn't be walking meat while young, and they still have their iconic thagomizers, you can't treat them like you won't get punished for running in blindly against one

nerfing stego for the sin of defending itself is absurd

that being said, it's really not hard to kill a young stego due to their stubby tail reach and lower health

[rare fractal]

I’m not sure why small animals can’t have high damage

Don’t assume you’re supposed to win against something because it’s slightly smaller than you

[limber hull]

considering it was "half the size of an adult stego", it likely wasn't even smaller than him

it was probably bigger

[rare fractal]

Mhm

It’s the high damage tank

It’s slightly smaller than it’s absolute largest size

Expect it to hurt even at that stage

[limber hull]

it punishes bumrushing (most of the time) and rewards baits, placement and skill

[rare fractal]

Too hard

[limber hull]

so you know, something most isle players can't counter and deserves to be nerfed

[rare fractal]

I want my targets to die on sight

I want the light refracting off of its skin into my eyes to trigger a cosmic smite

[limber hull]

it's like how teno keeps getting nerf requests for some bizarre reason

whenever teno is remotely in a good place, it immediately is requested nerfs

the only reason it isn't right now is because its entire species is endangered by a certain "scavenger"

[rare fractal]

Well

And pounce literally disabling slam

Even seconds after it dismounts

But pounce can’t be touched anymore so why would that ever change

God forbid we return to the accursed update 6 state of the game where Omni was the most balanced it had ever been

[limber hull]

it's really funny how teno's primary weakness is completely unfair stunlocks

U6 had them and now U6.5 had them

[rare fractal]

The status quo must never change

There must always be a way to stunlock teno

[limber hull]

except this time now people are super pro-stunlock for some reason because the animal they're playing can't possibly function without not allowing its opponent to not play

it's not like cera has an entire swiss army knife of survival tools if plan A fails

[rare fractal]

It has a mouth full of sharp teeth, so playing defensively means rush the target and spam or you’re fodder

[limber hull]

god forbid we play around environmental differences like forests or rivers

[rare fractal]

If that doesn’t work nerf teno

[limber hull]

no, plains is where the action is, that's where cera will be

[rare fractal]

Yeah sorry, trees repel most Carni players

[limber hull]

herrera will be interesting, because carni players will find themselves in a mix of confusion

[azure ruin]

I agree with you fully.

[limber hull]

a carnivore (good) that utilises trees (bad)

[limber hull]

i cannot WAIT for the days of Gateway where more than one biome is allowed to be interacted with

and the plains are seperated by forests, forcing poor carni players to have to walk through the nasty forests and engage with more than a single plains in the centre of the map

[rare fractal]

I don’t know if the player base will be able to handle such a contradiction in the fabric of reality

[limber hull]

no carnivore irl lives in jungles

[rare fractal]

Jaquars are propaganda

[limber hull]

big ecosystem wants you to belive its lies

[amber cosmos]

tigers dont exist either

[rare fractal]

Don’t listen to the grass eaters

They’ll make you think forests exist

Or something

Side note but I’m getting tired of people referring to every animal as a glass cannon

[quiet wind]

troodon pounce broken?

[rare fractal]

Stegos a glass cannon
Tenos a glass cannon
Carnos a glass cannon
Troodon’s a glass cannon
Omnis a glass cannon

Everything is just a volatile shard of glass or something

Like the only animals i haven’t heard that label on are animals with borderline zero combative relevance

[limber hull]

please add dibble and have it tank things lol

also it's bizarre things get called "glass cannon" just because they're SIGNIFICANTLY smaller than other animals, like how cera has been called a glass cannon for not tanking stego

[wispy jackal]

I see people wanting to nerf teno and I humbly ask you to stop, teno always gets nerfed leave the poor thing be it’s pretty ok now

[rare fractal]

Oh it’s

It ain’t ok rn

[limber hull]

it needs more

[rare fractal]

Basically

[limber hull]

giving back its tailslam damage could be a nice start

and no i do not care if the ceras complain that it means tenos can beat them to death better, avoid the giant-ass tail

[rare fractal]

It’s actually one of the easiest attacks to avoid

That currently exist

[limber hull]

still can't fathom why out of every attack, it got nerfed

entirely defensive direction, fair angles, stamcost makes sense

[rare fractal]

Also it’s stun

Is barely a stun anymore

[limber hull]

it is literally the one attack anyone can avoid unless they are SIGNIFICANTLY slower than teno

also tailslam got nerfed but not charge damage???

this enrages me deeply

[rare fractal]

Charge, the ability who’s primary function is NOT for burst damage

Slam, the ability primarily utilized for burst damage

Slam gets nerfed

[limber hull]

herbivore was failing to be hunted

[rare fractal]

Oh my mistake

I forgot that those who consume the ground are destined for dinner

[limber hull]

the real question is who in god's good name wanted TENO to be nerfed after update 6

[rare fractal]

Omni karens

Idk xD
I actually have no idea

[limber hull]

carno, sure, 100% makes sense why it got nerfed, people literally wanted this thing ground into a fine paste
deino, ABSOLUTELY warrented, not enough done, but I respect the gesture
pachy, for SURE this thing needed to stun less that was 100% on point

but teno? it was in the same position as omni, yet that guy walked out with a ton of shiny new buffs under his belt, whereas teno gets kicked while its down with a new predator that wants it dead, where swimming/endurance no longer works, and less ways to deal with it

it's bizarre, both omni and teno were in the exact same boat, except where omni got treated to a 5 star meal apology for the stuff it went through, teno got beat down, thrown in the cold and literally fed to rabid dogs

it truly feels like the loudest voice ends up with their cries heard with this, which is imho the true problem with these feedback channels. People are heard too much, and these people refuse to look from viewpoints beyond their own

Devs listen, and they listened to day-in, day-out complaining about omni's state, carno's state, pachy's state and they did something about it

Cerato was actually decently balanced, but the community literally pushed for more and more buffs, to the point that cera almost had 200 biteforce

because they saw matchups where inexperienced ceras died to experienced carnos, and interpreted that as "cera garbage tier and steamrolled by carnos"

[rare fractal]

That’s why I borderline don’t care about feedback channels

They just form a consensus on whatever the lowest common denominator deems the status quo

And rolls with it till they realize they were wrong

Like people STILL think Omni is in a bad place

[limber hull]

and stego is OP

[rare fractal]

Somehow

[rare fractal]

The fact anyone has really ever thought that post diets is bizarre to me

[limber hull]

stego is the closest thing we have to a "hard to grow apex"

and throw that thing on Gateway and hoo boy, get ready

more biomes, better space distribution, more points of interest, a larger overall playable space

we're likely going to see stego take full voyages

[cyan flame]

Stego in proper open plains with no terrain to use = extinct stego, more or less

[limber hull]

yea, i actually am excited to see rex-ready stego

[harsh otter]

i wanna see spino... do be my fav dino 🙂

[limber hull]

i'd be excited for spino if it wasn't presented as it is, something that kills every other aquatic animal without fear or competition

[harsh otter]

Well... it is apex predator

pretty sure if mosa is added... it finna die

[limber hull]

if a mosa is added, and spino walks out into the ocean, the only place a mosa would ever be, sure

[harsh otter]

pretty sure Things could kill spino... might be difficult but possible

He is quite tanky... i think it might still be difficult to kill deino

unless u go for the head

[limber hull]

based on what they've said, spino obliterates deino regardless of circumstance

[harsh otter]

😳

[limber hull]

cherius also apparently stands little chance

it's super lame and makes me super uninterested in spino

challengeless god that dominates its preferred biome and never has to interact with any of the land animals that could pose it a threat

[wispy jackal]

fr I am still so mad that teno lost the dmg from its more powerful looking attack goddamn

[jade robin]

I would love to see some Teno buffs 🙏 its my absolute fav but i don't play it as much now that he's been beaten down

[wispy jackal]

its gunna be........ really bad if Spino is completely unchallenged when fully grown :/ isnt Cherius close to its size? surely it should be a decent enough matchup

[limber hull]

it is, but cherius is shown to prefer tussling with suchos than spinos, and i doubt that was unintentional

[wispy jackal]

ughhhh

[limber hull]

i believe they literally left spino out of cherry's concept because they felt it didn't make sense for cherry to fight it successfully

[wispy jackal]

is it the biggest confirmed water based herbi we've got so far?

[jade robin]

watch them back cherry slower with less stam and no ability to fight spino so its just doomed

[limber hull]

it's an omnivore, so no

[wispy jackal]

non carnivore then lmao, if spino is the biggest

[limber hull]

it's POSSIBLY smaller than deino, but not by a significant margin. It's unknown how big they wanna make it exactly

Could end up being bigger than deino, we don't know yet

[jade robin]

it'll be like its an omnivore! we put a couple of AI things on its diet

[wispy jackal]

huh, be interesting to see if they make deinos model bigger to better represent its weight

[wispy jackal]

dont do this to me kes

[limber hull]

i mean, it'll likely eat fish

that much is obvious

[wispy jackal]

well yeah but let it eat player bodies too fr

[limber hull]

ehhh

i'd actually prefer it didn't, personally

[wispy jackal]

fair, I would like at least one player dino on its diet to fill one nutrient slot only, maybe the same one as fish

[jade robin]

idk making an omnivore class that's essentially just a herbivore that can also eat some AI seems boring to me makes it more or less a group that doesn't function any differently to a herbi

[limber hull]

idk what dino you could possibly put in that slot that cherius is expected to catch as a shallow wader

[jade robin]

not saying i want it to be able to eat all meat/everything just maybe some variety in the omnivores would be more fun

[limber hull]

idk, personally i feel having omnivores just be "eat literally everything" would make things a little too easy in my eyes

[jade robin]

thats why i said I don't want them to be able to eat everything

[limber hull]

also, again, no clue what a cherius would be eating that it could reliably obtain

[wispy jackal]

it makes the omnivore playstyle very boring and just the same as a herbivore then, and right now their AI systems are extremely lackluster so theres no challenge in it lol
As for what it could eat? Small water based dinos, Beipis, mimni, small crocs or suchos

if they bring one in - a sub aquatic hardosaur

[limber hull]

i'd only agree to the exceptionally small on that list, and even then, i'm doubtful they'd manage to catch them

suchos should not be an option for a cherius

[jade robin]

it's not like most things have a singular option on their diets except for herbis so it wouldn't be reliant on it - another option that could be interesting is that theres a particular organ they get extra nutrients from so can't eat the rest of it but will rip open a body to get that one thing out. Not saying it has to be for Cherry but for omnivores could just add something else, sorta like idea of some omnivores stealing eggs for the nutrients too

[wispy jackal]

Gives them some interesting aspect to their playstyle and also a challenge to grow a beast of that size if they actually have to risk hunting - idk, I kinda like that idea

[limber hull]

i just really don't see cherius being remotely good at hunting

it's described as "clunky", this thing isn't quick

nor a particularly capable hunter, in or out of the water

everything about it seems defensively oriented

[jade robin]

Again, doesn't have to be directly at Cherry could just be some added flavour for omnivores even if its mostly just scavenging something from bodies

[wispy jackal]

then how about this, why doesnt it just chase off other carnivores from their kills to eat? like suchos or smaller spinos/deinos and bully them off their food for the bits it wants

saves it hunting, but also gives it that little bit of spice

[limber hull]

i'd honestly think that fits better for sucho and spino than cherry tbh

[wispy jackal]

boo boring

[limber hull]

sucho and spino both suffer from the slow problem

same as cherry

neither are particularly adapt for hunting much outside of fish

[wispy jackal]

they better make spino slow, I dont want some ungodly fast broken dinosaur

[limber hull]

i want spino to be the second slowest of the non-sauropods, second to anky

[wispy jackal]

yes

[limber hull]

then slightly faster than spino is stego, but not by much

[wispy jackal]

nothing with a sail that big is running fast or for very long

[amber cosmos]

i think spino will have a slow sprint but a decent trot but not fast enough to actually catch anything unless completely off guard, we have already seen the trot animation and it seems decently fast

[limber hull]

i personally forsee spino def being the slowest of the apex carnis

when it's competing with giga and rex, that shouldn't be a surprise

[amber cosmos]

yeah i think giga will be the fastest trot wise and mid with sprint and rex have fastest sprint with slowest trot

[limber hull]

nah, rex is getting an insanely fast trot

[amber cosmos]

no idea on acro as the acro they concepted makes no sense lol

[limber hull]

giga should also 100% be the fastest sprinter, not rex

rex is also said to be getting a far more endurance/bloodhound niche this time around

[amber cosmos]

hmm interesting

[limber hull]

which i personally see as the better way of going about it

giga should be the fastest sprinter, not rex

[amber cosmos]

not going to lie if i ever grow a rex im just going to be lazy and push stuff off bodies like a giant cerato

[limber hull]

giga irl was built far more for speed than rex, and it's basically fact that in a footrace, giga wins basically every time

[limber hull]

@vale pawn there was something like that in Gateway's swamps

[vale pawn]

Good

[barren zephyr]

I miss playing Teno I wish it was more viable but it sucks so bad solo, can't outrun anything it's so stamina heavy with everything and the damage isn't even that good

[sudden arrow]

With teno you gotta have good stamina management, but if it’s a group of two or more you most likely can’t do anything

[indigo flax]

Teno is the Zebra of The Isle

In Groups? Stronker

Alone? Weak

[sudden arrow]

Agreed or in a herd

[barren zephyr]

that's someting you could say about literally anything

[limber hull]

true tho lol

[sudden arrow]

Depends

On what’s the situation

[limber hull]

every animal benefits from groups, except ironically stego, who is by far the worst herd animal in the game

[sudden arrow]

True that

But stego can stand alone against most things

[barren zephyr]

only because their tail is AOE

I would change it to single target tbh

[limber hull]

nah, AoE makes sense

[barren zephyr]

single target also makes sense

I am yet to see a video of someone knocking out 3 people with one swing of a bat

[limber hull]

yea but this ain't a bat

[barren zephyr]

stops at first target more often than not

spiky bat is still a bat 🙂

[limber hull]

it ain't a spiky bat

[barren zephyr]

it's a spiky noodle yes

only the very tip deals any significant damage

[amber cosmos]

i really want stego baseball swing not gonna lie

right now it feels like wielding a spear with the spearheads on the sides and stabbing the enemy with the wooden end it makes no sense

[limber hull]

i'm fine with the jab, as an alt-bite, but it should get another ability on top of that like a swing

[urban flax]

Tailswing (or the uppercut we saw some time ago) should definitely yeet smalls into orbit (rather than impaling them like the jab does)

[ebon coyote]

"ceratisarus is to small for apex can we make biger? Apex"@sinful yoke

As far as I know, Cera is not supposed to be apex. It shouldnt even hunt most of the time but eat rotten meat for bacteria, its a scavenger.

[midnight stirrup]

I’ve seen two carnos get killed by one jab

I have a video of it too

[barren zephyr]

.... u have no idea what I was talking about

[midnight stirrup]

then what were you talking about? What I said still aligns with the context. Regardless if it matters or not.

[barren zephyr]

I was saying currently stego tail is aoe damage while it would be more balanced if it was single target

[midnight stirrup]

yeah what I said was still relevant

you can kill more than one target with the swing as of now

[barren zephyr]

... we all know that 🙂

[midnight stirrup]

good for you

[sick crescent]

Not really?

Stego’s attacks being AOE seem fine to me.

If you make it single target it could unironically buff Stego though

Immediately makes it better at fighting in groups

[barren zephyr]

It's not the best but I will live with it being aoe cuz that means they can't fight too close to eachother

but single target would make sense looking at that tail

[sick crescent]

It sort of can make sense, but also not.

[barren zephyr]

yeah, depends on what and how you like to play

[acoustic spruce]

@gleaming silo is the night vision on in that image ?

[summer thistle]

just after i made that suggestion i lost my ptera and i can't find out which server it was on

[limber hull]

@lucid robin who said boars were temporary?

[lucid robin]

the devs.. i think. dont quote me tho

[limber hull]

i think the model might be temporary, but the AI itself is more than likely planned to stay

[north quiver]

I want boars to be dangerous menaces

(that won’t chase you halfway across the map and see you out of nowhere while you’re hiding ofc)

[barren crater]

Yeah it's a placeholder model right now. They want to make their own

[sinful yoke]

sarvenger is suppose to be small not big like cerasaurus

so devs need to make their mind if cerasi is apex or scarveng

[sudden arrow]

ceras are not apex

they may feel like that in game but they not

[limber hull]

cera is also very small for the total roster

we have some animals getting over 10 tons, and cera's only a bit over 1 ton

[uncut dagger]

@summer thistle i can’t identify it. there is no circle.

[summer thistle]

bruh it's a square

just because you say you circled something doesn't mean you made a circle

you're proabably just joking

[sudden arrow]

why is pt weight so low ? they are much bigger

can get up to 200 lb

no way troodon weighs more

[limber hull]

because for the size of the pteranodon we have, it being heavier than most animals is ridiculous. Flying animals need a low weight to body size in order to stay airborne, density will screw you over

[polar shore]

Hey! This is a comment ibe seen about the rex and trike and just wanted to see what people thought

'A Trike vs Rex would probably end with a Trike stabbing him with a charge or a Rex chomping down on the Trikes ass.

The Trike isnt an unstoppable animal, but just hard to 1v1. Similar to Rex, hard to 1v1. The trick would be to either group up agianst the one.

The way to balance these types of animals is to have a system in the game like a "Herd/Pack" system and "Territorail/Alpha" system.

A "Herd/Pack" would have leaders and they would defend their respective parties.

A "Territoral/Alpha" system would make dinosaurs of different kinds recieve "Buffs/Debuffs" for enteracting.Example #1: An "Alpha" Rex would be "Territoral" around other species of carnivores and if he left them alone he would begin to get a graduel "Debuff" to Stamina and Recovery. However if the "Alpha" Rex did attack the other carnivores he would recieve a "Buff" to stamina recovery and regeneration. Example #2: A "Herd Alpha" Trike will recieve a "Buff" for defending the "Herd" from any threat, which is any creature not in the "Herd". But if the "Herd Alpha" didnt attack those outside the "Herd" the "Herd" itself will receive a "Debuff" for stamina and speed.

These types of systems would differ depending on the animals they are applied to and would force those who "mix pack" to die off.(1/2)

[limber hull]

I'd cut down on the quotation marks personally because they're making it hard to read, but I do like the idea of territorial animals, to an extent. But forcing rex to fight carnivores that it quite possibly has no way of catching isn't really fair on the rex.

Trike also feels like the "buff" is unnecessary. By defending the herd, you buff them by premise of not dying.

[polar shore]

Example #3: If animals who refuse to leave the area of "Alpha" dinosaurs or their "Herds/Packs" the smaller or weaker creature will begin to "Stress/Strain" until it dies of said "Stress/Strain". Which will force players to refrain from mixpacking.

If Dino's form symbiotic relationships with those they are supposed to, the dev's should make them unaffected to these "Buffs/Debuffs" unless said animal causes harm to the other animals.
As far as the Rex being "All Powerful", it is the apex for land combat and should be. However, simply have the Rex be a great tracker and have good stamina pressorvation. But have it be slower than the prey its chasing or tracking so itll have to wait until its out of stam or resting itself.

Note - If a Rex locks onto you, id say your only hope is to mask your scent by going through water, or rolling around in mud.

As far as the Trike being the "Guard", i believe these systems ive wrote about should help with the issues of mixpacking and babysitting.

Ive got more information on my opinion of these systems for all the different playables as of right now, but in all honesty this game will need a system like this if it is ever going to make it.

Edit Note - The game should have an "Age" system so "Nesting/Breeding" is actually a must instead of a fun side quest.

An "Age" system would also help with scavenging and helping the weak fill the power gaps once those who ruled have died.

I know the Dev's have said they dont want this in the game, but immortal Dino's doesnt seem to fit the whole "survival of the fittest" thing.(2/2)

Sorry took a sec to get the whole thing posted!

[polar shore]

I'm sorry! I should have taken them out hah just trying to fit the whole message here sucked since this was something I saw from somewhere else hah

[limber hull]

Ah, gotcha

Rex having excellent tracking, an elder system and so on are planned for the game

Rex is shown to have a decent trot speed too, so it will likely be able to keep up with prey while tracking

The elder system makes it that there exists a stage where animals will become older and stronger than their adult stage, but grow weaker as they continue on in the elder state, until they can choose to die of old age, passing on "elder mutations", which we know little about, except only dying of old age can unlock them

[polar shore]

I think being able to choose to die is kinda weird? I think you should just kinda have to die since you have no choice in getting old

And Rex as it stands won't be playable in official servers anyway unfortunately

[acoustic yoke]

Watching a tiny troodon pin down something twice as large as itself is pretty silly to see. Birds don't weigh much, but they are some of the strongest animals on earth. For instance, Harpy eagles, a bird that weighs around 10-20 pounds, can carry up to 40 pounds.

Ptera might have a low weight, but they shouldn't be so easy for a troodon to grab out of the air either. Their wings have to be able to carry more than 100 pounds. They'd have needed great muscles

[acoustic yoke]

I believe if you choose to die of old age, you'll get to be the strongest of your species temporarily. Which sounds like a good trade off to me.

Personally, I would not like to spend 5 hours growing a dinosaur to 100 just for it to die soon after over a mechanic that you have no control over.

Even deino grab isn't so terrible, as safer watering locations exist.

[limber hull]

No, elder isn't optional, only death is iirc

So you reach your weakened state and then are given the option to die

[acoustic yoke]

This is what I have read about elders from the wiki. Is this outdated now?

"The Elder system is an upcoming mechanic where players can become an Elder variant of a species - which are larger, more powerful variations of the adult stage of life. They are only accessible by following certain diet and perk pathways."

[limber hull]

No, all things get old

[acoustic yoke]

So no more diet pathways? Someone will need to update the wiki

[limber hull]

Never take anything as fact from that wiki

[acoustic yoke]

I havent seen much about elders otherwise

Who said all dinos will be forced to age?

[limber hull]

Dondi

[acoustic yoke]

I really dislike forced deaths of a character. "You played your favorite dinosaur for too long" shouldn't be punished with no way to avoid it. Especially if you spend more than 5 hours to grow, only to get bumped back down to the fodder stage.

[limber hull]

Death isn't forced, elder is

[acoustic yoke]

Depending on how weak elder is, death will likely be forced. Either die and get a perk, or die.

[limber hull]

It's also unlikely elder will be extremely quick. You'd likely need to be adult for a while

[acoustic yoke]

If you get enough time to justify the long wait and difficulty, ig. You should get to spend at least a week or two with it if you dont die to other things.

And the elder system should not apply to things that die in one hit anyway. 30 minutes to grow a ptera. Keeping your big bird isn't going to hurt anyone.

[limber hull]

That's absurd, hypsi already suffers from being barred from the growth system, don't add even less value to smalls

[acoustic yoke]

Im not saying ptera shouldn't grow. If someone wants to die as a small dino and start over, they just have to follow the roars.

It sounds like the elder system isn't giving players something awesome. It's just encouraging them to start over by making them weak.

Which small dinos dont need

[limber hull]

Elder system is giving them elder perks, which all animals benefit from

I disagree heavily with some animals not being allowed to be elder

[acoustic yoke]

Elder perks will probably be something small and insignificant. Smalls shouldn't be excluded from the perks, just the forced death portion of them

[limber hull]

oh and we already have examples of elder models for ptera and troodon

[limber hull]

death still isn't forced

[acoustic yoke]

Die and get a perk next life, or die because you're too weak to do anything.

[limber hull]

Both are options, along with living on

[acoustic yoke]

That "perk" better be more than just a speedy growth back up to full grown.

[rare fractal]

You’re still not being forced to die

Where’s the argument even coming from

And we don’t even know how weak elders will get

[amber cosmos]

i honestly dont think elders will be that bad, i think will just get slower and maybe lose some hp

[acoustic yoke]

If they get bad diet weak or worse, it'll be pretty bad.

[rare fractal]

I’d bet you wouldn’t get too much slower

Speed is literally the most defining stat for viability

[amber cosmos]

i dunno about that, to be honest being tanky and alt biting as stuff comes in seems to work fine too

[rare fractal]

Nah

It simply doesn’t work on some animals

[amber cosmos]

as far as hunting is concerned if you catch them off guard and get some good bleed going they will have to stop

[rare fractal]

Speed breakpoints are again, the most defining balancing metric in the game

[wispy jackal]

whats the difference...

from adult to elder*

[acoustic yoke]

Imagine being at a disadvantage because you spent more time playing than someone else

[amber cosmos]

i disagree its not so simple, cerato played by a good player vs a carno played by a good player i think cerato would come out on top about 50% of the time

[polar shore]

Honestly with it being about survival just kinda seems like the natural program of things

*progression

And I can definitely see why that would suck

[amber cosmos]

my question is if you get to elder and grow a new dino with a perk if that dino dies do you lose the perk on the next one

[acoustic yoke]

Yes

[polar shore]

But I don't know if how long it takes to get to that elder stage has been mentioned?

[amber cosmos]

ok see that seems like a reason to nest in with people you know so that they can keep you alive

[limber hull]

it hasn't

[acoustic yoke]

I hope you'd be more likely to die to ai/boredom/other dinos/starvation/dehydration before you get even close to that point.

At least a week of gameplay.

[amber cosmos]

Sucho do you know for sure if you can lose perks by dying?

[polar shore]

Honestly The Isle is a survival game, not a 'Keep living on as a Highlander' Survive, Thrive, Procreate, Pass on. Rinse and Repeat.
If everyone lives forever whats the point of Breeding/Nesting. Other than something to do while you wait in a bush for 1,000 hours. At that point id probably wanna just click the alt tab and jump off a cliff anyway.
Aging as a system and dieing would have perks imo such as newer skin types, and the points you aquire to access new evolutions.

[limber hull]

No clue, I'd imagine you do lose mutations by death, considering that means it'd only take a few days to get literally every mutation

[polar shore]

I think part of the fun would be the whole process

The living the thriving and the eventual dying

[amber cosmos]

im hoping the mutations will be something actually worth the time investment, maybe some simple low % buffs to certain things or even the ability to adapt to new food to help survive

[limber hull]

stat buffs are a big nah from me personally

having certain animals just win because of some invisible bonus sucks imho

[amber cosmos]

its something coming to every animal and frankly if they are going to reward me with a skin when i already have a decent color pallet id be really annoyed and also question why its taking so long to put in the game

[limber hull]

even if it's coming to every animal, the balancing nightmare of "this mutation outright makes you faster" or "this mutation makes you deal more damage" would be nuts and super unfun

[amber cosmos]

and when i say low percantages i mean like 2% type stuff to give you a little edge against things you compete against such as members of your same species fighting for territory or even a 2% buff to food or water drain

otherwise i just dont see the point in even putting it in the game

[limber hull]

You can add mutations without making them generic flat stat ups

The system shouldn't just be new ways to make you better at PvP

[rare fractal]

A 2% buff to some stats would literally demolish hunting

[amber cosmos]

so what you want skins?

[limber hull]

no?

[amber cosmos]

what you want them to be

[limber hull]

changes to diets or survival elements. Mutations for deino that can permit it to live in the ocean, or some for teno that adapt it for more aquatic life, or mutations that expand Troodon's scope of mimicry capabilities, or turn ptera into a more scavenger style animal

[amber cosmos]

eh to me i feel like it should be all of that and some low lvl combat buffs

[limber hull]

then no one picks the other things

[polar shore]

Buffs are need for a game like this, if we dont have buffs or debuffs nothing would happen and everyone would mixpack.
Honeslty the 2 systems i had mentioned would fix the issues with thw core game since i havent seen any of the devs metion it

[limber hull]

you've ensured the meta already

combat buffs

[amber cosmos]

dude the meta is going to be apexs guns and strains anyway what are you talking about

[rare fractal]

Those are all problems too

It’s not like those are somehow exempt from bein terrible

[amber cosmos]

yeah im not a fan of modern humans being in the game or strains but some people want them so its whatever

[limber hull]

strains are actually done better because it notably visually modifies the dinosaur, allowing people to know their abilities off the bat, and they're designed to be unsustainable

[amber cosmos]

that dont matter if you cant hide or run from them

[lucid robin]

and a few others like omniraptor

[limber hull]

who says you can't hide or run from them lol

[amber cosmos]

one of them is literally for tracking if im not wrong

[limber hull]

the magna? that one's literally gone

[amber cosmos]

and they are fast

[limber hull]

completely decanonised

[amber cosmos]

bro for now lol they still have years of devolopment left who knows what strains they will put in

[limber hull]

how do we know they're fast?

[polar shore]

@limber hull This game is Survival and Leveling up. No one is going to get an edge over you without you being just as able to level up yourself.
Also if aging was added, the "OP dinos" would die to old age anyway.

[rare fractal]

You’re absolutely right, in fact as of last year strains were confirmed to have more weaknesses and be on average smaller than they’re legacy counterparts…

Things can change in good directions

[amber cosmos]

because they were fast in legacy and i dont see them not being fast otherwise why would you pick to play as one

[rare fractal]

Old age death is confirmed to be optional

[limber hull]

If the only way for me to deal with all the people picking combat perks is to pick the same combat perks, why add the system at all? The freedom of choice is an illusion then, pick the ones that matter, not the fun ones that diversify how you play, since if you pick the fun ones, you die to the ones who picked correctly

[rare fractal]

Old age isn’t, but the death is

[amber cosmos]

that doesnt say much hypo rex could solo a server and still have plenty of health

[limber hull]

Don't base anything on legacy balancing

Also I very much doubt neuros are going to be remotely fast

[polar shore]

Apexes are not gonna be playable. Litterally Trex and Trike will only be Ai in the Offical servers.
What a waste, considering they are pretty easy to balance.

[limber hull]

And hypers are literally too dense for their own good

[amber cosmos]

i dont even play official servers anyway mixpackers are lame

[limber hull]

There's nothing to say that's the permanent solution

[rare fractal]

Ok? Why does there legacy incarnation matter at all

They recognized hypers being unstoppable death machines literally caused entire servers to empty

Which isn’t what they want

[limber hull]

They quite literally took hypers away due to the whole unfun element, those hypers were proofs of concept, not the finalised product

[amber cosmos]

simple because until they give us more info and a look at these weaknesses i have no reason to trust these devs as far as balance is concerned, they have been trying to balance carno since evrima came out

[limber hull]

All strains in legacy cannot be taken as their final iteration, hell, the only neuro we got had absolutely zero of neuro's actual traits

[rare fractal]

Ok….but I don’t care about how competent they are, that’s never been what this discussion has been about, it’s about what the devs want to do with the game, and ways we think they could do it in the most functional way we perceive

[limber hull]

Especially since legacy was built mostly around who can move/turn the fastest over literally most other balancing factors. EVRIMA has more they can do

[rare fractal]

Whether they screw it up or not is to be seen

[limber hull]

Legacy's exceptionally limited combat means hypers win by default of having high stats

Since every animal in legacy is nothing more than a collection of numbers

[amber cosmos]

id say if they get an altbite they win by default anyway cause 180 head bite for the win

[limber hull]

alt-bites are defensive, why are you attacking a hyper

[rare fractal]

They don’t need to be combatible by most of the roster, they need to be survivable

[amber cosmos]

self defense cause they will probably be fast

[polar shore]

I feel like it being optional is kinda odd though like if I can't choose to be old or not I shouldn't be able to choose if I die or not

[limber hull]

self defence clearly doesn't work against the animal armoured to the nines and with strength to match

also, again, no proof they're fast

[rare fractal]

I don’t care personally, it’s a game, dying of old age by default would be lame

The game isn’t even that realistic to start with

[amber cosmos]

yeah well i wont be standing there coping while a strain kills me im atleast going to get some dmg in

[rare fractal]

For example, most animals reach full maturity in 3 days

[limber hull]

Or you can get away

[amber cosmos]

https://tenor.com/view/jonah-hill-annoyed-gif-11134341

[limber hull]

You seem to be still under the idea that strains will be inescapable because of legacy

Despite, again, us having zero proof of that

[amber cosmos]

why shouldnt i think that way i dont trust the devs lol

id rather strains just not be a thing

[limber hull]

because we've been shown time and time again that legacy doesn't matter anymore

[rare fractal]

It’s just as likely for them to be TOO slow rather than too fast if your reasoning to believe they’ll be too fast is a distrust of the devs

That reasoning doesn’t favor either side

[amber cosmos]

according to you. they still cant balance their game every update is an unbalanced mess, they even released deino super early just for hype rather then balance

[polar shore]

Compared to what? Living forever just hobbling around?

[rare fractal]

Sure why not

Inherited perks ARE going to be a thing

You’d lose those perks by death

Which would be lame if it just automatically occurred at a certain ordained time

[limber hull]

I really don't see what this has to do with strains. It really isn't hard to think of solutions to not have strains kill everything in the game with ease

[amber cosmos]

not gonna lie im starting to not like the perk idea either makes me feel like the game is going to become day of dragons with dinos

[rare fractal]

It’s so simple, if perks don’t alter base stats we won’t have issues

[limber hull]

Aren't you the one who wants the combat perks, which literally makes it that

[amber cosmos]

true enough my solution will be playing on servers with them turned off

[amber cosmos]

i dont want any of it in the game but if its coming i want it to be worth the investment in time and some lame perk that makes it so i can go die to a mosa ai as a deino aint it lol

[limber hull]

so why worry if you're never planning to engage with them, regardless of how well they're done

[rare fractal]

If it’s already bad why make it worse?

[amber cosmos]

that doesnt even make sense

[limber hull]

it makes perfect sense

[amber cosmos]

no it doesnt

[rare fractal]

What about it makes no sense

[limber hull]

if you think perks are bad, why make them even more impactful and frustrating

so that they matter more

[amber cosmos]

how is taking something like a worthless salt water perk into a 2% buff to HP that big a deal yall tripping

[rare fractal]

Why make perks stronger than expected in response to perks being added if you don’t want perks in the first place due to how they may effect gameplay

[rare fractal]

If you think a salt water perk is useless…..wow

[limber hull]

how is a salt water perk worthless

expanded hunting grounds, safety from many cannibals, more area to traverse, more animals to encounter

[amber cosmos]

whats out there that you need? how many players you see in Bob and pot out there? its a pointless biome as its not popular enough to populate

[rare fractal]

Also a 2% buff to some stats would actually break some animals

Yeah I’m out

[limber hull]

on spiro

[amber cosmos]

like which one?

[limber hull]

pick one

[amber cosmos]

HP

[limber hull]

no, pick an animal

because it'd break any of them

[amber cosmos]

ok carno

[limber hull]

2% more speed is already nuts

2% more weight means you can now knockdown other carnos

[amber cosmos]

sounds good to me it can run from ceratos now probably

[limber hull]

shouldn't need perks to account for bad balancing

[amber cosmos]

also lets see what 2% speed to carno brings it too

[limber hull]

that just makes more bad balancing

[rare fractal]

Being ANY faster than another adult Carno means you can’t be escaped

[amber cosmos]

max speed of carno atm is what like 56 or something?

[amber cosmos]

survival of the fittest welcome to a survival game usually arent fair

[rare fractal]

Bad ones aren’t sure

[barren crater]

Why not just balance BASE creatures

[rare fractal]

That’s an entirely arbitrary unfairness

[amber cosmos]

you ever play dayz? scum? like any other survival game?

new players get crapped on its part of being new

[barren crater]

Why do we need perks to change important stats. Why can't every Carno come with the same stats?

[limber hull]

hatchling? juvi? we literally already have that

[barren crater]

Let player skill be the difference

[rare fractal]

Because there exists no other way to make perks important

[amber cosmos]

and now you have elder and perks to add onto the end of the stages

[limber hull]

perks can be diversification of survival strategies, as mentioned prior

[rare fractal]

I typically prefer my games to reward success to players that are better at the game

[amber cosmos]

facts which is why they shouldnt be in game lol

[limber hull]

lmao

[rare fractal]

Agreed

So why make it WORSE

Wait no

[amber cosmos]

you dont even know what the perks will be what you mean make it worse

[rare fractal]

Sorry miss read

[limber hull]

why not just have the simple little survival perks. You won't care regardless, because you think it's useless

[ashen ginkgo]

I logged to get food out of my mouth on my 3 month deino I've had and when I came back to server it deleted my deino and brought me to home page. No nothing killed me my boyfriends monitor is behind me and we had just layed a nest so I was watching and he stayed to see my body despawn and everything. yall need to fix that crap

[limber hull]

So we get good perks, you get a system you don't engage with, done and done

[amber cosmos]

simple, imagine you spend a week getting to elder ok, you get your "saltwater" perk spawn in and get yeeted by a spino you just wasted a week of your time its a pointless perk, not to mention you are going to die as a deino vs a mosa specially with how jank the AI boar are in this game how you think the mosa will be?

[limber hull]

I'd be safer from spinos in the ocean, more space to swim

Also mosa is not confirmed as AI

Or confirmed at all really

[amber cosmos]

its been hinted at

[limber hull]

so has a perk that gives buffs to nested young of some description

[amber cosmos]

that is literally the most worthless perk i think i could ever come up with

[limber hull]

awesome, you don't need to have it

[amber cosmos]

heres a buff little baby with 2 biteforce

unless it buffs the parents there is no point

[limber hull]

no point to you

[rare fractal]

I’d do it

Cuz nesting is fun and experiential

[amber cosmos]

no its a fact buffing hatchlings literally worthless for surviving

[rare fractal]

And it’s an easy way to grow groups

[limber hull]

groups are useful for survival

[rare fractal]

This is simply a difference in what we value

[limber hull]

Groups can be argued as one of the most valuable survival strategies in the game

[rare fractal]

Personally I’d love to have a salt water perk because it opens up a MASSIVE playable area for me

That I otherwise wouldn’t have had

And it doesn’t break balance

[amber cosmos]

you can group without nesting

[limber hull]

and with gateway actually having a better ocean

[rare fractal]

Ok, nesting makes it easier and safer

[limber hull]

or i can group with nesting

the agency of choice is beautiful, is it not

[amber cosmos]

also when you say saltwater perk you mean drinking salt water as a croc right?

[rare fractal]

Yes

[limber hull]

drinking/living in salt water

[amber cosmos]

even saltwater crocs in rl dont do that

[rare fractal]

Literally opens up a larger playable aquatic zone than the one you start with

[rare fractal]

I don’t care, nor does the game

These are genetically engineered weapons playing ecosystem

[limber hull]

just make it your hydration goes up in salt water thanks to salt glands, done

[rare fractal]

That works too

[limber hull]

errm actually they aren't related to the military smh

[amber cosmos]

so yall just want nonsense in the game like strains and hypo killer lazer beams lol

[polar shore]

How does that work for this type of game? Strongest Dino beats all. The end thats all if that's the case

[rare fractal]

We already have that in the form of abilities like omnis pounce

[amber cosmos]

omni isnt even a real dino it should be replaced with an actual utah, which couldnt pounce

[rare fractal]

Not engaging stronger but slower targets ensures your survival. You don’t need to be stronger than another animal to be able to play around it

[rare fractal]

That’s not happening

[amber cosmos]

duh

[rare fractal]

Also….none of these animals are related to their “base species”

[limber hull]

so what do we do with troodon, hypsi, beipi and whatnot? do we get rid of them too?

[rare fractal]

They’re quite literally genetically created from zero prior material

[amber cosmos]

yes they suck in a few months nobody will play bleipi and troodon is a meme

[rare fractal]

I thought the issue was realism, not playability

[amber cosmos]

to me its both

[rare fractal]

Because in that case let deino drink salt water NOW

[limber hull]

in a few months we'll have gateway, i guarantee you we'll see a LOT of beipis

[amber cosmos]

i havent seen one all week so doubt

[limber hull]

because we're on spiro

which sucks complete ass

[rare fractal]

They’re ironically one of the most played playables despite Spiro sucking

[limber hull]

and has the most boring waterways ever concieved

and even then, how are you not seeing them

[amber cosmos]

you cant blame the map for everything bleipi cant even see underwater at night

[rare fractal]

Like I can’t play an aquatic without seeing packs of them

[limber hull]

i don't have that problem

idk what's going on with that

[rare fractal]

Underwater NV does indeed suck

[limber hull]

my NV looks sick underwater

[rare fractal]

That’s a NV issue tho, not a beipi issue

[limber hull]

beipi has the coolest NV I love it

[amber cosmos]

its both, deino NV is fine underwater

[rare fractal]

Gives me headaches

Not as bad as pointillism NV back in U5 but yknow

[limber hull]

i still actually liked the line NV and miss it so

[rare fractal]

Made the game unplayable for me

[polar shore]

Elder Hypsi that cant jump...or an elder Spino that cant leave the water because his sail is sore. Gtfo LMAO I can't get over this choosing die or just live forever thing

[rare fractal]

Which is why I don’t play beipi

[limber hull]

i very much doubt that's happening

[rare fractal]

You literally made both of those drawbacks up entirely

[amber cosmos]

im honestly fine with it but it should take forever like literally a week of playtime on a dino

[limber hull]

most dinos don't even live for 24 hours of playtime lol

[amber cosmos]

the elder thing anyway

[amber cosmos]

i mean sounds like a you problem or an official no rules problem to be fair

most of the time i kill my dinos out of boredom by running off suicide rock in SE

[urban flax]

The Isle update 10 patch notes :
-Every useless dinosaur removed from the game
-Remaining playable species : rex

[amber cosmos]

nah remove rex and keep hypsi

[rare fractal]

At least it’d probably be wel balanced

[polar shore]

I wasn't being literal on that lol just saying getting old and dusty but not dying is odd

[limber hull]

if you remove all the smallest animals, then you have new useless smalls

[polar shore]

Yeah that's what I'm thinking

[rare fractal]

Add it to the enormous list of things in this game that don’t align with reality

[limber hull]

basically every small tier you removed is replaced by the new small tier, until we end up with small tier paras vs apex tier rexes

and then paras are removed because they're useless herbis that no one plays

[urban flax]

The Isle update 11 :
-Removed rex because being the smallest creature, it was useless

[rare fractal]

Update 12 is just a title screen

[amber cosmos]

facts like how they are making Allo an ambusher when it hunts more like a endurance hunter like modern wolves that chase prey for miles then bleed them to death from a safe distance lol

[limber hull]

update 12 is humans vs a bunch of AI dinos, clearly what everyone wants

[amber cosmos]

i honestly think when humans come in the game will either die or go full cod lol

[urban flax]

The carcinization in videogames is every game slowly evolving into Ark

[limber hull]

i assume they're doing that because otherwise it's literally just bigger omni

that being said, allo has a very fast looking trot, so it's possible it can still endurance hunt bigger animals like stego

[rare fractal]

I genuinely don’t care all that much about what the animals habits were irl. That’s not an issue for me, especially since none of these animals are the same animals as the real ones..
We’re also mashing together dozens of animals that never coexisted into one tiny island, they have to be changed

Like I don’t say “add it to the list” in some sort of derogatory sense

[limber hull]

This trot looks more than capable of endurance hunting, man's got a STRIDE
https://youtu.be/aTnXdFgGPHY?t=46

[amber cosmos]

thats great but you also i think can understand that this is the closest thing dino enthusiasts have gotten to a good dino game that doesnt look like disney made it

[rare fractal]

I’m not sure that matters, at all

[amber cosmos]

everyone that complains about realism it matters too

[limber hull]

no, but it does look like universal made it (because it's literally based off Jurassic Park)

[rare fractal]

That’s not an important qualifier, these aren’t the real life animals

The game is literally set in the modern era

They were generated by a godlike toaster

One of the animals controls the weather

[limber hull]

most of the animals are heavily changed for gameplay, in fact, most are

the most true to life thing here is probably deinosuchus tbh

[amber cosmos]

your completely missing the point, i stated that this game is the closest people like me are going to get to a game that is close to rl for dinos

[limber hull]

alright

saurian exists

[rare fractal]

I’m not missing your point, I don’t think that’s a good point tho

[barren crater]

Allo being an ambusher also makes it good solo lol

[amber cosmos]

saurian fake game go away

[rare fractal]

Because that’s not something this game is concerned with

[limber hull]

yep

[amber cosmos]

how it will use bleed to kill, and if it doesnt thats another thing to be annoyed about lol

[limber hull]

it's also actually built to be a decent ambusher unlike a very specific dinosaur who lives in plains and is also given the role

[limber hull]

it's got a goddamn grab, it grabs the thing and kills it

[barren crater]

Allo can hunt in all ranges from the concept it seems. Ambushing smaller / similar sized creatures, endurance hunting larger ones

[amber cosmos]

bro everything has a grab for stuff small enough, it just does it with its arms instead of its mouth

[limber hull]

it can pin and grab cerato

[wispy jackal]

I hope Allo isnt as bad as it was in legacy and by bad I mean, too good that it could hunt anything in groups

[barren crater]

Bleed + fast trot is enough to run things down, nevermind allos likely fast speed

[amber cosmos]

ok and omni can pin omni and smaller, i am missing your point

[barren crater]

It could also have good regen so

[barren crater]

Will likely be the case

[limber hull]

given that it's a generalist, it's either going to be very good or very very bad

generalists were nuts in legacy, but in EVRIMA, generalists (like teno) tend to be left behind with the influx of more unique style of fighting

[polar shore]

Honestly it's a shame cause it's like people seem so happy with so little when it comes to some stuff with this game

[wispy jackal]

so long as something comes in that can contest an allo and keep it in line, that'll be fine

[barren crater]

Alberto will thankfully

[wispy jackal]

it was just nearly as overplayed as apexes in legacy which drove me insane

[limber hull]

alberto, yea, although i feel that's being designed more as a brawler?

[barren crater]

They can counter each other

Yeah pretty much

[limber hull]

alberto is basically the exact same size as allo, so they're basically perfect rivals

[wispy jackal]

Hoping the diablo is gunna be able to take it down tbh

[limber hull]

ehhh

[barren crater]

Ah

[limber hull]

diablo's probably not gonna be that

since it's been downsized

[wispy jackal]

whys everyone in here so against herbis fighting and holding their own lol

[barren crater]

Diablo is like half their size

It's not that

[wispy jackal]

ew lame

[rare fractal]

Dibble will probably be more than capable of defending against one alone

[urban flax]

Because herbis must eat grass and die

[rare fractal]

But…taking one down?

[limber hull]

that'd be cool, i just don't know

[rare fractal]

Unless Alberto is just…..slow

[barren crater]

It's that Diablo is small. It's asking too much to stop Allo / Alberto numbers

[wispy jackal]

ofc what else are they here for but meals for carnis

[rare fractal]

It’ll have to

[wispy jackal]

then we need a herbi that can idk what roster they have planned and what things sizes are

[amber cosmos]

alberto is post to be fast but low stam

[urban flax]

Just like irl

[wispy jackal]

dibble just could in legacy, hence my example

[limber hull]

don't misinterpret me, i'm teno and pachy's biggest advocate right now, but dibble just isn't oversized. It's like how cera lost a few tons post-legacy, since it could actually have stats that reflect it better without being grossly oversized

[amber cosmos]

@wispy jackal also when all is said and done i think herbies will dominate carnis in this game

[urban flax]

Styraco might take the role of an allo-alberto killer

[wispy jackal]

I just see little point in herbis that cant fight and the devs keep trying to make them redundant and all you guys think that they shouldnt fight half the time, its infuriating

styraco confirmed? good

[barren crater]

I've never been against herbis being strong / defending themselves

[amber cosmos]

well it can try atleast :p

[limber hull]

styraco should obliterate them lol

[barren crater]

I want Stego to beat Rex 😭

[limber hull]

dude same

[amber cosmos]

gross

[wispy jackal]

i want rexes dead

[amber cosmos]

stego beating rex is just nasty and i hate yall for saying it

[limber hull]

if stego can't run, it's gotta fight

[barren crater]

It's literally faster

[amber cosmos]

yeah fight and die its a rex lol

[limber hull]

and stego can't run

[barren crater]

And can likely delete it in an ambush

[limber hull]

that's literally just removing stego from the game effectively

[wispy jackal]

fair, I didnt know they were changing the size of dibble, if Styraco is confirmed then that should be able to destroy an allo, im just sick of carnivores being the only thing permitted to fight looool

[barren crater]

If a Rex is just walking up to a Stego, it deserves to die

[amber cosmos]

sounds like stego needs a diet

[limber hull]

if stego has zero way to survive a rex, it's essentially removed

[urban flax]

I would like stego to not beat rex but make it run away instead, but due to how isle players tend to always fight to the death that's probably not gonna happen
So yeah... Stego beats rex

[barren crater]

Brawl it, use your skill to overcome it. But it shouldn't be a guarantee

[wispy jackal]

if you cant run then you should be able to defend yourself imo

[amber cosmos]

if rex cant even kill a stego why play rex? lol

[barren crater]

Like ambush > cripple. Dead Stego

[fleet hound]

true

[limber hull]

it can, it shouldn't be guaranteed it

[barren crater]

Who said Rex shouldn't?

[limber hull]

stego should be ALLOWED to kill rex, rex should be allowed to kill stego, neither should win 100% of the time

[barren crater]

It's like you're ignoring actual skill instead of steam rolling something

[urban flax]

Good stego kills bad rex
Good rex kills bad stego
That's the law of nature

[wispy jackal]

stego shouldnt be an easy takedown, dudes covered in spikes on his back and has a spiked whip tail

[limber hull]

good

[amber cosmos]

i dont want to steam roll but if stego can beat rex might as well let para beat rex

[cyan flame]

Being able to fight back and win does not mean "can't be killed/will never die", it just means that your option to survive the encounter is fight, instead of flight.

[barren crater]

They're not even the same

[amber cosmos]

they are in the same weight class

[urban flax]

Apexes should be the most skill-reliant animals

[barren crater]

So should Kentro die the moment an Alberto sees it?

[limber hull]

how are those two remotely comparable

[barren crater]

Or Allo?

[amber cosmos]

from what ive seen it wont as carno doesnt even mess with it

[cyan flame]

Except para is a bit better made for running, and lacks a bit more weaponry, so it's fine if para can run. And if they do make stego run, that's fine too, even if I would personally prefer stego fighting

[barren crater]

There's a good reason. Spikes. Stego has it as well. Even longer ones on its tail

[cyan flame]

It's just that people don't really look at stego and think "Ah yes, this critter is clearly meant to run away from everything" :p

[amber cosmos]

size, weight, believe it or not paras also arent just food for carnis they have claws and stuff too and actively killed predators

[wispy jackal]

pls dont let para be a walking meal on wheels again ;___;

[limber hull]

carno is significantly smaller than alberto

[cyan flame]

But the devs could just decide to up stego speed and stamina and all and call it a day, as long as it makes stego viable, it works :p

[urban flax]

"stego should be hiding from rex"
Yeah, HIDING

[barren crater]

Kentro is 1.4t, Alberto is 3 - 3.4t

[amber cosmos]

yeah my problem with it is the hit box is on the whole tail instead of just the tip

[limber hull]

para's little claws on its tiny arms are nothing compared to a massive thagomizer

[cyan flame]

Hopefully we get a good para, though in comparison to stego, I'd argue para is far more of a runner than a fighter :p

[amber cosmos]

to be fair in this game the spikes arent even what kills you its the tip of the tail lol

[urban flax]

He's got a point tho, para should be able to kill some predators

[cyan flame]

Sure, if we go with full on biome locks, that works too I guess xD

[wispy jackal]

which is fine but old para couldnt even RUN T_T

[cyan flame]

Original survival para was fine, then someone took an issue with it, and we got the current one xD

[wispy jackal]

Ill defend para till i die, best hadro

[barren crater]

Maia >
but anyways

[amber cosmos]

ok and? kentro is literally dino porcupine even lions dont mess with them without getting messed up

[urban flax]

Where can we biome-lock a rex so that it never sees a stego, a plains animal xD
Rex will be coastal and die instantly if it touches grass

[wispy jackal]

maia also good but para is king

[barren crater]

Fair

[amber cosmos]

facts i honestly hate that people want para just to die its so dumb lol

[wispy jackal]

I want maia to keep its bright tail :) its so silly

[cyan flame]

No idea honestly, but at least in theory it might work, except we have migrations so maybe not xD

[wispy jackal]

PREACH!!! let it be GOOD

[cyan flame]

Maia is dumb, it's like allo, just... generic critter!

[wispy jackal]

I want it to honk so loud it staggers and disorients those that are close enough so it can run away if it needs too........ and has a decent swim/wade speed

allo is super generic

[amber cosmos]

disagree if they added iguanadon and you were talking about that id agree with you lol

[barren crater]

Nothing wrong with generic.

Simple fun

[cyan flame]

Fair enough!

[amber cosmos]

i want it to play like a big ass teno with a buff call like galli

[barren crater]

Also Evrima creatures can be made unique enough 😄

[limber hull]

stego can be made unique enough that it makes rex not just bumrush it on sight

god forbid

[amber cosmos]

i mean that would be dumb but im just trying to figure out how rex will get a bite off without getting stuck on it and wrecked by it since dinos are colliable now and i imagine rex isnt going to have great mobility

[wispy jackal]

yes and maybe give it a sort of tackle thing........ bro is big and hefty

[urban flax]

Well rex WILL bumrush stego on sight, no matter what
The idea is that it doesn't get rewarded for it

[limber hull]

rex has great trotrate and sprint, we know that, so the mobility is there

[urban flax]

Nothing should be rewarded for bumrushing a stego
Just like nothing should be rewarded for charging a trike head-on

[amber cosmos]

i mean the ability to turn

so like run in bite the head and turn out

[limber hull]

i do hope the turn is a little laboured

[amber cosmos]

i imagine it will be

so i cant figure out how rex will be able to kill stego without dying itself as rex will probably be around the same weight as current deino or maybe just a bit bigger meaning similiar hp pools meanwhile stego is getting a buff or new move set just to fight it lol

well actually i take that back it will be able to stay on stegos head alot easier then deino so maybe it wont matter

[limber hull]

idk, rex might very possibly be bigger and heavier than deino

[amber cosmos]

i dunno the model looks small too me

well not small but not big either

[sudden arrow]

The deino first appeared small

But in game is much bigger

[amber cosmos]

yes but we have seen rex literally last week on twitch streams being worked on

[limber hull]

the model in the amarok stream wasn't properly set up iirc

kept changing from big to small when it moved

amarok said it wasn't the right size, it was too small

[amber cosmos]

hmm ok

i dunno 10ton rex would be dope

specially if they up stego to 8 ton

[sudden arrow]

Most likely it will be bigger than deino

And stego

[limber hull]

10 ton rex is very possible

[amber cosmos]

could always hope for the best and get 14ton rex lol

that would be busted though

[barren crater]

Would need to move at a snails pace at that size

[amber cosmos]

25mph is a snails pace humans can outrun it while sprinting

[limber hull]

literally shant sized

[barren crater]

25mph???

[amber cosmos]

yeah thats how fast rex is thought to have been as adult

with a 3 to 5 mph trot

[barren crater]

Km not mph

An adult Rex is not running at 40km/h

[amber cosmos]

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/new-study-finds-that-t-rex-walked-at-slow-pace-of-3-miles-per-hour-180977572/

30 my bad

some even think https://www.livescience.com/t-rex-slow-walker-tail.html it could be as slow as 10 mph running but i dont think it could kill anything if it was that slow

[limber hull]

scientists like nerfing rex only to realise that it was probably as OP as they thought lol

remember "rex was purely a scavenger"?

[barren crater]

Rex was definitely not 30mph

That’s like Carno speed estimate range

[amber cosmos]

i mean true but they are basing this simply on its bone structure and the weight of the creature and think its bones would have suffered stress fractures or even shattered if it went above 30mph

[urban flax]

That was made by a guy who then admitted he just genuinely hated rex

[amber cosmos]

are you crazy lol

[limber hull]

yea i know

[limber hull]

30 miles per hour is pretty close to carno speed tbh

in fact, carno was estimated to sprint at around 30 miles/hr

[amber cosmos]

its estimated at 30-35 rex goes all the way from 10 to 25 lol

10mph difference is a big difference in speed def can notice if racing

[barren crater]

How so? 48km/h is close to carnos speed estimates. Might even make the range

[rare fractal]

Hi bird!

[amber cosmos]

a rex would never catch a carno 10mph is not close in a race

specially a foot race these arent cars

you ever race someone 1mph faster then you? you can tell just by racing them

[barren crater]

Yo

I’m so confused now

[rare fractal]

that's all I came to say, I have nothing more to contribute

[barren crater]

Idk what’s happening anymore 😭

[barren crater]

👋

[rare fractal]

Wait was the argument that rex and carno were close in speed irl?

Or what am I missing

Because yeah rex was an alarmingly speedy chungus

[amber cosmos]

the arguement is more so that 10mph difference in speed for living animals is a big difference in speed for me

[rare fractal]

Well, it is

It's not THAT big considering the size disparity of these animals tho

Like rex potentially even being half of carnos estimated speed is nuts

But at this point I'm confused why irl speeds matter

we have a whole paleo channel for that kind of thing

[amber cosmos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlwOhUKRibs

go to 15 secs

[amber cosmos]

it just kinda got brought up

[barren zephyr]

no they can't

[amber cosmos]

the avg human out of shape and all sprint speed is 15mph on avg, the avg athlete is 18-27 mph, so yes a human could outrun it

[barren zephyr]

no human can run faster than 25mph for long enough to outrun something

[rare fractal]

That's also like

the top 1% of humanity

[amber cosmos]

First point, I said humans can reach 27 mph, they can and have. Second point, I also said while sprinting

Also while nobody has done it yet the human body is built to run upto 40mph

[sudden arrow]

I’ve done it , when nobody was watching

[amber cosmos]

Lol

[barren zephyr]

first point I said, second point "for long enough" 40mph for 5 seconds won't get u away from angry beast

[sick crescent]

@summer thistle that used to exist

we have no idea why it vanished one day

[sick crescent]

@limber hull you disagree with unofficials setting their own growth?

[barren zephyr]

I do

[fleet hound]

really? where have read this?

[oblique crown]

Remember things on camera appear slower than they actually are

[fleet hound]

Shouldn't running up hill and through various terrain types impact how fast you can run, or force you to walk, trudge through an environment?

[sick crescent]

35-40, yes

However, that is absolutely pushing it

Humans could get an adrenaline mechanic that makes them run faster, sure, but definitely not over 48 kmh

[gleaming silo]

Yeh

it is

[jaunty basin]

Hi boys & girls

I'm currently working on a smoll project for a Discord bot. The main goal is to track the growth of our group and let your friends on Discord see the progress. I'm super enthusiastic about it, and I'd love to hear your suggestions to make it even more amazing! So, if you've got any creative ideas, feel free to share them with me. 😄

[barren zephyr]

@proven ore you aren't supposed to eat while in the open, get some cover. Make sure you are safe before you start stuffing your face. Camera lock is a good feature for forcing players to observe their surroundings more, it discourages afk playing.

[proven ore]

"it discourages afk playing" no one is AFK while eating and being able to look around means ppl pay way more attention to the game.
"Make sure you are safe before you start stuffing your face" is impossible for drinking and with food it is also impossible for herbis. For carnis it is only somewhat possible since a kill can be quite far away from any cover, making it super annoying to drag a body for a minute (Other dinos can also still smell it and run up behind u, even if u ckecked if it is safe).
"Camera lock is a good feature for forcing players to observe their surroundings more" literally impossible since the camera is locked or you stop between every bite which is definitly not a fun mechanic.

[sudden arrow]

Yeah what do you mean afk playing ?

[barren zephyr]

there are many players who are on autopilot and don't pay attention to game

they are barely more than AI

[proven ore]

well then you can ambush those people quite easily since they don't move around anyways, making the camera lock useless :)

[humble pollen]

i agree with dusk, nigel you are disagreeing and downvoting anything that doesnt have to do with deinos or if it will affect their gameplay

[barren zephyr]

Whenever you play you should be looking 360 around yourself at all times, track all sounds, look at every bush and rock. Your own fault if you die while eating because you didn't see someone 10m away

[barren zephyr]

I disagree and downvote anything that's stupid

game is't supposed to be that easy

[humble pollen]

just the truth but im not gonna sit and argue again its boring, bye

[barren zephyr]

bye 🙂

[proven ore]

Ok i actually just don't get you... YOU CAN'T LOOK AROUND WITH CAMERA LOCK. The camera being locked means a carnis can run up from behind and get a free kill, making the game easy and giving u an unearned kill

[barren zephyr]

OMG LOOK BEFORE YOU COMMIT TO EATING OR DRINKING

[limber hull]

^

[proven ore]

Dude you can check around sure but a dino can run up in no time

[barren zephyr]

you shouldn't be eating when there is nasty monster behind you

[limber hull]

i enjoy locked cam, personally, means i actually need to think about where and when I eat my meals

[proven ore]

oh well if you actually think getting free kills because the dino eating can't turn its head then fine, i agree with clapper and will not argue about it

[barren zephyr]

yes, it's good feature. Can't just be lazy and eat whenever. Either make sure it's all clear or flip that you won't die.

[limber hull]

the kills aren't free though

this feature has rarely ever killed me

imho, it's made hunts more dynamic, where it creates openings in otherwise impenetrable awareness

Like it's very hard to sneak up most of the time, because dinosaurs don't have to move their neck or bodies, they have complete 360 cam movement freely

[barren zephyr]

and the map has very few places where you can follow something without being seen

[brittle ermine]

Thoughts on muh post?

[sudden arrow]

Hmm Idk cam lock to me is kinda stupid , certain Dino’s can’t move bodies so you stuck where you killed the dino at

And also you can look around but who’s to say a Dino can’t run up in that time frame or right after

And if you want to ambush something why not hide in a bush why you gotta necessarily do it while they eating

[barren zephyr]

Nobody lives forever, removing opportunities to kill creatures would turn this game into another walking simulator. This dime its dino themed.

Plus you always have opportunity to grab a piece and then run away 3m and eat it there

[brittle ermine]

Why don't you like my idea then, it doesn't remove the opportunity to kill. It just adds some skill and pre-thought to the process.

[barren zephyr]

If you take away ability to see stuff above water from deino then the amount of successful hunts will decrease by 99%. Rn the only way to catch a drinker is to spot it approaching river and shift swim to it, if you hit lunge then pray you still have enough stam left to drown it. 350 hours of deino gameplay and I have only one time been lucky enough to be directly under someone. If you force deinos to poke up their head most players will spot it and again 99% reduction in kills. There has to be a better way, but only poking eyes above water would be cool for roleplay and such.

[amber cosmos]

i dont mind the locked camera i just wish it wasnt so jank, most the time i get stuck looking either all the way to the right or left and cant look infront of me

[sudden arrow]

catching someone eating isnt the only way to kill someone

[barren zephyr]

idk, I can move camera 60-70 degrees in front of me while eating

[sudden arrow]

the game is already meant for you to die

having cam lock is just idk

[barren zephyr]

I have never gotten a kill on someone because they were eating.

[sudden arrow]

So why u agaisnt the suggestion so bad

[amber cosmos]

i think it should be camera locked to 90% off the shoulders of your creature

other then that i dont think its a bad feature thats just what my thoughts are on it

[barren zephyr]

Because you are supposed to be looking at your food while you munch on it not your tail

[sudden arrow]

you supposed to look around you

but u cant

[barren zephyr]

they could increase the angle to 120 degrees in fornt of you, anything more would be cringe

[sudden arrow]

I doubt an animal or a dino just stands still and eats not looking around

[barren zephyr]

you are supposed to look around before you eat

[sudden arrow]

it just doesnt make sense

[amber cosmos]

i think 120 would be a bit much

[barren zephyr]

most creatures have eyes on their side, they could prolly see somewhere around 220 degrees

[amber cosmos]

well when they are munching on a body all they can see is the body, when i dont feel like im in a good spot to eat i just hit g and take my time with chunks while looking around

[sudden arrow]

same i never eat for that exact reason

cause i hate cam lock

also i only eat organs

[brittle ermine]

Where are you getting 99%? Just seems very arbitrary.

You should be using cover from foliage around water zones found in gateway.

As it is now, there is no counterplay to being lunged besides never going to certain water areas at all (which is bad for both deino and the prey). Or just being unlucky that a deino was there to pick you off.

[amber cosmos]

yeah same i eat organs and leave the body for my bros lol

[barren zephyr]

I hated stegos, then I just accepted how strong they are and play around it, not every feature should be easy for you.

[sudden arrow]

organs also give the most nutrients

[barren zephyr]

life is always about luck, I don't see why that's a problem

you can't give a counterplay to the single ability deino has to get food

[amber cosmos]

yeah a lung from an adult cerato gives 60% food to cerato as well its kinda nuts

[amber cosmos]

id say the counter play is to learn the map and drink where they arent but thats just me

[brittle ermine]

This is a game that is meant to be enjoyable. If the game is luck based then it inherently becomes luck based fun. Which is bad.

Everything absolutely should have counterplay. Should deino be auto doomed to spino players just because it exsists?

[sudden arrow]

yeah i agree deino shouldnt be able to see the top of the water underwater

[barren zephyr]

that's fair yes

[sudden arrow]

they use sense to know when something is drinking or the slighest change in water alerts them

[barren zephyr]

you have the wors opinions I have seen in a while

[amber cosmos]

that literally makes no sense they have eyelids designed just for that purpose

[barren zephyr]

what sense?

[sudden arrow]

they have like a million sensors

they can detect the slighest change in water

you think irl a croc can see the top of the water from underwater ?

[brittle ermine]

Eyelids. As in they need their eyes to be above water.

Not submerged...

[barren zephyr]

yes they can, but irl animals are so dumb they can spot an alligator and won't run away because they don't immediately recognize it

[proud coral]

Being unable to see above water without exposing yourself just means the Deino has to actually use it's other senses to find prey. You can literally detect people swimming or drinking

[sudden arrow]

exactly

[proud coral]

It'd be even better if given an idle that only exposed it's head

[sudden arrow]

i mean go look at the votes

[brittle ermine]

Or just hide behind some water grass..

[proud coral]

That too. Water debris may exist in the future

[amber cosmos]

no they do not, they have a lense that covers their eyes and protects them from the water as well as clearing their vision while underwater

[barren zephyr]

most drinkers never touch water so it does not toggle the blue dots, they also have a range of around 10m

[amber cosmos]

yes they can

[proud coral]

That sounds more like water sense could use some tweaking then, which we know eventually it will since the VFX are temporary thank god

[brittle ermine]

Well that's fine, the game isn't realistic anyway and shoudn't try to be.

[sudden arrow]

bruh

[amber cosmos]

yall literally just dumb if you want deinos to be blind when underwater

[barren zephyr]

idk, my latest suggestion got over 50 yes and 2 no

[sudden arrow]

does that suggestion have any thing to do wit deino ?

[barren zephyr]

yes, yes it does

[sudden arrow]

what did u suggest

[barren zephyr]

go look at it

[sudden arrow]

ion feel like scrolling up

[barren zephyr]

there is a fking search box

[amber cosmos]

feel like half of yall suggesting nerfs to deino die to them crossing the river at center all day then complain cause you didnt use your head to go somewhere shallow to cross

[barren zephyr]

yesterday a carno saw me chilling above water and he decided he gonna cross next to me

[amber cosmos]

yeah i bet he complains about deino too

[barren zephyr]

nah, I didn't kill him

[amber cosmos]

you could literally play this game and never even touch or be touched by a croc if you just learned the map

the amount of cope for deino is real

[barren zephyr]

They splash around, are huge and gather in 3 spots on the map

literally skill issue to die to one

[amber cosmos]

facts

[urban flax]

If you consider that the only counterplay to deino being never, ever seeing one is fine then idk what to say...
Do you find it interesting and engaging, playing as a deino and never see anyone because people know their only chance at survival is drinking where there can't possibly be a deino ?

[sudden arrow]

the most op dino

dying to it is a skill issue lol

[brittle ermine]

^

[barren zephyr]

? I see 10 morbillion creatures every day, I sometimes give them food

[sudden arrow]

great suggestion the votes speak for its self

[amber cosmos]

dude i dont expect people to feed me for game balance i expect them to do what they need to to survive lol

[cyan flame]

I guess we'll find out on gateway, with lakes where deinos are more or less incapable of being in, and see how it goes for them there xD

[urban flax]

And you consider that the only way of doing so is not interacting with a certain animal at all is fine ?
Everything else is designed to either be able to hide, outrun or fight potential predators, so you can always encounter something dangerous and survive if you meet one.
Bar deino

[cyan flame]

It's fine to apply that as the solution, but it is quite the boring one and risks making it impossible for the thing everyone avoids to survive if they can just not ever have to interact with it at all

[sudden arrow]

deino players just like to be op lol

like they already are

[barren zephyr]

deino has 0 counterplay agains other deinos KEKW

[cyan flame]

Given sufficient "safe spots", why would deinos ever interact with something

[urban flax]

That's a problem with all mirror match-ups dude

[barren zephyr]

ye but deino only has one enemy and it can't do nothing against it

[urban flax]

boohoo

[amber cosmos]

here is my stance on deino, 100% avoidable if your in NW part of the map, if your at center id say 75% avoidable cause if you need to cross there is only a few shallow spots but they could still possible get you there, swamp 100% avoidable as there are two shallow drinking spots where you can block them with trees and if you need to cross you can go through the middle of the swamp and go past the damn. and south is honestly 50% cause when you cross to go to nesting grounds they could grab you easy but there is a spot to drink

[barren zephyr]

the waterfall between NW and center has a glitch spot for 100% safe drinking

[amber cosmos]

if you want to interact with a animal that can one shot you then you come complain about your own decision it makes you look ridiculous

[barren zephyr]

unless some other creature jumps you

[amber cosmos]

facts

[cyan flame]

Because we should consider glitches when talking balance, obviously

[sudden arrow]

right lol

[urban flax]

You don't get my point
Interacting doesn't necessarily mean going in front of it and 2-calling it

[amber cosmos]

not only that if you go past storm drain there is another river through the tree line with a rock archway that is super shallow to drink at

[barren zephyr]

Wait for the new map before you cook some nasty stuff

[cyan flame]

I wasn't talking to you

[amber cosmos]

no your missing my point, its a survival game and your responsible for your own choices, you making a bad decision doesnt mean something should be nerfed

[barren zephyr]

free chat

[urban flax]

Running away from a predator is an interaction (that you can't have with deino)
Hiding is an interaction (that you can't have with deino)
Watching out for an ambush and avoiding it is an interaction (that you can't have with deino)
Fighting back is an interaction (that you can't have with deino)

[cyan flame]

And no, because even with new map, deino is inherently a questionable critter, and the solution of "just do not interact" is not good, and not even viable with deino because the end result of "everyone drinks at swamp" or whatever spot you'd prefer, means no deino ever gets a kill

[urban flax]

And right now the "bad decision" is drinking in water that is slightly too deep, and resulting in instantaneous death. That's fine for you ?

[cyan flame]

So then you'd have deinos be entirely unviable, or remain op, unless you adjust them in some other manner

[amber cosmos]

you can literally avoid the ambush of a deino

[amber cosmos]

yes

[urban flax]

Only by drinking where there are no deinos

[amber cosmos]

because i for one dont drink from those spots as its dumb

[urban flax]

So you're "avoiding" an ambush that doesn't exist

[brittle ermine]

By avoiding parts of the map. That's a bad reason.

[barren zephyr]

maybe don't just walk up to river, hide and listen for a minute, you will 100% find deinos if you just listen

[cyan flame]

Then maybe we should return the "shallows"? :p

[urban flax]

If they have a braincell they won't make noise

[cyan flame]

Was nice to have an entire part of the map where deinos just couldn't really be

[amber cosmos]

yall cope so hard over having to walk a few mins in game to get safe water when their are spots on every part of the map

[barren zephyr]

they always do

[sudden arrow]

deinos also dont make noise when speaking like other dinos do

what deino sits there 1 calling and making noise

[urban flax]

You can't try to make me believe that, I played deino

[amber cosmos]

thats literally a thing coming to gateway nerd

[cyan flame]

@urban flaxMaybe we should try out shallows again, see how well it goes for the deinos xD

[barren zephyr]

cannibals

[urban flax]

bring back oasis

[cyan flame]

No, no it's not. Not far as I know, but maybe you don't know what I'm referring to.

[cyan flame]

Oh yes, that too!

Get a few good "oasis" spots and no need to worry about deinos ever again

[proud coral]

The whole being unable to see above water thing to me sounds cool more because it'd make gameplay of it actually interesting for once. Even as a Deino, it's kinda lame being completely invisible AND being able to just.....right click stuff and win. There's no sense of skill or reward.

[amber cosmos]

they are bringing lakes that arent connected to rivers which means unless a dino wants to go there young and get trapped in the lake until it dies it cant get there without dying of thirst

[cyan flame]

I'm sure the deino players will enjoy only ever seeing other deinos

[sudden arrow]

Cant believe u think cam lock should be a thing , but deino gets 360 vision of the map while submerged underwater

[cyan flame]

That's not the same thing at all

[urban flax]

But suddendly it won't be fine anymore

[barren zephyr]

I disagree

[barren zephyr]

deino also has cam lock

[cyan flame]

Of course not, but for some reason no one seems to think of what would happen if people did apply the whole "only drink in these few deino free spots"

[urban flax]

It should come with the ability of being able to stick only its head out of the water tbh

[amber cosmos]

dude have your oasis there will still be morons going to deep water to drink, yall have drinking spots now and dont use them why do you think it would somehow change anything LMAO

[proud coral]

Definitely. I'd like that regardless honestly

[urban flax]

I want it to change because it's lame and boring