A vote on whether to ban AI in support channels

[bleak dome]

I'll share my opinion on this, if an user is looking for support here it probably means they are not looking for an AI response, they could have asked the AI itself

now this considered, if a person providing support wants to use LLM to inform themselves it's fine as long as they check the source, but as far as I'm concerned, copypasting from LLM should not be allowed

[vivid kayak]

it just falls under low effort help generally which should be punished regardless of whether it is AI or not

[bleak badger]

Used ChatGPT in Senior year of High School to code scripts in a Unity game because I had no idea how to use C# and only knew how to use C++.

Never was able to debug the code it spit out with or without the help of ChatGPT.

[hidden needle]

Or they are gonna spread misinformation and give bad advice

[slate leaf]

who was pasting ai answers

[glacial scarab]

yelling at the clouds are you not

[west trench]

it is evil, it burnt my toast

[untold wharf]

Thanks for proving my point.

[fallen fulcrum]

ⵣ Crystal ⵣ received a thank you cookie!

[vale tulip]

sounds like a you problem

[radiant token]

, social stigma around clearly AI-generated responses will probably be apt

[west trench]

ai is the same

[glad grove]

ai sabotages people asking for help too, and carries the risk of causing someone to potentially BRICK their devices

[forest steeple]

the point being ?....

[lavish elbow]

any purpose?

[odd pond]

i think its more of "i use ai and its ok, to agree with its ban means that goes agaisnt what i believe"

[grave phoenix]

to search through obscure decade old forum for my solution in 20seconds instead of me doing it myself in 3hours

[vivid kayak]

BRICK their devices omg!!!

[dense halo]

I had no idea how to use C# and only knew how to use C#.
✍️🔥

[slate leaf]

sudo apt update

[vivid kayak]

you know you can't really brick your device

with any sort of code

[untold wharf]

Did you actually read what I said? Clearly not

[tropic panther]

I’m okay with not having LLM answers, but a total ban is stupid.
If someone uses AI to help with phrasing or translations (keep in mind not everyone is English) that’s banned under “all contexts”

[ivory lagoon]

Came from me not liking AI brainrot memes and suggesting banning them

Now mods repurposed the thread to be about support

[vivid kayak]

like it's actually impossible

[glad grove]

it obviously depends on the support needed ofc

[haughty hill]

in my case when i first installed arch, i installed grub but forgot to follow the "configuration" section since i probably thought that was just for further customisation, so it's not quite that simple

[agile hamlet]

idk how this is even an argument, whats the point of asking people if u want ai and like it just sounds like everyone is taking this as banning AI completely even tho thats literally not the point of this thread

[tender sorrel]

meow

[umbral condor]

Wouldn't that create a situation where a person wouldn't be able to get help because AI introduced another issue? Or potentially haven't done anything to better or worsen the problem

[west trench]

your wrong

[bleak badger]

C++ mb

[dense halo]

ai slop ban this guy

[paper shuttle]

Not true! Lol.

[rough heath]

I mean on this server specifically

[agile hamlet]

what

[paper shuttle]

Oh boy not true.

[tender sorrel]

okiiiiiiii

[odd wasp]

Why didn't u censor a*t

[west trench]

ubuntu 17.10 bricked bioses, windows 365, all it takes is breaking uefi

[radiant token]

yeah pretty much

[vivid kayak]

ok unless you have a commodore pet or something

[slate leaf]

holy hell the mods hijacked and changed a thread

[hollow dew]

/ban johnny

-# ||/j||

[slate leaf]

thats crazy tbh

[forest steeple]

neither did you x),you asked an llm to generate a vague argument

[vivid kayak]

but writing Python or C++ you will not brick your device trust me

[magic path]

early 2010s uefi implantations: 👋

[west trench]

lenovo laptop actually

[forest steeple]

and i actually did read it

[coarse thunder]

Ppl got kicked out of my uni for doing this 💀

[rough heath]

Yeah like what

What do you want to use AI for, on this server

[odd pond]

"20 seconds" 🥀 takes me 7 seconds without llms

[lavish elbow]

either way yeah that's what I think in the end

banning AI entirely would be one of the steps towards a tinfoil community

if you're afraid of AI replacing you, then whatever you have to give back is so bland and unoriginal that AI is able to replicate you

be better

[untold wharf]

In what way was my argument vague?

[west trench]

rm -rf / can brick some lenovo laptops

[vivid kayak]

ok i mean like a modern computer not a 2010 laptop that can barely turn on

[glad grove]

what
im talking about support not vibecoding
imagine you're new and you ask chatgpt about some vital component and it just tells you to do something irreversible and you end up bricking your system

[manic reef]

You were able to (see: the entire history of computing before GPT) you just didnt want to take the time to learn to 😌

[hidden needle]

Tinfoil community ❤️

[dense halo]

what...

[shadow forum]

I thought it was about banning the mention of AI usage itself? that's why I voted no atleast

[paper shuttle]

Unless it has in-line assembly, then yeah, no.

[lavish elbow]

i love making fun of ai with my friends time to time lmao

[hoary burrow]

then ask the ai directly oh my god

[dense halo]

whats your point...

[west trench]

desktops from 2010s are wonky too

[hidden needle]

Efi vars mounted badly and wiped

[light gazelle]

I hate ai, however it could be used to help people parse documentation that's not in their native language, is a total ban really necessary or am I misunderstanding what the vote is about? Yes, translate exists but it tends to fuck up some terms at least in my native language so I'd see why a LLM would also be used to translate stuff. (thank god I'm fluent in English)

[vale tulip]

tell that to artists whose art is fully replicable by ai

[vivid kayak]

inline assembly will at most just hang anything non-ancient

[rough heath]

But what on this server

[lavish elbow]

the mods are being the classic arch linux server mods and changing the topic on the fly

[hollow dew]

The mods hijacked this into support, not memes

[untold wharf]

It was a quite clear concise multi-paragraph statement on why this is a bad idea that went into pretty good detail including pointing out that AI generated text indicators are unreliable and how moderation should focus on what was said and it's accuracy rather than what its point of origin is and you turned right around and proved my point 😂😂😂

[shadow forum]

this is also what I was wondering about

[coarse thunder]

I mean in the short term it won't replace high-skilled workers
sure as hell won't stop companies from trying though

[vivid kayak]

if you are on a pentium well tough luck

[west trench]

you can brick devices with bash

[slate leaf]

wdym it totally can, these programming languages are not sandboxxed

[manic reef]

Gotta keep the thread updated to latest version

[dense halo]

wait do you mean like beyond just the linux installation

[glad grove]

this is about people providing ai responses in support channels not about a total ai ban everywhere

[deep lantern]

define "usage of LLM". is it pasting exerpts from chatgpt/gemini/etc responses? is it a discord bot for an LLM used for helping out?

[warped igloo]

I thought it was about LLMs in support

[magic path]

you laugh but there are absolutely people out there dailying 10+ yo computers

[vivid kayak]

ok send me code to brick my computer in C++

[viral elm]

Let's replace you with AI

[radiant token]

it was clearly AI-generated😭 you do not need to use a detector to tell

[rough heath]

Banning AI in support specifically. Not mentioning it at all, just copying and pasting ai responses

[slate leaf]

THE MODS HIJACKED THIS THREAD

[west trench]

yes because systemd insists on mounting efivars and some uefi implementations would just die if deleted

lenovo esp was guilty of this

[glad grove]

the original purpose was banning ai slop memes

[vivid kayak]

i'll run it for you

[slate leaf]

yeah

[glad grove]

still not banning ai everywhere

[deep lantern]

any non-smooth brained individual care to answer?

[lavish elbow]

yeah, good

im sorry, people may disagree with my point, but back in the day when I was 12 and wanted a sketch of my character and an artist would ask me for $30 id cry

i spent 4 years trying to learn how to draw in and out of school before giving up on it because it's just not my thing

ai can generate silly sketches? finally, thank god, it's not gatekept from me anymore

[fallen fulcrum]

dubl33 received a thank you cookie!

[vivid kayak]

and tell you if it bricked my pc

[ivory lagoon]

ok

[shadow forum]

oh yeah that goes against the whole point of human support I do agree with banning that sort of behavior

[dense halo]

mounting where
also how is this related to this thread

[slate leaf]

the mods hijacked this thread

[ember edge]

To be fair, the poll question was worded weirdly and could easily be construed that way.

[odd pond]

its obvious its generated, first sentence is enough, the llm doesnt have access to the server so it doesnt know what its about, it classified it wrongfully

[glad grove]

i feel like u dont understand this discussion

[radiant token]

I really don't like this point

[deep lantern]

ANYONE???

[warped igloo]

Who initially made the thread?

[slate leaf]

ai slop needs to be put down regadless

[vivid kayak]

that isn't answered because they are just going to go off vibes when banning AI anyway

[ivory lagoon]

I did

[slate leaf]

@ivory lagoon

[west trench]

that ai instructions can brick devices

[dense halo]

@ivory lagoon

[bleak badger]

Well yeah. I’m arguing against ai since I experienced that and understand the argument from both sides.

I don’t have a reason to use C# anymore, but I’m still using C++

[radiant token]

no<3

[untold wharf]

Pro tip, I think it's an eloquent example of showcasing the exact kind of bias and problems that can arise from moderating against their use.

Because if you just take what was said on its own merits you can see the validity but all of you were so busy being up in arms about it being generated by an LLM that you can't see the forest for the trees.

And that's here now imagine how this is going to play out in the support forums

[vale tulip]

"gatekept" mfs when they don't want to learm a skill

[warped igloo]

Interessante

[rough heath]

I'm still waiting for at least one good use case for ai on this server outside of support

[paper shuttle]

Define "brick".

[agile hamlet]

how did the journy of learning art go

[deep lantern]

ok i understand the arch user hate

[crude vault]

Yes

[autumn crest]

it should be allowed only for users higher than a certain level to confirm what the ai saying might work or not

[hoary burrow]

if you wanna use ai jsut ask the ai directly ffs

[umbral condor]

Elitism is such a great philosophy

[tropic panther]

Poorly, obviously

[vivid kayak]

you can rm -rf / and it'll do damage

[autumn crest]

like an llm allowed role

[radiant token]

uhh yeah so LLM usage is when you use an LLM

[deep lantern]

you're talking to a wall of one

[vivid kayak]

you can also punch your computer and it'll do damage

[west trench]

device that wont do anything useful unless you maybe fix hardware wise

[forest steeple]

your ai generated response literally got confused on the first sentence, refering to this server as a "tech support community"

[deep lantern]

GENIUS

[hidden needle]

--no preserve root tho

[agile hamlet]

it just sounds like bro gave up without even trying

[lavish elbow]

read my message again, thanks

im not like most people who generate AI stuff - I agree that artists are valuable and there wouldn't be anything for ai to make without them to begin with

however I did try and try to learn and in the end it's just something I couldn't master without ditching all of my other hobbies and going all in into art - which I don't want to do because I'm not an artist and it's not the effort I would want to put into a sketch

[fallen fulcrum]

You're thanking too much ó_ò

[neon nacelle]

What is llm?

[vivid kayak]

you don't have to say it

[exotic bough]

so a windows device?

[autumn crest]

ai

[magic path]

thing is posting a lot doesn't like, actually make you able to discern whether or not an LLM is worth parroting

[west trench]

no

[neon nacelle]

Oh

[paper shuttle]

Also, I am in favor of eliminating direct AI responses, but I basically use AI instead of search now, so I'd be cooked for offering a lot of support if it means any use of AI at all.

[ivory lagoon]

Large Language Model (text AI)

[west trench]

windows devices you can just install linux iso it doesnt do anything

[deep lantern]

large ligma model

[manic reef]

Llama without the As

[west trench]

brick, at best you can reflash bios chip

[exotic bough]

yea sorry it was a dumb joke

[autumn crest]

maybe if you get like support points?

[bleak badger]

But it’s people. It’s people’s information.
All it’s doing is inaccurately regurgitating information.

[forest steeple]

"i use ai instead of search" damn

[west trench]

windows 365 turns your device into brick tho

[autumn crest]

like thanks cookies

but for support

[lavish elbow]

i ended on basics of perspective, shading, practicing on basic figures for ages and also periodically copying other sketches by hand but after all the time and help from friends I could not figure out anatomy and just ditched it because lack of time and motivation after all the years

[paper shuttle]

What can you break hardware wise using only bash on a modern operating system?

[magic path]

embed worthy works because it's a rough filter, takes a while for someone to actually start if someone wants to be disruptive with those perms

[radiant token]

I wonder how much AI usage has increased Americans' / Europeans' carbon footprints

[smoky valley]

Llama like the LLM?

[west trench]

NVRAM

[vale tulip]

at least i could finally build a house with all that brick

[west trench]

if uefi implementation isnt good

[manic reef]

No like Cusco in The Emporers New Groove

[untold wharf]

True enough. Yet it made multiple entirely valid points on how moderation on suspicion can lead to bad things happening in the community,

[mellow pelican]

hold up, what if someone doesn't speak english very well and uses an LLM to translate and populate a support request?

[simple igloo]

The anti AI warms my cold dead heart.

[lavish elbow]

im not trying to say artists are useless, please don't think so, but I can't stand defending people who only say "pick up a pencil" or "$30 for art isn't that much" because I picked up a pencil and the pencil told me it ain't my thing, sorry

[deep lantern]

LIGMAAA BAAWWLLSSS

yaall

eh eh eh

[vale tulip]

when we gonna talk about corporation's footprints?

[smoky valley]

Google translate is a thing, and it's not an LLM?

[forest steeple]

if it hallucinated on such an obvious detail, imagine it giving false advice to someone and accidently brick their system?

[deep lantern]

foot 🤪

[paper shuttle]

%mute 1373821537647333407 1337d ligma

[manic reef]

Did you try a more gregarious pencil or perhaps one that doesn’t speak?

[radiant token]

not what I was talking about but sure<3

[forest steeple]

if oyu are desperate, you will execute anything

[fallen fulcrum]

Silence!! ò_ó
...
I keel u, @deep lantern!! Ò_Ó

[autumn crest]

you can ig, but not to resolve the problem. also using translate can be a better option

[tropic panther]

Usage is overstated. Not particularly worse than e.g a google search. Training is the big offender.

[bleak badger]

Likely quite substantially, given that America insists on the use of fossil fuels for power and ai tends to use a lot of that.

[west trench]

ig deleting nvram isnt really hardware, but you'd need solder and reflasher to fix it

[hoary burrow]

AI corporations? we are

[frigid vapor]

Hmm Good question

[lavish elbow]

very funny, contributes nothing to my point

[west trench]

but that's just extreme

[odd pond]

the car culture in the US + llms is quite horrible
i dont blame US individuals for the car stuff, but how the cities were built, shit aint walkable

[mellow pelican]

some languages don't translate very well word for word, like google translate does it

[simple igloo]

As someone who can't draw, I feel you, but I would rather struggle and suck at art for a while and find myself in it than use AI to replace my lack of talent. I still respect your decision to use it and I use it for specific purposes other than artistic creation or references.

[agile hamlet]

were you that dissatisfied with ur anatomy? cuz anatomy isn't that important its good to know it but its not like its the core of the piece it would be fine if you know how to have basic proportions

[vale tulip]

not just AI

[manic reef]

Your point is pointless so nothing to contribute to

[radiant token]

I try my best to get around without my car😭

[west trench]

ai more often than not wont break your device, but will tell you something poorly so that itll bit you out of the blue in few months time

[bleak badger]

Truuuuue

[little grotto]

I write everything myself, cause I prefer to understand how something works. I just use ChatGPT as better google and ask it simple questions to know what lego piece I need and how it fits to proceed with my build.

[coarse thunder]

more funny is OpenAI is projected to use like 10% of the US energy production

[hoary burrow]

the same way you bringing the "but i dont wanna draw" contributes nothing to a thread about AI support

[odd pond]

🙏 may cities get better over there

[forest steeple]

damn.....

[gritty comet]

ai is simply ruining the environment in the areas its hosted, it can kill our planet by just existing, remember every time you pur that prompt into an ai you become part of the problem, this only happens because of how massive data centers are btw(why tf did I say life360😭)

[west trench]

or insecure and get hacked

[simple igloo]

Same.

[viral elm]

Honestly discussion about how crap AI shit is isn't even relevant since it doesn't change the fundamental point I said earlier -- posting AI response in support channels is literally a total waste of time, the person looking for support could easily do this themselves if that's what they wanted

Even if AI wasn't complete garbage you'd still be wasting their time

[west trench]

it might "solve" the problem, but at what cost

[haughty hill]

i use it when searching on ddg doesnt help me

[forest steeple]

i mean i really am speechless lmao

[ocean mirage]

a story game with bad graphics is still a good story game

[lavish elbow]

i was dissatisfied with it because I couldn't learn to replicate it without relying on someone else's - like I couldn't figure out how to draw humans and not copy them

it's unfortunately one of the pieces I'd like to learn

[tropic panther]

What part of “ban AI in all contexts” did you not understand?
It’s an overreaching policy, hence the complaints.

[haughty hill]

before chatgpt i'd probs ask in reddit i guess

[odd pond]

crypto all over again

[glad grove]

why do some people not acknowledge ai is capable of providing responses that would otherwise be LITERALLY sabotaging the person in need of help

take google's gemini (specifically the search assistant) for example, it's so stupid to where it blindly believes search results, and hallucinates fake words

i'm not sure we should encourage supporting something that will give you an answer without knowing what it's talking about, only relying on what it hears others say, however malicious that thing it heard may be

[forest steeple]

"i suck at this so instead of learning, or go to a master of that skill, imma cheat/use an ai slop generator 3000"

[lavish elbow]

i spent years trying to learn
also the thread was hijacked who cares lol

[simple igloo]

I feel like it's a good scouring tool for empirical resources but terrible when it isn't forced to provide supporting evidence to its generated thesis.

[agile hamlet]

doesn't that happen with everything else as well (I'm not saying it doesn't just saying like shouldn't cloud computing and stuff also do this)

[lavish elbow]

i did try to learn, people 😭😭
istg

[glacial scarab]

are the people not acknowledging this in the channel with us?

[manic reef]

amen Ty 😌

[fallen fulcrum]

Laura / Alcosmos received a thank you cookie!

[radiant token]

tbh we have bus infrastructure and a tram network, it's just that the bus system is super slow (like, 40 minutes compared to a 5 minute drive sometimes) and the tram network is small af

anyway this is insanely off topic

[west trench]

the reverse honestly
i couldnt yet get chatgpt to ever produce valid url for its "sources"

[untold wharf]

Well this is an entirely different situation isn't it? This was me using an LLM in an ironic way not checking what it was saying too closely obviously somebody using AI to help support someone would need to fact check what it's saying. But the overall point is is that people use AI to polish answers responses help communicate more clearly etc I don't think anybody's arguing that people should be using chat GPT for peer responses in support with no verification. My overall point is is that if we start policing people for being perceived is using AI it's going to do more harm than good because there's no way to prove it the very detection tool that you posted is extremely unreliable in the first place and this has been proven.

It's going to lead to witch hunts it's going to lead to people getting banned for no reason it's overall going to be bad for the community and that was my point I just did it in an ironic way and my oh my how did you guys sharpen the pitchforks

[odd pond]

ah damn, also oops yeah, lets stop there

[forest steeple]

then maybe not everyone is destined to be a blacksmith? sometimes you gotta be a scholar, and when you need smithing, you go to a black smith

doesnt this sound fair?

someone who spent years horning their craft now basically useless because "my machine can do it"

[agile hamlet]

thats a bit weird cuz AI does the same thing ur dissatisfied about, I'd say the most important part of art is the process not the result

[mellow pelican]

i dunno what the context of this is, but just wanted to say if you keep trying, you'll get up there, not to mention that you can use math equations (e.g., field equations and trigonometric functions) for it, if that's more your thing

[gritty comet]

yes it does but you're lacking the most fundamental understanding if what's actually causing climate change, the top 100 company's make up for 72% of carbon emissions, us living everyday as normal people and driving cars isn't the problem. Its far from it, its the corrupt company's backed by corrupt rich politicians 👍

[glad grove]

if an ai heard enough people say "apples are salty" it would GENUINELY believe that
picture this with someone saying "remove (vital system package) and you'll be okay" in 5 different forums, or telling you to bend 5 cpu pins it'd regurgitate that as fact even though it could and would genuinely break certain parts of your system

[lavish elbow]

okay, then back to my original point
the art i have on my pfp is commissioned - the only one because I couldn't afford any more

now it just doesn't seem fair to pay money for something that can be done for free with a quality that... satisfies me

also third world country so art prices are up in the sky for foreign artists

[radiant token]

, our society works on giving money to people to do things and it's probably better to do that with an artist instead of using an LLM (even if it's cheaper)

[forest steeple]

"me using an llm in an ironic way" if we agreed with you you wouldnt say it was ironic fam im gonna be real with you

[glad grove]

ai is simply a glorified search engine and it DOESNT cite sources

[simple igloo]

I usually would tell it to provide uncollapsed links I could read alternatively to it's generated texts. What actually bothered me about AI was the timing of its release and the deliberate act by Google to depreciate their own search engine. As well as the AI being forced into searches that diverts traffick from websites that are genuinely informative for AI slop summaries.

[plain folio]

like totally remove it or people who are helping should not just copy and paste response?

[glad grove]

latter

[still birch]

llm text is not more clear than human text, just more verbose

[glad grove]

utilization of ai in order to provide assistance to those in need basically

[vagrant kettle]

I think AI should not be allowed unless needed for translatiom

[radiant token]

llms are very good at saying nothing in a lot of words

[hoary burrow]

off topic but it's still those companies the ones making us depend on cars after lobbying against public transport

[gritty comet]

I'm gonna train the arch ai to think its Debian 😭

[hollow dew]

deepl/gtranslate tbh

[lavish elbow]

I'll pick up art eventually, maybe
i still have my sketchbook with me where I tried coming back to it and drawing something of my own or copying random sketches from pinterest by hand to try and get a better hang of it and understand how it works but right now i don't really have the time to do so

i really like art, but it's not my thing, not if I don't put even more time into it

[glad grove]

ai translation is faulty but thats understandable

[smoky valley]

Then you probably approached it in the wrong direction, brute forcing doesn't mean you'll get good results, and also what do you mean by 'try', surely there's many people who appreciate your art, it could just be you who isn't satisfied with it.

[forest steeple]

"it doesnt seem fair to pay money for something that can be done for free ? " it quite literally IS fair, because your tool that generates it was trained on what those people created over the past century, and you dont need to comission foreign artists, support local artists mate. im also fro ma third world country!!

[mellow pelican]

it wouldn't, LLM's don't "believe", as it were, they don't know things, can't, but the idea is correct - the statistical usage of "apples are salty" would define if it mentions that or not

[agile hamlet]

I'm sorry I'm not that knowledgeable in that area but wouldn't the solution be just to remove all the datacenters then? (its an absurd question but you should see what I'm trynna say)

[gritty comet]

Well those company's run the ai data centers lol, most ai services use Amazon's data centers

[odd pond]

the worst case on the topic of these examples, is llms feeding back into themselves, llm generated posts and blogs go back into being used by a llm, resulting in a multiplying amount of missinformation, the internet is doomed if it keeps going like this

[hoary burrow]

yeah

[simple igloo]

It sounds like you're very critical of your hand made art. I can relate.

[blissful monolith]

No I think its fine to use llms on some small things like how we would google or refer back to docs (since llms will have access to these) but its important not to blindly rely on ai because it can definitely hallucinate things and mess up big time

[simple igloo]

Agreed.

[glad grove]

llm's arent people so yes it's not the correct usage of the terms but frankly its enough of an analogy to where people would probably understand

[gritty comet]

Yes it would be but company's don't give two flying shits and all they're after is making more money, especially here in the USA, they pay off local mayors etc so they don't have to follow climate regulations etc

[lavish elbow]

I'm not arguing with that - im no genius and maybe some more advice would put me on the right track but unfortunately that's how things went

[hard elk]

Yay, it's poisoning itself!

[glad grove]

ais rely on what they hear not what they've seen happen

[forest steeple]

also imho, your art doesnt need to be anything fancy or anything to be considered art, i would rather a shitty hand drawn stickman as your pfp, rather than ai generated slop @lavish elbow

[manic reef]

mfw Google indexes the entire internet to send people to sites then makes a robot that stops people from going to their sites 😭

[tropic panther]

Welcome to to technological progress? Weavers yelling at the loom didn’t stop the Industrial Revolution either

[forest steeple]

and there are a thousand ways of making art

[odd pond]

and people are gonna drink the poisoned supply anyway 🥀

[ivory rain]

AI generated assistance is just a glance into a glorified documentation repository. And knowing that many Arch Linux sources are kept pretty up-to-date, I don't have any real reasoning at the moment to justify AI for this kind of use, aside from getting documentation (that could be erratic or obsolete) in a faster way.

[hoary burrow]

nice to see almost everyone agrees on the ai support ban

[lavish elbow]

i did commission from a few local artists, and I probably will more

it's funny im arguing for ai art but I haven't used any of the things I generated anyways 😭

[simple igloo]

Do you prefer to read a book or watch a video? I have a kind of content that helps people like us overcome our fear of making bad art.

[vocal crest]

Ai stinky poopy and shouldnt exist - no contest get that poopy stuff out

[viral elm]

I can't draw and would like to be able to, but I don't really want to put in the time to learn, so I don't go to the slop generation machine, I just look at cool art and say "waow cool art"

[agile hamlet]

so can I ask whats the difference of using AI and using something like nvidea cloud gaming thing

[tropic panther]

Now there is one more.

[smoky valley]

Maybe it's just your perspective, who knows maybe there's people who really like your art, and it's just you whose too critical of it

[mellow pelican]

my friend once showed me that just doodling things helps get to know your imagination, style, where those lines and scribbles would lead you eventually, if that makes sense

[untold wharf]

Someone who doesn't speak English as a first language would probably beg to differ with you

[hollow dew]

ai art isn't art

[radiant token]

I mean idk about you but I never really enjoy the images that an image model generates, they always look vapid

[simple igloo]

That's the pain point for me. It actually grinds my gears.

[gritty comet]

Nvidia cloud gaming doesn't release insane amounts of hot water into the environments around it, which kills plants and animals BTW, sometimes the water is literally boiling

[manic reef]

simple answer, two support channels one for people and one for AI

[odd pond]

even scribbles in paint.exe are worth far more than what a llm could ever produce

[manic reef]

It’s a legit existential threat lol

[glad grove]

that too
vibecoding is going to eventually become the worst thing ever, think of it like inbreeding; it causes the genes that would otherwise not be present to appear, so deformations would be extremely noticeable, and otherwise unavoidable
an ai could be prone to one mistake, but it'd regurgitate so much of that same mistake to where it wouldnt be able to tell it's a mistake unless told otherwise

[lavish elbow]

i guess it's the case, well, again
maybe ill pick it back up :shrug:

[thin jasper]

I am kinda new to this group, but I dont really see an issue with running a local LLM on your computer. If you are using your GPU, isnt it basically the same as gaming? Like are gamers destroying the environment? lol. I think using them can be a good learning experience. I agree there can be a lot of slop though

[forest steeple]

"hey crystal how many languages do you speak?"

[glad zenith]

no because people will probably use it anyway and then give u the answer they got from chat gippity but now they wont tell you that's where they got it because it's banned to use it

[still birch]

saying "translate this text to english exactly" or "correct the errors in this text" is different from inputting english text and receiving more verbose text with the same meaning written with more words

[smoky valley]

So is it support for AI, or AI support?

[viral elm]

well hang on, I'm okay with the line that gamers are going to destroy the planet

[odd pond]

cant wait for all infrastructure to have the same zero day vulnerability

[hoary burrow]

all the new ppl at the company depending so much on AI is giving me a great job security

[simple igloo]

Pro-AI people: This is great because we can replace workers with machines!
Unchanged, Late-stage Capitalism: Adorable.

[haughty hill]

ai probs uses 1000x of all gaming gpus

[tropic panther]

Where is the line? If I feed a sketch into AI, then redraw the details that didn’t fit my vision, is that art or is that nothing?

[bleak badger]

Not to mention the advice would likely be generally inaccurate as well

[glacial scarab]

vote to ban all gamers tomorrow?

[lavish elbow]

thanks for the advice everyone and I just do want to mention that whole I do argue in favor of ai art, i myself don't use it pretty much at all, unlike most people that defend it - it just makes sense to me from a third point of view

[tawny kiln]

What if I want help to use AI to create a real life FNAF animatronic???

[magic path]

it's crazy to think the 2000 voters so far make up 6% of the server

[forest steeple]

it is nothing

[lavish elbow]

maybe ill pick up art again, anyways

have a good one everyone

[hard elk]

We're talking specifically for support

[viral elm]

thumbsupdraw

[gritty comet]

I would rather ask a question and let Google scan a database and put me on a watchlist rather then "Oh yeah uhh I found this on reddit so I'm gonna say it " Kill yourself" lol

[hollow dew]

tbh i don't speak english as a first language, but i don't think it looks like it anymore
i can tell what im typing and know what im talking about in english, when my first language is russian
but others have it differently, and since i didn't experience that i won't talk about languages

[untold wharf]

I mean I didn't really make any efforts to hide it my guy. I planned on pointing it out either way. As it's a fine example of how AI can be used to polish/expand on an idea or argument.

[scarlet jewel]

the greatest poll to ever visit #announcements

[magic path]

please oh my god

[ivory rain]

Absolutely agree.

[forest steeple]

a hallal sandwich which got cross contaminated with pork becomes non-hallal

[woeful stone]

people have a problem with everything nowadays

[tawny kiln]

BUT SILKSONG!!!

[agile hamlet]

like I said Idk much about this, so can you like expand on this cuz I'm genuinly curious about this

[forest steeple]

art contaminated with ai instantly becomes worthless

[vast arrow]

ive seen llms give really helpful responses before but im voting yes because humans should be the ones doing everything, to encourage not being replaced by ai

[manic reef]

Tell everything to stop being shitty 🤔

[strange tundra]

AI =/= art, no argument against it

[smoky valley]

It's not art if it's AI

[viral elm]

Honestly the agreement seems fairly unanimous here

[rotund lichen]

when ppl come here for support they expect getting help from a human, if they wanted help from AI they would've just asked AI instead. Therefore using AI for answering support questions shouldn't be allowed here in my humble opinion

[magic path]

you may notice that many things in life suck

[tawny kiln]

Sora AI was a mistake to ever be released to public

[glacial scarab]

so the opposition is just analogous to a religious belief in what is "pure"?

[gritty comet]

Ai data centers use water cooling, because of how large these data venters are and just how many PC parts are there etc the water gets out back to a stream or river they were pulling it from and its usually so hot it damages the local ecosystems killing fish plants and animals

[glad grove]

people appreciated art back before ai art existed because art could carry emotions, deeper meanings, and otherwise make an impression on the viewer
ai art is just an image without the careful strokes that a real person would make to convey the message, emotion or whatever it is they want to convey

[vast arrow]

even if ai was just used in post-processing it still removes the creativity from it and ruins the art

[west trench]

this si about llm in support, ai image gen is different thing and is clear abomination but #1437070542103511041

[agile hamlet]

what cooling does other data centers use

[glad zenith]

what does AI art have to do with use of AI in support channels

[vale tulip]

this should've been the only message in this thread lmao

[smoky valley]

Agreed, Vote to ban problems?

[gritty comet]

Most of them use water

[strange tundra]

I'm a composer. I would be infuriated if somebody produced AI slop music with no effort and published it into spotify. I think I understand the frustration with artists perfectly

[vast arrow]

this 100 percent

[agile hamlet]

so wont them also have an impact as large as AI data centers?

[woeful stone]

lets ban opinions 😂

[glad grove]

real

[manic reef]

Okay Google, summarize the pros and cons of using AI in the support channel. Make it sound like a 12th century medieval peasant who just woke up from cryosleep in 2025

[viral elm]

there's basically no argument in favor of AI in support channels so the discussion shifted

[magic path]

insert the lawyer imagining a perfect world from the Simpsons gif

[forest steeple]

okay lemme give you a better example since you cant draw parallel lines:

If i lace your food with 0.1% fentanyl, would you still consider it edible food ? or trash ?

[gritty comet]

Small servers use air probably but the issue is the big ones ran by amazon and Google which use water cooling due to how large they are

[radiant token]

I say we ban banning

[royal basin]

yeah as an artist I've never used image gen for my processes because it takes away from the creativity using it even once

[vast arrow]

an ai version of anything is just a hollow shell of what humans would create

[glad zenith]

i gave an argument in favour of it

[woeful stone]

+1

[viral elm]

oh well nobody cares

[tawny kiln]

I say we ban revive mints

[agile hamlet]

yes but those data centers exsited before AI no?

[vast arrow]

opentabletdriver user? based

[west trench]

its the devil

[umbral condor]

Too much banning happening as of recent, might have to ban myself from here

[glad grove]

no valid argument** people are still in favor of it, and im guessing its so they can get points for "helping" (sabotaging) people with extremely standardized and general support

[glad zenith]

wonderful discussion, glad your contributed

[thin jasper]

i misread the announcement, I thought it was support for installing LLMs or something. But yeah I join discord to talk to humans id rather get support from a person

[vast arrow]

im also an artist so i have my bias lmao

[mellow pelican]

AI replacement isn't gonna happen, the moment enough power generation converges on AI capacity to complete tasks properly, it will start replacing CEO's, CTO's, CFO's, and all the rest of the C-suite, and that's gonna be the end of AI replacing the workforce

[radiant token]

the lancer administration is getting crazy

[viral elm]

try having a discussion with a chatbot instead, they'll gas you as much as you like

[royal basin]

yea I use otd but since I use kde it just works #waylandSwag

[haughty hill]

not that i advocate for ai art but wouldn't prompting the ai to include certain details that convery the prompter's message count, assuming the ai doesn't screw it up?

[glacial scarab]

the fentanyl would be empirically measurable, but people who absolutely oppose AI art would still say it's impure in a semi religious sense even if there was no way to tell from the output

[gritty comet]

Microsoft's Fairwater data center is an ai center being built that will cover 315 acres of land. That's 1.2 million square feet it will house hundreds of thousands of GPUs and cpus that rely on water cooling

[tawny kiln]

There is no administration bro the Roaring is coming bro

[prisma drum]

I'm gonna say this: had a small issue with pulseaudio. It broke my DE for absolutely no reason :/

[peak mango]

Lowkey why would anyone ask for support in the channel if they wanted AI support...

[gritty comet]

Most ai data centers were built for ai

[radiant token]

the ai will most of the time screw it up

[vale tulip]

how about we ban ai discussion :kappa:

[strange tundra]

Something I understand is using AI for inspiration. Anything beyond that, you're crossing a line and a point of no return

[forest steeple]

there are ways to tell from the output though!

[vast arrow]

yeah, the thing is ai cant make new answers, it basically just looks through people old posts for you which you could just do yourself through google and learn something from it in the process

[royal basin]

because some people just don't understand the issue sadly

[glad zenith]

you didn't even read what my argument against banning it was. i dont think it should be banned because people will use it anyway to get answers and then regurgitate that to people in support channels but if its banned they wont include a disclaimer that they got that answer from AI

[glad grove]

it wouldn't because it's only ever TAKING from people's work, never making a work of its own, never conveying its own emotions, never carrying a MESSAGE from itself, only using other people's messages and style

[still birch]

to anyone saying llms being bad is just a general issue and not an issue in this server, go to #quick-questions and look at the response to the question i asked half an hour ago

[forest steeple]

and even then,i can just tell you that your food has fent in it, i doubt you will go conduct an analysis before throwing it, you will just throw it instantly

[gritty comet]

People don't realize how large ai data centers really are I think

[odd pond]

human labor costs a lot more than electricity right now, so it makes full sense to replace asap

[manic reef]

God I can’t wait for CEOGPT to cook my books for me.
“We actually made 100 trillion dollars last quarter.” … “You’re absolutely right!”

[still birch]

large enough to triple the price of hynix and samsung chips

[gritty comet]

or we could just fix the economy 😂

[forest steeple]

ive heard enough, give 7 trillion dollers to elon

[glacial scarab]

can you entertain the hypothetical? what if the statistical models in the future were "good" enough to the point where you couldn't tell? wouldn't you still oppose it as being haram despite there being no way to tell from the output alone?

[smoky valley]

Hopefully a solar flare happens soon then

[winged nebula]

If you come to a server with humans for help, you should be given a response by humans. I see no issue with using ChatGPT to troubleshoot as long as you aren't taking a real human being's opportunity away

[magic path]

just did some quick math this much fentanyl would absolutely kill you btw

[mellow pelican]

your books? nah, fam, it's the CEOGPT's books now

[radiant token]

solution: increase cost of electricity
this will fix everything

[glad zenith]

i dont think people should use AI in support channels but they likely will whether its banned or not, the only difference will be that if it's banned they will not tell you that they got their answer from AI

[untold wharf]

And no one's saying that support shouldn't come from humans The point is is that humans use AI as a tool for things other than just simply getting answers and the concerns are that people will be banned for being perceived as using AI. In any context. It's difficult to prove and will lead to people being banned wrongfully

[manic reef]

Please bro please just 7 trillion more dollars

[odd pond]

but muh pc 🥺
tbh might actually be good for things to restart

[prisma drum]

It would be fine if it wasn't wrong 20% of the time. Let me repeat - 1 in 5 answers are WRONG and it's so confident about it.

[forest steeple]

we are 7 trillions away from AGI

[royal basin]

dude please just 1 more lane

[agile hamlet]

hmm but microsoft does have other datacenters that aren't used for AI no?

[still birch]

i agree with you but this is a bad argument

[gritty comet]

"human labors expensive so use even more expensive ai that also kills our local environments" What the hell are you going on about lmfao, just fix the economy

[royal basin]

1 more lane for the highways it will work

[glad grove]

"No, we conquered the Moon and saved humanity from Xen on Q1 of 2025!" "I apologize, you're absolutely right on this."

[viral elm]

I think they'd be spotted pretty fast with all the hallucinations and other mistakes it'll make, then they get support banned

or just banned in general actually can we just ban them

[gritty comet]

yes but at least they don't require water cooling and release the hot water back to where they grabbed it from

[radiant token]

1 more line to go up please

[agile hamlet]

wdym they dont use water cooling? I thought they did?

[smoky valley]

Real, might be hectic in first few years, but then I'll probably be chilling on a farm after that period

[forest steeple]

forever chemicals exist though

[gritty comet]

Lots of em don't surprisingly enough, when they aren't ai lol

[mellow pelican]

there's not enough power generation in the world to replace any business's entire workforce, you'd need a nuclear power plant on each data center

[forest steeple]

acid rain is a thing

[still birch]

google is working on that

[rough heath]

I think the main question is: why would you give me an AI response, when I came to ask humans? If I want AI, I'll go to AI, don't push it down my throat.

Unless someone pro-ai has a good argument against this, I really dont know what else there is left for discussion here

[untold wharf]

Ah but when everyone is paranoid about the usage of AI do you actually think people are gonna stop to try to make this distinction?

[glad zenith]

if they just copy pasted exactly what they got from the AI yeah it'd be obvious but if they paraphrase or just take commands to run from the AI and pass those around it'd be harder to tell if they got their answer from AI

[agile hamlet]

thats interesting I didn't know that thanks

[fallen fulcrum]

stu1d_d3m0n9 received a thank you cookie!

[smoky valley]

China already working on fusion reactors

[radiant token]

I like/rely on modern institutions too much for me to want this to happen😭

[mellow pelican]

on what? nuclear power plants?

[still birch]

this is not detectable

[gritty comet]

yeah but the most pressing current issue is reducing ai because of the emissions it causes and the local environments it harbors, then we handle the top 100 company's that release 72% of global carbon emissions 😭

[still birch]

modular nuclear power plants for use by companies

[mellow pelican]

everybody is, the tech isn't there yet

[gritty comet]

Nuclear power is the cleanest energy there is

[viral elm]

I think inevitebly they'd still reveal themselves, and even if they didn't, the outcomes probably wouldn't really be different

[gritty comet]

well its correct to say the element needed doesn't exist yet really

[mellow pelican]

yeah, my point stands

[manic reef]

Until we have Neil Degrasse Tyson spheres AI will remain starved for power

[untold wharf]

Neither are countless other uses of AI. And then what if someone is too "verbose" in their manner of texting you think this won't lead to false accusations? It will.

[haughty hill]

i mean i guess as small models get better and more efficient ai accelerators become more common that could change, but there's obvs more to the issue than power

[gritty comet]

we need something strong enough to resist a literal mini sun in a room for extended periods for fusion reactors lol

[winged nebula]

I have a few arguments I've seen here which made me second question it a little

Someone, maybe @glad zenith said that people are just not going to tell you if they used AI for their responses if it is banned. And if we ban it altogether people who use it for translation reasons will be impacted as well, so I think that a better solution would be to give a partial ban on usage of AI

[west trench]

we should send ai bros to mars so they can play with planet that's already long dead instead of fucking up alive planet

[still birch]

honestly i couldnt care less about the harm it causes to the environment but this is a great point to use when arguing with people about slop

[forest steeple]

the same way cheating in exams is not allowed, of course there are gonna be false positives or false negatives too, but at the end of the day, for now, in 2025, we are still able to tell if a response is a low effort copypaste from chatgpt

[weak pendant]

its so annoying when they make up an awnser when they dont know the actual awnser

[viral elm]

AI has a very specific writing method that's super easy to detect because literally nobody talks that way

[still birch]

it wont, an ai generated text is very clearly distinguishable, and if their answer is correct i dont care if they used ai

[west trench]

small models are the future once llm buble pops

[mellow pelican]

nah, tritium, deutereum, and helium-3 are used for the plasma, deuterium is naturally found in water, helium-3 and tritium is produced during nuclear fusion inside the reactor

[forest steeple]

and dont give me that "well people paraphrase and such" because this rule is directed at the 90% who just slap you with the most generic ai answer you can imagine

[radiant token]

this would actually save computer science research from AI pigeonholing

[surreal sedge]

obviously yes. Its support, people come here for help, they could have asked some llm already, ans usually they don't help much.

[gritty comet]

that's exactly the issue no one cares. Ai is unregulated

[still birch]

what isnt distinguishable is telling it to correct or translate

[strange tundra]

The whole AI bubble is gonna pop like the dotcom bubble did back then

[gritty comet]

They want to use liquid lead BTW

[smoky valley]

Guys we should always support AI, because it'll always come anyways, and maybe if we support it, it'll be nicer to us? Like roko's basilisk

[still birch]

its unregulated and it will never be regulated because the people in power profit from it

[radiant token]

actually don't quote me on this, that's just a fear I have about going into CS

[still birch]

yet they regulate bitcoin datacenters

[glacial scarab]

you're not going to be able to entertain my point about AI art opposition being akin to a religious belief if you refuse the to think of the hypothetical

[still birch]

because bitcoin doesnt bring them profit

[untold wharf]

As I said the focus should be less on origin and more on accuracy and validity

If the responses are accurate who.gives a fuck.

You guys want to ban something from the support channel? Ban wrong information

[manic reef]

roko can basilick my ...

[viral elm]

While I am #1 AI Hater, in truth I actually think it's pretty good for translation, machine translation is already fundamentally trash and a fancy prediction algorithm actually does help the situation a bit

[mellow pelican]

for which part

[quick linden]

Just found out about this thread and it deeply pleases me

[vagrant kettle]

TRUE

[winged nebula]

OpenAI and it's struggle to monetize:

[viral elm]

But I don't think the use of translators are what we're talking about, we're talking specifically about support people copy pasting info from AI

[forest steeple]

the over-skepticism is the small price to pay for a cleaner support channel

[hard elk]

What profit.

[radiant token]

bro trust me openai will make gillions in 10 years just invest

[manic reef]

pwese mr. government just 1 trillion dollars 🥺 👉 👈

[scarlet jewel]

we are only 1,185 votes away from surpassing the twitter ban vote

come on archies i believe in you

make history

[mellow pelican]

AI is pretty regulated in the EU

[still birch]

investor money

[still birch]

have you seen the nvidia oracle and whoever else trade they recently did

[viral elm]

that thread was way more of a shitshow it's interesting that mostly everyone agrees this time

[still birch]

its not about money its about power

[manic reef]

money is power bruh

[still birch]

do you think openai will go bankrupt

[viral elm]

mainly because the argument has a silver bullet that can't really be argued out of

[forest steeple]

nope because if you are just gonna paste in a wall of text that may or may not be useful, will only cause more harm than good. especially if you didnt even read it and fact check it beforehand

[still birch]

they have enough money to the point where money isnt power anymore

[magic path]

It does have some minor improvements on translation, but it doesn't address current weak spots in machine translation (like slang, intonation, and euphemisms) so it's pretty limited advancement wise

[scarlet jewel]

this thread is far more peaceful than the twitter one because a majority of people agree AI is bad in some form

[hard elk]

It's a shell game. There's no profit generation there

[severe nest]

I tried to get AI to help me install Arch to see how it'd do. It was an absolute disaster (GPT5)

[scarlet jewel]

whereas twitter is entirely politics

[twilit plover]

Nice

[manic reef]

not true until they own the air that we breathe they won't be happy 🥲

[mellow pelican]

not anymore, brother, russia made sure of that

[viral elm]

Oh yeah it doesn't solve anything, but I think it's overall more likely to bumble into the correct answer

[severe nest]

At this point it's like 99.99% gonna be banned, we won

[still birch]

they dont profit from chatgpt plus subscriptions, they profit in other ways, otherwise they would have long regulated ai datacenters
if they arent regulating it because of profit/power, then why are bitcoin datacenters which are much less harmful to the envIronment regulated?

[glacial scarab]

can't wait for the next symbolic ban vote

[radiant token]

we do this and then get mad at 67, talk about ageism

[scarlet jewel]

ban facebook

[manic reef]

bro relax symbolism isn't important when it comes to communities ❤️

[viral elm]

I would support banning literally all centralised social media if it was proposed lmao

[manic reef]

its like saying "language doesn't matter" 😂

[hard elk]

Because 69 is actually funny.

[magic path]

from my understanding, they usually get the same things wrong, but the LLM translation will flow a little better. That's just for English to romance languages though, I dunno about other languages or the process of other languages to English

[glacial scarab]

so ban discord?

[radiant token]

"actually funny" is a non-statement

[manic reef]

can we get a poll which is funnier 67 or 69

[viral elm]

Oh really? interesting, I suppose that makes sense

[viral elm]

YES

FUCK YES

[haughty hill]

25

[magic path]

let us be free

[haughty hill]

funnier than 24

[winged nebula]

I dislike AI too, but yeah... I can't say it's entirely useless and unethical, and I just don't think a complete ban of it's usage is the greatest solution to the issue :/

I think stuff like this should always be case by case. But I thought it was quite obvious that if you come to a Discord server for help and not ChatGPT that the OP wants a response from a human, so it's kind of baffling we have this issue in the first place

[still birch]

69 isnt funny but its also not annoying

[wise dome]

37 is better

[radiant token]

I actually need to stop using this platform😭

[twilit plover]

i was the one who posted the 67% one

[forest steeple]

"Ai is an accessibility tool"

Also AI

[mellow pelican]

yes, let's all migrate to matrix/synapse

[radiant token]

god bless america

[vagrant kettle]

42

[forest steeple]

42

[glacial scarab]

the remove discord vote is already ongoing - you may already leave the server at any time

[still birch]

21 as in 10+9?

[radiant token]

42 isn't a funny number it's a wise number

[magic path]

I am obligated to my cohort to vote 69 but please know I'm cringing doing so

[twilit plover]

try the #linux IRC channel

[untold wharf]

Oh I did read it. And this is a fundamentally different use case then what I'm referring to in terms of support channel. So by all means keep deflecting from the point

[twilit plover]

what's 9 + 10

[viral elm]

Yeah I feel that, the motivations of someone that comes into support and just copy pastes AI responses are very strange

I guess they want to feel like they're a helpful person but have the issue of being a useless moron

[still birch]

21

[twilit plover]

you stupid

[magic path]

It's not enough. We need the servers shut down permanently

[radiant token]

10 + 9 =/= 9 + 10 = 21

[smoky valley]

Be grateful it isn't 67

[haughty hill]

i didn't even know people actually did that until i got the announcement lol

[forest steeple]

i wasnt referring to the slop you posted earlier fam. but keep outsourcing critical thinking fam, you are doing great <3

[manic reef]

this is giving me anxiety please explain

[haughty hill]

nahm nat

[lavish osprey]

you people must be way too old to not think 67 is the funniest

[radiant token]

only 9 + 10 = 21, 10 + 9 doesn't = 21. hope this helps

[ivory lagoon]

It AIn't real art

[glacial scarab]

I'm not sure it's even being done all that much, no one told me they've actually seen it be a problem, this is just a symbolic vote since mods can already intervene if someone repeatedly sends low quality support help

[manic reef]

no I'm sweating but I'll get over it appreciate ya

[haughty hill]

it's not even 67, it's 6 7 🤓

[crude vault]

That's just classified as brainrot/noise imo

[radiant token]

I can't help but laugh at 67 I'm sorry😭

[twilit plover]

69 at least references something
67 exists in a vacuum, the only thing it's referencing is just referencing itself

[viral elm]

there's something all very creepy about it, using a machine to create this weird facade of lies around you, trying convince everyone around you of your helpfulness and kindness when all you're doing is churning out cold, empty words, that you yourself don't even understand the meaning of

Basically what I'm saying is that support is overrun with piratesoftware

[haughty hill]

it's some joke that a bunch of high schoolers did

[winged nebula]

I'm genuinely concerned with the future of critical thinking. I'm enrolled to a technical school for general IT (2 years of general IT then 2 years of whatever I want my main field to be) and the amount of people that just cheat and use AI on all of the work we're given is just sad... If you didn't want to be educated why did you enroll in this school and take away the opportunity of someone who does

[manic reef]

imo thats why I think 67 is funnier though, it's absurd in a sense

[haughty hill]

apparently a reference to a shitty rap song

[glacial scarab]

many traditional internet memes are self referential

[smoky valley]

Real og's know the funniest shit ever was do u know da wae

[manic reef]

67 is like the marcel duchamp of numbers

[radiant token]

I mean 67 is referencing a rapper (or rap song?) but it kind of xerox'd itself into self-reference-dom

[crude vault]

Save that for a "banning brainrot" thread

[untold wharf]

I'm perfectly capable of critical thinking. Hence why I know that this anti AI hysteria is gonna lead to more problems than solutions.

[forest steeple]

the rickroll is a self referencing meme twin

[keen eagle]

I’m gonna make a bold statement:

if the server wants to ban LLM support, you need to have better server Linux documentation that people can point towards.

• Yes, arch wiki exists but that’s a whole google search away and linking a URL doesn’t always clear up the problem.

• There are use cases for AI where using it to write cookie-cutter responses then editing those responses by hand to fit the situation is both faster and more coherent for support.

• Unfortunately, there isn’t much of a faster way to generate and post that information than an LLM.

That’s why I’m recommending an official arch Linux guide channel: it’s something to ease the pain.

[mellow pelican]

lmfao i didn't expect a roach reference

[haughty hill]

if you think about it it's an irl spongebob "25"

[twilit plover]

the rickroll comes from tricking others into clicking on it, same as the thunder cross split attack meme

[exotic bough]

...better than the arch wiki??

[twilit plover]

also rickrolls have been dead for, what, 10 years now?

[viral elm]

Last year a teacher gave us that week's assignment and then they left the room for a moment, and I watched around the room as maybe fifty computers all immediately lit up with chatgpt

[still birch]

oh

[forest steeple]

3

at best

[winged nebula]

🤢

[crude vault]

Remember to stay on topic btw

[lavish osprey]

21 got famous because of that clip of the kid saying it. very unfunny after the 4th time you hear it
69 is just funny cuz haha implies sex. what are you 9?
67 is the most recent.. is just funny just cuz 6 7.

[twilit plover]

.aw Touhou Project

[fast pagoda]

No results found.

[twilit plover]

wait shit i remember it being on there one sec

[manic reef]

you say "Unforutnately" there isn't a faster way. statistically AI is lossful communication and adds a ton of noise to text

[forest steeple]

funky

[manic reef]

so I would say that humans writing docs is a feature, not a bug

[twilit plover]

.aw Touhou

[fast pagoda]

Touhou

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Touhou

[winged nebula]

Wait what

[crude vault]

Please be respectful. This is a serious thread and topic

[winged nebula]

.aw mozc

[fast pagoda]

Mozc

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Mozc

[viral elm]

that's awesome

[twilit plover]

.aw Minecraft

[haughty hill]

fuck it
all 3 funi

[fast pagoda]

Minecraft

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Minecraft

[hallow spade]

agreed. IMO the biggest issues with AI are fact checking and pertinence. It's difficult to regulate, so I understand the proposal.

[viral elm]

every video game ever made should get an arch wiki page

[lavish osprey]

i do appologize we got into a tangent for a bit

[strange tundra]

69 is funnier because adult jokes are funny in some contexts

[keen eagle]

Doesn’t have to be better than the arch wiki, but there has to be something in server* for support providers to more easily link to new users.

[forest steeple]

67 being unfunny is the reason why its funny

[mellow pelican]

arch wiki writers just do it for the love of the game, huh

[winged nebula]

.aw hentaivsfurries

[fast pagoda]

No results found.

[twilit plover]

yeah

[forest steeple]

lets not

[crude vault]

Again, be on topic

[viral elm]

Just more macros then?

[twilit plover]

i think if it's a game featured on pacman you can get it on the wiki

[strange tundra]

what the hell dude

[magic path]

mods can "just do" a lot of things, but nobody has been pulled aside for providing poor quality help. It's not a rule.

people regurgitating AI happens occasionally in support though, mostly in #quick-questions
people are usually pretty upfront about it (we require disclosure after all)

There's a certain kind of person that comes into support looking for help and then simply do not listen to what people are telling them, just post what the ai told them and go "is this good". This often leads them onto focusing on particular thought paths while everyone present tries to guide them away from it

[exotic bough]

...i dont get it if you cant read a wiki you really shouldnt be using a computer

[manic reef]

theres two things here, 1. support users should probably troubleshoot with AI before asking questions in a channel 2. we shouldn't embolden people to use AI when they themselves don't understand what their doing, ergo a ban

[winged nebula]

My instinct went to a game that definitely shouldn't get an AW page sorry 🙂‍↕️

[radiant token]

seis siete

[still birch]

you should not troubleshoot with ai ever

[twilit plover]

make one

[strange tundra]

Depending on how bad the issue is, avoid AI altogether.

[crude vault]

yeah

[manic reef]

for simple things, to deny the usefulness (outside of the ethical concerns) is folly

[timber nacelle]

Regardless of ethical concerns, the fact that LLMs constantly put out lie after lie is a reason they should never be used for technical support, ESPECIALLY not something as fragile as an operating system

[mellow pelican]

i'm pretty sure if you can connect it to arch, you can put it on arch wiki, whatever it may be

[crude vault]

i thinkk we should avoid ai in work which we can do if result is not much applicable

ethical concerns

mattters too

[manic reef]

this is cope I can ask AI as a new user how to format a USB drive coming from windows and be just fine

[haughty hill]

solution: look up what each command does before running it, either via man or the web

[manic reef]

should I use Arch Wiki and man pages? yes

[forest steeple]

to be fair the ethical reasons are so out of the equation purely because ppl here simply dont care

[glacial scarab]

I'm confused as to why anyone would even come into support to do that since they're not getting anything out of it.
but thanks for confirming it has actually been a problem, but I would assume mods would already react to such behaviour if tickets were made

[fallen fulcrum]

laceflower received a thank you cookie!

[manic reef]

can I use AI to troubleshoot simple things? also yes

[winged nebula]

The joke was that they said, every game should have an Arch Wiki page and I responded with a really stupid game that shouldn't have an Arch Wiki page

[forest steeple]

so if you wanna make a valid point, you are gonna have to argue about how it affects them and them only

[radiant token]

if you're ceebs tldr is like infinitely better than using an llm for command stuff

[strange tundra]

I have to be honest here. I've used GPT for quick commands because I'm a lazy POS, knowing how to use the tools, and also checking if the commands were correct. In the case of asking for a xorriso command, it was right and completely fine. Now, that doesn't mean I would use it for an actual serious task. But "would you mind setting up this command for something non crucial?" can be done without any issues.

[viral elm]

I think mods are unsure at the moment how they should be policing AI, hence the poll

[crude vault]

hmm, you are right, but for me, they matters just a bit even so

[mellow pelican]

all i'm gonna say is... if there's a protondb page about it, it's ok to have an arch wiki page about it too

[forest steeple]

it matters to a lot of us(aka the ones who voted yes)

[crude vault]

yeah, most of user dont understand tbh

[haughty hill]

tldr?

[radiant token]

like condensed man pages

[forest steeple]

Personally i have most AI websites blocked on a DNS level

[crude vault]

They mean tealdeer/tldr tool from arch repos

[forest steeple]

because i dont want to catch myself lacking

[timber nacelle]

Imo the fact of the matter is that you're more likely to get bad advice from an LLM than if you don't use an LLM, and I think that fact alone is enough to discount their usage in support threads especially

[crude vault]

.p tealdeer

[fast pagoda]

extra/tealdeer

A fast tldr client in Rust

Upstream URL

https://github.com/tealdeer-rs/tealdeer

License

MIT, Apache-2.0

Size

1.33 MB

Installed

3.16 MB

Packager

George Rawlinson [email protected]

version 1.8.0-1 · Oct 4, 2025, 12:16 AM

[exotic bough]

basedbasedbasedbased

[forest steeple]

if you dont wanna drink wine, the first step is to maybe stop buying wine

[rocky jewel]

How

[haughty hill]

oh i didn't mean ask the llm what a command does, just looking up what the llm told you to do does

[winged nebula]

Okay not going to lie that's just doing too much 😭

[manic reef]

swag this is nice I will install it now

[crude vault]

... aiblocker

[fast pagoda]

#18039 📣 https://github.com/laylavish/uBlockOrigin-HUGE-AI-Blocklist

[forest steeple]

doesnt affect me considering i dont decide to use them, but if i do, its a reminder to not

[winged nebula]

Yeah but you BLEW UP the wine store

[mellow pelican]

rust is mf everywhere, i swear

[strange tundra]

I mean, that is fine. I use it for quick questions sometimes, but I have my cheatsheets and whatnot. I understand why, it's like trying to stop an addiction or a possibility of falling for it, right?

[forest steeple]

https://github.com/laylavish/uBlockOrigin-HUGE-AI-Blocklist, and also a /etc/hosts i wrote before that blocklist existed

[radiant token]

because it's awesome bro

[winged nebula]

Fair enough I guess idk I just thought it was kind of funny 😭

[crude vault]

Please stay on topic. A serious topic is being debated

[forest steeple]

exactly

[hallow sky]

If LLMs are gonna be used, there is no point of a support channel on Discord

[mellow pelican]

just write C++, i can't be bothered to learn rust

[manic reef]

just write Assembly, I can't be bothered to learn C++

[strange tundra]

I just reached a point where I don't really care that much, I need something easy and quick, I go for it instead of asking somewhere and being told to RTFM.

[viral elm]

The debate concluded like a hundred times over

[haughty hill]

i guess using an llm to help write a support answer is ok if you already half know the solution

[viral elm]

There's nothing more to say here

[exotic bough]

someone should rewrite C in rust

[winged nebula]

@viral elm look at their banner you might wanna take that heart away

[glacial scarab]

#1436046820043264040 message

[rocky jewel]

Ai sucks

[radiant token]

[mellow pelican]

no, that would cause a circular dependency

[forest steeple]

"9/11 is bad" ahh take

[viral elm]

oh man the imposter

[hallow sky]

What banner?
I only have a profile pic

[haughty hill]

otherwise why bother helping

[rustic falcon]

Negative iq take

[silk swift]

My opinion is if it's the only thing used for replying, then no. It's a tool to use, however should not be the end-all be-all. So long as it's done ethically, it should be fine.

[manic reef]

you're supposed to say "just write machine code" 😢

[forest steeple]

giorno wouldnt fw you

[exotic bough]

ethical AI doesnt really exist

[radiant token]

if your code is not an abstracted mess then I don't like you/j

[crude vault]

If you can't contribute to this convo, please don't say anything and use the proper channels. Thanks

[fallen fulcrum]

dotle31 received a thank you cookie!

[rustic falcon]

You know this because?? This dude is a mafia boss i wouldnt fw him💀💀

[manic reef]

last time I used a case statement was 2007

[forest steeple]

giorno canonically beat up an AI

[exotic bough]

sorry i get distracted a lot

[radiant token]

before I was born😭

[forest steeple]

also he is a chill mafia boss

he hates giving drugs to kids

[rustic falcon]

Yep i forgot he beat up the OpenAI ceo

[magic path]

People don't view it as that high stakes, from what I've seen. I think some of it is a chunk of traffic coming here for support, and being new users do not know how tickets work or the moderation culture. This is further worsened by a tendency of other users to not step in on the behalf of others, understandable as it may be

[winged nebula]

I forgot it's a Vencord thing. You literally have an AI generated banner my dude how are you going to say you hate AI 😭

[mellow pelican]

as long as it's just trained on non-copyrighted text, it probably classifies as an ethical AI

[rustic falcon]

But drugs for adults and murder and all other crimes are okay😞

[storm oak]

lol

[manic reef]

nah you're going to get into the environment raminifactions real quick

[mellow pelican]

GOTTEEEEEEEEEEEEM

[timber nacelle]

Ignoring the fact that there are definitely several people here who don't think copyright is ethical in the first place

[glad zenith]

exposed

[strange tundra]

suspiciously AI looking, generic checkpoint from a free website perhaps

[exotic bough]

yea but point to an LLM that both works well and follows that

[hallow sky]

I just don't like Text based generative AI for non-trivial stuff

[rustic falcon]

Free my homie mr GPT he did nothing💔💔🙏🙏

[mellow pelican]

you mean like power generation wise? just live near a nuclear power plant, tf?

[forest steeple]

@rustic falcon Formaggio's stand, and baby face are literally robots/AIs

[timber nacelle]

And I say this as someone who's anti-LLM too, copyright ethical arguments fall flat because I don't believe in copyright

[manic reef]

hell yeah simply throw more compute at it bro

it'll work soon I swear

[viral elm]

Build your own nuclear power plant

[mellow pelican]

pretty sure if you went around huggingface, you'd find one

[radiant token]

can a stand even be an AI or robot? it's a corporeal manifestation of the soul😭

[rustic falcon]

Idk if you can call a stand an AI, when clearly formaggio's stand is sentient 😭😭 stands are souls and nonetheless the stand tried to kill them all

[mellow pelican]

nah, i'm not that stupid, my guy, i know transformer architecture is a dead end

[sick temple]

https://discord.com/channels/399812551963049995/1437070542103511041

[strange tundra]

Mate, I think it's fine if you're not selling it or making profit off of it

[manic reef]

RIP Optimus Prime

[rustic falcon]

Ong😭😭

[strange tundra]

I mean your banner (I can't see anything, I see red, but I saw the screenshot)

[winged nebula]

People with AI generated Discord profiles have to be some of the lowest specimen... There are millions of artists who upload their online and condone their art being used on your profile yet you choose to AI generate something that will never look as good as the real deals.

People who AI generate their BIO are even weirdo though... AI will not be able to write you a more accurate description than yourself 🤯

[mellow pelican]

build your own nuke

[forest steeple]

i mean Little feet is technically a robot stand

jit looks like robofrog

[radiant token]

like remote-controlled?

[rustic falcon]

Judgement looks like a robot stand too

[viral elm]

Do people actually AI generate their bio lmao what freaks

[forest steeple]

this is the most Robot McRobotinson character ive ever seen

[still birch]

just put your cat on your pfp

[radiant token]

is literally a guy in armor

[rustic falcon]

Its their choice at the end of the day

[manic reef]

damn tell us how you really feel 😄

[mellow pelican]

all of the Jojo's characters look like they're walking golems made by an ancient greek sculptor

[haughty hill]

do stands count as artificial

[strange tundra]

they put mafter cheef in the soder

[rustic falcon]

No they're the manifestation of your soul

[untold wharf]

People AI generated their bios whaaaa 😂😂😂

[gritty comet]

the wall

[haughty hill]

well there you have it, stands can't be ai

[forest steeple]

Baby face is an exception

[radiant token]

ig you could say that babyface is an intelligence that was made by a man

[mellow pelican]

...well assuming it's a tokamak, which wall?

[radiant token]

but by this logic humans would count as AI

[forest steeple]

because the stand is the computer, and then the body that gets born after is an AI

[wheat shuttle]

Ai pfps/banners does not affect the chat spam issue whatsoever
kinda unrelated to this thread?

[haughty hill]

so do all the characters in part 3

[gritty comet]

The wall that actually braces against the plasma in the fission reactor

[radiant token]

babyface also needs DNA sampling from a woman

[strange tundra]

I'm spotting a few imposters

[gritty comet]

They want to use a liquid lead wall basically

[forest steeple]

the same way llms need samples from human-made text, i think we are unto something

(or on something

[viral elm]

I support banning people with AIs pfps on the grounds of them being complete losers

[crude vault]

You may have a point, but remember to be respectful

[viral elm]

funny juxtaposition

[radiant token]

that's an intersting comment, but to be pedantic is to ignore stuff that's interesting

[winged nebula]

Yeah... This guy here also likes to use ChatGPT to "roast" people, he's such a cornball.... He also uses ChatGPT to make Roblox games and scammed me for my voice acting work and steals shit from other people's games

[untold wharf]

Because one is a reasonable.point of discussion and the other is ridiculous policing of others? It's one thing to debate on whether AI tools are allowed in support and another thing to ban people for having an AI generated banner photo 💀

[manic reef]

emoji bullet points spotted

[plucky atlas]

lmao

[rustic falcon]

Its more referred to as a sentient, autonomous stand. If it were to be an AI then that defeats the whole concept of stands

[warped igloo]

%slow 5s
yes, a thread just got slowed

[forest steeple]

I agree with you

[fallen fulcrum]

Y'all can now send one message every 5 seconds.

[magic path]

I still have an issue with it, and it's that LLM scraping drains the resources of services that provide copyrighted material and puts them at greater risk, while companies making models have been able to suppress opposition from copyright holders using their wealth.

in a similar vein, content is taken indiscriminately from anyone regardless of personal consent or nature, and monetizes it for their own gain. Even if I don't believe in copyright as an institution, the companies doing this are actively worsening their content sources that humans also rely on.

[winged nebula]

It was a lot more obvious ChatGPT before this but I don't have a screenie D:

[haughty hill]

wtf it's meant to be a reply to this msg #1436046820043264040 message

[strange tundra]

I don't think the profile picture is the issue here... Banning somebody because of a picture is a bit extreme, don't you think? It's not illegal to do that. I understand it, but I think it's too extreme

[viral elm]

booooooooooooo

[slate leaf]

7+ years doing roblox dev and still cant even code lua....

[warped igloo]

there's so much random bs here unrelated to the topic

[radiant token]

guys we should change this thread to "A vote on whether babyface counts as AI" that seems more interesting

[viral elm]

I don't fuckin care tbh lol

[mellow pelican]

yeah, in a tokamak there can be as many as 4 such walls, the usage of liquid lead implies the usage of smart/liquid metal properties, which can be gotten with lithium, some titanium alloys, and ugh some other metal i forgot, each has different properties that would be good for some parts of the wall, and worse for others, so i'm more so asking how they're using liquid lead

[warped igloo]

anyone not discussing what the thread is about, move to #off-topic or #urandom

[manic reef]

pretty much everyone is on the same page. unless someone comes in here with a genuine, hot take, there isn't much more to say. apologies for the sidetrack

[forest steeple]

i mean, Sheer heart attack isnt really sentient, and is considered(by some) its own stand

[winged nebula]

He doesn't actually have that much experience, 7 years ago was the first time he opened studio XD

[winged nebula]

okie dokie!

[cyan yew]

LLMs?

[radiant token]

Babyface shows signs of sentience (I mean, it even adopts personality traits of the mother)

[magic path]

in support specifically

[rustic falcon]

Its more or less a substand as one cant have two or more stands at the same time (exceptions being Dio and cheaptrick) and sheer heart attack is semi autonomous and not sentient

[cyan yew]

what are LLMs

[manic reef]

Large Language Models

[cyan yew]

oh AI slop

[crude vault]

Yup. Tends to derail too much

[forest steeple]

isnt Pucci also an exception?

[magic path]

large language models. The programs you can give a prompt to and spit out text

[gritty comet]

I think they were gonna stick with titanium walls in general but have layers of liquid lead between each of the walls for cooling, the lead would also help the plasma be maintained longer, I haven't looked into how fission works much other then nuclear fission

[forest steeple]

iirc at one point he had the green baby and white snake at the same time

[median agate]

What if we just make mandatory to say when they are using llms. People who don't like it just ignore it. Why is it a problem?

[warped igloo]

wrong reply

[rustic falcon]

His stand evolved, like act stands so i dont think it counts

[smoky valley]

How about AI moderation?

[worn moon]

The only comment is a clarifying one, maybe because of how the question is worded, I don't think there's a problem with helping people set up tools like ollama to host their own stuff or helping people setup things like pytorch.

[strange tundra]

Sometimes, people don't care about censorship when it doesn't affect them. When it affects you, you'll see that kind of statement as extreme or too far. It doesn't affect me personally, but I see it could be misunderstood very easily. I'll stop here because it's going offtopic, but summing it up, banning somebody because of a profile picture is way too much if the picture isn't against any laws or rules. If people were banning "anime avatar pfps" would you agree, or think it's too extreme? I don't know if you get my point.

[warped igloo]

welp
there's polls about among us, people talking about roblox dev, people talking about stands or whatever

[cyan yew]

i see. fuck AI but what would banning discussing of it do. who cares really

[smoky valley]

I'm not in support of it, but would it be effective?

[forest steeple]

the talk about stands is relevant though

[crude vault]

You don't want it. See what happened to enderman

[worn moon]

With this exception I would vote yes

[radiant token]

barely

[rustic falcon]

ai is awesome

[smoky valley]

Who?

[warped igloo]

err

[magic path]

discussion shouldn't happen in support anyway. You can still talk about LLMs elsewhere on the server, there's no ban on that

[mellow pelican]

FYI fission is splitting, it's how modern nuclear reactors work, fusion is combining, melting particles together

[warped igloo]

this is a thread about banning LLMs in support channels

[cyan yew]

ohh

why are LLMs being brought up in support..

[crude vault]

Enderman, a tech YouTuber
AI moderation took them down

[warped igloo]

yeh so much derailment that you can't even tell

[haughty hill]

apparently people are copy pasting chatgpt answers

[versed gull]

My LLM opinion: Locally run LLMs (e.g. Deepseek R1 through Ollama) can be useful tools to help one think and process text in some circumstances, but information formulated by humans is superior when seeking support.

[plucky atlas]

Is this a ban on helping people who used LLMs, helping people with LLM responses or both?

[warped igloo]

#announcements

[rustic falcon]

Sometimes LLM's are used to troubleshoot

[magic path]

people sometimes copy/paste output from LLMs as a means of providing support

[smoky valley]

Oh, what happened was he banned due to AI error?

[gritty comet]

yeah I misspelled

[rustic falcon]

LLM responses i think?

[warped igloo]

both imo

[wheat shuttle]

is the topic about llms in support or just ai in general?
because all i can see is people discussing ai art and ai slop

[crude vault]

https://media.discordapp.net/stickers/1434809315377545359.png?size=160

[weak sierra]

up at the top of the thread it said "If you are looking for help after you have used AI you will be asked to start over (including possibly reinstalling your entire system)"

[crude vault]

Basically

[cyan yew]

so the arch wiki just does not exist ig

[crude vault]

Yes. So, AI is no good, sticking to OP convo

[cyan yew]

wrong reply

[plucky atlas]

I fully support a ban on that but I think there is such a huge number of new people who use them (you must admit, AI is pretty commonplace now) for help, that a ban on people who use them is just counterintuitive for this server being a help server

[strange tundra]

@warped iglooApologies in advance for the ping, but I have a question and I think you're staff, correct? I recall seeing people use GPT outputs on support, is that the reason for the vote and the whole discussion?

[magic path]

If someone goes "I used chatgpt and my system is broken", that's probably fine. It's gonna happen, unfortunately.
If someone keeps using an LLM while receiving human support that's not on I think

[crude vault]

Yes

[smoky valley]

What if the support is like "I asked chatgpt blah blah blah, and tells me to do this, is this correct?", would that still count as LLM in support?

[weak sierra]

anyway, this is stupid. how do we know if something was AI? Rely on it being disclosed? If we ban it, it will just not be disclosed.

[gritty comet]

Fuck ai lol ban it, make a proper poll and let us all vote

[warped igloo]

well
that's the thing
this thread has been derailed to a point where it's irrelevant to what it was initially about

[cyan yew]

i figured that was the whole discourse

[crude vault]

There's already an ongoing vote on #announcements

[rustic falcon]

I dont ngl. Gemini AI overview (when googling) is pretty useful when i need to troubleshoot if you use it correctly then you're fine

[weak sierra]

there IS a poll. you meatbags can't read any better than the tools you hate so much

[radiant token]

I like seeing the discussion repeat as people start waking up

[glad grove]

This is about using ai to respond not "is this the right course of action?"

[magic path]

yeah, you're going to get a better answer just asking the thing you're trying to use an LLM to solve

[sweet pulsar]

No, they actually want to ban people coming to help ask for issues caused by them following LLMs blindly (which we should do) but the vote isn't about that

[gritty comet]

it looks exactly like I thought it would

[cyan yew]

vote got ratioed anyways

[smoky valley]

I thought it was about AI answers being used to answer people in support

[weak sierra]

yeah I mean why would you bother reading what it's ACTUALLY about

[gritty comet]

using ai to setup an operating system is wild anyways

[hallow sky]

Did you guys come up with a conclusion?

[forest steeple]

oh wait hell no wtf ???

[strange tundra]

Isn't that too extreme? I understand people might go blindly asking GPT and screwing up, but that's human error. I thought it was more about offering a response that had been prompted through AI, instead of doing a real diagnostic on an issue.

[grand stirrup]

Just to be clear because I'm trying to understand what's going on. We're not supposed to use AI (ChatGPT, Gemini, Claude etc) to debug issues?

[forest steeple]

im all for banning ai responses, but to ban someone for using an AI and fucking their system and then asking for help ? thats fucked up man

[weak sierra]

why are you all for it

[plucky atlas]

No I mean I think AI is a helpful tool for people to learn from but like if you're just gonna reply with something you got from an LLM then what's the point. Anyone can do that themself

[strange tundra]

That's a classic human error. Same as not having backups and losing your data.

[cyan yew]

grok help

[forest steeple]

backread or something im not a parrot

[hard elk]

Where did you read that?

[weak sierra]

unless they're not paying a subscription

[gritty comet]

Just tell them to restart and do it properly tbh

[grand stirrup]

Oh wait I think I understand. You don't want people using AI and then replying with that answer on a forum to help folks. Yeah I 100% support banning that.

[uncut burrow]

We should just ban people who use ai and dont know what their talking about just need people who are logical to actually use ai efficiently

[magic path]

It's probably just going to reinforce ai usage if they can't get human help tbh

[untold wharf]

And what's to stop people from looking up stuff on LLMs and then providing answers in their own words?

What happens then? Someone gives a wrong answer, and they immediately get accused of using an LLM and banned?

[weak sierra]

why would this not be the rule for any screwup? what makes AI special?

[sweet pulsar]

The vote is for both

[meager forum]

Okay im okay with ai ban

[cyan yew]

wait are the mods gonna ban users for this?

[uncut burrow]

Like remove their access to the support channel i mean

[plucky atlas]

I mean I've never tried a subscription for an any AI service, is it really that good

[uncut burrow]

Just ban ai

[forest steeple]

yeah but to ban them, when they are probably depserate and at a very stressful time, i say its very bad

[gritty comet]

cuz ai major fucks it

[manic reef]

nothing it's a judgement case to be made by the mods, but setting rules assists with the culture at least

[forest steeple]

apparently, will have to confirm with the mods

[hard elk]

SOURCE?

[weak sierra]

2 weeks ago they had us start using claude at work and it works astoudingly well. not flawless obviously but much better than I expected

[sweet pulsar]

It says "in any context"
and the HU channel

[plucky atlas]

It should be more nuanced because I honestly think that's the best option and it looks like a fair few agree

[cyan yew]

i love how vague this is

[gritty comet]

Hey I used ai to setup my operating system but its in chinease how do I change it to English Gets banned

[timber nacelle]

Patently, this is fucking absurd and the vote needs to be split then

[warped igloo]

we ain't banning people for asking for help what

[haughty hill]

wassap beijing

[hallow sky]

They took a risk instead of asking for help when it was needed
Most AI fuck ups are hard to debug for the helper putting excesive load on them
LLMs mess systems up too frequently, the volunteers don't deserve this

[sweet pulsar]

Yup...

[forest steeple]

@sweet pulsar wait so if i get this straight.

Alice tries to do something and asked chatgpt on how to do it, it then backfires and it breaks her system, she comes and says "chatgpt told me to this and that and im cooked" and alice gets banned?

[weak sierra]

if we ban this then we'll just get "Hey I somehow set my OS to chinese how do I change it to english". Which is a fine question.

[manic reef]

I disagree, in five years when the world is held together by hallucinations and dreams we should not turn away those who are interested and need help.

[woeful depot]

What if I’m using AI to talk here?

[forest steeple]

and error is human! we all make mistakes

[manic reef]

if the vote is for banning people who are asking for help because they bricked their system, I disagree

[untold wharf]

It's gonna be a moderation nightmare

[cyan yew]

hm7 just clarified this is not the case.

[quaint crest]

Banning AI yes but only generative LLMs, translations services (this use AI behind the scene) for non native English speaker should be allowed

[smoky valley]

I just got a brilliant idea, why don't we use AI, to detect when someone is using AI for answers, problem solved!

[sweet pulsar]

The discussion is banned, not the person
@forest steeple you too

[plucky atlas]

What do you mean exactly?

[manic reef]

but if the vote is for people who are responding by using low effort AI posts, yes

[plucky atlas]

Yeah no I was agreeing with you andy

[quaint crest]

Image generation can also be removed IMO

[forest steeple]

and what does this mean exactly?

[sweet pulsar]

That they won't get help

[warped igloo]

why are we banning crystal

[forest steeple]

if they used an ai and it backfired on them?

[scarlet jewel]

???

[hallow sky]

Yes, and it can be reduced by refusing to debug the aftermath of LLMs
People will eventually start asking for help patiently instead of going to a LLM

[sweet pulsar]

😭 I wanted to mention her in the msg because it was a reply to her too

[manic reef]

can the operators give clarity - is this to just ban AI responses to support questions?

[scarlet jewel]

why are we banning crystal?

[cyan yew]

bro they are literally saying they are not gonna ban anyone for it

[warped igloo]

i'm confused

[warped igloo]

oh

[warped igloo]

no we ain't dw

[strange tundra]

In retrospect, I remember seeing people respond to questions with AI responses. I think that was the point, nothing else. Avoid people giving advice with AI, or letting it happen (which would be irresponsible).

[forest steeple]

they edited it to mention me x)

[timber nacelle]

I'm opposed to people providing support with LLMs because of their propensity to objectively provide lower quality information than someone who knows what they're talking about.

Banning someone who used an AI and fucked up their system from receiving support is just straight up a bad faith reading of the topic at hand.

[hard elk]

Me three.

[forest steeple]

yeah but still not allowing help for someone just because they used an ai and it backfired is also terrible imho

[warped igloo]

we ain't banning peple for it, rather the usage in support

[cyan yew]

good thing no one is getting banned for it

[forest steeple]

now if they do not follow what you tell them to do, and are like "chatgpt told me the opposite" then yes i agree that the person should be directly banned

[timber nacelle]

Then it's Hm7 providing said bad faith reading

[plucky atlas]

Do any admins actually agree on this? x(

[woeful depot]

Is everyone getting banned for using ChatGPT?

[cyan yew]

💀 im dead bro

[forest steeple]

the anti-ai mob is banning me for not being anti ai enough(jk)

[warped igloo]

are you illiterate

[woeful depot]

I have continuously used ChatGPT since 2022 without interruption.

[primal marten]

bro prolly needs chatgpt to explain it to him 😭

[quaint crest]

Someone saying:
"I used ai and it told me to do X, now system fucked up" should not be banned because it's necessary context for understanding what happened

[forest steeple]

#1436046820043264040 message

[warped igloo]

great, you want an award?

[hallow sky]

Instead of a forced rule, I prefer it to be an unsaid rule that should be self understood that if they were looking for a AI responce, they could get it themselves

[sour ledge]

As an AI language model, I shall sue this server for going against us.

[hard imp]

can we ban @woeful depot for using GTP?

[sweet pulsar]

But it literally says "in any context"

[haughty hill]

this tbh

[warped igloo]

in support

[forest steeple]

yeah but i would argue that both a system broken by human error, and by ai error is still a broken system

[manic reef]

yes the operators have differing views of what the poll is about

[hard imp]

i heard it both ways

[cyan yew]

no one is getting banned

[radiant token]

I'm assuming "in any context" means "any context within the support channel"

[strange tundra]

This, plus giving a disclaimer and a warning about AI usage being prone to issues in such cases, and avoiding it if possible.

[timber nacelle]

If the mods could actually figure out what fucking question they're asking before bothering all of us with a ping, that would be great. Figure it out.

[woeful depot]

If I did not use GPT, everyone would proceed to ban me. Such logic eludes me.

[hard imp]

to be fair, it is english

[radiant token]

who's gimmick account is this

[forest steeple]

its vague af

[hard imp]

totes

[dull lark]

This conversation quickly turned toxic on both ends. Yeesh.

[radiant token]

I love english sm

[weak sierra]

I think a vote on this is a bad approach considering the widespread "not knowing what we're voting on" and a better approach would be a public forum where we the mods can lay out exactly what they're talking about, take RFCs, and then decide based on that

[hallow sky]

Ok, let's blame it on the languages then

[feral zinc]

Ralsei's opinions on AI

[forest steeple]

because if we are voting for not providing help to someone who fucked their system because of AI. then i vote against(as a HEAVY anti LLM person)

[cyan yew]

i hardly talk in this server. this is probably one of the worst impressions i’ve had of this community

[warped igloo]

your first message here was this #off-topic message

[hard imp]

write the proposal in C to piss off the rust guys

[weak sierra]

a wild west thread is not going well

[woeful depot]

I have successfully installed Arch Linux entirely with guidance from ChatGPT, and the system operates correctly.

[hard imp]

can you do it blind?

[strange tundra]

I couldn't help but laugh after reading your nickname, I'm sorry mate

[timber nacelle]

Because I've already seen 2-3 mods providing entirely different perspectives on what this thread is even meant to discuss. I'm upset I was pinged for something like this when the people who are supposed to be the arbiters have no idea what they're even arbitrating.

[manic reef]

yeah I think it's fair that operators need to have clarity on this before at:everyone. this thread was hijacked from a previous one, the wording is unclear, and the mods disagree on the wording on their own poll

[hard imp]

^

[haughty hill]

clanker (haha get it cos your name)

[dull lark]

I joined a few days ago after hearing it was a friendly place for arch discussion and issues. This convo is giving me the exact opposite impression, with both sides (including mods) attacking each other. Sigh.

[rustic falcon]

Understandable

[quaint crest]

If you want to piss them off write it in rust but open the code with an unsafe statement and just use pointer everywhere

[forest steeple]

mods, freeze the poll now and maybe decide on a better explanation before resuming it

[timber nacelle]

Close the thread, figure it out in mod chats, then ask again.

[hard imp]

withdraw the proposal and resubmit it?

[hallow sky]

But if you are using an LLM for your system, why are you using a DIY distro anyway

[forest steeple]

the three horsemen

[haughty hill]

cmon man don't insult cowboys like that

[cyan yew]

im just watching it burn from here