Separate custom comps channel

[fathom flower]

I think at this point there really needs to be a custom comps channel that's not other marble talk. I'm not interested in custom comps at all, and unlike the JMR channels I and others don't have the baseline level of knowledge to talk about them, but I'm interested in talking about marble art + Marblearth + general creative discussion about marbles. These two topics uncomfortably share the same channel and you can't talk about one if a conversation about the other is going on without disrupting it. There's clearly a significant interest baseline for custom comps and a separate channel would allow for more in-depth engagement while also making things easier for people who are only interested in JMR content marble-wise to filter stuff out.

[valid harbor]

i kinda see your point, although i think at that point we'd need to change the name of other-marble-talk to something else entirely. thing is, like most cases, i dont really know what it should be

[burnt fulcrum]

great idea millim

[acoustic hemlock]

this is something we've considered and discussed recently in the past, so thank you for making this suggestion

we'll see what staff as a whole feels about it

[polar parrot]

Ok, my personal opinion is that it makes little sense to cut alternative marble racing content - or anything that's marbles but not JMR - out of the channel that's literally built to embrace such content.

[fathom flower]

the reason is that there are two extremely distinct types of content being posted there with minimal interest overlap

[polar parrot]

We can still talk JMR-related fan works on the traditional channels, although it isn't optimal due to how crowded these channels can be

[fathom flower]

for the record, i would also be fine with a new separate art/writing/creativity discussion channel to be made and for other-marble-talk to be made a custom comp channel

[acoustic hemlock]

would a forum be good for art/photography or would you think a separate channel would be better?

[valid harbor]

what im inferring from them is that the other-marble-talk (or omt for short) has two niches that it has to comply to, both of which are very distinct that it gets crowded in another sense

[acoustic hemlock]

this is something we're discussing

[fathom flower]

separate channel

[acoustic hemlock]

gotcha

i think so too

[fathom flower]

what my problem is is like

i was still having my pokemon/ml conversation

and then it devolves into custom comp talk

[acoustic hemlock]

i fully agree that the channel right now is used for two different topics that would best be separated due to how different they actually are

[fathom flower]

and I've gotta pack up and leave because i literally don't know what the conversation is even about anymore

[proper sandal]

i don't think that's a channel problem necesarrily thats just how convo's evolve

[fathom flower]

it is, though

because if there was a custom comps channel i could ask them to move

in the same way ML discussions that move to M1 get moved there

i don't have anything against CC content, in fact I'd hope that a new channel for it would allow that content to thrive

[indigo crest]

as it is set up right now, #marble-art-n-collecting IS the CC discussion channel

[polar parrot]

First things first, it's part of the nature of Discord.
Second things second, it's a collective environment, the discussion is happening at its proper room and I don't think these subjects should be forced out just because you don't like them.

[fathom flower]

right, okay

[indigo crest]

the reason the convo "devolved" was because i was trying to get the channel back on topic

[fathom flower]

then, why can't we have a new channel for other JMR related discussion?

[acoustic hemlock]

we can

[indigo crest]

we have 4 channels made exclusively for different JMR event discussion

[fathom flower]

things that aren't strictly related to one of the three main series

[valid harbor]

or one of the other miscellaneous series at the matter

[indigo crest]

thats what #other-jmr-series is for

dont get me wrong im in favor of making a separate space for art, but like ramen said thats something the staff team is still discussing

[polar parrot]

Just because the server has JMR as the theme, it doesn't mean we have to stop talk about homemade tournaments, marble collections or anything else that isn't directly linked to the channel. This is a community server first and foremost.

[fathom flower]

imagine a discord server for premier league football or something where discussion of your local 5-a-side team and any crafts/arts related to the actual teams in the league were occupying the exact same space

[fathom flower]

my argument is not and has never been to stop talking about it

my argument is that the way the channels are set up is forcing unrelated topics to cohabitate

and if that means custom comps getting other-marble-talk, that's gucci

[polar parrot]

So, #marble-art-n-collecting used to be in the off topic category to separate it from the JMR series channels. Would you think that is a good idea?

[indigo crest]

i personally would leave omt where it is and just put the art channel right under it lol

[fathom flower]

sure, and a more specific title and a replacement in jmr-talk

[indigo crest]

wdym

[acoustic hemlock]

alright here's a list of things that i generally believe #marble-art-n-collecting is used for currently:

• custom comp (existing non-JMR marble competitions) discussion
• posting one-off marble races or marble creations
• posting JMR-related art
• marblearth/lore discussion
• marble photography
• other miscellaneous creative JMR-related discussion (e.g. the pokemon types chat today)

i think the consensus is that it should split into two different channels

[indigo crest]

also just out of curiosity, why would you not want a forum? imo a forum would be better bc it would allow people to showcase their art by itself and allow others to comment directly on it

[acoustic hemlock]

so the first two points would be one, and the other four would be another?

[fathom flower]

agree, and imo the first two need their own space

[indigo crest]

plus going off of what ramen just said, we could include marble photography within that forum and have different tags for drawn art/photography/etc

[fathom flower]

because it doesn't cater to spur of the moment discussion

[indigo crest]

i think #marble-art-n-collecting would be the space for the first two, and then a new channel made for the other ones

[valid harbor]

so something like "other-marble-sports" and something that means jmr creative stuff for the other right?

[fathom flower]

if you want to have a looser conversation like the Pokemon one, or just chat lore, then you can't do that in a gallery/forum

[weak vector]

as someone who posts art, the way forums r set up just doesn’t contribute to lots of discussion, it’s kinda tedious to engage w em
cuz u have to click on the forum post, join it if u like it n wanna continue the discussion, then if there r a lot that u like then it clogs up the channels list w all the joined threads
having a channel contributes to a better conversation flow

[acoustic hemlock]

yeah i agree that a separate channel would be better than a forum to encourage discussion

[indigo crest]

i mean you still could, its just one extra step to make that forum post

[polar parrot]

Not exactly, because it still receives non-competitive discussion

[indigo crest]

thats fair tho

i see what ur saying

[fathom flower]

completely agree

[valid harbor]

oh yeah true

[fathom flower]

in discords interface it's just super clunky

[weak vector]

ya that’s my main issue w it

[indigo crest]

ig the way im seeing it is that a channel would also be difficult bc there could be multiple convos going on at once about different art

[fathom flower]

that's fine thk

tho*

the issue is not multiple conversations but multiple conversations about things that aren't related at all

[weak vector]

it’s a worthy sacrifice, i’d rather have multiple convos going then having to hop back n forth btwn multiple threads

[indigo crest]

thats fair

[fathom flower]

people have multiple conversations going in the ML and m1 channels all the time

i imagine in a custom comp channel there would be times where two different comps would be being discussed

[acoustic hemlock]

for sure

it's quite late for many staff members rn so we're still going to wait for more input but right now it seems like we're in agreement that a separate channel is the way to go

[fathom flower]

i admire the creativity behind CCs and i hope that the things i say don't come off as hostile or meant to divide ppl

i truly think that the community has a lot of strength

but I'll put it honestly: i am a JMR fan, I'm here to talk about JMR

[acoustic hemlock]

what would you feel would be a good name for a new channel for JMR related art/photography/lore etc

[fathom flower]

other-jmr-chat or jmr-creative-talk? those r kinda rough but that's the best i can think of immediately

[fathom flower]

• i also do say all of this in mind that i imagine the "i want to talk about x and not see x" is probably an issue the other way around for some CC people

[acoustic hemlock]

yeah, it's a valid concern from both sides

[fathom flower]

and a separate channel would also give an outlet for JMR conversations that segue into CC discussions without potentially interrupting active art/random talk

so ya

[acoustic hemlock]

how about jmr-fanworks for the channel name?

[polar parrot]

I may have sound a bit too aggressive here, in order to reinforce our goal to give users a space to show off their creativity.
But we have noticed the growing demand and are moving forward with implementation of the new chat. Thank you for the suggestion!

[opal plover]

as the resident on this server that shares the most CCs, I agree with what millim is saying; I kinda want to have a seperate channel for CCs

thatd be cool

[fathom flower]

that could def work

[fathom flower]

yeah, it's something i hope CC enjoyers could get a lot of use out of

[wraith basin]

How about a direct collab between the server and here?

[acoustic hemlock]

how so

[opal plover]

oh thats a good idea

[wraith basin]

Like you used to do with AML, strongly suggest people move to MI server to discuss all things ccs

[acoustic hemlock]

actually we discussed doing something like that as well recently

specifically for people who want to post continual updates of their comps

[fathom flower]

that seems potentially undesirable

[small willow]

The only thing that could stop people is the server join limit
Like as in how many servers a user can join

[acoustic hemlock]

we will still definitely have a channel on this server for general comp discussion, but for people posting continual updates (that we used to direct to servers like AML), we might broaden the server list to a few others

including the invites

[fathom flower]

conversations can change quickly and i can imagine people having a CC conversation may not want to move to an entirely different server

[acoustic hemlock]

CC conversations don't need to move

it's specifically for people who want to like

post results of an event as it's happening

[fathom flower]

hmmm, alright

that makes sense

[small willow]

Ig for now you could just ignore the CC talk until a solution is found and agreed by the staff

[acoustic hemlock]

tbh the only reason we haven't fully decided rn is cuz most staff are sleeping

[burnt fulcrum]

eepy staff

[small willow]

Smh

[acoustic hemlock]

it def won't take longer than a few hours or so for us to decide on and implement the changes

[fathom flower]

i kinda don't want to exclude CC people more because it feels like there's a strong interest in including this content in the server, and i don't disagree with that

[acoustic hemlock]

yep

as someone who likes basically everything that goes on in other-marble-talk, i'm a strong supporter of letting all enjoyers of various parts of it have their space to talk about what they like

[fathom flower]

yep, having diverse conversations is great

[warm stump]

has also been used for finding IRL marbles, sharing places to buy them, identifying them, sharing pics of your marble collection, etc.

[fathom flower]

it's just difficult for, say, there to be someone asking for input on their CC
and i want to talk about something else that can only go in there, but i can't talk about that without ignoring them

so it comes off as rude
but in reality they're two vastly different topics

[warm stump]

it's like on one hand I agree with you, but on the other finding art that was posted before is a huge pain in a text channel... you only have 50 pins and those get chewed up fast. having a forum you can use the gallery view and browse every art ever posted with big thumbnails. so it's like there's merit to both text channel and forum channel.

it's almost like #marble-art-n-collecting should stick around for general chatter with all the topics, and there should be forum channels to enshrine a piece of art or for custom comps to have their own space. maybe that can be in a single forum channel since tags are a thing and you can filter to just the art tag and use gallery view or just the custom team/comp tags and use list view or whatever...

[fathom flower]

all due respect, i think you're overestimating how much people like to use forums

[warm stump]

I'm not estimating, I use them successfully for art on other servers

all due respect, I think you may be writing them off ahead of time

[fathom flower]

they're clunky for discussion, mostly useful for archival purposes

[warm stump]

I admitted to both of those things in the above

[fathom flower]

couldn't we have a separate archive channel and a conversation channel where artists can double-post, then?

it's more channels, but the moderation burden wouldn't be any heavier, since the content would be the same

i really like the fluid space we have at the moment where it's really easy to see what's new and have an ongoing conversation that multiple people can contribute to, and a forum isn't the same

[warm stump]

artists can double post, yeah

and custom comps would pretty much just always use the forum

[fathom flower]

i also don't think ccs should just have a forum space

[warm stump]

custom comps pretty much just always create a thread at this point and those are... way way worse than forums.

[fathom flower]

first of all because an art archive and a CC content archive are too distinct to share a space

[warm stump]

filters

[fathom flower]

and because people do have very lengthy freeform conversations about CCs in general in other marble talk

and a forum just couldn't accommodate that

especially when the community seems to build very heavily on each other, and there's a lot of referencing past videos and whatnot

i really don't see what the issue is with Ramen's suggestion, especially with evie- one of the most active server artists- explaining very well the issues with forums from an artist's perspective

[polar parrot]

I think art showcases are the best use of forums that one could do. It's just much easier to find something you'd want to take a look at again, and you don't need to open a new one every time you want to update with new content

[fathom flower]

i definitely think an art gallery would be awesome

but there needs to be that and a place for fanwork/creative/general talk that's freeform

[polar parrot]

But it shouldn't mean that pure text conversations don't have a place, as you can have a continued discussion about a specific theme. They just aren't as attractive to join

But it depends on the type of discussion, it gotta be more focused to work out

[fathom flower]

fanworks and custom comps is a neat enough division imo

one is JMR related, the other isn't
if it ends up being too broad, it can always be changed in the future

[willow tundra]

personally, i dislike the ui and formatting of forums quite a bit, so much so that i essentially never use them unless i feel compelled to make a point

[small willow]

Well youre here now

[willow tundra]

well, using context clues and the final eight words of my message, you can conclude that i feel compelled to make a point

[small willow]

So

Whats the point?

[willow tundra]

well, as you can see, i'm typing

[small willow]

Well, as you can see, im not forcing you to answer immediately

[slender lake]

Yeah I agree, as much as the MB tries, text channels will always appear more welcoming and fun.

[willow tundra]

seriously windows why did you feel the need to respond to my messages and only my messages snarkily

[fathom flower]

hard agree, there's a time and a place but text channels are much more fun and casual

[willow tundra]

the way the forums are structured makes them basically invisible with how i use discord. i don't know if it's some sort of setting or if my brain is just stupid, but whenever i see something new in a forum channel, it doesn't click with me that i should read through it at all. i don't remember the last time i used #1019680475234705488 if i ever did, and the last time i remember even looking in #1019678563139584010 is when a moderator told me to use the channel to suggest something. in a specifically art context, i looked at project marblearth's art gallery exactly once when it was made and never again, which is such a shame because i really enjoy looking at works by the talented people on the server.

i definitely agree that a distinction between a jmr-fan-works text channel and an other-marble-content text channel would be useful

especially since not all jmr-fan-works are strictly an image or video

[warm stump]

in a specifically art context, i looked at project marblearth's art gallery exactly once when it was made and never again
I've heard that forum channel was successful, so I wonder if echoing new forum posts to a relevant text channel would help people like you. like we echo any new threads to a staff channel to keep track of them. echoing a subset of tags for #1019680475234705488 to #marble-art-n-collecting could hep with that type of engagement.

[small willow]

Well a forum channel is kinda a hassle to access

[fathom flower]

personally as a very active user of marblearth, i really disagree with that decision to make a forum

[small willow]

Absolutely agreed

Plus now its all clumped into one

[fathom flower]

i understand and respect it, but it's not fun to engage with, and it penalizes reading things without replying to them + often it's very unclear whether new things have been posted or not

[small willow]

I mean technically theres this thing to allow you to
Get notifs? Or something

But its a hassle nonetheless

[willow tundra]

if i wake up tomorrow and there's a new forum channel i will be cry

[warm stump]

nah, #1019680475234705488 covers all the forum/archiving needs

[small willow]

I mean
Spex can you do it for fun

[warm stump]

it has the tags to cover that bit

has Custom Art, Custom Comp, etc. tags

the question is around whether the #marble-art-n-collecting should be split up

specifically this thread is asking if there should be a separate channel for custom team/comp stuff

[willow tundra]

my support is behind the yes party

[warm stump]

historically we just booted that stuff

[willow tundra]

that's true

[small willow]

Ultimately, I think it should be a question for the wider community

Like maybe a poll or smth

[warm stump]

but with AML kinda dying down, we've been talking about reasonable ways to make room for it

it was just often kinds spammy and "name my marbles!" "look at this randomly generated stuff that happened that no one cares about!" which is why it was originally booted

but some stuff did reach some better quality

and they could just always thread, but threads are even worse than forums

[willow tundra]

i didn't like it when original creations and promos was born as an amalgamation of the art channel and the ads channel and thus pushed both into one spot

[fathom flower]

I'm obviously very in the yes party for separating custom comps and fanworks into different text channels

[indigo crest]

i personally think other marble talk should be left alone as the custom comp channel and we add another channel for art stuff

[small willow]

I personally would agree that it would make things much better

[fathom flower]

custom comps are getting very high quality nowadays and people are obviously already talking about them

[small willow]

But on how we split them, im with ocho

[willow tundra]

having more channels for more topics is always a good thing, especially since with this being a "community" server, users concerned with clutter can simply hide channels with topics they're not interested in

[warm stump]

there's a limit

[small willow]

Where we do a jmr fanworks channel then leave the other marble talk channel as the custom comp channel

[warm stump]

too many channels actually can hurt activity and quality engagement, too

[fathom flower]

fine with me

[warm stump]

it's not carte blanche more channels good

[willow tundra]

if the channels get too specific yeah

[fathom flower]

we've hardly hit that place

[willow tundra]

more channels for more active and relevant topics is what i meant

[indigo crest]

theres a ton of old archived channels that can go if need be

[willow tundra]

it does seem most people are in agreement as to how the split would go

marbrexit

[warm stump]

this is a very small group chatting, let's not jump to "most people"

[small willow]

Well, its not like we have a channel specifically for relegation talk and kobalts talk and pinkies talk, so i think its fine

[willow tundra]

most people present

[fathom flower]

it's more important to recognize that there are two distinct topics being talked about in one channel, and that has negative impacts on conversation quality

[warm stump]

it's way more than 2

[willow tundra]

i guess i should be more clear with what i'm saying

i'm tired, sorry

[indigo crest]

we actually (very briefly) considered making team channels for each team, but then we decided that was a terrible idea lmao

[small willow]

Present, as in the active fanbase or currently active in this forum?

[fathom flower]

two broad categories of conversation, then

[indigo crest]

in the forum i assume

[willow tundra]

people who are currently speaking right now

[warm stump]

#marble-art-n-collecting is also where "real marble" talk happened, buying, collecting, identifying, etc.

[small willow]

I see

[steep fractal]

smart call

[fathom flower]

fanworks and CCs

[acoustic hemlock]

i agree with ocho

[steep fractal]

considering how team servers ended up

[warm stump]

it's not just fanworks and CCs

[fathom flower]

irl marble talk can go with CCs

[small willow]

I wouldnt mind a Quicksilvers channel tho

[warm stump]

irl marble talk doesn't fit with CCs, imo

[acoustic hemlock]

oops i didnt see all the recent messages

[small willow]

Actually irl marble talk could just go in general couldnt it

[acoustic hemlock]

agree with this suggestion, i mean

[fathom flower]

i personally am not interested in JMR because i like marbles but because i like JMRs setup, hence i have no interest in CCs

[indigo crest]

lmao ur good ramen

[fathom flower]

i imagine interest in actual marbles more closely aligns with CC interest
but i wouldn't mind a carte blache for irl marble talk to be in either channel, or even general

[small willow]

Well CCs could definitely still be brought up in a channel like ML, but point taken

[acoustic hemlock]

i'd say irl marble talk can go in other marble talk with CCs

[indigo crest]

CCs and irl marbs still both fit within the scope of other marble talk

yeah what ramen said

[small willow]

Thats true

[opal plover]

agree with this

[willow tundra]

i also agree

[warm stump]

yeah, 100% not for me, I hate CCs and irl marble talk was all about identifying and collecting the same marbles JMR uses

[fathom flower]

yeah, if other marble talk was kept that name-wise it could easily accommodation both

[willow tundra]

that's a bit rude considering who are present

[fathom flower]

especially since CC people tend to be the ones buying and collecting marbles

so they're generally more knowledgeable

[small willow]

Considering like we have two people who run custom comps present and a fan of CCs, yea a lil rude
But i respect it nonetheless

[warm stump]

I have rare exceptions, yours being one of them

it has been exceedingly rare for me to have interest in CCs, mostly I like irl marbles and JMR stuff

point being that interest overlap is not some static thing

[slender lake]

I think generally we (custom comp people) should tone down the references to them when in JMR talk, I have a feeling thats where some of the distaste comes from.

[fathom flower]

that's completely fine, though I'd still say that in terms of "marble things unrelated to JMR" they are topically related

[warm stump]

but irl marbles for me was all about the JMR marbles

so...

[willow tundra]

how often does irl marble discussion happen currently?

[warm stump]

I don't care about non-JMR marbles all that much

[willow tundra]

(just curious with this question)

[warm stump]

irl marble talk was huge for a while, not sure about this year

[fathom flower]

i do agree, but i want to make it clear my suggestion isn't out of distaste but rather a desire to see a space for those conversations to happen

[warm stump]

I've been way less active this year

[polar parrot]

This too, people need to be mindful about adequate channel usage

[fathom flower]

it seems very uncommon

[opal plover]

they arent for everybody and thats okay with me

[small willow]

I mean, yea

[fathom flower]

most people who buy irl marbles seem to use them either for custom comps or fanwork photography

[small willow]

Ive definitely had some disdain towards custom comps being consistently mentioned

[warm stump]

we had tons of posts of people collecting irl marble JMR teams

[slender lake]

dw I wasnt accusing you of that, I just get this odd feeling of the mood being brought down whenever custom comp people bring them up in general JMR talk.

[small willow]

Unless absolutely necessary

[warm stump]

some trying to get the full team collection

some trying to get all the SMR marbles

etc.

[small willow]

Ha well good luck to anyone whos trying

[fathom flower]

well yeah, because the two are only tangentially related

[polar parrot]

Sometimes, just discussion of marble types in general

[willow tundra]

the mods can crack harder down to try and stay on topic in other channels when it comes to ccs as we see for any channel and topic in the server. for example, three minutes ago in #marble-league.

[slender lake]

I could very well be wrong because I mostly try to stay out of these types of disagreements.

[warm stump]

mostly we've just never created a good space for CCs, it's always been kinda tacked on or shoved out

[fathom flower]

and a lot of the time it feels like trying to be quirky/funny

[small willow]

Well we always go off topic eventually

[fathom flower]

since they're so big now i really don't see a way out of this that isn't creating a dedicated space

[willow tundra]

ban it entirely

[warm stump]

yeah

[small willow]

Too harsh

[willow tundra]

(joke marker)

[small willow]

Oh

[willow tundra]

(i forgot to include it)

[small willow]

Mb

[fathom flower]

damn, big brain

[warm stump]

I mean we did for a while

[willow tundra]

yeah it was pretty sad

[fathom flower]

right, but that's not going to work anymore

[polar parrot]

Well, I don't think the intention of this thread should to create a brawl

[warm stump]

heh, yeah, thankfully no one is brawling

[polar parrot]

Why forcing a split in the community?

[small willow]

Lets change that

[warm stump]

I don't think anyone is forcing a split in the community

[slender lake]

???

[warm stump]

Windows is being sarcastic

don't worry, y'all

[willow tundra]

quick put the (joke marker)

[slender lake]

Windows meet me in the JML Server, Toxic Reapers channel /j

[small willow]

Ok

[indigo crest]

i think leaving custom comp discussion in other marble talk should work enough as a dedicated space for them, and we can stick with what we did before where discussion of CCs is okay but if you want to post full results/events/etc (anything bordering on or considered spam) you go somewhere else like aml

[willow tundra]

from what i am reading currently since i have arrived in the conversation, i have surmised that most people actively talking are in favor of some sort of channel split, and the main discourse is as to what things would be in which channel

to clarify i am not a mind reader so this is only supposition

[warm stump]

or #1019680475234705488 and use the Custom Comp tag

[indigo crest]

then what is the point of other marble talk

[acoustic hemlock]

let's leave both options open

[warm stump]

which basically gives them their own channel

[warm stump]

totally

[slender lake]

i'm open to a custom comp - other marble talk split

[willow tundra]

to have a non-dedicated space for talking about such things

[opal plover]

I might use that for when I want to talk CCs

[willow tundra]

instead of "here's the entire season i am making in one channel" it's "hey i wanna talk about this thing that happened in this one event" and such

[slender lake]

custom comps have grown by like 10x over since late 2021 imo

[warm stump]

fair point

[fathom flower]

and frankly fanworks are also pretty active nowadays

[indigo crest]

i could see that

[willow tundra]

like how if you want to make a marble league simulator, you would make a forum channel, but if you just wanted to share some stats you could just post it in #marble-league

[warm stump]

fanworks have never not been active afaik

[fathom flower]

yeah, like that

and for casual chat

people really like referencing custom comps in JMR channels

and then talking about them

[willow tundra]

now i'm not pointing fingers

(end of sentence)

[indigo crest]

hold on let me make sure im getting this right, we would be putting both custom comps and fan art in the forum and not changing other marble talk?

[willow tundra]

nono

[polar parrot]

Both have seen a recent uptick recently

[fathom flower]

this is honestly even worse than the status quo

[acoustic hemlock]

still separate channels, with the forum being open for either

[opal plover]

way to throw me under the bus

[indigo crest]

lmao yeah thats what i thought too, i wanted to make sure

[acoustic hemlock]

that's what it should be

[fathom flower]

i didn't specify you

[indigo crest]

yeah that makes a lot more sense

[slender lake]

ah so it's mild coexisting

[fathom flower]

largely because it's not just you

[opal plover]

i was joking lol

[indigo crest]

ig my question at that point is why have the forum if both things already have channels

[willow tundra]

other-marble-talk can remain as a talk for other marble content, like cc's
[new channel] can be introduced as a place to share jmr-ish media
marble-forums can remain as a place to have dedicated, long running channels on various topics, as it currently does

[fathom flower]

because spex likes forums and he's in charge

[opal plover]

I like this idea

[slender lake]

maybe so people dont have to deal with threads idk

[fathom flower]

based

[indigo crest]

this makes sense

[warm stump]

long running stuff, yeah, what flami said

[polar parrot]

To keep it short, for everybody

[willow tundra]

one of the most recent forums in #1019680475234705488 is "What is best marble of each team?" which is clearly a #marble-league topic, but put in marble forum so that the discussion can be extended for a longer period of time without being disruptive

[warm stump]

also would love for fanwork stuff to get double-posted to the forum for easy browsing in gallery view

[indigo crest]

i think thats up to the people posting it to decide if thats something they want to do

[willow tundra]

mhm

[warm stump]

and was thinking about trubbish posting forum posts tagged with custom art to the text channel

being like "yo, new art!"

[willow tundra]

anyways i need to go write about 200 words in 1 hour and 6 minutes brb

[fathom flower]

that sounds fine to me

[warm stump]

and custom comp stuff could do similarly

[fathom flower]

i agree with you Spex on disliking CCs for the most part

and the way i see this is a way of making the server better for people who aren't interested in CCs

[warm stump]

and mind you, that's not us saying we dislike the people, just everyone has different interests and we're trying to figure out how to support all those interests

[fathom flower]

and people who are

[opal plover]

I will say again that CCs aren't for everyone, and I'm okay with that

[indigo crest]

yeah thats fair, CCs arent for everyone in the same way that fanart isnt for everyone

[opal plover]

you like what you like and I won't force you to change what you like

[fathom flower]

because the two groups keep rubbing up against each other unnecessarily

[willow tundra]

it's time for us to go our separate ways...

[small willow]

Idk on the extreme end we do something akin to counting, where we need a role to access it
On the extreme end tho

A split by itself should be fine

[indigo crest]

nah i dont think more role locks are a good idea lol

[fathom flower]

i really see no need for that at a

[indigo crest]

we have so many roles as it is

[fathom flower]

all*

[small willow]

True

Plus theres a role limt

I think

[warm stump]

in my head #marble-art-n-collecting stays for fanworks and irl marbles, and we create a new #custom-comps text channel where we can direct CC people who may be chatting in JMR channels, etc.

[polar parrot]

Nah, it's just a design flaw that we now are working to minimize

[willow tundra]

if you want to hide a channel, individuals can just do this to avoid seeing the content

[indigo crest]

i feel like other marble talk should be for CCs and other stuff and then we make a new channel for art

[fathom flower]

basically this seems to be the idea most other people have except in your view fanworks take the old channel

[warm stump]

yeah, I think older Discord users are still forgetting about this new-ish feature

[opal plover]

good idea

[acoustic hemlock]

i don't really think it matters which other marble talk becomes and which one goes in the new channel

[opal plover]

I can get behind that

[small willow]

Or you just do the hide muted channels

[valid harbor]

alright so we decided that a split is good yes?
so... which ones keeping the name?

[willow tundra]

proof that i'm not just an old geezer and that i do use some of discord's new features, just not forums

[fathom flower]

agree

[indigo crest]

personally it makes more sense to me to allow fan art/photography/etc to have its own channel bc imo irl marbs and CCs are closer to each other than fanart and irl marbs

does that make sense

[small willow]

Yes

[opal plover]

yeah agree with you Ocho

[warm stump]

no, that does not make sense to me, personally

[small willow]

I mean its called “other marble”

[warm stump]

but that's because turns out people have different types of irl marble interest

[small willow]

Thats true

[warm stump]

JMR vs all the rest

[polar parrot]

I agree, one's JMR-based and the other is not

[small willow]

But i think we just interpret it differently

[fathom flower]

disagree, fanworks are closer to JMR than CCs are to JMR

[warm stump]

my interest is in JMR marbles

[indigo crest]

CCs and irl marble buying both have the same general idea of doing something with irl marbles, while art is art, but i see where it goes the other way

[fathom flower]

this

[acoustic hemlock]

jmr-fanworks
other-marble-talk (specifically non-jmr-talk, including CCs)

[warm stump]

I think irl marlbes would go in both, then

[polar parrot]

NGL, I'm a bit confused with what "irl marble" means

[warm stump]

buying marbs for CCs? goes in CC channel

[indigo crest]

like people looking to buy the marbs of JMR teams

[acoustic hemlock]

buying irl marbles specifically to collect JMR marbles, go in jmr fanworks

[indigo crest]

stuff like that

[warm stump]

wondering where to get Gliding Glaciers marbles? #marble-art-n-collecting with the fanwork stuff

[indigo crest]

i like this

[acoustic hemlock]

buying marbles for a CC or just in general, other marble talk

[steep fractal]

marble purchasing I think

[slender lake]

I'm way more concerned about the main point of #marble-art-n-collecting being taken out so suddenly. Around 75% of the talk happening in OMT is custom comp talk I feel like, does that sound insensitive?

[willow tundra]

since joining the server, i recall very few instances of someone talking about buying jmr marbles in other-marble-talk

last time i saw it was in #general

[indigo crest]

yes i agree

[steep fractal]

or at the very least finding them

[warm stump]

this breaks what is historically in that channel

#marble-art-n-collecting has all the fanworks and JMR marble stuff

it does not historically have CC stuff

[indigo crest]

other marble talk has been primarily custom comp discussion, and i dont agree with fully reversing that and putting it in a completely different channel

[warm stump]

because we booted that stuff

[willow tundra]

but it's not history anymore, it's the present, and presently it has a significantly higher portion of custom comp talk

[warm stump]

not in the pins

[fathom flower]

how long is historically

[warm stump]

look at the pins

[indigo crest]

maybe not historically, but recently it has been mostly custom comps

[polar parrot]

I just see it as collecting, "irl" can be anything physical marbles

[slender lake]

3-4 years I believe

[warm stump]

I don't want to redo all the fanwork pins, pls

[slender lake]

so 2019-2020

[acoustic hemlock]

spex i feel like you're mixing general non-JMR marble content discussion and people constantly posting competition results (which is what we moved to other servers)

[fathom flower]

because over the last 6 months it really has mostly been CC content

[willow tundra]

the pins are still history

[steep fractal]

yeah, thought so too

[acoustic hemlock]

the latter we moved to other servers, the former has never been unwelcome here afaik?

[warm stump]

all the pins in #marble-art-n-collecting are fanworks

and JMR marble info

[fathom flower]

that said

in the pins context, i do agree with fanworks taking other marble talk, albeit with a rename

[valid harbor]

dammit i hate it when both parties are right in a way

[warm stump]

yeah, renames can happen

[fathom flower]

because the pins are, as Spex points out, not CC relevant

[willow tundra]

keep the legacy of other-marble-talk by not removing the pins but still have the topic change as described above

[warm stump]

[slender lake]

the pain of a debate

[acoustic hemlock]

then sure, make other-marble-talk the jmr-fanworks

[small willow]

I hate it more when both are agreeable and right

[acoustic hemlock]

and make the other channel for custom comps and non-JMR related things

[indigo crest]

delete every channel except general 💯

(lego will delete general again)

[fathom flower]

to be honest as a recent server user (relatively) i kinda assumed that CC talk had always been welcome in OMT

[acoustic hemlock]

i don't see an issue with that if that's what makes sense considering the pins

[steep fractal]

the ultimate option

[warm stump]

I'd name it #marble-art tbh, doesn't have to strictly be jmr art/photos yeah?

[slender lake]

ive done it so much times due to my club and it sucks that sometimes both sides prove valid points LOL

[willow tundra]

so is the proposal rename #marble-art-n-collecting to #marble-media or whatever
create a new channel called #marble-art-n-collecting that will be empty and for ccs and such

[fathom flower]

i mean I'd prefer if there was no CC talk

[slender lake]

its skyrocketed since 2023 I think

[small willow]

So, youre basically allowing CC fanart in there too?

That sounded rude

[indigo crest]

well yeah CC talk would be in its own channel

[slender lake]

there wasnt much in 2022

[fathom flower]

and also that lore talk can go in there

[slender lake]

just a couple of promotions and sneak peeks whatnot

[warm stump]

well yeah, art wouldn't be competitions, I think

[polar parrot]

The pins make sense, since they're influenced by the server's general theme

[slender lake]

so I doubt there was much in 2021

[fathom flower]

but people post a lot of CC art and graphic design in OMT

[polar parrot]

But the name of the channel would no longer make sense

[small willow]

Yup

[polar parrot]

Too generic

[acoustic hemlock]

i feel like a simple way to distinguish what goes where should be whether its JMR related or not

[warm stump]

sure, but that would then be CC specific so would go in some CC channel

[fathom flower]

which i wouldn't want in a jmr-relayed channel

[indigo crest]

i agree

[fathom flower]

just as long as that's made clear

[valid harbor]

time to shine
art in itself isnt restricted to kust paintings or pictures, it can be literally any medium. music works, sculptures or dioramas work, digital works, and writing works, anything as long as it has a creative process. i think

[warm stump]

yeah, for sure, I think it would be

[warm stump]

sure, that seems fine

[small willow]

Honestly i prefer the term fanwork over art

[warm stump]

which is my hope, tbh

[slender lake]

maybe rename creations and promos to just promotion? or is that going too far

transfer the creations part to that channel

[warm stump]

if someone takes a pic of non-JMR marbles in an artistic way that isn't a competition... I don't think that should go in a CC channel

[fathom flower]

fanwork is a good term

[valid harbor]

oh yeah fanwork works even better as it sounds more general

[warm stump]

fanwork is more strict than I think it needs to be

[fathom flower]

because it also includes general marblearth talk

[willow tundra]

fanwork? the work of a fan? the work created specifically by a fan?

as opposed to an enemy's work

[fathom flower]

it's an incredibly all-encompassing term

anything that involves creative processes or reinterpretation can be fanwork

[indigo crest]

i feel like we already had an agreed upon solution earlier with just making another channel and this has gotten more complicated than it needs to

[slender lake]

enemy is just too harsh! we should just label them as the opposition

[willow tundra]

it's not an agreed upon solution if not everyone agrees

[valid harbor]

yeah semantics dont really matter here

[willow tundra]

it's gotten more complicated because some people still have concerns

which is how discussion works

[warm stump]

glad some of y'all agree, I don't yet, I'm still working out the details because this is nuanced and that's okay

[fathom flower]

imo i think the first step is agreeing we need two different channels

[warm stump]

no need to rush, this isn't an emergency, we're getting there

[acoustic hemlock]

i feel like that has been agreed upon already

[indigo crest]

yeah, i think everyone is on board with 2 separate channels

[fathom flower]

that's good

[warm stump]

yep

[slender lake]

this is the general consensus yes

[small willow]

What we name it is another can of worms apparently

[polar parrot]

For me, the demand to split off the types of content is clear

[indigo crest]

marble 1 and marble 2

[slender lake]

its more of the name has a direct impact on whats included in the channel

[warm karma]

from what I've noticed, often times when I post art there's a delayed reaction to when people notice it...which is more time for people to come in and change the topic - usually to CCs, and then my work gets buried

[indigo crest]

we makin generals 3 through 7

[warm stump]

I think the CC one is pretty easy, just figuring out how we'll manage the non-CC one, I think it needs to be the broader one, but some sound like it needs to be the less broad one

[faint yacht]

channel and channell

[slender lake]

the line has kinda blurred between this and that

[steep fractal]

soon enough

[small willow]

I read this as marbula 1 and 2

[steep fractal]

we'll get general infinity

[indigo crest]

marbula 2

[faint yacht]

what if we name one marble and the other one marbles

[willow tundra]

you can only have one marble

[small willow]

Time to revive general 3 guys

[indigo crest]

oh man general 3 lmao

[faint yacht]

yeah bring it back

[slender lake]

General Three is goated

[small willow]

But back on track here

[warm stump]

the simplest is leave #marble-art-n-collecting alone, we can discuss renaming it on a less urgent basis. but all CC stuff should no longer go there or any other channel and we create a new channel exclusively for it. any long-running CC stuff should go in a thread if you want or a forum post in #1019680475234705488, otherwise chatter away.

[fathom flower]

this would work in the immediate future tbh, so it sounds good

[indigo crest]

i still dont think just completely pushing custom comps out of the channel is a great idea, just bc there arent any CCs in the pins doesnt mean theres no CC history in that channel

[small willow]

And what about the JMR game?
Does posting final results of a season go in the “CC” channel it current OMT?

[indigo crest]

theres already a thread for the jmr game

[warm stump]

sure, but the CC history in that channel is smaller, so migrating anything is more manageable

[indigo crest]

i think in #🎮gaming

[small willow]

Ah

[acoustic hemlock]

JMR game stuff should go in the thread

[small willow]

I have #🎮gaming hidden

[fathom flower]

future custom comp content shouldn't be in there

[indigo crest]

rip

[warm stump]

oh, yeah, I mean new stuff

[faint yacht]

here's the renames we should do:
#general - marble 1
#birthdays - marble 2
#spoilers - secret marble
#marble-league - team marble
#marble-rally - solo marble
#marbula-one - duo marble
#other-jmr-series - channel marble
#marble-art-n-collecting - more marble

[willow tundra]

renaming a channel would not remove the pins, so if needed, we could simply rename #marble-art-n-collecting to be a fanworks channel or however it would be named

[indigo crest]

yeah i was responding to windows

[warm stump]

no new CC stuff in other places

[willow tundra]

(if needed)

[warm stump]

anything that can be migrated, go for it, if not no big deal

[small willow]

Agreed

[acoustic hemlock]

my proposal:
rename other marble talk to other-jmr-talk (and use it for fanworks)
create a new channel specifically for custom comps, and be lenient about people posting photography/irl collections there too

[warm stump]

I have some issues with that

[acoustic hemlock]

i don't really feel like we need to be so particular about which of the two needs to encompass photography and irl marble collection

[indigo crest]

i agree with that in principle but i think other jmr talk and other jmr series could get confused

[small willow]

I think people would just confuse #other-jmr-series and other jmr talk

[indigo crest]

yeah

[acoustic hemlock]

sure, it doesn't have to be that exact name

[indigo crest]

yeah i agree 100%, it feels like we are getting caught up on semantics here

[warm stump]

I have a gut feeling that artworks for art don't want to be lumped in with CC as CC chatter doesn't mix well with it

[indigo crest]

boiled down, people want two separate channels

[acoustic hemlock]

but it isn't? artworks are staying in the potentially renamed other marble talk and CCs have its new channel

[fathom flower]

blanket rule "no discussing CCs" should do it

[acoustic hemlock]

or am i missing something

[warm stump]

what you said earlier:

create a new channel specifically for custom comps, and be lenient about people posting photography/irl collections there too

[small willow]

Just say stuff in announcements and itll be fine

[warm stump]

I disagree with that

[polar parrot]

I think it's worth to add some historical context. You could speak better for that, but I've seen the server and community (± before 2021/22) weren't as open for alt marble content as they are now, although they did coexist with JMR topics since then

[acoustic hemlock]

what if someone buys marbles specifically for the purpose of their competition

[warm stump]

then that goes in CC, yeah

[acoustic hemlock]

and chooses to put that in the CC channel

[indigo crest]

imo photography falls under fan work so that would go in the jmr fan work channel

[warm stump]

we said earlier irl marble stuff probably just splits itself

[indigo crest]

buying marbs just goes into whichever one it fits in

[warm stump]

some goes in with the art channel, some goes in with CC

[acoustic hemlock]

okay

i'm good with that

[fathom flower]

for irl marble photos there are two questions:

1. are you doing it for a cc? if yes , immediately go to cc channel
2. are they jmrbles? if no, also go to CC channel

[warm stump]

basically if CC, go to CC. if not, it's probably chill for #marble-art-n-collecting

[fathom flower]

that's how i see it, anyway

[willow tundra]

here's what i'm imagining, disregarding channels' previous uses and histories for the sake of argument:
"other-marble-talk" is a channel for discussion, posting about, and otherwise talking about other marbles. in this context, "other" means anything "other" than jmr's competitions. it is the unambiguous home for custom comps. it can also be used for cases such as irl marble purchasing, talk about marble-related products, or anything encompassing marbles not related to jmr. the channel's purpose is left intentionally broad, so it can work as a catch-all in addition to its cc-containing purposes.

"jmr-fanwork" is a channel for media created by fans of jmr, in any form that may take. this includes digital and traditional art, photography, contraptions using jmr marbles, and more, with the through-line being that it's somewhat related to jmr. "if in doubt, you can use other-marble-talk." the channel would also include discussion on said works; it is primarily a creative and creation-sharing channel. this makes the split more relative to medium rather than topic, and this channel would be the one with a slightly more strict content allowance

(oops i took to long to type and everyone else agreed on something else)

(nevermind)

[warm stump]

#marble-art-n-collecting as an object, regardless of name, is not going to be the place for CC

[indigo crest]

what about changing the current other marble talk to jmr fanwork and making a new other marble talk

does that sound good for everyone

[willow tundra]

yeah

[fathom flower]

yes

[faint yacht]

that would work imo

[warm stump]

no

[willow tundra]

this is why i specifically said the disclaimer at the start

[warm stump]

because I don't think it needs to be strictly jmr

[indigo crest]

marble fanwork and other marble talk

[willow tundra]

marble-media

[fathom flower]

what is there other than jmr and CC?

[acoustic hemlock]

marble fanwork and other marble competitions?

[indigo crest]

OMC

[warm stump]

"I bought a pretty marble and took pics of it in the forest" have been done

[indigo crest]

stealing my swag smh

[polar parrot]

Looks like it's gonna work better

[warm stump]

and doesn't belong in CC

[acoustic hemlock]

i like flami's suggestion

marble media is a good name to encompass a broad range of things

[fathom flower]

fanworks is fine then, since if you're in this server it's safe to assume you were inspired by JMR

[indigo crest]

keep in mind we have 3 catch-all channels that exist for things that dont fit perfectly within the scope of a channel, #general #birthdays #off-topic

[willow tundra]

ah so you're proposing that ccs be completely, utterly quarentined instead of having a home in a relatively catch-all channel

[warm stump]

I agree

[warm stump]

not so much quarantined, as enshrined

[fathom flower]

and you're not gonna be making that marble coach of the Pieces of Crap team in your new custom comp

[faint yacht]

I think it would just be easier to have a #jmr-fanworks channel first and foremost and then we could figure out semantics later

[warm stump]

I think that's way too narrow, imo

[fathom flower]

fanworks not fanart

[indigo crest]

yes i agree with danda

[fathom flower]

but otherwise sure

[faint yacht]

fanworks yeah

[indigo crest]

yeah

[willow tundra]

fanworks? I SURE HOPE IT DOES

[indigo crest]

HEYO

[acoustic hemlock]

this is kinda unrelated but can you like not constantly reference that as a representative for all custom comps to paint CCs in a negative light? because that's what it feels like rn.

not all CCs have silly team names like that and i feel like its a disservice to judge CCs based on one team name in a competition that's rather obscure and isn't even run by someone in the marblebase (i think)

[warm stump]

my hesitancy with the word "fanwork" is usually it means it should be based on something you're a fan of, in this case JMR. and while everyone here is brought here by JMR or inspired by JMR, I want it to be very chill for people to post non-JMR marbles and marble works in there so long as they aren't a CC.

[indigo crest]

and we can include that in the channel description

[warm stump]

and I want to make it really easy to find the CC place so people feel like it's welcome here, so don't want it to just be an "other" place.

[willow tundra]

marblefan-work

[polar parrot]

IMO, whatever the fanwork channel is, I still believe we should make it clear it's for JMR-based works, otherwise we can still put homemade tournaments in the mix

[willow tundra]

~~ that way it's work by marblefans instead of fanwork~~

[faint yacht]

I mean yeah here we go

[fathom flower]

at least that one's silly, i can bring up the numerous other problems i have if you'd like

[faint yacht]

problem solved

[acoustic hemlock]

i really wouldn't

[warm stump]

other way around

[indigo crest]

theres no perfect way to separate jmr fan art, non-JMR fan art, and CCs

[warm stump]

I want the CC channel to be really clear it's for CCs

the media channel can be non-JMR stuff if it's non-CC

[fathom flower]

bet 👍

[faint yacht]

agreed, so I think we should just try something now and then fix as we go imo

[willow tundra]

marble... works?

[indigo crest]

marble-fanwork and other-marble-talk

[warm stump]

I don't agree

[indigo crest]

i sure hope it does...

[willow tundra]

hey...o?

[indigo crest]

lmao

[fathom flower]

i also don't agree

[faint yacht]

marble gotta pay the bills somehow

[fathom flower]

there'd a pretty perfect way to segregate CC content

[warm stump]

CCs go in one place and all its related stuff, fanworks/art/media go in another place

that's easy

[indigo crest]

my point is, non-JMR fan art can fit into either of those two channel concepts

[fathom flower]

and it's by saying that if it's CC it goes in the CC channel

[polar parrot]

The way it's going, it looks we wanna fully isolate small leagues and position them as less important for the community

[willow tundra]

there's no perfect way to separate jmr fan art, non-JMR fan art, and CCs without there being at least a small subset of the population who feel it could be done better because this is in theory all subjective

[indigo crest]

perfect, then we make marble-fanart and a custom comp channel

[fathom flower]

well, this is a JMR discussion server

[faint yacht]

yeah this could work

[small willow]

This honestly feels like relegation talk again, where we go around and around in circles

[faint yacht]

at least for the time being

[warm stump]

we want to reduce the scatter and make it easier for people to engage with CCs

[indigo crest]

do we have a majority agreement of renaming #marble-art-n-collecting to marble-fanart and adding another channel called custom-comps or something

[faint yacht]

again I think we should just do something right now and then fix as we go if it ain't perfect right away so we aren't just going in circles discussing the idea of it

[acoustic hemlock]

my overall point is that i feel like it's become 'okay' to rag on CCs for various reasons and considering the time and effort people put into them, it can become seriously demotivating

people are entitled to not like CCs but why is it okay to be like "CCs suck" when you wouldn't appreciate it if someone spoke about how they disliked a particular artwork because the interpretation of whatever marble or character wasn't to their liking?

sorry, i just had to get that out there

[small willow]

We could set up a quick poll

[faint yacht]

this is facts

[fathom flower]

i understand what you mean

[polar parrot]

Yes, the theme is JMR, but again, it doesn't mean that non-JMR marbles don't deserve a space for discussion, because people in the community watch JMR and feel inspired to build their own leagues

[fathom flower]

but tbh i say what i say because ccs are having a negative impact on my enjoyment of this server and community

[willow tundra]

like, think of it like if someone was consistently ragging on how the pinkies aren't pink, but then you're a uniform designer and everyoen gets on the case of... the entire profession of uniform designing because of just the pinkies uniform

[polar parrot]

It's still a component that helps the community to take shape.

[willow tundra]

(the server is called the marblebase, not jelle's marblebase, which means we also need to rename the server in order for everything to fit in properly /j)

[fathom flower]

if ccs had their own appropriate space that people who liked them could engage with and i could ignore forever i would be much nicer about CCs

[willow tundra]

that is

uh

[warm stump]

can also word that the other way around for CC enjoyers

[faint yacht]

can we go back to this, how are we feeling on this

[willow tundra]

concerning

[polar parrot]

Be mindful of everybody, not just the things you like

[fathom flower]

sounds gucci

[willow tundra]

i don't want to make things too heavy but "if i shove everyone who thinks a certain way into a small dark corner of society, i can ignore them, and then i can stop hating them!" is an eerily familiar mindset, even if it is at a much smaller scale

[polar parrot]

There are people here who literally just message in off topic channels like #⚽sports, does that make them less valuable due to not talking strictly JMR?

[fathom flower]

okay, can people be mutually mindful that i don't like or watch ccs, that I'm not alone in that and randomly bringing them up in jmr conversations derails things? if so, then sure

[warm stump]

can we please not try to shove something through? this isn't urgent. it's okay to talk about the needs people have from the channels.

[willow tundra]

that's specifically an issue with how individuals act rather than an issue with custom comps as a whole

[slender lake]

thats fine, I would like it if it was more other-marble-sports or something, custom-comps is sort of a wacky name if you get what i mean

[indigo crest]

yes, and from my understanding of this conversation, it seems that the majority of people like that idea and we are just talking in circles over minute details at this point

[willow tundra]

like if there was a lesbian like me and they were loud and annoying and then someone based their entire perception of lesbians on that one person oh wait

[indigo crest]

lmao yeah i get that

[acoustic hemlock]

i think in general, CC or other fanworks, people should be respectful of people's different interests and the effort people invest in them

[polar parrot]

Ah yes, I don't like the term "custom comp" that much

[warm stump]

we're not going in circles, we're focusing in on next steps and it hasn't been that long of a discussion, can we please stop trying to rush it? no one has said we won't do anything today. I know I'm replying to you, but it's not just you, you're just the latest to say "drop everything and just do something." this isn't an emergency. just asking for some calm.

[fathom flower]

i respect CCs but i don't have to like them

[small willow]

One bad sheep would certainly impact people’s view of things

[slender lake]

well the term is fine, I just think that the term doesn't fit as a channel name

[warm stump]

details matter, that's okay

[indigo crest]

yeah i agree, at the end of the day its just a different medium based off the same original thing

[fathom flower]

they're noble and positive creative efforts but people involved with them seem kinda blind to the idea that people may not share an interest

[warm karma]

respect to CCs and CC creators, but usually the first conversation to bury my art is because of a CC discussion

[indigo crest]

what about like "other marble comps" or is it the comps part that makes it wacky

[fathom flower]

agree with toffee

same with lore discussion

[willow tundra]

as i keep saying, that's an issue with how individuals behave

[indigo crest]

yeah, thats why people want to give them both their own channels so that doesnt happen anymore

[acoustic hemlock]

that's the whole reason why we're separating it

so that it doesnt have to be one versus the other

[small willow]

Yea

[slender lake]

I think thats fine enough, certainly better than just #custom-comps.

[willow tundra]

building resentment against something because individuals propegate issues not specific to the actual subject is not productive.

[acoustic hemlock]

i'm good with this name

[fathom flower]

talking lore -> hey that jmr rivalry reminds me of (insert cc) -> long conversation about CC you've never heard of that you can't interrupt because it is on topic

[warm stump]

didn't realize custom comps was problematic as a name, appreciate that feedback

[small willow]

Other marble talk or other marble comps or just marble competitions is fine with me imo

[warm stump]

yeah, I think CC stuff is more than "other marble talk" as it usually is about creating teams, creating competitions, etc. "marble competitions" makes sense, but seeing now how that might not capture it either

that's interesting

[indigo crest]

we can include "talk about your custom comps" in the channel description

[acoustic hemlock]

other-marble-comps is a good name imo

[slender lake]

Like I stated, the term itself is fine enough even the "CC Community" refers to ourselves by the name out of pure habit. We aren't making an active effort to change that, of course I don't speak for everyone but I'm fine with the term as long as it isnt use to actively insultt he hardwork of people.

I'm just generally nitpicky with how discord channels are named and the MB Channels are very pleasantly named, so I wouldn't want a weird looking channel named custom comps to ruin that pleasantry.

[polar parrot]

I think that's an issue as well, it's repetitive behavior that derails a convo. But it's a case for enforcing the proper channel use rule on the individual, not calling to limit discussion of an entire subject

[willow tundra]

that repetitive behaviour isn't specific to custom comps

it also applies to people bringing up the other series in the series channels

and someone posting a random meme every time a subject is so much as mentioned

[indigo crest]

yeah i think thats a separate larger issue

[polar parrot]

True, it's common to see M1 in ML and ML in MR

But it flows naturally, sometimes

[slender lake]

the custom comp issue is more evident due to it not being fully JMR related.

[warm stump]

thanks, that's helpful background

[fathom flower]

but you can't because it is on topic

it's like if you had a social space zoned for zen yoga and death metal rehearsals

and no schedule

[willow tundra]

if i were a yoga fan, i wouldn't blame the death metal rehearsals, i would blame the social space

[fathom flower]

that's my point

[small willow]

I woudlnt be against the zen yoga thing

[fathom flower]

one group of people has to go somewhere else

[slender lake]

Unfortunate that humans are designed to switch topics during convos lol

[fathom flower]

not because of any problem with them but because the social space simply can't function

[small willow]

Its just human nature

[indigo crest]

yeah, and thats the idea with the 2 channels

[valid harbor]

its especially prevalent to people who dont pick up on social cues too, something i and a lot of other folk have basically told

[fathom flower]

yep!

[willow tundra]

wait, so was the pre-split causing you to build resentment about custom comps or not? that's the thing i'm confused about

because i got the impression that it was fueling your dislike specifically against custom comps

[slender lake]

It very much is, however we should learn to adjust when it comes to channel usage as well. Once we notice that a channel gets off-topic, just switch. It isn’t that hard and it massively helps the channel stay on topic and stay relevant.

[willow tundra]

rather than just fueling a desire to split

[fathom flower]

yes, but i still respect the community and i believe they should have a space that's also independent of people who want to talk jmr fanworks

[indigo crest]

yeah and thats part of our (the staff) jobs to move the convo elsewhere when its getting too off topic for the channel it started in

[willow tundra]

i see

my argument was specifically that sharing a space shouldn't be a cause for resentment of the other party in itself, not that it would be invalid to dislike them at all

[indigo crest]

correct me if im wrong, but i assume at least some of that resentment comes from art discussion being interrupted by CC discussion?

[small willow]

That should be correct

[fathom flower]

i have complex feelings towards CCs at this point, but i believe the issue of having a cramped space exists beyond my own personal dislike
if i believed it was really just something i didn't like subjectively i wouldn't have made this suggestion

[slender lake]

I think so

[warm stump]

This is what I understand so far. Any contentions?

## Established

– Mixing custom team and competition discussion in with fanwork/art/media discussion was problematic
- Current #other-marble-talk will remain as it is with a possible rename in the very near future
  - Fanworks
  - Marble art
  - Non-competition/team IRL marble discussion
– Custom teams and competitions will get their own channel
  - Naming discussions
  - Competition discussions
  - IRL marble discussion for custom teams and competitions

## Open Questions

- What would custom team and competition fans like to call their work?
– Do we want to funnel all custom team and competition work there?

[slender lake]

some people's hardwork getting overrun by other people's hardwork

[fathom flower]

and lore/writing talk, and casual jmr talk

[warm stump]

why is this formatting so poorly?

[slender lake]

so those people whose hardwork is getting pushed up aren't happy because they spent time on those hardwork

[indigo crest]

yeah i understand that

[willow tundra]

discord is bunk

[indigo crest]

discord moment

[fathom flower]

i by no means see art as better or more worth celebrating than CCs

[small willow]

I mean
Maybe we should leave the open question for a big custom comp server, then we come back to this with an answer or smth

[warm stump]

that's fair

[fathom flower]

filming and editing and just setting up events are all hard work and worth celebrating

[slender lake]

I get it, you just want a space where everyone's work is acknowledged

[indigo crest]

yeah

[fathom flower]

but the CC community here is very big relative to the art and writing community

[slender lake]

so making another channel helps with the cramming of topics in #marble-art-n-collecting

[small willow]

So I think the marble invites server sounds good for this

[fathom flower]

yes, that's my view

[warm stump]

fansports vs fanworks, smh

[willow tundra]

create a new channel called "temp-new-channel" with an image of a tangerine to confuse everyone who isn't in this thread

[warm stump]

I like it

[indigo crest]

load bearing coconut jpg

[fathom flower]

if toffee or evie or taurean post something it's nice to have a longer conversation about it

[warm stump]

yes

[acoustic hemlock]

hopefully with the changes everyone's work can be more appreciated

[fathom flower]

(not the only artists but you know what i mean)

[small willow]

Itd be even funnier if we just made the channel name that

[fathom flower]

but when you share your discussion space with CC people you feel like you're on borrowed time

[valid harbor]

"temp new channel"
has been here for two years now

[warm stump]

makes me wonder if we had a custom comp channel in the archives...

that we can just resurrect...

[small willow]

Maybe we do

[indigo crest]

not that im seeing but we had 2 among us channels lmao

[small willow]

Time to revive the marble smack talk channel and repurpose it for tbhs

[fathom flower]

and that would be the case even if every single cc creator & fan was the nicest most patient and socially aware person ever

[faint yacht]

we do that but send a message saying there are a set of extra rules for it that must be followed exactly or you're banned from using the channel, except we don't actually post those rules

[fathom flower]

(for the record most cc people are, interpersonally, great people)

[warm stump]

load bearing coconut is still the standout for me

[willow tundra]

ok i just finished writing my homework with 5 minutes to spare

[indigo crest]

W

[valid harbor]

W

[fathom flower]

W

[willow tundra]

it was on a sensitive subject which is why i was a bit sensitive here so sorry

[warm stump]

valid

[indigo crest]

damn that means this has been going for an hour

[slender lake]

massive dub

this is probably the most active forum post to exist on this server lol

[indigo crest]

it might be

[warm stump]

#creative-lounge
#competitive-lounge

[valid harbor]

the cl twins, nice!

[fathom flower]

all due respect but competitive lounge is kinda ass

it sounds like a pvp enabled area

[warm stump]

all due respect but it's a joke

retract the claws

[small willow]

Lmao the all due respect thing again

[slender lake]

what about #competition-lounge?

oh wait its a joke

[valid harbor]

oh dangit i thought it was serious

[slender lake]

my bad

[small willow]

Cmon mr howlett dont play us like that

[slender lake]

it sounded cool too

[warm stump]

well the goal of the joke is to ignite some thoughts, so if it did that, that's a good thing

[faint yacht]

channel-marble
more-marble
art-marble

[indigo crest]

i think marble-fanworks and other-marble-comps are the names people seem to like? what do yall think of those

[warm stump]

if #competition-lounge fits, I'm not against it

[faint yacht]

bam there's our channels

[fathom flower]

sounds good

[small willow]

For now it sounds good

[acoustic hemlock]

yeah i'm in favour of those names

[slender lake]

im fine with this or what spex suggested (change competitive to competition as to not make people cry over the name)

[willow tundra]

i avoided saying my piece on custom comp stuff but for me, i really really want to have an active location where i can gush about the things i make, but i tended to avoid using #marble-art-n-collecting because of the public perception (which is a term i used in my assignment) that custom comps were viewed as inferior, especially on the algodoo end of things. i want to talk about all my ideas and concepts and prototypes that i've written and designed and coded in a space where people would listen. as cool as other servers are, this server is definitely the place where i could reach the most people, but i was always worried i'd just be ignored and told to go away

[indigo crest]

yeah, worst case we can just change them later

[faint yacht]

yeah its not like they have to be perfect right away lol

[warm stump]

#fight-club

[acoustic hemlock]

i totally get that

[indigo crest]

and we can work out what belongs in which channel as we go, too

[slender lake]

where?

[willow tundra]

art-town
SPICY-TOWN

[warm stump]

I can't talk about it

[indigo crest]

funky-town

[small willow]

Thats just marble smack talk

[willow tundra]

funky town and spicy town send it

[warm stump]

[faint yacht]

you're forgetting the most important one:
funky-town

[acoustic hemlock]

i'd love to see your ideas and concepts in more detail flami :D

[willow tundra]

a tale of two cities

[slender lake]

that is severely unfortunate, ah well better luck next time.

[indigo crest]

beat u to it

[faint yacht]

damn

I too slow

[willow tundra]

wow, both of you said funky town

i guess that means there's funky twon

[indigo crest]

heyo

[willow tundra]

actually i retract that one it was awful

[faint yacht]

funky twon

[indigo crest]

A for effort

[warm stump]

#competition-marbles
#creative-marbles

[willow tundra]

sure

[small willow]

Freak marbles

[willow tundra]

they're prototype names so we don't have to spend a month thinking of a good name right now like i do with all my teams

(ding dong bing bong, it's the top of the hour!)

[slender lake]

you spend time thinking of team names?

[valid harbor]

art-marble? dont you mean, team-primary

[willow tundra]

(if you live in a non-fractional timezone!)

[fathom flower]

these lazytown sequels are getting weird

[small willow]

Blades of Grass Glass

[willow tundra]

we are number two

[faint yacht]

no yeah lets just go with a name now and then go from there if it ends up being confusing, ain't the end of the world

[indigo crest]

what do the people who are gonna be most using these channels think is the best name

[warm stump]

we just need something the CC people are happy with, tbh

[faint yacht]

this could work for now

[slender lake]

I still dont get why those exist, stop being so special smh.

[fathom flower]

[unreal scroll]

bruhh what

[willow tundra]

wait hold on i just realized what that sounds like

[acoustic hemlock]

as a CC person, other-marble-comps is good

[slender lake]

im pretty sure every one of us would be fine with #other-marble-comps

[warm stump]

cool

[indigo crest]

aight

[slender lake]

i dont see any problem with it

[unreal scroll]

or like custom comp talk

idk

[fathom flower]

honestly spicy town was unfortunate as it is

[indigo crest]

what about the fan art people

[slender lake]

and neither should be fellow CC members

[indigo crest]

you guys good with marble fan art?

[willow tundra]

that's true i don't think they're getting greenlit for a second season

[acoustic hemlock]

tbh i consider myself part of both lol

[willow tundra]

marble fan media

(proposal)

[fathom flower]

fanworks is better because it includes writing/photography type ppl

[acoustic hemlock]

i'm not an artist but i really enjoy seeing art and photography

and marblearth stuff

[indigo crest]

yeah i meant fan works lmao

[small willow]

Nah not enough 🍊

[fathom flower]

and lore discussion/hcs

[willow tundra]

fan works is good

fan (space) works

[indigo crest]

aight cool

[fathom flower]

so yeah, fanworks

[indigo crest]

#other-jmr-series #marble-art-n-collecting

no not other jmr series

#marble-runs-n-comps

hows that look

[slender lake]

if you dont shush about that ill throw a 🍅 at you

[indigo crest]

wait where did it go

[warm stump]

holding off on changing #marble-art-n-collecting

[indigo crest]

why? seems like there is agreement

[warm stump]

and we can rename #marble-runs-n-comps

[willow tundra]

there is agreement but also we're like 12 people

[warm stump]

we'll let those communities talk about what name best fits their needs

give it some time

[indigo crest]

we can also just change it again later

[warm stump]

yep

[indigo crest]

having both channels will be confusing imo

[willow tundra]

the server has 12 hundred people (error margin of a few thousand idk how many people are actually in)

[warm stump]

lol

[indigo crest]

somewhere around 8k

[willow tundra]

12 hundred-ten people give or take four thousand

[faint yacht]

yeah if I wasnt in this convo I would have no idea what the difference between #marble-runs-n-comps and #marble-art-n-collecting

[slender lake]

lemme ping everyone in the custom comp community

[faint yacht]

I say make the switch from #marble-art-n-collecting to #marble-fanworks or whatever, seems like people here like it

[fathom flower]

an announcement could clarify things in the meantime

[faint yacht]

yeah that too

[indigo crest]

yeah exactly

[warm stump]

yeah, I have an issue with "fanworks" carte blanche

that's not all it is or will be

status quo until we have some time to chat about it

[indigo crest]

im sorry spex but from reading this conversation it seems like most of the people in here (including the people who will be using that channel) are okay with it. i think its more important to minimize the confusion between the two "other" channels before worrying about the semantics of its name.

[warm stump]

this isn't an emergency

[willow tundra]

#marble-art-n-collecting-or-is-it

[indigo crest]

yes, its not, but its also not irreversible

[warm stump]

then change up #marble-runs-n-comps, have that convo in there

with the people who will have the best ideas for what it should be

[unreal scroll]

i suppose other marble talk can now be used for like artworks and stuff like that

[faint yacht]

uh yeah spex this ain't an emergancy thing but it's also something that we could easily change later, I just don't think it's a good idea to have the two channels named that bc it's confusing rn as is

[polar parrot]

Yeah. We'll still figure out what works.

[acoustic hemlock]

no one is opposed to other-marble-comps as a name though

[faint yacht]

we could always go back

[unreal scroll]

custom comp talk imo would be better

[indigo crest]

im going to rename other marble talk to jmr-fanworks, which seems to be the agreed on name, unless i am grossly misreading the discussion here

[warm stump]

yes

you are

[indigo crest]

if the fan art community wants a different name, we can change it later

[warm stump]

it's not just for jmr

it's not just for fanworks

that name doesn't work

[indigo crest]

marble-fanworks

and if its not for that, then what is it for

[acoustic hemlock]

marble-media?

marble-creations?

[slender lake]

marble-works?

wait that looks weird

scratch marble-works

[indigo crest]

@fathom flower since you are the one that made the suggestion, and you are also part of the fan art community, im gonna ask you which name you like for the channel

[faint yacht]

they better be

[willow tundra]

marble-fired?
marble-applies-to-different-job?
marble-starts-new-career?
marble-finds-new-success?

[acoustic hemlock]

creative marbles

[slender lake]

marble-climbs-up-the-rankings-to-become-ceo-of-high-valued-company

[unreal scroll]

what the

[warm stump]

millim made the suggestion to make a CC channel

that's what was made

y'all should discuss if you're happy with that name for it

[indigo crest]

yes, and im now moving to the second part, which is the name of the art sharing channel

[warm stump]

leave #marble-art-n-collecting alone for a bit, please

[acoustic hemlock]

can't we just keep the names as is rn? at least for the comps channel, no one is opposed to it

[fathom flower]

jmr fanworks is good and i think encompasses that this is a space for things that are creative and not CC
HOWEVER,
i understand spex's concerns that this leaves non-jmr and non-cc marble content somewhat homeless
so ultimately i can understand going with marble-fanworks, or at least making it clear that it can be a space for discussing marbles in general

[faint yacht]

I think most here are in agreement that the new comp channel is named fine

[indigo crest]

danda brought up the concern that other marble comps and other marble talk are too similar and could cause confusion, and i agree

[warm stump]

original #marble-art-n-collecting topic:

For all other marble sports, marble collecting, marble art, and other random marble talk.
current topic edited by Edu:
For all marble collecting, marble art, and other random marble talk.

[indigo crest]

and yeah i think people agree with the other marble comps name

[faint yacht]

my issue is it's confusing to have it named that and then have #marble-art-n-collecting that should be changed imo

[indigo crest]

yeah i agree

[warm stump]

lol, love how CC comes up with a name nearly the same as #marble-art-n-collecting then tries to shove out the #marble-art-n-collecting name as soon as possible, calm down please

[acoustic hemlock]

yeah thats a valid concern

[willow tundra]

a breakdown:

the biggest argument for changing #marble-art-n-collecting is that it is incredibly similar to #marble-runs-n-comps and therefore could cause confusion, especially without an actual announcement

the reason people would want to change #marble-art-n-collecting as opposed to changing #marble-runs-n-comps is because the latter's name does not have any opposition

another argument being used in favor of renaming #marble-art-n-collecting is that the name does not have the be permanent and can be changed to a more fitting name in the future

[acoustic hemlock]

spex i dont think CC is trying to shove out anything

i feel like its getting unnecessarily heated rn

[warm stump]

ocho is gunning super hard and fast

[indigo crest]

this was the basis of the discussion, and iirc you were a proponent of renaming other marble talk due to the art pins being there

[fathom flower]

i agree w ramen and ocho on this one

[indigo crest]

im simply trying to avoid getting tangled up in unnecessary details that can be changed later anyways

[fathom flower]

albeit i think waiting and issuing an announcement/call for input would also be fine

[warm stump]

no, I was a proponent of leaving #marble-art-n-collecting alone and making a new channel for CC stuff

[small willow]

Which was exactly what we sid

[warm stump]

if it's heated for me to say "please wait" uh...

[acoustic hemlock]

renaming the channel to make it more clear what it's for doesn't mean it's getting shoved out or devalued

[fathom flower]

this server is not so fast moving that two similar sounding channels will lead to anarchy in the streets

[acoustic hemlock]

if anything it makes it more clear what it's actually for

[indigo crest]

yeah what ramen said

[willow tundra]

i thought you were a proponent of the object, not the name of the object? or was i misreading it?

[faint yacht]

yeah I don't think it's a big deal to just make it more clear for now and then getting back to it later if needed

[indigo crest]

yeah exactly

[warm stump]

correct, but also taking some time, this isn't urgent

[faint yacht]

especially since it's like, 2am on the east coast for some of us lmao

[warm stump]

we have three "other" channels and tbh we should remove all three of those words

makes # complete and search a pain regardless

[small willow]

Wait whats the third

[acoustic hemlock]

#other-jmr-series can become misc-jmr-series

[small willow]

Oh

[willow tundra]

you don't always have to do one hundred percent of the thinking before taking any action. in this case, the simple goal is to prevent confusion between the two channels, not to say that "jmr-fanworks" is a perfect name or whatever. the proposal is that, as a temporary measure that is meant to be replaced, the #marble-art-n-collecting can be again, temporarily renamed to something that is ostensibly and currently less confusing

[small willow]

Missed that

[warm stump]

I can also not rush

give me some time

[indigo crest]

i agree with this

[warm stump]

this isn't urgent

[willow tundra]

just because something isn't urgent doesn't mean you have to wait for a significant period of time

while it isn't urgent, it's not... opposite of urgent?

[warm stump]

it's fine the way it is right now, please stop hammering on it

[willow tundra]

(considering several other mods are taking issue with it, can you really say it's fine?)

[warm stump]

yes, I can

[fathom flower]

to address the confusion and stop stressing spex out

maybe there could be a brief announcement

[warm stump]

yelling in my ear isn't helping, can I have a moment on this please?

[willow tundra]

i'm sorry if it came off that way