Stack avoidance option

[sinful olive]

Please add a stack avoidance option for solo/duo players. Voice chat, as expected, doesn't solve the problems of playing against stacks because the problem isn't the presence or absence of voice communication, as has been discussed many times. I understand that it's too difficult for you to understand how matchmaking needs to be changed to solve this problem. I also understand that it will take you years to make obvious decisions, but I think the time has come. This doesn't require you to think and make difficult decisions. If only I or a very small group of people need this option, then we'll be the only ones who suffer from enabling it. We can always turn it off. Just give us the option.

[patent void]

Voice would help if ppl would use it. I never had more than three ppl in voice so far.

But imo Duo only should already start at Plat.

[sinful olive]

The fact that voice chat isn't used speaks volumes about its inability to even out the disparity between stacked teams and solo players. I believe people simply look at what stacked players have and what solo players don't, and only see superficial things like voice chat. Stacked players didn't use voice chat because they had the option and solo players didn't. There are genuine reasons why players form large teams. And even without voice chat, stacked teams still have a significant advantage, which makes solo play simply unpleasant and uninteresting under standard matchmaking conditions. I'm not talking about winning or losing. I fundamentally don't want Predecessor to lose its solo/duo player base to stacked players, who are also much more psychologically resilient to staying in a game for long and experiencing negative experiences. My opinion is that there should be two queues: solo/duo and penta vs. penta, for a truly competitive experience. But then the second queue wouldn't be able to play, as there are very few such players. That's why I propose adding a simple option for solo/duo players to choose whether to exclude themselves from the general pool or not.

[haughty citrus]

You'd just get more smurfs in gold really

[patent void]

Not true, ppl are just too lazy to use it.
I play both solo and stack and the coms are basically the same. Voice would definitely help to go against stacks if the whole team would use it.

[ripe goblet]

If it's in the EU server, a lot of people don't speak English and a lot of people that can write in English can't speak it, and from the people that can speak it may not want to speak in a non native language for them

So it's not that people are lazy, just that they prefer to not use the voice chat for personal preferences

[patent void]

I would still call it lazy. It's not like you have to learn the whole language, more like 10 words + the lanes.

[ripe goblet]

Ok, learn 10 words + the lanes of German, Italian, French, Spanish, Greek, etc. And communicate with others in their own language

[sinful olive]

There are two facts. First, voice chat doesn't work as expected. And even if people used it, it's obvious to me that nothing would change. This may not seem obvious to others.
Second, the stacking issue hasn't been resolved. The developers aren't competent enough to address this issue flexibly and through matchmaking. The developers are largely incompetent, as they're a team of amateurs. That's no secret. And that's why this section exists. Therefore, I proposed a solution that wouldn't interfere with stacked players while simultaneously making the game more enjoyable for solo players and increasing player retention.

If anyone knows how to solve the problem given the current game situation and doesn't like my solution, this is the thread for that.
Don't discuss voice chat. I only mentioned it initially to connect the thread to previous discussions where voice chat was thought to solve the problem. And that the problem was not solved.

[patent void]

Imo u are really unfair towards the Devs here, the only thing we can accuse them of is that they trying to please everyone with MM. They try that players can play with friends and also tried to keep the ranked integerdy by stopping stacks at Diamond. Imo the only thing they can do is dont allow stacks at all or stopping them erlier maybe at Plat or even Gold.

Your suggestion would not work cause it would not only hurt yourself since players that don't have the option turned ON can't find you. It is just another playerbase split and MM gets worse and worse with less players, Search times and Skill distribution wise.

[sinful olive]

The developers are former Paragon players. They've been doing stupid things for three years and ultimately come up with the same solutions they were proposed to them several years ago in this very Discord channel. So I'm being quite fair to them. They're just amateurs, nothing more. I don't blame them for this or scold them. It's simply a fact we need to accept and not let them get arrogant, as they did before. Because we don't have another Paragon. And if Epic Games decided to make Paragon 2, I'd immediately go play it and forget about this amateur asset collection from free stocks. It is very sad that Predecessor has no competitors.

Regarding what I suggested. Activating this option only means that I, as a player, won't be counted in the pre-pool where there's a stack. That is, I can't be matched against a stack or with a stack. Matchmaking will be prohibited from adding additional players to teams with stacks of 3 or more. This means that this option only affects me and my matchmaking time. You also clearly misunderstood that this option should also apply to quick matches. I'm so tired of playing with stacks that I'm willing to wait longer for matches in the menu.

[patent void]

Ok explain to me like I am five cause i don't understand.

Let's say we have 10 players searching for a match ( 3Stack, 3Stack, 4 Solos) one solo player has turned on your option.

Like i imagine it, the MM cannot create the game now, affecting all 10 players. Now the MM needs to wait for another player that has the option turned off. More wait times means the MM will open up the MMR tolerance for the searched match, so a players that is not fitting that well gets into the Match with that 9 players. You are waiting longer and the other players get a worse match.

Or do i see something wrong here?

[sinful olive]

That's correct. If there are only 10 players online and we have the simplest matchmaking, which only takes this option into account, then it won't be possible to form two teams. A solo player with this option enabled will only be able to find a match if there are at least eight other players (1 or 2stack). Otherwise, he should be excluded from the pool, as he wishes. Although in the simplest matchmaking without priorities, purely statistically, as new players enter the pool, 3stack+2 (solo/duo) teams will first form, and only then will teams consisting of only solo/duo players begin to form.

Of course, there are other options. For example, introducing a coefficient to increase the average rating for players in a stack, prohibiting stack if the difference in ratings between players exceeds a certain value, introducing separate rating tracking by role, implementing role-based matchmaking, and so on. But over the course of three years, this has been proposed many times. And none of them have been implemented. After all, these are key moments for competitive play.

[patent void]

Afaik there is an increased rating for stacks, at least there was at some point in Pred.

And everything else was suggested yes, but fails because of the small playerbase. Basically every complaint on MM boils down to the low playerbase. So it doesn't make sense for the devs to work on such MM systems since they would hurt the MM even more, why should they waste dev time to make the game worse?

• Stack avoidance
• Role based
• Input based
• Different Ques for Stacks or Five stacks

Everything splits the playerbase and makes MM worse, on a small and big scale.

[sinful olive]

This should have been done after the first alpha test. Moreover, a small player base is no excuse for crappy matchmaking. It's an excuse to aggressively invest in advertising, especially after the grant from Epic Games. And now, yes, it's too late to do much. Advertising doesn't work, as Omeda has shown repeatedly that their massive updates, which completely change the game, are simply garbage, with minor changes, heroes that don't match Epic Games' sci-fi hero pool, and free assets taken from stock sites. Many simply don't trust the developers.
And don't even mention audience division. Instead of a single ranked mode, we have ranked, quick games, Labs Nitro, Labs Aram, and at least something that remains of a more advanced civilization - the Legacy map in custom games.

They are simply incapable of being who they claim to be.

[grand junco]

bro relax this game is not competitive just casual moba

Match using internal mmr, not grade

Rank mode allowing stack

Just enjoy it

If you want to play a competitive game, I recommend LOL and Dota