#Sex Doesn't Sell

96 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

oak copper
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My feedback concerns the artistic vision of female characters in Predecessor after the arrival of the new art designer (ThunderBrush). Specifically — the silhouettes, poses, clothing/armor, splash-art framing, and the prioritization of visual accents.
In the new previews and promotional materials, female heroes are presented with an emphasis on chest and hips, with repetitive poses and impractical gear that does not match their combat role. The silhouettes are pushed toward an «hourglass» shape, and the frame compositions deliberately emphasize sexual attributes, which stylistically clashes with the game’s tone.

This is not a one-off stylistic choice but a persistent pattern that is starting to shape the brand perception.** All of his female characters follow the same template**: exaggerated proportions, less clothing, identical poses. Excessive sexualization of female characters negatively affects the perception of the game, fosters toxic behavior in the community, and drives away potential players. ThunderBrush is not merely ignoring this information — he is actively working against the healthy development of gaming culture.

This opinion is easy to form from the latest announcements and skins for female heroes (now even for Twinblast), comparing them with earlier project materials and my own match experience. I am not against attractiveness, but I am against the templated “male gaze” that blurs the game’s identity and narrows its audience.

LESSONS FROM THE PAST

Looking through his work for Paladins, it becomes obvious:** this person is unable to create a female character without obsessively** emphasizing sexual attributes. Such actions portray ThunderBrush as an immature individual.
As a player, I am saddened by what the game is starting to turn into: instead of a strong visual identity we are slipping into clichés that do not strengthen the game design and do not add depth to the lore. All of this can be excused by the phrase «sex sells». But where is the evidence of the economic effectiveness of this approach? Paladins did not become more successful because of an abundance of sexualized skins. On the contrary, the game constantly loses players, and the studio is forced to cut budgets to the point where it cannot afford to produce high-quality art.

SUGGESTIONS

• I ask the Predecessor team to consider the following concrete steps and invite players to support a constructive dialogue within these bounds.

Feasibility vs fan-service check: for each design, define the combat function of costume elements and verify their effectiveness in gameplay.

Create an independent art review board: at least 1 inclusivity designer, 1 outsource illustrator with no history of hyper-sexualization, and 1 producer—with authority to block the release of contentious materials.

«Test» skins: release pairs — one functional and one fan-service — and publicly show sales and retention metrics to determine long-term value.

Redesign retro skins: retrospectively bring controversial looks to functional variants (alternative materials, refined armor, pose adjustments) without breaking the overall silhouette.

Communication with players: open a feedback form with examples of art revisions, hold quarterly reviews of visual tone decisions, and record which signals were taken in consideration.

Quality KPIs instead of hype: measure success not by social clicks, but by retention stability, growth of female and older audiences, and NPS for visual direction.

A game retains players with style, not with uniform fan-service that today feels cheap and short-lived.

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Sex Doesn't Sell

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For clarity: all such skins do NOT retain the audience. This kind of content attracts only an immature segment that will just as easily and quickly move to another project. Players who care about gameplay don’t care about such skins; moreover, they undermine the game’s aesthetics, kill its individuality, and gradually drive away players who loved the game for its unique style.

burnt trench
jagged silo
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Its important to note that the blame shouldnt be on ThunderBrush specifically but on Omeda for allowing it to happen. They've experimented with sexy skins before ThunderBrush (Dekker).

Omeda themselves need to just stop doing this shit ngl, cos its very tiresome to see from the industry.

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Its okay to have fan service skins, but not ones that enlarge features and to get them every other skin drop

fallen thunder
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Vote with your wallets. If it sells then what are they supposed to do? Not make more?

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I haven’t bought any, but I can see why they keep making them.

jagged silo
# fallen thunder Vote with your wallets. If it sells then what are they supposed to do? Not make ...

Thing is, Pred wont be taken seriously if they chase short term skin sales like this. Id imagine they want to be an esports, hence why they are pushing these tourneys officially now.

This wont happen if their playerbase are all immature teens buying skins. Im sorry but I dont want to play a game where every female hero skin is a Double D where I can see their asses from the front.

Pred wont die, its just gonna afloat like Paladins and Smite is doing.

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Never really going anywhere

old cape
# jagged silo Thing is, Pred wont be taken seriously if they chase short term skin sales like ...

Rivals has tons of gooner skins, and lots of fighting games have skins like this. Look at skins in Street Fighter 6, Tekken 8, or Mortal Kombat 1. Even LoL and Dota 2 have skins like this.

Kayn, Sett, and Viego don't have shirts. Evelynn is basically naked without nipples. Miss Fortune, Sona, Syndra, Katarina, and Cassiopeia all have the girls very much out in game. Now that's not saying there aren't more conservative male and female designs, and I'm not going to defend changing the model of Shinbi to enlarge her sexual characteristics, but let's not purity spiral here.

jagged silo
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Plus, I dont want them gone. We can strike a good balance. Fan service is good in moderation when not done in extreme. But things like the countess and the shinbi skin, gotta go.

old cape
jagged silo
old cape
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and if you would, provide me an example of what you would consider a tasteful skin that still has sex appeal, from any game of your choice.

jagged silo
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But its bias

old cape
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I would argue that's more of a "fashion skin" than a "sex appeal" skin. Sure it has sex appeal in that she is at a base, an attractive woman, but a croptop with a jacket isn't like crazy apparel or anything. I see more scandelous outfits at the gym.

old cape
# jagged silo

like excuse me but her gun literally has the Louis Vuitton logo on it lmfao.

jagged silo
old cape
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I wonder if riot paid or got paid for that

jagged silo
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Im trying to look for another example of an extreme that Im okay with but most are mid and the rest are just extreme that I aint like

barren flicker
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I'd personally argue Evelynn is actually more tasteful cuz she is literally sex appeal personified

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Her whole character is being a succubus

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Renna, Yurei don't really have much of a point to be

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For a directly comparable character, I'd give Akali for Yurei

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If anything, Evelynn is more comparable to Countess

hollow valve
hollow valve
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This is also a good example 👌

old cape
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I think all of these are examples of various levels of sexualization from not really (High Noon Leona) to Yes (Shadow Evelynn), and I'd argue that nothing Thunderbrush has done is any worse than pool party Caitlyn or Shadow Eve. Even the Skylar redesign that I see get heat is literally just Gun Goddess Miss Fortune, which I included.

hollow valve
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Shadow Evelyn is in fact less sexualised than her default aspect

old cape
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Chun Li from SF6

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Mai default from SF6

hollow valve
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As I mentioned Riven, she have a "sexualised" skin, which was done at the beginning of everything, but even this skins is better than what we have in Predecessor because at least there they didn't change characters body proportions

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She is Riven in a different suit, it's not the devs doing plastic surgery in the character to make it more sexy

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And the splashart moves the focus from sexy to bad-ass, so even when the theme of the skin is a Sexy bunny suit, they take it more as a joke than as intentionally trying to make it sexy for the sake of being sexy, like what happens with Yin bunny skin that is a "bunny skin" because it's in the name

old cape
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Now do Schoolteacher Fiora

hollow valve
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Yeah, I'm not defending Riven skin, but saying that what Predecessor does is even worse

old cape
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Omeda skins dont have splashes so its whatever

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both are bad skins just from a general design standpoint

hollow valve
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Bunny Yin

old cape
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but also are we going to pretend people don't dress up like that irl anyway

hollow valve
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Real Yin

old cape
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I see that kind of outfit all the time at cons

hollow valve
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They don't even look the same character

old cape
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🤷‍♂️

hollow valve
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She have her boobs, ass and things that the real character doesn't have

old cape
hollow valve
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Also the clothes are just sexy nothing more, Riven version at least is funny seeing a serious character in that situation with an enormous carrot Sword

old cape
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Paragon probably would have done better if they had more sex appeal in their base designs to begin with. Epic changed muriel's face because literally nobody wanted to play that ugly robot, but a very small and vocal minority complains about it to this day.

hollow valve
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I see both things really different, and both Riven and Yin are character that I love,

old cape
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Overprime also changed char models iirc

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It's almost like every company does it

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and companies pay a lot of money to know what sells

hollow valve
old cape
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so it can't just be a coincidence

heady ore
hollow valve
heady ore
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Personally I think it's a downgrade from what they wanted to do with Muriel

hollow valve
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Shinbi, Yin, Searth, etc also exist because Paragon wanted to appeal to the Asian market

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They were released at the same period, basically after Paragon moved to monolith, changed their direction

old cape
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Imo that wasn't a symptom of that being the wrong decision. I think it was more that it was already too late.

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I think the systemic changes that came with monolith killed the game, not the skin and hero design direction change.

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My main takeaway from this thread is that it's not that the skins themselves are the problems, it's that they're releasing so few skins at a time that each "gooner skin" release draws a lot of attention. If they released 4 high quality skins in the vein of Project or High Noon from LoL for every 1 gooner skin I don't think people would mind nearly as much.

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But this game probably doesn't have the buyers for so many skins at once. There is such a thing as market saturation.

weary halo
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SEX SELLS i automatic SKIP any non goon skin, and i insta buy any goon skin whatever the cost, also it's bad that they add censor like those ugly wings on the ass, bring more sexy skins and not censored

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and you should see STELLAR BLADE and MARVEL RIVALS, they sell sexy skins like crazy

vivid dew
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This is such a goated post! Nothing to add here, just wanted to say thank you! You actually managed to bring back my hope for this game, even if you are part of the playerbase. The guy above this post is a reason why i lost hope and quit playing the gane since i saw no point in supporting their current visual direction and vision for the game. Again thank you! 🙏

clear sigil
clear sigil
vivid dew
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Simply put: you don't know me. This isn't about skin design, it's about respecting what made paragon so unique. Please stop pinging me, i really don't like your behaviour

vivid dew
clear sigil
weary halo
clear sigil
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Dude, are you seriously trying to draw any serious conclusions about my life based on a couple of my messages? It's obvious that my joke about your age was a blatant dig at your insatiable passion for sexy asses and your even greater desire to buy them.

I'm married, so your logical conclusions have failed you. But more importantly, I have absolutely no interest in reading your "reasoned" opinion about sexy asses. Please, let's each keep our own opinions.

weary halo
vivid dew
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I don't see this as a feedback to the original post. You are completely getting off topic by just personally going at me even tho i just said that i left because of creeps like you.

Instead you started putting your imagination to why i left to justify your behaviour. I am saying this again, stop pinging me. Also stay on topic i am not here to discuss with you

weary halo
vivid dew
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Anyway, lets hope the devs see this post and respond to this. Would be cool to have more playerbase - devs interactions especially in the feedback channel

clear sigil
weary halo
pine mantle
upbeat heron
wide onyx
hallow lark