♡ i am still building my first pc ever ♡

[orchid gate]

Bad quote sorry

[spare sedge]

if im going asus. im going the rog strix. it has the single best air cooler of any graphics card ever made.

[orchid gate]

sure

And is that cheaper or more expensive

it’s also massive no?

[spare sedge]

the tuf was an option that i decided against

isnt the tuf massive?

[pearl heath]

The Tuf and the Strix are mostly identical

[spare sedge]

the suprim liquid x is smaller and same price

[orchid gate]

It was mentioned Strix was largest

or longest

[pearl heath]

Other than the cooler shroud thingy being differently styled, and the PCB being a touch different, they're practically identical

[orchid gate]

We had this discussion already

[spare sedge]

yeah but why go the tuf

yeah and WHAT DID I SAY lmao

[orchid gate]

Not what you said

But, remember a radiator is attached too

You need space to mount that as well

[spare sedge]

the radiator shouldnt be an issue

[vast geyser]

i mean, that description fits for every model

[orchid gate]

Will be if you watercool your CPU too

Pipe routing would be a pain

[spare sedge]

you can do 2 - 3 rads

[orchid gate]

sure

[spare sedge]

depending

[orchid gate]

Do that then

Totally unbelievable, totally dependable

[spare sedge]

i was thinking of doing double aio cpu and gpu and if it can fit in an itx great. if not then ill just go bigger. its nbd

[orchid gate]

but but but

Both their fans on both radiators would be exhaust

[vast geyser]

aaaaaaaaa

what if we hear me out

pick a case

huh

what about that

[orchid gate]

Yes please

[vast geyser]

then see what can and cant be done

[spare sedge]

yeah cause people wont tell me the answers

but thats okay cause ive turned out to be right on a lot of it

[vast geyser]

wat

[orchid gate]

Just ask about the component and not some specific ability you expect of it

So we’re not confused

because that could be far from its actual function in the first place

[spare sedge]

yeah but you need to understand that idek what are the right questions to ask

thats how it works

[orchid gate]

Just gave you the right question rubric

“What is mSATA” would be fine

[spare sedge]

im like this with everything and it has never failed me and everytime i only get more confirmation that i should do it more and more hardcore the next time for any subject

[orchid gate]

then maybe if you doubt anything integrate it into a phrase “does mSATA do xxxxx”

[spare sedge]

i dont follow but what is msata was not allowed apparently lmao

but it doesnt matter and i already have relations so i can better explain it to people who i teach one day

[lusty orchid]

tbh for their system, liquid cooling would not be advisable

[vast geyser]

dude yknow what would be funny

a custom looped pc on balkan roads

id laugh my ass off

and a nas

[spare sedge]

page 1-14 m.2 nvme ssds
page 14-16 m.2 sata ssds upgraded to nvme
page 16-18 msata upgraded to m.2
page 18 pata hdds old
page 18 - 19 PCIe AIC (add in card) SSDs that used nvme too actually
page 19 - 21 sas scsi ssds / hdds enterprise
page 21 - 56 sata (ahci) ssds / hdds / sshds upgraded to m.2
page 56 - 57 u.2 nvme / sata ssds enterprise

[vast geyser]

woooooooooooooo

[spare sedge]

honestly can probably cross off aic cards

[vast geyser]

yeah probably

maybe in the future you can consider them

[lusty orchid]

cross out page 18-19, completely useless for your case

[spare sedge]

cause i would personally prefer to save those for other kinds of cards entirely if i go atx

[lusty orchid]

the only ones that are worth it, are no longer available

[vast geyser]

like what cards

[spare sedge]

not sure yet. but i wouldnt want a whole bunch of unusued pcie

tbh

[vast geyser]

i have like 5 pcie slots

only use 1

yeah its 5 slots

[lusty orchid]

i use 3 out of 5 pcie slots myself

[spare sedge]

so im 100% getting a m.2 nvme ssd because they are much faster than 6 gbps idk how much tho but still

[vast geyser]

the speed of the ssd depends on the ssd

like 990 pro hits insane speeds, close to 8GB/s

[lusty orchid]

nvme ssd's are read at MB/s tbh

[lusty orchid]

though totally not worth getting for their use case

[spare sedge]

there is a small chance i might get a sata hdd or a sata ssd or maybe just a 2nd m.2

[lusty orchid]

no HDD's at all

[vast geyser]

just sayin

[lusty orchid]

any vibrations or sharp braking and you'll fuck that hdd

[vast geyser]

stop considering HDDs lol

1 speed bump and its gone

[lusty orchid]

1 sharp braking and it's dead

[spare sedge]

its hard when like 12 people recommended it to me and i spent a whole night talking about it.

[vast geyser]

again
its a van

[lusty orchid]

like who??, i've seen a ton tell you not to get it

[spare sedge]

yeah cause you popped up out of no where 3 days ago

[vast geyser]

in a normal setup, where its not moving, you could maybe consider them

but on a van? hell naw

you look at them wrong 1 time and its dead

[lusty orchid]

and i read through all the messages, they all said not to

[spare sedge]

yeah i dont think hdds are THAT fragile but ik they are fragile and ultimately that would decrease the lifespan

its good to consider

[pearl heath]

No, they really are that fragile

[spare sedge]

(not getting it )

[lusty orchid]

including myself telling you not to get a hdd

[vast geyser]

theyre really fragile

they dont make em like they used to

[spare sedge]

okay heard

[vast geyser]

[orchid gate]

Linus dropped an HDD in one of his build vids and he was concerned first thing its was bricked

[spare sedge]

hdds are also really slow

[orchid gate]

You could say that

They can do ok

SATA SSDs are good for additional storage if you need it

[lusty orchid]

and that drop was a force of no more than 3.5G tbh

[orchid gate]

500MB/s write is good for most things

[vast geyser]

yeppers

[orchid gate]

unless they’re video/movie files, game packages, p_rn torrents

[vast geyser]

after what jirp was saying about the 870 qvo, idk anymore how good of a choice it would be

[vast geyser]

nahhh thats messed up

[orchid gate]

Well I had to mention it

[vast geyser]

you did not have to

[spare sedge]

so wait speed is more important than capacity or is cap better

[orchid gate]

Sure

[vast geyser]

eh, depends on the user

[orchid gate]

Well speed goes up with capacity actually

[lusty orchid]

both are equally important and it depends on use case

[orchid gate]

larger drives do better, at least initially

[lusty orchid]

nope it can go down tbh

[spare sedge]

heres the top market hdds i guess they all use sata 6.0 so equal in speed to ssds

[orchid gate]

Speed kind of takes a backseat now

Since anything circa PCIe 3.0 is bloody fast in the context of SSDs

[spare sedge]

how does rpms impact anything lol

[lusty orchid]

none of those should ever be touched

[orchid gate]

It’s how fast the HDD spins (disk platter)

[spare sedge]

the seagate exos x20 looks good tho

[orchid gate]

Wtf no

[vast geyser]

dont buy a hdd

[spare sedge]

ik that but why does it matter if it spins faster

[orchid gate]

far from equal bro

[lusty orchid]

anything over 18tb on the major brands is essentially going to be smr so despite the speed it has a slower data access time

[orchid gate]

It can read data more quickly?

[pure mica]

Read/write data faster...

[lusty orchid]

nope

[vast geyser]

it spins faster so the pickup little hand thing has to work more

[spare sedge]

does a higher rpm actually equate to faster random r/w speeds???

[pearl heath]

Yes

[lusty orchid]

you need to understand CMR vs SMR in recording technologies for hdd's

[pure mica]

Yes

[vast geyser]

aaaaaaaaaaaaa

[orchid gate]

@spare sedge if you want more affordable storage invest in SATA SSDs over HDDs

[vast geyser]

but again, dont consider HDDs

[pure mica]

Delite that we don’t want learn about it for 2 day or more

[orchid gate]

they’re easier to connect and mount, mostly

[lusty orchid]

VAN BUILD = NO HDD's what so ever

[orchid gate]

Plus are somewhat faster

[vast geyser]

why tf r u acting like its affecting you bro? the only insightful thing you say is that you own a 4090 and 13900k 😭

[spare sedge]

yeah exos x20 seems the way to go if you do hdd

[lusty orchid]

no

[spare sedge]

im gonna look at sata ssds now

[pure mica]

False but ok

[orchid gate]

fastest I’ve seen an HDD was 320MB/s vs 560MB/s for the Crucial MX500, a sata SSD

[spare sedge]

why

[vast geyser]

not worth buying one unless you go 8TB

[orchid gate]

SATA SSDs are way cheaper as well compared to PCIe NVMe

Crucial MX500 <—-

[lusty orchid]

primarily you're doing a van build, so no hdd should ever be involved, secondly, going over 18tb in a hdd means you'll be using a slower smr drive not a decent cmr drive

[spare sedge]

sata ssds can go all the way up to 16 tb now. so yeah no reason to really go hdds even if you want the capacity.

hdds are really just high cap budget options

[brave brook]

Cheaper than gen 4 yes

[spare sedge]

16tb is only 6tb less than the highest cap hdds

[lusty orchid]

that doesn't matter

https://youtu.be/aztTf2gI55k?t=79

[spare sedge]

what is smr and cmr

[lusty orchid]

older video but relevant info in regards to cmr vs smr

[lusty orchid]

cmr = conventional magnetic recording
smr = shingled magnetic recording

[spare sedge]

theres only 3 ssds that go above 8tb so this is probably not worth so realistically. only 8tb is the max meaning it is 14tb behind hdds

which isnt bad. its honestly worth

[lusty orchid]

such a bad take there

[spare sedge]

since ssds should be fast overall but could still be a better modern solution for like cold storage ig

[brave brook]

Hdds are meant for high capacity, and ssds are meant for high speed

[lusty orchid]

and a hdd also for long term data storage

[brave brook]

There is no way in hell you’re using more than 4 tb of storage in a gaming pc

[lusty orchid]

/me waves

[brave brook]

?

[spare sedge]

so the only difference is that shingled is slower than conventional? do all hdds use smr? what uses cmr?

[vast geyser]

oh creeper.. youre not gamer enough..

dont underestimate a man with access to torrents

[brave brook]

I mean, ok

[lusty orchid]

hdd's use both smr and cmr, the data access times of a smr is 13ms where as it's 6-6.5ms for cmr, also watch the video i linked

[brave brook]

I don’t play a ton of games though

[vast geyser]

yeah neither do i, i just have a bunch of bullshit installed

[lusty orchid]

you not remember the amount of storage i have?

[spare sedge]

i will

[brave brook]

No I forgot lol

[lusty orchid]

i am at 8.1tb of total storage, i am using 3.5tb of it currently

[brave brook]

I have like 1.5tb (not counting the 1.5tb hdd from an old family pc)

[brave brook]

Lol

[lusty orchid]

4tb of it is hdd's

[brave brook]

Wow

[vast geyser]

the way of the vans is calling

[brave brook]

Will dream use 4tb though

[lusty orchid]

i have doubts

[pearl heath]

They will not

[vast geyser]

better to have more than enough, than not have enough

[pearl heath]

if their primary use is just running F@H/BOINC and some AI stuff... Well

[brave brook]

Which is why I said get a 1 tb ssd for boot, and 1-2 2tb ssds

[vast geyser]

nah, buying 2 2tb ssd is a waste

might as well go 4tb

[lusty orchid]

dw, i have a half finished nas, i just need to add hdd's to it to finish it off and transfer a ton of stuff to and use it for backing up

[brave brook]

Are they comparable in price?

[lusty orchid]

not worth it, get a 500gb for boot, and a could 4tb 's for storage

[vast geyser]

eh

eh

[lusty orchid]

$160 for a 4tb mp34

[brave brook]

i see

thats cheap

[vast geyser]

i mean

its a bit more than 2 2tb ones

[lusty orchid]

it is, and realistically no need to get any higher nvme wise for what they want to do

especially for any gaming they want to do

[spare sedge]

ive heard of zfs before

raid z is named after that

[brave brook]

it uses raid z

[vast geyser]

raid z sounds like a mobile game

[spare sedge]

okay thats what i thought

true

[brave brook]

so rn a 500gb boot and 1 4tb

bc of raid shadow legends

[spare sedge]

okay yeah so western digital is definitely a "titan" of the storage industry

any others then?

any other big names

[brave brook]

samsung and crucial

[lusty orchid]

pretty much

[spare sedge]

seagate is probably one

[vast geyser]

mostly HDDs

their SSDs arent worth

[teal pond]

Samsung has good ssds, but overpriced

[brave brook]

seagates hdds mainly but yeah

[spare sedge]

oh okay samsung

[lusty orchid]

seagate for a hdd, not for ssd's

[spare sedge]

who tends to overprice

[teal pond]

I meant overpriced

lol

[brave brook]

theres also teamgroup, adata, and a few others

[lusty orchid]

samsung themsef

[spare sedge]

ohh okay

[teal pond]

Western digital will be best bang for buck

[vast geyser]

msi sometimes has crazy deals

[lusty orchid]

skhynix themself

all depends on use case

[brave brook]

also silicone power showed up not that long ago, but idk what to say about quality

[vast geyser]

eh, cheap

[lusty orchid]

and dreams build doesn't require anything over a gen3 nvme drive

[brave brook]

yeah

[teal pond]

isnt gen 4 the most common one?

[brave brook]

a 4tb gen 3 is significantly cheaper

[vast geyser]

na

gen 3

[lusty orchid]

no, gen 3

[vast geyser]

gen 4 is starting to get cheap

[spare sedge]

i understand smr now. its like a cheating sort of way to get more capacity. and its only hdds

[brave brook]

yes, ssds are not magnetic

[spare sedge]

so that means cmr is just the normal non pushing it to its limits storage technology

[lusty orchid]

but they're not doing anything to take advantage of that speed so it's not worth it

[spare sedge]

so does that mean ssds are not cmr either

[brave brook]

^

[vast geyser]

its a situation of "might as well"

[lusty orchid]

smr and cmr are hdd only

[pearl heath]

SSDs are a completely different technology

[spare sedge]

okay so cmr is just normal magnetic disk spinning writing and smr ik is the weird shingley bs

[brave brook]

i might get a gen 4 boot drive, but the bulk storage one would def be gen 3

[spare sedge]

and then on top of smr they will also do cmr cashes to kind of make cheaper products better even further

[lusty orchid]

not even worth it for boot

[spare sedge]

wdym by boot drive

[brave brook]

has windows (or your choice of operating system)

[spare sedge]

like the m.2 with the os?

[lusty orchid]

the drive your OS is on

[lusty orchid]

yes

[spare sedge]

ohh so you just call those boot drives

okay cool

so wait could i run mac and linux on other m.2 and have them on ther

[brave brook]

not really mac

[vast geyser]

i mean

[spare sedge]

like 1 for mac 1 for linux and 1 for windows

[vast geyser]

hackintosh exists

[brave brook]

to my knowlege anyway

well yeah

but dont

[vast geyser]

its a bit weirder than that

[spare sedge]

oh is it cause mac needs more research and special hardware to pull off prolly

[vast geyser]

wait

[brave brook]

and linux can dual boot easily

[vast geyser]

maybe not with an x3d chip

[lusty orchid]

yes and no more than 500gb needed for a boot drive for any of those

[vast geyser]

i doubt you can use that for mac

[spare sedge]

okayy cool but i can start learning linux by getting a second m.2 one day??

[brave brook]

wouldnt recommend dual booting for a first time builder

[pearl heath]

No need to do that

[lusty orchid]

triple and quad boot also

[brave brook]

use a vm

[pearl heath]

Also I wouldn't recommend linux for anyone new to building PCs at all

[spare sedge]

virtual machine right

[vast geyser]

its really not that complicated

its just weird

[vast geyser]

ye

[brave brook]

exactly

[spare sedge]

do you mean dual booting as in linux and windows on the same drive??

[brave brook]

yes

[spare sedge]

oh so thats possible

[vast geyser]

wouldnt recommend same drive though

[lusty orchid]

yes/no

[vast geyser]

might be a bit annoying

[spare sedge]

wouldnt a 2nd dedicated drive for linux be better

[vast geyser]

if something goes wrong, you mess up ur windows installation

[brave brook]

so use virtualbox or something and make a linux vm for linux testing

[lusty orchid]

you can do that but it gives ocd annoyances

[vast geyser]

yeah it would

[lusty orchid]

grub .....

[vast geyser]

but unless you have a reason to dual boot with linux, just stick to virual machines

[spare sedge]

hm okay so dual booting is worse but its cheaper and requires only 1 m.2 vs 2 m.2s

[vast geyser]

uh, having them on 2 separate drives is still dual booting

[spare sedge]

can you put anything else on boot drives or do they have to be just the os

[vast geyser]

2 separate OS on the same pc is dual booting

[spare sedge]

oh okay

[pearl heath]

You can put anything you'd like on the boot drive

It's just called a boot drive cause you boot your OS off of it

[lusty orchid]

drivers and main launching programs

[vast geyser]

maybe thats the reason why my pop!_os got fucked

[spare sedge]

okay cool so you can have your os and have hot storage on there and then have larger files on a different m.2

[lusty orchid]

anything other than what i suggested should be on a separate drive

[vast geyser]

love it when dependencies uninstall themselves

[vast geyser]

yea

[spare sedge]

but if you separate your boot drives and only have 1 os max on each m.2 its safer cause you can tell bios which one to boot from

[pearl heath]

I have several games and utility programs installed on the same drive as my OS

[pearl heath]

The OS/BIOS is already smart enough to realise if there's multiple bootloaders on one drive, and will prompt you to pick which one it should boot to

[vast geyser]

no its the same thing
its just that windows and linux dont really get along that well

[lusty orchid]

i only have my os, drivers and main launchers on my boot drive

[vast geyser]

i managed to fuck up reinstalling my windows so now my pc thinks i have 2 windows installations, lel

[brave brook]

what the

[lusty orchid]

i did say

[vast geyser]

doesnt affect the conversation, just felt funny to mention

[spare sedge]

so whats dmsmr they didnt really explain that real well

[lusty orchid]

you could manually sort that out in msconfig

[spare sedge]

does pcpp list whether an hdd is smr or cmr

[vast geyser]

oh lol

[lusty orchid]

a form of smr and not one you want to deal with

[vast geyser]

so just delete that one?

[lusty orchid]

no

[spare sedge]

cause now im curious what the highest capacity is on a cmr hdd

[lusty orchid]

yup

[brave brook]

drive config:
boot:
https://www.newegg.com/team-group-mp33-512gb/p/20-331-416?Item=20-331-416&cm_sp=product-_-from-price-options
secondary
https://www.newegg.com/team-group-4tb-mp34/p/20-331-702?Item=20-331-702&cm_sp=product-_-from-price-options

[vast geyser]

thanks
thought it would be more complicated

[lusty orchid]

i've told you 3 times

[pearl heath]

This will require you to open up datasheets for every single drive you want to look at

Best of luck

[lusty orchid]

18tb

[lusty orchid]

nope

18tb is the the point where it's the edge of being a cmr drive

[spare sedge]

just the top but apparently there are 22tb cmr hdds

[lusty orchid]

that would be unlikely

[brave brook]

there are

[lusty orchid]

22tb is a smr drive due to how much can be fitted on a platter

[spare sedge]

https://www.anandtech.com/show/17377/western-digital-announces-22tb-cmr-and-26tb-smr-hdds

probably not out yet

[brave brook]

oh wait mb, i didnt understand the abbreviation

[vast geyser]

theyre still making new HDDs?

[brave brook]

no one saw my drive links :/

[lusty orchid]

because servers

[vast geyser]

sick

[lusty orchid]

totally fine, little slow but fine for a boot drive

[vast geyser]

really need nothing more than that

[lusty orchid]

for boot drives and games you really don't need anything more than a gen 3 nvme drive

[spare sedge]

dm is dynamic metadata

[lusty orchid]

games don't take advantage of nvme drives speed properly yet

[spare sedge]

metadata is just data about data

[brave brook]

then mp33 pro? its like $6 more

[spare sedge]

so that means dmsmr is even more extreme and even more slow

[lusty orchid]

which will be stored in the cache of a hdd

[spare sedge]

oh so dmsmr is that smr + cache that i was talking about earlier

a way of pushing hdds to their limits and cheating a marketing capacity number

[lusty orchid]

you can easily spot a smr drive from a cmr drive just by the cache primarily

[spare sedge]

it seems like cmr is still just as high tho and is catching up so doesnt really matter

also its all just hdds

[lusty orchid]

neither are catching up in the long run tbh

[spare sedge]

does cmr have a shitty cache on it too

[lusty orchid]

it has a lower catch due to a quicker data access time

not a shitty cache

[spare sedge]

yeah cause after better cmr comes out. a better smr will be out to reflect the cmr

so cmr DOES have a cache

[brave brook]

pretty sure all hdds have cache

[lusty orchid]

smr drives have much larger cache due to how slow they take to write data

256-512mb cache on a hdd generally denotes it's a smr drive

and a smr drive is only worth it if you're archiving data that barely gets accessed

[spare sedge]

it looks like ssds have the best caches

[vast geyser]

SSDs on top

[lusty orchid]

while a cmr drive is for use if you're constantly accessing data daily

64-128mb generally denotes it's a cmr drive btw

[brave brook]

yeah, most tlc/qlc ssds have a slc cache (they only utilize one data layer instead of all 3/4), and good sata ssds have a dram cache as well. new nvme ssds use the system memory as a dram cache

[lusty orchid]

decent nvme ssd's don't need a dram cache

[brave brook]

or that

[spare sedge]

mushkin seems like a horrible brand

i wonder why some of these basic ssds are so expensive lmao

the 870 qvo is the best priced and its ironically by samsung

[lusty orchid]

mp33 for example, or even a sn570, both don't need dram cache and as for the sn570 it can handle large data transfers better than certain (samsung 970 evo plus for example) dram cached ssd's

[vast geyser]

nah mushkin is goated

[vast geyser]

uhh, according to a member thats in here, theyre terrible

[brave brook]

because its qlc

[lusty orchid]

it's also a dramless qlc nand 2.5 inch ssd that really shouldn't be touched

[spare sedge]

someone was talking about qlc and qvo earlier but i have no idea what those mean

[vast geyser]

according to their own words "its slower than a hard drive after moving more than 5GB"

[lusty orchid]

and also mushkin has several decent ssd's that's good to get

[spare sedge]

they seem overpriced to hell

[lusty orchid]

qvo = samsung model, qlc = nand type used in said model

[vast geyser]

again, could be just the store

[brave brook]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErV-2tlf9Ls

[spare sedge]

on 2tb tho

[vast geyser]

oh sick

[brave brook]

youtube search results for more options
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=qlc+vs+tlc+nand

[lusty orchid]

https://github.com/windshields/stoRAGE-consumer-SSD-buying-guide/blob/main/SSD tier list.md

simple effective buying guide for ssd's

[spare sedge]

so literally like smr and cmr hdds.

except smr makes sense for huge storage hdds that want to be slow and cold.

whereas qlc makes less sense on a ssd unless you just want to spend less money lol

so tlc is actually better cause its faster and better at basically everything except capacity which isnt the use case of a ssd

[brave brook]

@spare sedge did you watch this?

[lusty orchid]

anything over 4tb you're likely to find being a qlc nand ssd

[spare sedge]

you just sent it

[vast geyser]

basically says the same thing but its a video

and more in depth

[spare sedge]

so yep same thing with smr not being marked or labeled.

[brave brook]

you can search the questions on amazon and usually find the nand type

[lusty orchid]

they're labelled with different brands

[vast geyser]

eh, not always

[brave brook]

key word usually

[vast geyser]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1B27_j9NDPU3cNlj2HKcrfpJKHkOf-Oi1DbuuQva2gT4/edit?pli=1#gid=0

[lusty orchid]

seagate has them clearly marked out

[spare sedge]

so you probably dont wanna overspend on storage. cause you probably wont use it all by the time the same storage option capacity because 50% cheaper in like 10 years

[lusty orchid]

WD it's not as clearly marked out

[spare sedge]

okayy

what is dram again

[vast geyser]

meh, if you made use of it, it was worth

its like complaining about something youve been using for a long while getting cheaper

[lusty orchid]

i.e WD blue HDD's come as both SMR and CMR but you have to check the serial number to find out which it is

[lusty orchid]

no different from ram but used as a cache for ssd's

[spare sedge]

okay so tlc and qlc are nand types

whats mlc

[vast geyser]

i bought my 6700xt for $550
now its around $400
is it a lot cheaper? yeah
did i get to use it and have a lot of fun? fuck yeah

[lusty orchid]

a 2 bit nand type

[vast geyser]

nand type

[spare sedge]

oh so dram is the ssd cache. got it

[lusty orchid]

there are 5 nand types
slc = 1 bit
mlc = 2 bit
tlc = 3 bit
qlc = 4 bit
plc = 5 bit

[spare sedge]

how does mlc compare to tlc and qlc which i already know

[spare sedge]

isnt that a gpu tho

[vast geyser]

theres like only 1 or 2 mlc consumer ssds

[lusty orchid]

much greater endurance but with a slightly slower write

[spare sedge]

its a little different with gpus

[vast geyser]

same logic really

did you make use of it? yes
then the price is a mere detail

[spare sedge]

cause storage the market is more extreme unless we start to plateau on cap now

[vast geyser]

ssds are way too cheap rn

theyre either gonna get cheaper, or theyre gonna increase in price

[lusty orchid]

nope it's not

[spare sedge]

well thats what im saying.

[lusty orchid]

you still need to determine which mobo you will use

and tbh, effectively for your build, an b650 or b650e chipset mobo is your ideal for the system you want

[spare sedge]

like in this video it says people were spending $500 for 32gb of space.

it is the whole advancement of technology vs running the experiment paradox problem.

if you send a ship to proxima right now. what happens when in 200 years you have the technology to make it to proxima centauri before the eta of the first ship. its like what was the point. those arent exact numbers but its the gist of ssds.

cause why spend $500 on 32gb ssd when in 10 years it costs how much??

$36 today

[haughty quail]

Inflation

[spare sedge]

so whats going to happen to m.2 and tb capacities in 10 -15 years

[vast geyser]

🔮

ill call you up in 10-15 years and tell you

hope you will still be using discord by then

[spare sedge]

yeah so inflation would mean the gap is even more insane. $500 of 2009 money is more than $1000 of todays money which is literally an insane gap from $36

[haughty quail]

I would advise: instead of focusing on the capabiilty of a product 10-15 years in the future that you will likely not use, focus on the capability of tools now to create the PC that is (in the present) piquing your interest

[vast geyser]

eeexactly

carpe diem baby

[spare sedge]

i disagree but thats alr

[vast geyser]

dream

you have no control over the next 10 years

[haughty quail]

The inflation just means that $500 back then is considered $1000 now. That does not mean the value itself has necessarily changed, it just means that the metric we go by has changed. However, it would still be considered the same amount back then as it did now

[haughty quail]

Feel free to disagree, just know your PC won't be built with the M.2 in the next 10 years. You need to focus on the M.2 of your interest right now

[vast geyser]

for all we know, in 10 years the world could end

[spare sedge]

if we see a similar pattern then, then something that is 8tb could end up costing $10 in 15 years

[haughty quail]

For example: it's like people saying that kids back then (as in 70s or 80s) looked older than kids now. They were both 18, did any of them actually age older? No, they're the exact same age. The metric by which we go by how someone looks older is completely different, though. The clothes we see on "older" people now are clothes we saw in their high school pictures, thus making them look older, However whether someone looks older at 18 vs. another 18 year old doesn't change the fact that they are both the same age: 18. Hope that makes sense 🙏

[vast geyser]

unlikely

again, 15 years is a long time

we might not even use SSDs by then

[lusty orchid]

quite unlikely

[spare sedge]

not really unless we start to plateau

[lusty orchid]

again you're also going over the top storage wise

[spare sedge]

not unlikely at all if the pattern continues at the same rate it has been

for all of storage market history

[haughty quail]

I feel like we're getting off topic from the conversation which should be around parts, and not so much the product value of said parts

Especially not products 10-15 years ahead in the market

[lusty orchid]

they have been doing that alot

[vast geyser]

the issue is that a ssd costs more than $10 to produce

[haughty quail]

I know, and then she blames other people lol

[spare sedge]

there are 32gb ssds for $36

after inflation

[haughty quail]

It's like me going "How much will toasters cost in 2056?" Idk, who gives a shit lol

[vast geyser]

32gb?

[spare sedge]

yes

[lusty orchid]

there is a 1tb ssd for $36

you wouldn't touch a 32gb ssd at all

[spare sedge]

its already happening

well yeah

[vast geyser]

only thing where you can actually care about the future is real estate honestly

[haughty quail]

Source?

Holy shit 17000 messages what

[lusty orchid]

you look at the wrong stuff way to much

[haughty quail]

Exactly. We actually have metrics for that to have a closer estimate other than anything else in the market

[spare sedge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErV-2tlf9Ls

[haughty quail]

Could you present something from your own research and not that of a second opinion? Since people aren't giving you exact answers

[vast geyser]

should have mentioned back in 2009

[haughty quail]

With the amount of research, an explanation given by the person should suffice

[spare sedge]

i did

[haughty quail]

Are you accounting for bare material costs
A 250GB hard drive and 2TB hard drive are effectively the same cost due to necessary materials

[spare sedge]

anyway this basically is the same problem as space exploration

and we arent plateauing

[haughty quail]

What does this have to do with PC parts?

[lusty orchid]

zero

[spare sedge]

so its bad to say. we cant predict the future of 15 years and then say that 8 tb wont be $10 - $40 in the future.

[vast geyser]

i hate the joy emoji so much

its so

unbearable to look at

[haughty quail]

It's funny to use ironically

It reeks of facebook

[haughty quail]

Same way I can't predict when the dayum PC will be built

So we should focus on the present, yes?

[spare sedge]

bare material costs could change too.

[vast geyser]

uh, its easy to say that it wont be $10
costs of materials increases

[haughty quail]

*will

[vast geyser]

we have limited resources on our lovely earth

[spare sedge]

its not. i did the calculation before inflation meaning that it could be valued at $5

[haughty quail]

If we’re still using today’s ssd tech in 15 years I’ll be disappointed

[spare sedge]

and just sold for some bare min company wants it price

[vast geyser]

..what

[spare sedge]

basically what this all means is that

dont spend $3000 on 24tb of m.2 storage

[vast geyser]

the 8tb ssds costs $5 or what?

[vast geyser]

that should have been clear already

[haughty quail]

Nobody's doing that lol

[spare sedge]

well it wasnt. obviously

[vast geyser]

uh

[lusty orchid]

it was from the get go

[haughty quail]

It was pretty obviously implied, I think it was just you who needed help getting to the conclusion. Not saying it's a bad thing, but the fact it wasn't brought up meant it was implied

[vast geyser]

we told you multiple times, 1tb ssd for boot, and another 4tb for whatever

[spare sedge]

cause in 15 years you probably wouldnt go through 24 tb of storage

[spare sedge]

no you havent

[haughty quail]

You don’t know that

[vast geyser]

wat

[spare sedge]

this is the first time ive seen you say that

[lusty orchid]

it's you who looked into the unnessacerily stuff

[spare sedge]

no it was you guys

creeper posted the video

[vast geyser]

yeah i havent said that personally
creeper and rauko did

[spare sedge]

and you started talking about smr and cmr for some fuckin reason

[haughty quail]

?

it has been said lol

[lusty orchid]

he posted a couple of vids, and also i've been telling you from the start not to touch a HDD

[haughty quail]

Woopy already said this

[spare sedge]

then why get all fanboy over smr cmr

[haughty quail]

?

Who brought up smr...?

[vast geyser]

rauko did yeah

for some reason

[spare sedge]

i was already moving on to ssds

[vast geyser]

this is what started

[spare sedge]

i love the fucking information but dont fucking judge me

[haughty quail]

You were talking about HDDs... which is what everyone has been saying not to get

[lusty orchid]

i never went fan boy, you kept posting about 20tb+ hdd's which i did state to never touch with a van build

[haughty quail]

The mod role color is very nice

Swearing

[lusty orchid]

though it was a reply to someone else that i failed to click reply on

[spare sedge]

rauko just likes giving random detailed info to appear smart and then just blames me when i take interest when he actually decides to go into more in depth stuff

[vast geyser]

its pretty epic

[haughty quail]

Who?

[spare sedge]

like i love it but leave me alone about going into unneccessary stuff.

im just learning

[haughty quail]

Aren't you the one doing that... just curious...

[spare sedge]

and buying

alr imma finish the video

[haughty quail]

Projection...

[vast geyser]

god i havent heard that in a while

[haughty quail]

It's true 💀

[spare sedge]

like i actually appreciate this stuf

i just dont want to be disrespected

[lusty orchid]

if i ever went and got a van, i know already what i'd do for a pc

[haughty quail]

You do it to sound smart and then ignore general consensus from people on "Don't get XYZ"

[spare sedge]

i can only ignore so much of it for 40 days straight

[haughty quail]

You are the one disrespecting other people, point blank

[vast geyser]

a laptop

[lusty orchid]

that be the easiest way to go about it

[haughty quail]

Real

[vast geyser]

laptop 4090s are flippin fast

[spare sedge]

what if i built the pc without a case directly into the van

[vast geyser]

so, a wall mount?

[spare sedge]

sure

[haughty quail]

How is this more convenient than a laptop?

[lusty orchid]

but an empty 4u server case where i can put whatever pc into it @vast geyser

[spare sedge]

i could build the pc into the cieling lol

[lusty orchid]

empty 4u server case

[vast geyser]

that requires quite a bit of moolah and planning, doesnt it

[vast geyser]

wait how big is 4U actually

[lusty orchid]

no much more than a normal pc build

[lusty orchid]

full atx case basically on it's side

[vast geyser]

oh

thought it was smaller

[spare sedge]

what about no case

[vast geyser]

might be a bit flimsy

[lusty orchid]

poor choice as it would lead to pc parts getting easily damaged

[spare sedge]

yeah maybe

but what if it was mounting to the cieling

[lusty orchid]

not a maybe, you're dealing with limited space while in a van

[lusty orchid]

it will need protecting still

[spare sedge]

have you seen any vanlife videos

[lusty orchid]

yes

[spare sedge]

i think you overcompensate for vanlife too much

[haughty quail]

They're not building gaming PCs lol that's the difference

They're building PCs suitable to their lifestyle

[vast geyser]

they usually use laptops

[vast geyser]

its easily the best way to go about a van life

[lusty orchid]

itx/matx or a laptop being used

[haughty quail]

Yeah, honestly, I mean: practicality. If you stop at a cafe or something, just bring your laptop for the free wifi lol

[spare sedge]

im building a pc not a laptop

[haughty quail]

That is the issue

[vast geyser]

yeah i think we got that already

[spare sedge]

even an atx would be fine

[vast geyser]

depends on the van

[spare sedge]

im telling you i will have enough space lol

[haughty quail]

Do you have the van?

[spare sedge]

pc first. van second lmao

[haughty quail]

So then how do you know you have enough space?

[vast geyser]

will u have free candy in the van

[haughty quail]

A model and dimensions of the van would be nice to determine how much room you'll actually have

[spare sedge]

cause the vans have enough space obviously

i already spent a night do this with the people in this thread

[haughty quail]

That's completely dependent on model, on top of additional furniture and appliances inside the van for your "van life"

[spare sedge]

im not doing it again

[vast geyser]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaanyway

[haughty quail]

Hmm.. if only the thread could be condensed into a few comments..

[vast geyser]

@haughty quail thats an issue for future her

[spare sedge]

so when i say atx or even eatx is fine.

its fine

[haughty quail]

Bro, I've viewed all possible futures: there's no PC built in any 🤣

[lusty orchid]

poor priority management

[vast geyser]

good soldiers follow orders

[lusty orchid]

i called that way earlier

[haughty quail]

Yeah, and a bad captain kills everyone who follows them

[spare sedge]

itx is just synergizes more

[haughty quail]

Real...

[spare sedge]

??????

[lusty orchid]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/145131903068 4u case for $90 basically

[spare sedge]

lmaoo

[vast geyser]

i mean... it wont affect us

[haughty quail]

Rauko has a point that we're all talking about

[vast geyser]

oh wow 4U is really bigger than i thought

i take it all back lol

[spare sedge]

no how???

[vast geyser]

a smaller size might be better though

[haughty quail]

True, but it's like arguing with a dementia patient. Forgets everything being said in like 10 minutes, "that never happened lmao??? nobody ever said that?? lmaooo"

[vast geyser]

we all know the true end game is 1-2U with a custom loop that had the fittings screwed with the power of a bear

[lusty orchid]

when i called it btw

[haughty quail]

In order to determine how much room you'll have your setup, it's better to have the van already purchased. That requires understanding basic finances for transport, appliances, furniture, etc. After measuring the dimensions of your vehicle, then you can proceed to figure out how to fit your PC inside the van.

The first step should have been to: figure out what case you wanted after getting the van

Because, there is no point buying all these parts if they do not even fit in the case

Just as how there's no point buying a PC if it doesn't fit in the van

[spare sedge]

you literally dont know my fucking life

i cant buy the van right now lmao

[haughty quail]

And yet you post it publicly?

[lusty orchid]

no but at the same time you don't get a van and make it work around the pc

[haughty quail]

Why not save up for the van since that will be holding room for your PC?

[spare sedge]

im not

im getting a fucking pc and then moving into my van eventually ffs

[haughty quail]

You made a public post regarding the preferences of your PC and how you want it to match your lifestyle needs (van life), and then asked for advice around that. Inb4 "well that was when I didn't know XYZ", we are still continuing discussions 17k messages later about what is needed/learned, etc.

[spare sedge]

whats so hard

[haughty quail]

So you cannot be upset that people are commenting on your life if you made it public for people to comment on 🤷‍♂️

[spare sedge]

lnb4???

[haughty quail]

Here before you make the point, is what I'm saying

[spare sedge]

just leave me alone. im so fucking tired of this

[haughty quail]

I'd be dayum tired if I was geting nowhere 🤣

[lusty orchid]

i can easily tell you it's going to be 10-15k for a van, 5-10k renovating it to how you want it, 6-8k for power setup, and you're wanting a system that's capable of doing 4k gaming for up to 5k budget

[haughty quail]

Come back with an actual argument or explanation for your thought process, and I will reconsider

[spare sedge]

hey look

[haughty quail]

Rather than running away every time you are confronted about your own attitude

[spare sedge]

leave me alone

i dont want help with the vanlife part

[haughty quail]

Again, you have the power to not respond to people. You choose to continuously respond

[haughty quail]

Well, it's obviously important since you mentioned it for your PC. If you need help, wouldn't it make sense to prioritize the van?

[spare sedge]

you shouldnt even be in here

you havent helped once

[haughty quail]

You mean... the public server... with a public thread...

[lusty orchid]

not aiming to help with that, doing napkin maths into overall spend, and relative to the pc that will be used

[haughty quail]

I think van first, case next, PC parts after

[spare sedge]

leave me alone

[lusty orchid]

case is decided with the build in that aspect

[haughty quail]

That is true, but with this case, it'll be obvious the other parts will be given more focus. So better to just nudge in the direction of focusing strictly on case

She'll be more likely to focus on the HDDs, PCIE slots, etc. other than if it can actually fit in the case so anything dimension-wise should come first 🙏

[lusty orchid]

i know they wanted a pink build originally, though any case can be made that way

[haughty quail]

That's true as well, I think the issue is specifically: is there room in the van?

So, maybe I should reiterate: less about parts in case, more about case in van

[lusty orchid]

spray paint it in the shade of pink they want in regards to the case

[haughty quail]

LOL

Noo, you don't understand - she needs the hex codes

Come on, the history of pink is so important guys

Like, literally, leave me alone

[spare sedge]

<@&750150305383186585>

[haughty quail]

Wait... did we decide where the power source is coming from?

[vast geyser]

oh yeah 100% the way to go about it

[haughty quail]

For the van, I mean

[vast geyser]

solar panel i think

[lusty orchid]

been discussed, solar setup

[haughty quail]

Interesting. So this was discussed?

Oh, good to know. The van was discussed

[spare sedge]

been discussed please i just want to focus on storage

[haughty quail]

So what are the plans for the solar setup? @lusty orchid

[lusty orchid]

very simple 500gb nvme for boot drive, couple 4tb nvme's for games and storage

[spare sedge]

why 500gb

[vast geyser]

dont need more for boot

[lusty orchid]

anything more for boot drive is not worth it

[haughty quail]

^^

[spare sedge]

yeah but as discussed earlier, you can put other things on the boot drive

just fine

[vast geyser]

yeah

[haughty quail]

You can, but that's already covered by the 500gb

[spare sedge]

so why take up a whole m.2 slot with a smal cap m.2

[lusty orchid]

you can but not needed, any games really should be stored on a second drive

[spare sedge]

why

[lusty orchid]

any corruptions that can happen with an OS will mean a wipe and reinstall of the OS

having everything all on 1 drive means you have to reinstall everything

[spare sedge]

so if windows corrupts itll be messy

[lusty orchid]

limiting it to only OS, drivers and main launchers on the boot drive only is a way to prevent that

[lusty orchid]

yes

[spare sedge]

so then its better to have linux on its own boot drive too

[signal moat]

Is the boot drive the drive that stores the windows data

[lusty orchid]

any important files should always be kept on a separate storage device from the OS

[lusty orchid]

yes

[haughty quail]

Yeah, it's the one that contains the OS

[lusty orchid]

also yes

[signal moat]

Oh ok

[spare sedge]

alright good to know

[haughty quail]

Nice pfp btw

🗿

[lusty orchid]

but mess with linux in a VM rather than straight up installign it

there's a reason why linux does live drives

[vast geyser]

linux is a pain

[lusty orchid]

linux live drives allow you to try that version of linux out without making any changes to your current system

basically a "try before you buy" scenario

[spare sedge]

do storage devices have benchmarks i can look at

[lusty orchid]

yes

tomshardware has several

and i know woopy linked an image from it in regards to several gen4 nvme's

[haughty quail]

https://www.tomshardware.com/topics/storage

[vast geyser]

dude that tom guy must be fun

[haughty quail]

He's dope

[lusty orchid]

anandtech also has several storage benchmarks as well

though it's funny how both showed a wd sn570 outlasting a 970 evo plus and a 980 from samsung

[spare sedge]

whats all this

[vast geyser]

https://tenor.com/view/white-dog-shaking-scared-nervous-dog-scared-and-shaking-gif-22874221

[spare sedge]

and so dram is always nice to have cause cache is always kind of op

[vast geyser]

my live reaction

[lusty orchid]

the configuration of controller to nand and cache

[vast geyser]

eh, not necessary on nvme drives

[vast geyser]

since theyre very fuckin fast

[spare sedge]

yeah but a nvme with cache if it exists would be faster

[lusty orchid]

it's nice to have, but it's not OP, and it's only worth it when it comes to sata ssd's

[lusty orchid]

nope

[vast geyser]

fastest nvme or smth is dramless

some intel optane i think

[lusty orchid]

one of the fastest ssd's is a dramless ssd from intel

[vast geyser]

most high end ssds have dram so meh

[spare sedge]

here are all the 5x4 m.2s on the market

heres all the 8tb m.2s

[vast geyser]

sure

[lusty orchid]

do not touch

[vast geyser]

that helps how though

[lusty orchid]

do not touch either

[vast geyser]

neither of those are worth buying

[spare sedge]

what if the mb has a gen 5 m.2 slot

[vast geyser]

just use gen 4

[spare sedge]

but i mean. if the mb offers gen 5

for m.2

[vast geyser]

its way overpriced

[spare sedge]

not really

[vast geyser]

for no improvement

[vast geyser]

$150 for 1tb

[pearl heath]

Gen 5 SSDs don't perform any better than gen 4 SSDs atm

[spare sedge]

8tb is overpriced and isnt future proof

[lusty orchid]

that is primarily for the pcie x16 slot, you don;t need to use a gen 5 nvme drive as it gives you no performance advantages for your current use case

[pearl heath]

And in some cases, they are worse

[vast geyser]

future proofing is a myth

[lusty orchid]

future proof doesn't exist

[vast geyser]

only future proof thing you can do in life is buy a large case and a slightly large psu

[lusty orchid]

there's future resisting

but there's no future proofing

future proof is a really bad misnomer

[spare sedge]

future proofing / future resistance been discussed

all im saying is 8tb will age badly

[lusty orchid]

and yet you brought it up to start with

[haughty quail]

Real, was just about to say that

[spare sedge]

m.2 gen 5x4 will not age badly

[lusty orchid]

yes it will, it needs active cooling

[haughty quail]

Future proofing is honestly just catered marketing. It is difficult to predict how long someone's PC will last

[spare sedge]

how??

[vast geyser]

they get hot

[spare sedge]

okayyy so then how do you cool it then >.>

[vast geyser]

a fan

[haughty quail]

Lol exactly

[spare sedge]

what do m.2 fans look like

[vast geyser]

do the 5nail5 ram cooler but for m.2

[lusty orchid]

a cooler designed for actively cooling the m.2

[haughty quail]

https://tenor.com/view/google-exists-google-search-it-geekboy-geekboy-cz-gif-25933207

[spare sedge]

where do m.2 coolers plug in

[lusty orchid]

nah, you can get a propper m.2 nvme cooler

[vast geyser]

[lusty orchid]

fan header

[haughty quail]

Kinda heat ngl

[spare sedge]

okay are they on pcpp

[haughty quail]

No pun intended

[spare sedge]

how much are they

[lusty orchid]

how long is a piece of string?

[lusty orchid]

no

[haughty quail]

Depends where you get from

[vast geyser]

its so sexy

[spare sedge]

idk like 2 m

[haughty quail]

ONG

[lusty orchid]

primarily amazon

[vast geyser]

the answer is: depends

[spare sedge]

what??

[haughty quail]

Yeah, but would still depend on seller I guess 😅

[vast geyser]

wdym what

[spare sedge]

wtfdym

[lusty orchid]

well the question you asked deserve the response i gave you, as it amounts to the same thing

[haughty quail]

The length of a string depends

🤯

[spare sedge]

yeah so anyway

where do i get the m.2 cooler

any links

[vast geyser]

...

[haughty quail]

It depends

[vast geyser]

do u really want that extra noise

for no difference

[spare sedge]

omfg

[lusty orchid]

@spare sedge

[vast geyser]

you can literally use amazon yourself yknow

[spare sedge]

https://www.asrock.com/mb/spec/product.us.asp?Model=Blazing M.2 Gen5 Fan-Heatsink

so this then

[haughty quail]

The difference in price is mainly difference in sellers

[spare sedge]

why couldnt you just say $20 -$30 jfc

[haughty quail]

It depends where you live also

[spare sedge]

so poetic with the responses today

[lusty orchid]

because there are those that are also 40+

[spare sedge]

its like im reading a book. im on the edge of my seat

[haughty quail]

Exactly

[spare sedge]

yeah but not $300

[haughty quail]

Since you're on the edge of your seat, can you reach for the PC parts across your desk and start building?

[spare sedge]

i literally wouldnt mind cooling a m.2

and if anything this just gives more reason to go custom loop

[lusty orchid]

there are also passive m.2 heatsinks you can also get for like 4-5

[haughty quail]

Heatsinks are nice too

[vast geyser]

i drank like 4-6L of water today holy shit i gotta be stopped

[spare sedge]

i linked a heatsink

[pearl heath]

Custom loop in a van is the single worst idea

[haughty quail]

Bro 😭

[lusty orchid]

not in a van

[spare sedge]

ive already looked into it

it works

[vast geyser]

uh

the issue is

that

vans move a lot

[haughty quail]

Do you.. have the van?

[spare sedge]

its not immersion

[lusty orchid]

vibration and bumps/braking says no it doesn't

[vast geyser]

and a few sharp turns, and the pc is a goner

[pearl heath]

Things with water in them don't like to be moved often

[spare sedge]

the res pump combo would be fine

[lusty orchid]

and also take a little while to settle

[haughty quail]

If we had dimensions of the van, this would be more helpful

[lusty orchid]

ford transit, long wheelbase, high top

[haughty quail]

To know how much is actually allowed to fit in there (ofc after having all the appliances and whatnot)

[haughty quail]

Oh, so she did mention van life? 🤯

So the van is important to the discussion then?

[pearl heath]

Unless you mount the graphics card in a special way, you will destroy it in a van, especially if it's got a waterblock

[lusty orchid]

she sent the pic, i just know the exact fan type

[haughty quail]

Outta curiosity: what model

[pearl heath]

The PCB will crack right by the slot finger and that will not be covered by warranty

[lusty orchid]

transit is the van model tbh

[haughty quail]

No, as in year

Sorry, should have clarified: the year of the model

[lusty orchid]

basics of the inside of one of them

[haughty quail]

Let me guess.. she wants brand new...

[lusty orchid]

dunno

[haughty quail]

Yeah, nope, custom loop is not gonna work in that 😢

[vast geyser]

ok that does not seem that large

[lusty orchid]

just i'm familliar with the room they have

[lusty orchid]

they're the tardis of vans dude

[haughty quail]

Called it lol

[vast geyser]

a time machine?

[haughty quail]

Okay, so let's say we're working with a 2023 Ford Transit

[vast geyser]

i know the meaning dw

just wanted to goof around

[haughty quail]

Ngl haven't kept up with the series anymore

[lusty orchid]

yes, but bigger on the inside

time and relative dimensions in space

[spare sedge]

it doesnt look big in the picture

[haughty quail]

You can call me The Doctor

[spare sedge]

but they are big irl

and there are different types

[lusty orchid]

like i said, they're the tardis of vans

[vast geyser]

ok so youre supposed to fit a bed, an oven, a table, and a shower in that?

[lusty orchid]

easily doable

[haughty quail]

💀

[spare sedge]

it is

[haughty quail]

The basic appliances are something that can be worked around, what makes it more difficult is the PC setup

[vast geyser]

the hell!

[vast geyser]

meh

[haughty quail]

Didn't even get to the solar part yet

[spare sedge]

i dont want to talk about vanlife anymore

[lusty orchid]

like i said to creeper, it's all about how it's implemented

[vast geyser]

if you can fit a table, you can fit a pc setup

[haughty quail]

It depends on who we're talking to..

[spare sedge]

probably wont have a table

might have a counter

[lusty orchid]

same diff tbh

[spare sedge]

it doesnt really matter the van isnt happening until after the pc

its not money reasons its just i need to sell my stuff

[lusty orchid]

a fold out counter doubles as a table

[spare sedge]

anyway yeah idc about all this rn

so nand type only has 4 types?

[vast geyser]

5

[spare sedge]

whats the 5th one

[lusty orchid]

and van life like a small home, it's all about how you use the space

[lusty orchid]

plc

[vast geyser]

rauko listed them above someone

[haughty quail]

Do you really need a custom loop tho 🤣

[lusty orchid]

nope

[vast geyser]

you never need a custom loop

[haughty quail]

Exactly

[vast geyser]

there isnt 1 scenario in which you would need a custom loop

[haughty quail]

I'm not arguing about the van (I'm sure things can be moved around if it ever comes to that point)

What matters is the PC but alas, we have neither of those things so everything's speculation

[lusty orchid]

@spare sedge on a side note, you can double up your solar as a form of heating also

[spare sedge]

what does p stand for

ik qlc is quad

[vast geyser]

perpendicular

[haughty quail]

It's.. at the top of the sentence

lmao

[spare sedge]

no that cant be it

[haughty quail]

https://tenor.com/view/funwaa-among-us-amogus-dumpy-gumwaa-gif-22154657

[lusty orchid]

it is

[spare sedge]

is plc the one that comes after qlc?

[lusty orchid]

yes

[spare sedge]

is it 5 bits per cell?

[vast geyser]

jarvis, zoom in on the picture

[haughty quail]

What do you think?

[lusty orchid]

yes

[haughty quail]

🤫

[spare sedge]

why not call it penta level cell wtf

[lusty orchid]

but you need to realise this one thing

[vast geyser]

cause thats a league of legends reference

[spare sedge]

lmao omg

[haughty quail]

Is she fr arguing with ChatGPT rn

[vast geyser]

https://tenor.com/view/wall-talking-gif-10919304

[lusty orchid]

the more cell layers the faster it is but at the same time the lower the endurance will be

[haughty quail]

LMAO

[lusty orchid]

how i feel like when explaining stuff to some people

[spare sedge]

then leave

[lusty orchid]

did i say it was you?

[haughty quail]

Self-insertion is crazy 🤯 almost there

[vast geyser]

dream

you have no idea how many people rauko talks to in tech chat every day

[spare sedge]

well dont treat me like this

[vast geyser]

what we do

[haughty quail]

??

[vast geyser]

i was saying that arguing with chatgpt is like arguign with a brick wall

[haughty quail]

Real

Arguing with people on the other end of the spectrum feels the exact same tho tbh 🤣

[vast geyser]

so true

i need more water

my bladder fears me

[lusty orchid]

careful dude, to much water on the body is as bad as having no water to drink

[haughty quail]

😟 Water overdose

[lusty orchid]

your brain also

[vast geyser]

im simply just thirsty ok

[lusty orchid]

that's fine dude just don't over do it

[spare sedge]

okay so the plc is penta level cells. but they werent out at time of writing that video

nvm the video is 2 mo ago

meaning that plc is still not out yet

and chat gpt doesnt know shit cause its 2021

[haughty quail]

What?

[spare sedge]

not until 2025

itll be the slowest nand type with a 25% increase to nand type

so chat gpt was probably just talking about something else

[pearl heath]

Wait, have you been referencing chat GPT for a lot of the previous parts you've talked about?

[spare sedge]

no im talking about right now

cause rauko said plc was the 5th nand type

[brave brook]

And a 25% endurance reduction