a break from keyboard talk
#audio-tech
warm scarab
i advise getting 3 other hi res audio stickers to complete the square formation
it provides better audio also
green marsh
real
pallid wind
topping is quite serviceable id say
Yeah I asked if they were a good brand here and a few people said yes.
pallid wind
it was like a few days ago lol
warm scarab
please dont be jackson please dont be jackson please dont be jackson
sleek lily
Everyone here needs an intro electronics class. I can't believe there was a discussion on the latency of effectively a wire.
That's criminal.
green marsh
here?
i think one of them was me but i definitely didnt say they were good
just good enough
pallid wind
Now I just need a longer audio cable for my FT1 headphones so I dont have the cables go across my desk
warm scarab
cant believe people think their fingers are faster than tensioned springs
sleek lily
The spring moves as you push it
pallid wind
So with dacs, you normally just keep your PC volume at 100% and adjust the volume from the dac wheel?
sleek lily
The moment if contact electricity flows
warm scarab
The spring moves as you push it
the theory is you push so fast it cant follow the switch's lip
sleek lily
Hookes law and shi
warm scarab
and it has to land
green marsh
So with dacs, you normally just keep your PC volume at 100% and adjust the volum...
well its a dac/amp but yeah
warm scarab
which is lol
livid ruin
i only stand by it that’s it’s considered additional latency because the material does not straighten up as nearly fast a electricity goes in a wire, as of science, i’ve never argued that it’s signficant
warm scarab
i only stand by it that’s it’s considered additional latency because the materia...
ok
pallid wind
Oh yeah update. I got my FT1 headphones replaced and I don't hear anymore crackling. They also fit a lot better
sleek lily
the theory is you push so fast it cant follow the switch's lip
That's just wrong unless the metal or the plastic literally compresses
sleek lily
Everyone here needs some ohms law and hookes law
green marsh
its possible if the spring is weak
sleek lily
Like they need those concepts asap
zenith pawn
idk how you can say moving an object both 1km and 1nm has 0 delay, and then say you aren't trolling
green marsh
or if you move it extremely quick
sleek lily
idk how you can say moving an object both 1km and 1nm has 0 delay, and then say ...
Because the moment of contact is the moment of contact...
green marsh
if something has a .00001 second delay it might as well have fucking none
green marsh
thats how it works in human interaction shit\
warm scarab
then the contact material may not be able to descend in time
and thats the argument here
its like physically possible
but inconceiveable
zenith pawn
if something has a .00001 second delay it might as well have fucking none
this is fine, it wouldve been nice if someone had just led with that instead of attacking me for even considering an idea
green marsh
maybe if youre a computer doing gigahertz speed maybe .00001 seconds has an effect
zenith pawn
Because the moment of contact is the moment of contact...
i think you got confused though
it's not about the latency between the leaf contacting, and then sending a signal
that would be the speed of electricity and i already said that's not what i'm talking about
livid ruin
i believe there are fasters ways than mechanical to sense actuation for example optical switches, i’m not saying that they matter, the delay is insignificant that it even makes audio speudoscience only believers look good if someone in a review tells you that it matters for gaming
warm scarab
?
zenith pawn
i thought optical was supposed to only be for getting analog capabilities but for some reason razer still does it
green marsh
i believe there are fasters ways than mechanical to sense actuation for example ...
tell that to optimum tech 
zenith pawn
?
sorry for possibly being wrong, i will have to repent tomorrow
although i don't think you deserve an apology
zenith pawn
you hurt mine too lmao
zenith pawn
what exactly does ohms law do to apply here though
green marsh
I can't believe any school doesn't tech these concepts
i would like to say this was taught to me in high school
zenith pawn
and don't just insult me and not answer
zenith pawn
they were taught to me too
sleek lily
As it should be
zenith pawn
i mean that in the most genuine questioning manner
livid ruin
we had ohms law in elementary
zenith pawn
as in i want to know the answer, not win an argument
livid ruin
as in i want to know the answer, not win an argument
i believe he mentioned ohm’s law as generally
zenith pawn
the guy left
livid ruin
not to the conversation
zenith pawn
i believe he mentioned ohm’s law as generally
perhaps
but then thats not very actionable advice
livid ruin
yes the mechanical parts make electrical contact before they touch but the cu may register it only once the power reaches a certain threshold
so he meant ohm’s law as it should be more and properly taught in schools
sleek lily
what exactly does ohms law do to apply here though
Because the moment those two leads make contact the DC voltage of both sides is 5v besides lag from the about 0 capacitance of the leaf.
livid ruin
but then thats not very actionable advice
i guess
zenith pawn
Because the moment those two leads make contact the DC voltage of both sides is ...
i don't have a problem with saying that when two metal wires contact, the voltage raises effectively instantly
that's completely unrelated to what i was saying
i think even klaus gets that
warm scarab
sorry for possibly being wrong, i will have to repent tomorrow
no but you said we are saying things you never claimed when you specifically mentioned leaf spring lag
sleek lily
And the wires make contact as soon as you push the part the appropriate distance besides the compression of the actual plastic and leaf, because they are pushing each other
There is no latency there
Besides how fast you press it, which isn't a keyboard variable.
zenith pawn
no but you said we are saying things you never claimed when you specifically men...
maybe it wasnt you
it seems like maybe you understand
warm scarab
you said latency isnt from spring contacting after saying there is lag from spring contacting
like
zenith pawn
you said latency isnt from spring contacting after saying there is lag from spri...
what
sleek lily
I don't know who was saying what tbh, I just know this whole convo hurt my soul every time I looked at it
Nearly everything I read was wrong
zenith pawn
And the wires make contact as soon as you push the part the appropriate distance...
maybe if that's the case, i didn't initially think the time length of the spring release would be instant
that means we need somebody to measure this and find out 🔥
green marsh
i dont think we do
sleek lily
You wouldn't because the part is pushed. The only variable besides material compression is how fast you press it.
warm scarab
what
"pretty sure ive seen poeple get different latencies depending on how strong the leaf spring is"
"it's not about the latency between the leaf contacting, and then sending a signal"
sleek lily
The leaf is pushed by that hook plastic part of the stem
livid ruin
There is no latency there
btw if you swing a plastic rod while holding it on one side the material it takes a while for each molecule to shift into place even without air resistance, that’s what you could call latency or delay
warm scarab
these two statements by you contradict each other
zenith pawn
"pretty sure ive seen poeple get different latencies depending on how strong the...
the strength of the leaf spring would theoretically change how fast it contacts after the leg "releases" the leaf, not how fast electricity travels
that's what i was trying to say
sleek lily
btw if you swing a plastic rod while holding it on one side the material it take...
It's not a variable because it applies about equally to all keyboards, but your latency from the stem and the copper compressing is immediately small...
warm scarab
we know?
zenith pawn
because the spring constant would change the acceleration of the spring
sleek lily
Like incomprehensible levels of small
livid ruin
It's not a variable because it applies about equally to all keyboards, but your ...
it still exsists tho
zenith pawn
i dont see how it contradicts
livid ruin
cannot say it has “no latency” in science
zenith pawn
cannot say it has “no latency” in science
yeah but that gotcha is not what i was going for
green marsh
cannot say it has “no latency” in science
you can if its within margin of error of 0
or under the measureable precision of the measuring instrument
warm scarab
you said it has lag based on spring strength first and then said its not about the latency between leaf contacting?
what am I not getting here
these contradict
zenith pawn
you said it has lag based on spring strength first and then said its not about t...
the latter isnt what i was trying to say
warm scarab
okay can you reiterate that then
green marsh
would you like to explain where in the keyswitch you think the latency is coming from
zenith pawn
the second is supposed to say the latency between after the contact, until the voltage raises above the trigger level, which is what biooc seemed to be worrying about
livid ruin
if you think about it on a larger scale it’s very important agaisnt earthquakes, even concrete can shift molecules a tiny bit without breaking or snapping bonds immediately
green marsh
well we arent talking about that here are we
warm scarab
okay so you are saying for this specific example, origin of lag isn't the leaf
in that message
for that example
zenith pawn
okay so you are saying for this specific example, origin of lag isn't the leaf
not correct
warm scarab
am i stupid or is this confusing to anyone else also
sleek lily
Comparing keyboard latency in this manner is like comparing frame latency by the reactance of the HDMI cable alone
green marsh
am i stupid or is this confusing to anyone else also
nah i aint know either
warm scarab
trying to understand the understanding ofbbaovanc understanding of my understanding to understand his understanding
sleek lily
Its just a stupid non factor not worth measuring in any scenario
That's literally all this conversation should have told anyone
zenith pawn
trying to understand the understanding ofbbaovanc understanding of my understand...
imagine if the process is
- the leg reaches actuation point and releases the leaf
- the leaf touches together
- the short causes the voltage to drop to effectively 0
what i was saying is the delay between 1 and 2 which may as well be negligible, i just had no idea
seemed like biooc was talking about the delay between 2 and 3
and then ashuran is just in here to dogpile for some reason
warm scarab
leaf doesnt get released by anything thought which is the issue here
it glides along an angled surface of the switch
it doesnt get dropped onto the contact
warm scarab
if you look at the gif I sent you'll see that
zenith pawn
i was thinking tactile the entire time
that makes a lot more sense
in tactile, once you go over the bump, it's as if the leaf is suddenly released
that's why i was saying the leaf spring strength matters, because that's an actual thing that we already see causes chattering issues in tactiles
sleek lily
This conversation gives me chronic diseases in my brain every time I see it. How have we not all concluded it's beyond pointless 😭
zenith pawn
This conversation gives me chronic diseases in my brain every time I see it. How...
minor miscommunication of me forgetting linear switches exist while you guys were going off of them exclusively
warm scarab
no im speaking tactile also just look at the gif I sent
green marsh
it doesnt matter the same thing is happening
warm scarab
or is that linear and did I goof up
livid ruin
i’m kinda lost about what you guys are arguing but yes there is latency, it’s neglidible, cannot say there is not latency reduction by going with optical or other ways than mechanical because the marketing teams that make optical would eat you up for not mentioning the switch being 0.xxx ms faster
green marsh
or is that linear and did I goof up
that is linear
zenith pawn
its linear
if you get an image of an mx brown it probably wont look much different
i mean ones where the bump is super severe
warm scarab
still there is no x mm of distance of a leaf being dropped im pretty sure, it still rides along an angled lip
green marsh
its still aint going to separate from the track
zenith pawn
still there is no x mm of distance of a leaf being dropped im pretty sure, it st...
its too fast for it to simply ride along the stem bump, as far as i know that's why leaf tick exists
livid ruin
still there is no x mm of distance of a leaf being dropped im pretty sure, it st...
the rail or angled plastic can bend slightly (extremely smol) as it tries to shift the metal parts
zenith pawn
my theory is the leaf releases quickly instead of gliding along the leg, and then causes a ticking noise
if that's not what causes it then i have to go back to the drawing board because ttc switches are garbage for some reason
livid ruin
anyways yes i admit this latency thing convo was pointless because most of it even proper devices cannot measure
livid ruin
my theory is the leaf releases quickly instead of gliding along the leg, and the...
i mean it could be that the contacts are closer than intended or ideal if the contacts make audible sound when actuated
or do you mean something else
zenith pawn
i mean it could be that the contacts are closer than intended or ideal if the co...
i dont know, it could be both
ive heard outemu is known for having weaker leaves, and i noticed that they seem to have below average ticking based on the switches i own
oh you know what the ticking probably is coming from inside the leaf, not from hitting the leg
but that still doesn't change anything
green marsh
aint it just the leaves hitting each other
zenith pawn
probably
or this is probably the ping noise, not the ticking that annoys me most
i hear both a ringing noise (leaf ping) and a click/tick noise (leaf tick) on some switches, and i dont really know how to solve either one, or if it's even possible
livid ruin
i dont know, it could be both
like do you mean the part which i market in blue is more bend towards the other contact?
zenith pawn
idk what this is saying really
im guessing the metal contact leaves hitting together at high velocity causes the "ping"
maybe metal on plastic sound when the leaf hits the stem after bump is the tick?
livid ruin
idk what this is saying really
like the leaf can be bent by the manufacturer so it can extend by itself, the leaf by default is pushing agaisnt the stem’s slider, if you bend the leaf more it’ll push less agaisnt the stem’s slider and if you bend it less it will want to be in the stem
green marsh
or this is probably the ping noise, not the ticking that annoys me most
i hear ...
nah thats from the actual spring u
zenith pawn
one type of tick is from the spring, but i think the other one is from the leaf
theres two types of ticks i hear with some of my switches
zenith pawn
look man i got some really fucked up switches
i dont know what i did to deserve it
everyone glazes them on the internet
livid ruin
one type of tick is from the spring, but i think the other one is from the leaf
the most common is the keycap’s stem not being perfectly aligned all times on the switch stem
livid ruin
i dont think ive ever had that
you know spacebar ticking, similar effect can be had on other keys
zenith pawn
interesting
livid ruin
you know when you press a side of a keycap instead of center
some keycaps may wiggle in the stem part
zenith pawn
for some reason my stabilizer keys can do that but they all tick anyways so i decided to just give up on them
livid ruin
for some reason my stabilizer keys can do that but they all tick anyways so i de...
glue could be a solution 🤣 /j
warm scarab
like the leaf can be bent by the manufacturer so it can extend by itself, the le...
but it pushes against the angled part of the lip you see
the distance which the lip is "dropped off" from is like
so incredibly small
zenith pawn
so incredibly small
that's why mx browns are barely considered tactile switches
livid ruin
so incredibly small
i agree
zenith pawn
maybe it still doesnt matter for latency though
even on something like a gateron type r
warm scarab
that's why mx browns are barely considered tactile switches
not true though
because you can see in every switch type there is no drop
in every case they glide along the angled lip aside from perhaps clicky which is still barely any distance
zenith pawn
it doesnt seem accurate given i hear ticks from the bump
livid ruin
that's why mx browns are barely considered tactile switches
you can see their travel forces they certainly have a bump on a graph/chart/measurement
livid ruin
they’re 700% within of what’s considered a tactile bump
warm scarab
you can see that tactile's lip has 2 bumps
but there is no bump for the release of the lip
the lip goes into some form of ditch
goes back up then gets dropped into the contact
the noise point of the switch isn't where it activates
it activates a slight bit before and you can test this on your own keyboard
you can activate it after the "click" by very marginally changing the key's height and unactivating it
zenith pawn
the noise point of the switch isn't where it activates
the tick point of the switch is where it activates though
i'm not talking about the bottom out noise
warm scarab
yeah
zenith pawn
you can activate it after the "click" by very marginally changing the key's heig...
this only happens if i go over the bump on my switches
zenith pawn
what
warm scarab
literally
livid ruin
one for noise
no feel :sad:
zenith pawn
are you talking abou tthe blue switch??
livid ruin
are you talking abou tthe blue switch??
look up rtings they have deeper dive on travel forces
livid ruin
anything that has an intentional or unintentional bump that can be seen on their graph is considered tactile bump outside of scratchiness
zenith pawn
look up rtings they have deeper dive on travel forces
any idea what keywords to search for
sleek lily
Is this still going on
green marsh
livid ruin
any idea what keywords to search for
rtings switch vs switch
zenith pawn
Is this still going on
talking about a different thing
green marsh
wow a distraction
zenith pawn
the leaf gets stuck on the first bump on the lip
uh i think its supposed to be past that bump when assembled
warm scarab
no
zenith pawn
hold on
zenith pawn
that doesnt really make any sense
green marsh
the leaf gets stuck on the first bump on the lip
id call them valleys not bumps
zenith pawn
it doesnt go in to actuate
green marsh
two valleys and one tactile bump
livid ruin
yes
zenith pawn
what did we do all this for
zenith pawn
which question were you answering, the one about latency all the way above? or the ticking
livid ruin
what did we do all this for
idk but you’ve asked questions someone with basic keyboard knowledge should know
warm scarab
I showed this to you
to display that the ticking is unrelated to the activation
its for a tactile effect provided by an additional bump within the switch
that isnt related to any electronic contacts
and the real contact happens after the tactile bump
in the same exact way it happens in a linear one
are you with me
zenith pawn
to display that the ticking is unrelated to the activation
what are you saying the ticking is then
livid ruin
the ticking can be caused by the leaf making contact with the other contact if it’s metal that’s causing the noise, spring also possibly but i thought spring usually causes just unwanted noises/resonances if not dampened
warm scarab
zenith pawn
the ticking can be caused by the leaf making contact with the other contact if i...
yeah, this is what i was thinking
warm scarab
its the leaf getting hit by the angled form of the lip
you can understand by watching
the leaf goes in and out briefly when the key is pressed
that makes the noise
and after that
it goes to contact along the lip
in an angled fashion like the linear one next to it
just with a steeper angle after the bump
zenith pawn
the leaf goes in and out briefly when the key is pressed
maybe that makes the ping, but not the tick
zenith pawn
i need a lathe to cut one of my switches in half
warm scarab
same but for some people in discord
zenith pawn
maybe that makes the ping, but not the tick
this would line up with what i observe
green marsh
just use a table saw
livid ruin
its the leaf getting hit by the angled form of the lip
can also be the other contact once the leaf hits it
zenith pawn
i can press the switch very slowly and cause the ping, which happens before the actuation
warm scarab
can also be the other contact once the leaf hits it
doesnt make sense because the sound isnt the activation point in a keyboard
zenith pawn
but the tick doesnt seem to happen until exactly the actuation. and it happens on some linear switches
warm scarab
find any tactile keyboard
get it to "tick"
and after the tick there is a small movement room you can use to activate and unactivate the key
zenith pawn
doesnt make sense because the sound isnt the activation point in a keyboard
the actuation comes from two metal pieces hitting together
green marsh
its something hitting stomething thats for sure
warm scarab
the actuation comes from two metal pieces hitting together
listen before commenting
you can still activate and unactivate the switch with zero sound
after the "tick" of the key
because the "tick" is an effect provided by the additional bump like I said 5 times
its unrelated to the activation
livid ruin
doesnt make sense because the sound isnt the activation point in a keyboard
yes i know that, but if it would be noise caused by the two contacts meeting each other it would be caused because the leaf has too much tension
warm scarab
yes i know that, but if it would be noise caused by the two contacts meeting eac...
if it was that then you could still make an activation sound after getting past the "tick" part of the keyboard
by dropping the key down fast enough
but you cant
livid ruin
the intentional noises are all made by plastics
warm scarab
yes
zenith pawn
you can still activate and unactivate the switch with zero sound
i can't, but maybe that's the issue with these switches
warm scarab
I am saying intentional noise is unrelated to activation because you can still reactivate the key past the point of the sound
zenith pawn
but i have no way of confirming it. maybe it is true and the tick isn't from the leaf contacting, then that maybe means its sticking on the leg slightly as it slides
green marsh
I am saying intentional noise is unrelated to activation because you can still r...
well its generally not intentional
zenith pawn
klaus what switches are you testing on
zenith pawn
maybe i'm seeing a different issue
livid ruin
i could theoretically make the leaf more tense and let you know if it does any additional sounds
warm scarab
the simplest way of proving this theory is seeing if you can reactivate the switch after the point of the sound
lone flame
guys
warm scarab
open up notepad
lone flame
this is #audio-tech
lone flame
move to #peripherals lol
warm scarab
no one ever comes here
lone flame
no one ever comes here
im here
warm scarab
leave
livid ruin
see what happens when you move the key up and down without it ticking
oh i keep forgetting did he say before actuation?
well then i have no clue
warm scarab
oh i keep forgetting did he say before actuation?
I don't think he did, I am just proposing sound is before activation
because its from plastic contact with lip instead of electronic contact with the metal
that is my proposition
zenith pawn
the simplest way of proving this theory is seeing if you can reactivate the swit...
youre right, i just took one of my gateron browns
if i push the switch past the tactile bump, it ticks exactly when it actuates
i can do that repeatedly even after staying beyond the tactile bump
warm scarab
👍
zenith pawn
so basically that concludes we are talking about different things
warm scarab
so you are telling me you cant reactivate the contact without the sound?
zenith pawn
no
zenith pawn
maybe because i am listening very closely
this gateron brown barely ticks at all
it sounds exactly the same though, i think i'm on the right track
livid ruin
this gateron brown barely ticks at all
yes you may hear a noise when the contacts touch, not arguing that it’s not possible
it’s unintentional
the noise
zenith pawn
that noise is what i'm looking at i think. the one that bugs me
livid ruin
it depends on how hard the leaf hits the contact if that’s the case in my theory atleast
warm scarab
are you certain that noise is what you hear when you do a high speed press
zenith pawn
or maybe the 3 springs i happened to try all have crunch. i could try a sonja spring
zenith pawn
are you certain that noise is what you hear when you do a high speed press
yeah because it happens suddenly even if i move the switch very very slowly
sleek lily
This place needs a priest
zenith pawn
i probably look like an idiot because i have my ear directly on top of the brown switch when testing it, since it's decently quiet
livid ruin
and 4 bullets in it
i eat the bullets tho
warm scarab
im going to introduce a new way of using those
zenith pawn
yeah i cant get this tick to not happen in sync with the actuation
it always does it
livid ruin
we need more scientific measurements
zenith pawn
oh now we've gone full circle
warm scarab
yeah i cant get this tick to not happen in sync with the actuation
issue isnt getting tick not happen in sync with actuation
you are supposed to get actuation
without the tick
thats why it should be in a keyboard instead of your hand listening to it
zenith pawn
yeah thats whwat i mean
warm scarab
go throttle the key in notepad
after that
lift off gently until it unactivates
then press it again very fast, see if it makes a noise
livid ruin
yeah i cant get this tick to not happen in sync with the actuation
if you’re willing you can remove the leaf or bend it out of the way so it doesn’t make contact and see if it still makes the tick
warm scarab
and press it again slowly in another try, see if it makes noise
warm scarab
if you’re willing you can remove the leaf or bend it out of the way so it doesn’...
i think adding like toilet paper infront of the activation material to damped might be the play
or some sponge
idk
zenith pawn
toilet paper is thick
zenith pawn
weirdly it seems like the tick happens on upstroke too, when i would think it should be pushing them apart
lone flame
Scrub Daddy
warm scarab
weirdly it seems like the tick happens on upstroke too, when i would think it sh...
see
told you
its the additional bump
not the contact
realistically speaking lip shouldnt get dropped off from anything to tick if its unpressing
but the sound bump is still present in the depress unlike the lip getting dropped
I am right yet again
zenith pawn
its the additional bump
uh but small problem i dont think this switch has an additional bump
livid ruin
i am wong yay
warm scarab
kvetinky will be forever remembered as the guy that lost the internet argument
warm scarab
uh but small problem i dont think this switch has an additional bump
isnt it a brown
look
zenith pawn
i was testing 3 switches
livid ruin
kvetinky will be forever remembered as the guy that lost the internet argument
i can’t face it help me
warm scarab
oh
zenith pawn
when i said that i was talking about my outemu pear
zenith pawn
it doesnt have the two bumps though
terse river
when i said that i was talking about my outemu pear
i love the khali box silent brown, from my knowledge its the quietest tactiles
terse river
hammer and belief
warm scarab
you can do them one by one
zenith pawn
theres 4 total, 2 on each side, though
zenith pawn
it doesnt flex enough for that to work
warm scarab
it probably does ive done it before
zenith pawn
i dont trust it
warm scarab
ok
zenith pawn
plus its pom instead of PC
zenith pawn
false
sleek lily
Why is this still going on
terse river
fr
warm scarab
my bp is up
zenith pawn
your british parliament
sleek lily
This is audio tech though, not whatever TF this is
zenith pawn
it's a sound
terse river
bionical psychiatrist
warm scarab
bet like
chatgpt could have answered this
instead of arguing for this long
i really dont think this technology is any form of secret this could have probably been googled
zenith pawn
chatgpt cant do anything
zenith pawn
What is even being discussed still
bad switch noises
sleek lily
Like I thought we concluded this was stupid earlier
zenith pawn
i really dont think this technology is any form of secret this could have probab...
it is a secret somehow
nobody talks about this really because i think usually it isnt audible
sleek lily
Just get the switch you like the feel and sound of tbh
livid ruin
theres 4 total, 2 on each side, though
nails work as well
sleek lily
Switch sound is subjective
zenith pawn
Just get the switch you like the feel and sound of tbh
therein lies the problem because it doesnt exist
sleek lily
Some people like scratching sound even
zenith pawn
oh yeah i have some of those hmx sonja scratchy switches
livid ruin
nails
terse river
i would really like to see a tactile switch that is linear on its way up
terse river
lunch
zenith pawn
that sounds like itd be a bit harder to make
terse river
yeah but would take my maain grpe away
warm scarab
i would really like to see a tactile switch that shoots you if you discuss about lip delay and which part of the lip makes a tick sound
zenith pawn
let me know if you come up with one
livid ruin
Some people like scratching sound even
they must like the sluggishness when they press a key at an angle, instead of the switch going smoothly it does like 6 steps instead when pressed less than fast
livid ruin
one of them ticks throughout the entire travel
that’s just scratchiness
zenith pawn
that’s just scratchiness
yeah
the leg not being lubed correctly on that one i think
theyre supposed to be lubed everywhere except the rails
livid ruin
well, i don’t quite get your defition of a tick or ticking sound but ok
zenith pawn
high pitched noise
its not a scratch sound
i realize that's what you meant. i shoudlnt have said yeah
livid ruin
the leg not being lubed correctly on that one i think
yes that’s scratchiness when there is friction
zenith pawn
that sonja defect is probably from the leaf sticking as it slides down
that one im pretty certain on
livid ruin
high pitched noise
i don’t know of which plastic your switch stem and casing is made out of so
yes there are plastics that can make high pitch noise when friction is applied
zenith pawn
a high pitched impulse though? or just a constant scratch sound effect the entire time you push
livid ruin
a high pitched impulse though? or just a constant scratch sound effect the entir...
everytime your switch moves when you actuate it slowly, you know when a bad switch is unlubed and it gets stuck in certain places?
is that where the high pitch sound happens?
livid ruin
that’s scratchiness yeh
zenith pawn
yeah i already came to that conclusion
livid ruin
alrigh
zenith pawn
yeah im pretty sure klaus is wrong about the other tick though
the leaf definitely isn't perfectly following the leg shape because its too fast
livid ruin
yeah im pretty sure klaus is wrong about the other tick though
alright, whatever it’s not that important anyways
zenith pawn
chances of anything happening:
always bet on nothing
the problem on the silent bluish white is it seems to actuate during the end of the bump,not separately after
livid ruin
im always correct
does this imply the past
livid ruin
ask anyone
you’re decreasing my confidence even if it’s not true
yor trick has worked on me
warm scarab
many such cases
livid ruin
sadge
livid ruin
nice try though
i found a source that states you’re wrong
which means your previous statement about you never being wrong is wrong which makes you even more wrong 🤓
(ignore it’s cut out of context)
warm scarab
ive never said that
civic beacon
ive never said that
You edited your message... #audio-tech message
livid ruin
i can see the credibility score falling from 100 to 0 /j
livid ruin
anyways, i gtg have good day/night/inbetween
i’m also sorry if i did sound rude sometimes i can’t find the right word always to express what i mean (in the previous messages)
candid hare
any ideas why my audio sounds horrible when playing games. headphones to headphone amp to audio interface to pc
lone flame
any ideas why my audio sounds horrible when playing games. headphones to headpho...
only when playng games?
candid hare
yeah
lone flame
what headphones etc
candid hare
@lone flame hey srry i was playing a cod match lol
lone flame
all good
candid hare
so i got the AKG k712 pro headphones with a creek obh-21 headphone amp and a focusrite scarlett solo 3rd gen
lone flame
hm
candid hare
hey calrification abought the bad audio
candid hare
yeah
lone flame
maybe you have a software for games etc installed
like GForce experience or AMD Adrenalin or so
candid hare
the audio sounds okay in terms of qaulity but the sounds are all over the place like footsteps sound like there coming for me every way
lone flame
the audio sounds okay in terms of qaulity but the sounds are all over the place ...
so the sound quality doesnt change
candid hare
no
lone flame
the headphone sound the same?
candid hare
i have mine eq. i posted it on here and a person said i needed to eq them a bit better he gave me a graph with settings
lone flame
hm
candid hare
ill have to try that
lone flame
to fix that you would need to EQ by ear
candid hare
yeah i really dont know how to eq i just used a preset offline
i really gotta train these ears
my ears need training
sleek lily
@candid hare make sure your channels aren't flipped. Look up left right channel check or something like that
candid hare
@sleek lily i will check that out thanks
zenith pawn
yeah Klaus was completely wrong about how the mechanical switch bump works
damn
I thought that almost solved my issue
worthy bane
Have a pair of JM Audio headphones coming in Friday. Pretty excited about that
green marsh
the audio sounds okay in terms of qaulity but the sounds are all over the place ...
most games audio solutions suck tbh
for 3d imaging at least
sleek lily
Hifiman actual site
livid ruin
Hifiman actual site
limk
carmine badger
hey does anyone know how to make my earbuds quieter even on the lowest volume?
(other than by throwing them at a wall)
carmine badger
hey does anyone know how to make my earbuds quieter even on the lowest volume?
mostly with my iphone 8
even on the lowest volume level on my phone its still quite loud and apple has given me zero way to fix it
and ive tried everything under the sun
(and i have also tried dragging the volume slider to lowest or setting it to 1%, that doesnt work)
sleek lily
hey does anyone know how to make my earbuds quieter even on the lowest volume?
Add a resistor in series with the driver
green marsh
hey does anyone know how to make my earbuds quieter even on the lowest volume?
install eq apo and set a negative preamp
oh wait its iphone
rip
simply buy a less sensitive headphone
sleek lily
Same idea applies
carmine badger
i dont think i know how to open em up and put a resistor in series with the driver.
carmine badger
simply buy a less sensitive headphone
is there really nothing i can do?
carmine badger
dang
was hoping there was some fix i could do within my phone rather than
get any new hardware
cos i might as well try refund these and get new ones then
appreciate the help though
zenith pawn
@warm scarab idk if you still care but I think that gif of the cherry MX brown is like completely wrong
This is a real stem photo from theremingoat
Maybe that explains the confusion
its just a linear stem with a bump in it, the bump makes the tactile
no second bump
warm scarab
<@1131332071109959781> idk if you still care but I think that gif of the cherry ...
this is identical to what I said happens man
zenith pawn
weren't you saying there's two bumps, one for tactility and one for actuation?
the divot wasn't the bump
warm scarab
green marsh
those arent bumps 😭
zenith pawn
the wedge isn't the tactile bump, that would be negative
warm scarab
ok
whatever the shape is called
the first shape provides tactility and sound
second is where leaf makes contact
they are seperate from each other
zenith pawn
The wedge you highlighted isn't for tactility. Its the entire bump shape
not just where it starts
There isn't even a wedge there, you drew it on
zenith pawn
the other one did have a wedge
warm scarab
literally the difference between a tactile switch and a linear one is this shape
zenith pawn
the entire bump is the tactility. Not just the inflection point
warm scarab
and I am saying the leaf has a different purpose based on which part of the lip its on
the wedge before the bump is for tactility, the indicator for "the key will be pressed" and the slight strength the switch provides opposing your finger
and after that the leaf glides to the contact area
zenith pawn
let me try a different switch
blue is actuation point, yellow is the tactility
that's how a tactile switch works,not the wedge before the bump
green marsh
arent you both trying to say the same thing
zenith pawn
it doesn't seem like Klaus is saying thay
green marsh
idk but lemme just say this part doesnt add any tactility
zenith pawn
To me it looks like Klaus is saying this is the tactility
green marsh
and that tactile bump is basically instant
zenith pawn
idk but lemme just say this part doesnt add any tactility
it does by making the force drop off so you bottom out the switch instantly
This switch bottoms out as soon as you get over the bump
green marsh
yeah just like any linear 💀
green marsh
what switch is it
green marsh
i mean technically nah
zenith pawn
I don't really trust the milktooth stats but those are accurate I believe
that's what the ending half of the bump is for
it's so sharp that you can't press it partially at all
it just instantly moves from like 0.2mm to 3.00
that doesn't come across through numbers easily
warm scarab
To me it looks like Klaus is saying this is the tactility
yes because that 's the only difference between a tactile and linear switch
put any linear switch and any tactile switch side by side
zenith pawn
the entire bump is the difference
warm scarab
the shape of the lip with a small wedge followed by a bump followed by a linear angled edge is what every one of them looks like
the only difference between the switches is the individual sizes of these properties
zenith pawn
well I thought this would help you but it doesn't seem to be going anywhere so I guess, nevermind
sleek lily
Does edition x v2 use 3.5mm connectors
green marsh
Does edition x v2 use 3.5mm connectors
the picture looks like it might be 2.5
looks a bit small
green marsh
yeah i looked at a review
Both connect to the headphones themselves with 2.5mm connectors.
idk about that
sleek lily
Time to buy a $1k cable
sleek lily
buy a pure silver cable
Gotta get that resistance down from 0.0001 ohms to 0.00009 ohms 
zenith pawn
Yeah that's what I was trying to show
the actuation part just feels linear
makes a lot more sense
livid ruin
Yeah that's what I was trying to show
actually, this
actuates before going linear
mx brown for example
zenith pawn
actually, this
I think its different on the type r
its hard to see since the housing has no transparency
livid ruin
its hard to see since the housing has no transparency
i think all switches atleast i know of don’t touch the stem once they actuate and then go linear, it would cause unnecessary friction (for mx style)
zenith pawn
Hmm maybe
zenith pawn
idk how klaus goes from that to "i'm right"
literally the opposite of what bro was saying
lean grove
all your dac/amps are mine now
Congratulations. You get garbage.
lone flame
hes not getting my Topping Stack
livid ruin
Congratulations. You get garbage.
yay
warm scarab
idk how klaus goes from that to "i'm right"
it is exactly what I described
I am not sure what it is that you got from my descriptions
but what I said was this
sleek lily
got some normalized recordings
sonic zinc
Can anyone recommend some audio mixers? Look for 3 input 2 out. Not looking for anything to expensive. Connects would be made via 3.5 mm jack
sonic zinc
they are 6.3 by standard
Ok imma be honest I’m new to this stuff.
What’s the difference exactly?
sonic zinc
they are 6.3 by standard
My goals is to plug in my Xbox, pc, and eventually something else maybe into it, and have it go to one speaker or set of headphones.
warm scarab
What’s the difference exactly?
its like 3.5 but larger in size
sonic zinc
its like 3.5 but larger in size
Alright so with that in mind what would be my solution for what I want to do?
warm scarab
go on amazon
write mixer
take into account every 1 input is mono meaning to have left and right channels you'd need 2 inputs per device
and find whatever fits your use case
maybe use ebay or a local 2nd hand website for it
studio mixers can go on very cheap in those
sleek lily
I think I finally figured out why so many people think all audio variables are just some lens of frequency response
zenith pawn
Why
sleek lily
Why
I think it's sort of like how some people get overly stuck on thinking they can just use ohms law to solve any circuit. Ohms law always applies, but the variables become more complex. For example, if you know the impedance of an RLC circuit and the voltage, you might want to just apply ohms law to find the current, but because of more complex variables, there is a good chance it won't work.
In short, they see the same variables showing up, so they want to try applying the first thing they learned to everything. The difference is they don't get a grade, so why not just simplify things in your own understanding and try to explain away the inconsistencies.
And tbf, using this method, like in my example, will likely result in a somewhat close answer in some instances. The issue is, there will always be this lingering inconsistency and you end up coming up with complex ways to explain away the inconsistencies that might not even apply.
dull rover
What are some decent cheap IEMs that are pretty flat?
I just want something to use on the go with some of my old phones turned DAP, just spotify downloads no FLACs or anything
violet heron
linsoul zero 2
dull rover
Those look pretty solid
I'm gonna have to get some decent over ear at some point to, and something to drive them lol
tawdry gale
What are some decent cheap IEMs that are pretty flat?
tanchjim bunny
truthear gate
7hz zero 2
all sidegrades but truthear gate comes with the best accessories
dull rover
I'll keep those in mind
zenith pawn
I think it's hard to call the zero:2 "flat", they're pretty clearly bassy
elder thistle
pretty linear otherwise though, at least for me with the light blue tips
upper midrange has tuning of the gods
glad creek
tawdry gale
I think it's hard to call the zero:2 "flat", they're pretty clearly bassy
"flat" is subjective
cuz all our ear canals have different frequency responses
zenith pawn
that's not a useful thing to even say
if your ear is bassisr then still something less bassy is less bassy
elder thistle
if you move from a headphone with +12db bass to a headphone with +6db bass, it is perceived as bass-weak for a while
why do you guys bother with trying to find the perfect tone
can't you get used to it and listen to something based on techs
tawdry gale
if your ear is bassisr then still something less bassy is less bassy
But ur ear can also be less bassy
Which will make the less bassy iem more bassy to ur ears
elder thistle
what is bassy
how do you define bassy
if bassy is what you can hear, observe, experience, then bassy is just electrical impulses into your brain
no
but if you experience the world as bassy per a "bassy ear(tm)", then that is your neutral
tawdry gale
if bassy is what you can hear, observe, experience, then bassy is just electrica...
I'm talking about how sound interacts with ur ear canal cuz iems bypass ur pinna
elder thistle
ok yes
different acoustic impedance and a real pressure system compared to an open ear
however if you listen to an iem that because of your canal is bassier than usual, listening to it for a while will passively make the bass seem quieter
because the brain accepts the iem's delivered sound as the new neutral
we aren't listening to various bands and artists in hardpanned stereo when walking around outside without earbuds
elder thistle
well...
I'm not one to really entertain FR as that important, but peaks and dips (in this case d i p s) that are steep and strong will create severe masking
especially with unresolving stuff. but regardless, techs are secondary to non-halfass frequency response
kinda
information can be destroyed by being too quiet and masked too frequently
tawdry gale
if you move from a headphone with +12db bass to a headphone with +6db bass, it i...
With iems it's much simpler, either u get a seal or no seal
Seal = bass
No seal = no bass
tawdry gale
why do you guys bother with trying to find the perfect tone
Cuz with iems, there are that many options
Headphones, no way
elder thistle
there are so many different sets of techs available in the <$100 area
reviewers are less inclined to try random headphones compared to random iems
if they weren't, nobody would be saying weird things about headphones under $100 being secondary to iems
tawdry gale
reviewers are less inclined to try random headphones compared to random iems
I don't trust reviewers, I just go to the audio store
The stores I go to let me try whatever I want
So I just try everything
lone flame
But ur ear can also be less bassy
more likely a seal thing
Humans hear Pretty consisten below 3kHz
buoyant vale
they said "with iems"
carmine mirage
$40 headphones
is it ok to ask what the headphone is ?
lone flame
$40 headphones
is that and untilted DF target?
noble axle
lone flame
Meze good build
left verge
https://github.com/AAFOptimus/AAFFamilyDCHAudio/releases
Does anyone have any experience with these drivers?
elder thistle
is that and untilted DF target?
merely an approximation of neutral for this rig
I'm sure it's somewhat tilted
just not with a line
lone flame
merely an approximation of neutral for this rig
what rig?
elder thistle
it is an approximation of neutral for this rig
lone flame
DF Tilt is Neutral 🗿
for this Rig
bcs this is how the rig hears a speaker in a room
lone flame
then maybe define what this target is
its not possible to compare or to see something in it if ya don't know the Rigs specs and what the target is exactly
elder thistle
is it ok to ask what the headphone is ?
tunical tnh-101 / lyxpro has15 / 512 audio academy all with particular velour pads from ebay
lone flame
not saying that this target is shit or something.
But generally hard to compare if you dont know firstly what you used and yeah... What this Target is supposed to mean
elder thistle
the actual measurement with this particular FR is with the m50x clone driver damping cups removed, and the backs dremeled out
lone flame
like if it's a Preferemce target etc
elder thistle
the actual measurement with this particular FR is with the m50x clone driver dam...
but it's otherwise the same sound-wise
just not in fr
lone flame
ah your target is how the "modded" m50x measured?
and you compared it to that?
or am im dumb right now at what u mean
elder thistle
red and purple are how the modded m50x clone measured
lone flame
ah ok ok
elder thistle
green is still the normal neutral approximation for this rig which I shouldn't need to repeat
lone flame
green is still the normal neutral approximation for this rig which I shouldn't n...
where did ya get that Target from?
or is it a self made?
elder thistle
it was carefully refined with 11 higher end headphones, various 5128 measurements (df, df-tilt, harman, didn't matter because further compensation later), and calibrated monitors
elder thistle
is it ok to ask what the headphone is ?
sleek lily
The missing eyes are kinda wild lol
exotic yacht
how are the crinacle 2 compared to tangzu wan'er
I'm also curious in the kz castor pros, the built-in configs seem nice
sleek lily
@elder thistle are there any physics focused audio servers you know of by chance?
terse river
In a similar way, I have speakers like 3 feet away from my head (desk setup) so how will i adjust them so im not in a null point
or know if I am in a null point
elder thistle
<@491262532917657600> are there any physics focused audio servers you know of by...
I don't think any of the "objective" thinking servers I've been in could be considered truly physics focused since they're not following scientific method and making a lot of scientifically ungrounded claims
subjectivist servers are inherently more scientific because of this
sleek lily
Yea, that's the big issue I've seen with audiophile scene "audio science" too
It's basically "I want this to be the case so I'll make this wild assumption which I assume makes it the case"
As opposed to any form of physics based or math based reasoning or experimentation
sleek lily
subjectivist servers are inherently more scientific because of this
Honestly, I've noticed this too lol
elder thistle
not that there isn't plenty of potential nonsense in either kind of server
sleek lily
No, I agree 100%
I just wish there was like a direct physics based audio science discord
Like actual engineering mindset discussion and reasoning
elder thistle
I find subjectivism beautiful because someone's experience and ultimately the inner workings of how audio works is stored inside that experience. just that separating out the mechanics from an experience is full of uncertainty or maybe impossible
but it's the proper starting point
whole picture, instead of a frequency response measurement
real ears and brain instead of a mic and pc
sleek lily
Yep, it's ironically a better way to describe things
elder thistle
if I find a server that does things more scientifically and understand the limitations of what they know or can know,
I'll ping you
sleek lily
Thanks, I appreciate it
jaunty pine
I bought this oled controller from AliExpress for my display
And idk why it doesn’t work
And there is a chip on the display board
And it is overheating
There is a chance for me to replace that?
sleek lily
Is it just dirty or did the resin literally burn there? It looks a little brown
If it's actually burning the resin I'm guessing there is a short in the chip
You could replace it, but you might need a hot plate and an air soldering station
But also, idk if this is the ideal channel for this lol
jaunty pine
I have a lab for that but there is a chance to find that chip?
Because that chip is certainly dead
And that is the only hot thing on the board
molten wasp
Sup, I need a recommendation for gaming headphones.
Prefer wireless but doesn't have to, I prefer popout mic.
My budget is 120$ / 400 NIS (Israel but can order from Amazon)
Mostly for competitive gaming and music 👍🏻
Right now I got the razer kraken pro v2, they were great but starting to die
sleek lily
@green marsh I looked more into oratory's explanation of minimum phase, and I think he might actually be referring more to phase linearity or consistent group delay rather than the strict definition of minimum phase. The idea that something is "within one phase cycle" doesn’t really line up with how minimum phase is typically defined in physics or signal processing. It seems like some concepts might be getting blended together, and even with a generous interpretation, it still doesn’t quite apply to how audio devices behave in practice.
I can't help his reactance definition though.
broken grotto
I have a lab for that but there is a chance to find that chip?
there is a chance to find the chip, it may come from somewhat sketchy sources but
you'll be able to find it.
maybe
lone flame
real ears and brain instead of a mic and pc
There is a reason why we use Gear instead of humans
Test it with one person and ask him every week once
he will probably tell a different story 😄
ofc blind testing
best way ofc would be to measure your own HRTF etc
lone flame
<@254690065618305025> I looked more into oratory's explanation of minimum phase...
maybe contact him and ask him derectly rather than saying "he means something else" like as you know what he means by that
thinking is not knowing.
And not like Jackson etc thats is "physics based" or so...
Why doesn't he has valid Data etc for the public?
i can read hundreds of pages and he has nothing to show.. only "Trust me bro"
But its useless to discuss it here
Could talk against a wall and it would have better responses
sleek lily
maybe contact him and ask him derectly rather than saying "he means something el...
He used the wrong definition. The options are he meant another word that better fits that definition or he doesn't know what he's talking about. On reactance, I legitimately think he doesn't, but on this, I just think he used the wrong definition and confused the definition of some different words with different mathematical meanings.
lone flame
He used the wrong definition. The options are he meant another word that better ...
or you don't know what he is talking about
sleek lily
And not like Jackson etc thats is "physics based" or so...
Why doesn't he has va...
There is? I took measurements demonstrating that things of linear frequency response dont share a identical behaviors and took measurements demonstrating devices to not be linear in efficiency or step/gain relation. These are also things that exist in the engineering space and aren't just new measurements I came up with and nobody else ever has, they're just ignored in audio circles for some reason.
sleek lily
or you don't know what he is talking about
Again, the word has a definition that has nothing to do with what he said. If what he said has nothing to do with the definition then he either doesn't know what minimum phase means, or he confused it with another definition l. I'm leaning on simple confusion occurring here.
lone flame
Again, the word has a definition that has nothing to do with what he said. If wh...
again... Ask him directly what he meanst by that...
sleek lily
I don't have him added. I'm just giving what he likely meant instead.
lone flame
trying to "correct" someone if you dont know what he menat is imo pretty uhhh
sleek lily
It's not a correction... They just used the wrong definition, but there are other words that definition better fits.
The word he was trying to define it doesn't remotely fit.
lone flame
It's not a correction... They just used the wrong definition, but there are othe...
maybe there is an exact reason why he used THAT term?
sleek lily
It's like if someone described height lbs. It's fair to assume they meant mass.
sleek lily
maybe there is an exact reason why he used THAT term?
Either they meant mass in that example or they don't know what height is.
Same applies here
lone flame
Either they meant mass in that example or they don't know what height is.
You just don't know what he meant by that
sleek lily
It's completely fair to point this out.
Except I do. His definition simply means "is within 360° of the original signal". Minimum phase systems can be any distance in degrees off from the original signal. That's just not a variable. The variables involved is if the relation is a non complex relation, and if the signal leads it can't be minimum phase.
Like I said, his definition better fits phase linearity or constant group delay.
lone flame
Except I do. His definition simply means "is within 360° of the original signal"...
ask him not me... i haven't wrote his text 😭
sleek lily
That's likely where he got confused
lone flame
you cannot know if you don't know what he meant
sleek lily
You keep assuming these things don't have physics based understandings or these words just can't be defined and nobody can know anything. Just stop doing that. It's annoying.
If you don't understand something that's fine, but don't assume off of that that that it's not an understood concept.
It's like some odd reverse circular reasoning.
lone flame
I give up... The simple “You can't know what the author meant because you didn't talk to him about it” doesn't seem to work. Believe what you want. Apparently you're Oratory because you know what he means...
zenith pawn
you guys and your arguments
lone flame
you guys and your arguments
This is how science work 🗿
zenith pawn
impossible
lone flame
espacially in stuff where research isn't that far 
zenith pawn
there's probably research but it hasn't reached the internet
lone flame
there's probably research but it hasn't reached the internet
maybe ye
sleek lily
It's not that research is behind, it's just the hobby space is behind for some reason.
lone flame
like.
"The world is 20-50 years in the future already, but the tech has not reached the public"
sleek lily
The things I describe aren't new concepts, they're just not understood in hobbyist audio science circles.
lone flame
It's not that research is behind, it's just the hobby space is behind for some r...
maybe you're behind for some reasons 😄
sleek lily
In what? Everything I described are understood concepts and definitions. Physics kinda is physics.
There aren't special physics for a hobby that are separate from universal physics
lone flame
In what? Everything I described are understood concepts and definitions. Physics...
maybe.
All i want to tell you is.
You don't know what a Autor means in his book, if you haven't spoke a single word with him
sleek lily
Again, the definition he used is wrong. There isn't an interpretation where it isn't wrong.
I'm simply giving an explanation as to what he likely meant instead
sleek lily
He has a physics degree so I'm going to wager he got confused rather than he had no clue what any of these words mean.
lone flame
He has a physics degree so I'm going to wager he got confused rather than he had...
Or he meant something where it fits. But you cannot know if you havent talked with him about it
thats so simple
but u dont understand
sleek lily
Like the example I gave earlier. If someone described height in lbs, they either meant mass, or they don't know what height is.
sleek lily
Or he meant something where it fits. But you cannot know if you havent talked wi...
Yes, like the alternate explanations I gave as to what he likely meant instead of minimum phase...
zenith pawn
if somebody described mass in lbs i would call them an american
lone flame
Like the example I gave earlier. If someone described height in lbs, they either...
"It's raining cats and dogs."
ever heard of it?
it has a meaning.
sleek lily
if somebody described mass in lbs i would call them an american
True
lone flame
the actual written stuff means something completly else
it has a different meaning.
that could be the case with Oratory's stuff
a meaning you didn't got
sleek lily
"It's raining cats and dogs."
ever heard of it?
it has a meaning.
Minimum phase is a mathematical and physics based term. It's not an analogy...
lone flame
If someone doesnt knew that
"It's raining cats and dogs."
means "heavy rain". They would think its actually raining cats and dogs
lone flame
Minimum phase is a mathematical and physics based term. It's not an analogy...
Maybe you didn't understand what he wrote. And that's why you think the term is wrong. So, for the hundredth time... Ask him what he meant.
what's so hard about that?
ask him.
He could explain.
Maybe he notices that he fcked up
but you cannot really know what he meant
BECAUSE!
Maybe he means what he wrote, that the term fits. But you didn't get it. Because you can't always read the author and what he meant by something.
it's just that simple.
And bcs of that. You ask the authot what he meant.
after that you can be 100% sure
that's why i always ask for a rephrase or example if i haven't understood something if someone tells me something
bcs. dafuq i know sometimes what people mean 
im not them, how should i
ocean pulsar
Maybe you didn't understand what he wrote. And that's why you think the term is ...
Not enough time to get rephrasings from all the people wrong on the internet
Explain the contradiction or correct it, and move on.
lone flame
Not enough time to get rephrasings from all the people wrong on the internet
Exp...
thing is...
idk what his point is.
I have read his text.
Also the definition.
And everything is alright xD
like. The definition is exactly what Oratory said
ocean pulsar
Except I do. His definition simply means "is within 360° of the original signal"...
So was this quote fake?
green marsh
So was this quote fake?
sleek lily
So was this quote fake?
It just doesn't match what the word means at all. I think it's just cause he confused a couple different definitions.
ocean pulsar
https://www.reddit.com/r/oratory1990/comments/1ef7mlg/comment/lfjxzek/?utm_name=...
Looks real to me @lone flame
And that definition has real bad vibes from the little I know about audio and signal processing, and doesn't look like any other definition I can find
green marsh
lone flame
Oratory explained it in one sentence xD
ocean pulsar
This being true doesn't make the other definition true
ocean pulsar
Except I do. His definition simply means "is within 360° of the original signal"...
I think I kinda get what he means here tho
The purest form of minimum phase digital BS has the absolute peak from the sound impulse appear before any other peaks in the sound
He absolutely said it wrong tho if this is what he means
lone flame
He absolutely said it wrong tho if this is what he means
thats what i say...
"if"
he can be wrong. like. i don't mind that.
But thinking you know what he means if you havent spoke with him and asked him is just wrong
bcs what IF he means something else?
zenith pawn
My understanding is that all of digital audio works on the principle that the sound chain is all a minimum phase system
And that this works fine as far as what file format we need
But nothing in the real world is a perfect anything, so in practice there are things you can tweak without affecting impulse response
What do you think about that
ocean pulsar
bcs what IF he means something else?
Then he can write that or edit his post or just be wrong on the internet
ocean pulsar
My understanding is that all of digital audio works on the principle that the so...
There's a lot of analog/hardware parts of the chain that are linear, the only often minimum phase part is eq
zenith pawn
Is that what people are talking about with things beinf "linear time invariant" systems
when you say linear
ocean pulsar
No
Linear phase is only referring to systems that mess with stuff
Eg eq or reverb
An lti system means that there's no change like my digital mixer with all effects off
But if I enable eq, its not lti, but its either linear or minimum phase (almost certainly minimum)
broken grotto
Is that what people are talking about with things beinf "linear time invariant" ...
a linear time invariant system just doesn't change over time.
there's normally 3 rules you follow, the first being additivity, wherein you have input x₁(t) gives output y₁(t). You also have the homogeneity, where if input x(t) gives output y(t), then ax(t) gives ay(t) for any constant a. This kind of thing rules out stuff like distortion, compression, basically anything where the input isn't directly proportional to the output.
We also have the time-invariant part, where the following must be true: if input x(t) gives output y(t), then input x(t-t₀) must always give the output y(t-t₀) for any shift t₀. Basically, doesn't really matter when you input the signal; it will always behave the same way.
these things determine if the system is LTI.
audio gear is commonly modeled as LTI.
thin crescent
So I have a budget of $200 and need a pair of headphones I have the soundcore life q30 right now but I broke the frame so want to upgrade from them and for earphones I have the Sony wf-c500 so ideally I want something better than both of them
If possible they should be wireless and also have an option to be plugged into and if possible when plugged in I want the inbuilt mic to work as with my sound cores they don’t
chilly prawn
what are these speakers? they have this sticker that proclaims a model number and everything but I can't find absolutely anything on the internet about them
molten wasp
Sup, I need a recommendation for gaming headphones.
Prefer wireless but doesn't have to, I prefer popout mic.
My budget is 120$ / 400 NIS (Israel but can order from Amazon)
Mostly for competitive gaming and music 👍🏻
Right now I got the razer kraken pro v2, they were great but starting to die
I do need them to be able to use as wired too, without a dongle (I don't care even going non-wireless)
sleek lily
hifiman fucked up and sent me an edition xs instead of an edition x v2
its still nice, but im gonna return it. I either want an edition x v1, v2, or arya
verbal fog
i bought some qkz ak3s and some kz edx pros i cant wait to see which gives me a better experience(one will be a gift)
red quest
@stuck bolt rate
stuck bolt
Ooooo