virtual-reality

[thick nest]

others suck

[pastel echo]

You've tried em?

[thick nest]

they are copies of the same headset

[thick nest]

i've seen countless people having trouble with them

and regreting it

the htc vive is a good headset

i would've bought it if the quest wasnt released

i like everything about ti

but recommending mixed reality

[pastel echo]

I didn't recommend mixed reality

[thick nest]

not you

scroll up

[pastel echo]

Okay well I'm not someone else, I just think old headsets are good if they satisfy the needs of the user

[thick nest]

ok

[pastel echo]

Grandma wants a headset to check out 360 videos, probably not getting her a quest

[thick nest]

old headsets as in htc vive?

[thick nest]

***phone vr ***

[pastel echo]

Nah I get her the rift 😎

[thick nest]

lol

the rift is a pretty nice headset

[pastel echo]

Man I hope the family I sold my rift to set up an oculus account before it become Facebook required

[thick nest]

lol

i gtg now

[rapid otter]

You can have a good experience with a cheap headset and good pc but a cheap pc and an expensive headset will be awful

Vr is extremely intensive on gpu/cpu

2080 with a Windows mix reality is a very good thing

But a 1060 with a pimax will be awful

[flat pawn]

Oculus software is taking years off my life man

I hate it so much lol

Their desktop interface is really nice though

But there's other options

[harsh niche]

oculus link's "home" thing is so bad

even the empty grid place

so bad

looks like it's straight out of 2012

[rapid otter]

I don't care really just for 2 minutes...

[chilly imp]

How much of an upgrade going from HTC Vive Pro to Valve Index? Just headset only

Just saw a local listing for $450 for a Valve Index headset only

[gentle coral]

Man yesterday was a mess in here, wish I was on. I completely agree with @haughty thistle, but I see where some of KoroDesu#0645 points are from, though they made some mistakes due to lack of knowledge about the history of WMR and oculus headsets.

I will go through an give a bit of info to some of the points yesterday that chickenbread was trying to make.

WMR headsets even when discontinued got multiple years of support in terms of hardware replacement and technical support. Facebook cuts almost all of its support immediately after they discontinue a headset. Rift CV1 had no way for users to replace parts direct from manufacturer the week after it was discontinued, and is known to not do much online technical support for cv1 users even a few months after it was discontinued.

Saving up for a new headset is not always an option especially if you are in a country that has a higher price for new headsets, and a very quick used market. Also many countries can't get Oculus headsets, so it isn't even a great option unless you want to pay a lot of extra money to import it.

Quest has a good library, but is not a native PCVR headset, so considering the steam store to be an expansion of all available games has some big caveats. The only reason you can play steam games is because Steam is building the support completely without the help of Oculus. Also you need a really beefy computer to play steam games on Quest or Quest 2 compared to any native headset, and there might be visual issues that make it no better or even worse then an old WMR headset.

Not to mention Oculus's PC side software is known to be a mess, much more then Windown Mixed reality portal.

The big thing people seem to often forget is the experience on any headset after 2015 is essentially still competitive and fully usable in pretty much all situations.

People don't always need the highest resolution nicest devices to have a good experience, or a competitiveone. Think about how many people are still fine playing new games at 1080p 60hz (not everyone needs 4k 144hz, and that also requires a strong computer).

Not to mention that most of the best VR games out there are still designed to be run on those old headsets (first gen WMR, cv1, vive). I played HLA, and boneworks on an old WMR headsets and it was still a great experience, and I could also play it on a lower spec machine if I wanted to.

If you use a minimum spec VR computer I would never recommend getting a Quest 2 if you want to do PCVR, if you can buy a used WMR headset for probably 100 dollars less.

Used WMR headsets are still completely usable for VR as they cost very little you can find them under 250 easily, have really good screens compared to most headsets of that era (higher resolution then rift or vive), and could be run on lower end hardware do to really good optimization in Windows.

I do think WMR has a ton of problems and should be better then it is right now. But some of their old line up (the Samsung headsets especially, are still very good headsets for a new person to VR.)

If you have the budget going new is going to probably be better, but don't assume that support is going to be there when it breaks (even if it is still in production).

Now on the data and privacy side. The danger with facebooks privacy issues is that they have been hacked multiple times and give their data to problamatic groups at times. This movement data can identify you extremely accurately, and it is tied to your real facebook account, which tracks you across other websites if you don't put multiple things in the way of it. If you went to a website that is illegal in your country and the government asked facebook to give it your movement data, they could arrest you off the street just by looking at how you walk down the street if there are even a few cameras in the area.

Also new headsets are getting new features like eye tracking, facial tracking, BCI, etc. The data from this stuff is really personal. And if the wrong groups (hackers or unethical or misdeveloped government agencies).

This data could very easily develop true prediction based policing if a government decided to take the data.

The most logical example i can think of is if they see the brain data from a oerson playing a fighting game enjoying it to much, and then deeming that person a danger to society so they arrest that person. They wouldn't even need to know who you are, they could find you anywhere just based off of your data, even without ever seeing your face.

BCI data and eye tracking will probably become the most dangerous as they can be tied to neurological disorders even right now. If a Hacker gets that data on thousands of people they could analyze it for things like Epilepsy, and if they wanted to could send a targeted ad to trigger it in people playing VR. (oh and yes facebook headsets will start getting more personal ads very soon).

[gentle coral]

I would usually recommend chickenbread to answer this, but as he has muted this server, I'll give a bit of input from my bits of experience. The only big difference will be the frame rate, slightly better lenses, a slightly wider FOV, and betterteacher. Also the Index is a bit lighter of a headset.

But the color contrast will be worse due to index having an LCD vs your current AMOLED Vive Pro.

If you haven't upgraded to the index controllers those might be more worth it at the moment.

You also have the option of getting the Vive wireless kit so you can do tetherless PCVR. This makes an amazing difference if you have a large space, or find yourself often having issues with the teather.

You could also buy some trackers if you don't have those yet either (tundra trackers, and Vive 3.0 trackers just came out).

If you have all of those or see a major benefit from one of the index features, then go for the headset. (Though the base Index price for headset alone is 499, so you are saving only 49 dollars and will probably be losing some of your warranty ability (which is important for the index (there are many known issues that can cause an RMA, or new part to be needed))).

[haughty thistle]

Why did I get pinged >.>
Anyhow, Py, I didn't mute the server, just this channel in particular. I wouldn't really have looked into here, if you hadn't pinged me...

[chilly imp]

Thank you so much for your input.
I'm in NZ so it is impossible to get an Index, unless go for the Ebay route which is about $900 total just for the headset.

Already using 4 Vive Trackers and Index controllers.
As for game, mostly rhythm game and VRCHAT.

So for me, it pretty much come down to the display, weight and comfort.
People praised the audio on the Index but the Vive Pro sounds pretty alright to me, at least for in-game song.

[sullen linden]

Index does have the better mic too

[chilly imp]

yes, and that too.
The Index sounds amazing

[haughty thistle]

To answer your Question:
In my personal opinion, the Vive Pro is the more comfortable headset, as it's weight is better balanced and the headstrap and padding do a better job of keeping the headset in place. At least when it comes to just looking around. Since the Vive is the heavier of the two, it doesn't really make a difference when it comes to quick head movement.
The FOV on the Index is slightly larger, but nothing that I'd consider game changing (like what Pimax offers for example). It might still be worth to you in combination with the more fluid animations of the 144Hz screens of the Index.
Personally I found the Vive Pro to be slightly sharper and obviously the contrast and colors of the Vive Pro's OLED screens can't be beaten.
When it comes to audio, I do have to say that the off-ear speaker design does add a little bit to the immersion in the sense of not touching your ears, but in the same way it removes some by not really going low enough to feel the bass (the Index only goes as low as like 80- 100Hz). Regarding the Mic, the Index is the clear winner as it can hold a candle even to some decent XLR-Mics. This can be especially important for VRchat.
Then again, when it comes to audio, you can just as well use your own cans and mic, on the Pro all you'd need extra is an adapter.
If you do play a lot of VRC though, the Wireless Adapter might be a consideration and that is only available for Vive headsets

[chilly imp]

Thank you so much

[haughty thistle]

One thing I should mention regarding my first point of the headset staying in place:
The Index has a tendency of moving up on the face when looking down as it heavily relies on the top strap and it's own weight to keep it in place. Look down and that top strap pulls the headset up. I haven't noticed this on the Vive Pro.
When tilting the head to the side, the Index also likes to droop down more then the Vive Pro.
At least in my experience

[green crypt]

if you want a mic upgrade on the vive pro you can go modmic wireless or a wireless lav mic

[haughty thistle]

This or use a mic with a Type-C jack/USB adapter.
I for example have replaced the Vive Pro headphones with my own and the DAC I use is TRRS-Compatible. If I had the right cable, I could use the mic of my gaming headset on there

[chilly imp]

Between bad HTC warranty and no warranty on the Index, which one should I go to then

[haughty thistle]

Between the Vive Pro, it's really a "Pick your poison" kind of thing. You have to decide whether you're fine with the degraded colors and contrast in favor of a larger FOV and smoother animations

[chilly imp]

Honestly, what holding me back is the warranty.
Went from 72hz on the Quest to Vive Pro, don't really see much different. Though I would expect a huge upgrade going to 120/144hz

Either it going to be a nightmare to send the headset to HTC and perform RMA, or become a paper weight if the Index break

[haughty thistle]

The way that HTC has routed the cable on the Pro, while expensive when it comes to required cable length, is quite genius is probably the most gently cable management I've seen on any VR headset. Period. While the secondary clip on the Index does help the cable not get bend in a 90° angle at the point where it comes out, it doesn't necessarily help the cable either, seing how much it kinks when moving the headstrap up and down. That's probably the thing you'd have to pay attention the most.
Other then that, for a long life of the Index I'd recommend staying away from any fans that may cool down the electronics of the headset. Afaik it isn't good for the Index panels to run cooler then intended when running them at high refreshrates. Not to mention that you might end up with more smearing then intended by Valve...

[chilly imp]

Alrighty, got that noted

Last question would be how durable, in your opinion, for the Index?

[flat pawn]

@chilly imp this may answer your question

https://youtu.be/HpUzHms4dNk

tl;dr apparently it's built like a tank

[haughty thistle]

The Index is built quite sturdy. Just be aware that the cable doesn't like being kinked and when using the headstrap as designed, will most likely cause the cable to be kinked. I for one only put on my Index by sliding it down my head, as if I was pulling on a Hoodie or something, not even bothering with moving the headstrap

[chilly imp]

Yeah, just watch that one.
Seems pretty decent given how rough he is

[flat pawn]

You can do that w/ glasses?

[haughty thistle]

I use Lens Inserts. On every headset that is currently in my possession, I have a set of VRO lenses inserted. And after that Pimax experience, it's almost a requirement for me going forward xD

[flat pawn]

If this 15mm pad doesn't cut it for me I'm

Well first I'll try messing with it a bit and making my own modifications

Failing that I'm willing to try lens inserts for it

By whoever

Even if it isn't VRO

I don't think my prescription is as strong as yours

[haughty thistle]

I have -2.5 mytopia (near sightness) roundabout on each eye with slight astigmatism on top

Never thought my vision was that bad tbh, but I also know it isn't the best

[candid bluff]

I've smacked my controllers against the wall with the index so many times and haven't had any problems

[flat pawn]

How's your wall doin

[candid bluff]

a lot of scuff marks on my wall since its gray paint

I had a quest 2 but the ring on the right controller was starting to separate and so I played stuff like pavlov and H3VR for a while instead of B&S and boneworks

[rapid otter]

@gentle coral from my experience the oculus software is very good

@haughty thistle @gentle coral i love people like you who can give good argument while listening to others and argue 👍

[rapid otter]

In my opinion the quest 2 controllers are sooo durable, i threw them so many times, i once hit a woden shelf and i sharerd a big chuck ect, these are very durable

[gusty frost]

Mine broke when I hit my wall playing best saber

[flat pawn]

The oculus software onboard the quest 2?

Or the PC oculus software

[rapid otter]

The two

[thick nest]

just saw this
thats the thing right now its mostly performance and hardware vs privacy quest 2 and 1 can run on most pc's and this is from personal expierence you just need a 1650/1060 970's would work fine and their alts in amd would work too you could even lower the res also what im saying is that ebay can be kinda sketchy if your a beginner you dont know if its going to be used and have problems or if its good and completely sealed unlike buying it from trusted sources amazon and manufacturars websites i live in the middle east there it took them 7 months to get the quest 2 here and its double the price but all i had to do is ship it with oculus thats it i didnt pay much for shipping and it was better than having to pay double my opinion but personally i dont think privacy is safe anymore your stuff has been shared hundreds maybe thousands of times between companies and ad campaigns maybe some people want their privacy protected then i would recommend the wmr headsets and hope the one you choose isnt broken but then you'd have to be verry careful with it since most of them are discountinued and you might not know how to fix it or if you can find the part you broke

[sullen linden]

idk if anyone can help me here, but i've been experiencing extremely poor performance when i open any steamvr game and it happens on steamvr home as well, i have tried everything i can to fix the problem but no luck, ping me if anyone has any ideas.

[pastel echo]

Just a side note, you can't use a 970, I have a 980 and it wouldn't run quest, the experience on a 1060 and a 1650 are similarly not enjoyable experiences in the slightest, gonna say a 1660 minimum

[gentle coral]

True, though finding parts for any headset is very hard, and even currently releasing headsets can be bricked by issues and have RMA issues (especially with some countries that have very little direct support from the manufacturer). This issue can make it a much more even playing field with used headsets if the used headsets are cheaper, or you can in person verify the headset condition. I completely agree that ebay, craigslist, and other used device sites are much more of a gamble as there is almost no high end used headset distributors (this industry will pop up at some point probably (hopefully)).

Also there is a lot of CPU overhead on Quest and Quest 2. Running like for like hardware you will have a better PCVR experience (if you ignore the tracking issues) on a used WMR headset then a Quest or Quest 2 until you have a 1080 or newer and good high clock hyper-threading 4 or 6 core cpu.

With used headsets I am somewhat biased as I have direct access to many of the parts in most headsets and have friends and tools that allow me to fix any part of any headset if I needed it (I have contacts that can buy almost any chip, or screen inside any headset, and have access to some micro soldering setups if I need to replace a small part.) I will probably start collecting broken VR headsets at some point to have extra parts on hand. Also I am in the SF bay area so I can actually go around and get barely used VR headsets for pretty much nothing.

...

I do hope that some competition comes to the low to medium end of the VR hardware industry soon (499 and less for everything). The high end and super high end is doing great in terms of headset options, which is cool to see, but that sector is not expanding all that fast, as unless you are a business owner, most of the high end consumer base already has a headset, or is waiting for one.

I also wish that more headsets had an upgrade program or simple long term payment where you don't own the headset fully tell you to pay it off. (Do the phone or car model of business). I am quite certain facebook is planning to do this, as they have talked about it before, and they seemed receptive to the idea at an industry roundtable at GDC 2019, when I brought it up (I mean they followed our recommendation to become a loss leader with the quest 2 (sell device at a loss and make up for it with software sales)). The problem is that Valve, HTC, Sony, Samsung, Microsoft and quite a few other VR companies were at the meeting and none of them really took the advice other than Facebook and Sony. HTC decided to double down on business stuff, and Valve is sticking to the high end consumer. And the "trade in" aspect makes a lot of sense for the more expensive headset options, more than the loss leader headsets. Because the WMR headsets don't have a software revenue stream they can't really have a loss leader strategy, so the only real way to get people to continuously buy their headset is to give perks that keep people buying that company's headsets. As a business model building a WMR headset right now is not really a great decision, as you have competition within your own system, and have only a single purchase per user.

Valve kind of splits the difference as they have a number of products you can buy that they get royalties on, and have a very clear upgrade path to keep you in the system, and they have stream.

[rapid otter]

The problem before the quest especially it's second iteration, was the entry price, you needed a powerful and expensive pc, some trackers and a very expensive headset, a lot of people couldn't pay for it ....

[chilly imp]

For those that want full body tracking without wanting to spend for trackers
https://twitter.com/Akiya_Souken_VR/status/1396720017153003522?s=20

空き家総研VRラボ -Akiya Research Institute,VRlab- (@Akiya_Souken_VR)

現時点での製品価格について。
無料版と有料版の２種類をリリース予定で、無料版で有用性をご確認いただいてから、有料版を購入いただきたいと考えています。
無料版では、キャプチャ結果に対する外部へのデータ送信機能に時間制限を設ける予定です。
有料版の価格は税込9,999円を予定しています。 https://t.co/LOJjuEJUOL

Retweets

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Twitter · May 24, 2021, 6:49 AM

The software will be in Japanese and English with free version (evaluation purpose only) and paid version (9999yen or around $100)

[pastel echo]

What am I seeing

[chilly imp]

Webcam based software that do full bodytracking and face/hand tracking

[pastel echo]

Oh neat

[thick nest]

I've seen multiple people with 1650 runs fine

[thick nest]

Trackers?????
Quest 2 doesn't need trackers it only needs them for full body like any other headset

[thick nest]

Don't all headsets require a 4 core and higher cpu you won't run vr on a 2 core cpu

[chrome bay]

would i be able to do vr on a i5 9400/rx570 system

[thick nest]

Yep

But check benchmarks

And for the games you wanted to play

Like you won't run hla at medium or high settings

[round orbit]

I have a vive pro, anyone know if I can switch my DisplayPort between monitor and headset? I tried a 4K 120hz switch and it only works for my monitor

[rapid otter]

The problem before the quest read carefully

[thick nest]

Ah ok

My bad..

[grand dawn]

guys

vive pro

or oculus quest 2

[flat pawn]

Depends on what you're looking for

Those are two very different kits

What's important to you and how good is your PC

[rapid otter]

Ho and budget

[umbral garden]

Wow, that's annoying, if you start up the oculus app it switches all outputs to the oculus headset... which isn't even plugged in

[pale orbit]

https://i.redd.it/235p96s0k1271.jpg

[umbral garden]

that looks so cursed

[chilly imp]

blursed

[gentle coral]

I am so excited to try it. I already gave a 1 hour presentation on the image as part of a neurotech meeting on Thursday and what different aspects of the image mean compared to the previous photos and renders.

Also gave a detailed breakdown of the possible costs and issues with it.

I can post a link if people want, or some of my written commentary from another discussion on the image I am having.

[pastel echo]

I want

[rapid otter]

Neurothec ?

[signal snow]

head scratcher nice

[hushed pond]

the forbidden head scratcher

[thick nest]

vive pro is pretty nice tbh if you have that kind of budget

but im not sure its been a while since i've seen the review but wasnt it bascially a vive but with a "new" name

if you have that kind of budget get an index

since paying an extra 50 dollars is really worth it with what your getting with an index

and there will be a vive pro 2 soon soo...

[chilly imp]

Doesn't the Vive Pro 2 already on the market for like 2 weeks?

[flat pawn]

It is not out yet I thought

Early June launch

[chilly imp]

I was really expect HTC to actually made some decent upgrade, but well, it is HTC after all

Yesterday, contacted the Index guy and take a look at the headset. Arrived, the guy brought it out and literally dropped the Index, face first into the concrete

Guess the Vive Pro will stay with me for another year

[grand dawn]

is there any companies that sell gloves that track fingers

[haughty thistle]

I feel like many misunderstood the Vive Pro 2, just how many misunderstood the Pro 1. It's meant for professionals and businesses.
If you just look at the Pro and Pro 2, it's quite an upgrade, seeing they have increased the FOV, resolution, refresh rate and improved the padding on the headphones.
They have focused on what matters most to their target audience: Resolution, refresh rate and noise isolation.
While the Vive Pro headphones don't have that great audio quality, they block a surprising amount of outside noise and the headband is easier to fit your own headphones over compared to some of the competition, if that's more your style.
Not saying it's the best out there, far from it, but for whom it's meant for, it's probably a bargain... (looking at other business focused headsets like the XTAL and Varjo offerings)

[grand dawn]

the quest 2 is a stand alone headset and doesnt require base stations

thats one of the points i liked

the controllers are pretty fire

too

[chilly imp]

While that is true, the screen upgrade is big deal. However, the rest stay the same from a 3 years old headset and design is from 2016 Vive

and HTC still brand the Vive Pro 2 as for hardcore gamer on their website

[grand dawn]

its also only 300 freedom eagles

whle the vive pro 2 is a glorious 1400

the valve headsets are like 1000

[chilly imp]

Well if you don't care about Facebook thingy, then the Quest 2 is pretty sweet

[grand dawn]

how come the quest and vive achieve the same thing but the quest does it without external sensors why couldnt htc copy that

[chilly imp]

Facebook 💸

[haughty thistle]

I don't see where they mention that tbh
And they really did a "Why fix what's not broken?". The headstrap of the Pro is super comfy (I'd dare to say it's the most comfortable headset I've used to date), the eye relief is easy to use and the IPD slider helps dialling in the IPD quickly and precisely. Exactly what matters to business customers

[grand dawn]

is it glasses compatible

[sullen linden]

Htc did make the cosmos but we all know how that ended up

[grand dawn]

we do?

[chilly imp]

The strap on the Vive Pro is pretty comfy tbh, but I would love to see the reduce in weight and bulk.
The only complain is the face cover, which I replaced with VRCOVER one immediately

The stock one is pretty gross

[sullen linden]

It was a failure pretty much if you don't count the cosmos elite

[grand dawn]

oh

[chilly imp]

Well both the Quest and Vive is glasses compatible, you need the glass spacer for the Quest though

[haughty thistle]

I think the weight and bulk is more a result of it's function actually. Unlike pretty much every other headset out there, the Vive Pro is well balanced out of the box (even the Index feels front heavy in comparison)

[grand dawn]

does it come in the box

[sullen linden]

And I personally need lighthouse tracked vr. I play so much vrchat in fullbody that I can't really play without it.

[grand dawn]

cant the quest do that?

[sullen linden]

Well not out of the box

[chilly imp]

You need the base station to track the Vive Tracker

[sullen linden]

And external software to sync the tracking

[grand dawn]

can you do it without voiding the warranty

[sullen linden]

Yeah

You don't change anything with the headset itself

[grand dawn]

then?

[sullen linden]

You need to buy the lighthouses and vive trackers

[haughty thistle]

Lighthouse tracking, while expensive, has the major benefit that it's a "subscriber based" methode of tracking. Aka the devices that need to be tracked are responsible to figure out their position themselves based on the relative position of the lighthouses. This essentially means you can have an infinite amount of devices tracked with the same base stations (given line of sight obviously)
As an added bonus it's super precise, which pretty much every inside-out methode can't say...

[grand dawn]

wait if u wear a quest in vr chat and crouch will the character also crouch

[chilly imp]

There are many company that sell finger tracking gloves, mostly for enterprise/commercial use.
SteamVR compatible is rare though.

[chilly imp]

Yes

That the point

[sullen linden]

Well yes but that's how the avatar IK works

[grand dawn]

without base stations

[sullen linden]

Fullbody means your legs and hips are actually tracked

[chilly imp]

You need at least 1 base station + 3 Vive Trackers for full body tracking

Else, you can only move the top half of your body/avatar

[grand dawn]

no im talking bout quest

[haughty thistle]

It only works on SteamVR. Essentially, the trackers would track with the lighthouses while your controllers track through the headset. A piece of software then combines the two tracking methods.
You'd need, other then the trackers, a pair of lighthouses for it all to work

[chilly imp]

That goes for every VR headset

[grand dawn]

but oculus doesnt sell trackers

[chilly imp]

Which is why you need the Vive Tracker

[haughty thistle]

The benefit of having a headset that already tracks with lighthouses is that you don't need extra base stations

[sullen linden]

Which is why you need the vive trackers (or tundra when available)

[grand dawn]

wait i have to buy that seperately?

[haughty thistle]

Because they are made by HTC (and soon also by Tundra Labs)

[sullen linden]

Yes

[grand dawn]

hou muh

also do i have to have the tracker on my body

[sullen linden]

You need 3 trackers and for the 3.0 ones it's 140$ each if I remember right

[haughty thistle]

about 100 per Vive Tracker 2.0/Tundra Tracker or 130 per Vive Tracker 3.0
Additionally you'd need a pair of lighthouses which set you back 300 bucks for a pair from Steam

[sullen linden]

Yeah you need to wear them while you play

[haughty thistle]

Yes. You'd have to strap one to each of your feet and a third one to your hip

[grand dawn]

ok so basically im spending 3 times the price of the headset itself

[grand dawn]

all 3?

[chilly imp]

and in NZ, 1 Vive Tracker is like $200US love the import tax

[sullen linden]

Yup

[chilly imp]

Yes, all 3

[grand dawn]

one on the hips and 2 on the legs i presume?

[sullen linden]

Exactly

[grand dawn]

thats seems like a lot of work for some casual vr chat

[sullen linden]

For me it's worth because of how fun and immersive it is

[grand dawn]

and you also have to power on the lighthouses

[chilly imp]

It totally worth it and a lot of fun

[grand dawn]

wait why do u need 2

[chilly imp]

The setup is pretty straight forward, if everything work

[sullen linden]

2 for 360 tracking, 1 for 180

[haughty thistle]

Everyone has something called body language and you basically represent that with fullbody. It's expensive, yes, but it just makes you more expressive

[grand dawn]

wait how exactly does the oculus headset and the tracker link up

[sullen linden]

I mean I have 4 but that's only because I bought a second index

You have to play through steamvr

[grand dawn]

also for index if i pay 999 do i get all the stuff like 3 trackers, and 2 base stations, etc

[chilly imp]

I sold my Quest a long time ago so probably cannot answer that

[chilly imp]

No, just 2 base station, Index and 2 controllers

[sullen linden]

No you buy the trackers separately

[chilly imp]

You still need 3 Vive Trackers

[grand dawn]

what if you buy the vive pro

[sullen linden]

Nope

[grand dawn]

does it come wit thhat atleast

[chilly imp]

No VR headset include Vive Tracker

[grand dawn]

bruh

[grand dawn]

what use is the base station without the trackers

[chilly imp]

The base station use to track the headset, and 2 controllers

In the case of Index and Vive Pro or VR headset that does not have inside out tracking

[grand dawn]

ooohhhh ok

does it provide moar precize tracking than oculus

[chilly imp]

It depends on the user

most people won't notice the different to be honest

[haughty thistle]

With the higher price of something like the Index or Vive Pro, what you're paying for is the superior tracking on the hand controllers and a native PCVR connection meaning no compression artefacts or or limited resolution. The headset will always run at native res, unlike the Quest which is limited to something closer to the Rift S

[chilly imp]

It improves a lot for me, especially in Beat Saber. No more weird tracking or controllers fly off the screen

[haughty thistle]

I noticed that the Oculus inside-out tracking can seems a bit jelly at times. It constantly trips me up in Beat Saber, even though I feel like I should be better with the lighter Touch v2 controllers included with the Quest and Rift S

[grand dawn]

so totally how much does 1 oculus quest 2 plus 3 vive trackers plus 2 base stations add up to

[chilly imp]

Honestly, if you decided to spend the premium for 2 base station + 3 vive tracker

Might as well spend the extra for a different headset

[grand dawn]

well not like i have other choices

if i want to play anyhting other than beat sabre traking is kind of mandatory

[sullen linden]

Just to make sure, do you have a VR capable computer?

[grand dawn]

shure, i run a 1660 ti 6 gb

[chilly imp]

If you are new to VR, the tracking on the Quest is more than enough tbh

[grand dawn]

the gpu said vr ready on the box

[chilly imp]

1660ti is alright for VR

[sullen linden]

Yeah it's ok

[grand dawn]

1660ti plus ryzen 5 3500

[haughty thistle]

Although the 1660Ti is more at the bottom of what one could use for VR, it's decent enough that I wouldn't say it's going to be a bad experience...

[grand dawn]

i tried getting my hands on a 3060 we all know how that worked out

[sullen linden]

thinks about my friend playing with a 1050ti

[grand dawn]

lmao its not a bad card per saY

still holds up pretty good

[chilly imp]

VRCHAT is poorly optimized so just a headup

3090 still have some pretty bad experience

[grand dawn]

as long as your willing to lower some settings

[sullen linden]

They get 20-40fps in vrchat MAX lol

[grand dawn]

really? with 24 gigs of vram?

[haughty thistle]

It's not the game, it's the worlds and most avatars

[chilly imp]

That true, pretty much no one optimize anything

[grand dawn]

kinda like roblox

vr chat is like the roblox of vr

[haughty thistle]

It's more that it's CPU bound rather then GPU bound. Dynamic bones really hit the CPU hard, and many makers abuse them for the littlest carp...

[chilly imp]

VRCHAT eat every resource in your PC

[sullen linden]

Vrchat be like "oh I see you have one particle effect on your avatar" BAM very poor it is

[haughty thistle]

Here's a free Tech Tip:
Want more performance in VRChat? Turn on the dynamic bone limiter and make use of the safety settings

[grand dawn]

what does that do

[thick nest]

WUT

[thick nest]

limits heavy avatars

[thick nest]

i wanna know how

[haughty thistle]

The Dynamic Bone limiter turns off dynamic bones on avatars that exceed certain limits

[grand dawn]

wait so like whaat did u make the purchase

[chilly imp]

You know that moment when your leg.exe just stop working, I guess the guy went through that process

[haughty thistle]

While it does mean that most avatars will look like static dolls, it improves performance big time

[grand dawn]

so i cant roll into a ball and go whee?

[thick nest]

oh damn

[sullen linden]

Huh

[thick nest]

is the headset and the guy good?

[grand dawn]

omg did he get fired or sumn

[chilly imp]

It was on a marketplace so I just message him

[sullen linden]

Dynamic bones are used to make avatars hair for example move "realistically" but it has an impact on performance

[chilly imp]

He is alright, but the poor Index might not

[grand dawn]

wait lol i thought the index guy was someone from valve corp. loll

[chilly imp]

nahhh, we only have Gabe in NZ

[grand dawn]

no i meant did u end up buying it

[chilly imp]

Of course not

[grand dawn]

or was it too severly damaged

how do u plan on getting another one

[chilly imp]

Probably wait for Index 2 or something

There is nothing really worth upgrading to

Only interest in that Index listing cause the price was pretty decent, and Index is impossible to get in NZ

Unless you pay scalper price on Ebay or have someone ship from the US

[sullen linden]

I could send you my 2 year old index but I don't think you want that lol

[chilly imp]

How do you mount your tracker, feet especially?

[sullen linden]

I bought the trackstrap+ for them

[chilly imp]

Mine just jitter the entire leg everytime I move

[sullen linden]

Sounds like you have them pretty loose then

Or is it more like tracking jitter

[chilly imp]

Yeah, I ordered that last week. Hope it will arrive soon

The tracking is fine, just the placement I reckon

[grand dawn]

why cant you just like tape them or sumn or like mak eur own strap

[chilly imp]

Tape will block all tracking sensors

[sullen linden]

Oh idk if you noticed but rebuffreality doesn't offer warranty outside the US

[grand dawn]

what if u use a piece of cloth to make ur own strap

[chilly imp]

Got that on Amazon, the regular one though

[sullen linden]

I've heard some people just bolt the trackers to some crocks lmao

[chilly imp]

The problem is the tracker only have the tripod mount, so you have to come up with your own solution to mount

[sullen linden]

I wanted straps with built in batterybanks because the trackers only last 4 hours

[chilly imp]

I tried with a cheap Chinese strap, bunch of 3D print stuff, none fix the jitter

[sullen linden]

Well I have the 2.0 trackers so that's why only 4 hours

[chilly imp]

Unless I put the strap slightly above ankle

[sullen linden]

I've never worn them on my ankles

[chilly imp]

4 hours is plenty for me, can't be in PyPyDance more than 4 hours anyway

[sullen linden]

I hate to say it but I'm one of those who just sits around

[chilly imp]

yeah, putting on ankle does not have the best looking tracking

[grand dawn]

i thought it used a type of ultra wideband

[thick nest]

damn

[sullen linden]

I feel like the battery under the tracker makes them more stable

[chilly imp]

They don't have that instock on Amazon unfortunately

Else I would probably get one set

[sullen linden]

I waited 5 months for mine after my first set broke

[chilly imp]

Tape will either block, or make tracking less accurate.
Even if it works, you sure you want to use tape around your feet and hip?

[sullen linden]

Just nail the tracker to your foot smh

[grand dawn]

it was just a thought lol

[grand dawn]

yea smh smh y didnt i think of that

[rapid otter]

Me too I play wireless pcvr and i can play where ever I want in minutes without base station

[tame mica]

[sullen linden]

??

[median heart]

any mods to go with the quest 2? recommendations?

[gusty frost]

3d printed strap

[rustic garnet]

Guys my steamvr boundary is off compared to my oculus boundary, and by extension real life

It's shifted like a foot diagonally back and to the left

Mostly back though

here's an SC, blue is oculus guardian, orange is steam chaperone

[wraith rose]

I just got a Quest 2 a few days ago, and I am trying to use link, and whenever I plug it into my computer (Which is a laptop with an RTX 2060 Max-Q) it asks if I want to enter Oculus link and I say "yes" and then it just loads for a minutes, and takes me back to quest main menu. Is this because of the laptop?

[gusty frost]

I'm pretty sure is bc your cable

[south grove]

might be able to change the GPU your oculus software runs on, sometimes with laptops intel intergrated GPU's can mess with your stuff.

[gentle coral]

Cool since you and a few others asked, I will share the vid link and my price guessing.

Vid of NeuroTechX SF hacknight Galea Headset leak Discussion. It's about an hour long with mostly a presentation of info for first 30 minutes or so.

https://youtu.be/jhu9XUysHSE?t=4862

Hear is my price guessing for the galea headset (without an index)

I expect the first 100 galea dev units to ship this summer (at about 10k per headset), then a larger dev run to ship winter 2022 (at probably 5k per headset), and consumer ones to come fall of 2022, or winter 2023 (for 1k to 2k).

my breakdown of the cost right now

1k- tobii eye trackers
$500-headset body
$500= 8 active electrodes + extras
1.5k=Cyton and two daisy boards for 24 total channels
$500=PhisioHMD faceplate

so 4k for hardware alone right now

With a larger run of components next year my costs become this

1k- tobii eye trackers
$200-headset body
$300= 8 active electrodes + extras
$300=Unreleased 24 total channel OpenBCI board
$200=PhisioHMD faceplate

so 2k by winter 2022

And lastly with a massive consumer run with an new driver board.

$500- tobii eye trackers
$100-headset body
$150= 8 active electrodes + extras
$200=Unreleased 24 total channel OpenBCI board
$50=PhisioHMD faceplate

So 1k by fall 2022 which is my timeline for consumer release.

(And I think the next index will release next spring to coincide with the dev kits)

...

Also would people here pay $1000 dollars for an accessory to their VR headset?

[pastel echo]

1000+ for a computer changes the way you can play your games and the capability of games you can play
A VR rig ranging from 600-1000+ (for dedicated new PC options) changes the way you can play games and opens a window to a whole new type of game

As long as the accessory were to have the same purpose of expanding the games I play and adding a whole new type of game I don't see why 1000 or so isn't possible for early adopters

[gentle coral]

True definitely seem like an early adoption type of tech.

But the thing I am more worried about is how few games will use the features as they are extremely hard to develop for right now, and the number of people who can develop or even understand neurotech VR games is very very low (maybe 100 worldwide right now could come anywhere near creating a compelling VR game that uses the BCI aspects of the tech. And without games that use the tech, it would become just a less comfortable headstrap for your VR rig.

[rapid otter]

@gentle coral can you explain me a bit what is neurotech ?

I don't really get it's uses in vr ....

[potent sorrel]

Should I get a quest 2 or save more and get something else

[rapid otter]

Idk

Explain what you want budget and everything

And the we will be able to help you@potent sorrel

[potent sorrel]

I just want to play games like superhot beat saber and that walking dead vr game

And I’m saving up some money so I can get a be headset

And the quest 2 seemed like it would be good

It seems like a good price for what it is

what are the drawbacks of the quest 2

[rapid otter]

Do you have more than 1000$ ?

[potent sorrel]

No

[rapid otter]

Maybe the fov (not the best but when you play you don't notice that much)

Then pcvr will be too expensive

Easily get to 1k

[potent sorrel]

Can’t you link the quest with a cable to a pc as well?

Or use virtual desktop

[rapid otter]

Games are limited on it's own but yes you can use the link on your Q2

As well as airlink the wifi option

[potent sorrel]

Do I need fast internet for airlink

[rapid otter]

Not fast internet (i mean download and upload don't matter )

But you need a good wifi router

Wifi 6

[potent sorrel]

Also I heard bad things about the strap would it be a major problem

As well as the foam on the headset soaking sweat

[rapid otter]

Depends

The strap is good if set property

And the foam is good in my opinion

Can get a good aftermarket for 30$

[potent sorrel]

How do I check if my router is WiFi 6

[rapid otter]

Go on the product page

Do you have a gaming pc ?

[potent sorrel]

Yes

I have a 1660ti with a 10400f

[rapid otter]

Ok

[potent sorrel]

Also if I got a quest 2 I may use it on the go sometimes

[rapid otter]

Might be cool but vr games are very demanding

[potent sorrel]

Mostly I would be home

[rapid otter]

The gtx 1660 is minimum spec (should be fine )

[potent sorrel]

So I’m good?

[rapid otter]

You have ethernet to your pc ?

[potent sorrel]

Nope

Too far to reach

[rapid otter]

Then you need to

That's a must

You need wifi 6 and ethernet after that you should be good

[potent sorrel]

My router is close enough to get a good connection but too far to connect a cable

Also I don’t want a cable going all over the walkway on the second floor

[rapid otter]

Then you can play offline games

[potent sorrel]

So I need Ethernet to use pcvr

[rapid otter]

With your WiFi 6 router plugged in your pc

You need that for latency reasons

[potent sorrel]

How bad would the latency be with a wireless connection

Instead of Ethernet

[rapid otter]

If ethernet and wifi 6 then not noticeable

Ho

Quite bad

Idk the numbers

[potent sorrel]

I’d mostly be playing without a connection to pc

Also do I need a pc to download side quest

[rapid otter]

Nope

I mean if you want

But you won't need sidequest for wireless vr

[potent sorrel]

Some games on there I want to play

Like gorilla tag

[rapid otter]

Then you have a pc so that's fine

[potent sorrel]

And this one attack on Titan vr game

[rapid otter]

Ok ok

Or you can go wired

But i don't know the setup precisely

[potent sorrel]

Also can I just buy a 3rd party cable or should I buy the oculus link cable thing

[rapid otter]

You can buy anker if you want

But nothing else

[potent sorrel]

Anker?

[rapid otter]

You need a 5 meter cable minimum

[potent sorrel]

Ok

[rapid otter]

If you can get longer it's better

How big is your play space ?

[potent sorrel]

In my room

Long enough to stretch my arms without hitting walls but not that big

But I will be moving my setup to a bigger room eventually

[rapid otter]

You need 30 cm from your arms all around

Be careful at first you have to be extremely careful

Then you'll get used and you won't hit things

[potent sorrel]

Also when I play not linked to my pc I may play in my living room

[rapid otter]

Ok 👌

For a first headset the Q2 is good

[potent sorrel]

Ok

Thanks for telling me all that about vr stuff

I knew literally almost nothing

[rapid otter]

If you need any questions even the dumbest one ask me

[potent sorrel]

Ok

How long does the quest 2 charge last

[rapid otter]

Depends i never charge it full

2 hours from 100 to 0

But get a battery

[potent sorrel]

Should I get a battery pack so I can charge it on the go or when I’m playing and it’s almost dead

[rapid otter]

Pro tip

[potent sorrel]

Pro tip?

[rapid otter]

Get an amazon powerbank rated at 2 A, a cable wich you run under your shirt to the quest

And put it in your pants pocket

[potent sorrel]

Ok

[rapid otter]

Hours of play

Don't charge when it's dead

Start at 25 % to be safe

[potent sorrel]

Ok

[rapid otter]

Also please get 2 batteries for your controller and get a battery charger

You can find em cheap

And it's better for ecology

[potent sorrel]

I have a whole bin full of batteries so that should last me a while

[rapid otter]

Please do it won't cost more

Ok then after

[potent sorrel]

Ok

How long do batteries last in the quest 2 controllers

[rapid otter]

Depends

The more the game makes it vibrate draw battery

But idk 2-3 weeks normally

[potent sorrel]

Ok

[rapid otter]

But you can easily last more than a month if you don't play that much

[potent sorrel]

You have been a big help with this stuff

I was going to go to sleep 5 hours ago so I’m going to go to sleep in a minute

[rapid otter]

That's a pleasure to help

Ok gn

See you

[potent sorrel]

See ya

[gentle coral]

So neurotech is just shorthand for neuro-technology (neuro is talking about the brain). In the case of VR the main subset of neurotech is BCI (brain computer interface). There is also biosensors (eyetracking, heart rate, etc), and biofeedback (haptics, and the like).

In the vr industry BCI, biosensors, and biofeedback allow for much higher levels of immersion.

It also allows for more immersve games in general (many AAA games already support eye tracking), but most of the game dev industry think it will make a much bigger impact in VR, then it will in regular flat games you play on a regular monitor.

The easiest uses are to change the game based on your state (change difficulty in real time based on your stress levels). And improve the way NPC's interact with your character based on things like eye contact, your emotional state, or how stressed you are.

But in the future you will be able to control parts of the game with your thoughts, or make your character do things just by thinking of doing that thing.

Valve has been researching its uses in gaming since before 2009. And is currently working with OpenBCI to integrate the OpenBCI Galea headset with the index.

[rapid otter]

Eye tracking will be so good for immersion

Heart rate too

@gentle coral thank you so much ❤️ for the explanation

[gentle coral]

Your welcome

[rapid otter]

For now and the coming years i think neurotech is a gadget the amount of work needed to make it viable is huge. Also controlling with the mind is kinda useless given the price it's at, it can be fun thinking about casting a spell and having it working but in my opinion the fun of vr come from the mouvements (reloading crouching pushing cutting swords ect) i tried controller vr, it's very bad because it doesn't give this presence feeling

I haven't finished my argumentation

I think that eye and heart sensor can give a real gameplay enhancement

What do you think ?

[gentle coral]

I am very excited for the tech (partly because I know how it can be used and have experience with BCI, and a number of biosensors).

Here is a very good talk by valve about their research into BCI.
https://youtu.be/Qhj3C1H5JWo

[rapid otter]

Also like full body tracking it's a niche for now, FBT isn't really implemented in games it price makes it a barrier to entry

Time will tell but me too I'm excited

[gentle coral]

Eye and heart rate are definitely easier then straight BCI (brain imaging) but long term all of them together will make the biggest difference. All the different sensors and systems make up for the others issues and help make sure the right things happen while playing.

[rapid otter]

Yes

[gentle coral]

For example using a system like the nextmind (a recent BCI for gaming that you can use with a VR headset) it takes a lot longer then a eye tracker to select something you want to interact with, but when you use both it can be faster and more accurate then either one individually.

Or another is that if you have a BCI looking at your motor cortex, and are wearing a full body tracking system you can train the BCI to identify the different movements and then match your characters movements to your real movements even after you take off the full body tracking system. Or even move your character without you moving at all, but just thinking about moving.

[rapid otter]

The second cortex thing is interesting

But

I don't think neurotech is better than FBT

Surely it can be a big leap for vr

[gentle coral]

Neurotech is much faster and can be as accurate as FBT if trained correctly.

[rapid otter]

Personally I want vr to be more uniform for a couple years like the quest do it will allow big innovation

And big games will come

[gentle coral]

Right now the fastest way to shoot a gun in a game is to predict a person's intent to press their mouse button.

[rapid otter]

I don't think vr would be here without the q and q2

[gentle coral]

I would say Quest and Quest 2 have had a mixed bag of positives and negatives for VR.

[rapid otter]

And that manufacturer should make new tech but reasonably priced

Yes

The good thing is that it removed the barrier to entry (partially)

But i listen to you, you know more than I do

[gentle coral]

I really think there needs to be more reasonable pr8ced headsets, but other then Facebook, the only one who could really make money on a low cost headset is Valve and Sony, who don't really care to compete.

If I did not have a problem with Facebook itself, some of their business practices, and a few really stupid decisions on the designand implementationof the Quest and Quest 2, I would see the Quest and Quest 2 as perfect.

They have gotten VR mainstream enough and low cost enough that game devs actually can make money developing VR games without needing their game to be a super success.

But a few things hold back the Quest and Quest 2 (mostly things that hurt the user, but allow Facebook to make more money, or keep you on their platform). Required Facebook account, and not supporting full bandwidth PCVR being the two biggest ones.

---

Right now it really is Facebook vs Valve, and HP kind of tagging along. If WMR did ot have the tracking issues and the companies who made first gen WMR still released even their old headsets or ones with even slight improvements, this would be a much more competitive race to improve VR.

[rapid otter]

I don't know what to respond, great argument

I am a quest 2 activist 😅

I sold my soul to the devil but I am fully aware of it and I am responsible of the risks i take

Minor's in my opinion

[gentle coral]

Now that VR is at this point it can definitely become more interesting, as the VR game dev industry is in a good position, and consumers are happy with the games, Facebook or Valve could release a loss leader standalone headset (headset costs more to make then what it is being sold for) at around 450 dollars, that would be considered a console competitor.

I am guessing the Quest 2 Pro will be 499, and valves standalone will be 599. Or at least I think that will be what people will currently be willing to pay for a well upgraded quest 2 or a current gen Quest 2 that supports uncompressed PCVR, or a standalone index that is identical to the current index, and supports full PCVR (but would be released st the same time as the Index 2 headset for the same price).

All 4 of those headset options would be very competitive and not even fully overlap eachother but will not out that much to manufacture compared to the current stuff as most of the assembly line could be reused, which would save a bunch of money.

[rapid otter]

I think so

Wireless pcvr is the future for the average customer

Not everyone needs 90hz 8k

Or can even get it

@gentle coral i can see that you have an expert vision it's much appreciated, you give me a more professional view on VR

Thanks to wifi 6 wireless is now a very good option

Wifi will be faster in the coming years( i think ) wich will make it even better

Do you think wireless/standalone is the future ?

[chilly imp]

That pretty much all companies are going for. Though I would like to see both standalone device and something like HTC Wireless Adapter

[daring pendant]

hey guys, i found a used oculas quest 1st gen on craigslist for $80, it has "touch controllers" and a game or 2, is it a good deal?

[pale wagon]

hell yeah, quest 1 is a great entry headset for only 80$, and you can still do a decent wired PCVR thing with a cheap cable

[daring pendant]

ok, Thanks! im going to get it

[pale wagon]

get yourself a link cable from anker or something similar aswell, if your PC is close to VR ready or is.

another 30$ for PCVR

and the q1 has a relatively low res

[daring pendant]

will do!

[rapid otter]

Me too when is at wireless i say both

[rapid otter]

For most pc it's enough

1440 x 1600 pixels per eye is enough to make your pc struggle if you have base hardware

[stoic geode]

Hey so im in a bit of a dilemma

Im finally getting a VR headset but im stuck between getting an original Oculus Rift or the newer Rift S

Pros of the Rift S would be its resolution (1280 x 1440 vs 1080 x 1200 per eye) and the fact that i wouldnt need base stations (which is a huge plus in my smol room), but it has a lower refresh rate (80 vs 90) and its LCD compared to OLED on the OG Rift

The S is also more expensive, i also have a relatively underpowered PC so i dont really know what to go for

What would be my best choice?

(Ping when replying, i dont check here often and sometimes just forget to check)

[shut hemlock]

have you thought about the quest 2 at all? oculus link is really good now. i recently upgraded from my original rift and am loving it. pluse it can now do 120 hrtz

[stoic geode]

I have, unfortunately its way out of my budget over here...

[shut hemlock]

@stoic geode gotcha, well i would recommenced the rift s then. inside out tracking is way to convenient, and works way better then i think it should lol. tho it should be noted that most oculus exclusives are going to be coming the quest 2 and not their larger eco system. so you might end up having to use something like revive to play a oculus exclusive on your oculus. not that you really need those games. beat saber is all you really need 🤣

[stoic geode]

Guess thats decided then, i guess the 10hz difference doesnt matter much?

Alsodont care for the exclusives yet lmao

[shut hemlock]

as some one who had to take down my base stations every time i planed and re set it up every time i really think inside out tracking is worth it. tbh i have never tried 80htz vr, but i have a friend who used a rift s for a bit and he didn't have any complaints.

[stoic geode]

Ah i see, my friend has a ton of issues with his which is also why im a bit worried

[flat pawn]

the 10hz difference will not be noticeable

also the rift s is very easy for a PC to drive

[gentle coral]

What is your IPD that could affect your choice, as thr rift S has no physical
ipd adjustment, while the rift CV1 does have a slider, and if you are too far from the rift S ipd, then any benefit of the extra resolution would be lost. Though the Rift CV1 really needs 3 cameras to get full 6dof tracking without noticeable blind spots. Also each of the rift cv1 cameras needs a good USB port, and probably a good extension cable. Also the 10hz difference is noticeable to some people, but if you get used to vr then it should be fine (much better then the 72 of the first gen Quest).

[gentle coral]

I think that standalone and wireless are just as much of the future as wired. I would definitely say that they will affect different aspects of the industry. I think for the majority of consumers and game dev's the wireless and standalone stuff will matter the most, while the wired high end will be where the hardware will develop the most. Most low cost tech is subsidized by the high end tech, and the tech trickles down somewhat fast.

[rapid otter]

Yeah that's what I think too but i wanted your opinion

[haughty thistle]

Just as we have wireless speakers and wired ones today, I think we'll also have both a wired and wireless VR future

[lethal obsidian]

Wireless will definitely be the more mainstream future though

At least for the next few years

The potential VR market is quite large but the amount of people that have VR capable computer hardware isn't

If the new consoles come out with proper VR compatibility, that may change

A shitload of people use the Quest 2 standalone as their only VR headset, and another large group use it with steam. A lot of those are using virtual desktop as well

• tether cables are a point of failure

[rough crypt]

Wireless also means more mobile and sometimes faster setup times. Which can be a big selling point

Just like with laptops

A store might be able to get a good combo going by selling a wireless headset with a VR capable laptop.

[lethal obsidian]

Personally speaking, I like high end displays and audio

The valve index might be a couple years old but its high refresh rate, audio, and great tracking are why I use it

But I would really like a good wireless PCVR headset

The Quest 2 is awesome, don't get me wrong, but the index knuckle controllers are so much better in most games that I play, and pairing them with a quest 2 isn't economic and is somewhat janky

[haughty thistle]

There's a reason I have both an Index and a Vive Pro 1. The latter I have kitted out with the Wireless Adapter. Yes, the adaper is expensive, but from my experience it's pretty much as if I have the headset plugged in directly into my PC. The only downside to this is the playtime (about 2-2.5h per 10Ah battery). Well, that is, if you can even get there without crashing. I'm looking into putting a fan on mine, as the crashes are in 90% of the cases the adapter overheating.
In my experience, if you're ok with wearing an audio-headset (you have to use a Type-C audio interface btw) on top of your VR headset, it's one of the best VR headsets out there...

The Pro 2 I wouldn't recommend using the wireless adapter on as you'd now have at least one downside of the Quest 2 running VD, as you're stepping down the resolution and not running the panels at native res. In my experience this almost always result in a blurry image.

I'd be super happy if HTC would release a Wireless Adapter 2 with full res support of the Pro 2 and possibly even 120Hz support. Only time will tell however

[chilly imp]

I thought HTC will enable 120hz or fullres through a firmware update or something?

Really want to get the wireless adapter but at $700nzd, that is pretty expensive

[haughty thistle]

Nope. The current Wireless Adapter caps out bandwidth wise slightly above the resolution of the Cosmos at 90Hz. They will offer that resolution for the Pro 2 later with a Firmware update, yes, but it's going to be locked at 90Hz and that update res is going to be something like 1632x1632

https://uploadvr.com/vive-pro-2-wireless-limitations/

[stoic geode]

I actually have no idea what my own IPD is, or how to measure it

[bleak night]

anyone know much about the pimax 5k super

im most likely going to just refund the index hmd

3rd rma already since january, and the headset broke a day after i recieved it

[rapid otter]

I think @haughty thistle had one ask him....

[gentle coral]

the easiest way is to get a ruler (with mm and cm, not inches), go stand in front of a mirror, line the 0 on the ruler up with the center of one eye, and then hold your a finger at the center of your other eye, and whatever distance in mm it says is your IPD (interpupillary distance). I did it with that method for my first VR headset well before I got glasses and found out that I measured my IPD perfectly when I went and got glasses last year. Somewhat common IPD is between 61mm and 68mm. Look up "interpupillary distance" on google images or youtube and that will answer everything

[haughty thistle]

Bot deleted my writeup because of my abbreviation of parallel projections ;-;

[bleak night]

index here hae been an utter nightmare

[gentle coral]

I wondered what happened, I saw it pop up and disapear in a second. (in response to chickenbread)

[bleak night]

i just want better fov tbh

[haughty thistle]

If you have to wear glasses, you'd have to add so much spacing to the facial interface, that you're essentially left with an FOV similar of the Index

[bleak night]

i already have reduced fov because of glasses

[haughty thistle]

Ignoring SDE, this is what I've sketched up how the Vive Pro, Index and Pimax (in this case 8k X, but the 5k Super was similar, just darker) compare to one another

[bleak night]

it already looks like that here

[haughty thistle]

I felt like I was going cross-eyed or something using the Pimax 8k X which is why I returned mine

Chromatic abberation was horrible (on both Pimaxes I had) and even though the Image on the 8k X was supposedly sharper, it felt significantly more blurry then my Index

[bleak night]

blurryness i already am used to

chromatic is... eeh i dont notice it much on the index but its there for me

[haughty thistle]

I notice abberation on pretty much every headset in the blue area, but only around the edge of the Lens. In the case of the 8k X it was both red and blue and even in the center of the image

You may also ask @flat pawn about his experience (he also has a 5k Super), but he's still waiting on his controllers and lighthouses I think...

[bleak night]

for me, id be fine with it

i already deal with severe issues with the index as is

well.. i did

until i started getting defective units as replacements

the qc is abysmal

[haughty thistle]

I personally prefer my Original Vive Pro over my Index as well. currently waiting on my pre-order of the Pro 2...

[bleak night]

im just wantind a decent headaet, and the eye tracking option for the pimax seems nice

[haughty thistle]

I just hope that HTC has the internal reflections more under control that are oh-so-common on dual-stack lens designs

[bleak night]

keyboard aagh. hands still hurt

[haughty thistle]

The Problem I see with eye tracking is that there's barely any software supporting it in the first place, and those that do often only support SRanipal (aka Vive Pro Eye)

[bleak night]

headset doesnt even connect to steamvr anymore

[haughty thistle]

big oof

[bleak night]

sits red

i at least liked how pimax has cables you can buy

unlike valve

[haughty thistle]

You can also buy the Index cable

It's on Amazon

[bleak night]

not from valve, and its the standard length

[haughty thistle]

Apparently the OEM making the cable for the Index has decided to list it on Amazon

[bleak night]

interesting

[haughty thistle]

It's exactly the same cable as you'd receive in the box or from support

Just doesn't have the little card that Valve would put in

[bleak night]

pimax uses the same conector as the index

pro 2 does too

[haughty thistle]

Not that I know of...

[bleak night]

and the reverb

its the oculink connector

[haughty thistle]

All of these headsets have different connectors

I know this, because I have a cable of each and compared them

[bleak night]

oh?

weird

looked at em and compared myself

interesting

older headsets from pimax were

[haughty thistle]

The connector on the headset side is important.
Left: G2
Center: Vive Pro
Right: Index

[haughty thistle]

I don't have the Pimax anymore, but it looked like a knock-off Vive Pro cable with a different sized metal bit at the top

[bleak night]

this connector is the same as the index

[haughty thistle]

They may look similar, but I guarantee you, they are different. All these headsets (even the Index) use a proprietary pinout. Even if it fits, doesn't mean it'll work

[bleak night]

oh i dont expect the same pinout

[haughty thistle]

Non of these use a standard connector on the headset side either. The Index does use OCuLink physical connector for the breakout cable. But that's about standard it goes for modern day VR-cables

[gentle coral]

Chromatic abberation, and distortion, on pimax has been a problem since they first started making headsets, and they won't pay someone to actually fix it. My friend tried the prototype 8k headset back at ces 2017, and was amazed by the amount of distortion and abberation. He even offered to fix it, but they didn't care to much

[bleak night]

i used a proto quest 2

was surprised how shit it was

retail is alot better

infact completely different

[gentle coral]

If I remember correctly the Prototype Quest 2 used the same lenses as the first Quest before they redid the optic pipeline or software correction.

[bleak night]

the one i used was near identical to a q1

[haughty thistle]

While I certainly wouldn't say the distortions on a Pimax headset aren't there (they defo are, and they are bad), they also aren't at a point where I would say that that's the worst for a Pimax. It's like everything else about their physical devices. From included cable length, over headstrap stability, chromatic abberation, lens heat, glasses support, audio, weight distribution...

[bleak night]

looked like it had black quest 2 touch controllers

mono sound from the right side of the headset

blurry as hell too

id be getting the 6 meter cable for the pimax at some point as is

and we have an active extender cable thats not used aswell

[haughty thistle]

For me personally, a Pimax just isn't worth it's money. You pay tons of money for a device that requires more modifications then a Quest to be competitive with other laternatives out there

[bleak night]

i dont see what else id even get

for the fov aspect... not much else i see

plus under $800 is hard to find aswell

[haughty thistle]

The Vive Pro 2 probably is a better headset. It's FOV is similar apparently to the Index yet cheaper then comparable Pimax headsets

[bleak night]

ive heard bad things about it

[haughty thistle]

Don't trust VoodooDE. He's heavily biased towards Pimax

[bleak night]

never heard of em

dunno, i compared stuff myself a day ago or so

kinda loopy atm, not feeling well

buut. the 5k super looks pretty decent in terms of what ive been looking for

the modular audio strap already included out of the box, with the comfort kit already included aswell

so, who currently has a 5k super atm

kinda just wanna here a comparison

[flat pawn]

Yep, they're apparently in the states now though

So it shouldn't be too much longer I hope

[bleak night]

.>

[flat pawn]

I do

[bleak night]

oh, well

[flat pawn]

Here it is under my rift

[bleak night]

how is it i suppose

had an utter nightmare with the index, and i kinda wanna get a 5k super

from what im being told, the bad parts of the pimax headsets..... i already get with the index

[flat pawn]

Never tried an index and I am still waiting on the rest of my kit but

[bleak night]

not to mention every damn headset i get breaks in less than a month

[flat pawn]

The little demo environment is nice to look at

The fov is great

[bleak night]

thats the biggest seller for me

[flat pawn]

I am holding back final judgements until #1 the controllers/base stations arrive

[bleak night]

the fov on the index breaks immersion more thanb the immense glare

[flat pawn]

#2 the thicker foam arrives

Since it's just a little tight with my glasses

[bleak night]

yeah

[flat pawn]

Do you wear glasses

[bleak night]

i do, but not big ones

[flat pawn]

Those are mine sitting inside it

[bleak night]

i got mine specifically when we had the quest 2

and i brought it with to test fit

132mm arm to arm

and eeh i can take my glasses off for vr anyway

blurry but playable

from what i hear aswell

[flat pawn]

For me it was only very slightly blurrier w/o glasses

[bleak night]

the index for me is the vive at its worst

[flat pawn]

But perhaps my vision is a little better

Right now I'm using my phone without my glasses and it's clear

[bleak night]

my vision aint the best

but its okay when i wake up

hows the pimax compare to the cvi

cv1*

since i know a few people who hgave a few comparisons of the cv1 to the index

hell... id go back to the rift dk2 over the index

with the issues im having. please.

[flat pawn]

I have only tried on rift s and the 5k super so far

[bleak night]

facepalm thanks google

[flat pawn]

So I can't entirely answer that one

Lol

[bleak night]

i look up rift s and i get the cv1

[flat pawn]

..lol

[bleak night]

but how do they compare

[gentle coral]

Yep, each headset that uses the OCulink connector has it's own licenced pinout by contract with the connector manufacturer (amphenol-icc if I remember correctly). The OCulink is one of the connectors where you can get a private licence for a modified connector and pinout for your company. And if you buy the connector and use someone else's pinout configuration on purpose without the licence you will breach your own contract, and no longer be able to buy that connector. Thus there will never be any third party cables for any of these headsets, unless the companies allow it (valve lets the company sell the cables on amazon).

I am sorry if this is confusing, it has been a while since I explained it from memory, I am to lazy to find the write-up I had from 2019.

[flat pawn]

From what I've done so far (desktop vrchat, pimax demo environment) I prefer the pimax over the rift s in everything but comfort when using glasses

And I can't judge software fully yet but

I'm not a fan of oculus PC software

[bleak night]

yeeah

[flat pawn]

I can give you my own proper review/comparison once I have my full kit if you'd like

[gentle coral]

Oculus PC software has always been a mess.

[bleak night]

mmhm

[stoic geode]

Alright thank you!

[bleak night]

i wanna get the pimax during the sale

its $720 vs $800 atm

[flat pawn]

What issues have the index given you?

Usually people love theirs

[bleak night]

well, besides breaking 4 times since january...

the ungodly glare

[flat pawn]

Have you tried rift s

[bleak night]

the aberration is dreadful

i havent

i did use a dk2 and a gear vr

and we have a quest 2

for visuals and audio, quest 2 is miles better

fov, software, tracking, and controllers, index wins

[flat pawn]

Quest 2 audio you preferred over index audio?

[bleak night]

very much so

my ear shape made it alot better than most

[flat pawn]

Now that's something I've never seen before

[bleak night]

its weird, index sounded kinda bland and muddy

quest 2 sounded vibrant a spatious

[flat pawn]

Everybody keeps saying index audio is the absolute best in consumer vr

[bleak night]

yeeeeeah i dont see it

its finnicky and kinda meh

im used to audiophile headphones too

so it was kinda weird to experience that

it was the intro scene for the quest 2, i heard it wasnt good audio, but my ears said otherwise

heard the index was the best of the best

i went into windows sound settings and even then i was kinda.... dissapointed

for the best consumer vr headset.. 16 bit audio seems kinda... meh?

dunno what the pimax supports for audio format, but im curious

the index is at least partially working atm so i might play beat saber while its still pixel spewing

or ballisticng tbh

and actually

the biggest issue with the index atm

it feels like im looking through binoculars

seriously just feels like this

but more... closed in

quest 2 is about the same, just its less noticable because the glare isnt as bad

[fathom sigil]

Yeah the quest 2 has a bit of that binocular effect, due to the lower FOV both horizontal and vertical

Still though the quest 2 is just really good value. The fact that you can do wireless vr for the price of a quest + a $40 tplink c6 router is pretty incredible

It's just a shame htc didn't try compete with them

[haughty thistle]

The 5k Super was on an even heavier sale just a few days ago. Until May 31st they had an "Upgrade to VR 2.0" thing, where they essentially sold you a 5k Super for the price of an Artisan if you already owned a headset (they even let previous Pimax customers take advantage of that sale lol)

[bleak night]

i just missed out on that yeah

audio popping. oof

the index just crashed my pc

[fathom sigil]

Since when was pimax a decent company, i always thought they were just way over their heads (no pun intended) but then suddenly they started making decent products

[bleak night]

big ouch

completely frozen

[haughty thistle]

The problem is upscaling audio with low latency methods almost always results in a degradation of the quality (rounding errors and whatnot). Someone who actually works as a sound engineer once told me, you should always set your audio setup to as close the source audio as you can.
It's minor and even I can't tell a difference, but honestly, as long as your source is 16bit, why run it at any higher quality anyways? You almost never run across 24bit audio samples in the wild, unless you're working with audiophile grade audio files (Lossless, FLAC and whatnot)

[fathom sigil]

Das not good

[bleak night]

i do myself but yeah

i like listening to music in vr

ouch though, complete l... uh

i think it killed my usb controller

.....

[haughty thistle]

Ouch...

[fathom sigil]

😳

[bleak night]

maybe not..?

[haughty thistle]

Sounds like the Issue with your Index then wasn't the main cable, but the breakout connector

[bleak night]

bios threw out a no keyboard error

its up in windows

[haughty thistle]

If it shorted pins in it, USB-Controllers like to turn off individual ports for protection

[bleak night]

il.. disconnect it for now

the pc locked up and when i rebooted, it threw the no keyboard error

dunno

[haughty thistle]

Quick question: how often did you disconnect the main cable from the bearkout connector? The OCuLink connector is only rated for up to 20 reconnections

[bleak night]

not often if ever

[fathom sigil]

20?

That's a fairly low number for anything

[haughty thistle]

Yup. It's supposed to be an internal connector

[bleak night]

but i went past that many trying to replug it because of steam support

though the oculink connector used for the index is a more refined ruggedized ish connector

[haughty thistle]

Heck, the LGA pins in a CPU socket are often rated for only like 10 reconnects.
In reality they often last longer, but a rating gives you an indication for how durable a connector is

[bleak night]

yeeah

i had to do more than 20 due to steam support

they had to have me reconnect it over and over

[haughty thistle]

I only ever disconnect my Index on the PC side, not the breakout connector side

[bleak night]

headset was throwing connection issues

on the headset side

so far ive seen errors that show, display port, breakout, and headset

[haughty thistle]

fun-fact: I once thought my Index was broken (right screen was mostly black and wiggling it around made it show garbled data on the right screen)
Turns out, the Optical Converter in the breakout connector just didn't reset properly and unplugging the headset from power for like 30 seconds and reconnecting it fixed it xD

[haughty thistle]

Sounds like a broken cable alltogether

[bleak night]

ive got mostly garbled data

sometimes flashes white static on half the screens

but mainlky sparkly bits

and audio pops sometimes

[haughty thistle]

When the optical fibres of the cable itself are broken you can get these flashes, white static and connection issues

[bleak night]

sounds wonderful

wonder what happened to the warehouse

a/c failure possibly?

or just quality control issues perhaps?

[haughty thistle]

The location most prone to such issues is the cable area between the clip on the top and the actual connector going into the headset.
For people with pully systems, I've also seen the cable breaking at the clip on the back

[bleak night]

i use pulley, but it had this issue since i unboxed it

[haughty thistle]

Optical cables hate being bend in a tight radius. While they are generally less prone to breaking, bending them too tight can break it immediatly

[bleak night]

it went away by replugging it at first

and with that

i already know a design fault

[haughty thistle]

I've noticed moving the back part of the headstrap up bends the cable in a rather tight radius in the area where it goes into the headset

[bleak night]

yup

[haughty thistle]

That's why that area is most prone to break

The only way to prevent it braking there is to never move the headstrap up

[bleak night]

the hmd part itself breaks most often

the bend anyway

and, thats an issue here, we have to put it up that way due to glasses

well, roomate does

[haughty thistle]

The problem is, Valve has added that clip to keep the bend radius under control, so it doesn't bend too much. Release the cable from that clip and it probably bends more then it used to

That's why I have lens inserts on my Index. It allows me to drag the HMD down my face without having to move the strap

[bleak night]

been kinda hard to get a set for me and my roomate

since she has glasses too

so if were going to do vr

thats kinda an issue

[haughty thistle]

The lens inserts from VRO sit only lightly on the Index lenses. They are a breeze to take off and put on

(unlike the Widmo lenses which sit really tightly on there)

[bleak night]

yeah we looked into em

just a bit too expensive

thats why we looked into the pimax, since it had the grooves on the interface for glasses

and our glasses are... pretty small

[haughty thistle]

Oh... those grooves...

If you've ever tried a Vive and thought the lightbleed on those grooves was noticable, be prepared for litterally seeing a reflection of behind you in the lenses. I used velcro to pull in the sides a little further to not have a litteral opening on the sides of my face

[bleak night]

never used a vive

dk2 had some light bleed

but never really had much issues

[haughty thistle]

At this point I'm just fed up with Pimax...
5k Super was an absolute $hit show for me and I really tried giving the 8k X every chance to shine where it could. But it all failed with me not being able to get the lenses aligned with my eyes. Eye-strain the moment I put it on is what I'm talking

[bleak night]

i feel the same with valve

worst case.. i return the 5k super

[haughty thistle]

Then you want to order the 5k Super on Amazon. Return process with Pimax has been the worst...

We decided to deduct 210€ from your refund to finance out internal refurbishment

Which, btw, they don't even declare refurbished products

When returning on Amazon you just get the full price refunded, and you also don't have to pay return shipment (like with Pimax)

[rapid otter]

What's what wires ?
.
"wireless gang"

[rapid otter]

Fade as you get immersed

[rapid otter]

What do you mean ? OCulink= oculus link ?

[bleak night]

nope

the oculus software is horrid

alvr is cool and all

but the fov on the quest 2 isnt great

[haughty thistle]

The physical connector is called OCuLink (capatilized like this)

[bleak night]

yup

[flat pawn]

Also regarding the cable bending angle, the pimax cord wraps around the bottom of the arm at a loose angle then rides the top of the side of the strap

So it doesn't seem possible to give the cord a hard bend

[haughty thistle]

Well... Pimax did after all a thing that I feel like every Chinese company is required to do: They copied it.
The MAS headstrap is essentially a copy of the Vive Pro headstrap. A bad copy, but that's besides the point.
The way the Vive Pro handles the cable is imo the best way possible as it's very gentle on the cable and I think every VR company should take note of this. I did try to see if it was possible to route the Index cable in a similar manner (bend it downwards from the connector and then rise it back to attach to the headstrap at the top) but there is so little space in the front for the cable, that I probably would've damaged it attempting this

[flat pawn]

How is the vive strap different than this?

[haughty thistle]

The hinge is a bit tighter on the Vive Pro and it doesn't wobble around like the Pimax MAS does. Because of this the Vive Pro sits more in place on the face. I noticed the Pimax did like to slide around in front of my face when tilting my head.
The Vive Pro strap also goes further down, so the back pad does rest a bit closer to the neck. The whole reason for this pad to hinge up and down as well as having that interesting shape is so that it can provide some additional support in the neck area when you look up. The Pimax MAS doesn't reach far down enough for that to fulfill it's purpose.
Lastly, the Vive one is not as wide, so fitting headphones over it is a little easier. Granted this is caused in part by the wide design of Pimax headsets, but something to note non-the-less

[flat pawn]

Fair enough

The wobble ends up being irrelevant after the thing is secured at least

And the back pad not reaching as far down hasn't bothered me yet

[haughty thistle]

Honestly, I feel like the Pimax engineers tried to replicate the Vive Pro headstrap without understanding what made it so great

[flat pawn]

Haven't had any opportunities to actually test the thing out yet

I never wear headphones so the width is a non issue for me personally

And if I did I'd probably use my wireless earbuds

[haughty thistle]

I still felt like the Pimax sits less secure on the face compared to the Vive. But that's personal opinion. I mean, there are people who prefer a Halo strap or even rubber straps over everything else

[flat pawn]

I definitely had no issues with the rift s halo

I might be a relatively unpicky user overall though

Wouldn't the lower back strap support better when looking down, not up?

[haughty thistle]

I like the Halo strap design as well. Only problem is that these often come with a hinge that breaks quickly, have no adjustment for glasses or when they do, it doesn't really hold the headset securely in place (the latter was on the Rift S I had started to wobble like crazy in Beat Saber)

[flat pawn]

Rift S doesn't have a hinge either

I didn't think halo straps had hinges

[haughty thistle]

Most of the initial WMR lineup and the Vive Cosmos like to disagree

Almost every WMR headset (except for the Samsung ones and the Reverb line) all had a hinge to flip up the headset

The one on my Lenovo Explorer kinda broke within the 2 months I was using it

[umbral garden]

there's three different VR beta's for ETS2. I assume I take the most recent version if I want to play with my quest 2? (which is Oculus+OpenVR game version 1.29 SKD 1.4.0)

[haughty thistle]

1.29 is a relatively old version, no?

The one you want is the first of these (literally just called oculus)

[umbral garden]

Oh, that's a typo. It's 1.39

wait no I am just being stupid

[haughty thistle]

Then, what you also want to do is to add -openvr or -oculus to the run parameters of the game. Which one you choose depends on whether you want to run it through SteamVR or directly through Oculus Home.

[umbral garden]

I am playing via Link so I don't know if that matters?

[haughty thistle]

Well, it depends on whether or not you want to use any SteamVR overlays or the SteamVR dashboard. In that case you pick -openvr.
If you want slightly better performance and don't need any SteamVR overlay, use -oculus

[umbral garden]

I didn't even know steamVR had an overlay.... Guess I'm going with -oculus

[haughty thistle]

What I mean with SteamVR overlays is like for example OVRToolkit. As an example, if you're streaming you could use OVRToolkit to put your stream Chat into VR.

[umbral garden]

Ahh I see. I'm just playing for myself so no need

Thanks for the help!

[haughty thistle]

Figured I might share this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYjcoOB7mfc

[patent dagger]

whats a good vr setup for a begginer to enjoy with my kids

i have a 3600 and 2080 ti

[pale orbit]

if they are under 12? nothing at all. not healthy for long term use for them.

[patent dagger]

occulus quest

[bleak night]

getting a replacement index cable i guess

[gentle coral]

This is mostly due to the headsets not being developed for smaller heads (IPD can't go small enough), and the headset weight can be a problem on younger kids necks if not set up correctly. Also the controllers are not designed for smaller hands, so would not be very ergonomic for them.

Most of these physical issues are just because of lazy headset designers and to save money.

But there is also the issue of there not being much data on how VR affects the body (how does it affect eyes, can it affect the neck if not properly seated, can controllers affect hand issues). All of these issues are still kind of confusing as doing cognitive and medical research on VR is very rare, and is usually done by groups that are biased to find a specific outcome.

[pale orbit]

lots of studies coming out on how it changes perception in adult brains alone.

kids brains are still wiring themselves up, if they spend a lot of time in VR it's going to wire itself for that

[gentle coral]

That is definitely something that is being researched, but there are no conclusive studies yet about the specifics of VR on kids.

Also most of the ones about adults should be taken with a grain of salt, as many have not been reproduced, and some have very small test groups. Also it is hard to do a placebo with a VR study.

But I definitely agree that it changes perception (based on my experiences and studies I have been a part of, or been around). It is more that we are unsure of exactly what it is changing, if it is permanent, and if those changes are good, bad, or both.

Headsets like the Galea will really help this research and might give us more conclusive proof of what some of those studies say.

I would definitely say that kids should not use VR extensively tell more is known about what VR does to human perception.

But I would also say the same about many people right now who use VR to much, or think that side effects are ok.

How our brains wire themselves is extremely complex and very few researchers even have a deep grasp of it in terms of how new stimulus can change it over time (this is also because everyone's brain is different enough that finding conclusive data on any one thing is really hard). Though this is also just a issue in research in general as getting a big enough sample size to account for variation in humans is really really difficult and there are some things that are almost impossible to control for.

[bleak night]

just asked steam support for a refund for the headset

[lament remnant]

Does someone have the list of mods that linus uses for beat saber?

[flat pawn]

any reason you want his in particular?

I could recommend some good ones but what sort of things did you want

modassistant lets you pick and choose from a list, you could activate anything you feel is interesting or useful

[pastel echo]

You know I'd take a guess it's because they look like fun mods

[flat pawn]

I've never seen him play

[bleak night]

refund is issued, sending the index kit back

[short dagger]

ummm so I have not opened oculus software on my pc for 1 month plus and this is my pihole over the last week, oculus is trying to do something on average every 40 seconds! goes to show how much data facebook collects.

[dense radish]

[haughty thistle]

The only reason I have the Oculus Software installed on my system is for the CV1 and maybe occasionally for the Climb...
Holy cow that's a lot...

[bleak night]

yeeted the software a bit ago

[glossy ibex]

Yknow, that there is a windows service running? Called OVRserver or whatever. And headset is making these calls too...

Well, yeah. It is a lot, but still, there are ppl who looked into it recently, and it seems like most of it, is stuff related to how you use it. Which is fine imo.

[flat pawn]

I can finally yeet the software as well

[haughty thistle]

Just yeeted all the Oculus Services from automatically starting

Just set these two puppies to run only when manually told so, and they should only run when you actually fire up the Oculus Software

[flat pawn]

Going to do that first thing after work lol

[bleak night]

pimax ordered

[rapid otter]

Nicceee

[flat pawn]

5k super?

[bleak night]

yeah

[flat pawn]

nice, same

[grim falcon]

does anyone know whyb when i cast an oculus quest two to a tv there is so much delay and if there is any way to fix it

but when i cast it to my pc there is barely any delay

[real shoal]

I think its just the amount processing power your tv has vs ur pc

[grim falcon]

that makes sense

[bleak night]

hoping its better

[gentle coral]

Dang you just reminded me that I don't think I did that since I cleam installed windows and a ton of software a few months ago, need to go check.

[sharp geode]

Yo guys I really am not able to know if my Laptop is compatible with the Oculus Quest 2 or any other VR for that matter

It's an ASUS ROG Strix G17 G713QR

It has 16 gigs ram, Ryzen 9 5900HX and RTX 3070

I would love if anyone can it specifically can connect to Oculus Quest 2?

[vapid depot]

5ghz router

[grim falcon]

Yea it should be compatible just search up "Oculus Casting" on an INCOGNITO browser and log in to the same email as the one you set up your oculus. Then on your dock there is a share button and when you press cast to "computer" you should connect within a minute

it works a lot better if you are connected to ethernet or have really good wifi

[gloomy crater]

Well, I just woke up to the sound of one of my base stations falling off the wall onto the wood floor

How should I go about checking if anything's damaged or not

[grim falcon]

whats a base station?

[chilly imp]

As long as it doesn't show the red light, you are good to go

for now

[gloomy crater]

I can't mount it back on the wall atm but when I launch steamvr, it will spin up and give an intermittent green light while it tries to figure out why it isn't on the wall, and it seems to show up as connected on the steamvr UI. I then promptly removed the other station in case it also decides to have an adhesive failure and will be mounting them both with screws later

[chilly imp]

Base Station, or light house, is used to track non-standalone PCVR devices like headset (Valve Index, HTC Vive), controllers or tracker

[grim falcon]

ohhhhhhhhhh ok i see, i just a quest 2 so

i wasnt sure what that was

thank yiou

[chilly imp]

Yeh, double sided tape is highly not recommend since the base station vibrate quite a lot

Green light then it seems to work just fine, just through a quick SteamVR setup after properly mount it again, or just use a tripod.

[gloomy crater]

It was previously mounted using a 3d printed mounting plate attached to the wall with the plastic type heavy duty velcro. I've had them mounted to a different wall with this same type of velcro fine for over six months, but I just moved house and remounted them and it seems this new velcro wasn't as sturdy as the old stuff.

I'll measure what size screws I need to pick up and then I gotta go back to sleep. I need to wake up for work again in two and a half hours. This was not what I expected to be doing with my morning.

[haughty thistle]

It could also be that the velcro just doesn't stick as well to your new walls

[flat pawn]

Yo guys I have this totally ballin computer, can it run VR?

[grim falcon]

lol

[knotty haven]

I just picked up Two 1.0 base stations to upgrade my Quest 2 Link to FBT down the line.. am I going to need to get Vive box as well in order to set these up?

(sorry if dumb question :0)

[haughty thistle]

All you need for Fullbody is a pair of lighthouses and a 3-set of Vive Trackers. The Link Box wouldn't actually work at all in your case, as it's bluetooth module is only picked up by SteamVR, when it's also running the headset intended for that Link Box (i.e. for the original Vive Link box, you'd need to run the original Vive for it to show up)

While the communication with the lighthouses is standard bluetooth, SteamVR refuses to use any off-the-shelf bluetooth modules either.
All you really loose is the ability to do a Firmware update wirelessly and Power Management. The former can still be done by plugging the lighthouse in via USB to the PC and the latter can be substituted with an Android App called "Lighthouse Power Management". If you don't have an Android phone, you can also use app-controlled power switches or just unplug the lighthouses when you're done with VR

[knotty haven]

Awesome!! I got them from FB marketplace and I didn't see any other cables except the power, but I saw the micro B port and figured I probably just ran one for each to the PC, but I wasn't 100% sure.

Two for $120, not a bad deal!😁

[haughty thistle]

Lighthouses don't need a connection to the PC to work. They run completely independent from everything else and the controllers/trackers just passively pick that signal up for tracking. The Micro-B port is used exclusively for wired firmware updates

[knotty haven]

Omg good to know! Such cool tech!

[lethal obsidian]

And firmware updates can be done without the cable as well, at least on 2.0 base stations

I can't say if 1.0s or other lighthouses do that as well

The only things I've had to actually plug in for firmware updates are my vive pucks

[bleak night]

2.0s throw a fit if you try to update via usb

[lethal obsidian]

yeah I've never even tried lol

I've only updated them wirelessly

[bleak night]

i need to buy 2 more again

i just have the one i bought from htc

[distant spade]

If im having a vr issue, should i ask here or in tech support? has to do with tracking on my cv1.

[rapid otter]

Here

[haughty thistle]

This channel is all about VR. Sure, just ask away ^^
What's your problem with the CV1?

[olive flume]

has anyone on here set up a oculus rift on linux? more specifically POP OS

[haughty thistle]

The Oculus software requires Windows to work

Running it in Wine is not recommended, as the Oculus software hooks into numerous Windows features and trying to emulate all of that, if possible, probably isn't worth the hassle anyways

[distant spade]

Sorry I was sleeping, I think whats happening is my sensors are constantly disconnecting like, im not even using it right now and while i was typing this, ive heard the disconnecting windows noise twice. What I wanna try doing first is resetting up sensor tracking but when i try it'll keep disconnecting and giving me "oculus hardware error", if it doesn't disconnect by this point, it just wont see my controller at all, it will say it sees it once in a while but then it fails. I have gotten past this part and even got into beat saber once before i heard a disconnection noise and then my controllers are stuck and place and i cant move. Last night i tried different usb ports but to no avail.

[haughty thistle]

Are you using any sort of USB extensions?

[distant spade]

I was using a usb extension for my rear sensor but i connected it Just straight to it since it reaches, just not cleanly.

[haughty thistle]

That's curious...

And you made sure to plug 2 of them into USB 3.0 connectors, right?

[distant spade]

all 3 are on usb3, is that bad?

i think i was told to do 2 3.0 and 1 2.0 or something like that before but wasn't sure, is that a requirement

[haughty thistle]

Well... Technically not (it's how I run my CV1 as well 3 on 3.0 one on 2.0), but Oculus recommends only having up to 2 sensors connected up to USB 3.0 and all additional sensors into USB 2.0

[distant spade]

Ok thought so, I can try connecting one to 2.0 and see what happens

[haughty thistle]

What you can also do is use like a USB 2.0 extension cable, as that would automatically drop the link speed down to 2.0

[distant spade]

The Extension cable i have is 2.0 i think

[haughty thistle]

So does it show up as 2.0 or 3.0 in the Oculus software?

[distant spade]

Could my rear sensor be faulty?

it says my actual headset is on 2.0 and the sensors are all on 3.0

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, that's defo not normal. If your cable is supposed to be 2.0 and it shows up as 3.0, then try and plug that cable into a 2.0 port and see if that helps

[distant spade]

Let me check though, pretty sure theyre all on 3.0 unless i changed it 2.0 last night

with the extension it says 2.0, but right now i have it just straight plugged into my front usb3

[haughty thistle]

Seeing how you said you have the issue without the extension too, may lead me to belive that it could be the camera as well...

Does the camera have a constant white light on the top when in use?

[distant spade]

let me check

right now it has a white light plugged into front usb3, ill try 2.0 extension rn

Still shows connected in oculus and it still has white light, it did go off though when this notification appeared.

[haughty thistle]

Is it fine in general with just 2 sensors connected, or is it always that one sensor causing trouble?

[distant spade]

It worked fine with 2 and when i reinstalled windows to fix a different issue, the 3rd worked perfectly fine but now its doing this.

[haughty thistle]

Other then re-install Windows, you didn't do anything else, right?

[distant spade]

Well i had to reinstall oculus and setup again but besides that, nothing that i could think of.

[haughty thistle]

I have a feeling it's a bandwidth issue, that prevents the sensor from working properly. Those things are quite bandwidth hungry...

[distant spade]

since i sent this ive heard something disconnect twice, pretty sure its the sensor since white light went off.

Im gonna try something real quick

[haughty thistle]

The reason I'm saying this is because I've noticed similar behaviour with Oculus hardware when not enough bandwidth is available...

[distant spade]

Is there anyway to know for sure?

[flat pawn]

Isn't there a setting you can change in device manager to help prevent USB power related issues