virtual-reality

[hushed pond]

THIS

[bleak night]

to be fair.. with my issues im having. the quest sounds pretty good uf i ever got it going oroperly

[hushed pond]

100% of my personal avatar are pc only and the fact they come up to me and saying im a shitty robot (the replacement quest avatar) piss me off so much

[bleak night]

too tired for this agh

[sullen linden]

I had to make one of my avatars quest friendly because some of my friends are on quest and I was annoyed because they couldn't see my avatar

[hushed pond]

most of my avatars are tf2 based and i hav eno idea how to port something as quest compatible

[haughty thistle]

I have added a Quest compatible variant to my main Avatar (both public and private version). Dunno if anyone has ever seen them on a Quest, but it's not like I spend a huge amount of time optimizing for the platform...

[sullen linden]

Is my avatar quest optimized? No.
Do I care as long as they see me? No.

[hushed pond]

i hang in private rooms with pc user 90% of the time so its not a issue for me

[haughty thistle]

I mean... this is the derp emote on the Quest variant...

I really don't care about Quest, but it grinds my gears even more knowing they'd see some complete other avatar otherwise...

[hushed pond]

id rather them seeing a error robot than some normal replacement default avatar

you know to showcase they cant see a pc user

[sullen linden]

Yeah I was annoyed when I discovered that quest doesn't support cutout textures...

[haughty thistle]

Cutout Textures use transparency fill which is a very expensive thing to render. So I can understand that it isn't supported on the slow mobile processor of the Quest

Don't get me wrong, the XR2 is quite a powerful chip for standalone VR, but it ain't comparable with the power of a GTX 1060...

[sullen linden]

I tried using a particle shader which looks ok in unity BUT quest players can't see any of it for some reason

[hushed pond]

even less my 3080

[haughty thistle]

On Quest all custom sharders are turned off for avatars

[sullen linden]

I know it was the particle shader that is supported

[haughty thistle]

You can only have custom shaders on the world, and even then, heavy restricitions apply as to what features they can use

VRChat -> Mobile Shaders. That's all you can use on an Avatar :/

[sullen linden]

And that is where I found the particle shader

[haughty thistle]

That's weird...

I also find it stupid that the Toon mobile shader doesn't support emissions...

[sullen linden]

Yeah the shaders are extremely restricted

[hushed pond]

i never figured out how to bring back my character into T pose after giving it animation in unity

it default to idle pose for some reason

[haughty thistle]

Sometimes Unity has a brainfart and actually applies the animation pose permanently to the avatar in the editor. That's why I always do animations on a copy of the avatar

[sullen linden]

Always make a duplicate when animating

[hushed pond]

god dammit that something i shoulve of been told before i start this shit

any other way to make it back into t pose?

other than completly redoing my scene

[haughty thistle]

I find it interesting how probably the majority of VRC users only use Public avatars, yet here we are 3 people who all happen to make their own avatars xD

[hushed pond]

my only guess is a animation that just does a t pose to bug it back into what it was

but i dont know how or where to get that

i cant do animation

my shit be like stuck like that

doesnt stop me from uploading but it being like that prevent me from making change to the view position

[sullen linden]

You could take the keyframes from the vrchat tpose animation and put them on it

Or hold on one of my friends made a video about how to get it back into the normal pose but it's old

Here it is:
https://youtu.be/Rs1gL7WG6eI

[hushed pond]

thanks il lbe saving this for later hopefully that work

[sullen linden]

Although if you don't have a bunch of objects and dynamic bones on your avatar you could just drag the fbx on the scene as a new avatar

[hushed pond]

i have in fact no dynamic bone and objects

problem is the fbx is HUGE like 8000% bigger than what a normal avatar would be

i have to set the scale to something like 0.02

and id need to set all my audio source up again alongside animation

rip guess there no easy way around

thanks god im not working with avatar 3.0 black magic bullshit

[pastel echo]

There might be a correlation between people who go as far as to discuss VRchat avatars in dedicated VR channels and people who make their own

[celest creek]

anyone here up for beatsaber multiplayer?

*with beattogether

[molten lark]

Hooked up my index for the first time and tried VR. Super fun but the motion sickness is real

[hushed pond]

it will dissapear with times

in my case im completly immune to it

[pastel echo]

Just remember when you get sick take a break @molten lark

It's like a muscle you train it not overwork it

[molten lark]

Yeah I think I learned that the hard way last night, going to take more frequent breaks.,

[weak falcon]

motion sickness from vr u either adapt or dont need adapting

do keep taking breaks tho

[willow rain]

anyone else experience or know how to fix an issue with the quest 2s 120hz mode where the feature will be turned on but no games will actually recognize the quest being set 120hz like in virtual desktop for example which i know is on the most recent update which has 120hz support

[thick nest]

guys i need help with oculus desktop

its been broken for a few weeks now maybe a month

i uninstalled it because it was kinda broken (Updates wont start updating just stuck in library) so after i uninstalled i tried again it failed after 5 gb one more try after deleting any extra oculus files i downloaded the setup files same thing it fails at 5gb somehow updating GPU drivers seemed to do the trick but now it gets stuck at another stage of the installation and gives the same message

i contacted oculus support and they didnt help since when i tried to run Logs it didnt find the files in program files x86 but im guessing thats since the app was fully uninstalled and the installation didnt install log gatherer yet

[winter root]

i mean i am using a quest one with 1.0 baystations and index nuccles

[gusty frost]

Can I run vr in a 780ti?

[rapid otter]

@thick nest files aren't in x86 anyway

For me it's in /program/

[sullen linden]

Wouldn't recommend it as you probably would need to turn down the render resolution quite a bit to achieve good playable framerates

[gusty frost]

I'm only going to play beat saber

[weak falcon]

if ur gonna play that

turn block debri off

[gusty frost]

Ok

[thick nest]

That's what they sent me i think it was c program files
X86 oculus support and logs

But it fails at finding the oculus folder

Which doesn't exist in x86 I looked the stuff up in normal program files and i didn't find the support folder

[weak falcon]

yup

common issues

[pastel echo]

For me I stopped getting that after a power cycle and turning the lights on

@woeful cypress it tells you that even with the lights on?

[dire jasper]

i wish for a PC building simulator, but in vr!!
time to wait 5 years

[rustic garnet]

Probably wouldn't be very fun lol

Unless there's like literally just a pc

So you can dedicate all your collision detection to that

[pastel echo]

Damn fair

[haughty thistle]

I've had the OG Quest track itself on a rather dim LED strip. If it can't track on those overhead lights, it's probably faulty. But I can understand that you want to switch to a better HMD with better tracking

[thick nest]

yeah same

can you try to cover the trackers with your hands all at once then after 5 seconds take your hands off

@woeful cypress

usually that triggers lost tracking and it refreshes after 5 seconds

[pastel echo]

Or clean the lenses

People don't always try that

[gentle coral]

Make sure that the tracking frequency of your headset is specific to your area (60hz, vs 50hz). Lights like that can cause issues if they are close to the frequency that the headset uses to track the controllers and surroundings. This is an issue in a few different headsets if they are purchased from a region that has a different electrical standard then where you live.

No sure if they have automated this in new headsets yet.

[haughty thistle]

Oculus Insight Tracking system can automatically detect the power grid frequency and adjust for it. There might be rare cases where that detection fails, in which case you can still select it manually. But you shouldn't need to...

[gentle coral]

Thought so

[haughty thistle]

I think WMR doesn't even have a selection for the grid frequency. If I had to guess, M$ is just very confident in their grid frequency detection. I dunno about Cosmos Inside-Out Tracking, whether that has any toggle or something...

Case in point: You wouldn't generally need to adjust that setting unless in very rare situations

[gentle coral]

Yep, I just remembered it being in most headsets dev options and advanced settings (though then again most of my headsets are dev models that have extra hardware access).

And if you have unique non standard lighting that it can cause issues at times (Camera based VR can be hard in a club or event space with a lot of flashing irregular lights).

[gentle coral]

Though I do have to say using a VR headsets sitting at a tech focused club in San Francisco is really a Sci-fi like experience.

[thick nest]

anything??

[rapid otter]

@woeful cypress you have issues with your gardian?

[onyx plover]

Frankenquest 2 Chinese knockoff edition lol. Airlink works great!

[gusty frost]

👀

||lttstore.com||

[rapid otter]

You mean airlink pcvr and everything ?

Did you bought it like that ?

Or did you add accessories

@ me it genuinely interest me

[thick nest]

for a second i thought that was white masking tape

[gusty frost]

Oh god no

[rustic garnet]

Does half life alyx overwrite the steamvr render resolution somehow?

Because whatever i do it still looks as sharp

[haughty thistle]

Yup

HLA has a dynamic resolution scaling, which is based on the "100%" render resolution. HLA then scales the resolution based on your hardware to always hit the refreshrate of your headset. This means, if you want to increase the image sharpness in HLA, you have to turn down the graphics settings ingame or adjust your headset refreshrate...

[rapid otter]

Same to reduce the résolution

[flat pawn]

hey @haughty thistle how thick are your glasses?

you said before that you had almost no space for glasses in your 5k super right?

can you elaborate a little bit? I ended up ordering one

I'm prepared to get prescription lens inserts if I have to but still

[haughty thistle]

Afaik there aren't any proper prescription lens inserts for PiMax headsets. Yeah, there's this one company, but the way they handle the prescription values seems very sketchy to...

In regards to my glasses, I think it's best to just send you a picture. I have frameless glasses, so they are basically a set of lenses attached to 3 strips of metal. They really aren't thick and shouldn't be a problem, yet they are.
I actually have an order in for the 8kx which is supposed to come with both the 11mm foam pad (the one that is included with the 5k Super) and the 15mm foam pad (which is not included with the 5k Super). So I'll be reporting on whether or not the thicker foam pad helps, but from my understanding it should...

[rustic garnet]

Yeah ik but i turned the render res in steamvr down but it didn't change anything even when i locked the fidelity level

So does it just always render relative to native headset res?

[haughty thistle]

Yup. That is how the dynamic resolution scaling in HLA works. Fun Fact: The SteamVR Home also has this, just that it doesn't always activate for some reason...

I had times on my G2, where I came back from a game, only for the Home environment to be all blurry and pixalated as if I had turned down the renderscale to like 50% or something

[pale orbit]

https://twitter.com/Tyrielwood/status/1392124184164249603

Tyriel 🥽 (@Tyrielwood)

The Vive Focus 3

Twitter · May 11, 2021, 2:27 PM

https://twitter.com/Tyrielwood/status/1392128123815305224

Tyriel 🥽 (@Tyrielwood)

And this is the Vive Pro 2

Twitter · May 11, 2021, 2:43 PM

[flat pawn]

I just want to know the specs

This presentation is very business focused so far

With one small nod to gamers like "ay thanks for getting us here"

[pale orbit]

https://www.roadtovr.com/htc-vive-focus-3-specs-price-release-date-announcement/

one of the highlights of Vive Focus 3 is the class-leading resolution of 6MP (2,448 x 2,448) per-eye. That’s compared to 2.3MP on the Vive Focus Plus and 3.5MP on the Quest 2. It even beats out the Reverb G2 at 4.7MP. Those pixels will be spread across the Vive Focus 3’s two LCD displays and a 120° diagonal field-of-view, HTC says. The dual displays also make way for a physical IPD adjustment which will range from 57–72mm.

https://roadtovrlive-5ea0.kxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/vive-focus-3-5.jpg

https://www.roadtovr.com/htc-vive-pro-2-specs-price-release-date-announcement/

[flat pawn]

Take a drink every time they say "business" or "enterprise"

[flat pawn]

Seems like Vive is doubling down on business focused stuff

Some upgraded specs on their existing lineup, still business priced and business focused

[chilly imp]

seems like I will keep my Vive Pro for another few years

[pale orbit]

now we just need valve to announce it's index 2 or whatever

[onyx plover]

@rapid otter yes Wireless PCVR. I got 120hz@4k to work last night. I had to upgrade my router to wifi6, change the position the same room as my play area, has a smart home so had to reconnect everything BUT MINOR DETAILS! It works great now lol

It doesn’t look too bad right? The zipties make it look a bit janky huh

[rapid otter]

No it looks good

Me to is use wireless pcvr

Not 120hz tho

It's a real official quest 2 ?

@onyx plover

[wheat kiln]

hey gang, sorry to barge on in here, but I was looking at the official Oculus VR cable and wanted to get some opinions and see what everyone thinks of it--I'm referring to the $80 one

I have my own opinions, but I guess I really wanted to see if someone has dissected it. I'd like to see this fiber optic cable along with its adapters on each end

[pastel echo]

It's pointless, the existing quests don't take advantage of the speed potential in anyway nor do they even fully saturate usb3 and the fragility to match makes it both ineffective and a cost risk.

[jade nexus]

I mean the VR is cool and all but that clock on the wall would drive me insane

[haughty thistle]

The Vive Pro 2 honestly sounds like an amazing headset for probably the best no-compromise Wireless VR setup. 120Hz, 2.5k resolution per eye and Wireless Adapter compatible. Again, may I reiterate that the Vive Wireless Adapter is basically as if the HMD is plugged directly into the PC.
And no, the Quest 2 in PCVR mode does not run at it's native resolution. It's decoder just isn't fast enough. The PCVR resolution of the Quest 2 is more comparable to the Rift S/Index

The price is honestly the pain point of the Vive setup. I mean, 739€ for the HMD alone, factor in lighthouses, the Wireless Adapter and Index controllers and you're well beyond 1k€.
You either got the "decent enough for consumer" Quest setup at the bottom of the barrel, and then you got the baller, rolling in cash Vive option. Nothing in-between for Wireless VR...

[flat pawn]

so they remain in the wireless pcvr niche

just with less compromises now

I suppose that's fine

it's just an expensive niche

like the 8k x

the fov niche

index being the well rounded option while also being a little cheaper

[rustic garnet]

Oh well then, because home doesn't seem to be affected by render scale either

[rustic garnet]

bruh that's literally just a 1st gen touch but longer and with an inverted ring

[flat pawn]

so... a quest/rift s controller?

lol

it really is

but those controllers are also great so

can't complain

the wands on the other hand

[rustic garnet]

Not quite the quests have a slimmer bit at the top, the thumb rest i guess you could say

The og touch have circles

[flat pawn]

the quest 2 "thumb rest" is large again

[rustic garnet]

huh

i think they should have put a knuckle strap on them

Oculus too for that matter

[flat pawn]

You can get good 3rd party ones for real cheap

They probably only include the wrist rubber band thing for cost reasons

[dire jasper]

the future is bulky for now

[flat pawn]

ur bulky

[dire jasper]

of course, i have the power of a samsung galaxy just oversized

[wheat kiln]

Oh man, I agree completely...here's my paragraph review of the product.

Let's start with weight, which seems to be a selling point of the cable. The listed weight is 9.1 oz, and my 10 ft copper cable alternative (that was $18.99) is 3.5 oz. The weight difference between cables is negated by the weight of the adapters on each end to transmit/receive the fiber signal.

As for performance/throughput, I haven't done any tests yet, but from personal experience running a cable that short you will see negligible performance gains of using copper vs fiber optic. But is it worth the fragility of a cable that will snap if you bend it too much?

The other thing to consider is bottlenecks. Even if you get 100% throughput of that cable, most people end up getting a copper adapter or their motherboard doesn't support enough power through USB-C connections. You will also most likely be in this situation of having some sort of adapter and will have a cable no better than a regular copper one.

Finally, I'd like to address the fact that nobody has actually taken one of these apart and posted a video going over the tech involved in the cable. I'd like Linus Tech Tips or someone to dissect one and give an in depth review of the cable.

$80 for this cable is either an unjustified cost, or just an outright scam.

[jade nexus]

There must be some reason they thought they'd need more usb bandwidth.

I don't know how long it takes to conceive and manufacture a product like the link cable, but perhaps they placed the order before they really knew what would be needed. (e.g., they might have expected a future with a higher-bandwidth lower-CPU codec?)

[wheat kiln]

Maybe originally they thought they would run data through fiber while powering the device through copper, which is what it supposedly does

thinking a regular copper wouldn't be able to do both at the same time well enough. Which is true, my copper cable won't charge the battery up from my USB port while I'm playing, but it provides enough juice to not really drain the battery, and with plenty of throughput to deliver video

but in the end I think they realized they wasted all that money on the cable, so instead of dumping the idea, they paid youtubers to promote the hardware without scrutinizing it or dissecting it.

maybe they'll break even

[haughty thistle]

The main reason it's so expensive is due to the converters. And there is an argument to be made that optical cables are better for VR. For instance, long optical cables are much more flexible then copper ones and don't require any active extenders. According to the USB standard, you can't go any longer then 5m of copper cable without boosting the signal. This is a strong argument for the Oculus official cable. These extenders like to break over time (I've had numerous, not just USB 3 ones, fail on me in the past).
Granted, a bi-directional optical to electrical converter has that problem too, but since it's essentially a bunch of LEDs and light sensors, but it's much less prone to failure then a bunch of transistors, which an extender basically is.

I feel like Oculus has missed an opportunity here to offer their cable in a 6m variant, as that would've totally made sense. It would've been essentially the same price or maybe 5 bucks more and you don't need a big extender like you would with a copper cable.
Most optical cables start at around 70-80 bucks because these converters are expensive. But longer cables often aren't all that much more expensive

I've used both copper cables and optical cables in the past, and the flexibility of the cable does make quite a difference in how much you'll feel it, if it's laying on the floor...

[jade nexus]

Ah, that's a good point. Maybe they should have focused more on cable flexibility and less on bandwidth.

[haughty thistle]

The Oculus cable should be more flexible then any decent copper cable could hope to be. I don't know whether it is, because I don't have one...

But I can only guess that it is. Like I said, from my experience at these cable lengths, fibre cables are still super flexible while copper cables can become quite stiff. And Optical cables aren't as fragile as some might think.
I mean, heck, the Index cable is optical and the cable is quite literally kinked if you move the head strap up. Granted, if you do this too often it will break, but the fact that it took almost half a year for the first people to report broken cables is damn' impressive. If you are any more careful then this your cable should basically last an eternity...

[burnt vault]

Anyone here have any advice for Beat Sabers flying all over the place during play, on an OG Oculus Rift?

It was working really well for weeks, tried today, and my sabers are going bonkers. I tried resetting the camera positions, made sure everything was up to date, reset my PC, etc, nothing is working.

Sensors and headset are reading as USB3, play area is "medium", no mirrors or flashing LEDs in the room to mess with the sensors either.

[haughty thistle]

Have you tried different batteries in the controllers. Oculus should know whether or not the battery still has a charge, but I guess it's one thing to try...

[burnt vault]

I haven't, but they're rather new Duracell from Costco, and claim 100% in app.

I swapped out dead batteries just a few weeks ago - they dropped from 60% to 0%, think I left them on, but no idea. It worked well for weeks after switching, and I've made sure everything is shut down after.

Slightly odd they still show 100% though, as I'd expect at least 10% lower.

I think it's related to swinging too hard, but I'm not 100% sure. I was trying for the SS rank on expert Steam achievement (got it today!), which had me doing more aggressive swings. I re-did my cameras again, played less aggressively, and the issue only happened once or twice.

[jade nexus]

🤔 https://uploadvr.com/vive-pro-2-wireless-limitations/

Understandable but reduces the appeal a lot

[young marten]

dang that's a rip

[cyan venture]

Is oculus on macOS a thing?

[gentle coral]

When I saw that the Vive Pro 2 was trying to do that Resolution at that framerate with a DP 1.2 connection, I knew that they were going to have some weird compromises as they don't have HBR 3 support, or some color support. They are right at the bleeding edge of that connections specs, and surpass it if you want full resolution and 120hz at the same time unless you use DSC, or chroma subsampling.

I expect that it will be further compressed for the wireless connection if you want to use the full Resolution, or Framerate, so they are probably hard locking it.

Wireless is still very very hard for any headset considering the bandwidth and compression issues that are almost unavoidable at the moment. Unless you are fine with a wireless solution costing more then the headset kit itself.

[pale orbit]

I wonder if anyone will get sony's new headset working on pc when it comes out

[modest talon]

Is HTC VIVE Cosmos Elite HMD Good?

[haughty thistle]

I personally would say that the original Vive Pro is a better buy then the Cosmos Elite. The Vive Pro has a better headstrap and OLED screens. It only falls short in regards to the headphones, but that's something you can fix, unlike the flip-up visor of the Cosmos which will lead to the lenses not being properly aligned with your eyes

[haughty thistle]

According to that article, then the Wireless Adapter can't even reach the resolution of the OG Vive Pro. But I know from experience that the full Sharpness is retained on the Vive Pro. So I can only guess that they're using some tricks to actually hit that resolution. Maybe Fixed Foveated Rendering?

[quiet spoke]

is there anyway i can get steam to do 90hz it seems to only wanna do 72

[haughty thistle]

The only headset where you can adjust the refreshrate in Steam is the Index. With all other headsets, Steam just takes whatever refreshrate it was given by the "driver". In the case of Oculus, that "driver" is the Oculus Software, Virtual Desktop or ALVR (depending on how you connected the headset with Steam). I know that inside the Oculus Software you can adjust the refreshrate if you have a Quest 2 and it is connected via a Link cable. In the case of WMR, that "driver" is Windows itself, so the refreshrate control can be found in the Windows 10 Settings Panel under "Windows Mixed Reality".

Often when changing the refreshrate, you have to restart SteamVR btw, and in some cases even the HMD itself (for example that's how it is with Pimax)

[rapid otter]

Aliexpress is full of dumb things...

Introduce the spike quest 2 cover

[pastel echo]

Not dumb but rather, super epic and hard core

[gusty frost]

It's not dumb

[rapid otter]

Safe to say the least

[haughty thistle]

For some people, especially careless ones, these spikes can help. But I personally think they'll be more in the way rather then actually protect anything

[flat pawn]

reminds me of the pimax hmd covers

those things look ridiculous

[wheat kiln]

that's why I thought maybe LTT would want to do an unboxing and look at the tech involved in the cable

[rapid otter]

Yes good idea

[fluid carbon]

is the oculus link cable (120 cad wtf) even worth 120 cad when it has wireless?

[knotty ocean]

IMO not a chance

[fluid carbon]

does it work with like jus ta normal usb cable

[knotty ocean]

but I've been using VD since launch, never had a link cable

[fluid carbon]

like a usb c to c cable

i have usb c on my gpu so

[knotty ocean]

airlink and wireless win IMO

as long as you have a clear AC wireless signal

[fluid carbon]

if i have 2 access points close to where i'll be playing will there be any interference issues?

[knotty ocean]

I couldn't say, but if you look up configuration settings online should help

[fluid carbon]

thats pretty much where they are relative to my play area

[haughty thistle]

It depends on how many devices are connected to each wifi and whether or not they are interfering with each other in terms of Wifi channels

[fluid carbon]

ill look into that, hopefully it will be ok

[haughty thistle]

In general though, it's better to have as little "Wifi pollution" as possible when running the Quest wirelessly

[fluid carbon]

buying soon hopefully, once i save up enough

i wanna play minecraft in vr

[haughty thistle]

That's why having a Mesh network close by is never a good sign for Air Link/VD

[fluid carbon]

interference and latency i'd assuem

[haughty thistle]

Yup

[fluid carbon]

also do i need a wifi card or something for my pc

or can i use the existing wifi

im wired in rn

[haughty thistle]

You PC should be connected via LAN to the Wifi Router

[fluid carbon]

then the quest will connect to the wifi router

[haughty thistle]

The Quest then connects to that same router via 5GHz and communicates to the PC over said router

[fluid carbon]

aight cool

[sullen linden]

Hmm my steamvr has decided that it's now a good idea to launch itself every now and then for absolutely no reason

[haughty thistle]

Sounds like some game is trying to launch a VR mode. My way of preventing the Index from showing up without fully unplugging is to just disconnect the power brick

[sullen linden]

The odd thing is like I could just be just watching youtube or something and it just decides to do it. Thankfully it doesn't happen often but I do find it a bit strange because I also have disabled steamvr from launching when you turn on a controller or put on the headset etc.

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, that's defo super weird...

[knotty ocean]

Mine was doing the same thing, to the point I uninstalled it until I play on the weekend

[rapid otter]

This is the price of a wifi 6 router

A better alternative for me

[fluid carbon]

i already got wifi so

if i need lower latencyh

ill consider it

not buying vr yet tho

sometime soon hopefuly

[rapid otter]

Ok then

[sullen linden]

hammerhead shark

[vapid berry]

what do you want ? @sullen linden

[visual mesa]

Would my CPU hinder tracking accuracy cuz I've recently gotten some slight tracking drift that hasn't been a problem in my 1 and a half years of having my index.

[sudden anchor]

Hello everyone, I am buying the vive pro 2 but my computer only has HDMI as an input, can I use a converter from HDMI to display port?

[fluid carbon]

I've only seen a DP to HDMI cable, but you can get a convertor im pretty sure

display port to hdmi cables are one way

you might need to get a hub or something

[sudden anchor]

Ah okay thank you for the info :)

[haughty thistle]

There are HDMI to DP adapters, but they are hella expensive and they can't really fulfil the DP spec, due to HDMI being an inferior protocol.
TL;DR: You can't adapt HDMI to DP, only the other way around.

[gentle coral]

The Vive pro 2 being only DP 1.2 can be fully converted by a good HDMI 2.0 to Displayport converter if they actually exist yet (the conversion is somewhat intensive when you are near the max bandwidth).

I don't think HDMI is inferior protocol, they keep changing what they support (each one has firsts of some nature). The part where HDMI vs Displayport matters to the manufacturer is much more about the licensing and standardization across a large number of devices, and what devices matter to them.

Though as devices get more and more advanced, the number of overall connections is finally going down, and standards are starting to actually be well adopted. I do though hope that displayport gets more adopted outside computer tech, as right now the actual competition between HDMI and DP is quite the lackluster fight (like two kids poking eachother, not a full brawl like AMD and Nvidia are in).

[gentle coral]

Also If you're computer is VR ready, that is almost a guarantee that it had Displayport somewhere (mini Displayport, Displayport over Type C, or Thunderbolt 3).

If you are on a desktop, then your Graphics card should have multiple Displayport ports.

[haughty thistle]

The thing about DP is that it splits up the signal into what are essentially 4 dedicated channels, which can be combined/split up as required. The benefit is that you can daisy-chain DP Monitors, as long as they together don't exceed the "channel". For example, with DP 1.2, you can daisy-chain 2 1440p monitors at 60Hz as each monitor uses 2 of said channels.
HDMI doesn't have that afaik. So you'd need an active converter that takes in the single HDMI signal and splits it up into the DP channels as required. So it might be fine for connecting something like a monitor or projector, but it ain't cut it for VR (due to the extra latency involved).
Another problem is the talk-back channel of DP. Yeah, HDMI has something similar, but there's a reason why true G-Sync only works over DP...

[solid compass]

can a 3700x and a 3060ti run vr?

[sullen linden]

Should run no problem

[weak falcon]

easy

[pallid hatch]

psvr worth it?

i have a ps4 and i always wanted to experience vr but i dont have 300 dollars to spend on a quest

is it worth it

[flat pawn]

isn't psvr also hundreds?

[arctic kindle]

I've been trying to setup an oculus account for over an hour now, it's either me being stupid or Facebook is just a fucking mess. Sorry for the vulgar language but holy fuck

[haughty thistle]

I was totally not trying to figure out how much of a Vive Pro I can put on a Pimax without any permanent modifications...

[pastel echo]

What?

[charred herald]

how is the pimax? i've never gotten to use one

[rapid otter]

What's the problem exactly?

[haughty thistle]

To sum it up in one word: Interesting.
Unlike every other VR headset out there, with a Pimax you really need to tinker with things, do modifications to the HMD itself, play around with settings in PiTool, etc.
The FOV is great, but unless you're really want that largest FOV around, you best just avoid them entirely...

For example, even with the 15mm foam pad (which is only included with the 8kx btw), I felt like I still wasn't getting sufficient distance between the lenses and my glasses, so I tried putting in a VRcover intended for a Vive Pro. While that did help with lens distance, it also created a big pressure point on my forehead.
I also took out the speakers in the headstrap, as I'm not using them anyways and their bulk prevented my from wearing my headphones on top of the strap normally.
Oh, and I also tried the back foam piece I took off from my Vive Pro (due to the Wireless Adapter), and see if that would make it a bit more comfortable at the back, and it kinda does...

Lastly, if you're used to 5m and longer cables in VR, expect to pay more then the listed Price for a Pimax, because the included cable is only 4.5m long. Way too short imo

[rapid otter]

Just tried half life alyx

What a blast

I've been trying to make it works for a month and now it's working perfectly

[wraith rose]

I am looking into buying an oculus quest 2, and I want to play PCVR games. I have an ASUS G14 laptop with a Ryzen 9 4900HS and an RTX 2060 Max-Q. Would I be able to plug in the included cable to the USB-C ports and play SteamVR or do I need a desktop?

[rapid otter]

You have an integrated usb C port on your laptop ?

Or a 3.1 usb port ?

[wraith rose]

Yes it has 2 USB-C ports included

[rapid otter]

Then it should be good

Do you have a friend who as a quest 1or 2 ?

@wraith rose

[wraith rose]

Yes.

They have a desktop

[rapid otter]

Then I recommend taking it and trying on your pc with their cables

When you install the oculus software on your pc you can test the connection it will show the mb/s and how good the connection is

Maybe you will need an oculus account

But you can create one before hand (you will need one afterward anyway

I hope I've been useful

[wraith rose]

Yes, you have helped a lot. Thanks!

[rapid otter]

Hit me up if you need help

[safe burrow]

i had no issues

[rapid otter]

Describe your problem

[charred herald]

i wouldnt get one as I have an index, was just curious what your experience with it was. I also have a vive that took a lot of modifications to get comfortable so im familiar with that part of VR headsets. in my opinion the index was worth it because I didnt really have to tinker with anything. just plug it in, put it on, and I was good to go

[haughty thistle]

USB 2.0 Speed. You can put multiple of these dongles in a USB 3.0 Hub with no problems, as long as you leave enough space between the dongles and any large metal surface

[lethal obsidian]

can confirm

I have my three puck 2.0 dongles on a USB C hub

I have issues with the hub but it's not related to bandwidth

The cable got damaged while it was in my bag so sometimes it briefly disconnects

Never caused any issues with tracking though

[soft hound]

Yeah, I have all 3 in a 2.0 hub up on a shelf. 0 issues for the past year of having them there

[soft hound]

It varies. Sometimes it's 8+ weeks, other times it's one week

[haughty thistle]

Like I said, try to keep them away from large metal surfaces. One such thing is your PC case

[lethal obsidian]

If you've already paid for it (purchased) then generally it will be shipped out within 1 - 2 days to a week

If you reserved an order, there's actually a time estimate in your Steam purchase history and it's roughly accurate give or take a couple of weeks

It used to be very inaccurate due to the extremely high demand for the index but Valve seems to have mostly caught up

I ordered my index in September and the HMD + Controllers took 3 weeks after placing the order to let me pay. I paid, it shipped the next day, and arrived in Canada at my door 2 days later

Hope this helps!

[tall shoal]

has anyone else having troubles with steamvr? Everytime I close a game something called steamtours opens and its causing my gpu to overload and starts using all of the vram it has when I close half life alyx, and it just stays pinned even after a force close

[rapid otter]

What is it an app that open ?

[tall shoal]

yep

[rapid otter]

Ok I'll look for it

[tall shoal]

it apparently has something to do with steamvr home if that helps

[rapid otter]

Do it appears everytime ?

Or only with HLVR ?

[tall shoal]

it seems to only happen with hlvr

[rapid otter]

Humm

Any screenshot ?

Maybe try to kill it in task manager ?

The good old way

[tall shoal]

i have one of the vram usage

but i've only managed to catch it twice, but forgot to screen shot

3060

[rapid otter]

Dang

I know HLVR use all my vram

6 go

It's very demanding on vram but 12 gb is a lot

Keep in mind HLVR is optimized like shit

[tall shoal]

this was after i closed hlvr because of lag and by time I got to task manager nothing was there out of the normal

then I switched tabs and saw this

[rapid otter]

Damn

I used to have perf issues with my rtx 2060 6gb but you should

[tall shoal]

i reinstalled steamvr multiple times

[rapid otter]

Just turned my resolution half

That's weird

[tall shoal]

thing is it worked great 2 days ago

[rapid otter]

I didn't find anything about steam tours online

[tall shoal]

neither did i

I sent steam a ticket concerning it

[rapid otter]

Nice

[tall shoal]

thanks again

i disabled steamvr home for now hopefully that helps, but right now i am reinstalling hlvr to fix a graphical issue

[sullen linden]

What

[haughty thistle]

HLA (sometimes referred to as HLVR) is really optimized, yeah. But what I find personally more intriguing is the dynamic resolution scaling which keeps the framerate under your HMDs refreshrate. Quite remarkable as to how well that works tbh

[sullen linden]

That's why I was confused about his comment

[gentle coral]

Agreed. Though it might be the issue that it means that it will alway try to max its settings just to the threshold, which might not be good on some computers where you are doing multiple things at once.

[rapid otter]

Optimized ?

I have an RTX 2060 6g a r5 2600 and the game run like shit

[gentle coral]

That is weird, I am on a laptop with a 8750, and a 1070 maxQ and I can livestream gameplay as well.

Sounds like either a game bug or something is really wrong with steamvr. What task manager show while playing HLA, vs another demanding VR game

[manic jewel]

did anyone have an issue of feeling like your still in vc even after you stop playing

*vr

i just started playing vr like 2 days ago

[gentle coral]

That is somewhat common especially depending on the game.

If it is a vertigo or sea sickness, or any dizzying then you probably played for to long

[manic jewel]

not that

just keep seeing things and feel like my hands aren't mine

lmao

i hear that's somewhat common

[haughty thistle]

It's rather uncommon, but not the first time I hear about this

[manic jewel]

not that reddit is a good source but i did see someone saying that happened to them on there

[rapid otter]

What's your headset resolution ?

[gentle coral]

You want to work your tolerance up (even if you don't feel sick in game, if there is a large ammount of dissociation then it will affect your brain over time, and you'll get that dissociation even outside of VR when just thinking about VR, or when doing really short VR sessions that shouldn't cause any issues).

Once you have been doing VR for a few weeks, at short ammount
S, you will be able to more easily get out of the dissociation, and it shouldn't cause any lasting effects.

Some games like Eagle Flight, Superhot, and richies plank experience are known to commonly cause after-effects that can last up to an hour if you play them to long.

[rapid otter]

How do you enable?

[haughty thistle]

The resolution scaling is turned on by default and it's quite difficult to turn off actually

[gentle coral]

Last time I tried it was with my Acer WMR headset which has a 1440 x 1440 screen per eye, just a bit les then the index.

I also have a Reverb G2, but have yet to play HLA using it

[rapid otter]

How

I run 1500 by 1500 and i barely get 72hz

[haughty thistle]

@gentle coral The thing about WMR is though, it optimizes Windows for VR while active. I've noticed on occasion better performance on my G2 then on my Index at 200% renderscale, even though the Index still renders less then the G2 at that point...

[rapid otter]

And i have 40 in fight and 60 in open area

[haughty thistle]

What headset are you using? Resolution ain't everything when it comes to VR performance.

[rapid otter]

Quest 2

Wireless

Over wifi 6

[haughty thistle]

And you only have the issue in HLA, or also other games like let's say Boneworks

[sullen linden]

I'd say boneworks runs worse than HLA

[haughty thistle]

I'm just asking, as both Boneworks and HLA are quite CPU heavy. So is Quest Link, Air link and VD. So if other CPU heavy titles have similar issues it points to the CPU not having enough grunt to run both HLA and VD/AirLink/Quest Link

[worldly wedge]

Anyone know if there's a Quest 2 alternative in the works? I really like the concept but like hell am I strapping facebook to my face.

[haughty thistle]

Well... there's the China-Only Pico Neo 3, although there are rumors that it's a straight up Quest Clone and Facebook might even have been involved with that one, and lastly there's the super expensive, business-only Vive Focus 3

[worldly wedge]

hmmm

I dont mind as long as I don't need a facebook login to operate it.

God they do look identical dont they? 😂

[haughty thistle]

Well... if you have an OG Oculus account you could technically count the OG Quest as a somewhat Facebook-less Quest

[worldly wedge]

ah I already have a Vive so wouldn't be much point in that

I would like a headset that I can run independent from a PC when I'm away though.

Hotel rooms would be a lot less boring if I had my own virtual theatre.

[haughty thistle]

As long as you're fine with 3DOF, you could also go super OG and use a Phone based VR system like Google Cardbord or Samsung GearVR

[worldly wedge]

I find it surreal that Vive are making a business-only Quest 2 clone when there's an obvious demand for a consumer version.

[haughty thistle]

The sad truth is, most consumers are absolutely fine with handing their data to Facebook. And Facebook is absolutely dumping the price of the Quest to make it almost impossible for any western Company to compete.
It's also very likely that if a company tries to compete with Facebook, Facebook will just pull another one of their dirty tricks to ensure their dominance.
The most notable was back when Microsoft tried to enter the VR market by offering a budget option with WMR. Just a day after the announcement, Facebook dropped the price of the CV1 from 700$ down to 400$, conveniently the same price at which WMR devices were supposed to start at.
If this was a one-off thing, I wouldn't have given it a second thought, but we're talking about the same company that has payed game developers to exclusively develop for their platform...

And now they're buying successful VR game studios left and right. So if another standalone HMD comes along for consumers, don't expect games from any of the now Facebook owned companies to make it there. Games like Beat Saber or Onward for example

[crude rune]

Biggest mistake is buying the PSVR

I want a oculas rift S

or even a VIVE

[crude rune]

Yeah so what if they know where I live, I don't care

Not like they are going to do anything

[haughty thistle]

I still find it interesting how people couldn't care less if Facebook or any other company knows basically their entire life, but when the government want's to know that information, they run riot...

[rapid otter]

You think a 6 core 3.4 ghz r5 2600 is enough ?

[haughty thistle]

It should be, but honestly, I have no idea how CPU threads are split up during VR workloads...

[rapid otter]

sip sip sip

I can't upgrade anyway

[steady moss]

what do people think about the vive pro 2?

[pale orbit]

https://news.ucsc.edu/2021/05/virtual-reality-time-compression.html

[bleak night]

it ships when it ships really

[haughty thistle]

As Sylva said. Once you've paid for it, it usually goes very quickly.

[haughty thistle]

Imo the actual HMD is an upgraded Reverb G2 with lighthouse tracking. The more expensive Tracking system as well as the other upgrades, make up the majority of the 200$ price difference (599$ for the G2 without controllers and 799$ for the Pro 2 without lighthouses and controllers).
I'll probably swap out my G2 for the Pro 2, now that I'm returning the Pimax. Mostly because I was never truly happy with how Inside-Out tracked headsets sync up to Lighthouse tracked controllers. So for me the Vive Pro 2 is actually going to be an upgrade over my Index

[steady moss]

jesus big dick energy here

Doesn't the vive pro 2 come with the lighthouse 1.0's tho? if you already have an index you can obviously just use those

[haughty thistle]

The Pro 2 comes just like the Pro Eye with 2.0 Lighthouses

That is, if you buy it in a kit. Unlike the Pro Eye, you can buy the Pro 2 alone without any of the other stuff

[gentle coral]

Its nice to finally see an academic paper on the subject. That is one of the effects that I was alluding to yesterday with @manic jewel. There has not really been a test of if that time compression lasts after you leave VR, but it is highly likely from when I have helped demo VR stuff and people loose their understanding of time for a while afterwards. Other perceptions can also be affected as well. This can be good or bad depending on situation.

[sick jay]

mmmmzzmnmmsdsss

[pastel echo]

You get it when you get it calm down man

[craggy turret]

I am looking at a quest 2, I have a Dell G7 7790 (I travel for work and its what was avail at the time of purchase). Should I be good to play it tethered and are there any big issues with having to be offline since I work in very remote locations.

[winged kettle]

Hi everyone, do any o you is using VorpX ? For me I am missing Half-Life VR type game, I have done Alyx twice already and I am wondering if VorpX works nice enough to do the others in VR

[hushed pond]

use garrys mod

half life compaign + vr plugin

[winged kettle]

I looked how to do it, it is just for HalfLife games, what if I want to play other games ? The VorpX idea is quite interesting because it is compatible with a lot of games already

[thick nest]

for me its enough

[rapid otter]

What hardware do you use headset gpu ect

[weak falcon]

its a expensive product give it a week or so

[rapid otter]

Can you give detailed specs ?

[craggy turret]

@rapid otter
Dell G7 7790 (G7790-7523GRY-PUS)
I7 9750H
dedidated rtx 2060
16 gigs ram
1 1.4 display port
1 thunderbolt 3

Performance im not worried but how do I verify the thunderbolt is tied into the graphics card.

@rapid otter My other issue is not having internet.. I have a cellular connection at best 30% and then the other time nothing or dial up speeds, with out paying outragous data costs. And by dial up I mean old dial up, like 14k on a perfect day.

[craggy turret]

should be a tracking #

[rapid otter]

Rtx 2060 is apparently good, i have one but i have a cpu bottleneck so ...
The I7 has a "low" base clock and you will maybe run into cooling isues

Apart from downloading the games and playing multiplayer you don't really need wifi

[craggy turret]

Its a space heater but plays everything I have. The only issue in reference to VR i can find is if the graphics will be fed by the 2060 thru the thunderbolt/display port.

[haughty thistle]

You call that a space heater? Then you haven't seen a 3090...

[craggy turret]

@haughty thistle Dell laptop.

Not exactly known for its airflow...

Or lack there of.

[sullen linden]

It isn't an Alienware from what he/she said

[sullen linden]

^

[gentle coral]

Quest link is fed by USB, it won't use any of the benefits of the thunderbolt port, and it doesn't matter if the port is connected to the GPU, as it sends it from gpu back to cpu then over USB. But I would recommend using the thunderbolt port as the type c port connection as it might have good power delivery.

[craggy turret]

@gentle coral Thanks.

And yes no alienware.

[digital monolith]

just received my index yesterday!!
now im looking for games to install
i already have beat saber, HL:A, the lab

[rapid otter]

Man get boneworks what a blast

[sullen linden]

Imagine putting metal boxes on your heads all day

Imagine not

[young marten]

Yeah imagine, I only put plastic boxes on my head. Much lighter.

[sullen linden]

I wish I could do it all day

[flat pawn]

By any chance has anyone ordered knuckles or base stations this month?

[limpid jay]

guys im a cheapo gamer who doesnt want to buy a vr headset lol is there any way to use a phone vr headset to play pc vr for free?

[young marten]

Not for free and phone vr isn't worth it as a pc vr solution.

[hushed pond]

a phone is not a vr device no matter what you do to it

[young marten]

I mean I use to play vrc with a phone, Google cardboard like viewer, and NOLO vr tracking. But that setup was dumb tbh.

and janky

[hushed pond]

you may think its vr but i garranteed you its not

[young marten]

I had 6 Dof tracking with controllers and all.

[hushed pond]

trust me i tryed with my phone and a thing you put your phone into and... nope doesnt remotly look close to vr in term of visual

[young marten]

Tbh my set up was vr besides the trash latency and low resolution.

[limpid jay]

oh ok, thanks anyways

whats a cheap vr headset youd reccomend

[young marten]

Quest 2 is best low budget vr option at the moment. It's just has the whole thing with Facebook making it not amazing.

[limpid jay]

oh ok. i was hoping for something cheaper though

[young marten]

The one I had gave around a 98 Fov, I have a dime there for scale, but was extremely distorted. I some how got use to it's disorienting nature. But oh boy is my Index 1000x better.

[chilly imp]

Is anyone having vram leaks and low fps/high frametime with the recent VRCHAT update?
VRCHAT pretty much ate all 10Gb of vram on the 3080, fps stays in the mid 20.

[sullen linden]

The last time I played vrc was yesterday and it was fine but I'll see if it's worse now when I get on in a bit

[chilly imp]

Most noticeable in PyPyDance with around 10 avatars

Though in other world, the vram usage is also higher than previously

[sullen linden]

Ah yeah I don't go to dance worlds so it's hard to say

[sullen linden]

I am getting this every time I launch steamvr now though

[chilly imp]

Seem like I am not the only one

[sullen linden]

I heard from some people that valve's gonna release a new headset sometime soon, any evidence to this or no?

[gentle coral]

Kind of as they are working quite a bit with OpenBCI on the Galea EEG and biosensing headset, which will be sending out dev kits this summer, but I think that version hooks into a regular Index. But Valve is working to make their own version of the Galea that is pre integrated into a new Index Model. Valve also published a patent back in March showing a few new headset designs.

[sullen linden]

Wait, ya got a link to the patents @gentle coral ?

I'm trying to decide whether it's worth waiting for the next headset or just buying an index rn.

[signal snow]

the next mars rover should have a 360 degree camera so we can view actual mars in vr

or better yet a 3d scanner so we can actually walk around

[gentle coral]

Here is a link to the patent people were talking about in March.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20210080996A1/en?oq=US20210080996

But valve had published a lot of patents recently related to new optics and displays, and controller improvements.

[gentle coral]

They have had 9 get published this year already, and the two Published this month were only filed in January, which is really quite a quick process.

And one of their patents related to BCI and biofeedback that they have had for a while just got granted back in late April.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US10981054B2/en?inventor=Michael+S.+Ambinder&num=100&sort=new

[haughty thistle]

VRAM usage in VRchat always depends on the worlds and avatars used in an instance. If everyone has like 10 8k textures on their avatar and the world is the usual optimized garbage, then yeah.
There's a reason people think games like CVR are better optimized, because the people over there actually invest time into optimization. It's a problem with the creators usually, not the platform.

I don't know about PyPyDance, but if I remember correctly, with the latest VRC update in order to fix the video player, they decided to download the whole video ahead of time and then play it from memory. It could be the way that VRC is handling this playback from memory that is cluttering VRAM, but my guess is as good as yours...

[chilly imp]

That make sense.
I guess the last thing I can try is to roll back to old NVIDIA driver, try SteamVR/VRCHAT beta and hope that it can improve somewhat

[green crypt]

Tbh using 10 GB of vram in VRC isn't that weird tho check how your FPS is when you are alone in pypydance

Also if you have FPS vr look at your frametimes

Tho if you really thinks it's a memory leak make a canny! In the bug tab

[chilly imp]

Hopefully the transition to Unity 2019 will improve performance.
Alone in PyPyDance is around 70-85 with VRAM already around 7Gb usage. Didn't have fpsVR at that time as I uninstall to do some troubleshooting

But in a room with 20+ avatars, CPU frametime 45-55ms, GPU frametime 20-25ms

Or someone willingly to sell 3090 at MSRP

Had lots of problem with AMD back when they launched 5000 series GPU

[green crypt]

Sounds like a lot of unoptimized avatars with that high CPU frametimes tbh

[chilly imp]

Will give CVR and Neos VR a try tonight

[haughty thistle]

Yup. The drop in frames you're experiencing here is because of how unoptimized the Dynamic Bone Script is and how overused it is on some avatars.

If you want free FPS in crowded VRC instances? Turn on the dynamic bone limiter. You can thank me later 😉

[signal snow]

wait valve is actually gonna make brain vr stuff?

i thought that was a rumor

man the world of cyberpunk is slowly approaching and im scared

[sullen linden]

One day there might even be a VR MMO

[signal snow]

as soon as VR can control the part of ur brain that receives acceleration/movement thats when shit gets real

you will be able to feel the acceleration and g's of a fighterjet

be able to actually feel what its like to drive an F1 car

damn that would be just too crazy

[sullen linden]

I'm moreso imagining SAO but in VR

Like the real thing

[signal snow]

idk anything about SAO

but yea mmo in vr

sounds cool

i mean

why dont they make one now

vr is pretty advanced now

star ctizen vr

[haughty thistle]

I've recently watched a Demo of the Yaw VR 2 on Youtube and thought like

Man I wanna have this for like ETS2 and whatnot
Then I looked at the price and decided it's best to keep my hands off that for now xD

[candid bluff]

they are working on that one game zenith

[sullen linden]

Any PVP or no?

[candid bluff]

don't think so yet but its in pre alpha

[sullen linden]

Ah.

[young marten]

[pale orbit]

the knife you used to steal it from the ups guy? lol

[haughty thistle]

Valve never updated that part of SteamVR

It's all still hardcoded for the original HTC Vive. Just plug in your Index controllers via a Type-C cable and you should be fine

[flat pawn]

You accidentally plugged in a Vive wand?

[haughty thistle]

I think he just accidentally plugged in the other Index controller. Steam was probably complaining about left and he had the right one connected or the other way around

[lethal obsidian]

fellow canadian VR enthusiasts, Vive 3.0 Trackers are $10 off in the amazon store, making them only $20 more expensive than the 2.0s. Not a world-changing difference but it's nice to see HTC stuff a bit below MSRP https://www.amazon.ca/HTC-VIVE-Tracker-3-0-Windows/dp/B08WFS5BMY/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=vive+3.0&qid=1621624678&sr=8-5

[soft hound]

[lethal obsidian]

They're $169 directly from HTC so

Not a bad price at $152

[soft hound]

Though I'm happy with the 4 hour battery life I'm getting from the 2.0s

[lethal obsidian]

Battery life is the main reason I'm considering the 3.0s

Also reducing wobble

Not necessarily for longer sessions, but for the ability to not have to always charge between split sessions

Wobble is a bigger one though now that I think about it, I like to dance in VRC and sometimes the 2.0s are just too big and make the feet motion goofy

[soft hound]

Ah fair enough, I'm more of the "standing with occasional hip sway, and a side of laying down" VRChat player

[lethal obsidian]

Yeah honestly the 2.0s are fantastic

It's much less a necessary upgrade and more just a nice-to-have

[vestal steeple]

i have th 2.0 and they are awesome

[lethal obsidian]

and I mean if I wanted the absolute minimum amount of wobble I'd have just gotten the tundra trackers

But I think there's a balance to be had between battery life, size & wearability, and tracking accuracy

i think I'm gonna hold off on the 3.0s for now but the price is very tempting
I've been loving the 2.0s so no harm in sticking with what works 👉 😎 👉

[soft hound]

Yeah, over $450 for a mild upgrade is kind of questionable

[lethal obsidian]

yeah, and even if I wanted to sell my previous trackers, it'd still be a net cost of around $150 if I sold the trackers for $100 each

[haughty thistle]

The main reason I got the Tundra Trackers was for the lighter weight

I'm honestly fine with the 4h battery life of the 2.0 Vive Trackers, but for convenience, I bought the TrackStrap+ anyway

[green crypt]

just snatched tundra early bird in place of normal

someone left early bird idk why but it's nice for me

also there are some kits open now as they announced shipping price!

[flat pawn]

How long are tundra compared to 3.0s?

Battery life

And is the tracking accuracy the same?

[haughty thistle]

In regards to battery life, the Tundra ones supposedly have a bit more (7h on Vive 8h on Tundra)

In regards to tracking accuracy, they both lighthouse tracking, so there shouldn't be a difference...

Notable is also that the Tundra ones are smaller, lighter weight and feature a swappable base with either a screw mount like the Vive ones or alternatively a strap mount so you can tie them directly into your shoelaces

Oh, and as a bundle, tbey srr much cheaper then the new 3.0 tracker (only a bit cheaper then the old 2.0 ones)

[flat pawn]

so if you were looking for your first set of trackers there's no real reason not to go with tundra

is what it sounds like

[gentle coral]

This is already completely doable and has been done, but not with brain stimulation, but with direct muscle stimulation. Look at the Teslasuit pitch deck .
https://teslasuit.io/special/TESLASUIT-presentation-Q12021.pdf

slide 3 breifly talks about their EMS / TENS muscle stimulation tech.

While slides 16-20 are the interesting ones about the F1 demo (feel the drive) and a rugby tackle demo.

The F1 demo does not look all that interesting from the outside, but the Rugby Tackle is quite the video.

here is video of the tackle
https://www.facebook.com/teslasuit/videos/2490740647673089/

I have yet to try the Teslasuit, but as I have tried similar tech and work on similar hardware, I know that the sensation is really lifelike and almost freaky (this is orders of magnitude better then haptic motors in almost every situation).

Right now it is not really possible to accurately target specific muscle response in the brain using tACS, tDCS, tPCS, tRNS or tMS. But Triggering the Muscles themselves with EMS / TENS is already very common in the medical field for physical therapy and is becoming more common in the sports training field.

The terms I used here

EMS=Electric Muscle Stimulation=NMES=Neuromuscular Electrical Stimulation=Electromyostimulation
tENS=Transcutaneous Electrical Nerve Stimulation
tACS=Transcranial Alternating Current Stimulation
tDCS=Transcranial Direct Current Stimulation
tPCS=Transcranial Pulsed Current Stimulation
tRNS=Transcranial Random Noise Stimulation
tMS=Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation

[signal snow]

so that suit can you allow you to feel the acceleration of an F1 car just like it would feel in real life?

[gentle coral]

to a certain level yes

it is triggering your muscles to want to move so it feels like there is something pushing them, it can feel very similar to G forces if done correctly.

it can even be used to control other people

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSfnm_HoUv4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGMDq3ay7Ro&t=13s

I don't think there is a video but with EEG braindata of the motor cortex you can actually allow fully paralyzed people to walk again just by thinking about walking (it is really hard to train, but it is possible).

It is really cool that this stuff is coming to the consumer market over the next few years.

The Galea (Valve and OpenBCI's EEG and Biosensor headset) will probably be around 5k to 10k when it comes out, but will easily drop below 1k dollars within a year or two as the specific chips needed for biosensors are dropping in price by orders of magnitude the next few years and allow for more channels . Along the lines of five $50 dollar chips vs One $20 dollar chip to run the same device.

Right now the best setup I can think of for immersion is a combination of this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdEXlImlP2s

with a Galea headset with Tobii eye tracker, VARJO or XTAL headset and a Teslasuit.

You would be out about 70k for a setup of this kind, when you consider the computer needed to really take advantage of all that gear would be at minimum 10k.

[gentle coral]

SAO and consciousness relative full dive VR where your body does not move, and you are in a dream like state is still probably about 30 to 50 years out, but if you are fine with full body motion and simulated senses then it is closer to 10 years for people to be able to experience stuff almost as immersive as SAO. Though costs will still be high enough that the only places that would have this would be some high end VR arcades, or really rich people. You would have to put these devices in the should I buy this or a nice Car category of purchases.

While the SAO style full dive helmets will probably not happen as invasive devices like Neuralink have enough benefits to make helmets not really useful (as our skull blocks a lot of the signal that BCI devices need to read our thoughts, or give us accurate brain stimulation). These devices will also be expensive due to the invasive nature of them. Though if there is at some point a wearable BCI device that is able to do everything that an invasive device can, it will be the device that will end up the cheapest over time.

[pastel echo]

I would pay 20,000 right now for this fully body stimulation and movement SAO experience and prefer it over full dive TBH

I wonder if they can get it to that price point by 2030

Also I hope it doesn't require a ceiling higher than 10ft because that's all I have

[hidden zodiac]

does anyone here have a valve index nearby?

[gentle coral]

Right now probably the best EEG / stimulation device for possible integration into VR would be the "Magstim egi Geodesic GTEN 200", in a 256 channel setup. The problem with this device is base price is 300k, and to fully utilise it, you would want a Full head MRI in an upright MRI machine (your brain changes position when you lay down enough that it would affect any Neuro stimulation to some degree). If you plan to lay down while using VR you would also want a MRI scan while laying down.

Here is a recent video that Magstim did about their device and also an intro to EEG and neuro stimulation. the findings of the Paper at 1:12:30 if shown to be reproducible will definitely be useful in VR EEG devices in the future.
https://youtu.be/H4habmVj5TI

with timestamp to the interesting paper
https://youtu.be/H4habmVj5TI?t=4355

As even if you have a BCI right now, training it is the hardest part, as everyone brain is extremely unique in how it processes information and how those signals move around the brain.

[hidden zodiac]

could really use these measurements

[gentle coral]

The teslasuit is currently $9,099 dollars if you get it through some academic institution, or want to develop with it. No games currently support it though.

[pastel echo]

Yeah I'd pay for the game experience

[gentle coral]

this video might be the best demo video of the teslasuit I have seen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KC83goKZXK8

few years old, but still accurate

[pastel echo]

If I'm being real honest with you I'd spend all that money and end up using the complicated ass rig just to play blade and sorcery

Really cool tech though can't wait to see where it goes

[gentle coral]

the price of the suit will probably drop soon, as they have said that their custom electronics are almost finished and can do a much larger run of components

[pastel echo]

I think Omni treadmills exist too

So ballin

[gentle coral]

they do, but are somewhat of an issue if you want to run, jump, or roll

[pastel echo]

You know what there is no VRcade type thing in my entire town

I'll just wait for this stuff and start one

Actually my property is considered residential/commercial hybrid

[gentle coral]

and for a similar price to a high end omni treadmill you can build a full body motion platform (that allows for all forms of movement)

[pastel echo]

I could legitimately do that

Okay I think I have a solid plan here to write off buying an SAO rig as a business expense

And I don't have to worry about the ceilings because I'll be building a VR building for the business end of things, man this is solid

Thanks for the idea pyconaut

[gentle coral]

these types of places will definitly pop up, and considering the level of experoence people would probably pay similar to a day at a theme park for 4 or 5 hours on a good system

100 dollars for 5 hours on one of these systems would not be to crazy if the games and experiences are good.

[pastel echo]

Hmmm $20 an hour is not ideal but should pay off the system itself within a year or two so that's cool

[gentle coral]

I am thinking in comparison to a good theater experience, plus the value added cost of being a player.

[pastel echo]

Oh I just realized

With omnidirectional platform it won't need a huge floor space

[gentle coral]

it could be cheaper if you find ways of lowering overhead (low staff, low electricity costs, good events and discount promos to bring a lot of people in.)

[pastel echo]

Only option in a town that has nothing except a bowling alley, aaaand being in my backyard so I can staff it myself should help with that

[gentle coral]

omnidirectional platforms would not be much bigger (15X15) then a current VR cube area (10x10). Though treadmills are the smallest at 5x5 usually.

[pastel echo]

Hmmm I think I could fit a 10x10 and still have room for 2-4 other VR stations

I think the real money would be in reserved events so other dedicated rigs would be important

[gentle coral]

I have been to a few high end VR arcades and they usually have 8 to 10 machines in quite the large space. For event participation the best would be to have 12 to 16 setups for big tournaments.

[pastel echo]

This is a small town

Graduating classes in double digits

So just enough for some groups of friends and giving me essentially a free SAO rig will do it

[gentle coral]

If setups become common around the world, then having one or two in a small town would be a good draw for rural players who want to join large online events (as by this point there will probably be some good VR-MMO-RPGS).

Also with remote work, and rental cars and what not being more common now, it makes sense for some people to get a high end VR rig instead of a nice car.

[pastel echo]

Exactly, it'll probably just seasonally operate when I have the time so I can have tax free VR and offer something to do in this community

Maybe I'll see how quick I can get a valve index to pay for itself and go from there.

[gentle coral]

For me I hope to have access to most of the devices I talked about by next summer through some non profit work, academic research, dev work, and beta testing. And to finish my versions of each device by 2023 or 2024.

[pastel echo]

Sick

[gentle coral]

oh looks like thrillseeker just got the Nextmind VR EEG device
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eumgqYgZzTg

already had someone use An extmind to make a god game at a virtual game jam I helped run a few months ago which was very cool to see, but am happy for another review of the nextmind by a well known VR youtuber.

[sullen linden]

That sounds like neuralink would make it somewhat possible in the future.

Considering how much work is being put into it atm, a bit over 20 years might make something similar somewhat possible, though maybe through a hybrid system

[gentle coral]

It is absurd how fast the hardware is developing. The BCI space is developing at almost moore's law speed.

[sullen linden]

Tbh, it's probably even gonna speed up soon

Neuralink is pretty new

They'll probably get more people working on it

As well as Valve's thing

And there's already some technology for movement detection in the motor cortex, and that's moreso the main thing required for something that's like SAO to some extent

Idk about full-dive, but hybrid systems could very well be there in a decade

Like accurate ones seeing the current developments

[gentle coral]

It will be less then a decade if you are willing to spend the money. Almost Every theoretical application of neuralink is already clinically proven to work if done correctly, the current problem is getting the devices approved so that they can install them and start training the AI and machine learning.

[haughty thistle]

Sorry for the late reply. In case you still need them, here they are:
W: 25.5cm (with Speakers) 19cm (without Speakers)
L: This one really depends on how large your head is and what you have the Index set to. In my case that's 31cm with what I'd guess is the dial half out or 2 thirds out
H: 12cm

Oh, and the height can also change depending on what angle you have the headstrap. I just measured the height of the main HMD unit itself

[midnight snow]

Ok, so any recommendations for a headset that doesn’t require me to sell my soul to Facebook?

[rapid otter]

Budget ?

@midnight snow

Because quest 2 is king

I sold my soul and don't regret it

[haughty thistle]

Vive Pro/Pro 2 with Index controllers
Valve Index
HP Reverb G2 with Index controller and lighthouses

Besides that, you're left with the entire backlog of now discontinued headsets on the used market

[midnight snow]

@rapid otter I value my information, I don’t have a Facebook account yet, and I never will.

[rapid otter]

Yes I understand

[midnight snow]

You’d be surprised how expensive they are still

[rapid otter]

But i already have instagram en everything... What can they get more ?

[haughty thistle]

You can find like a Lenovo Explorer for less then a Quest 2 actually...

[haughty thistle]

How you actually react to ads and whatnot?
Movement data in VR is much more accurate and basically impossible to hide/fake...

[rapid otter]

Also given how good the headset is i don't care lmao

[midnight snow]

What’s the difference between a mixed reality headset and a virtual reality headset exactly?

Nvm

Only really looking for a headset to play beat saber with

[midnight snow]

At this point I’m tempted to just snag a ps4 and it’s accompanying headset

[rapid otter]

None

[rapid otter]

Waste of money

[midnight snow]

Then why name then different things?

[green crypt]

bad marketing thats why

its just vr they planned mr features but its just vr

[snow mortar]

K

[harsh niche]

I just want neuralink to be able to take me into a place like the matrix

just like load up custom worlds and "plug in" to a supercomputer or something and do whatever I want just like it is real life

[pastel echo]

That'd be scary

I wonder how you'd differentiate the two for yourself

Maybe make it illegal for neural links to interface with pain and touch outside of hands and feet, something like that

[gentle coral]

In general they do actually mean different things, but often get mixed up or redefined. Right now my best definitions are.

Virtual Reality (VR) encompasses all fully immersive experiences. These could be created using purely real-world content (360 Video), purely synthetic content (Computer Generated), or a hybrid of both. This is beat saber, or the like.

Augmented Reality (AR) is an overlay of computer generated content on the real world that can superficially interact with the environment in real-time. This is Pokémon go, or the like.

Mixed Reality (MR) is any overlay of synthetic content that we observe or interact with Virtually or physically. This encompasses both AR and VR as well as ay experience in between. But people often use it interchangeably when talking about AR.

The garbage is that Microsoft decided to call their whole line of headsets (windows mixed reality headsets). This really confused the market, as it was making it harder to identify which of their products you were talking about (the VR focused ones or the AR focused ones). And it added a term to the general device that is redundant and confusing-
"I want a Windows Mixed Reality Virtual Reality Headset".

Also there is the term XR, which is generally a term for the hardware and software tools, technology, and infrastructure that allows for the creation of a Mixed Reality, or Extended Reality. This includes a lot of things on top of AR, andVR like wearables, BCI, cybernetics, telepresence, IOT, and the pieces of software that allow them to interact.

The XR term is the most annoying one because many people (including me sometimes), use it completely interchangeably with the term MR, orAR at times. And many companies have started using XR as branding when they only focus in AR, or VR, or MR.

These terms have all become marketing terms much more then their original reason for existence which was more for academic and design delineation.

Now you go online and will find tons of different definitions of AR, MR, VR, and XR, and how they relate to eachother. Even looking at the Wikipedia articles does not help all that much unless you understand the history of each term and their relationship.

Having been a part of this industry for almost 8 years now, I still have trouble explaining this to others, and can't always define which part of it I am in.

I will probably make a detailed graphic of this terminology relationship later this week as I know this will come up again at a presentation I am doing next weekend.

[green crypt]

yeah it's just dumb what microsoft did

[rapid otter]

@gentle coral damn very interesting

Thank for the time and effort you put into it

[flat pawn]

I'm looking forward to that graphic

[gentle coral]

I'm excited to be doing another VR panel at a convention, this time I actually have time to create new slide graphics.

Though I have to make new slides for 7 different panels i might do. I hope they add my second VR panel.

[wooden cave]

Would the Vive Focus 3 be a good headset to buy from a 3rd party source like eBay?

[pastel echo]

Personally I wouldn't

[rapid otter]

@gentle coral what are you working in exactly ?

[gentle coral]

I currently help develop VR hardware, AR hardware, help develop and test games and experiences for both of them, as well as do research on and test BCI devices, and biosensing hardware that might be used by the AR and VR industry. I am also an educator in the game dev industry and specialise on VR games at the moment.

I hope to make my own VR headset and accessories in a few years once I have a bit of money (I have the knowledge, tools, people, and industry access, but the money is always the problem, especially with how much the people I want charge).

I do many other things as well in other industries. I am what I like to call a "Multidisciplinary Specialist". I am one of probably a few hundred bay area people who would be considered general use independent contractors that can fill almost any role. We each usually jump from one company or startup to another pretty often, or work at multiple at once.

Its fun and you learn a lot of skills very fast but usually don't have great benefits. But it can be worth it when you get to write your own contracts, or force a company to open source any work you do for them. The ammount of skills is also beneficial because i can help teach new startups quite a few things (I can teach many semi-technical subjects to an intermediate level, or at least guide people to the right knowledge for them to learn).

[rapid otter]

That's very interesting 👍

[royal coyote]

on the index can anyone recommend a counter wight? been having some issues of getting headaches due to it pulling on the neck

[gusty frost]

A battery bank

[haughty thistle]

Everytime I read about strictly counterweights for VR, I always hear this name thrown around: https://www.studioformcreative.com/product-page/index-200-gram-7oz-curved-counter-weight
Maybe try them out? I personally don't really see the need as the Index is comfortable enough for me for longer play sessions. Although I do agree that the Vive Pro has a better weighted headstrap, but it's also bulkier, so pick your poison I guess...

[pastel echo]

Anyone know if there are enterprise or commercial index options

[gusty frost]

@royal coyote that

thanks chicken

[royal coyote]

@gusty frost thx ordered one 🙂 they had a slightly upgraded version that i ended up getting
https://www.studioformcreative.com/product-page/index-200-gram-7oz-enthusiast-kit
downside is the ~10$ shipping but oh-well lol

[gusty frost]

Nice

[gentle coral]

If you mean using an index for business then you can use the regular headset, and just make aure you can write it off. Or you could get a steam game cafe account and buy it through that account.

If you are looking for a more well built or higher spec index, then no, valve only makes one type of index at the moment.

[pastel echo]

No I'm interested in the warranties that come with commercial devices

[haughty thistle]

We may or may not have confirmed that Valve is working on a standalone Steam device. Whether that be like a Nintendo Switch type device, or a standalone VR headset, we don't know. But Patents hint to it being a VR headset possibly...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCM0JRUxmPE

Oh, and ofc possibly a wireless adapter for the existing Index

[gentle coral]

Contact them directly (Valve is not a big company and their emails are very easy to find.) I can't remember who specifically but I know I once saw the email for the VR dev relations manager or something like that.

[thick nest]

i wouldnt even consider older headsets these days

never

[thick nest]

dont please

its horrible

you may think its good

but there are bascially no good games to play on it

[haughty thistle]

For the budget, there really aren't any other choices. Especially, if you don't want all of your life documented by Facebook...

[thick nest]

you know that bascially everyone is being documented

with or without the headset it doesnt matter

[haughty thistle]

There is data that can't be recorded outside of VR

[thick nest]

i bet most of the people here have apps that track location and microphone data and i bet its not even facebook

[thick nest]

what is location data gonna do

[haughty thistle]

Not location

How you move your arms and head

[thick nest]

uhh thats location

...

[haughty thistle]

It can give crutial details on your physical state, that advertisers and goverments just drool over

Location =/= body language

[thick nest]

bruh they dont really care about your physical state

[haughty thistle]

They do

[thick nest]

it would only help with apps that relate to fitness etc

and lets be honset have you seen any ads that relate to that

[haughty thistle]

Mayhaps you wanna read the book 1984. It very much gives an insight when it comes to such data collection 🙂

[thick nest]

lets stay on our expierences not somebody i dont trust yet and could be speaking complete trash

[haughty thistle]

I haven't because I use services that actually respect the users privacy if they tell the company to do so. Unlike Facebook who still collects data even if explicitly forbidden to do so

[thick nest]

linus said it if your data isnt getting stolen by facebook you probably have at least 3 other apps not including OS that track your data

[haughty thistle]

services that actually respect the users privacy if they tell the company to do so

Facebook ain't such a company

[thick nest]

ok

your just making a big deal after some ads

then what

if they take some data to do ads

will a person suffer a heart failure

maybe such ads are helpful to a person

even if somebody gets a lenovo explorer his phone probably recorded the conversation he was having about some product

then what use a bad old and not user fixable headset

[haughty thistle]

I'm not saying that on-device data collection can't be helpful. What I'm against is sharing these very intimate details in the cloud and other companies

[thick nest]

is it gonna hurt the person

no...

[haughty thistle]

Is your Quest/Quest 2 user fixable? No.

[thick nest]

i can send it to facebook

[haughty thistle]

Just as much as you can send any other headset to the manufacturer

[thick nest]

not any other

a few

[haughty thistle]

If I still had my OG Vive, I could still send it in to HTC for a repair

[thick nest]

the lenovo explorer lost support 2 years ago

[haughty thistle]

Besides that, the OG Vive is actually the most repairable HMD of all time. Don't believe me? Watch the iFixit review

Oh, and loss of support doesn't mean the manufacturer doesn't repair it anymore

[thick nest]

thats because your og vive is still a "new" headset considering they havent launched many headsets after

also wasnt that thing 500 dollars

[haughty thistle]

Just as Lenovo hasn't launched many headsets after

[thick nest]

but its discoutinued

so

no support

[haughty thistle]

So is the HTC Vive

[thick nest]

and that thing is 4 years old

thats definately old wether the manufacturer sends support or not

even so the htc vive isnt the best

performance wise the q2 beats it in everywhere but in 360 tracking

[haughty thistle]

Besides, if you're saying that there's no reason to buy an old Headset, then how about the extreme budget. Someone has a VR capable PC, but only 150€ to spend and they can save maybe 20€ a month. Would you tell them to buy a used headset now or wait an eternety?

[thick nest]

they should save up

wether they save up for a few months

[haughty thistle]

So wait an eternity that is

[thick nest]

or a few weeks

dude

dont let me repeat

[haughty thistle]

There are reasons to buy older headsets

[thick nest]

most of the old headsets under 160 are discountinued

and will probably get broken within a month

is the wait worth it

[haughty thistle]

I think this conversation isn't going anywhere so I'll be doing the smart thing and stop arguing, because like Mark Twain once said

Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

[thick nest]

ahh i see you had no response so you choose to drop out

[haughty thistle]

Just because something is a year old, doesn't mean it'll break within a month

[thick nest]

4 years old*

[haughty thistle]

You're opposing used devices, just for the sake of opposing them

[thick nest]

means you have to try to not break it for a few years so it would be worth it

[haughty thistle]

It doesn't help the environment, it doesn't help poor people. It only helps rich companies that try to make as much money off consumers as possible

[thick nest]

since when was it about poor people

[haughty thistle]

Since forever

[thick nest]

bruh if you want to help poor people

go donate

[haughty thistle]

I was talking in the sense of people who just barely are able to scrape together a VR capable rig

[thick nest]

.

buying bad vr headsets wont help

at.all

they could start a go fund me

i know people who did

and got some money of their new q2

[haughty thistle]

Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

I'm out idiot

[thick nest]

. 2

im still shocked you are recommending bad headsets

[haughty thistle]

So those who actually care about VR can talk to me in other places. I'll mute this place

[thick nest]

since when did i say i didnt

this man is pure bs

[haughty thistle]

Sorry, but I feel like this place has been getting worse and worse in regards to VR. Especially Linus seemingly only making content if it's about his own rig or sponsored by Oculus. I don't see Linus ever making good VR content ever.
That's why I'll be turning to other places (like the Thrillseeker Discord) that favor a much more open discussion that doesn't have like "Facebook is the best and can't be beat" mindset.

[pastel echo]

Fair enough

[sullen linden]

Wtf happened here

[thick nest]

its not really facebook is the best and cant be beat

its that i think people shouldnt recommend stuff that is discountinued especially when there is a headset that is pretty cheap and isnt discountinued

[thick nest]

lots of companies are starting to show up and maybe they will be the next facebook

to change the entire industry of VR

[rapid otter]

Very interesting by the way

[rapid otter]

Also playstation wnat to record those to track inappropriate mouvements, where is privacy

[rapid otter]

That's true

[rapid otter]

The GTX 980 ti is a good example of that, it's old but the perf are still very good, flagship once stay like it for years

[thick nest]

your proving my point

its not just Facebook

its everyone

but i think its just too late and not worth it having to stop all of those companies

everything would be more expensive

at least if they would give some option for the people who care THAT much

which is kinda wierd tbh why would you care about your data that much unless you want to hide it from certain people

[rapid otter]

The thing is to know it

I know it

[thick nest]

know what

[rapid otter]

And i accept it

That facebook gather data

[thick nest]

i see

same

i dont really care tbh

if they take my data

[rapid otter]

I'm fully aware and I'm willing to give those because i want a cheap vr headset

[thick nest]

i dont really have anything to steal all i do is play vr so

[thick nest]

same

[rapid otter]

Me too

[thick nest]

but i think chickens point is to give options

but wouldnt that make the headset more expensive

and would you pay the price for them to stop tracking?

[rapid otter]

I know quite some things about vr and trust me what Chickenbread is saying is right

[thick nest]

that goes for youtube sony google etc

[thick nest]

using old headsets?

or data consumption

[rapid otter]

About old headset

[thick nest]

my point is that new people to vr would probably want their headset to live long

like when i got into vr

i was recommended the Sony PSVR

[rapid otter]

😳

[thick nest]

it broke 2 months after completely destroying 100% of its value

[rapid otter]

The psvr 2 is coming soon

[thick nest]

i know but the problem wasnt there

i got it for a relativly cheap price

[rapid otter]

The library is very small

[thick nest]

but the thing about it that made it not worth it is the software and hardware support

[thick nest]

exactly

[rapid otter]

The quest 2 with link has the bigger library out all headset

[thick nest]

i had no more than 3 games and i looked everywhere even if it was expensive i just wanted to use it

[thick nest]

yep

and guess what

you can fix your quest 2 right now

[rapid otter]

Wdym ?

[thick nest]

the psvr and quest are the same price

though the PSVR had limited library support and no support in terms of hardware

[rapid otter]

They're no 6dof on psvr

[thick nest]

but the quest has a big library covering 100% of the pcvr library and oculus's standalone

[rapid otter]

No

[thick nest]

wait are you talking about psvr2

[rapid otter]

Boneworks
HLVR
No mansky
Lone echo 1 2
Pavlov
And many others

[thick nest]

or 1

[rapid otter]

1

[thick nest]

ah ok

yeah its like a cheap ass 3 dof

[rapid otter]

Idk about the 2

[thick nest]

its bascially like phone vr with a bit of controller tracking

but both are the same price

thats my point

[rapid otter]

Yes so quest is better

[thick nest]

yeah and its the same price

in this sitiuation psvr also grabs data but lets see about other headsets

windows mixed reality

those got also recommended to me

[rapid otter]

WMR is cheap and it's quite good

[thick nest]

if you think about it windows mixed reality is a psvr with pcvr support and no data

but hardware support is where is lacks

you cant fix them with support unless its a reverb g2

so is removing data stealing for no customer support worth it

[rapid otter]

No 6dof vs 3dof and pcvr compatible

[thick nest]

yeah

[rapid otter]

This change everything

[thick nest]

is it better than the quest 2

[rapid otter]

Different

[thick nest]

maybe the only thing i would give to the windows headsets are no grabing your data and it lacks on everything else

[rapid otter]

The good think about a the quest 2 is wireless pcvr

[thick nest]

im not saying windows did a bad job the headset got released a long time ago so for that time they did an amazing job since they had customer support and good hardware for that time

[thick nest]

yeah

so why recommend it when you can save up for a headset with support or wait until windows mixed reality releases a new budget headset

[rapid otter]

Recommend what

[thick nest]

mixed reality

[rapid otter]

It's cheap brand new

[thick nest]

how is it brand new

the only new headset is a reverb g2

which costs 600 dollars i think

its a pretty nice headset ngl

but 600 dollars thats defiantely not budget friendly

[pastel echo]

@thick nest how old are you

[rapid otter]

My bad it was chepa brand new now it's kinda discontinued

But for a very good one you can 250 300

[thick nest]

14

[pastel echo]

lol

[thick nest]

lol

[thick nest]

thats the price of the quest 2

[rapid otter]

Where do you live ?

[thick nest]

do you like my pfp? @pastel echo

[pastel echo]

Not my thing

[thick nest]

ok

[thick nest]

middle east

[rapid otter]

Ok then 350 to 450

Euros

[thick nest]

????

euros

[rapid otter]

Yes

[thick nest]

we dont use euros

ok

[pastel echo]

Also old headsets are good if you know what you're getting. You get what you pay for and if you wanna pay to not have Facebook track you that's pretty fair

[rapid otter]

Idk what do you use then ?

[thick nest]

300 is the price of the quest 2 god dammit

[rapid otter]

I have no clue what's your currency

[thick nest]

can you fix it though

[pastel echo]

Can you fix what?

[thick nest]

lets say you tripped on the hdmi cable as an example

can you fix that

[pastel echo]

On what device?

[thick nest]

mixed reality

[rapid otter]

Pff imagine having cables

[thick nest]

lol

exactly

[pastel echo]

Depends on your mixed reality headset 🤷‍♂️. I've never once done that because I'm not clumsy

[thick nest]

i see your point now so you would only recommend it if the person knows how to handle a vr haedset

[pastel echo]

I didn't say that

I said old headsets are good if you know what you're getting

[thick nest]

.

[thick nest]

then how the hell is it worth it

old headsets

have no customer supprot since they are discountinued

they have relatively old hardware

and the price of a brand new quest 2

[pastel echo]

If someone wanted a device that didn't track them and works for beat saber I probably wouldn't recommend a quest I'd recommend a Vive

[rapid otter]

Yes but it's not all

[thick nest]

at what cost would you go out of your way to find a device on ebay while devices like the quest 2 are getting released

[rapid otter]

If you have a vr headset you would understand

[thick nest]

???

[pastel echo]

If you don't wanna be tracked you pay for what you pay for

[thick nest]

we have vr

[pastel echo]

It's not all about money to everyone

[thick nest]

i see

but recommend it to beginners

why though

[pastel echo]

And to some people the money does matter to a point where under $300 matters

Also beginner or not doesn't change data privacy concerns

[rapid otter]

Resolution / fov/ confort / refresh rate/ quality of build and screen/ connectivity / tracking / full body ?/ Lenses/

[thick nest]

unless they dont care if it breaks and they really care about privacy go for it

[rapid otter]

That's what I mean

[thick nest]

even though most beginners just want good vr

[pastel echo]

If I was a beginner I probably would have bought a used Vive

[rapid otter]

Me too

That's what I did for my pc

[thick nest]

you said you didnt care about privacy

[pastel echo]

I would have base stations if I wanted to upgrade, wouldn't use the shitty oculus software, and if it breaks it means I use it enough to upgrade to the index and not feel bad about it

[rapid otter]

Talking about that

Also with a quest i can play anywhere in my house

[pastel echo]

That's also why I would suggestion it to a beginner who's not fully into VR yet and doesn't understand the compromises of their data privacy

And I say that while having spent over $600 on my quest 2 experience

[thick nest]

htc vive used isnt really budget

so thats really not my point

[pastel echo]

I disagree with you because the stuff can be brought forward

It's cheaper if you upgrade

Where as quests are all in ones

[thick nest]

mostly used for pcvr

[pastel echo]

Another thing is not everyone likes wireless VR

[thick nest]

using the quest 2 as a ground to upgrade your vr expierence isnt a good idea

[pastel echo]

And link requires the god awful garbage that is oculus software

[thick nest]

you can say the same thing about steam vr

unless you are very picky about what you do in vr

[pastel echo]

I think SteamVR is miles beyond Oculus in terms of not being dog crap

[thick nest]

you wouldnt be that very very specfic stereotype

just go buy an index

if you bascially hate everything about vr

or dont get vr

[pastel echo]

Eeeeeeh and Index isn't where I want it to be yet

Also that's a weird thing to say to someone who never said that at all

I said I hate oculus software

It's garbage

[thick nest]

yeah but i hate steam vr

it lags out doesnt let me stream and sometimes just disconnects my headsets

even though my pc reconizes them as connected

[pastel echo]

Your headsets referring to your quest?

[thick nest]

not just the quest

[pastel echo]

What else have you tried

[thick nest]

psvr

that thing is getting emulated as a vive

steam wouldnt let me stream

[pastel echo]

PSVR doesn't count as a VR headset imo

[thick nest]

that has nothing to do with a headset

[thick nest]

same thing goes for mixed reality

[pastel echo]

Depends on the headset

[thick nest]

except the g2