virtual-reality

[weak bluff]

Trackers do use imu but the IMU on vive 3.0 is very terrible using MPU6250 TDK so i assume it does not rely on it much

[rustic garnet]

hey also im pretty sure it's possible to add a third touch controller for a tracked object

Wait

yeah check it

[cold shard]

"obviously". Yeah okay sure buddy. Given how trackers behave, it's very much not obvious that they have an IMU available.

[rustic garnet]

wait this is crazy does this work in steamvr

[rustic garnet]

you just said you dont have them how do you know how they act

the imu is integral (literally)

the fact that they track worse could just be due to them having less photodiode coverage

[cold shard]

Really? You've never played vrchat and seen someone's tracker lose tracking?

[rustic garnet]

i dont play vrc

but thats probably an occlusion issue

[cold shard]

With a half decent IMU available, it's pretty simple to continue tracking during occlusion. It would be very unlikely for an occlusion event to last long enough for drift to become serious. Yet vive trackers go flying away pretty often.

They don't just "track worse" tbc, they float away forever. From an outsiders perspective that hasn't learned the internal details of vive trackers, that makes it seem like they have no IMU. I was wrong, but this is hardly obvious as you claim.

[rustic garnet]

jfc i dont actually care

[cold shard]

Noted. You're one of those.

[rustic garnet]

😭 ok lmao

https://steamcommunity.com/app/250820/discussions/0/1488866813775262684/

[rustic garnet]

this looks incredibly deprecated

theyre not even in scene view it's so deprecated

but the rings are active so it totally messes up tracking

https://developers.meta.com/horizon/documentation/native/pc/mr-intro/

extremely deprecated lol

[rustic garnet]

WAIT i just remembered doesn't each tracking puck come with it's own usb dongle?? and you usually plug them all into the back of the computer hence like six radios talking over each other in close proximity

while the controllers connect to a radio in the headset

https://www.reddit.com/r/MixedVR/comments/zs9tu8/i_fixed_my_index_controller_trackingfloataway/

https://www.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/1dh02xf/vive_30_tracker_flying_away/

[cold shard]

What happened to not caring

[rustic garnet]

i remembered a lil factoid

[rustic garnet]

it isn't on wayback machine either and very hard to google

[haughty thistle]

There's a lot of factors involved in making LH tracking on these dongles bad, but I can tell you from personal experience that the proximity of the dongles themselves doesn't matter. Except when you're mixing generations of dongles, then it does matter (different gen dongles want to be separated)

[rancid kestrel]

Can you do wireless on the big screen 2? I don't see an option for it.

[haughty thistle]

Nope

These high res PCVR headsets push so much data that you just cannot make it wireless without defeating the whole point of it being high res

Plus, the Beyond is meant to be a small and lightweight headset, so putting in a battery and whatnot would also kinda defeat it's purpose too. Tho there is apparently a guy in the Bigscreen discord working on a sort-of compute puck for it? Basically a screenless Steam Deck whos only purpose it is to stream a video from a PC and display it on the Beyond and sending any USB data back. Last I've heared of that project tho, it was on a hiatus...

[weak bluff]

Its possible but it shouldn't be done. Winking at Index attempt.

[rancid kestrel]

That sounds way too high latency.

If I get that I'm going to miss the wireless...

[haughty thistle]

Trust me, the Beyond cable is super lightweight. It's not like the Index one which is bulky and inflexible...

[sly river]

plus you can get one of those ceiling cable management things which is what I plan to do

[reef dew]

My original vr had the strap pin for the top break

[indigo sequoia]

Just go an index from a og vive and was finding the cable so much less bulky and inflexible haha

I really want the beyond

[indigo sequoia]

You could have the battery attached in a backpack / pocket or something idk and still have one cable that goes from there to the headset, though I would not really be interested in that anyway

[rancid kestrel]

Not that I have used an Index to compare to.

[rancid kestrel]

The one I have just clips to your belt. It's super nice not having to think about the tether at all. No stepping on it, no accidentally hooking it, no twisting it up, it's so nice.

[high apex]

Personally, I really like the idea of having a compute and/or battery puck you keep on your body. To me, it's all the benefits of wireless without the downsides, but I can understand why not everyone would want that setup. I just kinda wish companies were playing around with that idea more, it feels like they all wanna skip straight to the end-game, all-on-your-face headset

[weak bluff]

why not just skip that puck in your body

and put that box in your desk

even better, make it big since you dont have to carry in your body anymore

man what a great concept

[rustic garnet]

the point is to not have wires man

[weak bluff]

Its sarcasm

[misty sand]

yo my usb 3.0 ports arent working. i've tried multiple 3.0 cables and the bandwidth is 370 im trying to use my quest 2 with my pc

[weak bluff]

370Mbps? If it detects as 3.0 its just fine

If its 2.0, its time to get new cable

[thorny plume]

Any thoughts on the vive focus 3?

Thinking again about moving off of my quest 2, really want something wireless as I do a lot of steamvr through my quest 2 and I hate cables

[grand cedar]

Yall what vr headset is worth it now ?
some people said if I wants to do full body then get the quest pro used Or quest 3 for better graphics

[haughty thistle]

Focus 3 uses the same crappy lenses as the Vive Pro 2 and Vive Focus Vision. Wouldn't recommend it tbh

[weak bluff]

nothing from HTC is worth at its stock price

[haughty thistle]

nothing from HTC is worth it at it's stock price
ftfy

The only exception are Lighthouses, but those aren't technically HTC's design

[rustic garnet]

i tried a vive focus 2 or 3 the other day the ergonomics were.. subpar imo

And the lenses felt floaty? And the sweet spot seemed small

I didn't get a lot of time though..

The tracking was a lil odd because i dont think the controllers were being tracked to where they actually were ....

[thorny plume]

Gotcha gotcha... interesting...

I hate that my best plan is to just roll with the quest 2 (or get the 3) and get index controllers

[weak bluff]

alternatives just dont have good value

[rustic garnet]

https://youtu.be/Wsoy1E0PoqA

[balmy dagger]

Late to the party here but wanted to chime in.

If you're looking for something fairly seamless you might get annoyed trying to use the Valve Index controllers with the Quest 3. It's doable but a bit of mucking around. People do it by either using their old headset connected to the pc to passthrough the controllers or they use Watchman dongles.

The standard Quest 3 controllers have come a long way. But if you're looking for the best experience at around the same price point, I'd go with the Quest Pro controllers. At one stage they were priced similarly to Index controllers. They self track using onboard cameras meaning they still function even when out of the headset’s view which the standard Quest 3 controllers don’t handle well. From what I understand, they use some form of "AI estimation" when our of view, which isn’t always reliable.

I get the feel of Index controllers and the layout is great and if that's a deal break you can get grips for the Pro controllers that make them feel/look more like Index controllers. At this point, that’s mostly for aesthetics or maybe hand protection when you smack something, but not really about core functionality.

If you're into Beat Saber, I can say the Quest 3 controllers are about 98% accurate in perfect lighting/space. They’re totally fine for casual play and slower paced games but if you’re chasing top scores or high speed competitive accuracy you'll notice some occasional micro misses. It’s minor a half step dropped at the wrong time but it will throw off perfect runs.

A Quest 3 + Virtual Desktop + Wi-Fi 7 access point is a killer combo. Even though the Quest 3 only supports Wi-Fi 6E (not 7) it still benefits heavily from 6 GHz. I’ve got mine on a Ubiquiti U7-Pro with its own dedicated SSID and disabled all other frequency bands to keep it clean.

Unless you’ve got a very specific reason to go with Vive, I’d personally steer clear for now until they find their footing again. Unfortunately (or fortunately?), that makes the Quest 3 one of the strongest standalone headsets available right now, even at almost 1.5 years old.

As for using a cable. One solution for going that way if you don't already have one is to get a VR pully system that keeps your cables up high and out of the way but they're not for everyone. PCVR experience is always going to better with a cable and a headset designed to fully integrate with the Steam ecosystem. With the perfect Q3 setup though using wireless makes this unnecessary. I have a 2080Ti so I can't bump everything to max but my latency was under 50ms and around 2400Mbps running at 90FPS.

Another option to look into is the Pico 4 Ultra. I've never used one but have read up a fair bit on them. Pro's and Con's over the Q3. Q3 has a larger store eco system for example but if you're mostly relying on Steam that won't be much of an issue. There's other considerations to look into though.

I was an early adopter of the original Vive Pro. At the time, it was a fantastic headset, easily one of the best available. Our local VR venue still runs Vive gear, and while it works, they’re still using Fresnel lenses and their software is buggy. When the owner recently (last 3-5 months) was at a conference he got to speak to HTC about the current state of their headsets and they admitted they were still having issues sorting out the software bugs which I believe is still the case but also that the reason they have stuck with Fresnel lenses was to help keep costs down.

For context, my Vive Pro cost me $2,200 back in 2018 which probably translated to about half that in the US. Perhaps slightly more.

HTC and Valve were tightly aligned early on, but once Valve went solo with the Index Vive seemed to lose its direction. They’ve since flooded the market with too many models and too much overlap, a handful of niche use cases might justify it, but overall it’s a mess to navigate.

If HTC released a headset that consolidated their best tech, fixed their software issues, and ditched Fresnel lenses, I’d buy one without hesitation. I actually tried to go back to Vive on my last upgrade, but the buggy software, on top of dated optics made it a no brainer to pass.

That's why I've kept my Quest 3 up until now. It’s not perfect, but compared to Vive’s lenses the optics are a huge leap forward and they don't have intermittent software issues like the Vive headsets do.

With that said I do have a BSB2e on order but that relies on a cable to work with PCVR.

[thorny plume]

I super appreciate all this info!!

Context: I really really can't stand wires and with my current space constraints (+ the existence of my cat who would jump off a ledge to try and reach the cable from the ceiling) id love to avoid them and stick wireless. As for the controllers, I'm mainly after the index controllers for hand tracking, I've tried the quest 2 and 3 hand tracking and honestly was just disappointed. For VR I'm mainly in VR chat I already am using some vive trackers for FBT and latency is not a problem at all (drifting is but that's mainly a problem because openspacecalabration isn't better). I am using virtual desktop for the wireless connection as well.

The more I look into it the more I've considered my only upgrade path to REALLY be a quest 3 because of my wireless needs.

[balmy dagger]

Yeah. I can appreciate how much of a pain cables can be. Especially with a cat around.

Meta did really take the market with the standalone headset didn't they. I've actually never used the Index controllers but I have a couple on the way for when my BSB2 arrives in June. I must admit I have not done any VR chat. I presume it's VR avatar chat?

[weak bluff]

meta headsets are sold at loss and it comes with mandatory terms and conditions

and they are the only one capable of doing that

so yeah they are best value

[indigo sequoia]

My index has 2.3M pixels
The bigscreen beyond as 6.5M which is already so much more
And the crystal super has a mindblowing 14.7M 😮

Too bad it's litteraly impossible to run this kind of resolution in sims lmao

[weak bluff]

There is more to rendering than just headset resolution

For starters, not all pixels rendered will see the same when it lands in your eyes

Index does not help for the fact that it uses fresnel lens meaning the image is distorted on the display to take account to lens curving

Because of that, Valve Index have 1440 x 1600 display resolution per eye BUT it renders 2016x2240 to take account for loss of sharpness from distorted view of lens

BSB2 does not have this weakness because it is a pancake lens

Fresnel issues that requires it to render higher resolution than display resolution

(altho fixed foveated rendering does help reducing this effect)

[gloomy crater]

The pixel density of VR headsets has really exploded in the past couple years. I'm worried about one day getting a headset with higher resolution than my current HMD because I really don't wanna upgrade my GPU. GPUs nowadays have given up on actually increasing raw performance in favor of adding AI features that artificially increase your FPS or resolution, except none of those features really work for VR as far as I can tell, so newer GPUs that will be able to natively push the amounts of Pixels that these new high resolution headsets are capable of are wildly expensive. I imagine I'd probably have to spend more upgrading my GPU to be able to run one of those headsets than the price of the headset itself.

[weak bluff]

Funny you probably going to hit DisplayPort limit before worrying about rendering that super high res

Some headset have 2 DisplayPort cable

[gloomy crater]

Ah, my stupidity has led me into a trap once again I am a massive idiot

Yeah, there was nothing to worry about (I would have known that if I had only taken the time to do the math before worrying about it) Playing a flatscreen game at 4k 144hz is roughly 1.2 billion pixels per second. A bigscreen beyond running at 90hz will upscale a native 1920x1920 image, which comes out to 331 million, one quarter of the pixels per second. So if anything, I should have an easier time running a bigscreen beyond on my current GPU than running cyberpunk at 4k.

[indigo sequoia]

It also has a higher render res though, but yeah overall less distorsion

[indigo sequoia]

Yeah I considered for a moment the crystal super, but it seems impossible to run with anything else than a 5090 lmao

For your calculation you'd need to take into account render resolution, it will upscale native 1920*1920 but this won't be the render res

[trail grove]

does anyone have recommendations for a quest 3 facial interface? the cloth of the stock one is getting annoying and the official silicon one is ridiculously expensive

i find the stock one comfortable but the cloth is just not good

[balmy dagger]

I have tried a lot of them.

I'm currently running with the newer AMVR Q3FC3.

It's pretty comfy. Works with the BOBOVR charging dock as well. The older Q3FC1 doesn't.

[balmy dagger]

It comes with a PU leather pad and a cotton pad and a replaceable nose pad to assist with blocking out the light. It also has 2 dials on each side for adjusting the interface in and out.

[balmy dagger]

I haven't had any experience with the Globular Cluster F3 but I've heard good things about it and I think it has 3 facial covers. It's also magnetic if you think you might like to switch them out frequently or if more than one person will use it consecutively.

Finally. If you want the best fit one on the market look into the Oblik facial interfaces. They're custom made to the contours of your face. I wanted to get one but they don't deliver to Australia.

I think the AMVR one will be cheaper than the Meta but the Oblik is pretty much on par but you get more for your money. I've just never tried it.

Hope this helps.

[indigo sequoia]

If the bigscreen beyond 2 had a slightly better display, like just 20% more pixels and, say, native 90Hz it would have been so insane

It's already so close to ticking every boxes I want, just the resolution is a tad bit on the lower side and feels a bit "old gen"

[haughty thistle]

Without a direct side-by-side comparison, you can't really tell a difference in pixel density between the Aero and Bigscreen, despite the Aero having a higher PPD.
30ppd is the point of diminishing returns. It's where you stop seeing the SDE. Sure, higher PPD is still better, since you can glance more details (especially in further away objects), but at that point, small differences in PPD become really unnoticable.
Plus: higher PPD = higher performance load. If you have a super high res PPD headset (like the Crystal Super or XR4) and run it at a lower resolution (say similar to a regular Crystal), it will look softer/blurrier compared to a headset which natively has that PPD

I do agree tho that it's kinda unfortunate that native doesn't run at 90Hz, but it's what's available in the uOLED market, so what canya do :/

[indigo sequoia]

Isn't the meganeX 90Hz and uloed?

And as for the ppd, I guess that in most vr games yes, but in flight sims like DCS I'm pretty sure it's useful

Also I'm the kind of guy that find 1440p blurry as heck and 1080p unusable so eh

Though, yes, it's already quite enough and yes more would be hard to run

[haughty thistle]

The MeganeX uses different panels. Ones that run much hotter and have a bigger requirement for cooling... something not really doable in the size of the Beyond...

With OLED the math is pretty simple:
Higher res and/or brightness = more heat output
More heat means more weight and larger size for the cooling :/

[rustic garnet]

Anyone got a direct comparison between the of rift and the quest 2/3 ergonomics wise mostly

the quests are significantly heavier right? (Battery and mainboard and all) and that mass is further from your neck so more leverage and moment of inertia and double and the strap is softer

seems like a triple combo to uncomfy town?

[halcyon comet]

Not sure about rift but the comfort of quest 2 and 3 stock strap are terrible

With 3rd party head strap it's okay, the headset itself weight about 400 grams

[haughty thistle]

Iirc CV1 is lighter and has at least a little bit of weight distribution

[native goblet]

question for y'all folks
anyone in the EU interested in a second hand, lightly used (50-60h) Pico Neo 3 Link ?

[native goblet]

you in the EU ?

[thorny plume]

no

[native goblet]

damn
good luck finding an HMD though, enjoy the VR !

[serene stump]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAyy_t5j1aM

[flint elk]

guys, 32gb of ram or 64gb of ram for vr?

[versed dock]

What kind of games are you playing?

[flint elk]

No Mans Sky and Half Life Alyx, Maybe more.

[versed dock]

Hmm nice, what resolution is your headset? But just going off of this you'll probably be fine with 32gb

[flint elk]

i'm using a quest 3 with the res of 2064 x 2208

[versed dock]

Yeah, I'd say you're probably going to be fine with 32gb, ddr5 I'm assuming, but if you can spring 64gb it is nice. Tbh though I only have 64gb in my workstation pc, and it's overkill I'd say (lightroom and premiere pro eat up RAM)

[flint elk]

Thanks for the information, prob get 64 next year maybe.

[gloomy crater]

I do fine in VR with 32gb of DDR4, but might be upgrading to 48 or 64gb in the future because I keep running out of memory for my chrome tabs 😐

memory usage is heavily tied to the game you're running though so future releases may cause your existing amount to be stretched thin as time goes on

[weak bluff]

32GB is fine and plenty

unless you have highest end headset its fiiiiiine

[real pasture]

im split between getting a PSVR2 or a used CV1 in the future, which one would yall pick? SDE shouldnt be too much of an issue for me (going from q3 to my phonevr setup, i did notice it, but i was more amazed by the OLEDs rather than complained about SDE), plus my laptop barely handles my q3 anyway, i always run it at lower than native res. i also want a dedicated wired PCVR headset with OLEDs that doesnt break the bank, so thats why im split rn, and want yalls opinion

[weak bluff]

CV1 would be worth it - if its really cheap like $50-70

what is your laptop anyways

PSVR2 may have issues if you dont have displayport

[real pasture]

rtx 3050, 32gb ram and r7 4800h

[real pasture]

and yeah it doesn't have a dp port

[weak bluff]

there is possibility the HDMI is not connected to dGPU

[real pasture]

when connecting anything into that port it shows up as connected to igpu, i have a fuzzy memory of this so i would need to check that again

[weak bluff]

does your laptop supports Nvidia Optimus?

MUX switch?

iirc you need MUX switch support to run VR via HDMI

[real pasture]

ill check that in 2-3h when im home and then let you know

[rustic garnet]

if you have a laptop can you even plug in all the sensors

you need at least three usb 3 ports

[rustic garnet]

this too

[real pasture]

yes

3 usb a type 3.2 gen2 iirc

or one a bit slower

[sly river]

Anyone else with the battery bank straps for their trackers have issues with the little USB cables breaking I buy in bulk because I keep hitting them, laying on them, or stepping on them while playing games with Fbt

[weak bluff]

i do but majority of them are caused by 90 degrees cables cheap from China

i switched to standard non 90 deg and it remaing to be seen what will come

[real pasture]

looks like no, though some people said that if a laptop has a usb-c port and you plug a display into it, its apparently connected directly to the dedicated gpu

not sure if i should trust that

[weak bluff]

Only if its DisplayPort-alt USB-C

You need to look if it has that spec

It's not common so unlikely

[real pasture]

https://kelaptop.com/en/asus-rog-strix-g15-g513ic-hn003-90nr0501-m00040
that is my laptop model btw, and this site says that i do have dp alt mode

[weak bluff]

But there is an easy way to get out of this mess is to just buy Quest headset that does not use displayport

[real pasture]

i already have a quest3, and i was looking for a pcvr type headset

[weak bluff]

Quest 2, quest 3s works

Oh yeah

Forgot

Yeah no in that case

I don't recommend switching to anything

[real pasture]

bummer

[rustic garnet]

why though

[brisk viper]

even playing fairly intense vr games ive never been anywhere near maxxing out my 32gb

[real pasture]

• my laptop struggles power-wise with the native res of my q3
• i want to experience a true compression-less pcvr experience
• (in case of cv1) better tracking than q3
• OLED panels (major reason)
• (in case of psvr2) eyetracking (there are people working on it, eyetracking now somewhat works on pcvr), and adaptive triggers and other nice psvr2 features once people get them working, which doesnt seem now like a far reality

like i said, i wouldnt mind SDE that much if i could run a headset on my laptop on its native res

[real pasture]

lcvr modpack with like 150 mods: let me introduce myself

[rustic garnet]

i think i would shoot for the psvr

cv1 sensor setup is a hassle and while yeah 360 controller coverage is a nice perk im sure the psvr tracking is just fine

especially with a laptop where you cant just leave them plugged in

and youre going to want to make sure they dont move after youve done room calibration

If you already have a powerful laptop id get an inside out tracked kit just for the ability to move it alone honestly

Is it not possible to stream to the quest at a lower resolution

[real pasture]

yes, but i lose quality

[rustic garnet]

well duh

[real pasture]

ik

[rustic garnet]

The cv1 has about a fourth of the pixels

i figure if you were to drop the stream and render res to that wont compression artifacts be more or less unnoticeable anyway

[real pasture]

considering im sometimes running my q3 at 200 pixels horizontally and vertically more than cv1 in some scenarios though

[rustic garnet]

though what

the panels and optic stack in a q3 are like objectively better than the rifts

[real pasture]

what about contrast in dark areas

[real pasture]

-though, at which point id just get a lower res headset for the laptop, since it doesnt look like im going to upgrade to a better pc anytime soon

[rustic garnet]

i havent tried a q3 personally but oled headsets have mura

keep that in mind

Idk do you have the possibility to try them before buying

vr kits are surprisingly preferential

[weak bluff]

its better to lower rest the quest 3 than to buy lower res display

i learned this the hard way

the quest 3 high res could mean you can upgrade laptop and use same headset

so stick with it for years...?

if you really want OLED, there... arent any good choices not even upcoming quest 4 will have it

the closest you can get to deep black levels for your laptop maybe is local dimming of Quest Pro

they however dont work well when there are too many black and colours in between

[weak bluff]

compression-less is not worth much if you have Nvidia GPU trust me i knew this when i switched Quest 2 to Rift S

unless you often go to most extreme bitrate situation

Nvidia does encoding quite well

eye tracking is quite useless if the games dont support it and most games still dont or support in limited capacity

[scenic quest]

h264

amd and nvidia h265 or av1 is on par

and rx 9000 also got the upgraded h264 encoder being like 20% better then last gens

[weak bluff]

yeah but this laptop is RTX 3050

no AV1 encode

[scenic quest]

ofc

[weak bluff]

also contra to popular belief, AMD AV1 is in my opinion rubbish and overrated because of lack of B-frame in RX 7000 series, RX 9000 reviewers shows it for some reason (wtf is going on AMD???) worse than RX 7000

[scenic quest]

wut

[weak bluff]

https://youtu.be/kkf7q4L5xl8?si=nxVVHthbwj2J6dDN&t=360

this

i believe this is software issue? because its wild

[scenic quest]

no the h264 encoder has just been shit

[weak bluff]

and its brutal to see its worse despite b-frame support

[scenic quest]

h265 and av1 are fine

[weak bluff]

watch the review

its talkign about AV1

[scenic quest]

massive difference, this was the biggest

this is h264

[weak bluff]

AMD is still incompetent when it comes to driver support despite meme trying to say they are getting better its still lackluster

[scenic quest]

well you cant say shit about general driver support while nvidia over there are making even their gtx cards shit themselves with the new drivers

[weak bluff]

they are not mutual exclusive both can be true

but in VR, Nvidia is doing fine now

[scenic quest]

i have done lots of vr with my 7900 xtx biggest issue i have had is with oculus being shit with the amount of time it took for them to add in h265 as something you could do with air link and then i just went virtual desktop

[weak bluff]

i think there is a way to force it in oculus debug tool but at that point if you have VD just use it

[scenic quest]

It has since before i got it but Airlink is just shit

[rustic garnet]

is av1 even supported for quest

[scenic quest]

Quest 3

[proper gale]

The display quality on the Vision Pro is pretty unforgettable. Wouldn't buy one, but it's worth trying out at an Apple Store.

[weak bluff]

Quest 3s and 3 only

[pale orbit]

https://www.sfchronicle.com/tech/article/zuckerberg-meta-reality-labs-layoffs-20294672.php

[high apex]

"subscribe now to continue reading"

[vernal agate]

Is there an extension cable for the vive wireless adapter?

[haughty thistle]

For which cable, the one going to the transmitter?

[neat jewel]

I’m thinking of upgrading my current VR headset from the htc vive to either the valve index or the quest 3 with the valve index controllers which do you think is better for me who plays PCVR

[storm robin]

I don't think Quest 3 is PCVR? Even if it was I wouldn't give them my money

[sacred perch]

It can be used as a pcvr but air link is buggy and the usb c connection is iffy

[little plinth]

Steam link

And virtual desktop

[weak bluff]

Quest 3 for SteamVR is fine

Quest 3 is better value than Index its better in display but worse by little bit in everything else like tracking, latency, compression

if you plan to use base station devices with quest 3, the calibration may be annoying

[neat jewel]

So should I get the quest 3 for PCVR or stick to getting the valve index?

[weak bluff]

either is an upgrade

Pros and cons of getting Quest 3:

• Better screen
• Better lens
• Wireless capability

• Stock strap is bad but can be replaced
• Controller tracking is meh
• Battery powered
• Compressed video
• Worse tracking
  Pros of Index:

• Better Audio
• Better comfort
• Better controller
• Good potential for mods (eye tracking addons, face tracking addons)

• Fresnel lens
• Always wired
• Outdated

there are extra cons for Quest 3 if you say use vive tracker or cknuckles is you need to calibrate headset manually for it to work with others

[little plinth]

Comfort is, subjective

And as you mentioned are a cheap fix

Wired however

Is a BIG downgrade in comfort

[little plinth]

Though, subjective also

But most would agree

[pale orbit]

valve is getting closer to releasing their new standalone headset, which will (one would hope)probably have a DP so it can be hooked up to pc natively.

[rustic garnet]

"closer" doesn't say anything about how close they are though

i mean i sure hope they're getting closer it would be a shame if they kept working and working and got further from releasing something ...

[pale orbit]

they have headsets in testers hands already, just the other week they were ramping up facial interface production

[weak bluff]

If your source is Gabe follower it's unreliable rumour

I still bet 99% they won't release this year

Get less copium

[rustic garnet]

fr if your source is anything but an official valve announcement it's more or less worthless considering theyve scrapped projects 90% complete in the past

Not saying they'll scrap this headset but if theyre not perfectly satisfied they will delay it more

[native goblet]

am happy, going to start tinkering with microelectronics soon this month !
gonna get started on a face & eye tracking apparatus for my VR headset :)
that ought to be an interesting little project, hopefully I get it done properly without too many issues

[hasty compass]

I would say Battery powered is atleast neutral since it allows for playing without wired, its not like you can have wireless and no battery. All you need is an okay ethernet connection and the right router for about £70 and Virtual Desktop

If you get the BoboVR headset you fix both the battery solution as it comes with a magnetic and detachable battery so if you want you can buy multiple for 100% uptime and you can play with no wires

[trail grove]

About the stock stap i put a sock behind it as a cushion, battery i have a 10.000mAh powerbank in my pocket that makes it last 6 hours total, compression is only an issue with confetti if you have a router for it
About the controller tracking uhh its like 70/30 when it comes to beatsaber: mostly i have no issues but some days its really bad

Also i thought metas support would be horrible but when my facial interface broke i made a warrently claim and within 30 min i got a verification email for a new fa and they upgraded me to a silicon one without me asking lol

[vernal agate]

Is there an rp-sma amplifier i can use with my vive wireless adapter? I am going to be using an extension cable for the transmitter but im not sure how well the signal will be able to reach the transmitter from the wi-gig card

[cold shard]

Nothing a consumer could obtain at least

[vernal agate]

Not with that attitude

Im just trying to make this cable longer.

[cold shard]

PNA and/or LNAs for ISM mmWave is just the kind of thing that has been integrated into the RFSoC/RFFEs. It's not large enough of a market to justify a dedicated production-scale chip for that. If you can find one it's gonna be uber expensive and the kind of thing you have to quote a price for because they'll probably make it on-demand.

[rustic garnet]

how much longer?

im thinking a pcie riser could work

Thats only a 1x slot didn't they make really cheap 1x risers for mining back when that was popular

[vernal agate]

Like an extra 6ft. I have an extension cable already but im not sure how signal integrity is going to be upon extending it another 6ft or 10ft if i decide to use the 10ft cable

Just trying to see if there is some kind of either amplifier or repeater

[hushed storm]

API cameras are now unlocked for devs on the quest 3

https://www.forbes.com/sites/andrewwilliams/2025/04/30/meta-quest-3-and-3s-finally-get-important-mixed-reality-upgrade/

[rancid kestrel]

It doesn't work, I've tried it.

Well, not with an amp.

[brisk viper]

anyone ever had a good experience with no mans sky pcvr?

[vernal agate]

My vive console isnt starting. How do i fix this?

[steady coyote]

Does the hp reverb g2 gen 1 cable not like the 550 and 570 chipset for amd? And will it cause driver errors, because that’s what’s happening with mine

[haughty thistle]

Yup, doesn’t like the AMD USB controllers. There’s two possible fixes. One is to use the Gen 2 cable and the other is to use a USB hub between the cable and the motherboard

Has to be a USB 3 hub btw

[rustic garnet]

How does a hub work if the root controller is the issue?

[haughty thistle]

No idea. Iirc the "fixed" G2 cable basically just implements a hub chip.
My guess is that the original cable is lacking what's known as a USB power-hoist (an indicator for the root controller that a connected device receives external power). Normally these show up as a USB hub. The G2 is externally powered, but the power injection point doesn't show up in the USB chain, so it's likely that the controller just freaks out and throws an error as a result...

You don't even need an externally powered hub for the G2 to work. Any proper USB 3 hub will work

[rustic garnet]

Ok that tracks i was thinking something power related

because a hub leaves the serial data intact

[steady coyote]

Also I read somewhere that if you plug it into a pc running 24h2 it completely bricks the headset. And I have two boot drives one for vr (23h2) and the one for my regular games (24h2 from my dead laptop)

[fossil siren]

I accidentally auto updated to 24h2 so can't use mine 🥲

just hoping someone makes some 3rd party drivers at some point or something

[haughty thistle]

All WMR headsets won't work on Win11 24H2, but this is more because the drivers don't exist on that version of Windows.
It wont brick the headset. It's honestly more comparable to trying to run like a Vive Pro 2 on Linux or smth

Just roll back to 23H2 and it'll work again

[steady coyote]

Alright thanks

[wintry wolf]

my controllers dont wnana like work togeher

just for some reaosn wont connect both too eachother'

one works great

disconnect it

other works great that was blue not too long ago

start up controller one again

nothing

i have tried using my wands too connect them too see if it was the controllers it wasnt

lighthouse thing

you name the easy try too fix it and ive 9/10 already done it

like can anyone please help me

if its connected too the pc it works

but if not it doesnt

[haughty thistle]

This likely means that they're both paired to the same dongle. Try to pair them again while the other controller is connected!

[rustic garnet]

Note that you wont be able to download the wmr service from microsoft after they deprecate it

[wintry wolf]

what dongle

it connects too the normal headset through my lighthouse sor something right

[haughty thistle]

Your headset has two dongles inside of it (assuming you have an Index, Vive, or otherwise lighthouse tracked headset)

[wintry wolf]

tried that too though

[wintry wolf]

yeah

It says this too

[wintry wolf]

Sooo yeah and it doesn’t look like it’ll be a self fix

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, that sounds more like a faulty headset 😬

[wintry wolf]

Nah it worked yesterday

And it worked for a minute today it just kept losing the connection and then not

[haughty thistle]

Hardware can fail all the time

[wintry wolf]

Yeah but couldn’t I just fix it if it’s a simple dongle-

Or like replace it in some way or another

[haughty thistle]

If I'm seeing that right, you have a Cosmos Elite. In that case what you could try is remove the front plate and put it back on. Hope that it's just a loose connection

[wintry wolf]

Okay then lemme try gimme a second

[haughty thistle]

Otherwise all the LH hardware (including dongles) should be in that front plate, so if the plate itself is bad, you could try replacing just that

[wintry wolf]

uhhh i could see if theres even a replacment for that

If not just fucked I guess?

Cuz it didn’t work-

[haughty thistle]

The LH Frontplate was sold standalone as an upgrade for regular Cosmos headsets. The Elite just came with it pre-installed

Tho I'm not sure if it's still made

[wintry wolf]

I’m not so sure

130 bucks

Godamn-

This hobby is a little expensive as fuck-

[rustic garnet]

correction the vive line is expensive

[haughty thistle]

Vive (especially with their more recent hardware) has always been more expensive then the competition while offering (usually) a worse experience :/
tbf the Cosmos did bring an interesting idea to the table, and it could've become a more popular idea, if HTC didn't screw up the camera tracking so badly...

Even to this date, I still read people just wishing headset X had lighthouse tracking as an option or headset Y had camera based tracking as an option... imagine if all it took to convert those headsets was just putting on a different faceplate (and not in the hardwired manner that Varjo ended up doing for the XR-4)

[steady coyote]

Should I get this one?

[wintry wolf]

I mean I just wanna have a vr that’s pc powered that I can boot up and play my simple little vr games with-

[haughty thistle]

That is the updated cable, yeah. But you can also get a decent enough USB hub from Amazon for like 15 bucks. It'll do the trick just as well

[steady coyote]

Ok

Would it have to be 3.1 or better, or will 3.0 work

[steady coyote]

Nvm I looked at the spec sheet

[steady coyote]

i don't know if you already answered this but here's a screenshot of my error and i did order the usb hub

[rancid charm]

VRChat performing setup!

Face tracking + Full body tracking

[haughty thistle]

Hmmm
2-43 doesn't seem to be a much reported error. The only result I did find that leads anywhere is an HP support forum one where the guy was using an unsupported low-end GPU (GTX 1050Ti)

I'd still say try the hub first (as it's the cheapest option)
Tho in the meantime, what GPU do you happen to have?

[brisk viper]

any idea on a free virtual desktop alternative? i only need the greenscreen passthrough option that quest link and steam link lack (image)

dont have the £20 for VD at the moment but i do have £4 quest cash if theres a cheaper alternative

[weak bluff]

try to get referral from a friend maybe

[haughty thistle]

I'm only aware of Quest Link, SteamVR Link, VD and ALVR as options for PCVR on the quest. No idea if ALVR can do the green screen thing tho...

[brisk viper]

https://github-wiki-see.page/m/korejan/ALVR/wiki/ALXR-Client this could be interesting

im not really sure how it works but it looks like a custom ALVR pc client that runs with passthrough? i dont understand it 🤷‍♂️

[brisk viper]

got it running, no clue on passthrough though smh

[steady coyote]

Amd rx 6600 and ryzen 5 5500

[brisk viper]

ALVR worked fine cheers

[real pasture]

there is a passthrough blend option in the streamer settings

if you are on the latest version (v20.13.0), the default lobby of alvr (before you connect) will use passthrough automatically, and then you have these options in the streamer

[steady coyote]

still doing sorta the same thing

[haughty thistle]

[steady coyote]

also it does this sometimes

[haughty thistle]

Again, 2-43 is pretty much undocumented. If the hub didn't do it, then I dunno what's wrong tbh...
Fact is you do need a hub with the original G2 cable on AMD mobos (at least 500-Series and older). But given that that didn't fix it for ya, then there must be something else problematic too...

[steady coyote]

the mobo it a few months old

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, 7-14 means USB init failed. Common symptom of the OG cable on old mobos...

What order you plugged everything in (not that it should matter, but still)

What I'd normally recommend is power first, then DP then USB. Had some init fails myself when I did it a different order in the past

[steady coyote]

when i did the power, dp, then usb and now its showing this

[haughty thistle]

Das weird...

How many displays are plugged into your GPU (besides the headset)?

[steady coyote]

1

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, that shouldn't be a problem either...

Huh... I'm honestly stumped...

[steady coyote]

😭

[haughty thistle]

• Your GPU is new enough
• You have tried the hub trick
• You are using the poweradapter

You have tried reseating the cable on the headset side..?

[steady coyote]

i got the gpu on xmas about a year or two ago, im switching betwen the usb hub and the usbs on the mobo, im using the stock power adapter, and ive reseated the cable on the headset a few times.

[haughty thistle]

USB Hub is necessary on AM4 boards

That is a known fact. Headset won't even start without one

[steady coyote]

it started the first few times without the hub when i got the headset

[haughty thistle]

Can you send a pic of the part of the cable the powerbrick plugs into?

(preferably with the powerbrick plugged in for scale)

[haughty thistle]

Yeah... that's weird. You got the original cable.. the one that throws a tantrum with AM4 chipsets... that's weird

Do you happen to have a mobo with USB 4 ports or smth? I can't imagine you were plugging the USB into the chipset when it worked for you that one time

[haughty thistle]

Yeah... hmm... no, that's most certainly a chipset port. That mobo has few enough USB ports that I'm certain of that... yeah, that's weird

[steady coyote]

Could it be this?

[haughty thistle]

Have you tried... flipping the adapter? The G2 needs USB 3, and the adapter clearly says that it only does USB 3 when plugged in a certain way...

[steady coyote]

When I flip it around it says “please plug into usb 3.1 Lightspeed”

Or supperspeed

[haughty thistle]

Ah, so it was on USB 3 already... been a while since I had to troubleshoot a G2 ^^"

[steady coyote]

It’s almost as stubborn as my ender 3

[haughty thistle]

3.0/3.1 doesn't really mean anything. Superspeed does. USB 3.x Gen1 or 5Gbps USB 😄

[steady coyote]

The hub is 5Gbps

[haughty thistle]

Haha. Yeah, WMR can be a bit picky at times. But I ensure you that your experience so far is far worse then what it's supposed to be, and I really don't know why... maybe it is the cable afterall. Does it have any visual damage (especially near the headset side)

Visual damage as in any unusual bumps in the plastic or weird kinks/bends

[haughty thistle]

Ho boy, that connector looks quite worn out

[steady coyote]

i got it used

[haughty thistle]

I mean, yeah, the headset hasn't been in production for a while now. Where else would you get one... but I can't help but wonder why the connector is this worn out. Damage like seen in the plastic there shouldn't occour from just a few plug in&outs...

[steady coyote]

When I have it plugged into the motherboard without the hub I get audio but when it’s plugged into the hub I don’t

[steady coyote]

brought to you by hp to make my life a living hell :)

(and microsoft)

[weak bluff]

i got my PSVR2 today

almost instant regret

actually

i regret

the halo band is comfortable but the way it fits headset to eye is so bad

[steady coyote]

It does this too

[green crypt]

what windows version are you using if it's windows 11 version 24H2. then you should try to go to 23H2 as that is the last supported windows version for wmr it's stupid tho so yeah

[steady coyote]

I’m on 23h2

[green crypt]

hmm yeah you could try to force wmr to reinstall maybe... tho if you get it working you for sure want to block windows from updating to 24h2 as then it just won't work at all anymore

[steady coyote]

how would i force reinstall

[steady coyote]

ive reinstalled it a few times

[neat tree]

Is the Meta Quest worth buying? I was looking forward to an open-source OpenVR.

[fair spoke]

I think so... I mean if don't have any other VR it's definitely a really good intro point, is cheap enough and good enough to experience most of what's available

you can hook it up to steamVR and if do development it's basically an Android device so use the Android NDK to compile stuff for it (can use Unreal engine or I imagine Unity too for targeting the headset), or can just have PC run the game and hook to the headset "PCVR" style so can be "standalone" android thing or PC powered

downside being meta/facebook integration, needing to sign in to setup etc. but that aside is fun

Guess one thing to look out for too though is extra costs for accessories (official link cable is more than it should be), rechargeable setup costs more games and whatnot but if have some cash to throw at it is worth checking out I think... I think you can use OpenXR stuff with it too but my experience with that is very limited, still though is good way to check out what's available and what's possible (play Alyx)

[brisk viper]

ever since i downloaded alvr i havnt been able to use steam link, any ideas?

[fair spoke]

Eh so the link stuff is unfortunately sort of a major pita, I haven't used alvr but anytime switching between wired and wireless streaming I've had to like kill everything VR related and try again a few times until all the settings are "right" and right combo of software to encode and stream the video without extra stuff

For quest I'm pretty sure need the fb app running for the wireless connection but is always a bit of wack a mole to get it working

My chicken scratch notes from when was messing more with remaking beat saber in unreal... There might be something on here that has a fix :D. Heh but more really check task manager and/or winky+r services.msc and see what VR processes are running and stop any unneeded

[real pasture]

if you want different settings on alvr, you can just get another instance (made extremely easy if you use the ALVR launcher app, separate from the streamer), as ALVR saves settings per-instance

no restarting steamvr needed and all your settings are kept

[real pasture]

thats unusual, check if adb.exe and/or vrserver.exe/vrmonitor.exe is running before starting steam link (you can check that in task manager)

(adb.exe can sometimes keep running after shutting down steamvr/when steamvr crashes when using ALVR in wired mode, that causes the "infamous" error message that some port is already in use, making you unable to use steamvr with any headset.)

[steady coyote]

Wmr does detect it on my grandma’s laptop just it doesn’t have a dp port

[haughty thistle]

Normally these errors sho up when it tries to actually init the headset, which it won't do without the DP connected

[upper prairie]

Does anyone else use a Quest? I have a Quest 2 and link has been getting progressively worse and worse over the past few months. It’s to the point where I’ll need to do 30-60min of troubleshooting and restarts every time I want to connect it.

I have a good USB-3 connection, and it worked (mostly) just fine a few months ago, but now it disconnects instantly whenever link tries to launch

[haughty thistle]

I presume you've already tried the USB bandwidth test in the Meta Link software..?

[serene stump]

New VR game just dropped and specs aren't crazy https://store.steampowered.com/app/3558730/Surviving_Mars_Pioneer/

Steam

Surviving Mars: Pioneer

Mars is calling—will you endure its unforgiving frontier?

The Red Planet is vast, desolate, and utterly indifferent to your survival. With nothing but your wits, limited resources, and the tools at your disposal, you must carve out an existence in one of the most hostile environments imaginable.

👩‍🚀VR Survival Systems: Monitor esse…

Price

$17.99

▶ Play video

[upper prairie]

Yep, shows all good when it connects

[past gust]

I have been having the same issue, tried to get on for ghosts of tabor and it wouldn’t let me

Kind of a bummer but my quest 2 controllers are dying anyways, might go for a PSVR2 or DPVR E4

[fair spoke]

Maybe double check the quest link app and drivers are up to date too there was an update a couple months ago and literally just opened it a few mins ago to see updates pushed, think if the headset gets updates but the app doesn't or vice versa can just end up with compatibility issues

[upper prairie]

Both are apparently up to date as far as either one will show, I'll keep checking for updates. Hopefully something will come along and fix it.

VTOL VR is fun

[strange sail]

Why do you regret it? I have one and it works perfectly fine on both my ps5 and pc

[weak bluff]

the face fit is quite poor

the controller

while i like the feel of it

the trigger have issues

halo band what can i say

its comfortable

but its very bad for tryign to fit it into your eyes

i find it hard to position it perfect into face

[strange sail]

I have no idea what that is lol

[strange sail]

It's pretty easy imo 🤷

[haughty thistle]

Between the PSVR2 and DPVR E4, I can guarantee you that you'll have a better time with the PSVR2 (assuming you have a compatible Bluetooth adapter)

Some people like halo bands, others hate it, I'm personally indifferent. Would recommend the Globular Cluster padding set tho, since the top strap makes the headset less likely to slip down the face ;D

[trail grove]

Meanwhile me who is still using the quest 3 cloth strap with a sock as a back polster

[real pasture]

personally i prefer halo-type straps for casual use and the default q3 headstrap when doing really intense and fast movements with the head (for example dance challenge maps in beat saber)

[weak bluff]

New headset dropped

I kinda like it

Not bad

If i ignore their bad record

[gloomy crater]

New headset: 😯
Pimax: 😐

[lime token]

I find it funny how their latest headsets are just copies of other products, first meganex and now bigscreen

[verbal magnet]

Hey guys looking at upgrading my PC for VR wanted to see if anyone had any decent recommendations today
I'm using a meta quest 3 and steam VR is not primary
I was running a Ryzen 7 5800xt
32gb of DDR4
7800xt but the 7800xt got popped into my sister's PC because her R9 380 died

So essentially I'm looking at replacing my GPU
I was thinking about putting my 7900gre into the PC and upgrading my main PC to a 7900xt, but I'm seeing I can save a few bucks if I buy the 5060ti which seems perfectly fine for what I'm doing (most demanding game being B&S) currently but I'm just getting into the VR so I'm not sure if that will change, I want to make sure I don't have to do much with it as this PC lives in my living room as a "console" and it's SFF with a 750w PSU so space is an issue

[lime token]

With VR on a Quest 3 I would reccomend something in the class of 9070 XT, 5070 ti, or a 4080. You can get away with 1 or 2 tiers lower if you need to, just make sure you get at least 16gb of VRAM.

[verbal magnet]

I don't know if it was a settings thing but when I did have the 7800xt it didn't seem like it was running well, lots of lag spikes resolution drops etc, the PC has a dedicated router as well so I don't think it was network traffic and I have gigabit fiber internet, I don't think the MQ3 can do hardwired on steam VR? If it can I haven't done it yet

[lime token]

I use Virtual Desktop wirelessly with a dedicated router. When I have problems I check the VD debug overlay and it can easily show me what part is having trouble, whether it's the game or my network connection

The q3 can do wired only using Quest Link

[verbal magnet]

I was just reading that, looks easy enough to set up

So the 5060ti wouldn't be worth buying for this guy, seems like I should hold off until more stock becomes available

I'm space limited as well, the case is a cooler master NR200 I believe

[lime token]

Pretty much, I'm not very impressed by pretty much any cards this gen

[verbal magnet]

I'm not impressed with much of anything from either party and Intel I've read just doesn't do VR well

[lime token]

[verbal magnet]

My 7900gre I don't think would fit in my case but when I do VR on that system it's fantastically fine

The 7900xt I found was $675 but I believe I'm power blocked with 750w if not I'm cutting it too close for comfort

[lime token]

I've done worse with a 750w PS, but ya it is risky

[verbal magnet]

I ran a 4070 ti on a 750w PSU.... It crashed.... A lot

[lime token]

I ran a 4080 and a threadripper 2920x with no issues on a 750 lol

[verbal magnet]

That's wild you got away with that

[lime token]

Ya, that system lasted me a long time, I've since moved to a safer 1200w with my newest build

[verbal magnet]

I think I'm going to order this 7900xt my 9950x needs a better buddy than the 7900gre

Sounds posh, but for the VR system I'm going to try and pick up one of the cards you mentioned above once stock and pricing fluctuates (hopefully)

[lime token]

Good luck, and understandable. I'm also in the posh zone with my system.

[verbal magnet]

Thank you again!

[haughty thistle]

It all started with the Crystal, which was a copy of the Varjo Aero, then came the Crystal Super, being a copy of the XR-4 (minus the passthrough stuff)... You get the jist

[weak bluff]

Pimax is a company that takes latest parts and turn it into headset

like they probably use same display as the one used in Rift CV1 and Dream Air SE uses same panel as Bigscreen Beyond

the Bigscreen Beyond panel can be bought on aliexpress its the seeye model

[haughty thistle]

I was more talking about how they seemingly come out with very similar headsets just a month or so after a competitor launched a product with lots of hype behind it
I'm aware of the part situation and that there's not many options to begin with. It's just a lil sus that their headset announcements always come mere weeks after those of a competitor and their product somehow has a similar proposition, while offering more for less

[weak bluff]

release new product before old one is released

[soft gulch]

Very easy to offer more for less when you skimp on totally unimportant things like QC

[weak bluff]

Pimax never have good track record on those

[soft gulch]

Exactly

[native goblet]

I think that's a bit overkill if the guy is on a limited budget
I don't have benchmarks on hand but I believe the B580 should land enough performance for a satisfying VR experience
and the 9060(XT) models should launch soon enough
9070XT, 9070, 5070 Ti and 5070 are all overpriced as they are right now so unless kyle can buy them comfortably, I don't think they should be the goto options here

[native goblet]

does your router have wifi 6 at a minimum ?

[native goblet]

the 5060s are dumpster fires and should be avoided at all cost

if you can find 5070(Ti) or 9070(XT) at MSRP, then go for that
but even at MSRP, the 5060s are pure disappointments

they don't offer much performance above the 4060s

which themselves didn't offer any uplift over the 3060s

the only thing that significantly went up in performance on the -60 class is AI processing power for DLSS 3 then 4 and that's just for frame generation

a B580 has more punch than a 4060 and comes with 12GB VRAM

intel made major strides with their drivers and XeSS(2) is better than FSR2/3 (idk about 3.1)

if you can afford to wait and see if the 9060s are worth it and sold at decent enough price, computex is just around the corner

and maybe intel will release other battlemage GPUs with some chance

[lime token]

I personally don't know if the Intel GPUs support VR yet, I have reccomended that GPU to friends who are just looking for a minimum gaming rig.
I do accept that lower tier GPUs can run VR, but the Quest 3 drives a lot of pixels and you sacrifice a lot of fidelity when you use lower class cards

[native goblet]

GPUs by default support VR, that has nothing to do with support
if it can rasterize frames, it can do VR

[lime token]

Nope

Last gen intel was a non-starter for VR

[native goblet]

well-

true

but that's an exception

they were first generation products and extremely low power

the uplift from alchemist to battlemage is huge

7600/4060 can VR

[lime token]

https://www.reddit.com/r/SteamVR/comments/1hpm8qs/comment/m4iqn80/?utm_name=mweb3xcss

[native goblet]

and we know the 580 has been benched above both of those

[lime token]

Still no support in Arc

[lime token]

Ya, though no guarantee

[native goblet]

but it works

[lime token]

With some people

[native goblet]

saying it doesn't support VR is just factually wrong

[lime token]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[native goblet]

most VR games work
I'm guessing it's just a matter of driver optimization, like a lot of games needed when Alchemist released

through driver updates, some games gained upwards of 280% performance

just on the alchemist series

because it was their first dedicated graphics generation

so they needed to put work into the drivers for refining them

the B580 supports whatever it can rasterize, VR included, it's just a matter of driver optimisation

[lime token]

Its a good card, its just not in a state I would recommend for VR. It also needs some VR benchmarks before I would be ready to recommend it for a Quest 3 or higher

[native goblet]

true

I used to be on a 3070 laptop

did some VR

was...

[lime token]

[native goblet]

suboptimal

moved over to a 9800X3D/9070XT combo with everything tuned
works brilliantly

maxxing out my HMD's 90Hz limit

[lime token]

Sorta same, I started on a 3060 for my desktop, dropped a bunch of money on a 4080 super soon after

[verbal magnet]

I found a 5070 for $550 brand new

[native goblet]

sounds good though I`d still hope you can get you hands on a better card if you can !

[verbal magnet]

I found a 7900xt for $675 but I don't think it will fit in my case I'm working with a max of 330mm but my 7800xt that was 304 was tight

The 5070 is 299mm so it's a hair smaller

[rustic garnet]

ai upscaling isn't applicable to vr performance

[rustic garnet]

ignorant thing to say

arc gpus straight up do not work with displayport/hdmi headsets

[rustic garnet]

thats so pretty i love sff boxes

[verbal magnet]

The 5070 didn't exist, so unfortunately back to square 1

[native goblet]

wifi vr exists

[native goblet]

i mentioned it because i guess he wont just do vr bruh

[verbal magnet]

The PC will only do VR

My VR PC is separate from my sit down and game PC

[gloomy crater]

Well, I thought the issue I've been experiencing for a week where my computer randomly restarts for no reason while gaming was being caused by a specific flat screen game, but it just happened while playing beat saber as well so I guess there's something wrong with my PC, not any specific game 😞 Depending on whether I get an acceptance or denial message tomorrow I'm possibly going to be moving across the state for two months for a temporary job and I won't be able to take my main rig with me anyway so I'm tempted to just put together a temporary PC to play games on to avoid the restarting issue until I leave and then I can take that with me when I go and wait till I get back to troubleshoot my main PC. Even if I do that though, the temporary PC would consist of an R5 3600 and a 5700XT so even though I could bring my Reverb G2 with me, I'm not confident that setup would do VR very well

[naive pebble]

quick question, highly unlikely but has anyone tested the higher end workstation grade Nvidia GPUs with steamvr? does it even work?

im talking like a100 or a6000

obviously not going to get one exclusively for that purpose but

if the cards cant serve a dual function I can't justify the cost and will probably just get multiple consumer grade GPUs instead.

and considering I could buy like 4 or 5 3090s for the same price as an a6000 it kind of seems like a bit of a silly question now.

[weak bluff]

We did on our university Nvidia A4000 Ampere it works like normal card

it works like normal GPU really

you have option for game ready driver or work driver

both works out

they are not good value unless you are 0.1% of scientists who need that essential features

[rancid kestrel]

I'm kinda curious as to what might be a decent GPU for the BigScreen 2.

[next osprey]

Best gpu you can get preferably with at minimum 16gb of vram prob

[rancid kestrel]

I mean, it's not like you can even buy a 5090. :V

I'd put my 4090 in my VR computer and the 3060 in my workstation but I occasionally use the 4090's grunt. .-.

[rancid kestrel]

How unreasonable would a 3090 Ti be?

[soft hound]

I mean, I run a Pimax 8KX on a 3090 Ti just fine
That renders at 3840x3160 per eye (on the second highest FoV setting)

[next osprey]

I mean or you could get a 7900xtx

[lime token]

That's not a bad VR card, around the 4070 Ti/5070 range

[little plinth]

better than 5070

12GB is shite

[rancid kestrel]

24 is a good amount.

What's the RT performance comparison?

[little plinth]

Brain turned off

I meant 12 gb is shite

[quaint beacon]

Hella late, but I'm pretty sure you could "force" frame gen on vr. I know that some applications like virtual desktop interpolates frames if there's any kind of stutter

[cold shard]

That's not why it isn't applicable. The kind of movement a VR camera does will create a vomit-inducing mess of artifacts. There's significant artifacts even with the much more predictable movement of a standard mouse+kb controlled camera, but at least they aren't right in your face.

[weak bluff]

Frame gen is easy, making it work well is hard

Its why VRChat did not implement FSR 1.0 hack because the recommended way is hard to implement and the hacky way of insertion looks bad

Adding frame gen makes it even worse

[fair spoke]

there is like "pose prediction" and some crazy stuff that happens with the frame generation to try and reduce latency but yea haven't heard of any like "frame gen" that I can recall:
https://developers.meta.com/horizon/blog/the-latent-power-of-prediction/
https://developers.meta.com/horizon/blog/a-vr-frames-life/
^^ some semi relevant stuff about the pose prediction

[rustic garnet]

there's also the issue of doubling the render latency which considering the wireless round trip latency of a quest setup might not be too bad

[upper prairie]

Quest Link does that as well with Asynchronous Space Warp. It can make games look super jittery and wobbly, even if there’s good framerate on the PC.

[cold shard]

Yes, they've got clever ways to help increase framerate. It just isn't AI upscaling

I guess it might also come down to how willing someone is to accept low quality as acceptable though. Some people could be fine with the artifacts and lack of clarity. ymmv ig

[upper prairie]

Low clarity is better than 2fps movement

[rancid kestrel]

Frame gen and AI smearfests don't belong anywhere near VR, especially since they don't belong in normal games.

[fair spoke]

I mean you can enable DLSS while using VR encoded output right? But they are separate things for sure (in terms of like pose predictions and rendering vs "AI framegen" and/or upscaling)

[cold shard]

It's not blocked by some impossible technical hurdle if that's what you're asking. VR games don't typically directly support it so it does require a mod to get it

[haughty thistle]

I've used DLSS both in flat games and in VR (ETS2/ATS have a mod that properly adds DLSS to the game). DLSS works a lot lot better for flat games then in VR... it makes the VR image a mushy mess, especially for distant things...

[fair spoke]

Eh yeah I've done limited PC vr stuff but just saying they aren't strictly "exclusive" things, not going to have DLSS happening on the headset but also nothing blocking you from enabling it PC side (for games with support)

[cold shard]

It's not gonna save 2fps. To be absolutely clear we're talking about AI upscaling, not ASW or related techniques (not that those would save 2 fps either though lol).

[rustic garnet]

now im wondering is it due to the much lower angular resolution? or more because the way the camera moves and such things actually unique to vr implementations?

[weak bluff]

AI upscaling should be optimised for asynchronous reprojection

Frame gen rely on previous and next frame to guess frame

Asynchronous reprojection have advantage of accurate middle frame

[cold shard]

I mean motion artifacts and lack of clarity aren't necessarily mutually exclusive issues (although I suppose artifacts would contribute to lack of clarity too). I find the artifacts make me wretch so it's why I've called them out specifically. Maybe some really great implementation have minimized the artifacts (I doubt it though), but I assume the lack of clarity is more challenging to resolve (pun intended).

[haughty thistle]

I'd hazard to guess angular resolution mostly. If distant text is barely ledigable in VR as-is, then lowering the render res and trying to reconstruct already non-existing details certainly won't help

[rancid kestrel]

That's a good point. God imagine if the AI just "thought" you were moving in a different direction for a frame, that sounds like it would make you sick. The only times I've really felt sick in VR is when the image froze on a static frame and this would be worse.

[rancid kestrel]

Huh, I suppose with some 3D sound shenanigans you could make the controllers sound like they have Wiimote speakers.

[haughty thistle]

Index controllers have a type of vibration motor that is basically like a normal speaker, just with a weight instead of a membrane. So ofc it can be used as a speaker (same goes with the Switch JoyCons btw)

[native goblet]

huh, I didn't know
why do you separate both like this ?

[native goblet]

literally any GPU that will do VR with other headsets
it's not like it has a drastically higher resolution screen than other VR headsets

the pico 4 ultra has a 2160² screen, the beyond 2 has 2560², it IS a chunk of extra pixels but a GPU that works with 2160 will work with 2560

wait the beyond 2 doesn't do wifi streaming ?

[native goblet]

define unreasonable

why would it be unreasonable

[native goblet]

not bad at all tbh

[real pasture]

nope

[native goblet]

facts

jsut fckn optimise your games people !

that's why I love VR

that's the wall game devs hit that make them realise they suddenly need to put in the work to optimise their shit

and they realize if they keep those optimization in non-VR, the FPS goes up as well

weird how that works huh

[native goblet]

damn, shame

[haughty thistle]

tbf straming over regular wifi (5GHz/6GHz) kinda sucks. It might be good enough for your average joe, but a 1k+ headset deserves better quality then wifi...

[real pasture]

unless you really hate cables

there is a reason for wireless adapters on wired-only pcvr headsets

imo there should still be an option to be tethered, and if you dont like having a cable under your feet that could easily break (or one that you would trip over), then have a wireless adapter, either as an addon or as a built-in thing

[rancid kestrel]

Isn't it like, 5x the resolution of the Vive?

So ~10x the pixels.

[rancid kestrel]

Price to performance essentially.

I do want to play racing games.

[haughty thistle]

Still doesn't change the fact that there's better wireless alternatives to Wifi...
The problem with Wifi is that the RF bands are used by all sorts of devices and not just VR. 6GHz might not have the problem now, but it will as it get's adopted more. The problem is that VR is super latency critical, and you can't ensure consistent latency if you have other devices just randomly shouting in...

Wireless VR needs a dedicated RF channel to become competitive with wired VR. Whether that's 60GHz or in some other frequency band doesn't matter, but you can't have the frequency shared with phones, IOT and other crap...

[rancid kestrel]

Honestly if I was rich I would get a Faraday cage for VR.

I don't have issues with my wireless Vive.

[haughty thistle]

Well, Vive Wireless uses 60GHz, not 5 or 6GHz...

[real pasture]

ah, havent seen it in that way, thanks for explaining

[rancid kestrel]

Your point still stands that if other random crap uses it near enough that it will prevent VR from working.

[cold shard]

60GHz is line of sight highly directional mmWave. You'd need some extremely unlikely circumstances to encounter interference on all 3/4 802.11ad channels that vive wireless can use.

I doubt the 802.11ax Low Power Indoor 6GHz channels (there are 3 160MHz LPI channels in the US, though only 1 doesn't overlap with narrower standard power channels) would ever experience meaningful congestion either. Just closing a door between the client and ap is enough to make an LPI channel drop off substantially

[haughty thistle]

The thing about these niche channels in the 6GHz range is that they aren't global. The higher frequency channels are available in only a few countries (not to mention that the 6GHz band isn't available at all in some places). Not sure if those LPI channels are affected by the high frequency channel availability tho...

[cold shard]

True, 6GHz channel availability and power levels are all over the place globally. For many countries every band is considered LPI (which is mostly just the lowest UNII-5 band). I don't know at what power levels though. I can only confidently say the US/Canada LPI bands will stay very low congestion

[weak bluff]

With the power of openwrt there is no artificial limitation

[cold shard]

Lmao. Iirc the incumbent in the US was like concert venue mics and shit, but if it's military use in other countries you may piss off people with the means to find and fine you

[rancid kestrel]

It sucks that wireless VR peaked with the Vive.

I'm really looking forward to trying out a new headset though.

I just don't want to wait until August.

[sterile coyote]

Anyone know how to sideload on the quest after version 76?

There are 0 useful tutorials because of the security patch and none of them actually use the latest

[sterile coyote]

I tried using adb to see if install would pop up in the context menu but nada since sideload didn't work.

😭

I'm just trying to read my novels bro

Is it so hard to let the andriod device run andriod applications???

Any help would be appreciated.

Idek how sidequest exists if I can't do this.

[sterile coyote]

So apparently the desktop version of Sidequest let's you sideload

Poggers

[real pasture]

sidequest (quest version) didnt work in early days of v74 as well, the app prob got updated to work on v74

[leaden ridge]

i think they quit working on sidequest

idk

[rancid kestrel]

Blocking ADB isn't much of a security update....

[fair spoke]

that is a bit of a bummer I imagine they already pushed updates for the Unreal plugins so can use their new packager/flashing tools but was nice being able to use adb and "regular android tools"/studio with it

wonder why the move away from ADB for packaging APKs though it does seem like a weird move if not moving away from Android entirely

meta horizon OS is their own "thing" but fork of some version of Android OS too, strange

[pale orbit]

https://wccftech.com/apple-vision-pro-owners-regret-purchasing-the-expensive-headset/

[fair spoke]

That's no surprise, I thought only reviewers and maybe some apple devs would buy it but no real market for headset at that price with the existing market of options.

[rancid kestrel]

No PCVR support means it's DoA as far as I'm concerned.

[weak bluff]

But that's not the reason why it's failed

[little plinth]

definitely not the 3500 buckaroo

[native goblet]

vive : 1080x1200 (1296000px)
P4U : 2160x2160 (4665600px)
Bey2 : 2560x2560 (6553600px)

[native goblet]

hmmmm well we know the relative performance of the cards
depends how much they go for on you local market

[native goblet]

...why ?

[native goblet]

oh

[rancid kestrel]

If I needed it to make wireless work in that hypothetical.

[native goblet]

yeah a sheet of paper will block 60GHz

I mean, Vive is outdated by now

with as well go with something better

imo the GOAT right now is the Pico 4 Ultra

[rancid kestrel]

That's why I'm getting a new headset.

[native goblet]

what it offers is essentially unmatched

the FBT pucks they sell alongside are ubeatable in quality/price ratio

not perfect but leaps ahead of literally everyrone else

and solid compatible DIY projects for eye/face tracking

[rancid kestrel]

FBT?

[native goblet]

full body tracking

[rancid kestrel]

Ah.

I have no use for that right now.

[native goblet]

they sell ankle straps as base setup
and you can get the waist strap to add an extra node for improved tracking
costs 140€ to acquire, is handled by the headset so works standalone, have yet to see something with any other competitor

[native goblet]

is fine, just mentioned it en passant

I personally own one and briefly tested Q2/Q3, the 4U is head by quite a significant lead imo

but beyond that, to each their own

[rancid kestrel]

The quests don't interest me at all.

[native goblet]

what are you looking at then ?

[rancid kestrel]

Big screen 2.

[native goblet]

ah if you only do PCVR car sim then it does sound like the best option
but if you want to try literally anything else, then you're SoL

dual micro OLED makes me jealous tho

we're still "stuck" on LCD in the 4U for now

[rancid kestrel]

PCVR is the best why wouldn't I upgrade to something that's less than that?

I'm just sad I'm losing wireless but it's time to get a better HMD.

[native goblet]

no no, I explicitly mentioned PCVR car sim (or any vehicle sim for that matter since I assume all vehicle sim are played in static position)
for anything PCVR not car sim, you're SoL
no controllers, no passthrough, no wireless, it's just a VR display

though it is a damn good one

wait a second

how much is the beyond 2 ?

HOLY SHIT

HOW MUCH ????

1370€

1020$

FUCK THAT

GOD DAMN

and the eye tracking version is a +180€ upsell

holy shit

geezus

for 180€ I get the hardware to DIY both eye AND face tracking for my 4 Ultra

I'd know, I'm currently doing that

[little plinth]

you'll find yourself appreciating versatility

i love being able to bring my quest3 to vacation and still play

[rancid kestrel]

Yeah I'm going to use index ones.

The point of it is to just be a HMD, I wouldn't expect it to come with anything else.

[peak tinsel]

I know very little about VR but am interested. However, I want VR for pretty much 1 reason. Giant Screens.
Am I able to play Apex Legends in VR using say a virtual 90ft screen with a ridiculous resolution around 90k while using a keyboard and mouse?

[weak bluff]

Does Apex even allow that?

You need consider if anyone tried and if it is officially supported because many games despite having mods for VR the anti cheat will hate that and ban you

[peak tinsel]

Apex is an example. Replace Apex Legends with any other online Third or First PErson FPS/RPG Etc as well as any other Desktop Game like Oblivion or Assassin's Creed.

Diablo, Borderlands, etc...

I simply want VR to create giant screens and maybe several or like 20 or thirty. I want to be surrounded by media while being able to play desktop games with keyboard and mouse on giant screens.

The goal would be to do something like have every different series of Star Trak all playing at the same time on a different screen while still being able to play Desktop Games with Keyboard & Mouse in a VR environment. Ensuring that only the screens I directly looked at gave me audio and even then a mute and unmute option for each virtual screen would be nice.

There are so many cool things that I believe VR will be able to do and I'm not sure on what the actual capabilities are.

[weak bluff]

Oh so like

Play as virtual monitor

You won't get better resolution just the feel of larger screen plus you might get motion sick while doing it

[rustic garnet]

You can but the resolution will be pretty bad

Compared to a normal sized 4k monitor or even a 1440 monitor

uneven frame pacing might also be a problem if your desktop app renders at 60 or 120 and the headset updates at 90 hz

though im sure there are software solutions to that i havent tried

[rancid kestrel]

Oh yeah the resolution will be awful. Think about it like this, you can have the highest pixel density screen at 20"+ or the same pixel density at like 2" on your face.

[fair spoke]

Meh it's not *that bad, but yes you aren't getting more pixels per inch by changing anything in the virtual environment so however high res the screens for the VR headset is an upper limit and whatever part of those screens your eyes can see is some fraction of the entire screen.

Since I have a big screen 55" TV here and nice monitor for my desktop (32" 4k 144Hz) the VR theatre or gaming on a 2d surface there doesn't have much appeal but could see if had smaller space or travelling or other cases where would be nice to use.

[rustic garnet]

it's fine for sure even on an og rift/vive you still get the "huge screen" experience for like movies or cinematic games perchance

it's just not better than say a projector and a large canvas

It's infinitely more flexible though of course

if you want a dozen different windows all around you in space you simply cant do that with real monitors

(well strictly speaking you can but it's wildly impractical)

[reef marsh]

Apple Vision Pro on the Price Is Right
https://twitter.com/i/status/1922456345015705726

Justin Ryan ᯅ (@justinryanio) on X

This is what happens when the Vision Pro shows up on The Price Is Right.

X · May 14, 2025, 12:58 AM

[rancid kestrel]

Wait, why do you think this is only good for car sims?

[peak tinsel]

My question still has not been answered. Can I natively play desktop games in VR on a virtual screen while using a keyboard and mouse?

[lime token]

Yes, mixed reality headsets like the Quest 3s/3 work pretty well with that

[fair spoke]

Yep can use whatever inputs basically VR headset is your monitor/output and acts as input for feeding head position/body tracking info as inputs but can use Xbox controller or keyboard mouse whatever if doing pcvr

With quest can hook stuff up over Bluetooth as well if using some kind of "regular controller" for games

I play some ms flight sim with hotas setup and VR for display is pretty fun but easy to lose track of where stuff is when can't see it (options for passthrough some sections of VR to see controls but prefer being fully immersed)

Tried doing some unreal engine work while in headset too but is okay for quick edits of game but if more than a real quick edit would pop out of goggles to make changes

[peak tinsel]

Thank you.

[fair spoke]

np

[weak bluff]

yes, not recommended tho

but because you insist

i strongly suggest buy headset with return window so you can change your mind

avoid low res headset like around 1920x1920 per eye or below at least i recommend

[rancid kestrel]

Yeah SteamVR has a desktop mode for playing games in your headset, I've never used it though.

[rustic garnet]

That and virtual desktop and bigscreen and etc.

[native goblet]

No I didn't say that (or maybe I misworded, idk) I said that a tethered VR display like that was much more oriented to vehicle sims
It can't go wireless, it doesn't support anything beyond displaying something, it has nothing to go for itself besides very good resolution and micro OLED screens at a price I personally find stupid because you could get two solid standalone capable HMDs for the same price and the eye tracking version is another 180;200€/$ upsell

[rancid kestrel]

Standalone is worthless though.

[native goblet]

It's not
Idk why you're stuck on the idea that it's worthless
Standalone capable means PCVR wifi capable
I am not aware of a single HMD that isn't standalone yet untethered for PCVR and includes hand controllers

If you don't move, you don't move, so it's not useful to you
But there are plenty of people who like PCVR gaming and want to be tetherless when moving around

And the only ones able to do that are standalone HMDs

And the most recent ones are incredibly capable

[rancid kestrel]

Is any of the Valve stuff on there and have they fixed the compression issues with trying to shove so much data down such a small pipe?

[native goblet]

Define "any of the valve stuff"

[rancid kestrel]

Alyx, The Lab, I think they have a couple of others but those are the main ones.

I don't think you can use a wheel with them either.

[native goblet]

And wifi 6 is enough to play high quality VR, it has more than enough bandwidth to push PC streamed VR through wifi 6

[rancid kestrel]

Isn't it only like 1Gb or so theoretical?

[native goblet]

You mean Steam games on standalone ? There's none
But name me one PC dependent HMD that's wireless with controllers and supports other things like body tracking, I'll wait

[rancid kestrel]

You need ~8.8Gb for raw modern VR, that's a very tall order for Wi-Fi and compression.

[rancid kestrel]

Vive.

[native goblet]

Been able to do a speed test on my Neo 3 Link (wifi 6) and get 700mbps online
Streaming VR from PC, Pico Connect has a slider that goes all the way up to 300mbps and I think Virtual Desktop has about the same cap

[native goblet]

Isn't it standalone ? (on paper)

[rancid kestrel]

Yeah that's going to be over a 10x compression ratio.

That's insane.

[rancid kestrel]

Huh?

[native goblet]

Unnoticeable
I used them with USB-C DPort, I saw no difference

And I have a good resolution screen and beefy PC that can get higher resolution raster than the screen does

I play games in 25XX*25XXpx and the screen is 2160x2160

[rancid kestrel]

I do not believe that.

[native goblet]

Feel free to not believe what I can get screenshots for you if I was in front of my desk
I go in steamVR, check raster resolution, it's set on 25xx*25xx and I can see the FPS when playing it through Virtual Desktop's "task manager" or directly in VRChat for example

I can get anywhere from 45 to 90FPS in VRC depending on situation and I was playing BoneWorks in 2500^2 with 90FPS

[haughty thistle]

You can't push very high resolutions over wifi without it turning to potato quality or having a latency too high for VR. That's a fact.
Not to mention that even at lower resolutions, the latency is technically still to high, only reason it isn't vomit simulator is because the headset does additional ATW, and as a result controller movement looks like it's moving through jelly

[native goblet]

Oh and btw, the 4 Ultra has wifi 7, I have a wifi 7 AP and my desktop has fiber (yes, fiber out of a network card direct to my switch which then does 2.5G to my AP)

[haughty thistle]

Wifi is good for the average joe wanting to have a casual chat with friends in VRC, but trying to play competitive in VR over wifi is like trying to play CS:Go on a cloud computer

[native goblet]

I set my streamer app to 180mbps, I don't think I'm losing a whole lot of quality and if I wanted to, I'd just push 300mbps

[native goblet]

I get a 10-12ms latency to PC, which is barely anything

[haughty thistle]

Haha. 180mbps is potato quality for Quest 2/Pro resolution

[native goblet]

I get bigger ping from PC to internet

[native goblet]

Sorry you have bad hardware then

[haughty thistle]

I dunno what number you were looking at, including en- and de-code your at a minimum latency floor of around 30-40ms, just from the video en- and de-code...

Hey, matter of the fact, if your happy with Wifi, that's fine. Just don't expect that everyone is happy with it

[native goblet]

Virtual Desktop's "task manager" (idk what they call it in software, I forgot) has a breakdown of the latency pipeline, I just tell you what the "total" says

Slowest I've seen ever was 21ms

[weak bluff]

but like does it says total latency like

including encode and decode

[native goblet]

And that was on Neo 3 Link (wifi 6)

[native goblet]

Yes

[haughty thistle]

Imo, Wifi is terrible for VR, just from the fact that you have to A. compress the video feed quite heavily to not run into latency issues and B. have to deal with other devices possible screaming into your transmission trashing any sort of consistency with the latency. 6GHz might not have the congestion problem yet, but it will as more and more phones and IOT Garbage adopts it.
Imagine living in an apartment with 30 different APs around you...

[native goblet]

The streamer app gives the encode time to the receiver app in the headset which gives you the decode time and it shows the full breakdown including frame raster time on PC
Just look it up mate, I'd give you screenshots but I'm 20mn away from starting an exam for my degree

[rancid kestrel]

That's like saying you don't notice when YouTube drops video bitrate.

[weak bluff]

im pretty sure 80Gbps wired is better than 180Mbps wireless ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[native goblet]

That's literally not saying that
VR streaming is the closest form of Live you can get, only second to seeing with your own eyes, if there's a drop in latency or anything, you'll notice dropped frames or any other sort of issues

[weak bluff]

thats a wild claim there

[haughty thistle]

Having a lightweight, and long enough cable really isn't that bad (unless you dance in VR)

[native goblet]

You're making start to think you've never played VR before

[haughty thistle]

Most people only ever tried cabled VR on a quest with a cheap, thick copper cable, often not even 5m long and think that's what cables in VR just are.
I can tell you from experience that you don't notice a good VR cable, like the one from the Bigscreen...

[native goblet]

I've got an exam to not fuck up so I'll see you guys later, I'll send you screenshots once I'm done

[weak bluff]

i do wireless quest 3 all the time ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rancid kestrel]

So you can't see all of the artfacting in modern YouTube that wasn't such a problem 10 years ago?

[weak bluff]

you can still see compression problem when you look at rain, snow, confetti, dark scenes today even at 500Mbps

[rancid kestrel]

Yeah but that's different than severe blocking on a simple pan.

Something that video compression shouldn't care about.

[weak bluff]

a sheet of aluminium foil is enough to ruin your wifi

[rancid kestrel]

Honestly all of the temporal components in video compression are super cool and VR just can't use them much because it needs to be as close to 0 latency as possible.

[weak bluff]

not sayign its a common problem

i play wireless vr from my bed around 20m away from PC

wireless wifi is quite good for my vrchat sessions

it definitely wont do it well on beat saber

[haughty thistle]

I used to play on a Vive Pro with a Wireless adapter, Quest 1 and Pro. I honestly prefer the wired experience, even on a Quest lol
Tho the Vive Wireless was as close to a wired experience I ever had. Still has its flaws at time with boxiness in the green channel at times, but yeah. I'd still take image quality over a cable, and even in normal images you can tell that the Quest on wifi looks softer compared to a wire...

Even the Quest looks better on wired Link somehow

[rancid kestrel]

I guess since I'm using it with a Vive there are less bandwidth constraints.

[weak bluff]

and then there is wireless Valve Index attempt

[rancid kestrel]

From what I've read they had to tune that down for RF regulations?

But yeah, unfortunately the universal truth has caught up to VR.

[haughty thistle]

Vive WA uses like 4 or 4.5 gbps for its transmission. Internally it's just a USB 3 Display link adapter, but custom made to utilize most of the available USB bandwidth

[weak bluff]

it seems hard to get a good wireless vr experience that is between standard wifi and wired

liek

[rancid kestrel]

The Vive "only" needs ~0.9Gbps.

[weak bluff]

in between struggles for some reason

[rancid kestrel]

So that makes a lot of sense.

Wait I'm off by a factor of 3.

With both numbers.

[rancid kestrel]

So ~2.7.

I thought I posted the bigscreen one.

~26Gbps for it.

[high apex]

I wish that VD worked over wire, since the main things I like about it are that it's fine-tunable and you don't have to run the oculus app to use your computer

[rustic garnet]

you do know that the bigscreen is part of lighthouse/steamvr right? you can use any controllers and any accessories with it

[rustic garnet]

nope

[rustic garnet]

Nope

[native goblet]

I watch YouTube in 1440p so not really

[native goblet]

Lighthouse ? What's that ?

[rustic garnet]

oml

[native goblet]

What ?

The only Lighthouse I know is a map on Tarkov

[rustic garnet]

you're talking with a lot of confidence

[native goblet]

Why is it so shocking that someone doesn't know something

[rustic garnet]

Lighthouse is how the vive and index and pimax and anything else that isn't camera tracked works

and they're all intercompatible in steamvr

all of their accessories too

[native goblet]

Oh
Well I don't own any of those so that explains why I didn't know about them

[rustic garnet]

Because it's literally the biggest hardware platform for vr??

[native goblet]

The only HMDs I ever used were Quest 2, Pico Neo 3 Link and Pico 4 Ultra
With some time on a Quest 3 for testing

[native goblet]

Never heard of anything beyond SteamVR

And standalone environments

[rustic garnet]

Steamvr is lighthouse

or like

Lighthouse started steamvr and then support for everything else was added later

[native goblet]

Never ever heard of SteamVR called Lighthouse by anyone I ever talked to about VR

[rustic garnet]

Lighthouse is the specific tracking system

the hardware solution

but steamvr itself is software

Lighthouse is steamvr native though

Either way

[native goblet]

Again, if it's about hardware, I mentioned the hardware I ever got my hands on, if they aren't part of lighthouse then that's why I never heard of them

[rancid kestrel]

A lot of content is only 1080p.

[rustic garnet]

Point being the bigscreen headset can be used with vive wands or index controllers and fullbody tracking pucks and even oculus controllers if you really want to

[rancid kestrel]

It's PC, of course stuff is modular.

[native goblet]

Most VR hardware I know about isn't
The only thing tying everything I know of is SteamVR

[rancid kestrel]

It's one reason why PCVR is the best.

[native goblet]

And that's because it can talk to separate systems at the same time

[native goblet]

That much I agree with

But that doesn't mean standalone is useless/worthless

(if we're still on that topic from earlier)

[rustic garnet]

exxaaaaccctly

[rancid kestrel]

I have no use for it, so in my view it's useless.

[rustic garnet]

well that's not

let's not generalize our own individual perspectives

[native goblet]

Look, my point was, I love PCVR
But when I go somewhere on vacation, it pours like crazy or I'm locked inside the house or every PC on the planet is destroyed and I can't do PCVR, bringing my HMD to play Breachers, VRC or Tabor without having to bring my whole rig, that's definitely something I can appreciate

[rustic garnet]

exactly

[rancid kestrel]

It would be funny to backpack a VR rig.

[rustic garnet]

saw plenty of those back in the day

around the time wmr dropped ig

[native goblet]

Exactly what I'm saying
It's not useful for you, that's alright, everyone got their own thing, but calling something straight up useless in a general fashion is just fucking stupid and completely oblivious

[native goblet]

Considering how far along SFF builds have been going, it's not impossible

[little plinth]

yeaaa being stuck to your PC is not good

i love bringing my quest 3 around

[rancid kestrel]

I'd honestly rather bring a PC and a good VR setup.

[little plinth]

good luck bringing a pc everywhere

though on top of that you also need a power socket around

[rancid kestrel]

I mean, anywhere you'd be using a VR headset should accommodate a PC.

[little plinth]

plane

train

or maybe on a mall

[rancid kestrel]

You wouldn't use a headset there, not enough space.

[native goblet]

No

[little plinth]

watching movies and sit down games lol

[native goblet]

Train could have the space by it would move too much
A mall would have more than enough space

[little plinth]

not all of VR are roomscales

[rancid kestrel]

That's just a phone.

[little plinth]

is a phone a 104inch screen

[rancid kestrel]

A mall has power too.

[rancid kestrel]

My phone can look larger than my TVs.

[native goblet]

Yeah ? Go find a place to put down your PC, a surface to put mouse keyboard and screen and an outlet to power everything, I'll wait

Meanwhile, I'll just stroll in with HMD on head and batteries in pockets

[little plinth]

bro is the 1in7 billion weirdo who brings a giant pc anywhere

[rancid kestrel]

Anywhere I'd want to play VR games I'd be able to do that.

[rustic garnet]

oml both of you are incredibly stubborn

[native goblet]

No lmao

[rancid kestrel]

I'm not going to be playing Beat Saber on an airplane.

[native goblet]

I'm not going to be playing any VR games tethered

[rancid kestrel]

To be fair I haven't for ages, but apparently the modern tethers are really good.

We will see when I get my new headset.

[native goblet]

A tether is still one too many

Moving around and turning on myself without risking a trip, a cable twist or a busted port, that's the way it's meant to be played

[haughty thistle]

And get to see only a tiny fraction of what VR has to offer (because let's be real here, an overclocked smartphone still is nowhere near powerful enough to render properly immersive VR environments; it can run VR, yes, but good graphics are something else)

Hecc, even a 5090 still struggles with a lot of VR games lol

[little plinth]

good thing standalones can connect to pc

[rancid kestrel]

Alyx will probably be a whole lot nicer with the new headset.

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, but I'd still take a native tether over compressed USB or Wifi any day

Thank Valve & Bigscreen that options exists

[native goblet]

If a 5090 struggles with a VR game, it's because it's unoptimized trash
I have a 9070XT, if anything gets me less than 90FPS in 2500x2500, I leave a negative review and tell them to optimize their shit

[little plinth]

it's not always optimization

[rancid kestrel]

The only wireless I want is one that's got a close enough bandwidth to the target so the compression hardly has to do anything so you get low latency and low data loss.

[haughty thistle]

Tell that to MSFS. The most immersive, and hella optimized, VR experience out there

[little plinth]

MSFS is actually so GPU optimized your CPU is the one crying

[rancid kestrel]

It sounds like you don't quite understand the absolute power that VR can take.

[native goblet]

It's always optimization
Alyx is the proof of that
Very few games look as good as it does and it has insane performance

[rancid kestrel]

I'm hoping my slowish GPU can keep up.

[haughty thistle]

Ehh... even then, on a 3090 I was not able to get a decent FPS on even an Index, with a render resolution that didn't make me feel like I forgot my glasses...

[rancid kestrel]

It also doesn't render all that much at a time, it's designed to only let you see a small part of the world at once.

[haughty thistle]

Alyx literally scales down render res if you PC is too crappy, and you prolly never noticed. I certainly didn't... until I upgraded my GPU and the game suddenly went from "eh" to actually sharp 👀

[rancid kestrel]

Also, does anyone else feel the hand snapping that Alyx does?

[native goblet]

Then they should optimize for CPU, no reason that modern 8-24 cores are crying like this

[rancid kestrel]

My headset is too low res to notice me thinks.

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, having a low res headset to begin with helps. Masks the render scaling too (since the reference scale is lower to begin with)

[native goblet]

We live in 2025, why the fuck would I gimp my experience in VR with low resolution screens ?

[haughty thistle]

The game targets 90fps, and it will scale down render res as far as it needs to hit that target. It will also go as high as 2x render res if you have enough resources over. And no, setting a render scale in SteamVR doesn't work, the game ignores that setting and goes with whatever 100% render res is in SteamVR

[rancid kestrel]

Funny Vive.

I might move my 4090.

[haughty thistle]

Maybe because you have a potato PC? A physical lower res screen actually looks sharper then running a higher res screen at the same render res

[rancid kestrel]

Dude I have a Vive from before there were better headsets, there's a reason I'm upgrading.

[haughty thistle]

That's the whole argument that Somnium makes about their VR1, how it supposedly looks sharper then the XR4, but with the big asterisk that this only applies when running both at the same render resolution

[native goblet]

I have yet to play a game besides VRC at 110% resolution that gets my GPU above 80-90%

Then again I haven't played all VR games I own lmao

I do have DCS to try out still

[haughty thistle]

VRC is a bad benchmark with all the unoptimized avis running around

[native goblet]

Gotta see what my PC gets me in it

[rancid kestrel]

The Bigscreen 2 was supposed to be August right?

[rancid kestrel]

The car rental company/god?

[haughty thistle]

???

[haughty thistle]

Apparently June. They had a delay in the production of the regular BSB2, so now both the regular and 2e launch in June. August was the halo strap iirc

[native goblet]

...that's why I'm excluding it bruh

[rancid kestrel]

https://www.avis.com/en/home
https://orville.fandom.com/wiki/Avis

[rancid kestrel]

That's the one I ordered, so August.

[haughty thistle]

smh. Avis is short for Avatars xD

I was gonna mention exactly what group of people are usually responsible, but apparently it's a banned word here xD

[rancid kestrel]

Yeah some random things are banned here for no apparent reason.

Once I got soft banned for posting a programming help question....

[haughty thistle]

[rancid kestrel]

Got to love people picking random uncommon words to turn into something vile.

Anyway.

[rancid kestrel]

I'm excited.

[haughty thistle]

Same... eagerly awaiting my 2e 😄

[rancid kestrel]

I'm hoping I'll be able to get a 5090 in the coming months, after I've got my new job.

I'm interested to see what the eye tracking ends up being used for, just the variable rate shading stuff would be cool.

How does the FoV compare to the Vive?

[haughty thistle]

Apparently the BSB2 FOV is larger then the BSB1 FOV
Comparing my Beyond 1 to the Vive Pro 1, I get roughly 3° less HFOV and 16° less VFOV

Tho, tbf I have my Vive lenses as close to my face as possible, which iirc is close then what it was on the original Vive

[rancid kestrel]

So, a decent amount more vertically and a little bit horizontally?

I suppose that makes sense with the more square displays.

[haughty thistle]

No, the Bigscreen is smaller in both directions

Only a little smaller horizontal, and more so vertically. Tho, as you said, the Vive has rectangular screens (taller then wide), while the Beyond has square screens

[weak bluff]

BSB1 and BSB2 i bet uses exact same display

They are just harnessing more of it

Its literally this

[haughty thistle]

Yup, more efficient optics allow the BSB2 to have a brighter image while still using the same panels, this has been confirmed by them

[gloomy crater]

I'm glad I decided to wait for more VR announcements to come before I committed to buying a BSB1. I was going to buy one in March of last year but then decided to wait and see whether Valve would finally announce their new headset or not, and because I decided to wait, I'll be getting a BSB2 instead because Valve still hasn't announced anything.

[rancid kestrel]

Yeah I was waiting for Valve but then the frustration of the Vive quality just hit a breaking point.

[rancid kestrel]

Is variable rate shading even a thing that's implemented yet?

[rustic garnet]

Alyx has superb art direction but it's rendering techniques were outdated when it released

[rustic garnet]

To maintain framerate

its very obvious if you listen to the devs talk about it

as i said youre acting very confident for someone who evidently knows a lot less than there is to know

[rustic garnet]

maybe eye tracked foveated rendering will finally become integrated into the steamvr driver 🥳

[rancid kestrel]

If their hardware supports it they definitely will. (Apparently the first time I sent this it had a bad word or something‽)