virtual-reality

[gray dome]

it doesn't deserve to exist

[next osprey]

They aren't that bad

[gray dome]

no

the sphere puzzle is a device used to do evil

it's an orb that contains only pure human suffering

[rustic garnet]

maybe if you have bad stereo vision

[gray dome]

I was stuck on some of them for more than an hour

I don't want to blame the headset controllers since they're pretty accurate

it was hard and somewhat random to tilt the ball though

and it'd give you 3 or 4 points you need to get to with many opportunities to get boxed in

because of the trails or whatever

the puzzle is not humane

should've been removed or made way easier

or at least sacrifice resin or something

while also being easier

[rustic garnet]

You can just let go of the laser dot and it becomes immune to the enemies

[rustic garnet]

This is a skill issue i fear

[next osprey]

It is

[next osprey]

Lmao

[rustic garnet]

even without doing that i never felt like they were hard

Which headset do you have

[slate mulch]

I can tell you what I have lol

I have a quest 3

[barren zealot]

the idea was good but when you have to do it under pressure it gets frustrating

heh, deckard and roy

i wonder why the blade runner fixation honestly, it's not the first franchise i associate to VR

[gray dome]

rift s

[little plinth]

pog turns out my quest 3 got batman arkham bundled

[next osprey]

Nice

[little plinth]

i've come to realize how overkill the IR floodlight that i got for low light play is

when comparing it to Q3s tiny ir lights

yeaaaa, it apparently has 50m viewing distance, 24w. shit's super overkill.

speaking of Q3s

what is Q3's depth sensor for if Q3s can get away without it??

[rustic garnet]

24 watts 😭 a ceiling light is like 8

[next osprey]

The 3s uses ir lights to try and determine depth, its not as accurate

[slate mulch]

Same

[little plinth]

the thing is, mine is older, 128G one, from a reseller. The box don't have the arkham thing. Though It's still sealed.

i guess it just has to be any newly activated quest during a certain time period

[weak bluff]

should have gotten referral to get extra $25 referral credit

[little plinth]

that requires me to buy through meta doesn't it

[weak bluff]

No just requires activate headset for first time via referral link

[little plinth]

fock

[little plinth]

lmao i really tried to scroll my PC monitor with the pinch gesture...

[next osprey]

https://tenor.com/view/alucore-gif-21193899

[slate mulch]

Still cool though

Anyways my lenses are in the process of shipping 🙂

[little plinth]

The 45w support is certainly nice to have

It does a solid 1.5%/min of charging for like the first 70%

[vestal pewter]

Yeah, fast charge is pretty cool. I "only" have 25W charging on my phone but that's enough to get to 80% in less than 40min. 0 to 20 takes less than 10 minutes. My Q2 charges with 7W, so with its 14Wh battery that results in around 50%/h

[queen quest]

ayy pog just got one for my birthday

i only have a 2060 gpu but with a cable it runs most games just fine

with airlink its 50/50, phasmophobia runs fine but vrchat struggles

[trail grove]

Hey can someone recommend me a good router for streaming wireless vr?

[little plinth]

Asus AX55

[trail grove]

A cheap one

[little plinth]

you said good

good is not cheap

AX53

[trail grove]

My vad

Bad

As long as i can get a stable 150mbits on 5ghz im happy

[little plinth]

Asus AX53 is about the cheapest you should go while still being decent

it's 60 bucks

[trail grove]

This one?

[little plinth]

fucking

i thought Q3 USB C supports 45w

turns out it's only on a fucking dock

i bought 3 different 45w charger

[honest sphinx]

I use a wifi extender for VR

[trail grove]

so am i rn

[slate mulch]

my PC can handle VR chat with no issues

[slate mulch]

my mail is running behind today LOL

my lenses is in my mail

[weak bluff]

Don't give me hope

[queen quest]

As can mine, but vr renders the game twice, once for each eye afaik

[slate mulch]

yes thats correct

[slate mulch]

aldo tbf i do have a more powerful PC than you as well

[slate mulch]

ngl i kinda like this design

also do you guys prefer snap or smooth turning in games?

me i personally prefer smooth

[rustic garnet]

the dpad ????

Lowkey dont believe its real simply because theyre not symmetrical

And valve loves their trackpads too this doesn't feel like them

[next osprey]

I mean it looks like a cross between steam deck controls and vr controllers

[haughty thistle]

Yet another new controller layout for VR that isn't going to be supported by basically any games! Yaay!

seriously tho, the only reason we ended up getting decent support for Knux is because they 99% share their layout with OcuMetabook controllers

[distant skiff]

valve giving up on their touch joysticks? and imma have to hold that controller in my hands to be convinced of those buttons sticking out from the side.

[weak bluff]

Im more surprised by base station ending at 2.0

https://x.com/SadlyItsBradley/status/1861595557463982086

Brad Lynch (@SadlyItsBradley) on X

Datamining the Valve Roy Controllers’ Blender file that was somehow ALSO INCLUDED IN THE LEAK:

Flat out details that these are using Arcturus Vision’s camera-based tracking algorithms

Public comments from this Valve partner previously hinted at openly licensing these algorithms

Twitter · Nov 27, 2024, 2:19 AM

If this is real

Expect 3rd party controllers to boom

I noticed the controller layout is designed to replicate standard controller so Valve aim to make flat screen games in VR is serious

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, Valve abondoning VR gaming to put flat games into VR
Because this is what this leak looks like

Deckard is just a Steam Deck with a VR display

[next osprey]

Wdym buttons sticking out from the side? Thats what most vr controllers do for grab controls

[distant skiff]

never seen that before. only buttons on the back for the index finger. and the index used capacitive touch for grab controls which worked quite well imo

[next osprey]

This is how most controllers do grip controls

[weak bluff]

Facts to know: Index Knuckles has no back trigger, only top trigger making grabbing relying on finger tracking making Half Life Alyx most realistic and immersive

The leaked controller has back trigger - meaning there won't be finger tracking sensor

making it worse, uses less immersive controls for Half Life Alyx

In Half Life Alyx, with Knuckles controller you open hand and close hand to pull item. Squeeze hand to arm grenade.

However with this more dated trigger, that means in Half Life Alyx it uses worse control using back trigger to close hand, press A button to arm grenade

TLDR: New controller downgrade from Knuckles, and it seems designed for Steam Deck and flat screen games since flatscreen games need 2 trigger each side. Lack of touch pad also suggest its trying to play flat screen games.

[next osprey]

I have heard that the method of grip controls are a bit jank in other games however

[weak bluff]

If true, Deckard is not a ultimate VR headset its more like VR-Flat hybrid

[weak bluff]

it is since its the only few controller that do so and dev did not put enough effort to tame it

i noticed extra odd thing about it

it really is 3 trigger back\

so valve could totally replace 3rd grip with touch but they did not

i guess the reason is because its mean to hold and there are no strap that lock the controller

[haughty thistle]

These Valve Roy controllers really look like as if you took the contents of say a PS5 or Xbox Series controller and stuffed them into the shell of a Quest 3 controller. Rear triggers and everything. The side grips might be either for remapping (like the rear wings on the Xbox Elite controller) or for basic VR game compatibility

These are defo not made with VR games as their first priority. They 100% are meant for flat games first, with maybe some basic support for VR gaming if you're so inclined

[weak bluff]

yep yep but more like Steam Deck

actually 3 trigger more like steam deck so no finger tracking chance here

[rustic garnet]

oh no 😭

No im actually pissed about this if its real

More buttons on controllers just encourage tying game actions to button presses instead of designing novel physical interactions

Like we already tried that with the original psvr and when the rift shipped with an xbox controller

[rustic garnet]

and pretty much every flatscreen vr mod is forced to do this (bc they dont have access to the engine etc etc) and it sucks

It breaks immersion it doesn't feel like im using my hands

im constantly reminded that im holding a controller and theres a vast disconnect between what the game tells me my action is vs what i physically perceive my action to be

[haughty thistle]

It's a layout largely incompatible with the OcuMetabook layout, so I doubt that many games will ever support them. It's 100% gonna be the Reverb G2 controller situation all over again

I doubt that whatever head mounted Steam Deck that Valve is working on is gonna be all that popular with VR enthusiasts given the latest controller leak. Ofc I could be mistaken, but these controllers honestly look way worse then the Quest 3 or heck, even the original WMR controllers for VR...

Maybe not as bad in terms of comfort, but they don't seem to be all that great for VR-first games, because of that d-pad

[weak bluff]

missing touchpad

[next osprey]

What do you like

Even do with a trackpad in vr

[weak bluff]

nothing but not parity with Oculus

touchpad is a common but unused feature

[gloomy crater]

It would actually be such a big blow to the dedicated high end PCVR crowd if Deckard turns into a soulless way of playing flat screen games in 'vr'. If they release a new headset with these controllers and NOT have the new HMD be compatible with the OG knuckles out of the box, that would arguably be worse. It would mean the last bastion of truly good PCVR is destined to forever more be a bigscreen beyond with index knuckles. There is SO MUCH riding on this new valve headset being a total game changer for dedicated PCVR, but from these insights, it's looking more and more like valve are just following trends, fleshing out the mobile VR landscape, and have given up on innovating or even really interacting with PCVR much at all anymore.

[rustic garnet]

For sure, if even valve is giving up on pcvr its dead in the water

Why would you even want to play flatscreen games with vr controllers its so awkward

[weak bluff]

no it wont be compatible with knuckles because that requires base station

[rustic garnet]

Im actually so fking annoyed

[weak bluff]

Valve stopped production of Base Station 2.0 already

[rustic garnet]

i had so much hope for valve

I usually love their hardware

[weak bluff]

and it is virtually not possible to slap mini base station since that thing spins liek hard drive

[rustic garnet]

but this is a complete 180

[gloomy crater]

I meant compatible in the sense that it would have the module to be able to interface with a set of knuckles and base stations out of the box like the bigscreen beyond can. If it's like the G2 where you have to buy additional dongles because the headset has no way of interfacing or tracking the knuckles, that's what i mean by not being compatible.

[weak bluff]

there is 1 cool outcome is potential for Valve to license inside out tracking meaning 3rd party like Bigscreen and others can make standard SteamVR inside out

[gloomy crater]

It feels like both a slap in the face to the PCVR crowd that have followed them since 2019, and a complete betrayal of what they've claimed to car about up to this point.

[gloomy crater]

Except that's completely useless for people who have never and will never want to use inside out only headsets, and comes with the massive downside of abandoning the single last bastion of base station / outside in tracking still being a priority.

It's like we've fallen into mark zucc's fantasy world where everyone uses a standalone inside out headset to play completely unaltered vr ports of normal flat screen games and likes it. squishy jello controller tracking that doesn't matter because you don't need good tracking when everything is controlled by button presses rather than the movement of your hands, no new genuinely groundbreaking games because that's not what these headsets or ecosystems are optimized for and therefor likely won't sell well so why bother, there is so much potential in truly good quality base station tracked PCVR but it just feels like everyone would rather give up on it than do the work to actually put these designs to good use.

[weak bluff]

this is Valve plan to never count to number 3

lul

they dont want Base Station 3.0

[rustic garnet]

i dont have strong opinions on lighthouse, its a means to an end and if inside out gets as good as lh that's great

[rustic garnet]

But this is a complete ideological shift that i dont agree with

[weak bluff]

Base station is great but unaffordable

You can still get base station from HTC if you wish

[rustic garnet]

lighthouses track really well but literally everything else is worse than inside out

theyre expensive, cumbersome to set up, prone to failure due to moving parts

Emphasis on the setup

[gloomy crater]

In my mind, base station tracking should be the BASELINE for high end PCVR and inside out should righfully be seen as a cheaper, less accurate but serviceable form of tracking if you're not really that serious about VR, or have a way cheaper setup. Saying inside out tracking is equal to base stations because of the few pain points it has is like saying that a webcam is a viable alternative to a DSLR camera because it only needs a USB cord. There's just no alternatives for the quality of tracking that base stations provide, and those negatives are the cost of that quality. Sure, a lot of people are just fine with inside out, but completely abandoning base stations because serious PCVR consumers are in the minority seems incredibly short sited from a business standpoint. A small number of rich, serious VR enthusiasts seems like just as valuable a market as a larger number of casual VR enjoyers to me at least. I just have no idea how companies are now beginning to see inside out as a set standard, like releasing $2,000 headsets that ONLY have access to inside out, with no feasible ways of connecting them to base stations. In my mind, such an expensive, enthusiast oriented products equates to high quality base station tracking, but clearly these companies don't see it that way. Whether they're ignorant to the differences, or just being cheap, not entirely sure.

[weak bluff]

I think Rift CV1 tracking should be standard instead of base station

[weak bluff]

Base station is baseline and it is but i also means new headset must be high end too so Base Station future is high end only

There is no room for mid range for base station

Inside out is great for low end and light sensor CV1 is best for middle ground

Valve chooses standard inside out

[haughty thistle]

afaik the only people still sticking to LH tracking are hardcore VRchatters. No business and the vast, vast majority of people do not wanna fuss about with base stations. Period. There's a reason why headsets with inside-out tracking are basically all you can get these days. If you want trackers, just get ones with cameras on them (in the future, Vive Ultimate trackers are kinda poo if you're not using a Focus or XRE)

Heck, even simmers prefer headsets with built-in cameras... as long as they're not using a motion rig that is...

Basestation based tracking will be destined for nieche applications. Whether you want to or not.

[weak bluff]

Base station is favoured with IT students who need sub-mm tracking and nothing beats it

Great for robots

[haughty thistle]

I'm someone who definetly prefers Lighthouse tracking, but I'm also just someone who sees the market space and the potential buyers and am realistic about what will and won't suceed on the market

[haughty thistle]

Again, nieche applications

[weak bluff]

Yes

It is niche and demand won't dry but won't go up either

Hence why only HTC makes them today

I believe base station will live for a decade more but without VR

[haughty thistle]

Demand will go down as IO-tracking improves. I won't say it'll ever fully dry up, but it will disappear from the VR market space (since if you need motion compensation, at some point camera-tracked trackers or some other methode will become available, and then you defo won't need an expensive LH setup which is prone to interference from the motion rig anyways)

[weak bluff]

I can imagine Bigscreen switch to new SteamVR SLAM and sell base station version at half price

[haughty thistle]

Yeppers

[weak bluff]

Ngl im excited for standard SLAM that anyone could make and I won't forget base station excellent quality either. Maybe camera based FBT or IMU based will become new standard.

[gloomy crater]

Oh hey. At some point today the fancy grip straps I bought for my reverb G2 controllers will be delivered. Probably a waste of $20 considering this headset will be a brick soon but I bit the bullet because I was sick and tired of death gripping these controllers like this

[rustic garnet]

Oh yeah thats another thing with playing flat games on split controllers: the amount of times i press buttons with not the finger meant for them is staggeringly high

And is only possible because i can shift my grip bc the other hand keeps holding on

[main jacinth]

hi im looking for AR glasses, i want them to have a good display with good ai, i want it to have good translation for any language, i want to be able to read books on them, create and type in documents on them through voice, and create shortcut terms for things to say when i want a certain task done, browse the internet through voice. (i dont want them to have to display through a separate device i want them to be their own thing)

iv looked around for glasses but i dont think any have all the features i want, price doesnt matter much, and looks i dont mind a lot. does anyone know if theres glasses like these that are out?

[weak bluff]

Yeah that glass does not exist yet

If you see any product advertising so, it will do it poorly

The best bet you can do is use smartphone and manual clicks with Google translate, Google lens, Google assistant

[rustic garnet]

what does "good ai" even mean

ai is sucha buzzword now

[main jacinth]

ok thanx

[main jacinth]

a program that can understand my unique commands based on it's previous understanding of language and progressively adapt to them

with few mistakes

hopefully the next thing after orion is good

[barren zealot]

bro thinks we in 2077

[main jacinth]

theres already glasses that have most of that

and there will probably be what i want in the next few years

[barren zealot]

no there isn't they're scams

have you watched any reviews of them at all

[main jacinth]

lol yea

like 10

on the rayneo AR x2

[barren zealot]

not to mention that talking to your glasses would make you look like a fucking dork

[main jacinth]

i said i dont care about looks

[barren zealot]

voice assistants like siri are already socially unacceptable

when was the last time you heard someone say hey siri in public

[main jacinth]

thats because siri is useless

[barren zealot]

she gets my commands often enough unlike chatgpt

[main jacinth]

i dont use either

[barren zealot]

i'm extremely proud to be the only person on my goddamn campus who seems to not be using ai for any assignment

[main jacinth]

thats crazy

anyways after orion I think I will have what I want

so maybe like 3 years wait

i hate having to wait though

so sad

also

i think the scam glasses ur thinking about are the ones that just project images from other devices

or that one extremely crappy one i saw a review on but that was only a single brand

I feel like theres gotta be some variation i dont know about that has what i want i need a smart glasses person

it really seems like there arent many ppl looking into these products

[rustic garnet]

Same

[barren zealot]

no those are the only good ones because they're actually useful

[barren zealot]

because generative AI is useless, because nobody except nerds who follow elon musk and listen to joe rogan podcast want thick ass glasses that talk nonsense to you and have to recharge daily and record everything you do, because no input technology can replace typing until we get neural interfacing

these glasses do absolutely nothing better or easier or more convenient than a phone

[main jacinth]

these ones are the actual ones that do nothing better then a phone because they literally just project the phone screen

[main jacinth]

as for the typing theres already text to speech im not sure what ur talking about

the features i want are pre existing things i just want put into a smaller device

[barren zealot]

text to speech is shit, always has been, always will be

[main jacinth]

depends on what ur using

[barren zealot]

no, they have a very precise purpose: giving me more screen without me having to carry around an extra monitor. i use my quest 3 almost daily to do university work since it can turn my laptop into a six monitor setup

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVUiDy79x7o&t=470s

[main jacinth]

those are not the same thing 😭

[barren zealot]

it's these things that are complete scams

[main jacinth]

oh yea that was the scam video i mentioned

those ones actually sucked

you should look at ones that are actually making progress

its sad linus didn't look at any good ones

orion and rayneo ar x2 are the decent ones they still arent what i want though i think

[barren zealot]

no because i have a phone

https://www.visor.com/

this is another really cool one that i'll buy for my dad

[main jacinth]

im looking for practical usage to replace the things i use my phone for

i also dont want it connected to anything

im looking to reduce time being wasted moving around not making the same things i do more convenient

when im walking around im not reading and thats something id like to do

holding a book while walking isnt a very good way to read either it gets too shaky moving like that

[main jacinth]

a lot of other things id like to do also

[main jacinth]

products like these are just to me for fun and not really practical for anything

[barren zealot]

are you 12

[main jacinth]

i think actual vr headset stuff is just a rip off

especially when its all just heavygear uncomfortable stuff

[barren zealot]

when you start to work in front of a computer screen you'll realize their value

[main jacinth]

theres nothing they do that a computer cant with the most insignificant inconvenience

i mean they are cool

but i would never buy them

also how is the hate for new technology this bad wtf 😭

i thought this was a tech discord

[weak bluff]

A true smart glass is impossible with today's technology without cloud computing

And no company is willing to host that muvh processing over cloud

Startup can never have budget to do this if they do they are scam like the rabbit ai device thingy which is just a chatgpt wrapper and takes 10 seconds to answer lol

[haughty thistle]

They're also a scam in the sense that they burn investor money to not have horrendously high prices

Most startups operation models are not sustainable without constant investment money. So either investors start pushing for a more sustainable model or they just stop investments alltogether, in either case a startup then might look to sell or prices skyrocket to a point that customers just leave...

[little plinth]

yeaa

i think the base strap and the facial interface

of the Q3

is really

not bad

different from the Q2, the dual band design really helps.

[weak bluff]

dual ban helps with people with pony tails

[little plinth]

still less comfy than P4's stock, however.

[rustic garnet]

lmao??

[rustic garnet]

this is certainly a thing you can say

certainly a string of words that hold meaning in the english language

[main jacinth]

is it not true

its a monitor that goes on ur head

[main jacinth]

the reviews iv seen for things like the rayneo arx2 is very close to something id want i dont think its that far off and its by tcl which is a huge electronics company and meta which also has a ton of money is also spending on developing them and they arent far off either

oh i meant to respond to the guy below you

does anyone know an active server that knows about glasses tech

it seems most people here are just basing their information off of the scam video linus did (i agree that product was real bad)

because theres products way beyond what most are claiming

[weak bluff]

dont desperately search for something that does not exist yet its like searching for server for flying cars even tho we know we are not ready for it yet

give industry some time to get there nothing we have today is good yet

[main jacinth]

if you guys saw some of the review videos you wouldnt be saying that 😭 i just want someone that can help me (and knows)

all i need to know is if theres a brand thats ahead of the ones i mentioned or if they have features i didnt know about that cover what i want

[weak bluff]

There isn't. If you keep searching for it you will find some scam startup product with misleading marketing because that is the only product that will promise (but not fulfill) what you need.

Or a niche that is made to sell people who want branded glasses like Ray-Ban Meta

[main jacinth]

well if you say so

[barren zealot]

It is one of the headbands of all time

Definitely

Swapped it with a kiwidesign h4 battery strap

[little plinth]

Certainly not the comfiest, but it's very tolerable, straight up better for laid back/lay down use

I forget about it after getting immersed 15 mins into the game

Custom strap is definitely a must if I'm lending it to someone else.... Somehow it always falls off them

Anyway, batman arkham is pretty cool

Definitely missing the PCVR level graphics

The combat while easy, lacks freedom that something like B&S has

[rustic garnet]

no its a fully immersive 3d environment are you stupid?

[main jacinth]

sure it is that doesnt change that its still a head monitor

in a practical sense its the same

its purpose is for the unique experience and thats all

its like going to disneyland for a ride, but im not interested in entertainment

[rustic garnet]

ok??

That doesn't mean its a ripoff

[main jacinth]

to me it is, especially when monitors are way cheaper and less inconvenient

in the case of you wanting multiple monitors i guess it could be a better deal

but managing with one or two isnt really that bad

I think you can see the value of what it is actually worth by the fact it released recently and dropped in half the price pretty fast

(talking about the link that was provided to me specifically)

[main jacinth]

this one

a 500 dollar drop off is pretty huge

oh my bad it hasnt even released yet

i wonder why the price dipped that much

maybe not many preorders

[little plinth]

People buy VR headset mostly for VR games...

[main jacinth]

i was talking about this product specifically which i dont think is for vr games?

though vr headsets i dont like either its too janky

[little plinth]

And monitors are stuck in one place

Monitors and XR/VR sets are not mutually exclusive, more like complementary

You can't bring a triple monitor setup anywhere you go

[main jacinth]

thats true but are you really moving around anywhere especially when theres a wire stuck to you

[little plinth]

A wire isn't a problem when you're just sitting at starbucks

Also something like Quest 3 and QPro is entirely wireless

[main jacinth]

arent those a lot bigger

and heavier

maybe some people dont mind but i dont think its worth having on ur face

especially when the computer screen is just as practical

[little plinth]

Bring a computer screen at starbucks

[main jacinth]

i mean like a laptop screen

which yea i hate them

[little plinth]

It's small

And that's only one screen

Not three

[main jacinth]

but i wouldnt want to buy a separate device just because i dont like it

[little plinth]

It's not for you, doesn't mean it's a scam

[main jacinth]

you can swap between tabs tbh

[little plinth]

Switching tabs sucks

[main jacinth]

yes

its all slightly inconvenient which i said, but i dont think eliminating that justifies the 500 and having to charge it and have it sit on you uncomfortably

but if your willing to deal with all that then sure its a decent deal

[main jacinth]

or however much the products you said cost

[bitter axle]

I got weird black brown ish lines on the left and right of my quest 2 display and im worried its irreversible

Kinda like a scuba mask

Not at the absolute border, a milimeter off of it

[rustic garnet]

good thing vr sets arent made to be monitor replacements????? Are you genuinely fucking dense?

you do realize two products can have different use areas even if the hardware is generally similar

[rustic garnet]

Or a plane

[rustic garnet]

can you get a picture though the lens?

[bitter axle]

Not really, but i can Try

[main jacinth]

i wasnt talking about vr sets

[main jacinth]

it was this

why are the linus discord people so mean

[bitter axle]

I think its on top as well but thats harder to tell

I assume i gotta replace the display huh

@rustic garnet

(Mobile wont send pics)

https://imgur.com/a/OS4q9jT

Hope you can see both pics on pc

@rustic garnet thoughts?

[rustic garnet]

Ahem ......

[rustic garnet]

Are you talking about the concentric rings?

or this

[main jacinth]

i only mentioned those for a second

[main jacinth]

i still agree with what i said there but what iv been arguing against wasnt vr

[rustic garnet]

oh nvm i didn't see this

that is concerning

or is that a scanline artifact

[little plinth]

that looks like signature BBQ LCD

[main jacinth]

oh i just realized ur message was responding to vr specifically

in that case I just think its janky

my family owns one and we never use it

besides my cousin who uses it for fnaf which its actually pretty good for because the immersion makes it a lot more scary and theres not a lot of need to have accurate controls

[rustic garnet]

Dont vr headsets use global shutter displays

or not shutter ig but flashing all the pixels at the same time

[main jacinth]

i thought you were still talking about the visor product sorry

[little plinth]

all modern display work this way

the p in say 1080p is really just legacy leftover

it really now means the frame is sent whole rather than half the lines

only CRTs do progressive scanlines due to the way they work

which is just a single electron beam

on an unrelated topic

is quest 3 on steam link registered as 3

since i got the Q2 icon

also P4 is registered as Q2 on VD also

so i wonder how inflated Q2 numbers are

[rustic garnet]

but each line in the transistor matrix is still updated separately?

i think this is what i heard it from

"low persistence global displays"

i take that to mean they update globally

all pixels at the same time ..

(https://youtu.be/JO7G38_pxU4 ye olde)

[little plinth]

focus on the low persistance

also that's 2015

[rustic garnet]

I know

But i can't find anything newer 😭

[rustic garnet]

when valve cared about pcvr amirite

[little plinth]

also any scanlines that you might see if it's from a camera is more than likely the shutter speed not cooperating with PWM brightness control of the display

[rustic garnet]

Right

Well either way what im getting at is

A dark line on a picture of an lcd could be due to the camera shutter

and what i mean is idk which lines waterblue is talking about 😞

this visually looks like a crack

but i also dont have an intact q2 for comparing lol

Idek why im trying to figure this out i dont rly know what im talking about

[little plinth]

GPUs however render progressively

which is why screen tearing happens

not line by line but tile by tile, but still similar principle

The tear is caused by the monitor only updating the pixels of the new frame which is only half rendered and leaving the rest causing an illusion of scanlines

[serene stump]

HEADS UP PEEPS

[little plinth]

lucky mf

i got mine for 450

[serene stump]

https://www.amazon.com/Meta-Quest-128GB-Breakthrough-Performance-Oculus/dp/B0D5H6WRPH

$380 for a 128gb version of the Quest 3 isn't bad

$80 more then a Quest 3S

[little plinth]

wdym isn't bad, that's a flipping good deal

[serene stump]

Be between this or a "new" phone for me

[little plinth]

think about what you get with a new phone

you end up doing the same thing you're doing with your current one

[serene stump]

Still on a Samsung Note 10+ here

[little plinth]

Q3 value >>

i used my S8+ until it's so beat up and had the touchscreen die before switching to S20FE

[serene stump]

Be looking at either the S22 Ultra or the S23 Ultra as a replacement

[little plinth]

at least 5 dead pixel circles, 2 literal holes in the screen glass

shattered back

[serene stump]

I need myu spen

[little plinth]

power button gone

bixby button gone

[serene stump]

There is a reason I toss an Otterbox style case on my devices

UnicornBeetle is what I currently have on both my Note 10+ and my Tab S5e

Devices are getting far to thin for me and its annoying

hence the thicker cases

So I can actually grip my devices without them litterally slipping from my hand(s)

[little plinth]

i miss the S8/S9 iris scanner so badly bruv

cause they work in the dark

[serene stump]

Able to wrap my thumb around the edge of the case and keep it steady

[little plinth]

the S20's face scan is utter garbage

[serene stump]

Had the S8 before I got the Note 10 +

Went Note 3/ Note 4/ S8/Note 10+ non 5g

There was no way I was going for the Note 5 and the Note 7 was yeah lets NOT talk about it and it was before the Note 8 was out so I was stuck with the S8 series

Moving carriers a lot back then hence the swapping of phones

going from cdma over to edge nad back

By the way that is $380 for an Amazon REFURB of the 128GB Quest 3

Pretty sure they got rid of the lower end Quest 3 for the Quest 3S

This is currently on my list for new phone https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B5VVQRND

Since it lacks an sd card the 1tb will be needed

About $585 currently

Lets see if Amazon drops the pricing on any of these over the weekend

128gb should be more then enough storage for sever VR games at a time

OS itself shouldn't be anywhere near the size of say Windows so I would be surprised if its more then say 16gb

And then VR games are about what 16gb-32gb or so a piece if that?

[rustic garnet]

isnt screen tearing bc the framebuffer updates out of sync with the physical refresh

[rustic garnet]

ah yeah

[rustic garnet]

i used my last phone till the screen was literally falling off and finally switched when i dropped it face down one too many times and the display just went black instantly

[rustic garnet]

my friend uses a toothpick to press the power button lol

[brave whale]

The back fell off my s21, I had replaced it and everything but ofc not as secure as from the factory in terms of waterproofing. I live in a very wet climate and rely a lot on my phone (it's my wallet and bus pass and stuff), so I didn't wanna risk it dying while I was out and I got a new phone

[serene stump]

I only get so much cash a month so I have to juggle what I get when

less than $1k a month and half that goes towards rent

rest is for food and the like

[brave whale]

Yeah I got a really good deal on a pixel 8, just 10$/month on top my normal phone plan for 24 months then I get to keep it

[serene stump]

Hence being behing on phones right now

[brave whale]

No problem with being behind on a phone lol, they're all the same nowadays

[serene stump]

And the MAIN reason I still have my Note 10+ even tho it is having software bugs

[brave whale]

I would've stuck with my s21 for many more years if the back didn't just fall off

[serene stump]

Yeah hence why I am looking back a gen or 2 at the S22 and S23 Ultras to replace my Note 10+

[brave whale]

Is the pen a must have?

The normal S-series are pretty darn good on their own.

[serene stump]

@brave whale Stick something like a Unicorn Beetle or Otterbox on it and yes the S-Pen is a must for me

Looking at $585 for the 1tb S22 Ultra which isn't bad

[brave whale]

Damn yeah that's great, go for it

[serene stump]

Since there is no SD slot on the newer phones I need to go with the 1TB

[brave whale]

Not sure I get you still but 👍

[serene stump]

Large rugged case LOL

[brave whale]

I don't know what phone case I got for my current one but I accidentally dropped it from atop a climbing wall (that's about 30 feet) and it was fine. the ground is soft tho.

I wasn't supposed to have it in my pocket in the first place 🤦

[serene stump]

https://www.amazon.com/SUPCASE-Full-Body-Belt-Clip-Kickstand-Protector/dp/B09P2WN7BK Half the price of an otterbox and otterbox has dropped in quality over the years

[brave whale]

Damn that's pretty extra

Happy with what I got, it was 10$ on Amazon

[serene stump]

Something like that basically

[brave whale]

Yeah, it doesn't hurt to be extra safe

[serene stump]

$25 isn't to bad for a case at least it isn't $60+

[brave whale]

Not the price, just the "ruggedness" of it feel extra to me but you should get whatever you feel is best for you

[serene stump]

Pretty sure Otterboxes are still $50+ and their quality has dropped a LOT since they were first introduced

Yeah mobile devices are way to thin for me these days and this actually gives me something sturdy to wrap my thumb and fingers around to keep in place

Have a similar case for my Tab S5e

Had a two piece case for my HTC One SV back in the day lol aka TPU inside and rugged plastic outside

[little plinth]

yea i reread the stuff, this is accurate

[little plinth]

definitely

if your internet is fast then 128gb is enough

Linus entered the deckard copeland

[bitter axle]

Ignore the scanlines, they are bc camera

I mean the black brown circle aound the border

Its not a crack, it has a brown tint to it

Tge stuff you circled

Sorry for afk, had a lil life stuff happenin

[barren zealot]

Calling deckard cope is wild

[little plinth]

it's a running joke where people constantly say deckard is coming

for years

[barren zealot]

I'm confident we'll see an announcement this year

[barren zealot]

As in 2025

should have mentioned that

[gloomy crater]

My guess was before Christmas of 2025. I made that guess back in 2021 and I'm sticking to it

As for my actual enthusiasm for the headset, that pretty much fell off a cliff once we all realized it's just gonna be Valve's version of the Quest 2 rather than a sequel to the Index

[little plinth]

Lmao my impulsive purchase of the q3 was the correct decision turns out.

Prices here have increased like 50 bucks

[weak bluff]

if rumour is true, i wont be buying deckard

i just dont like controller but if there will be 3rd party controller that would be great

[barren zealot]

It's gonna be knuckles compatible i'm sure

I'm willing to bet that the knuckles will become the "premium" controller and they'll be updated with a hall effect stick so they don't have to be RMA'd every two weeks

https://tenor.com/view/picklejuicelover69-gif-1483426411005875907

Gaben please release knuckles 2

[weak bluff]

But knuckles needs base station

And their new controller is a downgrade and uses inside out tracking

No chance it supports knuckles

[barren zealot]

It's not hard to make based station compatibility

Like it wouldn't cost them anything to maintain the base station ecosystem since plenty of people use them

Besides deckard would still be an upgrade from the index if the leaks of 4k per eye + 130 degrees FOV are real, it would finally kill pimax

[weak bluff]

Buddy you don't know how base station works

[barren zealot]

I don't see how the base stations' lasers would matter

Like ok maybe the lasers would impair the cameras' vision and the depth sensors but you either use the cameras or the base stations

Like the varjo XR 4 can do both inside out and base station tracking

[gloomy crater]

The Pimax Crystal does both Inside Out and Base Station tracking as long as you have the right addon accessory face plate

I agree it probably wouldn't be very difficult to add the necessary module to make it compatible with base stations, even if it is inside out tracked out of the box normally, and would make the headset a lot more appealing to index owners who have been holding out for five years for valve's next headset to upgrade.

And it offers a tangible upgrade path for people who want the better finger tracking or want to open up the possibility of full body tracking for social VR, cause right now the only real contenders for that application are the index, some vive models, and the bigscreen beyond. Everything else just either doesn't have the right features or is way to expensive

[barren zealot]

i wouldn't call the crystal a successful example of that but yeah i guess

mostly because it sucks both in inside out and base station mode

[gloomy crater]

I wouldn't really either considering how expensive that setup is for how bad it ends up being, it's just another example of it being possible to do both

[rustic garnet]

If the base stations are stationary on the walls sure

[serene stump]

Meant to say SEVERAL VR games at a time LOL

[weak bluff]

except you don't understand and it is NOT easy

[barren zealot]

Explain then

[weak bluff]

you need 2 sweeping laser scanning the room

mechanical

[barren zealot]

Yeah and

[weak bluff]

and very accurate at hard drive level precision

[barren zealot]

And?

[weak bluff]

such thing is not easy to mount on headset

[barren zealot]

What the fuck are you talking about

Why would i mount base stations on a headset

Those go on the wall

[weak bluff]

then you cant track knuckles with new headset without base station

[barren zealot]

Yeah?

[weak bluff]

if that is what you mean, you still need base stations

[barren zealot]

Why does that matter, did you completely misunderstand my statement

I said "i bet the deckard will be able to do both inside out tracking for the standalone AND be able of base station tracking with knuckles for pcvr"

[weak bluff]

why do that when you can already do that already with Quest 2

with any headset

there is no need to add extra cost installing outside in tracking on headset

just install vive or tundra tracking

[weak bluff]

in the end if you want to use knuckles, you need to buy base station 2.0 there is no knuckles compatible from headset which you stated here

[barren zealot]

Yeah i already have those lmao

Like having an upgrade path for people who want that functionality is not a problem

[weak bluff]

but valve Knuckles successor is roy controller which is worse

and uses inside out tracking

[rustic garnet]

that would be missing out on the occlusion benefit of lighthouse anyway

[weak bluff]

ye

also knuckles have IR sensor outwards

so it sucks at inside out even if it is

Valve aint making better Knuckles but I hope 3rd party do without trying to make it flat screen friendly

[brisk viper]

i doubt that many games will take advantage of the extra buttons on the roy controllers because quest is such a massive platform studios will be designing for quest first so 2 buttons per hand will be more common

i prefer the design to q3 though with the longer handles and more buttons and i hope tracking is as good/better

[gloomy crater]

I hope the Kiwi team has already gotten the 3d renders of the roy controllers and have started designing a set of their extended grip straps for them like they have for the Q2 controllers (this is a joke, I just hope they'll be able to get them out in a timely manner AFTER they're actually released as full production models)

There's just something comforting about being able to fully let go of a set of controllers and have them still be firmly strapped to your hands that all these minimalist controller designs for the last few years have failed to capture. It's the reason that grip straps are some of the most popular aftermarket adapters for pretty much every major VR controller. Idk why there's only really been one commercial set of controllers to utilize this when it's been proven for so long that people like it better that way

[weak bluff]

No vr game will or should design for roy controller if they want to have as many people play game as possible

[barren zealot]

The point of the roys is playing flatscreen games

All the leaks point to Deckard being a steam deck that you slap to your face as well as a high end vr headset

[brisk viper]

do we know anything about lenses and displays

hoping its quest 3 comparable

[barren zealot]

According to some indicators 4k per eye and 130 FOV but it seems unrealistic

[brisk viper]

yeah if they want to compete with quest 3 thats gonna be expensive

any leaks on pancake/fresnel lenses?

[barren zealot]

Valve does not compete with anyone and they don't design products with competition in mind

[brisk viper]

fair enough

i mean the index kit is still 1k 5 years later

[barren zealot]

Has to be pancake becausr of the better clarity, they found foveated rendering in steamVR and imo it would look really bad with fresnel

That also means eye tracking

[brisk viper]

surely foveated rendering would look better with fresnel because you cant see the blurry sides, pancakes would let you see the imperfections clearly

[brisk viper]

if theyre going this high end the 4k 130 displays could be real

[brisk viper]

i know the steam link app for quest has foveated rendering on by default, not eye tracked but just edge of the screen is let resolution

[barren zealot]

Foveated is almost certainly for the "steam deck for your face" feature

• doesn't psvr 2 have foveated rendering and pancake lenses?

[brisk viper]

nope fresnel

[barren zealot]

Huh

[brisk viper]

imo they arent quite as clear as quest 2 fresnel but better than index

[barren zealot]

People keep coping about a quest 3 competitor but imo deckard will be almost vision pro-tier

Just without all the apple bells and whistles

like if you take a good look at the state of VR today you can clearly see that the idea of VR as a console and standalone element is still unfeasible. zuckerberg gave VR to the masses and they filled it with AI slop games. i strongly believe that valve sees VR as another way to interface with a computer, and now that the technology has matured a bit since the index' release VR as a tool has become the predominant use case.

all the enterprise headsets, the vision pro, the immersed visor, they're all going for productivity

of course apple being apple their idea of VR as an interface is extremely limited but the fundamental idea of it works

[brisk viper]

i’m not coping i think it’s good we need more real headsets in that category, meta owns thier stuff and at the moment apple is really all there is

sorry it came off as cope

[barren zealot]

No the cope comment wasn't directed at you

[solid flax]

So I want to try out VR, and see what its about
But there is no way I'm getting an oculus quest 2 or 3, because yk, Facebook
I'm thinking of getting like a Rift for $30 or so
Is there a headset that isn't that much but isn't Facebook

[barren zealot]

I strongly doubt you will find a rift for 30 dollars lmao

Mostly because functioning rift CV1s are at extinction risk, the cable that connects them to the PC is extremely fragile and was prone to breaking even when they were new

[solid flax]

I can get one for that

Regularly I see them for that

[solid flax]

Hmm
And there's not a replacement?

[weak bluff]

You sure? Rift CV1 cable is like endangered species its rare and expensive

[solid flax]

It's like a range
Sometimes it's like $30 and sometimes it's $60
I checked again and it was $60 for a complete set with box
Or an oculus quest for $100

How much better is the quest ( 1 I'm guessing) over the rift

On second thought... maybe not
My phone is more powerful lol

[gloomy crater]

yeeeeah buying a Rift CV1 nowadays is like buying an old manual transmission car. In this instance, a Rift would let you figure out whether you like VR enough to get something better, or to give up on VR, without having to drop the money on a better headset up front just to see what it's all about. If you do actually want to have a good experience, there's unfortunately not much in the entry level space that doesn't in some way tie you to either facebook or the chinese equivalent.

[solid flax]

Thats sad
If I had to get a quest there would need to be a way to jailbreak it

[weak bluff]

there is quest headset business version with no requirement for facebook but it costs more

no need to jaibreak

but hey

thats the cost of privacy

https://forwork.meta.com/us/en/pricing/

also you cant buy it easily

aaand subscription required

[solid flax]

Ofc it has major caveats

[weak bluff]

oh yeah there is DPVR E4

its like Quest 2 but PCVR tethered

not recommended tho pricy and quality is meh

[solid flax]

Maybe I could use Facebook stuff
But I would need to do fake names and etc
And I don't really want to go out of my way like that
But I can

[weak bluff]

then its a no brainer best value out of anything

[solid flax]

Now I just need to find one that isn't $300 lol

[brisk viper]

ebay quest 2 like $80

imo standalone games are ehhhhh but quest i just use my quest for pcvr

[barren zealot]

Wasn't the quest 2 jailbroken a while ago

[little plinth]

I find myself playing direct on q3 way more than pc nowadays

[brisk viper]

havnt heard anything about that

[brisk viper]

what games?

[little plinth]

Mostly beat saber, there's also cooking vr

[brisk viper]

at the moment im playing modded contractors and h3vr the most

[little plinth]

Thrill of the fight

[brisk viper]

yeah that makes sense you dont really gain much from those on PC

[brisk viper]

used to play a lot of Ghosts of tabor and showdown aswell which both had massive pc gains

i bought the quest 3 purely for the lenses and display as an upgrade to my quest 2

i also play war thunder vr

[little plinth]

I would probably buy games on the quest store moving forward since i can play them outside the house

[barren zealot]

Never buying absolutely anything from the quest store tbh

Mostly because i intend to sell this headset as soon as deckard is out

[brisk viper]

the games i have on quest i got because they dont have crossplay with steam and the steam playerbase is dead

[frosty hawk]

Idk what VR to get I wanna play ur standard VR games like five nights at Freddie’s and beat saber but I wanna play games on my PC with is like phasmophobia or Skyrim VR and I wanna use my Logitech wheel and do some sim racing what’s a good VR and I’m on a tight budget so nothing that’s gonna cost a grand or something stupid like that

[gloomy crater]

Seeing this reminded me of one of the hopes that I had for valve's next headset. I wished they'd open a fork path for devs to make a mobile optimized version of their VR games so that when deckard releases, you can just play the exact same games you'd normally play on SteamVR with your PCVR headset (deckard in PCVR mode, with the option to use base stations and index knuckles) at home, and then when you take the headset somewhere else, you can play a lower quality version on mobile hardware (deckard in standalone mode, with inside out tracking and its roy controllres) while you're away from your PC. All while not having to re-purchase any games since you already have them in your steam library.

I do really think that the standalone quality of being able to take your headset and play games anywhere is pretty cool, but that comes at the cost of having to buy all of the games that you want to play exclusively for use on that headset in standalone mode, and you'll never be able to fully experience that game with PC hardware without re-buying the game on Steam. There's never been a headset that truly allows you to both have an amazing PCVR experience and then disconnect that headset and have a good standalone experience elsewhere, all on the same headset with the same game library, and I feel like valve is the only company who could make that happen because well, they own the biggest gaming library available.

[serene stump]

Yeah that is more exspensive then the standard Quest 3

[solid flax]

Forgot to say, but this is currently what I use for "VR"
https://www.amazon.com/Lenovo-Star-Wars-Challenges-Smartphone-Experience/dp/B076FDK9TF

[weak bluff]

Oh god

Memory flashback

[brisk viper]

i wish there was a game like arma for vr

[barren zealot]

no fucking shit you don't like it

[barren zealot]

it wouldn't be good. too many limitations.

[next osprey]

Arma isnt good either. Your point?

[barren zealot]

arma isn't good but at least it's enjoyable

[rustic garnet]

where did they say that

sony please please please horizon call of the mountain on pcvr please please please for christmas my present from you

[next osprey]

Lol

Real

[barren zealot]

ah i was tired and mistook him for that child who thought vr was useless and wanted fucking ar glasses

[rustic garnet]

yeah i figured 😭

[rustic garnet]

Arcane appearance

[next osprey]

?

[solid flax]

Actually I kind of enjoy it
Mostly because its what I have

[rustic garnet]

your pfp

[barren zealot]

Also general question, anyone know how to reduce that feeling of looking at two screens?

Like if i move my eyes to a certain angle the illusion of having one big screen in front of me kinda breaks

As in i can see the black space between my eyes

I can't tell if it's an IPD issue or a distance from the screen issue

[honest sphinx]

Are your lenses clean?

[barren zealot]

Yep

It's like, you know when you look to the far right you can see the outline of your nose but your brain superimposes it with your right eye's view?

Kinda like that but while looking straight ahead

[brisk viper]

check your ipd

and dont focus on things really close up

[honest sphinx]

Probably just a problem with current headsets and we'll have to wait for one that gets the lenses closer to our eyes/nose.

It hasn't been a big problem for me since I don't move my eyes to the left and right like that much.

[barren zealot]

I'll see

[brisk viper]

ive never ever had this issue with any of my headsets

rift s, quest 2 and 3

[honest sphinx]

Yeah, it's something you don't notice much until you look for it.

It's more of a problem when looking left since my right eye is dominant.

[little plinth]

wonder why there's a big influx with pico

it stayed stagnant for months before

[gloomy crater]

huh. even if pico did like, black friday sales, that would presumably lead to an influx of players after christmas, assuming they're being bought as gifts. Random increase in users after thanksgiving is kinda weird

[weak bluff]

No maybe just not rise of pico rather rest of headset growth slowed

This is market share not number growth

All headset except quest 3 are discontinued, pico 4 users probably are dedicated users that are willing to buy and use despite better alternatives

[little plinth]

it's a giant increase in a single month, this does not explain it

[weak bluff]

Maybe chinese users?

[little plinth]

it would be acceptable if it's over time

[weak bluff]

I know pico 4 is fire sale on aliexpress

Maybe it is on taobao or chinese ver

[little plinth]

that doesn't explain it either because the influx should be next month

sure as hell isn't the P4U

no one's buying that overpriced shit

[weak bluff]

Maybe valve merged multiple pico variant into Pico 4

Or pico sent merged data

[little plinth]

steam hardware survey doesn't take data from external sources

there's definitely not enough Pro and enterprise variant for it to make a dent

even then, detection is handled by steamvr

there's also the fact that VD still sends picos as quest 2s

[weak bluff]

Did that get fixed

That could explain if it got fixed

[little plinth]

idk can't check

i sold my pico for quest 3

[surreal bobcat]

does anyone with their finger on the pulse of the valve deckard rumors know if it's supposed to have a PCVR mode to it also? or is it standalone only?

[serene stump]

Pretty sure I posted about it but I am going to require a USB capture card if I want to use my PC on a Quest 3/3S correct?

I ask about both since the Quest 3 isn't slated for delivery until MID January so yeah if that gets canceled by Amazon I will be forced to purchase a 3S

[little plinth]

What?

Just use meta remote desktop

Works via wifi

Immersed is best definitely

3 monitor support

Works via usb and wifi

[gloomy crater]

So here's the thing- At the moment, valve doesn't have a marketplace full of standalone compatible games like Meta does. So far, we haven't seen Valve making any effort to get devs to make mobile optimized versions of their existing SteamVR games. It just doesn't make much sense for Valve, a company whose entire VR library exists solely on PC, to release a headset that doesn't have a PCVR mode. I imagine it'll be wired/wireless PCVR at launch, and then the standalone mode will come later, once devs actually get their hands on the production headset and they can start optimizing their games to run on the standalone hardware. That's just speculation though.

[brisk viper]

i hope the wired isnt just through a usb like meta's is

imo the headsets that connect with dp into your gpu seem to have sharper image

[rustic garnet]

they dont "seem to" they measurably objectively do

[next osprey]

Well yeah, a real display connection will always be better

[weak bluff]

Any intel arc users with vr can vouch for its usability on quest?

[little plinth]

If its x86 based like the deck there isnt much work making it standalone

[gloomy crater]

That's a possibility. There have been some flags referencing a VR specific Linux architecture like the Deck has, so it's possible that they're actually going to make the first ever x86 based standalone headset. I just expect that being the first of its kind will come with an appropriate price tag, which goes against the rumored purpose of the deckard being an affordable headset

[weak bluff]

The problem is there is no major architecture improvement on Radeon 8000 so AMD Semi Custom won't be good enough

I wish deckard wait for good amd gpu instead of rushing in 2025

[little plinth]

Still beefier than XR2 G2

[weak bluff]

AMD switching to Server first, consumer second like Polaris era does not help

I hate that deckard is not ready to get x86 if it releases in next 2 years

Maybe valve will make special ARM version of half life alyx or bust

[little plinth]

Theyll end up like pico if they try to fight in arm standalone

[weak bluff]

Maybe deckard is not VR standalone. Maybe its made for flat screen standalone only as in its standalone - for flat screen games only. In that case arm make sense.

VR games? With PC only

It would pair well if you already have steam deck with deckard

But god that sucks for vr

[rustic garnet]

aren't there also leaks about a proton-like layer for running x86 steam apps on an arm soc?

x86 is just not power efficient enough to run a standalone vr device at any kind of fidelity

Rumored 4k per eye?

[weak bluff]

They can if they try like Lunar Lake

X86 having worse efficiency than ARM is a myth

Its design, semiconductor and backward compatibility holding it back

[rustic garnet]

hm

[weak bluff]

But AMD does not have that

Intel does, then canned Lunar Lake because it is too expensive

As in canned successor

[rustic garnet]

Ok but even if x86 isnt inherently less efficient do any APUs like this exist

like the whole point of arm is to have less cpu complexity right

and so

[weak bluff]

Yes if they try. But no one will spend effort like Apple

[rustic garnet]

with the same level of manufacturing technology an arm architecture will be more efficient than an x86 one right

[weak bluff]

Apple buy exclusive and i mean by the only customer for TSMC latest and greatest node, can afford to pay extra for small gain because their product margin is big

ARM is less complex... In name kinda. X86 is not bad and its weakness is not really complex rather it holds too many legacy support.

X86 is trying to fix that without sacrificing backward compatibility. One of those is intel proposed x86S

ARM meanwhile lacks ACPI and UEFI support makes them significantly less versatile, makes software compatibility tricky because different ARM version require custom firmware

Ever wonder why you can't just install custom OS easily on smartphone like Windows and Linux on PC?

Apple wins not because ARM is the secret sauce. They win because they are willing to make best chip at higher cost even if it means sacrifice value which matters little when their mac is so expensive

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2023/08/report-apple-is-saving-billions-on-chips-thanks-to-unique-deal-with-tsmc/

That time Apple booked TSMC 3nm exclusively

Intel could do that but it won't make financial sense to spend so much for little gain. Anc their own fab is struggling behind.

No other manufacturers are willing to do crazy package design like Apple, until Lunar Lake which was amazing but wasn't worth it.

TLDR what i am saying Apple miracle is less about ARM and more about getting full control on chip design decision and their great negotiation power to leap competition

Their willingness to pay for best manufacturing technologies, the fact that Apple does not lose as much software wise as competitors when they switch x86 to ARM.

Apple wins using ARM but that does not mean ARM is necessary better than x86 in efficiency. They are better because they gained full control on design making crazy special design with on package memory, best in class node, sacrificing legacy support at little cost. They win because then can afford to get better without much sacrifice unlike competitors.

[rustic garnet]

how interesting

[little plinth]

If apple gets x86 license you bet your ass they'll make x86 chips lol

Intel and AMD holds a duopoly on x86 and x64 license

If say apple or nvidia acquires that means they get those licenses too

[weak bluff]

If apple have x86 license, i bet they will strip features too. Apple ARM isn't same as ARM used on Android either. They will do it because they can.

Probably old instruction set, 16 bit boot mode, maybe 32bit mode gone

[haughty thistle]

VD and Vive Wireless Adapter are the only two VR solutions that work on Arc. Tested it myself

[weak bluff]

i just want something more than 8GB VRAM and battlemage looks too good thats why i ask

[haughty thistle]

I can't really speak of the Quality from VD, as it's not super transparent if/when it uses CPU encoding. Might be the case on Arc as VD might not have implemented QSV...

[weak bluff]

Im still on Quest 2 so im on H.264

[haughty thistle]

What I can say is that it works pretty decent. Other then the kinda meh performance that is to be expected with a 3055-ish card, there wasn't really any big negative to report

(I tested on an A750 LE from Intel)

[weak bluff]

Im more worried about its performance on Unity and PCI-E 3.0

[junior raven]

I kinda wonder sometimes if the rumors about them using RISC-V could also come to pass, since we already know that all Apple cared about with going with their own chips they designed was just to have exclusive control over every variable down to the hardware in their products. Technically, it wouldn't be completely out of the question, even if just for small microcontrollers and such for some SoC designs and whatnot.

[weak bluff]

Apple is already on ARM, apple does not license Cortex unlike Qualcomm and others so they already don't pay much for ARM licensing why bother

[junior raven]

With one outlier who was basically VIA (who also bought up Cyrix when they went out), up until being changed to Zhaoxin, and being China-exclusive.

[weak bluff]

VIA does not have amd64 (aka x64 or x86_64) license

Zhaoxin have Zen 1 perpetual license

[junior raven]

Eh, they've always been in the position to do anything they wanted or at least felt optimal. It's really just one of those things where you couldn't past them if they did, and if not it's still understandable why. Apple does whatever they want really, so in a way it's unsurprising regardless which way they go about it with their products.

[weak bluff]

If they do, I doubt Apple will move away from ARM until at least 2040 since that is their contract deal with ARM

If something will happen that far, i bet they don't even think about moving away right now

[junior raven]

I personally don't think they would either. It's more like a good thought of what things will be like if they did, otherwise realistically I don't think they'll have much reason to with how far they got with the ARM instruction set as is.

[weak bluff]

Its still better to go ARM now since they have experience with ARM for iPhone and iPad and they can do it fast. RISC-V is still young. Assuming they move completely in 2040 then they would probably start transition in 2030s

[junior raven]

Yeah, and the ISA still has room to grow on ARM Holdings' end and with them doing so, Apple has references they can go off of for their customizations on existing cores as they move along.
Very much unlike the past arches they stuck with before.

[weak bluff]

But my money is on ARM extension. If suddenly RISC V is so good and killing ARM, ARM might as well go IBM

IBM admit competition, open sourced PowerISA

So ARM could go open source to beat RISC-V with good establishment

[junior raven]

It's interesting how out of most of the other surviving RISC-based ISAs besides ARM, POWER is still somehow able to be around, especially with ARM and x86 having a major foothold in the space.

Even MIPS for a time took over the network controller space too in some cases till ARM caught up to them (I think), so it was surprising to see a POWER 10 even now with potentially another to come later.

Even SPARC seems near invisible and J (previously Super-H) is mostly industrial/automotive embedded sectors at this point.

Others in the abundance, it's hard to tell who's around for mainstream. Most seem to stick around educational purposes or niche uses.

[gloomy crater]

So Valve added new third party hardware logos for packaging and branding

I'm wondering what they consider to be 'SteamVR Tracking 2.0', cause that could mean the 2.0 Base Stations that come with the index, or they could be considering the Index tracking to be 1.0 and whatever inside out tracking the deckard uses to be 2.0.

[haughty thistle]

SteamVR Tracking Version 2.0 does mean the HMD/controller support 2.0 lighthouses

And those SteamVR compatibility labels have existed since basically forever. For proof here's a Vive Pro 1 HMD only box:

I think the only new ones are the SteamOS and Steam Link ones...

[gloomy crater]

Aren't the Quest series the only HMDs that use Steam Link so far? Makes me wonder if they plan on adding Steam Link compatibility for other headsets, or if that's just the terminology they're gonna use for wireless PCVR on their next headset so they're updating the logos for it before then

[haughty thistle]

Yepp. Same with how the Steam Deck is currently the only SteamOS device. Valve very much seems like they're working on opening both Steam Link VR and SteamOS open for third-parties...

[serene stump]

So whats a good 3D modeling program I can use with VR so I am not looking at just a "window"? AKA want to be able to walk around the object I am modeling

Valve had to make some core changes to Steam OS V3 before it could even be considered for others to use. Such as rewriting their SD card stuff completely for example

Wouldn't surprise me if there was some other things that needed a rewrite before they can allow others to ship with the OS

[gloomy crater]

I hope that Steam OS and other recent developments lead to a push for better game support on Linux. I'd love to just run Steam OS as my next daily OS once Win10 gets axed, but first they'd have to fix all the little issues that comes with dailying a linux machine and getting all your games working, some of which don't work at all currently.

[serene stump]

My issue is that I have a Intel+Nvidia PC I want to install it to and yeah no Nvidia support in these SteamOSv3 distros

i5 3570k+Nvidia 2060 Super here myself with 16gb of ram. System runs 1080p@60 gaming perfectly fine but the lack of support for the hardware sucks right now

Yeah that PC is currently running Windows 10 becuase MS says W11 will NOT work becuase of the lack of TPM 2.0 on the CPU/MB

[gloomy crater]

I'm pretty sure LTT just uploaded a video today where they talk about how to get around those Win11 hardware requirements

[distant skiff]

only mentioned that its possible and linked a how to. should be in the description or pinned comment

[shrewd imp]

Hey dudes do yall know of a PC VR headset under 400$?

[rustic garnet]

quest 2 or maybe 3

[shrewd imp]

Dang

[little plinth]

There's the 3s

Even if the lenses and displays are the same as quest 2 the way faster chipset allows for higher bitrates in pcvr and of course better standalone experience if you need to.

[serene whale]

you can bypass most of them by just using rufus to create your bootable image

no need to do other sutff

*stuff

[little plinth]

Nice that quest controllers only use 1 AA

Pico using 2 really guzzles batteries

[weak bluff]

Mixed reality looks away

[past galleon]

Any suggestions on face tracking?

It seems super limited

[weak bluff]

Check out Project Babble

They are out of stock rn so wait for next update on their discord

[past galleon]

looks neat

Does it work well tho?

[weak bluff]

Its open source and is ok. Not as good as HTC one but it gets better overtime.

[past galleon]

always out of stock

[weak bluff]

Well alternatively you can make your own device since project babble is just webcam camera pointed at your mouth

[real pasture]

strapping a webcam to your headset?

[weak bluff]

Yes

[plain forge]

Heyo

Had VR headset a good while ago (dev kit of oculus rift)

Loved it soo much, and with bigger space and better pc, i would like to aquire a headset again. I see some tests rank Meta Quest 3 as best headset? Any thoughts? Really only HTC Vive and Oculus last time i was interested in this stuff

Is Oculus Meta now? Meta as in Facebook owner Meta?

[rustic garnet]

Yep

That happened before the first rift released

or well oculus got bought by fb but they phased out the oculus brand in favor of meta during the quest 2s lifespan

[plain forge]

Ah

But quality is still there. Even though vive and oculus both had their pros and cons

What would be a good purchase without breaking bank? Used Quest 2? How are those wireless ones? Only used the rift first version dev kit i believe

Also I see they have storage now.. Games are stored on headset?

[haughty thistle]

They've cost down significantly. If you're expecting an apple-esque experience from the moment you touch the box, yeah those days are over. (Really the CV1 unboxing experience and software was kinda Apple-esque, these days it's more like a mid-range Android phone experience)
Tho I'd defo say that the Quest HMDs remain the gold standard for software compatibility, mostly because everything is now being coded for them.
You can still connect the headset to a PC and play games through SteamVR, which honestly I'd recommend as long as the game is available on Steam and you don't necessairly need the ability to play VR away from a PC (as Steam purchased VR titles are headset agnostic, any game bought specifically for the Quest can only ever be played on the Quest)

The Quest can be used either over Wifi with a PC (for which it's heavily recommended to buy a dedicated Wifi AP/Router just for the Quest) or via a USB 3 cable

[plain forge]

Ah. Yeah it was incredible at the time. I actually believe i had the CV1 yes, not DK.

So cable is recommended anyway? Glad it can be played with cable honestly. Now.. Price.. Is there big difference between Quest 2 and Quest 3? Less than half the price for Quest 2.. I see resolution and refresh rate obviously but are quest 2 to be considered? Or Quest 3S? I can just as fine buy a Quest 3 with only 128 GB then since I can play with cable? Tracking and everything is good?

[haughty thistle]

The Quest 3s is basically the Quest 2 with an updated processor and better hand tracking hardware. If standalone performance is not a concern for you, then they might as well be the same headset tbh

The Quest 3 (non-s) has better lenses and screens, plus it can do proper physical IPD adjustment, and not that stupid 3-step BS that the Quest 2 and 3s have going on

Both the Quest 3 and 3s use the same SoC, the Quest 2 uses an older SoC with less standalone performance. The 3s is the only one that has the improved hand tracking hardware tho

[plain forge]

I want a good experience without breaking bank. Only positive I can think of with standalone is the one cable going to headset. I dont mind sensors etc. But downsides are storage, wireless speed, battery and more

[haughty thistle]

Not that it matters for PC gaming as hand tracking can't be forwarded (officially that is; Virtual Desktop can for VRchat purposes)

[plain forge]

Also found a site called vr-compare.com.. Seems like Pico 4 is okey as well

[plain forge]

Good hand tracking is defo a need. I remember being annoyed at times with the CV1 or DK1 or what i had

[haughty thistle]

I'd stay away from VRcompare. That site tends to fall into the typical marketing pitfalls for "higher res = automatically better" kinda thing

[plain forge]

Ah yeah only looked at comparison (spec sheets). Not any rankings really

[haughty thistle]

I had tried the Pico 4, but personally I found the Quest Pro (lower resolution; same lens tech, but different actual lenses) to be much better in terms of visual experience. There's a lot of things that go into a VR headset that pure specs can't tell you

[plain forge]

Quest pro.. First version?

[haughty thistle]

Things like lens internal reflections, Chromatic Aberration, e2e clarity. The Meta Pancake lenses (the ones found in the Quest Pro and Quest 3) are kindof the gold standard when it comes to pancake lenses in VR. Everything else (pancake optics concerned) is kinda dogwater imo.

[plain forge]

Ah

[haughty thistle]

The Quest Pro is basically a Quest 2 with the lenses of the Quest 3, a boosted Quest 2 SoC and Eye + Face Tracking bolted on

It's not the most comfortable headset, nor is it the most up to date, but if ET/FT is remotely of concern to you, it's the only decent option on the market rn

There's good Fresnel optics in VR headsets too. The PSVR2 is in a similar price-range as the Quest 3, but has much better PCVR performance as it doesn't need to do any video compression on the PC side for VR. Tho it does come at the cost of standalone capabilities, which the PSVR2 has none. But it does have really good fresnel optics and OLED screens

[plain forge]

Hmm

But cabled, VR experience on PC without going above lets say.. 600 $, its the quest 3?

I can buy a used Vive Pro 2 for 700 though. Electronics are for the most part more expensive here than in the US

With sensors and controllers

[haughty thistle]

The PSVR2 is regularly on sale and there's also plenty of options on the used market. I wouldn't say the Quest 3 is the only option, tho I do have to concede that it is an incredible value proporsition in what you're getting.
In both cases, the PSVR2 and Quest 3, you'd need extra hardware to use them on a PC. With the PSVR2 that's a 60$ PC adapter and with the Quest 3 that's a USB cable or Wifi router. You can use the Quest 3 on your existing wifi with a PC, but I wouldn't recommend it 😬

[haughty thistle]

Vive Pro 2 is a garbage headset. HTC forgot how to make good headsets the moment they parted ways with Valve...

Terrible, terrible lenses and equally bad driver software

[plain forge]

Oh. So being best on resolution when VR started they went down?

Damn but at the price of 1800 usd? 😮

[haughty thistle]

The last decent headset HTC made was the Vive Pro 1/Eye

[haughty thistle]

Yeah, HTC has a terrible value proporsition, and have some of the worst lenses in the VR market lol
I don't understand how they still have people buying their stuff

I guess being the only option in some markets does help their position...

[plain forge]

I guess with rankings like PCmag and PC Gamer etc

[haughty thistle]

I don't wanna sound like an HTC hater. I love my Vive Pro 1, and the Vive Pro Eye with the Vive Facial Tracker is still the gold standard when it comes to Eye and Face Tracking, but neither is being offered anymore, and the options that they replaced them with are just terrible replacements that lack many features their predecessors had >.>

[haughty thistle]

I bet the VP2 is the only headset they ever reviewed lol

Or they reviewed it by paper specs, which is a terrible way to judge a headsets performance

The Reverb G2 has a way better image clarity then the Vive Pro 2, and the Reverb G2 has lower resolution panels. Just goes to show how important the lenses are

[plain forge]

I glanced quickly at Apples knowing it was probably pricey. Did not in my existance think it would be 4k+ wtf

Between Reverb G2 and Quest 2? Image quality and tracking precision

[haughty thistle]

That said, the G2 is turning into a paperweight because M$ decided to can the entire driver software with alternative. So if you run W11 24H2 you just simply cannot use that headset anymore

[haughty thistle]

G2 has the better image quality, the Quest 2 has the better tracking precision

[haughty thistle]

It's Apple. How is anyone surprised by their pricing xD

[plain forge]

I mean.. True.. Their phones are the cheap stuff lol. What would you recommend me at 600 $ ish?
Quest 3 128 GB (can maybe stretch to 512)
Quest 2 (Better price)
PSVR2?
I guess not getting dizzy is main priority, with image quality second and tracking third

Also just a question, that matters if I at all want to buy VR again, how big difference is VR now compared to the CV1?

[haughty thistle]

Each of these three options are pretty good first-timer HMDs. Personally I'd go for the PSVR2 for that OLED goodness, but I'm well aware that not everyone is so focused on contrast and perfect blacks.
If you can afford the Quest 3, then I honestly don't see a reason to get the Quest 2. You've already experienced VR in the past, so it's not like your first time in VR. What you defo don't need is a ton of storage. Standalone VR games aren't that big, so even on the 128GB one you can fit plenty of games.

In the end, the decision is up to you. The PSVR2 does need the adapter box (and if your PC doesn't have built-in bluetooth, some sort of Bt adapter), the Quest 2 and 3 both need a long USB cable or extra Wifi AP to work with a PC. The PSVR2 does however add a ton of nice features when used with a PS5 while the Quest headsets can be carried to say a family meetup without the need to alos bring a laptop with ya...

[haughty thistle]

Modern headsets have barely any screen door effect anymore. It's still defo there on the more "mainstream" headsets, but it's so little, it's basically become irrelevant now. You also get a lot better lenses these days. The amount of "godrays" on modern fresnel lenses (with the exception of HTCs current ones) is pretty minimal, while the pancake lenses don't have them at all, but they do have internal lens reflections instead (basically dim, sometimes upside down, smaller and larger duplicates of what's on screen; sometimes in- sometimes out-of-focus)

[plain forge]

How big of a difference would you say there is between Quest 3 and CV1 if we talk GPUs comparisons? 😂 Just to get an general idea

[haughty thistle]

oof

Hard to say, given that the video enc load on a GPU manifests differently compared to raw compute loads

But it's definetly higher. Modern headsets have way higher render res targets

While with a CV1 something like a 970 or 1060 was plenty fine, with the Quest 3, I'd say a 2060 is the bare minimum, preferably more like 3060 perf on the low end...

Games also have gotten way more graphically intense. Half Life Alyx, while graphically breathtaking, isn't really a benchmark as it scales render resolution based on available GPU overhead. But it's the only game that I'm aware of that does that...

[plain forge]

Okey defo big then

Ill look into the psvr price

GF wants a PS5 so i guess thats a decent buy then

compatible with both

[haughty thistle]

Oh yeah, that's definetly an argument for the PSVR2 😄

[plain forge]

But the Fresnel lenses are fine? i see FoV is 110 on both, Almost same resolution and more. PSVR has eye tracking though. SteamVR for PC?

[haughty thistle]

The Eye Tracking hardware on the PSVR2 is locked to the PS5 (thanks stupid license agreements <.<)

The Fresnels like I said, are fine. They're a heck of a lot better then what the CV1 shipped with.

[little plinth]

3060 will comfortably runs 2033px per eye last time i had it

[haughty thistle]

It's not as cut'n'dry as some people say with "fresnel = bad; pancake = good", because there's bad lenses with both tech. If you want to see terrible pancake lenses, look no further then the bigscreen beyond
The PSVR2 lenses are some of the best fresnel optics I've seen... and I've seen a lot of VR optics

[little plinth]

It can't run 2544 however

I'd still get a quest 3

Trust me you'd use standalone features a lot more than you think you would once you had it

[plain forge]

https://www.reddit.com/r/virtualreality/comments/1eoe8ic/psvr2_vs_quest_3_pcvr_through_the_lens/ The blur/quality in the images of this thread, can anyone confirm?

@haughty thistle

[little plinth]

Well that's to be expected

VR2 has the best fresnel but it's still fresnel

It's not beating pancake clarity

[haughty thistle]

TTL pictures never properly represent the actual experience in my experience

Cameras just percieve the world different to our eyes, and edge blur on TTL pictures is expected

Pancakes in my experience have 0 e2e advantages over fresnel lenses. Their big advantage is the shorter physical light tunnel needed to get equal focal distance

[haughty thistle]

And this isn't just some "my experience has shown" type of thing. If you look at camera pancake optics, those tend to have way worse edge focus then traditional camera optics. So just because it's pancake doesn't mean it's better, it actually tends to be the opposite

The bend lightpath makes for some really challenging focusing problems

[little plinth]

I never tried PSVR2 so i can't give further insight.
Fuck i should've tried it when i was at the vr booth 😢

[haughty thistle]

What I can say is that the PSVR2 has a very small sweet spot. You basically have to have it perfectly aligned for good focus.

[little plinth]

Kinda makes DFR pointless no? When FFR would work just fine since you're stuck seeing the middle anyway

[haughty thistle]

And unfortunatly, at least on my face, it loves to slip down out of that sweet spot. But as long as it's aligned it has some really good e2e clarity. Not as good as my Varjo Aero (which is basically perfect), but pretty good for how small the sweet spot is

[little plinth]

How can it have good e2e if it has small sweet spot though

[haughty thistle]

Sweetspot and e2e clarity are not tied together

Some people prefer to use the term "eye box" for lens alignment range?

I stopped using that term after people started complaining lol

e2e clarity is just concerned with how large of an area of the lens is in focus when the lens is aligned with the viewpoint. sweet spot or eye box is how forgiving the lens is for alignment. As long as the sweet spot is large enough to not be a problem with pupil swim, it doesn't matter, and not even the PSVR2 has that small of a sweet spot

I think only the BSB has a sweet spot small enough to become a problem with pupil swim

[plain forge]

Hard stuff.. I guess i would either buy a PSVR2 or Quest 3..

Pico 4 235 USD / 222 Euro
Quest 3 512 GB 589 USD / 559 Euro
PSVR2 401 USD / 380 EURO

Quest 2 (used) 179 USD

Pico 4 Ultra with motiontrackers, 626 usd

[little plinth]

Just sold off my pico 4 for quest 3

Mainly because of standalone stuff however. The PCVR aspect is basically the same between the two

However quest 3 is able to maintain higher bitrate better thanks to it better decoder

But considering for you it's like 235US it's hard to pass up on that deal

[rustic garnet]

the rifts never had hand tracking only tracked controllers the quests have camera based controllerless tracking of your hands

if u had issues with the rifts tracking that was probably an occlusion issue

[plain forge]

oooo interesting

Hand tracking i thought of controller tracking

@little plinthHeard some things about the Pico 4 but yeah

[plain forge]

Well some angles etc it could glitch a bit you know so wasnt that great but no issues with what i played at the time. Just mostly fun showing off VR

Hows VR gaming on AMD GPU's? I have a 6800 XT

It should be around same performance of a 3080

[rustic garnet]

that sounds like occlusion

How they manage to track the quest 3 controllers without the led rings is beyond me tbh

[rustic garnet]

Finickyer than nvidia

[little plinth]

Wish they'd revive the electromagnetic tracker like pico 2 controller

Fully occlusion proof

[plain forge]

many different reviews around, and different opinions here too

damn this got hard lol

[little plinth]

If you're only after PCVR it's hard to pass up on the pico 4 if you wanna save money since it's 232usd

At 500 I'd get quest 3 anyday of the week

[plain forge]

oh yeah ofcoruse, but still 232 usd too much if it sucks

i absolutely hate spending money on things im not happy with

[little plinth]

It's equal to the quest 2 pretty much on standalone
And equal to the quest 3 on PCVR

[plain forge]

Well GF really wants a ps5 so we will be getting one.. but I will mostly use PCVR

[little plinth]

PS5 is such a hardsell considering the lack of exclusives nowadays

[plain forge]

well she just likes console better

and xbox will never enter the house anyway 😂

[rustic garnet]

oh yeah i think i remember that vaguely

[plain forge]

Yee that offer is gone. It was an outlet sale. Getting rid of it

Meta Quest 3S 128 GB is at 357 USD though.
I can get a refurbished Quest 3 for 500 USD. Refurbished by Meta

[haughty thistle]

Referbs done by the company making the product are usually really good. Almost like buying a brand-new product. At least this is my experience buying refurbs from other brands like JBL. Yes, there might be minor visual defects, but who cares about a tiny little scratch around the USB plug. It's not like you'd put some in yourself first time plugging the device in xD

[plain forge]

oh ye idc much

[solid flax]

Finally got this working

[past galleon]

oh fr?

[weak bluff]

Check project babble documentation

Preferably webcam with ir filter removed

[past galleon]

Guess imma do that

Prob better to have like a high refresh rate one in 4k right?

Strap a dslr camera to a headset

[little plinth]

That's gonna be completely overkill and extremely heavy

Any webcam will do since it's just simple mouth tracking

Since heck even my webcam can do entire face tracking for "trackir"

[weak bluff]

Using dslr camera is like jet engine in a car too heavy and unsuitable lens angle

A webcam is already too big

DIYers use ESP32CAM

[little plinth]

A webcam isn't exactly impractical
I mean people have strapped heavier things like a literal vive tracker on their quest just to use the index controllers

[weak bluff]

Valve index has extremely convenient usb slot great for usb camera

Also, ir filter removed camera is uncommon, nice to have for in the dark

[little plinth]

A wireless camera would do well

Might need to hook it to the quest or whatever hmd power however

[weak bluff]

Its great. But also need power source

Get a 2 usb port power bank and use as counterweight and extra power for headset

[little plinth]

Though ngl that's a lot of work for not a lot of benefits on your end

Other than other people seeing your mouth shittalk better

[weak bluff]

Prob better to learn DIY instead

Buy parts from aliexpress, flash firmware then close with 3d printed enclosure

Mount to headset

Many community made esp32cam enclosure

Some people in EyeTrackVR made eye tracking + project babble combo 3d prints

[rustic garnet]

thats just more pixels to process => more delay

machine vision is always better with as few pixels as possible

or like

just enough pixels to provide the information needed

[rustic garnet]

don't underestimate vrchatters

theyre the ones pushing the whole industry forward ngl

with nothing but mouser and a 3d printer