public-chat

[hearty spear]

What do I want for dinner:
Popeye's or KFC Chicken? Taco Bell? Chinese?

[hollow zealot]

KFC

[lucid echo]

Taco Bell

[hollow zealot]

Or Panda Express if you have it

[naive light]

i'm busy doing workshops for the mentally ill, sorry if you thought i was an easy target for moral scrutiny

[lucid echo]

Taco Bell Crunchwrap, add beans/rice/pico to the order

[hollow zealot]

[naive light]

anyway

[hearty spear]

you don't get to act like a little shit and then try to claim the moral highground.

[lucid echo]

"Guys trust me, I'm actually super moral. I just want people to do work for free for me, that's all"

[naive light]

all i gave you was opinions that you disagreed with

[fossil dirge]

Well Popeye's is very good

[hollow zealot]

The thing is, you refuse to listen to everyone else's opinion

[lucid echo]

And also your opinion is trash

[naive light]

were your parents hard on you guys, something along the lines of, "being unproductive"

[lucid echo]

Ah, classic

[hearty spear]

And opinions, despite much whining, can ABSOLUTELY be wrong.

[fossil dirge]

Well everybody has an opinion

[hearty spear]

and guess what, DH1

[lucid echo]

My opinion is that the world is flat

[fossil dirge]

In my honest opinion I love Razer products fight me

[hollow zealot]

My opinion is that you should visit lttstore.com and buy a water bottle

[hearty spear]

Saying you love something isn't really an opinion, that's a statement of fact

[fossil dirge]

Oh I see

So it becomes a fact when I say that I love Razer products

[lucid echo]

dh1 currently writing a novel it seems

[fossil dirge]

I do have a Lenovo Legion Y540 laptop

[hearty spear]

"Orange is the best color" is an opinion, because it's not factually true or false, it's what one person thinks, and other people can disagree, and still be right.

[fossil dirge]

I could have gotten the Razer Blade

[naive light]

look, it's a fact that a.i. tools are relatively new to layman public spaces, at this time, it takes manual work to get things done. later on, when things get settled in, it'll be easier and it'll make more sense to open up some basic tools for free use. i wouldn't mind giving someone a cup of water if i didn't have to wring it out of a rag on a tropical island. i'm not a monster nor a brat for acknowledging this, you guys are haughty and quick to box me in as some mooch with an entitlement complex.

now thank you for the advice, have a good day, to all of you

[lucid echo]

Aww cute!

[hearty spear]

who, what, huh?
Well, enjoy taking your ball and going home.

[lucid echo]

They wrote a paragraph explaining why they want free shit, I love it

[hollow zealot]

Have a good one

[hearty spear]

also, giving someone a glass of water is far from comparable to the ask in question.....

[fossil dirge]

Okay so when I say Blue is the best color it's an opinion

[hearty spear]

yup

[fossil dirge]

When I say I love Razer products it's a fact because I love their products

[hollow zealot]

What's the approximate price of your average server machine used for AI?

[hearty spear]

but when you say "I Love Blue" that's no longer an opinion, that's a statement

[hearty spear]

uhhhhh, anywhere from not super expensive, on up to I hope you have 6 or 7 digits to pay for that shit.

depends on your data sets and what you're doing

[lucid echo]

Thousands of dollars, at least

[hollow zealot]

And then would you say the average price to run all that is about the same?

[naive light]

i don't think you got the analogy. currently, it takes work to develop programs. when you have a.i. advanced enough to write that stuff at the press of a button, it's not going to be as much worth as something that had to be handcrafted.

[lucid echo]

To fund a popular public-facing machine learning service (ignoring development costs), the costs are tens of thousands per month, if not hundreds of thousands

[lucid echo]

You're forgetting about the operational costs of running that AI, silly goose

[hearty spear]

.... what? We're nowhere near AI making software for us.
And honestly, at that point we'd be close enough to the sentience singularity? I'd be afraid.

[naive light]

i'm not, are you considering the level of advancement i'm talking about?

[hollow zealot]

So, in comparison to the price to run the AI, the consumer is getting it essentially free

[fossil dirge]

Okay so when I say I love Blue (which is my favorite color) it's no longer an opinion but a statement

[hearty spear]

yup

[naive light]

i should get some data for you on code-writing a.i. sometime

sentience singularity is some freaky shit

[lucid echo]

Software engineer working on multiple machine learning projects here, you have no idea what you're talking about

Github Copilot is the best we got right now, and it sucks ass

[naive light]

you think your title and your experience makes you god?

don't make me laugh.

[lucid echo]

Yes

[hollow zealot]

I'm already laughing

[graceful burrow]

Id trust sanic here more than you lmao

[hearty spear]

No, but people with first hand experience in the shit you're begging to get ffor free? Probably know more about it than you do.

[lucid echo]

Dunning-Kruger in full effect here

[naive light]

i studied logic for 7 years for hours every day to not get befuddled by the likes of you, i know what i know.

[graceful burrow]

What even started this argument kek

[hearty spear]

"This is my Day Job" vs "I read some shit online"
I know where my trust is gonna fall.

[lucid echo]

Logic! Watch out everyone!

[hearty spear]

he as looking for ML Software for free

[graceful burrow]

Why is deadhitter in such a tizzy

[naive light]

quick to assume

[lucid echo]

DH wants 100% free AI services that don't need any coding experience

[graceful burrow]

If you make it, it's free

[naive light]

i said 'i dont care' and this ticked them off, i figure

[graceful burrow]

Honestly sounds like your the big dumbo in this situation

👀

[naive light]

maybe i mistook this place for a place of understanding

[sonic barn]

just use github co pilot

[lucid echo]

It is, that's why we're teasing you buddy

[naive light]

yeah, there's probably no way that any technological research is eventually going to be freely available to the public, but what do i know.

[hearty spear]

play the victim all you want, you're only digging deeper

[slender forge]

Uwu cant wait for the backpack

[lucid echo]

You think you're the first person to come in here thinking you're hot shit and try to talk down to people more experienced than you?

[sonic barn]

owo

[graceful burrow]

Owo can't wait for the driver

[naive light]

calm down, buddy

[slender forge]

Is there any news on that

[naive light]

you got some issues to work out, and they're not with me.

[lucid echo]

It is already freely available, you just have to know how to work with the APIs via code

[graceful burrow]

Haven't looked into it in a bit

[lucid echo]

I love you, please stick around

[hearty spear]

aand have a machine capable of running it

[lucid echo]

Or, you know, pay for a cloud service

[naive light]

remember when running a computer required advanced knowhow on electrical equipment

i do

[hearty spear]

... the 60's and 70s?

[graceful burrow]

Boomer

[lucid echo]

Are computers free now?

[naive light]

cherrypickin

[hearty spear]

cuz it hasn't needed that in 40+ years

[naive light]

could take 40 years, but it's gonna be there. tech advances quickly these days

[hearty spear]

And that's one of the wierder gates to keep that I've seen gatekeepers gatekeepin'

[lucid echo]

Alright see you then bud! Maybe you can save up some cash to pay for it once it's here

[hollow zealot]

By the time 40 years passes I don't even care what's going on inside my computer

[naive light]

i figure some of you guys are from america, is that right?

[graceful burrow]

What's nationality gotta do with anything lmao

[hearty spear]

40 years from now, our smartphones will be beyond supercomputers today.

[hollow zealot]

What does that have to do with anything

[naive light]

not much, just wondering.

[hearty spear]

I'll cop, I'm in fuckin' Bahstan

[noble salmon]

who want to be rick rolled?

[lucid echo]

And they'll still cost money

[naive light]

how's the weather

[hearty spear]

nah, we'll have the federation, with replicators and shit by then

[hearty spear]

too bloody hot. Fuck that outdoors bullshit.

[naive light]

lol

[graceful burrow]

We have to have a war that almost destroys the world before that

[hollow zealot]

I live in america, why do you want to know?

[hearty spear]

you say that like it's a stretch?

[graceful burrow]

No I'm just chronicling

[naive light]

just curious, we're all across the world, i find it interesting.

[fossil dirge]

Same I live in America

[hearty spear]

We're pretty on pace for the Bell Riots from DS9

[hollow zealot]

Omg

[graceful burrow]

North or south

[fossil dirge]

North

[hearty spear]

(Which for anyone keeping track: The Bell Riots in DS9 were supposedly in the mid 2020's)

[twin raptor]

Ds9?

[graceful burrow]

I'm sending you to brazil

[twin raptor]

Whazzat

[naive light]

my head is saying 'dead space 9' but that can't be right

[graceful burrow]

Deep space 9

[hearty spear]

Star Trek: Deep Space Nine

[twin raptor]

Ah yes

[hollow zealot]

Deep Space Nine is a piece of art

I'm partial to enterprise tho

[hearty spear]

I kinda feel bad for enterprise, they went a little too hard on time travel

[hollow zealot]

Yeahhhh

[lucid echo]

I'm currently using a (paid) AI upscaling software to convert that show to 4K

[hollow zealot]

But tbh what scifi show didn't in the 2000s

[lucid echo]

I think linus did a video on the software earlier this year

[hollow zealot]

Is that the one where he upscaled his first video

And the firetruck

[lucid echo]

Yeah, it works way better once you dial in the settings

Plus someone online shared specific configs for that show

[hearty spear]

but I imagine it takes a while

[lucid echo]

It would take months to do the whole show sadly. I just convert an episode every few days

[fossil dirge]

I need to watch some episodes of Star Trek especially that I heard it’s very good

[hearty spear]

for 7 seasons, 20+ eps a season, at 45 minutes an ep

[hollow zealot]

Tkitch are you an SG1 enjoyer?

[lucid echo]

Each episode takes about 4-8 hours to upscale depending on quality settings

[hollow zealot]

And same to you sanic

[hearty spear]

recently finished a full watch with he GF for both SG1 and Atlantis

[lucid echo]

No but my buddies are

[hollow zealot]

Y e s

Thank god

I've been secretly hoping for years now that they'll reboot that show
But I doubt it'd be any good with the state of scifi rn

[hearty spear]

They're making a Sequel

Michael Shanks and some others are coming back

[reef karma]

What's the new favorite / sponsored VPN for LTT? I've been thinking about getting one for the first time.

[hollow zealot]

ahwhat?

[hearty spear]

Yup, new SG1. 20ish years later.
Daniel will be there still, and probably some other cameos.

(But Shanks is waaaay out of shape now)

[hollow zealot]

I was gonna say

How the hell

[hearty spear]

Did you know he met his wife on SG1?

[hollow zealot]

I did not

[hearty spear]

When I tell you who it is... He swung WAY outta his league with her

Remember the Replacement DR from Seasons 8-10?

The General's Daughter?

[hollow zealot]

Yes

[hearty spear]

HER

[hollow zealot]

Her?? Jfc

[hearty spear]

Dude fuckin' scored on that one

[hollow zealot]

He's like a Daniel irl

[hearty spear]

Lexa Doig. (I also loved her in "Andromeda" too bad about Kevin Sorbo tho)

[hollow zealot]

Why aren't these shows a thing anymore? Or anything like them?

[full fossil]

can AI do anything humans cant?

[graceful burrow]

They're faster at well trained tasks

[thin echo]

Hmm very large and rapid calculations. Several tasks at once

[hearty spear]

It's unlikely that AI will ever do something that humans "can't"
They will, however, be doing things that would take humans such a dramatically increased time duration that it may as well be instantaneous

[full fossil]

heh like animating lego people

[manic torrent]

AI absolutely does things humans can't.

[lucid echo]

For example?

[manic torrent]

At least, in the current sense of AI

Because it works fundamentally differently

Humans are good at arbitrary tasks, but have a lot of limitations. Computers don't get tired or bored, they don't get semantic satiation.

[hearty spear]

If there's a Task with a definable "goal"
And humans vs AI get there using two different processes? It doesn't mean they did something human's can't, they just did it differently than humans generally do.

[full fossil]

if it were only possible to take a human brain and convert it into an AI

[hearty spear]

lets not have that hellscape happen plz

[manic torrent]

Yeah nah.

[thin echo]

I don’t even think that’s possible. I can’t see how

[digital crest]

krang

[lucid echo]

It's not

[hearty spear]

*not yet
Given enough time someone's gonna figure it out.

[lucid echo]

Copy, maybe. Transfer? No.

[thin echo]

The fear of AI is exaggerated quite a bit why is that?

[digital crest]

just gotta figure out all the wires lol

[manic torrent]

It is potentially possible, but certainly not even close to something current ai is even made to do

[full fossil]

I wrote science fiction about this

[thin echo]

I’d say putting a brain physically into a machine seems more likely but idk. Digitally I don’t see how

[hollow zealot]

Something something matrix

[manic torrent]

Because by the time you realise, it's way too late

[noble salmon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/381193783296917507/1003793581338791946/unknown.png

[lucid echo]

Fear of sentience is overhyped. We're far away from it, and it may be outright impossible.
The fear should exist in humans misusing AI to oppress/exploit others

[hearty spear]

Partially: Fear of the unknown, it's a scary prospect
Also Partially: We've seen what "AIs" today can do with minor flaws in programming, and it's already bad.

[manic torrent]

Bioelectrical machines absolutely

[thin echo]

Oh Yh but that’s not entirely electronic. There’s biologically so there is reason

[hearty spear]

Such as: The "AI Chess Robot" in Russia that just broke a kid's finger during a chess match.

[hollow zealot]

Absolute Chad of a kid too

[lucid echo]

AI is only as good as the humans who designed/trained it

[manic torrent]

He had it coming

[manic torrent]

And the dataset

[thin echo]

If it’s designed as a weapon yh

[full fossil]

You would have to capture the brains functions and synaptic activity mere seconds before death

[thin echo]

Consciousness and real emotions aren’t possible for an AI

[hearty spear]

And since humans are inherently fallable? AI will be inherently fallable and therefore do bad shit.

[manic torrent]

I would not say things like that. Not possible currently? Absolutely.

[hearty spear]

Again: Yet.
Tech we have today would literally have NEVER been conceived of 100 years ago.

[lucid echo]

We haven't even defined human consciousness yet, so that's a hard thing to be sure about

[thin echo]

Good point

[manic torrent]

Also what is a real emotion anyway

[hollow zealot]

Y'all talking about this and then Spotify deciding it was time for me to listen to the terminator intro on my 80s playlist sent me laughing

[full fossil]

i wish i had no emotions

[manic torrent]

No you don't.

[hearty spear]

The human brain is 8 pounds composed primarily of fat and salt water.
If that's capable of maintaining sentience? Why can't a PC do that?

[full fossil]

organic PCs

[manic torrent]

No emotions leaves you in decision paralysis. You cannot decide what to eat or wear.

[hearty spear]

Disagree.
Whatever work polo is on top of the pile is the next to wear. 0 emotion required.

[thin echo]

But we can get an idea. Also you can program an AI but to imitate emotions but that’s just imitation not real. Maybe I just can’t see it. My knowledge is limited so I can’t know

[lucid echo]

Some cognitive scientists like Daniel Dennett have some pretty solid cases as to why the human brain isn't conscious/sentient at all.

[hearty spear]

I would 100% believe that.

[manic torrent]

I could agree with you but we'd both be wrong, this is well documented

[full fossil]

its mostly instinct and rote answers

[lucid echo]

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/qualia/

[manic torrent]

For more detail, read "the decisive moment"

[hearty spear]

okay I'm going out to get myself some noms, and some alkuhmaholz.

[thin echo]

We’re quite similar to AI, so you may be right

[hollow zealot]

Enjoy

[steel pond]

Most major machine learning stuff is open source, there are proprietary solutions but that is normally due to development. The question about story telling... yes you can find this out in the world.

[full fossil]

if i could use my unconscious to do work while i sleep oh boy would that make life bearable

[noble salmon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/381193783296917507/1003795769498800179/unknown.png

[steel pond]

The reason it is mostly open source is because it is very hard to claim something as your own, because the data required to train the model is nearly always scraped from public domain.

[lucid echo]

Yeahhh that kid wanted a web-based NLP GUI for zero cost on his part

[steel pond]

Sure, you can do that.

NVIDIA RIVA is free to use so long as you're not trying to sell something with it

[hearty spear]

Sorry, you missed the kid who was all up in here about this topic when I tagged you. (Kid? Maybe Boomer? IDFK)

[steel pond]

Hehe I dunno, I was hammering on some stuff 🙂

[lucid echo]

Yeah but that requires setting up the SDK yourself, something he did not want to do

[steel pond]

Oh, a packaged NPL solution doesn't exist without cost.

[lucid echo]

He wanted plug-and-play GPT3-style AI for free

[steel pond]

No, that's not how AI works.

[lucid echo]

Yeah, we tried to explain that. He got mad at us

[hearty spear]

reality didn't seem to dissuade him

[lucid echo]

"I'll wait for it to be free"

[steel pond]

Yeah, I'm sure they will.

Enjoy the wait.

[hearty spear]

and 10 or so years from now? Today's level of tech probably will be free

[steel pond]

Training an NPL model takes hundreds of thousands of hours of training time.

I mean.. a really good model.

I can train bert in a week or two on a few A6000s

but it will basically just burp and fart when you try to get it to do something.

[thin echo]

Jesus really?

[lucid echo]

But he talked about how people make games for free... and how he'd be willing to give someone water for free... why won't coders train that AI for free???? /s

[thin echo]

That long

[steel pond]

That's not even full training. That's just the benchmark for training time.

[hearty spear]

machine learning takes a loooooot of time. Or a looooooot of money to buy the hardware to process it in a "reasonable" timeframe

[thin echo]

No way 💀 this isn’t a one man job right?

I didn’t know this stuff got this deep

[steel pond]

It can be

Take the stuff, push it to your GPU, wait.

[lucid echo]

That time is spent waiting

[steel pond]

Hopefully you set everything up right

[hearty spear]

it's mostly a 0 man job. Someone (or a small team) sets up the paramaters, and then you tell a computer "Do the math"
And ignore it until it's done.

[steel pond]

That's why there are so many pre-trained models out there, freely available.

You already have the basics done, after that you fine tune the model.

[hearty spear]

It's kinda like rendering a really big, really complicated image:
You tell it to "Go" and then you walk away and wait for it to be done.

[steel pond]

Yep.

NVIDIA Megatron looks to have been trained on 51,000 A100s

[hearty spear]

(Which is one reason server farms exist for this shit. When project 1 is running / processing, you're working on something else on your PC.)

[steel pond]

Don't take my word for it. I am not part of the AI team

[hearty spear]

only 51,000? Is that all?

[thin echo]

I see this all makes sense. It messes up everything if you don’t set it up right

[steel pond]

I think. I just briefly looked at the github

[steel pond]

Right. Sometimes it messes up for no good reason

and you only know what you're getting after it has finished training

[thin echo]

Gyaat damn

[hearty spear]

kinda like 3d printing:
No matter how perfectly done your model is on the PC, sometimes it just gonna fuckup.

[steel pond]

AI/DL is sort of a back box.

You say "Do eeet" and then it does stuff. Hopefully it does what you told it to do.

Established training methods will always produce the same stuff but if you go and much around with the math you could have a model that created its own language.

Or it could just completely fail to train

[lucid echo]

Sometimes it messes up everything even if you DO set it up right

RIP the almost-useless LSTM model that took me 3 weeks to train

[steel pond]

Yep. It happens

[thin echo]

How long does the set up process usually take

[lucid echo]

Days to months to years, depending on what you include in "set up"

[thin echo]

Or does it vary on the need

Gyaaaaat damn 👀

[lucid echo]

Data can be collected over years or decades

So if you include that..

[swift fulcrum]

not me... but people adjacent to my job have been trying to train ai(?) to recognize issues in heat maps of metal 3-d printing. theyve been collecting data to feed to it for almost 8 years

[thin echo]

Nearly 8 years 💀

[swift fulcrum]

they still cant get it to do what they want lol

I dont know too much about it. I run the printer, not the ai stuff

[thin echo]

There ain’t no way it can be this complex 😅

Maybe just two more years

[swift fulcrum]

I mean.... it is possible the people heading up the task dont know what they are doing lol

[steel pond]

Its all about data

Lots of data

Real or synthetic.

[swift fulcrum]

thats where the 8 years come from in my case. its all real data accumulated from running the 3-d printer over that span of time

[obtuse spindle]

Does anyone else here have that feeling when it's 2am and you arr watching something in the depths of YT, and then the next morning you saw and remembered that you watched it, and thought, "What was i watching?"

[slim yacht]

you can actually 'train' ai much faster if you already have sets of data needed. the reason why urs takes so long is probably because data collection is in progress and your ai is already on it

google assistant ai takes quite some time also

[obtuse spindle]

Hi, does anyone know what i can do if it is 3am and i am awake?

[noble salmon]

time to do it in #off-topic

[rugged bridge]

hello world

[feral quest]

1. get off discord

[full fossil]

dream diary

[vapid smelt]

Transfer me all your money in your bank account

[noble salmon]

somone review this chat its dead

[runic lagoon]

could be worse

[noble salmon]

?

[runic lagoon]

this server is much more lively then most 🤷

[atomic skiff]

My pinky, my pinky, in my brain brain bran bran, brain, nana na na naa Narf! 🧟‍♂️

Like labro-tory mice that are smoking something nice, before the night is done, i'll light another one!

[hearty spear]

Are you thinking what I'm thinking, pinky?

[atomic skiff]

oooohhh that smelllllllll....

[minor zephyr]

NT-H2 or Kryonaut Extreme? I am currently using Kryonaut extreme right now but it is pretty expensive. Or if there are any other thermal pastes that are better?

[lucid echo]

They're all about the same

You're not gonna notice any difference with name-brand pastes

[minor zephyr]

alright

[unborn flare]

If he's overclocking then there might actually be quite a significant difference

[minor zephyr]

What would you recommend?

[lucid echo]

Are you doing some hardcore overclocking?

[minor zephyr]

Nope just using a i9 12900k

[lucid echo]

Noctua, EK, Corsair, Kryonaut, any of those will be fine

A lot of them get their paste from the same OEMs

[thin echo]

Y’all seen the video where the guy mixes diamond powder with thermal paste and his degrees drop by 3

[minor zephyr]

No

[lucid echo]

Arctic Silver has that pre-mixed, no need for powder

[unborn flare]

Indeed

[thin echo]

Ohh, so arctic silver is better than other thermal paste?

Does arctic give one to those who order their cooler?

[unborn flare]

Then you'll be fine with the earlier mentioned pastes

[minor zephyr]

I have another question. I have both kryonaut and kryonaut extreme. Is there a difference?

[lucid echo]

Arctic Silver =/= arctic freezer

[lucid echo]

Yes but not one that you need to be concerned with

[minor zephyr]

Alright so im going to start saving money by only buying kryonaut and not the extreme

[lucid echo]

Good move

[thin echo]

Aren’t they both by arctic?

Btw does the arctic liquid freezer ii come with thermal paste

[lucid echo]

https://www.arctic.de/us/
https://www.arcticsilver.com/#

[thin echo]

Omg you’re right they’re not the same

[lucid echo]

All coolers come with some type of paste

They're not gonna fuck you like that

[thin echo]

I see okay thanks. 😂

Does it matter what paste?

Nvm I won’t overthink the paste

[unborn flare]

I mean the thermal paste included is usually good enough to saturate the cooler so thermal paste isn't really your concern unless you are doing overclocking because lower temps improve the stability of the system

[graceful burrow]

*when overclocked

[unborn flare]

Kinda obv but alright sir

[graceful burrow]

You'd think so but you'd be surprised

There are people here who don't know what a pc is

Cover all bases and you have to answer less followup questions

[proud arrow]

Hellooo

[unborn flare]

I will keep that in mind sir

[graceful burrow]

[pliant karma]

the stress mounts

[polar pine]

https://www.engadget.com/tim-hortons-location-tracking-lawsuits-coffee-donuts-183305506.html

🤔

[sonic barn]

Should've did vbucks like Fortnite

[polar pine]

Lmaooooo

[fluid ridge]

sorry tim horton's makes absolute shit coffee

you would need to pay me to drink that garbage

[coarse kayak]

I don't get why people think starbucks is so good it was worse than every other coffee i've had here [UK] except maybe mcdonalds

[umbral birch]

You're probably drinking the wrong coffees then

There are some that's decent, though there is a couple that I tried was plain horrible

[stray apex]

people usually go for starbuck's coffee based drinks, not straight coffee

[atomic skiff]

🧐

[stray apex]

and if you actually care about the quality of your coffee, you probably just make it at home

[atomic skiff]

or yoiu make it at home because

you care a lot about your

YOUR coffee

sip

[graceful burrow]

Homie actually posted his SoundCloud link as if anyone here gonna click it lmao

[atomic skiff]

it might be a sentient ai

if that helps

[umbral birch]

Nah

No thanks

[graceful burrow]

It could be
Or it could be some trash I don't wanna hear

[atomic skiff]

find out, or not, but don't judge what you know nothing of.

[umbral birch]

Don't wanna risk getting some virus nowadays

You can't always trust random links that people post on discord nowadays

[graceful burrow]

I'm judging the rule breaking because it's hilarious

[atomic skiff]

search it yourself

[atomic skiff]

well, I can break more, but your not worth my time.

[graceful burrow]

Inb4 "b-b-but it's not advertising!!"

[umbral birch]

Forcing people to view their content... smart

[graceful burrow]

Do it, it'd be funny

[atomic skiff]

nah, it is

[umbral birch]

You're not worth anybody's time

[graceful burrow]

<@&750150305383186585> advertising

[atomic skiff]

nah, small fry

[atomic skiff]

nark

[graceful burrow]

Yeah, I am :)

[atomic skiff]

😎

🛌 goodnight

[graceful burrow]

If you deleted it, mods can see deleted messages kek

[atomic skiff]

no, they did. not me.

[umbral birch]

There's a thing called logs btw

[atomic skiff]

goodnight.

[graceful burrow]

I'd say have a good one but I wouldn't mean it if I did

[lucid echo]

It’s good in the sense that it’s widely available & consistent. Plus the snackies are pretty solid

But I decided to get a single espresso shot there after exclusively going to a local fancy cafe for a while, and yeah it was disgusting. But at least you know exactly what you’re getting.

[coarse kayak]

well in UK there's others that are everywhere and better so nah starbucks F tier

especially for price

[oak mirage]

I kinda want LTT to do an updated video on DRAM vs DRAM-less SSDs.

I've read a lot of conflicting info saying that dramless NVMe is not good for drives with frequent reads i.e.: a boot drive. But then I've also seen people say the exact opposite and that it's not really noticeable now that newer NVMe drives have HMB (Host Memory Buffer) implemented.

I can't seem to find any actual comparisons of performance though. Just people discussing it.

[lucid echo]

In US the only coffee places with a comparable amount of locations would be McDonald’s and mayyybe Dunkin, both of which are about the same.

Imo calling Starbucks F tier is like calling McDonald’s F tier. Like yeah, they’re not very good, but you know what you’re getting, even if it’s out in the wilderness of Kentucky.

[lucid echo]

https://youtu.be/ybIXsrLCgdM

[oak mirage]

I believe that was prior to HMB popularity

[south spear]

God I love me some tech tips

[bitter thunder]

Hey, random question
If I inquire something and I'm not 100% sure I put it in the best possible channel (And nobody replied to it yet), is there a good non-spammy way to relocate the inquiry? I presume also deleting the original message so as not to have the same message in 2 channels

[graceful burrow]

That's pretty much the way yeah

[bitter thunder]

Alright. Just wanted to make sure

[full fossil]

Dim Message, Speak
Message=("gib me tech tips")
Set Speak=CreateObject("sapi.spvoice")
Speak.Speak Message

paste into .vbs file

[south spear]

I use arch btw

[full fossil]

lol

wont work then

[atomic skiff]

hi

[south spear]

Wtf

Did u follow me or something

[atomic skiff]

yes?

from annother server

[full fossil]

i have arch installed as a vm and I want to use it as my main os but i dont know if you can get microsoft office on there, i need it for school

[graceful burrow]

That's creepy

[south spear]

Libreoffice is pretty much the same thing iirc

[south spear]

Bruh you don't even know the half of it

[graceful burrow]

He came in here bein a cringe lord earlier I get the gist

[south spear]

Okay you've seen his shenanigans nice lol

[manic torrent]

oh man. Stray on my 48" OLED is just beautiful

[lucid echo]

Best solution is to use the web-based Office suite
https://office.live.com/start/Word.aspx

[full fossil]

oh thanks, i didnt think of that

[full fossil]

yeah it really is

I still find the OS on the c1 oled pretty terrible

[manic torrent]

yeah I don't mind the FO48U OS, but it's not great

[unkempt otter]

i wanted to ask a question ;^;

[graceful burrow]

So ask

What's stopping you

[unkempt otter]

.. does rtx 3060 ti continuously use 200 watts for any game??

[graceful burrow]

You can use hwinfo64 to determine how many watts it is using at any given time

As for normal wattage I'm personally not sure

[unkempt otter]

and i dont have it yet.. its gonna be my first pc

[unkempt otter]

does it work for laptop?

[graceful burrow]

Yes

[lucid echo]

A laptop GPU is not ever gonna hit 200W

[unkempt otter]

xd my fam says my laptop consumes the most electricity so gotta prove it

its a fking 65watt laptop..

[lucid echo]

No laptop is 200W total, let alone its gpu

[lucid echo]

Well there’s your answer

[unkempt otter]

heh??.. ;^;

[lucid echo]

Full sentences please

[unkempt otter]

nvm

[lucid echo]

Okay

[manic torrent]

what power supply does it come with

[unkempt otter]

eh laptop? it just has a 65w adapter 😄😄 pc is gonna be around 650 to 750 watts

[glacial basin]

if it doesn't come with a 200w+ power adapter it's good

[manic torrent]

so literally the most it can consume is 65W. The most, ever.

[unkempt otter]

for me it does not even exist!! never seen one

[glacial basin]

my laptop has a 240w adapter so I should be good to upgrade to a gtx 980m

[manic torrent]

They do exist. I have a few high power external PSUs

[unkempt otter]

how do i tell this to my family Xx

[glacial basin]

but I'm getting a pc anyways

[manic torrent]

it's likely written on the adapter.

[unkempt otter]

gesus ;^;

[glacial basin]

"adapters provide as much power as the laptop needs, it won't be overspecced"

[exotic jetty]

Does anyone know a low profile vpn that won't be detected if being used, rants l2tp and free?

[manic torrent]

lol

[glacial basin]

oh yeah my chinese essay test results just came in

[exotic jetty]

Hey if my school blocks them thru Wi-Fi I needs something so strong it over welms the block or some thing to discreet to not be detected

[manic torrent]

I would suggest learning how networks work for starters.

[exotic jetty]

I'm telling you we can't connect to vom becasue the internet blocks it, our chromebook support

The school just won't let's us connect

[manic torrent]

and I'm telling you that we're not here to help you circumvent your schools internet policy. If you want to do that, you should learn how to do so yourself.

[graceful burrow]

That is not how it works

[warm wharf]

200+ watt laptop power bricks aren't that uncommon

[exotic jetty]

I'll make a video on it

[graceful burrow]

You're talking about jamming, which is technically an illegal practice (at least in the usa)

[manic torrent]

nah he's not, he just has so little idea about what he's asking that it sounds like it

[graceful burrow]

That's my theory

[warm wharf]

The laptop I am using right now has a 280W brick, it's not super unusual for them to be over 200W.

[graceful burrow]

Just hotspot wifi from your phone and use that kek

[manic torrent]

do you know what a TCP is? What a packet is? What routing is? What the ISO layers are?

[amber shuttle]

Every Alienware laptop in existence from recent years - am I a joke to you

[night heron]

this is looking like a layer 8 issue

[manic torrent]

100%

[night heron]

my best advice to you for your school wifi issue is to use cell data instead

i made by fine with that

[graceful burrow]

I made my own proxy and hosted it on a raspberry pi

[amber shuttle]

Or connect via Ethernet, though most schools would put you on the sus bus immediately that way

[unkempt otter]

i live in a village..

[night heron]

f

[amber shuttle]

If it’s not in a Brazilian rainforest I see no reason why not to invest in solar power- aside from flooding

[unkempt otter]

who buys those owo scamsss buy pcc

[warm wharf]

laptop's are pc's

[amber shuttle]

The laptops actually aren’t bad if you use them correctly

like don’t use it as a daily driver for example

[warm wharf]

Though Alienware laptops specifically tend to be super overpriced

[amber shuttle]

True.

[warm wharf]

No reason to not use a laptop as a daily driver

[unkempt otter]

haha lack of space. and yes flooding is common when it rains

[glacial basin]

I use a 2011 dell precision to game and daily drive

[unkempt otter]

i use my laptop 18 hours a day i think..

[amber shuttle]

Either during that time you’ve got starlink or your router sinks

[unkempt otter]

nah it's fine. it does not affect flats and towers but small houses

[amber shuttle]

Ah

Sounds like a pueblo to me 🤔

welp even the gaming laptop with the most battery life so far, the ASUS ROG Zephyrus G14 clocking 10 hours uses a 240W adapter but can come with a 100W usb-c one (240W is delivered with a barrel plug or DC terminal)

[coarse kayak]

This isn't very important but they are also giant for the screen size cause they have the giant ass for cooling. It like can you guys just accept 14" laptop with an AMD processor makes more sense atm instead of adding some giant butt sticking out back for cooling.

[warm wharf]

I would never want a 14" laptop

terrible typing experience

[coarse kayak]

I got used to typing on surface pro keyboard so I don't find small keyboards an issue lol

[warm wharf]

https://www.gentechpc.com/product-p/sager-np8872t-s.htm
I'd probably get that if I wanted a new laptop right now

Not cheap, but quite powerful

[coarse kayak]

would not want to carry that around in backpack tho

I mean you might but I wouldn't lol

[warm wharf]

Thin & lights don't have the performance I'd want

that laptop though will smack around an alienware that costs $1,000 more than it

[hollow zealot]

The new Alienware cliche is absurd screen refresh rate
So no wonder the panels are so small

[coarse kayak]

Alienware have a 17" with 480hz

They don't have exact equiv for that as they don't have 1440p but the 360hz 1080p equivelant was $3500 so yh nearly 1k more

[amber shuttle]

Alienware X14

Already out

[coarse kayak]

yh ik but you were comparing to a 17"

sorry other guy

[coarse kayak]

that has intel

[amber shuttle]

Yea but smaller screen size lol, and better battery life

Though a lot less than the ASUS G14

[coarse kayak]

Right the point is the X14 claims to be small but isn't because it has a giant slab sticking out the back past screen for cooling

which makes it way wider than any other 14

[hollow zealot]

1440p at that refresh rate is way too expensive to be worth it

[coarse kayak]

so i was saying they should've used AMD CPU which retains most of it's performance without as much power so they didn't need all the cooling cause making it that big and only having 14" screen defeats point for me

like it as wide as other 15" ones

[warm wharf]

$2,588 Clevo:
i7-12700H, RTX 3080 TI, 165 Hz 1440P IPS DCI-P3 Panel, 32 GB DDR4 @ 3200 Mhz, 1 TB SSD
$3,849 Alienware:
i9-12900HK, RTX 3080 TI, 360 Hz 1080P IPS, 32 GB DDR5 @ 4800 Mhz, 1 TB SSD

I know what I'd pick there.

clevo has a better display, slower RAM, slower CPU, but I bet in actual gaming performance it is neck and neck, the cpu difference is negligible, and 4800 mhz DDR5 isn't amazing either

[coarse kayak]

easier to repair as well

[hollow zealot]

i7 is definitely more than enough for gaming

[warm wharf]

12700H and 12900HK have the same core count anyway

just higher clock speeds on the 12900HK

[hollow zealot]

Yeah, just a different price tag

[warm wharf]

It's only the HX cpu's that have more cores

[hollow zealot]

Even with 14(?) cores, it's still more than enough for gaming

[warm wharf]

The Alienware will get higher fps is it games at 1080P while the Clevo games at 1440P, but if both game at the same res, I actually expect the clevo will probably outperform

Clevo's just tend to have great cooling

[unborn flare]

I mean a six core processor is good enough for gaming

[warm wharf]

yeah, they're both 14-core cpu's, no real concern there 😄

[hollow zealot]

Tbh it's kinda sad how downhill Alienware has gone

[coarse kayak]

Don't really like this marketing that it's 14 core processor because a bunch of those cores are slower and not used for current games

they really like 6 or 8 core

[warm wharf]

eh, 20 series at least alienware and clevo made the "best" laptops, if all you cared about was performance

[hollow zealot]

I have a friend who buys a new Alienware laptop every other generation, and they've just gotten worse and worse relatively

[unborn flare]

Exactly

[warm wharf]

Don't think alienware ranks as high for 30 series though

[hollow zealot]

Remember, bigger number = happier customer

[warm wharf]

Mind you, the alienware's were super expensive even then

[unborn flare]

Worse in what aspect

[warm wharf]

I paid $1,900 for a clevo in 2020

a comparable performing Alienware at the time

[hollow zealot]

Mostly thermals

[warm wharf]

was $3,200

[plain wyvern]

Are y’all talking about Desktops or Laptops

[hollow zealot]

Laptops

[warm wharf]

I was referring to laptops specifically

like if you check 3dmark leaderboard for timespy, on 2080 super (notebook)

the top results are all alienware machines, or clevo's

[unborn flare]

Ahh but that's only if you max spec you GPU the bigger chassis have great cooling though

[plain wyvern]

Aren’t their desktops also bad?

[hollow zealot]

Yes lol

[warm wharf]

I think for 30 series the top results are mostly asus's actually

[glacial basin]

you can get better sff pcs for that amount lmao

[unborn flare]

Their desktops aren't even recommended

[warm wharf]

though the #1 top result right now, from any laptop, is a Tongfang

[plain wyvern]

I might pick up an HP OMEN Laptop

[hollow zealot]

They look sorta neat, but that's about it

[coarse kayak]

according to lTT vid x17 has 165W 3080/80ti so should be at top of performance but had janky issue with mux switch

[glacial basin]

on random ass sponsored mags alienware is the top

[plain wyvern]

Since it’ll go with my OMEN 30L

[unborn flare]

Yes their thiccboi designs push good numbers

[glacial basin]

but alienware desktops are shit

[coarse kayak]

those are giant in comparison to carry around tho

[unborn flare]

For desktop?

[plain wyvern]

Proprietary parts

[glacial basin]

yes

[hollow zealot]

Something I thought was really cool was that one tablet esque machine that Linus got his hands on

[gentle fox]

@gentle path yo ur available?

[unborn flare]

Oh my god wtf imagine someone buys those throttling pieces of crap

[warm wharf]

Prometheus XVII that was overclocked while using its water cooling tank though has the top timespy result for any laptop

[unborn flare]

Bad cooling too

[hollow zealot]

The Asus flow z13

[warm wharf]

The Prometheus isn't cheap, but I'd be tempted to buy it

i9-12900H and a 3080 TI Mobile

Alienware desktops are often priced really well at microcenter, but even with good pricing I'm not sure they're ever worth it

[plain wyvern]

The thing about prebuilt companies like HP and Dell is that they design their case with looks in mind rather than performance

Unless were talking about the 45L (I guess)

[hollow zealot]

I can't hate on Alienware because they used to be so good

[warm wharf]

https://www.microcenter.com/product/648424/dell-alienware-aurora-ryzen-edition-r10-gaming-pc
That is priced well though

5900X and a 3080 TI, under $2,000

[hollow zealot]

They're not doing great rn, but when they do well
They do really well

[unborn flare]

But i mean a pc is for computing and not a showpiece I'd still prefer function over form

[plain wyvern]

Bad thermals

[plain wyvern]

Personally I would either do a case swap

[hollow zealot]

Some consumers don't much care for every % of performance they can get tbh

[warm wharf]

Maybe, not seen thermals for that specific model, but thermals can be fixed

[plain wyvern]

Or drill a 110mm hole into the front of my omen and put another fan

[unborn flare]

Omen also makes proprietary overpriced prebuilts but their systems are properly cooled and also thier support is very good

[hollow zealot]

I feel like Alienware is oriented towards less enthusiast customers

[plain wyvern]

Nuhuh

[warm wharf]

I don't actually think Alienware desktops look good tbh

[hollow zealot]

The old ones looked sick

[unborn flare]

But like how you gonna use the i/o proprietary motherboard has io directly integrated into it

[hollow zealot]

The new ones look pretty okay imo

[plain wyvern]

https://youtu.be/8ulhFi5N2hc

[plain wyvern]

Unless you swap the board

Which I did

[graceful burrow]

They don't

[hollow zealot]

I'm a fan of this aesthetic specifically

[unborn flare]

Well you need to swap the power supply too since it's also non standard many times and thus you end up spending a lot more for a bad value machine

[warm wharf]

Same chassis, but completely different components, may have different cooling

The one in that video has a 3060 TI and a 5800

Microcenter's has a 3080 TI and a 5900X

[plain wyvern]

I think your talking about the HP PAVILLION

I have the HP OMEN 30L which is standard ATX

[unborn flare]

I was talking about the alienware but alright

[unborn flare]

Yea OMENs are good prebuilts

[plain wyvern]

Good prebuilts bad thermals

[plain wyvern]

I found my prebuilt with an Intel Core i7 10700KF 3.8GHz Processor; NVIDIA RTX 3080 10GB GDDR6X; 32GB DDR4-3200 RAM; 1TB SSD

Personally mine has a Ryzen 7 3700x, GEFORCE RTX 2060, 32GB DDR4-3200 RAM, and a 1TB SSD and HDD

[unborn flare]

Some models only have bad thermals the 40L case has good enough cooling.

[warm wharf]

I just meant that if the cooling struggled to cool a 3060 TI and 5800, I'd surely hope they changed it in some way if upgrading the system to a 3080 TI+5900X, but that's conjecture, it'd make sense for it to have better cooling, but I'm not saying it necessarily does

[plain wyvern]

Same with the 45L

45L has that Cryochamber design

[unborn flare]

Yea but that gets really big

[plain wyvern]

Personally I’m wondering if I can fit a custom water cooling kit in there

[unborn flare]

Yea the radiator is kept seperate in that design ig

[plain wyvern]

Since the case is getting sold separately

[unborn flare]

You might be able to

[plain wyvern]

I’m not sure if I could do hardline so I might have to stick to soft tubing

[warm wharf]

The RAM on the alienware is almost certainly some weird proprietary shit

It says it's 32 GB DDR4 @ 3466

3466 is not exactly the most common ram speed 😄

[gilded swan]

hi

[plain wyvern]

dumb! DUMBDUMBDUMBDUMBDUMB!

also in my house all the computers other then mine are Dell XPS Desktops

[gilded swan]

RIPP

bro i got so ripped off on my laptop

[plain wyvern]

There’s one sitting right next to my desk and I’m waiting for my dad to pick it up

Unless he lets me salvage it for parts

[gilded swan]

rtx 3070 mobile gpu at like 80+ watts and the cpu is a 11th gen i7 with only 4 cores

[warm wharf]

Only time I've even considered buying a prebuilt as during the peak of the gpu shortage, where DIY was actually more expensive

[gilded swan]

this thing doesnt even have a camera

[plain wyvern]

I thought about buying a prebuilt, grabbing the graphics card, selling the parts online, then getting my own parts

[warm wharf]

80W, what?!?

That's hilariously low

[gilded swan]

EXACTLY

[warm wharf]

My laptop's GPU is 155W 😄

[gilded swan]

AND GUESS HOW MUCH I PAID

3.2 K

[warm wharf]

you could get a Prometheus XVII with the external water cooling tank for that

[gilded swan]

i didnt know much about computers and stuff back then though 😭

[warm wharf]

and it'd have a 175W 3080 TI and a 14-core 12th gen i9

[gilded swan]

aud tho not usd

[warm wharf]

ahh

[gilded swan]

bro im so sad 😭 😭

[warm wharf]

Still pricy though

[gilded swan]

yeah

the thing that hurts the most is the 4-core cpu

[warm wharf]

Yeah, even my cheap thin & light

from 2018, was $999

has a 6-core cpu

[gilded swan]

dam

my old laptop had 8 cores and it was only a grand

[warm wharf]

i7-9750H, 16 GB DDR4 @ 2933 mhz, GTX 1660 TI, 512 GB SSD, 144 Hz 1080P IPS
That was $999

[fluid ridge]

scammed

[gilded swan]

thats a steal tho

[warm wharf]

It's a tongfang, rebranded by Maingear

[plain wyvern]

Are you allowed to bring pc parts or hell even the entire damn computer on a plane?

[full fossil]

If you can bring a laptop, why not a PC 😄

Right?

[gilded swan]

yeah if its in ur weight limit

[plain wyvern]

Because my laptop is perma dead

MacBooks man

[gilded swan]

the news ones are good tho

above mid

[plain wyvern]

I’m broke

[warm wharf]

Intel macbooks were garbage IMO

M1 macs are good, but not for everything

[gilded swan]

damn

[plain wyvern]

Alright getting my pc on the plane and building the entire setup

[gilded swan]

BRO THEYRE SUCH A SCAM

[warm wharf]

Like a high end Windows laptop can be my only PC, a macbook couldn't be

[gilded swan]

lezz go

[warm wharf]

Though macbooks have some.....scuffed pricing issues

[gilded swan]

Also i dont get the point of a macbook

decreased performance compared to windows

[plain wyvern]

I could take a raspberry pi computer on a plane

[warm wharf]

The base models aren't that overpriced, but the upgrades are

[gilded swan]

also increased price

[gilded swan]

abt the raspberry pi, do you have to build it first or can you get it pre-built

[gilded swan]

but the upgrades are basically everything

[plain wyvern]

Either one

[gilded swan]

ah

[plain wyvern]

Mryeetster built a raspberry pi computer on a plane

[gilded swan]

lol that sounds fun

[manic torrent]

for you maybe, but mos people don't do the same things

[gilded swan]

?

example pls

[manic torrent]

... you need an example of someone who uses a laptop for youtube, netflix, disney, email, web browsing etc?

Go outside and throw a rock

[gilded swan]

im just saying that

[limpid fern]

for a pi all you need is a psu, screen, keyboard and mouse and a micro sd card with an os

[gilded swan]

macbook has a lot of disadvantages

compared to windows pc's

[fluid ridge]

it has a lot of advantages too

[gilded swan]

like?

[gilded swan]

got it

[fluid ridge]

i would argue M1 macbook air is still the best value laptop you can buy

[limpid fern]

software

[fluid ridge]

software for starters, macos

[limpid fern]

not fore gaming

[fluid ridge]

not everyone is a gamer

[gilded swan]

i would personally count that as a disadvantage no offense

[gilded swan]

fair point

[fluid ridge]

im not a mac user either

mac is tailored to professionals more than windows is

apple's media engines are unrivalled

[gilded swan]

yeah it really is

[fluid ridge]

shit runs faster too

[gilded swan]

unrivalled for editing and music production etc

[limpid fern]

not all professionals

[fluid ridge]

much much more efficient OS

[warm wharf]

Here's an example of why I think macbooks pricing is scuffed.

$999 buys a M1 macbook air, I think this is reasonably priced
The problems are that it comes with 256 GB storage, and 8 GB RAM.
Going 8->16 GB RAM is $200. you can buy a 64 GB kit of SODIMM RAM for that $200.
256 GB storage to 2 TB? That's $800. A 2 TB SSD? That's about $180.

[manic torrent]

no, but you know what they mean

[fluid ridge]

yeah ok your local CS org wont be playing on macs for sure lol but

[gilded swan]

i would argue that macs are better for editing etc and windows are good for gaming anjd everyday task

[limpid fern]

mac os and mac for that matter is great just not for gamers

[gilded swan]

but its really bad for gamers

[limpid fern]

also windows laptops are cheaper

[warm wharf]

Or anyone who needs storage.

[gilded swan]

dang fr

[gilded swan]

yeah

[warm wharf]

256 GB -> 2 TB should not be $800 price jump

[gilded swan]

macs are made to be efficient

when windows are meant to just give performance for price

least*

[manic torrent]

..... are you sure?

[gilded swan]

yeah

have you guys heard about the new intel gpus

[fluid ridge]

i hope so

[limpid fern]

yea and so far they suck

[fluid ridge]

i hope nobody is playing cs on a mac

[manic torrent]

Omg no, I haven't seen any of the 123123124 videos about them

[gilded swan]

i think they are just bullshit

[limpid fern]

not on mac os

[gilded swan]

my opinion

[manic torrent]

cs go? You said CS org, I assumed computer science.

[fluid ridge]

intel arc has driver problems but they perform decently on synthetic benchmarks

[gilded swan]

bro

[fluid ridge]

oh lol

i meant csgo org

[gilded swan]

cs org meaning (counter strike organisation)

[manic torrent]

you're welcome to your opinion, wrong though it is

[fluid ridge]

intel arc isn't bad

if it came out during the gpu drought it would be 🔥

but it's too little too late

[warm wharf]

I wouldn't trust Intel to create a smooth, reliable gaming experience

[gilded swan]

thats what im saying bro

[manic torrent]

They are catching up on literally DECADES of R&D

[fluid ridge]

but they are still behind

[limpid fern]

they have had uhd and iris for years now

[gilded swan]

its surprising how nvidia's net worth is so much more than intels net worth

[manic torrent]

tbh I always thought it was a bit aggressive in terms of dates.

[fluid ridge]

there are chinese chipmakers who are doing the same but on the same standing AMD was 7 years ago

[manic torrent]

Do you mean market cap?

[fluid ridge]

just because your progress is exponentially faster doesn't mean you're fast

[gilded swan]

nah net worth

[fluid ridge]

what

[warm wharf]

they're effectively the same thing

[fluid ridge]

you mean market cap

[gilded swan]

nvidias is like 400b and intel has like 100b

[warm wharf]

the value of a company is the value of all its stock

[fluid ridge]

nobody uses net worth to describe corporations

[tawdry musk]

Arc doesn't need to be superior for desktop GPU's, they just need to work

[gilded swan]

oh mb

[warm wharf]

that's its market cap

[gilded swan]

mbmbmbmbmbmbm

[warm wharf]

NVIDIA is worth more than Intel and AMD combined though

[gilded swan]

im pretty new so.....

[manic torrent]

net worth is market cap, and it's a garbage number that means nothing

[gilded swan]

THATS WHAT IM SAYING G

[azure falcon]

Anyone think My Chemical Romance is worth seeing

[manic torrent]

Honestly, what that means is that intel is undervalued, tbh

[fluid ridge]

i hope elon buys intel and starts producing 420ghz 0.69nm cpu

[warm wharf]

Large part of the "why" there is likely NVIDIA's involvement in self-driving tech

[gilded swan]

💀

[limpid fern]

yea in like a few hundred years

[azure falcon]

I'm probably going to see my Chemical romance later this month Anyone ever see them live how were they

[gilded swan]

this is so random tho

lmao

[manic torrent]

oh god I'm so old.

[fluid ridge]

nah if my man big E takes over that shit happening yesterday

[unborn flare]

What is chemical romance

[azure falcon]

They are coming to my town just found out

[tawdry musk]

I mean I don't think gamers know what they want from Intel enough to care about how good Arc is

[gilded swan]

i-

[limpid fern]

yet hes backing out of twitter

[manic torrent]

arc doesn't need to be good, it needs to be good enough.

[gilded swan]

he is

damn didnt know that

[azure falcon]

Haha yeah I'm 32 also a little old

[manic torrent]

stanning for billionaires, nothx

[gilded swan]

bro

im so young tho

[limpid fern]

f, im half ur age lol

[unborn flare]

Good enough for a first gen dgpu from intel

[manic torrent]

I'm 40, so MCR was a little late for me even the first time

[old zephyr]

ahh

[gilded swan]

im 14

[fluid ridge]

yeah because twitter is fucking ass

[limpid fern]

agreed

[gilded swan]

Fr

cancel culture like fuck that

[warm wharf]

14....thanks for making me feel old

[gilded swan]

gen z needs help

[warm wharf]

😄

[gilded swan]

oops

[fluid ridge]

friendly fire

[tawdry musk]

Oh man, what the fuck am I doing in here

[azure falcon]

Can't wait till I get my work bonus

[gilded swan]

bro i can't with my own generation

have you seen these kids

[manic torrent]

I like money though

[warm wharf]

HardwareBob makes me feel young again though 😛 I'm 33

[gilded swan]

gonna get a job at maccas 😭

[azure falcon]

Same will be spending some soon tho on a car upgrade

[limpid fern]

me too

[fluid ridge]

and i do appreciate billionaires yes

[manic torrent]

I spend way too much money on ... everything

[gilded swan]

oh shit i was gonna ask what you guys wanna be when you grow up 💀 💀

[fluid ridge]

i have a very unpopular opinion on billionaires

[manic torrent]

billionaires shouldn't exist.

[azure falcon]

I install water heaters and make 1k a week before taxes

[unborn flare]

Lmao

[manic torrent]

there is no ethical billionaires.

[fluid ridge]

i think they contribute more than 1000 fold to society than your average joe

[fluid ridge]

i agree but the good far outweighs the bad

[manic torrent]

I wanted to be a sysadmin, so I did, now I am a solution architect.

[azure falcon]

Plumbing jobs pay really good money

[unborn flare]

I mean ethics don't make you especially rich

[manic torrent]

Because you don't know anything about the world.

[limpid fern]

ikr, and electrician

[gilded swan]

i wanna be a businessman

[tawdry musk]

I don't care much for billionaires, it just gets harder to spend your money that's all

[manic torrent]

You want to do a business?

[gilded swan]

bro my dad is a renovator and he earns so much in the first year of his business

[gilded swan]

yeah like elon musk, wanna be like an entreprenuer

[azure falcon]

I'm certified to do plumbing and electrical

[fluid ridge]

are you really going to make the claim that what you produced to society rivals amazon, facebook or tesla?

[manic torrent]

step 1: be born into a rich family

[fluid ridge]

with a straight face?

[gilded swan]

step one : failed

but i have faith

[unborn flare]

fails miserably

[manic torrent]

are you really going to make the claim that bezos does everything at amazon

[fluid ridge]

he was born rich, not born into 260 billion dollars rich

[fluid ridge]

that was never my premise

[manic torrent]

... yes, but you're still missing the point

[fluid ridge]

my claim is that without bezos, amazon does not exist

[manic torrent]

"creating value for shareholders"

[limpid fern]

i thought i would be earning minimum wage doing electrical, plumming and refrigeration\ work

[azure falcon]

Think where I work if I were to install 3 water heaters a day not on weekends I'd make 75k with bonus which is kind of insane

[tawdry musk]

Like, buying a bottle of milk and a loaf of bread
Millionare: I'm going to drive my fancy car to the shops
Billionare: Am I making the right decision here?

[gilded swan]

yeah billionaires are more down to earth than even some of us

if we're being realistic

[manic torrent]

Do you understand economics?

[tawdry musk]

We are all just animals

[fluid ridge]

yes i do

[gilded swan]

like? its a wide subject

[azure falcon]

One of the worst is Elon Musk

[gilded swan]

true

[unborn flare]

But something else would exist

[manic torrent]

As we increase effeciency, the need for labour decreases, but the same amount of work gets done - delivering the same value to the economy with less jobs. All of that excess money goes to the shareholders, who did nothing.

[fluid ridge]

thats just speculation

[gilded swan]

oh not the metauniversal theories again

[manic torrent]

everything is speculation.

[azure falcon]

Oh car wise I'm looking at a Subaru impreza wrx sti 2023

[unborn flare]

Well not that but i mean something that's equivalent to what amazon is

[gilded swan]

yeah i get that

[gilded swan]

also true

[tawdry musk]

The less people do the more they talk

[azure falcon]

Subaru makes great fucking cars

[manic torrent]

So, why do they deserve that money? and how do people who are now out of a job (because there is no need for their labour) eat?

[fluid ridge]

shareholders provide initial value and much needed funding to a company and expect to make more money back in return as the company takes their money and tries to make more with it

[manic torrent]

uhhh what?

[gilded swan]

has anybody watched kurzegesagts video on the medievial age to the industrial age and stuff

[unborn flare]

Indeed is but the base of human discovery is speculation

[fluid ridge]

the people who created the company deserve the money because without them, said company would not exist

[manic torrent]

Yes, I obviously understand that, that's not the point

[manic torrent]

and without the labour of the workers, it would not exist.

[fluid ridge]

but you say shareholders did nothing

[fluid ridge]

whats more important, the car or the gasoline

[tawdry musk]

Being unemployed is a fucking nightmare to be honest
When the need for labor goes down our mental health gets worse

[manic torrent]

They contributed capital. They did not expend labour.

[gilded swan]

one example i remember, says that at first we had to fight for a piece of cake, and rich people could steal other peoples part of the cake, but now after industrialisation we can just make more cake for everyone

[fluid ridge]

capital is labour

all capital comes from labour

[unborn flare]

That's alright that's what capitalism is all about i make the company i use my capital i reap the profits

[manic torrent]

which is correct, however, some people just can't afford the cake, even though there's plenty

[fluid ridge]

exactly

[gilded swan]

yeah but i would argue that being poor is kind of a choice

[fluid ridge]

and many times it's their fault they are unable to afford the cake

[manic torrent]

and you don't see any problem with positive feedback loops?

[gilded swan]

not in this type of context though

off-topic dont mind me

[manic torrent]

If you would argue that, you're a horrible person who should take a long hard look at yourself.

[gilded swan]

different context

[fluid ridge]

i see no problems in building a house and deciding not to share it with anyone, same thing here

[manic torrent]

no context required. It's straight up garbage

[gilded swan]

i mean you deserved it

[gilded swan]

true i better go look at the mirror

[manic torrent]

do you? What do people deserve?

[fluid ridge]

i wouldnt go as far as to say being poor is a choice but i will say you probably fucked up somewhere along the line if you're poor in a country like america or canada

[manic torrent]

absolute garbage.

[fluid ridge]

or any first world country for that matter

[gilded swan]

if you worked hard for a house its your place to enjoy and you deserve it so not sharing it would be kinda selfish

[unborn flare]

Not really there can only be so much cash flow in an economy and if a really powerful person controls how the cash flows they might be able to control the economy and the standard of living of people directly

[gilded swan]

this made no sense LMAO

[manic torrent]

Most people are at best, a few pieces of bad luck away from bankruptcy'

[tawdry musk]

You have less rights in poverty

[fluid ridge]

you act like people gathered up in a room, and names are drawn fucking hunger games style to see who becomes poor

[manic torrent]

that's basically correct.

[gilded swan]

i mean life is kind of like a chance game

[fluid ridge]

bruh?

[gilded swan]

its completely luck if you are born in a rich family

[short copper]

most people are born into poverty

[gilded swan]

can't argue with that

[short copper]

as well as right on the poverty live

[gilded swan]

even i can't\

[fluid ridge]

ok i hate to be that guy but ill be that guy, jeff bezos grew up poor with an adopted father from cuba who learned english in high school

🗿

[manic torrent]

If you live somewhere with no jobs, and your education is crap because you're in a poor area and your parents have no money.....

[short copper]

yeah and not everyone can be jeff bezos

[fluid ridge]

but my man went to princeton vaecdectorian and had a vision

[manic torrent]

which is of zero relevance. Some people get lucky.

[fluid ridge]

how can you call that luck

[manic torrent]

it's. luck.

[fluid ridge]

the instant dismissal of success is baffling to me

[gilded swan]

yes you know what i'd say, i'd say that its completely lucky where you start in a video game lets say, but if you dont play the video game, you're not gonna progress

you might start at the end

but never actually play

[unborn flare]

No America in a specially bad country for financially weak people so if you are born poor the system is set in a way to keep you poor there aren't many education opportunities in America which don't come with a ton of expenses increasing the burden on the student so he becomes a profit generator in basic sense

[short copper]

there are plenty of stories about "self made millionaires" but think about how many people who are born into poverty dont become anywhere near as successful

[manic torrent]

success is MOSTLY luck, and anyone else is kidding themselves, it's been well established.

[gilded swan]

or you could start at the very bottom

[fluid ridge]

"see that guy driving the lambo, he probably found 10 million dollars in a treasure chest in his backyard"

[manic torrent]

I mean don't get me wrong you still have to work at it, but you ALSO have to be lucky.

[gilded swan]

i would differ

[fluid ridge]

oh for sure, but you play luck to be the hail mary

[short copper]

saying that poverty is a choice or that if you live in poverty its your own fault is so ignorant its unbelievable

[tawdry musk]

Most of you are weak, and have no idea what is going on

[gilded swan]

what do we define as luck though

[unborn flare]

Actually he might have found the 10k in his backyard and made 10 mil Outta it the thing is the 10k isn't there for many people

[short copper]

i agree i am weak and have no idea whats going on

[fluid ridge]

if you work hard, there is no guarantee of success but you will for sure get farther than if you just sat on your ass and waited for luck

[gilded swan]

bro its a civil convo

[manic torrent]

I am extremely good at what I do, AND I enjoy it. It's ALSO a very lucrative career. That's luck.

[gilded swan]

so you didnt do anything for it

[tawdry musk]

Sorry, just keeping it real

[manic torrent]

you don't wait for luck, you put yourself in a position to recieve luck

[gilded swan]

your not gonna get a job if you just sit there

just praying to god for one

you have to do something to actually get it

[fluid ridge]

thats not luck, you have a particular skillset im sure you worked hard to master and found a job that brought you fortune

[manic torrent]

but I'm also a white male from an educated family

[gilded swan]

EXACTLY

[short copper]

yeah and its not a guarantee that someone will get that job or be able to make it work

[gilded swan]

that also plays a part

[unborn flare]

That only works if the game rewards you equally for the hours played life is more of a game that has variable exp per second and an exponentialy difficult hardness curve

[gilded swan]

true but its not something that can't be conquered without experience

[manic torrent]

"hard work" is not how you get to the top. Plenty of people work hard and get bugger all.

[gilded swan]

only playing it will get you over the curve

[fluid ridge]

ok lets be real, if you meet all qualifications for a job the chances of you not getting the job due to not having "luck" is probably pretty slim

[tawdry musk]

I just hope people in here find some form of independence, get a nice job, work their shit out

[gilded swan]

you can't be at the bottom of the curve and pray to just magically become a billionaire

[manic torrent]

You have no idea how much privelege you have

[unborn flare]

The boosters as i call them push your exp higher so that you get over the curve in your life time

[gilded swan]

also true

[fluid ridge]

all of the people at the top worked hard, not everyone who works hard makes it to the top

i agree