math-and-meta

[wind spade]

most of the numbers seem to be only half of what you need

and the recycled numbers are off

[median heath]

So they really screwed up then.

Because they are more space-efficient and more MW-efficient.
Not to mention they can actually do full throughput of 2 belts per individual platform.

[wind spade]

they can also teleport to 0|0 or get stuck in void for no reason

[median heath]

trains can also just stop and deadlock for no reason

[fringe pawn]

I've enjoyed watching trucks phase in my dune desert playthrough. I mde absolutely preposterous routes that would be doomed to fail if vehicles had to navigate with physics.

2 different routes that need to go through that coastal canyon maze, frankly they were a PITA to set, too, because I actually had to drive them without screwing up too much in the first place.

[median heath]

Can tell this is off at just a glance because when doing Diluted Fuel, Water = Fuel.
So if you had 3200 Water, you'd get only 3200 Fuel.

[wind spade]

yeah it's 1 hor + 2 water -> 2 fuel

[remote ice]

trucks are inherently uncertain and at the mercy of the physics engine if you go nearby.

Trains are safe, and only deadlock if you built a intersection. And since this isn't Factorio, it's geometrically possible for 2 rails to cross eachother without touching. There is no reason to ever built a intersection unless you just don't feel like making parallel rails.

[wind spade]

technically even in factorio you can cross 2 paths without touching

[fringe pawn]

I'm convinced nothing is uncertain about trucks after the feats I've watched mine perform

[remote ice]

not without mods

at least not how i'm thinking of it, technically by how you define 'paths' you might be able to sometimes

[median heath]

My trucks have been inherently certain since U2 when everyone hated them (with cause).
Now it's U6 and people hate them thinking it is still U2.

99% of truck issues are user-error.

[median heath]

Posting dick art in the math channel.....
Classy.

[wind spade]

it's the three tracks that are a problem 😛

[remote ice]

ah yeah, fair point, i think that breaks down with more lines

i'd have to stop and think about it for a bit

[wind spade]

(but yeah it's nitpicking and that's why I said "technically" and crossed the message)

[remote ice]

but yeah in satisfactory i don't see why you'd ever bother with a intersection unless you just really don't want to run a second rail a long way

[magic egret]

its useful when you have a big train network

[wind spade]

junctions are fine. Intersections not so much

[magic egret]

heres a good 4 way intersection

[wind spade]

here isn't 😛

[magic egret]

oh well

[wind spade]

(also you could just post the image itself)

[magic egret]

that was literally the direct image link

[wind spade]

rightclick -> copy image

[magic egret]

ah

[wind spade]

image link != image

[magic egret]

thanks

[wind spade]

I'm not sure how does the junction look like as it's 2D only here, but if it's a roundabout then NO it's not a good junction

[median heath]

Fair.
But truck stations are still fine and should not be completely dismissed as inferior.
Given in some circumstances they are superior to trains.

[magic egret]

like this

[wind spade]

yeah that's horrible

turbine ftw

[magic egret]

hm they have a huge network though and it seems to work fine for them

[wind spade]

roundabouts are even worse than standard 4 way junctions

[river night]

roundabouts work, but they congest much more quickly then a full turbine

[median heath]

Looks like a Nordic knot tbh.

[wind spade]

roundabout < 4 way junction < cloverleaf < turbine

[magic egret]

its not a roundabout

[wind spade]

here's turbine in satisfactory (iirc Amelie's build)

[magic egret]

nice

[river night]

i really like how a fully symetrical turbine looks too, just dont look at my first one that i build with oddly-angled tracks, it looks wonky af

[wind spade]

it's roundabout with slip lanes, which is slightly better than a roundabout, but still worse than even 4 way junction

[magic egret]

hmm

[wind spade]

from worst to best

(can't be bothered drawing turbine)

[magic egret]

second to last one seems best in terms of functionality and effort involved

[wind spade]

functionally they are all the same

in terms of throughput it's from worst to best

(in theory ofc, assumes equal usage of all lines and all paths)

if you have a non-equal usage, ideally you want to design an intersection that takes that into account

which turbine does by default 🙂

[fringe pawn]

It's been interesting playing on a group server where I'm allowing myself to using satisfactorytools, on my solo playthrough I decided to do almost everything in my head as a challenge. My solo playthrough... was sloppy. 😛

[fringe pawn]

This is going to be interesting. I'm planning an ADS factory with no oil and water only for aluminum.

I think I've got it dialed in, it'll be my first time using OC supercomputer. It'll be built at the nitrogen node in the Eastern Dune Forest.
https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=QkSzf2yKI9xIvwkM14zw

[frosty owl]

I once planned a maximized Turbomotor factory without tools
Designing the buildings required me to take some notes though...
(End of the flex)

[fringe pawn]

I didn't even use pen/paper, the most I did was occasionally use the calculator for some multiplication and division. A lot of things were never fully automated or connected. I just built big lines and manually fed ISCs of other lines via hypertubes.

[frosty owl]

I wanted to make a bit of a complex (and mainly load-balanced) layout spanning different buildings, so some notes had to be taken... Just too many numbers to remember them all (I might've used signs if U5 was already there 🤔)

[fringe pawn]

MAx turbo, so U3?

[frosty owl]

Yeah... Just in time to get kicked in the teeth by U4 halfway building it

[fierce ruin]

I love this

[forest blade]

she has a youtube video on how to build it along with other train interchanges. the files are also on her discord if you want to look in game at her examples

[cinder silo]

@magic egret time for some cannon science, two 15 stage cannons, one compact, one less so.

[magic egret]

woo

[cinder silo]

Spaced out cannon landing spot

Compact cannon landing spot

Definitely confirmed, spacing the sections more than doubled the launch distance.

[magic egret]

nice work

[cinder silo]

The spaced cannon was twice the length.

[stiff phoenix]

I want this on my global network now.

[stiff phoenix]

Thanks, forgot it's 2:1 Water to HOR :)

[median heath]

Doing things in ratios instead of exact numbers 🤢

[wind spade]

~~not using online calculators 🤢 ~~

[median heath]

L+Ratio

[stiff phoenix]

I prefer to use my head, just forgot the numbers.

[wind spade]

well as you can see from the screenshot I posted before, it's not the only error

almost all numbers are wrong in one way or another

[stiff phoenix]

6400 water + 3200 HOR. Happy now?

Also means I need 64 blenders as well, not 32.

[wind spade]

only the alt HOR numbers match, other numbers are wrong

[stiff phoenix]

I'll redo it when I get home. Want to start building the tower tonight.

[wind spade]

though the recycled numbers may be correct now looking at them, with the underclocking going on 🤔 hard to calculate if you split it like that

(not sure what's the reason for the split)

[cinder silo]

Well, spitters have a max range it seems, this one just keeps missing 😄

[stiff phoenix]

Tower based build, want to know the numbers per floor. Inspiration is the one on the right. (Picture posted originally by @uneven dagger)

[wind spade]

I'd say it's easier to calculate total numbers and then decide on the split based on space and other constraints 🤔

[stiff phoenix]

Space won't be an issue. Though Blenders will probably take up the most room, thus will most likely take up the ground floor.

[cinder silo]

I had something not too dissimilar in mind for my ammunition factory.

[stiff phoenix]

Also, I want to keep the numbers the same so I can just copy floor plans and belt work. (Manually but still copy)

[stiff phoenix]

Will have an ammo factory in the same area. Using the impure node for the HOR, fuel and turbo fuel for it

[cinder silo]

With mine I'll just be making it up as I go along because I want the three rifle ammunition rounds produced there.

[stiff phoenix]

I'll have mine making all ammo types eventually. Though I want the oil done first.

[cinder silo]

Much more basic, 4 floors of reprocessing power slugs, biomass, alien parts & flower petals, it ended up being more spacious inside than expected.

Ahh yes the oil, I'm floating around the spire right now plotting a path to pipe all its oil.

[stiff phoenix]

Small or not, if it works it works

[cinder silo]

I wish signs could have large single letters though, I would love to have a huge vertical sign on that bio shaker tower.

[stiff phoenix]

Just hope I don't screw up the math again, pretty big build with little overclocking.

[cinder silo]

Image grabbed off the internet but I'd like to be able to do signs like shown here for towers.

[stiff phoenix]

You can do that already. Just need to use square signs like pixels. Or use the large letter layout.

[cinder silo]

Well shit, I didn't see the scroll bar, thanks you just added some possibilities to my bland base 🙂

Thanks, as one could say the only cure for ignorance is knowledge 👍

[stiff phoenix]

People help me, I help people. Things just work out like that :)

[uneven dagger]

5 foundations high per floor would be nice

I'm still working on my super smelter factory

[stiff phoenix]

Going to have refineries inside. At least 8 high with space under floor for belting.

[frosty owl]

They used to have insane range in U5 (and earlier). Though they never shoot you from >50m or something, their projectiles traveled 500+ meters

(Just eyeballing distances)

[cinder silo]

I apologise, I have only just returned home, hence my lack of response.

[thorn bane]

yooo @frosty owl i just found the best use for sushi
100% efficient rotors using mk1 belts
they need 20/min rods and 100/min screws BUT if you do 20/min rods + 40/min screws on 1 belt and 60 screws/min on the other you have 60/min on each
thats a 2:1 merge which is super simple by just connecting 2 sides with screws and 1 with rods

[magic egret]

does that actually work

[thorn bane]

yep
ive done lots of sushi like that: #907847228188655676 message
there is a bug where you sometimes dupe items in splitters but its a buffer of 5/200 rods and 25/500 screws so it would have to dupe 195 rods or 475 screws for it to break
and by that point you probably already have mk2 or mk3 belts xD

[magic egret]

nice

[onyx scarab]

we'r using the 4th layout which is IMHO better because smaller then last one

[river night]

smaller, but at maximum use would have a bit more congestion, not that many people actually have that busy lines

[vapid gorge]

So for some simplicity I need to make some lines producing 86.666666666~ ingots per minute per machine. Is there a way to actually run a system without the occasional hiccup when dealing with repeating decimals?
Is the best way of doing this finding the overclock % and input that?

[oblique hollow]

just do 86.666 and you wont see a hiccup for 10 years

[river night]

you can often also adjust the overall throughput to get nicer numbers

if you really care

but otherwise the hiccups would be so rare as mentioned above

[vapid gorge]

fiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnneeee...................

I mean... I could adjust the copper and cat... might end up with a repeating somewhere further along the lines

[oblique hollow]

accept timely imperfections and just play

[vapid gorge]

yeah but my perfectly timed uranium rod factory!

https://tenor.com/view/cabbages-avatar-my-cabbages-damaged-broken-cart-gif-12054898

[knotty needle]

Which tool do you use for this?

[wind spade]

My own 🙂

[median heath]

Not an expert but I'd assume the one he programmed himself...

[wind spade]

It's in pins and #welcome

[knotty needle]

https://giphy.com/gifs/southparkgifs-26uff19P1Rvfk3tNC

[vapid gorge]

Numbers rejiggered! Repetition will not defeat me!

[oblique hollow]

[still blade]

to calculate how many machines i need to produce a certain amount of items, do i devide the number of items needed to make by how much ppm INPUT the machine has, or by ppm OUTPUT?

this is what i mean

[ember shale]

Depends on if your input materials are so available you're not limited by them or not.

(Locally.)

In general though, you'd divide by the number on the output side, and just tailor your input to match that

[still blade]

so =D2/40 and try to match the oil to that?

[vapid gorge]

Divide the Total Oil you're using by the per minute use of each machine

[oblique hollow]

machine makes X amount.

you need Y

Y/X

and logically you divide by the product

Refinery makes 40 fuel, you need 320

so 320/40
for number of refineries to make 320 fuel

then you multiply refinery number by the COST of the recipe (60 oil) to get the total cost for 320 fuel

[still blade]

in the chart a sent, i already have the cost number, i work by input, not output

[oblique hollow]

so you try to find out how much fuel you can make?

then its everything i just said again, but instead of output you use input

Oil you have / 60 (cost per refinery) = number of refineries

[mystic moon]

It's great. Used it on my hmf factory
One suggestion would be an option showing you how exactly to run beltwork. In the hmf factory, I had several lines over max belt throughput, and it would be cool if there was an option to show the beltwork for it, bit I can just imagine what a headache that would be. I'm also not sure how much of the challenge of the game that would take away, but it could be cool.

[fringe pawn]

I think Anthor's tool tries to do that?

[vapid gorge]

The satisfactory calculator tool (SCIM) does that but visualisation is a nightmare.

Besides there's many ways to do belt and pipe work especially if you want to do anymore more than very basic layouts.

[oblique hollow]

beltwork is most easily managed by grouping machines

like... you know how much each single machine makes

so group them in a way where they use a belt to a good capacity

[frosty owl]

Ahahahah, that's a really clever setup!
I love how this actually makes practical sense, as it allows to have a fully efficient rotor production without MK2 belts. Very fun

||I'd gladly make a Reddit post about it if you haven't planned one ^^||

[frosty owl]

Mergers don't duplicate items :P
So, 1 input sushi can actually be safe as long as only mergers are used

[frosty owl]

My approach is: clock slightly lower (86.6665) and manage the overflow of input, so no machines turn off ever

[frosty owl]

Oh right, there is only 1 issue with the setup that I can see: the belt connecting the rods/screws merger and the rotors assembler has more than 1 segment, so it won't carry 60/min!

Also, you need to explain why there's a yellow light in there (middle constructor)

[pulsar gale]

How do I split this?

Does manifolding normally just do this for me?

[frosty owl]

As long as you respect throughput limits and provide enough items, a manifold will balance itself out eventually

[frosty owl]

Though if you have MK3 belt it's easy as pie: merge everything together, send 1/4 to the iron rods const. and the rest to the other processing

As the total is 270 ingots/min, 67.5 is just a 4th of that

[pulsar gale]

Cheers that is really helpful!

[unborn ermine]

Yeah you can manifold or set a smart splitter to push out material to the iron rods and have "overflow" set to the other 202.5/min line.
Pretty much the same, but just more forced.

Ive used that for my quartz nodes up in the dune desert, as I am using the one water source(the hidden cave nearby) to get bonus production with the pure quartz recipe.

[mystic moon]

Oh I know that. I meant something like a visualization of where to inject into a manifold, etc

[vapid gorge]

wouldn't that be underflow though?

[vapid gorge]

this does belt planners https://satisfactory-calculator.com/en/planners/production , If you want custom jobs to things you want that'd be impossible to program.

Also please don't do injection manifolds. It just goes so wrong so easily and unless you use a ton of smart splitters it's just a mess

Had a nightmare of a time helping someone who refused to NOT do injection manifolds because they fundamentally didn't want to do simple maths.

[thorn bane]

sure i dont do much on reddit

[thorn bane]

because that constructor only gets 5 rods to make 20 screws to get to 40+40+20
i just didnt bother underclocking

[thorn bane]

oh i guess it cant actually ever fill up since that would require >60/min items

[mystic moon]

I only had to do 2 in this factory and they're working fine

Lol
I've played this game enough that I've settled on a mix of optimisation and ease of building for my factories

[frosty owl]

What about it?

[frosty owl]

It could fill up. If the MK1 belt segment I mentioned backs up, it would probably fill up on either rods or screws after a very long while

[vapid gorge]

If you under fed wouldn’t it occasionally starve?

[proven sphinx]

What was the formula for troughput on trains ? i got 9000 copper ingots per min (12x750) that needs to move from A > B and then empty back, but i don't know how long the trainride will take yet (let's say 10 minutes for 1 roundtrip ) .... i can add more than 1 train on the tracks so i was considering 6 wagons

[white isle]

Oh jeez I'm having a belt problem >.>. I'm trying to make a little side factory that produces Quickwire, Copper Sheets, and AI Limiters, the limiters are mainly to sink but maybe I can repurpose it way down the line for Supercomputers.

Anyway so I want to have 3 Assemblers running to use 300 Quickwire/min, I can produce that much but since I don't have mk4 belts yet, I can't have 300 items on a belt. I have a preference for load balancers but trying to do the math to figure out the amount of splitters/mergers needed with this particular instance hurts my head, any pointers?

[noble agate]

How are you producing your quickwire?

You could just have manifold for the 3 assemblers and feed 2/3 of the quickwire in the beginning and 1/3 before the third machine.

Or more than 2/3 (but less than 270) in the beginning and the rest before the third.

[white isle]

I've got 6 smelters all at 100% for 12 ingots/min, I split off 60 ingots to 5 constructors, all at 100% consuming 12/min to produce 60 quickwire/min. I had planned on just making 2 mergers, then splitting off 3 ways for 100 quickwire to each assembler before I realized I couldn't do that.

[noble agate]

Gather the quickwire from 4 of the 5 constructors to one mk3 belt (240/min), feed that to the beginning of your assembler manifold. Bring the quickwire from the 5th constructor to your manifold before the third assembler.

[white isle]

I'm a visual guy, so would it be like this?

Red=Constructor
Black=Mk1 belt
Yellow=Merger
Blue=Mk3 belt
Purple=Splitter
Brown=Mk2 belt
Green=Assembler

[noble agate]

Yes, if you draw a belt from the 5th red box to the second yellow box

I also like to build a manifold for outputs, looks more clean in my opinion

[white isle]

Oh lol forgot that 1 but had it in mind when I was drawing.

Maybe I'll change around to manifolds, this would be my first time doing 1 actually. I like balancers because then I know for sure everything is getting exactly what they need without having to wait for the startup.

[stiff phoenix]

About 15.5GW when adding the overclocked extractors.

[noble agate]

If you start by building the quickwire producing constructors first, they will build a nice buffer that will flow to the assemblers when you connect the belts. This will probably saturate them very fast.

So the manifold will have a fast startup

And for outputs manifold is exactly the same as load balancer. They all get to the same belt anyway, it doesn't matter if you combine the items using a manifold or a load balancer.

[white isle]

Actually I had it all already built but unpowered, I was just stuck on figuring out how to feed them. Manifolds will prob take me a while to come around to, one of the big things I like about Satisfactory is that everything tells me the exact amount, so I just naturally leaned towards balancing, I didn't even know manifolds existed until playing with a friend.

Thanks for helping though!

[noble agate]

No problem 🙂 And manifolds are usually the way to go - easier to think, easier to set up and easier to expand.

I'm building a huge nuclear plant at the moment and there I'm experimenting with load balancer for the radioactive items, to try to minimise radiation, though.

[cinder silo]

Load balancer for radiation is the way to go for Rad-Haz control, my power station is practically radiation free because of a 1-100 balancer up in the attic space.

[noble agate]

I'm just worried because there's apparently a bug with splitters that sometimes multiply items.

[cinder silo]

I've heard of that, I'm keeping an eye on the trickiest parts of the nuke cycle just in case it goes backwards.

If you can, put all your uranium mines on the same circuit, complete with off switch, should it go bad, kill the mines and clean up.

[unborn ermine]

Oh yeah the loading bug iirc?
Chance the game might load in and dupe an item in a splitter?

[cinder silo]

I have 1050 waste per minute, I'd hate for that to dupe.

[noble agate]

I'm building a maxed nuclear plant, but I'm adding about 20% more waste management that is needed just in case something goes wrong.

[unborn ermine]

Have a surprise overflow crate at the ready and loathe the day you decide to check it

[cinder silo]

I'm nowhere near max because I used the wrong recipes, blender for uranium cells and standard for fuel rods, so I get 21 rods per minute out of 2100 uranium.

I'm going to have to figure out what to do with 8 pipes of oil I just sent to the dunes, god knows how many refineries that's going to keep busy.

[unborn ermine]

Make some plastic iron plates

[cinder silo]

I went completely mad gathering spire coast oil nodes without a thought for what I'm meant to do with it all beyond resuming plastic/ribber, getting circuits made and well, like a quarter of the oil can handle that, maybe a third.

[proven sphinx]

is there a command that i can type so that i get the "warning " when its about to autosave for all clients on the server?

[oblique hollow]

that notification is broken and doesnt show for clients

[median heath]

Multiplayer Broken. Plz Fix.

[stiff phoenix]

I play single player and even with autosave disabled the game still freezes to autosave, I just get no warning :/

[dense warren]

anybody know the best recipe to make computers?

[deft lichen]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Computer#Alternate_recipes_analysis

[dense warren]

i know the wiki page mate, i really wanted an opinion...

[deft lichen]

I personally use default and crystal computers, but the most liked recipe seems to be caterium computers, so 🤷

decide based on which resources are available near your factory

[dense warren]

i've once built a factory for cat computers

but it was BIG AF, and only produces 5 computers and 5 super computers....

per minute*

[deft lichen]

yeah, from the looks of it, caterium board & computer are the most resource efficient while silicon board & crystal computer require the least amount of space

5 supercomputers/min is pretty big

[frosty owl]

Not if you clock it at less than your goal as I mentioned (.6665 instead of .6666). The following steps would have to account for that ofc ||in some cases, it might be worth matching the production to the requirements of the following processing if they make your numbers nicer||

[dense warren]

i think i'l use crystal computer this time to make it simple

just not sure about the oscillators, but i also think i'll use the default for that, what do u think?

[frosty owl]

And it's done: 100% efficient rotor production with MK1 belts
https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/vuh700/100_efficient_rotor_production_no_mk2_belts_and/

[topaz hedge]

yuck

[candid tundra]

Hey everyone, I think it's okay if I post this here. I just wanted to hop in and mention that I've updated my factory planner app for U6! I've been away from Satisfactory for a while but I finally got time to get things up to date, as well as add some stuff like better sharable links that aren't way too long lmao.
https://www.satisfactory-planner.net/

Enjoy!

[topaz hedge]

The fact that this produces 1920 fuel with a total of 8 blenders + water extractors..

[topaz hedge]

that's a neat feature.

[candid tundra]

Thanks!

That's a neat factory haha

[fierce ruin]

Would this setup work? The circles are water extractors and the boxes are junctions, with the lines being pipes. I need 270 per pipe for my coal plant

I just dont know about how backflow works

Also is having a 300 water pipe bad if only 270 is being consumed for backflow reasons? I can downclock if so

[oblique hollow]

backflow is not a problem

if they all are 120/min, you get 280/min per pipe

not 270

[fierce ruin]

is that a problem?

like do i need to underclock?

[oblique hollow]

ignore it if you dont care about machine efficiency

[fierce ruin]

ok. but that setup will work, right?

[oblique hollow]

ye

[fierce ruin]

thanks

[thorn bane]

@frosty owl isnt the max throughput bug super irrelevant for mk1 belts? i thought it scales with how fast they go so it would be 59.9999 something instead?
obviously i havent tested it but since going from mk5 to mk4 is a lot better id guess that mk1s are perfectly fine

[oblique hollow]

in theory there should be a mathematical limit to how low the throughput can get on a mk 5 belt

since you cant get 0/min on a long belt

[gloomy palm]

what does it mean in the patch notes that "Parallelized fluid system"

https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/526870/view/3321981593813963972

did something change about the fluid system mechanics?

[onyx scarab]

i mostly use https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/poc898/alternate_recipes_indepth_analysis_an_objective/ to decide which recipe is best

[oblique hollow]

something about using threads more efficiently

but nothing you would notice

[gloomy palm]

hmmmmm

sounds like a good thing to do

[median heath]

Best is subjective though...

[thorn bane]

yes
he uses the objective list to decide whats subjectively the best for him
thats now subjective and objective works sev

[median heath]

His "objective" list has the best Oscillator recipe and the tied-for-best Scrap recipe at the bottom.

Much objective. Very accurate list. 👍

[frosty owl]

It should scale with throughput, yes
I like to always keep in mind wether it'll have am effect or not and act accordingly, I haven't actually run tests or crunched numbers to see in what instances it (throughput bug) might cause actual issues with MK1 belts

[topaz hedge]

hahaha.. he shits on solid steel ingot

and wet concrete too..

solid steel I can understand, but wet concrete?

[median heath]

The 40+40=60 instead of 45+45=45...

Yeah, shit recipe.

Anything with water usually gets "objectively" weighted wrong because people assign a weight value to water...

[vapid gorge]

One of the reddit evaluators post?
There's a couple of them where he's using different metrics on 'value' if it's the ones I'm thinking

I seem to recall some of my fav recipes being low balled by a couple metrics that didn't seem important to me

[topaz hedge]

Most of the list I can agree with, even solid steel, since coke steel is really good.. but still.

but water has no value, and wet concrete is more power efficient vs standard.. so whatever.

[vapid gorge]

Solid steel is amaze balls. Shut your heathen mouth

[median heath]

Every steel alt is really good tbh.

Just wish we had a steel beam alt 😭

[topaz hedge]

I use solid steel too. I like 40+40=60.

[vapid gorge]

It's called 'encased pipe' 😛

[median heath]

The reason Steel Beam needs an alt.

[vapid gorge]

I find solid steel much more convenient than coke steel

[topaz hedge]

okay buddy, clearly this redditor thinks we should make residual plastic.

[median heath]

🤮

[vapid gorge]

if they add some recipes that need them I guess? for the most part after mk3 belts you hardly ever need them. You can deal with like 1 machine in the background feeding some storage of them when low for some random buildings I guess?

[median heath]

Residual Plastic has only one use...

[median heath]

Basically the reason Encased Pipe slaps is because Steel Beam sucks.
If Steel Beam had an alt to make it slightly more viable then EIB vs. EIP is an actual choice.

[vapid gorge]

Doesn't that say 'f tier' ?

[median heath]

Yes. So why is Residual Rubber in F?

Why is Recycled Rubber in F?

According to them Base Rubber is all you should ever use.

[vapid gorge]

oh recycled is in there too

weird

[topaz hedge]

residual isn't in there, it's not an alt.

[median heath]

Which is objectively a shit opinion.

Also Alclad Casing... is F... because why boost production?

[vapid gorge]

now now, every recipe is subjective in it's situation 😛

[median heath]

Exactly.
So there shouldn't be an F tier.
Outside of Fine Concrete and BioCoal

S tier: Encased Pipe, HOR
Nearly everything else: A tier

B tier: Most base recipes. Electrode Circuit Board.
C tier: Fine Concrete
F tier: Biocoal, Charcoal

[topaz hedge]

Which is why everytime someone makes a list of alts, they're just ranking them based on what they consider valuable.

[median heath]

Indeed.

If B is "useful, but usually better options" I stand by the list I just posted as being mostly objective 🤷‍♂️

[topaz hedge]

I doubt most of the people who've made them have made a world that's big enough to suffer from machine count too.

[median heath]

And like I said earlier, EIP wouldn't be S if Steel Beam had an alt.

HOR just straight needs a nerf though.

[topaz hedge]

leave hor alone.

unbuff fuel gens so they use 18 fuel again

[median heath]

HOR down to 30=30 instead of 30=40 and I'm happy.

[vapid gorge]

What was the metric they were using for that ranking btw?
I seem to recall a guy doing the lists from several view points

[median heath]

That's why they are all bad.
They compare with metrics instead of freedom units.

[vapid gorge]

Wait, they changed hor???

[median heath]

No.
I want them to. It needs a nerf.

[topaz hedge]

Why do you want us to have less plastic/rubber?

[median heath]

I want there to be more viable options in that production tree.

[vapid gorge]

No depth to your opinion :p

[median heath]

Currently there is 1 optimal way.

Having 1 optimal way is bad.

[topaz hedge]

nerfing hor makes a whole host of alts that are usable, worthless.

[vapid gorge]

A lot of people hate screwing around with refineries so that’s the stick to not use them

[median heath]

OVERnerfing HOR makes them useless.
CORRECTLYnerfing HOR makes them competitive.

[topaz hedge]

you're basically saying you don't like steel coated, and adhered iron plates.. and you don't want us to use those x:

[median heath]

And just to clarify: I'm saying nerf HOR the alt, not make the HOR item bad.

[median heath]

I'm not saying this at all.

[topaz hedge]

adjusting that recipe, so it either uses more oil, or is slower reduces the amount of plastic/rubber we can have.

slower wouldn't reduce it, but it'll make it unnecessarily more painful to build.

[vapid gorge]

The hor dilute fuel link IS optimal in resource output sure , but it’s a huge labor difference to get that benefit compared to other faster set ups

Gotta compare labor time to get the results and time investments

[topaz hedge]

I think residual rubber/plastic/fuel could maybe use a tweak, maybe so they'll be a slightly more viable option

[vapid gorge]

Nah, huge production output should require effort

[median heath]

Um... if you keep using the Recycled Loop, yes.
That's the point.
Giving more ways to make Plastic/Rubber/Fuel that are viable instead of just "there is one way to do this and if you deviate you're just choosing to be non-optimal"

[topaz hedge]

recycled loops are complex, and take effort and planning.. that's the reward.

[vapid gorge]

Then instead of wrecking a ton of existing set up create intermediary recipes that make less but require less infrastructure

[topaz hedge]

but a slight buff to residual options would provide a decent path for people who don't want to deal with that.

[median heath]

Single optimal way is enabled by a single recipe...
Balancing is simple.

If you want to adjust tons of different things instead of the 1 thing that enables it... that's on you 🤷‍♂️

[topaz hedge]

If they thought hor was overpowered. I don't think they would've given us a blender alt for diluted fuel that made it so much easier to exploit.

[median heath]

Reward people for doing it, just don't make the reward over 2x the return of doing it any other way.
Reward disparity is too high.

[median heath]

Blender alt is completely fine.

[vapid gorge]

That is the simplest way to change it but you’re ignoring how many factories that’d destroy.

[median heath]

All of them will get wrecked prior to 1.0 when they do the recipe balance patch.

[topaz hedge]

it's arguably more than 2x the work to setup a recycled loop vs doing it any other way. surely the 2x output is justified.

The last stream I heard them say they're going to keep everything in ratio for that patch x:

[median heath]

If you have a clip I'd love to see it.
My understanding is the fix to pipes will be kept in ratio. If they downscale mk3 miners on pure instead of doing split output, that would be kept in ratio.

But both of those are separate from recipe balance.

[topaz hedge]

Well, that's the one I was thinking of.

we'll see what happens after that.

[median heath]

Yeah. Fixing logistics issues is a separate thing from recipe balance.
Recipe balance is the reason they didn't remove beacons yet.

Because they know beacon removal will break nuke lines, and Snutt mentioned they are holding off because recipe balance will break production lines of all types, "and it's better to just break everything all at once instead of breaking multiple things across separate patches"

[topaz hedge]

I do look foward to having to shut my world down to point where I'm walking to between my factories to fix things 😄

[vapid gorge]

It’s 4x output

[soft scarab]

Explorers 😎

[vapid gorge]

Nuuuuuuui…. I’ll probably mod in old recipes XD I’m making extremely unadjustable factories

[topaz hedge]

Some of mine are adjustable, depending on how crazy they get with the changes. my nuclear setups can (and have, because I had nuclear power for U4 ex when they did the last balance change for it) tolerate a minor ratio adjustment

some of them aren't so adjustable.

[topaz hedge]

Alright, so it's 2x the work to build, 2x the complexity, and the last trade off is you've gone from a setup that can produce power, to strictly a power consumer.

[vapid gorge]

Sorry I thought you were talking about plastic/rubber not power XD

[median heath]

This is what I was talking about 🤷‍♂️

[topaz hedge]

I am talking about plastic and rubber, those are the trade off's as to why I like the setup, and I think it's balanced xd

[median heath]

Given there is only 1 way to do it optimally, I disagree. 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

Ok got confused XD so yeah 400% petroleum products returned or 200% power potential

[topaz hedge]

There can only be 1 optimal way. that's why it's optimal, or the best lol

[median heath]

Nearly everything else has multiple optimal paths.
Everything is a tradeoff.

And then you have oil, empowered by HOR.

[vapid gorge]

I think the outlay of building and planning is so great that it stops being optimal for a lot of people

You’re forgetting most people aren’t obsessive nuts like us

[median heath]

That's the beauty in the design of the game.
"Best is subjective."

Except when it comes to oil, empowered by HOR.

[topaz hedge]

But if I'm going to produce the maximum number of x/min part possible, there is only one possible or optimal path to producing that part?

[median heath]

Games shouldn't be balanced based on the lowest level of play.

[median heath]

False.

Example: Aluminium.

Sloppy + Electrode = Instant

Same result, different paths.

[vapid gorge]

It’s not level of play, it’s effort value placed on infrastructure

The ‘optimal’ recipes trade off is massive investment of time and labor

Most people can probably never need as much oil production as the optimal recipes produce.

[topaz hedge]

If I need the sulfur for something else it's not optimal. ex max ads would really only have 1 path.

[median heath]

I do not see a world where you convince me HOR doesn't need a nerf 🤷‍♂️

[median heath]

Baux to Scrap is the comparison.

If Oil to Product involved more than just Oil, HOR would be in a different spot.
But it doesn't.

[vapid gorge]

I don’t get how you can’t include labor in your ‘balance’ value

[topaz hedge]

sev's got a different way of thinkin. ig :p

[vapid gorge]

Logistics management is a significant factor as that’s significant labor value added

[median heath]

Because yes, the comparison in AL is the both give the same result, which path you take can depend on the other resources involved.

Oil to Product has no other resources involved.

[vapid gorge]

One of the reasons instant scrap can really fall short

[median heath]

Because 10 hours in the scope of 1000 in playtime is irrelevant.

[vapid gorge]

But that’s every recipe. You make a factory with automated power and get infinite product over time.
The whole game is around the time you invest building

And your time is finite

[topaz hedge]

^

[vapid gorge]

Sadly I will probably never get a robo body thus have finite play time

Even if I do the heat death of the universe will be tricky to avoid

[median heath]

You're saying this like setting up the Recycled Loop is a multi-day chore.

[topaz hedge]

I'll avoid some setups just because of the time involved. I already might spend 50 hours building a factory.

[topaz hedge]

It is for me.. weeks actually o.o

hell, u6 will probably drop on ex before I'm done with this build.

[median heath]

Skill diff

[vapid gorge]

If you’re doing a big job and care about form working with function? Very much multi day

But at the same time
If you just slap down both reg petrochemical and recycled petro, the recyc is still going to take way longer

[hidden scarab]

Wolfgrim builds big and organized

[topaz hedge]

size matters.

[vapid gorge]

Just build for girth

Like sure I could probably slap down a big recyc plant in a day easy. But I could slap a non recyc plant in less than an hour prob

I would never do that cause ugly, but it’s a thing that can happen

[topaz hedge]

Don't forget length too.

I do both.

[vapid gorge]

Length becomes a problem almost everywhere fast.

[hidden scarab]

Are we talking about my browser history?

[vapid gorge]

It’s not the history that matters but the number of tabs ?

I think we lost traction on the joke :p

[hidden scarab]

Sad

[vapid gorge]

But yes-

Because logistics needed for recipes in different locations alters any particular recipe in value, invested labor should be the same as that’s basically also what extra logistics is

Now both these things can be modified to a degree with planning and tailoring of a production line but since we are finite beings effort for set up is important

For example I spent two weeks staring at spread sheets planning locations and recipes and rail.

That’s labor investment XD

[hidden scarab]

I learned a lot by building big ;o for 500hours

[median heath]

If they never nerf HOR I will say it needs to be nerfed until we change to computers that can no longer run this game 🤷‍♂️

[hidden scarab]

Time to restart

[hidden scarab]

Wuts HOR?

[vapid gorge]

Heavy oil residue

[vapid gorge]

I approve of your style btw. Great way to learn

[topaz hedge]

but. speaking of recycled setups.. this is about half done

[hidden scarab]

I would be sad if they nerfed that

[terse sorrel]

wofgrim, my old friend

[topaz hedge]

same here. I will defend hor until the end

ello

[vapid gorge]

Most would. Sev is not like most

[hidden scarab]

Who’s sev?

[vapid gorge]

A bit spread for my liking but I appreciate the org

[vapid gorge]

The person above who hates HOR recipe and love

Also freedom :p

[hidden scarab]

Omg they are a communist??

[vapid gorge]

:flag waving:

[topaz hedge]

I like to sprawl. x:

[vapid gorge]

He might be that cool?

[hidden scarab]

🇺🇲🦅

[vapid gorge]

Build uuuuuuup

[hidden scarab]

OIL AND REBAR GUNS

[vapid gorge]

Look , there’s a reason I left the US…

[hidden scarab]

I like how you built ;o

[topaz hedge]

No. >.>

[hidden scarab]

Build horizontal

Then again wolfgrim seen how I build and I’m a mess ish

[vapid gorge]

Taaaaaaalllll

[vapid gorge]

We’re all a mess at first ❤️

[hidden scarab]

;o yeah for 500 hours

On my 3rd play through

[vapid gorge]

I spent 100hr just on my first mega factory on my fourth playthrough to realise I had done it all wrong.

It’s a learning process

[hidden scarab]

Yeah it’s just hard to stop when u are going at it D:

[vapid gorge]

Well there’s also a huge part of the game where it might be ‘wrong for you’ and you need to finish or mostly get through it to realise it

Like technically my factory functioned. But it was also all wrong

[topaz hedge]

While I like the design. it's too vertical for me :p

Part of it too, is figuring out your own building style, because everyone who plays this game does things differently

[hidden scarab]

Well once I turned it on I realized it all worked besides my train and some water issues of overflowing problems
Producing 126 heat fused modular frames a min with instant scrap and reusing water was an odd set up but I really enjoyed it

[vapid gorge]

Yeah, I quickly realised utalitarian wasn’t going to work for me

[median heath]

Yeah, weird people use hoverpacks 😉

[vapid gorge]

Nice. I promise to only judge you a little bit for the instant scrap :p

[hidden scarab]

I prefer instant scrap due to being so close to bauxite limitations

I was pushing max bauxite volumes given you need bauxite for other stuff

[vapid gorge]

From what I recall instant scrap is about the same as sloppy electro pure?

[median heath]

Instant and Sloppy + Electrode are equivalent in terms of Scrap per Baux.

The only decision you have to make is which black rock you want to use.
If Coal: Instant
If Coke: Sloppy + Electrode

[hidden scarab]

It was slightly less bauxite to do instant I thought? Like 10 less a minute or something and 6 less than electrode?

Or am I missing something

[median heath]

You're missing.

[vapid gorge]

I think that the end scrap from bauxite is the same

[hidden scarab]

I prefer not doing pure ingots either

Cause less aluminum

[median heath]

Instant and Sloppy + Electrode is the exact same Scrap per Baux.

[hidden scarab]

O_O HOLLLLYY

[vapid gorge]

From there you just choose pure or reg ingots

[median heath]

"The only decision you have to make is which black rock you want to use.
If Coal: Instant
If Coke: Sloppy + Electrode"

[hidden scarab]

Regular ingots

Ah

[vapid gorge]

Is there even enough quarts on the map to do all reg ingots?

[hidden scarab]

Yeah

[median heath]

Yes.

[hidden scarab]

That’s what I did

[median heath]

But Cheap Silica ftw.

[hidden scarab]

I didn’t use cheap silica cause I was lazy too

[median heath]

I have to because I'm making like 400 Oscillators/min

[vapid gorge]

Ok you’re not using all bauxite then.

Or you’re modded

[hidden scarab]

No not all bauxite, just almost all, like I said I was close to max bauxite but not all, I had like some thousand or so2 left over or something, can’t remember

I don’t use mods ;o

[median heath]

You can do max AL without Cheap Silica

[vapid gorge]

…. Nooooo… really?

[median heath]

Max costs 9780/10500 Quartz

[hidden scarab]

That’s actually good to know cause I was kind of worried about the quartz

I’m still learning O_O

[median heath]

Cheap changes is to 6985.xx

[hidden scarab]

HOLLLLYYYY

[median heath]

@wind spade any idea why Tools doesn't use Cheap Silica when you tell it to maximize Aluminium Ingot?

[vapid gorge]

I’ll have to go over my master plan again.
The copper was probably the killer I guess

[median heath]

I had to manually disable the base Silica recipe to get it to work.

[vapid gorge]

Limestone is worth more than gold

[hidden scarab]

I like limestone and concrete

Wet concrete is my favorite recipe

[median heath]

This is interesting because it means without Cheap Silica, the base recipe for AL Ingot is 1:1 between Bauxite and Quarts.

[hidden scarab]

Wait, why does rubber concrete exist?

[median heath]

Because it's good.

And because it's a real thing IRL.

[vapid gorge]

It’s pretty great. You can overclock like 2 refineries to a whole node

[hidden scarab]

It is? But doesn’t wet concrete cancel it out?

[hidden scarab]

Yah it’s the best to me

[median heath]

Define "cancel"?

[vapid gorge]

And really practical if you can make extra rubber on site I guess?

[hidden scarab]

Like make rubber concrete kind of pointless when wet concrete exists

[hidden scarab]

Only thing i could think of but idk why id use rubber for concrete when water makes more sense

[median heath]

Highest return on limestone so it's a massive production boost.
Anywhere you have poly resin to slap into residual rubber it's incredible.

[vapid gorge]

From memory wet produces less than rubber so if you’re in a sitch where you don’t want to import more limestone and have rubber it could help

[median heath]

10 = 9 vs. 6 = 4

Rubber gives you the most.

[hidden scarab]

OHHHHH so it’s more effective

O_O

[median heath]

And it isn't like Rubber (the product) is a rare commodity.

Same reason you switch from Stitched Plate to Adhered 🤷‍♂️

[hidden scarab]

My brain is going so kaboom right now

[vapid gorge]

I mean neither are. I think it’s mostly a choice in logistics

[median heath]

Logistics and just how much you need in the local area 🤷‍♂️

[hidden scarab]

I prefer bolted frame and bolted reinforced plate but Ik everyone hates screws besides me it seems

[vapid gorge]

I think you just said them same thing twice :p

[hidden scarab]

Tho i got 22,000 screws a minute

[median heath]

But in different ways 😉

[vapid gorge]

Oh yeah , I irrationally hate screws

[median heath]

But like.. why?

You enjoy spending more materials to make the same amount of things?

[hidden scarab]

I am fine with it ;o cause less machines

[median heath]

That is their trade.

[hidden scarab]

That and I was going over 3000 machines

Well 3200

So it was already aids

[median heath]

Adhered is 3 Plates = 1 RIP vs. Base/Bolted being 6 = 1

Stitched is 3 1/3rd = 1

[hidden scarab]

Well

Iron is so common I didn’t think to care Xd

[median heath]

True.

[hidden scarab]

People already use iron wire and I don’t use iron wire, I commit an atrocity and use fused copper wire

[median heath]

Bolted being 250/min Screws though I can't do with how I build.

Would be the shorted sushi manifold ever, lol

2 machines per belt 😂

[hidden scarab]

;o I got like 30+ something mk5 belts of screws

It sucked but they look beautiful

[median heath]

90 RIPs/min

iirc it's 2 rows of 10 and a row of 8.

[hidden scarab]

What’s a rip?

Rest In pieces

[median heath]

Reinforced Iron Plate...

the thing we've been talking about for the past 2 minutes, lol

[hidden scarab]

Jee it’s almost like when people acronym they should explain the acronym and not just assume I know lol

[median heath]

Almost like the wiki has a page on them 🙃

[hidden scarab]

I never looked? Again assuming

Lol abit rude but okay

[median heath]

Acronym complaint?
Let's hit them with the storage list:

Non-consumable items worth storing:

Plate, RIP, Beam, EIB
Pipe, Rod, ECR
CSheet, ASheet, Plastic, Rubber
Frame, HMF, FMF
Wire, QW, Cable
Crystal, Osc
CB, HSC, AIL
Rotor, Stator, Motor, Turbo
Comp, RCU, Super
Casing, Cooling
Concrete, Silica

33 in total.

😉

[hidden scarab]

See that’s better, actual understanding

[median heath]

I am a very understanding person.

Example:
I understand that @vapid gorge is crazy because he doesn't think HOR needs a nerf.

[vapid gorge]

You love screws and you aren’t making them next to the machines that are using them? You monster

[hidden scarab]

90 RIP a min is nice ;o, but this is why I use screws cause I needed 510 RIP a minute

[hidden scarab]

I did >_> but when u got that many machines you can’t just direct input or u use a metric fuckload more space

[median heath]

90 is just for refilling storage.
Other outposts that use RIPs for production chains have more in their lines 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

Put the screw machines under and use a lift

[median heath]

If Heavy Flexible didn't take 390/min per machine I'd probably use it.

[hidden scarab]

That’s what I did basically sort of but in a horizontal manner due to a little cliff

[median heath]

But right now the only thing I use Screws for is Copper Rotor.

[hidden scarab]

I like screws

[vapid gorge]

Layout planning is v important

[hidden scarab]

Sprawl is nice like wolfgrim says

D:<

[median heath]

Real question: How do you make them?

Encased Frame is just...
I can do 10 Manufacturers on a single belt. 😭
I really want to try Flexible though.

[vapid gorge]

I’m glad you’re trying to grow and be more flexible

[hidden scarab]

Steel screws

[median heath]

That's a second "oof" from me. 😦

But we established you're willing to sacrifice resources to save space, so it is in-line with your profile 🙂

[hidden scarab]

Lol everyone builds different

[median heath]

Steel Rod OP.

[hidden scarab]

I don’t like steel rod :C or rods in general

[median heath]

.Versailles. | The Opposite

[vapid gorge]

Remove rods from your game

[median heath]

^ New nameplate for you, lol

[hidden scarab]

I only save space depending how and what I’m doing Xd it’s not consistent

[median heath]

Steel Rod + Base Screw is the most resource-efficient way to make Screws.
Steel Screw being the space-saving method.

[hidden scarab]

I do, the least pain in my ass way ;o

[median heath]

Steel Rod is also the god-send for the base Modular Frame recipe.

[hidden scarab]

O_O screws it is

Bolted frame

340 a min, no rods screws only, steel iron plates only with plastic

[median heath]

This is where you lose me, lol.
If you're willing to bring in an oil product, why not just use Adhered Plate?

[hidden scarab]

Ngl, you got me cause it would of been easier to just do that after I looked at the recipe after I built everything and I was like, fuck it.

[serene burrow]

isn't steel plates with plastic adhered?

[median heath]

Coated Iron Plate + Adhered Iron Plate. 😮

[hidden scarab]

O_O what’s that meannnn

Let me use internet

[median heath]

Coated Iron is Plastic + Ingot = Plate
Adhered is Rubber + Plate = RIP

[serene burrow]

yes, my bad, adhered is rubber

adhered is like half the global resources % of the next best - crazy

[hidden scarab]

Oh I know why I did the steel and plastic, cause I could reduce the conveyors needed LOOOL

I’m at 410km of conveyor I don’t need more

[median heath]

Yooooooo

1 Coated Assembler at 1.2 Clock speed perfectly fits 8 Adhered Assemblers.
Let's gooooooo

[hidden scarab]

Maybe we should measure in miles so I don’t feel as bad for pulling stuff from across the map

O_O

I have done my factory all wrong

[median heath]

Or just 3 fits 20 if you need 75 RIPs/min or higher.

[serene burrow]

1 steel coated fits nicely with 4 adhered... and more resource efficient 🙂

[median heath]

Brings in Steel though.

Coal better spent on other things.

[hidden scarab]

Like?

[median heath]

Steel Pipes.

Aluminium.

[hidden scarab]

But I use oil and iron for that ngl, cause nuclear eventually cancels out oil for energy for me at leas

I’d probably use oil for aluminum set up too in the future

Coke it

[median heath]

Trueeeeee.
If you use Steel Coated but for the ingots you use Coke Steel we're still in a closed Oil + Iron system.

[median heath]

Coke vs. Coal is the only meaningful decision when setting up Aluminium,.

[hidden scarab]

Then again, you can instant scrap and use the coal and sulfuric acid and den just not have to care cause nuclear isn’t as big a deal anymore due to plutonium rods allowing for more nuclear plants, unless u hate the waste

[median heath]

You can do max nuke + 100% Instant Scrap and still have enough sulfur for a couple hundred batteries/min

[hidden scarab]

O_O so why do people complain about sulfur usage all the time? Seems like there’s too much to really matter at that point ;o

[median heath]

Because people don't know how to do math in a game primarily based on doing math 🙃

(and because people do massive turbofuel setups... which routes back to people not knowing how to do math)

[hidden scarab]

Why do math if we can ask u 1million questions ;o 😂

[hidden scarab]

Ohhhhhhh yeah that does it

[median heath]

Because I give genuine answers to genuine questions..
And dumb answers to dumb questions 🙃

[hidden scarab]

Damn well now I wanna restart and play through U6 and build my game again. So much knew knowledge from big brain people on here. Smh dolphin sized brain mofos.

[median heath]

I do a complete HUB0 reset every major update 🤷‍♂️

[hidden scarab]

That’s a good idea, less “my factory broke”

@vapid gorge horizontal meta

Sprawl!

[vapid gorge]

Also because there are fewer nodes and it’s more awkward to use

[hidden scarab]

Yeah :C

[topaz hedge]

it's just a pita. drones help, but unless you're building next to it, it's normally effort to get

I have 330km of belts

[hidden scarab]

I think I got everything less in than you but belts, I got 410km belts that’s all but idk if that’s even a good thing lol

[topaz hedge]

probably not. embrace trains

[hidden scarab]

I think I’ll do what you did and build a lot of trains.

That is very smart

[topaz hedge]

if it's possible. they are bulky

[hidden scarab]

I am fine with size, I build wide. And long. Just… not upwards.

[topaz hedge]

if you've got everything all centrally located in one area I don't find trains that useful unless it's to bring in raw resources.

[hidden scarab]

I like the idea of bringing in ore and raw items to one location

[topaz hedge]

which they're good for. like the bulk of my factory is the grasslands, but I'm only using the caterium, sulfur, and limestone nodes there locally.. and the water wells.

everything else comes from elsewhere. probably not the most efficient since I'm bringing copper and steel by train vs making it there but

[hidden scarab]

I believe in whatever your doing probably makes sense, I’ve seen your factory working at a solid 45-50fps lololololol my eyes hurt from it

I loved the trains so much tho O_O that was my favorite part man

[topaz hedge]

thankyou

imagine actually building this.. o.O I think the wiki could use an update

[median heath]

Oof

I could see DPF getting removed in 1.0 tbh.

[topaz hedge]

But it could still be used for power with packagers midgame. or for more jetpack fuel.

[median heath]

Simpler to just run Diluted and add a packager somewhere on the line.

Given my personal guess is that SAM will bring a bunch of alts with it, I'd also guess they will trim some of the "useless" alts (Biocoal, for example) so they don't have to add more pods to the map.
🤷‍♂️

But that is just me.

[soft scarab]

I wouldn’t be surprised if some of those alts wound up in the MAM like turbofuel and compacted did in U6

[median heath]

Both still require drives 🤷‍♂️

[soft scarab]

But I agree I think the “make diluted packaged fuel and unpackage it for power” trick isn’t the kind of gameplay they want to provide in 1.0

[median heath]

Poly is the one that got the drive requirement removed.

[soft scarab]

Oh they do? I didn’t actually check

[median heath]

Yeah. They are just drive + direct unlock.
Which I would like to see more of tbh.

Still go get drives, but do so with purpose instead of "and now random..."

[soft scarab]

I mean I could also see that being temporary and them changing it in the future to be normal materials to unlock

[median heath]

I like the drive part because it encourages the exploration.
Which is their main point in U6.

[cinder silo]

Speaking of drive, my explorer seems to have fallen through the world.

[plush girder]

Hi! Not sure it's the right channel but I'm actually running out of power in late game
I got power from oil (but I do basic Plastic and Rubber, no alt recipes)
I tried to mess up with nuclear but I really don't like to have waste…

So… Here is the real question: What would be the best way to get power from oil? Receipes, … I think I need something like 40GW (and I actually have like 15GW but I don't want more Plastic, … I already have too much, or I can rebuild my Plastic/Rubber factories)
I've heard you can get 20GW with one node but I don't get how… I use like 14 nodes actually and I hardly get 15GW…

[cinder silo]

Yup, I'm not getting that explore back, time to load the auto save 🤦‍♂️

[plush girder]

Known bug in update 5 (+wrong channel)

[cinder silo]

I'm on Ex, so still an issue.

[median heath]

If you're doing nuclear with waste... you're choosing to have waste.
Also "late-game" 40 GW is... light.

Simplest large-scale oil power is using Blenders and Diluted Fuel.

[plush girder]

Well I simply tried Nuclear since I thought you could recycle it and no 🤷🏻‍♂️
Hm… I thought there was something with Polymer Resin and Turbo Fuel which I don't use

[cinder silo]

you need tier 8 particle enrichment for nuclear waste reprocessing, I'd personally not turn on nukes without it.

[plush girder]

I'm on Tier 8 and you can't recycle Plutonium

[cinder silo]

Ahh no, well if you're burning plutonium instead of sinking it, you have a self induced nuclear problem 🙂

[plush girder]

You can't burn it...
Anyway, so if anyone has a good recipe for Power from Oil I would take it, the Wiki usually gives good tips but not for Oil Power

[topaz hedge]

nuclear is the way

just don't burn plutonium unless you want waste.

[plush girder]

Or unless you wan't to play the game as it should be played (I'm talking about Plutonium Waste)

[median heath]

Like I said. Blenders with Diluted Fuel.

(And you sink Plutonium Rods to eliminate Uranium Waste)

Max Uranium has no waste and is like 600 GW.

[topaz hedge]

Why make plutonium waste if you don't have to?

[median heath]

Max Nuclear has Plutonium Waste at a rate that will cause issues after like 3,000 in-game hours, and produces 1.13 TW

Both are completely fine because you probably won't make it to 3k+ hours on your save if I had to bet 🤷‍♂️

But also a waste-free 600 GW is usually more than enough power.

[plush girder]

Well I'm already 300 hours but I guess I'll restart a new save later yes
But I don't get it… How can you have no waste when there is waste…
I mean, ok you use Uranium Waste > Plutonium Rod
But burning Plutonium Rod > Plutonium Waste

[topaz hedge]

uranium -> uranium fuel rod = power + uranium waste -> plutonium fuel rod -> awesome sink

[median heath]

Awesome Sink doesn't have an output so where are you getting Plut Waste after sinking?

[plush girder]

Ah fck The Awesome Sink, I thought you were talking about using it in a Nuclear Plant (my game isn't in english so…)

[median heath]

Cheers 👍

[plush girder]

I didn't know you could sink Plutonium Rod… Is it a bug?
Btw thank you then, I guess I'll mess with Uranium 🤷🏻‍♂️

[unborn ermine]

Actual feature

You gotta work for it though

[median heath]

It's a gift from the devs.

You can "settle" for 600 GW ish, or you can deal with waste for 1.13 TW.

[topaz hedge]

you could also make 600GW, and have your plutonium reactors on standby until you need them too.

[plush girder]

Well I think I'll only use one Uranium node, I don't know how much it can provide but I don't want to map to be radioactive we like exploring the world with my friend 🙂

[median heath]

Tools will tell you exactly how much it can provide.

[plush girder]

Yeah don't worry I was just saying that I probably won't reach 600GW, I really don't need them actually

[topaz hedge]

72 reactors with alts from 1 node. ( mk3 @ 250% )

[south walrus]

Which should I pick?

[unborn ermine]

Going with the oil talk in #old-questions-and-help atm
I think in the future I will keep my starter setup for fuel, but split the 300 crude with blenders and diluted fuel.
~~Goes from 200 base fuel minus 20 for packaged fuel, to a 120(normal fuel recipe) and 180 blenders.

Keeps the setup the same, minus some extra waste from the starter build, but gets me 320/min fuel still doing the packaged fuel over time, but a nice 300/min fuel for gens instead of 180/min.~~
I wasnt thinking big picture, and forgot an alt in my planning. Can do much more

Best part all I have to do for my current setup is remove some refineries and extend a pipe, then rebuild the fuel gen array.

[unborn ermine]

For #satisfactory convo

You get that data after clicking a production chain

[frosty owl]

... Just treat the steel beams as compacted screws so you can fit everything on the belt and have the screws made where the manufacturers are?

[sterile shard]

please, explain; I am confusion

[median heath]

I don't use Steel Screw though 😉

[fringe pawn]

I've tried the others, I'm sticking with heavy encased frame. I could only see myself using heavy flexible frame in some gigantic endgame factory after you've already done all your progression. For progression gameplay, heavy encased frame is just sooooo good.

[median heath]

Flexible is anti-gigantic build for me though given Screw throughput needed.

[fringe pawn]

Yeah, given that you probably hit the limits of oil in the biggest of builds, I'm not sure where it makes much sense.

[median heath]

Not about oil limits, but alright.

[fringe pawn]

I've only considered screws for copper rotor, and I use steel beams as described for that. Otherwise I don't think I've ever even automated the default HMF recipe.

On my first playthrough I got heavy encased frame through dumb luck and that was that.

Default computer recipe is one I suffered through on the #off-topic-tech server. Made a 5/minute factory with it, and it only makes me want to immediately explore for HDDs versus ever using it again. Plus you find computers at crash sites.

[median heath]

Yeah. Base Comp sucks.

I exclusively use base Super though, in contrast 😂

[fringe pawn]

Base super is fine, it's what I've been running on the tech talk server. It's propelled us to finishing the last elevator delivery, in fact.

I see the appeal of OC super, too. Resource efficiency bedamned, it'd be easy to add some supercomputer production to the FMF and turbo motor factory.

I even made that computer factory with the default screw recipe, too, because we were that short on alts. In retrospect I definitely should have gone HDD hunting, but I wanted to see what default gameplay feels like.

I did convert it to cast screws later. I like the bit of deck space it opened up. It did just enough to make it not feel so cramped.

[median heath]

I would do OC Super if there was more Bauxite.
So if they add a baux node to the Spire Coast it's something I will revisit in overall world outpost design.

[fringe pawn]

Bauxite in the spire coast would be interesting, because otherwise bauxite essentially exists as a band going through the middle of the map.

[median heath]

Aye.

[south walrus]

YOOOO I finally got it!!!

[magic island]

it'd be a good spot for it. baux isn't supposed to be super convenient, but northern regions could stand to have it a LITTLE handier

[fringe pawn]

Inevitably it'll be up on one of the high cliffs

[median heath]

I'm fine with this.

Baux is my only limiting factor on my world design atm.
So +1 node would go a long way.

[fringe pawn]

Heh, for janky alt scenarios, on the tech talk server I have a silicon HSC and default HSC factory each running next to each other. It was just the easiest option for plugging in existing things that multiple people had built. THey're feeding automated speed wiring.

[median heath]

Silicon HSC is

[verbal seal]

What's the fastest ramp to use for trains? 1m ramp?

[median heath]

2m is fine

[verbal seal]

Ty

[wind path]

what am i missing, why is this not running on 100%? its got an empty output and been running for ages // thanks a lot in advance :)

[median heath]

Mods?
Multiplayer?
Dedicated Server?

[wind path]

thank you. its on a dedicated server, no mods, 2 people logged in

[median heath]

Multiplayer Broken. Plz Fix.

UI bug 🤷‍♂️

[wind path]

thank you :) i was confused because 16 coal burners use 16 * 7.14 which is roughly 114 and i make 120 compacted coal and still generators turning off/on at the end of the manifold

[median heath]

Pre feed

You want power manifolds to be about REfilling the machines, not filling them.

[wind path]

i did initially yet the started turning off/on an hour later which leads me to the compacted coal. must not be enough if theyre running out

[median heath]

Possible

[wind spade]

Maximise doesn't optimise for raw resources (yet)

[unborn ermine]

Thats why I like to separate weird recipes like that into two sets of factories on the site.

[wind spade]

Beta does optimise but it's unreliable atm

[median heath]

Hard-code it to never use base silica if cheap silica is selected as available.

😉😉😉😉😉😉

[wind spade]

No thx xD

[soft scarab]

Wait if maximize doesn’t optimize for raw resources what does it optimize for?

[median heath]

Doesn't really have to optimize because the function is maximize.

You then take the number that maximize spits out and type it in as target if you want things optimized.

[soft scarab]

Interesting. I guess that applies in cases where two different approaches/recipe combos would have the same yield and couldn’t exceed it, even if one approach uses fewer resources, gotcha

[median heath]

Exactly.
Like you can max aluminium no matter what silica recipe you use, the system being set to max doesn't have to care.

He is working to make it care though.

[silent storm]

is the fuel consumption rate for fuel generators equation on the wiki correct?

a clock that should be takeing 7 and 2/3 fuel/m is only taking 4.02

[mystic moon]

Wiki is correct

Never overclock gens

[silent storm]

oh i fixed it

its not an overclock in this case its an underclock

[astral agate]

how does split 5 into 9

[tropic hawk]

With great care

[astral agate]

well, technically, 4.5

and i just answered my own question

nvm

[snow dove]

splitting nine into 5, you would split into 3 sets of 3 then split each set into 9 sets of 1, then merge 5 of those.

[astral agate]

other way around mate

thanks though

[tropic hawk]

You want to split 4.5 I/min into nine outputs? Sheesh.

What process are you running?

[astral agate]

well, it was actually 540/m into 9 outputs, but, screws to reinforced plates

[tropic hawk]

540->9 = 60/each

[astral agate]

yep, i got it already, thanks though

[rancid sentinel]

Im trying to make an optimized 1 floor screw factory. it seems like 1 node at 270/min of iron can do 1000 screws. I had it at 1080 but realized it ended up weird for piping them out. curious if anyone else has suggestions. My plan is for a single floor factories for a single type of part and add floors as we need more of that part

So scaling my factory upwards instead of horizontal

[tropic hawk]

Only 780 iron to max screws?

As in 780 iron ore -> ??? Screws

[rancid sentinel]

Where 780 come from?

We only have mk3 conveyors

Sorry I don’t quite follow your question

[tropic hawk]

Whoops, misread your numbers...

[tropic hawk]

I'm asking if you only have iron to work with for the screw factory, and you are trying to maximize the amount?

[rancid sentinel]

This particular design I was only using iron yes

I don’t have a lot of coal readily coming in for Steel yet

[tropic hawk]

Then 1080 is the physical maximum for screws.

[rancid sentinel]

Kk ty

[tropic hawk]

However if you add water and coal... Whole 'nother story.

[rancid sentinel]

Is that more efficient and better numbers?

Maybe I’ll look into that. Not sure I have all the alternates though

This factory I do want to use into late game. So maybe I should do that approach

[tropic hawk]

Do you have refineries yet?

[rancid sentinel]

Ya

We working towards phase 3 name

So we have their 5/6

Most unlocked

[tropic hawk]

One moment...

How much coal and water could you dedicate?

[rancid sentinel]

I would be going to get it. So as much as I needed. That being said I want the floor of this factory to be the smallest possible where the math makes sense and then expand it upwards as I need more.

Ie each floor will be a copy of the floor below expecting the same input and outputs

[tropic hawk]

So if we focus on 270 iron and an undefined input of water and coal...

[mint sedge]

This comment confuses me, as I understood fuel consumption to be directly proportional to output i.e. linear. Apart from using shards, what's the disadvantage to overclocking generators? Does fuel some how get used less efficiently?

[mystic moon]

Fuel consumption isn't linear in generatord

[median heath]

Consumption is linear with power, yes.
But power is exponential when you change clock speed. So when you over or underclock a gen you completely fuck the numbers into imprecision oblivion.
There isn't a clock speed you can set it to that results in whole number consumption anymore, so you'll always have to overproduce to actually satisfy consumption demand.

Plus there are just... far better things to use shards for.

[astral agate]

overclock bio gens

[mint sedge]

Ok so apart from shard use and non-whole numbers, no other downsides?

[wind spade]

isn't that enough downsides lol? 😄

[tropic hawk]

You could produce at the max 16200 screws/min from 270 iron/min

[tropic hawk]

You have to run a ton of numbers

[rancid sentinel]

damm ok cool

[vocal tundra]

People still overclocking generators?

Can you not see the disgusting numbers when you put the shards in

[wind spade]

246.2288% clock speed 😛

[vocal tundra]

The percentage is a disgusting number

[wind spade]

it's easy to remember 🤷‍♂️

[vocal tundra]

True

Id just rather not waste powershards on a generator

3 power shards just for double the output

Aint worth it

[versed violet]

Unless its nukes.

[vocal tundra]

Yeah ill accept nukes because atleast the number isnt awful

[versed violet]

If you do not want to build an awful equal-splitter, or need to be able to turn off some generators, its more convenient to have half the generators with 50 stacks of rods.

[cinder silo]

My QW factory is outputting eight belts of 450 QW, depending on my target, does anyone have any tips on smart splitting/merging to allow those outputs to vary and self balance for distribution?

[versed violet]

side tip: don't ship qw around, ship ingots and make qw where it is needed

[mint sedge]

450=270+120+60

i.e. use the belts to divide and combine the rates

[versed violet]

or 480 with off-side 60 belt split in two, one merged back one forward.

[cinder silo]

The QW plant is right in the middle of where the products will be used.

[versed violet]

can you simply manifold it, or must be 450 exactly?

[cinder silo]

The build is shown here (one floor of two), 2160 ore is taken in, 720 ingots produced on site creating 3600 QW, that's why each floor outputs four belts of 450,

The outputs of 450 I'm trying to figure a way of sharing resources between them in a manner that makes sense so more can go down one out belt if needed, so I have fewer required outputs, tbh it's looking like I might need to just do pass through to stores at the destination end because of spaghetti.

Due to open space I have storage cans on site which I don't normally use, if I take it as four pairs, it might work to have each able to overflow in to the storage of its partner and vice versa, beyond that I'm not sure.

[versed violet]

do you have multiple independent inputs, or are they sectioned? Eg. are you expecting each input to vary as shipments arrive, or there would be eg. 2 sets of 4 inputs?

You could use smart splitter to prioritize some of the ingot to quickwire constructors to have 'guaranted output' belts and split those symetrically to all 8 outputs. then merge in remaining belts.

[cinder silo]

The factory output is eight 450 belts, but for example my computer/super computer factory needs an intake of 630

[versed violet]

do you need the outputs be proportional to input, or can you just pick which factories have priority?

[cinder silo]

I'm mostly aiming to use what the factory puts out, without stalling it, thus negating its build amount, I just underestimated how many outputs I ended up with, four groups of machines ended up outing to eight 450 belts because they can't do four 900's

Trying to get spares to flow in to other lines seems to make sense until I hit max capacity, I'm just not sure of a good solution that won't create a huge spaghetti.

I didn't think very far ahead when I decided to funnel two pure & a normal caterium node in to the factory, the place itself is surprisingly compact considering how much open space I left inside.

[versed violet]

it should work correctly, given you have some breahting space on belts (480 vx 450). Just use 'full belt' to whatever needs it, and put overflow on it. Gather the overflows as 'new' output.

[cinder silo]

My lack of a distribution solution is shown here, this entire end isn't built yet.

I might have to get the other caterium users built and come back to distribution, trying to make something flexible ahead of time is making my head hurt.

[sand epoch]

#drones :)

[cinder silo]

No point using drones to move items 50-200 metres though.

Since I sent my save, the spire pipeline went up, quickwire is now being produced & a huge refinery is part built 😛

[terse sorrel]

How many modular frames could be a good amount for a starter factory ?

I'm thinking 10-15, with the bolted frame alt recipe

[cinder silo]

In a starter factory, damn that early on I actually had closer to 5 let alone 15.

[terse sorrel]

Ah ? I may be more advanced than I think

[cinder silo]

Probably, I tend to consider the starter factory to be either the initial on the grass machines or the first cardboard box full of machines using 60's or 120's 🙂

[median heath]

135 or you're memeing

[terse sorrel]

I'm trying to make a lot of modular frames, for my versatile framework factory

[median heath]

[terse sorrel]

Then this is not a starter factory, my bad

[median heath]

Bolted Frame though... 🤢

[terse sorrel]

Either way, what amount of modular frames/min could he considered okay-ish ?

[cinder silo]

We all have ideas on what we consider to be starter*.

[terse sorrel]

Is it the screws ? Worry not, for I can craft steel screws

[median heath]

However many you need for HMFs + However many you want going to storage = Literal Answer

[terse sorrel]

In that case 40 should be a good number

I need my precious 8 HMF

[median heath]

Only 8?

[terse sorrel]

Hmm

i think so

HMF are a real bitch to manufacture

[median heath]

Gotta bump that number up.

[terse sorrel]

Make it a 10, then

[median heath]

2.8125 doesn't really go into 10 that well..

[terse sorrel]

I was thinking of the regular non-alt recipe

[median heath]

Why would you do that to yourself...

[terse sorrel]

That 1000 screws, 50 modular frames, 300 pipes, and 100 encased beams

[magic island]

multiples of 4.5 make modframes and heavy modframes (and the steps to produce them) come out to pretty clean numbers

[median heath]

45-81 rule

Less 4.5 and more 5.625

[terse sorrel]

I realized I can't afford my 10 HMF, I need more pipes

Eh, I'll look for more steel later, that's future me problem

[median heath]

You're still missing a 0 😉

[terse sorrel]

Elaborate ?

[median heath]

Instead of 10...

[terse sorrel]

I am so sorry if it was a joke omg

Wait

100HMF ?

[median heath]

Now you're talkin

[terse sorrel]

What torture bs is that

[median heath]

?

I do between 112.5-135

[terse sorrel]

I wouldn't wish even my worst ennemies to craft 100 HMF

[terse sorrel]

Teach me.

[median heath]

Just build 4 of these.

10 man's can be fed by a single belt (Heavy Encased)

Bleh on Bolted Frame.
Just use the base recipe with Steel Rod.

[terse sorrel]

Gotcha

[cinder silo]

I'd have to have a catwalk going down that above the splitters for the rule of cool 😄

[median heath]

Oh I do. That picture is just the proof of concept that it works.

[cinder silo]

❤️

[terse sorrel]

Actually It might be a little
Too compact

I like to have my belts in sight at all times, to monitor the flow rate of the belts

[cinder silo]

My HMF production will likely be done using a very similar build, because it is proven.

This room uses the same principle, just a little more spread out for computers, super computers & radio control units, I'm getting ever closer to being able to switch it on.

[terse sorrel]

Yay !

[vapid gorge]

per minute or by hand?

[terse sorrel]

Per minute

[vapid gorge]

Here I am excited to start on a 315 pm hmf factory XD

[terse sorrel]

Lmao.

Sometimes I wonder how any of y'all stay sane with this much work

[vapid gorge]

Problem solving fun!

[terse sorrel]

Yes ! But what do you do when solving problems causes more problems ?

[median heath]

When I do 135 it's with specific purpose. All of them are allocated.

Him doing 315 is insanity.

[terse sorrel]

It's
Virtual insanity

[vapid gorge]

Pure craftsmanship 😛

[vapid gorge]

Part of the excitement is getting almost all the resources on site and having to import very little

[terse sorrel]

Indeed, it's easy when your factory is big enough to produce 300 HMF

That's like 30 000 screws but aye

[magic island]

honestly above a certain scale of production my brain starts to rebel because its just endless repetitive manifolds. the sweet-spot for me fun-wise is just to work with a few nodes per resource

[vapid gorge]

Mostly building tall but I'm thinking even that way it'll be less than 500m from any node to production.

[median heath]

Sushi Manifolds. Embrace the life.

[terse sorrel]

My biggest factory – yet works with 8 nodes lol

[vapid gorge]

Spreadsheets and planners help. And breaking it into segments so you can work back and forth on diff parts

[cinder silo]

Man if using that many screws, I'd hate to see the stack of belt spaghetti.

[median heath]

Max Screws Build

1.4 Million per minute

[cinder silo]

If I tried a max screw build I think my pc would auto-defenestrate.

[vapid gorge]

Oh my 315 hmf factory makes no screws

at least the current plans. It's possible I might change my mind but prob not

[cinder silo]

Building an oil refinery on four floors might not be my brightest move.

[unborn ermine]

Im just getting into oil(to get the space elevator parts made) and im redoing my base area, steel and such.
Going to be pumping out 900 steel to start
Then doing the aluminium shop trick to get belts and a bit of tech settled. doing 1800 instead right after.

gunna be a fair bit of wiggle room for production

[cinder silo]

3600 Oil will be converted in to 1200 plastic & 1200 rubber here. 60 refineries per, and another 60 to reprocess the Hor.

[unborn ermine]

Surprised you arent going for recycled.
Just saving some pain?

[cinder silo]

Could say that, and I never worked the numbers.

Recycled both ways would produce twice the materials, hmm depends if I could make the fuel from .... crap!

[unborn ermine]

How many refineries do you have planned atm?

[cinder silo]

need water for the dilute from hor , and there is 0 here.

[unborn ermine]

Basic (recycle only) is like 214 refineries

output being 2000 even for both

[cinder silo]

I have both the recycled rubber & plastic recipes, I really don't feel like piping water up to this place, the hor production from the initial rubber & plastic is 1800, that would yield 3600 fuel when put through the blenders, 36 blenders, so 3600 water needs piped lol.

[median heath]

Truck it in. 😉

[cinder silo]

3600 water per minute on trucks.

[median heath]

3 stations. You'll be fine.

3600 Water per minute being Unpackaged 😉

[cinder silo]

Still crunching numbers, it has to be a better approach than having 60 refineries sinking coke.

[unborn ermine]

Plugged your build into tools using the recycled and diluted blend
Thirsty build.

Thats 8 full mk2 pipes of water commin from somewhere

[cinder silo]

My build has 60 refineries producing plastic, the other 60 on rubber, 1200 ea, you plugged all in doing rubber initially, there is less hor from the 60 plastics, the recyc recipe would swap plastic for 2x rubber & vice versa

[unborn ermine]

Yeah I just did what the thing wanted to churn out.

[cinder silo]

Thats why I calculated significantly less water 😄

[unborn ermine]

Since its maximising both recipes for plastic/rubber yields this

[cinder silo]

40 refineries each in my build then to take 30 plastic/rubber each and toss out 60.

Hmm, only 2400 fuel would get used out of 3600.

[wind spade]

add alternate hor and you get tons of plastic/rubber

[cinder silo]

Changing the build as is doubles the plastic/rubber yield and accounts for most of the outputted hor, hmm, if I blended only to 2400 fuel and had the rest as coke for electrode circuits.

I'll revisit the refinery in the future, I know I can do more, right now I just need it working.

[unborn ermine]

fun fact, my basic as hell starter recycled rubber/plastic (300/min crude) factory eats 600MW of power exactly.
Doing the "optimised" recipe with HOR alt and blenders is just a tad over 3x power usage. (not including water)
The best part though, blenders are using 600MW

[cinder silo]

I didn't think things through when sent I eight pipelines of oil from the spire to here.

[unborn ermine]

[cinder silo]

On top of that, It seems I don't need anywhere near the rubber or plastic.

[unborn ermine]

"yet" *

[cinder silo]

I just went herp a derp, Ooooh! lets harvest all this, whoops.

Found a use for the surplus QW at least, it seems to be the most productive at spewing circuit boards.

[north echo]

How do you make these kind of graphics?

[unborn ermine]

Sorry if im a little late to reply, the SCIM interactive map (link in #welcome) lets you upload your saves to it and you can see your base.
You can do a bunch of other stuff with your saves as well (editing and deleting stuff too).

[soft scarab]

This is from https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production

[unborn ermine]

Oh whoops

I just woke up so I was thinking like an idiot

I was half right

it IS in the welcome channel at least

[alpine moat]

Does anyone have a fool-proof water feedback loop design that works? Seems like my waste water recirc loop always ends up getting filled up no matter how many valves i put on the network.

[vocal tundra]

You mean a VIP junction?

[alpine moat]

oh man, that is amazing! thanks, cant wait to try 🙂

[vocal tundra]

Np

[alpine moat]

Is the design the same with mk2 pumps and pipe?

[vocal tundra]

Yeah i think so

[alpine moat]

OK, I was not sure if this design exploited the required head amount on the top branch

I think electronic valves driven from fluid resi level would be swell too

[calm valley]

I'm in the process of making my first "big" power plant and the current plan is 900 Oil > 1200 Turbofuel using HOR, diluted fuel, and turbo blend. Now I'm overthinking it and questioning if using the exact amount of oil to turbofuel is best practice or if I should use for example 1000 oil and package/sink the excess fuel.

[median heath]

You lost me at intentionally using Turbofuel.

[timber sparrow]

What's wrong with Turbofuel

[median heath]

Normal fuel is more than enough to get you to nuclear.

Turbofuel's primary use is making bullets.

[timber sparrow]

oh... yeah. True

I tapped the west oil fields and ran 600 plastic 600 rubber and the rest into regular fuel

1800 m3 oil/m

[calm valley]

tbh I'm mainly doing this because I like the idea, not even bumping up against the current power limit

[timber sparrow]

That's just more stuff to dismantle later

[golden mist]

but if you dont want to deal with nuclear... I prefer the HOR > Diluted Fuel > Std Turbofuel lineup then turn the leftover polymer resin into plastic and rubber

can gert 1200 TF with 540 oil that way

[calm valley]

I guess regardless of recipes or types of fuel, should I overprovision the fuel production or use the exact calculator numbers?

[median heath]

If you don't want to deal with 600 GW...
You can still easily get 80 GW out of normal Diluted Fuel.

[golden mist]

Never use exact numbers in anything, you will never get them

[median heath]

This is the dumbest thing anyone has ever said in this channel.

[golden mist]

No it isnt, over-supply slightly or lag and other inefficiencies will keep you from getting 100%

[median heath]

Yes, it is.
Everything I and many other people do is in exact numbers and it all works fine.

[golden mist]

It works but it isnt 100%, has never been since I started playing way back before trains

[median heath]

Welcome to U5/6
It all works.
This isn't U1 anymore.

Been playing since they hinted at Powered Walls.
So the whole "I've been here" is irrelevant.

[golden mist]

well witrh U4 I could only get 765 ipm out of a 2 segment belt, even when it was the only thing running, so unless they fixed that.

mk 5 ofc

[median heath]

Just because mk5s can't do a full 780 doesn't mean production lines can't be done in exact numbers...

Do exact numbers.
Just don't shove 780 onto 1 belt.
Simple.

[golden mist]

well then tell that to everyone I've had to help figure out why the 12th building in their production line was starving when they had "780" items coming in

then throw away mk 5 belts?

[median heath]

Because they don't prefeed their systems.

Also why would you throw away a mk5?

[timber sparrow]

prefeed?

[golden mist]

I helped them prefeed they slowly get behind

[median heath]

Oh no, can't do 780.
So just do 750.
Don't throw the belt out lmfao

[golden mist]

you said dont use 780 on one belt

I tell people that too but they dont listen

[timber sparrow]

you have to manually fill machine inputs?

[golden mist]

you can but it isnt necessary

[timber sparrow]

if you just wait long enough eventually it fills, no?

[cinder silo]

From mines I started just split the 780 in to two belts to enforce 780, only merge right at the destination input.

[median heath]

People not listening doesn't mean switch to telling people bullshit like "never do exact numbers"

[golden mist]

ok guess we need to agree to disagree

[timber sparrow]

exact numbers have typically worked for me

[median heath]

Why would we agree to disagree about you spreading false information??