If I build that much
#math-and-meta
cedar mica
tight phoenix
well, you got a huge project ahead of you, good luck, I hope you won't get bored/tired!
however, I just realized there is not enough uranium on the map for you to produce that much!
cedar mica
Seems even a 1000 is enough for 500 hours, with 700 waste a minute
tight phoenix
stop me if Ioh wait, I didn't take in account alt recipes sorry ^^
wow those are efficient, with alts you need 600/m uranium for 28/m rods, without alts you would need 3150/m uranium
tight phoenix
yeah, a lot of mats in general for all the parts, especially the control rods
wind spade
if you are looking for most efficient power source, then coal is your best bet
glacial hemlock
I think instead of go big with nuclear at once, why not develop in stages? then you could use nuclear to power up your nuclear.
crude girder
dude you guys see that?
smart/prog splitters might finally be saved
can someone test it ingame
fierce ruin
fierce ruin
thats programable one
crude girder
same difference
wind spade
so they work as I thought, splitting items 1:1 to every output where the item is listed?
fierce ruin
yes
honest helm
what do they do now when one output is blocked/stacked up?
sand garnet
probably only feeds to the other output until that's blocked too
honest helm
nice
sand garnet
keyword: 'probably'
honest helm
last version I tested they were stuck
kindred narwhal
best would be, if the item gets destroyed so it does not block the rest...
honest helm
like they HAVE TO alter the exists and when one was blocked it will wait till the predefined output can take the current item
sand garnet
when did you test @honest helm
honest helm
multiple weeks ago
sand garnet
because a new update for them came out otday so it could be different now
honest helm
thats why I asked
sand garnet
fingers crossed
honest helm
did not want to install windows just for a hope
sand garnet
to be fair, even with this change, I expect it to still just be an extension of the time it takes until belts get clogged and the the thing shuts down
but at least 'it's something'
fierce ruin
whats the real usage of smart/prog splitters? Without ability to "hide" or delete item they are useless
honest helm
we definitly need a machine to destroy items
fierce ruin
there is one - nice for testing outputs
honest helm
what? what is it called?
fierce ruin
its in mod
tight phoenix
I only use smart splitter for my biomass/biofuel chain, which has player-controlled/limited input
honest helm
I mean vanilla, not mods
tight phoenix
well obviously it must follow the same rules as what the player is allowed to manually delete
honest helm
there is stuff you cannot delete?
honest helm
oh ok, not there yet, waiting for trains to work
crude girder
@fierce ruin inventory sorting
hot cargo
Holy crap - you can do more than one item per output on the smart splitter now?
hot cargo
So its a different machine - damn. That in a HDD?
I dont think I have those, and all my HUB tiers are empty
sand garnet
@hot cargo put caterium in the MAM and research it > unlock it in hub > get a lot of stuff you dont have, like the bladerunners
hot cargo
^ did that - those are great
I need to look again, but was pretty sure I did not have programmable spitters
obsidian granite
You need to do the Caterium Electronics milestone, I think it's in Tier 4 or 5 (may need to scroll to the right)
.... after the research in MAM
earnest orchid
Greeny still no?
• Smart/Programmable Splitters should now use more than one output when there are multiple outputs with a matching rule
wind spade
I mean, how does that help you with the issue that stuff can get backed up?
if we are talking about mixed belts
crude girder
At least now I can make a working inventory sorter
wind spade
yeah, but that doesn't change the fact that inventory sorter is the only really useful usage of smart splitters
earnest orchid
What should the splitters actually do for them to be useful?
wind spade
I can't think of anything to make them useful. Splitters in Factorio work because belt has two sides and each side can be independent, essentially acting like two belts. Splitters in satisfactory, not so much. I mean for inventory sorting or prevention of wrong items in truck stations, they are pretty good, but other than that, they aren't good (and we also don't need them that much)
obsidian granite
I can think of a situation
say you want to run a single long belt, you could run a T4 belt, with 2 or 3 different items to travel that distance, and when you get to the other end use T3 or T2 belts into the machines.... (depends on ratios/requirements etc)
You can also ship mixed items via truck or train, filter them on the output to the correct location
sand garnet
smart splitters can only work with perfect production amounts or when you underproduce
as long as we dont get a trashcan in some sort of function smart splitters will never really work
fringe citrus
i'd like if they made the smart splitters do 'go wherever programmed to before going to *' so that * direction could be overflow and never clog so long as overflow is large enough
pale jetty
you mean making "* any" actually be anything with prioritizing any other output that was selected for a specific item
fringe citrus
Yeah. Like choosing wire on any side gets priority and the wire would only pass thru * if the wire outputs are full. Like hoppers in minecraft. Tries to go down, if it's full it goes forward
pale jetty
yeah that would make them actually "smart" splitters 😂
topaz ingot
And we clearly learnt that smart splitters are actually dumb splittes yewt
dim flume
when does it become more efficient to build another baes to make something, rather than truck something in, or use belts?
i have oil and im needing to bring it in, or build a separate base far away. for oil products.
sullen cloud
Imo it’s efficient to build power plants close to the nodes.
And the blue crater‘s could be a good place to erect a factory for a couple of items. Only bauxite and sulfur are quite far away
grave basalt
Hi how do you use the satisfactory calculator im not understanding the production planner
pulsar stratus
@grave basalt just click the add item button
peak wedge
I already helped him :3
pulsar stratus
Wonderful :)
glacial hemlock
The idea of manufacturing intermediate items locally is to reduce the overall belt length or logistics complexity
It is like 'what if there is only one giant Starbucks on the earth' hypothesis
misty light
How should I make a 4 to 5 line balancer? Because when looking around I don't see any 4 to 5 balancer schemes
wind spade
manifold
wind spade
why not?
misty light
Because I have already manifolds but theyr inputs needs to be balanced
misty light
I have 5 inputs on each side so then I have 10 inputs
wind spade
well I doubt their input needs to be balanced. You know how many items you have on the 4 original belts, so you can use those directly for the manifolds
misty light
Then I have to rework my whole factory
I have 8 belts but on each I have 573.75 items
wind spade
well then use "open manifold" - manifold what you can and have the rest merged into another manifold
--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--\
--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+---+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--
--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--/
something like this
sullen cloud
Isn’t there any SSS reddit post which you can link for manifolds?
wind spade
there is one that just compares them to balancers
I have some ideas about another post
sullen cloud
well, next one could be about that including the splitter/ merger „inventory“
wind spade
@misty light connect the belts to the first 4, then merge it on the other side and connect it to the last row.
wind spade
my amazing paint skills
misty light
I dont think the belts can handle it
wind spade
why not?
misty light
each manufacturer uses 60 silica
green crescent
why do you need the inputs to be balanced?
wind spade
so, one row of manufacturers needs more than one belt can handle?
misty light
I mean in total
wind spade
so the 5 inputs in total need 4 full belts of silica in total?
misty light
wind spade
so when you asked about 4 to 5 balancer, you actually meant 6 to 5 balancer?
misty light
no?
wind spade
how does 4 to 5 balancer help you with a setup where you have 6 full belts of stuff?
wind spade
and each belt has 560 items on it?
misty light
573.75
wind spade
then you have more silica than you need lol
misty light
to be sure
just to make the 4 rows full whiteout one empty space
and easier startup
wind spade
I suck at paint
but something like this should work
the boxes are manifolds of X machines
and on the right side, there is another 7 box
misty light
hmmmm that looks good
btw like rest of my mega factory has bigger logistical problems wayyyy bigger thats already fully optimized somehow
sullen cloud
time heals all wounds
glacial hemlock
if any single number of the calculator displays more than 780, it is time to divide your manifold.
and if you found yourself needing a balancer for a factory to work, then something might went wrong.
fierce ruin
balancing truck stations input... so far only way im using balancers
wind spade
I don't think that's needed as well
since you know the input of the truck station
so the output will be the same
fierce ruin
more or less... if you use few stations to unload single truckc than it gets a little random - and than Im using balancers (uhh... one for whole game that is really helpfull) to spread that evenly for train wagons
but you dont use trucks
wind spade
underwater trucks lol
fierce ruin
yeah deep sea exploration
wind spade
idk what are the rates there, but I'd just manifold the train platforms 😄
sullen cloud
you should have watched the streams of cazanator
He used several trucks to as a „balancer“, creative concept
sullen cloud
One or several trucks in succession driving past 4 truck stations, thus unloading in every of these stations. The trucks stations feeding a trail n station.
fierce ruin
thats how I imagined it
at screen above I wanted to have equal amount of oil on each of 4 wagons
2 first from left inputs are easy 600+600
sullen cloud
wagons means freight cars?
fierce ruin
and than truck stations, its smth like 750+300+900
yes, sorry
but I dont use it anway
sullen cloud
I am not sure if balancing of freight cars really works in practice. You would also need the exact train travel time
sullen cloud
Nvm, it’s too complicated to explain when typing with a smartphone 😂
fierce ruin
concept was*
glacial hemlock
truck stations and freight platforms are not balancer, instead they are a good overflow splitter.
ionic oracle
how many coal generators can a normal node support?
crude girder
take how much practical yield you can extract from that node, then divide it by 100/9
ionic oracle
ty
summer field
4:3? pretty sure I've seen designs for that.
fallow lily
To clarify, do you need to split a single belt carrying 240 items per minute into two belts, one carrying 180 items per minute, the other carrying 60 items per minute?
glad cradle
I need to take 2, 120 item conveyors (can make into 1 conveyor), and make a line of 180
So yeah
fallow lily
The easiest way to do that would be to split one of the 120 lines into two, and merge one into the other 120 line.
If you have a 240 line, split it into two 120 lines, then use the above steps to get to a 180 line and a 60 line.
fallow lily
Knowing more advanced mathematics doesn't translate directly into solving problems.
It gives you more tools, but learning how to apply those tools is its own skill set.
So, don't feel bad. Consider this a lesson in practical mathematics. :)
glad cradle
ye
I think I just get to lazy on my computer to think problems through
And @summer field
summer field
That should work too. At looks a lot less spagett.
fickle thicket
Question: is there a good tool for planning the layout - like, the actual physical layout - of a factory? Gonna be redoing my main factory a second time and I wanna make sure I plan things out well beforehand
pastel lotus
^ no idea, would be nice though, even like a ghost thing that factorio has
fickle thicket
I've seen some factory floorplans on the subreddit that look like they were made with some form of tool, but I can't figure out what
glad cradle
Alright, this one is confusing, I need to turn, 75 ore into 45 and 30
Will this work?
I think it will
fickle thicket
What's the initial M?
finite sail
A merger as it's fed from a splitter, and that would work
robust vessel
so what's the math like on trains? does having multiple engines help that much? is it recommended? necessary?
fickle thicket
Finished making this factory (at least, it's all running, the outer structure isn't finished yet)
https://satisgraphtory.com/#eW5jeXA%3D
All the outputs are grouped on the right-hand side
sullen acorn
@robust vessel doesn't help on flat surface, but multiple locomotives help large trains go up-ghill
fickle thicket
Produces all iron-only components besides modular frames from three normal iron nodes (ignoring alt. recipes)
robust vessel
thanks @sullen acorn! I assume then that it only makes the trains faster, but single locomotives still work? does the train being full / empty make a difference?
glacial hemlock
@robust vessel check wiki
robust vessel
Looks like you can just add extra locomotives to the back of the train without needing to add extra empty platforms. Nice. 
inland ice
Has anyone calculated the requirements for all ressources? I have a sheet at home, but I'm not sure this is right
sullen acorn
@robust vessel trains don't make it faster. they will always have the same top speed.
It just gives it more oomph. will get the max speed quicker.
tight phoenix
but trains can go beyond their top speed when helped by gravity though
sullen acorn
well yes, but that's gravity. gravity is evil black magic
marble tapir
if i cant get the exact ratio for what im doing, is it better to produce slightly more or slightly less than what I actually need.
For example if I need to produce 168.75, and adjusting the overclock I can get 169.2 or 168?
tight phoenix
what's the problem in producing slightly more?
marble tapir
that's what i'm asking.
Over produce - machines turn off every once in a while because resources have backed up
Under produce, machines turn off every once in a while because there are not enough resources for a fraction of a second.
just wasnt sure which was more ideal.
marble tapir
thanks
vernal birch
what's the best way of merging 6.5 600ipm belts into 5 780 ipm belts?
wind spade
or just don't merge at all and make 7 manifolds 😄
vernal birch
this is the one time i can't use manifolds only >.< it would screw with my trains
wind spade
you can manifold train stations as well 🤔
2 inputs, 2 outputs - ideal for manifolding high numbers
vernal birch
my trains take exactly how much is made, so manifolds would give it an uneven load, as there is never enough time for the manifold to buffer fully
wind spade
if one train will leave with smaller amount, it essentially gives more time for the manifold to buffer
even here, manifolds still work
just a first few trains will leave with smaller amounts
tight phoenix
I'm not sure if it has been discussed there already, but for manifolds that has inputs coming in bursts (trains), having the belts between splitters at a higher speed than necessary will help spread input around more evenly
(and especially before the splitters actually)
shut zealot
that satisgraphtory site looks promising if it would actually work
sand garnet
depends on what you want to do
shut zealot
It doesn't take into account the belt feeding correctly. simple 2 mine/4 smelter setup incorrectly calculates what happens in terms of feed to smelter 3 and 4
when cascades into incorrect flow calculation on outbound
err which
fickle thicket
Each miner is feeding a splitter which feeds two smelters, yes?
Bc that worked fine for me
shut zealot
fickle thicket
Oh it's some manifold design
Yeah you'd want to just have each miner feed two smelters independently imo
shut zealot
except I build vertically, not a lot of flat space if you don't just build in the sky
fickle thicket
How is that an issue? It uses less splitters
Here's a setup I did and it worked fine
https://satisgraphtory.com/#eW5jeXA%3D
wind spade
it's not expandable
fickle thicket
True
shut zealot
There is an expansion ceiling of course but what I found after a few play throughs is that after I discovered a few different alt recipes big production lines were a pain to re-tool and so I'm going with specialized build areas with distribution
rancid lark
hey @wind spade is there plans to add mining power used on your consumption tool? I know it's not a known amount since there's 3 types of nodes and whether the miners are overclocked or not, perhaps a range at the bottom from normal impure miners to overclocked pure miners to give an idea of the range of possible power requirements just for mining
wind spade
consumption tool can be used in many different ways
for example making stuff from ingots or plates
basically the items you have in "input" can be anything
and it's hard to calculate power requirement for an item
rancid lark
sure, but if I input raw materials like iron ore, the items tab could show the miners required and the power requirements for normal nodes, not overclocked as default?
no biggie, I'm sure you've been asked a lot about that, easy enough to use paper or spreadsheet
tight phoenix
oh satisgraphtory is nice, I was just looking for something like that today! Actually what I really want to do is overlay that on the map, so I can play with placing miners on specific nodes
wind spade
@rancid lark well I don't think you can easily estimate the amount of energy needed
I just tried for 780 iron / min, and the difference between mk1 pure and mk3 impure overclocked is 32.5 to 337.9MW. That's a super wide range. Any estimation would be probably way off from what the person has. Not to mention the fact that it would only work for raw materials. I think it's just easier to add that by hand
rancid lark
sounds good, thanks for the tool
crisp pelican
@wind spade Going back to that resource valuation stuff I mentioned recently, I think I've got a rarity/demand metric that kind of works: Rarity calculated based on output standardised to iron ore multiplied by a demand % (raw item demand divided by potential supply)
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bLBBJhF8mSs1CuvA55yKT89iESB3GkGVji66VDa14y8/edit?usp=sharing is the spreadsheet. I've guesstimated my machine counts for the moment but it looks reasonable so far. Still setting up my refinery site so that's why I don't have much crude oil demand yet.
solemn ibex
https://satisgraphtory.com/#bml4NTk%3D i was able to get 300 iron ore input to rotors and modular frames using only one node
ocean flax
Anyone know the reasoning behind the 780 belt speed on the mk5? Numbers seem like they would work out better with 720.
robust vessel
we need Mk 2 oil pumps 😦
merry sequoia
@ocean flax Yeah, the speed isnt fitting, but the mk 3 do ?
wind spade
@crisp pelican yeah, but it's still kinda objective
rose stirrup
@ocean flax what numbers?
I mean the only thing that could theoretically be impacted by a higher than necessary belt speed is performance as more stuff has to be calculated per <timeslot(minute/hour/whatever you want)> but that would probably be negated by the fact that other things fill up faster so on average I have a hard time seeing the issue there as well
wind spade
if you are moving X items per minute, it would be actually worse performance-wise to have slower belts
pastel hedge
I'm not very good at math. But I was able to figure out my items/minute using trains. Not a hard problem in the grand scheme of things. But I'm proud. Turbo motors, here I come
short onyx
Is the channel where I can get help with a Space Elevator that is probably missing due to a restart after mass dismantle?
sand garnet
you dont have it?
and jus tselecting it in the build menu? or does it say you already have 1
sand garnet
i take it you used a mod for mass dismantle?
short onyx
the save editor yes
sand garnet
sounds like you edited out your space elevator too
short onyx
yup 😃
sand garnet
I'd head on over to the modding discord to see if they can do anything for you
short onyx
oh modding.. ok
short onyx
ty
sand garnet
you may be able to build a new one using the editor? i dunno
they should be able to help better than people can here
modern pumice
Manifold for life balancers take up too much room
tight phoenix
I was trying to understand what life balancers were, and then I realized you forgot a comma :)
sand garnet
because we're all idiots in the satisfactory channel
how long for an ISC to fill up with waste?
cedar mica
Depends on how much waste you are giving it
sand garnet
assume 1 nuclear plant
sand garnet
ohh alright
wind spade
sand garnet
thanks greeny
sand garnet
hey guys
how many supercomputers per min can you make with the current nodes?
any way I can check this for myself?
rancid lark
I'd say use greeny's calculator page linked above (consumption tab) and set Oil to the max you can grab across the map (that seems to be the limiting resource)
cedar mica
From what I can tell, so is 50 super and 50 turbo, very close to the map limit atm
Then again, that is with some production of computers and such, for storage
rancid lark
seems the consumption tab is messed up right now @wind spade, tried in both Chrome and Firefox and it's freezing the browser tab
cedar mica
Working fine here, but if you put in high numbers, it can freeze up
rancid lark
ya, had some high numbers, restarted all instances of the browser and still locks up. maybe I need to clear cookies or something that's keeping state between sessions
nope, doesn't appear to be any cookies. is state info kept on the server @wind spade ?
wind spade
@rancid lark if you need to save your build that you have there, PM me and I'll try to help
otherwise the best thing to do is open the tool in anonymous window, press "share" and copy the url, open the url in normal browser and press "edit", in that way, your setup will be overwritten by the "empty" setup
the amounts shouldn't be an issue
only the complexity of calculations
@sand garnet max supercomputers is 125, heavily limited by oil
sand garnet
He claimed he was bored and the map was too small because he mined every node and made ~200 sc
wind spade
well send him to me 😄
wind spade
If you meet him again, send him this 😄
wind spade
at that point, the max was like 120 or something
didn't change much, since it was limited by oil even then
wind spade
that's what we nerds do here
sand garnet
I will postpone the alt screws gospel for another few weeks as a thank you
wind spade
if you keep it away from #math-and-meta then I won't even see it lol
unborn parrot
I wonder if the MK2 manufacturing and smelting are either gonna decrease time or make more stuff per raw material
It will mess up greenys site if it makes more stuff lol
wind spade
it won't lol
I'm prepared for everything
well I would need to do some updates
especially for analyzer tool
but production and consumption tools should be fine
but I doubt it will make more stuff from less mats
pale jetty
They’re most likely gonna be similar to how miners are -> more throughput. According to the wiki it’s 25% faster compared to MK1 but that’s something we‘ll have to wait for 😉
sand garnet
i dont think we should trust the wiki on future content
pale jetty
True the 25% is like a speculation
But the amount of resources per item shouldn’t decrease
sand garnet
agreed
pale jetty
So the only thing making it worthy of an MK2 Name Extension would be increased speed
iron python
They were 50% faster before, it's unlikely to change much if at all
wind spade
if it will just be faster, then it's good
but if they'll eat more power (e.g. if mk2 constructor equals 2 mk1s in speed, but eats more energy), then theoretically mk1s will still be better
higher mks of miners are better because we are limited by node count
practically if the power requirement isn't that much higher, I'd ignore the fact that they aren't the most efficient thing
polar sleet
yeah mk2 buildings tend to use power at higher ratio than shards i believe. but in exchange you get a higher cap for shards as well. but that's only useful for miners/pumps.
what we really need is fancy things like next stage foundries/refineries. basically a chemical processor / adv alloy foundry. so we can make fancy devices at even higher tiers.
iron python
Power increase on the MK2 buildings is about +120% for the +50% speed increase
glacial hemlock
Saving the power shard for much power consumption?
Mk2 smelters that consumes iron ore and coal electrode and outputs coal ore and iron ingot x2
polar sleet
yeah it would seem like a solution to allow you to dedicate shards to less common structures. but honestly it'd be better efficacy to increase building count instead. only real merit to MK production is improving FPS.
oblique bloom
425
Or was it 375
Dont wanna math
375
250+125
Its weekend okay..my mimd is wired for games
marble tapir
having a smart assistant right by my PC makes me not even think about doing the most simple math. Any time I want to work something out, i just ask alexa.
summer field
That's how the rise of the machines begin.
sand garnet
headmath is more fun
glacial hemlock
I would rather, like to see machines that produce extra material out of thin air, with the cost of increased power consumption
sand garnet
tier8?
glacial hemlock
I mean, improved productivity.
weak relic
I would what we think we iol get in tier 8? What kind of new buildings? Someone know what is possible?
patent bough
there are some hints at future content in current content (like, what does SAM ore make? why do 2 pods ask for superposition oscillators and quantum computers, items that you can't make? are these things all related?)
that being said if anyone actually knows what is coming the discord rules ask us not to talk about unreleased content.
at least i think they do i forget
earnest orchid
we have no idea
surreal elk
There's a ton of unreleased buildings in the wiki currently
Hadron colliders, quantum stuff, etc.
surreal elk
It's a good a guess as any
glacial hemlock
Wiki is not allowed to write extensive info about any unreleased items
marble tapir
We aren't even supposed to talk about it. Doing so is specifically "strictly not allowed." as per the #rules
fierce ruin
lol
summer field
This explains why it's so quiet now, thank you Izu.
marble tapir
trying to get quartz set up into my system, I two 300 quartz lines, and enough limestone to put all of it into Silica alt recipe factory. But I dont have anyything making crystals. I assume crystals are used less than silica. What kind of ratio should I split the raw quartz Silica:Crystals ?
glacial hemlock
Again, use calculators. But based on my experience of making turbo motor, you should be using equal numbers of machine for each. Note that this doesn't mean you will be consuming equal resources. Only the machine numbers are same.
For example, using 10 assemblers for producing silica and 10 construcors for quartz crystal
wheat nymph
Hello #meth-and-mate! Is underclocking nuclear power plants in any way beneficial? I am hoping it would create less radioactive waste / kWh energy produced.
From what I can see it does indeed work like that
empty hemlock
no, all powergenerators automatically clock down if you are not using their full load.
all you are doing with manual underclocking is setting a limit on how fast they work
wheat nymph
my 100% power plant creates 1 piece of waste every 300s and produces 2,500MW
a 10% power plant creates 1 piece of waste every 1,763s and produces 425 MW
@empty hemlock You are talking about that power gens will not use excess amounts of resources, right?
That's not what I am concerned about. I just want to produce as little waste as possible per MW
fallow lily
Using less nuclear power is the only way to do that.
empty hemlock
yes, you always get the exact same amount of power and waste from a single fuel rod. the speed at which that process happens is entirely decided by your power consumption. changing clockspeed of the generators does not change the consumption, it only changes the available limit
wheat nymph
Indeed
indeed indeed
oh well
the numbers do quite agree. Not sure why they gave me the wrong idea at first 🙄
currently I'm putting my waste into mk2 storage that I pile on top of each other + conveyor lifts and bob's your auntie. The sky is the limit!
Is this a bad idea once it fills up?
I don't have a solid feeling for how much the radioactive radiation scales
There's people who look for super far away caves and put their stuff in there and while I think that's cute, I don't see anything wrong with just building a super tall storage thing. Or is there?
empty hemlock
takes about 80 hours to fill a single mk2 container at 100%, so depending on how much power you use a couple of MK2 containers will hold you out for a couple hundred hours
wheat nymph
ok
2 times the waste results in how many times radius of the radiation sphere?
inverse square law? cos that would be swell
wind spade
@wheat nymph no matter how you underclock or overclock generators, you'll still get the same amount of waste. You can check that using my power tool
and the formula for calculating radiation is really complex, so I'd suggest using the radiation tool instead
wheat nymph
radiation tool, hu, I'll go check that out
glacial hemlock
There are at least 2 useful tools for calculating radiation, one is greeny's the other being interactive map
@wheat nymph you should use all 2500MW before you come to such conclusion.
glacial hemlock
You have the capacity. But power generator actually only generate as much as how much being consumed. So if your power plant stats is 100/100/2500 MW, then it is actually only generates 100MW
Also, 4.6 times of item quantity doubles the radiation range, just in case if you wonder
@wheat nymph nothing shields radiation damage, other than distance. Walls or caves doesn't matter. And further more, it is possible to have the entire map being contaminated by radiation, given large quantity of radioactive items
fierce ruin
@glacial hemlock in theory it is possible, in reality Im struggling to have more nuclear waste to cover bigger area with radiation :)
fierce ruin
one full ISC for ~10 foundations looks nice
in a grid
still need a lot
I build a train with like a 30 locomotives just to go round and use power - not very effective :(
than I thout OC manufacturers would be great
beacon recipe looks nice
but still only 1k for a iron node
not sure how its running when low on materials
wheat nymph
@glacial hemlock what conclusions are you referring to? I haven't made a single one in regards to radiation. I merely asked if it was following the inverse square law like it would do IRL. I guess I abbreviated my question a lot and that caused the confusion.
glacial hemlock
my 100% power plant creates 1 piece of waste every 300s and produces 2,500MW
a 10% power plant creates 1 piece of waste every 1,763s and produces 425 MW
wheat nymph
Yeah that is taken directly out of the game UI
glacial hemlock
Oh, nvm, i guess you already guessed it right
wheat nymph
No guess involved, just read it off the screen 😃
glacial hemlock
2500MW is the capacity, not power generated
wheat nymph
Of course
To be more precise: Power generated at full load
I was hoping driving the plant less aggressive would allow it to make better use of the fuel rods, yielding more power for the same waste
Not that this would make too much sense IRL but whatevs 😄
wind spade
if you overclock/underclock a power generator, the only thing you are changing is the limit of power it can produce
everything else stays the same
wheat nymph
Yeah
I would really like to be able to overclock and underclock trains
Or an entire train network
Throw more volts onto those rails
Have the choo go faster
Where is the suggestion bot when I need it
pale jetty
if that would be possible, i'd do another power grid just for trains 😂
shrewd yacht
sheesh... my 26 machine manifold takes 27 minutes to work at full capacity
is there a calculator for mergers and belt speeds needed?
crude girder
you can drop that fill-up time to a few minutes if you hand fill them
shrewd yacht
I connected them up as I built the splitters so it was not so bad
built a double row of 26 refineries at 50% to fill a mk5 belt with plastic
cursive umbra
has anyone done breakeven calculations for distance on where belt/train/truck is best?
wind spade
define "best"
theoretically, belt is always best, since it doesn't eat any fuel or power
fierce ruin
@fierce ruin When doing math be mindfull of belt speed limits
@fierce ruin?
yes?
@fierce ruin yes? what math?
ealer you said "but still only 1k for a iron node" so i thoguht you ment mining from 1 node to 1K a min. no belt is that fast.
it was about 1000MW i think
Oh ok
yes
do you run power poles all over or feed from the stations to the mining nodes?
train stations? I dont have much of them - but generally I would choose to use them as a power connector
cool. I was thinking its a better idea.
i also want to pull from EVERY iron node on the map.... but not sure how i want to do it.
there is a nice concept of powerbox
a place where you can cut off power to factories
why would you do that? all of mine are powered up 24/7
to stop all production and save on FPS
you dont need to that any mroe with the LOC changes
what is your production buildings count?
further away u are the slower the distant FPS to make closer FPS better
over 1900
But its spread out not compacted close. to take advantage of the new LOC feature
and you dont see difference when its running or stopped?
not at all.
not since the latests updates and the LOC + Distance changes.
I can be on other side of map, and I have an impact of my production
did you change the LOC settings?
no...
LOC.. line of?
new game - 150fps / my save 20 to 40
deleting all belts helps a lot :)
@fierce ruin 21fps normal - 34 after cutting power
not bad
I still have no idea bout tht LOC
how to change it and what it is?
culling?
fierce ruin
idk
peak wedge
Lo-Colgate max white
shrewd yacht
trains feel like a waste up to 2km imo
They slow down so much before each stop and waste time. And the loading and unloading is also taking up time
peak wedge
That's why you automate them
peak wedge
Autopilot
shrewd yacht
and that is when it is slow
compared to me driving and braking before a station it is so slow with AI for some reason
peak wedge
? put more wagon on it
shrewd yacht
and why are these trains not producing power when braking!? 😛
peak wedge
They are not Tesla
peak wedge
Until solar panels are a thing i don't think that the train produces power from breaking.
shrewd yacht
don't see what solar panels have to do with that
peak wedge
Because Ficsit takes theyr time
fierce ruin
0-o
and about trains - generally all you need to do is to add more wagons. Personally I prefer vehicles on shorter distances.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/c78bo0/satisfactory_saturday_spam_6_choo_choo_train_tips/ there is a nice time table
peak wedge
on short distance are conveyor belts more handy
peak wedge
i only use conveyor belts for everything ;3
fierce ruin
size of production?
tells nothing except love for Italian kitchen :)
(just joking)
fierce ruin
drop a save on interactive map
but my point is - larger factory - less belts you will try to use
peak wedge
i'm laying down in VR, too lazy right now xd
fierce ruin
(less connections to be specific)
solemn breach
wait you can lay down with VR?
glacial hemlock
It is impossible to have a train with round tip time below 2 minutes
fierce ruin
why not?
I mean on such a low distance it wont be really useful, but why not possible?
rancid lark
if it's both unloading and loading that slows it down quite a bit no matter how short the run. if it's not unloading/loading then it's not really doing anything useful.
glacial hemlock
You could try it out, build 2 stations 400meters apart and measure the time taken
glacial hemlock
There is no reason to build anymore nearer, right?
fierce ruin
right
red rose
Not sure if this is meta/math or not HOWEVER, just testing a few times in the Explorer Vehicle on a long stretch of road, long and controlled drifts is actually quicker than just driving from point A to B...... Mind you it has to be a decent road to give you time to pick up speed but each drift gets you 95-105kmh as opposed to 91-93kmh... Meta or not you decide ;p you're welcome to those who have long and wide highways
night narwhal
What's the best way to split a conveyer up for stitched iron plates?
I'm trying to work out the ratio of iron ore for stitched but ended up with 30:16.666667 and haven't a clue how'd I'd split my conveyers to get that sort of ratio. I have considered rounding up to 30:20 and just using a 1 to 5 splitter set up.
This is with iron wire unlocked.
feral dew
insert manifold rant here
In seriousness though, for that sort of production, you'll want to use a manifold, which is in essence a single long belt with a high quantity of resources on it, which has a lot of inline splitters splitting into machines.
Yes, it is efficient and easy to build, no it is not inexact. For things like wire and screws, which are needed in high quantities, underclocking is usually used to make ratios better
night narwhal
Ok! I've used manifolds pretty much EVERYWHERE else so I don't know why I got so fixated on a splitter. 😛
glacial hemlock
🇲 🇦 🇳 🇮 🇫 🇴 🇱 🇩
feral dew
^
feral dew
-+---+---+---+-
crude girder
the language of the gods...
wheat nymph
@pale jetty
https://questions.satisfactorygame.com/28771/over-underclock-trains it needs your upvote!
fierce ruin
honestly good one - I was thinking about similar thing - unlocking train buffs by using power slug (like faster acceleration / better brakes so on) +1
wheat nymph
yay!
unborn parrot
im gonna start my nuclear megafactory today
do i set up mining infrastructure first or the factories?
peak wedge
hmm, i would say factories, then you have a clean ressult at the end
unborn parrot
ive got 40 mk3 miners to set up
wheat nymph
one idea for that: Keep your conveyor belt with the uranium ore like super away from all the others
unborn parrot
all over the map
wheat nymph
I mean eventually the whole place is gonna be radiaty a bit but it's nice to jetpack where possible
unborn parrot
1.05 tw of power
cant wait to see rads
ok
i need to build a railway for 6600 iron ore per minute
yay
peak wedge
6600 rip
wind spade
@wheat nymph uranium conveyor belt won't radiate much
wheat nymph
yes it does when you stand right next to it
glacial hemlock
A perfect example of manifold
https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/cmyyz2/stackable_concrete_factory_floor_plan/
wind spade
@wheat nymph yeah, that counts as "won't radiate much" lol
fierce ruin
right next to it :)
wind spade
unless you are literally standing on the belt or are super close, you won't take any damage
fierce ruin
its really nothing flummi
wind spade
so I don't really get the people that build the belt 600m away from the base saying "I don't want the radiated belt to be near me"
unborn parrot
how big a line do i need for 1800 iron ore per min
how many trains i mean
its from the grass plains to the north east desert
its from the grass plains to the north east desert
should i process my iron ore into beacons onsite to save space
at the factory
wind spade
depends on number of freight cars, belt speed and track length (meaning how long will a train take to go from one station to another)
unborn parrot
is it better to ship 1800 iron ore/min or 168 beacons/min
wind spade
for what do you need 168 beacons/min lol
vernal birch
IO/minute * trip length in minutes / (32*stacksize) =wagons needed
glacial hemlock
Always ship the item with most compression possible
Uranium belts radiates at 13m, and 19m with 2 belts
fierce ruin
you need to be less than 2 meters to take rad damage seriously
unborn parrot
168 beacons for 84 fuel rods
unborn parrot
well i havent got the will to do all this right now so im gonna play csgo
fierce ruin
it will take some time :)
dense carbon
Blinking
cedar mica
Anyone know what calculated into the "power used at maximum production", at satisfactory-calculator.com?
I'm just a bit surprised, it says I'm at 9,868.504MW, when barley have any machines
154 machines + 18 extractors, to be exact
peak wedge
You was tiping in some wrong numbers?
cedar mica
This is reading my save file
peak wedge
hmm. idk then, someone else has to help, sorry
cedar mica
Hmm, an average of 64MW, yet only 5 of 154 machines is using more then 55MW...
7 manufactories, 3 oil pumps and 5 oil refinerys. Rest is sub 30MW
sand garnet
no it's a bit confusing
i told anthors the same lol, suggested for him to round it to a whole number so there's no .504 going on
it would just say 9,868GW
sand garnet
yea i think it's the difference between europe and the US but not sure
wind spade
we have space instead of , and we have , instead of .
so 9,868,504 in US is 9 868,504 for us
cedar mica
Guess its just a case of having more built, then I though. Still a bit surprised that I can use 10GW already
Guess I need to get that nuclear up and running sooner then I though
boreal cypress
US is always special ... like imperial and metric xD
tight phoenix
and don't forget the crazy way dates are ordered, month/day/year ...
toxic shadow
train stations have a constant draw power draw frieght stations maybe as well I havent tested any track length power draw tests.
tight phoenix
power drawn depends on what the train is doing, not the length of the track
toxic shadow
I knew that was not sure if there was a track draw was all so trains trains stations and hills and what not all impact power draw.
tight phoenix
but it's good to test it to be sure though I guess
toxic shadow
I put my intial build factory on all my old coal plants and only thing on my feul gens is trains and stations and freights and it has over a 1.5k draw.... factory under 1.2 k with making up to computers
tight phoenix
so you are saying that your train setup seems to use 300?
glacial hemlock
maybe it is assuming you overclocked all your machines to 250%
toxic shadow
no my train set up burns 2k in power with no machines and six locomotives
its on its own power grid so I can tell exactly how much it burns
glacial hemlock
It is a good indication that you should setup a nuclear power
manic kiln
anyone got a good layout for computer manufacturing? nothing too fancy, just something for the default 1.875/mn recipe
junior cloud
PaperMartin: great starting point for that is https://satisfactory.greeny.dev/calculator
wind spade
here is a nice setup for a small amount of computers https://satisfactory.greeny.dev/calculator?preview=uicfFBV69F
junior cloud
Haha, yeah, should let greeny do it better
wind spade
oh, @junior cloud beat me to the punch
junior cloud
BTW: thanks so much greeny, that tool rocks. I failed so hard using excel.
wind spade
I used excel before too
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1u5Z8xDwWF7jsP34DjR_P1tUAbtOwI0PT-L4jCGrRVQs/edit?usp=sharing this was my tool before the web version
manic kiln
satisgraphtory is pretty nice to plan out stuff too
manic kiln
thanks though
wind spade
it works better on smaller scales and for fine-tuning stuff
manic kiln
oh didn't see the visualiser thing
wind spade
I'd suggest clicking the link from @junior cloud first and playing with the tool
what I sent you is a link to finished setup
manic kiln
yeah saw it
the visualiser could use graphical icons for different machines etc but I can see how it's better
wind spade
I was aiming for more schematic view
I think that icons wouldn't look good on big setups
manic kiln
maybe an option to switch between icons and the current schematic block things
wind spade
however everybody has a different taste, so I don't say it's a bad idea. It just looks cleaner this way (for me)
manic kiln
depends on peoples probably
I personally like icons better than text
wind spade
the other issue is, that the rendering library I used can't do icons (or rather has a very limited support for them)
manic kiln
fair enough
wind spade
so the icon would replace the box and numbers would be over the icon, practically unreadable
if it could render the icon inside the box, I would have it there
twin salmon
Which of these recipes should I go for? It's my first hard drive. About to build Space Elevator.
twin salmon
thanks.
wind spade
Iron Wire is the best recipe you could've gotten
for next drive, look for Stitched Iron Plate
The Iron Alloy (the 1st recipe on your screen) is decent too
but you shouldn't bother with the reinforced plate recipe or any screw recipe
boreal cypress
just get every alt receipt as fast as possible ^^
twin salmon
Are there enough drives to get all of them?
wind spade
there are a few more. I recently updated the wiki page with alternate recipes, you can scroll down and check section "bad recipes"
worn cloud
Is there a way to know how many hard drives you've researched ?
sand garnet
you guys are smart right?
twin salmon
I'm kinda an idiot, honestly.
sand garnet
can someone explain the stuff about how overclocking to 200% doesnt actually get 2x the amount of power?
I dont entirely get it myself
wind spade
in the same way as you use way more power for 1 machine @ 200% than for 2 machines @ 100%, overclocking power generators isn't linear and there is some loss
@sand garnet
you can play with https://satisfactory.greeny.dev/power, set stuff to 1 generator and change overclocking
sand garnet
but what about if its coal gens
wind spade
all gens use the same formula
sand garnet
is it that the power boost gets lessened due to the fact it takes more coal now?
wind spade
it works a bit differently
sand garnet
like, the coal gen produces power, so how does it not scale linear
wind spade
@sand garnet so, each generator has a "power limit", which is how much it can produce MW. That's the limit we see ingame.
every fuel (not the item, but anything that can burn in a generator) has "energy value". Generators just convert the energy from the fuel to power to the network. The power limit is the max they can do per second.
example:
Coal generator has 50 MW power limit. Coal has 270 MJ energy value. So at max load, coal generator "takes" 50 MJ from coal and "converts" it to 50 MW. From that, we can also calculate, that the "burn time" of coal is 5.4 seconds (270/50), however burn time isn't used anywhere, the game works with energy value and power limit.
that's without overclocking.
With overclocking, the only thing that is changed is the power limit. Overclocking a generator increases the power limit, underclocking a generator decreases the power limit. The energy value stays unchanged, so you'll still get the same amount of power from 1 piece of coal, just faster/slower
the power limit isn't changed lineary tho (the same way as power requirements aren't linear when it comes to overclocking production buildings)
sand garnet
so the guy in #old-questions-and-help says: " but the max energy that could be produced is only 85.2 mwh, although it should be 100mwh. At 150% its 68.3mhw?"
that 85 is significantly lower
wind spade
it uses a similar formula: [power limit] = [normal power limit] * [(overclock/100)^(1/1.3)]
sand garnet
simpler would just be powerlimit * OC percent
which is, seemingly, what people expect
wind spade
well then it wouldn't have any disadvantage 🤔
sand garnet
increased coal intake?
wind spade
if you read the thing up top again, you'll still get the same amount of power
polar sleet
it would be funny if the problem was the belt thruput
wind spade
every coal piece can provide you with 270 MW
sand garnet
i feel so dumb because for some reason, the explanation doesnt click in my head lol
wind spade
so if it would work the way you said, then 1 gen @ 200% would be exactly the same as 2 gens @ 100%
sand garnet
me and math are not friends :p
wind spade
ok, dumb example incomming:
sand garnet
and yes 2 gens at 100 being the same as 1 at 200 is exactly what people expect
it would be sacrificing slugs for space
wind spade
imagine you have a bottle of juice. It has 2 liters in it. You can pour it slow (0.5 liters/s) or fast (1 liter/s). In the end, you'll end up with 2 liters anyway, but it depends on how fast/slow you pour.
bottle of juice = piece of coal
pouring = using coal in gen
so if you need 1 liter/s (base consumption), you can either have one bottle pouring fast (1 liter/s, overclocked bottle) or two bottles slow (2x 0.5 liters/s, non-overclocked bottle)
sand garnet
right together its still the same
wind spade
yeah
but overclocking isn't linear
so you need something like 2.4 bottles or something
polar sleet
I'm not sure why people would bother overclocking powerplants, unless they're short on the mats to make them. That's the only time I've bothered, and even that is just a temp fix. fancy math is reserved more so for planning long term design/usage.
sand garnet
yeah the non-linear thing is whats confusing
wind spade
but you are still pouring 1 liter/s in total. So there is no increased resource intake
polar sleet
I get the non-linear for power consumption though.
sand garnet
like, it should be IMO
wind spade
you still eat the same amount of coal, no matter how you overclock or underclock gens
sand garnet
but doesnt that mean that the 200/250% is misleading?
polar sleet
yeah the only thing that improves power performance, is upgrading fuel types.
wind spade
well, if you overclock something to 250%, it doesn't always mean it works 250% better/faster
sand garnet
yeah and that part doesnt make sense
wind spade
but I agree that it may be a bit misleading if you look at it that way
sand garnet
if i sell something in a store
wind spade
it makes sense as slugs shouldn't be 100% efficient
there is some loss involved with slugs
wind spade
that's a bit different example, but yeah, I get what you mean
the % for the gen overclocking can't be taken literally
polar sleet
well overclocking with slugs is essentially stressing the building to increase thruput, more so than anything related to efficiency. that being said, overclocking power plants should normally cause fuel efficiency to drop, rather than create diminishing returns for output.
sand garnet
I wonder if they should change the OC %
wind spade
if you overclock production building to 250%, you don't consume 250% more power, you consume like way more %. So the issue is there as well
sand garnet
and if so, how
wind spade
I think it's fine as it is now
polar sleet
yeah having the penalty be the thruput rather than effeicincy is better for power plants.
proud lichen
imho its not. Its misleading
sand garnet
^^ is the person why I asked this question btw
wind spade
tl;dr overclocking power gens is useless, unless you don't have resources to build more or you need a quick solution to your power issues
polar sleet
but i also agree that the overclock values for power plants is also misleading
wind spade
@proud lichen I get that it may be misleading a bit. I'd suggest reading this https://satisfactory.gamepedia.com/Clock_speed or playing with my power tool https://satisfactory.greeny.dev/power if you want to understand it better
polar sleet
they could scrap overclocking for power plants instead, to "fix" this.
sand garnet
just call it 'overclock' without %
just give it 2 steps for powerplants without a slider
polar sleet
it's more of a luxury, than a needed feature.
proud lichen
greeny, noone asked, if it is more worth to build more gens or not and i do understand the calculations you wrote, i just want to explain, it should be better documented IN THE GAME, what you overclock, if you overclock gens
wind spade
yeah, for gens, the % doesn't really represent anything
@proud lichen no need to be agressive. I didn't read your message in the other channel and I only work with what @sand garnet said. He included a few questions of his as well
polar sleet
also i want to see them build a powerplant that is just a battery station.
sand garnet
@proud lichen having extra information is always nice and yes, the extra info WAS actually very helpful for me
proud lichen
i am not aggresive, your just writing around the term for like half an hour without a good solution to the problem
sand garnet
he was writing to me, dude
I only linked you here because it had info that would answer your question in there too
wind spade
wait, the problem is that the game didn't tell you what exactly what will happen if you overclock generator, right? how do you expect me to solve the problem?
I'm not a CSS dev or anything, I just do math.
sand garnet
while at the same time the conversation was mostly for me to understand how this stuff works
proud lichen
i dont expect you to solve the problem, but your like a phone supporter, talking for half an hour, without anything usefull to say
sand garnet
@trim veldt how about you dont be a dick
wind spade
(did you just pinged a radnom person instead of him?)
sand garnet
the conversation was between greeny and myself, and I just tagged you because part of that conversation would be helpful for you
wind spade
I like to think that the stuff I said was actually useful. I explained how the overclocking works, provided examples and answered questions. Sorry to dissapoint you. If you include your question, I'll answer it directly if I can.
wind spade
(I still don't know what question you asked, Joly0. I was talking to Tom with 99% of my messages)
proud lichen
greeny, to be specific, i want to know, why the ingame "documentation" of the gens is wrong or "misleading"
rancid lark
because it's early access
polar sleet
^
proud lichen
You cant point every mistake to a game being in early access
wind spade
I beleive that the ingame "documentation" is just a slider between 1-250%, right? I don't recall any other info about overclocking (maybe ADA gives you something?).
sand garnet
yea thats what he means
the slider and 250% thing
which is why i asked how that stuff works
because in order to try to answer a question, i try to understand the logic behind it 😛
polar sleet
oh i know. the slider represents effort, not results.
rancid lark
if I overclock my CPU to 110% it doesn't mean every program runs 10% faster, it's more complicated than that
polar sleet
you need to refer to ficsit pioneers manual for details (aka the internet)
proud lichen
your comparing apples to bananas, twotwoeleven
wind spade
Well not sure what ADA gives you as info, but I can see that it could be improved a bit. You can suggest that to the QA site, I think it may get a good number of upvotes.
But I also think, that not all info needs to go ingame. That's what wikis are for.
sand garnet
agreed
shadow prairieBOT
You can send Questions, Feedback, Suggestions, and Bug Reports at https://questions.satisfactorygame.com @proud lichen
<3 @sand garnet
wind spade
If we take some example, let's go with Minecraft. The game itself gives you only a very limited amount of info. You are free to play it without knowing what half of the stuff does. But if you want to make any complicated redstone build or efficient farm, you need all the info the wiki can provide you (and I don't think that info should be ingame).
I know that Minecraft is a different game, but I think this example may apply to most of the games. Wikis are great sources of extra information for games
rancid lark
quite a few games leave discovery of the mechanics up to the user as part of the entertainment value
sand garnet
good example
overloading the ingame menus with information isnt necessarily the greatest thing to do
wind spade
However in the case of overclocking power generators, I think there can be a bit more info in the game, probably with ADA transmission or in the email (or as a short oneline description near the overclocking UI).
proud lichen
greeny, in satisfactory its "documented by a slider
just if the slider would be right, ther would be no need to go to the wiki
wind spade
as already mentioned, if you want to suggest this feature, I'd put a post on the QA site linked a few messages back.
well the slider is right. You overclock the building to 250%
but overclocking a generator to 250% doesn't mean you raise it's power limit to 250%
it's the same as overclocking a production building doesn't increase power consumption by 250%
but actually by over 400%
TwoToEleven actually had a good example from real life. Overclocking stuff by X% doesn't always mean that it works X% faster
proud lichen
still, then it should be more obv, what the oc does oc
wind spade
I don't think I follow. You overclock the generator. That's quite obvious
the effect is increased power capacity
but it isn't linear
proud lichen
i mean, which of the various values you oc
sand garnet
greeny and I bought agreed that OC% on a generator isnt necessarily the best idea but it still works as intended for every other building
wind spade
as I already said, it isn't documented exactly, but for now it's on wiki and you can put the request to QA site. I don't think I can help you more with this. I agree that it may be confusing for people that don't know about the math behind it, but I also think it may confuse people if the extra info is there. I guess some UX dev needs to do the call
sand garnet
yeah that indepth explanation ingame would confuse the shit out of me lol
proud lichen
i mean, with the math and everything its ok, but if i see, an 200% overclocked machine to produce 200% more in 1 minute, i expect a gen to do the same
wind spade
I see where this is coming from. However machines have the disadvantage of increased power consumption. Gens need a disadvantage as well, so they just don't scale lineary.
sand garnet
makes sense
proud lichen
it does, but still not obv enough in game
sand garnet
so did you post it on the QA site?
proud lichen
not yet
rancid lark
I don't see what the big deal is. If production machines consume a non-linear amount of power when they are overclocked (i.e. less efficient), power generators should also generate a non-linear amount of power as they are overclocked (also less efficient)
wind spade
he is ok with that, he just wants this info somewhere ingame
proud lichen
the deal is the generated product. For machines, you get exactly 200% more if overclocked to 200%, for gens not, although the produced product is indeed energy
rancid lark
the product of power generators is (power generated - power consumed). The power consumed is the non-linear part just like all production machines and will make things overall less efficient on the amount of power generated
proud lichen
so if machines give you 200% more of a product, a normal player expects generators to behave the same
wind spade
just to correct you a little, machine gives you the same amounf of products, it just works 200% faster
but in the end it's the same thing
proud lichen
yeah, i mean it gives you 200% more in the same time
rancid lark
the power consumption curve for normal machines isn't documented in the UI either. I assume you want the formula displayed there as well?
proud lichen
not exactly, i just want a better documentation of what gets overclocked
sand garnet
wiki then?
proud lichen
- in game
wind spade
wait, if you change the slider, doesn't the generator show you how much power it can generate?
proud lichen
just a better info "Hey, this value gets overclocked by this and that vlaue by that"
rancid lark
I feel like we're being trolled 😃
wind spade
if the power value changes when you overclock the building, isn't that sufficient documentaiton?
proud lichen
no, because as a player, you expect the values to change differently
wind spade
well not sure about that, I would experiment with the values and take the result as a rule.
rancid lark
all machines in the game use exponentially more power when you overclock them (i.e. tell them to work harder). the product of a power generator might go up internally by a linear percent of power but the amount it uses of that product to run itself will increase exponentially and so the output will be reduced
proud lichen
if i test machines, and i see they produce 200% more if overclocked to 200%, i expect gens to produce 200% more if overclocked to 200%
wind spade
well since generators aren't machines, I wouldn't assume that.
rancid lark
the issue is the power product and power consumption are the same, you have to cancel them out
wind spade
@rancid lark no, power gens use the same amount of energy, that doesn't change with overclocking
rancid lark
technically there's no telling what a power gen uses since all you see in the UI is the net output, right?
wind spade
well we got the formulas from devs, so I assume they are correct 🤔
and also the math fits to experimentation ingame
basically - no matter how are your gens overclocked/underclocked, you'll still use the same amount of fuel/min
(if we are talking about generating X MW)
rancid lark
ya, but I think you could do the math such that, for example, a fuel gen actually generates 200 MW but uses 50 MW at 100%. Overclocking increases the 50 MW just like other machines. Not sure what the amounts would be to get the math to work and don't care to do it since I'm fine with the in game info.
wind spade
well then you would broke the equation of fuel energy = power generated
rancid lark
but as we're discussing, a linear relationship of fuel energy to power generated doesn't exist when you overclock. I'm suggesting that's the power consumption of the power gen machine.
proud lichen
what about fuel energy stays = power generated, just the time coal burns increases so 200% oc fit 200% more power generated?
wind spade
@rancid lark you are mixing two things together. power generated is always the same. I assume you are talking about the power limit
proud lichen
i mean, it would just make more sense in terms of you oc the end product
wind spade
@proud lichen sure, but then we would need to make another disadvantage
rancid lark
guess I'll do the math later and get back to you 😃
wind spade
otherwise the shards would keep 100% efficiency
proud lichen
hiogher fuel consumed, that is the disadvantage already?
wind spade
again, you are not consuming more fuel
(assuming we are talking about powering the base)
proud lichen
as i said, it should be. Burn the fuel fast, produce more energy = more fuel needed
in same time
wind spade
you burn every piece of coal to 270 MW. No matter the overclocking
that is already 100% efficiency
so the disadvantage of OCing gens is that the power limit isn't increased linearly
glacial hemlock
@proud lichen so why not wiki? Lol
Wiki is the documentation. In the game there is a much simplified documentation called codex, however it won't answer your query
manic kiln
which recipe is the best one? I still have 5 more drives to scan
boreal cypress
so Satisfactory has a discord ingame feature?
sand garnet
@manic kiln we would help you if we could see the actual game lmao
manic kiln
oh shit lol
sorry the screenshot happened after I switched to discord for some reason
ok which of these is better https://puu.sh/E54LG/4204d912f6.jpg
boreal cypress
2
manic kiln
kk
boreal cypress
no more copper for wire :D And you can use the copper for alt. quickwire recipe
manic kiln
I want the quickwire computer recipe :c
boreal cypress
you can do a trick. Save game, check for research recipe, reload game
manic kiln
I know but I haven't moved the game to my ssd yet so it takes forever
boreal cypress
Even with SSD my game loads 2min xD
manic kiln
epic launcher is kinda ass when it comes to moving a game's folder
boreal cypress
<@&387163995947270144>
i didnt has a problem :D first i had the game pirate and then i buyed it... no Problem with moving it to another location
knotty venture
!ficsitHR hardban @white folio spam
boreal cypress
atleast i want a thx :c
wind spade
@manic kiln iron wire is like the best alt recipe, the circuit board recipe is good as well
manic kiln
kk
boreal cypress
i like the quickwire circuit board more
wind spade
this one saves more materials and doesn't require caterium
manic kiln
is there really much of an advantage in using trains over trucks? cause trucks already carry more than enough stuff and they don't require rails
wind spade
yes. Trains are better, can have more throughput, don't require fuel and don't fall off the clifs
manic kiln
fair enough
I'll use a train for my caterium mine then
also just got the quickwire computer
wind spade
@boreal cypress
manic kiln
hey if I have a train with 2 freight car, and have it stop at a station with 2 freight platform, one loading and one unloading, could this work to both retrieve ore from my caterium mine and bring fuel/coal to power said mine?
wind spade
yes, but train tracks work as a power line, so you can just have the mine connected to main grid
manic kiln
oh nice
wind spade
so if you connect the station at main base and the other station to the mine, then it will connect both networks together
and it isn't a good idea to have separated power networks anyway
manic kiln
though with a setup like that couldn't you possibly have a train that carries one type of material per car and have freight platform unload the proper car based on the space between the station and the freight platform
wind spade
yeah, empty platform is the "spacing" building for that
manic kiln
that's actually really interesting 👀
eternal slate
how fast building (like Miner mk.1 - oc 100%) uses the energy / how many items can be produced per certain fuel (coal)?
how big hill can locomotive climb with 1 oil barrel burning in generator? 🤔
boreal cypress
What?
glacial hemlock
check wiki
mossy sky
I think this online calculator is broken. 4 Crystal Computers require 16 circuit boards p/min, correct?
mossy sky
Cheers.
boreal cypress
oh per minute
wind spade
@eternal slate it uses energy for the time it produces, 5 MW. 1 piece of coal will give you 270 MW.
fallow lily
MJ.
glacial hemlock
fallow lily
Saying that one piece of coal gives 270 MW is...confusing at best.
wind spade
beleive me, I have confused so many people by saying MJ instead of MW
so I just gave up on that
glacial hemlock
if the audience cannot differentiate between MJ and MW, they are not going to understand what you are trying to explain anyway.
wind spade
well nice article you linked there @glacial hemlock . However it has incorect sentence there:
`A single item of Coal last for 5.4 sec. A Miner Mk.2 on a Pure Coal Node outputs item at 240/min, or 4/sec. Multiply both together, 5.4 sec * 4/sec = 21.6
In this case, a Miner Mk.2 can supply just enough coal to 21.6 Coal Generators. The Engineer can choose to build 22 Coal Generators, with the last generator underclocked to 60% for perfect ratio.`
eternal slate
so if coal piece is 270 you can power up miner mk1 with 100% for 270/5 minutes?
glacial hemlock
just feed them with facts and number should be enough.
wind spade
@eternal slate seconds
@glacial hemlock if you underclock a power gen to 60%, you are not getting 60% of the power limit
glacial hemlock
You are right. It actually is more. XD
eternal slate
ah MW = MJ /s and coal is 270 MJ yeah thx :D
wind spade
you are getting 67.6% actually
fallow lily
There's no real point to underclocking reactors, in any case.
glacial hemlock
This sentence is written by me few months ago. Perhaps I am not understand too.
eternal slate
and miner will generate 270/5/60*{miningspeed(120)} ores for one coal 🤔
glacial hemlock
@wind spade thanks for pointing it out! I had rewrote that sentence.
glacial hemlock
node purity for which page?
eternal slate
and then again if you have under clocked 50% it generates more for same amount of energy
wind spade
oh, that was for @eternal slate 's formula
fallow lily
Underclock does not make generators more efficient.
It just limits the maximum amount of power they can make.
wind spade
yeah, if you underclock it to 1%, you can have more coal mined
@fallow lily we are talking about a miner
fallow lily
Ah, different matter, then.
boreal cypress
Power generators are equally efficient at any overclocked rate (or underclocked), unlike normal machines
eternal slate
you can extract 3x more ore with same amount of energy if you set miner from 100% --> 50% 🤔
glacial hemlock
but why? lol
boreal cypress
but you need 3x coal nodes
wind spade
you can extract almost 10x more if you underclock miner to 1%
eternal slate
but that's not practical :D
wind spade
neither is 50% underclocking 😄
eternal slate
maybe