math-and-meta

[fallow siren]

i love that one

[rigid harbor]

you could just make a second production item and just under/ overclock to the number you need

i know its just a quality of life mod but i like playing most of my games vanilla

you could have one machine making 1 item per minute and another making 2.5

[safe gorge]

i mean with splitters and stuff

[rigid harbor]

it would be 1,000,000 times simpler than splitting into weird fractions

[vapid gorge]

what are you feeding it to that you can't use a manifold?

[safe gorge]

two constructors , but i have limited recourses , and i can't get more , so there can't be wasted recourses

[vapid gorge]

ok so manifold it

it'll self balance over time

at what point in the game are you that you're limited in how many constructors you're building? you can jsut hand craft a few parts

[rigid harbor]

what are you crafting?

[safe gorge]

no , manifolds waste recourses because they create overflows

[fallow siren]

no?

[rigid harbor]

no?

[vapid gorge]

they are literally 100% efficient

[rigid harbor]

just takes some time to "spool up"

i religously use manifolds and they are perfect...

[safe gorge]

maybe i understand manifolds wrong, can someone link a video?

[rigid harbor]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCLevySglH4

[vapid gorge]

don't even really need a video

as long as you feed enough or more parts per min than a system needs it'll self balance over time

how couldn't it?

[safe gorge]

are those smart splitters or regular?

[rigid harbor]

regular

it wouldint matter, if the 1st smelter fills up it will automaticly move onto the next...so on and so on

[fallow siren]

u dont need smart splitter for manifold

[rigid harbor]

only time ive used smart splitters in a manifold is to recirculate the input to fully saturate my belt

[fallow siren]

for ex, this is manifold for my 1200/min steel pipe

[safe gorge]

do conveyer speeds matter?

can i use mk6 on everything?

[dusky dust]

Basically: when you first fire it up, the first machine in the line is getting 50% of the material, and everything after has to share the remaining 50%. The first machine is getting too much, and the others are getting too little. After awhile, though, the input buffer on the first machine fills up, and at that point it only consumes exactly as much as it needs. Then the next machine in the line is taking 50% of whatever's left (and the machines after that splitting the remaining 50%). Same thing there; eventually the input buffer fills up. Eventually, the last two machines in the row are getting basically exactly what they need, so you won't see their input buffers growing

[rigid harbor]

as long as your required input doesint exeed the belt limit you can use any

[dusky dust]

Not really; using slower belts might, somewhat weirdly, cause the manifold to warm up a little faster, but I nearly always just use my fastest belt for everything

[fallow siren]

im using fastest belt to avoid mistake

sometimes silly mistake like lower belt speed hiding

[rigid harbor]

look at all the green lights

manifolds arent wasteful

[vapid gorge]

most of the time feeding with slower belts actually increases spin up time

[safe gorge]

yeah , not what i want

[vapid gorge]

you don't want a 100% efficient system? weird

[fallow siren]

manifold save time and space, it works the same as load balancing

[safe gorge]

the workloads aren't equal

[vapid gorge]

define work loads

[safe gorge]

left takes 40 wire/M , right takes 100 wire/M

[vapid gorge]

they don't need to be equal

[fallow siren]

it will overload the 40/min and then fed the 100/min

[vapid gorge]

literally the only things you need to make a manifold 100% efficient is

a) a fast enough belt for your parts per min
b) at least enough parts per min for the whole system

[rigid harbor]

predator vision monitor there

[safe gorge]

and the wire in the overloaded assembler will get wasted , as it should be in the constructor

[fallow siren]

they dont get wasted

[vapid gorge]

it won't it'll fill up

[rigid harbor]

im rocking horse vision 😎

[vapid gorge]

and then pass on the next machine

[safe gorge]

yes , i don't want it to fill up

[fallow siren]

lets say its 40/min and 100/min and you have 140/min line, the manifold will overload the 40/min and the rest of 100 will go to 100/min, is is that hard for you to understand?

[opaque pebble]

so basically you don't want either line to back up at all, is that it

[vapid gorge]

in ANY case your options are

a) build a 100% efficient manifold as explained
b) build 2 seperate machines to produce each quantiy on it's own and don't merge them
c) go look up load balancing tutorials because each load balancer you make is unique and often a pain in the ass

good luck with life

[dusky dust]

Oh, oops, I'd remembered that conversation (and graph) but remembered the wrong result, then. :D

[vapid gorge]

it happens 🙂

[safe gorge]

"They Called Me A Mad Man. And What I Predicted Came To Pass."

[vapid gorge]

so you made a manifold

[safe gorge]

30 wire that should have been in the constructor

[safe gorge]

.

[opaque pebble]

If you call items just being somewhere else "wasted"

If it really annoys you that you need to wait for the manifold to saturate, prefill it

[dusky dust]

The other real benefit of manifolds, beyond just saving yourself a ton of space versus balancers, is that later on in the game when you've got "weird" numbers all over the place to deal with, they let you basically not worry about it at all

[safe gorge]

yeah , because those 30 wire should have been turned to cable

now i have 69 cables instead of 100

[opaque pebble]

In the short run, yes
In the long run, no

[vapid gorge]

so? the process is automated , your machines will run at 100%

suck it up or learn to load balance

[safe gorge]

but i only have 140 wire

[dusky dust]

Like you've got 173.5/min material which you need to split up between two different consumers, each with like a prime number of machines taking from the material, etc. Or one machine which needs far less than the others, etc. With a balancer you could spend hours trying to get things split, but with a manifold you just set it and go

[vapid gorge]

and then go insane from load balancing everything

[safe gorge]

how to learn to load balance?

[vapid gorge]

video tutorials.

[opaque pebble]

When the wire in the constructor is completely filled up, the conveyor will start backing up
When the conveyor is backed up all the way to the splitter, the splitter will route everything to its other output holes

[safe gorge]

i know

[dusky dust]

Keep in mind that in general folks set up their machines in Satisfactory to just run forever. You only have 140 wire right now but ten minutes from now you'll have more. It's a neverending accumulation of material

[safe gorge]

do you know good ones?

[dusky dust]

You'll eventually have so much wire stored up you'll never get through it all

[vapid gorge]

no, because load balancing everything is insane

as I said, 'good luck'

[safe gorge]

i don't wanna load balance everything

[dusky dust]

Some folks do like load balancing just for the fun of it, and I agree that in the very early game, when you've only got like mk1 belts, waiting for manifolds to warm up can be annoying

And there's nothing wrong with building load balancers if that's what you want to do

[vapid gorge]

eh, you ahve so few machiens on a mk1 belt it doesn't take any time

[dusky dust]

I would recommend at least trying out manifolds, at least once you've got mk2 belts going on and are producing a bit more.

[vapid gorge]

it gets wildly out of hand very quickly when you have multiple steps though

[dusky dust]

I think you'll eventually come to love them. :)

[safe gorge]

i'm making a phase 3 blueprint

[vapid gorge]

so many people around tiers 3/4 have gone 'yup, LBing everything is a nightmare'

[opaque pebble]

Manifolds work here because raw resources are unlimited

and also because there is no true wastage, just buffers

[vapid gorge]

how are you at phase 3 w/o having had to manifold or load balance?

creative mode? unlocked tech with advanced game settings?

[opaque pebble]

Dedication

[vapid gorge]

they also said they had limited resources to build machines??

[safe gorge]

answer is , i use manifolds for everything

[vapid gorge]

this is getting weirder by the second

[opaque pebble]

atp it's just not worth explaining

[safe gorge]

this assembler needs those stuff , and i don't produce stators or cables

[vapid gorge]

you probably should automate them then

[safe gorge]

i need the load balancers to reach 100% item efficiency, but i just gave up

[vapid gorge]

the elevation change going up to the packager can cause issues yeah

you don't want any elevation changes to the feed pipe in a liquid manifold

honeslty lucky it's such a short manifold, otherwise a single pump might not have fixed it

[digital root]

yea im just tryna do this stuff so i can unlock turbo fuel so i can set up 128 turbo fuel gens

with 600 crude

after i put a pump into it and took it off its working flawlessly

[vapid gorge]

just be more careful with pipes in general. You'll almost certainly need to feed the TF gens with a loop

like this https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1347281805534826537/1347317611750490222/satisfactory-cobalt_of_doom-pipe_manifold.png?ex=67cb62ce&is=67ca114e&hm=e900128bad1a32f326e236a06ba0916c753c96d903372149289682e42801b5a3&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1353&height=1055

[digital root]

so what ur saying is i should have the many fold above where its feeding from so i dont have any problems?

[vapid gorge]

well the loop itself is the important part. It can stabalise back flow.

the top fed pipe like in this example might be more stable than other loops though. It'll have gravity priority to the bottom pipe that feeds the machines.

[digital root]

ok got it

[nimble haven]

any issues that will come from this?

HAHAHAHAH why?

[fallow siren]

you need pump to bring water vertically

extractor only provide 10m of headlift

[nimble haven]

Sooo, how do i make this not take up the amount of space that imma prob need? the pipes are working but now taking up tooo much space

wait, nvm, i can make these pipes take more

[smoky aurora]

i ask myself more why building Nuclear up there in the wood and why not down at some coast ,.. soooo much easier 😄

[nimble haven]

Are you able to?

wait bro. the coast isnt that far away

like . . .

far but not hard.

[smoky aurora]

i would build it down at the huge waterfall ,...

you are located at the Oil nodes ,.. may not blocking them 😄

[nimble haven]

i forgot about the oil node

i also got rid of my whole plant

actually nuc plants at teh coast, tehn bring the waste back here

Look at all that nuc power

[eager knoll]

what alternative recipes are the best for making uranium fuel rod / plutonium / ficsonium ?

[wind spade]

that depends what classifies as "best"

[eager knoll]

well most efficient + resouces saving

resources*

[wind spade]

well, how is "efficient" defined? 🙂
and what resources do you want to save?

basically there's no "best" or "optimal" and it depends a lot on your preferences and goals

[eager knoll]

i would like to save the most resources that is possible like if id needed 3000 iron ore p/m i would like to save some

ignore the efficient

[wind spade]

well yeah but then the question is how do you rank different resources... like is it better to save 5 iron or 2 copper? etc etc.

sorry for giving a no-answer, but it's not as simple 🙂

[eager knoll]

well since copper is "rare resource" i would like to save like 50/50

[wind spade]

generally easiest is to open some production planner and play with the recipes until you're happy with the outcome

[eager knoll]

yea i understand thats why i am trying to ask someone :P cuz this is my first nuke powerplant

[wind spade]

honestly if you don't know, just go with whatever

[eager knoll]

ah tweaking okay i got it ima try my best

bet tysm anyways

[stoic quest]

@nocturne seal

This torch shuts off if you go thru a hypertube

[nocturne seal]

I mean

It might be feature not a bug

Well either way it's just a small incovenience

[stoic quest]

@fierce ruin just for your info this is what i mean

[nocturne seal]

I only use the torch at night

[stoic quest]

Yea I just wanted to show what I mean

[fierce ruin]

OOOOOH. Flashlight. I gotchu

[outer vale]

blashlight

[fierce ruin]

I want 1st person hypertube view

Having my camera change perspectives when zooming by stuff makes me nauseous

[wind spade]

1st person would be even more nauseous imo

[summer flare]

If you double those numbers to get the smallest whole number ratios, you want an assembly that takes 7 parts and distributes to 2 and 5.
Odd numbers, especially primes, will need a merged loopback. To ensure that the merged output doesn't exceed your belt throughput limitations, it's best to have the input split multiple ways and the merging done on these outputs.
In this case, a two way split of the 7 and loopback of 1, will give two of 4. One of these is split two ways to give the required 2 output, the other 2 split two ways to give the 1 loopback and the remaining 1 merged with the other 4 to give the required 5 output.

[opaque quartz]

As has been stated multiple times, manifolds are 100% efficient. Resource nodes are unlimited, so once the machine buffers fill up, the machines run 100% of the time. Nothing is “wasted”

[civic bronze]

I bet on this channel word "manifold" it typed out daily

[opaque quartz]

Almost as if using manifolds is the meta in this game 😬

[dark nymph]

Guys just are happy to unterstand manifolds and dont think of situations where they are not the solution for a distribution problem. So they tend to say that noone should think about balancer.

Oh great, reading the chat above @vapid gorge mentiond fast belts etc. 😀

[neon pewter]

this should be fine

[civic bronze]

Im pretty sure 1 car is enough to output 1200 at constant rate

With the help of ISC

And if train route is long, make same train

[neon pewter]

ISC?

[opaque quartz]

Industrial storage container

[neon pewter]

ah

current logistics under the train

[neon pewter]

at the current setup the round trip would need to be about 16 mins, which should be fine(or not) because it'll be going across the map to the dessert to a mega ore refinement complex that i've yet to start building

[sharp hamlet]

Blender; Heavy Oil Residue + Water = Fuel. I provided the modeller

There is no need to package water, or any fluids for that matter, almost ever. This is a common misconception when using fluids, some sort of fantasy need to package all fluids, however the reality is that there is no requirement to do so. There is a single reason that packaging fluids is "required", to get rid of excess fluids via a Sink. Otherwise, packaging is needed to use as motorized fuel in vehicles/drones/jetpack.

[carmine wigeon]

And also if you haven't unlocked the blender yet but you want to make use of diluted fuel

Or for transporting via train. can pack in more

[sharp hamlet]

3.5 to 1 + 2.5; we first break down 1 to 7, then merge 2 and merge 5. So a splitter 1:3 then each of those into 3, this is effectively a 1: 9. Take the two outside and those merge back into the initial source. This leaves 7. From there merge 2, then merge the remaining 5.

[dry fern]

Yeah, that's what I was getting at, I don't have the blender yet. I probably should've just waited till I unlocked it but it's fine. It'll work the same with just a little extra work.

[sharp hamlet]

Just unlock the blender by "hand", don't try to set up some elaborate set up to do it

[dusky dust]

Packaged Diluted Fuel is easy; no need to rush ahead

Also unlocking the blender might also mean "finishing Space Elevator deliveries" (ie: not a trivial matter of just clicking a few buttons)

As I mentioned before, remember that you can fit the 1x Refinery + 2x Packager closed loop inside a 4x4 blueprint, which can include the empty packages preloaded into the input buffer. It becomes a one-click mini blender.

[dry fern]

Yeah, I haven't set up machines to make the modular engines and adaptive control units yet

[dusky dust]

The only real downside in that scenario is that yeah, it helps to have already automated Empty Canisters, and those little "mini-blender" blueprints only output 60/min (instead of the Blender's 100) but those are pretty minor

And an upside is you get to watch a lot of canisters whizzing around. :)

[dry fern]

I've already got it set up with the packaging system

That is a plus, I like watching stuff on conveyors it's cool. Especially the faster belts

[sharp hamlet]

I had to pull up the hub to confirm, you mentioned you already had the optional diluted fuel recipe so I thought you already had Blender (tier 7). At tier 3 (and 5) I had a coal / fuel / turbo fuel power set up. By the time I reached tier 7, I switched everything to Rocket fuel.

[dry fern]

All good

I'll probably skip turbo fuel and jump straight to rocket fuel. Depends if I wanna mess with these pipes again when I get there lol

[sharp hamlet]

You're on the right path. I'm on my 4th "save", every time I always built a reasonably sized coal power set up, then went to rocket fuel. Make sure to get MK II pipes

[dry fern]

Yeah, I need to expand my coal plant more. (I think I have 32 gens) And I did get the mk2 pipes, this would be so stressful with mk1 pipes

[thick plank]

i mean you can get dilluted fuel as soon as you unlock fuel

[thick plank]

I never really needed any power more advanced then basic fuel until I had nuclear unlocked

[outer vale]

can't use it til you have packagers mind

[thick plank]

IDK why you would need rocket fuel etc

[thick plank]

isnt that on the same tier?

[outer vale]

certainly the same phase, probably same tier, but still a different milestone

[thick plank]

but yeah, youre right to point that out, forgot about that requirement

[opaque quartz]

Refineries, petroleum power, and packagers are all different milestones in the same phase

You would need to unlock all three to do diluted packaged fuel power

[viral sparrow]

the miner doesnt have power

[outer vale]

the belt's not connected

it's attached to that lil stand just before input

[open island]

yes normal i deactivated

oh ok

[open island]

the belt from the mk1 to the smelter?

[outer vale]

well it's not to the smelter, but yes that one

[thorn trail]

good eye

[open island]

Yes thx now it works

[viral sparrow]

you can connect belts directly from machine to machine provided the distance isnt too large

[mystic hawk]

Pipes too

[viral sparrow]

shhhh they dont exist yet

[mystic hawk]

Ohh

[twilit fractal]

@viral sparrow

They are all going idle.

[thorn trail]

need to get rid of the HOR

[twilit fractal]

oh my god

I forgot pipeline pumps for where it extracts the HOR

[viral sparrow]

does it travel up more than 10m ?

[twilit fractal]

My game is so laggy everytime I tab out, and yes

It won't unfreeze when I try to tab in bro 😭

I hope it autosaved, cuz' I gotta refresh

[sharp hamlet]

I don't think I'm understanding correctly. Blender (Diluted Fuel) doesn't unlock until tier 7, while fuel is available from a refinery (Residual Fuel) at tier 5.

[vapid gorge]

packaged diluted fuel

[sharp hamlet]

Rocket fuel offers the highest power / effort ratio available in the game. over 480,000 MW is easily available off the 3 oil nodes in the middle of the map (1200 ppm) and sloops on the final rocket fuel. Even without the sloops, 1200 oil produces 240,000 mw.

[vapid gorge]

a million fuel gens is not low effort
nuclear is simple, just more smaller steps

also modeller is dog shit

[sharp hamlet]

Modeler works great. Nuclear power takes far more effort.

I don't see anything called "Packaged diluted fuel" in recipes and I've unlocked them all.

[vapid gorge]

it is, by far, the worst planner. It only got popular because the author put it on steam.

and if you can't find the existence of one of the most basic recipes I'm not going to take your very seriously

[sharp hamlet]

we'll agree to disagree, the planning tool doesn't account for over clocking and sloops as I need

packaging a liquid doesn't do anything, it converts n-fuel to n-fuel

There is "Packaged Fuel", but there is nothing referrenced as "Packaged Diluted Fuel", especially at tier 5.

[opaque quartz]

Packaged diluted fuel is an alt recipe

[sharp hamlet]

Found it. It's not in the recipe search list for fuel, but found under heavy oil residue. Thank you for helping

not as efficient as diluted fuel (blender), but still useful for tier 5

[dusky dust]

Pakaged Diluted Fuel has the exact same material ratios as Diluted Fuel, btw -- exactly as efficient resourcewise

It's slower; each packaged loop will only produce 60 compared to the Blender's 100, but the material ratios are identical

[glad vigil]

Packaged fuel one is less efficient in terms of energy

[vapid gorge]

a meaninglessly small amount of extra power used

[glad vigil]

Also very painful to setup

[vapid gorge]

packager -> refinery -> unpackager -> back to start

can create a bp and build it in minutes

you can, of course, make things much more painful for yourself like in all things you build in the game.

[dusky dust]

re: the Blueprint that CobaltOfDoom mentioned, also keep in mind: the 1x Refinery + 2x Packager loop can easily fit in the basic mk1 4x4 blueprinter, and you can even include the Empty Canisters in the input buffer. Becomes basically just a 1-click mini-Blender

So not painful at all once you realize that's possible and have it set up. (Admittedly it does generally help to have also already automated Empty Canisters, which some folks might not have thought to do yet)

And it's got the distinct advantage of being available much earlier in the game

(Obvs. everyone prefers the Blender version once you've got it, but why wait that long to dilute your fuel?)

[vapid gorge]

I do hate double fluid input blenders mind you

[glad vigil]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/577227596903743509/1284949646313263144/factorycart_short.mp4?ex=66e87e1c&is=66e72c9c&hm=8f148b4d707c005105cfa20c962437239201cb5df46a6e2b33e30dd89ec795cf&

Yes I did the blueprint thing

[tame obsidian]

okay so there's a roundabout at the top of the screen but i was just using that as a test, eventually it will go to another train station. I just want the trains to go in loops forever, and have signals to make sure they don't hit each other

is this jsut bc i dont have the other station built yet?

[alpine mortar]

if theres only 2 block signals it wont work since a block is guaranteed to have a train if theres only 2 trains 2 blocks

place another block signal somewhere on that loop to create a third block (make sure its large enough to fit the train) and this issue should resolve

[tame obsidian]

ah ic

ok i get it now

thanks

[alpine mortar]

👍

[wind spade]

Super simple, you make a blueprint and then you use that blueprint as sort-of blender

[errant cave]

what is that whitish liquid?

[frosty owl]

Supposedly, it's water...

[thick plank]

I honestly dont understand why you dont like packaged dilluted

its really not that more complicated to build. You just need two more packagers per fuel refinery

[glad vigil]

Nitric acid 😳

[unique cedar]

I changed my factory a little bit, im still new to the game (recently got the space factory :D) so im just curious to ask if this is ok

[fallow siren]

its fine for your first time, u will learn how to build cleaner factory the more you progress

no need to stress yourself at making it looks cool

[unique cedar]

thx

[vapid gorge]

yup this seems fine

clock the machines as needed

[fierce ruin]

the smelters outputs 48 iron ore, but 21 have to go in iron rod and 27 in plates

how can I split the 2 things

[vapid gorge]

manifold

if you want them on one line

[magic dock]

or clock one to 27/min and one 21/min

[vapid gorge]

or 1 smelter makes 21 and one smelter makes 27

[fierce ruin]

but still if I put a splitter, it will go 24 in one smelter and 24 in another smelter

[vapid gorge]

it'll even out over time

[fierce ruin]

alr

[vapid gorge]

this will evenly fill the smelters for example

[wind spade]

And what happens if you give 24/min to something that needs 21/min? 🙂

[fierce ruin]

the other smelter wont work efficiently

[wind spade]

What will happen with the one that gets more?

[fierce ruin]

will always work

but the one that takes more will work less

[vapid gorge]

... it'll eventually get full right?

[wind spade]

And because it gets more than it needs ...?

[fierce ruin]

yes

[vapid gorge]

and what happens when it gets full

[fierce ruin]

idk

[fierce ruin]

ore stop getting in the smelter

[wind spade]

And when it gets full, where will the extra resources go?

[fallow siren]

it will eventually fills the 21/min and the rest will go to 27/min, thats how manifold works

[vapid gorge]

and go to ....

[fierce ruin]

the other one

[fierce ruin]

to the other smelter

[wind spade]

Exactly 🙂

[fierce ruin]

ty

[wind spade]

So it will self-balance that way

[vapid gorge]

the other main way is to have 2 smelters
1 making 21
1 making 27 and jsut feed them like that

[fierce ruin]

I did some calculations

48 ÷ 2 = 24
24 ÷ 2 = 12
12 ÷ 2 = 6
6 ÷ 2 = 3

21 = 12 + 6 + 3
27 = 24 + 3

so that means that I can use splitters and mergers to make it more balanced?

[vapid gorge]

it'll be 10x more work and work the same

but that's up to you

[fierce ruin]

and it will be not a good looking factory maybe

[vapid gorge]

some people like Load Balancing. That's what that's called btw

[magic dock]

It can also cause issues if one would back up

[vapid gorge]

some people like the look.

[fierce ruin]

right

[fierce ruin]

like me, but I cant make good looking factories

[magic dock]

If you like it, its good looking. Thats all that matters

[vapid gorge]

tiers 1-9 are like a long tutorial. Just learn how to build

make pretty factories after

[sharp hamlet]

Nitric Acid, thanks for catching that. Updated. Also updated with titles and options for poly resin.

[fierce ruin]

I still have a issue on how to make it look good while the nodes are far away

[magic dock]

And don't be afraid to ask for suggestions or feedback on designs in #design-and-architecture everybody is always down to brainstorm with you

[vapid gorge]

don't. It'll be a lot of wasted effort right now. Just go up the milestones

[fierce ruin]

I almost finished the game

that's why im asking this

[vapid gorge]

and you've never manifolded? or looked at makign a basic set up like this before?

[fierce ruin]

imma send a pic in #design-and-architecture

ops

[sharp hamlet]

To be honest, I don't think I've ever realized that doubling fuel with that particular recipe was available that early in the game (tier 5). As such, I never incorporated that particular game strategy and simply used blended on tier 7. Easier? probably, but since my personal power goal was, is and always has been rocket fuel, it may have changed my game play slightly at tier 5, but overall I would keep using blenders.

[vapid gorge]

seems very odd you're asking about a very basic beginner challenge then

[sharp hamlet]

whole heartedly agree, there are too many items, machines and belts needed for larger factories. complete the tiers/ phases relatively quickly, then expand

[stoic quest]

first lil bro flew away, the other 2 are stuck, what an interesting encounter

what is even happening on this trip bruh, left with 0.1 health or sumthn

[sharp hamlet]

Looked like you were attempting to switch to parachute manually and you hit the ground before opening it. You can hotkey switch anything for your hands inventory simply by opening inventory (tab), then pressing 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 etc. This allows quick and near instantaneous swapping of jetpack, parachute, hover etc.

[stoic quest]

interesting, thanks

[viral sparrow]

if your full health you dont die of falling

[summer flare]

This is one of the easiest to do proportional distribution or "load balancing".
The simplest ratio for the 27/21 iron ingots is 9/7 so an assembly that distributes 16 parts to 9 and 7 will do the job.
The iron rod distribution 12/9, simplified is 4/3 so is a 7 part distribution to 4 and 3 is required.
A single assembly can be used to do this for the iron ingots, as a 16 part distribution for 3 separate lines, 9 for the iron plates, 3 for the iron rods making the screws (or cast screw) and 4 for the iron rods that go to the manufacturer making the modular frames.

[fierce ruin]

bro wth 😭

[opaque quartz]

Or you could just not bother with any of that and do a manifold 🤷‍♂️

Or clock your groups of machines and direct feed

[agile cairn]

How many coal power plants can one mk1 pump run? I currently have 3 connected but am afraid to do more haha

[carmine wigeon]

Pump has no effect on throughput

The pipe affects the throughput

[opaque quartz]

I assume by pump you mean water extractor

How much water does a coal plant take? How much does an extractor produce?

It’s pretty simple math tbh

[civic bronze]

Hmm water extractor produces 2 /s, coal gen takes 180/4min

[carmine wigeon]

Yes that seems like the most reasonable approach

[agile cairn]

Kinda snarky. Ill keep the stupid questions to myself 🤷‍♂️

[opaque quartz]

Trying to encourage you to work it out for yourself, it only gets more complicated from here 😊

[stoic quest]

huhhhhh???

gotta try this out

[viral sparrow]

(i say this with 80% confidence)

[opaque quartz]

Yes, if you have a completely full health bar you won’t die from a fall. I believe there’s an achievement for it too

[viral sparrow]

yeah

[stoic quest]

you were right

@magic dock have you shown your omega factory in here?

kinda curious how it looks like

[rain lichen]

exCUSE ME??

this just seems like a flat out GOOD recipe if you got coal nearby 😓

[river night]

It is good

[sharp hamlet]

Load balancing, or proportional distribution, is often over analyzed in Satisfactory. In nearly every case, it’s a solution to a problem that doesn’t actually exist. While an interesting concept, it's usually easier to let the machines self-regulate. For a 27-to-21 split, a basic splitter suffices. Initially, the output will divide 24/24, but once one side backs up (only consuming 21), the overflow naturally redirects to the other, achieving the desired split without any effort of any kind.

[wind spade]

I mean all recipes are "good" in some cases

[magic dock]

#screenshots message (Dedicated thread: https://discord.com/channels/370472939054956546/1306740216890916987)

[stoic quest]

Xd

[earnest ravine]

if i may ask what are you using for that mathing of yours.

[vapid gorge]

the worst planner in existence

Modeler

try tools, https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production
or really any other

[earnest ravine]

thanks

[blissful crypt]

hey I'm looking for a extremely customizable planner, as I need to spilt 592.5 iron Ingots into 405 and 187.5.

[vapid gorge]

excel

make a plan in tools and then put down the details in excel. much faster than manipulating a bunch of boxes in a browser

[wind spade]

Make two sets of machines, one making 405 and one 187.5

[storm imp]

Not sure this is the place to ask.. But how come Biomass Burners doesn't charge Power Storage?

I've just setup 100 Power Storage units - but my army of Biomass Burners doesn't help charge them up :/

[thorn trail]

biomass burners only function on demand, and power storage isn't considered demand

you need an always running power source to charge power storage

[storm imp]

Yeah luckily I got some extra capacity from Geysers (Hence the fluctuation in power)

Not sure if the Priority Power Switches (Never played with them) can split the power grid, so as long as the Power Storage is charging, the Geysers will be directed to those, instead of supplying the factory, and the Biomass Burners can supply the factory grid..

I know its a little special situation, as most people would have more self supplied power grid by Coal and Oil, which I've opted out from as a sort of challenge towards my self..

[thorn trail]

worst case you could manually split the power grid to charge the storage

since it sounds like you already have it somewhat wired that way

[storm imp]

I don't have my power split, but could be forced to route it that way if necessary as ~5 hours charge time for the battery pack aint really ideal lol

[glad vigil]

Charcoal

[mystic hawk]

Cringe

[wind spade]

also good in some cases

[thorn trail]

automated portable miner production is the one I can never see using

i suppose some people like having a stockpile of them for building miners

[wind spade]

it's fine if you don't want to use it, but it's great in case you want to just have them in depots in cases of building miners and drones

[thorn trail]

btw greeny, do you take suggestions for SatisfactoryTools or are you pretty much not touching it except for game updates?

[wind spade]

suggestions are fine, but current ongoing plan is to write new tools from scratch, so it most likely won't be added to current tools, unless some specific case

[thorn trail]

just a UI suggestion, adding a set of radio buttons for Phase 1-5 that would restrict the machines and recipes based on which Phase you selected

and thanks for your all your work you've already done, it is quite a useful and slick site

[wind spade]

while some things are tied to a phase, some aren't, so it would be hard to define what is available in which phase

[remote flame]

When I want to build something with the appropriate phase on satisfactorytools, I just disable any machines I have not unlocked yet (So below Tier 4, you won't have refineries/manufacturers etc). That also wipes out any recipes that the building uses ofc. And yeah I get what you mean though, convenience 🙂

[thorn trail]

yes, as do I, it would just be a convenience thing

[dark nymph]

I hope next ui is more intuitive 😅

[languid ember]

Love love love your site. Any thoughts on hosting a non-ad-riddled blueprint site?

[wind spade]

hosting a file-sharing service is kinda problematic due to possibilty of spreading viruses and such. And for that I'd need to add things like parsing blueprint files, which is a lot of work.

That being said, I'd love to do so if I had time. (but there's also the question whether it is worth to do so, since most people just use SCIM for that)

[languid ember]

They do by default, but the ads are intrusive and the search/filtering functionality is poor.

The map is great, though!

[wind spade]

the problem is how to move people to use my site if it has no blueprints

[wind spade]

is there something non-intuitive about current UI?

[viral sparrow]

you concern me @civic bronze

thats enough for 24 tpr /min i think

[civic bronze]

Oh so i will be able to use it, cool xd

[viral sparrow]

24 tpr is a LOT

[civic bronze]

I think ill just do 6

[viral sparrow]

thats 15 modular engines , 6 turbo motors , 18 cooling systems and 6 fused frames

[civic bronze]

Ill need to get new power production before ill think about making this

[thick plank]

What is the mist efficient production method for rubber/plastic in regards to oil (so the best oil/plastic ratio, ignoring power, space, other resources etc.)

I never actually did the calculation for that

[civic bronze]

i've been told before - the recycled recipes

but i wouldn't let to cut my hand on that

[limber nest]

has anyone made something like a 20 warp drive per min factory?

working on finishing phase 5 stuff but ultimately the plan is to do something insane like that for golden nut achievement

[dusky dust]

It's a combo of Heavy Oil Residue, Diluted Fuel (packaged or otherwise), Residual Rubber, and Recycled Plastic+Rubber (feeding into each other). Results in 3x the oil split however you want between rubber/plastic/fuel

(Though going too heavy on fuel will eventually drag the 3x down a bit)

[civic bronze]

wait so if the game rounds up to the 3rd digit, then fuel gen at 150% clock will take 6.25 instead of 6.2505? (4.167 x 1.5 = 6.2505) (rocket fuel)

or will it take 6.26

or wtf will happen

[opaque quartz]

Fuel gen at 240% takes exactly 10 rocket fuel/min FYI. Produces 600 MW

[civic bronze]

oh thanks

[opaque quartz]

That’s what I always build my gens at for rocket fuel power, makes mathing out the number of gens easy

[civic bronze]

Yeah made it really easy, Ima be adding 60Gw to my power

[wind spade]

game doesn't round anything for its calculations except for clock speed (4 decimals)

everything you see is a rounded value in UI though (but that rounded value isn't used in calculations, the "exact" one is)

[civic bronze]

i see

[civic bronze]

tho 10/2.4 is 4.166 and not 4.167

[wind spade]

wel rocket fuel burns at 4.166666666.../min

[civic bronze]

lol

that makes sense now

[unborn ermine]

Yeah if you want the fraction, 25/6

thats more for calculations, but it helps you figure out nice generator ratios.

[civic bronze]

Thanks, figured it out now with 240% > 10/min bones told me about , 1000/min = 100 gens at 2.4x, therefore 1000/min = 240 gens at 1x. 100/24, 50/12, 25/6

[opaque quartz]

[Finn the Human voice] Mathematical!

[civic bronze]

[Bmo] Yes Finn. it goes in my butt

[dreamy nimbus]

(modeler time) how to make it always select PPM instead of percentage ?

[vapid gorge]

no idea, modeler is the worst planner

[dreamy nimbus]

modeler is a manual planner it's fine nah ?

[vapid gorge]

it takes so much longer than basically any other planner and if you want to break up one of the fast plans you can easily make some quick notes on parts per min and how many machines are in a group with a spread sheet or even paper. And do it much faster

[dreamy nimbus]

at this point it's preference

[vapid gorge]

use SCIM or Tools to make a main plan and just jot down a few notes on how you're breaking up the processes

[dreamy nimbus]

sadge that doesn't answer my question

tools is great, calcs less great, but I just want to be able to do it my way

It's fine either way I'll get used to percentages

[opaque quartz]

Maybe the modeler author has their own discord. They’ve not ever been active here afaik

[deft lichen]

@dreamy nimbus @opaque quartz the modeler has a discord linked on its steam page

[thin plank]

only gen not getting enough is one on far right

already did the calcualtions I have enough extractors

why is it not getting the correct amount

[nimble haven]

That looks very beautiful. What are the white materials on the bottum right. some of its not "full"\

[wind spade]

How much water are you moving through that pipe?

[thin plank]

its only moving like 16pm for some reason

[rain lichen]

how much are you supposed to be moving?

like how much do all the generators need combined

[wind spade]

No, how much do you need to move

[thin plank]

720 for all the gens

[rain lichen]

through one pipe? 😨

won't work

[thin plank]

found the issue

the pipe connected to it has no water moving into it for some reason

[civic bronze]

thanks, its not very efficient to build flat in 3d game tho 😅 do you mean framed glass floor? some of it got out of my short render distance

[viral sparrow]

those are glass frame foundations

[nimble haven]

Why use the glass frames?

[civic bronze]

just to fill the space without machines

[wind spade]

the issue is that you have 720 water and you try to push it through 300 pipe

the extra 420 water can't go there

[nimble haven]

Is a mk3 blueprint worth?

[deft lichen]

on one hand the lack of verticality looks funny, on the other it's cool to see everything laid out

[wind spade]

if you need to blueprint something that's 6x6x6, sure

[nimble haven]

its just . . . . BIG

Like i dont even have the space to put it down lol

[wind spade]

well most people complain that BPs are small lol

(me personally I think they are big enough)

[nimble haven]

I am going to need to expand my base. I messed up by building everything so close atthe beginning so now i need to not only make blueprints of them but also connect them.

[wind spade]

honestly, blueprints are not required to build things, you can easily play the game without using a single one

[nimble haven]

This will hopefully give me the opportunity to unnoodle my conveyors

[nimble haven]

I know that but it does make it easier to build something in an empty space that can be deleted ALL with one button.

[wind spade]

yeah, but personally I wouldn't delete anything, even a bad factory still makes stuff

[lethal tapir]

The Bps are perfectly fine for most situations it seems

Havnt had to much of an issue with the sizes

Later game though I could see limits

[nimble haven]

I have made a single BP that im proud of. and i havnt touched it again. I wanan do that but a few more times.

[lethal tapir]

I made a 12x constructor manifold and a little refinery 1

[civic bronze]

mk2 is enough for me, with mk3 i would probably only do 1:2 trainstation

[opaque quartz]

Mk3 blueprint is useful for NPPs, can’t fit them in the smaller ones

[nimble haven]

Hey what is the best way to place a partical accelerator to make it take up as little space?

[civic bronze]

When you downclock it, it shrinks so build them at 25% that my recommendation

Jk, what do you expect as an answer? Theres enough space on the map, dont worry about expanding, build big if u need

[thick plank]

also build big if you have no reason to do it. More building means more destroyed nature, wich means a happier ada and a more efficient engeneer

[dreamy nimbus]

mk3 is cheaper than mk2 though

[ornate dragon]

is there a way to make train throughput match the machines output vs a belt?

or will it always be less

[amber umbra]

@ornate dragon For train stations, do 1 belt feeding an industrial storage container feeding 2 belts to the station. Vice versa for unload.

[ornate dragon]

Is it better to wait for the station to fill? or run loops constantly

[amber umbra]

Then make sure the train has excess throughput relative to the belt feeding it via keeping the route short enough.

You can do the train schedule multiple ways. I personally prefer using "full/empty OR 10,000 s" which causes the train to only move when full/empty.

But it depends how you setup your trains. I do the simple, robust style where a train only carries one item type per train. Trains are a lot though, so watch a guide.

[ornate dragon]

Its currently a closed loop short haul for quickwire

output is 450/wire min, only have mk4 belts

Input requirement is 410/min but I am only showing 370~ish, I'll try having it wait for a full load

Overall it the time waiting during animation will be less even though initial startup will be slower

I think lol

[amber umbra]

Trains just take quite a while to really get a feel for. Get in game and starting playing with them is best way to answer things.

[ornate dragon]

Yep this is basically my learning track

I have a big mainline for output pickup back into a main storage facility but I've never used them for processing yet

[pastel obsidian]

I would say wait, when a train unloads it stops for 30 seconds

[opaque quartz]

You need the ISC buffer on each train platform to keep throughput going when the station is loading/unloading

[ornate dragon]

I do have crates on in/out for their respective stations

[opaque quartz]

Being able to do two belts in/out allows the buffer to “catch up” w the platform once the load and unload are done

[ornate dragon]

It seems like I was losing my throughput from the wait times because a loop is about a minute

[opaque quartz]

You could try pausing the train for a minute or two and letting the supply side buffer fill up somewhat

[vapid gorge]

it doesn't look like you have your train platforms buffered

[opaque quartz]

I usually build my network and get the platforms loading long before I start running any trains

[ornate dragon]

Buffered platforms?

[opaque quartz]

ISC in front of the platform. What we’ve been talking about

[ornate dragon]

Its underneath

[opaque quartz]

You say you do but they are not visible in your screenshots

[vapid gorge]

you've only got 1 belt coming out of your platform though

[opaque quartz]

You need to connect both ports to the platform

[vapid gorge]

into it

[ornate dragon]

Is that necesarry with 480 speed belts and 450 output of items?

[vapid gorge]

1 belt into ISC , 2 belts from ISC to platform

otherwise the buffer basically doesn't do anything

[opaque quartz]

Yes, because the platform is paused for 30 seconds when loading and unloading

[vapid gorge]

and then the reverse on the delivery side

[amber umbra]

It is true that you technically can do feed greater than consumption and just do 1 belt in/out. In practice just do the 2 belt, 1 belt thing. Want to say the 1/1 thing only works at low item/minute rates. I just do the simple style so haven't thought about it in forever.

[opaque quartz]

So you need that second belt to catch up

[ornate dragon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1213961834759983114.webp?size=96&animated=true

[amber umbra]

Since it wasn't explicitly said, when a station is loading/unloading, it pauses the belts into/outof the station. It doesn't make sense why it does that, but the ISC thing is the workaround.

Very unintuitive that the station buffer needs an extra buffer.

[ornate dragon]

So if I am understanding correctly, I can keep the train going constantly without waiting for a full load if I buffer with ISC + 2 belts

[amber umbra]

Those two things aren't related.

[vapid gorge]

and then do this on the delivery side

[nimble haven]

anyone got a very big but organized nuclear power plant? i wanna expand but the amount of space a convayor takes up with one nuclear, i ned i deas

[civic bronze]

#screenshots message can you guys roast him like u roast me about uneven numbers

Also, splitters in factory planner? Why?

[vapid gorge]

@gritty notch , @civic bronze is being mean to you and making fun of your hatred of decimals

[civic bronze]

👆 that's right

@gritty notch .5 aint that bad grow up pioneer 😎 (btw no need to balance it, it will balance itself)

[wind spade]

I think their question was about splitting rather than decimals

[civic bronze]

there was no question tho

[nimble haven]

how would is work

[nimble haven]

what are the refineries making for this?

[smoky aurora]

this looks wild 😄

[civic bronze]

bruh you gonna have to manually set the route for each drone port, just go with belts man

[nimble haven]

Not my buil,d its reddit

[gritty notch]

does it like, automatically split correctly or what?

[outer vale]

if we're talking manifolds, yes their premise is that eventually they'll self-balance (assuming supply = demand)

eventually being the operative word there, depending on numbers it may take a long time

[gritty notch]

just regular splitters though, I can't do manifolds yet

[smoky aurora]

as long theres enough input on belts it fills up 1 machine by the other ,...

[outer vale]

manifolds use regular splitters

it's just a method of building

[gritty notch]

cause I was messing around with production planner looking at methods to make modular frames and it was giving me uneven math with singular splitters lol

[smoky aurora]

splitters basically dont change the math itself ,.. they just split input on attached lanes

[outer vale]

roughly the way it works is

• you start with an uneven split, but you're supplying the right amount
• because it's uneven, one side will initially get more than it uses, so gradually fills up and backs up the belts on that side
• once that side's fully backed up, it can only take items as quickly as it uses them, so the excess now goes the other way

[gritty notch]

ah, I see
I was trying to 1/1 it but ig that works too, ima have to look into manifolds

[outer vale]

there are other options, including mixing and matching

main one would be clocking your machines into groups that don't need that sort of splitting. Whether that's by groups, or direct input

since direct input is just groups of 1

[harsh schooner]

could u drop the reddit link by a chance?

[nimble haven]

Sorry I closed out of it a long time ago, but I went to r/satisfactory and searched “nuclear”. I found ideas but lots of mega plants that where just tooo much for me

[vapid gorge]

dumbly

[civic bronze]

Based

[nimble haven]

Mmm

[mild rampart]

Those pipes look nearly perfect

Its all NEARLY perfect 90 degrees

Looks wonderful tho

[rain lichen]

nuclear's fun. 1/4th of my required water, not accounting for plutonium and eventually the last tier of fuel rod

(overclocked)

[civic bronze]

Oh boy

You about to become Mario

[rain lichen]

well hopefully i won't enter any pipes 😓

[civic bronze]

Yeah, because once you do after this is complete, there is no way out

[rain lichen]

oopsies

minor miscalculation

wait nvm im being stupid again

[nimble haven]

What is the most organized why i an get the nuclear waste from here to my farm without too much clutter?

[viral sparrow]

if you dont want belts visible on top use lfits to put them underneath

which you seem to have done for rods anyway

[viral sparrow]

basically, what i was saying, is to make the petroleum coke youll have access to residual fuel anyways, which you can burn for more power output

[gentle zephyr]

@viral sparrowokey, but do i need to switch my powersource?

[viral sparrow]

you dont need to change them at all, leave your coal plants down for as long as you want, more power is always good

theres plenty of coal on the map so you dont have to worry about that

and you can connect multiple different power sources to the same grid with no issue

[gentle zephyr]

ye but i have nothing better atm

so i need to extend my current.....

[viral sparrow]

heres how i calculated that if you were curious

my G's are a bit ugly but oh well

[gentle zephyr]

i dont get it haha

[viral sparrow]

same heavy oil residue output is on both sides

to make petroleum coke, youd need 5 refineries, taking 30 mw each for a total of 150mw

to make residual fuel, youd need 3.333, taking roughly 100 mw

petroleum coke makes 1800mw total, and fuel makes 1666.66mw total

[gentle zephyr]

so its better to just connect as much coal to what i have?

[viral sparrow]

however, petroleum coke also costs 230mw more

[viral sparrow]

you have access to fuel right?

[gentle zephyr]

yup but i havent used it for more then vehicles yet

[viral sparrow]

okay, fuel is more power efficient than coal

[fallow siren]

fuel are easier to setup

just place gen and pipe

[viral sparrow]

yeah you dont need to worry about water too

also, with fuel, there are alt recipes that give you way more power output

[gentle zephyr]

so i can put it in canisters into coal generators?

[viral sparrow]

you need to unlock petroleum power in the hub first, then place fuel generators

[fallow siren]

coal gen doesnt accept anything except coke and coal itself

[gentle zephyr]

okey

[viral sparrow]

(and compacted coal)

[wind spade]

Compacted coal

[fallow siren]

yeah forgot that exist

bcs i rarely use compacted for coal gen

[wind spade]

(And the gen tells you what it accepts when you build it)

[viral sparrow]

heres the same amount of heavy oil residue converted into 5000mw

[gentle zephyr]

inj what phase do i unluck petroleum power?

[fallow siren]

phase 3

[viral sparrow]

its with oil

same tier

[gentle zephyr]

oh i already did

[viral sparrow]

this uses diluted packaged fuel alt recipe if your wondering, the steel canisters loop back into each other at 1:1 ratio

[gentle zephyr]

so its a totally new setup now?

[fallow siren]

you can set a BP for the canister loop since its 1:1:1 ratio

[gentle zephyr]

okey

[viral sparrow]

it entirely depends on whether you want more power or not

[dusky dust]

That same layout in a more sensible solver, fwiw...

[viral sparrow]

this works fine

[viral sparrow]

how is it more sensible?

[dusky dust]

Check out all that "telling you exactly what's happening instead of having to guess recipes and materials!"

[fallow siren]

oil > hor > diluted fuel is the most efficient oil alt you can get if you want to squish every bit of oil

[viral sparrow]

you dont have to guess, and modeler lets you input whatever you want

its easier for me to organise

if you cant follow it, then thats your problem

[dusky dust]

You absolutely have to guess if someone just posts an image with a lot of rando icons on it

[viral sparrow]

how?

[gentle zephyr]

@fallow sirenThanks

[viral sparrow]

its clear what each input and output is

[dusky dust]

I have seen zero Modeler graphs which have any indication about what recipes machines are using

And many resources have very similar-looking icons

[viral sparrow]

you dont need the name of every recipe lmao you can (mostly) see by just looking

[fallow siren]

thats why i use both, modeler for my own and if i want to share a whole production line im using tools 🙃

[dusky dust]

On satisfactorytools.com graphs you can tell instantly exactly what's being used. On a Modeller graph you've gotta specifically look at each individual step, and then compare it to a wiki page or whatever to figure out what recipe it's using. Sure, if you happen to recognize it then lucky you, but there are a lot of recipes

I would hate Modeller graphs far less if they actually labelled things usefully

[viral sparrow]

its pretty clear what almost every recipe is but you do you

i say almost because bolted plate/frame use the same materials

[dusky dust]

It requires a lot of in-brain synthesis which is absolutely an impediment to information-sharing

Why not actually label recipes and resources?

[viral sparrow]

itd be great if they did yeah but it isnt the end of the world

[dusky dust]

It just creates more work for anyone looking at the graph and trying to understand it

[viral sparrow]

its not any more complicated...

[dusky dust]

I acknowledge that maybe as something you created, it's useful to you, because you're the one who created it and you understand how it's put together

But it's absolutely awful for sharing info, IMO

I've yet to see a single Modeller graph which was instantly understandable at a glance

[fallow siren]

yeah actually idk why they didn't put any label until you actually hover your mouse to it

[dusky dust]

It really would make most of my complaints about it essentially evaporate

[fallow siren]

would definitely be a good update

[dusky dust]

I suppose this has, rather nicely, solidified for myself what I don't like about it -- not that Modeller itself is a bad tool necessarily, but that its graphs are awful at actually conveying information.

Every single step of comprehension when looking through a graph requires extra mental effort from the viewer, and the viewer might not even have the necessary info

What recipe's being used to make X? Well, I can look at the inputs and if I'm familiar with it then maybe I can recall the name off the top of my head, but also maybe I've literally never even seen the recipe before

Is that building an assembler or a foundry? You've gotta zoom in sometimes to even know -- an experienced player would probably know in general anyway, but a newer player wouldn't necessarily

Is that resource Coal or Compacted Coal?

That part over there is some kind of Space Elevator part, but damned if I can remember which icon goes with that one; it's not like you see them often

Just every single step requires thought and deduction and (in many cases) prior internalized knowledge, or else you may have to be looking at a wiki to even know what a recipe is

You take some rando graph making HMFs and it could take someone minutes to suss out what recipes are being used

Whereas if things were just effing labelled it'd be so much clearer

Honestly that really is all I want out of the thing, in the end -- just actually provide the information upfront. Don't make a viewer have to jump through dozens of hoops just to be able to interpret the thing

Anyway, rant over. :D

[nimble haven]

thank you to the davs for making a no spider filer.

uh oh. i didnt know trains could be weight down.

[polar mauve]

Yeah they get slower with every full car

More engines will speed them up though

[nimble haven]

wdym more engines?

you mean mor electric locomotive?

one on front one on back?

i thought it was gonna be way more complcated than just putting another one on the back.

[polar mauve]

Yes

Just put more anywhere on the train and it'll go faster

[nimble haven]

yup, i noticed right away. just build and it work

[polar mauve]

Yup it's pretty easy

Don't let this happen

I went too fast too close

[odd raptor]

ive never used trains so i dont see the issue

[polar mauve]

Run into one and it gets knocked off the track

[odd raptor]

oh. thats neat

[polar mauve]

You can see the other one on the ground all apart

[pastel obsidian]

The front fell off

[civic bronze]

hm, been wondering, is there a difference if i type out manually i want to make "0.3333/min" of item and when i type "1/3" since its possible to enter calculations in the machine clock speed

[pastel obsidian]

Yes

[civic bronze]

what i mean, when i type "0.3333" its finite number, you know, its 0.33330, but 1/3 is 0.3333... infinite - and you said game don't round anything for calculations, only in ui

[vapid gorge]

afaik, it'll only register the 4th decimal no matter what you type in. Fraction or no

it's just that you can type in an equation if you like

[pastel obsidian]

The game will turn the fraction into a number

[vapid gorge]

and only read to the 4th decimal of that number

[civic bronze]

intresting

[wind spade]

I said anything except for clock speed

[vapid gorge]

what other thing is there in the game that it could not round?

[civic bronze]

right, but there's computer recipe that makes 3.333

does it make 10/3 or 3.3330

[wind spade]

3.33333... infinite

Because game doesn't work with per minute values at all

Game works with cycles and whole items

So it makes 2 computers every 36 seconds

[civic bronze]

then how can i clock a machine to take it if i can't clock infinite

[wind spade]

Well... depends on recipe

[oblique hollow]

Some numbers are not representable in binary or decimal, such as 10/3. So you go with whatever value is close enough for you

3.334 or 3.333 instead of 3.333333 is something that takes hundreds of hours before any kind of error appears

add one more decimal and it takes 10 x longer for an error to appear

I always work with these repeating decimals and i have yet to run into any issue from that

(as expected for such a timescale)

[pastel obsidian]

If you are worrying about the difference of 0.001 I think it might be time to touch some grass

[oblique hollow]

60 x 33.3333% vs actual 20/min would be a difference of 11 items after one year of ingame time. ... out of 10.5 MILLION items made

[civic bronze]

hm, seem like thinking in time cycles recipes seem fine - i make (3.3333.../min) 2 computers every 36 seconds, i build radio control unit which at 100% takes 2 computers every 48 seconds, i overclock it to 133.3333% and it takes 2 computers every 36 seconds now

nah im not worrying im just curious, could always learn something

[oblique hollow]

the game rounds the / min values it displays

just like it rounds 5.625 to 5.63

so that 3.3333 might be 3.33334 or whatever

but you wouldnt ever really know

[civic bronze]

thats funny

[wind spade]

Technically that's 36.000009 seconds per cycle, but yeah, unless you want exact numbers, it probably can be safely ignored

[civic bronze]

ohhhhh

someone gotta do a 1 year time lapse and catch a yellow light on the machine

[thorn trail]

are we sure that the devs aren't adding in the remainder to production after quotient number of production runs? seems like they are already doing something similar to that with odd slooped production counts

[wind spade]

yes, we are sure, because game doesn't care about items/min

[nimble haven]

Hey with the "Alien Power Augmenter" how do i get the circuit boost from 10% to 100%?

[wind spade]

build 10 of them

[dreamy nimbus]

add more of them

[nimble haven]

oh.can i just make 100 of them and get 10000%

[wind spade]

you won't have that many sloops

[dreamy nimbus]

you won't

there's I think like 108 somersloops

[nimble haven]

Whats the max %?

[dreamy nimbus]

well then 100 I'd say

[wind spade]

1080%

[civic bronze]

why do you want spoilers

[dreamy nimbus]

that's a lot

[wind spade]

power is practically infinite even without the boosters

[dreamy nimbus]

greeny did it before me :0

[nimble haven]

So whats the point in making a big nuclear gen farm if 10 alien things like boost it?

wait, dont answer that. nvm.

[wind spade]

they boost your power production, you still need to make power

[nimble haven]

oh

[thorn trail]

because to some people ( myself included ) sloops are much more valuable to boost production

power is easy to come by, boosting production without increasing material costs is much more valuable IMO

[nimble haven]

how many nuclear gens would i need for 12 particale accelerators to not be enough?

[wind spade]

depends on recipes on the PAs

[nimble haven]

wiat there are more recipes for those???

[vapid gorge]

and what you've clocked the gens at

[pastel obsidian]

Use one of the calculator tools to find out

[nimble haven]

how many drives are there?

[wind spade]

more than you need

[civic bronze]

same, i dont plan on building a single augumenter on my save, i like using sloops in production

[dreamy nimbus]

phase 5 you unlock more recipes too

[wind spade]

why keep asking spoiler questions?

[nimble haven]

SHould i at the half way point OC them or make "too much" then OC

[nimble haven]

im 3 iteoms that need to be made from completing phase 5

[vapid gorge]

do whatever you like

[dreamy nimbus]

great

[nimble haven]

yah i dont really know hwo to articulate this.

[smoky crater]

The pink is a two way railroad two stations. The red is a rough guess of what i plan to built and add 5 more stations. Any thoughts?

[wind spade]

making a loop is not very efficient

[thorn trail]

i think it looks a bit like the Big Dipper

[smoky crater]

I havent even looked at other peoples system so im going off of what I thought made sense

[vapid gorge]

well you force every train to do the whole loop instead of having a 2 way rail to take a short path

[wind spade]

shortest travel time - direct connection from A to B

[smoky crater]

It is two way and the stations have u turns so they can turn at any station

[wind spade]

you still need to go around the island instead of straight

[vapid gorge]

that looks like a single rail

show an actual image of it?

[smoky crater]

im using the Community Railway Set

https://ficsit.app/mod/CommunityRailwaySet

a bit modified

removing some of the unnecessary stuff

[vapid gorge]

we would need to see what yo uactually built and how

not random blueprints

[smoky crater]

give me a min

[wind spade]

roundabouts 🤢

[smoky crater]

just built this one

[fallow siren]

is it fine if i put truck station in a row like this?

[vapid gorge]

ok so it is two lanes, yeah add more stations if you like

[smoky crater]

but i shouldnt do the loop around the island?

[vapid gorge]

my only recommendation is

a) not use roundabouts, they are there because they were built as generic stations w/o knowing which way you need things going

b) build your own rail so you actually learn how to do things instead of building other people's factories

[vapid gorge]

if it's two way and your trains can turn around then it doesn't really matter if it's a loop if it services your needs

[smoky crater]

I tried building my own rail when i played back in September but it looked like crap so i tried using blueprints this time around

[vapid gorge]

all vehicles and logistics options have a learning curve it's true, everyone's first rail's look like crap

mine were certainly garbage at first

in general I would say, probably for everyone, that all first attempts at a style of doing things or using new mechanics in this game will be terrible your first go. Or at best ... functional but awful

[oblique hollow]

ever truck that drives under one will dock and either take or offload items.
If you want that its fine

[smoky crater]

I'm like 20 hours into this save so im not ready to start over yet but ill definitely make it custom next time around

thanks for the help btw

[pastel obsidian]

Platform looks sick

[proven pawn]

What do i get

[wind spade]

whichever you want

you can get all recipes anyway

[proven pawn]

well of these 2, which do i get

[wind spade]

again, whichever you want/need
or flip a coin

there's no "better" with alt recipes, they are tradeoffs and it depends on you whether you like them or not

[proven pawn]

oke

[nimble haven]

it would be cool if there was a stat on the amount of items and what the items where that have all gone into the awesome sinmk

[pastel obsidian]

ReScan

[nimble haven]

?

[vapid gorge]

if you think one recipe might be useful for your next factory? pick that, if there isn't rescan or pick at random 🙂

[civic bronze]

Was just checking discussion page for clockspeed, what the hell is this (apparently still doesnt work, just different numbers)

This is just what hiding decimals does

We should be able to click any production number to open a window with infinite scroll wheel lmao

[dreamy nimbus]

there aren't that many bauxite nodes on the map though...

[civic bronze]

Wait how does power work, on ticks?

[deft lichen]

Unsurprisingly a post from 2019 is a bit outdated

Generator clock speed was hell before update 7

[remote flame]

Something about that already doesn't make sense. The Mk2 Miner at 100% is 15MW draw. at 110%, The miner Mk2. needs exactly 15(110/100)^log(2.5) = approx. 17.014MW.
Now a 15% Coal generator is 11.25MW (75MW x 15%), as all generators scale linearly regardless if above or below 100% clockspeed. I think I recall a time when this was not the case, but I couldn't tell you exactly when.

So doing the exact same test, you could run a mk2. miner at approx 80.4429% (just substituting in clockspeed in the above equation [ 15*(x/100)^log(2.5)=11.25 ]) from a 15% clocked coal gen 🙂
In terms of decimals though.. if you rely on decimal points in your power grid.. I feel like just building a bigger power grid could completely fix that problem lol

[civic bronze]

oh i didn't notice the note "Since miner mk2 power usage changed in the newest patch, here's an updated example:" is also from 2019 my bad, i just assumed

[wind spade]

Computer can't represent the number properly anyway

[wind spade]

also missed this

each tick each gen eats X MJ from the fuel in it, if it can't, that gen doesn't provide its MW to the network

[dreamy nimbus]

funny how power gens work on ticks but the rest work on cycles

[wind spade]

rest work on ticks as well. Every tick the crafting progress is advanced, if the machine has power. If it reaches 100%, it begins next crafting cycle

[dreamy nimbus]

so cycles are based on ticks technically ?

[wind spade]

cycle is X seconds, which is some amount of ticks, yeah

[dreamy nimbus]

thank lord I don't need to really know that to 100% the game

100%ing the game makes no real sense, maybe any%ing makes more sense

[opaque quartz]

I imagine most people consider getting the golden nut statue/achievement is 100%ing it (or perhaps getting all the achievements)

[rain lichen]

(are cool)

[wind spade]

not only they are unrealistic (for trains), they also have practically lowest possible throughput from all the junction types

[rain lichen]

still cool

which is more than enough reason to build one

[wind spade]

if you want to build one just for the sake of doing so, be my guest. But I don't find them cool and they definitely don't have any reasonable advantage over other types of junctions

[rain lichen]

[dusky dust]

(On the other hand, Satisfactory trains tend to spend so little time in intersections that optimizing efficiency rarely actually matters, IME. Roundabouts may be the least generally-efficient intersection, but I'm willing to bet that it doesn't really matter for most folks)

'course once your train network gets to a certain level of business that may start becoming more of an issue

[wind spade]

I mean yeah, but just build a normal X junction, roughtly same time to build, same or even less space, slightly more throughput and doesn't allow train to turn around so you don't get weird pathing

(and it's not just about the train at the junction, but a slowdown of a train can have cascade effect)

but I agree that for smaller networks it probably doesn't matter much

[nimble haven]

i just unlocked portals. whats the downside to them

[dusky dust]

Nothing apart from power consumption + Singularity Cell requirements

[nimble haven]

ok, the discription was scaring me with big words.

[dusky dust]

(I think consumption maxes out at like 1GW per portal? Which isn't bad really)

[nimble haven]

how many mw is that

[dusky dust]

K = kilo, M = mega, G = giga. 1000k = 1M, 1000M = 1G

[nimble haven]

Oooh

[wind spade]

k, not K 😛

[wind spade]

same as bytes, 1000 kilobytes = 1 megabyte, etc.

you already know the prefixes 😛

[nimble haven]

SO im about 5 minutes from completing peak efficiency.

I just now need to complete the last part of phase 5. boy have iu come a long way. What a beaituful game.

Are facsonium fuel rods better than the other fuel for nuclear power? also what waste does it produce?

[outer vale]

no, and no

[nimble haven]

no its not better but no waste either

[wind spade]

that depends how you define "better"

[outer vale]

their whole point is that they're wasteless

in return, they're pretty weak for power output, and cost a lot of SAM to make in significant numbers

[nimble haven]

How much longer do they last put againt the normal nuc fuel

[outer vale]

less, not more

[dusky dust]

!wikisearch nuclear+power+plant

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=nuclear+power+plant

[outer vale]

a fifth IIRC?

[wind spade]

they provide 1/5th of UFR energy (or 1/10 of PFR energy)

[nimble haven]

oh wait, i ned platonium waste to make it. nvm.

[outer vale]

yeah, 1/min ficsonium, vs 0.2/min uranium and 0.1/min plutonium

yes, it's the next stage in nuclear waste handling

[nimble haven]

Oooh wait. SO would it be better to go through the recycle process for that plutonium cause the 0.1/min?

Or all that work for a 0.1 difference

[viral sparrow]

you dont need to do plutonium at all

[nimble haven]

ok

[outer vale]

many options

• Just do uranium, store the waste
• Do uranium, make plutonium rods and sink them to get rid of that waste. No waste
• Do uranium and plutonium, store the waste (less waste than uranium would give)
• Do uranium, plutonium and ficsonium. No waste
• feed plutonium rods to vehicles, since that makes no waste

as a datapoint, I went with storing plutonium waste.
Ficsonium wanted more SAM than I was willing to provide IIRC, using plutonium doubled the power output over only using uranium, and the waste buildup is slow enough that I've built about 7000 hours of storage

how you weigh things is obviously down to personal preference, as is the case with most things in the game

[dusky dust]

(Note that if you feed plutonium rods to vehicles, you almost certainly also want overflow from that sinking, since you're very unlikely to have exactly matched your vehicle fuel requirements to your rod production. I'd personally group "use as fuel" as a side effect of the Do uranium, make plutonium rods and sink them to get rid of that waste. No waste strategy, rather than one on its own)

[empty maple]

this is the best use of plutonium waste

[outer vale]

fair, I included it because I know people have mentioned it before

[nimble haven]

Wil there be a future use that storing them right now will help you out?

[outer vale]

maybe you decide to Ficsonium later, and temporarily OC/overbuild the setup to deal with the backlog

for stable power though, no, since ultimately you need waste produced >= waste used

[empty maple]

i have no backlog of plutonium, built for fisconium and went backwards. all my plutonium waste is sitting on conveyor belts, no containers

there is an overstock, but max somersloops on 4 fisconium makers powers more than i need . plus i have another port that would temporarily match and restart my whole grid if the worst were to happen. hundreds of hours on this game taught me power is paramount

[viral sparrow]

makes me wanna do a reg playthrough with refined power

[nimble haven]

Even though i dont need to. i lowkey wanna make a plant for all the gens. not including the biomass one.

[nimble haven]

what are these?

[outer vale]

mods

[nimble haven]

Ahhh, are mods safe?

When someone says thy are using a mod i feel like they want to like some weird site and downloaded something sketh

[opaque quartz]

Good discussion for the modding discord, if you are curious and want to learn more #welcome message

[nimble haven]

question, would it be smart to make a GIANT storage place, then destroy all my builds to rebuild them in a better more elegant look?

[outer vale]

destroy to rebuild
no

[nimble haven]

how would you do it

[outer vale]

also no need for central storage these days

[wind spade]

build new, keep old

[outer vale]

I would slap a couple crates and a DD at the end of each item's production line, plus a sink for overflow

and yeah, leave existing stuff that's work fine, alone

if you want to do central storage for the sake of it (not uncommon), go for it by all means

[nimble haven]

Also would this game count towards an engineering job? be like "Yah, i did used this program to reenact machine building and plant management. i have several thousand hours in this practice so i think my experience is good for this job."

[nimble haven]

I wanna do that but my isssue is the way i build my game was more of. THis here, ok this here, oh i need this now, ok ill put that uptoop to save space, oh that machine needs these parts fro way over there ill just put a splitter. 500 hours later of that you are left with something that resembles a working factory.

[outer vale]

and what part of that would central storage solve?

[nimble haven]

Like, Oh i need 10k of this item for the next phase.

[viral sparrow]

those are from the refined power mod

[outer vale]

so this is for manual setups for spelevator? DDs still exist, and failing that, having to get stuff from individual locations once per phase isn't that big a deal I'd say

[ruby current]

Somebody give me challenge I can't refuse... I've done Fexpan and 10X Elevator Parts... Next?

[thorn trail]

finish the game only producing the project parts, everything else must be found or bought from the awesome shop

you didn't say a fun challenge

[ruby current]

Wow... That would be difficult

[thorn trail]

probably more boring than anything else, you'd mostly be waiting around for doggos to find something for you to cash in for coupons

[ruby current]

Really it would be all the loot from Crash Sites and Doggo Farming.

[thorn trail]

the crash site loot doesn't go that far

[ruby current]

Actually Tier 9 has stuff that isn't in the Awesome or Loot too.

Dark Matter, etc.

[thorn trail]

yes, but that is required for project parts

[ruby current]

Not sure if I've ever had anything Tier 9 from Doggo.

So, you are saying, anything Elevator related can be built... Makes it a bit more manageable.

[thorn trail]

no, anything not available from the store can be built.

because it has to be

[ruby current]

Ok, but to being tough again...

*back

[thorn trail]

yeah, i thought about trying it and thought better of it

[ruby current]

Obviously you could sloop all elevator, but still it would be tough. What about Power. I guess Coal would be only option (biomass too)

[thorn trail]

you can buy fuel from the awesome shop, but that would seriously dig into your coupon flow

you would likely have to budget your part building carefully and exist off of geothermal

[ruby current]

I thought about a short belt run (ie mostly hand feeding everything...)

[thorn trail]

how about a no alt recipes run?

[ruby current]

That seems pretty straightforward.

All belts 5 or less, with no more than 1 container per "line"

There would be some planning, making sure machines are as close to the supply as possible.

[civic bronze]

thats kinda funny

[mossy shard]

Is no base recipes possible?

with the exception of some project parts, I think it might be

[civic bronze]

Aluminium sheet doesnt have an alt

[wind spade]

Also this goes into rabbit hole of "what is and isn't alt/base recipe"

[viral sparrow]

highest tier item i remember getting is turbo motors

[civic bronze]

Compacted coal: 🫣

[viral sparrow]

imo easiest way to go about that is:
uses hard drive to unlock? alt recipe

[wind spade]

Yeah that's the general way people go about it nowdays

[viral sparrow]

it simplifies it at least

[wind spade]

But imo "base recipe" isn't all others

See things like compacted coal, residual plastic, dissolved silica, ...

[viral sparrow]

for the sake of the challenge not being a headache i'd say that if it uses a hard drive it is if it doesn't it isn't

also, rhats just made me realise, to make rubber/plastic you'd need to make loops for both that feed each other

[wind spade]

That's normal

[viral sparrow]

witb recycled recipe

you'd need to get it from crash sites first too since you can't make it any other way

(if following hard drive = alt recipe)

and you'd need to make hor with either polymer resin or hor alt recipes

and fuel with diluted/packaged fuel

wait it'd be impossible without the blender recipe because of unpackage/package recipe

[thorn trail]

you can make rubber and plastic by just using the base rubber and plastic recipes. inefficient, but doable. you don't need HOR to make plastic/rubber, it just works better with it.

[viral sparrow]

^ we were discussing this

[thorn trail]

sorry, my misunderstanding

[viral sparrow]

all good

[mossy shard]

Seems it might not be but then what are the required recipes for a full game

[viral sparrow]

you'll need a way to get rubber for modular engines (you can probably just buy it but still)

alclad sheets are used for quite a lot and don't have an alt

[mossy shard]

Yeah only casing does

[viral sparrow]

i mean, making iron ingots and copper ingots is pretty not cool until phase 2

i think it's safe to assume spelevator parts don't count to this because the game would be completely impossible otherwise

motors would be hard too

no alt recipe rhats possible until manufacturer

which is only possible with plastic automated (for plastic ai limiter, needed for oscillator alt)

and rubber for the oscillators themselves

i might take a closer look at this it's quite interesting

there certainly are a lot more things not possible compared to what i initially expected

[proven pawn]

how long does this phase take for you guys?

[pastel obsidian]

Depends on how much time I spend looking for hardrives

[fallow siren]

the fastest i finish phase2 is around 3hrs

[hoary wigeon]

Took me like 40h

[limber nest]

Took me 20-30 hours

But whenever I dont feel like building I just got explore the map and procrastinate lol

I’m pretty sure I had the 150 mercer, 50 somersloops and 100 hard drive achievements close to done before I finished phase 4 and I regularly go fly around the map now when I’m lazy and don’t feel like automating stuff

[proven pawn]

ooouu i wanna sink that

[remote flame]

On the very first playthrough I did since 1.0 release, it was about 10 hours.
In a nutshell, Phase 2 is:
Coal Power (priority for stable power you can leave unattended, which means a good supply of copper sheets for pipework too), Then
Steel Pipes/Beams and Encased Beams > Stators/Motors. Then If you didn't build it already (and I certainly didn't), Modular Frames will need to be made for versatile frameworks. Modular Frames and Motors will probably be your largest factories in this Phase. With Alt recipes, you'd be surprised how simple they become however.

If you have a good sized factory for Reinforced Plates and Rotors already, you'll find you probably never need to make more for your own personal building use for the rest of the game. Everyone builds at different paces in Satisfactory, but my little Phase 1 factory that could (10Reinf Plates and 12 Rotors/min) was enough to supply my storage and dimensional depot all the way to Phase 5. Some individuals like to build gigantic amounts of one particular item in a factory then export to other factories that need it (like rotors in motors), but honestly it burns far more time than you gain doing it that way, and kind of goes down this rabbit hole of 'future planning' which you really don't need. I only build big once the True Tutorial is finished (Phase 5) haha

[viral sparrow]

given a tiny bit of research today the first major roadblock is motors

ima keep looking into stuff

[viral sparrow]

okay ive compiled a list of recipes i would deem useful or required for that challenge

ones marked with - are ones i would say could be useful at some points but not requried

i wasnt too sure what to do with diamonds but my personal favourite is oil based because its so simple

i dont think i put a computer recipe in there actually oops

imagine crystal computer is there somewhere

now to list where each recipe would become available 😟

i think thats everything?

notice how the earliest you can make motors is phase 4 lol

items without alt recipes arent being considered

e.g alcad sheets / most spelevator parts

my biggest concern is motors and completing phase 1

youd probably have to make all the parts for the space elevator yourself with is no fun

[viral sparrow]

(as in to place it)

i dont think i included a cable recipe because i unironically have no idea what to do for that, all require phase 3 or higher

anyways i might look into this further another time i cant be bothered now. maybe ill try come up with a route that would actually allow you to complete the game without base recipes

[rain lichen]

what's the most resource-efficient recipe for turbofuel?

[amber umbra]

@rain lichen I’m remembering turbo blend being highest resource efficiency for at least one of the resources but requires higher tech. Turbo heavy is fewer processing steps but less oil efficient. Regular turbo fuel in the middle.

If you’re doing turbo fuel, it often is used for rocket fuel. So good idea to also explore the rocket fuel alts when assessing turbo fuel.

[outer vale]

depends which resource you're trying to reduce, really

[wind spade]

depends which resource efficient 😛

[rain lichen]

i mean i was just thinking in general, but it seems to me that turbo blend fuel is the best for me as of rn

[wind spade]

"in general" still needs to define which resource you value how much