math-and-meta

[nimble lodge]

ok now im at last tier but factories are LITERALLY all around the world so i will use trains to connect those factories to make final space elev parts

[steady gate]

trains are a lifesaver

even early game

for example check my screenshot in #screenshots where i move all the bauxite to a location where i can process everything with little to no problems

[grim crane]

The f 650?

[vapid gorge]

fluid can go in and out of both ends.

Also - avoid buffers

unless it's for trains

[grim crane]

ok

👍

[north mauve]

(as a note I call my wife, my female best friend, and my two girl cats bro, literally on a daily basis; bro is a very gender neutral term in modern vernacular)
Train signals are only as difficult as you make them. That is to say, if you make two lanes of rail and have locomotives stick to right hand or left hand rule (pick one for your map and never break that rule), signalling is very easy. TL;DR signals: path signals before entering an intersection, block signals existing an intersection. Stations should be branched off intersections and not on the main rail. You can get by only ever making T and cross junctions.

Making rail look good is subjective. People go one of three routes:

1. rail on dirt (this clips a lot and can be ugly and messy, but it's very easy)
2. elevated highways built along natural terrain (this takes a lot of effort)
3. skyrail / elevated highways that care not for terrain and are often way too high above it (this is very easy)

The time to place rail and intersections quickly pays off.

And please for the love of ADA can someone make a train starter guide so we can all just link it when people say they don't understand trains

[nimble lodge]

FR

[charred saffron]

I'm not a big expert on (common) train usage in this game, as I love them more than the community seems to do, but I know how they work

I could cook smth up sometime soon

[north mauve]

Text based

[deft lichen]

I started work on one but never completed it. I still have it on my mind, just don't have the time

Especially signals

One doesn't need to fully understand signals as long as the guide covers enough common scenarios

[wind spade]

<==----==>
there you go

[deft lichen]

[north mauve]

Something akin to this but for Satis https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comments/4f38sk/factorio_train_automation_complete_parts_23_and/

[nimble lodge]

i'll take notes to make a huge rail system which connects all my factories to produce space elev parts

[deft lichen]

Yeah. It'd go up on the wiki

[grim crane]

Whats a good amount of Computers to carry me until the end?

20 a minute seems fine right?

I dont wanna spend a lot of time with this after spending 80 hours on motors and Frames

[north mauve]

Do you plan on never making computers in another factory?

[grim crane]

Not rly

Thats why i wanna make enough now

also looking at supercomputers

[north mauve]

7.5/min is consumed just for supercomputers, and that's a mere 1.875 at 100% in a manu. 2.5/min for basic RCU recipe.

And most people want more than one manu of RCUs

[grim crane]

7.5 for supers

[wind spade]

make what you need now, don't build for future

[grim crane]

RCUs?

[grim crane]

Rn i need 0 technically

besdides for the space elevator parts

[grim crane]

I like building for the future

[wind spade]

since you don't know what future holds, it's impossible 🤷

[grim crane]

Most of the time i overproduce tbh

[nimble lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/black-man-spinning-on-his-chair-gif-26077425

[north mauve]

RCUs are needed for pressure conversion cubes, turbo motors, alt recipe for super computers, and then plenty of build gun stuff.

[grim crane]

mhhhh

[wind spade]

see also https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Tutorial:Independency

[north mauve]

And you don't even know what you need pressure conversion cubes for, or how many

[grim crane]

imma do this diffrently

just gonna see how much oil i have rn and what i can get from it

[grim crane]

Plutoniom

I am just gonna copy my old nuclear setup

[wind spade]

yeah that's the "not recommended" way

[north mauve]

I'm just saying 10/min is pretty low. I'm not recommending anything for ya, just answering your question on "is 10/min enough"

[wind spade]

10/min is more than enough imo

[grim crane]

So i need 10 pressure cubes

[north mauve]

I went the non pressure cube route for plut

But that is one way to do it

[grim crane]

There is a reason i am going to enter a mental hospital soon enough

[grim crane]

I had 10 in production for the space elevator parts in my old save

so it was just waiting for that to finish and then put it on a train

Im overproducing SCREWS???

Oh wtf did i mess up 😭

[north mauve]

Well for one, ya makin screws at all

[grim crane]

It was a early game mega project ...

two actually

[wind spade]

screws are fine as part of production line

[grim crane]

Yeah, they are funny to look at when you have that many

but as a part they are kinda meh

Aslong you have the belt speed

[wind spade]

they are the same as any other part

[grim crane]

I seriously question this alt ngl

does anyone actually use this?

[wind spade]

yes

[grim crane]

Damm

[wind spade]

why not?

[grim crane]

Crystal Oscillators are just

Kinda annoying to make

(i ironically made 300/m of them 😭 , and used like 40)

[wind spade]

crystal oscillators are easy

[north mauve]

I don't get why people say cryos are hard to make

[grim crane]

The normal recepie is fine

[north mauve]

RIPs are basic beginning of game stuff. Quartz is just raw plus constructor. Cable from iron wire means no copper.

[grim crane]

I just always go over board a bit

[wind spade]

it's:

• crystals (one step from raw resource)
• RIPs (super easy)
• cable (super easy)

or you replace RIPs and Cable with rubber (basic oil product and AI limiter, which is quickwire (almost basic product) and copper sheet/plastic (both super easy)

[grim crane]

Wait yeah nvm

Leached Caterium any good?

[wind spade]

every recipe is "good" if you like what it does

[north mauve]

I personally consider all non pure recipes weird things I'll never use because I don't megabase hard enough to need more ore than a fully overclocked miner can give me

[grim crane]

Pure recepies are godly
I just hate water to its core

[north mauve]

If you hate water, you'll hate leached

Also I consider sulfur the rarest element besides uranium

[charred saffron]

I have a pretty big bias because I've had a hyperfixation on rollercoasters (which also extensively use block signal systems to avoid crashes), but honestly block signals are not that difficult. I think it's easier to explain them from blockzone to block signal (coloured area to signal) rather than vice versa, but either way it's not rocket science imo

[grim crane]

I am consuming like 90% of sulfut near me rn

Sulfur is weirdly rare

[wind spade]

let me guess, you're doing turbofuel branch

[grim crane]

This is btw where my hate for oscilators comes from, these are all fully overclocked....

[grim crane]

Yeah

Gonna switch to rocket later

[wind spade]

yeah just do diluted fuel and then switch to nuclear

[grim crane]

That is actually gonna consume less sulfur, while using more oil

[north mauve]

Oil is plentiful

[grim crane]

Yeah

[wind spade]

diluted fuel consumes no sulfur 🙂

[grim crane]

I wanna use up the whole biome for Rocket fuel

Not even for a real reason
just so i can say i build 1.3k Fuel plants

[charred saffron]

only 1.3k?

[grim crane]

But it uses water

[north mauve]

But you also want nuclear power?

[grim crane]

I rather sacrifice sulfur

[wind spade]

and? water is infinite

[grim crane]

Just a small setup

[wind spade]

sulfur is limited, water is not

[grim crane]

About 50000 MW of nuclear

[north mauve]

The giga unit exists for a reason and simplifies a bunch of 0s in a row that can be hard to parse

[grim crane]

Wait nvm
Only 24 generators or smt
not 50k

Im not insane

[north mauve]

No no no don't you 50k me

If you can understand that k = 1000, you should know that M = 1000k

And G = 1000M

[north mauve]

50 GW

[grim crane]

I hate doing the pipe work
I rather run around the map and collect every last sulfur node

[north mauve]

That's... why? It sounds like you're doing something very wrong.

[wind spade]

I love how people wanted pipes so much and now pipes are pretty much universally hated

[grim crane]

I never wanted pipes lol

[north mauve]

I think pipes are fine? They work great. They do not surprise me.

[deft lichen]

They're conceptually very simple, but a ton of people cram their tracks too close or just build spaghetti and then get signal errors

[wind spade]

pipes are indeed fine

[grim crane]

They are fine 90 of time

If its a production

[north mauve]

(the other 10% is PEBCAK)

[wind spade]

they are fine unless you do something weird

[grim crane]

but the moment you needa collect lot of fluid pipes of water or oil i absolutly dislike them

I just cant get them tidy and cutely organised

[north mauve]

Pressure extracts are the only places I struggle to make tidy

[grim crane]

Those are horrid

[charred saffron]

Yeah, trains need a little bit of planning because you can't expect to shove an entire interchange in a like 3x3 foundation area 😅 Worth noting if/when I make that beginner's guide to trains

[grim crane]

Also can we get the old oil barrel texture back?

The red one instead of the black one

[grim crane]

me in a nutshell :3

Imma just go with this now
nice "easy numbers"
and i already produce a decent amount of rubber and plastic as a side product somewhere

[wind spade]

go with diluted (packaged) fuel 🙂

and then use recycling loop to make plastic/rubber

[grim crane]

I alreadey produce enough rubber lol

[wind spade]

it would save you like 75% of oil in this setup

[grim crane]

I dont think it can get less then this

[wind spade]

best you can do is 1 oil -> 3 plastic or rubber

[grim crane]

Mhh

I never do it like that

I always do the ultra complicated shit where you use a list of alts, to produce rubber, use those byproducs to produce plastic to then produce the rubber

[grim crane]

Yeah

[wind spade]

yeah that's the best oil->plubber ratio

[grim crane]

I dont have enough caterium...
Omg i hate this already

[vapid gorge]

try using the pure caterium recipe for more

[grim crane]

i am already

Imma just take a break for now
fix this math later

[grim crane]

Slooping omg

Instead of traveling around the world for 90 fuckig Caterium i just Slooped it

[livid turret]

Or you can put 3 refineries in a loop with seed material and turn 90 fuel into 90 rubber/plastic basically turning fuel to chosen product in a 1 to 1 ratio. Plus whatever you get from the polymer resin if you don't want to sink it

[meager flicker]

hey if i am transporting cargo via train over a long distance should i make it from 1 car to a two car

[wind spade]

depends how much throughput do you need

[meager flicker]

im currently working with a 300 but will be working with a 375 soon (per/min)

[wind spade]

honestly most of the times one belt worth of materials works fine with one car (if properly buffered)

[north mauve]

A train car holds thousands. 375/min on one freight is plenty

[meager flicker]

all items go through a storage container before being sent through

my only issue in my mind was the length the train is traveling

[north mauve]

In general do it with one, see how it looks. If it comes back before the unload station is empty, it's good

[meager flicker]

that's what i'm doing, if it isn't what would be my solution tho

[ionic crystal]

anyone know if satisfactory tools doesn't work a 100% for oil production?

[primal flicker]

Looks like you have no alts selected. Also, selecting maximum on all products will force it to make equal amounts of each.

[ionic crystal]

alts?

[primal flicker]

Alternate recipes

[ionic crystal]

and don' t care about the equals, just want fuel for power for now.

[primal flicker]

Then Max fuel and ignore plastic and rubber.

Heavy oil residue and diluted packaged fuel get you the most.

[ionic crystal]

yea but i want those as by products 😅

[primal flicker]

Then add an arbitrary manual amount of them.

And only maximize fuel

[ionic crystal]

don;t have those yet. but i'm confused as to why heavy oil residue is not turned into fuel and i still have fuel as a by product. or is that because of the maximize on all recipes?

[primal flicker]

It's the last part.

Max fuel first. See how much it is. Then maybe put a slightly lower number and max plastic and rubber. You don't need resin for anything except researching polymer fabric iirc

[ionic crystal]

yea, this looks better (still a lot of polymer)

[dapper zephyr]

should i shoot an unsuspecting lizard doggo with 100 rounds

[ionic crystal]

thats just sad 😦

[dapper zephyr]

there is a backstory

[north mauve]

So a second freight wouldn't help in this specific case, if the original platform isn't full every time it's loading your train. What you would actually need is a second train and to try and time placing it so that the two are unloading while the other is loading.

[ionic crystal]

no rudolf christmass hat wearing lizzard doggo deserves 100 rounds

[dapper zephyr]

he already took it

[grim crane]

I swear i needd longer for tier 3/4 then 5/6

Anyways

Whats you all preferd way to make Aluminium?

[ionic crystal]

never been there yet 😅 i really need to be less of a perfectionist

[grim crane]

I feel ye

i just gave up for my mental health

I needed 90 houts to automate Motors and heavy frames

[ionic crystal]

100 hours in now, second playthrough and only completed phase 2 😅

[grim crane]

Haha

Dude idk how i achieved so much in my ld save

[ionic crystal]

i'm strugling with oil now

how far can pipes carry fluids horizontally?

[grim crane]

only 360 hours and i have 40 Nuclear plants

a huge turbo fuel plant
two huge Alumini plants
another fuel plant

and 300 oscilators a minute

[grim crane]

Idk actually

I just do a huge Water tower where i pump them up so they basically have unlimited range once they go dowm

[ionic crystal]

but like 100 meters is not to far right?

[grim crane]

That should be

[ionic crystal]

only horizontal

[grim crane]

one mk2 pump?

[ionic crystal]

haven't used pumps here yet

still trying to plan fuel power etc

[grim crane]

Oh

I have a small turbo fuel plant rn

Small

(yes i fucking collected 40 Sloops)

This will be the next thing i will build

5660 Rocket fuel a minute!

195GW

or 200GW

I am not sure

[ionic crystal]

gimme that power

here i asm with a 2400mw coal power plant

[grim crane]

Its actualy pretty simple

My whole power plant

(most are slugged to 250% tbh)

"load balancing"

[grim crane]

You got this

I believe in you

[foggy ocean]

I made my plant yesterday and somehow put 1 mk1 pipe in the mix
I was scratching my head why i am not getting enough power then i found that imposter

[grim crane]

omg i feel that SO much

[foggy ocean]

I hate fluids just because of these things

[grim crane]

Opinions on this?

Is the pure recepie rly that good?

Cus this seems like a like 10h project

And i remmeber spending days on aluminium

[foggy ocean]

I haven't built my aluminium factory yet but some alternative recipes are very good

[grim crane]

I normally go the blender route

[foggy ocean]

Now i have power time to fix some old janky setups then i will go ahead but i will make a jnaky aluminium factory first for mk5 belts

[grim crane]

but if i can eliminate Sulfur

How many Pure Bauxit nodes are on the map?

This is actually reasonable lol

[foggy ocean]

Not sure but there is oil and a pure bauxite ore on that hill there

Oil on island

[wet palm]

can someone tell me why my last two refineries are struggling for water? I have 40 refineries doing pure copper ingots with a couple of them slightly overclocked. the recipe calls for 10PM water each so 10*40 = 400 water needed minimum.. i have water extractors on this line making 600 PM. but these last two are struggling for water .. why?

[foggy ocean]

Make a tower of pipes at start or see if u have a mk1 pipe in the mix

Fluid physics is annoying

[wet palm]

does it matter that the 600PM input line is on one end of the refineries to manifold all 40 ?

[grim crane]

at the start yes

the problem with Manifolds is you need a bit of backlog

Id just remove the output belt

let it all fil upp

then reconnect the belt

[wet palm]

but why does that matter if im pushing more water than what the system is asking?

[grim crane]

Manifolds + Water physics

I just know it works, and i have cheated myself like that trough a lot of this game

[wet palm]

ok so disconnect beginning belt.. let all sytems fill up with water. reconenct belt then no issues ?

[foggy ocean]

Yes

[grim crane]

No i mean the output belt

[foggy ocean]

If u have enough throughput after that of fluid

[grim crane]

The belt where all the copper ingots merge

[wet palm]

im so curious to know why that resolves it..

[grim crane]

Let that fill up

[wet palm]

got it, output belt

[foggy ocean]

Pipes need to fill up for the throughput its hard to explain in simple terms
But make a rule always fill the machines with fluid first for manafold

[wet palm]

okay. ty ty i will try

[burnt yarrow]

anyone know any blueprints to make production easier like a modular frame factory blueprint. Or does anyone know any nice numbers that i should aim for that collaborate nicely with phase 4 stuff

[wet palm]

so this issue with my refineries is happening again. disconnected output belt, let all fill with water. reapplied output belt. after awhile the last two are struggling again for water. i dont understand...

[burnt yarrow]

sorry brand this is more important just gonna make the message more new 🙂

(teehee im a sneaky boy)

[wet palm]

10 frames per minute is what you want. there question answered

[burnt yarrow]

fill it up with water

[wet palm]

make frames

[burnt yarrow]

haha

have you tried turning your pc off and on again

thats as far as my knowledge goes sorry

[wet palm]

have you tried uninstalling the game? that will get you those frames. i heard deleting discord helps too

[burnt yarrow]

brand mate why you so mad i was being serious

it might help maybe your game is just bugged and needs a restart

then it will work

[wet palm]

i was too. you want 10 frames. seriously.

[burnt yarrow]

hmmmmm

[wet palm]

restarting the game made no difference. i thought that as well

[burnt yarrow]

im getting an incling to not trust you (we should get married and have an explosive devorce)

[wet palm]

you want 10 frames. 5 for thermal propsulstion rockets. i found 3PM rockets is good which requires 5 frames of production. then the other 5 is solid for nuclear pasta at 5PM

there!

[wet palm]

so this didnt work, what wrong with my refinery setup?

[grim crane]

Try valves

Can i see the pipes?

[wet palm]

yeah one sec..

[wind spade]

don't do valves

[wet palm]

So what do I do then? What’s the issue?

[wind spade]

loop the pipe

[wet palm]

Ohhhh. Why does this work though?

[wind spade]

gravity helps and the loop prevents sloshing from having a big effect on your production

[wet palm]

Sloshing??

[wind spade]

water reaching end of pipe or a full machine and bouncing back

[wet palm]

Ohhhh that’s why my fluid buffer near the water extractors must have been going + and - , rather than always +. I was wondering how it was doing that..

[wind spade]

yeah (but also, don't use fluid buffers)

[wet palm]

Why? I also heard that helps with balancing. Guess it’s a myth?

[wind spade]

well, you shouldn't balance pipes

and buffers mostly just hide issues at best

they don't really help anything and in many cases they hurt your production

[wet palm]

Ok I see

[wind spade]

(same reason you don't put industrial containers on your belts - why would you do that? either you produce too much and it will be always full, or you produce too little and it will be always empty, or you produce exact amount you need and then the buffer will stay at same level)

[wet palm]

Yeah makes sense. Thanks for clarifying

So looping the pipe - it’s just a matter of what helps (gravity and sloshing).. but I’m confused why that helps when I’m pushing more water than what the system is asking for. Water can’t go opposite direction of pumps correct? Cuz for me it seems like it is and if so, then the sloshing issue makes sense why that would fix it

Is there a video on this I can watch, haha

[wind spade]

imagine the first junction of a manifold, water splits into two sides, let's assume it splits equally (it may not), so e.g. a 600 per minute fluid will go 300 to each side

the side that goes to machine gets filled and then rest of the water bounces back (sloshes)
then it reaches the junction again, and splits the flow in half to both sides, so ~150 goes in the wrong direction (back through the feed pipe), effectively reducing the total flow into the system (because a pipe can do 600 total only, so if you have 400 flow to one side and 200 flow to other side, you have 600 total)

the reality is slightly different, numbers don't work like that, but it serves to illustrate the point well enough for you to understand it

[polar gyro]

I would add don’t think of it as one long tube but a series of water bottles chained together or rather cells that fill with water. They are never all perfectly full but rather transferring from one cell to another

And you can have pockets of cells affected by things such as gravity or simulated water effects

[wind spade]

yeah, in general, unless we're talking about a pump or valve, fluids can and will go in both directions (especially if dead ends are involved). So making the loop makes sure that both directions are "correct"

[wet palm]

So this where my mind goes in error mode - if I have pump at the beginning of the system like literally right before the first manifold. Wouldn’t all the sloshing eventually cancel out and the pump forces water to the sloshed areas .

Maybe that’s too simple to think of it that way?

[wind spade]

pumps don't push water, they only provide headlift

[wet palm]

Ah okay, so there I think is where a confusion needs to be cleared up with me. Pumps are not directional in that water can only flow in one direction of them. Correct?

[wind spade]

but also, yes and no

if a backflow happens, it reduces the flow to the system for a while, which means there's less fluid in the system. Unless you're overproducing the fluid, the reductions of flow will eventually starve some machines (which makes it so that less fluid is consumed, so you technically have "overproduction" and it gets filled back - but the machines won't run at 100% capacity, they will turn off and on)

[wind spade]

pumps are directional, but they don't actively push water

[wet palm]

Ahhhhhhh

[wind spade]

but even if they did, the message above would still apply

[wet palm]

Yes yes I’m getting it now

[polar gyro]

Think of a pump as only affecting the height and nothing else whatsoever.

[wet palm]

You guys are a super helpful this is so much more clear now. Thank you greatly

[polar gyro]

And if you have a pump at the beginning of the chain it doesn’t necessarily consolidate as a whole, like if a cell far in the back is messed up it won’t solve the issue all the way at the start because it’s not one big flow

[wet palm]

Yeah I see, my brain was thinking pumps are always only directional in that they won’t allow back flow I even if the pump isn’t active. That’s where the root of my confusion started with all this.

Thank you gents 🙏🏻

[polar gyro]

Have fun

[wind spade]

well they won't... but only from one end of pump to another

any pipe section can still have backflow

[polar gyro]

They should prolly change the name from “pump” to headlift generator or something. And change the animation when you put a pump down instead of showing a flowy line going through the pipes to like an indicator of height somehow.

Everything we know about “pumps” in life in general has to do with pushing pressure and acceleration of what is inside

So we naturally assume headlift is implied to be generated by increased flow, pressure, pushing power, whatever….

But in fact it’s essentially just allowing the cells to behave as normal even when going upward without any of the implied other behaviors of a “pump” such as acceleration and velocity and increased speed and valve like behavior

[wary rapids]

@burnt yarrow

@burnt yarrow

I got though all of tier 4 with just that number of HMF.

[cinder silo]

The edges of that ceiling space look like prime candidates for this sort of lighting (blueprinted billboards in a glass foundation)

Ah nuts!!, I just realised I posted in math-and-meta in reply to that screen shot, sorry 😦

[inner flame]

if im going to make 6 nuclear power plants how many uranium fuel units should i make a min

0.2 burn rate

[cinder silo]

1 fuel rod per 5 power plants, so you want 1.2

[inner flame]

1.2 a amin?

[cinder silo]

Yep, my old save used 21 fuel rods per minute to account for 105 reactors (well 100 clocked at 105% because numbers)

[plush marten]

can anyone give me a rough idea about the total power that can be produced by using all the urarium in the world ?

[vapid gorge]

without conversion recipes? like... 500gw

[wind spade]

I mean depends what you call "uranium", if it's just uranium fuel rods, or plutonium or even ficsonium is allowed

[plush marten]

i mean all like UFR , PFR, and FFR

combined

without using any conversion for UFR and PFR , only time i am planning to use sam is for FFR production

[vapid gorge]

make a plan in satisfactory tools, you'll come up with a number pretty quick

I never bothered to look past ur rods

[plush marten]

does it show the amout of power i will gen ?

[vapid gorge]

no, but it'll show you how many rods you make and you can easily math it out from there

[plush marten]

okey

[vapid gorge]

just a bit of basic arithmatic after that

[plush marten]

already on it

i have to check if how much resource is left after i have finished my IF Factory

[fallow siren]

i have no idea how to do train signal, is this even working

maybe ill just try running the train first

[main shuttle]

can you walk a doggo thru a portal?

[prisma kraken]

haven't tried, but have tried the factory cart - that's no bueno

[vapid estuary]

you won't know until you put a train on it.
however, it's hard to imagine running more than a single train on this entire thing

[meager flicker]

@fallow siren hey still need help

[fallow siren]

i want to know where to put block and patch signals bcs clearly the first design doesnt work

i never really use train b4 so idk shit about signal

[meager flicker]

block signals on every station beginning and leaving

would u like help with the t section

also how does the incoming train path look (coming into the stations)

[fallow siren]

i made it like this

[meager flicker]

see the little black triangle

put a path signal there in the direction of the trains moving

remember block signals at the beginning and end of every full train station

[fallow siren]

ok so what does path signal mean by waiting for path reservation

[meager flicker]

so basically before any rail overlap u need a path signal because it will tell the other path signals hey i wanna use this, it will work in order of what train comes first

the reason block signals wont work is because they dont account of overlap and reservations

[fallow siren]

okay

what about block occupied

[meager flicker]

could u send a ss

[meager flicker]

puit the block signals againt the train stations

also my bad the path signal should be a block signal

[fallow siren]

ok i tried running the trains first to see if its working, it does work but theres one block signal that blocks one train to pass even tho that one train currently is at its station and really faraway

[meager flicker]

able to send a photo

[fallow siren]

it blocks the 2nd train to go to the right railway

or did i do somth wrong

or am i missing smth

[meager flicker]

okay so

fly above your t junction and idenfidy where your lines are spliting that is whjjere you are going to put your path signal

make sure to have a path signal at all points where a train like is spliting/cutting over another train line

after every path signal down the rail line put a block signal

want me to send a example?

[fallow siren]

yes why not

[meager flicker]

oght bet give me a sec

this help or makes it more confusing

[fallow siren]

is ur path signal the one painted in black?

[meager flicker]

they have the white arches

[fallow siren]

ok lemme try it first

[meager flicker]

bet let me know how it goes

@fallow siren update?

[fallow siren]

im still working on the T junction, but the rest works perfectly fine

[meager flicker]

good good

[fallow siren]

@meager flicker update, works perfectly fine now, ty

placing block signal far away from path signal so the train wont slow down after entering the T junction

[meager flicker]

glad to hear it

[ionic crystal]

anyone know if i need to put valves on this pipe line?

[meager flicker]

no, btw mk2 pipe lines are glitchy

[ionic crystal]

oh why are they glitchy?

[meager flicker]

idk the full reason but everyone i play with explains how the pipes work on a decimal system and that at 300 it's 100% effect but at a long range 600 it is not

[ionic crystal]

well, this is not long range right?

[meager flicker]

if i were u i would place a junction right after your oil extractor pipe that short line as a 600 then split it into 2 300

it is

your whole line is 600

[ionic crystal]

wait wut...

[meager flicker]

r i doing crude oil?

[ionic crystal]

yea

[meager flicker]

for power?

[ionic crystal]

yea

[meager flicker]

r u gonna use water

[ionic crystal]

no? what would i need that for 😅

is that an alt recipe?

[molten lintel]

diluted?

[meager flicker]

do u have alt recipes

[ionic crystal]

not for oil no

[meager flicker]

ding ding ding

[ionic crystal]

still need to gather a lot of disks

[meager flicker]

ah well there is a very fun activity you can do when you have it

[ionic crystal]

what> diluted oil power?

[meager flicker]

yes u get extremely more power

[ionic crystal]

aaah..

[meager flicker]

i currently have a a massive set up for it i'll send a photo

[ionic crystal]

well, man, you kinda ruining it now 😅 i wanted to get oil power running tonight and now i first need to hunt disks

[meager flicker]

no do the way u can rn then later update it

[ionic crystal]

i just want to get more power than my 2400MW coal plant currently makes

[meager flicker]

i promise u its worth to do it the way u can rn

[ionic crystal]

but then i need to redo everything soon 😅

[meager flicker]

youll find the jy in it tho trust

[ionic crystal]

jy?

[meager flicker]

joy

[wind spade]

you never want to put valves or buffers anywhere

[wind spade]

they are not

[wind spade]

this was fixed ages ago

[meager flicker]

I've still have had issues with it, so

[wind spade]

that's player issue, not game issue

(not meaning this in a bad way)

[ionic crystal]

what are those machines right before the power generators?

[wind spade]

correctly built pipes can do 600 without issues

[meager flicker]

blenders

[ionic crystal]

still need to unlock those aswell, so probably no diluted oil for me atm

[ionic crystal]

gave me an idea for a layout tho, so thnx!

[meager flicker]

i build them the normal way I build a 300 i honmestly dont know where i couldve gone wrong but ce la vie

[meager flicker]

can u use blueprints?

[ionic crystal]

still need to unlock it, probably have the resources for it tho

[amber umbra]

600 fluid/min pipe “feature” strikes again.

[meager flicker]

i feel dumb now

[meager flicker]

trust me get it

[ionic crystal]

got it in 5 minutes

[amber umbra]

@meager flicker Effectively 600 fluid/min through pipes requires building in specific ways that aren’t required for lower flow rates. People are very particular about not calling it a bug though for reasons.

Easier to just target flow rates below like 590 fluid/min.

[ionic crystal]

why are fluids in games so confusing 😅

[meager flicker]

i see so it isnt a bad idea tho to split a 600 into 2 300 pipes

[meager flicker]

just how it is

[amber umbra]

Yea, it’s easier in many ways to design around like 400 fluid/minute sub production lines and having the only 600 fluid/min being things like a pure oil node.

[oblique hollow]

theres never a proper reason to max out a pipe

You could call it.... a pipe dream

[meager flicker]

bro has good FLOW

[wind spade]

did you loop them? prefilled the whole pipe setup? only fed from above, not from below?

did you use any buffers or valves?

[wind spade]

reason is "it's not a bug". Developers confirmed it

[meager flicker]

no buffers no vallves now I didnt loop it

[wind spade]

they behave similarly to irl fluids, so with that come all the negative things that you have to consider irl as well

[wind spade]

setup like this works in 99% of cases

[ionic crystal]

i don' t work with fluids irl so i don't have to deal with the negative things irl 😂

[ionic crystal]

wait how you even make such a nice loop?

AAH

easier as expected lol

[wind spade]

but you're familiar with them, even if you don't realise it

main "problem" of pipes is backflow (fluid flowing in opposite direction, which decreases pipe flow in the desired direction). This happens when fluids reach end of pipe (e.g. a full machine) and they bounce back (same as if you make a water wave in a bath tub and it bounces back from end of the tub).

The loop makes sure that fluid going in opposite direction doesn't hinder throughput, because fluid can go the other way as well

[ionic crystal]

hmm thats pretty smart 👍

please remind me to never become an engineer specialised in fluids 😂

[oblique hollow]

irl fluids are probably easier than this in some aspects

at least if you stay at the level of house plumbing

[night bronze]

which is the best fuel type/recipe for net power gain?

[livid turret]

Fluids can be a problem and you don't even need to max the pipe, the issue seems more related to quantity of connections, I was pushing 480/min with a MK2 and some producers were taking a pause, adding the loop to the output of the producers fixed this (consumer input already had a loop)

[livid turret]

If first power plant, diluted packaged fuel is the easiest

[night bronze]

nah I'm later in the game

[oblique hollow]

rocket fuel.
any one them
ionized not so much

[livid turret]

People seem to agree on rocket fuel

[night bronze]

it's dipping into my batteries so wanna get the overhead

thx

I knew there was a point where it's not really worth it to go any further, wasn't sure where that was

[opaque quartz]

Rocket fuel: extremely OP, relative to the inputs, but requires building tons of fuel generators
Nuclear: more complicated production chain, but better power generation per plant. Requires dealing with nuclear waste

Pick your poison

[night bronze]

yeah I don't have the overhead for the production chain to build scaled nuclear atm lol

[oblique hollow]

anything fuel generator related will always be ballooned in size compared to nuclear

[opaque quartz]

I saved the day using two RF plants which was enough power to carry me through the end game. I only did a nuclear build after beating the game for fun/for the challenge

[night bronze]

have 6 nuke gennies fed by 1 uranium node and just storing uranium waste atm lol

[night bronze]

yeah that's basically my plan

[opaque quartz]

If you already have nuclear started you could figure out the production chain for converting the uranium waste to plutonium rods which have even higher power yield

[night bronze]

again, lack the power overhead

batteries already being dipped into as is

RF should be less strenuous to turn on, as it were

[oblique hollow]

eeeeeh do not underestimate the power use of refineries and blenders

[sage void]

so im planing on building a motor factory that makes 120 motors per min. im fresh out of phaze 2 and wondering how to plan this, i started doing the math figuring out how many constuctors and assemblers needed, but half way through i realized that the codex only tells you the items per minute of the finished product. so how would y'all plan this out?

[night bronze]

can expand as I go tho

[opaque quartz]

I suppose you could just spam more uranium generators to get you over the hump

[night bronze]

eh yeah idk could say the same either way

[oblique hollow]

you go down the chain one by one.
Its just a matter of making one number match the other.
pick a motor recipe, scale it up to 120/min output, then look at how much input that needs
if you click on a codex recipe it does tell you the rates of inputs and outputs

since the codex can also simulate clocking, but not more than 250%, you can just set the recipe to make 12/min motors and then just add another 0 to everything

[livid turret]

https://satisfactory-calculator.com/
Here you can set what you want in a planner with the recipes and machines you have available

But 120 seems like a lot of motors for phase 2

[sage void]

i just feel like im behind cuz i have single digit production for most stuff

[livid turret]

I have like 5 or 10 per min and I'm in phase 4

[night bronze]

I haven't gone back to expand on my single assembler dedicated to motors since tier whatever-it-was-unlocked-in

[livid turret]

Maybe it could be better to plan for the final product like a space elevator part or another specific part and create a factory dedicated to a small quantity of that

[oblique hollow]

just go with 20
Overbuilding isnt as useful when theres other parts to automate

[livid turret]

And you could get alts, you could build motors using only iron with the correct set of alts.
Also what McGalleon said, overbuilding leads to burn out

[sage void]

it probably just me trying to copy the flashy phaze 9 super factory type stuff when im woefully underprepared for that

[night bronze]

don't try copy those at all ngl

[oblique hollow]

yeah no thats out of your league

stay at your level

[sage void]

ight

[wind spade]

most stuff is only needed in single digits

[latent anchor]

if you want to get to that scale, play the game by building larger and larger things over time

one way to do it is to build 2-4x the amount of production you need in the moment, so that you don't overbuild but also don't need to immediately build more

[vapid gorge]

every time you build a new type of factory, with a different style or scale it's a 'new thing' for you. Requires different planning and layouts. The first time you ever do a new thing in the game? will probably be bad. But you'll learn from it

[polar gyro]

I actually put a ticket on QA site suggesting to take out or replace the line that says to build vertically because it confuses people about the scope of the tech tree lol

That combined with seeing videos of mega factories and esspecially multi story monoliths

(And when they build such things before they even have jetpack :))

[near zodiac]

Is this a good way to setup the pipeline for my coal generators?

[vapid gorge]

well good is subjective and I'd really need a higher up shot to see, but if you're putting 6 extractors in one pipe I can see the main issue right now

[near zodiac]

and that is?

[vapid gorge]

look at how much a mk1 pipe can move pm and how much water you're cramming in it

[near zodiac]

300m³

when active, the flow rate until a certain point is that amount

then it starts varying, going up and down

[vapid gorge]

and how much does 12 coal gens need per min?

[near zodiac]

and suddenly, in a very specific point, both the flow rate and the amount of water in the pipe goes down MASSIVELY

[near zodiac]

50

[vapid gorge]

they each need 45 water pm

[wind spade]

that's wrong for both 1 and 12 gens 😄

[vapid gorge]

so how much is 12x45 and can 1 mk1 pipe do that?

[near zodiac]

so I need two pipelines

[vapid gorge]

at least yes.

!wikisearch CG

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=CG

[vapid gorge]

check out these example layouts. 3 extractors to 8 gens is the common rookie set up as the numbers match up nicely

tends to match up with the available coal on belts too

since 1xmk2 belt can feed 8 gens

[fallow siren]

u are producing more water than ur pipes can hold, u need 2nd pipe system

[near zodiac]

yep should've said that straight up

[fallow siren]

i recommend to just do 2 extractor 1 pipe

[near zodiac]

imma do 3 extractors 1 pipe lol lmao

[vapid gorge]

this has been covered yes

[vapid gorge]

how much does 3 extractors output?

[fallow siren]

3 extractor is 360/min and mk1 pipe can only hold 300

unless u underclock one extractor

[near zodiac]

I'll pump the numbers of coal gen to 16, so I'll have to do more pipelines anyway

[meager flicker]

if i have a train thats gonna be traveling a really long distance should i make 2 cars

[vapid gorge]

entirely depends on travel time and how much you're moving

[meager flicker]

375 per min on the belt

[vapid gorge]

on 1 belt?

so you have mk4 belts?

[meager flicker]

i have mk6 belts

my issue is that the train drop off point isa givingn me a 252 items per min counter

[vapid gorge]

ah, well time how long the round trip is, by driving the train. it's its less than 6min or so you'll only need one car

[near zodiac]

now we're talking

[meager flicker]

how mmuch power

[vapid gorge]

glad it's working 🙂

in general I'd recommend you try to keep your pipes neater though, flat and straight on sections where they are feeding machines.
Coal generators have a lot more tolerance for wonky pipes and you can do things with them that won't fly with future systems

[near zodiac]

1200

[meager flicker]

i hope u use diluted fuel its a game changer

[near zodiac]

I'll get there one day

[meager flicker]

when u do hmu ill slide u my blueprints

[meager flicker]

guess what

[vapid gorge]

what?

[near zodiac]

Ok, listen dude. I may be stupid

nah, nothing. Just wanted to say that I may be stupid

[vapid gorge]

Not trying to offend, just a good habbit to have.

[meager flicker]

im at 3 mins and i havent even refilled

[near zodiac]

nah bro I'm actually actually stupid

[meager flicker]

trust youre not

[vapid gorge]

3 minute trip? easily done with 1 car

[meager flicker]

be careful your pipe arent at risk of the headlift

[meager flicker]

no i mean from droopping off itsd alr been 3 mins getting back to the pick up location

[vapid gorge]

well, in general, if your round trip is ~5 minutes you can do about 1 full belt per car

you're doing like 1/4 of a belt per car, so I think you'll be fine

don't trust the platform movement rates

[meager flicker]

5:35

round tripo would be 11

[vapid gorge]

what's the stack size of the item?

[meager flicker]

100

ik i need another car, my storage buffer is alr full

[vapid gorge]

ah, ok so only 3200 per car, yeah you'll need a 2nd car then

OR.... 2 trains

[meager flicker]

i cant believe its over 11 min round trip

ima prolly do 2 trains

[vapid gorge]

is it only the 2 stops?

[meager flicker]

yes

do yk the brazite pure node in the central of the map

[vapid gorge]

... do you have a SCIM image of how long it is? xD like the very corner to the opposite corner seems liek it'd be shorter

[meager flicker]

abnd the blue crator oil area

[meager flicker]

?

[vapid gorge]

ah there's an online map editor that you can load your save into to show what's on it

[meager flicker]

oh that bet

[vapid gorge]

but it's a full map exploration spoiler, you might not have explored enough to really warrant spoiling that

[vapid gorge]

is there a lot of elevation changes? even if it's from one end to the other I'm surprised it's 11 min

[meager flicker]

i just have a shit load of trains

[vapid gorge]

so you think there's a bunch of traffic slowing it down? It'd take... dozens to really slow things down

your train stations are off to the side of the rail right? they don't block traffic?

[meager flicker]

they dont

[vapid gorge]

yeah very surprising then

I'd make it 2 cars then instead of 2 trains. Reduce traffic if you think it's already busy

[meager flicker]

good point

[vapid gorge]

fewer actual train stops at any particular station also increases throughput on those platforms. Not that it's an issue in this case but a good thing to keep in mind

[meager flicker]

therews maybe 2 stops

potential

[main shuttle]

i assume that packaged biofuel takes up less footprint space than liquid biofuel in tanks

[vapid gorge]

.... probably? I don't think anyone ever makes enough for the difference to be a huge deal

[meager flicker]

why are you trying to be environmentally clean

[main shuttle]

i might have a bit of a problem

[meager flicker]

wtf

build a fleet of trucks and just have them drive around

[main shuttle]

🤣

that's a nearly full 16x16 block of leaves

[meager flicker]

build a city and just have like 100 trucks on the road

[main shuttle]

this is my "full clearcut" i promised myself once 1.0 came out

8x16 of wood, 20 containers of mycelia

& yes, i know it's ridiculous

[unborn ermine]

oh did you do the caves too

[main shuttle]

yup

[unborn ermine]

theres TONS of wood in some caves

[main shuttle]

i know it's not completely clear, but it's damn close

[unborn ermine]

I know specifically there was the cave that links dangle spires to red forest, has wood all along the cliffs AND a ton in the cave at the bottom.

Remember the cave because I was messing with water extractors there to see what kind of mess I could get away with if I chose to

[main shuttle]

yea this is a passive run, after the last 3 years i wanted some calm for doing this 🤣

[twin imp]

what is the maximum points per second one can get accounting for all resources and power use?

[plush marten]

preparation for IF going well

[vapid gorge]

zero, because your computer will melt before that

[twin imp]

true

[nimble grove]

recently, i made a fuel plant that recycles canisters
i cant figure out how to make it not be inefficient, if i supply too much, it stops; too few, it stops
is there a way to calculate how many i need for everything to have 100% uptime?

[vapid gorge]

make the cannisters once, then loop them

or is that not the issue?

[nimble grove]

its not

[vapid gorge]

ok have you followed the fuel feeding hte gens back to see what is stopping the flow?

[nimble grove]

yeah, the canisters

[plush marten]

what i do is i suppy a bit excess and set up a overflow line to sink that way if anything is excess it sinks and it doesnt stop the system

[vapid gorge]

ok so are you nothing having enough? too many?

[fallow siren]

full supply on both packager and unpackager

[cinder silo]

The monster I have planned is this setup, x3 in the blue crater.

[nimble grove]

with smart splitter? took too many

[lunar ingot]

option 1: stick a storage container somewhere along the belt as a buffer, so the range between "too many" and "too few" is bigger.

[plush marten]

it does but in long run if i have any excess it doesnt cause a issue

[nimble grove]

i have, but im trying to have it be 100% efficient

[plush marten]

and with big buillds i always prefer to do that so that i dont have to think too much about it

[nimble grove]

having too few causes issues too

[vapid gorge]

go packager, refinery, unpackager and loop them in units like that.

[plush marten]

worked for me so i suggested but anyway good luck

[lunar ingot]

option 2: probably not useful for this factory, but for the next build, don't do a bunch of machines as a manifold, do a bunch of small loops of 1 water packager : 1 refinery : 1 fuel unpackager.
it should fit in a blueprint nicely

[nimble grove]

yeah slightly inconvenient

for next one tho 👍

[vapid gorge]

might just want to accept it's not going to be 100%

[fallow siren]

just fed a lot of canisters until the fuel plant reach 100% efficiency

[vapid gorge]

honestly with that image there's probably a ton of flow issues with the pipes

realistically probably a full pipe/belt retrofit is needed

[nimble grove]

checks out, ive been crying that i didnt plan anything for this before i built it since a day after i started

[vapid gorge]

with big builds especially you want a lot of planning

for every step and how they interact

especially with fluids

[fallow siren]

u always want to plan big projects

with planning u will mostly know exactly how many things u need

[nimble grove]

o7
ill just live with this until next save then i guess (85gw including other power if it was made well)

[fallow siren]

im currently building 300GW rf plant

using all sulfur on the blue crater

i can do 500GW since i still have 1.2k coal available, but i need to ship some sulfur from outside with trains

[warm bane]

If all you want is compressing the biomass and make something useful out of it, you could go
(Leaves/Mycellia)->Biomass->Bio-Coal->Diamonds(->Time Crystal)
Wood->Charcoal -^
That would be some pretty insane compression ratio

... not that much actually now that I'm doing the math
That nets you 1 time crystal for 66.666666... leaves; or for 3.3333... mycellia; or 4 wood

Sink point wise that would be a very nice increase though
960 points vs 200, 33.3333...., or 120 respectively

[remote flame]

Personally, I've hit 127,000,000 points per minute on average on an advanced world that uses about 40%-50% of the nodes on the map. And that isn't being the most efficient on Alt Recipes either.
I think someone worked out a theoretical limit on the wiki of about 480,000,000+ on average/min using 100% clockspeed buildings (they aimed to sink Ballistic Warp Drives, Assembly Director Systems, AI Expansion Systems and Plut. Fuel Rods in bulk.)

But you'll most likely either hit the object limit, enter complete insanity, or be busy for quite a while to get that.

However peak points/second, where you could store a whole heap of Ballistic warp drives and dump them all at the same time in to multiple sinks.. you got me curious so I loaded up the world Ive been stockpiling in, set up ballistic warp drives to spike it for a minute through 10 Awesome Sinks at 1200/min mk6 belts (so 12,000 Warp drives a minute) and didnt need to run it for very long , the peak limit is 2^31 🙂 , or 741.7 Ballistic Warp Drives a minute, so I kinda went over by.. a bit. lol

[plush marten]

aren't we completely insane in the first place 🙂

[near zodiac]

which ones do I get?

[versed violet]

technically, is there a limit at all?
Ficsmass gift trees can be built in unlimited amounts and each makes 15 gifts worth 1 point each. Andrew made a factory sinking those in couple milions before the game exploded.
And the number display on awesome sink has an integer limit, but game actually counts every point sunk so they do not get lost. Just display breaks.

[wind spade]

whichever you want

there's no "good" or "bad"

[viral sparrow]

pretty sure iron pipe and fine concrete are good but you should wait until someone with more experience responds lol

[cerulean stratus]

iron pipe

[viral sparrow]

i mean the miner one is bad no

[wind spade]

no

[cerulean stratus]

iron pipe allows you to make a lot of things without going steel

[viral sparrow]

what can it be used for?

[wind spade]

automating miners?

[viral sparrow]

but why would you want that

[wind spade]

but increasing costs by a lot

[wind spade]

so that you can put them in depots?

[cerulean stratus]

so you can put it on the depot and not worry

[viral sparrow]

eh good point

[viral sparrow]

idk why your being passive aggressive i'm still a new player lol

[cerulean stratus]

there's a lot of locations with iron and copper or limestone that can be used for a lot of ingots, but no coal

[wind spade]

if you're new, why are you assuming something is bad if you don't know the full game yet?

[cerulean stratus]

or oil

[viral sparrow]

i couldn't think of a single use for it when it came up, completely forgot about the dimensional depot

[wind spade]

coal is almost everywhere tbh

[viral sparrow]

plus i was more asking although i didn't make that clear

[wind spade]

I mean there wasn't a single "?" in your messages, so yeah, I assumed you're just claiming things instead of asking

[viral sparrow]

i don't use punctuation like that 99% of the time so that makes sense lol

[wind spade]

could be a good idea to start using it 😉

since text doesn't convey voice tone

[cerulean stratus]

well, I remember starting in the green fields, making a base in the middle and coal being a bit out of the way. another example is above the west coast on the rocky desert. Plenty of limestone, iron and copper, but you have to get out of your way to bring coal in

[wind spade]

you build near the coal 🙂

[cerulean stratus]

I didn't know that at the time. I just built the starter factory where things are

[viral sparrow]

yeah, most of my friends don't either and we understand what we mean so ig i'm just used to it

[cerulean stratus]

and people start in the northern forest cliff not because it has coal greeny

[wind spade]

yeah, the game tries to teach you to expand by having resources outside of your starting area 🙂

[cerulean stratus]

it also allows you to bypass some of that with iron pipes

[cerulean stratus]

it also means that coal isn't everywhere, if it was, you wouldn't need to expand

[wind spade]

I meant it as "it's easy to find a location for steel"

nothing is trully everywhere obviously

[wind spade]

sure, it's an option. I just feel that it should be mentioned that it's a more resource heavy variant, when giving people suggestions to use it

[cerulean stratus]

yeah I can agree with that

[viral sparrow]

i feel like it's more convenient earlier on

[wind spade]

I feel that it is a red herring. When you unlock steel, the game teaches you how to do steel production and then builds upon that in further tiers. If you skip it, you end up not learning what the game tried to teach you 🤷

[viral sparrow]

i mean you still need steel beams anyways for industrial beams and frameworks so you have to learn before phase 3 anyway

[wind spade]

so if you're doing steel anyway, iron pipe kinda loses purpose (for me)

[viral sparrow]

i understand why it doesn't have much purpose but i like to use it when i have lots of iron around and coal is a bit further away than i'd like

[cerulean stratus]

you may want to do heavy modular frames in a different spot from the rest of your steel factory

[viral sparrow]

especially if i don't need that many steel pipes - i can overclock miner if i need to

[cerulean stratus]

in general you do want a lot of steel pipes honestly

[wind spade]

I usually do every new item separately

[cerulean stratus]

for motors, or heavy modular frames. Encased pipes also good

[wind spade]

never hook factories to other factories

[viral sparrow]

for a specific item or something like stators i wouldn't need many

[viral sparrow]

i only unlocked that recently but my steel beam production is fine for now i have several containers full of industrial beams

[cerulean stratus]

yes, it doesn't mean they can't use overflow from other nodes

[wind spade]

not saying that 🤷

[cerulean stratus]

yeah I think we're just in aggressive agreement here

[cerulean stratus]

you may have for now, but if you need to make more heavy modular frames, you'll need more encased industrial beams and steel pipes

[analog meteor]

who said. (not trying to be disrespectful, ik you know more abt the game) but for me it worked fine for all late tier items. usually produced more than a recipe requires and just hook it into a manufacturer or smth* when im dealing with single digit numbers per min. but thats only for inventory and depot

[cerulean stratus]

well that's good, but a lot of times just 1 machine isn't enough for all that you need

and you need to make more rcus, again

[analog meteor]

well from my experience it has been more than enough

[wind spade]

it can work and people are doing that 🤷
it's just many players suffer from burnouts and such when "planning for future", so I recommend not doing that

[analog meteor]

only need tons of concrete to build the base. and when i am building the bins fill up with stuff like turbo motors and when i do need them i can spam down particle acelerators and stuff everywhere

[cerulean stratus]

i think just as many players feel burnout building a massive factory for 1 item, just to have to do it again and more

[wind spade]

the nice thing about the independency strategy I suggest is that the factories you build aren't massive

because you only make like 5-10/min for most items

[cerulean stratus]

an rcu factory will always be annoying to build

[analog meteor]

all late tier item rate was determined by the slightly advanced items already made in bulk and yes later and later items signifinacntly decrreased in production rate bcs of the itmes being made before it but it was still more than enoguh

[analog meteor]

but it was fairly straight forward. oscilators and stuff already made the floor below it so only like one constructor for aluminum was added for that.

[cerulean stratus]

i guess crystal computers are good for that

[analog meteor]

and pasta was very easy (decided only made 2 per min bcs thats how many particle acelerators fit into a certain room). just belted rcu and fmf from the outlet of the storage bin straight to an asembler. and already prepared for coper powder

[cerulean stratus]

the copper powder is easy, the cubes aren't really

[analog meteor]

i didnt even use that. used the base recipe which was already being made with 2 full oc manufactures

[analog meteor]

yeah but all the stuff i did before for the rcu and fmf meant i had more than enough to make the amount i wanted for portals

[cerulean stratus]

i'm really curious as to how you build things, do you leave your computer running overnight?

[analog meteor]

no. i go to school and i get 2 to 4 hours a day

[cerulean stratus]

so you leave your computer running during school?

[analog meteor]

no

2 to 4 hours of satisfactory

my friends very much know how much im adicted to this game

[cerulean stratus]

yeah the math isn't really adding up to me

[analog meteor]

its been like 2-3 months and i played eveyr day

idk how to count months

[cerulean stratus]

I always make enough parts for both my storage and production, for things like cooling systems, I made 1 manufacturer for me, but still needed like 5 for other recipes

[analog meteor]

i skipped the adding other 5 and just clocked turbo motors down to leave me some for other stuffs

[cerulean stratus]

I've used like 8 manufacturers making crystal oscillators for all the rcus I needed, which was like 5 rcus

[analog meteor]

ill check tmr to see exactly what im making and how much of and the chains of it. and show it ig

[cerulean stratus]

my thermal rockets is a massive factory, with some parts being brought from other factories, with some parts being brought from other factories, all being transported by drones

all that for 4 thermal rockets per min

[analog meteor]

huh. im using a mega base thingy and i jsut made a tower inside it and each floor is a higher level of item taking items from floors below. ig thats why i only have 88km of belts

[cerulean stratus]

even when making mega bases I always felt like I was never making enough items for everything

were your recipes running at 100%?

[ionic crystal]

would a split like this work? mk2 pipe brings in 400m3 fuel wich is split in 2 lines of 200 (10 fuel generators per side)

[oblique hollow]

its only 400 fuel

so ye

[ionic crystal]

seems to be struggling sadly 😦

[oblique hollow]

slap a pump down on it and keep waiting

[ionic crystal]

no valves?

[oblique hollow]

pump is better

pump resets head lift, valve doesnt
valve only passes on head lift

[ionic crystal]

only gets a flow rate of 340ish

[oblique hollow]

watch it fluctuate some more

[ionic crystal]

last 3 refinerys in the line barely get pumped empty

[oblique hollow]

if it jumps between 500 and 300 then its good

[oblique hollow]

did you use all mk 2 pipes near the refineries

[ionic crystal]

mk1 on output to mk2 main

is that a problem?

[oblique hollow]

not necessarily.
try adding another pump somewhere close to the refineries
like right between some of them

and make sure you arent bottlenecking yourself somewhere by accident

by having a hidden mk 1 pipe wedgeded inside somewhere where it doesnt belong

[ionic crystal]

no mk1 anywhere besides that split in the screenshot. another pump between the refinery's (right in the middle) doesn't seem to do much so far

[oblique hollow]

welp.
400/min isnt a lot and definitely shouldnt overload the mk 2 pipe

is that pipe full at all times by any chance?

[ionic crystal]

near the last 3 refinery's yes

[oblique hollow]

ok thats normal then.
probably just needs time to work through the fluid.
you can flush that part a bit

[ionic crystal]

wait a sec, maybe this makes sense to you

pipes inside sqaure 1 are full, pipes inside sqaure 2 are not

right from that corner everything is half full

well, screw this game..... underneath a junction was 1 teeny tiny mk1 pipe.....

right infront of that corner😭

[oblique hollow]

yeah thats always a real annoyance

make sure to not "splice" pipes too much.

build the central pipe at the right pipe mk right away, if possible.
then add junctions and then connect the machines

and if possible do NOT build anything ever right near a support

supports obscure things

especially if a junction or similar is built too close to it

[ionic crystal]

yea... that was the case here

thanks a lot!!

[oblique hollow]

you're welcome.
for future reference: if you build mk 2 pipes and mk 1 pipes and the mk 2 pipe seems to stay weirdly close to 300/min flow rate.... it probably is bottlenecked by a mk 1 pipe somewhere

[static drift]

Been there. I once found a small mk. 1 pipe under a pump.

[hazy hill]

why do u need mk2 pump on flat pipes

[ionic crystal]

Read the conversation 😉 was part of the troubleshooting. They're gone now

[polar gyro]

I would love to have troubleshooted that on someone’s scenario lol. Just finding that juicy mk1 piece under I imagine would have been so satisfying

[near zodiac]

is it viable to use three power shards in every single building of mine? I have 6 water extractors feeding 3 pipes running to 16 coal generators producing 1,2k MW of energy. Currently I have 23 un-powered buildings and it's already filling 1,750 MW. I still have to check how much the production of energy and water/coal consumption will increase if I power a coal generator

[peak lantern]

Yo could someone give me a how-to or a setup on how to split two 75 belts and a 120 belt into three 90 belts (coal geni setup)

[vapid gorge]

if you have the shards? sure but you probably want to save them for miners as that gets you more resources.

otherwise all it does is save you space

[peak lantern]

@math-and-meta Yo could someone give me a how-to or a setup on how to split two 75 belts and a 120 belt into three 90 belts (coal geni setup) plssss

[opaque quartz]

!wikisearch manifold

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=manifold

[opaque quartz]

Assuming you only have mk2 belts? Injected manifold should work. Check the wiki link for an explanation

[vapid gorge]

injection manifolds. Gross.

[peak lantern]

nvm

its coal genys and i thought 45 coal was to one geny

sorry yall

[opaque quartz]

Ah I see the thread now

[patent blaze]

injection manifold is so cursed

keeping track of the numbers in those is an absolute mess lol

i'd rather just waste 10% of my resources overall than have to deal with that

[vapid gorge]

for me it's mostly that effectively it's still multiple manifolds, they're just connected to each other. They tend to look a lot worse to due to layout options and the only benefit is that it might reduce total machine count a little depending on your clocking.

[patent blaze]

i just divide every machine group by a nice number and clock them so it works out

[amber umbra]

Only niche for injection manifold that made sense to me is when you want to utilize all of the input items and your production lines aren’t scaled to cleanly use that amount. Otherwise it’s better to maintain separated manifolds.

Seemed similar to those belt compressor tactics like converting 780 belts into 600 belts.

So pretty niche.z

[prisma kraken]

i tend to agree on the injection manifold - lot of bookkeeping math to get it right. still, sometimes when dealing with several belts coming out of a train, you're choices are between the injection manifold or doing some sort of balancer. neither is really great. As you said, getting things partitioned to consumer what you are supplying at the correct rates is a lot better of a way to go

[wind spade]

or just separate manifolds

[prisma kraken]

i personally prefer doing even splits between machines wherever it makes sense to do so, but yeah, properly sized manifolds are the easy button

in a lot of cases, it doesn't make much of a difference, but for something like smelting aluminum scrap, waiting for a manifold to warm is painful

[patent blaze]

I love that splitters and mergers can almost always fit within the bounding box of the actual machines

compact manifolds that dont take any extra space

[prisma kraken]

yeah, i'm a bit surprised that they changed the assembler hitbox to be slightly smaller than its natural 2-splitter width

in general, that was a pretty nice change, but you have to be careful with it at times

[polar gyro]

Ew

[teal urchin]

So I’m curious how you guys like to do things.. do you make a ton of a single item, then ship it out to somewhere else to be used for a build; or do you start your new build and remake the same item just for it?

[patent blaze]

i remade everything at the place where i need it

i did nuclear all from raw resources other than plastic

[teal urchin]

Yes that’s what I do. Making huge amounts of an item, and then shipping it out SOUNDS cool. But boy, it sounds like it’d require soooo much planning and management lol

[patent blaze]

exactly

you have to plan your entire playthrough before placing the first foundation

[teal urchin]

Yea lol

[patent blaze]

comparatively i can just use the calculator website to make a production plan and then adjust the inputs based on what i have in the area

[plush marten]

i make it where i need it

transport all the raw resource to one place and then i make my stuff

[patent blaze]

:)

[unreal mortar]

@teal urchin Before we had the the dimensional space i had a small factory for everything i needed for laying down train tracks that feed into a train so i could just call it where ever. Was pretty nice while making a train network in every biome. But now if dimensional is not enough i make extra where i need it

[fading talon]

I have like.... 85 hard drives scanned so far, I have all the pre-requisites but i've still not gotten diluted fuel.... am i missing something or just unlucky

[remote flame]

Going through on the 10th playthrough of the game now, I think I've seen so many individuals' creativity and thinking on megafactories, satellite factories, and centralised resource hubs (factories that dedicate the use/processing of one kind of resource to distribute everywhere else!

Personally, from Tier 1-5 items, I produce everything needed at the same factory. So this ranges from the simplest iron rods/plates, to motors/circuit boards. When it comes to Tier 6 and beyond it depends.
Heavy Modular Frames I have almost always seen one large factory dedicated to its production where a small portion is used for construction/build gun and the rest is transported to other factories that use it. This is because HMF's have incredibly limited use above them in production, going to fused modular frames and Adaptive control unit. So the logistics of shipping it to potentially 2 different locations is.. really easy.

Computers in bulk to other factories is also really possible since it has 4 potential advanced items it can go in to, I have seen this done mostly when people use the 'Crystal Computer' alternate recipe due to the surrounding resources not supporting any further advanced parts.

In other words, Making items in bulk can dramatically centralise production chains, keeping it easier to keep track of and manage/compact future builds. But I wouldn't go recommending to use it too much on Items lower than Tier 4 as transporting the sheer quantity required to the sheer amount of future factories that need that part, make the logistics extremely painful on an item that could be made in the same future factory with very minimal effort 🙂

tldr; both, whatever makes sense with the location/resources nearby!

[frosty owl]

Some like to truck things, others like trains...
I like to sushi things

[frosty owl]

Missing some luck, yes 🤞

[pliant vortex]

Use satisfactory tools to max produce from the nodes you are tapping in an area. This will inevitably create an excess of items that you can sink.. In your future builds you can then decide if you want to transport those excess items to your new factory or just make it all on site…. But you have the excess there if you want to utilize it, and you haven’t wasted your nodes…

[wind spade]

I personally wouldn't recommend this approach

and there's nothing like "wasting a node"

if you're not using the node fully, it's not a waste, because same argument could be said about every single node on the map, you're not using it, you're wasting it

[pliant vortex]

If you’re going to the trouble to build a factory you might as well get all you can out of a tapped node imho.. and this can scale with your mk miner level. You can go back and upgrade the miner and then overclock the machines if you need more of an item

[wind spade]

why build more than I need? and why artificially limit it to one node?

I'll just build what I need and not worry about future, not waste time on extra machines that don't do anything relevant to me and in the future I'll have much better understanding of how much of what I need and I'll build it then

[pliant vortex]

To each his own

Who said anything about one node? Max the nodeS (plural) for any given factory to your miner level.

[wind spade]

why artificially limit it to [whatever] amount of nodes?

like if I need 10 plates/min, I'm gonna build 10, not 800

[pliant vortex]

For some items you will need a lot more later (use the wiki to figure it out prior to late game arrival)..

[wind spade]

but why would I guess how much I need, build it in advance and get it wrong (most likely), when I can just wait until I know how much I need and build it later?

and also build it at the place where I need it, rather than somewhere where I built it in early game

[pliant vortex]

Greeny, obviously it’s fine to play as you propose and make everything from scratch at each place, in fact as a challenge it might be a fun way to go in a future play through, but some might like what I propose and to use those trains and drones and such to move lower volumes of mid tier items instead of using them to move base resources as you would be required to do with your method

[wind spade]

I don't move base resources (much), I build near base resources

and I'm not forcing anyone, I said at the start that it's my recommendation

[pliant vortex]

Have you finished the game yet?

[wind spade]

I haven't played the game since May 2019

[pliant vortex]

Maybe things changed in the last 5 years? Base resources for end game items are all over the map, so you either transport base resources or you transport mid-tier products or some combo of both..

[wind spade]

my recommendation isn't based on my playthrough of the game

[pliant vortex]

Then what’s it based on? I am basically finished with it on my first playthrough (I’m just holding off completing the final phase because I don’t want it to end:)). Now I am just going back and making cool looking factories and fully automating the final productions..

[wind spade]

on talking with many people that have thousands of hours in the game, helping new players pretty much daily on this discord and knowing what does and does not help them. Many new players feel burnt out or overwhelmed when they build the way you said, because they are not progressing further that way, they are "preparing" for future they know nothing about instead of focusing on present.

(and also a bit of making tools for people to use)

[hushed trellis]

ey chat satisfactory calculator n satisfactory tools have different constructor counts for the same factory, why's that?

[wind spade]

because SCIM doesn't optimise anything, it just uses whatever you select and does some weird plans
Tools optimise production for raw resource usage and pick alts from your selected list that lead to the resource savings

[pliant vortex]

Just a crazy thought…. I’d recommend actually playing the game before handing out advice..

[wind spade]

just a crazy thought... if I'm repeating experienced players' recommendation, I don't really need to

[hushed trellis]

to be honest i spend more time reading material n people's experiences on satisfactory to plan out my own factories than actually playing the game and experimenting

[pliant vortex]

That’s smart, but sounds like you do actually play it.. I think I am at like 700 hours and I’ve only played on 1.0.. so not exactly a newbie.. but as everyone parrots on here there is no “right” way to play…. Some ways may be more logical or faster or whatever, and it is fun to read the various opinions.
However, I think most would agree actually playing it probably gives you some additional insight beyond just reading about it….

[wind spade]

so if an experienced player tells you something, that's fine and you agree with them, but if someone who just was around in the community for many years repeats the same thing, suddenly their opinion is invalid?

[hushed trellis]

i mean yea but i have this curse where i just need to perfect everything otherwise i restart the whole run, and communities usually help with that :v

[wind spade]

even though it's literally the same opinion?

[hushed trellis]

also i only have like 65 hours in this game i havent gone past coal production yet, i do NOT know what im talking about

[oblique hollow]

The advice to build near nodes stayed unchanged over 5 years because its something thats fundamental to the game: endless nodes. Limited throughput, but no time limit

So there is no downside to building near nodes, while building far away has the downside of extra logistical effort

[pliant vortex]

Yep, not the original discussion. It was make everything on site from scratch at each location or use transport to move some mid level items to more advanced factories.

[versed violet]

slight cheating question - are trains not possible to sample and build when not unlocked?

[pliant vortex]

You can use advanced game settings and unlock whatever you want if you like

[versed violet]

Keeping milestones locked for now to limit alt recipes pool.
I have my old factory copied over into the save and slowly getting things back online. Slowly being the keyword.

[hushed trellis]

chat are manifolds worth it? i keep worrying about factories not getting their resources fast enough

[wind spade]

we're not chat

manifolds work at same efficiency as balancers, once stabilised

[north mauve]

The most important resource in the game is your time. Manifolds save you time. Properly set up factories don't really know the difference between the two options once any amount of time has passed

[hushed trellis]

both figuratively and literally?

[kind cairn]

they are: || use dismantle mode on build gun and sample from there||

[north mauve]

Time wasted setting up balanced distribution could've been spent building a second factory with manifolds

Also manifolds make blueprints go brrr

[hushed trellis]

im more worried about if it doesn't stabilize tbh

[kind cairn]

if you are worried about a manifold not stabilizing "in time", just prefill it. provided the main belt speed on the manifold can carry the required items/min for the total machine input, and that you are putting in at least 100% of the required items/min, manifolds will always eventually get to 100% efficiency... prefilling just cuts the wait time for them

[north mauve]

Feed the output into a box, see if it balances a few hours later.

[kind cairn]

theres a handy manifold prefill calculator somewhere around... one sec

||i wonder who wrote it 🤡 ||

https://satisfactory.greeny.dev/machine-fill

[opaque quartz]

Ooh that’s pretty handy

And you can pre-fill machines in a blueprint too IIRC? Which requires you to have those resources in inventory or depot when you plop down the blueprint

[north mauve]

Yup! Not sure why anyone would care that much, but yes you can do that.

[oblique hollow]

For a lot of components is IS validated. Shipping basic components around is a lot of overhead. I consider things like basically all iron parts, copper parts, steel and some simple electronics to be in that category of "simple components"

[opaque quartz]

I mean if you have a fully stocked depot and you are doing a big build then you can just not have to think about it

[north mauve]

Right but then you'd have to carry a bunch in your inventory and have a custom BP preloaded for making a specific thing

[oblique hollow]

You can decide where you wanna draw the line. But for a bunch of things, making them from scratch is usually easier and faster than long range transport

[opaque quartz]

Not advocating for the approach, just interesting to have the option. My blueprints are mostly generic for machine type so i couldn’t do that anyway since a recipe is not selected

[north mauve]

You could, you would just have to load the BP, set them all, fill them all, then save a new BP "Assemblers x8 - <item>". That's the part I find wasteful.

[oblique hollow]

It has its use for certain things. Definitely for a diluted packaged fuel BP or maybe even recycling for plastic and rubber

[opaque quartz]

ooh yeah, a canister loop having the empties pre-filled makes sense

[marsh path]

Yo, gooday
Is there a way in Satisfactory Tools in which I put the amount of a resource available in a node or a region and the products I want out and it gives me how much I can do with it?

Imma do my initial Oil stuff on Spire Coast, where there's a ton of oil

[north mauve]

Not that I know, but you can always just see how many a single item would need and calculate by the amount of stuff in the area

Just make what you need

[uneven burrow]

can someone explain wtf is happening i checked every generator i got and none of them are slacking

[marsh path]

That's what I've been doing, but I'd wondered if there was an easier way

[outer vale]

the closest thing to that would be the Maximise option, but that attempts to balance all the outputs evenly and doesn't optimise for resource usage, so not recommended

how would you expect it to work, would it prioritise certain outputs over others?

[wind spade]

you still need to select what you want to make

[north mauve]

Can you describe the issue

[uneven burrow]

my production is going up and down

[outer vale]

at least one gen somewhere isn't getting enough fuel

or coal

[uneven burrow]

i checked ALL of them

[north mauve]

Any geotherms?

[outer vale]

nah they wouldn't look like that

[uneven burrow]

nope

[outer vale]

how much is the drop, 250?

[uneven burrow]

lemme check

[outer vale]

that'll help you narrow down what's conking out

[uneven burrow]

up to like 980 mgw

i fucking found the generators

but they both only make 500mgw

I SWEAR TO GOD ONE CONVEYOR WAS MK1 AND WAS SUPPOSED TO BE MK2

im so dumb

[wind spade]

wtf is mgw

[uneven burrow]

megawats

[wind spade]

that's MW

[uneven burrow]

then idk

im used to calling it mgw

[wind spade]

m is mili, M is mega 🙂

and g is grams

[uneven burrow]

and its pretty much the same th-

💀

alright buddy

[amber umbra]

People tend to be particular about their SI prefixes here. Greeny is trying to be helpful.

[uneven burrow]

alright then

[amber umbra]

I'm happy if people make any effort to use units, so all good.

[uneven burrow]

yeah and sure enough its stable now

[wind spade]

I mean if you at least called it mw, it'd be fine-ish
but mgw is bogus 😄

[outer vale]

nothing wrong with milligram-watt-equivalents

[uneven burrow]

i mean techniclly power weights nothi- 🤓 👆

[north mauve]

They're real units. If you pay your utility bill, or think about EVs, it's pretty easy to think about KW and KWH on a daily basis.

It's fun to see how a piddly little constructor uses 4MW, which is more than hundreds of houses. An overclocked particle accelerator uses more energy than New York City.

[north mauve]

I prefer my energy measured in ounces

[outer vale]

wonder how many calories my factory burns a day

[spark crescent]

I wonder if the in-game power is in MWh. For comparison, CERN uses 1.3TWH/y.

[ruby junco]

any idea why satisfactory modeler isn't meeting the set outputs? also some connections full on break the planner. anything I did wrong?

[vapid gorge]

that program is a crime

absolute bottom tier planner that only got popular because it's on steam. That's why

[ruby junco]

what would you suggest using?

[vapid gorge]

honestly any other planer I've seen is better than modeler but sftools is at the top.

what's the final output you're wanting on that?

[ruby junco]

three of the niblicks and smart rifle ammo

[vapid gorge]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=sg2qVZBfdxkEISMc7tgs

I wasn't sure if you meant 3 of the homing rifle or just 'some' so I left it in as 10 pm

you can change some of the recipes you want to use in the recipes tab, I recommend when you check a recipe you want you uncheck the other recipe so it forces teh planner to do it your way

otherwise it'll optimise resources based on it's weighing, which isn't a great option imo. Largely because it's better to have control and plan a location around what resources you want to use/need

very useful buttons here

share tab creates a link you can send to people or jsut paste in a document to save as reference

[latent anchor]

Yeah, 1 battery stores 100 MWh. It's properly proportional to time and energy in the game as well, an empty battery charging at 100 MW takes an hour to fill.

also nice pfp, KSP is great. I just need to get better at orbital rendezvous

[wind spade]

Power isn't, energy is

Same as irl, in your example, cern using 1.3 TWh per year is how much energy it uses

[latent anchor]

I find it funny (even though it makes sense to do it) that units like W, J and g relate to each other so scientifically and then hours get introduced. They still have 3600 seconds instead of something stupid, but Ks or Ms would be easier to work with

but then you convert to normie units anyway for the stats to be interpreted

[wind spade]

Watthour is introduced as it's easier to calculate with, but in essence is the same as Joule

If something is using 1MW and running for an hour, it used 1MWh of energy or 3600 MJ

[latent anchor]

yeah, not as simple as running it for 1000MW seconds and getting 1000 MJ but it's just a single number and it's not a problem

only issue is when you start multiplying the 3600 by different numbers, or even worse start measuring stuff by the day

1 MWd or MWy is a bit more annoying lol

86400 and 31536000 seconds respectively

[grave prism]

Anybody knows whats the most efficient fuel?

[fallow siren]

rocket fuel

very op

[opaque quartz]

Most efficient in what sense?

[grave prism]

Like for fuel genes, drones and jetpacks

[wind spade]

what do you mean "efficient"?

most energy per item? cheapest cost? (in what way?)

[grave prism]

Both? Like which one will be the highest energy per item while it not just doubling or trippling the cost for like 2 point different so to speak

[wind spade]

most energy is plutonium fuel rod
"cheapest" depends on how you value your resources and can't really be simplified to a single answer

[grave prism]

For me i just want to try and get the most bang out of my buck? So like if setting up 32 coal genes is more efficient than setting up a diluted fuel power plant then i had want to stick to coal and so on

But like if the production of turbofuel is gonna cost me more than what it will give me in terms of power then i rather not go there either

[wind spade]

oh, if you mean for power, then generally every new tech you unlock is "better" than the old tech

I personally don't like the turbofuel branch though

[grave prism]

How so?

[wind spade]

fuel gen spam is annoying and you have to bring two extra resources at least. Generally easier to just do diluted fuel into nuclear

[grave prism]

Gotcha