math-and-meta

[sullen mulch]

but it's possible i might not ever get it running, the reason i started the save was to see how much i could kill the fps

[cinder silo]

I tried moving uranium via train, once, this happened

[sullen mulch]

hahaha

yeah im scared about that

[cinder silo]

I moved it via belt after that.

[sullen mulch]

definitely going to use drones where possible for anything nuclear i reckon

[cinder silo]

I use belts for the whole thing, with the radioactive stuff being load balanced, there isn't that much radiation like anywhere, the hot spots being the reprocessing blenders near the accelerators, and the plutonium fuel rod manufacturers (and both of those are at the bottom of the waterfall)

[sullen mulch]

ahh yeah, I haven't actually worked with nuclear before so im going pedal to the metal with this build. Definitely going to try and load balance the radioactive bits now though

[cinder silo]

I recorded a brief tour of my nuclear setup, it's quite old now but still relevant : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ioMoBN0ZoM : if anything here helps, go for it.

[sullen mulch]

i'll definitely have a watch, it'd be good to get an idea for scale into my little brain

[cinder silo]

This setup fuels 100 reactors.

[sullen mulch]

ok at least i can comfortably say i won't need to build as much as you did

[cinder silo]

I used default recipes and it burns all the maps uranium ore.

[sullen mulch]

I think i have all of the alts unlocked but im going to prioritise whole numbers in production so i don't need to deal with decimals too much

[cinder silo]

The best alt with the least risk would be the one for uranium fuel cells, right at the start of ore processing.

[sullen mulch]

i'll have a look at that then, i think i got given a breakdown for everything i would need to make ages ago but i reckon i'll try and make my own process to use the recipies i like the best

[cinder silo]

Have you used https://u6.satisfactorytools.com/production

[sullen mulch]

yeah ages ago

i think last time i had a proper look at it was last december

[cinder silo]

I found it handy to use in order to break the huge chain in to much friendlier chunks.

[sullen mulch]

yeah big time, it's nice because you can mentally convert entire processes into satellite factories

definitely makes things a hell of a lot simpler

[cinder silo]

As for choking fps, my save does a decent job of that, actually crashes most pcs 😄

[sullen mulch]

hahaha, that's awesome. iirc i wanted to see if i could take down my pc because i got an upgrade just as i started understanding satisfactory

thought it would be the perfect test

[cinder silo]

I'm running a 12900k, 64gb ddr5, rtx3090 , seagate firecuda 530 4tb nvme. under some extremes I've pushed it down to 14fps, and a train crash experiment that taxed the physics got it down to 9fps.

[sullen mulch]

haha yeah that would still nuke my pc

i have a ryzen 9 5900x but it's bottle necked by my 3060 right now

[cinder silo]

Here's one of those train crashes, look at how long it hitches before all the cars get launched.

[sullen mulch]

i think my pc would go pop if i was to give that a try haha

[storm fiber]

So u lose all the cars on that?

[cinder silo]

You can re-rail the mess to rerun.

[storm fiber]

Wow

[cinder silo]

Here's the same crash but without the physics crucifying blockhouse.

Zago's save that I was messing with 🤣

There are some huge issues building plutonium processing where I put it these days.

The fog is ridiculous, good luck seeing the blenders from the particle accelerators (same room)

[proven valve]

WHAT

[prisma sapphire]

If I make 1/2 rubber and 1/2 plastic how much plastic must I turn into rubber to make 1:2 plastic to rubber?

[wintry aurora]

Could use Satisfactory Tools?

[prisma sapphire]

Cheating

[wintry aurora]

Ok then.

[prisma sapphire]

I made an equation instead, I think I’ll get it

[barren elm]

How is asking here less "cheating" than using a tool

[prisma sapphire]

Idk XD

1/4

1 fourth

Quarter

[median heath]

2 dimes and a nickel

[deft lichen]

Cheating is whatever you define as such, if you're playing singleplayer

[median heath]

"Cheating is whatever you define as such"
He said to all the married people

😉

[snow dove]

that’s multiplayer not singleplayer

[median heath]

😂

[prisma sapphire]

I think an easier way to go about it is to just go for not an exact ratio rubber to plastic

[median heath]

Why is this about Rubber to Plastic instead of about Oil to Rubber or Oil to Plastic?

[snow dove]

produce the amount of rubber you need, produce the amount of plastic you need, any more and it’s overkill

[prisma sapphire]

I shouldn’t be making thousands for fun?

[deft lichen]

1 entire node to plastic and 1 entire node to rubber

For fun use alts but have fun figuring out the rates without SFTools

[prisma sapphire]

Always

[prisma sapphire]

Recycling

[deft lichen]

I genuinely want to see that

The factory is hard to build even with SFTools

[prisma sapphire]

Nah

[deft lichen]

The rates are so ugly

[prisma sapphire]

I make notes

[deft lichen]

Let us know if you succeed

[prisma sapphire]

I just use math like this for example

[barren elm]

Personally I just use the tool to figure out nice ratios

Like how steel beams can be simplified down into 4 smelter -> 3 foundry -> direct feed from foundry into constructor

[deft lichen]

By math complexity, it's nothing that an 8th grader couldn't do, it's rather how much of it there is and how long it'd take to calculate

[median heath]

Yes. Recycled Loop is 1:3 Oil to Product.

[tall kestrel]

hey hey, just a little thing: Im in the north dune desert and trying to get a maximum out of steel products. Need to mention that Im currently using the impure coal nodes for power. So now the calculator presents the following layout: https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=r1mOaoPmbfcPswBYwisc . Is there any expert who can say if thats the maximum i can get out or is there an option to get more by deactivating specific recipes? (wanna keep the 2 pure coal nodes for later projects tho)

[deft lichen]

If you toggle all available recipes, limit the resources in the input tab and set the output resources to maximize, it will automatically do the maximum possible

[tall kestrel]

yeah sure.. just asking here bc I had the case (while setting um fuel) that I needed to deactivate specific alt (in that case petroleum coke) to get way more output...

and since I got also copper nearby I was curious if it might me better to use iron alloy ingot instead of pure iron

[deft lichen]

The planner uses weighted cost to figure out which recipes it thinks are the most resource-efficient

[tall kestrel]

okay thanks

[wind spade]

that should never be the case, if it is, feel free to send it to me

[prisma sapphire]

Just use your own brain, it’s more reliable

[deft lichen]

I wish it was lmao

[cinder silo]

Using my own brain is how I got the 6x 800 trying to take up from 6x 780 belts (before throughput issues), lack of thought ftw.

[prisma sapphire]

Hmm

I just take too much time thinking probably but I never use the calculator

[deft lichen]

If you don't get tired, why not

A nice way to train the brain

[prisma sapphire]

I also spend time on dumb thoughts, like: „should I make one rubber and plastic cycle that then feeds more machines that turn plastic to rubber/ the other way around or should it be all one loop“

[tall kestrel]

totally agree - but the planing process would be a lot longer with all recipes and their numbers in mind

[prisma sapphire]

It depends on the complexity of a project

But since I usually go with the flow when playing I would just plan one part, then execute it and then do another etc

[tall kestrel]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=lvABGH46clkByxbgAHXf best example. I would be insane calculating it on my own 😄

[prisma sapphire]

I see

[warm wren]

🤔 It's better to OC the nuclear power plants to 200% or no?

[prisma sapphire]

Although, you would probably always want to set up a bunch of the base resources for later use anyway

[prisma sapphire]

I personally don’t think overclocking anything but miners is worth it if u don’t really have to, for me it’d only be a last resort if I don’t have enough space in a building

[tall kestrel]

true. did that with batteries but i usually build up one big factory for 1-4 products on its own in a decent spot...trying to avoid long transports

[prisma sapphire]

But it depends on your preference

[prisma sapphire]

Ye I see

I’d say you should also have a big copper sheet setup with refineries later in the game

For example

[tall kestrel]

well thats worth a thought....never spent a minute about a copper sheet factory on its own 🙂

[prisma sapphire]

It’s super useful tho, because the alternate is very effective yet needs a lot of space, so I think a big setup is worth

[barren elm]

Wet copper bars into wet copper sheets is the dream combo

[versed violet]

Nukes take a lot of space and overclocked to three slugs ™️ have almost the exact water needs as one mk2 pipe can supply. Almost as in there is a very small thousands digit difference, and mk2 like to fluctuate, so assume they might drop offline from time to time for couple seconds.

[median heath]

I never do because a normal nuke can be done 1:1 with a Water Extractor at 250%.

[umbral escarp]

so this is a super early game iron rod factory, any tips?

[median heath]

Keep playing?

[umbral escarp]

cool lol

[cinder silo]

Build on foundations as you can.

[median heath]

Is this your first run ever?

[umbral escarp]

had a few false starts so no but its the first one im trying to take seriously

[median heath]

May I give you my new player advice?

[umbral escarp]

by all means

[median heath]

Drop this Discord, entirely (for now).
Play the game by yourself without any guides, hints, wikis, or help all the way to T7.
Experience the game for yourself, meet the challenges and solve the problems yourself so you learn how to think about the game.
Get your own perspective on how things work. Once you're at T7 then come back and you'll be in a much better spot to compare your experience with others instead of just having information handed to you.

You lose so much of the journey if you are just gifted answers.

[umbral escarp]

Alright, thanks for the advice

im not gonna leave but i certianly wont ask for help on every minute factory detail

[barren elm]

Actually I do have some new player advice I wish I followed

Save your first factory designs somewhere, don't discard the save, they're really fun to look back on

[cinder silo]

Alas my first save of around 400 hours was discarded due to data corruption, I didn't know there was potentially a fix, I wrote the whole thing off and started again.

[umbral escarp]

frankly i just had miners and smelters and took the materials and used a crafting bench lmfao

[vapid gorge]

What do you mean by visual tilt?

[vapid gorge]

other than Sev's tip which I don't disagree with - don't be worried about mistakes. The game is set up in such a way that you benefit from tearing down old factories and rebuilding to meet new needs.
Experiment and don't obsess about perfection.

Also build you coal power plant at distant nodes keeping the power grid seperate 🙂

[wind spade]

or don't 🤷‍♂️

[dusky rover]

._.

i dont really need anything

[wind spade]

pick one and move on

[dusky rover]

but wich

[wind spade]

doesn't matter if you don't need any

you can get all alts anyway

[dusky rover]

welp

thx

[vapid gorge]

what are you working on right now or next you think?

[short drum]

I meant the visual clipping sorry

[vapid gorge]

Oh you mean when objects z fight and flicker?
So you can control that some what with what materials you use and if your clipping only covers a small portion of the foundations it become really minimal.

Along with that there's a couple simple ways with mods to change the z (height position) by 0.01m , which stops all flickering

[vapid gorge]

in that particular image it may have looked like there was intense flickering because of shape/colours but that was actually just poor rendering at that distance XD

[dusky rover]

Just wanna play normally. But i think the screws were a nice decision

[vapid gorge]

Ah well all the recipes lets you play 'normally'.
But I understand the reflex to ask. Recipes aren't bad or good for the most part. Their value changes with what resources you have available in whatever location you want to build and how you prefer to build.

some recipes are more flexible and some are more niche.

For example your screw recipe I find really flexible early on since it lets you skip a whole step. Later on it might have a lot less value since you can remove screws from your world with alt recipes 🙂

The other 2 recipes in the pic are pretty flexible as well. Iron Wire I love because iron is much more common than copper so you have a lot more locations available to you to build things with wire w/o having to find copper. And copper alloy is pretty great as sometimes you need a ton of copper and if you have spare iron in a location you can use it to make more copper and it might save you from having to import it

[wind spade]

since you can remove screws from your world with alt recipes 🙂
or use steel screws/rods

[vapid gorge]

Or remove screws and rods 😄

Never see a rod again!

In fact you can never smelt an iron ingot again if yo udon't want to !

[wind spade]

but copper rotors

[frosty owl]

No need for iron ingots there

[wind spade]

I mean screws

removing screws is so U2

[vapid gorge]

That's right. The new wave is 'remove iron ingots'

[frosty owl]

Almost did it once. Good for machine-count reduction.

[vapid gorge]

but solid steel ingots ❤️ can never let go of them

[wind spade]

I never felt the need to remove a single item 🤷‍♂️ I don't see any advantage it brings (I mean removing the item directly, not the advantages from recipes used in the process, if the recipe is good and it's "byproduct" is that it removes something, then sure why not, but I won't use a recipe just because it removes thing without any other advantage)

[barren elm]

Steel screws sure feels like it removes screws from play at least

Since it replaces any kind of screw input with 1 assembler (2 at most?)

But yeah, last time I played copper was only used to make iron, and screws were a meme...

[wind spade]

I mean you should always put screw constructors in front of machines that need them anyway

no matter what recipe you use

[finite sun]

screws are troublesome
there's even that HMF alt that can't be run at 250% OC due to needing 975/m screws

so my typical answer to screws is to not use them anywhere aside from RIPs and rotors (and rarely, MFs)

producing default computers would be another sorta viable case for screws, but currently it's massively easier to use caterium there and not much other uses for caterium aside from connectors and computers

[wind spade]

well
if you don't OC buildings, screws are hardly troublesome, they are the same as almost any other item

[finite sun]

it's the least "compressed" item in the game, even compared to other 500/stack items
most recipes need tons of screws/m; until you unlock mk5 belts - it's always additional work on logistics, more belts, more splitting, more mess

only quickwire is somewhat comparable, but there's much less recipes using tons of quickwire, especially early on

by the time you need numerous HSCs with their 210/m quickwire input - you've already unlocked mk5

[wind spade]

or just put the screw constructors in front of the building, then it's no logistics and no splitting 🤷‍♂️

[finite sun]

yeah, matching 50/m production to 52/m consumption is fun

[wind spade]

overclocking exists

[finite sun]

imagine OCing screws

[wind spade]

underclock the consumers then 🤷‍♂️

[barren elm]

I run a belt of steel beams and treat it as a hyper-compressed belt of screws, and I'm pretty satisfied with that

But yeah it is pretty bad that an alt recipe literally can't be completed if overclocked to 250%

[finite sun]

yeah, the downside is that steel screw eats lots of steel
and steel rod + default eats lots of space and creates logistical pains

[barren elm]

...wait can you use multiple inputs on a manufacturer for the same resource?

[finite sun]

you can use one input to supply all the resources

or you can use different inputs to supply same resource

all inputs are absolutely interchangeable

[barren elm]

I'd kill for circuits in this game

[wind spade]

you can, so you can even feed that alt recipe at 250% 😛

[barren elm]

Yeah it hadn't occurred to me that you can use 2 feeds for screws

Kinda complicates things I guess but hey

[wind spade]

I mean you complicate it for yourself by clocking the manufacturer 😛

[finite sun]

yeah, for heavy flexible frames you can technically mix part of screws input into another belt

[barren elm]

I am sympathetic to people who cheat in 10k power shards and overclock everything to 250% to save performance

(or, you know, lizard battery farm them)

I remember when I played previously the matra was "Sure you can theoretically make 100 turbomotors per minute, but your computer won't"

[wind spade]

I mean even if you clock everything to 250% it's still a lot of buildings. So clocking a few manufacturers to less than 250% is not a big deal imo

[finite sun]

that seems to be the worst approach to saving performance
since it's mostly GPU-bound issue to draw lots of machines, and in current times they're pretty optimized with low LODs and no animations when viewed at a distance

it's back in U3 days looking at a big factory killed you fps right on the spot

[barren elm]

I mean, all gpu issues can be defeated by just not being in render range

It's a solved problem

[wind spade]

all issues can be defeated by not playing the game

[barren elm]

True that, just play through the calculator tool

But yeah I get your point, I was mostly leading into "build modular, save gpus"

[finite sun]

you would be simply switching easy in-game issues for hard and difficult real-life issues

[barren elm]

Issues like "build mk3 miners on your real life job to farm the upgrade for your graphics factory belt speed"

[finite sun]

nowadays you can architecture your GPU into slowdowns much faster than you can factory it
lights, glass windows, and all that fluff uses quite a lot of graphic power

[brittle thunder]

aye, Machines to kill your CPU, fluffy stuff to kill the GPU, best of both worlds!

[dusky rover]

I see

Thank you

[finite sun]

machines probably contribute the smallest part here
I'd imagine belts and other transports create most CPU load

but since you need more belts for more machines, it's kinda related

[dusky rover]

Yea. Belts especially if they are long and tramsport radioactive things

[finite sun]

oh yes, real-time recalculations of radioactive zone must be pretty heavy

[brittle thunder]

aye, for this argument I meant machines as in anything on production, and fluff as anything non-production

not immediately clear, I appreciate

[dusky rover]

Mhm. I think cramping up stuff at one place will do it too

Best example is let's game it out with his tornado wich completely ruined his framerate

Or his.. uh what is it callef again..? The like webbed field where all of the rad stuff had to go through

[barren elm]

Sure but 3x the machines usually means 3x the belts

Each constructor is another 4 belts + 0/1 splitter + 0/1 merger on the manifold

[tropic hawk]

His belt weave?

[dusky rover]

exactly yea- thanks lol

[barren elm]

https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/xutbq3/phase_4_alternate_recipes_ranking_w_spreadsheet/

This is a really interesting post that comes to some conclusions that I otherwise wouldn't expect

And I'm still not entirely convinced by, like pure copper being F tier

But the results kinda speak for themselves in the form of that before-and-after resource graph

[wintry aurora]

Subjective analysises are subjective.

[barren elm]

Fantastic?

[wintry aurora]

I prefer using the info on the wiki.

[barren elm]

Ok

[median heath]

Fine Concrete being "Recommended" 😂

[deft lichen]

No way

[barren elm]

I mean my first impressions were bad too

[median heath]

Insulated Oscillator -- which is the only way you should make Oscillators is in C tier.

[barren elm]

But the guy backs it up with some pretty convincing results

[wintry aurora]

UHHH, why do they have recycled rubber under F tier? Can't do the recycle loop without that.

[barren elm]

Yeah they list recycled recipes as being scored independently but when combined are better

[median heath]

omg...

[barren elm]

Which is weird imo but whatever it's not my post

[median heath]

He put Classic Battery in F...

[wintry aurora]

But that's the problem, the alt recipies are almost never in isolation.

[median heath]

Classic Battery, Instant Scrap, Pure Caterium, Cheap Silica, Iron Wire...
All F according to them.

[deft lichen]

Iron wire f tier 🤣

[barren elm]

Yeah pure caterium is a weird one

[deft lichen]

What kind of formula is being used to get these results

[median heath]

They also somehow ranked Turbo Heavy above Turbo....

[deft lichen]

Wha..

[median heath]

And regular Fuel above Residual.

[wintry aurora]

Almost all top tier stuff is computer and chips related stuff.

[deft lichen]

Steel rod and steel screw are D tier while being the best way to make screws each in their own way

[median heath]

Yes.

[barren elm]

I believe he said he doesn't use screws at all somewhere

[wintry aurora]

@barren elm Take a look at this one https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Hard_Drive/Alternate_recipe_analysis It's outdated, yes, but should bring about the point of how subjective they are.

[median heath]

He also has Steeled Frame ranked higher than I would ever put it.

He cares so much about MW cost... 😭

[barren elm]

Yeah I think that explains the weird results

[deft lichen]

Eh, I use steel frame, I think it's pretty ok but that's because I tend to make too many pipes even early on

[wintry aurora]

@barren elm The point we are trying to make is that subjective is EXACTLY that, subjective, it's completely based on opinon.

[deft lichen]

Probably wouldn't recommend though, I think it's highly biased due to my play style

[median heath]

It's not bad by any means.
Just wouldn't prio it above the other 2.

[wintry aurora]

The chart on the wiki takes out the subjectivity as best as it can.

[barren elm]

Right but I'm not saying this post is correct or incorrect, I'm saying this place might be interested in it

Like I'm definitely not gonna use coke steel ingots

(I think he even has 0 coal usage for the whole factory using alt recipes)

[wintry aurora]

I'm using coke steel for the weapons plant because I figured why not.

[median heath]

That's a choice.
I think they are great.

[barren elm]

Sure, I'm just saying, I'm not defending the post

[deft lichen]

Power draw is far less significant than all other metrics, so that's pretty bad

[wintry aurora]

It was more of an opportunity thing because I'm already using coke there. I haven't decided whether I'll use it when I rebuild the whole thing so that it's synergic with itself.

[median heath]

Power draw is a metric?
😉

Sounds like you're building power wrong.

[deft lichen]

You can't throw it out the window but I wouldn't design factories around it

[barren elm]

The correct way to build power is to feed plutonium waste directly into the lizard doggo for easy removal

[wintry aurora]

lol

[median heath]

But.. I do throw it out the window. 🙂
It has literally no effect on what I build.

[deft lichen]

It's just for consideration like "overclocked miner + default copper" vs "normal miner + pure copper"
There, power would be 'wasted' if a low amount of copper is needed

But I can understand not considering power in the slightest

[errant sable]

who knew that ranking something complex based on a few traits was a bad idea

[wind spade]

that is highly subjective analysis and shouldn't be relied upon 🤷‍♂️

not to mention that "ranking recipes" is very bad way of looking at the problem

much better way is "ranking production line/recipe paths"

[barren elm]

I just thought it was interesting

[wind spade]

I mean I could write a random rank generator and it would probably be more interesting 🤔

[barren elm]

What, more interesting than a global factory that never uses coal?

It's an environmentally green factory

[deft lichen]

Voting website

[wind spade]

oh no

then cast screws would win

[deft lichen]

I'd like to see the results of that honestly

[wind spade]

the problem is to get relevant results - you need as many players as you can get, but also only players that have experience with all the recipes (and players that want to give their time to actually rank the recipes). So in the end we'd get like 3 relevant answers and tons of bullshit as bonus

[deft lichen]

I'm not saying the results would be good

A good subjective "pro-player" list could be obtained by manually reaching out to as many such players as possible

It would be biased but that would be fine because it wouldn't present itself as being objective, or trying to be that

[errant sable]

does satisfactorytools take power and building counts into account or does it just minimize resource usage

having it generate a production line for every item in the game (with all alts included) and seeing which alts were used frequently might work for a ranking

[deft lichen]

Afaik SFTools optimizes for resource cost but I'll let Greeny answer that

[tropic hawk]

you can set the beta version to prioritize building or power

[tropic hawk]

also, this might be better suited for his tools' discord

[median heath]

Beta version prioritizes power.
Alpha version prioritizes space.
Sigma version prioritizes resources.
@wind spade

😉

[errant sable]

yes let's move an entire discussion to another discord because i mentioned a third party tool

[wind spade]

it only minimises resource usage. And yes, questions are better on my discord, as here it's technically offtopic 🤷‍♂️

reason for resource usage minimisation is that resources are pretty much the only limited thing in the game, so it makes sense to optimise towards them

[strong saffron]

What’s the max output of power possible in the game if you convert every single resource available towards power production

[median heath]

I know nuclear alone is 1.13 TW

I don't think you can reach 2 TW though tbh.
If you can it would be just barely.

[deft lichen]

iirc max nuclear is 1.19 TW and max fuel/turbofuel 0.55 TW, but that's when built separately

however, you could have unsustained power production (buffer fuel and burn it all at once later), which is only limited by the engine object linits

[median heath]

Pain...

[deft lichen]

is that net or total output?

[median heath]

Totes.

Will double check it though 🤷‍♂️

[deft lichen]

https://u6.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=FrscLnhfyUIIfrizEQK5

[median heath]

50.4 Ur Rods
22.4 Plut Rods

[deft lichen]

yep

[barren elm]

What's the max nuclear power if you sink all the plutonium rods?

[median heath]

630 GW
560 GW

1.19 Total.
Yeah, I think 1.13 is net.

[median heath]

0.63 TW

Max Ur is 50.4 rods.
630 GW or 0.63 TW
Whichever you prefer to type 🤷‍♂️

[deft lichen]

I chuckle whenever I see someone type "KMW"

kilomegawatt my beloved

[median heath]

😭

[median heath]

Pain.

[errant sable]

dadadadadadadadadaW

decadecadecadecadecadecadecadecadecawatt

[strong saffron]

It was a simple question that went down a full rabbit hole

[barren elm]

The nuclear plant above has a total waste of 5040 per min, but there's only enough uranium to feed 252 reactors at 100%, which only produces 2520 waste per min?

What am I missing here?

[median heath]

Uranium makes 2520 Uranium Waste, yes.
Only way to get more would be burning Plutonium Rods instead of sinking. In which case you'd get a completely different item, Plutonium Waste.

[barren elm]

Ok so the 5040 figure in the above thing isn't the max waste per min?

Max reactors (0 plutonium) is 252?

Just asking for a sanity check here really

[median heath]

Aye.

[barren elm]

Alright thanks!

[median heath]

And I do those 1:1 with Water Extractors clocked to 250%.
Keeps it simple.

[barren elm]

I wonder if they'll ever stop us sinking plutonium fuel rods

[median heath]

Nah

It takes a whole other level of complexity to make them.
So it's a viable reward.

[barren elm]

Is doing a self-contained loop like this ever going to cause me engine accuracy problems?

[median heath]

Not if you build it properly.

[barren elm]

I'm thinking literally just half-filling a buffer of water calling it a day

[median heath]

Eh

Put the buffer above the pipe and use it to feed until the system is online.

Then delete the buffer entirely.

[barren elm]

Man this nuclear setup feels like a real "If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe" moment

[median heath]

Indeed.

[frosty owl]

I chuckle when I see someone type "K" instead of "k"
||Not really, I'm just trying to oneup you||

[median heath]

I chuckle when I see mono-item belts instead of sushi.

😄

[frosty owl]

Looking at single-item manufacturer feeds like:

[deft lichen]

I know this, but I wouldn't expect someone typing KMW to know that k is supposed to be lowercase

[tropic hawk]

I wonder what people are on when they say they need x kWh hours of backup

[cinder silo]

I built 8001 power stores for the hell of it, I doubt they'll ever be needed but they can run the entire show for days on their own.

[barren elm]

Is it common knowledge that power batteries have 2 power connections instead of the usual 1?

Because I love it and wish it were more common

Can just daisy chain them infinitely

[cinder silo]

I think so, I would have hated connecting them old school.

[cobalt meteor]

theres no way

guess who built power poles

[cinder silo]

Ouch!

[cobalt meteor]

next time i guess

i didnt build too many but still

[main shuttle]

are power shards generally primarily used on resource nodes first?

[vapid gorge]

I’ll make sure even on my iron ore lines to have a merger and smart splitter to loop random items along the length

[vapid gorge]

By most people yes because on miners you get resources which are limited while on machines it saves space which you have lots of.

I overclock everything though cause I want smaller factories

[frosty owl]

You can use Micromanager to make things smaller

[vapid gorge]

"what is this? A door for ants?"

[round hill]

Did the weightings of alternate recipes in the wiki get a significant change in Update 6 due to the only resource currently in the Spire Coast being oil?

[barren elm]

Were spire coast nodes even changed? Pretty sure it was only oil before too

[round hill]

I wasn't sure what it was like prior to update 6, so I figured I would ask.

[wind spade]

wiki has weighting of recipes?

[round hill]

Yeah, it gives each a Weighted Point score based on (resource consumption / maximum extraction rate) * 10,000 where the lower the score, the better (usually)

[wind spade]

ah, but that's weight of resources, not recipes 🤷‍♂️

that's where my confusion was coming from

[round hill]

ah, gotcha, sorry

[barren elm]

Seems like the calculator prefers to use the packaged fuel recipe for reasons I can't figure out

[wind spade]

which one?

[barren elm]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=9mkHYNoY5ojpkaM0VpUC

This is just 2 oil nodes set to maximize

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=WDqp7bEM7ngy8NNy2OVz

[wind spade]

maximise doesn't optimise for anything

[barren elm]

This is the exact same but with the packaged diluted fuel recipe disabled (uses less buildings + less power)

[wind spade]

it just picks whatever path leads to max possible result

in case of diluted (packaged) fuel, both variants lead to same result, so it picks first one it finds 🤷‍♂️

[barren elm]

Alright makes sense

[median heath]

Use "Maximize" so it spits out a final number, then switch it to "items/min" and type that number in.

[barren elm]

Ah I see, yeah that goes for the blender recipe

[wintry aurora]

What are the arguments for/against the default motor and it's two alts? Trying to decide which ones to use in my mall rebuild. I'm also not sure which stator, rotor (semi-tentatively copper rotor, may change to steel) , and crystal oscillator (possbly insulated), but I'll be able to decide better once I build the matrix in Satis Tools.

[wind spade]

I mean all possible arguments depend on your save only

what you prefer, what you want, what you have available etc.

[magic island]

the alts involve more effort/complexity, and more types of resources consumed, for a net gain in resource & power efficiency.

if you want the absolute simplest motor factory possible at the expense of efficiency, you miiiight use steel rotor + default. if you want the most efficient motor factory and can handle all the different parts required, use an alt.

I personally tend to go copper rotor -> default motor, because I don't want too much complexity but I wanna be a liiittle thrifty

[obtuse citrus]

can i have a website to help me with my calculated
i have a lot of site for that but no one can see me with overpowered ( or overcloak)
i'm french sry

[wind spade]

there are some in #welcome
overclocking can be calculated by you directly:
for example if you need 12.85 machines, that means 1285% in total. So e.g. 12 machines at 100% + 1 machine at 85%. Or 5 machines at 250% + 1 machine at 35%

[obtuse citrus]

i'm busy to calculate 🥲

[wind spade]

well usually overclocking of machines isn't worth anyway, so most websites don't bother with it

[magic island]

only thing you absolutely definitely should OC are miners

everything else is optional for space-saving and tidiness, so calculators won't specifically tell you when/how to do it. OCing production is honestly more of a style/layout choice than a logistical choice

[wind spade]

it also doesn't change any other number (apart from building count), so you can easily calculate it yourself 🙂

[median heath]

Alts are better than base for mass production.

Osc vs. ECR is the only decision that needs to be made imo 🤷‍♂️

[gray rock]

Hey does Head lift travel through or reset at fluid buffers?

[snow dove]

travel through iirc

[gray rock]

And does if effect the level they can fill to?

[snow dove]

honestly don’t know, i dont really use buffers

[median heath]

Why are you using fluid buffers?

[gray rock]

Its in their name sake

[snow dove]

oh buffers are pretty much useless outside of temp setups and fluid stations

[median heath]

Tell me you don't know how many problems they cause without telling me you don't know how many problems they cause.

[gray rock]

Pretty much, but they look nice

[median heath]

Also yes, headlift affects how much they can fill.

[gray rock]

There, easy, didnt need to be a Jerk

[snow dove]

you could just clip the pipe through the buffer, get the look without the issues

by clip i mean having it look like it connects to both connections

[median heath]

How you interpret honesty is your business 🤷‍♂️

[gray rock]

Yeah true

[wintry aurora]

They reset headlift, BUT, the fluid from there has the headlift of the height that the fluid buffer is at. That's how water towers work in the game.

[gray rock]

Thank you! Thats mostly what i assumed, that or it had a basic 5 m headlift

[wintry aurora]

Fair point then I guess. There's no shortage of iron around here anyway.

[median heath]

Only reason I don't use Rigour Motor is because all my Osc's go to Computers.

[wintry aurora]

I see.

[median heath]

So I end up using Electric Motor.

[sinful rover]

Why do I see something in #screenshots for this channel? Yall have embed perms lol

[ember fractal]

Fluid buffers are kinda necessary for fluid trains

[median heath]

That is their primary use, yes.
But you have to setup a hybrid VIP/VOP junction with them.

Which not everyone knows to do.

[ember fractal]

What is VIP VOP

[median heath]

Variable Input/Output Priority

[wintry aurora]

Not sure where to put this, but uh, for sushi belts, is it okay if the inputs just flow on through (just using MK4 on the one belt for easier screenshotting)? I decided to put the miners on max because I don't really want to deal with fine tuning the system.

I'm testing this setup to make sure it works before committing to the design, going to try to sushi belt as much of the mall rebuilding as I can.

[distant aurora]

i have 240 raw quartz /m, what's a nice ratio to make silica and crystals?

[wintry aurora]

Which recipes?

[distant aurora]

default

[median heath]

Nice Ratio = However many of each you're going to use.

[distant aurora]

frankly not sure about that

[median heath]

Then I wouldn't build it until you're more sure 🤷‍♂️

[wintry aurora]

Would you like alumina solution with your silica? (Satis Tools thinks the best default way is to use alumina when maximizing.

[distant aurora]

not at aluminum yet

[wintry aurora]

boop

[distant aurora]

that's a lotta ugly decimals

[wintry aurora]

Hey, it's what you wanted.

[distant aurora]

i'm farther in the game than i ever have been so idk about the later stages, would you say the two are used at more or less the same rate usually?

[median heath]

That's entirely dependent on what you choose to do.

[wintry aurora]

That sorta depends in part how many signs and glass stuff you choose to use.

[median heath]

Also if you're using oscillators in alt recipes and if you're using silica to maximize aluminium.

!wikisearch Silica

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=Silica

[wintry aurora]

100 each would be more than enough for personal use, IMO.

[median heath]

Silica comes into nuclear as well.
And if you're using Silicon CB or HSC then you'll want more too.

So, as always, the accurate answer is "it depends."

[wintry aurora]

Yea, weirdly, Satis Tools decided to use alumina solution, but I know the maximize tool doesn't actually optimize.

You get somewhat cleaner numbers with alts, but all maximize does is try to tell you how much you could potentially make out of a given amount of resources, not neccessarily the optimal way to do it. @distant aurora

[distant aurora]

oh i forgot i do have cheap silica, though ive heard that one's kinda bad no?

[median heath]

Cheap Silica is the best Silica

[wintry aurora]

Really?

[median heath]

??

[wintry aurora]

I thought it'd be kinda niche.

[median heath]

You're thinking about Fine Concrete.

[distant aurora]

ohhh 22.5 and 37.5 are halves of 45 and 75 that's why the recipes are so hard to work with

every recipe that involves a 45 fucking sucks

recurring decimals are the bane of my existence

[wintry aurora]

Steel beams don't suck (though they're the only beam)

[wintry aurora]

I guess you'd like to know how @median heath does it?

[median heath]

45-81 rule 🙂

[wintry aurora]

Yea, that.

[distant aurora]

elaborate

[median heath]

So the premise of the 45-81 rule is getting production in "clean numbers" with respect to clock speed.
As you may or may not know, the game enforces a 4 decimal limit on clock speeds (it does not care about parts per minute, nor does anything in the game actually operate on parts per minute, EVERYTHING is done in individual cycles with respect to clock speed for cycle time)

Example: if you tell a Smelter to do 20/min instead of 30/min, the clock % changes to 66.6666%.
The UI will say 20 ppm, but this is a lie to make you feel better about yourself. The machine truncates anything after xx.xxxx%, so you do not actually get 20/min, you get 66.6666% of 30 (which is 19.99998).
Now, to MOST people, this doesn't matter. But I am a stickler for precision, so not actually getting 20 bothers me (even though you'd literally see a production difference only after a couple hundred thousand cycles).

So the math was done to find out how to make production lines "behave", and the first thing we solved was the 81 part of the rule. With respect to Rubber/Plastic - always do them in multiples of 81 and all machines in the recycled loop automatically fall within the 4 decimal limit. No repeating numbers, no imprecision.
The 45 part of the rule applies to non-oil products. Do your final product amount in multiples of 45 and everything in the production chain automatically behaves without you needing to think about it.
Exceptions: Caterium Circuit Board, Pure Iron, Fine Concrete
(CtCB and PureFe usually outweigh the rule because you'll be doing them in such large quantities that they fine a common multiple somewhere up the chain.
No one should ever use Fine Concrete.)

Note: 45-81 is the lowest whole number multiple, but you can cut them in halves to achieve closer to your actual goals.
I.E. 45/22.5/11.25/5.625/2.8125, or 81/40.5/20.25/10.125 (going lower than 10.125 on oil causes issues)

So if you needed 100 Plastic, I would instead say to make 81+20.25=101.25

[distant aurora]

i see

so for non-oil products just use halves of 45?

[median heath]

45/22.5/11.25/5.625/2.8125

[distant aurora]

hm

what about rounding up the last digit for recurring decimals? ie 6.6667? is there a situation where that could cause issues?

[median heath]

Now you're overconsuming.
So every X cycles you'll stall out.

Inefficient.

[wintry aurora]

The game is going to automatically do that anyway because it's an infinite.

[distant aurora]

yeah but that's better than underproducing

[median heath]

Why do either when you can be precise?

[distant aurora]

i guess

btw, the devs were actually helpful and made 2 constructors of each add up to 120 raw

which is more silica than crystals but at least it's way easier to do the numbers

so thank god, i can kick that can down the road till i actually need lots of quartz

at which point i'll just abuse trains and overproduce

[wintry aurora]

@median heath Regarding miners, is it best to try to be precise as possible for sushi because I was having a hard time with fine tuning and I just kinda entered the ppm (yes, I know, the thing you said not to do) into the miner because it's tricky to balance it, and I've got a whole lot of resources to balance. Its the first time I've done sushi on a large and bottom to top scale.

[median heath]

Don't aboose the caboose!

[median heath]

Miners can't be done precisely unless you go way into the weeds on math.

[wintry aurora]

How would you do it then, just put it on max and let it flow?

[median heath]

That's the beautiful chaos the devs have made.
Miners work in 60's.
Items work in 45's.
Belts again work in 60's.

Only way to avoid chaos is to do everything in multiples of 180.

[wintry aurora]

I'm just wondering about that part.

[median heath]

Close as I can get but slightly over. 🤷‍♂️

[wintry aurora]

As precisely as I can then, ok.

[dark laurel]

I dealt with that particular issue by running a special overflow-kind of splitter, off the back sides of the bi-product storages into the sink, so that way everything could always be running at 100% and nothing would stall out, but containers would stay full when not in use. The only thing I found difficult to deal with was adjusting the fuel plant production numbers, since they lie to you when you under/overclock it.

[median heath]

You shouldn't overclock generators.

Power is related exponentially to clock speed so it never ends precisely when you deviate from 100%.

[dark laurel]

I underclocked them.... 233.33.. fuel into 20 generators I think, split equally

[median heath]

How is 233.33 an UNDER clock?

[dark laurel]

cause the 33... is from 40 @ 100%

[wintry aurora]

I think that;s the fuel?

[dark laurel]

I only had 50 resin coming in

[wintry aurora]

I don't know if they follow machine rules for underclock.

[dark laurel]

but that's besides the point

[median heath]

20 gens need exactly 240, so why would you adjust from that perfect integer of a number?

[dark laurel]

because I would have had to overclock something else to do it

[wintry aurora]

Then build more.

[median heath]

[dark laurel]

..... dang it, 1 sec

alright, so Oil Extractor 1: 600 crude oil/m, -> (300 goes to make 100 plastic, 100 rubber, 150 oil residue / 300 goes to make 200 plastic, 100 oil residue). That makes for 300 plastic, 100 rubber, and 250 residue total.
200 of the residue goes towards making steel, which is all well, and balanced, and great. The remaining 50 goes to making fuel at 83.33333%, giving the 33.3333/min.

Oil Extractor 2 only gives me 300 crude oil/min, making 200 fuel and 150 polymer. -> the polymer goes to making the remaining 18.75x4 rubber, for 75/min, at 93.75.

Grand totals for this little set up end up being 233.333... fuel.... oh, I've got all 20 running at 96.3104% btw....
300 plastic/min
175 rubber/min
800 steel/min

[wintry aurora]

There's other oil nodes in the area, there isn't anyplace that just has a lone oil node.

[dark laurel]

I am aware, but I don't care about those yet.

[wintry aurora]

Well, could use one of those for the fuel generators instead of trying to split it.

[dark laurel]

I could, but I don't know what T7/8 are going to want from me yet (don't spoil it), so I'm saving them. For now, I'm just trying to finish off the rest of the 5 & 6 automation.

but to hopefully answer your question, maybe.... I usually run the fewest number of buildings necessary to finish something off, then start underclocking remainders

[wintry aurora]

There's tons of oil on the map, why are you worrying about that?

[dark laurel]

as of right now, I have 4? oil nodes I'm aware of. I haven't ventured off into the NE forest really yet

[wintry aurora]

Sure then.

[dark laurel]

but personally, I prefer making a little more than I'm using (for crafting materials at least) so I can pull when necessary. Otherwise, it doesn't matter, long as things are stable. Math gets a bit wonky if something starts toggling on and off though.

[cinder silo]

Auto sorting warehouse works great for grabbing overproduction, then overflow after full to sink 🙂

[normal gate]

Has anyone done the math/spreadsheet/whatever for all the nodes in a biome and the amount of each ore per minute based on a mk3 miner, mk5 belts, capped at 780? If so where could I look at one

[patent dirge]

usually doing those by hand with https://satisfactory-calculator.com/en/interactive-map#3;50668;366|gameLayer| so that you can decide what constitutes the biome you are talking about

[normal gate]

yea i got the calc. Its the rocky desert which if i remember the count, is 84 nodes. I just lost my notes and really don't wanna redo by hand lol

[normal gate]

I adhd the math

[sand epoch]

Or just look at the amounts on tools :/

[vapid gorge]

Would you like my interactive resource per min biome spreadsheet?

[ivory thicket]

I guess that makes sense, kinda sucks about the ppm part though

but on the flip side I guess I can just worry about the actual % instead of trying to make the ppm look nice

[thick plank]

Id like that

[fierce ruin]

does this look reasonable for heavy frames? i've never gotten this far before so i'm not sure if this is good or not but i tried to make enough for building + fused frames later without going overboard

[wind spade]

build enough for building machines now. Build more HMFs as part of FMF factory later. No need to prebuild 🙂

[vapid gorge]

Your early factories will probably not really serve your end goals when you’ve unlocked everything so yeah keep things simple. Even like 2-4 a minute is fine because you can slowly fill a container of them while working on other things

[blissful magnet]

I think my heavy module frames is only 2/minute

It looks slow on paper, but you'll turn around to fix some other spaghetti or grab a slug, and then the storage is full before you remember that you need HMFs.

[vapid gorge]

Yeah 2 is probably just fine to unlock and build things.

Later? Maybe 200 🙂

[ember fractal]

I want to see a 200 HMF factory

That would be a chonker. A phatt factory.

[wind spade]

here you go

[near zenith]

damn, only 27gw and 2k buildings? that's doable

[wind spade]

why wouldn't it be doable?

here's your max possible

[ember fractal]

I wanna see it in game hehe

[near zenith]

it pains me that it isn't 1111.11

[median heath]

Only 161 GW? Ez

[ember fractal]

Cake

[north cloak]

I have 240 iron coming in, without any alt recipes. How many modular frames can that make?

I am struggling with the math

[barren elm]

@north cloak https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=nDOCUA4h9L53JLUVbAZS

[north cloak]

oh thank you!

[patent dirge]

i messed up big time pioneers, i messed up my heavy modular frame production line from the very beginning during my calculation phase. i based the line on producing 30 HMF a minute and ran with it. turns out that i am producing far more materials than included. i am producing enough for twice my figures.

https://tenor.com/view/yatilio-tunisia-success-suffering-from-success-gif-26530473

[glossy wagon]

Can anyone tell me why this isn't efficient

[cobalt meteor]

as long as your numbers are right it will work efficiently eventually when the machines fill up

and the belts can support the throughput, although it looks like they can

[vapid gorge]

Dune desert is a solid spot for that

[glacial hemlock]

You are feeding into 4 constructors. And yet using mk1 belt, and that's not even a full belt.

[vapid gorge]

what's the belts speed? How many ingots per minute are feeding onto the belt with the constructors? How many ingots pm do the constructors use?

[oblique hollow]

unknown recipes, unknown input/min

always a great start

[barren elm]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-j7MXxCP1H9KISzFSbxjO5ZkBWg-HQnljJlbWKV1vUg

Could use a sanity check on these alt recipe choices if anyone wants to laugh at my decisions

[sullen mulch]

guys what's the recommended fuel for nuclear power plants, uranium or plutonium

[wind spade]

well you can't have plutonium without burning uranium

[sullen mulch]

ah right so what i would have to do is run some reactors on uranium to get plutonium

[wind spade]

how is "using rarer resources" or "using copper/coal" bad?

[median heath]

Uranium would be the "recommended" one tbh

[wind spade]

unless you use all resources from all over the map, it's more important to have resources available locally instead of worrying about global availability

[snow dove]

best way to do it in my opinion would be produce power with uranium, then make and sink plutonium to deal with the waste

[sullen mulch]

ah right ok

yeah i am finally starting to think about figuring out how much space i really need for this

so i'll have a look at uranium then and then plutonium to reduce nuclearwaste

[barren elm]

Yeah, using resources from all over the map, basically just having a train focused run for vanity reasons

So distance isn't a factor

[snow dove]

you don’t want to “reduce” uranium waste, you want to match your processing to how much uranium waste you produce, so it never stockpiles

[sullen mulch]

right, yeah i'm going to need to reconsider all of the design work im doing then so that I can actually get around this factory without a hazmat suit on at all times

[median heath]

The only way to reduce Uranium Waste is to make less Uranium Rods.
You can convert all of that waste into Plutonium Rods and sink it to eliminate Uranium Waste.
Plutonium Waste is permanent, which is why most people don't burn Plut Rods.

[sullen mulch]

ahhh right

in total i'll need 12.8 uranium fuel rods p/m for the reactors so I won't be maxing out tthe uranium in the world atleast

[median heath]

Only 12.8 👀

[barren elm]

Well... "permanent" is subjective

[sullen mulch]

i beleive so but it has been a moment since i have tried calculating anything

[snow dove]

NO.

[sullen mulch]

i did the math based on a reactor burning 0.2 uranium fuel rods p/m and i'll only have 64 reactors to feed

oh shit have they fixed the pipe bug where running at max capacity you can loose capacity when you reload the save

[snow dove]

MK2 pipes still can’t quite reach 600m^3

[median heath]

Save/Load Bug was fixed, yes.

[sullen mulch]

ok aslong at Mk1 pipes work consistently then i don't mind using 64 MK1 pipes

right good

just don't want a meltdown on my hands when i eventually try atsrting everything up

[snow dove]

make sure your processing is functional before you turn on the reactors

[median heath]

This is what I do.
I OC the Extractor to 250% and just 1:1 ratio them with nuclear plants./

[sullen mulch]

oh yeah i'll spend the time to fill machines before things get started

[sullen mulch]

yeah I'll probably end up doing that otherwise I'll have a hard time getting water to the desert

only other thing i am scared about is having enough power to get the production line running

[snow dove]

B a t t e r i e s

[sullen mulch]

yeah i have a few hundred of those haha

but i do have about 8,000 MW left to play with

if it comes to it I'll just shut some factories down

[wind spade]

they can iirc

[median heath]

Mk2s can reach 600, but they are very delicate.
Part of why they are getting reworked.

[harsh dew]

how sould i do alunamun (sorry not best at spelling some big words) it takes water and then makes some a step later so how sould i set it up

i have up to 2 480 belts

[wind spade]

you can put the extra water in generators or pure recipes or anything else that requires water

[harsh dew]

its the 1st thing im making in my new maga factory im working on

[snow dove]

or recycle it

[harsh dew]

i want to reuse it for it

[wind spade]

anything else that requires water 😉

[snow dove]

say you need 160 water for the first refinery, then later on it makes 40 water, give the first refinery 120 water, then pipe the 40 water to the beginning

[harsh dew]

im just scared it may over fill

even with a vavle

[wind spade]

valve won't help you

if you build it properly it won't overfill

you can also dedicate some refineries to use the recycled water

or just... not recycle it and put the water somewhere else instead as I suggested 🙂

[sullen mulch]

i recycled my water in the aluminium factory but i have a large buffer just incase something gets cranky

[median heath]

VIP junction 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

That's not entirely true, but its easier to work thing as if it were true

[distant aurora]

ok this is it i'm starting up a world train network. i'd like to set some consistent rules to build it so:

• should i make the tracks 1 foundation apart or right next to each other?
• what's a good distance apart to place block signals? plan's to make my trains 4 freight cars long max

[median heath]

Have you read the top pin in #old-questions-and-help ?

Well... second pin now.

[distant aurora]

i've not, lemme see

[median heath]

It explains everything about how signals work.
From that, deducing your ruleset should be straightforward.

[distant aurora]

what about the track spacing? should i leave a foundation between inbound and outbound? ive seen people place em together but ive heard that might cause collision issues

[median heath]

Spacing is definitely an 8m minimum (which is 1 Foundation, yes)

[distant aurora]

so like on the left? cause on the right it's technically 8m between the middle of each track

[median heath]

What's on the right is fine.

Just be careful with turns.
Because it can look like the same spacing, but they actually get slightly closer when you make them curve.

[distant aurora]

hmm

might as well make it like on the left then just to be sure

[median heath]

Fair.

[distant aurora]

ok wanna be sure i'm understanding this correctly; path signals go at the entrance to intersections, if no other paths are blocked in the path's way and the block signal in front is green, it lets the train through, yes?

why does the game hate me i get several HDDs of garbage straight and then i need to choose between these

[median heath]

Yes.

[median heath]

2=3 > 1

[distant aurora]

yeah got wet concrete. still sucks to lose the other 2 :(

[median heath]

Meh, Steel Rotor is entirely skippable in my book.

Copper Rotor all the way.

[distant aurora]

making rotors and stators with the same ingredients sounds nice idk

but yeah heard copper rotor is good

[median heath]

It's the most resource-efficient option for Rotors.

[wintry aurora]

Went steel rotor this time so I wouldn’t have to deal with screws.

[vapid gorge]

Well if you want to get fancy, why not put one above the other? 😄

[distant aurora]

that sounds like a nightmare

[vapid gorge]

It cuts down the foot print of your rail dramatically which can allow for easier terrain movement and in a lot of cases it's a lot easier to make intersections that don't have rail overlap slowing the whole system down

[distant aurora]

welp unfortunately ive already started at a horizontal system

[onyx mesa]

The idea of stacked rails sounds intresting, how do you make them to connect to a station though? Also do you put a piece of a train track so a train can turn back (for convenience in manual driving)?

[heavy gust]

looks like a lot of extra efford over the horizontal version

[vapid gorge]

@heavy gust not really any extra effort and the same way you would connect them with flat rail but with fewer overlapping tracks to slow things down

For both flat and stacked I lay down a line of foundations and run the line. And most stations have a track going off the main line so not really any dif . I’ll get some pics in a bit

[ember fractal]

Interesting idea

[small kayak]

The main rails are looking good 👍
I'd be interested in the way you build crossings. And how to split off to a single station and how you deal with multiple station next to each other

[vapid gorge]

Well this is how MY stacked rail looks. The pic was done by Member #2 😛

[vapid gorge]

A 3 way interchange, T junction, is really simple, you have the rail coming in at a vaguely perpendicular direction and have on/off ramps for it.

[prisma sapphire]

Where do I find people that actually play to make clean looking maps like this?

[vapid gorge]

And this is modified Turbine Interchange with stacked rail. I haven't had need to use it yet.

[vapid gorge]

If you're looking for people on a server for it? ... You might have trouble. Personally I only do single player and would never have others on my map because I have extremely specific needs

[prisma sapphire]

Sad life

[vapid gorge]

And I'd bet a lot of people who do extremely specific things are probably in the same boat as I am

[vapid gorge]

Well on the plus side you too can craft neat things. You... just need a lot of time. And adhd doesn't hurt

[prisma sapphire]

It’s just a lot more fun not to be alone

[wind spade]

the problem I can see is that you basically need to have 16 different designs for that 😄

[vapid gorge]

How so?

[wind spade]

depending which track is "inwards" and "outwards" on each connection

it's probably not 16 but less, as some of them have rotational symmetry

[vapid gorge]

So I haven't logicked it out in my head entirely but I think as long as you were aware of the directions of hte layers intersecting... I think you could get away with .. two? iterations with slight changes.

[vapid gorge]

This is the top down view, I've kept is a symmetry with it

Hmmm it might be 4 versions with slightly different ramps

[past cedar]

try the USA "Clover leaf interstate interchange' method

[vapid gorge]

I'd thought about that but I wanted a smaller foot print. I'd be a lot easier to plan visually initially with a clover leaf but I don't like the look

Mostly I was trying to make the most efficient junction you could have but compact and stacked

[past cedar]

ah... this is a pretty new take on the cloverleaf ...

[vapid gorge]

That might be a turbine

[past cedar]

might even be able to tighten that up in satis

looks like a turbine

[vapid gorge]

Yeah thats a turbine

[past cedar]

google failed me when i typed in clover leaf

[vapid gorge]

nah probably someone mis labeled it or it had more than 1 lable

[barren elm]

That's a great intersection

[vapid gorge]

But yeah my goal was to replicate not having any unnecessary track crossings like a Turbine but keep it stacked and small 🙂

[past cedar]

very nice

shame the foundations butcher that view 😉

[vapid gorge]

My stacked junction gets no love XD

I think the Turbine one I posted might be from Amelie By The Sea

[barren elm]

I think they're there for measurements sake

[vapid gorge]

similar as to how I have the directional foundations in my build

And I think that junction was part of a tutorial they were doing

I was fooling around with some structure for my one. Didn't get toooo far though

[past cedar]

im too ashamed to show a picture of mine lol

its adhoc at best

[barren elm]

Well coming from factorio, the BEST intersection is having no intersection at all, so...

[vapid gorge]

xD look, I've spent a lot of time polishing it. 2k+ hrs. If you sunk that much into it you'd be building weird things too

[past cedar]

i dont even know how to handle it in that game... theres no train tunnel blocks

[vapid gorge]

Sleep for me though 🙂 night!

[wind spade]

while that's true, turbine is still one of the best intersections for when you really need one. Cloverleaf is meh and roundabout is terrible

[small kayak]

What about a roundabout with a bypass on each entry to the next? Still terrible?

[wind spade]

yeah

even more terrible than standard X junction

[deft lichen]

there is no need to build anything else than a level X junction

[wintry aurora]

sneaks into discussion on train intersections

KABOOM

I have absolutely no idea what this one could possibly shape into XD some parts are split into three for reasons I forget what.

[deft lichen]

hell

a SCIM screenshot might be necessary

[wintry aurora]

Sure.

[small kayak]

Woah...🤣

[wintry aurora]

and yea, it took a lot of tweaking to get to it's final state.

[wind spade]

from worst to best

[small kayak]

I'll just rip the roundabout I try to beautify and put a flat x instead 😁👌

[wind spade]

depends on how much throughput you want 🤷‍♂️

[deft lichen]

yeah, but how many trains are you running to justify the need for that

this isn't cities skylines

[median heath]

over 9000

[wind spade]

I can definitely imagine the need for turbine if you have a lot of trains

[wintry aurora]

Though to be honest, I wasn't really going for any particular one, though IIRC, it was partially based on a turbine intersection?

[wintry aurora]

The middle one looks like a typical urban rail intersction.

[wind spade]

cloverleaf

for some reason people like to call it "best" even though it isn't

[deft lichen]

cloverleaf is decent in cities skylines

[small kayak]

Turbine is better than clover because? Higher passing speed because of bigger radius?

[wind spade]

splits before merges

[wind spade]

cars are something else than trains, though it's still worse than turbine

[small kayak]

Ohhhh, I never thought about that. Thanks!

[wintry aurora]

WTF clyde, how the hell do you see explicit.

Other than the going AAAAA at the mess of a rail.

@deft lichen

Clydeeeee........

@deft lichen

I tried writing STFU clyde, but gave up at the C

[wintry aurora]

Roads are a good analogue to Satis rails though.

[wind spade]

difference being roads don't need signals, have MUCH smaller and shorter vehicles and can have multiple lanes 🤷‍♂️

[wintry aurora]

True, but the intersections are analogous.

[median heath]

smjjames | 🍝 Rails

[wintry aurora]

lol, yea they are XD Honestly, they looked worse than this.

[barren elm]

Nah clover intersections just allow a train to turn around at the intersection, which is (if you value throughput) something you want to be in control of with a dedicated piece of track

Reason being that something like this (where the red track is above or below the green track) effectively has infinite throughput

And so divorcing the ability for trains to turn around from your intersection reduces some strain from that intersection

(this also happens to be, in addition to potential deadlocks, why roundabouts are bad)

[deft lichen]

the general layout could be reordered into a 4-way junction

@wintry aurora

[wind spade]

if you need your train to turn around you already have inefficient network, so "allows train to turn around" isn't as big advantage anyway

[barren elm]

I mean, they're turning around somewhere

Whether it be at a roundabout, in your train dock itself, or going around your whole track, or your rail cell

Even a full left or right hand turn only network still has the trains turn around

Like the only way to completely eliminate the need for trains to turn around is to have a single rail network, and nobody does that because it means trains need to run around your whole track to go "backwards"

[wintry aurora]

I used one on a stretch of track as I decided I could use one for manual driving. But that's a wholly separate thing.

[small kayak]

My trains usually don't need to turn around because they can enter and leave every station from/to any direction

[wintry aurora]

Maybe, though I forget the reason why I split some parts early. Probably while I was stress testing the network.

[barren elm]

So they're turning around in the station really

[deft lichen]

also height difference, the junction has to be at the level of the bottom left track, which means all other tracks need to go way up

this is fixable, the X junction would be a T junction and the bottom left track would connect to the middle left track

[cerulean lintel]

i cant imagine doing it any other way personally, surprised people have this need of a train turning around. train leaves station, goes directly to its next stop in time table facing the correct direction. simple

[barren elm]

So it's turning around in the station

[small kayak]

Kinda, yeah

But it's the only reasonable way to 'turn around' in my book

[barren elm]

I guess it would've been clearer if I did it like this instead

Same image, just the curve is more akin to what you see in gameplay and the word "factory" is in a box

[small kayak]

I don't think it's a turn around if a station where the train halts is involved

[barren elm]

I mean it is turning the train around

Like a good rail network controls where the trains turn around, and that's one tool in the box

[small kayak]

Can we agree to disagree about the terminology in that case?😉

[ember fractal]

I think you guys are talking about different things
There's train reversing, meaning it's heading in the opposite direction it was originally moving in. That's typically on the same rail with locomotives facing away from each other.
Then there's train looping or turning, where the train continues to move in the same direction it was originally moving in, although relative to the world, it could be travelling back to where it came from.

The actual wording "train turning around" is too ambiguous, because it can be interpreted in various ways

[small kayak]

I think that in a two way rail system if the train comes to a halt in a station aka reached the destination and then leaves the station in the direction from where it came (but on the other side of the two way rails) it did not turn around because it began a new travel to another destination.

If a train has to take a turn around on middle of the rail system to reach a destination it may well be called a turn around because that is the only thing this piece of rail is supposed to do

[maiden halo]

🤓

[thorny heron]

The hell is that interchange?

My brain hurts from just looking at it

[wintry aurora]

My own crazy custom interchange, lol.

It's my only super weird one though on that save.

[faint ember]

Check my math. Nuclear power plants consume 300 cubic meters of water per minute. Just getting water at 20C to boil (let's not use steam stables here and assume atmospheric pressure, pool-type reactor) would take ~262 GJ per minute, or 4.37GW of power.

Obviously, you need wicked high pressure steam to spin the turbine that is in the back of the plant.

But we can assume that 4.37GW is the minimum heat that the NPP has to produce just to boil off the water.

The most efficient practical Carnot cycles are around 30%, so the NPP that makes 2.5GW electric has to produce at least 8.3GW of heat, which is probably more accurate.

So we'll bound the actual power output of the NPP from 4GW to 10GW, although it could be much higher if it was even less efficient.

[near zenith]

you're bound by the assumption of 1atm on earth though, who knows what that acutal pressure is on our little spacerock in the sky

we're in a pressure suit

who says there is air at all? rather, the same air, cause the friction on landing defo comes from something

[faint ember]

Foliage and stable liquid water.

It could be higher pressure, of course, which would just raise the minimum thermal power.

Nuclear fuel 'burnup' is measured in the dizzyingly inefficient unit of gigagwatt-days per metric ton of Uranium (GWd/mtU), or something equivalent depending on the fuel cycle.

Fuel burnup is dependent on the materials and the enrichment, but the theoretical maximum is somewhere around 900 GWd/mtU, while a more practical limitation is a bit closer to 100, which is probably a better assumption since waste in Satisfactory can be reprocessed into more fuel.

That's 8.64E15 J per metric ton of Uranium fuel, or 8.64GJ per gram.

A single fuel rod burns for five minutes, producing between 1200 and 3000 GJ of thermal power based on the above.

Meaning each fuel rod contains between 150 and 850 grams of Uranium fuel as it is commonly understood today.

That is an unusually small amount.

[barren elm]

That's interesting, does the 5 minute lifespan change much? ie scaled up to a more "sane" fuel rod lifespan of 5 years, a real fuel rod would be about 2.6mil satisfactory fuel rods

[vapid gorge]

Ahem - I don't see my stacked interchange to the right there. Obviously better as I don't have to have elevation changes along the lines at stations to make sure there isn't overlap 😛

[faint ember]

The quantity of fuel would scale linearly with the time it took to burn. 18 months is normal for commercial

Commercial reactors are also burning hundreds of fuel bundles that each have about 100,000 kg of Uranium in them though

[barren elm]

I'm pretty sure yours is a turbine intersection, it's just having 1 rail above the other really makes it visually confusing to figure out

I see the hallmarks of a turbine intersection there but some of the curves are hard to see

Ultimately though any rail intersection where none of the rails cross (and trains aren't spending longer than they need to be at an intersection) is going to be good enough in satisfactory

[vapid gorge]

Oh absolutely and that was what I was going for 😄 The other thing I like about stacked, other than being able to maneuver around terrain more easily low to the ground, is that when I have stations to the side I find it easier to make on and off ramps w/o overlapping the other rail

[wintry aurora]

@ earlier talk on the fuel rod stuff: Thing though is that the devs have to make a lot of handwaves to make nuke plants actually balanced, considering that new nuke plants take years to build (provided you get past the regulations and especially the NIMBY and rods last years.

Whether it's actually correctly scaled or not, I don't know.

[vapid gorge]

That's close to the American approach to nuclear power. Building and designing bigger systems that have more and more strict location requirements for stability ect, and each one has new challenges that get worked out.

Japanese approach is the cookie cutter method. Small plants that have been tested and had the kinks worked out and can be plopped out much more quickly.

[faint ember]

Hahaha, Fukushima

Funabashi's narrative history of the disaster is about 600 pages that carefully and consistently dismantles every claim you make about nuclear safety culture in Japan, though it is deliberately written to contradict the commonly understood narrative pre-disaster.

[wintry aurora]

Somehow, in a place that has recorded earthquakes and tsunamis since they began recording, they didn't expect an earthquake AND a tsunami. That's my understanding of it, though that's probably oversimplified.

[faint ember]

It is. Industrial accidents of that scale require not only disasters, but also a dozen serial human failures.

Anywho, not relevant. NNPs in Satisfactory seem to be within an order of magnitude of the possible, but also kind of weird.

[wintry aurora]

NNP? Something nuclear plants?

[faint ember]

Typo

NPP. Nuclear Power Plant.

[wintry aurora]

Oh

[wintry aurora]

Not to mention a whole lot of handwaving and simplification, which is probably why they're kinda weird.

[faint ember]

But being within an order of magnitude of the possible is really impressive!

It takes work to get there and to make it balanced!

[barren elm]

Tiny fuel rod goes in, 50 barrels of waste comes out, can't explain that

[vapid gorge]

Most of it is irradiated water?

[dusty haven]

i hope this is a correct server so question. I have 120 lines of coal that goes to 8 coal generators. how do i make it so that all the generators are getting the coal and not only the 4 in front? should i just let it run for some time cos i tried to run the line from one side and from the middle and the result is the same

[deft lichen]

!wikisearch Manifold @dusty haven

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=Manifold

[oblique notch]

Have device smaller than a pistol that can make machines 40 m long in 10 seconds from simple parts like concrete bags and copper wire and then can produce super computers from just 4 parts in a minute or so.

But ok, the rod to waste is the in straw that broke the believers back 😉

[oblique notch]

With a manifold. Eventually the first machines will fill their hoppers, and it will start to saturate. Time is all you need

[vapid gorge]

How much is the miner making per minute and what mk belt are you using?

[oblique notch]

Assuming you have enough input of course

[dusty haven]

two mk1 miners to one mk2 conveyor belt(?) 60+60=120

[deft lichen]

Yeah, then a manifold

You might need to pre-fill the generators first

[dusty haven]

so in time everything should work out?

[deft lichen]

Yes

If a generator takes more than it needs, it will eventually fill up and pass the rest to the next one in line

[dusty haven]

ok thanks, i was worried that i need to do something complicated this early on

[vapid gorge]

Nope! Though often times you might want to pre fill you water pipes before turning everything on if you're getting stuttering flow

[dusty haven]

yeah, i watched a video on how to balance the water pipes but for now i just use 1 water pump per 2 coal generators

[vapid gorge]

pipework is probably the most challenging thing in the game. Coal power is the intro to it.

Keep it simple. Don't have a lot of weird bends and elevation changes.

Oh and looping the feed pipe back on itself solves a lot of issues

[loud trellis]

I didn't realize there was a channel for the nitty gritty of Satisfactory

[vapid gorge]

I mean there's at least 3. Maths, design, 'general'.

[dusty haven]

@loud trellis have you watched kibitz episodes on his nuclear plant?

[loud trellis]

I think so, yes

[frosty owl]

Ofc it was supposed to mean Nuclear North Pole

[marsh gate]

Confusing question that would like an answer.
So I'm trying to follow a Heavy Modular Frame tutorial video, and the person says this build requires 'a bit over a GW'.
What is exactly a GW in this game? Because right now I have about 14 to 15,000MW.
According to Google, anything that's 1,000MW or higher is considered a Gigawatt. But I'm not sure if that's the same in this game.

[deft lichen]

correct

1 GW = 1000 MW

1 TW = 1000 GW = 1000000 MW

[marsh gate]

Ah. Thank you. Good to know.

[deft lichen]

the game only ever uses MW though, just search up metric units on wikipedia for details

[marsh gate]

Yeah, I was confused, because the guy was making a Fuel power plant setup that has 400MW less than my 32 coal power plants, calling it a second power plant and "all he would need".
Yet he said "GW" and I'm like.. HUH?? How in the fuck is that going to be enough?!
Thank you so much for explaining.

[frosty owl]

Generally we (as in us pioneers) use the same symbols as the internationally-accepted ones.
So k for thousands of something, M for millions, G for bilions...

[glacial hemlock]

Like how you read megabyte / gigabyte.

[gritty void]

what's a reasonable rate of production for a pre-space elevator setup?

or rather, are there any calculators that work to find the best solution based on your potential mining capability

this might be the wrong channel sorry 😓

[glacial hemlock]

Someone clear the 1st space elevator package at 22min, while many others after a couples of hours. It depends on whether you want to play it stressless or maxing out your APM.

Have at LEAST 1 machine to automate each of the component is a good start.

[vapid gorge]

Satisfactorytools.com can set the 'inputs' to what resources you have around you. Tbh though you shouldn't worry about that. Build lots of stuff, connect things up, tier up tech.

You'll spend more time trying to figure out some sort of efficiency combo than actually jsut building things and getting through the goals and learning the basics

[barren elm]

Having 3 of each machine producing the current "most complex" item is a good enough benchmark imo

It'll get milestones and the elevator done in good time

Assuming you're going through the somewhat expected process of build factory -> explore -> repeat

[small oasis]

So ... a full ISC of plutonium fuel for a truck will last approximately 556 days of game time. :/

[small sand]

ISC ?

[barren elm]

imperial star container

[small sand]

okay I wouldn't have asked cz I am even more lost

[oblique hollow]

big storage container

once you unlock it, you will know it

[small sand]

is it added by update 6 ?

[oblique hollow]

its been in the game since update 2

[small sand]

okay so I still don't know what you are talking about and I already did the whole game many times🤷‍♀️
I think I'll look for that this time and I will see🤷‍♀️

[oblique hollow]

This thing

Industrial
Storage
Container

ISC

aka "big container"

how was that so hard

[ivory thicket]

I love those things

[small sand]

here I agree
I know what it is
but

imperial star container
I don't know that lol

[barren elm]

Yeah the Ficsit Star in orbit is surrounded by them

[oblique notch]

You're getting trolled. That's all that was

[half token]

I just call those double chests, too much minecraft

[ember fractal]

Love the big ISC

[half token]

finally figured out how to have my cake and eat it too, wrt having intermediary exits AND a long end-to-end tube I can jump into and go afk

I can jump out, or not

[supple belfry]

I’ve always had luck spacing two entrances about 2m apart, with the “default” afk tube just spitting you into the other. A second entrance can be place two “clicks” over relative to the first entrance and you can redirect yourself (or exit the tube) by pressing left or right.

[glacial hemlock]

Try building a cannon with hypertube.

[tidal yacht]

do you guys prefer to use recipes with no screws?

[fierce cypress]

either is fine

[wind spade]

it's up to you really. I would never use a recipe just because it doesn't have screws, it's a nice bonus, but it's not a factor in decision making

[tidal yacht]

if you use screws, do you make them out of steel or iron?

[wind spade]

most resource efficient is steel rod -> base screw
decently compact is steel screw
no coal variant is base screw/cast screw

again, depending on situation, I'll pick different ones

[tidal yacht]

k, cause I am in the dune desert, and coal (for steel) is a lot more limited than iron

[small sand]

yes I understood it.. but after

[mossy folio]

Ah yes, plutonium waste bins

[naive ingot]

I space the two entrances about 4m apart and have them each angled 45° upwards, and have a ladder positioned directly above each of the entrances. If you are AFK, you fly up, hit the opposite ladder and fall back down into the opposite hypertube, if you want to exit, move forward and you grab the ladder and climb up and over onto whatever platform I've built up.
Very low power consumption and it conserves a lot of momentum.

[naive ingot]

I absolutely prefer to escape from screws.

That said, by escaping from screws, you become dependent on wire.

To a slightly lesser degree.

[versed violet]

There is always the rubber way.

[naive ingot]

Once you master the rubber/plastic recycling paradigm you do have more rubber than you know what to do with.

[wind spade]

I don't really see "remove item X from production line" as any advantage. The factories still have pretty much the same complexity, just with different items. I'd rather have recipes that do actual saving of resources or space or whatever I want to save in the particular case

[versed violet]

sanity

[naive ingot]

It's more important if you're making satellite factories each outputting one item than if you have megafactories with ore or ingots as their input.

[barren elm]

Come to the church of the steel screw

Never belt screws more than a single foundation, all it takes is 1 constructor between your steal beam belt, and all your screw related needs

[crimson mulch]

Do you provide the people of this community with steel and steel accesories?

[wintry aurora]

I belted it more than that though in my old mall because that’s just where it ended up.

Wasn’t far though, six foundation maybe

[wind spade]

*steel rod 😛

[signal nimbus]

@oak edge All three are amazing, I'd recommend 3 if you're looking to build motors, while the other two can be swapped in later.

[median heath]

Amen.

[unborn path]

i need help optimizing my factory

[soft scarab]

Try https://www.satisfactorytools.com

[unborn path]

thanks

[rugged bolt]

I have quite literally spent half an hour trying basically everything I can think of, how can I get 46.5 to eventually split into 22.5 and 24, picture for context

[median heath]

Single splitter.

[rugged bolt]

how?

that would be 23.25 no?

[median heath]

46.5/2 = 23.25
23.25 > 22.5

22.5 side will fill and then be able to take only 22.5, after which you have a perfect 22.5:24 split.

[rugged bolt]

wait a damn minute

[median heath]

Recommend pre-feeding the 22.5 side so you don't have to wait for it to back up.

[rugged bolt]

idk why I never thought of that

[median heath]

Do you normally balance lines for some reason instead of making manifolds?

[rugged bolt]

yes

[median heath]

That would be why.

[rugged bolt]

I'm slow in the head

[median heath]

🤷‍♂️

[ivory thicket]

I do balance setups occasionally just for a change in look lol

[median heath]

Balancing comes more into practicality when you start doing sushi tbh.

[wintry aurora]

I tried balancing some steel pipe lines, but it didn't work out the way I had hoped.

Turns out the throughput wasn't an issue as I thought it was going to be, hence why I tried to split it.

[dire vigil]

i just look at the macro: x inputs = y outputs

takes forever to reach equilibrium/max production but it gets there eventually...also keeps power consumption sane until then

[wintry aurora]

Me? it was more of an issue of getting the splitter to balance things and since it's sushi, it's ever flowing. Ended up just winding the belt through the section I was trying to balance. The throughput issue I was worried about never materialized.

[dire vigil]

one thing that helps is using different speeds of conveyors...a 60 belt is basically locked to 7.7% of the time from accepting anything off of a Mk5 conveyor

it's full for most of the ticks so nothing can get off of it

[wintry aurora]

Although I did keep the concrete partially off the sushi belt for that section.

[dire vigil]

likewise, if if you have a 780 belt onto a 780, but it only has like 10 items coming on it, it's going to prefer those items over an adjacent 60 belt in an merger simply becasuse it's getting scanned 92.3% of the time

i use that technique in aluminum processing loops so it prefers the recycled silicon (i think it was) over injecting new from an outside source

[wintry aurora]

I'll consider that the next time I run into a similar issue with sushi belts.

[dire vigil]

in general, i'd argue it's better just to overwhelm lines, if you need 20, give it 21 or more and stockpile the extra in a container so you have something to snatch for yourself

[past cedar]

interesting

we smart split a product line to storage bins, all set to overflow ... then dump all the stuff that reaches an end into a sink (if its not been used by something)

but thats interesting about mk5 and mk1 into a merger

[heady bolt]

is there a way to check on drone distance and per miniute rate? to check the math on if im delivering enough uranium to keep the power on 😛

[lunar cliff]

How do you reintegrate fluids back into their production lines? Residual from aluminum and battery production keeps stopping my production. I added a valve to restrict flow, from my production machines, but because the valve doesn't restrict properly (I set it to x, and it allows x.yz through) the production machines gradually overflow the pipes

[median heath]

VIP junction.

[barren elm]

Worse, but somewhat simpler, is just making wet concrete and sinking it

[median heath]

Routing it to Coal Power also works.

Or, if you're using an Alclad recipe and bringing in Copper anyway, you can use the water to make Steamed Sheets very effectively.

Alternatively, use Instant Scrap and just don't have to worry about it at all 🙃

[barren elm]

I know it's double heresy to mention here but fluids in satisfactory really make me long for factorio's circuit system

[median heath]

Fuck Factorio 🙂

[barren elm]

Not my personal choice of porn category but whatever you do in your own time is your business

[median heath]

I do wish we had more reasons to use VOP junctions though. 🤷‍♂️

[lunar cliff]

Is the VIP junction something specific to this game? I don't see how I was supposed to figure that out

[median heath]

Neither the VIP nor VOP are taught to the player.
You learn them by testing what you can do with pipes 🤷‍♂️

Idk if they are specific to this game though.

[wintry aurora]

Lolwut dude, or dudette if that's the case.

[signal nimbus]

@queen lantern The Spiffing Brit invaded.

[queen lantern]

Cheeky bastard

[wintry aurora]

What machine is that? #screenshots message

[frosty owl]

The drone port's UI should have all aviable info

[frosty owl]

I'll expand onto that, hoping someone may find the info useful:
When merging items on a belt, each input is given equal "priority", but the faster a belt, the more chances it'll have to push an item "in" the merger as soon as there's space to do so (though the merger will try to then accept an item from the other input instead). As long as the inputs don't saturate the output belt, nothing weird happens, but when said belt is full things can get harder to predict...

Example: you have a MK4 belt carrying 480/min. You pass this through a merger (M) and then a smart splitter (S); S splits off the items on a MK1 belt and sends the overflow ahead; the MK1 belt merges back to M. How much is the overflow/min?

[frosty owl]

I did the thing
#satisfactory-memes

[oblique hollow]

dont merge fresh and recycled liquid

no mixing = no way one can clog the other

[median heath]

I approve.

[median heath]

McGalleon | VIP Trust Issues

[oblique hollow]

certified VIP distruster ™️

[median heath]

There it is.

Although still, just use Instant and never have to deal with it 🤷‍♂️

[oblique hollow]

easy win

Certified Instant Scrap Enjoyer

[thorn bane]

use 2 systems, one with freshwater and one with recycled water
and then use a smart splitter to give priority to the recycled refineries

[thorn bane]

doesnt instant scrap also output water?

[oblique hollow]

yea but 1 to 1

[median heath]

Perfect amount for the Sulfuric Acid.

[oblique hollow]

instant is easy pz water recycling as theres no fresh water for acid needed

[median heath]

No special junctions or fancy piping needed.
Just plug and play.

[thorn bane]

hm i guess now that theres no fluid loss anymore

[median heath]

Exactly.

[thorn bane]

hm i guess non-fissile uranium -> any of the acids also works now

[median heath]

Aye.

[frosty owl]

When you realize 1:1 fluid loops can finally (and reliably) be a thing:
Surprised Pikachu face

[oblique hollow]

i tried testing this and....

i dont see the overflow doing anything useful

unless you do some belt limiting? or whatever

as far as i can see you need to overbuild the recycling refineries?

anyway, other result: precise fluid recycling where you use some refineries with ONLY recycled water works great

i logged the whole system with water and alumina, and it managed to unclog it

and its been running fine since

[thorn bane]

yes you overbuild both
or rather you just dont underclock them/overclock them fully

the whole point of the smart splitter is to be able to send all the bauxite to the recycled refineries, in the case that theres too much water
for that you obviously need enough refineries to be able to handle that amount
you also need to make sure that theres no initial bauxite/water in the system so the recycled part is starved on water and the fresh part is starved on bauxite

[grave grove]

I'm currently running 4 Coal Generators 100% and 1 water Extractor at 150% and the pipes are traveling less than 10 meters up, for some reason 1 of my coal generators and sometimes a 2nd one keeps turning off. I'm unsure why I'm not getting enough water. Help please.

[loud trellis]

80 constructors for concrete

How much limestone would I need?

[snow dove]

how much does 1 constructor require?

[loud trellis]

None overclocked

[snow dove]

what is 45*80

[gray cove]

If you haven't already done this at least once, I'd recommend giving your system a chance to stabilize with the pipes full. I've found this to solve some of my issues - what's happening is that you're using exactly enough water, but the machines only check "every so often" to see if they have water. If you start with a full buffer, 1) that solves this issue, and 2) if you still lose water, you know it's either a supply or headlift issue.

[loud trellis]

3600

[snow dove]

there is your answer

[grave grove]

very helpful, thanks a lot !

[gray cove]

(if it's generators, which this is, it won't take water in while it's not powered - unless you connect it to a tripped circuit. Generators (and honestly most/all machines) can take input (fluid or solid) when connected to a tripped circuit. So to build a tripped circuit easily, build a biomass burner, hook it to a pole, and hook the pole up to a sink. Put one item in the burner, let it trip, remove the burner but not the pole, and bam, tripped circuit. Then disconnect your generators from everything but each other and hook them to the tripped pole. When done, remove sink and that pole.)

[loud trellis]

1200 concrete for blenders that need 450 for all, so I'm actually gonna be overproducing.

[gray cove]

Overproducing isn't a bad idea! I just sink the excess and leave a sign for myself telling me how much I'm expecting to use, so that if I want that material (e.g. concrete) later, I know how much "spare" I have.

[loud trellis]

Logistics routing is the best.

[gray cove]

That's what I use floor holes for. 😄

[loud trellis]

I'm also overproducing sulfur

By like, 400m³

[trail dome]

does the calculator in satisfactorytools expect you to have a high tier miner or something? I tried making a factory that it told me to but it's not really working out well..

[wind spade]

it doesn't tell you anything about miners, it just tells you how much ore you need to mine

[trail dome]

but isn't that tied to the miner tier?

sorry i'm new to this game and suck at calculating stuff

[barren elm]

The calculator might tell you that you need 1000 iron, but how you get that 1000 iron is up to you

You could get it from just 2 max level miners, you could also get it from 17 low level miners

On that note the calculator doesn't factor in belt speeds either, so if it's telling you that you need to convert 1000 iron into 1000 iron rods, you'd need to figure that out using the belts you have as 1 single belt won't be enough

[small kayak]

Overclocking miner is a good thing

Higher MK miners double the extraction speed every time. Factor in the purity of the node to calculate the amount you can get out of a single node

[wind spade]

you can use multiple nodes (miners) if one node doesn't give you enough

[small kayak]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Miner?so=search

[barren elm]

If they're new it might not be wise to dump wikis on them

Lots of spoilers if they value that kind of thing

[small kayak]

Look at the mining speed section

[sand epoch]

They wouldn't be here if they feared spoilers

[barren elm]

Maybe, maybe not, I personally wouldn't do it but each to their own

[small kayak]

Satis tools could also be seen as a spoiler 😁

Messing with excel sheets was 'fun' only for my first bunch of smaller factories. Thanks for the tools greeny!

[trail dome]

okay so like.. the calculator tells me I need 216 iron ore per minute, so since I am at mk. 2 miners that would mean put down two miners on my nearby iron ore nodes? and then do one at 100% clock and the other at 80% so I get exactly 216 iron?