off-topic-tech

[night girder]

You keep saying "Its not implemented" while it's right there.

[twin dew]

And if the kids use their computer/device time to watch ads, and not play something etc., what is the problem?

[night girder]

I am not pulling these screenshots out of thin air.

[dire igloo]

Which is something you have shown just now, this far into the argument

[night girder]

🤦‍♀️

[twin dew]

Whole thing got started because Discord in the last 24h implemented that stuff.

[night girder]

First message I posted today.

[dire igloo]

Because ads crafted to lure in kids can pause gigantic harm:
Luring them away to less regulated areas (i.e. pseudo-gambling)

[night girder]

If you dfidn't pick that up. Or believe me. That's not a me problem.

[dire igloo]

That looks like an announcement which could be happening whenever

[night girder]

The fact that I have to send screenshots, literally showing ads on discord, holy shit.

[dire igloo]

It's not an actual implementation - but it does answer the question of where you see it (assuming it's not gone after a restart, like patch notes)

[night girder]

No, it was the first thing that pop onto my screen when starting my PC. And it's in the news.

[dire igloo]

I don't disagree that these quest thingies are ads.

This whole time, I was under the assumption, that this watch ads for orbs stuff was yet to come.
Because there was nothing for me yet (admittedly, I'm on my phone)

[night girder]

No? That's why I keep posting screeenshots.

Else I would say; "these SS are from article and link URL".

Which I do 99% of the time.

[dire igloo]

News will be flushed out after a few weeks, so that's not permanent.
Start page pop-up might be permanent but unclear

Now, the incentive to watch the ads is to get orbs.
The incentive to get orbs is to spend orbs.
Where, how and why would I spend orbs?

[night girder]

You going to make up arguments forever at this point to justifity... I don't know what anymore.

Said my piece.

[dire igloo]

You're complaining about people being "forced" to watch ads.
You're not being forced to watch ads, you can choose not to.

So there has to be some very strong incentive to watch ads, otherwise you wouldn't be complaining

[night girder]

I posted the carrot and donkey.

If you didn't get that analogy 🤷‍♂️

[dire igloo]

I'm not making up arguments, we finally got to a point where I can argue specifics and don't need to ramble about generalized concepts

[dire igloo]

Correct, I didn't.

Btw, very early in the discussion I was already thinking about the idea of ad-exclusive content

[sterile plinth]

as long as it is cosmetics its fine

[dire igloo]

You have had very specific criticisms which I dismissed because I lacked info about the implementation.
Now that I know that there is a specific implementation, I am requesting that info so we can actually have an equal discussion.

[dire igloo]

Not really, especially not with kids and teenagers who gain a lot of their self-worth from other people's opinions.

Just look at Fortnite and how people with default skin are being treated.
The community itself is guilt tripping its users into spending money on cosmetics.

[night girder]

There is no discussion. You think it's fine. I see potential issues for younger ones. That's it.

You love it. I hate it. Simple.

spend too much time on this already, while the information is all there. In discord. The app you use atm.

[sterile plinth]

fortnite is a game whose target audience is 10 year olds, that's the reason for it

but I get your point

[dire igloo]

I never said it's fine.
I said that your vocal criticism wasn't justified because there was no implementation.

I was wrong, there is an implementation already.
I don't have access to that, so I can't say if your criticism is justified or not.

[dire igloo]

Stop making up things for me to have said

[dire igloo]

It literally is not here

At least not in any easily findable location

[dire igloo]

Fortnite literally has a minimum age restriction of 12 in Germany

[pure karma]

i see that someone beat me to it

but yea this is a thing now

[dire igloo]

And ESRB has it rated T for Teen, so 13+

[sterile plinth]

does that really prevent them from playing it though

[dire igloo]

Well, depends on how well Epic Games have implemented their age verification

[sterile plinth]

most services allow you to state your own age

so there is no real check

[dire igloo]

But if that age restriction fails, especially if it can be shown to be negligently loose, you can just get them through that approach, no need to complain about in-game stores n shit

[night girder]

Welcome MagicZ 🤣 Join the fun. Haha

[sterile plinth]

What i care about in games is fairness, if there is deceptive marketing on cosmetics i will accept it as long as I can play it f2p without being held at a disadvantage

[dire igloo]

btw, I have never once seen the discord item shop in the app.
I've seen it promoted in my profile customization right next to the space where it tells me I need Nitro to customize my avatar

[pure karma]

nah im leaving for 2 days fuck this

il come back when my desk is ready 😂

[dire igloo]

And that's shortsighted because cosmetics can play a huge role for the community

[night girder]

let us know when you break the desk after a few days trying to overclcock or underclock it.

[sterile plinth]

i dont disagree with you, but the one that will get hurt from overpriced cosmetics will usually be the corporation, not the customer (fortnite is an exception because of its low age playerbase)

I like the system league of legends has for skins. While you can buy all skins with money, one can also acquire skins while being free to play without too much difficulty

[dire igloo]

I just went into my profile and I've seen the store for the very first time - equipped with a "new" badge to show me they just added it

Ngl, it sucks ass. Most of the cosmetics idc about and everything has an IRL price attached

Things this does not have:

• desirable items
• ability to find items that you do desire
• a way to pay with ads

[dire igloo]

ahem, Hall of Fame, ahem, gambling, ahem

But I do like that there are skins which are not obtainable through purchase

[dire igloo]

Honestly, I'm taking more issue with the cosmetics shop because of its poor usability and the insanely high prices

6€ for an avatar border is insane

I'd expect that shit to be included in Nitro

THEY ARE COSMETICS FFS
It costs you NOTHING to sell them

[sterile plinth]

nitro is by far the most worth it paid feature of discord

even if no avatar border

boosts, emojis, animated stuff, custom banner

the rest are all shit

especially the boosts

5 euro a month for 1 boost

[dire igloo]

Access to animated emojis, using emojis regardless of server, increased character limit, increased file size limit

Could even consider increased screenshare resolution to be a worthwhile feature for some

[sterile plinth]

yes yes all that

[night girder]

are you using betterdiscord btw?

because that might filter the features out.

[sterile plinth]

i don't, I use discord on browser

[dire igloo]

Boosts idrc about, custom banner idc, GIF profile pic idc

[sterile plinth]

the nonchalant guy

[dire igloo]

I've been on unmodified discord mobile this whole day.
Desktop PC has vencord

[sterile plinth]

my fav is the emojis

[dire igloo]

That's the one thing I miss the most about not having nitro, by far

[sterile plinth]

the only thing i really noticed when they were giving out free nitro

[dire igloo]

Using any emoji anywhere is amazing

[sterile plinth]

I have a super cool server called "catmoji"

that has a version of every single emoji but with a cat

best thing ever

[dire igloo]

also, I think nitro users can join more servers, but not sure

[sterile plinth]

yeah

while there was free nitro i didnt think much about it so i joined a lot of servers

and then once it ended i realized i was at 115

and i needed to leave 16 servers to join another one

[night girder]

I clean up communities I am not active in.

Because how can you be active in 100+ communities? 🤔

[sterile plinth]

well, each one is its own thing

Some of them I'm in just for the announcements

in others I talk once a week

[dire igloo]

You don't, you keep them around in case there's something very specific you want from there

Like, I'm in several servers which specialize in specific types of hardware.
I'm not active in most of them, but if I ever have a question, I know where to ask

[night girder]

I don't keep them around.

I rejoin if I need them again in the future.

[dire igloo]

Which would need me to memorize the server names or have some place of storing invite links (hoping they don't expire)

I have like a dozen servers for different friend groups.
Most are inactive most of the time, but we get together occasionally

[pure karma]

il make sure to give it a few bonks

Thats a new error

[night girder]

I love it when they give you stuff like that.

[cloud estuary]

go inside the box

[night girder]

Just "something is wrong" figure it out 🤣

Also pretty sure I know why they hide all the details for users.

[pure karma]

Well i know why its cause im on mobile data so its upset but yea its definitely annoying when it dosent tell you why a error is happening

[night girder]

The good old error codes, while not perfect, where atleast something to get started from.

[pure karma]

well… some of them

the old bluescreens that existed with the sole purpose of beeping at you and giving you a heart attack weren’t exactly very useful

[twin dew]

They used to contain much more than today.
Just in more technical format.

[night girder]

And the whole purpose of the codes was to look them up.

Or contact support and say; "Hey I got this code, what's going on?".

[elder blaze]

i recommend vencord instead

[twin dew]

And those errors are really well documented, including the deeper level numbers that used to be shown, and then got removed at some point, and now have to be gotten from the dumps or event viewer.
https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/debugger/bug-check-code-reference2

[feral drift]

Somehow I assume this is my ISP's Protocol connecting to the "main route"

[twin dew]

Can have very high bandwidth when using high-capacity micro-SD cards, but horrible latency and chance for packet loss.

[night girder]

Best example ever. Just have gone for a bald eagle.

https://tenor.com/view/merica-bald-eagle-eagle-america-american-gif-2277187416326490184

That stuff makes sure your packet arrives safely.

[twin dew]

Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway.
–Andrew Tanenbaum, 1981

[soft bloom]

Given circumstances I want to learn how to do it. At least there's less traffic monitoring this way.

[night girder]

You think?

[soft bloom]

You have proof of the opposite?

[twin dew]

Put data on some removable media that is small and light enough.
Have the trained avian carry it to wherever.
Someone else then takes that removable media and unloads the data.
Where in theory that electrical loading and unloading could be automated to work with basic IP networking.

[soft bloom]

And someone will make PigTor one day

[twin dew]

Carrier pigeons of modern day use.

[night girder]

(trained) Falcon plucks pigeon out of the sky.

[feral drift]

How does Spoofing work in IPoAC? :D

[sterile plinth]

abduct the pigeon and send another one

[twin dew]

Just with micro-SD or like instead of small piece of paper.

[charred relic]

A trained raven is infinitely more useful...

🙂

[sterile plinth]

Man in the middle attack: bring down the pigeon and replace the message without anyone knowing

[night girder]

We have a lot of experience here using pigeons as carriers.

[soft bloom]

In cities there's enough pigeons to assume safety

[night girder]

It does has drawbacks for sure.

We even gave a few pigeons medals.

Because they came back with bullet holes and still delivered the message. Heroes with wings.

[charred relic]

Ravens tend to bring you medals o.O

[soft bloom]

Replace pigeon without nayone knowing ..
They have personality, you know?
Also, signing works. So you can go as far as take a photo, sign it, and it will the proof.

[night girder]

This monument in Brussel is for that. It's to remember the pigeons.

[twin dew]

Which is why often many pigeons were used, and the messages were enciphered.

[night girder]

And also why some didn't make it. It's not foolproof.

But still reliable.

[soft bloom]

I thought practice of shooting pigeons stopped in ww2, or even earlier

[twin dew]

Where the avian count depended on how large chance you wanted for at least one to get through, vs. someone outside getting their hands on the message.

[charred relic]

A lot birds are super smart

[night girder]

32 pigeons got a medal.

Called " Dickin Medal".

Another, named Cher Ami, lost his foot and one eye, but his message got through, saving a large group of surrounded American infantrymen.

Cher Ami, I think that's "Dear Friend."

[charred relic]

There were times a pigeon was the most relible method

[sterile plinth]

how much weight can a pigeon carry?

[night girder]

Nah, that's paratroopers when in the air.

[twin dew]

Was just going for that, Lost Batallion:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cher_Ami

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_Battalion_(World_War_I)

[sterile plinth]

Considering there are 1TB sd cards that weight a few grams the bandwith could be insane

[soft bloom]

So it is ww1

[twin dew]

Yes, pigeons were out by WW2, but still in common usage during WW1.

[night girder]

True. But if you think they didnt shoot at em during WO2...

[charred relic]

Radio gear being bulky and problematic... pigeons were perfect

[soft bloom]

Radio does wonders

But now it's all monitored...

[night girder]

During World War II, the United Kingdom used about 250,000 homing pigeons for many purposes, including communicating with those behind enemy lines such as Belgian spy Jozef Raskin.

Still popular during WO2.

[charred relic]

Yeah even WW2 the radios weren't awesome

And like all types of communication like that, limited range

That damn... curve

[twin dew]

Well, for a spy, the radio transmission is locatable much easily than pigeons, as long as keeping pigeons isn't weird yet.

[night girder]

Fun fact; there is a lot of money involved in the pigeon sport.

[charred relic]

Fun fact I tended to a racing pigeon once that landed in my neighbors yard one night

[soft bloom]

I have pigeon house whatever it's called nearby. They were built commonly here. You can even spot a flock of white pigeons circling around

[charred relic]

gave it some fresh water and let it chill in the bushes

[night girder]

Someone paid 310.000 euro for one pigeon in 2013.

The name of the bird was Bolt for those that want to look it up.

[soft bloom]

And the more wild variation of pigeons is quite common in suburban and rural areas. They are dam loud

[charred relic]

We have a lot of hawks around here...

[night girder]

In our cities, we can't feed them or we get fined.

One moment they are heroes. The next moment you get fined for feeding those "heroes".

They do spread like a plague though 🤣

[twin dew]

Rats of the skies 😅

[night girder]

Exactly 😄

also just out of respect, dogs did well too during WO's.

[charred relic]

Some people call the squirrels here "yard rats"

[soft bloom]

But why?..

[soft bloom]

W O ?

[night girder]

ooh sorry bad habbit from me.

Wereld Oorlog, world wars.

[charred relic]

Probably breeding

[night girder]

WW in english. WO in dutch.

[charred relic]

The people against hunting here really do not know the antler hell we'd eventuallylive in if we didn't allow deer to be hunted

Ever had a big buck just about square up on you... pretty scary shit lol

[soft bloom]

Here, due to priximity to forest
There are looots of crows
When sun sets they move in huge flocks
Idk comparison in numbers, pigeons are more commonly seen, but maybe in volume they are comparable.
Definitely louder audiably

[charred relic]

Also lots of traffic accidents with them getting hit... the old deer in the headlights effect is def based on reality lol

those things will just stop and look at you

[night girder]

also, I am not sure if pigeons cary specific disseases other birds don't carry.

but honestly, I think we get fined because there are too many pigeons in a city and they poop on everything.

[charred relic]

and whatever you do... if you have a great climate for it... do not import kudzu

good lord it is out of hand so many places here... haha

[twin dew]

And most other birds aren't tame enough to be a constant problem.

[night girder]

constant problem ... not sure. But I guess? I never had problems with pigeons tbh.

[charred relic]

it'll be great to prevent soil erosion...they said...

[night girder]

And I lived in the city.

[charred relic]

the cities here i've been to people feed them all the time

[soft bloom]

any bird has easy access to dumpsters

[charred relic]

city pigeos don't have that fear either so they'll just come right to you... or climb right up on you

[soft bloom]

so you might not feed them - they will feed themselves.

and crows are not afraid of people that much. well maybe they won't get like under your legs, but will get curious and walk around you for sure

[night girder]

Oh I remember, seagulls can be aggressive/bold.

[twin dew]

Which was the constant problem I meant, that they have absolutely no issues with being near humans, even less if fed regularly.

[night girder]

https://tenor.com/view/got-em-gotcha-stolen-gimme-gif-18153012

[twin dew]

Yeah, seagulls are another pain, but in different way.

As they just come near in bursts to steal food.

[night girder]

I kinda have respect for that bird in the gif. Casual walking up to it like it's nothing.

Then fleeing for it's life, so human 🤣

[soft bloom]

oh and especially were my parents live, I remembered pigeons there as having absolutely no fear flying extremely close to you while you walk. like their wings hit my headwear a couple times

[charred relic]

I like that video of the pigeons outside a shop pretending to be sick/hurt... which they started doing after seeing a human taking care of a hurt bird

smart little jokers...

[night girder]

you know what would solve the pigeon problem in the cities? Wind turbines. Since they kill all the birds. 🙈

[soft bloom]

I believe not a single late spring goes without a crow with hurt wing jumping around

and some hedgehogs in the summer (why are they sniffing so loudly?)

and bats, ofcourse. silent hunters of the dusk

[twin dew]

Basic instinct when "predator" comes near the nest.

For many types of birds.

[night girder]

yeah, altruism.

[twin dew]

Meant that "fakes broken wing" thing, as part of the move to try to get the predator to not notice the actual nest.

[night girder]

altruism.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altruism_(biology)

Doing something that puts yourself in a more dangerous situation to save the nest/offspring.

It's a common term in biology.

[safe trench]

i read that as autism

[sterile plinth]

man, I have some external seagate hdd i bought like 6 years ago and, while it shows up on windows device manager, it doesn't recognize the disk's existence in the disk manager at all

It's weird because the HDD has been spinning for a total of maybe 10 hours in its entire lifetime, just for backups once a year

i tried updating the drivers, does anybody else have ideas as to what I should do

[feral drift]

IIRC some externals requires additional power to make it run properly..

Else I'd try on another machine to see if it reads it.

And if not, its most likely broken..

[sterile plinth]

it has a special cable for it

It is like micro usb and usbc merged into one (horizontally)

Extremely weird shape

My point being, this cable is probably data transfer + power in one

[feral drift]

Is it SSD or HDD drive ?

[sterile plinth]

hdd

It is popping up in device manager, but not in disk manager

[feral drift]

Just to rule it out - but are you pluggin it into a USB 2.0 or USB 3.0 in the PC?

[sterile plinth]

tried both

[night girder]

tried different cable?

[feral drift]

Try Disable and Enable it via Device Manager - at least someone got that running on Reddit

[sterile plinth]

again, its an extremely specific cable, it probably has a name but not something I can find easily

[sterile plinth]

tried

[night girder]

I know what cable you speak of.

I have it too. Can still be the issue.

[sterile plinth]

it kind of has this shape

[night girder]

micro b

[sterile plinth]

its just weird because I only use this hdd once a year to store backups there, it should have zero wear or tear

[sterile plinth]

yup, that's the one

[night girder]

Yeah.

[feral drift]

or if USB-A type :P

[night girder]

you should still be able to find those in the shop.

[feral drift]

If everything fails.. I'd try pull the case apart - and just connect the HDD directly into your PC

[night girder]

Uhu. Not sure if you can also try to find a case for it.

[feral drift]

They also exist yeah - a HDD adapter for USB.. If memory serves me well - they're not super expensive either

[night girder]

Yeah, I got a few cases like that.

[sterile plinth]

what hard drive brand would y'all recommend so this doesnt happen again? this one (the broken one) is a seagate

my recent favorite is WD

[feral drift]

Think any brand can do - but they look something like this:

Just search sata adapter to usb and went to the first webshop :)

And if its an option - try pick one where have the option to plug in an additional USB for power supply - just to make sure its being fed enough power :)

[sterile plinth]

not that, I meant a good brand for my next external HDD (one that won't fail so easily)

[feral drift]

I've had good experience with Samsung T7 Shield SSD Externals..

They're in a nice soft case and hasn't failed me

[sterile plinth]

well ssds are in a league of their own as far as reliability and speed goes, what I need is mass storage for cheap

[night girder]

NAS out of the question?

[glossy glacier]

micro b 3.0

[sterile plinth]

nas or no nas, main thing I'm asking is company recommendations, because as you can see I was not very pleased with seagate

[feral drift]

Well drives will die eventually - regardless of brands..

But WD, Toshiba and Seagate is probably brands i'd recommend..

However I've not used HDD for 10+ years :)

[night girder]

That's what I was thinking too, that's why I brought up the NAS.

Because if you set it up correctly, you should always have a backup.

And that reduces worries when a drive fails.

[feral drift]

The beauty of a NAS - if 1 drive dies, you'd have a backup due to the RAID setup yes :)

Unless you go YOLO and run RAID-0 :D

[night girder]

and NAS has specific drives

[glossy glacier]

have you tryed another cable @sterile plinth ?
if you still have, try a normal usb micro-b 2.0 cable

[night girder]

they don't have spare cable

[glossy glacier]

not even on of these?

[sterile plinth]

oh, i for sure have one of these

but this is the one the drive needs

[glossy glacier]

yeah, thats a micro b 3.0
but a micro b 2.0 is compatible, if at lower speeds

a 3.0 is just 2.0 with more pins to the side

[night girder]

worth a shot

[feral drift]

Though the drive was USB 3.0 - due to the extra power demand of the drive.

But you'd probably be able to read that on the drive, how much mA the drive needs

[pure karma]

You know times are desperate when you start getting excited over usb cables

Its going to be so hot tomorrow 😅 the sun is literally blood red

im probably gonna start taking my setup apart tomorrow

i was going to start tonight but theres so much to do that it would literally take all night

[safe trench]

chat are we cooked?

rog.asus.com/event/ROGxHatsuneMiku/

[maiden coyote]

so expensive.. it doesn't even come with the copper pipe or wire to plug it in..

it says it r410a though.. which is nice.

[charred relic]

couldn't say about price, installed one of those decades ago but I also got mine at wholesale since my neighbors dad owned what was at one time the largest HVAC company in the southeast

I wanna say around 800ish, but that had the copper line and

And damn well plenty of it lol

That company was sailing high... until the housing market bubble bust and new home installs was a huge part of the business

[maiden coyote]

I'm debating on it.. I'll need a flare tool, and a set of 410 gauges wouldn't be a bad idea.

if I'm going to get a manifold for 410a, I'm going to get one of those fancy digital manifolds with the temp probes that calculate subcool and superheat for you

things were much cheaper a decade ago lol

you could get a 50 series gpu for less than $100 then, and the 80 ti series was like $700 lol

[charred relic]

Def not for everyone or all situations but the portables can be an option... just don't get a single hose model because they suuuuuck... like literally suck some of the cool air they are making right back out lol

I didn't charge the system, just did most of the physical installation. Neighbor vac pumped it and charged it up, the refrigerant didn't cost me a dime

[twin dew]

Just Micro-USB 3.0.

And again I mess up by not reading everything.

[languid gulch]

so my mmo is trying to convert to 64 bit servers, and is failing miserably

was supposed to happen last week, got bumped to yesterday

update failed and they had to roll it back

now it's at least thursday

and it's something they have to get done, because both the hardware contract & 32 bit support ends 31 august

been laughing my ass off at the rampant incompetence

[feral drift]

Am I missing something.. Or are they doing the 32bit to 64bit convertion on "production" instead of a test server?

[thin trout]

A lot of stuff breaks when trying to go prod after testing, especially if that testing isn't sufficient

e.g. on WoW they screwed with the databases in 2018 and it worked fine, no issues visible.. unless you were playing 20man group content, in which case it caused constant 500ms frametime spikes

lots of other stuff they have handled fine even on public tests, but when 100-1000k people try to access the content simultaneously (instead of 1k), everything breaks then

[feral drift]

Thats true

Usually why you'd invite players to a stress test session

[thin trout]

With MMO's there are so many problems that just aren't caught when 1000 people come and test your stuff for free, but completely breaks down when 10,000 or 100,000 or 1,000,000 people try to do it at launch minute.

The best devs have fallbacks for that sort of thing e.g. on WOTLK classic launch the transport boats broke, so they flipped a switch to spawn a teleporter NPC which they had already set up and tested.

[thin trout]

but this sounds like straight up client broke and it didn't work for anybody lol

[night girder]

DDG is down 😦

[pure karma]

[maiden coyote]

yeah no.. portable is not an option xD

most split systems come precharged for x amount of lineset.. I think this one is precharged for 15 feet of lineset.

that means if you have more than 15 feet you have to add charge, and there's a formula somewhere for it so you don't have to measure subcool/superheat to figure it out

[safe trench]

so i finally tocuh (g word)?

and get a (j word)?

[languid gulch]

wasn't the client that broke, part of the way the players are supposed to "pack up" for the transfer wasn't working, so they cancelled it after trying for an extra hour

[feral drift]

Did they atleast have a backup ? :D

Or were they real men

[visual tree]

Got a design from an adviser how solar panel installation would look like on my house

14 Trina solar 450w panels, 14 optimizers and either Huawei or Solar Edge inverter

[night girder]

RIP mainstage Tomorrowland.

Started like that.

[visual tree]

We had the largest paid concert in the world 2 weeks ago and it's a miracle nothing happened

Even if someone gave me a free ticket, I would not want to be in a crowd of 500.000 people....

[night girder]

Festival opens in 2 days. Nobody got hurt. But no mainstage.

[mental oriole]

From what I read it was during testing of fireworks display. But idk didnt really read into it.

As long nobody got hurt, material damage can always be fixed (probaly not in time for the festival). Still sad for those affected either way.

[night girder]

I don't know either. Last I read was that opened an investigation for involuntary arson.

[night girder]

Eh ... wait. Let me see if I can get better picture.

Look at those stacks. That's a lot of money.

You totally right. But this can be a financial setback for the organisation.

[mental oriole]

True.

[night girder]

Not sure if insurance covers all this damage.

[mental oriole]

No idea. Insurances are complicated.

So guess wait and see.

[visual tree]

Insurance companies will always put fine print somewhere and screw you over

Don't really like them....

[night girder]

and they like to drag it out if possible. (years?)

[visual tree]

People think you just need to read a contract but it's not that simple

Because they will put a fine print in footnote which says to check document B

And on the document B there is a fine print which tells you to check document C and so on

Basically, you would need to study contract and terms for a week in order to find hidden tricks

[night girder]

Yeah, we call them lawyers 😄

don't see citizens do it, but maybe organisations behind a festival?

[visual tree]

We got ChatGPT now but I would not recommend it for legal affairs unless you want to end up in more trouble lol

Even law firms started using ChatGPT but it didn't go as expected

[night girder]

I saw someone, using a AI lawyer video in court.

[visual tree]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/MkmfZPt-gaw

[night girder]

Yup.

Got shut down quick.

[visual tree]

I watched that video like 20 times by now. Can't get it over it lol

[night girder]

It was his own AI company or something?

yeah, the video has layers to it 🤣

[visual tree]

Yeah, I think he tried to test his "AI" product in court

[night girder]

or hoped to use court as a platform to launch his company.

I think the judge mentions that.

[visual tree]

Something like that

[night girder]

and at the same time. Get out of jail card.

[visual tree]

The AI lawyer introducing himself is so cringe 🤣

Not to mention I haven't seen a lawyer that happy in court

[night girder]

"... before 5 distinguished judges" 🤣

So what did the AI learn? To ass kiss the judges.

And the best part. Is that sneeze at the end.

"Shut that off!" - other judge sneezing at exact time

[visual tree]

I suppose that video will eventually become more popular than the lawyer who didn't know how to turn off cat filter in a zoom call

[night girder]

cat filter was pretty funny too. But innocent.

[high ivy]

Finished my pc build

https://youtube.com/shorts/S84ssdszeCE?feature=share

[pure karma]

That one is a classic

[soft bloom]

https://youtu.be/KiFYcuoK490
hmmm, interesting.
reminds me of something...

[languid gulch]

i think i may have sharpened my knife too much

i use it to clean my mouse along with a brush, but now it can fairly easily slice the plastic off

[verbal raft]

WTF https://www.tomshardware.com/video-games/pc-gaming/intel-releases-new-tool-to-measure-gaming-image-quality-in-real-time-ai-tool-measures-impact-of-upscalers-frame-gen-others-computer-graphics-video-quality-metric-now-available-on-github

VMAF for upscalers ?

[mental oriole]

but why... just optimize your game...

[languid gulch]

just completed my first deep clean on this mouse

i think it might be 10g lighter

[night girder]

lately, my mouse weights too lightly.

I think I am losing parts 🤣

[languid gulch]

i just wanna know how all that crap sneaks in

[night girder]

your hands.

[languid gulch]

ioh i know that

but with all the sealing around it

[twin dew]

Brain not Braining today...

Very annoying.

[faint turret]

Looking for opinions:
Is 250€ a good price to get a used (<1 year, perfect condition) Asus rig strix rtx 2070?

[feral drift]

If it was a Formula 1 racer, that would equal to about 0.01 second quicker per lap.. Which is huge :D

[dire igloo]

Why that one specifically?
And why used if you want perfect condition?
And what country are we talking about?

[twin dew]

And weird for it to be less than 1 year old, when the production almost certainly stopped 3-4 years ago.

[feral drift]

If its been sitting on the shelve on a small local hardware store or something

[feral drift]

Are you expecting just to game on 1080p ?

If so, then Its pretty much as good as a new GPU in the same price range

[dire igloo]

I'm wondering if that'd make it better or worse

cuz not using the GPU means no thermal cycling on the paste, power delivery circuitry running empty, etc

[feral drift]

Imho its not something I've experienced - my kids PC runs on 15-20 year old GPUs who can just put in a ESD-back and stores on a shelve in my office room.

And they have been running for some years now :)

Given they don't play AAA games either - so the GPU ain't pushed

[night girder]

Nitan? Do you do phone repairs as a job? (curious)

[thin trout]

When it comes to high end graphics, "optimise" basically means: delete 80% of the processing time so that it runs as well without temporal solutions

spending 5x as long on each frame and temporally scaling + motion smoothing looks way better than spending 1/5'th as long on each frame because you're only rendering up to Low settings.

in a world with DLSS4 and MFG, every game that doesn't have them looks and/or performs awfully by comparison.

it is basically black magic doing 1080p120 > 4k480

[jagged snow]

This is not a "CarPlay ultra is good" situation, it's a "too much software ruins cars and makes them more expensive and less intuitive"

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2025/07/everything-we-learned-from-a-week-with-apple-carplay-ultra/

[karmic socket]

Hi everyone, I got a problem with my pc, anyone willing to help ?

PC Specs :
Mobo/CPU : Asus ROG Strix Z790-F Gaming Wifi (firmware from 08/24) & i7-13700K (about 2 y/o)
PSU : Seasonic Vertex PX-1000 (6 m/o)
GPU : Sapphire Pulse RX 7900 XT (1 y/o)

I was playing a small game (Terratech Legion demo) yesterday evening and my PC insta shut-down. No smell of burnt plastic or loud pop of cap dying. I wasn't able to reboot the PC at all (no fan spin, no RAM stick RGB, no RGB on mobo). Nothing. Went to bed thinking my CPU and/or mobo died.

This morning I tried turning my PC on. To my surprise, it did light up but was stuck at POST. White Q-LED was lit, meaning VGA problem according to the manual. I cleared CMOS and retried, same issue.

Since I kept my old GPU (Sapphire Nitro RX Vega 64), I decided to plug it in and it worked. I did a quick check of everything : SSDs seem healthy, cinebench OK, furmark at 1080p OK.

Shutdown. Plugged my 7900XT back, stuck at post, white Q-LED. I tried swapping PSUs, I even went as far as degrading the link speed in the BIOS (went gen 4, 3, 2), didn't work.

So I'm like "OK, GPU is dead, about a year old, it sucks."

Now here's the fun part. Don't ask me why I did it, but just to be sure the GPU was dead, I plugged it an old mobo/cpu I had lying around. It's an old Asus B85-PRO with an i5-4570 or something old like that. It didn't boot because it didn't have a boot device, but it posted and I was able to see the BIOS menu.

So now I don't know if it's the GPU or the mobo that dead ? Any tips ?

[pure karma]

try another pcie slot if there is one other than that idk

[twin dew]

Or just the CPU.
Had you updated to the late fixed BIOS versions?

[pure karma]

cpu wouldent die instantly

[twin dew]

It isn't completely dead, but degradation could cause weird issues even with PCIe bus.

[karmic socket]

hmmm, can't trie other pic-e because the card is 3-slotter

[twin dew]

This fuckup:

Three things Intel fucked up (first by not limiting what MB makers were doing like AMD is):
MBs undervolting CPUs by default (straight up unstable CPUs without damage at stock).
eTVB activating when it shouldn't have (damage).
CPU making too high VID requests (damage).

Mostly fixed on the BIOSes with that 0x129 microcode at stock.
And BIOSes with microcode 0x12B to fix last cases of that third point.
But any already accumulated damage is permanent, and will continue to degrade at faster rate than normal would have been.
With Intel seems now trying to bandaid the CPUs with permanent damaga over the warranty windows with new microcode 0x12F?
https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/Microcode-0x129-Update-for-Intel-Core-13th-and-14th-Gen-Desktop/td-p/1622129
https://community.intel.com/t5/Blogs/Tech-Innovation/Client/Intel-Core-13th-and-14th-Gen-Desktop-Instability-Root-Cause/post/1633239
https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/Intel-Core-13th-and-14th-Gen-Vmin-Shift-Instabilty-Update-New/m-p/1686948

Affecting 13th and 14th gen Intel CPUs.

[karmic socket]

while I understand the cpu might remotely f' me up, that wouldn't explain why my old gfx is running ? guess I'll try flashing to the latest bios, even tho it's probably too late 😦

[twin dew]

Intel had to extend all warranties by 2 years.

If related to that.

That another GPU works on that MB and CPU, and that that GPU works in another machine makes this something weird.
And it being older 13700K makes it more likely to be somehow then related to those fuckups, even when not the normal way.

[night girder]

Wtf is this?

[pure karma]

honestly this screams motherboard or drivers to me

[night girder]

Carplay barely works. Now they have ultra?

[twin dew]

Cannot be drivers at that point.

[pure karma]

cause gpu blackouts for me is the nvidia drivers

[twin dew]

And MB is just passing lanes between GPU and CPU.

Only with redrivers in some cases, otherwise just plain copper lanes.

[karmic socket]

so I guess I should change mobo and CPU ?

[twin dew]

Just getting RMA replacement CPU might help, if related to those 13th gen issues with older microcodes.

[pure karma]

although i wouldent be against the theory that degredation could be afecting the lanes cause i get multiple gpu errors per second in event viewer when my gpu starts having a meltdown

when load drops errors start piling up

and then the system either hangs or lives

[twin dew]

Would depend on the errors, if they are WHEA reports about PCIe bus errors, then yes.

[feral drift]

I dont no.

I work in automation field, programming logic controllers, assembling control cabinets, draw the electrical schemes for control cabinets, and commissions the machines we build :)

[pure karma]

driver errors so maybe not but they still exist and updating the drivers only ever seems to delay there return

[night girder]

Ah, my bad sorry.

[twin dew]

And no idea if Intel usually has that PCIe error report support on or off, not even sure what AMD default is, just that on AM4 and AM5 you can configure that if you want to.

[pure karma]

i think i have an option for it but its an old option for motherboards that can still beep

[twin dew]

PCIe AER

[glossy glacier]

I hate windows update.
Why can't it just install the update as quick as possible

[feral drift]

Would assume they're doing rolling updates - to not replicate the Crowdstrike effect

[night girder]

apple updates aren't much better.

[glossy glacier]

Yeah phased rollout is a thing but I mean the speed of installation once it is available
Sitting here like 20min for 2% progress

Meanwhile the install process is basically idleing with no resource usage

[night girder]

progress is kinda bullshit, in the sense, it's a guess/estimation.

[feral drift]

Ahh in that capacity yeah..

Not sure if its a good idea to do some torrent kinda system, so whenever say a larger corp who can handle the traffic has downloaded the update, they will seed it allowing more and more users to get it done quicker..

[glossy glacier]

You mean a WSUS? Still only the download part, not the actual installation

[night girder]

Apple will say update takes 10 minutes to install, it will say this for an hour. Then the 10 minutes jump to 1 minute, to restarting your laptop now in second 🤣

I guess it's backing up the files before updating for rollback.

[feral drift]

Yeah was about to mention my bad, didn't read it properly..

Must say usually its not something I have issue with, but I'm also the type of person who just lets windows update when I go to bed..

Only issue I got with that is when i click the freaking "Update and Shutdown" then I wakeup to the PC at the login screen because no fucking reason..

[night girder]

Oh, it restarts the system after update.

I had it happen once too.

[glossy glacier]

Yeah, update and shutdown works like one in ten times
maybe

[pure karma]

update and shutdown? more liek update and turn on

[night girder]

I found out that if you update and then hold the power button for 10 seconds, it does shutdown properly.

[glossy glacier]

Its just, the installation is stuck at the same percentage for like 10min and the process shows no disk and barley and CPU usage.
So wtf are you doing you dumb process?!

[night girder]

Just be patient.

Trust. The system.

[glossy glacier]

I have like two more servers to install, hurry up

[feral drift]

But imho - if its stuck 20min for 2% - either its terabyte of update - Or it sounds like your disk is running super slow (i.e. HDD) or its close to being full..

[night girder]

Nah, it doesn't mean anything afaik.

2%, like I said, means not much.

if I have 100 tasks, and every tasks is 1%, but the first 99% tasks are just calculating something simple, then the user will see 99% after few seconds. Now if the last task takes an hour to complete. User will see 99% for about an hour.

It really depends on how it's implemented. But the fact that I see updates jump from "1 hour to 1 minute" out of the blue, for years. Makes me pretty sure it's all just a bit of magic.

[glossy glacier]

I hate it the most when it gets stuck at 100℅

[feral drift]

Now is a good time to introduce the Unattended Installation of Windows it seems :D

So once u got 1 server running, make a new ISO and use that to install the other 2 servers - seems like you'd save a ton of time with that :)

[night girder]

Also, if the update needs to constantly have a feedback loop for progress, that sounds a waste of resources. And another thing that can break/bug out during updating.

[glossy glacier]

While true, making an image in this case would take longer
And the next time there are new updates in the meantime

For client deployments we use it. 1-2 serves at a time, nah

[feral drift]

I'm assuming you can't work with them at the same time - so they all can sit and enjoy the installation of the update simultanious

[mental oriole]

meanwhile 5 min and my linux is fully up to date.

[glossy glacier]

Indeed

[tough owl]

unless you know someone whos crazy and runs gento

[quick estuary]

yo guys do yall think the ASUS Prime GeForce RTX 5060 Ti OC is good?

16 gb

[twin dew]

There are currently no stable drivers for any 5000-series Nvidia cards.

[pure karma]

none of 50 series is good

[quick estuary]

ok so youd rather get a 4090 than a 5090?

[twin dew]

All the Nvidia drivers from last 6 months are broken in one way or another.

[pure karma]

yes cause one works and one dosent

[quick estuary]

they do work tho

[tough owl]

not well

[jagged snow]

I'd get neither unless you are spending money for the fun of it

[twin dew]

Probably meant 4060/4070 in some variant if the original plan was 5060 TI.

[quick estuary]

no

i said it because he said the 40 series were better

[pure karma]

i said 40 series works unlike 50 series

so its a free win

[jagged snow]

If you want your GPU to work reliably, then yes, 4090

Although iirc the studio drivers are good for 50 series

[twin dew]

Currently 4000-series is reliably useful without problems on older drivers.
On current drivers both 4000 and 5000 series are crapshoot, and 5000-series cannot use the older drivers.

For some of the issues, using new studio drivers works.

[jagged snow]

Imagine your certified drivers not working

[quick estuary]

id still rather get a 5060 ti than a 3060 or something else tho

[twin dew]

Don't know if they help with everything on gaming side or not.

[jagged snow]

If you're buying a 50 or 60 class card I'd not go nvidia at all

[twin dew]

Unless CUDA is a must.

[sharp matrix]

Imagine thinking Nvidia drivers are good anymore

[quick estuary]

i tried amd and i dont like it and intel too

maybe intel is good

but id still rather a 5060 ti

[jagged snow]

I don't think cuda is ever a "must" at that price point IMO
And if it is, buy used

[sharp matrix]

I would just skip Nvidias disasters at this point

[jagged snow]

Get something with more than the absolutely anemic 2k cuda count on that card

[pure karma]

at that range get a B580

for half the price

[jagged snow]

why don't you like amd?

[sharp matrix]

I still have a vega56, that was a interesting gpu

[quick estuary]

i bought one and it lagged when i used more stuff at once i did try most of the stuff and it was better from my previous nvidia card but with like videos and stuff it lagged so i refunded it. the cards are not bad tho

[twin dew]

Did you just switch it in to same computer with same Windows without DDU run to clear older cards drivers?

[jagged snow]

Wow that's
So interesting

[pure karma]

thats what happens when you dont lock framerates

[quick estuary]

i did clear the drivers

[pure karma]

thats a skill issue not so much a gpu issue

[twin dew]

Ok, weird...

[jagged snow]

Might not have even had hw accel on

[sharp matrix]

Too bad Nvidia has a skill issue not releasing drivers that aren't garbage

[jagged snow]

Or was trying to decode at high res with demanding game running

[twin dew]

I haven't had any issues with RX580 or RX6600 to watch multiple Youtube videos and play at same time...

[sharp matrix]

I find it amazing that a 4 trillion dollar company still can't get its drivers right, guess money can't buy skill after all

[quick estuary]

trillion?

what you on about?

[twin dew]

I said in another place that the exec level might have fallen for their own hype and forced driver teams to start using more AI code generation...

[twin dew]

Nvidias current market cap.

[quick estuary]

4 trillion?

[twin dew]

The theoretical valuation of all current shares, if they were valued at what last shares were traded.

[twin dew]

Yes, 4.22 trillion USD on short scale.

Right now.

[quick estuary]

so like 4000 billions

[twin dew]

Yes.

[jagged snow]

They don't care about gaming drivers because the entire gaming segment is chump change. They've poached every engineer they can from every division for datacenter ai

[pure karma]

money cant buy decency

[quick estuary]

and whats wrong with the drivers?

[pure karma]

everything

[quick estuary]

so

[sharp matrix]

I know, I still find it interesting regardless though, but yes it is as you say

[quick estuary]

what do you mean with

[twin dew]

Crashing in various games, depending on driver version, up to BSODs etc.
Various graphical issues.

[jagged snow]

Yep
It still sucked

[jagged snow]

Performance inconsistencies and general unreliability as well

[twin dew]

Whatever Nvidia added to do DLSS4 injection into older DLSS games has been causing various messes, even when not active for the game.
As another point.

[feral drift]

Nvidia most likely outsourced the drivers coding team to a bunch of Vibe coders..

[pure karma]

i had to update to the latest driver cause whatever one i was on before either got sabotaged or corrupted

but yea the drivers of recent times are a mess

[sharp matrix]

What you dont enjoy Nvidia drivers, but they are so bad how couldn't you

[quick estuary]

man idrc of drivers even if they are not good it will still be better than the one i have rn with fps

[feral drift]

I mean its bad if MagicZ is recommending against it :)

[jagged snow]

Then why not go amd at that point?

[quick estuary]

bro i already told why

[pure karma]

cause i had to deal with this shit sunday

[twin dew]

Because you had issues years in past?

[pure karma]

and now i dont want to

[jagged snow]

"idk if it's glitchy, I just want fps but I won't go amd because it was glitchy"
What a clown

[twin dew]

What card did you try?

[sharp matrix]

If you have 40 series gpu thankfully you can use 566.36, those are at least stable

[quick estuary]

what? ok so i dont know what you do and what amd card you tried but for what i do i dont like it. they are good but id rather stay nvidia. how old are you

[twin dew]

Because AMD for example had major issues with RX5000-series, both drivers, that is now mostly fixed, but also possibly some HW level issues that aren't there on later cards.

[sharp matrix]

Bad thing about 50 series you can only use newer drivers, so that advise doesnt apply unfortunately

[pure karma]

unfortunately you cant... or atleast i cant they arent stable for me anymore

[jagged snow]

I'm just saying that your reasoning is logically inconsistent

[sharp matrix]

What👀

[twin dew]

So if you got and tried RX5000 series card when they were new, your experience might have been the norm.
But that doesn't make it be true for current cards.

[twin dew]

MagicZs computer is fucked in multiple ways on HW level.

[pure karma]

thats what i did originally and the errors kept happening so i had to go to the lastest drivers

which seems to have now fixed it

[quick estuary]

im also no engineer i just tried it dont liked it refunded it done. and also because i was supposed to get a better one thats why i refunded it

[karmic socket]

somebody kill me

with soft plushies

[jagged snow]

I'm laughing because you returned an amd card for being glitchy and just said you don't care if your new nvidia one is glitchy

I really don't understand it

[quick estuary]

no?

[karmic socket]

So I upgraded my mobo firmware, it almost bricked my pc, but I'm back on integrated graphics (thank god I didn't skimp on those 20€). My old GPU isn't working well, its detected as Gen3-x4-laner.
Any mobo/cpu combo similar to what I had (Z790-F ; i7-13700K) that you'd recommend?

[quick estuary]

that amd card just wasnt like i expected and i refunded it

and i was also supposed to get a 3060 but then there were some problems

[twin dew]

And I asked what AMD card you did test that time?

[sharp matrix]

And you have a 40 series gpu?

[pure karma]

yea 4070TI

[sharp matrix]

Interesting 566.36 should be stable with it

[pure karma]

tbh i dont care what driver im using as long as it works 🤷‍♂️ 😅

[twin dew]

Like I said, HW level problems.

[pure karma]

yea idk but my cpu dosent run anymore on intel defaults so i think the end is near

it had a good run

[twin dew]

And you cannot be bothered to go through CPU RMA?

[feral drift]

Can see through reddit that 576.88 (Newest release from 1st July 2025) still causes Crash to desktop on ect. UE5 games

Seems the latest "stable" version is 576.80

[sharp matrix]

Hmmm sounds like something is wrong with your pc, maybe raptor lake instability

[pure karma]

after 3 years? nahhh its not really worth it at this point

[twin dew]

Free new CPU isn't worth it?

[pure karma]

do i have to return the old one?

[twin dew]

Yes.

[sharp matrix]

Honestly if your cpu is damaged because of raptor lake instability rma is your only option

[pure karma]

then no im not doing it cause its not worth it

[twin dew]

So you rather have dead system, than be without it for few weeks?

[pure karma]

it works fine as long as im not on intel defaults so its pissing me off because its actively wanting to die

[sharp matrix]

Up to you, but if you have a damaged cpu all bets are off unfortunately

[twin dew]

He likes to complain constantly, but is never actually willing to take advice.

[pure karma]

honestly i could probably bump the voltage and it would run but thats the entire origin of the problem so whats the point by then

[sharp matrix]

You do realize that means it isnt working fine right, because it should be working fine on defaults, the best your doing is putting the cpu on life support now

[twin dew]

The point is to get new replacement CPU from warranty replacement?

While the warranty is still there to be used.

[pure karma]

isent the warranty 2 years?

[twin dew]

Intel extended them by 2.

[pure karma]

0+2=2

[twin dew]

For 13th and 14th gen.

[pure karma]

its been longer than 2

[karmic socket]

aynone would happend to know why a gpu would go from gen3x16 to gen3x4 ?

[twin dew]

No, the stock warranty is 3 years.

So 5 years with the 2 year extension.

[sharp matrix]

Yes and definitely do not increase the voltage, very bad idea, would not recommend

[twin dew]

Either physical MB or card damage, or electrical damage in the CPU or GPU ends.

If it works x16 in the other computer, then that limits to the slot and CPU.
And slot damage can be checked visually.

[jagged snow]

(Or a bios issue/bug)

[pure karma]

yea but its like a whole 0.2V bellow spec so like both are bad

[jagged snow]

(Or you populated a port that shares lanes with that slot)

[karmic socket]

no device added. but thanks. how long does intel RMA process take?

[twin dew]

Depends on country as start.
If you do the replacement with store you bought the CPU from, or with Intel direct (4 weeks?).
Where that Intel direct is the model in US, store in EU, don't know about rest.

And might be faster now than at the peak.

[karmic socket]

store doesn't do replacement, they sell oem version of cpus

[twin dew]

And Intel might not replace OEM CPU either when sold at retail.

[sharp matrix]

Intel screwed up on their original specs and overvolted their own cpus, which lead to cpu become permanently damaged, so I wouldnt trust the previous specs....

[twin dew]

Buying such grey market stuff is often very stupid, as the price reduction isn't high enough.

[karmic socket]

T_T

[twin dew]

And Magic seems to be just comparing the absolute max on highest end CPUs to the normal all-core for the model he has.

Intel tray CPUs are for OEMs and any in retail channel are grey market, basically without warranty if the store doesn't provide one.

And Intel only provides warranty with lesser time limit to whoever bought the whole tray.

[karmic socket]

hmmm, I might have had my words mixed up. By OEM, I mean shipped in a box, just no rad/fan attached.

[twin dew]

Yeah, that is retail packaging.

[karmic socket]

oh so its not oem then

[pure karma]

because it can actually hit spec when not handicapped?

[twin dew]

With that 3(+2) year warranty from Intel.

[pure karma]

why else would i be comparing

[karmic socket]

I guess I'll try the store then Intel if it fails.

[twin dew]

No, Intel OEM CPUs come in trays of 1000.

With no packaging.

[karmic socket]

that's a lot of cpus 😮

[twin dew]

And some places buy a tray, and then sell the CPUs in retail individually.

If it came in Intel packaging, with or without a cooler, depending on CPU model, then it was retail packaged.

3th gen Intel CPU tray stack:

[pure karma]

well mine is packaged atleast

[karmic socket]

that being said, should I really RMA, I mean, even with update firmware, its gonna degrade and go poof eventually right?

[cloud estuary]

"3th gen"

Thirth

[twin dew]

As pic example where there was lot of trays on top of each other.

The current tray is different, but the concept is same.

Most pics I found only showed one tray.

[twin dew]

If run significant time with the older microcodes, or if having problems related already, yes.
Any already happened degradation will just accelerate, even with fixed microcodes.

[cloud estuary]

Hey that's cool and all, but what about 1th gen and 2th gen

and 4nd gen, and 5nd gen

[karmic socket]

you forgot 11rd gen 😋

[cloud estuary]

there you go

[twin dew]

Ah, sorry.

[cloud estuary]

no harm at all dude, you're not wrong, just a funny little oversight lol

[twin dew]

Brain fart when typing quickly and my brain isn't braining today in general.

[karmic socket]

a'ight. if I were to choose to not RMA and instead buy something equivalent mobo/cpu-wise, what would you recommend (I don't care about brands per se) ?

[pure karma]

i mean AM5 obviously since theres no other option

[twin dew]

AMD 9800X3D or 7800X3D cannot really currently be beat in gaming.
With any AM5 MB basically, 600 vs 800 series "chipset" doesn't matter, only the exact MB model having features you want.

Or just new CPU to the same MB, if the MB isn't damaged.

[sharp matrix]

Yeah AM5 would be my recommendation, Intel is a hot mess, but we'll see what happens with nova lake

[twin dew]

B650(E), X670(E), B850 and X870(E) use exact same chipset chips, no technical difference beside the exact connectivity, just branding thing.

A620 and B840 are different, but work fine if the lower connectivity and PCIe bus gen doesn't matter.

[pure karma]

the 9800X3D is so expensive tho its like a over 1000$ swap

[karmic socket]

ok, I heard (a while ago) that "AMD" had troubles going at 6400 when OCing DDR5, is it still the case ?

[twin dew]

540e in Finland for the CPU.
Then starting from around 120e for ok quality MB.

[twin dew]

About 50% of the CPU IMCs can keep up with that at 1:1.
About 90% can do 6200MT/s.
And 99+% can do 6000MT/s.

With 1:2 they can all go higher, but then you need to get to 7200+MT/s for it to make sense.

[karmic socket]

and that 50% is a coin toss or something you can look for with P/N or S/N ?

[twin dew]

Just silicon lottery.

[karmic socket]

ugh

[twin dew]

Intel is much worse, as their IMC quality is much more varied and they don't bin for it at all.

On 13th and 14th gen.
Where the spec with 2 slots in 4-slot MB is just 4400MT/s.

Where as AMD spec is 5200 for 7000-series and 5600MT/s for 9000.

Intel just markets the spec for 2 slots used on 2 slot MB number with "Up To"

[karmic socket]

ok, then can a 6400 kit turn into 6200 kit easy?

this was my first time buying OCable memory

[twin dew]

Yes, you enable XMP, then lower the frequency.
And then you can change the latencies by simple calculation if you want to do that too.

[karmic socket]

ok, so I just avoid the auto-setup from the bios

[twin dew]

Because those numbers are just clock cycles.
Where the absolute time is what matters.

[twin dew]

No board auto-enables XMP.
And just runs on JEDEC speeds and timings if not manually set to be used.

Often 4800MT/s in case of DDR5.

Basically you enable that XMP, then lower the RAM frequency.

If it isn't stable at straight XMP.

And many RAM sticks already contain two XMP profiles with different clockspeeds.

[karmic socket]

a'ight, thanks a lot for the tips! I'm gonna try and find an old sata ssd and install win10 on it, so I can use GPU-Z and check the GPU lane count

[twin dew]

And for the latencies:
You just take the number, divide by original frequency, multiply by new frequency and round.
So CL34 6400MT/s comes CL32 6000MT/s for example.
Because the timings are in clock cycles, and the RAM actually cares about absolute time.

And just enabling XMP and lowering one or two RAM speed bins is so close to also changing the timings that might not be worth it to do that, especially with X3D CPU.

If unstable at the RAM spec speed.

Basically do install with XMP off, then confirm the system is stable like that.
Then enable XMP and see if still stable, if not, lower RAM frequency by one setting, test again etc.

And Satisfactory is very good tester for that as example, so just playing works.

[jagged snow]

I'm currently at a research conference and I'm shocked how many times I've seen blockchain come up

[faint turret]

I'm reading that as "that GPU is worth buying only at half price or less", is that right?
(Sorry for late answer, the notification didn't reach me)

[thin trout]

There are default-on power saving states which reduce pci-e BW

[thin trout]

Yeah XMP/EXPO is big suck

where memory scaling exists, you get about 2.5x the benefit from custom timings that you get from XMP

[karmic socket]

Yeah it would wake up and update when rendering stuff, which gpu-z does as well

And also, it never did that before today, so highly unlikely.

[feral drift]

Well in my opinion its not a terrible GPU..

It support DX12 and is fine for 1080p gaming

[glossy glacier]

That's still relevant? Obviously everyone moved on to ai

[faint turret]

Do you think a "not terrible" GPU for 250€ is a good deal, when used? 🤔
I just don't have a good grasp on the market prices and online prices are all over the place 😅

[night girder]

Wasn't there rumors GTA 6 wants Crypto/Blockchain?

Or was it NFT's 🤔

[feral drift]

I'm not super with searching EU market - but I'm assuming you got access to like Amazon..

And there I can find in similar price range a AMD RX 7600 8GB (XFX) and RTX 4060 8GB (PNY)

They're giving slightly higher performance, as within 10% more than the RTX 2070 - And there I would take into consideration that Asus is probably better build than PNY and XFX in terms of cooling ect.

[verbal raft]

can you stretch up to 350 ? if yes, just buy a 9060 XT 16GB if no, try looking for a B580 instead
cuz the 2070 is an 8GB card, and spending just 100$ more now could save you lots of money in the future

even a 3060 would be better IMO, just cuz of the VRAM

[faint turret]

Thank you, I really appreciate your analisis <3

[faint turret]

Nah, 250 is about the max I could spend atm. I was trying to judge wether this was an occasion worth taking or not (I'm thinking not) to bring my Desktop back to life (lacking GPU)

[dire igloo]

What's the rest of the hardware inside it and what country are you in?

[feral drift]

Curious question regarding iPhone (assuming any phone could experience this)

My daughter has left her Phone outside in the sun, and meanwhile the battery is drained.

I've let the phone cool down, and put in charger about 30 minutes ago - now the phone is boiling hot, as in I could easily cook an egg on it..

The phone wont gain any battery charge, so I'm currently assuming that the heat from the sun has damaged the phone - but I ain't got experience here.

[night girder]

No experience with that scenario. But charging my iPhones can make the battery very hot.

[feral drift]

Yeah however this is about 10-20 degree above what it would be normally

[night girder]

The fact it's not getting battery charge is interesting. So it's trying to charge it seems.

Just not holding charge?

My suggestion; stop touching it.

[feral drift]

show the low battery logo

[night girder]

And go to shop to maybe replace battery.

[charred relic]

Should never ever get cook an egg hot

[night girder]

If it's damage, charging it, or trying to turn on phone can further damage to point it's not salvageable.

[charred relic]

Not from charging it heh

I'd start watching for swelling...lol

[feral drift]

Yeah just tried plugging it into a PC USB Port (Minimize the amp output) it still cooks like within 20-30 seconds

[charred relic]

If you start to see any deformity in the case get rid of it somewhere it can't start a fire.

[night girder]

Or if you can replace battery yourself 🙂

[charred relic]

It'll get pretty hot but not THAT hot

[feral drift]

I mean i sorta how the temperature normally - and you can still touch it.. I'm sorta getting burn marks from holding it

[charred relic]

Sounds to me like it's ont eh verge of getting sent into thermal runaway, you don't want that...

[night girder]

Eh, I had that happen with my iPhone 🤣

It got so hot I couldn't touch it or put it in my pocket. But mostly when fully drained battery that happened.

[charred relic]

It sucks in more power when it's low

cells take a charge a lot faster at 30% than 80%

[feral drift]

Well I mean the phone did spend the entire noon and afternoon uncovered directly in the sun.. the outside temp was about 30c in shade

[charred relic]

or.. are capable of rather

[night girder]

My friends always look at me weird when I see their phones in the sun and put it in shadow. This is the reason why.

[night girder]

Still sounds like damaged.

[charred relic]

yeah the sun directly on it tho...

it could be lower tempt han that and still cook something

[night girder]

Did it connect to your PC? Did it show up as device?

[charred relic]

I was worried about mine one day after leaving it out much hotter than that in the sun

How old is the phone?

ouch i just checked the estimate on mine... health 91% lol

Guess this thing is getting some age...

[feral drift]

Think its the Iphone SE (2020) model

[night girder]

Mhm.

[charred relic]

That cell is gonna be weak

More likely to get damaged... and won't be holding a charge like it used to anyhow for sure

[feral drift]

It doesn't but the phone wont turn on either

[charred relic]

If you have apple care and it reads under 80% health it qualifies for a battery...

[night girder]

You know how hot it is more or less? Because you said 10-20 degrees celcius more than normal, so I assume you are measuring it?

[charred relic]

edumahkated guesstimations

[feral drift]

no just a feeling.. But i'd say around 60c

[charred relic]

I could plug mine in and measure it

[feral drift]

140f for them muricans :D

[charred relic]

...if i can find my heat gun lol

I use it for so many things...

[night girder]

I can't find temperature for charging for that phone darn it.

[charred relic]

like cooking... dealing with vapor pressure densities

gotta keep the stomata happy 😄

[feral drift]

pretty sure the cell is collapsed

[night girder]

the apple forums; put it in the freezer 🤣

[feral drift]

Have had the same issue with my LIPO batteries for my RC cars

[night girder]

||don't do it plz.||

[charred relic]

That;'s how I feel about dead crap... I have a TV with a dead backlight I have to replace soon

[feral drift]

I'll take it to a hardware professional

[charred relic]

I'll pop this one open... because there's a chance I can fix it lol

[night girder]

I think that's your best bet.

You could try again tomorrow. Or buy a new phone.

But I would also go to profressional.

Or contact apple support if you really have the energy for that. But I think they will say the same.

[feral drift]

Its her 2nd phone in 3 years.. I dont think she will get a new one if this one is broken anytime soon

[charred relic]

apple will just want to sell you a new phone...

[night girder]

Yeah, I totally leave that part up to you 🤣

[charred relic]

That'll be their biggest angle... you need a new phone

[night girder]

Btw, the phone itself, it looks alright? Nothing bend/bulging at the back?

[feral drift]

Yeah nothing out of the ordniary

[charred relic]

I'm that guy that 'll be like "No I need a new phone when I decide I need a new phone. Now lets discuss repairs on my current phone shall we?"

[feral drift]

Its glass on all sides though - so probably harder to budge

[charred relic]

Don't worry if the cell is going wonky it won't care 😄

[feral drift]

Yeah - but i do when it starts shooting flames :D

[charred relic]

Go make it spit fire 😄

lithium cells are super fun when they are in thermal runaway

[night girder]

Lithium ion batteries hate heat above 50-60°C. If your battery reached way more than 60°C it is probable that the battery has lost a bit of capacity and has gained some internal resistance.

Found this on reddit. If it gained internal resistance, that would explain why it's still getting hot while charging.

[charred relic]

Which means not only will it not charge as well it won't hold it as long

double whammy...

[feral drift]

found an old USB charger - which only gives 250mA.. The phone ain't going red hot over it

[charred relic]

That's what has made the Japanese made eneloop cells so good, super low internal resistance

they have a good shelf life fore rechargable cells

I'd love to take a crack at change an iphone cell

[willow pike]

mas.to/@gabrielesvelto/114813152373394985

If you have an Intel Raptor Lake system and you're in the northern hemisphere, chances are that your machine is crashing more often because of the summer heat. I know because I can literally see which EU countries have been affected by heat waves by looking at the locales of Firefox crash reports coming from Raptor Lake systems.

[charred relic]

How hard could it be...

[feral drift]

I did battery change on my old 5SE model..

I'd rather pay the $80 to let a "professional" do it..

[charred relic]

I wouldn't try an iphone unless it was dead and I was just gonna replace it... and it had no trade in value... and that never happens so

[night girder]

depends on what they ask yeah and what the damage is.

[feral drift]

Could be the board thats dead for sure

[charred relic]

Need to find one that's trashed for some reason, I really just want to see how bad it is to get inside one

[night girder]

How long was it outside in the sun for?

[feral drift]

5-6 hours when the sun was at its highest I'm assuming

So it has reached fairly high temps

[night girder]

That sucks 😕

[charred relic]

Heat bad

Hard disks really don't do well in the heat

crushes lifespans like nobodies business

[thin trout]

Stop doing that, it's extremely dangerous

like: will burn your house down and cause toxic chemical inhalation while it's doing it

[feral drift]

Its been off charger for a while now - and temp is back to "normal"

And keeping a keen eye that it doesn't show trace of bulging of battery.

But it'll be stored in a flammable prof package over night, just to be safe (bags for LIPO batteries)

[charred relic]

shapez 2 looks so much more fun than 1

Thinking about snagging it while it's on sale... just snag the supporter edition or something

or... the complete apparently has shapez 1 but no soundtrack... it says a lot that I'd rather have the soundtrack lol

[verbal raft]

Uhh, legal reasons ????
www.pcgamer.com/hardware/graphics-cards/optiscaler-has-been-updated-to-theoretically-support-amds-fsr-4-in-all-games-with-upscaling-that-dont-use-vulcan-or-anti-cheat-which-is-nice-but-why-the-heck-doesnt-amd-do-this/

[soft bloom]

they actually have launchpads as item transportation

[verbal raft]

Something tells me NVIDIA wouldn't let it slide if AMD started spoofing their GPUs and converting DLSS inputs into FSR 4

[cobalt ivy]

I don't care what you think.

[safe trench]

gl cleaning that

[soft bloom]

roses are red

[cobalt ivy]

I wasn't going to leave the rest of the tube empty. I paid for the whole tube; I use the whole tube.

[pure karma]

Thats not even that bad

[languid gulch]

not remotely

iirc linus put 12g right into the fucking socket and it ran just fine

[charred relic]

If you use the expensive shit you won't even want to do that lol

[languid gulch]

or liquid metal

[charred relic]

yeah

basically anything from thermal grizzly that isn't a sheet lol

They do make good stuff tho...

[languid gulch]

oh sorry, his total was 18g

[cobalt ivy]

I got that derbauer stuff. Well, I did before I squeezed it all over the ihs

[charred relic]

Think I used a tube of Notctua stuff on this build...

(but not the whole tube)

[cobalt ivy]

Wanna see the first half of the tube before I switched sockets?

[charred relic]

TV in here died... bad news is it was money I wasn't planning to spend on a TV. Good news is I'm gaining 5" and a step up in quality

This TV in here started as just the backlight being dead, could hear the clicking sounds if i tried to navigate menues and from the right angle barely make out a ghost image of part of the screen

now there is no indication it's powering on at all lol

Oh and the new one has a high VRR but it's far from perfect apparently, capable of up to 144 and had VRR. So it'll make a decent seconedary display for some games.

Also.. last time I shopped for a TV was several years back and man the tech has gotten better for less just in the last few years.

[unique pivot]

@cobalt ivy gonna continue convo of #design-and-architecture here.

Interesting choice going with the X670E PG lightning though

[languid gulch]

it's also gotten way worse with all the garbage preinstalled

[pure karma]

how old was that paste?

[charred relic]

Microcenter new...

I don't use old paste, some of it separates over time. Not good.

I don't buid often enough to not just buy a small tube when I build anyhows

also it doesn't have my choice of interface for sure but if it sucks I can just get a box from DirecTV or get a apple tv box... the apple box would pay for itslef in a year vs renting from direc

[languid gulch]

i did a triple pc swap and didn't have to repaste a single cpu

[charred relic]

and i don't care about the live tv in here soooo and can do that with an app... soooo

It's FireTV software which might have just been my last choice but it fit the price and quality whatever

I'd had def taken googles frontend over firetv... or even roku

It's a giant step up from the one it's replacing for sure. New one is QLED with local dimming zones

[feral drift]

Meh no phone explosion this night.. Guess its a good sign.. maybe :)

[faint turret]

Why are you asking that?

[twin dew]

To know if it makes any sense to try to get new GPU for it.
And because new and used HW markets depend lot on the country.

[dire igloo]

• CPU/RAM to know if it's worth spending 250€ on a GPU or if you'd run into performance limits
• MB to know its PCIe version which could lead to reduced performance (CPU too)
• PSU because it will have to be able to safely power your GPU
• country because the Irish tech market is fundamentally different from the Dutch market
• country also because used markets are very localized, so deals you'd see in Greece aren't usually worth buying if you're in Finland
• country also because importing from a neighboring country can sometimes be smarter - many Portuguese buy from Spanish Amazon for example

[dire igloo]

Btw, have you addressed these questions yet?

[dire igloo]

Another thing to note: many eastern European countries have access to good package forwarding services which allows them to buy from more saturated markets like the Netherlands or Germany

[twin dew]

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/firefox-dev-says-intel-raptor-lake-crashes-are-increasing-with-rising-temperatures-in-record-european-heat-wave-mozilla-staffs-tracking-overwhelmed-by-intel-crash-reports-team-disables-the-function

[languid gulch]

so are the higher temps exposing already existing instability?

[twin dew]

Just making it worse.
As expected.

Need more voltage for same frequency at higher silicon temperature.
And Intel doesn't do dynamic adjustment AFAIK based on that temperature, unlike AMD turbo tables.

Higher ambient temperature directly raises silicon temperature for same voltage etc.

[faint turret]

I know that my system can run it. I was just dubious about the price and how it compares to similar products to judge wether the chance I had was worth taking or not

[faint turret]

Don't cool your PC, just turn on the AC

[unique pivot]

Not on Intel but god I'm happy I went overkill on the cooling. PC be thanking me with these recent EU heatwaves

[dire igloo]

Generally: 250€ for an RTX 2070 is big yikes.
The 5700xt performs similarly in gaming while consistently going for <150€ used

[dire igloo]

And even if you know that you can run it, we don't.
That's why I asked - to have the info I need in order to give you good advice

[willow pike]

mas.to/@gabrielesvelto/114813852829259704

there have been microcode mitigations rather than fixes. From the distribution of microcode versions affected none really solve the problem, but it is less likely to happen on some of them. In particular microcode 0x12c had reduced the incidence of a number of bugs, but they've come back in full force when Intel released version 0x12f

seems new microcodes have not fixed it

our worst fears have come true

[twin dew]

Not for any CPU that has taken damage basically.
And that 0x12f is purely trying to make the CPUs last beyond the warranty.

[willow pike]

fundamentally broken arch

[sharp matrix]

Welp, its over....

[twin dew]

Basically even if the Intels microcode fixes worked, they would only protect NEW CPUs.
Not any that had already been damaged from running with the older versions, all of which would have shortened life to some degree.

And that 0x12f seems to be just trying to baby as many of the damaged CPUs past the warranty period as possible.

[thin trout]

All affected CPU's (and boards / systems in general, for non-DIY users) should have been recalled and replaced

(they weren't, but they should have been)

[twin dew]

Basically.
But instead Intel has done lot of work to keep the whole issue from getting to news, so people wouldn't know.

[willow pike]

if

i had no reason to believe what intel said 5 years ago, least of all now

at this point we are forced to conclude that they will never fix it to prevent errors even on brand new raptor lake

[thin trout]

best case scenario, everyone updates immediately, all of the CPU's sold in the span of around 2 years are replaced and then everybody is left with CPU's that will die in 5 years instead of 20

but they are really dragging it out and making it much worse than that

[willow pike]

people won't update cause people don't know, and intel are still rejecting warranties with the official advice being "Keep pestering our warranty team until they give in"

when the xbox 360 had the red ring of death flaw, Microsoft went out of their way to issue seamless and fast warranty replacements to anyone who asked

like I can't over emphasize how good their response was

intel are doing the opposite

[thin trout]

The amount of people in my communities like "hey WoW is popping up a thing saying my bios is wrong, wat do" is off the scale

and they have usually been running those cpu's for 2-4 years on the bios that it came with.

A lot of the time cpu is FUBAR before they even know

[twin dew]

Yeah, basically Intel is trying to minimize short term money loss, ignoring long term effects.

Money, sales, reputation in long term are ignored, just to not have to replace too many CPUs in short term.

[willow pike]

intel pinto

i still remember when some poor bastard who had saved and scrimped for his first ever gaming PC came here and said "I'm getting out of VRAM errors wat do"

it was mass F in chat

[sharp matrix]

Yep intel basically nuked their reputation with raptor lake, its going to be a long road to recovery....

[twin dew]

But as long as investors don't hear about it from major news source, everything is fine ™ 🤪

And they are doing much more for the large OEM customers etc.

[sharp matrix]

https://tenor.com/view/this-is-fine-gif-24177057

[willow pike]

even if nova lake is all that and a bag of chips, we cannot recommend them to anyone

but it would be very funny for a cpu named Nova to burn itself out

[sharp matrix]

of course not, intels engineer's have shown just how incompetent they are, one cannot recommend a product knowing it could very well be bad

i sure as hell am not recommending intel to anyone anymore

[willow pike]

intel keep saying they have too much management and they're trimming the fat with all these layoffs. okay then why are they firing so many engineers

[sharp matrix]

Because intel has no idea what they are doing apu

sure we can hope they are firing the engineers that had a hand in raptor lake instability, so the mistakes can never be repeated with future cpu, but this is intel im not holding out hope

Even their 18A looks to be doa, with them now switching to tsmc 2nm for the chips....so the future looks great for intel overall....

[maiden coyote]

We don't want those engineers going to amd, they should give them a raise.

[cobalt ivy]

It's not the best board. I didn't much research before buying. Lol

[cobalt ivy]

Not even 2 years. If it looks dry and cracked, it's not. I built a new rig with Intel just before I found out they had known for years that their 13th and 14th gen CPUs had defects. Only reason I switched "sides".

[thin trout]

The last Intel CPU that i bought was an 8700k; they knew about meltdown and spectre for a year beforehand, and did not mention to anyone that their new-to-come CPU's had massive security vulnerabilities which would make them unable to perform as reviewed

[unique pivot]

yeah... I was wondering cos you those mobo's go like
A620 < B650 < X670
and then Asrock has
PG Lightning < PG Riptide

so you went with the most expensive platform standard... and then the cheaper option from the same brand ^^'

[twin dew]

Only about the total connectivity.

If the cheaper board had all the necessary for him connectors etc. then it doesn't matter which "chipset" the board is.

[cobalt ivy]

I'm mostly pissed that my m.2 slots require screws on this one

[unique pivot]

I mean even between B650 and X670 I don't really find the price difference anywhere near worth it

though to be fair, the B650 PG Riptide has known-ish issue that it for some reason doesn't let the 7800x3D truely shine... or atleast it's M-ATX version did

[cobalt ivy]

It does have a fancy bios flash usb port. I can update the bios with the system shut off.

[unique pivot]

I think most mobo's come with that these days ^^'

[cobalt ivy]

Lmao. I know so little

[twin dew]

Was basically mandated by AMD for AM5.

[cobalt ivy]

I was on x99 in 2016 and thought I had more fan headers than anyone. Now I see only 4 pins for days

[unique pivot]

To be fair I'm not that in the loop on the 800 boards... last stuff I'm 100% in the loop of was 7000 series AMD GPU's, 4000 series NVidia GPU's and then AM5 and Intel 13/14th gen

mostly becos that was around the time I got my first "real adult" job, so ofcourse I first wanted a proper PC instead of a 1050 laptop... ^^'

[cobalt ivy]

RIP 1050 laptop

[twin dew]

Just branding exercise.
Still using same exact chip as 600-series AM5 boards.
Just different requirements for each "name", where X870 is B650E + USB4 and X870E is X670E + USB4.

[unique pivot]

oh lmao

TBF I don't have to upgrade my PC for a while, when I do I'll probably get the smallest M-ATX case I can get that I like ( currently ITX, but you mostly pay for the novelty while M-ATX tends to be the cheapest while being the same. just slightly bigger )

[cobalt ivy]

Well. My buddy is getting my 13600k and these basically-new puppies. He's so excited because with the money saved he ordered a new gpu, ram, and a cooler

[pure karma]

Cause yea it looks terible

Heck my like 5 year old paste looked in better condition than that

[cobalt ivy]

Explain

Most of it was on the other side. Maybe it peeled off funny. Idk. My temps were great.

[pure karma]

The fact that all the materials in the paste just separated essentially

Or atleast it looks that way

[cobalt ivy]

I think it just looks weird in the photo. I didn't notice anything off when cleaning the surfaces.

[pure karma]

ig maybe my standards are just too high

but yea mine did not look nearly as bad even after 5 years of fairly regular use

[faint turret]

That is exactly the kind of info I was looking for, thanks!

[twin dew]

And B850 is almost same as B650, just tiny bit difference in PCIe 5.0 requirements.

[jagged snow]

Ended up going with the cmf buds, quite impressed so far

Only area where I'd say they are anything short of excellent for the price point is fit

anc, sound quality, and battery life I'd say are all well above average

[tough owl]

do they not fit well?

[twin dew]

Didn't come with multiple thingies to adjust the fit?

Because ears are never one size fits all, usually 3-5 sizes of pads coming with any in-ears.

And some people need to use different sized in each ear.

[dire igloo]

You're welcome - I still can't help but feel that the advice was inadequate

You were way too specific in your initial question for this to be the appropriate answer - also, there are many factors for which the 2070 will outshine a 5700xt

[languid gulch]

dumb airflow question

single row higher flow fans on a rad, or push/pull lower flow

[dire igloo]

How is high/low flow determined?

The point of push pull is to keep the flow but increase static pressure

[languid gulch]

mm H20

i think

[dire igloo]

That's not flow, that's static pressure.
Flow is cfm (cubic feet per minute)

[languid gulch]

oh sorry

lemme find the specs for both

[dire igloo]

Don't bother, they're about as accurate as advertised monitor response times

[languid gulch]

lol

[dire igloo]

Also nigh impossible to compare across brands die to varying methodology

[languid gulch]

well, lemme check if GN has testing for them

it's mainly because the fans that came with the AIO don't have RGB, and i'm a bit worried that just doing a straight fan-for-fan replacement with definitely lower quality fans won't be enough

[dire igloo]

Well, what usecase are we talking about here, what's the AIO, what CPU are you cooling and what's the target temp?

And let's not forget: unless it's a super high power draw CPU, the point of an AIO is style, not performance.
So don't be too concerned

[dire igloo]

Oh yeah, and what's the fan replacement you're considering?

[languid gulch]

9800X3D, ryujin III 360 AIO with stock Noctua Industrial PPC-2000 PWM fans, have some leftover Thermalright "how much cheaper can they get before taking a loss" $13-for-3 RGB 120's

running the cpu in eco mode, not planning on OCing

[feral drift]

If the fans ain't got RGB - they should be switched..

We all know that RGB = more FPS :)

[languid gulch]

noticing 0 difference between limiting it to 90W vs letting it cook at 160W

[languid gulch]

i wouldn't care normally, but i have the spares, and the case has 7 other RGB fans in it

i put it under the "now that everything else is top end, cosmetics can be a thing"

[dire igloo]

You're fine

[languid gulch]

as in i'd be fine to swap them out?

[dire igloo]

TL-C12C-S aren't known for longevity, but they're fine to use

[languid gulch]

kk

[dire igloo]

Yeah, 9800X3D is nothing demanding, even at 160W

[languid gulch]

and yea, definitely bought them because of the price

[dire igloo]

Some of the best in that range

Thermalright SFDBv1 sux ass

[languid gulch]

they were gonna go in another system, but then i got this pc and things changed, so now i have 6x of them just sitting in a box with a controller

[feral drift]

I would do it - just because the Thermaltake is ~4dB lower acustic noice

I do prefer the silence from my fans :)

[languid gulch]

it's kinda bugged me since i got the pc that besides the gpu fans, they're the only ones that aren't RGB

[dire igloo]

What Thermaltake?
Also, what's the source for the dB number?

[feral drift]

Well was just looking at the specs from both the Noctua and the Thermaltake. (Given there is a good explanation for it being more quiet)

Noctua is specified to have 29,7dB @ 2000 RPM - pushing 121,8 CFM

Thermaltake is specified to have 25,6dB @ 1550 RPM - pushing 66,17 CFM

[dire igloo]

Thermalright. Not Thermaltake.

[feral drift]

Ahh sorry

[dire igloo]

Also: specs are meaningless, especially across manufacturers

[feral drift]

Getting late for me - just read it as Thermaltake lol

[dire igloo]

Also: more airflow at higher noise means jack squat.
You can spin the loud fan slower and it will move the same air - but it's unclear whether its noise actually reduces enough