off-topic-tech

[night girder]

So, measured from the corner of my house to another building, 25 meters (with few spare meters). Cat6 should be good.

[jagged snow]

Just get cat6a

[night girder]

Nah, expensive.

[jagged snow]

Not that bad?

[night girder]

1 euro +- for cat6 per METER

1.5 euro for cat6a per METER.

[jagged snow]

Holy cow

That is not what I paid

[jagged snow]

Oh are you buying premade runs?

[night girder]

Unshielded, shielded cat6, shielded cat6a

[night girder]

premade?

[jagged snow]

Pre cut and terminated?

[night girder]

I am not making my own cat cables no.

[jagged snow]

Ahh yeah
That makes sense

If you buy in bulk cat6 and 6a are more or less the same price

[night girder]

You made 25 meters of your own cat 6a cables? You woven them and everything?

[twin dew]

When buying as a roll, and not as such precut you screen-shotted.

[night girder]

cat6a is 50% more expensive? 🤔

[twin dew]

The seller is taking extra.

[jagged snow]

Prices may have changed, or it could just be that distributer

[night girder]

And then I have 25 extra meters for nothing.

or even 75 meters. Since some start at 100 meter.

[night girder]

Yeah, not much I can do about that 😅

[twin dew]

Also those Cat6A cables are more expensive fire safe versions for the insulation and the Cat6 cables are just plain PVC which generates lot of toxic smoke if exposed to fire.

[jagged snow]

Oh yeah plenum rated cables cost significantly more

[twin dew]

LSZH, Low Smoke, Zero Halogen. Not sure if has the official papers to be plenum rated.

[night girder]

Euhm no?

I selected outdoor cables and normally they should be fire safe.

None of the indoor cable types are suitable for outdoor use. UV radiation and moisture will quickly ruin the cable jackets. Instead, use something more durable and UV resistant. Enter LLDPE (Linear Low Density Polyethylene). Also seen is HDPE (high density polyethylene). So, pick either LLDPE or HDPE. Both jackets are used whether the cable is meant for above or below ground. The outdoor cable in question may not be marked with any kind of CM rating, or it may be fire rated as CMX (communications residential). That CMX rating won’t make any difference for commercial installations, but could become a factor in residential installations in a very positive way!

[twin dew]

No, that is separate thing.
Fire ratings are one thing.
And weather ratings are another thing.

[night girder]

Anyway, I am following guide. Guide you gave me once. So I should be good 😉

[twin dew]

And these two say they are just PVC insulated.

So not outdoor suitable either.

[night girder]

Ow yeah, only 6a have it atm.

and the 7 also.

[night girder]

Store marked them as outdoor safe.

you can se eit in screenshot

[night girder]

"Geschikt voor buiten".

maten is PE.

not PVC.

[twin dew]

That was for the per meter stuff, I was talking about the 50m rolls you linked.

[twin dew]

And even those are repackaged, the originals are the 305m versions.

[night girder]

I don't want rolls.

You started to talk rolls being cheaper. And I screenshotted because I doubt it's cheaper.

Is PE Polyethylene?

[twin dew]

Yes.

But weird how the store seems to mix outdoor and fire rating.
That Cca is purely about fire rating, not UV etc.

[night girder]

The store sucks. The filters do.

[twin dew]

EN 60332-1-2 fire rating levels.

[night girder]

But it's best one I've got.

I can only select one of those filters. Not multiple.

And "buitengebruik" and "buitenkabel" translate to "use for outside" and "outside cable", no clue what the difference is.

[twin dew]

non-rated (maker doesn't say anything)
Eca (maker says not fire safe)
Dca (maker says fire safe to lowest level)
Cca and up (actually tested by third party)

[night girder]

Anyway, don't want to get sidetracked. I am not worried about fire. I am worried about moisture. Cable goes into the ground.

Cable will go into a tube though. Just want to order a good cable that can handle the outside. 25 meters long.

[twin dew]

For underground install, mainly about how it handles water immersion etc. long term.
And for above ground mostly about UV etc.

[night girder]

It's not really deep.

Taking this as reference. It's not direct burial. But more "run along side".

I also put this in the ground, but instead of the wires, it has one metal wire.

so I can attach cable to metal wire at one side. pull metal wire to pull cable into tube.

Random shop 1:

Random shop 2:

Random shop 3:

All the same style 😭 Am I the only one that don't trust such stores?

Random shop 4:

[twin dew]

Whops, I was off by one step in the original message.
Fca is the lowest self-certified step.

Fca: Combustible, fire spread of more than 425mm

Cables classified to Class Fca may have high levels of flammability due to the materials they are made of. For example, cables with a PE sheath that are primarily intended for external use, such as telephone or duct grade cable, could be tested and classified to Class Fca, which is perfectly acceptable when used in an appropriate environment.

But basically that cable is "Fca" doesn't say anything about weather resistance.
Just that weather resistant cables often go into that category for fire safety, because the materials needed for the weather resistance are not fire safe.

And in commercial use, or by commercial installer, max of 5m of Fca cable can be installed indoors.

[night girder]

I was reading more into it, but doesn't seem that shops use that standard.

[twin dew]

At each end.

[night girder]

So all you mention, I don't have access to that information at my stores.

It's outdoor or not outdoor. Maybe some information about materials used.

Also CCA is added to "veins (Aders)".

So not sure how CCA is related to veins.

[twin dew]

Yeah, that isn't about the fire Cca, but seems to be just about if single or flexible cable is used.

Or really not sure, as the Kern seems to be about that.

[night girder]

Confusing right? 😒

[twin dew]

When "Aders" also can be translated to cores?

Ah, copper clad aluminum.

Hard pass.

aluminum cable with thin layer of copper on it.

Instead of pure copper.

[night girder]

Yes, aders translates to veins/cores.

[twin dew]

So that was about what material the conductors are.

CCA is copper clad aluminum.

[night girder]

And look at this one.

Here it says: Aders: AWG 24/1

[wanton orchid]

this makes me think of high power cables

[twin dew]

Yeah, Single strand AWG 24 pure copper conductors.

[wanton orchid]

damn hope one day I will be able to actually work for tech on my own path

[night girder]

Also, it states 6a, but in description refers to 6

[twin dew]

But basically the shop is putting random stuff in random fields depending who input the data.

[night girder]

So don't be fooled. I linked a 6A cable there.

Which seems to be better?

[wanton orchid]

I hate when even manufacturers don't publish specs

it's like buying a random box in a game

[twin dew]

"Ask"

[wanton orchid]

Also known as "tell us who you are so we know how we ll lie to you" ?

[night girder]

I could ask the store, but euhm ... how high are my chances I get an honest, truthful and correct response.

They probably just read back the same information we are looking at.

[twin dew]

What would you want to know?
Suitable cable for the use?

Something with water/ground resistant outer shell (just material, like that PE), with Fca fire rating (needs to be stamped on the shield), thick enough pure copper conductors.
If single-strand or multistrand depends on the exact end terminations.
If going into hidden RJ45 socket that exploses another RJ45 socket, then single-strand is better, if needs to be more flexible or will be handled after installation, then multistrand.

PE has excellent insulation characteristics and is used for data and RF transmission. It is very resistant to water penetration and thus used as sheath for outdoor/underground cables.It has three major types.ie.Low, (LDPE) medium (MDPE) and high (HDPE). Generally speaking, the higher the density, the better the mechanical performance.Callular polyethylene has even lower capacitance than solid PE and is used for low loss data cable.

Then if the cable will be in sunlight, you would need UV stabilization.

And then if chemical/oil resistance or very large temperature range is needed, then there are other options.

PE should be good to -40C - 125C in static use IIRC.

PTFE, FEP, ETFE etc. would go from -75C to 150+C with chemical & oil resistance.

[night girder]

No.

If what I read on the website, is correct or not That's what I would ask the store.

Or; "You mention it's suitable for outside, on what criteria did you base that?"

[twin dew]

Basically for that install, any PE sheathed cable should work, as long as it isn't in sunlight outside, but inside that tube or underground the whole way.
And then needs to be switched to indoor fire rated cable so that at max 5m of it will be inside single fire compartment in each end.
If this isn't personal install.

https://www.nexans.nl/en/business/Building-Territories/Building/Fire-safety/Construction-Products-Regulation.html
https://www.nexans.nl/en/business/Building-Territories/Building/Fire-safety/Bouwbesluit-2012.html

One large cable manufacturers site

Since the CPR only applies to cables permanently installed in buildings, patch cords and work area
cords, in general, are excluded from the regulation.

IIRC the current legal requirement level to not be "permanently installed" is that it can be completely removed without tools.
As the actual regulation didn't specify and it went to court.

[night girder]

Mhm. Ok.

[charred relic]

Seeing all this rigamarole makes me glad I got a guy...

"Yo Chris I need to run a hardline out to the shed"... "aiight you wanna do it this weekend?"

Best part is he'll show up in the work truck with spools of cable and everything else heh

Granted I'll likely end up with an overengineered solution for a consumer installation but I'm totally OK with that.

also i guess i got so tired i forgot i had farming simulator running heh

[night girder]

This ISP router sux so bad. I see two uPnP rules for a IP that is not one of my devices.

It seems to be a left-over from PS4 days 10 years ago. But I don't ahve that PS4 for ages.

But because device is not on my network, I cannot delete the UPNP rules 🤦‍♂️

[charred relic]

My router is... well the interface sucks

It's slow as Christmas...

[night girder]

Even after a factory reset wtf. Why does it keep making UPNP rules, for a device that's not on my network

[charred relic]

Like if I click to go to a different section of the config pages it'll sit there for like 7+ seconds before anything happens

As far as it's Wifi and wired performance it's fine... the wifi on it is actually really solid

[night girder]

omg, I disabled the rules.

They just enable again. Can't delete em. This is some 100% bullshit crap.

Port Mapping with UPNP without a chance to delete or disable it. Good job ISP. Morons.

[charred relic]

Yeah well they can send a file and reprogram anything in it

[night girder]

and nothing on my network can be triggering those UPNP rules since it's a device isn't even on my network.

[charred relic]

or limit it... I used to run a modded surfboard modem with comcast, had a serial port on it so i could TFTP my own configs in

I was getting the max bandwidth my copper could even supply lol

Best bet is to bypass as much ISP crap as you can... that's been my experience

[twin dew]

That would point it to be hard-coded in the firmware for some ISP reason, or just as bug.

[pure karma]

man do i miss having a battery that can go down to true 0%

[charred relic]

Eventually my modem will just hand off internet to another device to handle everything else

[pure karma]

having double the intended battery life was so nice

[charred relic]

0% is relative to the machine telling you that though heh

Try draining a lithium cell truly to 0 then lemme know how charging it goes 🙂

[pure karma]

worked fine

i did multiple times

[charred relic]

I'm just saying... one device will read that as 10% some 0%, another 2%...

And in some cases if it's software reading it... who knows what math they did

[twin dew]

Just fucked up current monitoring, so the percentage was complete fabrication.
Not that it was able to get out any more runtime.

[charred relic]

I will say this the manufacturers have a decent idea of when to charge a cell, when your laptop wants to shut down just let it FFS

either that or don't cry about your battery life in 2 years heh

[night girder]

That makes no sense?

[charred relic]

Keep waiting on the next battery cell revolution to hit but so far I've been waiting a very long time and seen very small improvements for a long time

[night girder]

Because the ports opened are the ones from my PS4 10 years ago.

So, 99% sure it's a bug.

[pure karma]

yea except it would and then i would turn it back on and keep using it for another hour lmao https://discordapp.com/channels/370472939054956546/457105940844380160/1169258598073897022

[night girder]

I know my IPV4 range in my household. I can see every device connected.

[charred relic]

Over discharging is one of the deadly battery sins heh

[night girder]

The IP is:

1. Not in my network. So nothing is setting it.
2. The port is a port commonly opened for PS4.
3. Router should allow to disable UPNP altogether, if ISP cared.

[pure karma]

yea but it was fun

[charred relic]

Not a great idea to charge to 100% either....

At leat not all the time... and don't leave them sitting around at 100%, they do best at about 80

[pure karma]

like this time were it was at "0%" for like 5 days straight

[charred relic]

(for storage)

[night girder]

Well, let's put the router into the microwave for a few seconds. Maybe that fixes it.

[charred relic]

Sounds more like a calibration thing really

Man I'd hate that...

The chart just doesn't really make sense

[pure karma]

voltage would keep going down like 3-5V bellow normal until it inevitably couldn't run anymore so likely wasent

[charred relic]

Unless it was a device that was used used used then bam went into a lower power state

but it was used used and just kept getting used normally then yeah that's... off

3v is getting extremely low

[pure karma]

not 3V bellow nromal nto 3V

[charred relic]

like it may bever charge again unless you have a hobbyist charger then maybe kind of low

[pure karma]

it would drop all the way down to like 9V before shutting down

soemtimes even 8._

[charred relic]

Some hobbyist chargers can revive cells that aren't toooo damaged from over drain

[pure karma]

for a 13V ish battery thats quite low even for discharged

[charred relic]

laptop batteries used to be so simple to repair...

Now you have to rely on finding the right size/shape flat pack

used to any decent 18650's would work

I mean it was going to happen, the min thickness with those cells is... well the cell itself is 18mm thick

inside the housing of a pack, inside the laptop... not great for space

Plus not even taking full advantage of the space since the shape of the batters leavea lot of unused air space inside the battery housing.

[pure karma]

honestly batteries bother me less than cooling systems considerably insuficient for the performance class

this thing cant hit even averages without SIGNIFICANT external cooling help while still at 100C

i dont know how this heatsink is even this bad honestly

it seems to just store all the heat instead of help spread it

like if ram temps are in the 90's of degrees despite not touching the heatsink in anyway there is some kind issue somewhere

because ram dosent get that hot on its own

[verbal raft]

user shit bark roasted
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyLxjG41tJQ

[night girder]

Just nuked my whole network

I pressed a button on my ISP website, advance blabla setup VLAN.

And by clicking that button, my whole network got nuked rofl.

[wanton orchid]

I hate how these are most often locked behind proprietary / incompatibility scam shit

[verbal raft]

thats one hell of a dislike ratio

[night girder]

so far possitive reviews for the game (checked metacritic, tweakers etc)

Now I am waiting for the users to review it

[verbal raft]

critics dont f-ing matter

[night girder]

Assassin's Creed as a formula is no longer very original, but that doesn't matter: an unoriginal product can still be good and Assassin's Creed Shadows certainly is.

🤨 "Excellent"

[verbal raft]

https://tenor.com/view/champoy-el-risitas-kek-issou-etu-gif-17837830

[charred relic]

Know what I do with critic opinions

wipe my arse with them... then flush them down the toilet where they belong

[languid gulch]

2 out of 3 successful PC hardware swaps, no issues firing up

3rd will be tomorrow 🤣 i was taking my time & trying to keep things clean

[twin dew]

Today is going to be "interesting"...
Woke up after 6 hours of sleep and couldn't sleep more, even when tired.

[charred relic]

I dream of getting 6 hours most days...

[languid gulch]

does win11 pro let you remove stuff like copilot

[twin dew]

Yes, via Group Policy at least.

[languid gulch]

i assume for Home they make it a royal pain

[twin dew]

Not that badly, the icon etc. can be hidden even in Home.

[languid gulch]

oh i mean remove remove it

nuked from orbit

[twin dew]

Not sure it can be removed even in Pro etc.
Just set to be blocked from being used via Group Policy on per-user basis.

[languid gulch]

k

[twin dew]

The screenshot to disk thing can be uninstalled in any version.

[languid gulch]

my mom's been having it pop up randomly & be annoying like Clippy

for some reason mine's been behaving

[twin dew]

Yeah, probably needs to go through Settings app, lot of places where by default "Suggestions" are on by default.

[languid gulch]

ah, that might do it

dumbass windows update might have switched everything back on

[twin dew]

Additional ones have been added over time, each new one defaulting to on.

[languid gulch]

yup

which can also switch on other ones, magically

so my "let's see how bad this can go" upgrade at my parents' house went almost perfectly

since i got the new monster, that freed up a bunch of hardware so they could get upgrades

mom went from a 2600X/1660S to a 5600X/6600XT, dad went from a 5600X/1660 to a 5600X/6800XT

did a full teardown of both systems for a deep clean

[twin dew]

Just changed mothers computers CPU from 2200G to 5500GT and upgraded to Windows 11 Home, not clean install.

[languid gulch]

yea kept them both on win10 for the moment, until closer to the support deadline

didn't want to risk doing both a hardware & software upgrade going badly at the same time

[twin dew]

Had printer problems, the print queue kept getting stuck.
So the upgrade was part of attempt to fix that.
Removed all printer related before, upgraded, reinstalled printer stuff.
CPU had been waiting for several months on desk already.

[languid gulch]

oh & my dad got a new psu since the one he had was a 350W 🤣 don't think that would have gone well with a 275W gpu

[twin dew]

Was just easy to do that at same time.

[languid gulch]

oh god i hate printer software crap

i'm afraid to touch any of that, their printer has been basically perfect since day 1 for some miraculous reason

HP 8610

yea, 10 years old apparently 🤣

[twin dew]

Worked for long time, but suddenly started to have issues where the print queue would get stuck after few print jobs.
But fixed now.

Not sure if printer maker software issue or Windows side breaking down.

[languid gulch]

i kinda wish i had held onto our original family printer, i bet someone makes 3D printed cartridges for it now

[charred relic]

The craziest printer I've ever been in the room with was an old IBM line printer. To be safe for the ears you needed earplugs to be in the room with it running if a tech was there with it open. Slamed out an entire line at once and was insanely fast.

Company used Unix... with some proprietary software literally nobody in that building actually understood heh. I explored it and would do things like oh you know put my print jobs in the front of the queue

which apparently nobody knew was even a thing... i'd just act like i had no idea why it was printing mine first lol

[languid gulch]

i'm tempted to buy a thermal ink printer because of how little i use color ink

[charred relic]

There's a reason they had a printer that fast though and when I said I ahd some paper work to do... I meant that shit

[languid gulch]

or a decommissioned old company printer where you can use refillable cartridges

[charred relic]

i never had good luck with refills

toner on the other hand is much less expensive if you just print black, than ink

[languid gulch]

the way ink works feels like it should be illegal to exist like it does

[charred relic]

Also tend to print fast

[languid gulch]

it'd be like filling up your car costs $40 for the first 5 tanks, then after that they charge $30,000 per refill

[charred relic]

Me and my friend used to not replace ink carts we're place the entire printer becuase it was as cheap since that model was always on sale somewhere

sometimes it was even a little cheaper heh

[languid gulch]

i just print as little as possible anymore

[charred relic]

Now they all want to sell you in a subscription srvice for X number of pages person month.... -facepalm-

[twin dew]

And usually the starter cartridges are only 10-25% capacity to the smaller retail ones.

[charred relic]

wee per month

I never printed much personally so it's all whatever to me really

[languid gulch]

it's just a racket

[charred relic]

If it'll spit out a page every once in awhile that's fine

One thing I do need is color so...

[languid gulch]

1 cartridge costing as much or more than a new printer is absolute horseshit

[twin dew]

Reason why I bought 400e color laser with both dual sided printing and scanning.
Should last for very long time.

[charred relic]

scanning useful, i'd dual side print perhaps... never

[twin dew]

For most people cheap monochrome laser would be right choice.

[languid gulch]

i'd want a non-networked printer. usb it to my pc, no wireless

[charred relic]

But the color does need to be applied to vinyl

...might just start doing the liquid dip stuff though I dunno probably still want to print some stuff too

[languid gulch]

OH i also had bought 2x3 fan packs for my old system before i got the completely new pc, so i swapped out all the fans on both their systems

and now some of their old pc guts gets to go into replacing the living room streaming pc which is an old prebuilt

7th gen intel i think

& god knows what gpu, i remember it doesn't have pcie power

at one point it wasn't on an ssd

[feral drift]

Think I found a solution to all that talk about Nvidia GPU plugs getting a little too hot..

You might want to invest in some serious Noice cancelling headphones though

[tribal kraken]

New workshop PC arrived. Win11, SolidWorks and rest of software installed by me. Wish I had better than 4G internet here. All data transferred by swapping secondary m.2 drive

[warm jay]

What are the spec’s ?

[night girder]

Is it possible to disable WAN port on a switch when all LAN ports are down?

[formal plover]

still cant run satisfactory

[verbal raft]

why ?

[formal plover]

would crash a bunch lol

[verbal raft]

#1038092680493801533

[tribal kraken]

https://fi.pcpartpicker.com/user/Laserkari/saved/#view=pLDXnQ

[warm jay]

Nice, but why this gpu for a cpu this powerful ?

[twin dew]

Work?
As said?

[tribal kraken]

Yeah it does everything needed there, RTX4060 scores about +20% better in Time Spy than the old Quadro RTX 4000 (Turing). And if really need GPU power then do it home with 4090. Some compares: 3dmark.com/compare/spy/54281180/spy/54275205/spy/44255891/spy/52137940#

[pure karma]

yea i was gonna say, you have gotten like 4 new computers already this year... one of them is bound to make for a good worst comes ot worst backup

[cyan crescent]

Im ready to drop kick my pc into orbit. Ive tried everything and HD2 wont stop crashing

[charred relic]

https://tenor.com/view/kermit-darkside-star-wars-evil-innerme-gif-13048146

[verbal raft]

Just blame errorhead

They cant even add usable AA to their game

Why palworld

[tribal kraken]

Who me? nooo this was the first in 2025. My 9800X3D was so 2024 and 13900k and RTX4090 been in use from 2022, adn 5900X from 2021 😄

[mental oriole]

Did my last pc upgrade like 8 years ago... idk why you need to upgrade that often...

[tribal kraken]

At home, its a hobby as any other. And I'd like to keep up with new hardware. But for work at the moment need more PCs here

[mental oriole]

Fair enough.

I recently upgraded from i7-7700k to 9800x3d 🙂
It gave me about 2-2.5x performance improvement in my messagebus hobby project. Still havent fully swapped to it yet, because waiting for a better case to put it in.

[charred relic]

I have come across something now that says "yep that'll be about enough internet for today"

[tribal kraken]

For me the workshop PC upgrade is not huge, but I can feel the faster CPU snappier in general sketching and opening and closing features in SolidWorks. Everything just happens slitghly faster. In the pic is my largest project, about 5500 components. Opening that took 5 mins 10 sec on the old system, now with faster CPU and NVME, its down to 3:00 min.

[uncut flicker]

How can you guyss discuss OVER WEEKS the same Topic 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[charred relic]

Ever seen Eternal Sunshine

...it's kinda sorta like that...in a strange kinda way

[verbal raft]

All of the people in this channel know each other

To some extent

[uncut flicker]

i dont complain ,.. just watching it literally over weeks been funny to me 😄

[charred relic]

Don't worry my friend tomorrow we'll wake up and have this converstion all over again and it'll be brand new!

[uncut flicker]

https://tenor.com/view/baby-kid-shouting-yes-yess-gif-12254544011488707697

[charred relic]

In fact by my calcuation this is alredady the 218th time...

[uncut flicker]

https://tenor.com/view/confused-computing-counting-math-problems-gif-14678592

okay 😅🥸

[charred relic]

You know people sat down to try to calculate how long he was stuck in the time loop for in Groundhog Day heh

No matter how to slice it you come up with a long loooong time. Kinda makes the movie a bit more...grim

[dire igloo]

No, it's still the first time, it's just taking this long

[mental oriole]

Relatable

[mental oriole]

Fair enough, 2min 10s improvement is a lot 🙂

[pure karma]

shifts around here and there but yea it stays about the same and then i break something and a riot starts and then it all goes back to normal and that repeats and then maybe something new releases and its relevant for like a few hours.... and that's basically the last like 2 years summed up

[dire igloo]

wdym "a riot starts"?
weird way to say that you get made fun of

[dire igloo]

You forgot the debates about semantics

[pure karma]

i wasent part of the great semantics war of 24

[jagged snow]

My phone battery just completely crapped out on me within a week

Super high parasitic drain and really low capacity

When about a week ago I could still make it through the day on a charge

[dire igloo]

Check which apps drain the battery

I've noticed Amazon Music to be a horrible battery drainer

[night girder]

High temperature changes? My phone battery indicator goes a bit crazy in the winter.

Can go from 60% to 10% in minutes. And then back to 45% 😄

I have very old phone.

[jagged snow]

It went from 80% to 10% in about 3 hours with the highest listed app using 2%

Its really odd behavior

[jagged snow]

Nope, and for the most part it's been pretty pleasant weather lately

[night girder]

backup your phone asap.

[jagged snow]

But tonight I left it in power saving mode at 60% battery and it had drained all the way down to 0% and shut itself off in about 8 hours

No apps open

[jagged snow]

Yup 👌

[night girder]

Omg, amazing news! Discord is adding ads to mobile

They call it "quests" ... omg gamification of ads is beginning.

[pure karma]

mine dosent care lol

actually none of my devices care because all of them drain more the hotter they are actually

[jagged snow]

They can be considered a feature ig

That's where my profile decoration came from and I'm alright with it since they're pretty subtle and discord is a free platform

I guess it's better than locking more and more features behind nitro

[night girder]

I don't know how I feel about it ... people seem to forget, that a app, without a community is nothing.

So one could argue, it's because discord pays for the server we have communities and so many people using discord.

But one can also argue, without strong communities, people, moderators etc, people wouldn't be interested in discord.

And it's not that we forced the developers to make discord, someone created it once for free, that's the starting point.

Discord could also allow people to host their own servers or something. Then the argument of "we need money for the servers" becomes less important.

Then the only argument they could make is; we need to pay developers. But then you can make discord open source 🤷‍♂️

TLDR; it's not discord as a company don't have options. They choose to keep everything behind closed doors. They choose to generate more revenue through ads, nitro and 100000 billion other ways. They need the money, because of the decisions they make inhouse.

[charred relic]

If you didn't pay for the product then you are the product 🙂

Which ties in with older saying...nothing is free

[jagged snow]

Microsoft, I am the document owner

Yikes

[charred relic]

I'm generally OK with Windows but there are certain aspects of it I do find infuriating personally... like all the hand holding

like look I'm THE top level account on his machine, if I say do something fucking do it

know how many times i've been denied doing something as root... zero

And I get it for the average joes out there that much power would lead to too many folks oopsie nuking their system. But could we at least have some toggles that turns the hand holding off...

ALSO those access warning dialogs are so stupid, people now are jusdt condition to click through and don't even read that shit anyhow now

[winged valley]

My first rackmount

Waiting on RAM still :(

[charred relic]

Gosh fine... so impatient...

gets out the musket and ramrod

drops powder in and starts ramming it...

there... happy now? ARE YOU HAPPY?!

[winged valley]

defeat may I ask what you are trying to do so frequently that requires SYSTEM/TI permissions

I have encountered this issue maybe twice in 10 years

[charred relic]

Ever tried to access all the shit it puts in it's game and apps folder

yeah it's a pain in the ass, it shouldn't be

I should have at least have a toggle that lets me tell the OS to let me do what i want to do

if i take a risk as a superuser I'm taking a risk, I understand that

And BTW guess how many timves I've accidentally screwed up a system using super user privs in well over a decade.

Also zero.. See how worthless anecdotal evidence is?

[winged valley]

2 questions:

1 - Why are you using the MS store
2 - What are you getting from there that you need to access

[charred relic]

bro

[winged valley]

Those folders are hyper protected as a shitty form of DRM

[charred relic]

it does not mattter WHAT im after or doing in there

it's MY machine, MY drive, MY data.

[winged valley]

As I just said, it's a shitty form of DRM

[charred relic]

what im in there to do does not matter one teeny tiny bit

[winged valley]

There's no real reason for them to be so protected

[charred relic]

I'm being locked out of part of MY system and force to jump through hoops to access it

[winged valley]

Technically you're trying to access files for a program of which the license terms probably state you aren't allowed to do that. They technically aren't your files

[charred relic]

There's probably some group policy bs that can remedy all that but then that's a whole thing i have to go learn, nah

i don't... care

[winged valley]

There's no GP workaround unfortunately, you have to inheritance override the folder permissions

[charred relic]

if it's on my system and I canj't see it at all, it won';t be there much longer

in this case you CAN get access so I don't care as much

if they lock me out of them entirely then I have a major major problem with it

[winged valley]

Well in the future consider not using the MS store. It's a dogshit platform to begin with and using it especially as a poweruser is only asking for trouble

[charred relic]

i typically don't

but guess what else does that.... XBL for PC

Which I do use

[winged valley]

Unfortunate

[charred relic]

some aspects of pc gaming i find infinitely infuriating

like how everybody and their brother just haaaaaas to have their own launcher... yay just what i always wanted 28 different game launchers

[night girder]

if it's not on steam, I don't care. That's what happened to me with all the launchers. Was frustrated too. Now I am not.

If I know a game has separate launcher and I cannot disable this, then I just don't buy the game

[glossy glacier]

game is on steam
still has a separate launcher

[pure karma]

yea when i saw that with cyberpunk i literally facepalmed

atleast it hasent been problematic so im not too too bothered by it

[night girder]

That's why you double check Read reviews etc.

[gilded helm]

Ha! I was also looking at Anno 1800 but didn't purchase for exactly that reason

[pure karma]

god damit adblock is broken again

[glossy glacier]

They can always add one later on

[night girder]

Yeah, let's see that happen

That used to be ok. Because every gaming company was suddenly making their own launcher.

But a lot of us are launcher tired, so if company now adds a launcher, I am curious to see how much backlash that will receive.

[glossy glacier]

Cities skylines got one very late in its life cycle

[night girder]

For example, how would community react if CSS suddenly adds launcher + seperate account.

[night girder]

CS1? That's pretty old game by now.

Last I played it was 3 years ago and it had launcher if not mistaken.

[gilded helm]

The biggest problem IMO is actually that other launchers really, really suck.

[night girder]

and launchers (steam) that launch laucnhers (ubisoft, etc) just does my head in.

[night girder]

and what do they add that steam can't do? 🤷‍♂️

[gilded helm]

And more specifically, that Steam does better.

[night girder]

One extra account to keep track of. One more screen to go through before you can play the game?

[gilded helm]

I don't even like Steam necessarily, I just find EGS to be fucking terrible.

[charred relic]

I'm not going to deny myself a game because it has it's own launcher. What I'm not ok with is the internet required to function bits. Now THAT to me is way over the top.

[night girder]

I like Steam. Born and raised on it 🤣

[charred relic]

And as pointed out sometimes not possible for some people

[night girder]

Honestly, the other launchers add zero functionality for us gamers.

It gives the companies a LOT of advantages over us.

[charred relic]

add something or not im not going to deny my selkf a game I'll enjoy because of a launcher disagreement

[night girder]

99% wants more profit and not deal with steam I believe

[charred relic]

that, to mee, seems very sillyu

[night girder]

Because if you are on steam platform as a developer, you pay to steam. Less profit.

[charred relic]

I will shop in an order, and I will buy on steam first if available as a first option

if the only option is their launcher then it is what it is

[night girder]

A launcher is for the purpose of connecting to the internet.

And combat piracy, get more money, track you usage etc.

[charred relic]

I don't like it... but I'm not going to deny myself joy over it

again... seems incredibly silly to me'

fundamentally for me it's a fairly petty disagreement really

[night girder]

I think some don't know how spoiled we are to still have steam atm.

[charred relic]

i don';t think they should have a launcher, they do... oh well that's lif e

I'm sure at least some people... like it

[night girder]

Honestly, what am I missing? There are so many great games out there.

[charred relic]

maybe?

Well for you thgat's the case

if you don't mind not playing them he y nothing wrong with you not playing them

[night girder]

If you as dev, publish a game on steam, that redirects to another launcher, you know pretty darn well what you doing. And that you lose some players and gain some others. It's their choice. It's my money 😄

[charred relic]

that's up to you.. ya know

I'm so picky with games that I'd risk cutting myself off from a substantial amount of gaming if I were too picky about all that

[night girder]

Just got tired of having 5-6 launchers on my PC. Last game I bought with launcher was minecraft 2 years ago.

and that games want you to log into the microsoft store also. Else it wont launch.

[charred relic]

If I could snap my fingers and just have everything on Steam I'd do it, that's for suree tho

[night girder]

Even better would be if we didn't need steam/internet at all 😄 (to play games).

[charred relic]

But then what if Steam went rogue afterward...

It's all a mess really heh

[night girder]

Or goes down, we're fucked.

[charred relic]

True but they do have benefits, for developers even

like if not for seeing SF on Epic I may have still not heard of it... who knows

[night girder]

I don't have Epic and I still heard about SF 😉

[charred relic]

And I was about to just pull the trigger on Factorio when I saw it and was like ok this looks way way cooler to me

[night girder]

Some people made the argument in here before; I can still play the games from my floppy-disk.

And even that isn't 100% true. I want to see them try it on W11 and how smooth that goes.

If you have an old system from back in the day the game was madew on floppy you have more luck. But old software isn't always compatible with new hardware.

[charred relic]

I got Epic originally for Fornite

[night girder]

What I am trying to say; even have hard copies of games has drawbacks over time.

[charred relic]

because my best friends son was begging me to get on and play with him

[night girder]

My niece was here for a week, she was constantly playing fortnite.

She grew up on it, but now dislikes it because they ruined the game 🤣 Graphics look like shit now.

[charred relic]

Kids like family... how can I say no

[night girder]

She only plays it to chat with her friends I believe. More like a social thing and a habbit.

[charred relic]

I haven't played in awhile... he moved on to being interested in other games

I did enjoy Save the World... too bad they just kinda... said whatever... to all that

[night girder]

Also, they add "spider man senses" to the game? So when an enemy is near you, you get a visual indicator on your screen telling you what direction they are.

[charred relic]

I was never good at that game because I sucked at building

[night girder]

I think it's meant for people who can't hear or have issues hearing. But every turns it on because it gives huge advantage.

[charred relic]

some guy is like 4 stories higher than me by the time I get 2 stories up

like yeah ok i can't win

i can get lucky... but not beating this dude by skill alone lol

[night girder]

I watched the finals a few times, good content. They build super duper quick.

[charred relic]

Then I go play world of tanks... so I can feel superior again heh

I've actually had fun in that game being the one getting outplayed by the pro or near pro level play ers

it's a.. fun interection against competent players

[night girder]

Cba with comp anymore.

[charred relic]

one pro played me in a way that I just had to laughm can't even be mad about it lol

i don';t do comp but i could see somebodys general skill level... and sometimes there would be pro level guys in lobbies I'm in

I'm well above average in that game but they are well well above me even.

Actually learned quite a bit... getting outplayed by those types heh, very educational :

[night girder]

Go behind tank. Shoot behind of the tank. Win.

[charred relic]

I prefer to play people better than myself

it's the only way to get good gains

Playing somebody the same as me or worse teaches me nothing

I learnded that when I played pool... from an old huslter at the local hall

...never got good enough to consistently beat that man either

i was like 60/4 at best, me 40

[night girder]

speaking off launchers, reading new AC reviews. Some of the top ones are;

Top one is:

I love steam reviews

[verbal raft]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dy1_9dcToJU

[languid gulch]

so, 3rd pc hardware swapout hasn't gone to plan. system fired up, but it turns out the 350W "not even a Great Wall" psu fan is screaming bloody murder. it's probably fine, but i don't wanna open up a psu, and having someone else do it to swap out a cheapo fan on a cheapo psu is definitely going to fall under the "just get a new psu" territory

[tall plaza]

when is the next 90% off sale going to happen? summer? anyone knows?

[soft bloom]

So i just had YT tell me that AdBlock is o pause
some.people have no chill - but we go tyou covered
And there's a choice to watch the ads or with adblock

I m deeply confused

[pure karma]

adblock broke again

thats whats up

[pure karma]

im not exactly sure i even get the new DLSS transformer model

worst performance for more blur less image quality worst latency and just overall feels like shit

maybe its cause im on 40 series and not 50 but man it sucks

it does the exact oposite it says it does

actually im curious about something

hmm i though maybe it used more vram but no they are the same but that might just be because im too close to my max altho that confirms the "30% reduciton in vram usage" is bs

the only thing the new model has going for it is it somehow fixed my microstuters

i tought maybe the new model was using ever so slightly more vram causing minimal impact offload to ram but no its genuinely just bad

seems like i have something to experiment on for the weekend perhapse

[twin dew]

So the new GPU for this computer ?)
https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/rtx-pro-6000-blackwell.c4272

😜

[feral drift]

Price starting at $20.000 ? :D

[tribal kraken]

Would be nice to grab used Ada gen card from someone who upgrades to those

New RTX4000 Ada is about 1,5k€ atm

But yeah 20k not probaly far as the RTX6000 Ada 48GB hovers around 8k 😄

[languid gulch]

think any of them will be missing ROPs?

[feral drift]

Know its some time ago.. But still remember when Nvidia launched their flagship Titan Xp series - which was priced at ~1k€.. I know its 8 years ago - but still you barely get a mid range GPU for that price point nowadays

[languid gulch]

1080Ti was an exorbitant $700 at launch

also i'm still laughing my ass off at all the people who bought RTX Titans at $2500

22 months later and the 6800XT beat it for a quarter of the price

[tribal kraken]

Best part of 1080Ti was that it kept my PC room warm and mined its price back as Ethereum 😄

[feral drift]

Waiting for Tom's Hardware to release their GPU Benchmarks Ranking with 5090 and RX 9070 - to see the difference

[languid gulch]

TPU puts the 5090 at about double the performance of a 9070, so i'd expect around that overall

[tribal kraken]

Found my "for sale" pic of 1080Ti, looks like wanted 400€ for it with EK waterblock in dec. 2019

[languid gulch]

i was kinda tempted to water cool my 6800XT, but then i realized i'd hate it

[feral drift]

Still trying to justify spending $3500 for a GPU..

Hence why I wanna see how much you'll miss out with AMD's high-end RX 9070 XT which is less than $1000

[languid gulch]

it's not even their max performer

7900XTX still wins

the $/performance is definitely better

7900XTX is ahead by like 15-25% depending on what you're doing, and has more vram

well, ignoring ray tracing 🤣 9070XT has some substantial improvements there

[wanton orchid]

efficiency wise at lower loads ?

[languid gulch]

not too different actually, 7900XTX is 350W, 9070XT 300W

tho 9070XT is going to be more power efficient from new architecture

[wanton orchid]

I mean like is idle power lower ?

[languid gulch]

oh no idea on that

idle power is never really too much of a problem

my 4090 idles at 7-15W

the only time i've seen any reviewers concentrate on idle power is when there's some weird shit going on that got updated in drivers later on

[feral drift]

Can't seem to find a Benchmark comparison on TPU's website

[languid gulch]

i just use the huge ass scroll chart

other outlets do better with specific applications, but TPU does ok with general relative ranking

[twin dew]

Which doesn't show real performance.
Just raw max theoretical TFLOPS.

[feral drift]

Alright found some "useful" info - just click into a review, and see the charts they provide with comparison.

Taking Average FPS at 1080p - then I guess you can somewhat justify RTX 5090 having 256 FPS, meanwhile RX7900 XTX is sitting at 184 FPS

And the gap just increases the higher resolution you pick it seems

[twin dew]

Doesn't take power limits, drivers, memory bandwidth etc. into account at all.

Just instructions per clock if all units are at full utilization times clockspeed.

[languid gulch]

yup, why i mentioned hunting down specific applications to do better comparisons

[twin dew]

In some cases the comparison on those can be off by factor of 3 as most egregious I have IIRC have seen.

[languid gulch]

oh 100%

i absolutely loved GN doing 32bit PhysX on the 5090 for that reason

[feral drift]

Question is ofcourse... Does RTX Pro 6000 Blackwell run Crysis...

[verbal raft]

XTX is
10% faster at 4K
15% faster at 1440p

According to HUB anyway

And its 26% slower in RT

[languid gulch]

HUB showed in some cases the 7900XTX is ahead by as much as 42% with 4K CS2, kinda why i qualified it with the "depending on what you're doing". if you're playing CS2, Delta Force, Jedi Survivor, the 7900XTX blows the 9070XT out of the water

it is impressive the differences tho, the 9070XT keeping up with an awful lot of games while having 8gb vram less

[wanton orchid]

I think cs2 could optimize for that
people wastly underestimate software optimization
only Nvidia invested a bit in it and it was part of why they had better performance for a long time

but they invested it in the most unfair monopolistic ways they could
and I'm still watching for it to backfire

[feral drift]

Wouldnt the ideal benchmark for gaming be the worst software optimized game.. At least then it would only be a positive experience from there..

[languid gulch]

nope, need the array of applications, because sometimes driver optimizations will show up that can make a card leapfrog ahead

[feral drift]

True, i guess the Tom’s hardware approach is the best.. Average FPS across multiple game titles..

[languid gulch]

the 6800XT came out with a bunch of garbage results because of crap optimization, and over the next year AMD put out a bunch of driver updates that made it shine

[feral drift]

Which TPU also has a section in their reviews

[languid gulch]

that's why it can sometimes be better to wait to buy

[feral drift]

Driver optimization isnt really something ive considered tbh

[languid gulch]

intel's for their GPUs went from "not a chance in hell" to "actually functioning"

[feral drift]

I know Intel have for many years made GPU embedded into the motherboard.. But aint their ARC series somewhat pretty new to them.. At least in my eyes gives them the right to not hit the nail on first attempt..

But Nvidia and AMD has been at this game for so long, you’d expect it to be somewhat perfect at release..

[languid gulch]

oh not remotely perfect

for nvidia's 30 series, they decided to forget to implement power limits, so people would fire up games like New World & the menu fps would push the GPUs until they literally caught on fire

[twin dew]

No, they had averaged power limit, but not instantaneous.
So the load was so spiky that the instant went way over the average.

To tune of 3X.

By design.
Nvidia STILL disables all the protections in the VRM chips themselves like those instant power limits etc.

[languid gulch]

oh right, forgot that that was the start of the transient spike BS

[twin dew]

And only monitors their own shunt resistors.

But for those 3000-series cards, it was averaged over very long time.

[languid gulch]

but yea, nvidia & radeon are known for occasionally forgetting to do stuff with driver updates

[feral drift]

There is many examples of these..

Had the GTX970 .. Advertised to be 4GB, but in reality it was only 3.5GB..

[languid gulch]

or choosing to do dumb shit like retiring 32bit PhysX

[feral drift]

But back then the GPU was also a fraction of the price, of what they are today

[languid gulch]

and that was still enough to trigger a class action lawsuit

now cards catching on fire isn't fucking enough

[wanton orchid]

almost like of having money somehow deter lawyers

[feral drift]

Ain’t that because you can’t solely determinate if its the plug from PSU, or the Pins being faulty from factory..

I mean I know they dont disclaim that your card catches on fire..

But a good lawyer will use all the tricks in the book to say “the problem is out of our hands”

[languid gulch]

the connector is known garbage, yet they insist on using it

[feral drift]

Meanwhile the 4GB advertised vs. the 3.5GB reality i guess is harder to defend against

[wanton orchid]

up to actual lie then the investigation team will surprisingly forget details

and the juge will never do any mistake of course
everything as it should be

[feral drift]

Guess it comes to that the current 6 pin or 8 pin connection is cost effective and a industry standard..

Ofcourse Nvidia could make a better connector and sell adapters to be backward compatible..

Or AMD for that matter

[willow pike]

back then the market was able to bully nvidia into doing the right thing

[languid gulch]

the 6/8 pin connectors are built to carry more than double their expected load, the stupid connector has a 10% margin

[willow pike]

cost effective like a ford pinto

[twin dew]

With the better pins, the 6 pin can carry that 75W with one pin (of two), and still have more margin that the new 16-pin :D

[languid gulch]

OCing a 5090 blows right past the safety margin for its connector. i wonder what regulators would have to say if any other product in any other industry would try that shit

[feral drift]

Doubt you pay $100.000 for your Ford Pinto though :D

If we should compare it like that..

[willow pike]

lmao

[languid gulch]

clearly you've never attended the Barrett-Jackson auction

[willow pike]

cost effective for them, not for us

saving a few cents on every GPU with the 16 pin connector while charging ludicrous margins for everything they sell

[feral drift]

Exactly

[languid gulch]

can't hit $4T value without it

[twin dew]

The move was more about PCB space, to make the PCBs smaller.

[willow pike]

make the PCB 1mm wider

or taller

or use a daughter board

[twin dew]

Not saying it made sense, but that seems to have been Nvidias objective.

[willow pike]

the only reason to do it this way is to save as much money as possible while maximising cooling

[languid gulch]

removing safety stuff is definitely a space-saver. other industries have done that too

[twin dew]

Doing that kind of cramped PCB is not cheap compared to more spread out one.

[willow pike]

consider this: would apple compromise safety to save a few bucks?

[languid gulch]

$i $have $no $idea

[willow pike]

yeah exactly, they made it small to get the dual pass through working, and then they decided to save a few cents on power

there are many ways to have such a small PCB with safe power delivery and they chose none of them because they did pinto math

[languid gulch]

i just hope that something comes of all the bullshit

[willow pike]

well, with that new 96GB RTX pro whatever, nvidia will be diverting all the dies to those while geforces can pound sand

[languid gulch]

can't wait to see $2000 5070s

[willow pike]

imo this is the final year of AI being the big wall st darling

nvidia will only attempt to win us back as customers when the AI market dries up

[feral drift]

Ahh this makes sense.. :D

Its like the VW Diesel Gate, where VW (And all other car manufactorer) made a software for inspection, to hide that their cars aint as clean and efficient as they say…

Nvidia/AMD does the same.. They install a 75A rated connector, and say its very energy efficient.. But the card draws 150A of load..

[willow pike]

but even now people (scalpers, but still too many people) are buying geforces, even with such a shit launch and shit product

[verbal raft]

#Lackwell

[willow pike]

nvidia throws most of their output to AI with geforce being a distant second priority and they still sell out

they have no reason to change

tell all your friends to buy RDNA4 because they're the only graphics cards that won't fucking melt

and mercifully they're actually good

which I honestly didn't see coming

nvidia still won't notice, they are a lost cause

only when AI dies will jensen look at us again

and if you successfully get everyone you know to radeon, if enough people do that, nvidia will have to actually work for our money for once

we can go back to the days of it being a two horse race

capitalism does not naturally result in competition; it results in monopolies. we need to make it competitive

[feral drift]

Not saying Team Blue has an opening after Team Green went full on AI, to compete in the gaming sector..

[willow pike]

Intel's latest CEO is a venture capitalist with a long career of gutting companies, firing people and killing projects to increase profit margins. celestial is almost certainly dead

and The Current Administration has reneged on the CHiPS act, money that intel had planned around having

I wouldn't count on anything good coming out of them on any front

[feral drift]

Well the price point of the ARC GPU aint insane.. Problem is for me AMD GPU on similar price point products, overperform on ARC by a rather great margin

[willow pike]

ARC also has very high driver overhead, so they need a fast CPU to perform properly, which kills the value

and xess is uh. it's baby

[twin dew]

And Intel is selling the cards at production cost or even below.

[willow pike]

FSR4 and DLSS2 (and above) are good ML TAA. xess is weird and messy TAA.

[feral drift]

Then you have the Nvidia GPU which is priced at 2-3 times the AMD GPU, but that is the price you must be willing to pay, if you want the performance..

AMD doesnt have a GPU that competes with highend RTX 4000-5000 series as far as I can see

[willow pike]

yeah Intel are selling 80-class chips that performs like 60-class. they're huge compared to their performance

[willow pike]

9070 XT ~ 5070 Ti, only the 5080 and 5090 are faster and both are ludicrous money

the 5080 isn't that much faster and is much more expensive, while the 5090 is just stupid

honestly the 5090 is so expensive it's not worth talking about. you either have $2000 of disposable income every 2 years, or you don't

if you don't, it's not a real product to you

[feral drift]

Yeah but if your budget for a new PC is $10.000 then ofcourse the RTX 5090 is your go to..

For me personally I’m more than happy with my AMD GPU, it gets the job done, and I have plenty of money to spare, which can be spend elsewhere :)

[willow pike]

yeah that's what I said, people who are upper class can get a x090 every two years and not blink

i am not that lmao

[feral drift]

And once my kids PCs needs and upgrade, it would most likely be Ryzen + Radeon.. Then u can also utilize SMA and get those 5-10 extra FPS in most games

[willow pike]

ryzen has been the way to go for years. this is the first time in ages that I've said radeon is the way to go, without exception

[willow pike]

sma?

[feral drift]

Smart Memory Access

[willow pike]

ah yeah that thing

[feral drift]

Where u allow the CPU to use a fraction of your GPU Memory for certain tasks :)

[willow pike]

seems to always help on radeon and sometimes help on geforce, sometimes hurt

also the 5000 has worse 1% lows then the 9000 which is a shock to me

maybe nvidia doing so much in drivers is hurting them? hard to tell

[glossy glacier]

No? PCIe Re-BAR allows the CPU to access more than 256MB VRAM at once.
Without it can still access the entire VRAM, just with way more transactions.
SAM is the AMD implementation/optimization

[twin dew]

AFAIK other way around.
Allows GPU to access CPU RAM via DMA for much larger slice.

Without CPU involvement.

[glossy glacier]

Either way without it's still possible, just limited in chunk size

[feral drift]

I’ll lay flat down and say, that was my understanding of SMA.. Never the less how it works.. I dont really care.. All I can say is that it works :)

It aint super great, but it makes lifts most of my games perform slightly better..

And that would be 5 to 10 FPS at absolute best

For me that made sense as GPU Memory is usually quicker than your regular RAM.. Hence I thought it was allocating a small fraction of GPU Memory to be used as RAM for the CPU

For certain tasks that is

[twin dew]

Way too much latency for that to make any sense.

[glossy glacier]

VRAM is good for parallel access, not so much singular

[twin dew]

GDDR itself is already higher latency than normal DDR, optimized for bandwidth.
And then the extra PCIe-link on top adding 100+ns by itself.

Where RAM access latency on itself is usually between 50 (very tight manual timings) and 100ns (JEDEC)

Whole point is to make data transfers between RAM and VRAM more efficient, without needing as much CPU and driver time.

Where the old process was for CPU to move stuff into that BAR window, then it got transferred to the GPU.
Then after that one slice was transferred, move more into the window, transfer to GPU.

Larger BAR allows for more data before CPU has to do anything again.

[night girder]

Baldur, you a fan of AC (Assassins Creed) no? There was someone here in who was into the lore.

[twin dew]

Not really fan of the games as games anymore, with all the crappy RPG mechanics stuffed in.
And the lore has started to sprawl way too much, as there doesn't seem to be high level control of it to extent necessary.

I am/was interested in where it was going, but waning even on that because of the sprawl.

[bright sonnet]

Anyone here tried running Satisfactory with Vulkan on a 9070 XT? I just did and apparently it's so experimental that it does something terrible to the shader cache. Had constant heavy stutters in any Vulkan game after this until I reset my shader cache. This is repeatable at least on my machine.

[night girder]

Was reading some opinions about new game in franchise, and read similar things.

I am serious wondering where the story is at at this point... 🤣 Can't even remember what the modern story was for Odyssey 😛

[twin dew]

Spoilers to Odyssey and Valhalla:
||Laula found Atlantis near start, and became the Keeper after Kassandra/Alexios.
And then in Valhalla AFAIK will join Desmonds spirit somewhere outside of living to run simulations "in the Grey"||

[willow pike]

vulkan is experimental on any gpu

[bright sonnet]

I know that. It just was less broken on a 6900 XT

[cobalt ivy]

Cookie cutter games, these days.

[verbal raft]

its actually
Smart *Access Memory
🤓

[verbal raft]

man
i would love to have win-dowes on my NVME

past me, i HATE you

[pure karma]

potato pc

[verbal raft]

now i have to deal with this as my C-drive

[feral drift]

That average response time though...

[verbal raft]

still better than my C-Drive

[pure karma]

yea literal USB stick as a c drive lmao

[verbal raft]

and i Was in the middle of transfering 200GB

now its 2.5ms

[pure karma]

i have 0ms beat that

[verbal raft]

at 20times the speed of my C-drive

[verbal raft]

EZ

[pure karma]

hehe

[dire igloo]

Opened win11 task manager for the first time ever today - holy fuck it's hideous

[glacial zephyr]

I feel like it’s not that different from windows 10

[dire igloo]

It's similar in many ways

Except they made a collapsed menu on the left side instead of tabs at the top

[pure karma]

win10 task manager dosent have tabs at the top???

[glacial zephyr]

I kinda like the side menu, it’s small and I only ever use the the first two options

[pure karma]

yep its simple effective and you can hide it

[dire igloo]

How else do you switch from task overview to performance info?

[pure karma]

oh right its up top by default

[dire igloo]

It's ineffective if you need to look up what the nonsensical icons mean, that's my point.
Why use a collapsible vertical menu instead of tabs?
It's not user friendly, it's copying Apple's dumbification

[pure karma]

anyway its more stupid if anything

[dire igloo]

The collapsed menu is only usable if you know what the options mean

[pure karma]

it takes like 5 seconds to figure out 🤷‍♂️

[dire igloo]

If they rearranged the menu points or added new ones, you'd be completely lost

[pure karma]

nope

[dire igloo]

If windows 10 did the same, you'd still find it

[dire igloo]

Gigantic fuckton of wasted space

Move these to a tabs menu on the top

[pure karma]

then stop bitchin and hide it bruh

[dire igloo]

Hide it and tell me what icon you'd need to click to see the detailed list of everything running, including system services

Without looking at the screenshot and without trial and error

[pure karma]

idk which one you mean because they arent merged but the last 2

[dire igloo]

The collapsed menu is only actually usable if you know the menu from memory

[pure karma]

the list icon for the running and the puzzle for services

[dire igloo]

Look at them

Okay, poor wording

[pure karma]

i agree the icons are stupid but the menu does its job and it works

[dire igloo]

Wanted to mention both while only referring to one, ended up making the wording ambiguous

[pure karma]

and it takes at most a minute to memories

[dire igloo]

It's a fucking menu, of course it's functional

I'm not arguing its function

I'm arguing the design and usability

[pure karma]

but your arguing the function of the icons 😂

[dire igloo]

You either have a gigantic part of the window as wasted space or you have silly pictograms that you need to either trial and error or know from memory to find what you're looking for

[dire igloo]

I'm not?
Usability is not function

[pure karma]

ok programer

[dire igloo]

Function: click button, button does what it's intended to do
Usability: user knows which button to click, menu is laid out efficiently

There was ZERO functional reason to move the menu from the top tabs to the side

[pure karma]

looks cleaner thats it most likely

[dire igloo]

It's not layered enough to justify a tree representation and it's too unintuitive to warrant simplification

[pure karma]

also means lot less mouse travel distance ot swap between all the diffrent menus

[twin dew]

Doing it on lot of other programs too.
And the original point was probably attempt to make better use of widescreen space.

[dire igloo]

Except it only does when you collapse it which is smth that you only do if you're very familiar with it or click through every option

[pure karma]

i think it looks fine uncollapsed

[dire igloo]

I think it doesn't

Dead space, inefficient

[pure karma]

just a bit too wide but thats not a huge deal

[dire igloo]

Besides, task manager is a tool for functionality, not aesthetics.
Nobody says "I want my bloatware finder to be fancy", they want it to work

Name one reason why someone would remove the top tabs.
A reason that makes it actually inferior

Because you had to go out of your way to design a new UI, something had to justify that effort

[pure karma]

fits with everything else

[twin dew]

To make the actual content area as tall as possible, and use the "useless" wide space on todays 16:9 or wider monitors.

[pure karma]

and plus task manager has essentially become a required tool so i can see why they would want it giving a good "quality" impresion

[twin dew]

For Task Manager, mainly to keep it to same style as rest of the new apps using that paradigm.

Main selection left, then second more granular pane, then the main content area.

[glacial zephyr]

You expand it out to read, then collapse again

[dire igloo]

More vertical space means you get taller performance charts and can see more processes. The latter being scrollwheel functionality.
More horizontal space means you see more data fields per process or get a later data-cutoff per data field, also longer performance charts. Nothing you used your scrollwheel for

[dire igloo]

So you require three inputs to switch pages. Instead of one - just clicking the tab you want

[glacial zephyr]

Or I just click the button I want because I know where they are

The icons are pretty self explanatory

[dire igloo]

Which is one of the caveats I mentioned earlier, you need to know the UI from memory

That's not user friendly tho, is it?

[dire igloo]

They're not. They make sense if you know what they mean, but you can only make sense of them retroactively

[dire igloo]

This is the only reason I see that would make some form of sense - it came at the cost of usability tho

[glacial zephyr]

The graph symbol takes you to the graphs, the tach symbol takes you to startup, and the other ones are pretty standard

And I’ve never had a problem with space, all 20 cpu graphs fit on a 16 inch laptop screen with task manager minimized

[dire igloo]

The list of services is behind the list icon, the tachometer shows performance data.
Both reasonable assumptions, both wrong.

And if it weren't the default page, no way in hell would anyone think that those three squares mean app overview

It's not intuitive

You retroactively make sense of it

You know what they mean and interpret the icons in a way that they align with the meaning behind them

[glacial zephyr]

Alternatively, expand the list out if you refuse to learn the icons

The space is really not an issue

20 graphs fit fine

The tachometer is startup apps, the list icon is details which is pretty intuitive

[dire igloo]

It's not because users don't see the meaning and make sense of the icon.
Users see the icons and need to figure out which is the performance tab

Or the list of services

Cuz a fucking cogwheel is not an intuitive representation of a services overview

[glacial zephyr]

Performance shows you graphs, which is the graph icon on task manager. Of all the icons it's probably the most intuitive of them all

[dire igloo]

Not if there's a 50/50 guess against the tach

[glacial zephyr]

And none of them are cogwheels, services is a puzzle piece

[dire igloo]

And yet again: it is not better than the tabs

It doesn't matter if it works, it needs to be better

[glacial zephyr]

This is such a non-issue, it takes less than a second to click

Either learn the icons or expand it out, space is not an issue

[dire igloo]

time accumulates, extra interactions add navigation complexity

[dire igloo]

Then why bother changing it?

[glacial zephyr]

You'll click on the wrong icon maybe 3 times

[dire igloo]

They made a worse UI

[glacial zephyr]

If you don't learn after that it's your fault

[dire igloo]

again - change needs to be an improvement

And it's not an improvement in any way

[glacial zephyr]

Of all things that would waste time, task manager is at the very bottom of the list

They changed the design to fit with the rest of windows 11

[night girder]

Average response time in task manager is weird for me.

[glacial zephyr]

It is not hard to learn

[night girder]

jumps from 0.3ms to 22ms sometimes. And then jump back to 0.3ms.

So it doesn't feel like an average ... or it doesn't take history into account.

[glacial zephyr]

I believe it's measuring the response time for the current process, not an average

[night girder]

Yeah, while it does say "average". I don't know if Task Manager is the right tool for accurate measurements.

[twin dew]

Doing average over X time, but in discrete steps and not as running average.

[night girder]

That X seems very little. Like doing average of 3 second time (or even less?)

[glacial zephyr]

It’s probably to account for the random read/writes that usually happen

[dire igloo]

Still doesn't make it better UI

[glacial zephyr]

Doesn’t really matter tbh, it works and it’s really not all that different

Extremely a non-issue

[feral drift]

Usually avg. is calculated by taking example 20 response time, and draw an average of those.. Why its useful I dont know..

[night girder]

@twin dew Explain to me please 🤣 patch cables with CU or CCA 😒 (from amazon btw).

So, how can they be both or one of the two? 🤔

[twin dew]

Someone trying to be cute?
Because that CCA contains copper?

[night girder]

Is it amazon way of saying; you'll get random patch cables being either CU or CCA?

but CU != CCA. You told me to try to avoid CCA, since it's just a thin layer of coper over aluminium

It's n1 most sold patch cable.

[twin dew]

Like I said, trying to fake and saying CU, because there is that copper cladding.

[night girder]

Ah, found a better one that promises to be CU.

[twin dew]

But still saying it is actually CCA.

[night girder]

Cat6a, 0.15m, 28 AWG pure copper, 550MHz.

[twin dew]

CU cladding on aluminum, so CCA.

[night girder]

First time I see a cable mention MHz. For this purpose.

[twin dew]

Because that comes from the CAT spec.

So it is redundant.

And that AWG28 is very thin, but shouldn't matter for 15cm cable.

[night girder]

0.15 meter but then it say in a image .. its 7 cm

amazon sucks.

Needed to buy a present on it for my mother, free shipping from x price. So I was thinking of adding some cables I need.

Ah, 15cm in total, 7cm cable.

[glacial zephyr]

Is the cable to connect the modem and router or something?

That’s really short lol

[night girder]

it's a patch cable? they are short 😄 Example:

[twin dew]

15cm cable only can get between neighboring ports on same strip.

Those are probably 25-30cm for the shorter ones, and 40-45cm for the longer ones.

And Buildzoid has confirmed that the 12V-2x6 connector spec REQUIRES that all the pins are immediately tied together on the PCB.
No splitting into per pin regions allowed...
So the Asus Astral cards are not spec compliant as they have per pin current monitoring shunts before the combined power plane...

Active current monitoring and/or balancing explicitly forbidden in the spec

[night girder]

It'll be fine

[twin dew]

Yeah, I have three 10-15cm cables as jumpers just for that.

Don't want to remove any of them to check the exact length.

[glacial zephyr]

Oh ok, that makes sense

[twin dew]

Got some extra 25cm and 50cm cables.

[wanton orchid]

I'm .25 .5 team

[pure karma]

im 50M team

[twin dew]

50 million broken computer parts?

[pure karma]

[soft bloom]

I just had the wildest thought - project manager role exists just as a role to put blame on

[charred relic]

You basically just described literally every role in the corporate world heh

Unless of course you're in the big seat... then you're the pigeon... the rest os the statue

[night girder]

Had to think about the pigeon and statue metaphor. 😂

Not something we say here

[charred relic]

In general life it works both ways

sometimes you're the pigeon

[night girder]

Statues shitting on pigeons?

[charred relic]

...sometimes you're the statue

Either way shit rolls downhill in the corp world lol

[night girder]

Always…

[charred relic]

believe me i've seen people above me have to take heat and then everybody under them feels some of it lol

if for no other reason they're in a foul mood now

[night girder]

That’s human nature

EU new rule in the work: games must show real world price next to ingame valuta.

https://tweakers.net/ext/i/2007339916.jpeg

Like that 😁

[charred relic]

an improvement

[night girder]

For EU

[charred relic]

i mean they use such scummy tactics

not having aprice and representing real world value with whatever is an old old trick

casinos live chips... that 1000 dollar chip is just... a chip

doesn't really seem like a grand holding it... but it is

[night girder]

Yeah they will find loopholes for this one.

[charred relic]

some places they are required to take cash bets at tables

others not...

[night girder]

But better than doing nothing as a gov

[charred relic]

Yeah it at least gives you an instant reality check on how much money that costs

what grinds my gears about the gambling mechanics is they are going after kids with it... which is just vile

...wonder how many parents have had some major surprise charges to some video game heh

Personally I don't have a weakness to gambling fortunately. We started doing a lottery here decades ago and I've bought maybe 4 scratchers in that time... and once a few numbers to the big one but only because it was mathematically a positive equity gamble.

[night girder]

gambling mechanic is forbidden in EU for years now.

OW lootboxes were not random in EU etc.

some games are not available in my country, because game refuses to remove it. And we don't allow it to be played here.

[charred relic]

The gambling aspect makes it weird becuase like in some places here it's legal, in most it's not. But games... can I guess get away with it.

Personally I feel if somebody has reached adulthood they can do whatever as long as it's not hurting somebody else.

[night girder]

there is this game, looked like diablo, ARPG, with lot of loot mechanics. Banned here 😄

[charred relic]

At some point you just can't project people from...themselves

*protect

[night girder]

forgot it's name, it was popular

[charred relic]

Also gambling is illegal in my state but they have a lottery. So it's OK if it's state sanctioned and run gambling heh

People have pushed to legalize it in Atlanta for a long long time. Underground Atlanta at one point when it was in disrepair would have been the perfect area for that too.

[night girder]

Lost Ark!

[night girder]

But reality is, kids play games too. So what other options are there? forced e-id?

[charred relic]

Well ideally the games that do that stop being predatory greedy cretins but we both know THAT isn't gonna happen

[night girder]

And we know gambling can turn into an addiction, so do we really want to the young ones already interacting with gambling mechanics?

[pure karma]

yes

[night girder]

With that logic, you have to do something. Here it's ban games for now. So it's up to the developers to adjust to the country.

[pure karma]

thats exactly what they want

[night girder]

The other solution proposed, is a login system based on your ID, so you have to plugin your ID before you can play the game.

Not sure what else we can. Facial recognication with AI to calculate age. But then you have to have webcam.

[night girder]

but I said "we"

But yeah, they as in gaming companies, they don't care.

[mental oriole]

@night girder new build delayed by cables now The sf psu cables are bit too short for the case for where I have to place the psu, but grabbing some new braided cables to swap them out with, which should also ease for cable management down the line, they are longer and can be adjusted more easily.

[night girder]

You are getting there

[mental oriole]

yup

[night girder]

Now let's hope it all boots up with no quirks.

[mental oriole]

It booted before, so should be fine.

It's official cables from the supplier so they're compatible.

[night girder]

Nice, did you run benchmarks? Put some pressure on it?

[mental oriole]

Just have to wait for new cables 🙂

[night girder]

my system was fine too, until I started gaming 😄

[mental oriole]

I'll let you know 🙂

[night girder]

I should redo my cable management. I had no clue what I was doing.

[mental oriole]

hehe

[night girder]

I skipped this page in the manual:

It's not bad. I went by my gut. I just didn't put things where they have to be according to the manual.

[charred relic]

How dare you

Ok this one might be so bad it's good... "Popeye the Slayer Man"

[pure karma]

ever since updating drivers obs crashes games with 100% sucess rate 10/10 would defedently update again

and GPU imploded

could have seen that coming

fuck it we ball the integrated graphics will do lmao

[pure karma]

i "fixed" it

and by i fixed it i mean i made it work "enough"

[jagged snow]

Happens way too fast

[languid gulch]

whenever 402 insertions happens too fast for me i have to take the rest of the day off

[languid gulch]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBPRLelsfAg

that would have been really interesting

[languid gulch]

but also it sounds like resources that they should have been putting into ksp2 instead of a quick & lower quality cash grab

[mental oriole]

LGTM 👍

[cobalt ivy]

Chungus 0_0

[feral drift]

Time to get the Dremel to cut the cabinet so it fits :D

[jagged snow]

What're y'alls recommendations for a 2022 era smartphone to grab used

Looking to spend <250 usd and pick up something that era or newer with good battery life

Pixel 7/7pro is an option

Also looking at oneplus 10

Other option is to buy a newer low end phone but those are almost always a worse deal than older flagships

I can get oneplus 10pro for 210 refurb

[jagged snow]

Welp, found a better option on the 10pro and took that

[verbal raft]

why do we have an 8 and 16GB GPU with the same name

[twin dew]

Happened multiple times?
And is completely useful naming when both GPUs are exactly the same except VRAM amount.
But Nvidia has done it where it is pure misdirection with differences in other specs too.

Do you get the lower VRAM model for cheaper, or higher VRAM model for more.
Where the VRAM only makes difference if the lower models VRAM amount is not enough.

[soft bloom]

1 JWST is great
2 lite traveled 33Gly??? that metric makes no sense what so ever
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKoWyBA9Xx8

[visual tree]

Looks like RX 9070 series prices are slowly decreasing 🙂

This one was above €1000 on launch

I believe it will drop even more in 3 months. The reason prices on launch were insane because a lot of people had FOMO and even decided to buy from scalpers

[willow pike]

nature is healing

[dire igloo]

tbf, best pricing info is still collected across multiple AIB designs. Just to weed out board partner supply variance

[visual tree]

I don't believe it will drop under €750 though because of VAT and margin

[twin dew]

On the EU distributor level for that Sapphire 9070 XT Pulse, from one Finnish retailers site tracking (including any margin the retailer has input over the distributor price):

15 in stock at the distributor.

[twin dew]

Which is retailer level price tracking.
Probably showing the cheapest price at any tracket retailer?

My pic was what some specific EU level importer/distributor is charging from retailers (+ store specific margin on top).

That that specific distributor had suddenly added huge amount of extra price into each card retailers would want to buy.

[night girder]

What we doing?

Posting prices of the Sapphire 9070 XT Pulse?

[visual tree]

Yes 👍

[night girder]

Here it's pretty stable it seems.

[twin dew]

That they charged lot of extra during the first day, then dropped the price.
And now hiked it up fuckton.

[night girder]

Index of 7 shops.

[visual tree]

Wish there was an EU country with 10% VAT so I can buy from there

[wanton orchid]

it does not shock me at all
I was just waiting for that kind of stuff to drop

[night girder]

patience is a virtue 😉

[wanton orchid]

spoiler alert : it didn't travel that far

[twin dew]

And the price of any shop with internal inventory is set by the price they got the cards from card manufacturer or importer/distributor.

Which was why I used that one store that has almost no internal inventory, and basically shows for most stuff whatever the price at their supplier is, + that unknown margin for themselves.

Because that EU level distributor pricing is what sets the long term prices.

Unless the specific retailer is big enough to import directly from factories in Asia themselves, which most aren't.

[night girder]

I don't care about the price of source honestly, I am interested in the price at the end (consumer side).

[visual tree]

Yeah. Don't plan on buying a new GPU right now but could after this summer

I wonder how much I could sell my RTX 3060 Ti for

[night girder]

Also anyone can see it's highly similar. 1000-900 range, even less for the shops.

The one you post goes above 1000 euro.

The chart I posted stays below 1000 euro.

[soft bloom]

here's a riddle: how much time it takes light to travel 33gly?

[visual tree]

What's really sad is if VAT here was reduced from 25% to 20% for example, prices wouldn't drop at all

[night girder]

check local stores for prices/websites (2n hand). Here I see prices between 200-300 at a quick glance.

[visual tree]

Just did. Average is around €300

[night girder]

Seems about right 😄

[twin dew]

And Finland has 25.5% VAT, so higher than Germany.
And if you look, the spike in retailer price was just few days ago, not enough to affect any retailer with confirmed orders or like.

[visual tree]

Models under €300 are weaker GPU models

[night girder]

Yeah I know, but still so far similar.

[visual tree]

Yeah, versions like this

[night girder]

Also 8GB

[twin dew]

Probably kind of misinterpretation as the number.
That we calculated that the galaxy today would be 33G LY away, not that it was when the light we are receiving now was emitted.

[visual tree]

I have this version:

[night girder]

Can you allow to bid?

[visual tree]

No bids but people can always ask you to lower the price

[night girder]

Yeah, but anyway. You aren't selling it yet so 😄