off-topic-tech

[charred relic]

like what if we have robots with AI that do work for us... but one or two become self aware

Can't force them to work... that's not right.

What about the rest? They could wake up any time? Are they life too? It could get weird

Some people might view the ones not "awake" like babies or embryos

Drones are kinda scary on their own merit lol

Or... can be

They use decoys

while the counters take care of the decoy BOOM

the one with the boom comes

Imagine a swarm of dozens with fully automatic rifles on them

You walk outside and your house is surrounded heh

Genetic manipulation could fix a lot of things

Doesn't bother me personally but def a can of worms

Somebody asked me how I'd feel about them using m y body for X, Y or Z af ter I die

and I'm like uhhhh I'll be dead I won't care

Honestly somebody can do whatever with my body... if I could I'd donate my corpse to the person with the best idea for a practical joke involving a corpse

You probably haven't met many libertarians... at least not real ones.

lol

My stance in general is this. I really don't care what you 're up to as long as nobody is being harmed in the process.

If you're a grown adult you do you...

A lot of modern libs are really just... republicans or democrats

But as far as those guys I'd have to dig into their politics and aint nobody got time for that

Sometimes they'll answer things a certain way a lib just never would... l

Based on the show I'd say they the writers are at least open minded.

And smart enough to take advantage of hot button issues without going toooooo far (usually)

By too far I mean making too many folks all butthurt

Just remember folks. People have only as much control over your emotions as you give them. 🙂

Give them none, watch them be powerless. Pretty simple.

Best to find something productive to focus them on.

Sure

I kinda want to play the first Assassins Creed for some reason

wonder how much that'll run me

Can't be much at this point surely

5 dollah

totally worth

I have it on 360 if I want to dig a 360 out... and find the disc (technically I could burn one heh

I have 1 and 2 around here somewhere in a box though for 360...

Ah you still got a box and a disc then...

hmph

I was hoping for like... a package deal that had 1, 2 and 3 or something maybe for 10 or 1 5 bucks

But not seeing anything

Oh well 5 for the OG is fine!

wait but what is this... Assassins Creed: Dirctors Cut on GoG... for 20 bucks

mumbles something about needing wikipedia to figure out what edition is what

[languid gulch]

waiting on that carrington level solar flare

i used to agree, but with the direction humanity is going, we need a hard reset

[charred relic]

Oh man I found the disc and I am so tempted to break the 360 out now

Ya knoiw I'll set that up down in the shop, can play it when i take breaks

Pretty sure we're like that meth infested trailer park on the other side of town

the aliens go 10,000 light years out of their way to avoid it

That and we could boom the solar system or something with anti matter at some point, sure tehy'd rather avoid that

Well it's a lot of stuff but it's not like it's packed with stuff up there

It will be eventually if we don't do somethig else though lol

The scary thing is doing a spacewalk something teeny tiny can hit you and compromise that suit

Well there's a LOT of room up there haha

Even in low orbit

For some reason I hate space junk on Kerbal although it doesn't matter. When I travel out I try to leave as little behind as I reasonably can heh

And I try to leave most of it at a certain altitude

One time I came within sight of an old engine stage... guess that's rare but I was like yeah something could def go wrong here

[languid gulch]

i remember when scott manley was able to "dodge" space debris because the physics engine rendered it 1 frame late

i think he was actually trying to hit it tho 🤣

one of the things i always build in KSP is a huge honking relay station at almost the max SOI around kerbin

[charred relic]

space itself can make you unliving

t urn you into something that resembles a chunk of freeze dried jerky

lol

Just imagine having moisture escape literally everywher eit possibly can 🙂

[languid gulch]

we do have video of someone being exposed to vacuum

[charred relic]

Y eah you can't withstand it for too too long

not insta death but you're in fuckin trouble

We are def not designed for a vac hahaha

[languid gulch]

yea the guy said the last thing he remembers was the moisture on his tongue boiling before he passed out

[charred relic]

yeah lol

that had to be wild

[languid gulch]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KO8L9tKR4CY

[charred relic]

Your blood is boiling in there too, it's all boiling it is boilable hahaha

what a way to go...

[languid gulch]

you'd be dead before your blood boiled i think

[charred relic]

probably

i cant' remember how many seconds it is they estimate

before you would just for sure be dead

[languid gulch]

i'm glad humanity has never tested that in reality

[charred relic]

That guy that did t he first high altitude balloon jump had a compromised suit

decided it wasn't too bad, kept it a secret and did it... dude has a brass pair the size of two moons

[languid gulch]

imagine being someone whose job it is is to be subjected to all the same stuff as astronauts, but never be able to go to space

[charred relic]

"so what do you do for a living"

"i help them find out what happens to humans if exposed to space" -nose slides off-

[languid gulch]

although probably one of the best jobs in the world would be briefing astronauts on personal experiences with the training

[charred relic]

Just strap me in the damn rocket

[languid gulch]

"here's the point where you're gonna shit yourself" 🤣

it'd be fun (if there was a way to reduce actual risk to 0) if you could just strap a rando into a rocket and go

[charred relic]

risk 0 removes the fun :/

[languid gulch]

HA

just heard someone blow 2 tires

my neighborhood's near an area that some idiots have decided is a halfway decent racetrack

[charred relic]

There's a bunch of folks around here that reat this one spot near here lik eit's some kinda race track or somethi oh wait that literally is the speedway

[languid gulch]

yea but some people have set up hidden cameras that catch these idiots

[charred relic]

I can see every inch of my property from right here... 😄

[languid gulch]

it's like a 1km x 2km square, 6 traffic lights, an underpass under a highway, an overpass over that same highway (but no access to it, so lower traffic & a big hill), and then a canal crossing with a small hill you can ramp over

no HOA here, we're all just sane people mostly

[charred relic]

HOA's are the devil

like i want to bow down to a bored Karen...

[languid gulch]

i've never seen one that didn't devolve into greedy & corrupt stupidity

i'm sure it's possible to have a good one, but it's so reliant on single people not being jackasses

[charred relic]

Like I said before most are fine but it's a situation where if it's bad it can be so so bad I'd rather avoid them entirely

They can make your life a living hell

[languid gulch]

if our neighborhood needs something, we get together and talk it out

[charred relic]

heh

[languid gulch]

the houses here that started off as tacky are now landmarks that everyone knows

🤣

i don't live with an HOA, but my sister lives with one that's nationally notorious

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrizmAo17Os

he does a fantastic job

mostly they're there to pay for collective maintenance to make the neighborhood have a consistent look, but man it always seems to go off a cliff

the whole "$275 fine for having your rear bumper over the sidewalk" shit is where things go wrong

[charred relic]

The roads here are city/county

ditto for the street lights....

[languid gulch]

yea same

[charred relic]

So tax money covers all that

light goes out, somebody makes a call

[languid gulch]

HOAs like to piss off their residents by burning cash on lawsuits against the city when it comes to that kind of maintenance

[charred relic]

pothole, we make a call

Doin't need a bunch of bored Karnes for that...

heh i used to mess with new employees at the theater my sister was manager of

[languid gulch]

oh they're not bored, it's the entire reason for their existence

[charred relic]

i'd be in the area and swing by and act like a karen going " I need to see the MANAGER"

they'd get all nervous and start saying sorry and trying to help and im like nah seriously i need to see the manager, she's my sister

My theory is some of them wanted to be in politics but they suck at politics so this is as close as they can get...

[languid gulch]

when we needed the main wall painted, the painting contractor did it with some leftovers 🤣

[charred relic]

Gotta watch your cats here... we have fox

[languid gulch]

and with the savings, we all pitched in and raised the wall by 4 bricks so that the entire row of houses had a bit more privacy

[languid gulch]

we have foxes, coyotes, and the occasional javelina

[charred relic]

im trying to make friends with some of the foxies

[languid gulch]

don't, they're rabies carriers

i am

[charred relic]

they're fine :))

[languid gulch]

lol no

[charred relic]

Bats can carry it too, doesn't mean they are

[languid gulch]

yea but i'm not about to risk it

[charred relic]

Have tons of those... might have to do with all the bat boxes i have up out back 😄

[languid gulch]

we have bats every once in a while

[charred relic]

sometimes i can count a dozen in eyesight fluttering around in the evenings

[languid gulch]

sometimes they show up on our weather radar

[charred relic]

sometimes you get a nice look if they swoop right in front of ya to get a bug

lil cuties 😄

[languid gulch]

this is from a couple years ago

[charred relic]

I play with spiders... and snakes

[languid gulch]

somehow we've never had a tarantula or a rattlesnake here

got plenty of scorpions tho

[charred relic]

I've seen two scropions ever here

little teeny ones

[languid gulch]

yea ours are bark scorps

[charred relic]

one was on my arm, i thought it was a spider until i actually looked

[languid gulch]

only spiders we have here are little ones or black widows

[charred relic]

then i was like holy shit it's a scorpion that's too cool!

[languid gulch]

if they get in the house i'll kill them

outside they're fine

[charred relic]

I'll relocate spiders 🙂

Although some are supposed to be inside, they can stay 🙂

[languid gulch]

our scorps mean we don't have crickets or roaches

[charred relic]

Only two dangerous spiders here

As far as I'm concerned the spiders can shroud this entire house in webs at night

keep all the annoying insects out 🙂

[languid gulch]

we have vinegaroons occasionally

[charred relic]

The bats eat a LOT of flying insects as well

[languid gulch]

they look like tiny bebeliths

[charred relic]

And I have a venus fly trap... she does what she can

We have a lot of jumping spiderrs and they are super fun

Tend to be quite curious and seem to want to interact sometimes

[languid gulch]

a bit of nightmare fuel

[charred relic]

wonder what they taste like...

[languid gulch]

but yea, tell me that ain't the direct inspiration for the D&D bebelith

that's probably on the short list of unique stuff from around here

blue tongue skinks

gila monsters

[charred relic]

I've played with bugs and other critters since I was a kid so none of that stuff phases me

I'll be wrangling in a garter snake and buddy is like the hell you doing

im like relax he's friendly enough

[languid gulch]

they're basically harmless, but when they run at you with the pincers out it's definitely scary

they can move

[charred relic]

Sea roaches

[languid gulch]

mermaid scorpions

i've had deep fried rattlesnake

[charred relic]

No I'm not that hard up for protein...yet.

I keep telling vegans they should just stop it... because in dire enough circumstances not only am i not vegan but you become part of the menu

...they might want to remember that

wonder if vegans taste better...

lol

i mean... grass fed beef taste better than corn fed

[languid gulch]

my stomach doesn't do beef anymore. idk what happened, but literally just one day it said nope, and i haven't been able to handle it since

[charred relic]

I like grass fed beef, kinda spoiled on it

[languid gulch]

it really is weird that you can taste the difference between corn & grass fed beef 🤣 but yes, grass fed was always better to me too

[charred relic]

Buffallo is healthier

[languid gulch]

bison population is still way too low for me to be willing to try it

we do have a restaurant nearby that serves it tho

[charred relic]

All I know is this... and never forget.

Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo

that is actually a valid sentence in english

[languid gulch]

i still get a kick out of europeans who think buffalo wings are made out of buffalo

[charred relic]

LOL

well that means they think buffallo have wings?

little...tiny wings?

[languid gulch]

or just wing shaped chunks

[charred relic]

just imagine those lil tteny tiny wings on a big buffallo

[languid gulch]

like our version of shark fin soup or something 🤣

[charred relic]

wings are too expensive at most restaurants

I usually just make them myself at home

[languid gulch]

ngl most of them are probably about on par with what you could get frozen from a store

it's the sauces that make the wings good

[charred relic]

Yeah

It's really just a conduit for sauce

[languid gulch]

hunt down stuff from Kansas City or Tennessee

[charred relic]

The chicken here is actually fine... other than the breed they use has no flavor heh

big ass chickens tho

Yay for selective breeding... they bred in size and bed out flavor

[languid gulch]

we're mainly good at taking foods from different places and smashing them together into something new & tasty

[charred relic]

Well even our chinese food is just what the immigrants came up with for the american taste

[languid gulch]

yup

[charred relic]

Sure is taste though 🙂

What I like is ging to a good Japense steakhouse

those guys are artists... the chefs

[languid gulch]

insulting "american cheese" is insulting european cheese since it's just a 4 cheese blend

[charred relic]

Ahh it's not cheese... if you look at Kraft slices nowhere does it say cheese!

[languid gulch]

i'd argue our food isn't any better, just larger

[charred relic]

they cannot legall call themselves cheese heh, it's a dairy product

we call it cheese... but cheese it is not

[languid gulch]

oh that stuff yea, but the stuff labeled american cheese

like how a lot of ice cream is now labeled "frozen dairy dessert" because of how little cream it has

[charred relic]

Soimebody challenged me on kraft american slices being cheese

told them to show me ont he package where it says it's cheese lol

Makes good grilled cheese sammiches though :/

I like it on burgers...

[languid gulch]

american food, from the people who brought you "how much sawdust can we stuff into this jam until someone notices" 🤣

[charred relic]

I know people who loved worcestershire sauce forever before even knowing what it was lol

like yeah playah it's basically fermented fish juice

🙂

[languid gulch]

oh mcdonalds would probably kill to protect their potatoes

[charred relic]

I hope they go back to using tallow

for real, the fries were WAY better then

like WAY better

[languid gulch]

mcdonald's ketchup is a special blend

[charred relic]

ya know i think you're right

[languid gulch]

it's advertised as Heinz, but it's their own patented mix

[charred relic]

it doesn't taste like heinz or huntz

it almost tastes liek both heh

[languid gulch]

restaurants here have been competing with their fries lately, i wouldn't put mcdonald's in the top 10 anymore

[charred relic]

well if mcdonalds goes back to frying in lard

you might sing a different tune lol

[languid gulch]

eh, maybe

[charred relic]

i stoped with fast food, it's all terrible now

[languid gulch]

same

[charred relic]

i rarely ate it before anyhow so walking away entirely wasn't hard

[languid gulch]

the only fast food i get anymore is from Salad n' Go. gigantic salad for $8

[charred relic]

I'll sometimes do a beef n cheddar from arbys, or chik fil a, that's about it

Every time I try anywhere else it's cold

fries rubbery...

[languid gulch]

yea look at this. $8 and even tho it's an ad pic, that's 100% what it looks like. dump the dressing on it, put the lid on, shake it around

1 whole sliced egg, avocado, chicken, bacon, tomatoes, onions, lettuce

[charred relic]

Mcdonalds marketing and reality as so far apart it's comical

[languid gulch]

idk why they've never been successfully sued for false advertising

[charred relic]

They show this pristine gourmey looking burger, what you get it uhhh... yeah

not....that...

[languid gulch]

stomped on with a boot

[charred relic]

yeah basically, like they made the nice one then stomped it

describes it perfectly actually

[languid gulch]

🤣

[charred relic]

one time i ordered with no onions and i swear to god they were fucking with me becuase when i got him that thing had a half an oninion on it

[languid gulch]

i don't trust myself with a kebab, i just know i'm gonna stick my face with it

[charred relic]

like i have never seen a burger with so much minced onion

i've never seen 3 bugers...

[charred relic]

I like a little... this was over the top

The biggest trick to a good burger, honestly, get fatty beef.

Lean beef makes terrible burgers.

[languid gulch]

steak burgers

the best american burger is actually canadian. i present to you the Double Big Mac, unavailable in the USA

[charred relic]

Trust me a lot is available here not on the menu heh

Some employees know about those items, some do not.

[languid gulch]

oh yea but it's fucking insane to me that the double isn't on there at all

[charred relic]

Some are even on the register heh

But yeah you can get those here... if they know wtf you're talking about or it's one on the register... and you know to ask

so,...i might could get one lol

or they might look at me likw wtf is he on about...

There's some shit not on the menu anywhere... they probably have thststuff there too surely

the "hidden" menu items

[languid gulch]

there's a tiny town in Iowa where you can get a 1lb post-cooked burger

450g patty

[charred relic]

I used to be able to down a double quarter pounder super sized

i wouldn't finish the fries now...without even touching the burger

[languid gulch]

THE GUNDER BURGER

the town's like a house, a restaurant, a mailbow, and a dog

[charred relic]

That is another FF place I'll still go to...

They have steakburgers

[languid gulch]

i've had people assume i'm french because of my username

when you say it it's kinda close to cuillère

yea but the only belgian stuff we're willing to call belgian are waffles & guns

[charred relic]

mostly waffles...

Oh yeah... The Varisty downtown is another exception but that's more of a specialty type thing... and that place is an Atlanta icon

The burgers come looking like mcdonalds squished... but uhhh that's also how they're supposed to look lol

Interestingly enough I don't often see people order waffles at The Waffle House...

spiderman spiderman swinging from a rubber band...

I don't have any cats but my neighbor does... they come hang out with me becuase they know I give good scritches

[twin dew]

https://www.theverge.com/news/617901/nvidia-confirms-rare-rtx-5090-and-5070-ti-manufacturing-issue

[verbal raft]

#LackWell

[charred relic]

Hey Dude Where's My Cores

[glossy glacier]

Just generate them with DLSS duh

[languid gulch]

Multi ROP Generation

[charred relic]

https://tenor.com/view/trollfacelmaaaao-gif-23938565

I didn't watch it but I saw a video where apparently at least one VRM has failed

Somebody gonna die in a fire at this rate...

[twin dew]

Yeah, VRM on Asus 5090 Astral gave up its internals as smoke and flame.

So Nvidia is still disabling all VRM chip protections.

Ok, that was wrong, those protections don't protect agains all kinds of faults.

[verbal raft]

leaked RDNA 4 benchmarks !?
https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-radeon-rx-9070-series-gaming-performance-leaked-rx-9070xt-is-42-faster-on-average-than-7900-gre-at-4k

seems like we wont be getting 6800 XT V3

[dire igloo]

tbf, Nvidia also claimed the 5070 performed like a 4090 when not even the 5080 did

[twin dew]

But that slide did have the small print at bottom that it was FG 2x vs. MFG 4x at specific DLSS settings, just colored etc. to be less noticeable.

[languid gulch]

i'm so sick of them not putting out just the raw base performance metrics

[twin dew]

There might still be CPU selection fuckery going on, but would need to see more of the slides.

[verbal raft]

NVEDEA had that as Multi flame gen 4X

AMD has native numbers here

[languid gulch]

yea but do they list the game settings

[dire igloo]

throwback to when people cared about TFLOPS

[glossy glacier]

Tbf the article is not with/from official AMD sources. It's just what they could gather from spying

[verbal raft]

thats irrelevent unless AMD used different settings between each card
the scaling is what metters all that matters is that they be directly comparable

[twin dew]

Because raw TFLOPS doesn't tell the actual performance in anything.

That TechPowerUp GPU comparison is based on that, and is often way out of whack.

[glossy glacier]

Seems like a 7900XT V2

[verbal raft]

the only way that'd be fair is if it costs the same

though it'd be impressive given the lower core count

[glossy glacier]

If the numbers are true the RX 9070 is about 20% better than the RX 7900 GRE which itself is about 20% worse than the RX 9700 XT

[languid gulch]

looks like both AMD & Nvidia have stalled out this generation

[glossy glacier]

If the RX 9070 is in the 400-500$ range that'd be great

[languid gulch]

it wont be

[glossy glacier]

More and it'll be stagnation, true

[languid gulch]

i'd like to know why they wouldn't just discount current manufactured stuff instead of having to invest in new stuff and still have a lowered price

[twin dew]

Always happens when the two gens are on same node.

[verbal raft]

gen on gen uplift ?
let me introduce you to ZEN 2 and ZEN 3 : )

[glossy glacier]

Leaks say 500-600 for the XT, so 400-500 for the normal should be possible

[twin dew]

Zen 2 was minor rehash of Zen 1 on new node.
Zen 3 was major redesign on same node as Zen 2.

On GPU side there aren't often low hanging fruit left for major performance improvements by raising IPC.
RDNA3 tried to do that, but failed.

[languid gulch]

yea but you're not thinking like a greedy bastard

[glossy glacier]

I see performance from a >700 card in a <600 card as a win

[languid gulch]

and radeon execs will use that logic to make a $700+ card $700+

[glossy glacier]

Zen2 was a big change from Zen1. They switched to chiplets!

Zen2 to Zen3 was a smaller change with the combination of the 2 CCX per CCD to one

[twin dew]

No.

As the first largely "ground up redesign" of the Zen CPU core since the architecture family's original release in early 2017 with Zen 1/Ryzen 1000, Zen 3 was a significant architectural improvement over its predecessors; having a very significant IPC increase of +19% over the prior Zen 2 architecture in addition to being capable of reaching higher clock speeds.
Much more than just CCX change from 4 cores to 8 cores.

[willow pike]

zen 5 was another such ground up redesign but focused more on AVX512 and it gets held back more by the IO die

zen 2 still used quad core CCDs cause it's an improved zen 1

[twin dew]

"Make it chiplet based" basically.

[charred relic]

But like... they're just glued together (this message brought to you by Intel

[verbal raft]

quad core ???

no?

[willow pike]

CCX

my bad

it's been so long since CCD and CCX weren't the same thing I forgot

[verbal raft]

wat

[willow pike]

core complex

[verbal raft]

is that the CPU core chiplet ?

[willow pike]

zen 2 had two 4-core complexes on one chiplet

[verbal raft]

ohhh

i see

[twin dew]

And those two couldn't talk directly on the die, everything passed through IOD.

Even between the two CCXs on same CCD.

[willow pike]

yeag

[glossy glacier]

Huh, okay yeah. Apparently Zen1 already used chiplets in the EPYC parts. Alway thought that was the new huge thing with Zen2. Zen2 brought it just to consumers.
Zen+ was a bugfix and transistor shrink.
Zen3 then was a huge optimization including combining the CCXs, more cache and faster IF

[willow pike]

so you had two lots of 16MB L3 cache

then zen 3 changed that, instead of 4 cores being fully connected, you had 8 cores on a ring bus

said ring bus was also designed with x3d in mind

[willow pike]

yeah, one 8 core die for ryzen, two for threadripper, four for epyc

they instantly got to 32 cores cheaply while intel were charging like twenty grand for 28 cores

[verbal raft]

#ThreadRipper

[willow pike]

and zen got a 52% IPC bump from FX

[verbal raft]

its easy to be way better than garbage

[verbal raft]

and
FakeCores

[willow pike]

i'm not even super mad about the idea of sharing floating point cores if you just bought a GPU company and they do floating point math

things didn't turn out that way (CPU floating point still has many uses)

but good fucking lord every other decision they made was the wrong one

[twin dew]

Heterogenous computing as another hype tech that didn't pan out in the end.

[willow pike]

they figured it out eventually, don't compromise on any one piece to prop another piece up

stronk cpu, stronk gpu, they even bought xilinx

strix halo is the best heterogeneous computing chip out there and it's not what they thought heterogeneous computing was gonna be

[visual tree]

Not to mention RTX 4000 series production has been halted with the exception of RTX 4050/4060 afaik

[verbal raft]

https://tenor.com/view/champoy-el-risitas-kek-issou-etu-gif-17837830

[visual tree]

RTX 4080 is now being sold for above €2000 and it's only going to go higher because the supply will soon run out

[languid gulch]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HahfZk-QmUc

great video title

[night girder]

8 threads huh?

[twin dew]

Probably taking that "Module is two int cores", when it isn't.

[night girder]

Yeah, double checked it.

[verbal raft]

4 real threads + 4 fake threads

[willow pike]

8 integer threads, 4 floating point threads

[night girder]

Versus.com: AMD is better. Passmark.com: Intel is better.

[twin dew]

Versus is just comparing paper specs in very stupid way.

[willow pike]

if it's pre-steamroller, even the integer threads will fight over stuff

[night girder]

Yeah, wanted to say; anyone else not liking results of versus?

[twin dew]

Absolutely useless except when comparing same manufacturers same generation.

[night girder]

That's why I went to passmark for aggregated results. Not perfect.

[languid gulch]

wait, why not just use userbenchmark

[night girder]

35W vs 65W oof.

For 48% gain? Well, kinda make sense.

[twin dew]

T variants are 35W.

So i5-7500 is 65W, i5-7500T is 35W

[night girder]

I only use userbenchmark when I want to buy Intel, and I want a website to tell me Intel is the good choice 😉

[languid gulch]

oh i know, it pained me to write that

[night girder]

I am looking into 7500 not 7500T.

[twin dew]

But few days ago the other option was T-variant IIRC.

[night girder]

Yeah, I look into it daily to see what new products hit the market.

Then I take into consideration; price, distance to pick up or how much it costs to send.

Problem with this one is that it's integrated into the screen

[verbal raft]

versus be like : gooder jiggle hertz = more gooder performance

[night girder]

Intel Core i5 4e-gen processor
8GB geheugen
256GB harddisk

I hate some of these descriptions.

Intel Core i5-4570T @ 2.90GHz - 2 core it turns out.

Why not just post that for fucks sake.

And these is from 2nd hand hardware sellers.

[dire igloo]

Passmark is about as helpful as Userbenchmark, while their data is accurate, their tests are just computation

[dire igloo]

because it doesn't sell, easy as that

misinforming people by not mentioning specs is standard practice

[twin dew]

But in general the comparison is being made between 35W Excavator APU parts, and Intel parts of same timeframe.

[dire igloo]

also, plenty people still believe that paper specs matter in some form

[dire igloo]

just stating that I'd turn to neither of the three websites if I want any tangible result

UBM, Passmark, versus, doesn't matter. none of them are any helpful

[twin dew]

Just that that those Passmark results were closest to useful.
They are at least somewhat manufacturer agnostic results from specific CPU test suite.

Not anywhere near perfect, but best there is in this case as the old actual CPU reviews never covered the stuff.

[dire igloo]

if I wanted to have some surface level convenience over accuracy CPU comparison site, cpu-monkey is better than all those combined

[verbal raft]

i just use GN or HUB

[dire igloo]

GN sadly doesn't have aggregates

TH and TPU also good

but Letterdief doesn't like TPU cuz he doesn't understand how they present their data

[twin dew]

35W 9800E not in Monkey, but for the same as previous with 65W version for AMD too:
https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-amd_a12_9800-vs-intel_core_i5_7500

[dire igloo]

I absolutely love 3dcenter for GPUs. their data has an asterisk too (being launch data), but it's an actual aggregate

[twin dew]

In which A12-9800 is 50-65% of i5-7500:s performance.

In the few tests that both had runs on.
Several tests were one or other only.

[night girder]

Didn't you use passmark a while back to link to me?

[twin dew]

Yes.
As CPU Monkey didn't get as result back then and I didn't remember the existence.

When options given were Versus, UserBenchMark and PassMark...
PassMark was at least neutral and actual testing.

Limited coverage, but real results.

[dire igloo]

yeah, PM is the best of those three
which says more about UBM and versus than it does about Passmark tho

[twin dew]

And point was to show how bad Excavator is/was compared to same timeframe Intel.

Except for the IGP.

[night girder]

I need something to compare hardware. Can't just buy blind.

[languid gulch]

lol

my first desktop cpu was the 9700

and yes, was 100% trash

iirc they tried to advertise those bulldozers as having "10 cores" (4cpu+6gpu) but hiding that fact as much as possible

[willow pike]

it was a mistake

[languid gulch]

i think it was after amd had already gotten nailed for lying about their core count with FX tho

[night girder]

Anyone have JURA?

[visual tree]

I still have Jura E8 for 6 years and it's the most robust coffee machine I ever owned

Made a lot of coffee and it has never broken

Just make sure to clean it regularly and it should last for a long time

[night girder]

pretty pricy for a coffee machine

[visual tree]

Yeah, that's the only downside with Jura

[night girder]

almost a low/mid range PC

[visual tree]

Mine was €932

[night girder]

does it cut beans?

[visual tree]

You mean, does it have a grinder?

[night girder]

yeah, grinded or beans?

[visual tree]

Yes, it grinds beans and you can set the settings for fine or coarse coffee

I think there is also a compartment where you can insert already ground coffee afaik

I think it's this hole

[night girder]

Jura ENA 3 for 150 (second hand).

[visual tree]

Don't know about that model but you can compare prices from your local stores with computeruniverse.net from where I bought my Jura

[night girder]

3 is discontinued.

Jura E4 is 760.

[visual tree]

@dire igloo Maybe Fireworker still has a discount code. I think he gave me a discount few years ago when I was buying new PC hardware from Computeruniverse

[night girder]

Nah, I'll buy it 2nd hand.

Way too pricey to buy brand new.

[soft bloom]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca_sxDTPo60

[night girder]

My current one cost my 20 euros and is holding for 10 years.

Just some plastic crappy one with one/off button and filters.

but robust (bought it in construction shop).

[visual tree]

Just don't buy those coffee pod machines. I am not a big fan of them tbh

[night girder]

doesn't taste great though 🤣

[night girder]

I have euhm... fuck forgot the name.

Nespresso.

[visual tree]

Nespresso is the most common brand here

[night girder]

But they changed something to the cups in my shop.

and now the cups are always leaking all over the machine.

And the plastic waste is incredible.

So that's the reason I am looking for an alternative.

[visual tree]

My sister owns an Nespresso and I hate it. The coffee has that artificial flavor

[night girder]

it's convenient. But you have lots of cups at the end of each day.

and before you can throw them out, you have the drain the water from them.

Else all the water will collect in the garbage bag.

[dire igloo]

it was from an influencer collab but that ran out sadly

[visual tree]

Np 👍

Thanks for the code btw

[night girder]

I do have espresso machine, but I don't like small cups with high caffeine.

I rather have large cup with less caffeine so I can sip more 🤣

[dire igloo]

yw

[visual tree]

Just avoid Philips LatteGo series like a plague

[night girder]

I got delonghi esspresso 😄

[visual tree]

My sister had it (including my former company) and it's a nightmare to clean. Also had issues with milk container leaking

Not to mention mold collecting after only 1 month

[night girder]

nespresso. a coffee machine. And even a perculator.

[visual tree]

Wish I had barista-grade coffee machine but that's going to cost me a fortune lol

[willow pike]

espresso mentioned

i can spec you a grinder and machine that comes to about £750

and will be as barista grade as you could ever want

i've been doing espresso for ten years and i can reliably get it tasting delicious

[night girder]

You might need to read a bit up Whyzeman 😄

[willow pike]

yeah I saw y'all considering a €1000 machine

a superautomatic

i cannot stand them as they're a nightmare to keep clean and the grinders are below par

[night girder]

Not at all. Way to expensive for me.

[visual tree]

Depends on the brand. I have Jura E8 and it's very easy to clean

[willow pike]

if i had to buy all new coffee gear right now, i would get a DF54 grinder, and gaggia classic espresso machine, or maybe a breville bambino if budget is tight

[visual tree]

Philips is an abomination when it comes to coffee machines btw lol

[willow pike]

grinders really do make all the difference; when i upgraded mine it was like a whole new drink

and I've never heard of any superauto having a good one

maybe new breville oracles but that's not a superauto really

[visual tree]

Noted 👍

Hope my Jura will last another 4 years though (so far, it had zero malfunctions)

[night girder]

All I was wondering is, is it worth to spend 1000 euro's for a machine, when a 20 euro machine gets the job done.

What does that 980 extra euro give me?

[willow pike]

the gaggia classic can be modded with a gagguino which turns it into a £4000 machine

[night girder]

I might be willing to spend 200 euro. But not that much more

[willow pike]

taste gud

espresso is not a cheap hobby

[night girder]

Not espresso.

[willow pike]

this i will grant you

[night girder]

Regular coffee.

[willow pike]

aeropress will do you fine but it's still worth grinding fresh

for a tight budget I would get a hand grinder

ground coffee loses most of its flavour after 30 minutes, so preground won't taste as good

[visual tree]

I was considering getting a grinder + espresso machine for a long time but my parents are lazy when it comes to coffee and prefer all-in-one machine

[verbal raft]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0xAqkzQ53k

[willow pike]

tasty

[night girder]

I don't like espresso. Too small.

Too strong 🤣

[willow pike]

aeropress gud

a good grinder will elevate any coffee brewing method

[visual tree]

You can set how much espresso milliliters you want and you can add milk later if you want

[willow pike]

i am fond of aeropress for being simple, tasty, cheap, reliable and durable

yeah diluting espresso with milk makes real tasty drinks too but i have stopped doing that now my espresso is good enough

[visual tree]

Corect me if I am wrong but all types of coffee are basically modifications of espresso

[willow pike]

99% of any coffee you get in a coffee shop will be espresso because it's fast

[visual tree]

Yeah, barista will just add milk if you want it

[willow pike]

but there's pour over, french press, aeropress, V60, chemex, drip, percolation, moka pot, turkish

none of these are espresso

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KCYmk3bTxA definitely not espresso

[visual tree]

Oh, forgot about those but I was refering to the ones you get in a bar which are almost 99% espresso as you mentioned

There are few ones that also make turkish coffee

[willow pike]

yeah because espresso is fast

nyoom

though it takes me ten minutes to make one because i fuss about with it to make it taste better

i will never tell anyone they need an espresso machine; y'all drink your coffee as you like it. but a good grinder is worth the investment no matter how you drink it

-# at least two years from now they won't come out with a newer espresso machine with frame generation

[visual tree]

There is a turkish store here making the best baklava, rahat lokum and selling some other turkish products

I've seen them making turkish coffee in a sand like the video above

[willow pike]

I've always wanted to try it

[mental oriole]

I'm never touching coffee.

[willow pike]

tasty

[visual tree]

Local store selling baklava, rahat lokum and some other turkish products

They bring you a coffee in a traditional plate like this:

[night girder]

Turkish coffee is good.

[glossy basin]

is a laptop 4080 overkill for the game?

[verbal raft]

this one ?
yes

[visual tree]

Even my RTX 3060 Ti is overkill

[ebon egret]

Playing on a 1050 and i had a good experience balancing performance and lighting quality

[manic cipher]

Looks like the satellite is having issues again.

[ebon egret]

Excuse me what

[jagged snow]

Hey I see me in that little patch of unpleasant raininess

[night girder]

Macbook Pro is confusing the hell out of my. When I switch fron wifi to lan. It just works. When I switch from lan to wifi. I need to do either:

a) Enable wifi. Disable wifi. Enable wifi. To get internet.
b) DHCP release.

[mental oriole]

[night girder]

thinking of making little script, to switch from lan to wifi, and release DHCP

[mental oriole]

The fact you need to in the first place ...

[night girder]

I know, macOS has interface priorities, not sure if something goes wrong there.

and everytime I switch from wifi to lan, I have internet. So really no clue why it's only in one direction.

probably because the ethernet interface stays active and I disable the wifi interface. Apple is not that smart.

You plug in ethernet cable, it keeps using wifi. Even if priority is ethernet > wifi. So I have to disable wifi to get ethernet

[mental oriole]

[night girder]

I know ... something so trivial and even that doesn't work.

Maybe I should make a script for better interface prioritization.

Crazy stories out there.

[willow pike]

https://tenor.com/view/dealwithit-steve-jobs-stevejobs-apple-gif-4462573

[cedar lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/fire-gif-10341555270454130792

[languid gulch]

5080s now being reported missing 8 ROPs

[willow pike]

-# jesus christ

[languid gulch]

speculation about how it could be happening:

[languid gulch]

wtf is that percentage shit 🤣

[safe trench]

not sure if i already sent this

but its funny so

and now that were at it

[mental oriole]

[safe trench]

||i made this one my self
so i better see 98$ in my go fund me that doesnt exist||

[verbal raft]

[charred relic]

DLFS, Deep Learning Flame Sampling. Don't worry only one out of 4 fire flames will be real fire.

[mental oriole]

[charred relic]

Just make sure to have your Deep Learning Fire Extinguisher handy...

[twin dew]

Only 5999.99 while supplies last.

[charred relic]

jk paper launch can't find them for under 12 grand

paper launch for a paper launch only need to manufacturer like... 1

I need to keep track with the AMD stuff in case I wanna upgrade...

[manic cipher]

All those pictures look exactly the same.

[verbal raft]

https://tenor.com/view/willem-dafoe-laugh-crazy-car-gif-22580177

[night girder]

👀

Ah (5080)

Funny how the 5090 story spreads, with screenshots of 5080.

Ok, found it.

[twin dew]

That 5090 and 5070 TIs being out with too few ROPs was known before, now during last 24h first 5080s with same problem were found.

It was just spotted first on 5090s.
Then Nvidia put out PR that about 0.5% of 5090s and 5070 TIs were affected.

And after that some affected 5080s have been found.

[night girder]

Nice. Nvidia said production line is fixed.

[night girder]

Baldur, for what does the T stand for with Intel CPU like 6500T?

I noticed lower TDP

[pure karma]

talk about some max efficiency

fake frames and fake numbers

[charred relic]

https://tenor.com/view/crazy-eyes-steve-buscemi-big-eyes-gif-14249327279284242293

But... the ROPs technically are there...right?

[twin dew]

Just type modifier which usually denotes that lower power variant for Intel.
Like K and F etc.

So usually same max turbo, lower base frequency, and lower TDP than the base version.
But otherwise same.

And usually binned for that lower power, to retain as much of the normal performance as possible, and correspondinly higher price per unit.

[night girder]

If they are cut off by a laser, they aren't technical there.

[night girder]

But no clue what the T sstands for

[twin dew]

None of them stand for anything.

[night girder]

I find that... confusing.

What person just makes up letters without any abbreviations.

[twin dew]

T is lower TDP.
K is overclockable (and sometimes larger changes now from the base version, including core counts etc.)
F is without IGP.

[night girder]

Tdp. Ok. overclocKable. Ok. IGP ... no no clue.

[twin dew]

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/processor-numbers.html
Part: Suffixes for Intel Core Ultra and Intel Core Processors

But they don't really have any meaning, and never have had.

[night girder]

Thanks Baldur 👍

[charred relic]

i buy parts all the time that have a lettering or numbreing suffix that doesn't stand for anything other than telling you the type

[night girder]

T = "Power-optimized lifestyle" ... the marketing

[twin dew]

Yup.

[night girder]

For people like me, it's highly confusing. And maybe that is their intent. Just throw random data (suffixes) at the consumer, let them figure it out. If they don't figure it out, they buy blindly. Higher chance they buy overpriced product etc.

[charred relic]

Some stuff is named for it's dimensions... like an 18650 or similar battery.

[twin dew]

K used to be purely that it is unlocked.
But in later gens Intel changed it to have much larger differences.

Now that unlocked multiplied means almost nothing.

[dire igloo]

or m.2 formfactors

[dire igloo]

But wouldn't a blind consumer buy the cheaper of two options if they can't tell them apart?

[twin dew]

Suffixless is the general option?

[tough owl]

What again is the difference between 5090 and 5090d

[twin dew]

Second is special China version to be below US export limits.

[tough owl]

Got it

Functionally same card different name for exports

Weird but ok

[twin dew]

The specs are probably not right.
Should be lower performance.

5090D specs might have not been released anywhere.
For previous gen:

4090D offers only 14,592 CUDA cores and 425W TDP, compared to 16,384 CUDA cores and 450W TDP of the RTX 4090

Ah, only AI reduction:

AI TOPS have been reduced from 3,352 to 2,375.

Well, tensor core performance reduction

[willow pike]

exactly how are 5080s missing ROPs anyway

they're not harvested

iun get it and i haven't ever heard of anything like it happening

[twin dew]

You know it to be not harvested?
Or you expect it to be not harvested when it is the highest spec product using the die?

And might be that the process to burn the turbo table for example has been hitting some ROP disable too for example.

[willow pike]

i haven't seen any evidence that it's not a full GB103

[twin dew]

Can only be proven or disproven once someone makes x-ray or similar dieshot of the actual die and tries to count the functional stuff.

But for large die, not ever selling the full version is pretty common and every SKU has disabled units.

[visual tree]

When AI betrays it's own creator

X later "fixed" the output

[dire igloo]

"if I were allowed to mention Elon Musk for this question, I would"

[twin dew]

But question is, was Trump already blocked from being mentioned when that original reply of Elon Musk was done...

[visual tree]

I think Musk got confused when he said Grok 3 is the smartest AI in the world. Maybe he meant AI smarter than Musk

[twin dew]

Might be smartest AI.
But the first rule of current Twitter is that you aren't allowed to say bad things about Musk, no matter how true.
If you do, you get shadow banned in various ways.

[visual tree]

From what I read, when X noticed this., they rushed with a quick fix without approval from the management and probably made a mistake in the process

[dire igloo]

With how full he is of himself, anyone smarter than him would seem like the smartest person on earth.
It's just that he believes no human can be smarter than him, so any super basic chatbot gets that crown instead

[twin dew]

And the point was that it doesn't take much to be "smartest AI", when they are all extremely dumb?

[visual tree]

Should have laid off ketamine

[sharp oasis]

It's time to figure out how to make a windows recovery partition by hand so I have a proper one and not one that's mashed in with my system files.

Goofy ahh Toshiba recovery system

[visual tree]

Btw, I moved from intel to amd 3 years ago and now I am considering moving from nvidia to amd too when my GPU stops working in a few years or becomes outdated. Nvidia is trying really hard to get rid of it's loyal gamers

Although, not to be confused, amd ain't a saint, they also have their shady practices

[night girder]

Nah, AMD doesn't do anything shady

[glossy glacier]

I know how. Need help? @sharp oasis

[night girder]

Just try to figure out price for performance.

e.g:

AMD GPU: 10% less performance, 50% cheaper

vs

Nvidia GPU: 10% more powerful, 50% more expensive.

Or vice versa.

[visual tree]

I picked ryzen over intel 3 years ago mainly because specific models with same performance were cheaper

[twin dew]

Less than a year ago CPU "comparison" in games with RX6600 as GPU.

As the last big lie from AMD marketing in official slides.

In marketing for Ryzen 5900XT and 5800XT

[visual tree]

I got shocked today when I noticed used rtx 3060 ti on amazon is being sold for a price higher than the new rtx 3060 ti I bought 3 years ago

People are trying to avoid rtx 5000 series anyway they can

[night girder]

If it wasn't obvious, I was sarcastic 😉

[sharp oasis]

Would be appreciated

I already have the recovery partition created but is there anyway I can move the winre without using a usb stick

I suppose I could mount iso unpack the recovery and move it onto the recovery partition somehow

But that probably involves setting up a drive letter for said partition and I need help with alot of that

[willow pike]

every company will be as shady as they can be. problem is people keep buying nvidia even when it's not the best option and now they can get away with murder

[visual tree]

Yeah, nvidia really pissed me off with rtx 5000 series

I am not giving you money this time....

[night girder]

You lasted longer.

Nvidia (and scalping) pissed me off during Corona.

[visual tree]

Oh, don't even want to remember than nightmare

I managed to order my GPU and then the order was canceled next day because there was no stock even though there was when I made an order

Ended up ordering all other hardware from the store and GPU from amazon

[languid gulch]

i wouldn't be on nvidia if it wasn't free

and better than what i had

ok, since this is my first time with a water cooled cpu, is it normal for it to have temp spikes under initial load kinda like how air cooling is

[glacial zephyr]

I'd assume so, the temp will rise quickly at first and then should settle

[languid gulch]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LvBtfqU6svo

him listing out all the issues with it really drives it home

we've seen these issues before, just not all in one launch

[visual tree]

If they can make fake frames, they might as well make fake ROP

[languid gulch]

think we can buy some nvidia stock with fake dollars?

[visual tree]

Not anymore, I threw away my monopoly dollars

But I get the joke

[twin dew]

Multi Failure Generation

🤣

[mental oriole]

"It's a feature"

[twin dew]

But to yesterdays case.
Seems I was wrong and Nvidia released PDF does say that GB203 full chip specs match to 5080 spec.

Which in a way seem little weird, as for GB202 in 5090, they are disabling about 11% of the die.

From 96 TPCs down to 85.

And 25% of the L2 cache (128MB to 96MB)

Ah, forgot how many lower end GPUs using same die Nvidia expects to produce for each 5080.
Unlike for 5090 and the higher end SKUs using same die for enterprise.

Where 5090 is the crappiest product being made with the GB202 die.

[languid gulch]

GN pointing out that nvidia either knew and shipped it anyway, or didn't know and were extraordinarily incompetent

[twin dew]

Yup.

[languid gulch]

i can guarantee that government regulators would be kicking in doors if a car company started selling cars with a cylinder completely missing while advertising it as the best in the world

[dire igloo]

Or a car where the foot plate on the gas pedal isn't fixed in place so it can slide off and be locked in a position of high throttle

Oh wait, nvm

[twin dew]

That was kind of assembly line error.
The pedal as designed was tight fit with locking tab.
It was so hard to install that the assembly line people started to use lubricant to do it, which was never cleaned away, as it wasn't supposed to be there.

So design didn't take actual installing into account, and then installers did something that the design hadn't taken into account to actually install it.

[charred relic]

I can't imagine spending up to 3 grand on a card to begin with but imagine if you did then find out it's literally missing shit inside the GPU...

Personally I don't trust much of anything Nvidia has to say at this point because they'll be in full damage control. At this point they should probably just recall the things.

[tribal kraken]

Computer hardware has been surprisingly good comparing to ie cars. When it comes to recalls and shit manufacturing

[twin dew]

Because normally having safety critical fault in consumer electronics is hard to accidentally have.

[tribal kraken]

My 2023 dirt bike just went to dealer 250km away for front brake caliper recall. Was not allowed to change by yourself. Luckily my workmates drive past there every week with van.

[willow pike]

he didn't even bring up the black screen driver problem

[twin dew]

But is that real, or is it just people changing GPUs without DDU.

[charred relic]

I'm not real

So DiskMark has a setting for NVMei hadn't activated... seems that alters the threads and queue size, all I can see it doing

oh yeah seq read def went up a bit

[willow pike]

some people fix it with an underclock, unlikely to be drivers

feels like they're binning too close to the sun

the ROP shenanigans supports this

[twin dew]

Ok, haven't paid any attention.
If so, then yes.

[charred relic]

...set the controls to the heart of the sun

[willow pike]

so in summary;

• unstable stock clocks
• MFG frames out of order
• melting power connectors
• missing ROPs
• entirely fake MSRP
  and the complete lack of improvement even if none of these issues existed

this is one of the generations of all time

[charred relic]

it's a dumpster fire...

1000%

Surely somebody gets fired...

[willow pike]

a lot of people are gonna get fired

everyone who uses the 16 pin connector

[charred relic]

Just the power connector alone was ugly but man...

[twin dew]

Jensen will not get fired, and I would expect that everyone else was just doing what they were explicitly told from above.

[willow pike]

yeah the shareholders do not give a flying fuck about any of this

[charred relic]

Only one thing matters to a shareholder

Make me some money

[willow pike]

they would only eject jensen if the profit went down

that will only happen when the AI bubble crashes, which it does seem to be

[charred relic]

Nvidia could be out there pooping literal turds on people and the shareholders don't care if there's profit lol

[willow pike]

even then nvidia are gonna be fantastically profitable, even if growth shrinks

so jensen remains

[charred relic]

Not that I own a lot of holdiings but that's certainly how I feel about them.

[willow pike]

and even when ai bursts, nvidia make their bread and butter in server and workstation, gaming will always be an afterthought

[charred relic]

Sadly firings usually involve mostly people not even responsible

[willow pike]

be interesting to see how effective amd is in penetrating those markets, MI300 is a hell of a salvo

[charred relic]

I wanna see what the pricing is on their cards, it'll be upgrade time at some point

[willow pike]

geforce 6000 is gonna be the same repeat of flat improvement fuck you got mine

[charred relic]

I would have been cpu necked by much more than I have at the time, not the case now lol

[willow pike]

i am not hopeful of the 9070 being priced well

[charred relic]

*had

[willow pike]

amd love to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory

[charred relic]

We'll see, if not it's no biggie there are other paths. Also this card will hold up for a good bit longer if I want it to

[willow pike]

though honestly at this point i would still recommend it as it wouldn't suffer from any of this bullshit

[charred relic]

It's a 6750 XT so it's not completley weak heh

[willow pike]

want a card that just works? probably gonna be a radeon

[charred relic]

Well I can't see going Nvidia for sure

If it was a good lineup I might consider something like a 5070 or 5070Ti

[night girder]

@twin dew You got any ideas how to check the designed airflow for a case?

Something like this screenshot, but more official? I checked manual but nothing.

[twin dew]

There usually really isn't one, outside how default fans have been placed.

[night girder]

I don't know how long ago it was, but I felt some airflow comming out of the top. Like it is on the screenshot, and I though the top would be intake for air, not output. I haven't place any fans there either, so everything is default.

[vocal sky]

as far as airflow testing... well... there is, via fog machine, but the clean up can be teadious if you run it too long and its not super accurate but it can give you a better idea than doing little or nothing

@night girder ^^^^

[twin dew]

That is for testing if the airflow you put in works or not.

[night girder]

I use toilet paper 🙈 Put fan to 100%. Put toilet paper where I want to check;

• toilet paper gets sucked in (pull)
• toilet paper gets lifted (push)

[twin dew]

In positive pressure fan config, all the non-used places are outlets.
And you want positive pressure if you have dust filters.

[dire igloo]

Default setup:
Front/side/bottom intake
Rear/top exhaust

So the red arrows on the PSU shroud are the wrong way around, you'd want them to be intake to give fresh air to the GPU

[night girder]

Thanks, that's what I needed to know 😄

The screenshot I posted is as it is atm.

Pull front, push top, push back and push bottom-rear (psu).

[dire igloo]

Also, top exhaust can be inefficient with air cooled CPUs

[willow pike]

oeuf

[dire igloo]

Handwavy explanation: you exhaust the cold air before it had the chance to cool the heatsink

[night girder]

Wasn't that predicted already yesterday?

[willow pike]

i must have missed it

[night girder]

De gpu-prestaties gaan volgens de fabrikant door de ontbrekende rop's met ongeveer 4 procent achteruit

4% performance loss said vendor

[willow pike]

things move fast

that's over 10% though

[night girder]

Well, that's what the vendor "promised" 😉

I wonder if we will ever know where those missing ROP's went too. Baldur said something about x-rays.

[willow pike]

someone needs to get at them with an election microscope

[night girder]

And someone on reddit posted that it might be lasers cutting it off 🤷‍♂️ (but I haven't seen proof)

Now we all learn how important ROP's are 🤣

[twin dew]

And larger the resolution, more important they are.

[night girder]

Yeah, makes sense. Rasterization.

[twin dew]

Because as GN said, it isn't actually 8 ROPs that are missing.
It is one ROP, that can handle 8 pixels per clock.

[night girder]

I think it's time to clean out the PC. Whish me luck that I don't fry it with air

[willow pike]

yeah despite what nvidia would have you believe, a GPU isn't a vehicle for AI and games will never be fully AI

a shitload of a GPU is fixed function hardware to make rasterisation go brr

[twin dew]

So the GPU can finalize 8 pixels less per clock cycle once rest of the GPU starts to finish and ROPs get into use.

[willow pike]

there's also the question of CUDA cores not having ROPs close by and having to wait around

[twin dew]

So same percentage loss, but higher absolute loss more pixels there is.

[willow pike]

causing a single-warp bottleneck

or whatever nvidia call it, I think they say warp

it's a really carefully coordinated dance to make sure everything is as parallel as possible, one SM not having as many ROPs as intended will delay the warps on it more than going from 96 to 88 would imply

do they call it a wave front?

[night girder]

Oh btw, I only have 3 fans. Two pulling in the front, 1 pulling out. The top and bottom are "natural" airflow pushing out without any fans.

So, if I understand it correctly, my setup is already possitive.

It's default Lian Li Lancool config.

[willow pike]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thread_block_(CUDA_programming)

A warp is a set of 32 threads within a thread block such that all the threads in a warp execute the same instruction. These threads are selected serially by the SM.

I was right

[twin dew]

Yes, as you have more input airflow than output.
And that will cause the inside to have positive pressure compared to outside, which will cause that "extra" air to get out any way it can.

[night girder]

👍

Btw, compressor on low bar is safe to use to clean out PC right?

And I should leave PC plugged in for ground? I forgot 🤔

[twin dew]

Not directly related.
ROPs are which take the "processed by other units" stuff and actually convert it into pixel image (including antialiasing).
Work when everything else has finished.

Warps are where shader work is done.

[willow pike]

yeah but surely it isn't "wait until all warps are done, then invoke ROPs"

warps can work on the output of ROPs

[twin dew]

But the ROPs cannot do anything until all the shader work for at least certain area has been done.

[twin dew]

Other way around.

[willow pike]

yeah and some shaders will want to work on the final pixel outputs, like reflections

[twin dew]

No.
ROPs output 2D pixel image.

[willow pike]

plus as you say it's done in pieces, so even if that weren't true you'd still have them doing work simultaneously

[twin dew]

That is put into the final display framebuffer.

Only DLSS etc. work on after ROPs

[willow pike]

hm

[twin dew]

They are what converts the 3D scene into 2D image, one final pixel at a time.

[willow pike]

you have plenty of shaders do work after the scene is collapsed to 2D

[twin dew]

Which?
Outside that kind of upscaling etc. work.

Or FXAA etc.

[willow pike]

it sounds like you're describing worldspace to screenspace rasterisation

forgive me it's been a very long time since I studied this

I hope to never write another line of opengl again

(they had us draw triangles with raw openGL in 2005. how fucking practical is that)

[twin dew]

Basically.
Rasterizing from the generated scene to just single flat bitmap image.
And only stuff that does modifications to that flat single framebuffer image should work after.
So FXAA, possibly TAA, DLSS etc.

[willow pike]

modern rendering has shaders put into every step of that process that will read from pixel data

[twin dew]

And things like adding HUD elements as second flat image.

[willow pike]

it's more like a dozen steps even without deferred rendering

[twin dew]

So yes, anything post-processing is after, sorry.

[willow pike]

when I'm not at the gym I will go brush up on this shit again

[twin dew]

No, not sure.

[willow pike]

I forgot about most of it because who the fuck codes polygons in raw opengl

sure Pixar did

in the nineties

[twin dew]

ROPs are hardware components of modern GPUs that handle later steps in the graphics rendering pipeline, such as antialiasing, transparency, and colour blending. Once prior rendering steps are complete, ROPs write the final frame data into VRAM.

[willow pike]

ah so they don't actually do that step

interesting

[twin dew]

In computer graphics, the render output unit (ROP) or raster operations pipeline is a hardware component in modern graphics processing units (GPUs) and one of the final steps in the rendering process of modern graphics cards. The pixel pipelines take pixel (each pixel is a dimensionless point) and texel information and process it, via specific matrix and vector operations, into a final pixel or depth value; this process is called rasterization.

Therefore, the ROP is where the GPU's output is assembled into a bitmapped image ready for display.

[willow pike]

i was gonna say a counter example is bloom; early implementations of bloom would fizzle with bright single pixels, because the shader (running on a cuda core) had already output pixels

but rops do not do this

well, if ROPs really do only get invoked when the CUDA cores are finished, i was still sort of right in that the deficient SM will be running at half the speed of the other SMs doing ROP work and that accounts for the performance difference being bigger than the drop in ROPs

it's highly unlikely that ROPs from one SM can help with work from another SM given how important locality is to the whole process

[twin dew]

But basically anything that doesn't play nice with MSAA is done after that main ROP pass.
As MSAA is/was done by ROPs at that point.

So anything screen-space.

[night girder]

damn, my PC was dusty

but atleast I get 10 FPS more

[tough owl]

wccftech.com/user-combines-rtx-3050-rtx-5090-massive-boost-nvidia-physx-games/

[twin dew]

Because 5000-series dropped support for 32-bit PhysX.

And those old PhysX versions intentionally don't really work on just CPU.

So Nvidia 5000-series people are in same situation as AMD card owners with the old PhysX games.

[tough owl]

I know they dropped physx support

its just stupid they werent transparent about this

[night girder]

Finally figured out how to split my renderer.ts file. It was so stupid and simple. But nowhere documented.

Electron is pretty 💩 when it comes to documentation. They are good at telling what to enable for security etc.

There is an option to disable imports in renderer.ts (or .js) files for security reason. But if you cannot import, then how do you split up the file when it becomes too large etc.

But apparantly, functions and variables are in the same space between multiple renderer files.

Renderer processes

When renderer processes in Electron are sandboxed, they behave in the same way as a regular Chrome renderer would. A sandboxed renderer won't have a Node.js environment initialized.

Therefore, when the sandbox is enabled, renderer processes can only perform privileged tasks (such as interacting with the filesystem, making changes to the system, or spawning subprocesses) by delegating these tasks to the main process via inter-process communication (IPC).
note

For more info on inter-process communication, check out our IPC guide.

And the IPC is a red hearing in this case. Which should be used to communicate between main process <-> render process.

[jagged snow]

Too many platforms 😭

I just went to dump something to serial and my brain got jumbled

I went throgh System. console. printf() and then finally Serial. 💀

[night girder]

I was looking into my netflix account, to see if I can disable games.

Then I noticed this was enabled.

Sneaky little .....

[willow pike]

https://tenor.com/view/heresy-purge-w40k-warhammer-gif-10271501

[night girder]

Also using my adblocker to get rid of games on netflix 😄

[pure karma]

i dont even use netflix problem solved

[night girder]

Here are the rules if anyone wants.

First rule removes the row of games.
Second rule removes the giant banner at the top of the screen that plays GTA V trailer.
It used to play trailers of series/movies. So It's possible those are gone now too.

So that top banner with Luther. Is now playing trailers of GTA V mobile 🤦‍♂️

Enshitification 101.

[night girder]

GN is so done with it 🤣

[opaque grove]

I was translating something and the translator threw this one up n d t h e d e s c r i p t i o n s o f o u r

[night girder]

Wtf?

Framework launched a new low entry model. Wanted to check it out. But I have to wait 46 minutes?

[tough owl]

they made me wait 90 minutes

[night girder]

DDOS attacked?

[tough owl]

i started 5 minutes ago and now im down to 11

[tough owl]

more like hype

[night girder]

🤔

[tough owl]

395+ mini pc

with up to 128gb ram

[night girder]

I am interested in framework. Just depends on price, quality, support etc.

[tough owl]

https://www.theverge.com/news/618784/framework-laptop-12-touchscreen-convertible-announcement-release-date
https://www.theverge.com/news/618785/framework-desktop-annoucement-price-release-date
https://www.theverge.com/news/618769/framework-laptop-13-2025-amd-ryzen-ai-300-strix-point

[night girder]

But it should be cheaper than a Macbook pro 😉

Well 26 minutes more!

[tough owl]

7 minutes for me

[night girder]

Time flies 🤣

[tough owl]

(might buy a refurb 13in)

[night girder]

Nice.

[jagged snow]

I can't do what I need to on a laptop that small, it'd have to be the 16 for me

[tough owl]

I can

I just need ram for multideskop

[night girder]

Same, laptop on the move has to be small for me.

[tough owl]

one per vm for my cybersec hw 💀

[night girder]

For office/home work I connect to external monitor + keyboard etc. (So it turns into a desktop).

[night girder]

128gb sounds a bit overkill though 🤷‍♂️

[tough owl]

I had to basically virtualize an entire home network and pc outside of that network to learn how to firewall stuff

[tough owl]

not for ai when you can give the gpu 110gb alone

[night girder]

You didn't mention AI 😉

[visual tree]

They asked me at work do I want a laptop with bigger or smaller screen (we also have a separate monitor). I opted for laptop with bigger screen in the end

The only downside is that's it's heavier

[night girder]

If you don't have to pay for it yourself sure. But I like my 13inch now.

[tough owl]

I had a 16in and it was heavy

[visual tree]

No, it's company property. I don't pay for anything

[tough owl]

I hated it

[night girder]

Smaller is cheaper

[tough owl]

I might try to ressurect my 12in macbook with linux on it

i love that laptop

[visual tree]

My old work laptop only had 1 charger and it made my backpack even heavier....

[night girder]

In theory, that's what a thinkbook is trying to solve right? That we don't have to buy a brand new laptop, but can swap out parts to replace them. In theory.

[visual tree]

The company in the past basically offered a laptop with a charger and a docking station in the office which only some employees had and you had to take a charger with you when working at home

Good thing new laptops come with 2 chargers, one for home and one for the office so I don't have to bring them with me

[night girder]

First world problems 🤣

10 more minutes!

[tough owl]

i got in

[visual tree]

I suspect they did this because additional charger is cheaper than a docking station

[night girder]

So in 9 minutes, I got from 46 to 10 minutes. Impressive.

Cloudflare is being very efficient on the estimate script to preserve resources.

[glossy glacier]

touchscreen framework: yay~
it's only 12": whyyy 😦

[tough owl]

education

[jagged snow]

Targeted at every cs major that wants to feel like a hardware guru because they put custom io modules in their laptop

[night girder]

Frameworks 16 inch only has AMD?

Factory Seconds laptops are new systems that use excess parts. Rather than scrapping this material, we combine it with new parts, run it through our normal factory tests, and make the resulting laptops available at greatly reduced prices.

👌

[tough owl]

thats outta stock here in the us

[night girder]

Just playing around on the website.

And you can even not opt for the NVME and DDR4 and find it yourself.

[tough owl]

yup

which is cheaper for a 1tb

[night girder]

It blows my macbook pro out of the water.

and is a lot cheaper.

[tough owl]

its also newer

[jagged snow]

The 395 is wild, it really holds its own with m4

Framework 16 with a 395 would be an insane machine

[glacial zephyr]

I feel like that laptop isn't a great deal for somewhat outdated hardware

[willow pike]

yoooooo

[languid gulch]

framework is modular, that's what you're paying extra for

[jagged snow]

The 300 series isn't outdated? It's literally as new as it gets?

And also I feel like the 395 kinda kills the desire for add-in GPUs on the 16 lol

[glacial zephyr]

Pretty sure we're talking about different things

[jagged snow]

Oh?

[glacial zephyr]

I'm talking about the screenshot

[jagged snow]

Ahh
Yeah that spec specifically

Gotcha

[glacial zephyr]

I guess, but that screenshot doesn't seem like a great deal tbh

[languid gulch]

yea i agree, but i'm also now allergic to intel

[night girder]

639 isn't that bad, you can find other parts cheaper.

[glacial zephyr]

idk, it's a cpu from 2020 that uses ddr4 and it has no dedicated gpu

I would rather just get a new laptop for more that will last longer if your goal is to do anything intensive on it

[languid gulch]

the premium is in the frame, you can upgrade the guts at any time

right now they're still in the boutique segment, which always has a price premium

[night girder]

also depends on what you already have. If you have macbook pro etc.

[languid gulch]

yup

and you have an expansion slot for a dGPU if you want

[glacial zephyr]

I mean I'd have to see their other offerings, but buying a lower level laptop with the goal to upgrade it soon doesn't seem worth it

Maybe their higher end options are better deals

[languid gulch]

not soon

over time

i wouldn't mind paying a bit more for a decent frame with options to upgrade guts over time as needed

instead of "sorry, RAM's SOC'd, chuck out the whole thing if you want 4 more gigs"

[night girder]

Framework is also pretty unique afaik.

[glacial zephyr]

Most laptops I've seen use SODIMM but I'm sure some have soldered RAM

[languid gulch]

quite a few now

[night girder]

So I find it hard to compare it with other laptops, since it's not just like the other laptops 😛

[languid gulch]

yup

[willow pike]

if my pc dies I'm buying a framework desktop

I do not want to know how much it would be to price up a new pc these days

motherboards are bullshit, graphics cards are bullshit

[languid gulch]

just go older gen stuff

[willow pike]

I'm real curious to see how that entry level ryzen max performs with a desktop heatsink

[languid gulch]

the lower tier ryzens are still on 65W, so probably just fine