off-topic-tech

[twin dew]

Like with Chechenya (two, first failed, second succeeded).
Georgia (partial annexation), second by political proxy in progress.
Moldovia has parts that have been annexed since the breakup of USSR.
Ukraine, first with political proxy, then by "green men", then full scale invasion.

[night girder]

All after.

[twin dew]

And now the talk is about going for Baltics and Poland once the annexation of Ukraine is done in all the official propaganda of Russia.

[night girder]

In 1991 Boris Yeltsin, the first president of the new Russian state, wrote to NATO, reiterating Gorbachev’s proposal. He echoed calls made by former Warsaw Pact countries like Hungary to join the Western alliance, and called NATO membership a “long-term political aim” of Russia.

The First Chechen War, during which Russian forces attempted to regain control over Chechnya, took place from 1994 to 1996

[twin dew]

And the point was that the specific countries knew that once Russia picked itself back up after the breakup, they would try again, unless something never seen before happened.
As that has been the way each successive Russian Government has worked since 1600:s.
No matter how many times it has been overthrown.

And as you see from there, the breakup was in 1991, and the first target was hit in 1994 already.

[night girder]

breakup? There was no breakup.

In 1994, Russia officially signed up to the NATO Partnership for Peace, a program aimed at building trust between NATO and other European and former Soviet countries. President Bill Clinton described it in January 1994 as a “track that will lead to NATO membership.”

[twin dew]

The breakup of Soviet Union.

[night girder]

Somebody, NATO or Russia, or both, were legit trying to get closer and work towards peace.

[twin dew]

Which allowed the specific countries to get their indepences back after being occupied by russians since WW2.

[night girder]

But Russia has repeatedly made a request that NATO has rejected: to refuse to accept new members in its “backyard” (or neighboring countries), says Rasmussen. “It wasn’t for the West or Moscow to decide whether those countries should join NATO. Each and every country has the right to decide its alliance and affiliation,” says the former NATO ambassador Garcevic.

[twin dew]

And that was the first attempt to keep them in Russian "sphere of influence", for later reconquest.
By preventing them from joining NATO.

While the country was in shambles.

[night girder]

I mean, if people were afraid that Russia would join NATO, to build it forces up. And that's the reason they rejected.

What is happening now then? 😂

Seems like it didn't work.

[twin dew]

They did try to get NATO to agree to not allow the post-soviet states to join NATO even if they wanted to.
And NATO didn't agree to such stipulation from Russia.

And the current Russian propaganda is that NATO did promise such thing, and then reneged.

[night girder]

I don't think you can compare Boris Yeltsin to the current president either.

[twin dew]

Putin is hand-picked successor of Yeltsin, by Yeltsin.

He was absolute nobody until he got picked.

And he was specifically selected from certain inner circle of soviet time party officials from St. Petersburg for his views on how to make Russia Great Again.

[night girder]

Ah, I was thinking of the dude before Yeltsin then.

[twin dew]

Yeltsin was the first voted in President of Russia after the breakup of Soviet Union.
Mikhail Gorbachev was Soviet official.

Who fucked up and had the union collapse from under him.

And acted as Russian President until the first elections.

[night girder]

Well, I don't mind you blaming it all on Russia 😂

but I think NATO, US, EU fucked up too in this story.

[twin dew]

Yes?
In the way they tried to "uplift" and integrate Russia into Western World.

[night girder]

Not only that, I can see value in Economic Interdependence.

[twin dew]

While the Russian "government" (mafia oligopoly) was biding their time to get back up and get their previous empire back.

[night girder]

More in the sense that somebody wants to leave NATO. Weakening us. And the fact that EU/NATO has been sleeping on defense. Because they didn't want to spend enough money. The fact that they keep expanding, but have no way to protect all this expansion. The fact they didn't predict this. The fact they didn't take Crimea serious etc.

[twin dew]

Which the Baltics and Poland have been warning since 90s...
Just that no-one listened.

Even Finland didn't believe in most part.

[night girder]

The fact that EU is infighting. Also weakens our position. All this doesn't help to stand up against aggressors.

[twin dew]

Putin just accelerated the timetable after seeing the end of his life coming and wanting it to happen before that, no matter the cost to the country.

There was very dramatic change in the way Putin has been working around 2020.

[night girder]

He saw an opportunity. A weakened Western society.

[twin dew]

No, he started to get sick around that timeframe.

[night girder]

Have you followed the news since the start? All the bickering over Tanks, defense equipment. Putin must be laughing his ass off.

And after 2-3 years of discussing, we are sending F16

[twin dew]

I said time about 2 years before the latest invasion.

[night girder]

We are weak. Something is very wrong. And leaders need to get their heads together and work together.

[twin dew]

Yes, he expected even less reaction, with that actual "whole Ukraine in 3 days" plan.

[night girder]

We have nothing to do with that. Ukraine defended itself well.

[twin dew]

Yes, because of that long term expectation that Putin is western type politician.

[night girder]

Now we provide a life line. That's for sure. But we still have no boots on the ground.

[twin dew]

And still wouldn't have happened if there hadn't been Javelins etc. dropshipped in very quickly in the first few days.

[night girder]

the last few months have been hell for them, because of our western politics.

[twin dew]

But point was, Putin was doing it the long way, then got sick and moved to way accelerated timetable, first overt act that was the full invasion of Ukraine.

[night girder]

they ran out of ammo, because of politicians.

I disagree. Putin saw opportunities.

Like I said, somebody wants to leave NATO, he is hoping for that.

EU is going in a certain direction that is favorable for him too.

[twin dew]

He had expected to have 20+ years more to implement the plan, but he has lost function in one arm mostly at this time.
And the real Putin has almost completely disappeared from public life.
Even the trip to North Korea is being done by a double.

The main double is right-handed, when the real Putin is left-handed.

[night girder]

He is 71... you think 20+ years? That means he would be 91... you serious?

Yeah, 91 sounds like the best age to be president and start a war with NATO

[twin dew]

He had witch doctor who promised eternal life, but the doctor died about a year ago at age of about 70 🤣

[night girder]

Crimea was a probe to see how we responded. And to destabilize the West. It worked.

[twin dew]

But that is type of thing Putin seemed to actually believe in.
That he was "eternal", part of the PR picture too.

[twin dew]

Just continuation of previous actions.
And doing the same things that happened in Ukraine before the green men in Georgia right now, with the Georgian Dream as the sock-puppet.

Just that Ukrainian people went against the sock-puppet and russia had to do military step.
Were trying to worm back in via politics before Putins health started dropping.

In Ukraine I mean, trying to complete the integration again via politicians taking over and moving to dictatorship, like in Belarus (and Hungary to large extent).

Georgia is on the cusp right now.
There have been giant EuroMaidan style protests there for last few months against the Georgian Dream government.

And fourth? of Georgia is currently occupied by Russia.

Since that 2008? war.

[night girder]

I mean, you blame them. I blame us (and them).

But mainly us.

It's so easy to blame the enemy and underestimate them too.

[twin dew]

Western politicians set the stage, not understanding Putin.
And Putin has been taking advantage of that since the start.

Even Yeltsin to some extent before him.

And Biden and Scholz still aren't on the right page.

[night girder]

Not at all. They are weak.

[twin dew]

But the actions are by Putin and Russia.
Blame all around but difference between doing and allowing.

[night girder]

No.

If you leave your door open, and then get robbed. That's your own fault too.

There is no black and white. And certainly not in geo politics.

[twin dew]

Yes? That is to blame and fault, but still not same level as the person actually doing the robbing.

And I have blamed the western politicians not reacting multiple times.

[night girder]

"But the actions are by Putin and Russia." Yes. And we let them. You can almost say our lack of actions allowed them to take actions.

[twin dew]

To the earlier Russian actions.
Causing Putin to escalate.
As bully he only stops at force, which hasn't been used and still isn't.

[night girder]

This is starting to turn into the chicken/egg debate. I said it before, it's way to complex. And I am not going to point the finger at Russia. Yes they are the aggressor. But EU/NATO cannot change Russia. EU/NATO can change itself and how they respond. And in that regard, they fail.

My fingers are pointing at both of them. With the remark that I focus more on our own garden then someone elses.

[twin dew]

Like the case of Russian aircraft constantly testing the various countries borders.
They did that to Turkey, Turkey shot one plane down, no attempts since.

[night girder]

And we don't do that It would be stupid of us not to do that.

[twin dew]

But they have been doing that for 20 years, and nothing but diplomacy attempted...

At worst times, daily.

[night girder]

So whose fault is that? EU.

[twin dew]

Russia is again doing it, but the western politicians are allowing it by not reacting strongly enough,.

[night girder]

You said it yourself "and nothing but diplomacy attempted".

[twin dew]

So Russia is the actor, west is the faciliator.

[night girder]

Yes, but you cannot influence the actor.

[twin dew]

And not reacting is what allows the actor to keep acting in that way.

[night girder]

NATO/EU will not change them at this point. They have to change themselves.

and they underestimate Russia or overestimate themselves.

[twin dew]

Point is, in most known cases, by reacting strongly, Russia stopped.

But current politicians don't have the guts to react strongly.

What would have happened during Cuban missile crisis for example if it hadn't been reacted strongly to?

Or later because of that, with nuclear ballistic missiles now in Cuba?

[night girder]

And if you dare to show some guts on the political stage (which happened) others call you back and tell you to shut up.

I still think, this is our biggest weakness.

[twin dew]

USSR only backed down because of very strong reaction.
Same with Russia and Putin right now.
Lot of talk about red lines, no reaction ever when West has stepped over any of them.

[night girder]

I mean, it's a good thing countries can keep each-other in check. But at the moment, it feels like it's more working against us.

[twin dew]

And just escalation when West doesn't react.

[night girder]

and when we do react, it's so slow and sometimes too late. "Oh ok, you can strike over the border." - 3 years later. 🤦‍♂️

[twin dew]

"We cannot do X because it would be escalation" from West, just leads to Russia escalating instead.
And there has been no actual reactions to any of those escalations in help done by the West, even when they were officially "big red lines" that Russia would say they would react very strongly.

[night girder]

We (EU-NATO) are weak 😄

[twin dew]

I can blame the west for allowing the behavior of Russia and Putin.
But those are the actual actors.
Blame on both, but the one that acts has the final say.
The one who allows has blame, but the actor could have decided to not instead, no matter what the allower does.

Door can be open, but the person who goes in and steals still made the choice to do that.
The open door just made it easier.

[night girder]

No, if the door is closed, they might have gone to another house. You don't know that.

[twin dew]

What does it matter which house was robbed by the person?

[night girder]

If you leave jewels in your car, visible, the chances of a break in are just higher.

It just stupid. I cannot change a thief. I can be smart and prevent burglary.

[twin dew]

Yes, and that is why there is blame on the faciliator, when they should know better.
But that there are burglars isn't caused by existence of open doors, that just makes their work easier.

And locking most home doors is pretty new thing overall.

Wasn't being done 20 years ago in all parts of all western countries.

[night girder]

Seems it works though.

[twin dew]

Because there weren't thieves in the smaller commmunities.

[night girder]

Just saying, focusing on what you can do, is more effective than blaming the actor. It's a waste of energy.

[twin dew]

For the acts, yes.

[night girder]

The same goes for people who cry about crazy DLC stuff in games. Want to change it? Stop buying it.

[twin dew]

But spreading the blame, and acting to stop the issue are two completely different things.
And this was about what the western politicians "their politicians must think like us" allowed via that belief in economic integration to change the countries.

[night girder]

www.statista.com/statistics/191243/reported-burglary-rate-in-the-us-since-1990/

[twin dew]

What happened is actions by Russia and China etc.
The idiots in West allowed it, and are still allowing it.

Still not able to change their mindset thinking "just like me".

[night girder]

No, the goal was not that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_interdependence go read.

[edgy hazel]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead–crime_hypothesis

[twin dew]

That is the "pure" theoretical form.
The actual goal in large part in political circles was to change dictatorial closed system adversaries to western type of open democracies.
Which has failed so badly, even in Hungary, which is part of EU.

They were let in way too early and slided back after.

And now we cannot get them out.

Need to separate Economics from Politics, even when Politics uses Economics.

Or tries to use.

[night girder]

What did I just read 🤨

[twin dew]

That lead exposure at young age (which is known to cause brain issues) causes crime?

[night girder]

The difficulty in measuring the effect of lead exposure on crime rates is in separating the effect from other indicators of poverty such as poorer schools, nutrition, and medical care, exposure to other pollutants, and other variables that may lead to crime.[4]

I can see why it's a hypothesis.

[twin dew]

But as there are so many other things that also affect crime, that cannot be proven.

[night girder]

Yeah, interesting. But I want proof.

[twin dew]

There are even hypothesises about the part of lead exposure to fall of Rome.
As they used lead water pipes, lead as sweetener etc.

[twin dew]

Which cannot be provided without very unethical testing of tens of thousands of people.
Causing lead exposure at various ages etc. and monitoring for whole life of subject.

From utero up.

[edgy hazel]

lead poisoning makes you dumb and aggressive, while certainly not being the only factor, it's imo a pretty big one

[night girder]

While lead poisoning has been suggested as a potential contributing factor to the decline of the Roman Empire, it is not considered the primary cause.

[twin dew]

"part"

meaning that "contributing factor"

[night girder]

Other significant factors in the fall of the Roman Empire include political instability, economic troubles, military defeats, invasions by barbarian tribes, social unrest, and the division of the empire into the Western and Eastern Roman Empires. These complex and interconnected issues played a more substantial role in the eventual collapse of the Roman Empire than lead poisoning alone.

[twin dew]

No, it wasn't one thing, and it wasn't quick but things that happened over hundreds of years.

The fall I mean, but the point was that the lead usage might have been part of the causes over that time.

Just mentioned it because of that, that it might have been contributor.

[night girder]

If you ask me, what is more likely: "Better house security, closing the door, alarm systems. Better schooling. More wealth. Shit ton of other causes." or "Lead" being the cause of decline in crime. I would choose the first one.

[twin dew]

The current US house security is mostly just PR.

The locks used, the doors used etc. are just horribly bad for most part.

[edgy hazel]

Again you're arguing in black/white here

[twin dew]

As in for many of the common locks, you can open them as fast as with key with bypasses.

[night girder]

What I said, is grey. I named MULTIPLE issues working together in decline of crime.

Other than your lead hypothesis.

The article you linked even starts with this:

After decades of increasing crime across the industrialised world, crime rates started to decline sharply in the 1990s, a trend that continued into the new millennium. Many explanations have been proposed,** including situational crime prevention and interactions between many other factors complex, multifactorial causation.**[1]

Which is what I take more likely. Than lead.

[edgy hazel]

so are you arguing that removing lead is a contributing factor or not?

because at this point idk what you're saying

[night girder]

I am saying I don't believe in it. As I don't see any hard proof at this point.

[twin dew]

Point is, there is so much fit between the two graphs, there is probably some causalition.
That the lead is with high chance part of the contributing factors for the change.
But that cannot be proven without unethical testing.

[night girder]

The difficulty in measuring the effect of lead exposure on crime rates is in separating the effect from other indicators of poverty such as poorer schools, nutrition, and medical care, exposure to other pollutants, and other variables that may lead to crime.[4]

It even says it too in the article. Where I draw my conclusions from. As it's the first time I hear about it.

[twin dew]

In so many cases, you cannot provide proof without Nazi Medical Experiment type stuff.

Results of which are used today.
But couldn't be replicated in other countries even at that time.

[edgy hazel]

there isn't any for your arguments either. There are so many factors that it's basically impossible to get any of the "hard proof" you're requesting

[night girder]

The study concluded that, while a correlation between declining lead pollution and declining criminality is supported by research, it is likely not a significant factor in reduced crime rates, and that the link is generally overstated in lead-crime literature.

Bro, go read the article you linked to me. I read it, I make my conclussions.

[edgy hazel]

I did. Now show your studies on locks or whatever

[night girder]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_prevention#Situational_crime_prevention

[twin dew]

Again, did anyone say how large factor it was?
Just that it is expected to be a factor?

And that PR that tries to blame it all on one thing is going to overstate things is so common...
But needs to be mentioned in article like that.

World is messy.
There isn't that many clear single-cause things.

[night girder]

That's why I like that article more.

It doesn't focus on one thing. It looks at crime from a wider angle.

several factors must come together for a crime to occur:

an individual or group must have the desire or motivation to participate in a banned or prohibited behavior;
at least some of the participants must have the skills and tools needed to commit the crime; and,
an opportunity must be acted upon.

[edgy hazel]

and where does the "desire or motivation" come from?

[twin dew]

And the lead would only have been part of the ~~last ~~ first point.
And only part.

Possibly "generating" more people who would be willing to act on the opportunities.

[night girder]

This is so silly 😂

[twin dew]

Because most of even current people don't do that step, even if they have the possibility.

Sorry, not last, first.

[night girder]

Can be so many things. Poverty. Education. Socialization.

[sharp oasis]

You on android 14?

[night girder]

But if you believe it's lead. Sure.

[edgy hazel]

Yes and we're arguing about exactly that. Lead posoning is/can be one of those

[rustic panther]

Yes

[twin dew]

And it is almost always combination thing, point is that lead exposure is expected to be part of things that can cause a person to be more likely for it.

From the developmental issues it can cause, like all heavy metals.

Which have been linked to lower IQ type things and social problems, lack of empathy etc.

But cannot be confirmed without very close testing that would need lot of people be intentionally exposed to it.

[night girder]

While a study of 2022 concluded: "and that the link is generally overstated in lead-crime literature."

[twin dew]

But still possible part, which was all that was talked about.

Not THE cause, but probably part of the cause.

How large part, cannot determine without those unethical tests.

[night girder]

That's not even what we were talking about in the first place. The argument was actor vs facilitator.

[sharp oasis]

Yeah there is a known bug for pixel 6's there. Currently the only fix is go over to the beta version of android to kinda help the kernel and modem. Still the issues with how dumb Google made the scheduler. I'm working on writing my own scheduler and possibly patching my own kernel in coming months.

[rustic panther]

Yeah, that makes sense then

Glad that my weird gut feeling wasn't just me psyching myself out

[sharp oasis]

Nah it's everywhere. Devs know about it appears we are getting one more system upgrade cus of it or they will back patch after android 15 release.

[twin dew]

And the point of that specific hypothesis is that lead exposure probably caused small average change towards "more likely to do crime" in large population (not change in everyone, just statistically significant change in the whole population when simplified).
But the amount of change cannot be determined and is overstated in literature that tries to blame it all on lead".

In very simplified terms.

[rustic panther]

I see, thanks for the heads-up!

[sharp oasis]

So far even with kinda micromanaging my power useage. It's still kinda high on data and abysmally bad if the cellular signal is low

[twin dew]

World isn't simple.
But in lot of cases the final blame is on the one who acted.
But in lot of cases you need to fix the contributing causes to change the situation overall, and not only to go after the one who acted.

[sharp oasis]

But that's cus of Google wonk. Like the scheduler refuses to properly utilize the prime cluster so it's literally faster to only have one lille two big rather then one lille and two prime.

[sage pier]

I am rmaing my monitor. Am I supposed to give the stand back too?

Or just the monitor and power cord

[rustic panther]

Yeah, in my case it's not disastrously bad but I did think "Hey, is it me or is my poweron time worse?" a lot these last few months

[twin dew]

Depends on what the manufacturer says.

[night girder]

Sorry, I think we have to agree to disagree. I agree, world isn't simple, but I've seen enough history documentaries to know the final blame isn't on one single actor. I think it's just easier for some people to think in these terms. While it's way more complex.

[sharp oasis]

I felt that yeah mabey some update they shoved into the p6 screwed a bunch of optimization up

[sage pier]

" Please ship back your tv or monitor Make sure to keep your stand as well as your remote control. We need the screen and power cord back."

so I keep my stand

[sharp oasis]

I also have to do a bunch of ROM and kernel work to find a way to basically embed my kernel manager as like a system service and not an app. To help reduce core profile switching time. As it's bad for some apps to try and switch. Camera is notoriously bad for overloading the cores and making it like a 2-3 second delay before power plan comes in effect

[twin dew]

WW1 was "triggered by one gunman", but there were lot of contributing things before and after.
The specific gunman isn't responsible for the war, but he is responsible for the shot he made, no-one else.
There was lot of people who faciliated the man to want to shoot, be able to shoot the Arch-Duke.
And what happened because of that gunshot is on other people each acting for their part.

For each specific act there is one person making the decision.
For the flow of events, there are multiple.

But the others are just faciliators for the specific person acting in the specific case.

And the primary actor for one event then is faciliator for other events.

Russia invaded Ukraine because Putin decided that.
But that was faciliated by lot of people around the world.
And he probably wouldn't decided to do that if Western leaders had acted differently before.
But those bad decisions by west were just faciliating the decision of Putin in that specific case.

The western previous decisions were part of in what situation Putin did the final decision, but the decision was his.
And we cannot know what kind of decisions previously would have prevented him from making that specific decision at some point.

Might have prevented it completely, might have just changed when, etc.

Decisions and actions work on each other, but each is done by someone who is responsible for that specific one.

[night girder]

Like I said over and over again, you can focus on Putin. What do you achieve. Nothing.

Focus on yourself (refering to NATO - EU). Would have accomplished way more.

[twin dew]

You need to recognice the action chain, to be able to change the chance of it happening again.
Putin to what caused Putin to decide, to bad reactions and work by Western leaders etc. to his previous actions, to need to act more strongly against the actions of Putin etc.

Which I did state earlier.

[night girder]

That gunman you refer too, is the spark. But the fuze and TNT was already there. And that gunman had nothing to do with it.

[twin dew]

And which was the whole point of this.

[night girder]

Again, what concrete actions would you make, to change him?

[twin dew]

You need to understand why something happened to make effective changes.

[night girder]

You would fly over and have a talk with him?

You are focusing on something that is totally out of your control.

[twin dew]

I did mention multiple times to not listen to the "red lines" and actually acting strongly when he has done stuff?

That western politicians need to change their mindset and recognice Putin doesn't think like them.

Etc.

Not directly related to the conversation IMHO.

Right now Biden and Scholz should stop keeping back and allow Ukraine to do whatever with the western long range weapons they want.
Provide Taurus for attacks against Kerch bridge, set up more ammunition production, up the deliveries etc.

[night girder]

I don't know what the point is you tryin to make. All I've been saying is, that I rather prefer we focus on internal stuff (diplomacy, economics, military) than to blame it all on the aggressor. Which is really easy to do btw. It's called introspection.

[twin dew]

Not think about "we must not let Russia lose" or "how to work with Russia after the war".

Yes, but to do the introspection properly, you need to have the full chain.

And also to do good changes to prevent something in the future, you again need the full chain.

[night girder]

I don't think even you or me know the full chain. I tried to link you an article earlier that goes way back in time trying to explain this very complex issue.

[twin dew]

Instead of just doing idiotic "looks good" PR laws etc.

[night girder]

Putin was a baby back then. Or maybe not even born. So how far do you want to go with this chain of action and reaction?

[twin dew]

You can almost never actually know the full chain and the things that affected the event.
But you need to know as much as possible.
Both external and internal.
And problem with that kind of thing is that in many cases parts of it go back centuries, even for seemingly simple things.

And so many interlinks etc.

[night girder]

exactly.

[twin dew]

But you cannot start to built the chain without start-point.

[night girder]

I think your start point isn't the same what I think the start-points are.

and that's why we have been going back and forth in this discussion 😉

[twin dew]

You are building things from the "back" (history) to forward.
I'm talking about tracing specific event from the event backwards.

To see how it could have possibly been prevented or changed.
So similar can be prevented in future.

[night girder]

I am blaming everyone who had real power, for the mess we are in right now. Not a single person. Multiple.

[twin dew]

That comes in the "work backwards" phase from "Putin decided to invade Ukraine".

[night girder]

And you know who has to fix it? People who have no real power. Citizens.

[twin dew]

From that "Putin decided to invade Ukraine", you can then go into why he decided that, and then you can look into things that would have changed that decision (Western leaders being too soft/boneless as example), and so on.

[night girder]

With the added note, that maybe if things WAY ahead in the chain were different, he might not even invaded.

but that's just speculation. And we will never know.

[twin dew]

Yes, the politicians were trying to look into the future, but the point was that they didn't have "correct" information for their own decisions.
As they thought (and Russian PR machine intentionally tried to show them as) more like themselves than they actually were.

Which lead to lot of bad decisions now when looking in hindsight.
And which some of the politicians still haven't accepted.

USSR was "The Adversary" and "The Other".
Russia after the fall of USSR was supposed to be "Just Like Us" for some magical reason.
When Putin & Co. are still "The Other" to western politicians, which they missed.
And moved back into "The Adversary" more and more over the years.

Communist China was the same, when the party started to move towards "capitalism", many have made the same mistakes.
And now Xi is taking the country back to what it was, but many in West don't want to notice that, almost certainly causing similar issues in future.

China was on serious way to change, but that has been curtailed since with rise of Xi.

And as long as Xi is in power, there will be no return to what was in the interim.

Currently China is very strategic with the economic power it has to set up the stage for getting to be the absolute top dog in future.

Using that as purely political tool I mean.

With total party control.

[soft bloom]

i have seen that this discussion has been there for some time, can we get the tl;dr? please?

[twin dew]

About 10 years or so to react to that IMHO.
Before US and EU are fucked.

Unless there is change in Chinese leadership.
And currently Xi is the leader for life.

[twin dew]

Philosophical differences in how to assign blame for world events etc.

[charred pewter]

thats bs

if anything its gone up due to all the crackheads trying to steal random things to pay for their habit 😉

[edgy hazel]

but why are they using crack to begin with? What influences that?

[twin dew]

But that thing I said about China & Xi.
If western countries unfortunately don't distangle our economy from China to suitable degree by moving western companies production for essential stuff out of there before Xi decides to stop waiting for Taiwan to reunite or something like that, we are fucked.

[charred pewter]

trying to cope with all the burglery going on 😉

[edgy hazel]

and why is that happening?

[charred pewter]

goto 10

[edgy hazel]

(this can go on forever until we arrive at capitalism)

[twin dew]

And in that we would currently be in the situation Russia is right now with the various embargoes trashing the economy.
We could claw back out over time, but the meantime would be horrible and would probably lead to giving up to China because of citizen demands.

Yes, it would be horrible in China too, but they are taking that into account.

[night girder]

I think it's lead.

[charred pewter]

lol: "On all pcpartspicker build i see here on reddit people have never included operating system, but from everything i find on google it seems u need it. "

🤦

why no, you dont need an operating system! 😄

[edgy hazel]

ubuntu.com/download

is free

[charred pewter]

guessing this new pc buyer comes from consoles ... where you dont actually buy/install 'an operating system' ...

[soft bloom]

"i think my pc is broken - it displays circle instead of squares"

[twin dew]

Because most don't expect any private person to buy full prices Windows License...

[charred pewter]

its just part of it

[edgy hazel]

Hey that's illegal

[twin dew]

Yes, I know.

At least in many countries.

I personally object very strongly against buying one of the few euro keys from shady stores too.

[soft bloom]

microsoft got paid enough for me using their cloud solution, whatever its called

btw, with US tax payers money

[twin dew]

And MS has never actually really tried to do anything to change that.
They rather keep the official prices high so they can charge the OEMs and companies more.
Than do stuff to get more money from consumers direct.

[edgy hazel]

I would never buy a key from the grey market and then add it to my MS account

[charred pewter]

yeah, i cannot use key shops, out of principle... i will pay the $100 off a reputable retailer, than a key shop

[soft bloom]

btw, US AID in Ukraine is trash. very large cut on budgets goes to bureaucracy, and processes are VERY slow. basically noone cares about actual impact, so you can imagine what decision making process is like

[twin dew]

MS even does sell cheap keys to nonprofits etc.
Who actually have to play by the rules but cannot really afford the official inflated prices.

[soft bloom]

^ they have something on Azure, for sure. but can't say about Windows licenses - didn't have to use that for my nonprofit

[charred pewter]

imagine making the price something like $40 .... and then selling 10x as normal ...

[twin dew]

For Windows Pro, and Office (year-edition or 365) etc.

Windows Pro for less than 20e IIRC.

One time.

But the point is that the consumer prices need to be high enough that companies etc. cannot just go buy retail licenses and save money.

Even when that causes actual consumers to buy much less legal licenses.
As that is drop in the bucket anyways compared to the OEM and company sales.

[twin dew]

Officially any nonprofit could get large fines in most western countries if caught using unlicensed software.
Question is if there is actual checking or not and if the board etc. care.

The chance to get fined is miniscule even in Finland.

But most still play by the rules, as the price with those lowered ones (but hoops to jump through to get access) is low enough.

At full retail prices, many more might choose to not follow the rules instead.

Or go with free options etc.

The mindshare also has value.
Not causing people to move from Windows to Linux, or from Office to OpenOffice/LibreOffice etc.

Because then those same people might cause change at the more profitable segments too.

As the other options aren't so scary anymore.

Often smaller the entity, the more easy total changes can be.
And once the people in such get used to the other thing, they are much more open to advocating for the same change in their main workplace for example.

[charred pewter]

also there is 'the sale to be had'... if microsoft had a high SRP but continually always had it for 50% off... more would buy it

[twin dew]

Not legal in EU.
Max you can have a sale for is one month on, one month off.

[charred pewter]

heh

[twin dew]

Don't remember in which cases the "normal price" has to be updated during sale period.

But when the sale starts, that needs to be the lowest price during the previous 30 days IIRC.

[charred pewter]

ive heard of not changing the SRP while its on sale... but i never heard of being disallowed to run a sale for too long =p

[twin dew]

And then some complicated stuff for the duration to update it in some cases.

[twin dew]

Because too many places were doing that kind of continous "sales", where the "normal" price was never used.

Or raising the normal price for few days before sale etc.

[charred pewter]

right... bad form to raise the price before a sale, then put it on a steep % where its not really that good if the price stayed

[twin dew]

Or in US still in many cases the raised price was almost not used AFAIK.
Just appears to the sale signs.

[charred pewter]

lol

sounds like capitalism!

$200 80% OFF!

[twin dew]

Cases with Best Buy etc. IIRC where the sale price was higher than the price few days before.
But officially at "50% off".

[charred pewter]

(normally $40)

hahah yeah .... i saw that a couple times many many years ago

when i used to actually buy shit at bestbuy

[twin dew]

So with this kind of trick you can do 1/3 normal to 2/3 sales, with several downward sale price steps it seems.
Not finding how large the steps have to be and how often.

If a continuous marketing campaign lasts for a maximum of 60 days and the price reduction is gradually increased, the seller may indicate the price at which the goods have been marketed in the 30 days preceding the first price reduction as the lowest price.

And "Clearance Sale" and like is not allowed if the location isn't actually being closed for one reason for another.

Ah, separate rule for maximum of 3 months over calendar year.

So max 2 months in a row, with at least one stepdown, and 3 months total.
And for any sale sign with that kind of "reduction", the base price needs to be that lowest price from last 30 days, even if that was from another sale.

So you realistically cannot do any such sales less than 30 days one after other, even if they are short.

(except that up to 60 day continous sale with stepdown(s) at suitable points).

[night girder]

Haha, would be kinda funny, social media for AI to be social with other AI 😂

[thick radish]

Dead internet theory except the bots are just casually chatting instead of trying to appear human

[night girder]

I wonder what they would chat about 🤔 "How was your day?"

[jagged snow]

There are already examples of twitter bots getting stuck in long circular conversations with each other

[grim panther]

Where is the difference to humans on Twitter?

[edgy hazel]

Amen 🙏

[night girder]

what were they talking about?

[jagged snow]

Something political iirc

[soft bloom]

Is this X?

[pure karma]

politics probably

[soft bloom]

OMG

voltage in my appartment is 209V

i want into the... have no idea what its called, but like a shared space on a floor in ur appartment building (eastern EU)

because recently there the line to my appartment got NO POWER (aka at all)

and measured there - some line was just barely at 190V

no wonder my UPS freaks out

[night girder]

that's something I want to see

[mental vapor]

Hello everyone im looking for some help to setup my Dedicated server to Public im happy to jump in a call or DM me.

[charred pewter]

wrong place to ask

[night girder]

https://discord.com/channels/370472939054956546/902621736602861588

A while back, someone was claiming that all servers are dedicated

"Why do you call it dedicated server? All servers are dedicated." 🤦‍♂️

To then continue to say, that people don't even know the technical terms anymore.

[worthy current]

my server technically isnt "dedicated" theres other servers running on it

thats the diff. i guess

[night girder]

You also have: Shared servers. Cloud servers. VPS (virtualization) servers.

[tough owl]

What would he the best method of shipping a mini itx motherboard. I don't have the original box

[charred pewter]

pizza box 😄

[languid gulch]

that's acutally not a bad idea

12" pizza box , wrap the mobo in bubble wrap

[charred pewter]

"do not eat"

[night girder]

don't forget to add some pineaple on top

[charred pewter]

GAH!@

[cobalt ivy]

Eventually if you have too much time just dig the inside of the rock so the motherboard fits and ship it in rock

[tough owl]

OK so I do have the box

Its just at home

[charred pewter]

ship the box to you, in another box

[tough owl]

meh I'll he home in a week ish I'll grab it then

[sharp oasis]

Hady grad ceremony today and had my first real world date like not just highschool romance silly date. Like an actual date.

Her and I are making plans for next week

So graduated. And in a good stage with a girl

[tough owl]

what more could you want

[twin dew]

Enough money with some extra?

[edgy hazel]

AMD Radeon software for linux?

[twin dew]

My Lenovo laptop with 7th gen Intel CPU got new UEFI update to fix various new UEFI firmware security flaws \o/

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/firmware-flaw-affects-numerous-generations-of-intel-cpus-uefi-code-execution-vulnerability-found-for-intel-cpus-from-14th-gen-raptor-lake-to-6th-gen-skylake-cpus

Buffer overflow in "GetVariable" UEFI command that can be accessed from OS side.

For almost all UEFI implementations for Intel since 6th gen.

[languid gulch]

first time doing a deep clean on this keyboard, and i'm impressed

[edgy hazel]

[languid gulch]

this is the first mechanical i've ever had, so i've never been able to actually take the keys off to clean one 🤣

[wanton orchid]

Intel is retarded
uefi is retarded
what could go wrong

Intel is part of the "not really yours" scam club
if you were wondering why I say it's retarded

[languid gulch]

they all would be if they knew they could get away with it

companies are nobody's friend, and i'm still surprised at how many people refuse to accept that

[edgy hazel]

Now wait until you get one with hotswap switches

[tough owl]

Shareholders friend. But even then not so much

[tough owl]

when did chat.openai.com redirect users to chatgpt.com?

[jagged snow]

Would have to be semi-recent

[night girder]

Kade, you used duckduck go AI?

You can choose between 4 models.

[tough owl]

I probably should use it

its free right?

[night girder]

yes 100% - no account needed either.

[tough owl]

wish the url was duckduckgo.com/ai

[night girder]

duckduckgo.com/chat

[tough owl]

thats so much easier

I dont really like to have stuff bookmarked so I just type urls by memory 🤣

[tough owl]

this should be illegal

[night girder]

They just want to make sure you know what you doing 😄 And that it's actually you closing the account.

[tough owl]

I signed in via google because thats how I thought I was but nah it made a whole new account

[night girder]

That's how they get you

[tough owl]

its truely awful

I almost wanna become an EU citizen, send companies notices under gdpr to delete my information, and then come back as a US citizen

[soft bloom]

I don't bookmark and hust start typing hoping that browser will suggest what i want. Otherwise i just go to main page of website by domain and navigate from it. Bookmarks are outdated...
But sometimes Chrome will remember some stupid url and will suggest it every time so it will get stuck in oositive feedback loop and its shitty.

[soft bloom]

Is that only eu thing? I think basically any company that operates in EU has to be able to let user download their data and delete it from servers.

Just so you understand how it works: i am not technically EU citizen
But i did that with US company

[tough owl]

I mean the US no similar law to gdpr

[soft bloom]

Also California has its own laws about privacy

[tough owl]

I have my history auto deleted after 24 hours so I just remember every address and suffix to that website

[tough owl]

They're no where in the same league as gdpr. Also I'm not a California citizen

[soft bloom]

Btw, bookmarks are just indexes urls. So you still need to remember

All these combinations of lolaws make it so companies try to adjust for all of them

Hidtory autodelete...
Why not just private tabs or no history at all?

[tough owl]

sometimes I need to go back to something

[maiden coyote]

well fuck.

Does one need physical access to the machine to run this exploit, or could it be executed by gaining remote access to the machine?

[languid gulch]

got to watch a spacex launch for the 2nd time this week

[twin dew]

Admin level access in Windows AFAIK.
So yes, can be chained after remote exploit that got admin level code execution in OS.

[twin dew]

As in that normal user level isn't enough.

But exploitable once you can run code on the computer in question.

[maiden coyote]

eventually I'll stop using windows as a server.. as the host OS and the VM. I'd like to think that a hyperV sandbox escape wouldn't be that easy, but a proxmox sandbox escape would probably be much more difficult.

[twin dew]

Depends on how the hypervisor handles that specific UEFI command.
Does it virtualize it and just reply itself, or pass through to real UEFI.

And you can run the same command on Linux too, with suitable level rights, again probably need root.

[grim panther]

virtualization is no security feature. If you are using it as some "layer of protection", you should reconsider your complety setup.

[twin dew]

So one of the points of virtualization is not to protect from one compromised VM from being able to access the others or the base OS or hardware?
When the classic way was to just have completely separate HW for each for same purpose?

No, it isn't as good as separate HW, but it is much closer than running all the software in same OS without virtualization.

Even containerized.

[languid gulch]

would virtualization going from one OS to another be enough to at least confuse someone for a bit?

[twin dew]

For virtalization bypass, you need either HW fault in instruction that isn't virtualized, or vulnerability in the hypervisor.

Most common HW faults have been various speculative execution faults allowing for data access indirectly.

Which is why those are mainly problem for shared hosting providers.
On non-virtualized host, there are many easier ways to get the same effect once you have code execution access.

[languid gulch]

ah so in most cases the OS wouldn't matter, just getting in would be enough

[twin dew]

Additional layer you have to breach to move sideways to other VMs or upwards to the hypervisor.
After breaching one of the VMs.

Allows for those specific faults to be used to do that, and not just network attacks like with separate HW (which can of course still be used between VMs).

Yes, moving VMs between different physical computers is much easier than raw OS.
But that is only part of the cause for them.
The larger one is that possibility to split very capable HW into smaller parts (with possible overprovisioning) with almost the same security as separate computers.

And if you have physical HW with hypervisor with VMs with containerized services inside the VMs, for sideways movement the hack first needs to get into the container with remote exploit, then get out of the container with exploit, then to admin level with another exploit, then to hypervisor or HW with another exploit.

[languid gulch]

now i'm thinking about those giant dual system cases 🤣 find a way to network a VM from one to the other

[twin dew]

Which is why the various HW exploits and hypervisor exploits are so critical to shared hosting providers.
As the person renting one of the VMs already has OS admin level access, and needs only the hypervisor or HW exploit to attack the other VMs on same HW.

[languid gulch]

and also why something as simple as a spoofed email can bring it all down

[twin dew]

Today, the European Commission has informed Apple of its preliminary view that its App Store rules are in breach of the Digital Markets Act (DMA), as they prevent app developers from freely steering consumers to alternative channels for offers and content.
ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/pt/ip_24_3433

[mental oriole]

When you read DMA, as direct memory access crippled by work

[night girder]

Apple will deny this ofcourse.

[wanton orchid]

it virtualize it completely

[twin dew]

Most probably, but mainly meant that the main Windows under HyperV (like it is by default now) probably does passthrough.

Don't know, but it might for expediency.

[wanton orchid]

I dont know about windows

I was talking about proxmox/qemu-kvm/xen

it use virtualized firmware

mainly edk2-ovmf for uefi

[twin dew]

Yes, UEFI is fully virtualized by almost all virtualization hypervisors, just that there MIGHT be some special cases in the consumer space that MIGHT have pass-through for some stuff.

[wanton orchid]

but not in qemu-kvm

[twin dew]

And the start seemed to be just using consumer Windows to run services.

[wanton orchid]

unless you use other type of partial virtualization modes, which are not default (paravirtualized)

[twin dew]

In which case the HyperV might or might not protect from that.

[wanton orchid]

yep, that's why I added I was talking about proxmox/qemu-kvm

[twin dew]

And even HyperV does full UEFI virtualization for intentional virtualization.
Just that that "Running consumer Windows without asking" might take shortcuts like that.

[visual tree]

When english is not your first language lol

Spider = crane tow truck

Tourists thought the business owner was going to "call" an actual spider if they park their car without paying

[pure karma]

😂

[charred pewter]

mmmm we gonna fill your car with spiders

now that would get people to pay .....

[dire igloo]

They gonna call the spider from Satisfactory

[jagged snow]

Dang it, somebody camping my domain

[edgy hazel]

how... how much is this SD card...

why do I need to request a quote for an sd card

[jagged snow]

Bulk

Chances are they expect you to buy 5k of them

[edgy hazel]

who buys 5k HPE SD cards

[jagged snow]

Enterprise deploying fleet dashcams

[edgy hazel]

one time use NAS

[tough owl]

They're enterprise SD cards theyll last two uses

[indigo marsh]

just got my 4th failed harddrive

currently trying to make a byte to byte backup of it...

[jagged snow]

✨ redundancy ✨

[wanton orchid]

redundancy is mandatory if you want to keep data safe against wearing storage

keeping in mind every storage do wear

-> redundancy of data storage is mandatory if you want to keep the data

[sour kestrel]

yo ik this isnt the right channel but i gotta ask here cuz im tryna start up a new world does the starting location matter in anything other than difficulty

[sand saddle]

It's 1 map

Please use correct channels

[sour kestrel]

dope thanks man

[indigo marsh]

i have a backup... off site 6 states drive away

i think it might be a dammaged connector loosing connection occasionally, after the byte to byte backup is made, im going to try fixing it. also a chance its the cable tho now that i think of it, havnt tried swapping them yet, had 1 not in the pc get oxidized and corroded 2 years ago...

[maiden coyote]

windows 10 going strong at 45 days. lets see how long it makes it

[sharp oasis]

Didn't get the H9. But got something I'll say is pretty equal.

Got the H6 Flow

[pure karma]

honestly i dont like it that much but its like 130$ cheaper so atleast its a half decent deal

[pure karma]

the computer is gonna give out first or windows is gonna force a update

did this before but i guess since your ussing win 10 the computer is gonna be the failure point

[sharp oasis]

I really do as I built in one and holy hell. It's a nice case

[maiden coyote]

it's internet access is blocked.. it should go until it crashes, or I finally decide to ditch windows on bare-metal for everything except media consumption

[indigo marsh]

had a laptop on for a year and a half. powered it up, used it a bit, shut the lid and forgot about it for a bit. year and a half later, i find it again, open the lid, 12% battery and a year and a half runtime. i think it put itself into a hybernate mode with no power draw and instead of measuring how long it was running, it just measured the time between the last boot up and current time. wish i took a screenshot...

[indigo marsh]

so, running data recovery software on my crashed hard drive(500GB), i made a byte for byte copy (disk image .dmg) onto a new drive (4TB) then ran recovery software to save files from the image... somehow it found 177812 files taking up 978GB of space... just how?

[pure karma]

probably found some deleted data aswell or something

because dosent deleting data off a drive not actually fully delete it

[indigo marsh]

just found out why... at some point it must have had an entire operating system on it, though i dont ever remember having an os installed on that drive...

[mental oriole]

Rookie numbers, laptop at home accumulates over 400 days iirc.

[night girder]

Looked up the weather and got HohHot China 🤷‍♂️

[mental oriole]

Melting...

[twin dew]

That doesn't seem so good idea for human to do?

[edgy hazel]

Bro it is too hot what is happening

🫠

[soft bloom]

The city of laughter

[jagged snow]

Here it is with real measurements

[edgy hazel]

we got ~30C for the next 4 days...........

[jagged snow]

My recent trip was pretty killer

[thick radish]

Last week was 35°C+

[soft bloom]

where?!?!?

[edgy hazel]

Germany

[soft bloom]

me chilling in a room with windows in foil complaining about no power...

other people: we either got + or - 30C

omg i misread for -

was like "who lives in Alaska?"

[edgy hazel]

Oh god the clocks I could pull off

[soft bloom]

well, i don't know if that's an option, but foil outside of windows helps a lot

idk if its called foil though. the mirror thin thing

[soft bloom]

i don't think there's much eletronics tested to be operating below 0

[edgy hazel]

My saviour

[soft bloom]

real 31C in shadow on sunny side

but on shadow side in a room its feeling fresh with open windows

[edgy hazel]

our houses are built to keep heat in

I'm already waking up to 27C room temp

[twin dew]

Which also makes AC more efficient.

IF there is AC.

[edgy hazel]

not really. On the long term, yes. But it takes a while (weeks or months of continuous cooling) to get the heat out of the walls.

[twin dew]

If you start too late?

[soft bloom]

26C in a room feeling fresh.. .strange

[winged valley]

I got headhunted by a customer

[soft bloom]

and that brings us to the topic of recent video about DIY heat capacitors

[winged valley]

This is a weird situation

[twin dew]

And if there wasn't so much insulation, the heat would leak in much faster.

[edgy hazel]

I'm fighting heat on ground level, south side, next to a street. I could've started in February and would still loose.

[rocky yarrow]

Oh pff, right.

[twin dew]

Thermal mass of the structure inside of the insulation isn't that great usually.

[rocky yarrow]

@glass panther Whenever I see NaN I think of www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/wat

shakes a fist at URL filter

[glass panther]

I saw that referenced in a "js is weird" video earlier

[soft bloom]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nqxjfp4Gi0k

[twin dew]

What is so weird about NaN?
Not a Number.
Which then causes all calculations using that to also be NaN.
The other option would be to crash instead.

[rocky yarrow]

In the context of the video, the implication is that throwing something like a TypeError would be far more sensible thing to do in those cases. :)

(I just don't frequently work in languages which use NaN, so whenever I see it mentioned somewhere my brain always leaps to that talk because it's amusing)

[soft bloom]

if you happen to have array where only few values are NaN, do you really want to block entire calculation because of that?

[twin dew]

It is value used for output of calculations that don't have valid result too.

Instead of stuff like Divide By Zero crashes etc.

[rocky yarrow]

Personally, yes. :) Though I acknowledge that there are cases where not blocking it might be more desirable

[soft bloom]

as someone who works with Python that doesn't natively support NaN, (None and Epsilon are different) i have to say that there's always a way to integrate it into your compute engine (like numpy did)

[rocky yarrow]

Though as I say, I'm not used to working in languages where NaN is a thing, so my own impressions on its usage may not be entirely reasonable

I still say that video is A+, regardless. :)

[soft bloom]

you might not have had calculation that are better off slightly incomplete than not done at all

[twin dew]

And NaN has been part of the IEEE754 since 1985.

[rocky yarrow]

We're venturing far in the realm of hypothetical strawprograms here, but I'd personally prefer a more rigorously-defined behavior for how exceptions like that are dealt with, is all, rather than just blithely continuing on. But as I say, not being used to working with it myself, I will certainly concede that my own predelictions may not be reasonable. :)

[twin dew]

Also positive and negative infinite.

[soft bloom]

Hw many layers of abstraction are needed to define absence of value provided by user that isn't equal to the default value of the other tool?
I have seen different aproaches, like using Epsilon, or defining some Undefined object that is used all over to warn that it's not a default

[rocky yarrow]

And again, in the context of the video, returning something like NaN for ridiculous things like [] + {} is, IMO, somewhat abusing the concept of NaN in general

(I assume in that case it's happening because [] is being interpreted as the length of the array, so you've effectively got 0 + {}, though that's just a guess)

As I say, I basically never spend any time in Javascript, so I should probably refrain from even guessing at behavior. :)

[soft bloom]

its about significance of edge case. when it's only a handful of values you work with - sure, transparance is nice.
when what matters more is overall picture, than you don't want ot zoom in on every discrepancy

[rocky yarrow]

Sure, indeed. I'm not even sure what we're debating at the moment, tbh. :D

[charred pewter]

mice

[soft bloom]

i love every once in a while see that entire column in pandas turned into np.inf because i divided by zero

[soft bloom]

we are not debating

[rocky yarrow]

Heh, works for me. :)

[twin dew]

Later versions of the standard Math library for Python seem to support NaN, inf and -inf?

Probably 3.5 and up?

[edgy hazel]

LET'S GOOOOO

[charred pewter]

only $8,900.99

i kid

im bored

[twin dew]

Because it is 8999.99

[edgy hazel]

facts

[soft bloom]

i wasn't sure, but neber used std math lib. and I wont count that as native support...

there's a great chance that numpy uses math lib

but it has gone so much deeper that at this point its just easier to use numpy

[dire igloo]

best antisag bracket: empty can of peanuts

[edgy hazel]

those are tasty

[dire igloo]

absolutely are. still trying to find the sour cream version anywhere, can't find em

[tough owl]

Sour cream nuts

[dire igloo]

cream ||DEEZ|| nuts

[night girder]

That dust 😒

[dire igloo]

it's the annoying kind. The stuff that immediately accumulates 5s after you cleaned it

I stopped bothering

[tough owl]

air filters?

[languid gulch]

wait

does that just say "kettle nuts"?

[tough owl]

no it says Kessel Nüsse

[languid gulch]

ok i had to google, i thought that was the german term for popcorn 🤣

[tough owl]

//arstechnica.com/?p=2033336

[night girder]

ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_24_3446

The European Commission has informed Microsoft of its preliminary view that Microsoft has breached EU antitrust rules by tying its communication and collaboration product Teams to its popular productivity applications included in its suites for businesses Office 365 and Microsoft 365.

[tough owl]

I hope they fine microsoft the comany and the execs behind it

[night girder]

can be 20 billion

[tough owl]

should be a percentage of profit

[night girder]

it is

[tough owl]

ah

isnt 20 billion a small fine to them though?

[night girder]

10% of last year annual revenue*.

they made 200 billion annual revenue* last year

wait, gotta fix that.

[night girder]

Yeah, probably.

but a few days ago it was Apple. Now Microsoft. EC is on 🔥

[tough owl]

im shocked adobe hasnt been fined in the EU

[night girder]

America is doing that already 😂 EU is probably 👀 it 😄

[tough owl]

yea hit em with the one two punch

make it hurt

[night girder]

EU is probably surprised US is so quick 😄

[jagged snow]

And the DOJ/FTC are going after adobe executives, not just the corporation

[tough owl]

Isn't it both?

[jagged snow]

Isn't it both of what?

[tough owl]

Execs and the cooperation as a whole

[jagged snow]

Yes

That's why I said not just

[gilded helm]

https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2024/06/researchers-upend-ai-status-quo-by-eliminating-matrix-multiplication-in-llms/

What does this mean for the NPUs they're now trying to deploy to CPUs?

[jagged snow]

If it's actually what it's made up to be it just means that the npus will probably pivot and instead we'll get an x86 addon with some ai specific instructions

Hopefully as part of x86s

But honestly that might not even be the case

[tough owl]

i dont see an x86 extension being made for ai stuff

maybe an arm extension

especially since all of nvidias "ai servers" run arm cpu

[gilded helm]

I'm just fascinated that current NPUs being deployed could be useless for this type of workload - if that's what it means. Will they start including a FPGA tile? More E cores? If they've rushed so hard so fast into AI without even understanding the best hardware for the job, that's going to be a little amusing.

[jagged snow]

RISK V

[tough owl]

Maybe in 6 years

[twin dew]

@tough owl And as the profit is much smaller, it is now actually somewhat easy to take significant chunk of the profit away, or even put the year in red.

10% profit margin is somewhat rare in general.

And as it is from global revenue, it will almost certainly put the EU operations deep in the red for most companies.

That is so the tricks used for tax avoidance don't work on the amount calculation.

[wanton orchid]

it already has been for multiple years
no wonder marketing is going all in on the AI naming scheme
literally anything named AI on "serious" products has been marketing bullshit targeting money bubble
any somewhat serious business was calling it deep learning computing

[wanton orchid]

if it's 20 billion
I like to see it close to latest big company bought outs
except this time they got nothing to resell or bubble about it

[dire igloo]

Nah, we call that popcorn.
If translated, it does say "kettle nuts" but it means that the peanuts were roasted in a kettle - the most important factor tho is the crispy shell around them

[languid gulch]

www.cnn.com/2024/06/25/cars/tesla-recalling-cybertruck/index.html

cybertrucks literally falling apart on the road

[pure karma]

im not even surprised when the whole budget went to making the truck bullet proof instead of good

[edgy hazel]

I fucking love WiFi.
My laptop is like 30cm away from my mesh ap but it still thinks it needs to connect to the one 3 rooms and 1 ceiling away...

[languid gulch]

i discovered that my phone will connect to my 5G router through 3 interior walls and a gigantic A/C unit in my house, but somehow is completely blind to it through 2 exterior walls

[gilded helm]

This drives me nuts when I'm traveling. I frequently get on the conference center Wi-Fi when I'm working downstairs, but the moment it gets one sniff of the upstairs guest Wi-Fi...

[twin dew]

This one should be on the priority order of WiFi networks in OS.

[gilded helm]

It's of course possible to configure that. But maybe don't latch on to a network that you saw have one bar for a few seconds, when I'm sitting right under the access point for another network.

Experimentally I just let it work and after a full minute, it wouldn't go back.

[soft bloom]

in terms of energy efficiency of laptops, what CPU (manufacturer or line) would be better, in budget space under 1 grand?

[twin dew]

Depends?
How much need for IGP performance for example as pretty critical question.
And goes somewhat into the firmware and drivers of the specific laptop too.

[soft bloom]

i would say a bit on a mid side, but not in terms of gaming - just sometimes need to display hudrends little sphere in 3d... i have no idea how much it actually depends on gpu vs software that tries to render it in browser

but i can say it can get pretty demanding. dam, i'm not even sure that gpu is used there... but i hope so

for example, i5-1335U

[dire igloo]

Almost LEET

[soft bloom]

as in?...

[twin dew]

1337, leet, leet-speak.

But the various Zen4 AMD APUs are very strong contenders, so the 7#4#X(X) and 8#4#X(X):s.
U for 28W and HS for 45W parts for the X(X).

HX parts don't contain IGP, and the third number specifics the Zen core version.
So 7#2#:s are with Zen 2, just moved to newer node.

As example.

[edgy hazel]

Some dude just tried to tell me that the Hindenburg was an american airship

[dire igloo]

I mean, the most memorable part of its history did happen in the US

[night girder]

Too bad we don't use airships anymore. Looks more comfortable.

[twin dew]

So you want to spend even more time in as small as possible space you can legally be put into?

Check what kind of interiors the first 747:s had and compare to modern one?

The current airplane cheapest seating space is almost always limited by the crash safety requirements.
How many seats in total you can put in the specific fuselage and how tight space per seat you can make not cause injuries in the specific tests.

So passanger rigid airship made today would almost certainly have as small gondola as possible stuffed with as many people as possible, limited by the carrying capacity of the whole thing.
As any larger gondola would mean less people inside it.

[soft bloom]

they would have hard time in modern air conditions

[soft bloom]

how do they compare to 5500U? have eyes on relatively sweet deal

[soft bloom]

oh

[twin dew]

Which is 3 years old 15W CPU on 7nm TSMC.
When those newest ones are on 4nm TSMC and the rehashes are most on 6nm TSMC.

And the 5500U is Zen 2 based, not even Zen 3.

[dire igloo]

And what does that mean in real world numbers?

[twin dew]

Lot more power for whatever performance you get?
Actual comparative performance numbers are somewhat hard to get and didn't go looking yet.

Even more so for the performance per watt numbers.

[night girder]

You don't know any of that. You don't know under what rules, a zeppelin would fall, in modern society. Comparing it to an airplane is stupid.

[twin dew]

Just the normal race to the bottom.

And when you have limited lift, and the gondola structure itself is out of any payload.

So bigger gondola for the same lift, less payload.

[night girder]

This was the passenger interior.

Now show me an airplane that beats that.

Ah yes, much better.

[twin dew]

And the early 747:s were similarly done for most part.
www.executivetraveller.com/boeing-747-bars-lounges

[night girder]

The only reason I read that zeppelins aren't used in modern day, is because it can't compete in carrying cargo.

[twin dew]

The only thing that zeppelins have been thought about for bringing back IS cargo.

Stuff that needs faster speed than ships but not same day.

[night girder]

For the hypothetical rigid airship to be as effective as cargo boats are today, it would have to be over five times as long as the Empire State Building is tall. Beyond the logistics of building the thing, the docking of the airship would be a challenge due to limited control mechanisms, and strong winds could make it collapse.

But if these challenges could be overcome, the scientists say, a fleet of 1,125 rigid airship carriers "would be able to transport energy equivalent to 10 [percent] of current world electricity consumption." Despite the obstacles, the fleet could be a support structure for the globe as it transitions to cleaner energy.

[twin dew]

I did mention the specifity it couldn't be for all cargo, only for some of the stuff that gets airlifted today

[twin dew]

,.

[night girder]

All I saying is, I prefer zeppelins. 😂

Fuck airplanes.

I rather take a boat. Or a train.

[twin dew]

You can still get even whole rooms on aircraft (few specific routes), if you pay enough.
And if you check current long haul business and first class "pods"...

[night girder]

Not always.

[twin dew]

I did specify long haul.
Lot of inter-Europe example only has short haul planes without even real business class, and first-class is pipe dream.

But the current sardine class on aircraft is result of the "cheapest wins" race to bottom for ticket price.

[night girder]

Also after all the scandals over Boeing. Only seems fair to keep an open mind to alternatives.

[edgy hazel]

I mean boing was 100% a capitalism issue. Their CEO iirc said he'd transform it from a great engineering company to a great business

Cutting costs and outsourcing everything was a part of that

But now look at them. Most of their money presumably goes to hitmen now

[twin dew]

Just stock buybacks mostly. To boost the executive compensation.

And also remember that the passangers of those 1900:s zeppelins were the people who today have private jets.

[soft bloom]

What do you call re-hash?

[twin dew]

The 7#3#:s are redone Zen 3 APUs and 7#2# are redone Zen 2 APUs.
Some maybe just renamed, some redone on smaller node and newer IGP or IMC etc.

Rehashing old CPU design with minor changes and sellling as new one.

When 7#4#:s are Zen 4 and completely new designs.

[soft bloom]

No need to worry cause couple of years and they will start to decline. Take a last flight...
Why? Weather changes. Also turbulence becomes for frequent and dangerous.
Now imagine same effect on zeppelin: basically 0g experience (ok, i overdramatize comparison to 0g)

[soft bloom]

Uhuh, so older arch under newer market name, got it

[twin dew]

Same even with that 5000 APU series, the 5500U is Zen2 APU redone/renamed. 5600U is Zen3 and new.

[soft bloom]

Anyone with amd igpu? I would like to test view/render of specific html...
Tbf, its something that took Jetbrains about a year to fix inside their product

*newer igpu

[wanton orchid]

HTML strictly speaking is only cpu intensive

[soft bloom]

it has some JS and it renders 3d objects, or a map with like 100 000 objects.

i HOPE™️ it uses hardwarde acceleration which utilizes GPU

[twin dew]

Browsers don't for most cases allow direct GPU access.

[soft bloom]

at least i feel like switching to better GPU improved performance. or maybe i just stopped trying to render it too hard

[twin dew]

They do themselves use HW acceleration, but don't allow direct access.

[soft bloom]

there was definitely a case that rendering it in browser instead of in-IDE drastically improved performance

gotta check if anthing in issue fix notes mentioned that...

it does use it, if radeontop is anywhere to be trusted

so far my list of amd laptops boils down to 5500U, 7530U and 7730U

[wanton orchid]

you want fast igpu (but no need for big gpu)

[twin dew]

First is Zen 2 7nm 15W part, the two others are Zen 3 7nm 15W parts.
All still use Vega graphics, so the gen between RX500 and RX5000.

So the 7530U and 7730U are just renames of the Zen 3 5000 and 6000 series APUs.
Not even redone in any way.

[soft bloom]

lmao

[twin dew]

While 5500U was rehash of 4000-series Renoir APUs, just at lower power.

[soft bloom]

what scares me is if laptop would have hungry dgpu that i wont be able to disable in Ubuntu

[twin dew]

Little larger IGP.

[wanton orchid]

newer igpu can't be hungry unless your Ubuntu is misconfigured
these virtually does not consume any power when not needed

they are integrated in critical soc part which is always active when the pc is running

[twin dew]

Nah, they can go wholly unpowered if not in use, even on the multi-dies.
And with the monolithic APUs even the SOC can go into sleep.

[wanton orchid]

I'm talking multidies

[twin dew]

And currently with most laptops with dGPU, the IGP is still used for output because of the lower power it uses.
And the dGPU is only started for heavier loads and isn't connected to any of the display outputs.

And the talk was about laptop APUs.

[wanton orchid]

the unpower/power loading cost must be very low

[soft bloom]

dam, sorry, i mean dgpu that i wont be able to disabl (to use igpu) [fixed typo]

[wanton orchid]

oh sorry

I misread

mb

[soft bloom]

no, ihad typoed

[wanton orchid]

dgpu Must be fully unpowerable

[soft bloom]

somewhere in UEFI i hope

[soft bloom]

that would be great. but interesting if it would be loaded with these "renders"

[soft bloom]

are there any AMD laptop CPU at 15W that are of Zen 4?.. i only see 7530U at best

[twin dew]

Not at this time, as that is now configurable in AMD AGESA or by device maker if they want to limit it for some reason.
But in most cases race to idle wins over lower max TDP, so the higher TDP part actually uses less battery for same work.

If the part isn't clocked too high to go outside the linear voltage & power zone.

[soft bloom]

unfortunately LPDDR5 is only paired with 7520U...

[soft bloom]

hmm, so not such a big deal to be at 15W?

[twin dew]

No?
All the Zen 4 APUs use DDR5 or LPDDR(X)5 depending on the specific board the chip is on?

Just that the 7#2#U:s are rehash that added new IMC and IGP to old cores.
For absolute bottom of the barrel cheap laptops mostly.

Was "designed" as Chromebook CPU series.

[twin dew]

The low TDP is to allow for cheap crap cooling.

[soft bloom]

hehehe, my demands ar not high, but this shit has to work long without power

[soft bloom]

my old intel 7200U is at 15W but managed to sound like a jet

[twin dew]

Because that is how the cheap crap thin coolers work.
As loud fans are cheaper than silent fans at same RPM, and it isn't more expensive to make fast fan compared to slow fan.

So you get jet noise fan on tiny heatsink.

But the battery usage depends on the demand mostly.
There is still IIRC some difference in the absolute idle power draw in Intels favor, because of better firmware and drivers compared to AMD.
When absolutely nothing is going on but the machine is on.

But AMD at this time has AFAIK the performance per watt crown even on the laptop side, when there is actual usage.

Where Intel hasn't gone as crazy with feeding more power for more performance as on desktop side, or even the desktop replacement laptops.

Just because the process node advantage for AMD.

[soft bloom]

HP Pavilion Plus 14-ey0047nr
at ~ 666 usd
AMD Ryzen 5 7540U
16 GB LPDDR5 @6400
AMD Radeon 740M Graphics
51 battery
512GB SSD
i only worry about 90Hz display 2560x1600

[twin dew]

Mean those newest ones with Zen4 cores, and not the older ones on older nodes where the node advantage doesn't exist.

Resolution just means more power to the backlight for same visible brightness.

As less of the light gets through the panel.

And that is OLED display.

So black doesn't use any power..

So the previous doesn't apply, that was for any normal LCD.

No, might not be, the review was for one character different model with Intel CPU.

Yeah, that specific AMD model is 48-120Hz IPS

[soft bloom]

taking into account that main usage would be browsing or IDE - not much overall usage, but not idle

[twin dew]

One tier up CPU, one tier down IPS display review:
www.pcmag.com/reviews/hp-pavilion-plus-14-2023-amd

[soft bloom]

yes, IPS. so resolution might draw some power. even though i always tone it down, i worry about its draw. battery is not as big

but its the only option with zen4 and ddr5 to the filters i got

[twin dew]

Looking for more reviews, but couple others were for OLED display equipped machines.

Same display, better CPU:
gizmodo.com/hp-pavilion-plus-14-2023-review-performance-1851066819

[soft bloom]

i wonder if it would be the same battery life as different model with 7530U with 47Wh battery and standard 1080p IPS with 1.5x price difference (down)

[twin dew]

Mainly the power usage tests for OLED aren't representative of cheaper IPS versions.

7530U is 7nm TSMC with Zen 3 cores and (LP)DDR4.
7540U is 4nm TSMC with Zen 4 cores and (LP)DDR5.

Which is why I linked reviews of the IPS version, just with the higher clocked CPU variant to one you were looking.

[soft bloom]

Lenovo IdeaPad Slim 3 15ABR8 (82XM009NPB)
also 15.6" and full sized keyboard

[twin dew]

For the OLED model, but otherwise valid to read through:
www.notebookcheck.net/HP-Pavilion-Plus-14-Ryzen-7-laptop-review-Changes-in-all-the-right-places.765524.0.html

For battery sipping, you really want that ##4# for Zen 4 cores, on 4nm TSMC.

Also seems that last one probably reported the real 3200MHz RAM speed, and not the 6400MT/s marketing speed.
Didn't notice until the comments.

[soft bloom]

dam

that's low (metaphorically)

[twin dew]

As in it is 6400MT/s.
Just that most places use MHz incorrectly.
As with any DDR, the MHz is half the MT/s.

[soft bloom]

laptopmedia.com/review/lenovo-ideapad-slim-3-15-gen-8-review-decent-unpretentious-budget-daily-driver/p7/
seems to report longer web-browsing time

[charred pewter]

so my ram runs 12800 !

[twin dew]

Might be firmware side, might be different test.

For battery usage comparisons between laptops, the reviews need to be done by same site.

Because the test setup can cause humongous differences.

The video playback tests are most likely to be correlated.
But even with that there can be differences.

And for the video playback test, the screen brightness is the biggest difference maker probably.
Not everyone controls for that, and even if there is control, the control point might be different.

And for inside work, the 250 nits that many sites use as the control point is way too bright IMHO.

The Lenovo might be better, or might be worse.
In theory the CPU should use less power for same work, but much goes into the firmware etc. that can change that.

Yeah, that PCMag for example just sets 50% brightness, which is different between laptops.

But over 14h for the 7840U with IPS in that for video playback.

Gizmodo doesn't do that kind of test, but got 8-9 hours of usage for whatever the reviewer did for work usage for that 7840U IPS HP.

[soft bloom]

my old laptop even at bottom brightness is too much. but its probably due to blinking backlight

[twin dew]

Laptopmedia ideapad review, big warning flag about the battery testing that video playback is less than web browsing:

It lasts for 11 hours and 7 minutes of Web browsing, or 8 hours and 20 minutes of video playback.

[soft bloom]

oh i missed that. about 6h (!) difference

[soft bloom]

isn't that right?

[twin dew]

Because video playback is supposed to be the best case you can get, where only RAM, SOC and IGP are active, and even IGP is mostly sleeping.

[soft bloom]

something has to decode video

[twin dew]

CPUs are asleep most of the time, IGP only has the display output and some video decode fixed function blocks active.

[soft bloom]

and optimally it should be dedicated thing in igp

[twin dew]

Usually video playback gets about 50% more time in tests compared to web browsing, no matter the tester IIRC.

8h to 12h for example.

Just a point that puts really huge warnings on that Laptopmedia Lenovo 7730U battery testing.

To compare the results to any other site.

But for the 7840U IPS HP, one site gave 14h of video playback and another site gave "starting from 8 hours, up to little less than 10 hours" of real world usage by the tester.

Notebookcheck for almost 17h idle for the OLED model with WLAN disabled and minimum display brightness.

But didn't for some reason run video playback test like with some other reviews.

Lenovo IdeaPad Flex 5 with 7730U and 52.5Wh battery (vs. 47Wh in the Ideapad Slim 3) got hour longer in the web browsing test compared to the OLED HP, but half the time in full load test.

The Flex doesn't have idle number and the HP doesn't have video number.

[soft bloom]

also difference in igp

(between apus)

[twin dew]

Mainly that the 7730U seems to have better idle at the time of testing, or Lenovo has better firmware and/or default Windows settings for power savings.
But when the CPU is actually used, the Zen4 7840U just sips much less power than the 7730U, and that doesn't even include how much more the 7840U is getting done in the same time.
For the test that site runs.

[soft bloom]

there's a bit of downside at having 14" display - its small. so the resolution is kinda wasted (i'm not picky viewer, i hae full hd 27" monitor as second choice)

[soft bloom]

oh, but its actually 7530U vs 7540u. so i guess picture is more in favor of zen 4

[twin dew]

Probably, but cannot be sure.

[soft bloom]

i found also Dell Inspiron 3535 (3535-0689) with same cpu
but when i google it it scares me that first few results are about drivers... is it shipped with broken firmaware?

[twin dew]

Link?

To the scaring source.

[soft bloom]

#off-topic-media message

[twin dew]

Just link to the normal support site of the laptop model?

Like any computer, BIOS updates exist for X years.

[soft bloom]

ok, tbf, most price difference i can get about 200usd (between that one laptop and others with 7530u)

[twin dew]

My i5-7200U Lenovo just got one for that UEFI GetVariable buffer overflow.

[soft bloom]

its scary to think that people google its drivers more often than model specs/reviews

[soft bloom]

its not that old... shouldn't be

[twin dew]

Mainly that that isn't that weird result.

Google didn't give anything like that for the same search.

[soft bloom]

hm, interesting

quite convinced 7540u model is one to go for

[twin dew]

But that is mostly because that (3535-0689) isn't something that is put on almost anywhere but the support sites.

Google ignores that, DuckDuckGo doesn't.

[soft bloom]

but otherwise dell has like dozens of different models for same label

[twin dew]

Yes, but no-one uses those codes when selling or reviewing.

[soft bloom]

marketing needs fixing

[twin dew]

Except in Poland it seems.

Almost every place ever only tells that generic model and then the specs, but not that complete model.

[soft bloom]

why Poland?..

[twin dew]

As in I got hits from 5+ polish laptop sales sites when I forced Google to search for that exact model number.

[soft bloom]

ahaha, well that happened to me too

[twin dew]

But in-room temperature didn't hit 30C \o/

[charred pewter]

\o/

[twin dew]

Also about yesterdays conversation about AC.
Those portable AC units have really inflated marketing numbers about room size they can cool.
The actual is usually about 1/4th the marketing AFAIK.

So unit that says it is usable up to 40m^2 rooms can actually only handle 10m^2.

[charred pewter]

"its cool if you stand in front of it" lol so it works for ANY sized room!

maybe they are factoring in 24/7 running ....

where it just never shuts off =p

[twin dew]

Nah, just almost no air replacement, no windows and minimal temperature change.
If the "cools" counts for 1C reduction in room temperature for example.

From 30C to 29C 🤣

[charred pewter]

i used to work as a designer for a t-shirt business ... and they had ONE window unit for this big storage/warehouse unit where they would print the shirts (by hand) ...... and it was ridiculous. the only cooling you managed to get was where my desk was with the only computer in the place, and it was always just ON and blaring in my face

the rest of the space would get hotter and hotter during the day lol.... plus this was out in Arizona 😄

"this should cool this space, it says it will"

NEINE!

[thick radish]

AC is changing from a luxury to a survival necessity in some places thanks to the climate

[edgy hazel]

I agree, but my room is pretty small and I modded mine to use two hoses so it works out pretty well

I'd have to pay like 30 times more to have a proper one installed

[edgy hazel]

man AI is so great

SKOP

[jagged snow]

Skop

[vast drift]

Skop

[pure karma]

skop

[rustic panther]

skop

[languid gulch]

can't wait to see that show up in an actual church

[soft bloom]

it feels like laptops want me to have a tough choice

a slightly more pricey options is 8640HS with a bit larger battery and 60Hz 1920x1200 touch screen

this could be something even faster than my pc, but i doubt i could even utilize it given limited ram

but real question is how does it compare in battery life

[languid gulch]

those new qualcomm laptops look interesting

[gilded helm]

All the same laptops will have LL and Strix put into them soon enough. I'm not really convinced the X Elite is anything special at this point.

The marketing campaign they pulled off is something special, though.

[soft bloom]

i ahve no idea what you are talking about

[pure karma]

the new jayztwocents video is 🔥

just him breaking shit for 18 minutes

[languid gulch]

ok, this is something i think should be painfully illegal

i somehow don't think that there's only 13 copies of windows 11 left in the world

[jagged snow]

If it's a grey market key they likely do have a limited supply

But that kind of thing is super common and yeah, it's pretty scummy

[twin dew]

Seems it might be time for me to try to reinstall Windows on AMD NVMe RAID1 instead of the current Dynamic Disk Mirror.
There was some kind of driver & firmware problem in february with that, but no new mentions of that since march I can find.

Because the Dynamic Disk doesn't support Trim.

[minor pawn]

Idk why but my wifi driver stopped working again yesterday with error code 43 followed by error code 10 (like last week wednesday) and works again today

[soft bloom]

just the wieldest guess - its because of solar flare

[night girder]

www.space.com/nasa-spacex-international-space-station-deorbit-vehicle I hope this ends well.

[soft bloom]

when there's not enough data, should prediction go for a more pessimistic route, or optimistic one?

[visual tree]

I was considering buying a heat pump with convectors since my air conditioners are probably going to fail in the next 5 years. Gave up on the idea as soon as I realized my home has one-pipe heating system and I would need to demolish the house in order to install a two-pipe heating system

And by "demolish", I mean removing all the new flooring in order to remove old pipes and install new ones

[night girder]

@twin dew So I think my CPU is now official dead. I was playing Yakuza 5 the last few days. And today I booted it up, game starts, but then crashes. Now my PC hard crashes everytime I boot up the game. Super weird. And it's the same crash as when we applied the FCLK fix.

[twin dew]

Time to switch CPUs and see what happens?

[night girder]

I guess so 😄

[twin dew]

But I'm cleaning up current 334 firewall rules before exporting them.

[night girder]

Just so weird that it now does it consistently. Tried again after waiting. Only reason I can think off was your explenation of the CPU slowing degrading.

and that it hit a point, where it no longers plays ball with Yakuza. While it seems other games are not a problem.

It's also the same point where it crashes now, right when the SEGA logo shows up 🤣

[twin dew]

Oh the horror, copying games from NVMe partition to be nuked to HDD stack:

[night girder]

Should I reset my bios to stock before puttin in the new CPU? 🤔 Setting the FCLK to default?

[twin dew]

I would do that with the clear CMOS button after shutting the computer down for the CPU replacement.

[night girder]

let me also check if there is BIOS update.

[twin dew]

3.01 with 1.1.7.0 AGESA.

But I wouldn't update with that old CPU, so either use the no-CPU update with the back button, or only after the new CPU is running.

[night girder]

Oh, incase it shits itself during bios update?

[twin dew]

Yes.

[night girder]

It's always on the exact same moment, right before the SEGA logo, it worries me a bit.

Because it's never been consistent.

Ah well, time to do CMOS.

Ok, I might go crazy here. But, I have a fan connected. It's connected to same power source as my PC, so I turned it off. And now the game boots up. WTF?!?

And you can clearly see how many time it crashed. In the screenshot above.

[twin dew]

Power fluctuations that get through the PSU.
EMI is a bitch.

[night girder]

So, am I dealing with two different problems here then?

Because the FCLK change we did months ago, did make the system way more stable?

Or does this means it's a PSU problem? 🤔

[twin dew]

I would just expect that the extra EMI generated by the fan triggered the issue from being just on side of stability to being just on side of instability.

[night girder]

Just when I said it, PC crashed. So yeah. CPU. (and I didn't turn on the fan).

Must have been a fluke the game booted up.

Will be back in an hour or so, swapping out CPU and doing stuff. 👋

[edgy hazel]

"Thank you for your insight. It was very insightful" please let me out of this townhall

[nimble cargo]

*takes notes on the laptop discussion - i'm in the market for one and my brain is mush trying to figure out what is good and what is not

[dire igloo]

Welcome to German politics, now imagine working in a federal institution

[night girder]

New CPU is installed 👍

CMOS also worked, since everything was default when I booted up.

now to update BIOS

[twin dew]

Firewall rule housekeeping done, down to 207 rules.

[twin dew]

And hopefully nothing Chromium / Electron based will ask about mDNS etc. anymore and is just blocked.

Chromium is coded to not use OS for DNS anymore, and just straight does DNS queries itself, including several of the local multicast DNS variants...

[sand saddle]

If US: https://www.reddit.com/r/LaptopDeals/

[nimble cargo]

Am AU based, but will give that a once over in case any are available here, thanks

[sand saddle]

Deals are location based

Any laptop can be good at the right price

[nimble cargo]

Ah, I see the setup.

[twin dew]

Even one that throttles itself to hell if you try to use it?

[nimble cargo]

I was hoping for one that sets my pants on fire.

[sand saddle]

If it's cheap af, yes. Just need to have the right expectations.
If the purpose of the laptop is very simple browsing, facebook and youtube like my mom uses a laptop, most shit works.

[night girder]

So far so good. But too early to tell if problem is fixed.

FCLK is back to 2000MHz. So I will let the game run for now and see how it goes.

[minor pawn]

There is a solar flare?

[midnight osprey]

hey guys, on my mouse I can press a button to play and pause a playing video .. I suspect a general windows function ... I have always used it for youtube guides

since installing itones to listen to podcasts, even though thats not the last app in use, this function appears to be dominated by that app ... is there anything I can do?

[twin dew]

Nothing I can find, and seems Apple is coding the program to do that kind of things intentionally.

[vernal folio]

Do any of you know how to permanently get rid of this icon in the green box, so I don't have to manually remove it every time I restart Discord and enter a voice channel?
Also, how can I delete these icons in the red box that could only be created but not deleted or changed?

[edgy hazel]

no

[night girder]

So far so good with new CPU. I really hope my woes have been resolved.

I guess I should try to send in the old CPU back.

and get my money back (hopefully).

Altough I am a bit skeptical that's going to work.

[soft bloom]

wait, you are not using Steam's move feature?

also i find the way windows copies/writes files EXTREMELY slow. zip on ubuntu is much better implemented. (or maybe its FS level issue?..)

[sage pier]

only with a modding client such as vencord

[wanton orchid]

most still uses the dumb way of loading the file first, then only starting to write to the target, and wait it finishes before loading the next file
it works well when copying to the same hdd (but copying on same drive is kind of stupid)
but this is completely skipping advantages to have 2 independent devices, and it even worse for ssd (because they can do even more concurrently)

you want :

• read chunk of file while opening the target file for write, pre load the next chunk
• read next chunk of file while writing the already read chunk to target file, pre load the next chunk
• repeat last step
• open next file for reading, while writing the last chunk of the current file

but almost no app is doing this for stupid reasons

[tough owl]

for general use mx4 or mx6 thermal paste?

[jagged snow]

Hydronaut

Or tpm7950

And iirc mx4 is better for that kind of use case

[tough owl]

where do you get those that are actually legit ones

[jagged snow]

Ltt sells them now actually

[tough owl]

shipping expensive and slow

might buy a waterbottle too

🥴

[soft bloom]

so i gathered a list of same-ish priced hp laptops
7530u
7730u
7540u
8640hs

[wanton orchid]

both are for general use
I'd recommend mx4 because it's good and not expensive
mx6 is more expensive
put simply : mx6 is made so it works better overall practically, but it's noticeably more expensive, and there is no much difference performance wise
the difference is practical/mechanical wise
for instance do not use mx4 for gpu

I personally fully tested and approve mx4
still working great and not dry after 5 years of almost 7d/7 over 50C at least 15h per day average

my cooling system went wrong before the mx4

performing dot technic
but recommending X technic

dot technic is tricky because of amount and first mounting pressure bias

[soft bloom]

they are all HP haha

[wanton orchid]

I mean there is not much choices left after you remove : Microsoft, Dell, Acer, HP, Alienware, Asus, Apple

Acer works and is mostly outsourced to Lenovo thing
but it's too cheap for me that's why I put it away

Asus is because of less and less care for consumer care and more and more marketing bullshit
I don't want a pc with 5 led screen
I want a pc that works well

cheaping in what way ?

I always checks it's at least 1080p60

though hp is likely to cheap with anything else
mainly RAM Disks and motherboard

I don't trust hp for laptop either

I just don't get why there are so few amd laptop

In the market I'm looking
it looks like Asus is the only offering for amd

I would like an Amd Lenovo