This game is too easy on late game I think a harder dungeon

[wild path]

It does not need to be fair. I want to fight until I see Vahalla... Maybe all bosses of the same faction at the same time... Other thing that we need is a block bar...

[daring tree]

#news message ?

[wild path]

Tier 6 would be nice. I see you guys are going to do something similar of Blood Omans on others factions(and a love it). But what about all tier 5 bosses at the same time? 🤩 Just a thought !

[daring juniper]

Actually all dungeon types are now equaly complex with the enemy types

What guard is talking about is the introduction of ancienc chambers with legendary loot and a unique new faction of enemies

[wild path]

Oh, i get it now. Thanks

[daring juniper]

Either way a harder dungeon and harder endgame content is planned alongside according prizes

[odd marten]

There are still some core mechanics missing (stealth) and at least 3 more factions, I wouldn't praise the day before the sundown

Even this update they added a ton of new skills to all the mobs

[daring juniper]

3 new enemy factions you mean?

[odd marten]

Not sure about Council or Grey Army, but counting them out we still should get whoever was teased next and DD's

[daring juniper]

Those are other human factions, not enemies, they will work like the magistrate bit with diferent things, for example i remember one of the devs mentioning that a town in the north lf the map, on the icy parts will have a town with bigger fjal precense

The enemies next will probably be just the hardest enemies on the game, in the update that adds character creation i theprize it will be orcs and goblins

We will get rattlings at some point tho

[odd marten]

Aye, the Deep Dwellers

all the sewer creatures, rattlings and goblinoids

I remember those from the early game designs

[supple pasture]

Where was this mentioned? iirc the kickstarter goals aren't reliable anymore.

[daring juniper]

Wayfinder direclty

[daring juniper]

Here

[supple pasture]

If he's considering ratlings to have their own dungeon, then that means more major races could have their own dungeon!

[daring juniper]

no, only 5 dungeon types are planned

I dont remember exactly if caves are part of that number

[odd marten]

Kurs from Q&A I'm pretty sure confirmed it's not going to be Deep Dwellers next patch, so someone else is being introduced

But as far as I can tell, it was never said that sewers or sunken coves have been scrapped, so we most likely will get our ratmen and goblinoids eventually in some form

[daring juniper]

Sewers havent been invented yet, goblins and orcs will be an overworld enemies

The next enemy faction inplemented in ancient echoes will be related to the ancient chambers and legendary items so its theorized they are from axonian origin

[supple pasture]

Then we have all dungeons. The 3 contracts, caves, and the legendary dungeon.

[odd marten]

that's still only a speculation

[daring juniper]

Like i said, im not sire if caves are part of that

[daring juniper]

Pretty solid speculation if you ask me

[supple pasture]

Way said they are

[odd marten]

Could be anything, truth is, another Secret Cult or anything

[odd marten]

Proof?

[daring juniper]

I mean the axonian origin, them being related to the ancienc chambers is 100% obvious

[daring juniper]

I think it would be lame if it was another pseudo humanoid group of enemies instead of something like quimeras or something

[odd marten]

Lame is a bit strong a word. And you've got to remember this wouldn't be much different; It's a dead empire, so all that's left of them are the relics, bones and wraiths.

Ergo, if Axonians were to be introduced, that would be, in essence, just an undead expansion

[daring juniper]

That would be lame like i said

I dont want just necromancers 2.0

They can have necromantic aspects, after all they invented necromancy and magic

But necrlmancers 2.0 sounds borring for whats suposed to be the ancient empire that invented magic

[odd marten]

But they are dead. Axonia is a long-forgotten empire. If the new faction is of Axonian origin due to relics, it would have to be undead

[daring juniper]

The manticore is a magical guardian that does not need suitinance, more quimera guardians like that would be better imo

[odd marten]

And what does it summon? Undead Axonians

So yea, still, chimeric mini-bosses with undead hordes and wraiths?

[daring juniper]

Or a faction of quimera enemies that can also sumon undeads, but some of them

[odd marten]

Besides, the location is a bit out of place. I think if anything, Axonian eldritch and undead would be a better fit on a different map - If I remember correctly, mountains of Nistria were a part of Axonia, right?

[odd marten]

And nobody found and purged them for centuries? So many places with mini-chimeric enemies? Seems a bit far-fetched, honestly.

I'd say someone would have to pick up the scraps first to make it believable.

Perhaps some evil druidic Secret Cult trying to replicate Axonian magic would be plausible.

But if it were just axonian undying guards, that would have to be Undead 2.0.

[daring juniper]

We agree to disagree

[odd marten]

It's not a high fantasy - magic isn't so cheap or common in this universe. Making "axonian" beastmen with necromancy out of it would dilute the feeling of it

Not that I'm opposed to beastmen, just axonian origin would feel like a cheap excuse 😉

[daring juniper]

You are aware that axonians were not only the inventors but also the masters of all current magic?

They literaly bended the elements without issue and summoned undeads without will or needing to use an unknown entity

If anything they wpuld be the perfect fit to showcase the perfected magic axonians had

[odd marten]

Which just stood there, undisturbed, for centuries after their empire fell? highly doubtful

[odd marten]

Dead masters and inventors

[daring juniper]

And yet the manticore can perform this magics without misscasting

And the undead summoned are the ones without will

[odd marten]

Oh sure, but it's a special boss, one of 2, and it came to be active by an accident of an overzealous warlock experimenting with ancient relic

Sure, there are other, lesser manticores out there, game implies so, but Venemist was a stand-alone exception, being more coherent due to being a warlock

If axonian magic was to be resurrected, it would need outside intervention of some kind - thus, a third Secret Cult would be needed

simple 😉

Axonian Beastmen just being there doesn't fit the scenario or lore unless the Devs provide some solid explanation why they weren't purged for centuries after the Axonia fell

[daring tree]

What you are talking about in ideas?

[daring juniper]

Not experimenting, its the result of a curse made by the axonians that has lasted for who knows how long

[supple pasture]

Bit hard to do while I'm out. Just look up "ratling" from Way. He'll be talking about 5 dungeons there.

[odd marten]

One doesn't negate the other, and @daring tree is right - this is off-topic.

[supple pasture]

Btw I was talking about Way saying caves are part of the 5 dungeons

[odd marten]

Anyway, back to the main topic; I honestly think it's too soon to tell if the game is too easy or not late game, since even some of the core mechanics are not implemented yet

Everything might change with Stealth and as they add more skills and then add them to every enemy, like they did this update

[supple pasture]

Yeah don't think they're intending to balance it yet knowing that mechanics and map changes will affect it.

Way even said some contract dungeons will be removed. Not all settlements will have 3 dungeons. That's only for now since it's a small map.

So the pacing and difficulty will def change

[odd marten]

What's missing for me is dominant themes.
With new proselytes, I'd like more visible disparity in enemy types depending on who's the boss:

• more humanoid warriors with Nakkatar-Brander,
• more beast-like monsters with Leechlord-Wormbearer-Abomination,
• and more cultists/spellcasters if it's an Apostle, Admonisher, or a Seer that's leading the cult there

[odd marten]

btw.

But I wouldn't fully trust Wayfinder, he talks sneaky sometimes

Because by the same logic @daring juniper' Axonians could also be crossed out from the potential faction

Which is why I think if there's going to be something tied to Axonian magics, then most likely it will be a new Secret Cult, or some twisted druids/witches/warlocks trying to revive it

[naive imp]

The whole theme of Proselytes is they're the united cult where some members ascend and some don't, turning into monsters, but they're a single entity

so having subfactions doesn't fit the theme of Proselytes

[daring juniper]

"what does the creator know about his creation? "

[daring juniper]

Also doesnt this prove it wont be undead 2.0?

[odd marten]

Yet, a local cell boss being either a priestly caster, beastly warrior, or abominable monstrosity certainly would attract different kinds and ratios of followers overall, wouldn't they? 😉

[daring tree]

it is achieved by dungeon modifier and enemies combinations.

[odd marten]

Separation would be stupid, but more consistent ratios wouldn't, especially when we have the ability to ask who's in charge there

[daring tree]

In any case it is the idea for dungeon difficulty.

[odd marten]

and that is directly tied to the types and ratios of enemies we meet

Right now, asking about the contract's details is meaningless aside from the pay,
BUT if, as a caster, I learn that there's a Rogue-type boss, implying the possibility of a higher ratio of Mage Hunters or Murkstalkers, that can give me a reason to reconsider

Right now, it's just a repetitive flavor text

[daring juniper]

Dunno about you, knowing about dungeon modifiers and the boss is quite important

If you at t4 get the goliath proselyte boss you know what to expect and prepare acordingly, then you learn that the dungeon will have the ascension ritual so you know you will need to fight the ascension room before the boss

[odd marten]

Modifier, yes, rarely but sometimes at the start for an extra bandage for hex, or detox for Miasma

Bosses? Never XD

Not even once have I found it useful

Perhaps with some really quirky build it could be worth it

[naive imp]

It's quite important at higher tiers, as many bosses require specific strategy or preparation

[naive imp]

They don't really attract anyone

It's not like the cult followers get a say where to go and whom to join

But even besides that, a third or a half of the dungeon being 1-2 specific enemies is hardly interesting

[daring juniper]

[odd marten]

You mean this update? Or has something changed in the recent Hotfix?
I already have two characters above lvl 24 and haven't noticed anything

Or are you saying it's the proper way it will have to be played in the future, not right now, after all the missing pieces get added?

Brigands I don't care, same with undead. It's the brigand guards and the crypt room swarming with undead before the boss room that I'm worried about, not the mini-boss himself

With new Proselytes, I couldn't care less if it's a Priest of John Carpenter's Thing.
But to be perfectly fair, I can imagine the third new one, the deluxe murkstalker, being more tricky for some builds with his annoying teleports back and forth, so there's a seed of truth in it, I guess?