#Thievery Feedback

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

torn saddle
#

I had originally planned on going until I had found and stolen 500 Black Market Goods (BMG), but after spending about a month working on it and only just hitting 400 total I am a bit burnt out on stealing and will be taking a break. I plan on picking it back up eventually and going for 1,000 total to report what I found. I will be keeping this post related to PvE stealing rather than pvp even though I am a prolific pvp thief and have stolen 3 runic vanquishing weapons to date.

The Good
I'll start with what is good about Thievery in it's current state. The goods themselves feel mostly rewarding and it is a good source of gold and random materials for little investment and risk. It's a relatively easy build to get up and running and the largest investment outside of GMing skills is getting the snooping talisman so you aren't restricted to Humanoids. You can find some decent deco and masks from thievery if you are into that sort of thing and it seems there are some newer items being added as well. It's fun and rewarding game play if you are into that sort of thing which I am. I truly enjoy the "thief" playstyle and wish to see it continue to grow and be a legitimate playstyle for anyone.

The Not So Good
If multiple people are attempting to steal around the same time it can be incredibly rough as you may come through a dungeon and found it picked clean and have wasted 20-30 minutes of your time with nothing to show for it.
I'm not entirely sure how to fix this without decreasing the respawn time of items in the "snoop" window of mobs that doesn't also make PvE stealing completely insane. Maybe adding the dungeon stealable tables to the new mobs that Jim has added in Hedge or the Desert will be a good place to start as thieves won't be limited to just dungeons for stealing.

The Bad
I had started working on this post prior to the most recent update to stealing and my biggest gripe was going to be the items you get out of the higher end and rarer goods just felt down right terrible. I will say that I think this update is a step in the right direction. But finding an Extremely Rare (ER) BMG which I'll get into the chance of finding one later and getting some Ore and 1 Blue Gem feels kinda of lack luster given how rare those goods are. Outside of the mandatory talisman for PvE the other talismans leave a little to be desired if you aren't that big into deco or things of that nature.

My suggestion here is based on the current drop rates that I have found from Rare, Extremely Rare, and Legendary Black Market Goods. (We will get into those rates soon I promise) I would increase the count of items found when getting these goods. If I find a ER BMG and turn it in for 110 Agapite ore and 1 blue gem I get kinda frustrated. As the value of that good is around 5k for the ore and I need another 29 gems to hopefully get something of value out of an RNG chest. I would suggest 2x or 3x the amount of ore/wood received and 4/5x the blue gems or other "rare" items that you can turn in. If I got 300 Agapite ore from 1 that's about a 14k value which is line for just how rare these level of goods are.

The Ugly
The drop rate of the rarer goods is really really bad for what they give in exchange. In my opinion the best reward currently from PvE thievery is the coveted t6 map. Out of the 400 BMG's that I stole not a single one of them rewarded me with a t6 map. I found my lone t6 map on a mob. I would fix this by increasing the rate at which the ER and Legendary BMGs appear as well as increasing the likely hood of finding a t6 map or allow us to purchase t6 maps with thieves coins. This in turn creates a market for the coins as well as a use once you have acquired the talismans you want.

This will continue on in the actual thread as I am at the character limit.

#

The cooldown on Stealing (10 seconds) feels really rough when you fail multiple steals in a row (which is another issue we will address shortly). My suggestion is to lower this to 5 seconds permanently or introduce a blessed talisman that goes in the Necklace or Earring slot that accomplishes the same thing and is purchasable with Thieves coins.
Talismans, I found two talismans in my entire journey, one is the snooping one and the other is the increased range of snooping. The most coveted talisman from this is the one that allows you to steal more than 10 stones at a time. However with it being corrupted the risk of using it does not outweigh the potential benefits of this item as the only items that really weight over 10 stone are plate chests.
Something is off when trying to steal from Humanoid monsters. You can sit there and fail 20 times in a row. Trust me I have done it. I don't know if it is intended to be this way but most people I know just skip trying to steal form Humanoids all together as the repeated failures with the 10 second cooldown just makes for a really bad experience.
The drop rate of the rarer BMGs. My data shows that ER has a 3.25% chance to appear and Legendary has a .50% chance. For how rare they are and the rewards that you get it's currently more of a detriment to getting them. Like I mentioned earlier I stole 400 BMGs. 13 of those were ER and 2 were Legendary. I didn't get a single t6 map from those 15 ultra rare items. I'm rambling on now so I will end this here and will post my screenshots below show casing my data, pain points and other exciting times.

TL:DR, read the thing or don't. PvE stealing is in a decent place but some areas can use some love.

wary condor
#

Good work gathering this data. Definitely encountered the humanoid stealing issue too, was 40+ fails on a titan if I remember correctly.

I'm 100% in support of a faster cool down for stealing, at least in pve. That'd be so much better.

torn saddle
#

I wanted more data but this alone took around 100 hours

#

I also now have 400 bags that need to be turned in as I kept ever bag to ensure my data was good

wary condor
#

Make sure to use the talisman that'll give you coins for bags

remote hinge
torn saddle
#

That’s an even better solution than another talisman.

#

I’d also like to see additional talismans that are outside of the thief gameplay loop. Currently only other thieves need coins. But if you introduced talismans that other builds and playstyles could utilize you now have a market for them.

torn saddle
#

17 fails in a row on a Humanoid should not be a thing with GM stealing

image.png
wary condor
#

yeah it's a bug that needs fixed for sure

timber thistle
torn saddle
#

Did another 50 BMGs today.. so much for my break from stealing. Here is the updated data. Got pretty lucky getting 3/50 being Extremely Rare, still no legendary or t6 maps.

image.png
timber thistle
torn saddle
#

Updated data after another 100 BMGs, 550 total tracked now

#

Highlights from the last 100 steals include 1 corrupted wisp in a jar and 1 lucky thieves talisman

#

Still chasing the illusive legendary chests and t6 maps

wary condor
#

Wow you must be loaded

torn saddle
#

I wish

torn saddle
#

update after 600

image.png
#

Oh and all stealing has been done in Destard to keep everything consistent

wary condor
#

It's definitely a good source of gold and items and resources. The only problem will I see with these rates is that the legendary rewards better be worth the low chance of getting them?

torn saddle
#

From the two I got they definitely weren’t worth it

#

That was pre loot update but regardless the rate at which they appear the rewards would need to be insane to justify it. Like guaranteed t6 map.

#

This was the last one I got. Around 200 BMGs in

#

Obviously not very good

wary condor
#

well 20 coins 😐 that's pretty good but yeah sure not for a .3% rate

timber thistle
torn saddle
timber thistle
#

and some other nice tweaks.

#

ok done.

torn saddle
#

🩷

wary condor
#

T is #1 at like "oh, fuck, one sec..... ok fixed" fixes

torn saddle
#

Yea he puts in the work. Super appreciative of what he’s done for PvE stealing

timber thistle
#

Thank you for the kind words 🙂

#

it’s really the whole team making it happen. Everyone’s working hard on so much you don’t see, and we’re all excited to share some awesome updates soon! Lots of great team working going on!

torn saddle
wary condor
torn saddle
#

That’s a good one

wary condor
#

did thief's coins drop off hard? last 4-5 runs i've did i've come back with.... 3

remote hinge
#

the bmg loot expanded a lot so technically yes.

#

But if you do enough thieving those coins become the thing you want the least so its fine imo

wary condor
#

well sell em to me for cheap then

torn saddle
#

Sure how many you want

#

1k a pop

torn saddle
#

Another 88 BMGs, i have changed to only stealing from Despise 4 as it has the highest lvl mobs and deepest dungeon level in hopes of trying to find a legendary BMG

image.png
torn saddle
#

Taking a slight break from my thief to work on my grave digger. But will be going for 1k BMGs and will post the data.

#

I’ll probably stop keeping track after that unless there are any changes to pve stealing

torn saddle
#

here is the data after 800 BMGs

image.png
#

Still chasing after a legendary BMG with the revamped loot. Last 300 have all been in despise at titans

wary condor
#

should put that data in the wiki somewhere!

torn saddle
#

Once I hit 1k that’s the plan

#

I’ll be done with stealing at 1,000 unless there are more changes or revamps to the system. I want to stop already as I only got into it for t6 maps and well a .25% chance at a t6 map after 800 is killing any motivation I have to grind more of them.

#

But I committed to doing the thousand for the data so I’ll finish it

wary condor
#

you're prob up to 1.5m in gold alone from all that shit. that's wild.

#

nevermind all the resources from uncommons and stuff

#

if you wanna sell me thief coins, hit me up. i can't find literally any anywhere

torn saddle
#

I haven’t tracked the gold or resources extensively but yea I’d wager it’s around 1mil total in gold and a couple hundred thousand in resources

torn saddle
wary condor
#

doesn't that make a talisman like 150k?

torn saddle
#

That’s what I’ve sold em at in the past

#

The snoop talisman is easily worth 150k

torn saddle
wary condor
#

lol nice

grim wadi
torn saddle
#

Here is 900 BMGs, highlight is i found 2 t6 maps during this time. still no legendary BMGs though

image.png
torn saddle
#

Here is 1,000 BMGs

image.png