💀┃acolyte

[kind forge]

and then cast marrow through rip blood

[tall mural]

See, Im wondering If I can get enough dmg to just spam rip blood for most things

but adding marrow is likely the way to go, even with chaining

[kind forge]

bloodsplatter sounds like bait ngl

[tall mural]

It works, but right now using splatter is just a worse version of spell flay

[kind forge]

lol

[tall mural]

Well, Im assuming, I havent run the numbers yet

[kind forge]

cold spell flay uwu

[abstract summit]

Even wo mumbers one can shotgun, the other cannot soooo

[unreal hill]

The slam worked.

[abstract summit]

Phat

[buoyant bear]

Sacrifice got a sexy buff

[tall mural]

Well, if you convert it to a spell, you lose shotgunning technically but the added dmg effectiveness is like 150 higher

[abstract summit]

well kinda, but it still cascades

[tall mural]

lmao, so there really isnt any reason you'd do it other than the meme, which I can respect

[kind forge]

where

[abstract summit]

ye tbh 3/3 in plasma fountain sounds strictly better in ST as well

[buoyant bear]

Sacrifice
Now has 80 base damage and 400% effectiveness of added damage (from 40 and 200%).

[kind forge]

oh ic

problem is its a spell

so it uses your dmg and not your minions stats

[buoyant bear]

That's a lot of damage and... respawning skeletons got better*

[kind forge]

its weird

cuz every source is 40%

lel

so youll just have 20% overcap xD

you could take a few points off the tree or off skeles but then you would be undercapped

[buoyant bear]

It's okay, it just sounds so useful

[old hull]

A perfect T5 set affix is 20%, exactly to cap

[kind forge]

OH

lol gg

[kind forge]

can you get t8 set mods now? and do they actually scale past their t7 if they do?

i know yall said champion mods could

but sets

[tall mural]

ah ok, so I do somewhat see a reason to use rip blood base dmg 20 vs 5 with flay

[kind forge]

also very spammable

and the flat added dmg buff

[tall mural]

flay is faster lol

[old hull]

Otherwise, just the set shield itself is pretty fine tbh, and that saves you 2 skill points on skele

[abstract summit]

ohm no

[old hull]

Yes

[abstract summit]

1.467 vs 1.1

[tall mural]

Right, RB has a longer cast time

or is that base speed before mods?

[old hull]

You wouldn't even need a single point in skeletons to get 100% resummon chance if you do a T8 shield, but that takes up your primordial

[abstract summit]

ye base speed is what gets multiplied by your atk / cast speed (and weapon)

[kind forge]

woa

[tall mural]

I shouldve known it was some weirdness

[kind forge]

almost caps it by itself kek ... altho probably a waste to throw away your one primordial item on that

[abstract summit]

flay is slow AF 😄

for some reason

[tall mural]

So faster and higher base on RB, I guess I will just have to test both out and see

[buoyant bear]

definitely not with the tree giving 40% on top of +1 skel

[old hull]

There's gotta be a meme around this belt mod, too

[kind forge]

wait

TIL we dont have set quivers

gg

or bows prob

[abstract summit]

i think they might have suspected flay procs gonna be an issue so slapped it with a giga low base atk speed to make you work for it, but then kinda forgot to run the numbers on all specs 😄

[kind forge]

no set spear

no set 2h sword

[buoyant bear]

What's a build that goes through a lot of mana?

[kind forge]

hmmm didnt realize how many item types dont have set items

[abstract summit]

sets were kinda discontinued very early, they could make a couple new now

[kind forge]

would be cool

[old hull]

Not sure, ballista I guess which can also make potions would be my thought

[tall mural]

I could use both, stacking up Blood revelry and then casting RB, I dont know WHY but I could lol

[old hull]

meteor, EQ

[abstract summit]

avalanche

[kind forge]

think its kinda cool vilatria isnt locked to mage anymore

can use the ring to replace the set helmet

[buoyant bear]

there might be something to do with fragments of the shattered lance*

[kind forge]

ye but that would keep you locked to mage xD

cuz the helmet is class locked

owo t8 curse dmg is big (sinatha mace)

[old hull]

Yeah, might even be a worthy primordial for witchfire

[kind forge]

ye

[autumn bough]

does anyone know if AOD still snapshots in s3?

[kind forge]

ok thats sad

t8 mana cost ring is only 7

i cri

couldnt even round it up to 8

uwu

[wintry flame]

Mike said no

[kind forge]

was hoping it was 10 tho

[autumn bough]

tyty

[obtuse quest]

Problem is that the helm is mage locked, so it forces you to use the staff

[kind forge]

the staff isnt that bad tho

[obtuse quest]

Shattered lance+ vessel is the easy combo (That most people thought of the moment the ring existed)

[obtuse quest]

Kinda locks options out.

[kind forge]

or it adds options that never existed uwu

i need to go look at the set mod

ok ye you would probably wanna use the real thing

its kinda bad

[tall mural]

I'm looking forward to seeing shattered lance, bears scorn life based liches, the regen will be absurd

[kind forge]

I MEAN

there is a world

where you use it on sentinel

for smite

[tall mural]

I wanna use it just to take that golem node that gives 150% of my regen to the golems

[kind forge]

lol

[tall mural]

Bone golems made out of wolverine bones

[obtuse quest]

Or use the helm instead, BUT ALAS

[vivid ruin]

Do marked for detah and pen stack or different multis?

[obtuse quest]

Stack. Pen and res shred are effectively the same thing damage wise.

Same multi.

[kind forge]

lol

[vivid ruin]

Ty.

[kind forge]

i mean stormbolts would probably really like it too

oh wait no its a weapon

kek

cuz you would be using cleaver

smite tho

i could see smite

[vivid ruin]

Ty. Does armor shred go in the same bucket or separate?

I vaguelly recall there being a cap on extra armor shred damage?

[wintry flame]

separate

[brisk elk]

armor shred mechanically cant mitigate more than 85% and cant make them take more than 85%

for phys

for other dmg types its like 50%

[kind forge]

and 0% for dots

[vivid ruin]

Thanks you. And you cap it around 100 stacks yea?

[brisk elk]

https://lastepoch.tunklab.com/armor

^

depends on effect

[vivid ruin]

tee why

[kind forge]

doesnt it just go

where like

the more stacks you have the less efficient it gets

[brisk elk]

for shred yeah for your own armor no

[kind forge]

ye for shred

[brisk elk]

shred is just armor algorithm but backwards

[kind forge]

ye me no engrish

xD

[brisk elk]

but instead of going from 0% to 85%, you're going from 100% to 185%

so its a much smaller difference

[kind forge]

ye

[queen acorn]

i mean, that's why it's also inefficient for your own armor as well, 6.6k armor is 70% dr, 24k armor is 82%, tripled your armor to get 12/30 = 40% dr

[obtuse quest]

Seperate. No hard cap, 100 stacks is close to soft cap(70% more hit damage taken).

[unreal hill]

I slammed an ex you might not berate me for.

[kind forge]

lol

[vivid ruin]

70% hit damage from any source or capped at 50% for necrotic hits?

I see. No actual cap. I might need to calc how many shred stacks I can have up before they expire.

[obtuse quest]

👍

Yay for more ward gen

[obtuse quest]

70% physical 50~% for anything else

[abstract summit]

57 but ye

[obtuse quest]

The tunklab chart is your friend.

[unreal hill]

you might hate the fact that I'm scaling healing instead of ward.
Tho there is ward

[obtuse quest]

That's literally the whole point of exsang, more health=more missing health=more ward per second=more ward

It is, hilariously enough, a life item in it's own way.

[dark inlet]

yeah, that and realizing how many sets are 3 pieces rather than 2 made me realize the ring isn't as crazy as I was hoping

[obtuse quest]

But it enables vessel+ lance! The one that matters!

[dark inlet]

because even the 2-piece reforged items a lot of the time only slot well into very specific builds

[obtuse quest]

(And whatever all set setups people cook)

[dark inlet]

vilatria is the other one that really likes the flexibility. no longer locks meteor to one specific staff

[old hull]

Even slapping T1 seals to complete sets once you already have the ring is generally pretty decent

[obtuse quest]

The helm is still mage only so it doesn't open up THAT much.

[tall mural]

The ring enables ruby fang without the shield, because the shield is basically worthless xD

[dark inlet]

it lets them use legendary weapons though instead of only reforged. big flexibility for them

[unreal hill]

I was thinking of scaling this w/ healing effectiveness
and using corrupted form to stay at low life. I'm not sure why it would be bad.

oh wait I might need a lot more healing effectiveness

[old hull]

It caps out at 525% inc eff I think

for corrupted form

still quite effective with less than that of course

[pearl scarab]

Ruby fang dw gaming

[tall mural]

Flay should have had a fire conversion

[twilit flume]

and aod should have a necro conversion

[tall mural]

yeah, that is a little odd it doesnt get one ngl

[brisk elk]

would be too op or something

[twilit flume]

would also be neat if in reaper form we got a node that lets our dots crit

[twilit flume]

think the devs just didnt want everyone and their mom going stygian coal for another patch

[tall mural]

I dont wanna hear anything about OP until erasing strike is reigned tf in

[brisk elk]

falconer?

???

a dude hit 30k corruption this season

[twilit flume]

imagine they gave spellcasters a way to put 30 flat -5 cost reduction on rings

[unreal hill]

30k corruption takes some serious mental fortitude just to play that long.

[brisk elk]

yeah sounds miserable

[kind forge]

it is

they cut worldsplitter crit in half ... and voidwell has 4 second cooldown instead of 3 so you need like 1000 mana instead of 600 to sustain

i wish they would play more into the old erasing strike + void cleave combo tho sadge

[kind forge]

its not that hard to scale up assuming your already strong enough to just go and run the new lvl of content

glyphs of envy and the needles

[obtuse quest]

I meant that as “it’s realistically still locked to mage”

[dark inlet]

I know

[queen acorn]

So much going on with the new items and Lich trees, I assume there's a ton of stuff different between our setups. Interested to see how similar they are though. I posted mine below, I'll keep my eyes out for yours. Thanks for the new axe!
https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1mtd3a0/excited_to_share_my_13_lich_build_23_chaos_bolts/?

[kind forge]

human skin for boots

ew

[queen acorn]

It puts the lotion in the basket

[kind forge]

lol

[queen acorn]

Woops, forgot to post my Bone Curse spec instead of Death Seal, gonna try both I guess so w/e

[kind forge]

wonder if rip blood can sustain the cost of marrow shards

[jade cove]

Oh wow, that is an extensive post, I didn't expect that. I will gladly read through that! Definitely let me know how your setup will work in practice compared to the theory.

Yeah the different setups is what I totally expected, but it is still so amazing to see so many different ideas and approaches with basically the same core idea.

I will post my setup a few days after the ptach probably and how far I have gotten with it, because I don't want to influence people too much. But my own setup will with certainty not be the most optimal objectively speaking, since I care for theme more than for numbers and I never sacrifice my core theme philosophy for raw numbers.

Not sure how or where I should post my setup, since I don't have any big reach anyway, probably Reddit and LE Forums and then I will link to that here as well.

[kind forge]

at least for clearing it should easily cuz you need to hit 3 enemies with it anyway

means 3 orbs

[queen acorn]

Just gonna pretend my Flay+a few chaos bolts aren't gonna kill everything and the 40 mana from the other 20 bolts won't be wasted :copium:

Not a problem on Uberroth at least!

[ashen bluff]

for cbolt cast 1% chance per max mana is a ridiculous stat to give

[jade cove]

Excellent post, love it! Very detailed. My favorite part is, that you extensively talked about other options/alternatives for a lot of slots! Would love to give you more than one upvote 💞

But your setup is vastly different from my planned one. From your question in the ask the devs I thought you will be closer to mine 😅

[ashen bluff]

esp cos you get 20% More dmg per 100 max mana D:

[queen acorn]

Lol yeah I kinda figured with just how much flexibility there is

[kind forge]

lol

[jade cove]

Its just weird, because my Unique already names 2 skills and Flay is not directly named but makes sense with it. So that is 3/5 skills. But unfortunately a lot of people don't even wanna spec Harvest (I am crying 😭 😭 😭 😭 😭 ).

So you "only" have 2-3 skills that you can diverge. And then the gear

[kind forge]

what unique

[jade cove]

Executioner's Tithe, my Creator Unique

[kind forge]

oh you were the parent of that disgrace xD

jk

nice

ye idk

[jade cove]

Is that good or bad? Not sure yet lol

[kind forge]

imma be honest ... i dont know if i would use it over deaths embrace because of that 5 second grim harvest cooldown

[queen acorn]

I think it's cause a lot of people are lazy like me, I only wanna use extra buttons for specific situations (Reaper form when it runs out, Death Seal for outplays or Uberroth triple slam etc, Harvest if my mana depletes). Seems like you can rely on greater Harvest in monoliths though, with some decent cdr, or just spec into harvest and mourning frost and have chaos bolts proc it 3 times/sec

[jade cove]

Obviously after my first Creator Unqiue (Death's Embrace) basically saw absolutely zero mainstream use I tried designing something a bit more popular and broken.😭 😭 😭 😭 😭

[kind forge]

well we didnt use it because harvest itself wasnt all that great

i used it this league tho

[jade cove]

But jokes side, I completely didn't saw it coming that it will be soo popualr, atleast in preperation fo the patch and all the theorycrafting xD

[obtuse quest]

The pendulum has swung the other side lmao

Giving acolytes access to mana stacking breaks stuff-

[jade cove]

I have become a meta slave

From Hipster to Metaking

[kind forge]

playing harvest in this league felt like playing a worse shattering strike

[tall mural]

I mean, with the harvest changes I can see deaths embrace being used

[kind forge]

like alot worse

your slower attack speed ... you only hit once instead of twice per attack

you are necrotic and not cold

[jade cove]

But yeah besides Tithe I will be very happy to see what peopel might do with regular Harvest, there are so many options there as well. But I will do my Hit/Crit Harvest Lich as my last char this patch in SCF. Back to the roots

[tall mural]

You cant comare the two, they are too mechanically different

[kind forge]

they basically are the same

functionally

[tall mural]

We;re just gonna have to disagree there

[kind forge]

like the only thing harvest had over shatter strike was the easy crit

and that doesnt really exist anymore

even with 2.65x dmg because of the curse mechanic

it was like eeeeh

i mean im not gonna say it wasnt fun

[jade cove]

Lol Harvest still, even after the "nerf" to the crit is the skill with the most base crit in the skill tree, by a landslide.

19% Flat Crit and 100% Global

[kind forge]

ye but you used to have like 35% base crit in a normal tree

xD

[jade cove]

59%

[old hull]

Mana strike still has pretty much guaranteed crits from flat

[kind forge]

ye at the cost of having no extra dmg from crits

xD

its definately the highest base tho ye

[jade cove]

Anyway, I am still with Draven, Shatter and Harvest are not compareable. I mean on paper maybe, but the gameplay and gearing are vastly different

[kind forge]

its like 45%

5% + 40%

[ashen bluff]

that's a wild set of lines <_<

[kind forge]

would you dual wield executioners tithe or would you go tithe + the int dex dagger

[ashen bluff]

tithe + tongue

[kind forge]

lol

[old hull]

Tithe + something else, tithes just don't really stack much oddly enough

[kind forge]

the mana effect wouldnt stack?

[ashen bluff]

almost nothing on tithe stacks

[kind forge]

oh sad

that was mainly why i was thinking dual wield

[kind forge]

ye thats just evil

[ashen bluff]

not really, it'd be mandatory dual wield if it stacked

[kind forge]

well we DO have mana scaling effects now that are actually relevant

so it would have been nice

[ashen bluff]

and thats why it'd be mandatory...

it'd narrow the build space

[kind forge]

i mean since when was it ever not narrow

[tall mural]

Now I gotta build around this grim harvest axe just to see how much aoe I can get on harvest

[jade cove]

I made it so DW specifically is very much not beneficial, because that would be very very boring. I wanted options and alternatives.

Not sure if the planners have the advanced tooltips already but here's the advanced tooltip

[kind forge]

i mean there isnt much alternative because you would just go with the thing that gives bigger number

aka tongue

+4 to harvest and 13% base crit

[obtuse quest]

LETools has them.

[jade cove]

If you speak strictly numbers, yes I knew that like 95-99% of builds would go for Tongue, especially because Flay and Harvest have both Dex and Int Tags. BUT there are still alternatives if you wanna go fancy.

Also like some people know me, I am not a meta player at all, and I much prefer If I have the option for some cool other shit.

But there are some good alternatives

[kind forge]

true

but like

not really your fault but tongue is kinda insane

lel

and they just casually gave harvest the one stat it needed to use it to its best effect

[jade cove]

I agree, I think tongue is fine, but its super low LP is not justified, I hope its LP gets nerfed in the future, to make 2LP still easy, but 3LP grindy already and 4LP not possible

[kind forge]

true

dont overnerf it tho cuz no fun allowed is sad

[jade cove]

I think something between Dragorath's and Smoke Weaver's LPL would be fine, like Fulgurite Shard level

[kind forge]

fulgurite would be perfect lel ... the first time i used it was for a shuriken build that used those 2 together xD

[jade cove]

And if they wanna keep the low LPL at least lower the min roll on the off-hand crit

like 4-13

[kind forge]

ew

please dont uwu

[jade cove]

I loooooooooooove huge roll ranges on uniques

[kind forge]

you already have to get lucky and roll 3 mods

[jade cove]

gives reasons to be excited even in endgame and gives great use for reroll sacrifice

[kind forge]

need to roll int lvl
need to roll crit
and need to roll dex lvl

[jade cove]

Yes

love it

[kind forge]

so it is a little bit frictiony already

[jade cove]

Also tongue even with +1 on both int and dex is still BiS

it literally doesn't need the rolls to be good

the crit is what makes it BiS automatically and the min roll is already 11, which is just insane

they could also instead nerf teh crit entirely. like lower both min and max by 2-3%

[ashen bluff]

mana stack to get juist insane amount of chaos bolts seems funny but damn if cold stack isn't just so synergized

[kind forge]

i mean if it isnt +2 +2 then i wouldnt use it because when your using it on the right skill you really need those levels to do your trees

the crit is ye

less important

[jade cove]

well all of that depends on your current character and progression

flay has a lot of intermediate travel nodes that you can cut a few points without losing that much

[kind forge]

lol

[twilit flume]

is exiled mage farming still the strat for xp?

[ashen bluff]

oh okay

[kind forge]

lol

[ashen bluff]

this could be funny instead of tongue

[queen acorn]

It's pretty gg with the mourningfrost setup, for sure. I'm convinced Astral Blood is OP though, so already committed to my primordial slot

Couldn't find a way to convince myself of the build(s) defensively until considering Astral Blood

[ashen bluff]

astral blood is quite busted as well

tho I think there's plenty of stuff on lich esp w reaper form to stay tanky without it

[kind forge]

true

[kind forge]

dark stride but for accolyte kek

well and rogue

[ashen bluff]

just a generally nutty dagger tbh

40% pen for all

[slim mason]

Slap some armor shred and we'll be golden

[unreal hill]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/oNMrbd5B
I think the tankiness is there.
Healing effectiveness counters the drain from ex and tree.
about a thousand life regen.
corrupted form to always be at low life.
Over 2000 endurance threshold.
78% armor
capped res
blossom of immortal stone
90+ % block chance.
35% of damage from hits taken over time

[stuck owl]

Lich, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (20) / Necromancer (10) / Lich (50) / Warlock (33)

General:

▸ Health: 3,636, Regen: 752.6/s
▸ Mana: 157.9, Regen: 11.68/s
▸ Ward Retention: 196%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 98 Str / 12 Dex / 98 Int / 19 Att / 60 Vit
▸ Resistances: 60% / 60% / 60% / 155% / 16% / 76% / 76%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 187%, Threshold: 1,778
▸ Dodge Chance: 16% (537)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 75% (8,298)
▸ Block Chance: 79%, Mitigation: 50% (2,050)

Used skills:

Aura Of Decay

[kind forge]

lol

[kind forge]

youll always have at least half of the total regen xD

8 16 24 28.8

/ 2

14.4%

but now your missing out on sooo much dmg you could have gotten from your idols

for being in aura of decay

eh maybe not

[abstract summit]

Define gg 😄

It's aight

[pallid plume]

Okay i think this is the setup for explode mages - https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/BMwJ7qrA

You get 80% chance to re-summon skeletons and then by getting res on gear you give the mages pens for profane. Still not 100% sure on some things like how much ward on minion death vs damage you want.

[stuck owl]

Necromancer, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (26) / Necromancer (65) / Warlock (21)

General:

▸ Health: 1,440, Regen: 22/s
▸ Mana: 121.51, Regen: 8/s
▸ Ward Retention: 109%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 2 Str / 2 Dex / 17 Int / 2 Att / 6 Vit
▸ Resistances: 30% / 30% / 30% / 0% / 0% / 96% / 26%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 30%, Threshold: 288
▸ Armor Mitigation: 4% (81)

Used skills:

Summon Skeleton / Infernal Shade / Summon Skeletal Mage / Summon Volatile Zombie / Dread Shade

[ashen bluff]

has no equipment

[vapid belfry]

is death seal still mandatory for lich?

[abstract summit]

Kinda the opposite

Almost nobody specs it, put it on bar unspecced as a panic button

[kind forge]

ngl im stealing that

kind of

gonna merge it with the meme exanguinous tech

[visual girder]

Could this facetank uber

[ashen bluff]

god the fangs belt is interesting too

[kind forge]

probably not

youll have low ehp since it will only equal out to your max health

but the sustain should be there

anything that cant one shot you

wont kill you

[visual girder]

Rip

My goat judgement got gutted so no more facetanking uber 💔

[abstract summit]

One tapping it is faster anyway:)

[visual girder]

Aint that get fixed too

[jade cove]

Oh no, now you have to play mechanics. Imagine PLAYING THE GAME. 😱 The build is still broken af

[visual girder]

Oh no imagine that my regular potato pc lags out during uber and i have to cheese the most boring fight ever, nah but lowkey is kinda is boring

[vapid belfry]

guessing the chaos bolts cast by flay are affected by the tree?

and not unspecced

[grim rune]

how fixed?

if u 1shot u skip

[visual girder]

Also afaik there's basically 0 reason to play judgement now since the cleanse is basically only 1 every 4 seconds and is way less tanky

[grim rune]

if u do less than 30m dmg then u have 8 sec zzz phase so kill is like under 30 sec anyway on uber

[visual girder]

The one shot methods i mean, aka timerot frostbite/poison stacking and i am not too sure about shift

[grim rune]

U need to do like 230m hit to 1shot if I remember, uber has about that health

[obtuse quest]

Yes.

[grim rune]

anything over 20m just skip phases anyway

[abstract summit]

At the minimum necro, BM and lich will have one shot builds

[visual girder]

Hopefully

[abstract summit]

And I just dont know the other specs lol

[jade cove]

Typical ARPG Community reaction. Build got nerfed, still is beyond strong, but people cry "unplayable" 😞

[unreal hill]

Insert ratatouille meme here.
I dont do mechanics, and if I do I die :p

[visual girder]

Estrike is better than judge in basically every way now afaik

[abstract summit]

Will (unless devs nerf stuff)

[grim rune]

bleed hammer sentinel might be good

[visual girder]

Devs when players figure out a way to skip a boring and grindy fight

[jade cove]

every single one of the top builds that got nerfed is still fine, while they might have been nerfed in different ways and the endresult causes them to be mroe noticeably different. But they were very different before that already anyway

[abstract summit]

Hammer is the one skill i would never play even if it did 100m uber lol

[grim rune]

i mean throw hammer spin to win xd

[abstract summit]

I sleep

[unreal hill]

Hammer is just a weird memey reference to d2.

[abstract summit]

Zeal or bust

Am aware, i grew up on d1 lol

[vapid belfry]

im stg zhp falc has been nerfed every patch and is still top tier

[coarse dew]

I actually forgot, can you dodge dot ticks in this game?

does dodge help against dots?

[jade cove]

no

You can dodge hits that apply ailments, but that's about it

Same with block, glancing blow or parry, all of that only works versus hits

armor also only works against hits, but there are ways to make armor apply as DoT mitigation

[coarse dew]

sorry for sidetracking, but your answer actually sparked an idea.
I personally feel this partly contributes why LE feels "easy".
At least for me, dying to hits feels more "fair" and the enemy stronger, while dying to dots feel like I'm getting swindled

and because dots scale crazily fast (used to and still). most of the times the first wall I encounter is I die because I can't stand in 2 ticks of dots (cap of my reaction time) for example

[slim mason]

So flay proc cb which proc bone curse which proc rip blood... More blood for korne

Cb proc harvest is an after thought

[jade cove]

for the last few patches incoming damage over time, mostly from direct DoT abilities and not ailments necessarily was very prominent and dangerous.

Since the last 1 or 2 patches since was majorly improved across the game.

I think its in a much better state now, but Possessed Enemies in conjunction with Champions are still a little bit iffy.

[coarse dew]

as opposed to other games that have conditioned me (poe, souls, even jrpgs) where I mostly die to hits

[slim mason]

And cb hitting blood cursed enemies for mana

[abstract summit]

Invisible on death hits ye, so much better lol

[jade cove]

I disagree with you though that it feels like oyu get swindled. Most DoT are very good telegraphed but many players simply have no good mitigation versus them until they die a couple of times and THEN start building DoT mitigation

[abstract summit]

You also super die to corrupted blood in poe btw

[grim rune]

how dot works in LE? if bleed for example shows me in LETools 1420 dmg and duration is 7 seconds

its 1420 every 1 sec

or 1420 over 7 sec?

[coarse dew]

yep I've went through that phase too, and that's good learning.
I'm also thining about probably 70-80% of players that will not get to that stage

[obtuse quest]

Over 7.

[jade cove]

To be fair what is the difference between a hit and a dot from the players perspective? If you stand in a giant cone when the mob does some scream, or channeled laser. There is no different from standing in front of a mob shooting 30 projectiles at you and getting killed

[obtuse quest]

LEtools shows total damage per stack

[coarse dew]

this has a similar argument to heavy's above. new players will die to bleed/cb, but they learn

[grim rune]

but then duration has like 0 sense

why would i wanna scale duration of bleed

[coarse dew]

and in poe most times (besides sirus storm), dots make you vulnerable to being one shot by a big hit, it doesn't kill in itself

[abstract summit]

Cause it scales total damage proportionally

[coarse dew]

which feels more like "if I were't standing in dot, that big slam wouldn't have killed me"

[obtuse quest]

99 damager over 3 seconds becomes 132 damage over 4 seconds if you get +1sec duration

[grim rune]

oh ok

[jade cove]

I don't know all of PoE's dangerous DoT's are some circulr fields on the ground xD very boring. LE at least has some cool mobs doing cool telegraphed DoT's

[obtuse quest]

If you have +100% duration of x ailment, that ailment is doing double damage per stack, just over the course of the duration

[coarse dew]

Yes, this is really hard to quantify. I'm hypothesizing that there is a feelsbad mecahnic, even though it "should" be the same

[jade cove]

But yeah I think LE is in a much better spot in terms of balancing with Hits vs DoT's since a few years ago.

I still hope the balance adjustment they did in 1.3 helps with the spikyness of certain Champion + Poession Combos.

Because not dying for like 30 echoes and then dying from one mob that was harder than any boss feels weird

[coarse dew]

oh yeah and lasers too, how can I forgot that abomination.

[visual girder]

Do dots effects like poison or damned proc armor/resistance shred if i have a "shred armor on hit/shred resistance on hit" on an equipment piece/idol

Or is it only actual hits

[coarse dew]

so after our exchange, my hypothesis is something like.
players die to 5 hits: "I could play better next time, I know I can only tank 4 hits with this gear" (even though I could've geared better to prevent this)
players die to 1 shot: "I must not get hit by this next time"
players die to 5 dot ticks: "why does this dot do so much dmg?" (even though I could've geared better to prevent this, it feels bad)
players die to dot 1 shots: "bs" (historically wengari avalance, laser, spire, uber rectangle, etc.)

[ashen bluff]

dots aren't hits

[visual girder]

rip

[coarse bear]

sigh, I am still trying to figure poison lich out, but poison being half the damage of bleed or frostbite makes it rough to justify :( is there some thing I am missing that makes poison not strictly worse? the poison resistance shred is nice, but I dont think it is enough to outperform, especially on higher stack counts?

[obtuse quest]

Did you account for poison overload?

Otheriwse there really isn't that much?

[coarse bear]

I cannot find a tooltip of what it actually does 🙈 what does it do, eactly?

[coarse bear]

looks like lastepochtools screen? I still cannot find it on the whole website, where is it hiding 🙈 looks powerful for sure though

[obtuse quest]

Tunklabs, it's given through a warlock passive.

[coarse bear]

yeah I know where it comes from, I just really failed to find the tooltip in whole lastepochtools and maxroll lol, thanks <3

but Warlock also has bleed overload, which I would expect to do the same? so its not like a huge bonus for poison specifically, it jsut means ailment lich needs to go into warlock a bit 😅

[obtuse quest]

Each overload has their own buff, they're different-

[coarse bear]

oh ok, that makes a big difference indeed, thanks

[grim rune]

got bleed lock to 18 021 596 vs 100 D:

compared to like 20m sentinel it's meh

oh i forgot the idols while overload + bleed overload into that

[mighty tundra]

I can imagine lock could go higher

Yeah

[grim rune]

ye bleed lock might go to 25m

but gloves seems so shit vs bosses

[mighty tundra]

Consider extra shred from aura of decay for example. That seems to help my bleed lich a lot

What gloves?

[mighty tundra]

Why would you slam a T6 on that?

[grim rune]

ye t7 ofc

forgot to change in other builder

i will probably stick to cb flay lich anyway

and just mana stack

[mighty tundra]

I don't think it's unreasonable to reach for 2lp on that also

My aspirational bleed lich is a little over 35 million but it needs double t7 slams on most of the pieces

It's probably just under 30 without I think

[grim rune]

i mean with double t7s fully geared lock might even go 30m+

but let's be real, will be hard XD

3lp julras would break the game. I love this ring

[mighty tundra]

Stardial?

[grim rune]

yea

i dont care about echos

just uber

[mighty tundra]

Wasn't there an infernal whip lock that cleared the Uber? I remember seeing it in a build show case from the Devs

Might be fun

[grim rune]

well u need ~24m to skip mostly uber

4 sec phase 8 sec rest 4sec phase repeat

[visual girder]

Wait does reap count as a mobility skill?

[thick whale]

I am curious about abomination but im wondering if I can make a keyboard macro for the summoning and skill swap...
Is it possible?

[obtuse quest]

Yes.

[visual girder]

I think i might be cooking something and it might even be decent

[obtuse quest]

Using reap without that node makes it share a cooldown with transplant and the like

(Also cooldown lmao)

[pallid plume]

If I play abomination I'm just using abomination and minions not doing any skill swap stuff. As that's going to be annoying each time you gotta resummon stuff.

But im mostly looking the abomination new consume minions with on minion death triggers.

[visual girder]

Will it proc the julra rings tho?

Wait shit misread that

[thick whale]

Could you explain this change?
I neve rolayed this class so I'm quite clueless

[pallid plume]

Basically the abomination will continually consume minions while it's alive.

Before it just consumed them on summon.

So you can get 80% chance for skeleton to resummon if they die and your abomination can keep consuming them for buffs which triggers all your gain ward on minion death stuff.

The abomination consume build power really comes down to if consume minions is good.

Otherwise my fall back plan is to play mages that explode other minions for dmg

[vivid ruin]

Did we ever figure out what possessed nemeses do? Are they just a nem or did they have drop buffs or something?

[visual girder]

Anyways what do yall think of this weird build I cooked up
https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/planner/2w9af0gh
Basically supposed to be an uber abby upfront damage dealer in a team, go to uber, bone curse, death seal, summon wandering spirits on him, drink a potion and hold down harvest for shred, then reap and unseal while making sure you are at lowest hp possible without exiting reaper form, or at least that was the plan

[grim rune]

@topaz lynx (if it's correct lizard)

[mighty tundra]

I'm happy with my blood lich now. Probably won't blood tether at all because 0% cast speed interrupting my flays lol

[grim rune]

ah yes scorn gaming

[mighty tundra]

yep

this is assuming it's value is over 3 seconds

not full value at 0.25

[grim rune]

i really wanna know the abomination tech (100m)

[obtuse quest]

Super buffed(double damage and hp)with drop buffs

[vivid ruin]

41m dps? As flay bleed lich?

[mighty tundra]

38

i'm not gonna use tether

[grim rune]

even if new abomination necro tech does 100m dps I can't be playing it. I hate minions so much

[mighty tundra]

that tether figure isn't accounting for my 0% cast speed and honestly i don't want to try account for a 0% cast speed rip blood interrupting my flays lol

plus i'd have to swap my axe out of taste of blood

unless I can think of a way to make it worth it, I'll just delete those 2 rows with tether and tether + scorn soon

The only problem i need to solve is making sure i have enough mana to keep up with Flay

[topaz lynx]

60m dps lock (crit) is in the oven

on 1 t7, not hollywood gear

[coarse dew]

if I want double t7 to slam but it's 1 prefix 1 suffix, do I still imprint 2 prefix? or is 1 prefix 1 suffix more efficient

[mighty tundra]

screw mana regen i'm just gonna put a mana gain on harvest use affix on my chest lol

[grim rune]

Can’t wait to see abomination 1shoting Uber in s3

[left whale]

Can abomination devour T.Rex? 😅

[grim rune]

im halfway doing abomination rn and dps is already 47m

XD

[coarse dew]

meanwhile trex... this is all included.

seems like it's meant to buff, not be main carry

I'm sad

[left whale]

How do you check the dps?

[grim rune]

excel

lmao

[left whale]

Oohhhh

U already put the calculation there

[jade cove]

Looooooooooooooool I am getting downvoted and accused on Reddit for not sharing my own personally planned Tithe Flay Setup. I am HIDING IT 💀
As if people think I am planning on playing some crazy meta setup

Gotta love me some good Reddit

[topaz lynx]

my 2h version (already ulploaded) is 160m can do more full glass cannon ofc xd Shield is like 80m

[coarse dew]

is the gameplay similar to last league where you wait for abom to come up to packs and one tap one group at a time?

[topaz lynx]

should be a bit better, he now teleports to you if u go far away

and there is aggresive stance for minions

[obtuse quest]

Someone on reddit is about to have a rude awakening.

[topaz lynx]

radious and AoE got buffed ALOT

[coarse dew]

prehistoric apex predator vs 1 frog, who wins?

[jade cove]

ARPG Player and reading tooltips thoroughly. These two things can never coexist 🤣

[coarse dew]

I've been condition by EHG to still doubt tooltips even if I can read anyway

[obtuse quest]

Oof, slightly relatable

[jade cove]

Step 1: If you read a tooltip, read it again.
Step 2: If you THINK you understood it, read it again

[obtuse quest]

Step 3: If it looks broken as hell or underpowered as hell, read again to make sure you didn't misread it.

[mighty tundra]

Oh boy

[jade cove]

Step 4, somebody in the chat will point out that you skipped one word which ruins your entire play

[obtuse quest]

• Streamer only step

[jade cove]

Or when you share your ultimate discovery here on discord

And this chat gives you the cruel reality

[mighty tundra]

Just like this guy I saw who didn't realise he'd have a ward cap with corrupted form

[jade cove]

And once again you question all your life choices

[obtuse quest]

OH NO

That's not even that hard to miss!

[mighty tundra]

Ikr. 14k ward+ overleech and half your health is way too good to be true, let alone somehow missing that part of the sentence

Poor guy

At least it's not too hard to adjust your build around

[obtuse quest]

Thank the god it was caught before live

[mighty tundra]

Mhmmm

[obtuse quest]

Otherwise they'll probably rip blood themselves.

[coarse dew]

for those who come after?

[grim rune]

can new belt affect abomination?

with inheritance amu

with str stacking

then u go with cleaver xd

[topaz lynx]

needs increases

fill your empty buckets

[autumn bough]

inheritence is not good cause it will get fcked by trex(most likely) they both are minions

[grim rune]

i dont use trex

i go with frenzy belt

[autumn bough]

but its useless for summoner

u just take more dmg

🤔

[grim rune]

well if u str stack and u gain frenzy effect %

and inheritance applies frenzy to ur minion...

[autumn bough]

ye but belt is applied only to you

that wont work like that

[autumn bough]

ye all these additional frenzy effects are only for u

they dont carry on minions

[grim rune]

well no, check shattered worlds

there is no 'on you'

[autumn bough]

thats just a typo/bad tooltip and even if it works as you assume it works abom will only get more speed not more dmg etc

[left whale]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/Q97ElbGo

[stuck owl]

Necromancer, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (34) / Necromancer (79)

General:

▸ Health: 2,085, Regen: 162.3/s
▸ Mana: 144.51, Regen: 10.88/s
▸ Ward Retention: 340%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 170 Str / 22 Dex / 170 Int / 22 Att / 47 Vit
▸ Resistances: 84% / 84% / 84% / 82% / 89% / 99% / 99%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 272%, Threshold: 1,187
▸ Dodge Chance: 4% (120)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 79% (11,479)
▸ Block Chance: 121%, Mitigation: 33% (850)

Used skills:

Assemble Abomination / Summon Skeleton / Summon Skeletal Mage / Dread Shade / Infernal Shade

[autumn bough]

But tbf with ehg never know maybe check offline when patch drops

[grim rune]

well, sword catcher has 'on you' too

would they really miss that jsut on this belt xd?

[obtuse quest]

Inheritance only applies the stats of itself. If another stats boosts it, it doesn’t get transfered.

The usual rule of “if it doesn’t state minions it doesn’t affect minions” apply here

[grim rune]

So inheritance applies different instance of frenzy?

for me if it applies frenzy to minion and u have like 200% frenzy effect

it applies frenzy with that 200%

can't wait for actually test it in offline

[obtuse quest]

The correct way to explain it is:
Inheritance applies the BASE version of frenzy.
Frenzy gets applied, THEN it is modified by whatever exists on the object.

[ebon mica]

In all other places it's a generic formatter, but on Fangs of the Berserker it's a custom text, so it's probably just missing "on you".

[grim rune]

time to ask devs

[autumn bough]

Ye i would be very surprised if its not a typo

[zenith current]

All right @ebon mica I got clarity on Scornful Blood and Hollow Lich.
Scornful Blood turns the leech on the skill into a more damage multiplier for that damage type. Leech rate doesn't increase overall damage but makes it tick faster. Overkill leech most likely works.
Hollow Lich on the other hand is a generic increase in damage for any type of damage, including while transformed(as its technically generic). Skill-specific leech (e.g. on skill tree or health leeched with Harvest) does not count.

[arctic grotto]

If you want perma frenzy on your minions you can use this 2 item combo.

[zenith current]

so now

i gotta cook a leech monster

[grim rune]

it's not about perma frenzy

it's about giving like 250% frenzy effect

as u str stack

[zenith current]

I think Lich Leech with belt seems a bit baity

Hmm

[obtuse quest]

I'm sorry, it follows the damage type?

[zenith current]

Referring to what here?

[obtuse quest]

Scornful

[zenith current]

health leeched does not have a damage type

so its "true" damage

or same category as reflected

[obtuse quest]

Oh

You spooked me

That's as perdicted

[zenith current]

did I say something off? :p

[obtuse quest]

"More damage multi for that damage type"

[zenith current]

right, so if you melee leech, its melee more%, spell leech is spell more %, etc

meant it the other way :p

okay so... dot leech makes no sense for scornful

[lost gale]

so no way of scaling the scornful damage then?

[zenith current]

Dealing more damage

is your way of scaling scornful damage

[lost gale]

yeah that's what I mean

[vivid ruin]

This wording makes it sound like it would double dip on Pen. Once from the damage causing leech, then again on the leech->damage of the type. I assume that's not what you meant but that for calc purposes it's just a new more bucket?

[lost gale]

still, T7 melee leech on a 2h weapon is a big dps gain

[vivid ruin]

Huge bucket anyway. I'm sitting at just shy of 50% leech.

[zenith current]

It's just a new more bucket, yes

has to be melee

there's no way dot can get close to this

[vivid ruin]

Why melee?

[zenith current]

with its measly 8%

just sheer amount of leech you can get for melee

[vivid ruin]

We theorycrafted a bleed lich toight too and it has MORE leech than my flay/cb lich.

I'm not using melee leech either though as melee skills dont hit enough.

Mainly all purpose leech and CB with mana stacking.

Interestingly x%leech while transformed affix on body armor outperforms mana on the mana stacker.

[obtuse totem]

whoa whoa whoa, is that THE rhys

in my acolyte channel

[zenith current]

Yeah more% eventually outscales, but i dunno where are you getting the generic leech

[grim rune]

now I wonder. Is 6.02 aps for abo good ?

[vivid ruin]

I'm definitly 'a' Rhys

[grim rune]

XD

[obtuse totem]

are you the rhys from d4 barb chat

[zenith current]

You can run a 2h sword (or Torkrefins Hunger) for 15% melee leech and smack a t7 40% melee leech on it

are you telling me you get more generic leech than that?

[vivid ruin]

11 from armor, 5 from hollow lich, 6 from feast. 66% to all from feast. Plus the spell leech node form lich tree ends up outscaling all other dps nodes so it's maxed for 4% more too.

[vivid ruin]

Less leech. But 20 chaos bolts/attack at 3.5 aps, with leech.

[vivid ruin]

I have played d4 and I did play a barb in one of the 2 seasons I played. It's pretty unlikely it's me though; Haven't played d4 since S2.

[lost gale]

you going up to 2k mana? that's a lot man

[obtuse totem]

fair enough, he used to do things like the enigma/equanimity with his name, thought you were the same guy xD

[vivid ruin]

Yep. 2k mana in early/mid game gear. No crazy LP, single affix. Good idols thiough so I will be short on mana but a few hundred until then.

[vivid ruin]

Sounds like a good bloke.

[zenith current]

i mean you dont really have any leech that is not available to melee. Thats just more CB shenanigans than leech

[lost gale]

not running into seriously diminishing returns of getting damage from 2 buckets (spell damage & more CBs) by 2k?

[vivid ruin]

I agree. The leech is just a sick scaler though. a few points for 1.4 multi is very strong.

[vivid ruin]

Mana is still outscaling everything else I can put. If I can find a way to swap mana for CM that'll be good. My CM is garb (+233%) but prem gear should bump it up.

Crit capped too ofc but cm is hard to get.

[lost gale]

fair enough

[zenith current]

i'm just looking around if there's a harvest or melee Flay take in here. I think running scornful blood with berserker belt is bait

[vivid ruin]

Probs end up trading some mana charms for cc/cm charms that are imprinted but they will take ages to get if I dont wanna dump resources.

[vivid ruin]

I agree with you. I think scornful is just very good in general. Not sure it needs to be overly focussed. Very cheap multi bucket.

[lost gale]

do we know if scornful blood will heal the lich while dealing damage (drain is ambiguous)

[vivid ruin]

Strong enough that the best T7 mod on my armor is actually %leech while transformed.

[vivid ruin]

I assume we get no heal.

[zenith current]

it won't

[vivid ruin]

It says 'instead'

Fortunately, CB a nd harvest have healing reminiscent of heartseeker.

[zenith current]

let's just do a thought experiment

how much leech

i can squeeze in

brb

[grim rune]

abo auto if belt works

[lost gale]

also lets you concentrate a multiplier to AOE DPS to a single target

[coarse dew]

yeah, also trying to create but it seems to no avail, a non chaos bolt variant of flay

[zenith current]

I made a spell variant of blood flay

bleed*

i dont think it measures up to mana stacking tho

[slim mason]

think it hits that chaos bolt node?

[zenith current]

what part confuses you

[slim mason]

mana threshold more bolts?

damn im gud

lol

more mana means more fuel too

[grim rune]

yes

[molten bramble]

Every 100 max mana you have when you cast flay casts a chaos bolt. Every 100 max mana you have increased Flay and CB dmg by 20%

[grim rune]

basicaly u want mana everywhere

[slim mason]

flay sucks mana hard too

[grim rune]

well CB returns mana

[molten bramble]

stack a bunch of mana get more chaos bolts and more dmg multiplier

[slim mason]

i mean rip blood and bone curse can be mana neutrak

[grim rune]

can't wait for it to be nerfed by next week

[slim mason]

nah

they didnt nerf hh until folloeing major patch

and that was even worse

lol

[grim rune]

tho I do not recommend playing necro

[slim mason]

pally the face tanker

[grim rune]

120m uber dps

will be nerfed 100%

well if belt doesn't work as I think it does then abo dmg drops to like 70m

[slim mason]

you need bone curse though

since we not running fissure

hence the blood focus

not sure why dread went poison

[lost gale]

CB is a great ailment application skill and poison overload is very strong?

[slim mason]

is poison stacks unlimited like bleed?

[zenith current]

yup

[slim mason]

thought they top off at 30?

[zenith current]

any ailment is unless stated otherwise

[slim mason]

or was that for poison shred

[obtuse quest]

That's just the shred part of the ailment.

[zenith current]

its not exactly poison shred

[obtuse quest]

It has no cap.

[zenith current]

but yes 30 first stacks of poison apply it y

[slim mason]

hmm but again easier to gear for poison vs bleed

[zenith current]

bleed is much easier to gear for arguably

but poison I think has a higher top end on account of all the res penetration

[slim mason]

not if you want to use that dagger?

stuck with taste or undisputed

[zenith current]

not sure which dagger you mean

oh traitors tongue? I think thats not restricted to just poison but yeah i think youd use something else for bleed

[slim mason]

that jaw dagger too is nasty

yoss up between that or gloves

[zenith current]

id prolly use that one for dex stacking cold

[zenith current]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/Bx8jb77B just a quick whip up of focusing primarily on leech.

[stuck owl]

Lich, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (20) / Lich (93)

General:

▸ Health: 2,898, Regen: 18.2/s
▸ Mana: 104.51, Regen: 11.84/s
▸ Ward Retention: 110%, Regen: 54/s
▸ Attributes: 10 Str / 102 Dex / 35 Int / 2 Att / 12 Vit
▸ Resistances: 68% / 82% / 68% / 62% / 60% / 98% / 90%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 34%, Threshold: 638
▸ Dodge Chance: 18% (593)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 32% (1,648)

Used skills:

Harvest / Reaper Form / Transplant

[zenith current]

180.11% leech

Not too shabby?

god knows i need to make this tankier tho 😛 i just wanted to see how much leech i can realistically squeeze in

[coarse dew]

what's your recovery if leech doesn't recover?

wondering about this, what's a non clunky way

[vivid ruin]

Wow, that's a lot of leech.

[lost gale]

use AoD healing with tons of healing effectiveness

[coarse dew]

aod?

[lost gale]

aura of decay heal 8% of missing hp per second

[vivid ruin]

Melee attack speedon the axe propbs better than pen. Pen is pretty crap in this game compared to most arpgs every time i run the numbers.

And you have velocir raptor jaw for tons.

[molten bramble]

Pen is super good as a stat the issue is the amount they give you on weps/ammys is just low

[pearl scarab]

Yeah 1% pen = 1% more because how of resistances work

Whereas in like Poe 10% pen is a lot more

[zenith current]

So, what, an Eagle Wing instead? Or?

[vivid ruin]

I just meant the legendary affix

[vivid ruin]

In my spec, dropping 3%pen from passive for 15% damage was always increasing damage. And i'm not even high pen.
I think it's cos you get 75% from mark+shred.

[zenith current]

the ruby fang mod?

cause thats the only suffix with attack speed

[vivid ruin]

On the exalted axe. Can't you get t5 melee attack speed rather than pen?

[zenith current]

pen is a suffix, attack speed's a prefix

[vivid ruin]

RIGHT. I'm thinking like Lp 😄

It's an ACTUAL exalted.

[zenith current]

Would you use something else? :p

[vivid ruin]

Not sure. I think that item is good. Did you consider the primordial that buffs exalter items?

I wonder if that''d be better damage than the dagger

Probs not though. The dex dagger is pretty awsome across the board.

[molten bramble]

You must not have much increased damage either than. You also have to keep in mind resistance shred is less against bosses. Both stats get less valuable the more you have .

[pearl scarab]

Have you looked at the pact severance one handed axe?

Ignoring the whole sacrifice bit of it, it comes with a chunk of attack speed

[zenith current]

the necrotic base bothers me

and the phys added

its not really working here

[vivid ruin]

I did forget about bosses. 60% less effective for shred; i'll redo my mate on pen.

[arctic grotto]

Quick question Abom no longers consumes skeletal vanguard, ethereal revenant, Arek's Flesh etc. basically any non acolyte minion skills right? or nah

[vivid ruin]

Does mark/pen have similar?

[pearl scarab]

Fair

[vivid ruin]

Fair point.

[zenith current]

Doesn't consume what it doesn't say it will :p

I could be convinced to maybe run an eagle wing for a bit more crit and ms

[pearl scarab]

The new axe

[zenith current]

new axe is sadly necrotic

[pearl scarab]

Time to force it into every build possible

[zenith current]

I mean i did try to dw it at first but most of its effects dont work when dw

[pearl scarab]

You’re cold right?

[zenith current]

Ya

honestly any type of big melee dam works

[pearl scarab]

Eulogy of blood

[zenith current]

Can very well go phys

[pearl scarab]

Cause I see a cold affix

[zenith current]

but both harvest and flay are dex scaling so

might as well double dip on that

[fading aurora]

Do you guys think skele archers with resummon chance could kill Uber Abby?

[pearl scarab]

Anything is possible

[zenith current]

I had an idea for a skele churner ifnernal golem but infernal aura is so bad

[pearl scarab]

How are you scaling damage

[zenith current]

it is depressing

[obtuse quest]

If they're dead longer than they're alive, probably not.

[fading aurora]

Well 😅 I guess they are more dead then alive

[pearl scarab]

More dead than undead

[zenith current]

so far im most pleased by my skele rogue vit stacker

from the 4 something builds i made

so far

vit stackers get so tanky its funny

ideally i wish there was a necrotic dot minion instead

thatd be even tankier

but theres nothing potent in that direction

[vivid ruin]

Unundead.

[pearl scarab]

Dudunsparce gaming

[zenith current]

there's no good necrotic dot minion right

im just double checking

but im pretty certain there isnt

[earnest lichen]

Gm gamers. 3 more days 🙏

[zenith current]

there's just damned on mages with hungering souls, that's shite.

[gaunt abyss]

Anyone have some kind of build guide for lich?

[zenith current]

buddy you gonna have to narrow that question down

[harsh warren]

most of my stuff is in theory in the planner

[lost gale]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/QqDPMWNA
This is the start of what I'm looking at

[stuck owl]

Necromancer, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (20) / Necromancer (43)

General:

▸ Health: 1,476, Regen: 22/s
▸ Mana: 104.51, Regen: 8/s
▸ Ward Retention: 71%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 2 Str / 2 Dex / 18 Int / 2 Att / 8 Vit
▸ Resistances: 0% / 0% / 0% / 0% / 0% / 128% / 8%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 30%, Threshold: 295
▸ Block Chance: 30%, Mitigation: 34% (875)

Used skills:

Summon Volatile Zombie / Summon Skeleton / Infernal Shade

[harsh warren]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/AVK9wLlQ
and this one's mine. diff flavors

[stuck owl]

Lich, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (31) / Lich (68) / Warlock (14)

General:

▸ Health: 1,955, Regen: 27.2/s
▸ Mana: 213.51, Regen: 17.6/s
▸ Ward Retention: 204%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 12 Str / 12 Dex / 82 Int / 18 Att / 20 Vit
▸ Resistances: 110% / 65% / 85% / 123% / 110% / 151% / 140%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 34%, Threshold: 430
▸ Dodge Chance: 2% (65)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 24% (1,026)

Used skills:

Rip Blood / Bone Curse / Aura Of Decay / Death Seal / Flay

[harsh warren]

(Ignore the red rings, you just need another 35% mana regen somewhere)

[gaunt abyss]

What you mean narrow it down?
Im not looking for end game build, but one i can use in the campaign and start do mono with till i have the lvls and gear for end game build

[zenith current]

so you want a levelling build

[gaunt abyss]

Ya

[zenith current]

maxroll will cover you on that front shortly.

[gaunt abyss]

But for lich, not warlock and then swap to lich

[zenith current]

since they fixed rip blood

id prolly go bleed rip blood but thats me

Poison lich probably a solid lich for levelling too

[earnest lichen]

I'm definitely gonna be doing that

Please rip blood be good 🙏 it sounds fun

[harsh warren]

i'm gonna also be hard speccing rip blood til it either works or i get frustrated and swap it to spirit plague

[zenith current]

ill do skele rogues

but thats necro

[little wigeon]

so rip blood into blood tether with bleed chance, then spirit plague, then reaper form (for huge dmg bonuses). that will carry you early

at 35 you can spec into marrow shards since rip blood will be able to cast it indirectly, aura of decay is another option for more bleeds

im doing it right now and its not bad, single target could use some work but i dont have access to blood tether so hoping that will help

[harsh warren]

aura of decay is in my direct build plan so once i get there and can sustain it ill be done

[earnest lichen]

I'm not smart enough to make my own build so I'll be following the inevitable maxroll guide when it comes out

[little wigeon]

i dont think they are going to change it much, just fissure warlock and mastery swap

[earnest lichen]

Definitely gonna league start with rip blood tho

[slim mason]

wandering spirits first then switch to rip blood

[earnest lichen]

[harsh warren]

I believe in your ability

[earnest lichen]

Ty gamer

[zenith current]

thats not lich specific tho :p

[harsh warren]

all i need is rip blood stack bleeds get a lucky exsang drop then full bore into aura of decay bleeds /s

i'm sure rip blood will take me thru the campaign no problem

[zenith current]

^

[obtuse quest]

%inc added together x %more1 x %more2 x %more3....

[hidden sable]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/BglXDxxo

[stuck owl]

Lich, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (20) / Lich (63) / Warlock (30)

General:

▸ Health: 2,616, Regen: 20/s
▸ Mana: 320.66, Regen: 22.64/s
▸ Ward Retention: 214%, Regen: 88/s
▸ Attributes: 19 Str / 15 Dex / 107 Int / 5 Att / 6 Vit
▸ Resistances: 118% / 80% / 80% / 106% / 62% / 158% / 68%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 33%, Threshold: 601
▸ Dodge Chance: 2% (60)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 26% (1,159)

Used skills:

Ghostflame / Infernal Shade / Aura Of Decay / Rip Blood / Reaper Form

[zenith current]

whats your question

[obtuse quest]

1. Add all flat damage together
2. add all %increases together then multiply it.
3. Multiply each %more damage node and effect.
4. multiply pen and or resist shred.
5. multiply estimated armour shred stacks if hit damage.

500 cap is baby numbers for flay mana stacking-

[slim mason]

gotta start it up till chaos bolt lol

then use chaos bolt and rip blood to get to flay

[obtuse quest]

Tithe can give more than 500./

[arctic grotto]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/BZNY4aDB

[stuck owl]

Necromancer, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (21) / Necromancer (92)

General:

▸ Health: 1,989, Regen: 29.2/s
▸ Mana: 134.51, Regen: 10.88/s
▸ Ward Retention: 329%, Regen: 38/s
▸ Attributes: 143 Str / 17 Dex / 143 Int / 17 Att / 21 Vit
▸ Resistances: 96% / 96% / 161% / 84% / 127% / 119% / 95%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 43%, Threshold: 398
▸ Dodge Chance: 3% (92)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 75% (8,240)

Used skills:

Dread Shade / Infernal Shade / Assemble Abomination / Summon Skeletal Mage / Summon Skeleton

[arctic grotto]

Pretty much what would my build would be, feel free to change to your liking

[obtuse quest]

There's a theory craft that turns 1.5k mana into 2.5k mana?

[little wigeon]

with "unethical" helmet/chest they were hitting 3k mana lmao

well you arent directly casting spells that takes most of the lines away unfortunately

[obtuse quest]

No as in, using the new axe people went from 1.5k mana to 2.5k mana lmao

[little wigeon]

oh nice

tithe/traitors tongue is just too strong of a combo

skill points, 17% base crit, mana stacking and mana regain*, spell dmg for chaos bolts, etc

[earnest lichen]

Is it just gonna be a random world drop or do we know where this unique comes from yet?

[little wigeon]

random drop

[earnest lichen]

Works for me

[little wigeon]

its lvl 70 tho 🙁

[harsh warren]

converting to spell flay and using celestial decouples the mana gain from required kills

[earnest lichen]

Oof. Gonna be a 1lp for me then

With max cof getting 2lp+ probably won't be that bad

[little wigeon]

idk if i run dual traitors and use mana on harvest chest or just wait till lvl 70

[earnest lichen]

That too

[little wigeon]

i kinda want to jump straight into flay lol

[earnest lichen]

Do love me some flicker...

[bleak cypress]

bonk

[earnest lichen]

Probably gonna make separate characters for harvest, flay, and rip blood. All 3 sound so fun

[little wigeon]

it would be so much easier on a 2nd character for lich

just make dex gear and run harvest

[earnest lichen]

No

[obtuse quest]

What the heck are you talking about

[earnest lichen]

Multiboxing?

[celest arch]

Yeah

[celest arch]

Yes think you could do it on Diablo

[earnest lichen]

Don't think that's a thing in le. Maybe if you use 2 separate accounts but I dont think it works like that

[celest arch]

Wish you could multibox thanks your reminding me of the name

[rotund kettle]

Hello guys, do you have any recommendations for summoner necro build? I would like to try some Abomination build ❤️

[obtuse quest]

Abom builds are everywhere.

[earnest lichen]

Abom enjoyers are eating real good rn

[rotund kettle]

And any specific link? 😄

[obtuse quest]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/build-guides/necromancer-abomination-snapshotting

[stuck owl]

Necromancer Abomination Snapshotting Build Guide

Game Cycle / Version

Tombs of the Erased / 1.2.3

Class

Acolyte / Necromancer

Used skills

• Assemble Abomination
• Infernal Shade
• Dread Shade
• Summon Skeleton
• Summon Skeletal Mage

Used unique items

• Ambitions of an Erased Acolyte
• Naal's Tooth
• Tolmat's Incorrect History of Eterra
• Hollow Finger
• Wraithlord's Harbour
• Death Rattle
• Eterra's Path
• Julra's Obsession
• Aaron's Will
• Orian's Descent

Tags

Boss Killer / SSF / Minions

Created by readceras · May 16, 2025, 4:55 AM

[slim mason]

abom was good at the beginning and now its abom renaisance

lol

[vapid belfry]

honestly just look at maxroll

lizard cooked a 60mil hit abom or something

[celest arch]

Oh just read isboxer can open 2 steams and can allow multibox for LE

[vapid belfry]

https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/build-guides/abomination-necromancer-guide

[earnest lichen]

Fyi I don't know if this is against LE's tos so do it at your own peril

[rotund kettle]

Thank you so much ❤️

[earnest lichen]

I wouldn't do it if I were you but you do you king. Gl

[vapid belfry]

honestly just make your character and then dupe him to offline

[celest arch]

Just would be nice to level up 2 at once , I really hate making alts

[bleak cypress]

ngl it would be way easier to just make a friend and ask him to level up your alt LMAO

[vapid belfry]

granted youre now offline but eh

[earnest lichen]

It takes like 3 hours to get an alt from 1 to emp monos

[vapid belfry]

yeah this game makes twinking a character super easy

[celest arch]

Yeah im a lazy gamer , never do more than 1-2 hero’s per season

I should pay someone to level up each class for me

[vapid belfry]

ok elon

[celest arch]

$300 per level 100

[earnest lichen]

[bleak cypress]

i'd dig that.

thats like 1/3rd of my salary.

[celest arch]

Elon is doge , I’m eth

[earnest lichen]

You don't even need lvl 100 at all. Mid 90s is plenty

I dont think I've ever finished 100 on a character. 98 or 99 a few times tho

[harsh warren]

I hit a 100 last season

[bleak cypress]

i hit lv100 and i play since 8.08

[earnest lichen]

[bleak cypress]

10 days was enough LMAO

[earnest lichen]

Damn

[harsh warren]

I was playing a brand of deception autobomber

[earnest lichen]

I usually get bored with the character by the mid 90s and move onto an alt

[harsh warren]

yyyea i had more than 10 days

[primal remnant]

Do sacrificed minions count as dying for all purposes ? Like skellies' "gain mana/ward on death" and all

specifically when they get sacrified by Cruelty or by skele mages

[keen barn]

The wording of this node makes me think it wont work for single target? Like it'll only shoot marrowshards at a second target but not the one you crit with flay?

[harsh warren]

generally that stuff prioritizes different targets, and then your primary if there's nothing left to hit

but we'll have to see on release

[obtuse quest]

Yes.

[little wigeon]

it works. "marrow shards will hit the initial enemy" 3rd paragraph

[primal remnant]

thanks ! I may try sacrifice this season, never tested it yet

[bleak cypress]

anyone made some WiP mana flay cb build i could copy the homework from? (learn wtf are yall even taking there)

[little wigeon]

yea search for the one from bwz in here

[keen barn]

I saw that but I figured it was just talking about whatever target its sent at so you know it pierces, not specifically saying "It's gonna hit the flay target"

[little wigeon]

it will hit the flay target, also mike confirmed it in the dev chat

[keen barn]

Oh nice

[pearl scarab]

Yay

[wintry flame]

okay I'm up, yooooo

[pearl scarab]

Good morning

[lost gale]

anyone looked into Abomination sacrificing 100% revive chance skeletons to spawn blood wraiths?

you get 15 mana back per skeleton sacrificed

[pearl scarab]

No but I want to look at it now

[lost gale]

but you gotta pay 120% the mana cost of sacrifice when Abom casts it

and we don't know how fast he'll cast it

[wintry flame]

I haven't look at sac abom it's on my list lmao

took me like 3 days to make 6 planners so tired

[lost gale]

he definitely won't sacrifice the blood wraiths because he'll only sac whatever you make him out of

[wintry flame]

trueee

[bleak cypress]

oh im either blind or dumb but cant find it

[lost gale]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/omELKlno It's a bit pathetic but this is as far as I got with zombies/skeletons/shades. I'm not sure the zombies are even needed

[stuck owl]

Necromancer, Level 100

Game Cycle / Version:

Beneath Ancient Skies / 1.3

Class:

Acolyte (20) / Necromancer (93)

General:

▸ Health: 1,557, Regen: 22/s
▸ Mana: 104.51, Regen: 8/s
▸ Ward Retention: 81%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 2 Str / 2 Dex / 23 Int / 2 Att / 19 Vit
▸ Resistances: 27% / 27% / 27% / 6% / 6% / 166% / 25%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 30%, Threshold: 311
▸ Block Chance: 30%, Mitigation: 34% (875)

Used skills:

Summon Volatile Zombie / Summon Skeleton / Infernal Shade / Summon Wraith / Dread Shade

[limber berry]

Seeing some really good abom builds with super accessible gear early on.

Wondering if I might just chill with big abom boi and farm reap gear and see what builds people come up with

[exotic bison]

u could do the bouncey sacrifice and it'll bounce to the wraiths maybe?

[lost gale]

bouncey sac will bounce to the abom i'm pretty certain

[wintry flame]

I can look in a bit

I need to make a video today or something

[exotic bison]

hmm, the skill node for abom sac did say it wouldn't target itself

[little wigeon]

heres bwz

[bleak cypress]

thanks 🙏

[pearl scarab]

My assumption is the initial target won’t target itself

[lost gale]

sacrifice chain says it recasts on any minion in the aoe of the explosion

[pearl scarab]

But the bouncy sac won’t care about that

[little wigeon]

(if you search from: bwz and has: link, makes it easy to look up people's builds)

[lost gale]

I wouldn't bet on that not blowing up abom

[exotic bison]

dunno

could go either way

just gotta test it

[pearl scarab]

Yea

[lost gale]

even if it does, chain sac helps with cast speed or making the most of limited triggers, if abom just casts rapidly any time you have mana you may not need it

[exotic bison]

yea there is that too

the question of how fast is "rapidly devouring" 🤣

[lost gale]

and you pay more per sac with chain, abom is already making you pay 120% of the already steep cost of sacrifice

[exotic bison]

I'm hoping it's basically passively eating them in like a split second

[lost gale]

if it is rapid the abom will be functionally unkillable because it's gonna heal so much from nomming

[pearl scarab]

Somewhere between every 0.5 seconds and 4 seconds per chomp

[lost gale]

4 sec would be totally worthless (& thus it's probably 4 sec)

[pearl scarab]

Perhaps even every 5 seconds

[lost gale]

lets make it 2 per 12 seconds like the vengeance primordial unique

[exotic bison]

pfft

[lost gale]

abomination being able to sacrifice minions is very cool

[wintry flame]

It's copy pasted from wraithlord

[lost gale]

Devour
Rapidly devours minions that had previously been absorbed to create the Abomination. Restores 10% of the Abomination's health for each minion devoured.
Range: 0-19 meters
Engage Range: 18 meters
Pursuit Range: 20 meters
Mana Cost: 40
Cooldown: 0 seconds
Base Speed: 0.733 per second
Use Delay: 0.5 seconds
Use Duration: 1.2 seconds
Scales with Cast Speed
Base Damage:
40 Necrotic
Critical Chance: 5%
Critical Multiplier: 200%
Added Damage Effectiveness: 200%
Is a Hit
Hit up to 3 nearest enemies in 7 meter radius
Target nearest
Scaling:
Per point of Attunement:
+2% Mana Efficiency
from LET

[wintry flame]

based on the minion data

[pearl scarab]

We need some funny item that makes the player count as a minion and then abom uses sac on you

[wintry flame]

it will be a little bit faster than wraithlord by default as wraithlord has a less cast speed mod

[lost gale]

I'm surprised there wasn't a Minion Modifiers apply to the player at X efficiency primordial unique with a chunky less life modifier on it to offset the delicious T7 351% increased minion life affixes

and yeah, don't cast sacrifice while wearing it

and definitely don't equip cruelty

[pearl scarab]

[keen barn]

Is the "% current hp lost/% missing hp as ward" something you go all in on? Or is there a threshold where its too much

[harsh warren]

can't die from that

[little wigeon]

no such thing as too much, normally you want it to zap all your hp to 1

so you get more ward

[keen barn]

ok so more is better pretty much

[obtuse totem]

Somehow I worry that the flay build will heal too much to generate much ward at all

[little wigeon]

its either all in or like none at all

[earnest lichen]

Going off of that, if you're using an ability that costs hp to use like marrowshards and sitting at 1 hp on a lowlife, does that just kill you? Or will shards just not proc off of rip blood if you don't have enough hp

[harsh warren]

there's somewhat a critical mass to get it online, just one source often won't give you enough ward compared to the health

[earnest lichen]

Or will rip blood healing be enough even with low life

[little wigeon]

it uses current health so you can still use marrow

[keen barn]

Might depend on if it's a flat hp cost or a percentage. I would think marrow shards would still work fine cause it's % current hp then if it rounds down it'd basically be free at 1 hp

[earnest lichen]

Thought so but had to check

[tender ridge]

necrobros is there a decent looking horde build coming together? a buddy of mine really only ever wants to play horde style minions but doesn't mesh with the beastmaster vibe

[obtuse fossil]

How fast do Blood Specters decay?

and is there a maximum number?

[autumn bough]

define hord

is 20 wraiths a horde?

if so then flame wraith is strong as always

skele rogues should be decent

i didnt fck with mages but maybe u can go now mage army

[tender ridge]

lemme get his quote when I sent him the abom guide

[8:14 AM]
Confehdehrehtheh:
Abomination Necromancer Guide - Last Epoch Maxroll.gg
Abomination Necromancer Build Guide for Last Epoch, Season 3. Skills, Passives, Gear, Blessings, Idols. Builds for Monolith, Dungeons, Arena.
https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/build-guides/abomination-necromancer-guide

the new season lets you build your monster and then run around with it + trex

[8:18 AM]
Aurk:
One monster though
I want a million expendable minions

I think wraiths might be too much of a turret playstyle

like he usually plays ARPGs to summon a bunch of dudes then just loot. he's pretty casual about it

[autumn bough]

flame wraiths or if someone makes rogues work, other than that there isnt much

[autumn bough]

ahh well then the most casual is abomination or archmage skeleton, you summon 1 op dude he clears 3 screens for u

for armies idk

not in LE imo with many minions comes a lot of buffing

[wintry flame]

rogues look fine all variants are around 10mil dps with conservative calcs

[tender ridge]

yeah playstylewise he'd probably like those, but it's about the vibes too

[wintry flame]

I'm working on a minion army build

[autumn bough]

wait for zeckars builds 🙏