Atomic card advice

[wind scaffold]

Hello,
I wanted to have your thoughts and advice on how to more efficiently create cards when you NEED to have multiple informations. For examples, cards in which I need to recall clinical signs of a specific disease.
I wanted to know if there's a more efficient way of making these cards than "Clinical signs of X" and a list of the signs I need to remember. And also, what to do when I have 50% correct ? Only one missed ? for FSRS to work as its best

[worthy aurora]

for the last question

for me how i view it is that in an exam if they ask me to name the clinical signs of x

and if i get 5/10 if they give me 50% and i am fine with 50% then i will hit hard

but in an exam if they want me to get all of them and i dont get them all, i will hit again

[wind scaffold]

Yeah so I do the same thing for that concern

[fluid cloak]

Personally this would be my approach, but I have no experience studying for med school. #general message

[fluid cloak]

There's a lot of advice out there for medical students using Anki. I found this:

I like making two cards for list items, one that asks for each item one by one, and one that asks for all the items in the list.

Note 1 (Recall items one by one)
Disease Q presents with symptoms {{c3::X}}, {{c2::Y}}, and {{c1::Z}

Note 2 (Be able to recall all items in a list and the list name)
{{c2::Disease Q}} presents with symptoms {{c1::X}}, {{c1::Y}}, and {{c1::Z}

https://medshamim.com/med/make-high-yield-anki-cards

[wind scaffold]

I don't think note 2 is a great idea as some diseases presents with the same symptoms and I could be technically right but not on the right card

But first example of note could be good honestly, I could try clozing my list of symptoms instead of creating a basic card and having to recall all the list

[fluid cloak]

Yeah, I have that problem with Chinese vocabulary. My deck has a few words that sound the same. So those cards have a line in red saying "Not XYZ" or "Context: XYZ". It sounds like it might be useful for differential diagnosis in the long run if you do something similar?

[wind scaffold]

I was thinking, is there an addon to randomize a list ? Like I tend to remember where things are placed when I have cloze cards, so I recall based on the position of the word and not the context. I'd like to have something to change the order of the list

[fluid cloak]

That does sound useful. Someone posted something similar on this server recently, but it sounds like it would take a lot of work to adapt to your needs. #general message

[worthy aurora]

i think you can hijack the mcq addon

into working for you like that

[wind scaffold]

Yeah unfortunately I don't have that much time to tinker around lmao

I'll look into it if I have time after exams

[fluid cloak]

For what it's worth, I am seeing multiple people (including med students) arguing that you shouldn't actually randomise the list, because it will be easier to memorise if it's always the same order. They said if you really have to, then use overlapping cloze deletions. Like this:

• A ... D, E, F
• A, B ... E, F

It's funny, because I would prefer just memorising the whole lot in one card, but people really seem to think it's not a great idea for Anki, since you waste time reviewing every item whenever you forget one piece of it. Hmmm.

[wind scaffold]

Si I did something like that and with enhanced cloze it's like hints

Like that, I can click on the blue ones to reveal them and the red one is the one I need to recall on this card

I hope it'll be effective like that, otherwise I can still convert them in standard clozes

But what I fear is that they will be siblings so I will not see them as much as I could need for some of them

[fluid cloak]

That looks great, I hope it works!

[toxic plinth]

Currently, I try to remember them all, like put them all in one card, no cloze nothing just good ol' normal reversed optional cards and I either get them all correct or nothing and hit "again"

My problem is that I eventually get so tired from it that sometimes I kid you not if I get 2 wrong out of 7 then I just hit "good" and call it a day

I'm open to any new suggestions, that would be awesome.

[wind scaffold]

Yes I was at the same point as you and so I did what shown in this discussion with enhanced cloze of each symptom. I don't have much hindsight to tell you if it works well or not, but I can already tell you that if you're studying somewhat short term it could not work as each cloze card will be a sibling in each note, so you may get around to see all the symptoms in like 1/2weeks if you have 7 symptoms for example

[toxic plinth]

Wow that's a really slow rate of learning, won't work for me

[wind scaffold]

Or you can disable disperse siblings but I would advise not. Or another solution is to do it with enhance image occlusion addon as each card created with a mask will not be a sibling inside the note

[toxic plinth]

Does disabling disperse siblings have any effect on memory if all of them are hidden though?

I think my problem with cloze cards is that they feel so odd for signs

they make you remember the order more than the answer itself

[wind scaffold]

No, it will not affect your enhanced cloze cards but it will affect the rest of your collection where you might have relevant siblings

[toxic plinth]

What happens if you put answer #1 in placement #3?

[wind scaffold]

Personnaly I like to think of all the signs when I get shown the card, then I uncover the ones that I wasn't asked for and complete with the missing one

[toxic plinth]

I'm confused, wouldn't that be the same as a normal standard non-cloze card then?

(Sorry for asking so many questions, I kind of want to improve my Anki skills lol and I'm learning a lot more right now)

[wind scaffold]

It would be if you want to skip the part of thinking of all the signs first

[toxic plinth]

But that's exactly what you do in a standard card anyway lol

[wind scaffold]

First you see that

Then I reveal the other

And then I answer

[toxic plinth]

You misunderstood what I mean, "thinking of all the answers" and then showing it is exactly what you do in a normal non-cloze card.

I just don't quite get the "bonus" or the "advantage" of using a cloze card instead over a normal one.

[wind scaffold]

You have a card for each symptom so each symptom will be processed by the algorithm. If you struggle to remember that there's fever you'll see fever more often than the other symptoms of the disease

[toxic plinth]

Okay that makes sense but what happens if you get the asked-for card right and you don't get one (or more) of the others right?

This wouldn't work if you have "bury siblings" enabled, you will only get one per day and that means if you get the card right but one of the others no that would just ruin this plan.

It's amazing though if you have it disabled though, I will definitely try it, thanks!