i mean i just think its silly to even suggest they fuckin stole them again
#General Mario Lore
minor delta
lusty jackal
It kind of is
buoyant turtle
It really isn’t
What kind of logic is that
I ask again
Do Whittles exist
Or Lubba
minor delta
i dunno if spinoff guys would or wouldnt be allowed to mention it, i just dont tjink they have to
buoyant turtle
Or heck, Tostarenans
lusty jackal
The logic is that the origin of these Characters are entirely isolated within 30 year old games
minor delta
and even then that explanation could only be relevant to that game only
buoyant turtle
Tostarenans haven’t appeared since 2017, do they reeeeally exist
minor delta
sometimes they have wands and sometimes they dont
buoyant turtle
Sometimes people carry things
minor delta
sophie youre really grossly misunderstanding what the premise of sayinf this is
buoyant turtle
Sometimes people don’t carry these things
minor delta
its not retroactively sayinf Yhey dont exist anymore and never did
buoyant turtle
Existence is retroactive
thin hatch
Why would they allow them to not?
lusty jackal
Not to mention, under a strictly Lore perspective, they wouldn't be canon anyway because smb3 is a play, right?
minor delta
do you seriously think as a Lore Historian the koopalings just went and stole back the exact same wands again and its been unresolved for ober 20 years now
minor delta
Existence is retroactive
no it isnt
minor delta
and you should not do thay because you will just be mad about this conversation otherwise
which i can assure yiu
leaden hemlock
Why would they allow them to not?
the kings haven't been featured in anything since super mario bros 3, as such even though they exist they're probably not up for grabs for licensees
minor delta
yiu do not have to be
leaden hemlock
only in-house nintendo would have jurisdiction on that
thin hatch
the kings haven't been featured in anything since super mario bros 3, as such ev...
I wouldn't think that's the case, I think it would mroe be does anyone wNt to
lusty jackal
I'm also pretty sure Zelda 1 is constantly inferred to
minor delta
something Not Existing Now isnt literal
it means They Might As Well Not
they arent relevant
they are unliekly to appear
they sidnt vanish
buoyant turtle
Well then say it
leaden hemlock
I wouldn't think that's the case, I think it would mroe be does anyone *wNt* to
i mean idk i feel like the kings would be brought up by anyone at some point
buoyant turtle
Say they exist and aren’t relevant
leaden hemlock
but they haven't
buoyant turtle
Which isn’t the same as not existing
leaden hemlock
maybe they're just wildly unpopular
minor delta
only you took it to mwan they never existed
buoyant turtle
The stance of “they do not exist” has been maintained since this convo started
lusty jackal
Yeah it doesn't mean They never existed it means They basically don't exist
lusty jackal
tru
buoyant turtle
It isn’t
lusty jackal
It's just a play 
buoyant turtle
It’s not
minor delta
which is like its own can of worms and not the kind of thing sophie is taking the angle from
buoyant turtle
Literally in SMW
The story begins with “after the events of SMB3”
In a way that undeniably references the actual events that did in fact exist
In 1990
lusty jackal
But if you're approaching it from a strictly Lore perspective, right, which is how you come to the conclusion that the kings, in modern canon, still exist, it's outwardly stated that smb3 is just a play
minor delta
it isnt outwardly stated its in fact explicitly implied
unless theres a miyamoto quote floating around somewhere
lusty jackal
Miyamoto also says it's a play so I mean uh
buoyant turtle
How does one explicitly imply something
leaden hemlock
miyamoto stated it was a play
in the same video he stated he was bowser jr's mom
unforgettable
buoyant turtle
Framing device
lusty jackal
That's what I meant by "outwardly stated" as in Miyamoto literally said so
minor delta
How does one explicitly imply something
in the game it is not stated to be a play but things are bolted to the background eith dropshadows and so on
hence
lusty jackal
Ok these are all inferences
buoyant turtle
And TTYD is just a play
minor delta
it is Explicitly (only and outwardly) implied
lusty jackal
@ lady Sophie
clear remnant
i thought smb3 was a play but the events within did happen
Which is why you have a sunken airship with a magic ball inside in smw
or something
buoyant turtle
Yes
The events of SMB3 happening is what lead to SMW mentioning the events of SMB3
leaden hemlock
i thought smb3 was a play but the events within did happen
that's one way to assume it
but like it's not directly stated anyway
buoyant turtle
That’s the way SMW directly states it
clear remnant
Honestly though
I think like Boom-Boom and its flying it’s probably easier to assume the Koopalings’s wands, at least as they have them now, are just made by Magikoopas or something
They even have the shapes in their spells
buoyant turtle
That also works
leaden hemlock
for the longest time i thought magikoopas were from mario 3
probably because of that
minor delta
shoutouts to mario world ever having only one magikoopa on screen at once
first implied appearance of kamek
leaden hemlock
kamek is a fucked up name
thin hatch
it's a goblin name
leaden hemlock
no it's fucked up as in it literally just means magikoopa in japanese
thin hatch
Kame means turtle
leaden hemlock
i kind of wish the localization of yoshi's island got it right
leaden hemlock
that's what I mean
everyone (and by everyone that means every person exposed to US mario media only because magikoopa is kamek in england) thinks kamek is a uniquely named character
minor delta
i kinda would rather they all be called magikoopas over kameks
but thats because i like derivative names
leaden hemlock
i don't even care about the name in particular
i care about kamek the magikoopa being like that
thin hatch
there js one kamek
leaden hemlock
instead of magikoopa the magikoopa
when there sometimes isn't even actually a single magikoopa
thin hatch
instead of magikoopa the magikoopa
I MEAN THERE WAS A TOAD LIKE THAT
leaden hemlock
there is no toad the toad
thin hatch
THERE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE
leaden hemlock
it's all just toad
i don't even think any mario rpg's bothered with the concept of there being a single main toad
minor delta
it would make more sense if there wasnt a "the" kamek any more than yoshis island had a "the" yoshi
clear remnant
for the longest time i thought magikoopas were from mario 3
But if you close your eyes...does it almost feel like nothing’s changed at all...
leaden hemlock
yeah this is pretty natural
thin hatch
it's all just toad
There is one toad -
Mario wiki implies /talks about it
The toad in the party games and stuff is One Toad
leaden hemlock
mariowiki is kind of fucked on its head about toad
leaden hemlock
kamek's job is interchangeable with the entire magikoopa species
thin hatch
kamek's job is interchangeable with the entire magikoopa species
No it's not??
leaden hemlock
the only difference is that there sometimes isn't more than one magikoopa
minor delta
it kind of is
leaden hemlock
that's really just it
thin hatch
god i fucking hate mario character desgin sometimes
minor delta
its the same situation as yoshi i think
clear remnant
They even have the shapes in their spells
I also don’t mean this in a “oh get it because the koopaling spells are just circles” which isnt even true in the games between smb3 and smm2 but they have the actual, literal magikoopa shapes in their spells
minor delta
yoshi also has yoshis island as his backstory
thin hatch
And as the guy in drag sometimes thank's new soup /j
minor delta
and theres a bunch of yoshis
thin hatch
yoshi also has yoshis island as his backstory
that was 8 different yoshis
minor delta
so kamek could just be a magikoopa
leaden hemlock
super mario rpg and paper mario 1 both have a the yoshi right
minor delta
please stop splitting my words you know what i mean
thin hatch
super mario rpg and paper mario 1 both have a the yoshi right
Neither do
minor delta
SMRPG has the yoshi
leaden hemlock
which yoshi
thin hatch
mario rpg does explictly refrence yoshi's island w kamek despite fucking up translation 50 ways
minor delta
the one you ride
leaden hemlock
in what game
minor delta
SMW
thin hatch
That's a newborn yoshi i thought
buoyant turtle
Yoshi's Island DS implies the Yoshi was born there
thin hatch
in mario rpg
minor delta
he mentions that he remembers you from it
thin hatch
Yoshi's Island DS implies *the* Yoshi was born there
Also this
minor delta
unless you can string the SMW yoshi to YI1
minor delta
in mario rpg
thats another one
buoyant turtle
the Yoshi from SMW2 is just an older Yoshi who isnt the Yoshi born in YIDS
minor delta
you go to yoster isle and theres a bunch of yoshis including a baby and also the yoshif rom SMW
thin hatch
this discussion is so hard tk have because i don't even know if nintendo knows anymore
who's who
minor delta
i mean
the only way to distinguish "the" yoshi or "the" toad is when the games themselves distinguish it as such
which tends to be in spinoffs only
or if they have a unique playable role
thin hatch
they do keep trying to single out one magikoopa,
And like sometimes one yoshi
Not toad anymore
so Kamek is ... mostly his own?
Yoshi is slightly less so
Toad
minor delta
"the" toad and "the" yoshi otherwise dont really matter as much as they are the singularly important toad relevant to the specific story
minor delta
kamek is basically the same way but NoA just gives the given magikoopa hte name if they choose to
leaden hemlock
there isn't a single one kamek and there won't ever be
buoyant turtle
thats ridiculous
thin hatch
there isn't a single one kamek and there won't ever be
We have no proof it's that way
leaden hemlock
it really isn't
buoyant turtle
how can you tell me the magikoopa in TOK is just acting like any magikoopa
minor delta
if they say its the same one that raised bowser then its the same one
thin hatch
there's been a guy - like singled out at least a few time
thin hatch
if they say its the same one that raised bowser then its the same one
Exactly
buoyant turtle
is any magikoopa explicitly responsible for raising Bowser and Bowser Jr
minor delta
but thats the only signifier really
thin hatch
is any magikoopa explicitly responsible for raising Bowser and Bowser Jr
And being the advisor
Lile - in new soup
minor delta
i mean isnt kamek the only magikoopa in tok
buoyant turtle
but thats the only signifier really
which means it is one
buoyant turtle
unless, you believe the entire magikoopa species was responsible for raising Bowser and Bowser Jr
thin hatch
whos to say magikoopas dont act the same
because there have been other magikoopa npcs
And the one in oragami king specifically talks about when Jr wad a baby anf such
There have been other magikoopa npcs
fhis is the dumbest discussion ever
minor delta
aight
thin hatch
there is no clear answer other than whag can be inferrd
leaden hemlock
what I mean is that the kamek that appears in
mario kart tour
it is no different from any other magikoopa
thin hatch
is probably the guy but not for surr
leaden hemlock
despite being called kamek
leaden hemlock
there is no one kamek unless directly stated in the game they're in
thin hatch
Bleugh-
Nintendo made a bad decision once w charscter desgin and now we all sugfer
thin hatch
there is no one kamek unless directly stated in the game they're in
Or directly implied by what we see jim say or do
buoyant turtle
ok so when you say "There is no kamek character" you dont mean "There is no kamek character", you mean "There is a kamek character"
minor delta
jesus fucking christmas
leaden hemlock
there is a kamek character but in most games where kamek is named kamek kamek is not kamek
thin hatch
The one that hovers over bowser's shoulder is Probabkh the guy but not always
I HATE THIS
leaden hemlock
hope that clears it up
buoyant turtle
jesus fucking christmas
well I'm sorry for thinking that when I'm told, and I quote, "there isn't a single one kamek and there won't ever be"
leaden hemlock
they don't have kamek from yoshi's island as a separate character
they just have it as magikoopa
buoyant turtle
I think its pretty clear kamek from Yoshi's Island is a separate character
thin hatch
^
buoyant turtle
the caretaker kamek
unless, like I said, you believe the entire magikoopa clan was responsible for personally taking care of Bowser and Bowser Jr
scenic mango
Just found out there was this whole argument about the Mario 3 kings I missed
All I can really say is that I like how the upcoming movie is bringing the concept of kings back, even if they aren’t explicitly the ones from the games
buoyant turtle
any game where the caretaker magikoopa appears pretty directly ties it to the caretaker magikoopa character
so the three YI games
minor delta
unless, like I said, you believe the entire magikoopa clan was responsible for p...
what is the logic behind this
minor delta
this is the second kind of sweeping "if you think this then it means this" statement youve made this morning
so i want to know the logic that makes this the case
buoyant turtle
well, besides the "name", the only difference between kamek and other magikoopas is their role
so if you believe there is no kamek character, you must believe there is no difference between the role of kamek and the role of other magikoopas
so if the role of kamek is being the caretaker of Bowser and Jr
then you must somehow believe that applies interchangebly to any magikoopa
thin hatch
Nintendo should really just be like
" yeah lets just uh, give the Guy - some distinction. He had an apron in one game right? Yeah ok apron guy is unqiue"
But they don't
minor delta
so it is about the role of kamek rather than the presence of his unique character
buoyant turtle
whats the difference
minor delta
because the role could be done by a generic magikoopa
by giving him a unique name it implies there is more character present beyond his role
buoyant turtle
wouldnt that make said generic magikoopa not generic anymore
minor delta
its all just semantics anyway
i mean
it would still be wholly aesthetically indistinguishable
so i would say, no
which is not the answer you were looking for
buoyant turtle
Im not asking aesthetically
buoyant turtle
if thats not what Im asking, then thats not an answer to my question
minor delta
it is an answer you have to accept because it is stupid that kamek as a character is wholly and solely defined by his role in a game 20 years ago
and not any other facet of his character beyond stating "i raised bowser (and bowser jr maybe)"
buoyant turtle
wholly and solely defined by his role in YI, YIDS, YNI, PIT, TOK, SMRPG
minor delta
i dont think i have the capacity to entertain an argument of semantics baout how No, Technically By Giving Him A Unique Signifier, No Matter How Small, No Longer Mkaes Him Unique
buoyant turtle
wholly and solely defined by his role in YI, YIDS, YNI, PIT, TOK, SMRPG
and maybe more that Im forgetting
thin hatch
it is an answer you have to accept because it is stupid that kamek as a characte...
i Fucking Hate This dessgin decision because nintendo makes things so dumb sometkmes
minor delta
this discussion is becoming exhausting
thin hatch
and maybe more that Im forgetting
And some of the party games
And his kart tracks
he has at leasf 2
minor delta
if you are reduced to mincing my words instead of just engaging in even a normal level of faith then you can have your sandbox all to yourself
enjoy
buoyant turtle
what have I even done
minor delta
i said "wholly and solely" and you pulled receipts of 5 other games because "solely" is not technicalyl correct! he actualyl did the same thing 6 times!
buoyant turtle
yeah
minor delta
i should not have to explain to you how this is an exhausting way to have a conversation
you know what i meant when i said that
buoyant turtle
because what you said was implying that was entirely his role
like I was hanging on to a thread by a two decades old game
minor delta
his role being to raise bowser as a caretaker
which did not hcange in
any of those games
buoyant turtle
like I was hanging on to a thread by a two decades old game
as some desperate attempt to argue hes a character
minor delta
no, i did not take you in that bad of faith
buoyant turtle
well thats what you sounded like
minor delta
to you
i am explaining that kamek's role is defined by the one thing he did then and it has been upheld in every subsequent game he appears and has a major role in
buoyant turtle
isnt that what "Wholy and solely" means
minor delta
no
because he Wholly and Solely has one
consistent
job
the thing
as we have argued
that describes kamek as an individual
is his role
the one thing he does in the mario universe (present tense!)
he continues to do it
because if he did not
buoyant turtle
yes and what is the issue with that
minor delta
he would no longer be kamek
he would just be another magikoopa
hence why kamek sucks
outer bloom
kamek is cool me thinks
minor delta
yaay
leaden hemlock
kamella
i can't say i know what this is
uh
pet theory is that super mario galaxy initially tried to copy aspects of paper mario 64
so this is kammy koopa
but as their own
minor delta
yea basically
outer bloom
cool design but it never appears again huh
leaden hemlock
yeah
minor delta
kamella is just in-house nintendo's "fuck your dumbass oc we have our own cooler kammy"
outer bloom
real
leaden hemlock
idk if i'd even say it's that
outer bloom
when you think about it
leaden hemlock
i don't know why kamella exists
outer bloom
waluigi was another companies OC that made it into the canon of nintendo characters
outer bloom
true
lusty jackal
Well he was made specifically for Nintendo
minor delta
the joke of the kamek conversation when kamella exists as the closest thing theyve ever made to a Boss Magikoopa
lusty jackal
It's not like Waluigi is a surprise guest character
outer bloom
no no it’s not what i meant
but it’s cool to think about how he was only created to be warios partner and luigi’s rival
you know
i guess the same could be said about wario but waluigi was created for a tennis game
leaden hemlock
rereading kamella's article
i guess they just wanted a boss magikoopa to go with the boss piranha plant and boss blooper
leaden hemlock
oh yeah I guess
minor delta
trying to remember if SMG1 has any others
leaden hemlock
i'm glad king lakitu doesn't exist
minor delta
i guess the mole
leaden hemlock
anymore
mighty island
super mario rpg and paper mario 1 both have a the yoshi right
Who even is "the" yoshi
Im presuming it's the one you rescue in SMW
with the house
which would mean that SM64 yoshi is the same
But is there any other like mainline games with him
mighty island
i'm recalling dialogue that implies he's a different character
or like he just met mario for the first time
"The Luma tells Mario that a Magikoopa appeared out of nowhere, trapped Yoshi inside an egg, and encased it in a magical forcefield"
that's cool
toxic halo
Im presuming it's the one you rescue in SMW
this is correct
The one in 64 and Odyssey is at the very least the same one.
Maaaaybe the standard green one on NSMBWii and/or NSMBU
as for RPGs, he appears in Mario RPG
I believe the one in Color Splash is supposed to be him too?
can't remember off the top of my head
he's also likely the Yoshi in Topsy Turvy
mighty island
also i kinda like the idea that Galaxy 2 Yoshi and Odyssey Yoshi are the same but not the same as 64/smw
assuming my memory is correct and galaxy 2 yoshi implies he doesnt know mario
i may be wrong
mighty island
it also sucks and I hate it
lol the only thing i know about topsy turvy is
i went to gamestop as a kid with my mom and went to the gba games
and i wanted to buy "mario and luigi superstar saga" without knowing anything about it
and the guy running the counter was like
"ma'am this game has too much reading, it's for bigger kids. you should get him yoshi's topsy turvy instead"
and my mom was so insulted he implied her son was stupid so she made a fuss and bought me mario & luigi anyway
so i never actually played or seen footage of yoshi's topsy turvy
toxic halo
guess there's no indication
toxic halo
so i never actually played or seen footage of yoshi's topsy turvy
good
mighty island
maybe i was weirded out by how unfriendly the dialogue is
i am weirded out that way about pauline's dialogue in mario odyssey
galaxy and odyssey have dialogue that's unnaturally just straight to the point
though odyssey has bowser call mario "plumber boy" and that's bad ass
so its kind of inconsistent
mighty island
i am weirded out that way about pauline's dialogue in mario odyssey
(dialogue in question)
lament rain
her city is kinda under attack
mighty island
it just comes off as dry
minor delta
it doesnt read in the animation because Lol mario game but
i take this as mario like
tapping her shoulder as she's looking at her city
and she doesnt actually turn around to see its you or anything
shes just saying it because she thinks you're some guy
iirc she realizes it's you further into new donk's storyline
mighty island
i honestly don't think it's intentionally supposed to be that she doesn't recognize you - i'm pretty sure later on she just starts calling you mario, there's no like "oh, it was you!"
I like your interpretation though that's cute
i feel like if i were to write it though since there's no unique animation or anything
i'd just have her say "Mario!" before saying "I'm sorry, can't talk"
lol
toxic halo
Even if she did know it was Mario, it's not too big of a stretch to assume she was too stressed & preoccupied with figuring out what to do than to acknowledge that.
It was a bit weird though
And she does see Mario fairly frequently in the Mario vs DK games, so it's not like some big reunion after several years or anything
mighty island
And she does see Mario fairly frequently in the Mario vs DK games, so it's not l...
that's why i'd be satisfied if she just said his name
toxic halo
new headcanon: Pauline didn't want to talk because she thought he wanted to talk about the Mario Toy Company while her city was in the middle of a crisis
mighty island
this isn't coming from an objective truth perspective just as like, a player, i remember seeing pauline, getting excited, talking to her and then the dialogue was dry and i was disappointed
i like that LOL makes mario seem like a douchebag though
toxic halo
"Pauline, I've got some ideas for new Mini Mario toys."
"What the frick, Mario? My city has lost power and is being attacked by a giant metal centipede abomination"
mild lotus
we may be in trouble stadians
toxic halo
The movie is straying so far away from the game continuity that I don't really care what the film does anymore.
Was pretty worried for awhile, but it's clear they're just doing their own thing and I'm all here for it
leaden hemlock
how will you feel when the new mario game references the movie
toxic halo
depends on how deep the reference is
like if they straight up use the Mario Movie map then yeah that's an issue
leaden hemlock
lol
vivid trench
I could see them using the new DK Island
toxic halo
maybe
leaden hemlock
the new dk island is gonna step on the toes of whatever epd dk is doing for sure
I don't see it remaining
vivid trench
or it could just be what they're doing
leaden hemlock
I don't think they'd share details like that
toxic halo
I'm wondering if DK's design is going to make its way outside of the movie.
Since Miyamoto put so much focus on it
leaden hemlock
especially since at the time of the movie the game wouldn't really be far along
DK redesign I would buy but not something like the island
toxic halo
yeah I agree
and DK's design is like Nakaue's design verbatim.
They should've changed Yoshi's design to be Nakaue's version as well
vivid trench
if the game isn't that far along wouldn't that be all the more reason?
vivid trench
yeah
toxic halo
isn't the game supposed to be really far along though
leaden hemlock
uh let's see
game supposedly started pre-production or production in late 2017 or plain 2018
or maybe 2019
the movie was uh
toxic halo
the movie was like 2015 or something?
toxic halo
oh right
Also it looks like the Mushroom Kingdom is just one biome so I'm thinking that they aren't gonna adapt any of that kind of stuff into the games.
Also DK Island is like as big as the Mushroom Kingdom itself (although we don't know if they're just exaggerated for the sake of the map). Which would be odd
I guess they could copy the design but just shrink it
vivid trench
the world map doesn't even look like anything to scale
minor delta
this movie is absolutely going to be marketed as "marios origin" and nintendo is going to be sharing it around heavily as though its all ideas they subscribe to and are ok with
like the real world/mushroom world thing just confirms to me that theyve been chill with it and they just havent talked about it
it just hasnt been relevant
vivid trench
then why did they make New Donk
minor delta
shrug
toxic halo
They seemingly just scrapped the idea of the OG DK though
minor delta
but its still being referenced and the other kingsoms are here
toxic halo
although I guess Mario could be like "It's you guys!" or "I fought a gorilla like this back in Brooklyn"
minor delta
og donkey kong was also cranky so we yave no idea ehats goin on woth that
i still bet itll be cranky coming from the mushroom world with the bros in their old colors
leaden hemlock
i think whether or not nintendo will borrow from the movie will depend entirely on who is making what mario game
leaden hemlock
i don't know if the rpg's will ever borrow from the movie
toxic halo
i think whether or not nintendo will borrow from the movie will depend entirely ...
yeah I think that's fair
toxic halo
cause I'm thinking... having to work with what the movie establishes will hinder the ability to do whatever you want
so a lot of devs will just ignore it
minor delta
i wiuld be surprised if any game takes from the movie because Lol but the movie is tsking from odyssey as much as any game tends to build from any other
leaden hemlock
the movie is hardly taking anything from odyssey
minor delta
its taking enough
leaden hemlock
the kingdom setup is much closer to mario 3
toxic halo
oh wait that's odd lol. The existence of Sand Kingdom and Cascade and Metro. But not being on the map
minor delta
if theres any major concept its the dichotomy of the real world/mushroom world
leaden hemlock
yeah they're just cameos
vivid trench
that's why I think the map is nonsense
toxic halo
I'm wondering if they're just gonna have different galaxies
like that all is one galaxy
minor delta
since now you have a clearcut reason for how the tour shit works
toxic halo
and New Donk is on another galaxy
minor delta
its adventures of mario 3 rules
toxic halo
they should've pulled more from that for marketing instead of Super Show
call the flying castle the "Doomship"
minor delta
yeah they're just cameos
i mean if theyre cameoing as patches as though they exist
then, I mean
toxic halo
there's also straight up Crazy Cap
vivid trench
we also got crazy caps
minor delta
even if the map is nonsense which, it prob is either way
vivid trench
yeah
minor delta
its a bunch of major faraway landmasses scrunched together
vivid trench
yeah it's like those old-timey maps from centuries ago
toxic halo
I'm very curious to see the next Mario game and see if the movie had any effect on it at all
also the DK game of course
minor delta
i think because its got as much higherup influnece as any other game, if not more, it should be treated as such
toxic halo
I'm not sure how I'd feel about DK's design changing officially. Because I adore Nakaue's DK design to heck, but it's also super different in 3D than the normal design
minor delta
the decisions so far seem at least a little bit like theyre circling back to ideas they havent had a chance to work with for a ling time and that reinforcement makes it seem like This is what they meant
vivid trench
yeah it's like those old-timey maps from centuries ago
like this
minor delta
god dam
shy bobcat
i thought that was a pie
toxic halo
oh boy what flavor
clear remnant
blueberry
outer bloom
pie pie pie !!
eternal void
How do dry bones work?
toxic halo
Koopa Troopas die. Their soul stays with their skeleton. Possibly aided by magic.
They put on gloves
outer bloom
boos
desert hare
Koopa Troopas die. Their soul stays with their skeleton. Possibly aided by magic...
Well I'm dead anyways so might as well try this new look
-dry bones
But where is wet bones
That's the real question
outer bloom
damp bones
clear remnant
But where is wet bones
toxic halo
cool thing about Fish Bones is that theybare specifically Cheep Cheep skeletons
desert hare
What's the most comprehensive and well put together map we have of the mario world
clear remnant
toxic halo
The Odyssey one is the only official one currently
scenic mango
Would you have preferred if there always was one DK, or do you still prefer the country one being a descendant?
leaden hemlock
cranky kong is funny so i like dk having descendants
desert hare
The Odyssey one is the only official one currently
Smh you forgot Mario is missing
Do we have any idea of what could be in the unexplored locations
I've seen some people saying they thing pi'illo island is next to ruined
But idk about anything else
toxic halo
well you can theorize about where a lot of locations would go, but nothing is really confirmed.
A popular idea is that the continent south of seaside might be Sarasaland.
The ones that I personally believe in are DK Island would be an island off the coast of Metro, and Dinosaur Land being off the coast of Cascade Kingdom
desert hare
Are the places Mario goes to in 64 real?
toxic halo
yes
desert hare
Source???!1!1!?1
toxic halo
Whomp's Fortress returns in Super Mario Galaxy 2
toxic halo
in Galaxy at least
it's a floating island anyway, so who knows if it's always been there, or if it was floating in a different area
desert hare
Do you think the fact that they're floating means anything
The mario odyssey kingdoms float too but they're clearly part of a greater area
As seen on the world map
@toxic halo ?
toxic halo
Whomp's Fortress is floating, but idk about the other areas in SM64. I'd assume most of them are actually connected to a larger area, like the Odyssey ones.
desert hare
Hmm okay fair
Is the mario world connected to DK and Banjo-Kazooie
I know donkey kong is a part of it but to what extent
Is it connected to Banjo-Kazooie? Is it connected to Conker?
I saw a YT video once about where Banjo-Kazooie would be in the DK world
But where would it be on the mario odyssey map
clear remnant
mario world is the same as dk world
this is subtly hinted at in the game Donkey Kong, where Mario fights Donkey Kong
toxic halo
talked about this a little bit in #mario-spinoffs yesterday.
But the gist is:
Nintendo and Rare have never made an official statement as to whether DK and Banjo share worlds or not, so if that's your basis, it can go either way. However,
Diddy Kong Racing DS removes Banjo and Conker due to licensing issues.
And furthermore, Gregg Mayles, who used to work for Rare, has said recently that they do not share a universe.
It may have been the intention for them to share a universe initially, but I don't think they do anymore.
On Banjo's side, they've referenced Diddy Kong Racing in Nuts and Bolts, meaning some form of Diddy and DK exist in Banjo's world.
But on the Mario/DK side, Banjo is no longer a part of it.
Conker is an even trickier case. Banjo's world already doesn't fit that well into the world of DK and Mario, but Conker is massively different. Being a digusting, gory world with its own rules that even Banjo doesn't even follow.
--
So in other words, you can believe they share a world if you want, but imo it's clear that they're not. I can't prove it, but I'm going off of Diddy Kong Racing DS, Gregg Mayles' statement, and the contradictions that exist between each game's worlds.
mild lotus
but the smash trailer
toxic halo
Smash itself is its own continuity that exists in the imagination of a child's head.
The trailer is also a meta reference, so it doesn't necessarily mean anything.
If Nintendo ever shows them interacting in a game like Mario Kart or a remake of Diddy Kong Racing, then I'd see it as a hint that they're the same world. But as for now it's just a meta reference to me
mild lotus
not fun
desert hare
But remember Da Dude, Diddy Kong Racing DS still has Tiptup in it
That's a joke btw it doesn't prove anything
desert hare
talked about this a little bit in <#730453671263076403> yesterday.
But the gist...
So you're saying it's probably either a one sided deal or a no sided deal
toxic halo
my internet just died sorry
yes, I think it's one-sided from Banjo's side. And that the implied connection has been severed on DK's side
I'm also biased because I don't like their worlds being conencted
and I think Tiptup could just exist in both worlds
honestly Diddy Kong Racing as a whole is a big mess. Because on DK's side, they're probably never gonna use those characters ever again, unless they do something with Diddy Kong Racing again. Because Rare owns all of the characters aside from Diddy and Krunch
desert hare
I'm also biased because I don't like their worlds being conencted
Yeah but it's the most logical too
toxic halo
The tiger and the mouse and the clock?
yep, every single one
desert hare
Yeah but it's the most logical too
Because Rare is owned by Microsoft now
toxic halo
the only reason they own Krunch is because he's a Kremling
desert hare
Do you also think it's possible that Yooka-Laylee has a one way connection with BK
I have little to no proof for this but I'd like to imagine it does
toxic halo
I know DK Vine thinks Yooka Laylee is part of the DKU (their belief of a shared DK & Rare Universe).
But I'm not sure exactly how they would be linked? I'd have to look into it.
desert hare
I don't know if there's any real evidence
All I know is there's a bunch of books in Yooka-Laylee with a Conker quote on them
toxic halo
The only thing I can think of is a reference to Conker inside Hivory Towers
yeah that
which is just a reference
minor delta
they were going to try to have banjo and kazooie cameo in person, iirc
desert hare
And there's a bird character that has the same colours as kazooie
toxic halo
they were going to try to have banjo and kazooie cameo in person, iirc
that would've been cool
hope they're able to do that in a future Yooka Laylee game
desert hare
For now this is all we have
desert hare
hope they're able to do that in a future Yooka Laylee game
Tooka-Laylee or maybe even Yooka-Laythree
obtuse grove
Yookalaylee isnt made by Rare anyway
leaden hemlock
general mario lore
desert hare
Yes
leaden hemlock
realistically nintendo would do both have dk and mario in the same world and have dk and mario in separate universes
they wouldn't care to keep the story straight as long as both of them feel like different series anyway
leaden hemlock
realistically nintendo would do both have dk and mario in the same world and hav...
depending on the game
toxic halo
what if Banjo Kazooie is just a video game universe inside DK's world and he comes out of it for Diddy Kong Racing?
Oh wait this isn't #1029062121352343613
desert hare
Well there's a difference between headcanon and theory
Wait the bird has a name
Oh yeah I forgot
Kabloomie
Guys this is definitive proof!1!1!!1!!!
Kabloomie = kazooies child confirmed!!!!!
clear remnant
Kazooie and Gruntilda finally tied the knot
obtuse grove
realistically nintendo would do both have dk and mario in the same world and hav...
That’s kinda how I view it
Not every game has to be in different locations of the same world
But they’re all based on the same world
Like, the timeline doesn’t matter at all unless it’s a sequel
Every game is just something that could happen
obtuse grove
Cranky Kong came from outside the Mushroom World too right?
leaden hemlock
uh depends
going off of odyssey the logical thing is that mario and cranky are from new donk
the specifics of mario and cranky's origins may change depending on the game
mario doesn't exist in dkc so it's not important there
toxic halo
Cranky Kong came from outside the Mushroom World too right?
Cranky and all the kongs would come from DK Island, which is most definitely on Mario's planet.
obtuse grove
Really? I thought there are Mario items in Cranky’s place
leaden hemlock
what game
vivid trench
those are just cameos
vivid trench
like mario and yoshi at the end of the game
leaden hemlock
is that a poster of a killer instinct character
vivid trench
yeah
obtuse grove
Cameos can still be "real"
obtuse grove
I forgot which game it is
vivid trench
yeah but link is also there
leaden hemlock
uh definitely not for what the developers intend to be interpreted as part of the world
vivid trench
so it's definitely not of the world
leaden hemlock
which is the point of this channel
toxic halo
It's Cranky's museum of video game heroes. He's not physically there
leaden hemlock
what the developers intend is lore for a specific game
obtuse grove
Killer Instinct can just be a game within DKC
I’m not saying every reference is real
But I think the Nintendo ones are
Cuz we’ve seen Mario meet DK
Why would DKC alone be excluded?
leaden hemlock
Cuz we’ve seen Mario meet DK
that's the thing about dkc2
as far as dkc2 is concerned mario never met (modern) dk
so he might as well be an old man like cranky is
obtuse grove
Mario vs Donkey Kong? Any sports game?
toxic halo
by the point of DKC2 they'd never met
clear remnant
did mvdk even exist when dkc2 was released
obtuse grove
Sure, I can see that
leaden hemlock
by the point of dkc2's existence the story was that they never met
clear remnant
not counting dk94
obtuse grove
I get what you mean now
clear remnant
it did not exist for several years.
obtuse grove
Well I think Mario met modern DK for the first time in MvDK
toxic halo
the extent of Mario in DKC was just Cranky being the og Donkey Kong and referencing the event occasionally
obtuse grove
I’m not sure but sometimes it feels like Nintendo considers 1981 Donkey Kong and 1994 Donkey Kong to be the same character
Like recently they don’t really care that Cranky was intended as a reference. But maybe I’m wrong
toxic halo
they definitely do at times, but they also make it clear that they don't actually in others. So Cranky is still officially the original, but it gets ignored in certain instances
leaden hemlock
sometimes they practically do
but generally speaking cranky is intended to be seen as the arcade dk
yeah
toxic halo
the whole video game heroes thing was scrapped too. Cranky doesn't make 4th wall breaks about video games anymore. Instead he just makes witty remarks, references, and occasionally takes jabs at video game logic (without mentioning they're in a video game of course). Probably to make it feel more like a lived in world.
It was a very Rareware thing to do to reference being inside of a game, and it's something they still did with Nuts and Bolts and that short Conker demo thing.
toxic halo
which is one of the main reasons I don't feel they really fit in DK's world anymore.
Banjo is very explicitly in a video game. The whole plot of Nuts and Bolts is that they let themselves go after not having a game in forever, and video game god transports them to another world.
and around the same time Banjo had a handful of cameo appearances in random series spin-offs. Almost as if he was being placed into different video game worlds by L.O.G. (The video game god I mentioned)
toxic halo
some random stuff that I hadn't heard of until recently
lemme go find it
some sports indie game I think. I can't find it
desert hare
What?
obtuse grove
Banjo-Kazooie had easter eggs
eternal void
How does bowser grow to the size of a building
clear remnant
Adrenaline
obtuse grove
How does bowser grow to the size of a building
Usually dark magic
Power Stars/Grand Stars let him grow too
clear remnant
mario and luigi hit the Adrenaline Spheres and that’s how bowser bowsbiggens
toxic halo
Either magic or yeah, the adrenaline stuff
I'd like to think that Kamek's magic activates that adrenaline and causes a response
since on his own he can't grow to that size without the bros inside him
In Galaxy 2 he ate a Grand Star
If you're referring to the sporadic size changes in games like Mario Odyssey, I don't know if that's supposed to actually be happening, or if that's for Gameplay.
could be the adrenaline stuff on a smaller level
leaden hemlock
this isn't the headcanon thread
shy bobcat
Power Stars/Grand Stars let him grow too
how do power stars even work
magic power i would presume
lusty jackal
Nano machines. Duh
toxic halo
how do power stars even work
honestly idk. They're power sources but that's basically all we know
other than them being transformed Lumas, and being able to take different shapes like moons and presumably shines
obtuse grove
how do power stars even work
Same way irl stars are a source of energy
desert hare
honestly idk. They're power sources but that's basically all we know
This reminds me of the underground part of metro kingdom
Where you could just see the juice getting sucked out of the moons and feel the pain of never being able to get them
desert hare
Hey wait a second
So you know how hint toad has a map of bob-omb battlefield
It's the same as the in-game maps that are made by the crazy cap
So does that mean the crazy cap people went to bob-omb battlefield
buoyant turtle
yeah probably
desert hare
awesome
meager dragon
obtuse grove
Been missing ever since
thick peak
does anyone know where this originally came from?
minor delta
wasnt it a cybershell or simpleflips video
its not Real like the whole premise of the joke is that its like
a fake room someoej tells you about on the playgrouns
toxic halo
classic image
vivid trench
no it isn't he just jokingly took credit for it
because oneyplays doesn't have original jokes
it's like saying he invented wario apparition
raven void
you can say that and maybe its true but like
i distinctly remember him talking about how he made it
and he pretended it was real for the bit at the time of when he first made it
In any case it would be a bit tainted in my mind
vivid trench
I just don't believe him and don't see anything about him on the documentation for it
yeah it predates him pretending to have made it up
like I said he has no original jokes
raven void
am i coming off as if i am defending him....?
vivid trench
no
I'm just saying he's the kind of person who takes memes and does barely anything transformative with them even though he's heavily associated with them
and this is just another case of that
regal pagoda
So uh usually lore stuff isnt for me but I do have some questions. Was Mario ever considered the last of anything like Superman is supposedly the last kryptonian?
vivid trench
humans are pretty elusive in the mushroom kingdom so that could just be inferred at some point
him surviving a drive-by as an unborn fetus is also kind of like superman's origin
but as far as literally being the last of his kind with some exceptions it's not really a thing
toxic halo
Yeah there are loads of humans in Mario's world, we just don't see them in the Mushroom Kingdom often.
Unless Bowser or some plague killed them, there are at least 2 human villages in the Mushroom Kingdom.
I guess they all could've moved like Mario did, but who knows
trim monolith
Okay so I have a question about Galaxy. This may seem dumb, but Rosalina is the girl in the storybook right?
clear remnant
Yeah
obtuse grove
Mario is the last person with an M on his head
runic raptor
Yeah there are loads of humans in Mario's world, we just don't see them in the M...
We're reassured that New Donk City has a lot of humans, at least
leaden hemlock
there is no mushroom king or queen in mario
buoyant turtle
there is a mushroom king in Mario but he's never been seen
leaden hemlock
i don't even know what game you're referring to
but the current story is that there's no king or queen besides peach
buoyant turtle
the current story is that Peach is the daughter of the Mushroom King
whether he's dead, alive, absent or whatever doesn't change that fact
leaden hemlock
idk you're talking about a character that nintendo never mentions or lets anyone mention on purpose
obviously that character just doesn't exist anymore in all practicality
buoyant turtle
Im talking about a character that Nintendo has mentioned
which is enough
sure you might think he doesnt matter, or that he doesnt do anything practical, or that Nintendo will never use the character or mention him again
none of that changes that Peach is the daughter of the Mushroom King
leaden hemlock
sure enough
buoyant turtle
until Nintendo shows something else, which they probably wont since why would they bother
leaden hemlock
all i get about the mushroom king is some shitty comics character and a mention in a blurb from nintendo of america
lol...
desert hare
there is no mushroom king or queen in mario
If there's no king or queen why is peach a princess
Sure it could be a fake title
But the mushroom king is an existing character as far as I know
leaden hemlock
If there's no king or queen why is peach a princess
because super mario bros is inspired by fairytales
if nintendo wants to they can make peach be a princess without having a dad that's a king
clear remnant
Peach is like Bowser, her closest thing to a parental figure at least of current is her advisor Toadsworth
toxic halo
I think the Mushroom King is like definitively dead
I feel like he would've at least been mentioned in Partners in Time or something. I think Peach's Parents died while she was really young
vagrant siren
Why is NOBODY talking about how the cast of mario party 2 are gods who can shape worlds to their whim?
vivid trench
because nobody likes the idea of mario characters being anything more than regular people
leaden hemlock
i just realized this is aster posting this
greetings how are you enjoying the general mario lore thread
toxic halo
Why is NOBODY talking about how the cast of mario party 2 are gods who can shape...
Me when Universal Studios teams up with Nintendo to make a new world (Super Nintendo World)
obtuse grove
because nobody likes the idea of mario characters being anything more than regul...
Mario has never been a normal person
However, a god can be a normal person too
So it should be fine either way
That line in Mario Party 2 is probably just a fancy way of saying Mario and friends made a cool amusement park
Fits with how the platformers call each group of levels a "World" despite being another part of the planet
toxic halo
That line in Mario Party 2 is probably just a fancy way of saying Mario and frie...
it is, lol. I think they were just making a joke
vagrant siren
greetings how are you enjoying the general mario lore thread
sometimes i pop in to raise the questions everyone else is too afraid to ask
gotta keep yall on your toes
leaden hemlock
keep it up
vagrant siren
can do!
brazen badger
It's strange how nobody brings up Mario Galaxy's ending
Because it explains why Mario odyssey's kingdoms are so diverse
Another good thing to bring up is the Multiple Luigi Conspiracy
modest pollen
It's strange how nobody brings up Mario Galaxy's ending
Galaxy resets to ~the time it started but with minor differences to create Galaxy 2
modest pollen
Because it explains why Mario odyssey's kingdoms are so diverse
I don't understand how but I woke up like literally 10 minutes ago so
modest pollen
Another good thing to bring up is the Multiple Luigi Conspiracy
Could you elaborate more?
toxic halo
A lot of people seem to think Mario Galaxy's ending means a bunch of crazy things, but yeah, it really just erases Galaxy 1 and has Galaxy 2 occur in its place.
clear remnant
omg this is just like sonic the hedgehog 2006
toxic halo
except in this case Mario, Rosalina, and the Lumas remember
possibly Peach and Bowser too but I think that's unlikely
We know that Captain Toad forgot at least.
north marlin
Wait so like birdo is a species right
And as we know Birdo is trans
So are all birdo trans or just the one pink (main) one specifically?
leaden hemlock
nintendo doesn't even consider birdo to be trans anymore
but i guess it would be the former
obtuse grove
Hi
north marlin
Yo
north marlin
but i guess it would be the former
If we’re going by the “nintendo doesn’t even consider her to be trans” I guess that makes sense
eternal void
If dark bowser from mario and luigi bowsers inside story has all the DNA of bowser, does that mean bowser can shoot a sphere of destruction out of his mouth
toxic halo
Birdo is a species, yes.
And this is more head-canon than actual lore, but here's my belief.
Just like Yoshi, Birdo is likely asexual.
Without makeup, perhaps Birdos were seen as masculine creatures, just like how we look at Yoshi as a guy. But Birdos feel feminine and present as such. They feel like women, thus they are women.
I'd assume Yoshis just don't care if they're called guys or girls or neither.
Of course there's a lot of confusing things when you think about it on a deeper level. I really don't think the developers intended for my headcanon, and they certainly didn't intend it when they created the character. And it's probably best if they just continue to ignore all that and call her a woman, like she deserves.
Personally I'd like it if there were male-presenting Birdos out there as well. Both because they look cool without makeup, but because it would make more sense to explain her situation.
Although it's probably for the best if they don't address that any further.
toxic halo
If dark bowser from mario and luigi bowsers inside story has all the DNA of bows...
I'd assume that's a dark star thing
leaden hemlock
something tells me nintendo is phasing out birdo being a species
they haven't done it in a while
besides mario kart tour
probably just mario strikers though
minor delta
thats a pretty damning contradiction
i also feel like its hard to fully say theyre phasing out birdo being trans
i think its more they dont talk aboutnit
otherwise why would there still be problems in localization
leaden hemlock
i haven't seen any references about birdo being trans outside of captain rainbow
wasn't that done for a cruel joke anyway
leaden hemlock
well it'd make sense for them not to bring it up again for that reason
minor delta
its like capcom outright saying poison is trans
she still is. thry just dont talk about it bwcause they havent treated rhe character witj respect
toxic halo
i haven't seen any references about birdo being trans outside of captain rainbow
Super Mario Party in Europe
calls her a him
minor delta
ugly game
toxic halo
The American version is the same but they say "She"
apparently the Japanese version skirts around it and doesn't state her gender at all
vivid trench
that's because in Japan you aren't really meant to use gendered third-person pronouns
north marlin
Birdo is a species, yes.
And this is more head-canon than actual lore, but here...
Yeah would be cool if there were both male and female, would make it more diverse
clear remnant
We should like destroy europe i think
toxic halo
true
and then we can change those Mario Kart courses to Void Promenade, Void Loop, Void Byways, and Void Drift
lament rain
its insane they just left the misgendering in both that and mario tennis aces
its gross
and like, very blatantly the product of some transphobe in the NoE localization team
clear remnant
Yeah
Something something “companies are fine with characters being explicitly queer actually it’s only a problem if their queerness is not the butt of a joke”
obtuse grove
Yeah bruh
leaden hemlock
the answer is they don't exist in universe
toxic halo
they do, they're there
leaden hemlock
they're a game play mechanic
toxic halo
yes but they're there
leaden hemlock
yeah it's like regular coins in mario they're just all over
fossil topaz
Do they know that star coins unlock 9 extra levels?
toxic halo
this is referring to Star Coins btw, for any bystanders
leaden hemlock
maybe they do
maybe they don't
but they don't in the original new super mario bros
toxic halo
All I'd say is that they exist. Idk if we can really judge anything more than that
leaden hemlock
star coins exist only for sick wallpapers
fossil topaz
I get it in NSMB beacuse there are signs showing the bros that you need them
toxic halo
In NSMBWii you spend star coins for hints and cool videos at Peach's Castle.
You could maybe argue in-universe Toad is just giving you advice in exchange for the star coins.
But it's really impossible to say what they do with them or if they really even need them for anything.
fossil topaz
Then again, everyone seems to react positively when there's a message saying that you collected everything in a specific world
toxic halo
that's a gameplay thing
I don't think there's a booming voice that says "you got all the star coins in world 2"
in fact the world map as a whole is just a gameplay thing.
In universe they'd just walk from one level to another.
fossil topaz
in fact the world map as a whole is just a gameplay thing.
In universe they'd ju...
Ohh
The other theory I guess
Every time there's an SMB3 Port
They're updating the story
Visually
For new and old audiences
toxic halo
in-universe SMB2 was more than just a dream. Subcon actually exists as a dream world and Wart invaded and took over. Mario & Co save it in their dream, but the manual and title screen explain this.
And in BS SMBUSA (satellaview sequel), they go there without dreaming
north bobcat
this may be a stupid question but SMB3 “happened” right? like it’s meant to be a stage play but that doesn’t mean it’s a fictional story in-universe. i’d assume it’s just a retelling of that adventure.
lusty jackal
I'm pretty sure on a conventional level the whole stage play theme is just how the game is presented
And not it Literally being a fake stage play that doesn't happen because it's a play
vivid trench
there's no meaningful continuity in mario so it didn't happen anymore than any other game
lusty jackal
Yeah
toxic halo
this may be a stupid question but SMB3 “happened” right? like it’s meant to be a...
yes it happened
SMW is a direct sequel and calls back to it in the manual, as well as having the ghost ship.
The stage play is just the framing device
north bobcat
i figured as much, good to know that's the consensus lol
austere olive
ok guys. ive decided to make my own mario timeline based on only CANON details weve been given. this is what i have so far
toxic halo
The one issue here is that Lost Levels takes place in a parallel world, but there's no indication of whether it's an alternate timeline, or just a sequel that has Bowser kidnapping Peach and bringing her to another world.
I always interpreted it as the latter considering Blue Bowser's existence.
austere olive
i always assumed it was the former
toxic halo
That's a fair interpretation.
I think future games might reference the game, but probably not to the extent that it means alternate timeline/universe is impossible.
I don't think Nintendo themselves really care. Unless Blue Bowser returns for some reason
clear remnant
The former is more likely. Occam’s razor
austere olive
expanded
toxic halo
will there be more Woolly World splits?
austere olive
probably not, every game follows the same possible path besides the very start where a different color yoshi survives kamek's onslaught
plucky reef
What about the custom Yoshi’s?
eternal void
So what is up with the transformative caps in sm64ds
leaden hemlock
they just exist
toxic halo
yeah
I can't think of any speculation or headcanon or anything. I don't think the manual even has an explanation. They're just there.
If they ever remade SM64 with the DS content, I'd prefer if they remove caps entirely and just let you switch characters during level start
vivid trench
why do the caps work for the playable characters but not for the enemies
shy bobcat
why do the caps work for the playable characters but not for the enemies
they’re not trying
naive tendon
why do the caps work for the playable characters but not for the enemies
could be similar to the Super Crown
or they could have some connection to each other, they act very similar but the transformation caps transform you entirely into a specific character, unlike the Super Crown which changes your appearance to look more like Peach while having elements of Toadette
both only work on specific characters and not enemies, meaning they're probably made by someone for said intended purpose, rather than most items being part of the world
vagrant siren
the woods in warios woods are a lot like the mystery flesh pit if u think about it
vivid trench
i'd rather not
clear remnant
i would
north marlin
the woods in warios woods are a lot like the mystery flesh pit if u think about ...
Please elaborate
I need to know
vagrant siren
scary
leaden hemlock
that's what makes the woods in wario's woods so terrifying
you know not in which way, shape, or form they're resemblant of the mystery flesh pit
you just know they are
raven void
the mystery flersh pit
runic raptor
Do I even wanna know what a Mystery Flesh Pit is
buoyant turtle
It’s a horror story/worldbuilding project you can find online
Completely unrelated to Mario
clear remnant
But integral to the lore of wario’s woods
vagrant siren
essential for warios woods lore
thin hatch
you know not in which way, shape, or form they're resemblant of the mystery fles...
are there like aphrodisac pools
vagrant siren
no but u can match 5 monsters/bombs in a row to make a diamond that when matched with at least 2 other monsters/bombs of that color will clear the board of all monsters of that color (but not bombs so watch out!)
inland rose
Isn't Paper Mario a separate person from Regular Mario?
toxic halo
yes and no
They're treated as if they're the same. And the Paper Mario series acts as if all the normal Mario games happened to Paper Mario.
But Paper Jam shows that Paper Mario is from a Parallel World
However anything that applies to Paper Mario can usually apply to real Mario and vice versa.
They have the same personalities, likely the same experiences, and the only big difference is that one lives in a paper world.
vivid trench
it just means that paper mario is only separate in the context of pointing out the series as separate from others
to which end M&L mario could be separate from mainline mario, or mario kart mario, and so on
actually it's also like dr. mario
inland rose
However anything that applies to Paper Mario can usually apply to real Mario and...
another difference is that one of them is mute
toxic halo
well Paper Mario isn't mute
inland rose
oh yea
toxic halo
there are implications of him talking in all the games
inland rose
like any other paper mario game
you can pick responses to speak when interacting with others
it's just that there's no speech bubble.
lusty jackal
The way I see it
Paper Mario 64 is just supposed to be another rpg in the Mario universe
Just presented in a storybook style
Because it's. Literally Mario rpg 2
And then ttyd comes in as paper Mario 2 with a plot and world that still seems plausible as a story in the regular Mario world with some additional paper flourishes in some funny game mechanics and visual effects
At this point it's still capable of being a Regular Mario story
Super paper Mario doesn't outright state it but I think that's the separating point
Everything following is "Paper Mario" and not "Mario but in a storybook" if that makes sense
north marlin
As a non italian I can confirm thats the best italian accent I’ve ever seen
north marlin
What’d he do
lusty jackal
She hates Waluigi and Waluigi is naturally prone to getting beat up
clear remnant
is this canon
Yeah
obtuse grove
Excellent
devout nova
Re: Paper Mario being its own universe, yeah I think the newer games' plots pretty clearly wouldn't work out of the paper context
I generally prefer M&L and it's a big part of how I view the Mario universe, so the whole book thing in Paper Jam is part of that for me
toxic halo
I think Sticker Star and Origami King would work fine in the real world.
Color Splash with paint being a lifeblood is where things get odd
certain events like Toads being crumpled and shoved into cabinets could only happen in the Paper World. And "things" are definitely a paper-world exclusive thing as well.
plucky reef
So is Mario galaxy 2 a separate story from the og galaxy
shy bobcat
Since galaxy 1 ||reset the universe|| and everything yeah I'd guess so
stray shuttle
Oh I read that one. I still have it.
stray shuttle
Since galaxy 1 ||reset the universe|| and everything yeah I'd guess so
Oh that was a spoiler. I should start keeping it blanked just so then when I finally get to that part I can unfold that.
stray shuttle
What my man’s Luigi do to deserve this bruh.
toxic halo
Since galaxy 1 ||reset the universe|| and everything yeah I'd guess so
yeah Galaxy 2 happens in Galaxy 1's place.
The universe reset in SMG1 puts everyone back to before the events of the game. Galaxy 2 happens instead.
toxic halo
yes
We know definitively that Mario & Rosalina remember
it's uncertain if Peach or Bowser remember but I'd assume they don't because they weren't there for Rosalina's Astral Projection moment
All we know is that Honey Queen and the members of the Toad Brigade don't remember.
The Toad Brigade forms "for the first time" in Galaxy 2.
outer bloom
so mario lives his entire life knowing that the universe reset and his loved ones and also enemies remember little to mostly nothing of the events prior to the universe starting from galaxy 1 to it resetting ? its the way i have always interpreted it
toxic halo
yeah
Maybe he explained the situation to everyone else but they thought he was making it up
that would be funny
outer bloom
luigi would believe him
vestal panther
“Luigi the universe reset and I had to rescue you multiple times on different planets”
outer bloom
canon
shy bobcat
he's been through enough to know this is 100% likely to happen
outer bloom
not to mention luigi can save himself in galaxy i think he’d definitely believe it
eternal void
In mario and luigi: bowsers inside story, peach uses "heart power" to beat bowser, why doesn't she do this all the time
I mean she can at least weaken bowser with this
toxic halo
I believe it's called Wish Power
Her wish power alone doesn't beat Bowser, it's her wish power + Starlow's star power.
She and Starlow combine their power again in Dream Team when they zap Bowser and shatter the Dream Stone.
I don't think Peach's wish power on its own can really do anything.
Other than I'd assume that's what she uses to heal people in Mario RPG
leaden hemlock
there's a headcanon thread for this
subtle fiber
regal pagoda
They just asked about where to talk about ordering games so I just said here
I thought that was fine here
The line between this and the headcanon thread is in reality, very thin
;)
leaden hemlock
this thread should be dedicated to subtext in official mario media
which timelines don't really fit in
like I think it would be cool to discuss the deeper intentions that something in mario actually has you know
toxic halo
there's a headcanon thread for this
thought you were talking about my wish power statement and I was like "bruh, that's literally in the RPGs" lol
leaden hemlock
the ones that are known to be near peach's castle
i think the answer to this depends on the game
so just name a game and we'll tell you
vivid trench
i think everywhere is the mushroom kingdom unless stated otherwise
leaden hemlock
well that's also a fair answer