Just a spot to talk about lore between the Star Traders games, and Templar Battleforce, in general.
Also apparently there's no posts with the lore tag, so I'm fixing that now.
#General Star Trader Lore Discussion
hexed cosmos
Steel Song is objectively superior to Cadar. Its true, my crew member said I can't be wrong.
General Star Trader Lore Discussion
vale anvil
Objectively superior in perhaps melee combat.
mighty mirage
Steel Song does have a more colorful flag, and melee combat
hexed cosmos
But look he says it here
vale anvil
Lemme put it this way. You'll get zero.
Cadar. Ultramarines
Steel song. Blood angels
brazen ledge
Aren't the Steel Song the closest thing we have to Team Slytherin in the Star Traders Universe?
hexed cosmos
Jokes aside...
Fine I'll say that Cadar navy is probably better than Steel Song.
mighty mirage
Alta Mesa ships still outmatch Cadar ships
brazen ledge
At range 5, certainly. Cadar has that Cadonya torpedo launcher in STF, as I recall, and the critical strike torpedo talent in ST4X.
hexed cosmos
But while I'm a zealous Steel Song Fanatic, I in general am on the side of the Great Houses as a whole, so I still call Alta Mesa the best in ship warfare
They at least have the best ships, and some of the best pilots.
mighty mirage
Alta Mesa is a Clan though, not really a Great House, no?
hexed cosmos
The Clans are under the Great Houses.
vale anvil
As i said. Cadar is for all intents the stf equivalent of the ultramarines from 40k
They are mediocre at everything
hexed cosmos
After 4x, there was no distinction between the Clans and Houses anymore.
vale anvil
Which makes them such a powerhouse.
brazen ledge
Great Houses. Space Feudalism. Thulun is great if you're last name is Thulun, if it isn't you're a serf. Give me syndicates any day..
Of the three syndicates, Cadar are militaristic , Rychart are Shelgeroth. So I'll take De Valtos.
vale anvil
I'd take DV for just their ability to literally sell biomass for more then 40x it's buy price
mighty mirage
Great Houses. Space Feudalism. Thulun is great if you're last name is Thulun, if...
I see someone isn't willing to let go of Tarquin here
hexed cosmos
Cohorts... a system where you have unreasonably high expectations put on you at all times and you are expected to excel at everything you do in order to one-up and better everyone else.
mighty mirage
Personally like the Alta Mesa flag design as well
brazen ledge
Well, remember out templar contact in STF? The guy who killed the Jyeeta shriver? He still thinks all Rychart is a Shelgeroth front, and he always has the "hates Rychart" trait.
vale anvil
Cohorts... a system where you have unreasonably high expectations put on you at ...
Being a star trader in a nutshell or you are dead so....
hexed cosmos
I prefer the simplicity of the Houses. While Castes are not great, they do allow for social maneuvering in the Houses unlike real caste systems so they're not set in stone
hexed cosmos
Being a star trader in a nutshell or you are dead so....
Okay being a Star Trader I chose that life.
brazen ledge
Cohorts... a system where you have unreasonably high expectations put on you at ...
So excel. Problem solved.
Don't like it. No worries, I'm sure Javat will have a place for you mining on some asteroid in the back end of beyond.
Me, I prefer the independents if they were at all a workable faction.
vale anvil
It's actually not that bad
Mining for javat
Till a Xeno grabs your leg from a long nap
Then you are quickly a slurpie
So aside from THAAAT
It's not so bad
mighty mirage
Eh, usually don't see too many Xeno
hexed cosmos
I think a Javat miner might see more than they want
vale anvil
There is a reason Javat's exo scouts get a bonus
hexed cosmos
They're probably more liable to go out and mine uninhabited planets and exploit their resources.
vale anvil
Yup
hexed cosmos
Which may have Xeno on them
vale anvil
"Do"
hexed cosmos
May.
You don't tell them the Xeno are there until they're already on the planet.
brazen ledge
In my current STF playthrough, mining colonies don't generate tons of valuable cargo.
You can either get down and dirty digging in the mines and sell it to De Valtos for a pittance, or you can be De Valtos and sell it onward, live life wealthy on the sweat of other people. De Valtos: The capitalist faction.
vale anvil
*May*.
You don't tell them the Xeno are there until they're already on the plane...
True
hexed cosmos
Because they can't back out once they're on the planet mining
Not until the job is done
brazen ledge
Javat in a nutshell.
hexed cosmos
Javat is just my Fortress on Dwarf Fortress.
hexed cosmos
Did I really need to mine the funny cluster of blue metals? No not really. Was it worth the ensuing chaos?
According to the King. Yes.
The bottom miner is every other house. The top one is a Javat Miner who won't stop
brazen ledge
So aside from finding xeno, do the artifacts do anything else to them even absent Xeno? Mind-blast them into cultists? Drive them insane? TURN Them into Xeno?
As I recall, in Star Traders Classic having artifacts on your ship would result in a decrease in your crew count and an increase on the xeno count in certain xeno encounters ...
hexed cosmos
It does increase xeno encounters still
vale anvil
By a non trivial amount btw
hexed cosmos
But other than that, I don't think it does anything in game.
In lore, I don't even think they actually do anything but its more a pyschological problem of carrying the things.
vale anvil
I mean... let's be real.
hexed cosmos
Everyone is raised to despise the xeno, and their artifacts are seen as dangerous. Spacers are especially superstitious usually, and Gravs aren't an exception really but probably still less so than the Spacers.
Not even just raised to despise them. You would despise them as soon as you come across one of their ships.
Unless you're a cultist.
vale anvil
Would YOU wanna be the guy who's hauling a possibly 4-5 feet tall "dead" thing that can melt steel with just it's claws touching it ?
hexed cosmos
Not particularly, no. But that's why I give it to the crew dog.
vale anvil
But in general do you even want that thing IN your cargo hold ?
hexed cosmos
Especially the crew dog that had a bad day and was arguing with someone earlier that week.
vale anvil
Probably not
hexed cosmos
By a non trivial amount btw
How much is it actually?
vale anvil
Think it's around 0.1-0.2%
Not 1000% sure
You notice
At 50 artifacts and above. You notice
brazen ledge
Just double checked
https://startradersrpg.proboards.com/thread/13005/star-traders-elite-manual-updated
at
https://www.mediafire.com/download/58y735a53b7scac/Star_Traders_RPG_Elite_Manual_1.1.zip
While artifacts effect in STF only attract xenos, their effects in the original ST: RPG were quite different.
Types of Alien
These descriptions apply to the alien AI rather than the ship used.
Alien Terror
These have no captain and only attempt to close to board. They cannot be defeated in captain duel, kill 200% normal Crew, are immune to weapons and** any artifacts on board increase attack power by 100% per artifact.**
Alien Horror
These have 2 captains (one male, one female) and only attempt to close to board and fire at zero range. They can be defeated in captain duel, kill 100% normal Crew, any artifacts on board increase attack power by 20% per artifact.
Alien Devour
These have 1 captain (weak) and only attempt to close to board and ram at zero range. They can be defeated in captain duel, kill 10% normal Crew,** any artifacts on board increase automatically converts 7-17 Crew to Aliens per Boarding Action.**
Alien Flayer
These have 1 captains (nearly invincible) and only attempt to close to board and shoot guns at zero range. They can be defeated in captain duel, kill 300% normal Crew, are 50% immune to weapons, fear artifacts (-10% alien efficiency / artifact in the hold)
Unpredictable Alien
This type of Alien acts like a smuggler but then randomly selects any other AI and changes every 2-3 turns. These are very hard to predict. If they select terror, horror or devour they will stick at that level. Best to escape early.
vale anvil
Kinda a PITA to implement it into STF
brazen ledge
Oh, and some character classses increase damage to aliens when artifacts are on board as well.
It's probably just as well some of that was trimmed; how would you choose which crew to convert? And then you have to recruit new ones and build them from scratch?
vale anvil
Yeah
Tho there is one thing on one hand i'm glad ST franchise never did but curiosity IS killing me.
brazen ledge
But in the older ST, the game made it very clear: Get artifacts off your ship just as soon as you can, even if you're dealing in them.
vale anvil
Non hostile alien species.
brazen ledge
Well, I wish they had.
"The Ur-Quan Masters" , from the 1990s, is chock full of non-hostile aliens. While it IS a combat game, the objective is to establish contact, and form alliance with, friendly or neutral peoples in the hopes of beating the Evil Empire.
I miss that. Especially encountering the Slylandro who live in the clouds of a gas giant.
hexed cosmos
I don't know, I actually kinda like Star Traders being just humans.
hexed cosmos
I still get annoyed when I see those comments on steam.
Its especially bad for Battleforce.
But I have a vague memory of seeing someone mention it for Star Traders as well after Rogue Trader came out
brazen ledge
How is having nonhostile aliens a "warhammer copy"? In WH40K, everyone is at war with everyone else, so there's no such thing as a "peaceful encounter". The other type was pretty common in the 80s and 90s, and was widespread.
hexed cosmos
How is having nonhostile aliens a "warhammer copy"? In WH40K, everyone is at wa...
Because anything that has any similarity is a copy.
That's how people usually think.
There are technically non-hostile encounters with the Eldar and Tau though.
vale anvil
I'd be NICE to have a faction like the Aeldari who well. Know how to atleast "subdue" the Xeno for example. Like pacifiy them
hexed cosmos
More Eldar than Tau.
hexed cosmos
Yeah I know, but they also have worked with Eldar on occasion.
hexed cosmos
Drukhari on the other hand...
vale anvil
Hahahahaaha
hexed cosmos
That's a funny story.
You don't work with the Drukhari.
brazen ledge
I think of the xeno as something like antibodies; I can't think of anything that is an analog to their viciousness except our own immune systems.
This being the case, I wonder if it would be possible to create some kind of IFF flag so Xenos would recognize us as part of their "body" and leave us alone. You'll notice xenos never kill other xeno species, so they have SOME way to recognize each other.
hexed cosmos
Not if you value dying.
vale anvil
I think of the xeno as something like antibodies; I can't think of anything that...
Tried and failed. Cultists atleast
Xeno are SUPER advanced for being feral
hexed cosmos
I mean, just because it failed, doesn't necessarily mean its impossible.
Well that particular route probably
brazen ledge
Cultists tried to control xeno and no one can do that. Their creatures lost control, and the Narvidians failed also.
Being able to set an IFF flag? Maybe. Doing what they tried in Battleforce, which is to try to create a Litch, control it, and sic it on their enemies ?Bad, bad idea.
vale anvil
Good luck trying to get enough research done before your entire base is buring from metric tons of promethium
hexed cosmos
But there's bound to be some way to pacify them at the very least.
But I think I'll put more stock in a Hydra flamer.
vale anvil
Keeping Xeno a "mystery" gives us a "bad guy"
hexed cosmos
Yeah I agree.
I'm just saying that science works in a way that you fail 90% of the time, nearly succeed for 9% more, and then finally win.
vale anvil
Lemme use an example. Imagine the imperium one day could just snap it's fingers and control the nid hive fleet
hexed cosmos
Do I actually want them to be able to in Star Traders? No, not at all.
vale anvil
That's a GG for those guys.
Same thing in ST
Humans controlling Xeno ?
Let's go invade the guild
Re take that
brazen ledge
I don't want to [i]control[/i] xeno. I'd just like a handy little device merchants could install so xeno ships in the void will simply depart rather than instantly attack like piranhas after a steak.
vale anvil
Just throw the Xeno into the meatgrinder
hexed cosmos
Well they didn't leave the core because the Guild was still there
They left because the war made the place an inhospitable hellscape
vale anvil
Narvs EVERYWHERE
hexed cosmos
as well as the Guild still being there
vale anvil
And i mean EVERYWHERE
hexed cosmos
So there's no benefit to going back even if we could
vale anvil
Some lunatic probably thought of it tho lol
hexed cosmos
Most of the time, in the intro for 4x, the intro for Battleforce, and even the lorebook if I remember right, all mention that the Core is basically a ruin at this point.
Which was the main reason for leaving
There's no point fighting over the scraps that remains
Especially not with how the Factions are
vale anvil
And the boatload of Narv ships doesn't make it any better
brazen ledge
In Spaceward Ho! , biological spaceships -- xeno -- are at the end of the tech tree.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaceward_Ho!
Here's the rationale: The game has two resources : Money (renewable) and metal (nonrenewable)
There's a fixed amount of metal in the game and, once it's used up, you can't build ships any more. You can mitigate this with advanced technology (ships cost more money, use less metal) but you can't really get rid of the problem entirely until biological ships mean you don't need metal to build ships at all.
The fact they eat colonists for fuel? A regrettable problem but the alternative is mass extinction.
When you think of it, that makes a dandy origin story for the xenos in the ST universe.
vale anvil
We actually have an origin for Xeno
hexed cosmos
Really though I'm fine with the Xeno just being hostile alien bugs.
hexed cosmos
I don't usually like the bioweapon aspect of most alien bug xeno in sci-fi if I'm honest.
Which... I don't think it is the case for Xeno actually?
hexed cosmos
In Battleforce the Goliath almost makes it seem like they were just bugs, but things like the Goliath were tampered with by the Narvidians
vale anvil
Some are biomechanical yeah
hexed cosmos
So most of the Xeno were just that. Big alien bugs. But the Narvidians made more by experimenting on already existing ones
Though that's merely my interpretation based on how they mention the Goliath
brazen ledge
My understanding is each xeno species is genetically engineered for a particular task. Red Zorga are scouts. Jyeeta are heavy transport, and so on. Each is a piece in the jigsaw puzzle that was the ancient creator's economy.
Then the creators lost control and were annihlated by their own creations, which went feral and are still around.
vale anvil
Yeah the Alfaan made them to combat the Xarth
The creators of the narvs
That's the story
How canon is it NOW
hexed cosmos
Oh my god. I forgot about that
vale anvil
I'm unsure
hexed cosmos
I was wondering where I heard those names before...
I was starting to think it was Galactic Civilizations.
vale anvil
Nope
vale anvil
I would assume so till TBF2 and STF2 either fails to mention them or rectons
hexed cosmos
I find STF2 funny since technically it'd be the third game.
hexed cosmos
Oh yeah I know, I just find it funny
vale anvil
It IS funny
hexed cosmos
I wonder what a third would be called.
Between Frontiers, Flashpoint... Battleforce...
Something with an F.
vale anvil
Don't ask me lol
brazen ledge
Fury. I assume the next game will cover the war against Guild 2.0.
hexed cosmos
Star Traders Fury does sound like a cool name though I'm not gonna lie
brazen ledge
"The empire, long divided, must unite; long united, must divide. Thus it has ever been." -- Romance of the Three Kingdoms.
hexed cosmos
I want to read Romance of the Three Kingdoms
Damn it, there's a lot of books I need to get.
brazen ledge
This means that humans in a state of division will compete until they have a single , unitary state, which then collapses over time as the central government weakens.
We can see the process of consolidation starting in STF. We can either follow that line, or fast forward to the inevitable revolt against the now-corrupt central government.
hexed cosmos
If the factions unite, better not be under the United Coalition. My pettiness knows no bounds.
vale anvil
I'm not a fan of guild 2.0 being a thing because frankly there is a bigger power play happening
Gux is out there
And interestingly
THEY of all people wanted the coalition to fail
hexed cosmos
...Way to make me second-guess my being against the coalition
vale anvil
hexed cosmos
I actually never did do the Gux related story yet, if I'm honest.
I haven't done much of the stories at all, I just kinda go off and do my own stuff
vale anvil
TLDR
Gux has a new apprentice. Gux miga.
They forged evidence against Estelle
Juuust unclear enough to remove her from her seat
hexed cosmos
Interesting. I need to do the Arbiter's stuff I think.
brazen ledge
They did indeed.
But the original guild were themselves heroes for centuries.
Before they eventually collapsed.
A guild 2.0 could indeed oppose all manner of terrible things, becoming the new crusaders for justice, before themselves becoming subverted.
It happened before.
hexed cosmos
They weren't really heroes...
brazen ledge
In fairness though, I don't think we can say they "forged" evidence against Estel. In the mission, we find a single data cube with only the barest encryption which purports to show Brokstrom doing very bad things. It's obvious that the cube has been selectively edited to put her in the worst light possible.
It's not the truth. It's a weapon.
But that's still not the same thing as "forged", made up out of whole cloth. Deliberately showing the things least flattering while suppressing any exonerating counter-evidence is a lie, but of a lie of a more subtle stripe.
vale anvil
It is forged
vale anvil
From the whole truth
hexed cosmos
Everything
vale anvil
Mainly
brazen ledge
The point is, it's a patently obvious lie made to discredit Brokstrom. I don't think even Thulun was fooled by it, but it was a useful lie, so they used it to discredit her anyway, knowing full well it was a lie from the start.
hexed cosmos
Murder.
vale anvil
Assassinations
brazen ledge
And concealment. Disguise. Stealth.
There's one other thing Steel Song is good at ... they're the only faction that offers the interrogation chamber module.
vale anvil
Who better then the star trader who helped build it all assassinate the magnate if they get too far out of line
hexed cosmos
And concealment. Disguise. Stealth.
Hey don't lump us in with Rychart.
I mean we do but
hexed cosmos
True
I don't think they bother hiding that Steel Song was involved usually actually
brazen ledge
Oh, there's one other thing about Steel Song I'd love to See more of -- the Jah-vakt tournament or whatever it's called. The tournament that ends a duel of assassins with 100% guarantee.
That could be a game in itself.
hexed cosmos
I'd love to see more of anything Steel Song related.
But I'm biased.
vale anvil
REALLY. REALLY. REALLY bloody melee tournament is my guess
hexed cosmos
They're known for three things.
Assassins, Blade Dancers, and Pit Fighting
vale anvil
Like we're talking on the fringes of shalun law allowed bloody
brazen ledge
So an ST-flavored martial arts tournament? Mortal kombat, Street Fighter?
vale anvil
Mortal Kombat
hexed cosmos
Pit Fighting is legal during Festivals.
Steel Song Pit Fighting is probably just more...
Spectactular.
brazen ledge
It has to be single combat. With only one winner. THE assassin of assassins in the quadrant.
The prize for second place is in the morgue.
hexed cosmos
In game its four on four but that's just because of the Crew Combat mechanics
hexed cosmos
I can see a Steel Song sponsored Tournament being one on one
vale anvil
Not that it is built around it
brazen ledge
I think for a 1v1 you'd need an entirely different game with a much more detailed hand-to-hand combat mechanic.
vale anvil
Yup
brazen ledge
Unless part of the tournament is a survival competition, not just melee.
Drop 10 competitors in the wilderness, come back in a week with seating for one.
hexed cosmos
Unironically as just a side game, a Pit-Fighting game would be kinda cool. Probably not as a full game though.
brazen ledge
Hunger Games in the ST universe, with a wilderness planet as backdrop?
mighty mirage
I would also take an RTS game of commanding faction militaries against Xeno invasion
Or, a ST game where you're building up a starport and managing what it exports, what it produces, faction rep, stuff like that
vale anvil
That wouldn't be bad
brazen ledge
For the starpot game, it should have Independents as a hard mode option; you've got limited funding, limited resources, and every faction ship with guns plunders your merchants because they're easy money with no friends to protect them.
I wonder if this is what the Hunna are for? To give faction pirates a reason to leave independent ships in the void alone?
vale anvil
Yes that was the point
And unfortunately. We never got the follow up to that
I always wanted to know what happens to Val
brazen ledge
I wish we could have seen more of the Hunna and Valencia. While I fought against the Hunna when they shot up a civilian starport, I've always wondered if there was more to them ; if they didn't have a valid cause for fighting.
vale anvil
They do have a valid cause. The blood feuds ruined not just the life of a so called "princess"
Easy to go "haha palace princess"
Val is anything but
brazen ledge
How about this for a game: Hunna Revolutionary. You take out bounties and stage actions in order to get the Independents a seat at the table as a faction in their own right, not just everybody's whipping boy.
vale anvil
No matter the faction choice
brazen ledge
For example, maybe there are pirates who prey exclusively on independent ships. Time to show them the error of their ways.
vale anvil
That's the idea
hexed cosmos
The Hunna are something I am against on virtue of being a Fanatical Steel Song Star Trader.
brazen ledge
How about this for a three sided conflict: Coalitions vs. the factions vs. the Hunna. Each is pushing for their own vision of a world.
The factions want things as they are.
The Coalition wants a central government.
The Hunna want independents to be a faction themselves.
hexed cosmos
They are terrorists that only meet the sharp end of the Steel Song blade.
brazen ledge
I remember Valencia Faen. They are more than that.
hexed cosmos
But a Hunna game would be cool
vale anvil
Even if it was your own ? Who got wrongfully sent to the gallows ?
hexed cosmos
Eh wishy-washy. Steel Song stab themselves sometimes too with their own assassins so its not that weird
hexed cosmos
I'm not entirely against the Hunna, but they are enemies of the Faction in general.
And when given the choice between the two I will support the Faction
brazen ledge
Actually .. what DO The Hunna want? Do they just want to be a faction? Or do they want to abolish the factions altogether and create a People's Socialist Republic Of Star Traders, in defiance of Shalun Law?
hexed cosmos
They are trying to change the way the Factions treat Independents
brazen ledge
And when they're shooting up innocent civlians or bombing starports I am entirely in accord wih @hexed cosmos .
vale anvil
Hunna pre val yes
hexed cosmos
So I worked with the Hunna on behalf of Valencia, and if the Hunna attack an enemy starport I'll support them
vale anvil
Post her we don't know what she's done to rein them in perhaps
hexed cosmos
But, the last time I got that event was on a Steel Song world.
brazen ledge
If they'd only been shooting at faction military I might have sided with them. As it is, I've got no use for terrorism, however just the cause.
vale anvil
Can you blame them tho ?
hexed cosmos
Post her we don't know what she's done to rein them in perhaps
My problem here is that she's not the Leader of the Hunna Collective.
She was given a leadership position.
Which could be anywhere from a squad leader essentially to leading a whole cell.
We don't even know if there is one unified leader
vale anvil
My problem here is that she's not the Leader of the Hunna Collective.
She was gi...
Remember the image ?
brazen ledge
And of course the relationship between the Hunna and the factions isn't always adversarial. In the coalition sidequest, we find Rychart are arming a hunna cell to attack the Moklumnue by proxy.
hexed cosmos
Which one?
brazen ledge
Can you blame them tho ?
Yes, actually. Being oppressed isn't an excuse for murdering civilians.
hexed cosmos
And of course the relationship between the Hunna and the factions isn't always a...
Thus my willingness to work with them so long as their goals are in line with the Steel Song.
But as a whole, they are technically still my enemy.
brazen ledge
Technically EVERYONE is everyone's enemy. At least, if you're closely tied to a given faction.
hexed cosmos
Or if their goals align with my own.
I'm still mad at Moklumnue.
brazen ledge
Oh? What'd they do to you?
hexed cosmos
In all honesty? Literally nothing, I just happened to be doing a mission for them when everything went horribly wrong on my ship.
But I needed a scapegoat.
brazen ledge
Ah.
hexed cosmos
If I'm dying, it isn't gonna be on behalf of Moklumnue. So I didn't. I survived, out of spite.
hexed cosmos
Oh yeah I do remember that.
Still, doesn't necessarily mean she's the leader, necessarily.
vale anvil
It's been 6 years i THINK we can talk about it
hexed cosmos
...Why do I repeat myself like that. Redundant.
hexed cosmos
Well yeah... she's a swordsman
vale anvil
But she was kinda fighting with a butter knife in her mouth against a Goliath(The factions)
With her hands tied
If not severed from her
If she didn't get accused.
She's got the chops to be a princess quite quickly even in grav years.
Not as an heir but in her father's place
But alas.
Next game...
Seriously tho
3 things i wanted "tied up"
Val. The whole Coalition thing post Jyeeta
And the Moklonume princess storyline that even HAS/HAD a unique contact model i accidentally found and Andrew promptly fixed
brazen ledge
The Pale Queen.
brazen ledge
Sorry, the Pale Queen is a loose end I want tied up. I hadn't seen the Moklumnue storyline.
I don't recall seeing that one.
vale anvil
Because i "fixed it"
By that i mean i snitched on myself
And Andrew got rid of the contact from spawning REAL quick
So ofcourse you didn't see it
I don't have the save anymore
Buuut
@brazen ledge
I have an ungodly memory for this stuff
Andrew stopped her from spawning REAL quick once i mentioned it
Which is a shame
brazen ledge
Hey, that character model shows up in my current game. Hold on a second.
Oh, wait. I have the character model but not the court option, which looks cool. Too bad they cut it. But they had their reasons, I suppose.
vale anvil
Model perhaps got "released"
I'm still taking the copium laced spice. "Maybe someday"
The whole
https://tenor.com/view/i-didnt-hear-no-bell-randy-marsh-south-park-s9e5-the-losing-edge-gif-22282212
brazen ledge
There she is.
vale anvil
Oh wow
brazen ledge
And look, the character has a unique model and the exact same name yours does.
Perhaps I should pay her a visit.
brazen ledge
After my character finishes his current set of missions for a steel song academy doctor; several pirates to hunt down and a remote base or two to prep for.
hexed cosmos
After my character finishes his current set of missions for a steel song academy...
I approve of this message.
vale anvil
Playing 40k gladius with a friend and i kinda suck at Aeldari
vale anvil
Hint
hexed cosmos
My brother has the rest of the DLC so if I play with him I can get the other stuff
vale anvil
My brother has the rest of the DLC so if I play with him I can get the other stu...
Dunno if that works
hexed cosmos
It does
vale anvil
Wierd
hexed cosmos
If you join someone with the DLC you can use all the stuff, except the faction you don't own
vale anvil
Ah
hexed cosmos
You can't play as a faction you don't own but all the units you can make
So I at the very least want the Mechanicus.
hexed cosmos
Yeah
brazen ledge
So I checked in with Keitta Lumotte; she's just an ordinary contact, albeit a permanent one with our own character model.
I fan-hypothesize that, given her pale coloring, she is the "pale queen" of the xeno city vignette.
vale anvil
So I checked in with Keitta Lumotte; she's just an ordinary contact, albeit a p...
She was "meant" to be the mok prince's cousin's granddaughter that got murked when Estelle was working towards the coalition by Gux i believe
Decades prior
But as you can see. No court
hexed cosmos
You know what, I'm reviving this to an extent.
So, what do the FDF uniforms look like for each faction? Looking at the FDF Portraits in Templar Battleforce, Rychart's seems to be golden armor of some sort. And their colors seem to be the same as their flag, primarily red, with white.
I'd assume De Valtos and Rychart have similarities, given the fact they are both syndicates, as well as the their colors being similar...
I'd also assume that the Great Houses differ from the Syndicates' uniforms.
vale anvil
@hexed cosmos Ever seen like "sterotypical" depiction of roman soldiers ? That's how i think about Rychart soldiers. Just well "modern"
Or something like 40k's Dante
That would actually be funny if in rychart's history they had a "Dante"/Sanguinius like figure
hexed cosmos
So do you think Thulun soldiers have a more French-Medieval look?
vale anvil
So do you think Thulun soldiers have a more French-Medieval look?
nah more spanish. Less pompous then the french.
but not by much
hexed cosmos
I can see that.
vale anvil
Cadar is just texas as a nation
hexed cosmos
You know what... Yeah. Texan Cadar is something I now believe to be canon.
But their FDF is probably the most typical I feel. Like, you imagine Sci-Fi military... and I think you got Cadar.
I think the same can be said for Alta Mesa.
vale anvil
Zenrin i have a hard time placing since we interact with them so little
My BEEEEEST guess is somekind of variant of norse culture due to the sheer reverence of the past
hexed cosmos
Moklumnue I can see looking Dutch maybe... Or English. One of the Mercantile nations in the 1700's.
vale anvil
But that is loose at best
hexed cosmos
Or Celtic Zenrin?
Similar reason but I think Celtic would fit slightly more than norse.
vale anvil
Yeah celts would fit the bill more
hexed cosmos
Now the ultimate question...
Steel Song.
I'd say either Middle Eastern, Indian, or Chinese.
One of those three.
lone burrow
I want to read Romance of the Three Kingdoms
I owned that series. It was pretty good
mighty mirage
I missed so much here
hexed cosmos
We need more... I don't have a random topic of Lore to talk about at just this second though
hexed cosmos
cuz of the whole melee fighting thing
Actually about this, this is why I said Chinese actually. Melee fighting thing, but more specifically, the Blade Dancing.
The reincarnation and stuff too makes me also think Chinese, but moreso Indian... though it's not like the beliefs didn't transfer to China as well, when Buddhism went to China.
hexed cosmos
Is there a story behind the Temple of Refuge?
I remember finding it in the first game, but it's just a backwater Indie world there.
mighty cypress
I'd take DV for just their ability to literally sell biomass for more then 40x i...
Wait, what? Is this from the older games, or from STF?
vale anvil
Wait, what? Is this from the older games, or from STF?
#st_4x the joke is that de valtos can convince you so hard that you will rip yourself off and overpay
Not that THEY will rip you off. They'll convince you to rip yourself off
mighty cypress
The reincarnation and stuff too makes me also think Chinese, but moreso Indian.....
ShaoLin are chinese Buddhists, but I am not sure why they would have all that torture stuff.
hexed cosmos
Well, it's not one to one.
Blade Dancing isn't inherent to Steel Song but they're most known for their Blade Dancing.
That's what I mean
mighty cypress
Maybe they are like the Fremen
finite fog
Steel Song reminds me of the ancient Celtic warriors. Apparently their ability in combat was great enough that they were often hired as mercenaries by other nations, and they were less afraid of death because they believed in reincarnation.
mighty cypress
Mujahedeen also come to mind, but that's getting to the spicy politics things that we should probs steer clear of
lone burrow
I think it's fine to discuss. Although I'd argue they're closer to Zealots of any faction than SSC specifically.
worthy kestrel
Yo what’s the context of this image? wtf?
I’m just back reading
vale anvil
It was a tease. Waaaaaaaaaaaay back when.
worthy kestrel
3 things i wanted "tied up"
Oh don’t forget Zette and that well done fried guy we saved! “I’ll update you star trader”
does literally nothing else ever again
worthy kestrel
It was a tease. Waaaaaaaaaaaay back when.
Noooooooo
worthy kestrel
Wait for STF2 is what
If it must be done 🥺
vale anvil
I'm not exactly thrilled either but it is what it is
worthy kestrel
Nah, just glad I’m not the only one who wondered. I love Valencia’s questline and it’s honestly “canon” to me, but it sucks how reward wise, it’s currently the least useful of the faens. Worth doing once for the story, but not for subsequent playthroughs when mommy Zette exists
worthy kestrel
I'm not exactly thrilled either but it is what it is
I’m honestly just happy that there could be a part 2. Like time will tell if that happens or if CKF becomes a bigger success that they focus on
vale anvil
I just wanna find Tarquin and make him wish he was ripped apart by the Xeno
finite fog
Is it possible to mod in vignettes that are close enough to the existing story missions?
vale anvil
Personally not aware
worthy kestrel
I just wanna find Tarquin and make him wish he was ripped apart by the Xeno
I forget who is that? Is that the fight club guy?
vale anvil
#battleforce main villain/manipulator
finite fog
Slimy Rychart traitor who worships the xeno
vale anvil
Basically
worthy kestrel
<#359350857160196107> main villain/manipulator
Wait what IF. The games take place… IN THE SAME UNIVERSE???!!!
/s
Speaking of universes, yall think the OG star traders has any canonicity to it at all these days?
vale anvil
Obvious sarcasm aside,yes they do
finite fog
It made me sad to see the cirm sector (at least in v2 map) had no/few Mok worlds, I guess the attack on them was too much to recover from.
worthy kestrel
Obvious sarcasm aside,yes they do
Yeah I always thought it was cool
worthy kestrel
It made me sad to see the cirm sector (at least in v2 map) had no/few Mok worlds...
Wait what’s the lore of cirm sector?
👀👀👀👀👀
vale anvil
Speaking of universes, yall think the OG star traders has any canonicity to it a...
Yes. Just might need few retcon stitches here and there
worthy kestrel
Yes. Just might need few retcon stitches here and there
So timeline wise is it like pre our story or like pre exodous.
finite fog
It's where battle force take place, and Mok got the short end of the stick in the xeno attacks. I was so excited to see Nyra Ridaan was part of the Jyeeta fighting effort
vale anvil
It made me sad to see the cirm sector (at least in v2 map) had no/few Mok worlds...
I meeeeeeean. That attack was effectively a quadrant ending threat. Are we really shocked?
worthy kestrel
Assuming Shalun is same in OG games
We should gta them and call the OG games the “3D era” and the modern games the “HD” era
finite fog
Hehe that is true
vale anvil
Shalun is still a mystery and i'd prefer to keep it that way
hexed cosmos
Speaking of universes, yall think the OG star traders has any canonicity to it a...
It is still canon yes.
And it's after the founding, but before the Hyperwarps.
It's the Farfallen Rim in Frontiers.
worthy kestrel
Shalun is still a mystery and i'd prefer to keep it that way
Hard agree
worthy kestrel
It's the Farfallen Rim in Frontiers.
WHAAAAT???? WOWOSISJJSJSJSKKSKS THATS SO COOL
Like I know the map isn’t 1:1 but YOOOOO
finite fog
It's the Farfallen Rim in Frontiers.
Holy heck that is beautiful
vale anvil
A planet blew up here
vale anvil
Another one got thrown into orbit
worthy kestrel
And the arbitrer just exists
vale anvil
So the map changing isn't too big of a deal
hexed cosmos
It's the original system in the first game, and just the overall richest/more successful Quadrants that was founded.
finite fog
So Shalun and templars destroyed the xeno around Farfallen Rim/Alzean core that started the Exodus between stc and stf, and then hyper warp gates allows them to return.
hexed cosmos
It's where the Syndicate Capital is located, which is the richest planet. And De Valtos owns it.
worthy kestrel
So canonically far fallen rim is the birthplace then?
vale anvil
It's the original system in the first game, and just the overall richest/more su...
There is a joke in there somewhere if the Jyeeta scurge spawns next door to the rim
worthy kestrel
Okay my timeline knowledge is confused. Did we have hypergates before or after exodus?
vale anvil
After
vale anvil
Different methods
worthy kestrel
Different methods
Pre exodus transport
worthy kestrel
It's the original system in the first game, and just the overall richest/more su...
Wait so where’s your source on this and PLS SHARE
vale anvil
Last i recall "gravity jump" was used. Not exactly detailed in #st_4x loading screen pop ups tho
hexed cosmos
So, it goes like this.
Guild, then the battle agains the Guild with Shalun, the destruction of the Core.
The Exodus, where everyone is leaving the Core and finding new places. This when ST4X takes place, along with Templar Battleforce.
Post Exodus, which is the first Star Traders. This is years after the Exodus (AE=After Exodus).
Then there's the Hyperwarp Gates, when STF takes place.
ST4X is basically us founding these different quadrants that are then united in STF when the Hyperwarp Gates come around
worthy kestrel
Different methods
So
-
Guild starts gilling people
-
We (the people) rebel and get wrecked
-
We flee to the new place we are in now.
-
Shalun Jesus fights xenos
-
Hyper warp is discovered
-
Arbitrer gets played by gux people
-
We come in
worthy kestrel
So
-
Guild starts gilling people
-
Shalun Jesus and We (the people) rebel and get wrecked
-
We flee to the new place we are in now.
-
Not shalun Jesus fights xenos
-
Hyper warp is discovered
-
Arbitrer gets played by gux people
-
We come in
vale anvil
Shalun is basically the star traders equivalent of the emperor of mankind from 40k just has no "magic"
worthy kestrel
Okay so here’s my confusion. Is the new system we are in a different one from the guilds old one? Did the jyeeta attack while Shalun Jesus was alive?
vale anvil
Yeah Jyeeta took him out.
But his crew gave them such a bloody nose they had to hibernate
hexed cosmos
Wait so where’s your source on this and PLS SHARE
The planets in the Farfallen Rim are all in the first game.
Correloth, in the Xi System for Steel Song, the Syndicate Capital, Ryeline, Rinze Mining Camp, even the Temple of Refuge.
They're all in it.
As for the Syndicate Capital being the richest planet... it says in the De Valtos Faction description in game.
If you're curious by the way, Correloth is an isolated Steel Song Planet in the north, the Syndicate Capital is all the way to the west, the Rinze mining Camp is where you start as an independent Captain in the northwest, Ryeline is in the bottom right, and the Temple of Refuge is also somwhere around there I think.
worthy kestrel
Yeah Jyeeta took him out.
Should have put more points in fortitude smh.
vale anvil
I have a hunch that dude hadn't slept or eaten in possibly weeks or months
worthy kestrel
I have a hunch that dude hadn't slept or eaten in possibly weeks or months
Also needed resilience too it seems 😤
hexed cosmos
Oh yeah, and Templar Assault takes place after the Exodus as well, during the same era as the first Star Traders, if I remember right. I think it is also in the Farfallen Rim I think?
That's when the Gux Mastermind Cult is first active.
worthy kestrel
Besides, my crew goes weeks without eating and they are fine.
I I have to assume they don’t eat since we dont have to carry rations
vale anvil
Oh yeah, and Templar Assault takes place after the Exodus as well, during the sa...
Yeah they're hunting down Gux and "insert cultist of the week"
hexed cosmos
So it goes, in order, ST4X/TBF, Templar Assault, Star Traders Classic, and then STF.
vale anvil
That checks out. Roughly
hexed cosmos
Anything before ST4X (The actual guiild war, and Shalun himself) are not in any games, only mentioned in lore.
worthy kestrel
So it goes, in order, ST4X/TBF, Templar Assault, Star Traders Classic, and then ...
Ooooo makes sense too! Tech improved to where 80 or however max amount of crews were not needed for ships anymore
vale anvil
I don't think you'll read a decade's worth of forum posts to piece together anything pre 4x lol
worthy kestrel
Like og star traders had a TON of crew members per ship holy crap
hexed cosmos
Well the reason for the smaller ships is actually due to the hyperwarp.
vale anvil
Technically the old ships are still around
worthy kestrel
Well the reason for the smaller ships is actually due to the hyperwarp.
Where is the source 😭
Is it from the lore book option I never pick?
hexed cosmos
The massive ships of Star Traders Classic are super inefficient and expensive to jump through the hyperwarp.
vale anvil
!lorebook
vale anvil
Hold on
hexed cosmos
It's not mentioned in game as far as I know, but Cory mentioned it in #stf_chat at some point.
It's also somewhat implied, when you look at how the ships work in game.
The more you upgrade the ship, the larger it is, the more it costs to jump.
And these are small by comparison
Now imagine a ship with hundreds of crew, and tons of weaponry.
vale anvil
20 RP ship 🤤
hexed cosmos
vale anvil
Imagine all the guns all firing off at a Xeno ship 🤤
worthy kestrel
Imagine all the guns all firing off at a Xeno ship 🤤
Ooooo xeno ships had to adapt tooo!!! Like they are kinda living things iirc?? So they used to be bigger but then they had to become smaller
vale anvil
Those things adapt anyways
hexed cosmos
Oh god, if we had to deal with the Xeno Ships from the first game with our ships in STF...
vale anvil
Just period
vale anvil
Oh god, if we had to deal with the Xeno Ships from the first game with our ships...
They would be screwed
vale anvil
Simply from the speed/agility multiplier on our ship
worthy kestrel
20 RP ship 🤤
20 rp ship with 200 fuel and 350 jump cost 😎
worthy kestrel
20 rp ship with 200 fuel and 350 jump cost 😎
Wait this is classic. The cargo hold only has 80 in it. No built in water tanks
vale anvil
I never even thought about the fact that the *Xeno* ships are smaller too...
To be fair. A scittering USED TO be the size of a full sized adult human in peak condition
worthy kestrel
They would be screwed
Simply set game to normal difficulty where they can’t die. Mission achieved 😎
vale anvil
Them be chonky bois
hexed cosmos
I want to see a Goliath next to a normal person.
worthy kestrel
Wait so questions.
Is guild still alive? Like are they just chilling in an otherwise empty galaxy (where we used to be)
hexed cosmos
I mean, they're bigger than Templars, and Templars, at least in Battleforce, are in mechs that they pilot in the chest.
The Leviathan armor is a lot bigger than I think some people think
worthy kestrel
Are did xenos get activated and eat them all?
hexed cosmos
I think the Guild is just gone.
The Narvidians don't really have much use for them anymore.
worthy kestrel
I think the Guild is just gone.
The Narvidians don't really have much use for th...
Yee I was gonna also assume that the geth people ate them
hexed cosmos
And the Factions themselves actually did a number on the Guild before leaving anyway
worthy kestrel
And the Factions themselves actually did a number on the Guild before leaving an...
Except for steel song ofc.
flees
hexed cosmos
I'm not biased, or anything, but Steel Song did do widespread killings of the Guild.
hexed cosmos
Except for steel song ofc.
*flees*
vale anvil
I think the Guild is just gone.
The Narvidians don't really have much use for th...
Probably the systems are still out there. Ruined beyond repair and shoved full of drones that wake up the microsecond they smell human activity so. Bad juju to even attempt to go near that place again
worthy kestrel
Maaan this game lore is so beautiful.
Also the world is very much very bad I think. 10/10 government ratings are toleration after all
hexed cosmos
And that was Steel Song alone. Rychart was more violent in the day, Cadar is very good with their ships, and Alta Mesa makes really good ships. Give Rychart and Cadar Alta Mesan ships, and they're a force to be reckoned with.
And without them fighting each other, the Factions are deadly.
vale anvil
Buuut if you feeling. Well frankly suicidal. Sure. Go for a trip towards the guild. I am sure it'll work out wonderfully. Obvious sarcasm btw
hexed cosmos
Oh yeah, a Totalitarian Feudal Society, that's either based on the idea that's all about competition and being better than literally everyone else, or a caste system.
finite fog
There was some kind of sect of steel song that was imprisoning vytautas, but they assassinated a bunch of guild members before
worthy kestrel
Probably the systems are still out there. Ruined beyond repair and shoved full o...
STF2’s jyeeta arc basically? They come back and we gotta deal with them
hexed cosmos
Faug Daen
vale anvil
And that was Steel Song alone. Rychart was more violent in the day, Cadar is ver...
Cadar was just high on spice and if it had plutonium or uranium it was shot at the enemy in question lol
hexed cosmos
They're the most prolific of the Steel Song Death Cults.
worthy kestrel
They're the most prolific of the Steel Song Death Cults.
Not next to me ofc. My captain eats those ships for breakfast and then a few military officers for lunch, and a bounty hunter or two for a snack.
worthy kestrel
Not next to me ofc. My captain eats those ships for breakfast and then a few mil...
Jyeeta devastators are my dinner
hexed cosmos
I wouldn't know. I've never and never will go against the Faug Daen.
vale anvil
They're the most prolific of the Steel Song Death Cults.
They sucks at their job apperently then for not being able to off Vytautas
During the fight mind you
Not while he's in shackles
hexed cosmos
I mean, I'll be honest...
And I don't usually say this...
But that's not shocking, given the fact that he's a Cadar Shocktrooper.
worthy kestrel
Oh, do yall believe in the United Coalitions? I like to do it in every “canon” (where I care about the story) playthrough.
hexed cosmos
Assuming he's on par with the Elite 303 at all, they clearly did something better.
...They took him alive, something that is supposedly impossible.
worthy kestrel
Oh, do yall believe in the United Coalitions? I like to do it in every “canon” (...
I don’t trust the arbiter with my safety, but I do believe her goals are sincere
hexed cosmos
Oh, do yall believe in the United Coalitions? I like to do it in every “canon” (...
I go against them.
worthy kestrel
I don’t trust the arbiter with my safety, but I do believe her goals are sincere
At the cost of anything ofc. She gets mad if you actively respect the law and expose the rychart people
worthy kestrel
At the cost of anything ofc. She gets mad if you actively respect the law and ex...
It’s a complex character and I enjoy that about her. She’s not exactly my homie, but I think she’s a useful genuine ally
So long as you don’t jeprodize the peace
After all
finite fog
I don’t trust the arbiter with my safety, but I do believe her goals are sincere
This is what I feel as well. She keeps order even if she has to lie. A little scary
hexed cosmos
She wanted Cadar's help over Steel Song's so I don't help her.
Then we have Retribution Justice. That's clearly more profitable.
finite fog
I wonder if there will be a climax where Valencia fights against Estelle over disagreements of being truthful but violent or secretive but peaceful
worthy kestrel
This is what I feel as well. She keeps order even if she has to lie. A little sc...
Yee yee. Like the whole scandal arc is also very much a good moral thing too.
I personally don’t fully trust that the arbiter is an innocent victim, but I also don’t trust the sussy Baka nature of the evidence
hexed cosmos
At the cost of anything ofc. She gets mad if you actively respect the law and ex...
For someone who's supposedly about upholding the law, anyway, I can not at all accept this.
She says it herself, her inability to uphold the law will be shown by future generations.
And she does it anyway with Rychart.
worthy kestrel
Also I LOVE that the main important plot character tis a woman. Good on the trese brothers to avoid the whole “sci fi is for men” thing.
finite fog
It would be nice to keep the evidence and figure out the Estelle's side of the story in a later quest
worthy kestrel
She says it herself, her inability to uphold the law will be shown by future gen...
Okay TO BE FAIR. She has plausible deniability there since she doesn’t know about the stuff until you expose them.
worthy kestrel
It would be nice to keep the evidence and figure out the Estelle's side of the s...
Have you ever talked to her?
With the evidence?
hexed cosmos
Also, I don't trust the evidence necessarily, but it's hard to pinpoint anything when the Gux Cult is involved.
finite fog
When I asked her, she mainly said that Gux Miga is a liar and that she would destroy Miga if given the chance.
worthy kestrel
For someone who's supposedly about upholding the law, anyway, I can not at all a...
YAS I LOCE THIS. ITS DISCUSSION. I just like the greater good aspect of it. It’s uncertain if this will turn into the guild, but the world felt so much emptier without it. Like I was shocked when I didn’t have hot commander lady in the jyeeta arc with best boy Volpane
In the playthrough where I ignored coalition
worthy kestrel
When I asked her, she mainly said that Gux Miga is a liar and that she would des...
Yee I was just like “please tell me homie knows about siding with Estelle here 😭”
finite fog
I think she really did ask a bounty hunter to threaten someone, but the Gux probably turned it into a bloody murder. Hopefully she never makes that mistake again.
hexed cosmos
Hot Commander lady is an upside to the Coalition.
I'm too petty to fall to her propaganda however. She should have asked Steel Song.
worthy kestrel
YAS I LOCE THIS. ITS DISCUSSION. I just like the greater good aspect of it. It’s...
Now they aren’t VERY impactful mind you, I still wish there were universal trade permits (up to 2 for balance purposes) or something, but I do enjoy having them around as to not
worthy kestrel
Hot Commander lady is an upside to the Coalition.
I'm too petty to fall to her p...
On the same token, hot thulun lady is an upside to killing coalition
Choices choices 🤔🤔🤔
finite fog
YAS I LOCE THIS. ITS DISCUSSION. I just like the greater good aspect of it. It’s...
Same, another reason I side with Estelle is that it feels a bit lonely without coalition people popping up in places
worthy kestrel
Same, another reason I side with Estelle is that it feels a bit lonely without c...
They also aren’t bad at all. Like they are a free source of high level recruits if you get enough of them. They all buy intel, your rep with the coalition should never fall far
And those recruits have no coalition homeworld to desert to
hexed cosmos
I am just part of the problem that Estelle seeks to avoid honestly.
I literally won't help them sometimes because I refuse to work under Cadar.
Xeno threat?
That's cool, didn't ask Volpane.
Assuming he's even alive if I let him live.
worthy kestrel
I am just part of the problem that Estelle seeks to avoid honestly.
I literally ...
Sorry partner. Here in the grav world, I’ll buy you some spice.
But in the void?
I have a death warrant partner
worthy kestrel
I have a death warrant partner
Mostly because my build isn’t crew combat focused so I wouldn’t pull a cutter on you
worthy kestrel
<:irid:363923291901001738>
Ah shit, a boarder
hexed cosmos
Step closer, what's the problem?
finite fog
What if Faug Daen had an evil counterpart, the Daug Faen, which was lead by Calagan Faen and prioritized open negotiation and getting intel from people by giving them vacations
hexed cosmos
Evil Faug Daen:
Lets you go peacefully
finite fog
Evil Faug Daen:
Causes Vytautas to defect to Steel Song by paying him more for doing his job
worthy kestrel
What if Faug Daen had an evil counterpart, the Daug Faen, which was lead by Cala...
YES. He was pulling the strings all along. None of the family members knew that HE caused the bombing of the high wind
worthy kestrel
Shower thought
Just realized that farfallen rim FEELS so much smaller in STF because those empty planets in ST RPG are not visible in the map because why would they??? They have nothing of value
hexed cosmos
Also it doesn't have every inhabited planet.
Just the most notable ones.
For example, it doesn't have the Prime worlds, because the Prime worlds will spawn elsewhere. The Steel Fortress also spawns elsewhere, rather than in the Farfallen Rim. Then just some minor worlds, like the Independent World that was just a pirate encampment for some old pirate. Forgot what it was called, just up in the Northwest.
vale anvil
For example, it doesn't have the Prime worlds, because the Prime worlds will spa...
Technically they coulda just "moved" the prime worlds once the hyperwarp became a thing
vale anvil
I don't mean the entire planet
The planet is there
Just not called "Steel Song Prime" or "Zenrin Prime" anymore because they just sold it or something
hexed cosmos
Yeah but I mean, there's probably multiple Prime worlds because at least if you take ST4X as an example, they probably often made their own Prime world when they first arrived to a quadrant.
So they probably had to like...
Decide on a new Prime world.
vale anvil
Reach a concessus on which quadrant will actually HAVE the prime world
vale anvil
Likely control % and how good the planet is beyond what we as the player see in STF
I'm willing to bet my neck the arbiters were HEAVILY involved there
I don't mean only the political ones. The ones that make you disappear ones. Who go after Gux's goons at the faintest sniff
hexed cosmos
Yeah.
I mean, the hyperwarp caused a ton of problems as much as it did solve them in the immediate aftermath of their discovery
We're at the more stable portion by the time we're involved in STF
worthy kestrel
Wait so did we get the hyper warp after the events of ST RPG?
Just wanna make sure
vale anvil
We're at the more stable portion by the time we're involved in STF
And even now it's shaky at best. And almost on the verge of collapse at worst
worthy kestrel
Yee okay.
vale anvil
Looks stable. But it is sure as hell not
worthy kestrel
We just... don't see them
Maybe they are past the parts of the quadrants we can see
hexed cosmos
I forgot how the years work in STF.
Because AE was After Exodus, which each Quadrant started at a different time and had their own 0AE.
worthy kestrel
And even now it's shaky at best. And almost on the verge of collapse at worst
Oh hell yeah it’s fucked lol.
hexed cosmos
Looks stable. But it is sure as hell not
Compared to the chaos that would ensue the moment the quadrants are all connected, it's more stable.
That's all I meant. I'm not saying it's in a good spot.
vale anvil
I forgot how the years work in STF.
Because AE was After Exodus, which each Quad...
1 turn is 16 hours. Beyond that i'll have to call in doc to do the math because i sure as hell ain't figuring it out
worthy kestrel
Compared to the chaos that would ensue the moment the quadrants are all connecte...
Wdym connected? Like do we make the hyperwarp gates? Or do you mean if we discover more b
vale anvil
Wdym connected? Like do we make the hyperwarp gates? Or do you mean if we discov...
"both"
hexed cosmos
I mean that the gates connect the Quadrants together.
And it would lead to plenty of problems when it first happens.
Such as there being like, thirty worlds called "Steel Prima"
vale anvil
Oh yeah. I'm willing to bet that Arbiters were working overtime
hexed cosmos
And each one claims that they are actually the real Steel Prima
worthy kestrel
Such as there being like, thirty worlds called "Steel Prima"
Oh my god yeah lol. The factions can’t even keep law and order in the void, so expecting that just NAH.
hexed cosmos
1 turn is 16 hours. Beyond that i'll have to call in doc to do the math because ...
I don't mean the mechanics in game, I get that.
I mean that the game starts in 210AE... but every quadrant would have had a different 0AE.
vale anvil
Oh my god yeah lol. The factions can’t even keep law and order in the void, so e...
The "no laws in space" bit is 1000% intentional on Shalun's part
hexed cosmos
I remember Cory mentioning it before.
I'm trying to find it again
Wait right
I remember
He changed it in STF
vale anvil
Bro knew people were gonna break the laws ANYWAYS so...
vale anvil
Shalun quite literally did this lol
Because dude KNEW people were gonna break the laws anyways
And space is MASSIVE
hexed cosmos
...I feel like I'm misremembering so I'm gonna stop talkin' about the AE thing and just assume they all agreed that it's now 210AE.
vale anvil
Dude was freaking shrewd that's for sure
hexed cosmos
The "no laws in space" bit is 1000% intentional on Shalun's part
I mean... We barely want to deal with laws in International Waters on Earth.
Now imagine that but in space.
vale anvil
Yeah...
I mean i wouldn't put it past shalun if he lived he woulda found a way to police vast swaths of space.
But he put in the redundancy in his law specifically because he knew he was eventually somehow gonna kick the bucket and frankly everyone else around him is a bunch of morons to put it lightly
Man is confirmed to have precognition
Actual future sight
He would have to be insane to not plan for the actual worst case scenario
hexed cosmos
But like how much precognition did he have?
Was he like Paul or Leto II in Dune?
Or is he like an Eldar where he saw millions of outcomes and decided on trying to get to a specific one
Which I guess was the question people asked when the Coalition was forming...
vale anvil
Given the dune inspiration. I'd say more % on the Leto II one
hexed cosmos
Because if he's like Eldar man, I ain't putting stock in his prescience.
The Eldar don't have a good track record when it comes to long-term prescience.
vale anvil
They didn't even see gorillaman's ressurection so....
hexed cosmos
But yeah if he's like Paul or Leto II, (which like you said, likely since Dune), it's definitely something to think about. Just hopefully for a different outcome.
Leto made everything specifically to collapse.
I think Shalun was trying to make sure everything stayed together
Or at least... not collapse
vale anvil
I think he tried to keep everyone from straight up butchering eachother
Despite the fact they literally fought out of what you can essentially call "hell"
hexed cosmos
Look, I know.
I am part of the problem.
It is the laws of Shalun that stop me from attempting to completely wipe out Cadar from the world. And it's the laws of Shalun that make sure that I resort to... less overt paths to screwing over Cadar.
vale anvil
Look. We can't unify the factions to fight off the Xeno who will have zero qualms about eating everyone regardless of flag
And the Narvs are worse.
hexed cosmos
Xeno threat?
That's cool, didn't ask Volpane.
I don't know what you're talking about.
vale anvil
Which is exactly why i lowkey feel Shalun died intentionally...
hexed cosmos
I'm willing to unite. Under Steel Song. No one else.
vale anvil
Say that again when the steel song worlds are getting collectively munched on.
Not that the other worlds won't be. But i imagine it is possible the Xeno will like the specific taste of steel song worlds or something
hexed cosmos
Nah, they'd go for Javat first I guarantee it
vale anvil
Oh no they're screwed outta the gate
But to be fair to them
They kinda stumble upon them the most
hexed cosmos
And I don't mean this to be disrespectful to Javat.
I respect them
vale anvil
I mean they literally "dig" the hives out on accident
hexed cosmos
Hey, someone's gotta dig.
vale anvil
Or intentionally if there are massive stores of something like IDK duranium
vale anvil
Bad if you dig em up
hexed cosmos
-# Warhammer 40k reference #17534123
vale anvil
Worse if they wake up armed and ready
hexed cosmos
But yeah, I'd rather Javat find them than they wake up without us noticing
vale anvil
Atleast if you dig em up you can just stick the end of a promethium lance in there and just SPRAY
Better then the alternative that's for sure
finite fog
It is strange how much space is needed for 1 passenger, and also how much a transport job costs. How often are normal gravs able to travel between planets? Are there specialized big ships that transport thousands of people to their jobs on different systems? How often would a normal grav go through a hyperwarp in their lifetime?
Also, salaries seem to be very small compared to what you can buy. For example, a Crass Straightblade can cost many years of crew/officer salary, when it is just one sword. Are these salaries small compared to stationary grav jobs because of the benefits of living forever, seeing many worlds, and spice halls?
hexed cosmos
I think the passenger cabins are large because passengers aren't complacent with "inadequate quarters" and the ships are actually overall kinda small.
Though prisoners... eh, I think that's just 'cause balancing or something.
As for the pay... it's actually more than grav jobs, from my understanding. At least, the typical grav.
...But no one is paid well in universe.
Except Star Traders themselves and the influential gravs (contacts)
finite fog
I wonder what people do with the xeno artifacts that are sold
hexed cosmos
Study them, take them to cults, display them proudly in front of a Templar... uh... Yeah that's all I got.
vale anvil
Study them, take them to cults, display them proudly in front of a Templar... uh...
Usually it ends up in cultist hands or studied or ending up in templar hands if the buyer is particularly an abject idiot. Or possibly a templar buys it and the only reason we're not immediately shot on sight is better for them to be supplied with it and then destroyed then ending up in the former 2's hands
I've atleast sold it directly to the templar before
worthy kestrel
Also, salaries seem to be very small compared to what you can buy. For example, ...
Well the thing the game doesn’t tell you is that we are basically getting paid in 100 dollar bills.
Like this is from the wiki, and I am sure it’s in the lore book or somewhere, but these swords are just that high quality
So while our crew isn’t making much in our eyes, they are basically setting up their families for life with just a month of working with us.
worthy kestrel
So while our crew isn’t making much in our eyes, they are basically setting up t...
Which does suck since they can never go back to being a faction citizen after this
hexed cosmos
No, they can
Only the Star Trader renounces citizenship.
The crew and officers only temporarily suspend their citizenship.
But they can return to life within in their Faction if they wish.
But kinda like what it was like in real life, a lot of people who choose a life in maritime, ended up staying in it for basically as long as they could. And unlike real life, they don't get old very quickly.
However, Star Traders can't return to being a Faction citizen. Though they're even less likely to want to, than the crew. You have to be a special kind of insane to be a Star Trader, I think.
vale anvil
However, Star Traders can't return to being a Faction citizen. Though they're ev...
I mean. I can't exactly blame the crew for wanting to go back as i repeatedly keep throwing them at Xeno nests and ships so the willingness to go back home is UNDERSTANDABLE
hexed cosmos
I mean they don't usually try to go back.
...You're one of the extra special kinds of insane Star Traders.
vale anvil
If they did i wouldn't blame them
hexed cosmos
I wouldn't want to be on your ship either to be honest
vale anvil
I wouldn't want to be on your ship either to be honest
No amount of pay would convince you would it ?
hexed cosmos
...That really depends. But at the same time, what good is money when fighting Xeno.
vale anvil
But i mean... If we just keep on winning
It's like gambling in a way. If you just keep on constantly winning you can't fathom losing
Which is kinda the point of the sheer level of insanity that being a star trader is
hexed cosmos
That basically adds up.
I prefer sticking to human opponents though.
I'll keep winning but against Cadar.
worthy kestrel
But they can return to life within in their Faction if they wish.
Honestly I am glad that we don’t have a retiring system for crew or whatever because it would be very annoying to have to constantly cycle crew after a while because they want out
hexed cosmos
Some of those that desert probably go back to their lives as a grav.
But the Quartermaster seems to imply that crew are under a bit of a contract to stay on board for a certain time. Obviously that would be kind of (very) annoying to deal with though.
Since their anti-desertion trait is something like "contract renegotiation".
I don't recall what it was entirely
But yeah, I know what you mean. Crew desertion is already a pain so imagine if it was just 'cause they were done instead of low morale.
worthy kestrel
But yeah, I know what you mean. Crew desertion is already a pain so imagine if i...
YUP. Conscription would be mandatory to refresh your supply of high level recruits.
vale anvil
But yeah, I know what you mean. Crew desertion is already a pain so imagine if i...
At some point you just gotta suspended belief a little. Cuz if ST:F was 100% lore accurate in gameplay then skitterlings for instance would be as big as the regular hunters
And hunters would be much bigger
And 100 or so years of advancement in weaponry only gets you so far.
It's stated plain as day that FDF's can barely beat down hunters with actual heavy weapons. Think 50 cal rifle equivalents
Getting into a melee fight with one is suicidal. So this same idea applies across the board
On different matters
hexed cosmos
I know. And I agree
mighty cypress
Andrew stopped her from spawning REAL quick once i mentioned it
I have seen her recently, but no story stuff
hexed cosmos
You know, I'm kinda curious about the legality of salvaging in the Star Traders universe.
It seems to be Mostly Legal™️
But some of the cards make it sound like it's an illegal act, and that you're doing it without the Factions' permission, between the overall rep loss card, the aggressive FDF Crew Combat Cards, etc.
Yet, at the same time, when you get just money cards, it also talks about how you just go sell salvage to the Faction's starport, and collect a salvaging fee basically.
mighty cypress
It's legal if you are friends with the faction and don't fuck things up for them... Getting a bad card means you fucked things up for someone and they take offense.
But some of the good cards are also illegal, you just didn't get caught.
It's very semiquasipseudolegal
hexed cosmos
So it's Mostly Legal™️
vale anvil
So it's *Mostly Legal*™️
Legal if you don't get caught/got enough money
mighty cypress
Untold Wealth is a money heist where you got away clean
And sometimes they slap a mission on you, that's always fun.
elfin wigeon
Alta Mesa ships still outmatch Cadar ships
Harbinger Carrier FTW 
mighty mirage
Harbinger Carrier FTW <:spice:363923291402010625>
Ought to load up an STF save of mine and check out my ships there
elfin wigeon
Ought to load up an STF save of mine and check out my ships there
A thing of beauty. At a cool 2 mils, you got the best out of Alta Mesa's Star Forge (to date)
elfin wigeon
A thing of beauty. At a cool 2 mils, you got the best out of Alta Mesa's Star Fo...
Granted, I'm playing in Normal, but it's always super satisying to blow all Xeno ships unlucky enough to waylay your travel in the Void to smithereens with it EASILY 🍻
elfin wigeon
A thing of beauty. At a cool 2 mils, you got the best out of Alta Mesa's Star Fo...
"Xenobane" is my nickname for it 
mighty mirage
My long term save isn't on my phone so it doesn't have my really powerful ships, but those Alta Mesa launch bays are some of my favorite
M9000 ships tend to be my preferred ships for the late game
elfin wigeon
M9000 ships tend to be my preferred ships for the late game
M9000 lineups are no joke, yes, but i just love Alta Mesa's overall designs, i mean they ARE your go-to shipbuilders in-universe
elfin wigeon
My long term save isn't on my phone so it doesn't have my really powerful ships,...
It's rather underutilized in my case tho, only used 4 out of 5, 1 Interdictor, 1 Bomber, and two Boarders
I mean, i got my capital weapons (the Cadar Lance especially) do the job for most part hha
mighty mirage
It's rather underutilized in my case tho, only used 4 out of 5, 1 Interdictor, 1...
Meanwhile I use two Bombers and 2 Interdictors, and with a Warhammer engine it's able to line up a powerful first strike.
Then it's missiles or autocannons until close enough to board
elfin wigeon
Meanwhile I use two Bombers and 2 Interdictors, and with a Warhammer engine it's...
Nice move. I use flash charge and park my ship at range 3 or 4 (no advancing further, maybe range 2 at most), and blast them with lance and ion cannon, and board when i'm bored hha
mighty mirage
I like missiles since they cover range 3-5, and autocannons are the best for small craft defense as far as I can tell. Flash charge is good to get up to range 4, and then attempt to move closer for a shuttle board talent with officers to mess things up early on
elfin wigeon
Meet Nghia von Haek, a top Naval Academy instructor/veteran Ace Pilot of Alta Mesa. He spearheaded the fighters with his MX9 Roxburn Interdictor.
elfin wigeon
I like missiles since they cover range 3-5, and autocannons are the best for sma...
yeap, autocannons the best for swatting those pesky small crafts out of existence
mighty mirage
Meet Nghia von Haek, a top Naval Academy instructor/veteran Ace Pilot of Alta Me...
A fine craft, the MX9 Roxburn
mighty mirage
yeap, autocannons the best for swatting those pesky small crafts out of existenc...
They are also great up close in boarding, just to continue chipping away at health and morale while the boarding team causes havoc inside
elfin wigeon
They are also great up close in boarding, just to continue chipping away at heal...
Yeah, ferocious crossfire + saboteur's boarding talent (forgot the name) and other talents are ALWAYS satisfying, especially when you could kill at least 3 hha
mighty mirage
Yeah, killing crew is actually pretty effective on them, especially since it works for both Xeno and other enemies. Having two Interdictors also means they can be used to support the ship and it's defense so much more too
stark matrix
I'd take DV for just their ability to literally sell biomass for more then 40x i...
When dealing with shit in many forms and vectors, everything becomes a currency. 😉
stark matrix
Me, I prefer the independents if they were at all a workable faction.
I really hope that the Indies become even more prevalent in the future. Seems like that might be a pivotal plot point for the next game.
Bring back Captain Duels!