thread-archived

[ocean mauve]

What are the correct selections for these?

[vast sierra]

For the device, I have selected the obvious SkyConnect option in my list:

/dev/serial/by-id/usb-Nabu_Casa_SkyConnect_v1.0_

Baud rate
460800

[ocean mauve]

Yeah I have these

[vast sierra]

What do the logs say?

[spring bramble]

Your router shouldnt be handling mdns at all - mdns is just a multicast technique that works out of the box if multicast can travel freely over the layer 2 network.

Things get broken when a router (such as Unifi) actually tries to be smart and forward/shape mdns traffic (even worse: over different vlans) - that is pure evil. We have seen mdns forwarders overloading the network with packets, malforrming them etc. I cant recommend them for simple IPv4 based mdns dependent IoT like Airplay and Chromecast but for Matter (especially Matter over Thread) it will actually just break it.

So for Matter its actually best to have a stupid simple consumer-grade network setup, then it will work great (as long as there are no bugs in the hardware). Most issues we see reported here, on Github and the forums are with people running (semi) professional network gear like Unifi, Omada etc.

[vale cliff]

Aw man I hate consumer grade stuff, MikroTik actually lets me configure my network exactly how I want it to be

So is my only solution then to get a worse router if I want Matter over Thread to work smoothly?

[twin vine]

Its not the fact it wont work, more that you might get it working, then the orientation of the sun will change slightly and it will all fall to shit

[spring bramble]

Maybe I should have been a bit more specific. Matter (along with many other protocols like Chromecast and Airplay, Homekit etc) is designed for normal domestic home networking setups. There it should work out of the box. If you run more enterprise oriented network hardware, you will have more work to set it up and a higher chance of getting into trouble. The best advise I can give there is to stay away from so called "multicast optimizations" as they optimize the situation in enterprise setups where multicast is limited to the minimum, but it will hurt these home protocols. Keep the setup simple and then start enabling more advanced features until it breaks is the best advise I can give. Many folks here have it working on network gear like Unifi and Omada after toggling the right settings. Golden rule of thumb is to not route it over vlans.

[rich river]

In essence, mentally take your router out of the setup entirely and just work on everything having to have flat L2 connectivity, i.e. your typical standard non-technical user's network 🙂
If you keep HA, your TBRs, any WiFi Matter devices, and your phone on the same L2 network, and you turn off any mDNS/multicast stuff on your router, then it should work irrespective of what router you have, whether UniFi, Omada, MikroTik, pfSense, Cisco, etc, etc. 🙂
As soon as you have to send mDNS/Matter/etc traffic via the router stuff is likely to go wrong!

[sick swan]

mDNS doesn't need any particular support, it just needs to support multicast which basically all switches /router do today.

[twin vine]

Aka you might need to install the multicast package on routerOS 😅

[sick swan]

Hm, but reading up, "you need a thread border router" sounds not like @vale cliff has a mDNS issue.

And this indicates that syncing just failed? 🤔

I think we need a bit more systematic approaches debugging these issues.

[bronze fog]

What's the easiest way to get the clear text thread credentials in an iOS/tvOS environment? I ordered the Nordic nRF Thread topoogy monitor and USB dongle. The software needs the clear text thread credentials to join the network and visually show the topology.

[spark hornet]

Suggest you stay away from SmartWings, their Matter solution has many problems. The only better choice is Eve MotionBlinds

[vale cliff]

I'm all ears, however from a boatload of forum posts this multicast package solutions seems like it might be the key.

[vast sierra]

Sadly, some of the decision is not just mine. They have the styles and variety my wife prefers.

I'm going to be in their asses about updates.

They shades have been stellar, other than the devices freaking out and becoming unavailable occasionally.

[vale cliff]

I downloaded every package I could grab from the Mikrotik site and disabled the ones I don't use after installing them, but none of them outright said multicast at all.

https://help.mikrotik.com/docs/display/ROS/Packages

This site reccommends going here for downloads:
https://mikrotik.com/download

But none of the package bundles for arm64 contained any specifically labelled multicast

[vale cliff]

Ugh christ the multicast package is only in way older versions of the archive, can I even install it with everything else?

I'm on the latest stable

[ocean mauve]

My open thread instance is producing this log after the haos 13.1 upgrade

[serene prawn]

@ocean mauve I converted your message into a file since it's above 15 lines :+1:

[ocean mauve]

It was working fine before the update

[upbeat cairn]

Unplug it, plug it back in, and then restart the addon

[sick swan]

@vale cliff what is the current issue you are facing? Still that "you need a thread border router" error? What commissioning method are you using?

[spring bramble]

Like said before by me and others you don't need that - your router has nothing to do with matter/thread.
Just make sure that everything is on the same L2 network and you're done.

[vale cliff]

My HAOS is being run as a VM on a Proxmox server which has an ethernet connection to my router, my router uses a bridge to have all ethernet ports (except for the WAN port) on the same 10.0.0.x subnet

And I have a SkyConnect with USB passed through to the VM

So I think it's all on the same L2 network? But then again if the SkyConnect is making a Thread network on it's own then I think that's a separate L2 network from like my WiFi and ethernet connections

[spring bramble]

Ok, so no routinhg involved ? Just bridging then ? In that case no problem.

[spring bramble]

Yes but then OTBR is the "border router" between the Thread radio network (which is just IPv6!) and your regukar network

If I remember correctly you had an error about no border router found, that has nothing to do with actual networking

But with the thread credentials on your phone. Do you have an iphone or android device ?

[vale cliff]

iPhone

Hate this damn thing, switched to it unwillingly in highschool.

Getting a Pixel 9 once they're out of pre-order and the RCS update ships to stable on iOS

Pixel 9 has Thread protocol support 🤤

Why would a phone need that? I have no idea! But it'll be cool to experiment with!

[spring bramble]

You wont be able to use it - and btw iphone has that as well, also unusable 😉

[vale cliff]

Oh cool I'm gonna save money and get an 8a then lmao

That was straight up the only thing I cared about for the 9 series

[spring bramble]

So when commissioning devices, we use the sdk on the phone itself to do the initial pairing, hence its important that the phone knows about the credentials of the thread network

Since you have no Apple Thread network, we need to tell it that you have a skyconnect Thread network

On the phone open the HA Companion app and go to Settings --> Thread --> Configure

You should see a button to sync the credentials "import to phone"

[vale cliff]

Okay did that

Then do I use the nanoleaf app to pair them or the HomeKit app?

[spring bramble]

BTW: All this is also in the documentation: https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/thread/#case-1-making-home-assistant-your-first-thread-network

[spring bramble]

The HA app

Matter device or homekit over Thread ?

[vale cliff]

Matter device

Also I found the credentials section and it has like three different Thread credentials in it from repeated failed attempts to do this right, woops

Can I clear those from my phone

In debugging > thread

[sick swan]

I think is a problem on iPhone other reported too. Or are you aware of a way @spring bramble ?

[spring bramble]

Yes there should be a way embedded in the iOS app - I at least used that once but I cant remember if that is also in the current app. We will have to ask @old niche about that.

[ocean mauve]

Thanks, this worked!

[old niche]

No, deleting credentials is not available in prod, just in that specific build I made for you, the task is on my backlog.

[vast chasm]

Failed to store thread credential in keychain

For the record, I had this issue and was able to resolve it.

If anyone runs fancy network setups, make sure that your HA instance and any relevant devices are connected to the same network on the same subnet

I had my HA instance on a different subnet as I wanted to divide my LAN and Proxmox VMs, and I happen to run HAOS in Proxmox.

Figured it might be a subnet issue, so I switched a few things over and, well, it worked.

[vale cliff]

Alright now it's at least not saying there isn't a thread border router but it just tried for a few minutes to connect and failed.

When I try to use the Nanoleaf app it says no network found the moment I try

[marble perch]

your phone also needs to be in the same vlan as the the thread border router (specifically, it has to be able to receive ipv6 router announcements from the border router, and resolve mdns queries answered by the border router)

[sick swan]

Yeah Google and Apple require besides the credential a border router as reference (or something like that). And it seems that at least Apple validates that this border router can indeed be found on the network (presuably via mDNS/DNS-SD)

[vale cliff]

Well shit I think that's my issue, somene above mentioned to me that iOS has thread border router connection capabilities but that it's broken

What brand of smart phone is it not scuffed on?

Pixel 9 is supposed to have thread protocol support officially

But people have been setting this stuff up since before then so

Idk

[marble perch]

setup happens with the phone initially talking to the device over bluetooth to configure the thread network credentials, then is finalized by the phone talking to the device via the thread border router (which requires mdns lookup to find the thread device's ip address, and working ipv6 routing from the phone to the thread network)

[vale cliff]

I think that's where my problem is and why so many posts talk about needing mDNS

Because my phone is on my WiFi network and that shit is NOT on IPv6

Well at least I don't think it is

I should check

Yeah I don't think it is, I don't even have a DHCP server for IPv6 setup on it

Which from what I understand I shouldn't need one?

But still nothing has IPv6 addresses except for my bridge interface

[marble perch]

the phone needs to have a non-link-local ipv6 address in order to talk to the thread device

[vale cliff]

Could you explain to my dumbass what a non-link-local address is, I understand IPv4 a lot better than I do v6, I know how the naming scheme for v6 works but the rulesets still fuck with me

[marble perch]

if the phone is on the same link as the thread border router that's supposed to happen automatically, since the thread border router should (in the absence of any other ipv6) send out router annoucements with an ipv6 ula.

i used used "non-link-local" to mean pretty much any unicast address other than than "link local" type, since link local addresses cannot be routed by routers. link local addresses are the ones that start with fe80:

[vale cliff]

Ahhhhh yeah my bridge has a link local address

So should I set up a DHCP pool for IPv6 then?

Or what if I just made a static IPv6 address just for my Homeassistant VM?

[marble perch]

it should be sufficient to just have the home assistant and phone on the same network segment as the thread border router, assuming the tbr is using the recommended method of sending out router announcements.

if the phone or ha are on different network segments, then things get a lot harder, since that means your routers have to be set up to know to send traffic for the thread subnet via the thread border router.

and also you need working mdns relaying :/

[vale cliff]

Wouldn't they have to be on different network segments by nature? I only have one subnet that being 10.0.0.x but IPv6 is on a completely different scheme altogether

Not becuase I've specified another one but like, there's no DHCPv6 server

Only regular DHCP

[vale cliff]

So I DO need a multicast package, I am getting such mixed feedback on this lmao

[rich river]

You only need multicast and mDNS on your router if, and only if, you have different parts of your setup on different L2 networks / VLANs, and even then it’s not recommended to do that as it really doesn’t work well.
If you have everything (HA, thread border router, phone) on the same network, so that they don’t have to go via the main router to talk, then you don’t need anything extra on your router, as they’ll talk direct to each other.
You shouldn’t even need DHCPv6 enabled as it’s all designed to work with local addressing.

[vale cliff]

Everything physically communicates through a MikroTik hAP ax3 which is layer 3 but since I only have one subnet it should be all on the same layer 2 connection right?

[rich river]

So if “everything” is on the same network with the exact same subnet, then they should all be able to talk to each other without going via the MikroTik, so you don’t need to do anything on the MikroTik.

[vapid shell]

The microtik has 4 Ethernet ports if that’s what you mean. Normally even though it’s physically the same device, topologically it’s a switch bolted on to a router. So layer 2 traffic is switched and does go through the router OS.

[vale cliff]

So if my phone is on WiFi and the VM is running through a bridge on Proxmox into a port on the router then it's going through a layer 3 routed connection then?

[vale cliff]

I'm pretty sure they are but I'm not certain if IPv6 is considered apart of this network layout

[vapid shell]

It should still be layer 2

[rich river]

Is your WiFi on the same subnet as your wired connection?

[vale cliff]

Yes

[vapid shell]

Some routers do split them in to 2 subnets to reduce pressure from multicast traffic, but you’d have different ip ranges for Ethernet and WiFi

[rich river]

So the WiFi is probably bridged to the same L2 network as the wired ports, so not an issue

[vale cliff]

Damn I have no idea what the problem is then

My phone says I can upgrade the nanoleaf bulbs to thread, it recognizes them, it tried to commission them, the Home Assistant VM is getting an IPv6 address, but it just won't commission it

I feel like I'm even more lost than I was at the start lmao

[rich river]

You mentioned before that you’re running HA on Proxmox?
Wider question to anyone here using Proxmox, is there anything special you need to do for HA?

[vapid shell]

Are they homekit bulbs (I scrolled back further and they are not)

Can you send me a diagnostic download from the thread integration? I can at least check Ha can see your border router

Make sure you do it from the part of Ha that shows a list of border routers with vendor logos, it’ll be missing info otherwise

Did you get them working in the homekit app at all?

[marble perch]

yeah, talking about "subnets" is kind of misleading, since that's a different layer of the stack than what matters here. you can (and will, with ipv4+ipv6) have multiple subnets on the same L2 network segment.

a fun thing about thread devices is that you can literally just "ping" them; it's ip traffic so a lot of normal network diagnosis tools work.

[bronze fog]

Is there a way to grab the clear text Thread credentias that the ATVs shared with HA (Thread Master key)? I have a Windows Thread topology mapper program that uses a Thread USB dongle and it needs the thread network creds to join and map out all my devices.

[soft sequoia]

Hi there, so am pairing my devices with Home Assistant and with my Nanoleaf Essentail lightbulbs (A19 Thread) I'm encountering issues to a high level of Frustration.

I cannot seem to pair it, I tried connecting to HK and disconnect. Then it appears and can add it as HomeKit deivce, but getting this error: This accessory is already paired to another device. Please reset the accessory and try again.

When I reset the device I cannot discover it. Unless I turn on my bluetooth on HA. Also able to pair it, however it remains on Bluetooth and doesn't swith to Thread

What am I doing wrong here?

[marble perch]

after you have it connected to home assistant via bluetooth, you should be able to join it to the thread network following the instructions here: https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/homekit_controller#to-add-a-homekit-device-to-a-thread-network-via-home-assistant if HA has the thread credentials for a network and has it set as the preferred thread network.

[soft sequoia]

Thank you!! That worked!! Amazing!!

[haughty blade]

Hey everyone, for almost a year now I've been having issues with my Matter / Thread network and its driving me nuts. I redid my network hoping that would help (and a reason to because i wanted to) and now the OpenThread Border Router won't start at all and I can't contact any Matter devices (only bulbs / switches right now) with logs ending with:
INFO: mDNS ended with exit code 4 (signal 0)...
s6-rc: info: service mdns successfully stopped

I have a reddit post with logs and details (https://www.reddit.com/r/homeassistant/comments/1ezodoh/skyconnect_matter_thread_woes/) but I can post it here as well. I would appreciate any help! This is really getting to me now!

[slender willow]

Have you tried setting autoflash_firmware: false?

[haughty blade]

I set autoflash to false, also set flow_control: false and firewall: false

[serene prawn]

@haughty blade I converted your message into a file since it's above 15 lines :+1:

[haughty blade]

and current config:
device: >- /dev/serial/by-id/usb-Nabu_Casa_SkyConnect_v1.0_8c1b6475b796ed119af3be98a7669f5d-if00-port0 baudrate: "115200" flow_control: false autoflash_firmware: false otbr_log_level: debug firewall: false nat64: false

[upbeat cairn]

Uninstall the addon and re-install it. The default settings are correct for it (baudrate needs to change, as does flow_control, as does autoflash_firmware)

[haughty blade]

I uninstalled / reinstalled OpenThread Border Router, only changed the device to the SkyConnect and saved. I got the same errors, BUT I then uninstalled / reinstalled the Silicon Labs Multiprotocol add-in - only updating the device to SkyConnect. Looks like when I did that, OpenThread BR was able to start successfully, so it seems like they are conflicting with each other? Now, the SL Multiprotocol addin is throwing the same errors OpenThread was. I tried changing the Baudrate for the Multiprotocol add-in but no dice and still no matter connections according to HA. Restarted HA just to test, still no luck. Will add some new logs on my Matter server Add-in in case that helps?

[haughty blade]

<Node:32> Setting-up node... 2024-08-26 10:58:06.033 (MainThread) DEBUG [matter_server.server.sdk] <Node:32> Attempting to establish CASE session... (attempt 1 of 2) 2024-08-26 10:58:34.909 (MainThread) DEBUG [matter_server.server.client_handler] [549382268688] Connected from 192.168.3.6 2024-08-26 10:58:37.050 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.DIS] Timeout waiting for mDNS resolution. 2024-08-26 10:58:51.040 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.DIS] OperationalSessionSetup[1:0000000000000020]: operational discovery failed: src/lib/address_resolve/AddressResolve_DefaultImpl.cpp:119: CHIP Error 0x00000032: Timeout 2024-08-26 10:58:54.045 (MainThread) DEBUG [matter_server.server.sdk] <Node:32> Establishing CASE session took 48.0 seconds 2024-08-26 10:58:54.046 (MainThread) INFO [matter_server.server.sdk] <Node:32> Attempting to establish CASE session... (attempt 2 of 2) 2024-08-26 10:59:25.053 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.DIS] Timeout waiting for mDNS resolution. 2024-08-26 10:59:39.049 (Dummy-2) CHIP_ERROR [chip.native.DIS] OperationalSessionSetup[1:0000000000000020]: operational discovery failed: src/lib/address_resolve/AddressResolve_DefaultImpl.cpp:119: CHIP Error 0x00000032: Timeout

[upbeat cairn]

Let's back up for a moment. You have the Multiprotocol addon installed as well?

[haughty blade]

Yes, for some left over Zigbee devices but I still have my old Zigbee stick and would be fine using that and not multiprotocol

[upbeat cairn]

Each addon actually installs different firmware to the stick

If you run two, it's a race to see which one manages to do it first 😄

[haughty blade]

That would make sense... Should I be able to use just multi protocol then? and I wouldn't need OpenThread?

[upbeat cairn]

No, split it up. One stick for Zigbee, one stick for Thread via the OpenThread addon

I would do it this way: get it working again with multiprotocol and then use the hardware migration to disable multiprotocol, it'll migrate your Zigbee network back to Zigbee firmware and make sure your network works. After that, set up your second stick with Thread

[haughty blade]

Gotcha - let me take an even further step back because its been forever since I've looked at this now. My ZHA integration actually looks like its pointing to my Nortek HUSBZB-1 which is still plugged in so I wonder if I just never actually finished migrating it off that device, only Sky Connect, so seems like they are already separated. I had my first kid around the same time I was switching some stuff over so my memory is fuzzy.

So right now I have OpenThread working, MultiProtocol turned off. My matter Server is still complaining about mDNS resolution though and not communicating with any devices still.

Edit: I did not know I would have to re-pair Matter devices since I changed the SSID of the network / it lives on a different subnet now too. Re-pairing so far has been successful. Thank you for the help!

[full meadow]

Hello, is there any known hub/device like the zbt-1 but ip based? I have homeassistant running on a vmware cluster and would prefer not plugging it in in one of those servers in case a host goes down. I've tried the usbip mounter addon but that was quite unreliable and wouldn't remount devices when home assistant restarted

[stark jewel]

SLZB-06M, although I have not used it for thread myself, only zigbee. Works

Any ideas how to further debug issues with adding first device (aqara u200) to HA via thread? I have conbee II with thread firmware installed. I’m using official docs (so companion app has credentials synced on android, thread network is preferred, I’m using 2,4Ghz, I’m clicking „set” button on the u200 etc etc).

According to smlight docs that lists steps when adding the device to the thread/matter, I should have these steps

Connecting to device...
Generating Matter credentials...
Connecting device to network...
Checking network connectivity...

This step time-outs with an error which says “Can’t connect with the Thread network ha-thread-1b97”
Connecting device to Home Assistant... (I’m not reaching this step)
Device connected! (I’m not reaching this step)

[full meadow]

thanks, but I do need a device with thread. although I've read something that I can modify it's firmware to get it working? I think i'll just order one and try it out, thanks

[stark jewel]

It supports thread, you don’t even need custom firmware. You can just choose one with thread or thread and zigbee. I’m using zigbee because I needed stable one, thread is marked here as beta

[full meadow]

https://i.imgur.com/43An8b9.png do you know by any chance if there's a way to clean this up?

I've tried the aqara m3 today and it seems to have completely messed up my thread network ://

I'd prefer to keep everything under the home assistant network if possible

[twin vine]

How are two Apple devices on the aqara mesh network lol

Anyways, without a factory reset, no

[full meadow]

well I'm ready to factory reset everything I need to

I've tried resetting my home pods but they rejoined the thread network

https://developer.apple.com/documentation/threadnetwork/thclient/deletecredentials(forborderagent:completion:) well maybe I can use this but I'd have to recompile the ios app for that. too bad home assistant doesn't offer this

If anyone knows some way to fix this without messing with the ios code or could tell me what I need to reset to remove the entries from my keychain, please let me know :)

[twin vine]

I mean, you have have to get the credentials from the keychain, which should be the myhome network, then setup from there

From experience with googles way of it. You need to reset both of the ones on the aqara network to “remove” it. Wait a bit. Then set them up. Making sure they join the my home one

[full meadow]

I fixed it by deleting my home, and resetting all my home pods as well as my network settings on my iPhone. Not sure if all that was necessary but it works now

[jaunty elbow]

Can somebody help me to find the issue, why my homeassistant-os kvm on ubuntu 24.04 server is not able to add matter / thrread devices?

This is my kvm network config:

 <interface type='direct' trustGuestRxFilters='yes'>
      <mac address='52:54:00:0a:0f:12'/>
      <source dev='eno1' mode='bridge'/>
      <model type='virtio'/>
      <link state='up'/>
      <address type='pci' domain='0x0000' bus='0x01' slot='0x00' function='0x0'/>
    </interface>

• ipv6 is enabled on my router, on the kvm host and on the kvm-hass-vm
• I did the "troubleshot ->Sync thread device" in the companion app

But everytime when I try to add an thread matter device like my Nuki lock Pro v4, I got:

Failed generating device credentials

There was an error while trying to generate credentials for the device

[safe latch]

adding from an Android phone? Sync'ed the credentials? I feel like getting thread to work is a massive achievement, after a week and reseting everything, I finally got HA OTBR working along with ordering a skyconnect stick to use as dedicated thread device. Turned on a google home display(which doesn't support thread but 🤷‍♂️ ) so google would let me add matter devices at all.

[jaunty elbow]

Yes I tried two different android phones and I sync evertime the thread credentials in the troubleshooting area of the app. Did you mean these thread credentials?

Last time I spent almost 2 weeks for a test-setup. Started with docker and realized that otbr as a docker makes more problems then just installing a kvm with hassOS. After a while it worked.

I am using a sonoff stick with rcp software on it.

Is there any chance to test something on in a shell?
I plugged in now a usb-3 to lan adapter and passed this to my kvm. But I got the same error. This means it can not be a Ubuntu network issue...

Any tipps please! I am a bit down...

[safe latch]

I have no idea as that setup is outside my knowledge, I'm using a yellow. What stick are you using for thread?

Sonoff?

Have you watched through the home assistant YouTube video on setup? By HA themselves?

[jaunty elbow]

did you mean this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk0n0r0eKcE

[jaunty elbow]

Sonoff ZBDongle-E, flashed with OpenThread RCP by by darkxst. I used this webflasher: https://darkxst.github.io/silabs-firmware-builder/

[jaunty elbow]

Its interesting that, when I just install matter-add-on but no openthread addon, I got the same error message.

Failed generating device credentials

There was an error while trying to generate credentials for the device

[spiral junco]

@denschub you worked out how to map from the RLOC shown in OTBR web UI back to a device that I could see in HA's Matter info, or no?

[spiral junco]

is there a path for using the OpenThread CLI against the HA OTBR (as installed via add-on on a SkyConnect)? I don't see any way to get direct access to the device through the HA console -- maybe I'm missing it. Or is there a way to connect the CLI to the OTBR via REST?

[jaunty elbow]

For everybody who want to get sure that there google thread and matter sub-modules are successfully loaded. Here are two adb commands to check that.
https://developers.home.google.com/matter/verify-services

adb shell dumpsys activity provider com.google.android.gms.chimera.container.GmsModuleProvider | grep "com.google.android.gms.home"

is resultung in my case on a raphael (xiaomi mi 9t pro) phone with LOS and gapps installed:

com.google.android.gms.home_stub [v243333000]
com.google.android.gms.home [v243333000]

and

adb shell dumpsys activity provider com.google.android.gms.chimera.container.GmsModuleProvider | grep "com.google.android.gms.threadnetwork"

is resulting on my raphael:

com.google.android.gms.threadnetwork [v243333000]

[graceful geode]

I have a eve motionblind that I'm trying to connect over thread with skyconnect usb stick. But when I scan the QR code with the home assistant app it's giving me this error message:
can't connect to nest-pan-234F

what can I do to start diagnosing this issue?

I think we just have to reset the blind

it still says can't connect to thread network net-pan-234F, what can I do to diagnose this issue? Are there any tools for figuring out why thread isn't connecting?

[serene prawn]

@graceful geode I converted your message into a file since it's above 15 lines :+1:

[quaint osprey]

My router, an TP-Link Omada, doesn't have IPv6 ULA, but I'm noticing my Thread devices have a IP like fd6a:a34:920a...

Is it possible my HomePods or HomeAssistant is generating a new IPv6 ULA?

[vapid shell]

Yes, that’s exactly how typically thread works

Even if there are other ULAs on the network segment it will still use its own

[safe latch]

whats the preferred network in home assistant?

[crude willow]

Did you reset the connection first? Hold the program button for 10 seconds until led blinks 5 times.

[verbal knoll]

😄

[jaunty elbow]

ohh man. I still have no clue what is wrong with my setup. Is here anybody who can help me a bit? 😩
*Connect my kvm hassOS to a seprate USB-Network adapter to avoid kvm-network on my ubuntu as a problem
*checked my matter and thread libs with the aboved mentioned adb commands
*used multiple android phones to add the matter devices. always the error: "Failed generating device credentials"
*checked always the Thread-Creds on the android hass app (in trobleshooting area of the app)
*try to different OpenThread sticks, the Sonoff ZBDongle-E (setup: baudrate 460800, nat64 on, flow-control on, firmware OpenThread (RCP) SL-OPENTHREAD/2.4.3.0_GitHub-7074a43e4) and Easyiot ZB-GW04 Revision v1.2 (setup: baudrate , nat64 on, flow-control on, firmware OpenThread (RCP) SL-OPENTHREAD/2.4.3.0_GitHub-7074a43e4)
*add-on matter does not show any errors
*add-on openthread-border-router does not show any errors

[graceful geode]

Yes. But it looks like the network keeps being remembered. The person I did this for was rather dissapointed because we couldn't get it working. So he wanted to return the home assistant. Mainly because he wants all of his current hardware to work and not having to deal with connecting everything directly to home assistant. Where some devices also aren't supported. He's going back to google home

[crude willow]

If you can't get it to work this trick might work.

Do a full reset

• short press program button , next hold for 20 seconds until 5 blinks. You do need to re program the end limits.

Turn off the motor by turning it in to transport mode. Hold program button and pull twice to turn it off. Repeat this step to turn it back on

It should work after that for sure

[graceful geode]

He's already returned the home assistant. The other thing was that he had several hubs and he had hardware that didn't support home assistant. So he wants something that initially works with all of his devices instead of buying hardware that works with home assistant.

Which I personally don't have a problem with. I love my own home assistant. And I'm willing to buy what works best

But if you already have the hardware I kinda get it

And I'm sure you can get the blinders working.

[graceful geode]

And some of his other equipment. But not all of it. Specifically this one for example:

Tapo magslim lidar vacuum robot

[nocturne sundial]

Hi all, i have just bought the ZBT-1 so i can setup a thread network but not sure if i am running an incompatible setup for it. I am running docker.io/homeassistant/home-assistant:stable in podman (from root) and exposed the device to the container (--device /dev/ttyUSB0) which it discovers and offers to configure when HA starts up.

I have already flashed the USB to the thread firmware so i selected thread when i configure the ZBT in HA but then i just keep getting:

"The OpenThread Border Router addon can only be installed with Home Assistant OS. If you would like to use the Home Assistant Connect ZBT-1 as an Thread border router, please flash the firmware manually using the web flasher and set up OpenThread Border Router to communicate with it."

This seems a very conflicting message, i can only use OTBR in HAOS but it advises i setup the firmware (already done) and then configure OTBR. Quite confused...

Any help appreciated, thanks.

Cant find any documentation to configure the OBTR outside of HA on the ZBT if that's what it means which seems like it would be a well linked page if it did exist.

[jaunty elbow]

Its a shit show to run an OTBR outside of HassOS. Believe me, its terrible. I try everything, really everything to get it to work 8 month ago. Withing this trial and error, I installed a hassOS kvm/qemu and it worked really fast. But as you can see in my post here from yesterday matter/thread makes me headache again and its still unsolved.

I reallly really do not recommend you to run your ZBT outside of HassOS. Sorry for the hard words but I waste to much time into my docker setup with otbr-docker and homeassitant + matter as docker.

[nocturne sundial]

Uuurgh, thought that might be case. Docs and the popups seem to suggest that this is perfectly fine just as it leads down a dark alleyway with bad men that want to take my hard earned 30quid 🥺

[jaunty elbow]

I also got very far 8 months ago, I would say. I think the biggest problem at the end were the ipv6 settings. Apparently they patched the Linux from hassOS because the magic ipv6 packets flow through better. At least that's how I think I understood it... 😄

But I did a lot with multiprotocol, let's just not start talking about that ;/

[slender willow]

Fwiw, this is likely the Linux kernel you‘re talking about: https://github.com/home-assistant/operating-system/blob/dev/buildroot-external/patches/linux/0001-ipv6-add-option-to-explicitly-enable-reachability-te.patch
It really is easiest to use HAOS. I switched from HA in a container for the same reason.

[nocturne sundial]

Ah, ok. I cant remember what I set for IPV6 on the host. I will take a look into getting that setup. I am guessiong i am looking for a functional IPV6 within the container to confirm that should be sufficient for the zbt to function?

[hushed cliff]

I'll +1 that as an extremely stubborn person who just wanted to keep their docker compose setup because everything else on that machine was docker compose, it was well worth it to just setup haos in a KVM

Thread works how and haos is nicer to use compared to the docker. Having it as a VM didn't change my setup at all and added a lot of functionality outside of thread

Pass the skyconnect through as a serial/by-id device, don't use the bus ID like the home assistant guide says. You do this by editing the VM XML and adding a serial device in the devices block. This was important for me because my sonoff ZigBee dongle uses the same chip as the skyconnect and shows up with the same IDs

[rigid kayak]

Hey just checking in to see how everything is going with your SmartWings shades from last week? I'm in the process of adding about 8 shades to my cart and I'm really agnozing over the radio choices. HK over thread for 79 extra each or 94 for matter over thread just seems like a massive cost increase compared to Zigbee for 29. It would be an extra 500 bucks or so for the whole order to upgrade from Zigbee to Matter over thread. Curious if you had it to do over again would you still have gone with matter?

and @bronze fog curious for your take as well

[bronze fog]

My thread/matter shades still drop out here and there. Otherwise good. I’d suggest zigbee or HK.

[rigid kayak]

Thanks, yeah I've had really good luck with Z2M over the years so I think I might just save myself the 500 and expose the shades to HK through home assistant.

[potent tangle]

@rigid kayak if I had to do it over again, I'd have gone with a completely different brand. I deeply regret going with SmartWIngs for my shades.

Granted, I have 19 of their MoT shade motors in my condo so I'm far more likely to experience issues than most. But I have multiple motors that make clicking noises now. The way they mount is just a terrible design. Relative to most of the other brands, it's a real PITA to put up or take down longer shades. Also a few months back one of the mounts on the end of one of my longer shades broke, which then caused a cascade of failures of the rest of the mounts and the shade crashed onto my concrete floors.

@vast sierra SmartWings support is brutally awful. They were telling me the same thing months ago. I think they tell you that just to try and get you to go away. I persisted, and eventually they finally told me that the shades could not be updated at all, and that they would have to replace the motor entirely.

They eventually sent me (and I believe @bronze fog) a MoT to RF bridge to instead control the shades by RF. They claimed that bridge would be upgradeable but I took one look at the instructions, laughed/cried, and demanded a refund for at least the cost of my 19 shade motors. They obliged, but I'm still not happy. They would have to pay me far more than I paid for these shades to make the amount of time I've wasted on them worthwhile.

Are you using that Inovelli switch to control the shades somehow? E.g., using the dimming function to set the shade height?

[tired surge]

How can I download a Thread network dataset from the Thread Intergation in HA WebUI ?

I only found the 'Dataset id'.

I would like to get these missing parameters:

• network_key
• pskc

https://imgur.com/a/wVNLGmB

https://imgur.com/VnDgndb

[tired surge]

I would like to get get these keys to join Thread nodes to my Thread network (running on my AppleTV devices + 1 Home Assistant OTBR).

[jaunty elbow]

It works. Was able to add my Nuki Thread lock and my two Zemismart Thread Curtain driver.
The problem was.....

My two Android Phones. Both above Android 8 (I guess 12 and 10). But both had Gapps installed on a custom rom.

The last time I had this terrible issues was 8 month ago and there was a official Xiaomi phone with official gapps installed the problem...

My successor this time was Fairphone 5 with stock os.

[marble perch]

if home assistant has the credentials for the network, you should see "Active dataset TLVs" when you click the ⓘ icon, which has all the information to connect to the network encoded in it. I don't know why that's not showing up for you, HA says it has thread credentials from the OTBR in your thread network :/

[fickle mantle]

Trying to help someone on the HA Community Forum who has sent their HA Thread credentials to their iOS HA Companion App, but along they way they have done this several times and now have around 5 or 6 different Thread dataset/credentials in their Apple Key chain (according to the Companion App's Debugging Thread display). Is there a way to delete these Thread dataset/credentials from their keychain? or know which one is actually used?

[finite widget]

good news: thread is 100% fixed https://www.theverge.com/2024/9/4/24235097/thread-1-4-spec-launch-matter-smart-home-problems

[quick bronze]

1.5 will fix the problems introduced by 1.4?

[vast sierra]

Nothing remotely that fancy yet.

Simply have it set to smart bulb mode, since I have hues in the ceiling on that switch

With the up and down triggering automations for the on/off lighting.

I have another about 12 ft away from my HA box that is stock settings and seems fine

But signal test is still yellow

Its red on the one I'm having trouble with.
Working at Switch is in between the SkyConnect and the Flakey switch

I thought the switches worked as mesh nodes for thread.

SkyConnect is using an extension cable, and is hanging outside my network cabinet just to rule that out

[vast sierra]

That's wild. They said October would have an OTA update.

Incredible Product, but the tech support/reliability is a bummer

[half bluff]

Is OTBR going to be updated to 1.4?

[vast sierra]

Now that you've planted that idea, sounds awesome.

[spark hornet]

Considering they are using HooRii's Matter 1.1 motor solution, I don't think SmartWings will deliver on the OTA promise unless you can get a more accurate response from SmartWings (evidence)😂

[tired surge]

Thread 1.4 Features White Paper https://www.threadgroup.org/Portals/0/Documents/Thread_1.4_Features_White_Paper_September_2024.pdf

[bronze fog]

Yes I laughed at the RF/Matter bridge as well. They are such a joke.

[slender willow]

After several days of stability, half of my Thread devices are offline again. The OTBR log is spammed with NoRoute errors like this: Dropping IPv6 UDP msg, len:54, chksum:c598, ecn:no, sec:yes, error:NoRoute, so I assume there is some IPv6 connectivity issue. Any idea how to debug this?

[sick swan]

Do you have multiple BRs?

[slender willow]

Yes. 3x AppleTV 4K (running tvOS 18), 1 Aqara M3, 1x ZBT-1

In addition, there are 6x Eve Energy acting as routers

[sick swan]

Hm, I wonder if some TREL link fail 🤔

[slender willow]

TIL about TREL.

[sick swan]

TREL essentially forwards packets to other BR via WiFi/Ethernet.

Apple BR's support TREL, so if OTBR deems that the target device is closer to an Apple BR, then it will try forward it.

[slender willow]

Reading https://github.com/orgs/openthread/discussions/8478 now

[sick swan]

But this could also be another issue 😅

What is interesting that only half o them are unavailable. Is there a pattern which one those are? Are they in one part of the house or something?

[slender willow]

So what I observe is that occasionally whole segments of the Thread network go down

I don't see a pattern. Sometimes it's only one of two Eve Door & Window sensors attached to adjacent windows close to the very same BR

[sick swan]

So one thing you can do is see if the Matter operational discovery is published for this device. For that you need a mDNS discovery tool

[slender willow]

Which mDNS service should I look for? _meshcop._udp. at least knows about all BRs

[sick swan]

I would first start on Matter level

So _matter._tcp in that case

[slender willow]

Wow, there's a lot more entries than I would have expected

[sick swan]

Use the Node ID from the Device Info page from a device which is currently offline, convert it to hex and see if there is a service published.

[sick swan]

For each device and each admin 1. So if you have 20 devices connected to Apple, Google and HA, that should be 60 entries 😅

[slender willow]

103 items. 29 devices, most with 3 admins, some with 2. Adds up, more or less 🙂

[sick swan]

So the ones which go offline, they go offline on the other platforms too? 🤔

[slender willow]

Yes, offline everywhere

[sick swan]

Ok. Yeah I expect that you won't find the node id then in the discovered devices

[slender willow]

The node IDs are quite low and the entries under _matter._tcp have a very different format

Like 339ECD31796DBF5A-00000000148EBB40

Here's a log, in case this helps: https://justpaste.it/elkfa

[sick swan]

The entries are {fabric-id}-{node-id}. Other platforms assign random/different node ids, we currently assign monotonically increasing numbers.

The values are in hex. So e.g. for Node ID 102 there should be <something>-0000000000000066

(that <something> is also printed on startup of the add-on, but since others assign node id differently, you can largely just ignore that)

[slender willow]

Got it

[sick swan]

Maybe check a working one to see if your mDNS browser returns all the devices.

[slender willow]

So Node 2 which is offline, actually has a published service

[sick swan]

Hm, interesting. Can you ping the IP address which is published?

[slender willow]

Nope, pings don't get a response

[sick swan]

From where id you run ping from?

[slender willow]

From a MacBook on the same VLAN (flat network, so there's only one)

[sick swan]

Can you maybe compare the IP address from a working Thread device in close proximity. E.g. is it the same IPv6 prefix? (if yes: They are on the same Thread network, if no, that would mean your Thread network partitioned)

And can you ping that other device?

[slender willow]

I checked two more devices which are working: same network prefix, but can't ping them either

But maybe I'm holding it wrong?

❯ ping6 fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:7769:fd62:59ba:f963
PING fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:7769:fd62:59ba:f963(fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:7769:fd62:59ba:f963) 56 data bytes
^C
--- fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:7769:fd62:59ba:f963 ping statistics ---
33 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 33ms

D'oh. I take the above back. I can ping them

I was pinging from a ssh session on my NAS 🙂

Responses from the "offline" device:

❯ ping6 fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53
PING6(56=40+8+8 bytes) fd91:9cba:53a2:fb42:1466:84c8:b4af:6e04 --> fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53
16 bytes from fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53, icmp_seq=0 hlim=63 time=282.514 ms
16 bytes from fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53, icmp_seq=2 hlim=63 time=87.232 ms
16 bytes from fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53, icmp_seq=3 hlim=63 time=91.921 ms

Name resolution works, too:

❯ ping6 5EC3944EEA475334.local
PING6(56=40+8+8 bytes) fd91:9cba:53a2:fb42:1466:84c8:b4af:6e04 --> fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53
16 bytes from fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53, icmp_seq=0 hlim=63 time=47.931 ms
16 bytes from fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53, icmp_seq=1 hlim=63 time=44.977 ms
16 bytes from fd4c:aacd:aeef:1:c3eb:a7e0:d5ea:9d53, icmp_seq=2 hlim=63 time=553.682 ms

Here's how that device looks in HA: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1SMzJWmYMGX6XiP40hH-D7MueTatUYn1C/view?usp=share_link

And the mDNS service: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1X-hTNaDdmbn6NWodb3VtGKgzUvTyrRJh/view?usp=sharing

So I can ping the device from my MacBook, but not from the HAOS VM (nor from the hosting NAS). That would point at some IPv6 routing issues, right?

[slender willow]

Actually, I can also ping from the VM running HAOS. The packet loss ratio is just so high that I didn't see any response on the first try. It varies between 25 and 88%, which would probably indicate problems at the PHY layer, maybe interference with WiFi or Zigbee?

[sick swan]

For battery operated devices, they check-in with the Thread BR only every couple of seconds, there it is normal that pings are a bit grouped. But most device don't have actual packet loss.

[slender willow]

44 packets transmitted, 5 packets received, 88% packet loss doesn't sound healthy, does it?

My Thread network is on channel 25, there are two Hue bridges using 15 and 25, respectively. There are also a bunch of UniFi APs talking on 2.4 GHz channels 1, 6, and 11. I guess I could move one of the Zigbee networks to 20.

[sick swan]

Hehe no, that is too much yes.

@slender willow trying to find a non-busy channel is certainly good. You can use Zigbee methods for that (they are documented in community forums etc.). Alternatively, the OTBR has also a channel monitor feature. We don't have it exposed currently, so you'd need to jump into the OTBR container to execute a couple of commands, specifically:

docker exec -it addon_core_openthread_border_router /bin/bash
# ot-ctl channel monitor start
... wait ...
# ot-ctl channel monitor

But you need to wait quite some time 😢

[spring bramble]

My experience is that the best you can do is set all your WiFi AP's to use channel 1 for 2.4 Ghz.
Then you can use some channels for your 2 hue bridges and leave channel 25 free for thread

[slender willow]

I can try that!

So I moved the Thread network to channel 20 and slowly the devices are coming back online. Pinging the same device as above now seems… better 🙂
20 packets transmitted, 20 packets received, 0.0% packet loss

[sick swan]

Yeah WiFi channel 11 can influence 25, and 20 might be not super bad since it is one in the middle of the WiFi bands, but it still is affected by the sidebands.

This page has nice information about the issue (Zigbee uses the same physical layer as Thread, so the RF problem applies exactly the same):
https://www.metageek.com/training/resources/zigbee-wifi-coexistence/

Also keep in mind that this is if you use 20MHz bands (which is common on 2.4GHz). 40MHz bands extend further up afaik

[slender willow]

I use 20 MHz bands for 2.4 GHz

I would have expected some overtalk and maybe some packet loss, but I wouldn't have expected that big of an effect, tbh. The APs use just 6 dBm for this band. I'll still let the channel monitor run for a while. Thanks for the pointer @sick swan !

[sick swan]

Yeah Zigbee/Thread is rather sensitive to interference, unfortunately 😢 It's fixed channel, and afaik the retry mechanism is also not super aggresive (for power savings reasons).

[serene prawn]

@slender willow I converted your message into a file since it's above 15 lines :+1:

[slender willow]

All devices are back online after the channel change. Thanks for your help, @sick swan and @spring bramble!

[hushed cliff]

Does connecting thread devices work on a network with combined 5GHz + 2.4GHz or do I need two separate WiFi networks?

The companion app hangs when verifiyng WiFi connection when adding my devices for the first time. Skyconnect set up on HAOS vm

[abstract tide]

I don't know why, but my RGB controller won't connect

I bought the SR-MT1029-5C, it worked for 2 days and then it stopped working

It won't connect again, not to Home Assistant nor to another Matter bridge like the Google Nest

[tired surge]

Would it be possible to add counters from the Thread network (OTBR) to the HomeAssistant web interface?

• number of router devices
• number of nodes

[tired surge]

For the moment, I'm querying the OTBR REST API directly. I have 10 Thread router nodes:
curl http://core-openthread-border-router:8081/node/num-of-router 10

/usr/src# ot-ctl router list 10 13 15 17 22 24 46 49 53 59

[slender willow]

That would be enough for a RESTful sensor, no? https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/sensor.rest/

[tired surge]

I'll try that 🙂

[tired surge]

Nice, it works: https://ibb.co/pvV19yj
configuration.yaml

  - platform: rest
    resource: http://core-openthread-border-router:8081/node/num-of-router
    name: Thread router nodes```

[marble perch]

well, that's fun. updated my esp border router dev kit to esp-idf v5.3.1 and the result isn't completely broken.

[drowsy furnace]

Newb question: Will all Matter devices work over thread or do I need to look for Thread specifically?

[twin vine]

Matter deivces are either matter over thread or matter over wifi

typically it will say on the box

[drowsy furnace]

Thanks. Having trouble finding matter over thread dimmer switches

[twin vine]

https://homekitnews.com/2024/01/13/inovelli-to-launch-matter-over-thread-dimmer-switch/

?

[drowsy furnace]

Thanks

[twin vine]

i know there isnt many at the moment

[tired surge]

All I need now is a graph with Thread topology.

[twin vine]

there is, the OTBR web app, its just not the best lol

can get to it by port 8080 if its enabled

[tired surge]

Is it enabled with HA OTBR ?

This one is great but only for nRF sniffer firmware: nRF Thread Topology Monitor

[twin vine]

yeah, the settings to assign the ports are down the bottem of the configuation

[crude willow]

You can't see this with Google BR right ?

[twin vine]

I don’t think so

Atleast I haven’t found a way

[slender willow]

Is that API documented somewhere? Or is it essentially https://github.com/openthread/ot-br-posix/blob/main/src/rest/resource.cpp?

[tired surge]

Yes, here: https://github.com/openthread/ot-br-posix/blob/main/src/rest/openapi.yaml

[slender willow]

Thanks!

[tired surge]

I managed to run a POC with ESPHome (running on ESP32-C6 board) node over Thread network from this GitHub repo: https://github.com/mrene/esphome-openthread-poc

Screenshot: https://ibb.co/qkL9BXX

Also you can use Arduino and ESP32-C6/H2 to add a router node in you Thread network and extend coverage at low cost: https://github.com/espressif/arduino-esp32/blob/master/libraries/OpenThread/examples/SimpleThreadNetwork/RouterNode/RouterNode.ino

[ionic plaza]

MoT plugs are getting really cheap here for routers but glad to see more options

[winter shale]

Do any of yall have OTBR running with the Sonoff ZB Dongle E?

[ionic plaza]

me

[winter shale]

would you share your config?

[magic surge]

Does Aqara u200 lock work well with HA? I read that aqara have joined HA foundation.

[ionic plaza]

nothing special, just flash firmware built by @jade quest and choose 460800 for Baudrate; the new OTBR add-on will automatically flash dongle-e but it depends on batch

[winter shale]

Nope it absolutely doesnt, I have it and the M3 Hub and its absolutely horrible and I couldnt get it to work at all, not via the hub or via OpenThread

[polar thunder]

hell are you talking about

works fine for me through an apple homepod mini

[half bluff]

For some reason my homepod minis are connecting to my aqara thread network. I had separated the 3 thread networks I had and the minis are just crossing over? Maybe its a bug

[tired surge]

https://www.theverge.com/2022/7/19/23269460/thread-1-3-0-matter-border-routers-homepod-mini-echo-nest
With the release of the Thread 1.3.0 specification, the Thread border router function is being standardized. This means no more competing Thread networks; border routers from different manufacturers will join the same Thread network seamlessly. “Thread 1.3.0 makes the border router appear on the Wi-Fi [network] like any other Wi-Fi device, allowing any existing device on the Wi-Fi network to interact with those Thread devices without requiring any special software"

[spring bramble]

Do you have the Google Home app in iOS perhaps? It’s known to mess up thread networks when a nest hub exists on the network

[unkempt whale]

Does anyone recommend aqara u200? Or should I get another lock? Thanks 🙂

[abstract tide]

Aqara u200 is amazing!

[hushed cliff]

Does anyone know why I would be unable to pair my inovelli white switches with my newly installed skyconnect matter setup? I am seeing this error in OTBR logs

Default: mDNSPlatformSendUDP got error 99 (Cannot assign requested address) sending packet to ff02::fb on interface fe80::d060:b3ff:fe31:d7e2/veth2563b72/27

it hangs on the verifying wifi connection step in the app

[bronze fog]

U200 is working very well for me

[unkempt whale]

Does it work with any matter over thread hub?

[unkempt whale]

How do you connect it to home assistant?

[bronze fog]

Just scan the QR code.

*Assuming you have a thread border router

[abstract tide]

Not sure, but it works with OTBR and Google Nest

[vast sierra]

I found the range to be quite poor with that combo.

Less than 15 ft away I get medium signal on the nearest white switch

[spring bramble]

The range of skyconnect is rather limited, especially if you put it in a place far away from your device(s) and with lots of intereference (read: the utility closet). What really helps is getting a long-ish extension cable of good quality and hang the skyconnect (or any other stick for zigbee, z-wave or thread) a bit higher up in the sky in your utility closet away from the wifi router and power cables. When still running into issues, it could help to simply have a powerplug in between the stick and your other devices to act as a router/repeater of the signal. Or the other option is to simply (ab) use existing border routers of apple or google that are at more friendlier places in your home just for thread border router.

[unkempt whale]

You think it will work with slzb-06m?

[bronze fog]

Never heard of that before.

[foggy saffron]

Actually i just bought the slzb-06m because I could never get my sky connect to work with OTBR adding and to connect any device

[unkempt whale]

And how is it?

[foggy saffron]

I think if it would work it would be amazing

I managed to connect my HA via network to it and OTBR communicates with it - but it don't know why my thread network is still not working

And I could not yet find any information about if it might be possible to work with one Homeassistant with more than one skyconnect/slzb-06/other device

Also I don't know if it should work as only HA with SkyConnect or SLZ-06M and OTBR addon as only thread border router but it says in different ways on all documentations that you need a thread border router additional to HA with OTBR addon

[unkempt whale]

So it also doesn’t work?

How did you choose m version over regular version

[foggy saffron]

In the meantime I bought an aquara m3 just to have somebody translate matter to thread
Interestingly for me: the aquara m3 doesn't need to me initialized in any way
I just put it on the network and scanned the matter qr code and it shows up in HA and from then I could connect my thread devices with the HA companion app to the thread network

Unfortunately my HA still doesn't speak thread in any way
It won't connect to the aquara m3 thread network and the devices won't work it the aquara m3 is offline
So for me right now I have no idea how thread with home assistant should work

[foggy saffron]

It might work because some people at least got it to work
I just bought the HA green to get a thread network but was heavily disappointed from the thread integration because it worked 0% for me with lots of tests and reinstallations on my HA
Apart from thread i am a huge fan of HA and am hoping that thread will work someday

Actually during the tests with the SLZB-06M I found something interesting which I have never seen before:
In the configuration video
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WwYVRuVpAJI&pp=ygUWc2x6Yi0wNm0gaG9tZWFzc2lzdGFudA%3D%3D
of the SLZB-06M at 7:08 there is a message in the companion app "home assistant and this device use the same thread network"
I have never seen this message in any documentation before and it has never appeared in my tests. This might be a hint to my problem.
Maybe someone here knows something about why this will not appear.

[unkempt whale]

But why did you get the m version and not the regular version?

[foggy saffron]

Oh sorry

[unkempt whale]

And I wish I could help you, but I don’t have anything thread related right now

[foggy saffron]

Because I found some information that it is using the same chips as the skyconnect an therefore should provide better compatibility than the other versions

[unkempt whale]

I just wanted to get the u200 lock and then I need a matter over thread bridge as I understood

[unkempt whale]

Ah, interesting

[foggy saffron]

Sorry because of my problems I never tried more then two devices in my thread network ... but I can tell you that none of them work if there is no thread network 😛

Atm I can only say that the documentation is right - If you want to use matter over thread, get another OTBR apart from HA. For me the aquara m3 worked realy well because I have no need for some cloud google whatever device and this one works without internet and account registration. (It might still be good to look for firmware updates from time to time)

Whether or not HA should be able to communicate with a thread network I don't know. In my case it is not working yet.

[digital salmon]

SLZB-06M > EFR32MG21
SLZB-06Mg24 > EFR32MG24

So, the SLZB-06M uses the same chipset as the SkyConnect/ZBT-1. It should work. I am unsure about the new MG24 version. Is this confirmed that MG24 works with HA OTBR?

I am interested in this ESP32 PoE MG24 device. 😃

[tired surge]

I have a MG24 dev board an OTBR works fine https://imgur.com/kV8j2kh

You have to flash Openthread RCP firmware.

[digital salmon]

Good to know. So, it is not automatically updated, when I use the OTBR addon?

[tired surge]

I don't know. I have a dev board.

[hushed cliff]

I'm trying to scan from only ~7ft away but the switch is past a cement board wall since the skyconnect is in a closet. Would that still be too difficult?

I'll raise the skyconnecy even higher but its currently on a 10ft extension raised about 4-5 feet

[foggy saffron]

This looks exactly like my log

[foggy saffron]

I think the missing message in the companion app could be a hint...

[sick swan]

@foggy saffron are you using iOS or Android?

[foggy saffron]

Android

[sick swan]

Make sure you got through the steps documented here: https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/thread#case-1-making-home-assistant-your-first-thread-network

Specifically step 3

[foggy saffron]

Did that

[sick swan]

Ok, and what happens now when you try to add a Thread device?

[foggy saffron]

Exactly the "success" message is missing im my case

Oh it's just telling me that the device is not working with my network

[sick swan]

Oh yeah, that is a problem. What message do you get?

[foggy saffron]

"Updated network from Home Assistant on this device"

[sick swan]

You did run into this issue: https://github.com/home-assistant/android/issues/4146

Essentially, your phone knows a credential from a previous attempt, and overwriting for some reason doesn't seem to work.

I was assuming that with the new network naming scheme ha-thread-... we have this under control, but it seems not 😢

[foggy saffron]

I don't know if this has anything to do with it:
When my aquara m3 is up and connected via matter to HA, I can connect thread devices with the companion app - but with the aquara thread network ... 😛

[foggy saffron]

I'll test that now

[sick swan]

yeah afaik the Google Play Services Thread credentials system only allows a single Thread network to be preferred. I guess that means the Aqara one is your preferred on the phone side. Updating that is unfortunately not possible (altough, their API claims it is, but this is kinda the problem here, we don't get feedback from Android/Google Play Services)

Keep this in mind! ⚠️ Deleting Google Play services data does reset some other device settings, namely the Google Wallet cards. ⚠️

[foggy saffron]

Good thing that I don't care about Google things ... iam happy to delete this cache 😄

wow, so this worked - but now i get an error "matter is currently unavailable" when trying to connect a matter device

restarting the phone didnt help

[foggy saffron]

fyi - i tested another wifi matter device which is working, so there seems to be no major issue with the matter server

[sick swan]

Uh, don't remember I've seen that error. Is that a Google/Android framework message or something from the compagnion app

I think others noticed that Google wants Internet, otherwise it refuses to onboard Matter 😢

[foggy saffron]

there is no restrictions in internet connection atm

it seems to me an android message

but has an HA picture in front

i'll try to upload it

https://imgur.com/J3xKB2Y

[sick swan]

Hm, yeah that looks more lika a HA issue.

Is the Matter integration active and without errors?

Check under Settings -> Devices & Services the Matter card

[foggy saffron]

alright

so after restarting the matter server and testing another matter device - working, i tried again to connect a new device with the companion app

i get the same error in the app and there is nothing appearing in the logs

maybe i could try another loglevel

[sick swan]

Which logs are you checking?

So the Matter integration itself looks good, and you still get this error? 🤔

[foggy saffron]

the matter server logs "http://homeassistant.local:8123/hassio/addon/core_matter_server/logs"

[sick swan]

The problem here is the Home Assistant Core (where the Matter integration runs).

[foggy saffron]

ah okay

[sick swan]

App -- HA Core (Matter integration) -- Matter Server

[foggy saffron]

in these logs: http://homeassistant.local:8123/config/logs?provider=core_matter_server
there is nothing new

is that the correct logs?

i think i will reboot HA green - just to be sure

[sick swan]

Nah, sorry, this is still the add-on 🙈

[foggy saffron]

i am sorry 😄

[sick swan]

Issues in the Matter integration would be in the core logs .../config/logs

[sick swan]

No worries, I understand, it is a bit confusing 😅

[foggy saffron]

ah alright

http://homeassistant.local:8123/config/logs

i have been there but there where no matter things there

i just tried again - there is nothing new

[spring bramble]

Yes, I have seen that issue before and in that case uninstall + reinstall of the google home app worked

The whole flow on android can be a bit flaky at times

[foggy saffron]

true .... ^^

do i need to do something with google home apart from installing?

amazing! it works!

iam so happy 😄

finaly

@spring bramble jea we had this conversation before .... 😄

these android things messed everything up...

[foggy saffron]

to spread the information: Thread is now working with the SLZB-06M via network with the same config from the video (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WwYVRuVpAJI&pp=ygUWc2x6Yi0wNm0gaG9tZWFzc2lzdGFudA%3D%3D)

[foggy saffron]

and if you are still having problems try reading the last ~80 messages in this channel

the only information that we are missing right now would be, if it is possible to use multiple SLZB-06M with one HA host... maybe @sick swan could know that? 😛

[unkempt whale]

Should I get the m or non m version, and does it matter?

[foggy saffron]

nice one 😛

because of the same chipset i would still try the "M" version first. Mainly because it is working for me now and also because it is more likely to work/ to be supported by HA with the same chipset as the sky connect

[spring bramble]

Not this time as you also need multiple instances of the OTBR addon

[foggy saffron]

Some feedback for improvements to the HA-Team if it is welcome:
It would be good to have the two important informations of the last hour on the website (https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/thread/)

1. When describing the part Companion app - Sync Thread credentials, it would be good to know that you could try the sync again and it is supposed to say "home assistant and this device use the same thread network" - i never knew that and tried for the last 10 month to connect to this network without ever seeing this message
2. Adding a thread device to HA network with android smartphone needs to have the google home app installed - would be nice to have that information in the documentation too.
   Maybe there are places where these informations are already present. But at least i could not find it...

[foggy saffron]

alright thx for the answer!

[sick swan]

Did you try before reinstalling?

Because the error came from Home Assistant 🤔

[acoustic yacht]

Hey, I didn't see anything in a search, I'm having an issue trying to set a nanoleaf elements as thread border router.
I followed the steps in the docs but ended up with a preferred network called NanoleafThread73 with no devices, and "Other Networks" shows Nanoleaf42 with my elements as the border router.

The Nanoleaf42 network showing up as the border router was the case before I tried to follow setup, so I went with the "case 2" steps.

Not sure how to troubleshoot from there, re-importing the credentials on my android device in the HA app doesn't change anything.

[foggy saffron]

Google home was already installed because I heard somewhere that it might help - but I never used it
So it was there but didn't work. After reinstalling it worked again

[sick swan]

2. Adding a thread device to HA network with android smartphone needs to have the google home app installed - would be nice to have that information in the documentation too.
   So this is weird: Technically, our App manifest should request those Matter dependencies 🤔

[sick swan]

Hm, I wonder if reinstalling Home Assistant would have resolved it too at that point 🤔

https://github.com/home-assistant/android/blob/05c71cac2bd61d298454ca52eda607f5094a866d/app/src/full/AndroidManifest.xml#L81-L91
https://developers.home.google.com/matter/apis/home

That is why we added this to the docs https://www.home-assistant.io/integrations/matter#remedy:

2. If this did not work, try reinstalling the Home Assistant Companion app.

[sick swan]

Once imported, there should be an option available "Make preferred network". But in any case, you don't need the Thread credentials in Home Assistant, if your phone has the credentials from Nanoleaf, it should work to add Thread devices from the HA app

(that said, i did not try that particular case.. maybe Nanoleaf does not export the Thread credentials to the phone wide Thread credentials store 🤔 )

[acoustic yacht]

Yeah I saw screenshots with the option, but I don't have it, reinstalling the HA app in case that solves it, I had not seen that in the docs (it's not in the thread-specific stuff I don't think)

[foggy saffron]

Interesting...
I would be happy to help but I don't have that problem atm
And I like it better this way 😛

[acoustic yacht]

Hmm, reinstall didn't solve my issue. Since HA is seeing the network is there a config file I can edit to point it correctly somewhere, to just skip whatever's going on in the UI? 🤔

[sick swan]

Hm, maybe then the Nanoleaf app did not set the Nanoleaf border router as preferred border router.. 🤔 If you want to really dive deep, you can try syncing and then open the logs. Maybe they say a bit more clear if there were Thread credentials to sync or not..

[acoustic yacht]

Yeah I just noticed my nanoleaf seems to have a firmware update available (I have it blocked from internet in general), so I'm gonna update that and see if it fixes, then next stop will be log-diving; would you recommend I just check HA supervisor logs? Or download diagnostics from the thread integration?

[sick swan]

Yeah I mean technically Home Assistant doesn't need the Thread credentials for Matter onboarding. At least when using the recommended Matter onboarding, then only your phone needs the credentials.

[acoustic yacht]

Hmm yeah issue's still there after: firmware update on nanoleaf, disabling/enabling the Thread integration, and restarting HA (with me re-trying send credentials to home assistant between each step).

I'm not seeing anything surfaced in logs that seems to map to Thread related things and there's no threads-specific log visible in the HA UI, I downloaded the diagnostics from the integration configuration page, so I have a snapshot of how things are but I don't see anything that immediately stands out as out of place

[sick swan]

So what is your issue exactly? 😅

[acoustic yacht]

HA sees the border router on a network that I don't think it's letting me access (unless I'm missing something)

[sick swan]

Or rather, what are you trying to achieve?

[acoustic yacht]

Ah yeah that would have been a better starting point 😓 I did not follow question asking practices, end result I'm looking for is to control matter over thread lights from HA

[sick swan]

Currently, Home Assistant can't really control third party Thread Border routers. The only thing Home Assistant can do is import and export credentials. So e.g. you can transfer Thread credentials from your Android phone to Home Assistant, and then in a iOS phone from Home Assistant to your iOS phone. Then both phones will be able to commission Matter devices.

The other use case where Thread credentials can be useful in Home Assistant is when you add HomeKit devices.

However, we can use thrid party Thread border routers without problems. But using them (as a means to transport) doesn't need anything from HA side.

[acoustic yacht]

Oh maybe I am misapproaching this then 🤔

[sick swan]

If you have Nanoelaf Thread lamps, you can onboard them through Nanoleaf app to the Thread network. And then from tehre you can connect them to MAtter

Press the Connect button in the device settings (in the Nanoleaf app) and select Home Assistant.

[acoustic yacht]

Ah okay, so there's no "pure-HA" workflow for getting them set up, but once connected through the Nanoleaf app I can interact/control them through HA?

I think that's what had me tripped up, sorry I'm still finding my legs on matter/thread stuff 🙂

[sick swan]

It is "pure" on Matter level (as in, Home Assistant has it's own Matter fabric/network/cryptographic material thingy, Nanoleaf can't listen), and HA will talk to the Lamp "directly". Nanoleaf however provides the means of network transport via their border router. Think of Wifi for IoT... Nanoleaf makes the bulb but also your Wifi AP..

[acoustic yacht]

Yeah sorry not the greatest terminology, I meant specifically the setup/onboarding for new devices can't be done entirely through the HA UI

[sick swan]

Yeah Nanoleaf is a bit special since they have their own protocol they run besides Matter.

So their process of enabling commissioning mode goes through their App..

Altough, I think recent bulbs they sold come with a MAtter setup code from the getgo 🤔

But they had broken Matter software, so I usually had to update through Nanoleaf App first still 😢

[acoustic yacht]

Yeah the new bulbs are what I got, I was just not using my brain on this for whatever reason I guess, I've gone through the needing-to-initial-pair outside HA process with other devices before 🤷‍♂️

Anyway, appreciate you helping me get past it, thanks!

[sick swan]

Make sure you have the 3.6.196 on the bulbs, then things should be fine.

I guess at one point they will ship with 3.6.196 from factory, then technically it should be possible to add them directly to Home Assistant, from the bulbs perspective.

But to setup the Nanoleaf Thread border router, you'll still need the Nanoleaf app, so 🤷‍♂️

[acoustic yacht]

Yeah could be worse at least, it's not too bad dealing with their app

Always nice to have one fewer to need installed though

[compact rapids]

Any thread range extenders you people recommend? I don't want a light bulb actually.

[tired surge]

You can use Eve Energy Smart Plug as a Thread node router: https://www.evehome.com/en/eve-energy

[compact rapids]

You can use Eve Energy Smart Plug as a

[marble perch]

Yeah, if you have an existing thread network which HA has credentials for, then commissioning Nanoleaf bulbs via the HA app works fine (I think the problems caused by having one of the broken firmware versions were only visible after commissioning)

Main reason to use the Nanoleaf app if you only have their bulbs is to upgrade firmware before connecting to HA, or to play with the scenes stuff that's only available via the proprietary API.

[ember trench]

Someone succeeded to add a SLZB-06 as a border router? I have the sky connect as multiprotocol but want to change it for 2 SLZB-06 running Thread on one and zigbee on the other. The SLZB-06 is flashed for Thread, connected to USB but fails to add from the OTBR add on.

[serene prawn]

@ember trench I converted your message into a file since it's above 15 lines :+1:

[ember trench]

Above a section from the log.

[tired surge]

Are you sure your stick is running Thread RCP firmware?

[ember trench]

Yes. It automatically flashed it when I changed to Thread in the web interface. I just ordered a SLZB-06M, hope for better luck with that one.

I have now a SkyConnect flashed with dual Thread/zigbee but trying to move them on separate SLZB-06. I took a backup and removed everything Thread/Matter from integrations and Add-Ons, then rebooted the PI5. Tried several times the whole day, then I gave up and ordered the other model.

[digital salmon]

SLZB-06 has a CC2652P chipset. Is that chip compatible with the Thread RCP firmware?

My understanding is, that you need one of these:

• SLZB-06M (EFR32MG21)
• SLZB-06MG24 (EFR32MG24)

[twin vine]

ive got a feeling that they will release one with the EFR32MG26 soon

[digital salmon]

Maybe… 😃 By the way… Which chipset is used by Nanoleafs Essentials line, EFR32MG21 or EFR32MG24?

[twin vine]

i think its the MG24's?

[tired surge]

EFR32MG24 is fine for RCP firmware

[ember trench]

Yeah. I saw somewhere that you need SLZB-06M for flashing Thread. Then I found the SMLIGHT youtube video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwYVRuVpAJI where a woman flashes a SLZB-06 with Thread firmware and installs it in Homeassistant. I tought based on that video that a SLZB-06 would work. Anyway, ordered a SLZB-06M today, hope it will work with it.

[twin vine]

Yeah, it works, but only via USB (at the time of making the video), I think you can also do it over IP tho now with a OTBR update

[ember trench]

I could not get it to work over USB or IP. Waiting for the M version.

[digital salmon]

Keep us updated. 😉

[frigid nymph]

Question: my extensive zigbee network is on channel 25, my 2.4 gHz WiFi channel usually self adjusts between 1-10, so what channel would be best for my growing Thread Network?

Thanks for any assistance

[digital salmon]

The best would be to use WiFi 2.4GHz channels 1 and 6 only. If you have the choice for the Thread channel you can use channel 24.

How many WiFi access points do you have?

My access points are all on channel 1 and 6, my HueBridge is on ZigBee channel 20 and my Thread network uses channel 25 (on a HueBridge you can configure ZigBee channel 11, 15, 20 and 25 only).

This link explains the coexistence of 2.4GHz WiFi and ZigBee very well:

https://www.metageek.com/training/resources/zigbee-wifi-coexistence/

Thread uses the same channel scheme as ZigBee.

[faint siren]

Is it possible to add Homekit over Thread devices?

[twin vine]

Yes

[faint siren]

Would I need a dedicated TBR for Home Assistant? I assume I can't use Google stuff right?

[twin vine]

I believe so yeah

[faint siren]

Okay, I guess I'll have to think the ZBT-1 since I use the original Skyconnect solely for Zigbee.

[marble perch]

home assistant can use any thread border router for homekit as long as it knows the thread credentials

i think it's able to get the credentials for google thread networks via the android app? so that should work.

[faint siren]

Oh if that's the case then I should be good to go. I've already allowed credentials for my Nest router which is TBR.

[marble perch]

if the thread integration in HA shows a preferred network, and the shows you the dataset TLVs, then you're set.

[faint siren]

I see Dataset id with a very long set of numbers and letters. I assume that's what you mean.

[vapid shell]

You also need a Bluetooth dongle or esphome Bluetooth proxy to set up homekit over thread devices. Matter is able to use OS features in Android and iOS to do the Bluetooth part, HomeKit is not. You pair them to Bluetooth first, then there is a button on the device page to migrate them to thread. You’ll need to be in range of the thread border router and the Bluetooth radio to do this, and some devices have a weak Bluetooth radio needing to be within 1m of your dongle/proxy.

[faint siren]

Okay, I do have several ESP32 BT Proxies spread throughout my home. So aside from possible range issues, at least I have everything I need.