general-chat

[delicate stream]

95! Now they're flying OFF the shelves

... 96? back on?

95 again

[glossy knoll]

Cut to a scene of someone frantically soldering parts to Pi 3 A+ boards

[delicate stream]

... 96, it is confused

[late fulcrum]

I suspect invalid orders are getting rejected and the stock being returned to available status.

[delicate stream]

This must be it

[keen arrow]

Tbh, if you need a board for computer vision I highly recommend the openmv camera board over the pi 3 a+

[delicate stream]

pshhh, boring explanation

[keen arrow]

It's basically a pi zero 2

[delicate stream]

93 :O

[keen arrow]

I've been doing a lot of computer vision as of late and once you understand the openmv it is so much more convenient

[late fulcrum]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8G7pUqRZjU8

[delicate stream]

I've been thinking about doing computer vision on my car and tracking license plates I pass, wondering how often I actually see the same vehicles in the same area...

[keen arrow]

You can do that with Openmv

[delicate stream]

I shall investigate this

88!

87...

[keen arrow]

If you have any questions feel free to ping me or something. I don't work for openmv or anything I just want to grow their community

[frigid tiger]

Are pi3s in shortage now

[keen arrow]

yes

Every pi is

[frigid tiger]

Good idea

[keen arrow]

That's why I switched

[delicate stream]

All Pis have been short on supply

[keen arrow]

I've been using pis for computer vision but I can't reliably order 10+ of them anymore

[frigid tiger]

You could probably log position data and approximate the routes of other cars

[late fulcrum]

I wonder if OpenMV runs on ESP32-CAM

[frigid tiger]

I'd probably go further and see if you record the data of the drivers and establish a database

[keen arrow]

I don't think so unfortunately

I would love if it ran the new esp32-cams3

but it doesn't

[delicate stream]

The OpenMV board looks good, but I think I might go with a PC and USB cameras... I have tons of webcams XD

[frigid tiger]

So would you multiplex those webcams

[keen arrow]

If you want something small then get a google coral dev board

They are in stock and they should support usb cameras

[delicate stream]

I might build a PC frame in my trunk and just use a full size GPU, lol

[late fulcrum]

Hmm, I have a Jetson with a Coral TPU board, maybe that would work

[keen arrow]

That would work 100% but not with openmv just use opencv at that point

[delicate stream]

I wonder how Coral compares to GPUs...

[keen arrow]

Much more capable

[keen arrow]

It's only for inferencing

Opencv is an amazing library

[delicate stream]

76 of the 3 A+ left

[late fulcrum]

I'm tempted to buy one of the 3 A+ but I think I'll let people who have a greater need buy them.

[delicate stream]

I have a project in mind that could use one, but I've got a couple of the 3B on hand anyway

74!

73... is there an API to check Adafruit stock? I was thinking about having a Pi stock board that updates in real time, lol

69

they're flying now

[tardy badger]

I ordered one last week

[delicate stream]

67

[tardy badger]

Got tired of waiting for CM4 and not being fast enough for a Pi 4 :/

[delicate stream]

My last purchase of one was August 24, 2021

[tardy badger]

I did also buy some batteries

More LiPos for projects 😬

[delicate stream]

I buy a lot of stuff sporadically XD

66... I've been finding a lot of batteries

65 more people to be made happy

Wait, is Women's History Month this month or next month?

Wait it's March

[keen arrow]

this month

[delicate stream]

nevermind

[keen arrow]

Yea

[delicate stream]

brain fuzz

I forgot it was no longer February and was like "wait, are we overlapping?"

lol

[keen arrow]

did you get the uconsole from clockworkpi?

[keen arrow]

ya feb only had 28 days

[delicate stream]

Unless it has 29 XD

[keen arrow]

that only happens like 25% of the time

[delicate stream]

Lol

Today is March 1096, 2020

51!

A dozen people must have ordered at once!

[tardy badger]

I wasn’t doing anything like that 🤔

Possibly thinking of someone else

[delicate stream]

I wonder what the time limit is for "1 per" -- a week? 2? a month?

[tardy badger]

I’ve definitely wondered

Perhaps it’s a rolling window

I’m gonna put a back order for a CM4 with mouser and just wait for it to eventually arrive

[delicate stream]

In my experience, most places do "[timeframe] since last purchase", but some do "1 per resets at the end of [week/month]

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/oki-waiting-lean-on-the-glass-cute-funny-gif-13238293

At the window...

[tardy badger]

For the next 9-12 months waiting

https://tenor.com/view/waiting-gif-23395435

[delicate stream]

lol

40 left

[tardy badger]

Okay, backordered 3 of the $30 CM4 from mouser

Estimated lead: end of September

🥲

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/this-is-fine-fire-house-burning-okay-gif-5263684

33

28... all gone in under an hour? Possible

[tardy badger]

Mehbeh

[delicate stream]

26, looking unlikely

Definitely under 2 hours, lol

[tardy badger]

The 3A+ are less scalpable so they definitely last longer

[delicate stream]

mmm... they are much less flexible

[tardy badger]

But great for octoprint 🙂

[delicate stream]

mhmmm

[tardy badger]

I’m planning on pulling my 3B+ that I have octoprint on and moving it to my 3A+ coming today

[delicate stream]

I have 3B+ on a few printers, probably will move to 3A+ too

[tardy badger]

Then using the 3B+ for a test jig for FPGA boards

[delicate stream]

18 left!

[tardy badger]

Estimated ship date updated: October 2nd

[delicate stream]

17... the night draws near

[tardy badger]

I opted for all three to ship together

[delicate stream]

Hopefully they'll ship sooner than expected

[tardy badger]

I need to finish my carrier board

[delicate stream]

Gives you time to work on it then, lol

lucky 13 left

[tardy badger]

It has a USB hub, an RP2040 connected to 40 pin headers, a nice juicy 5V supply

[delicate stream]

noice

[tardy badger]

5V/5A

Can take up to a 60V input 😬

On the barrel connector

[delicate stream]

FirePi

[tardy badger]

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/LM22679TJE-5.0%2FNOPB/1950805

Uses this beast

Sorry, 42V

But still

[delicate stream]

Smol chip, big power

[tardy badger]

Smöl

Lol

[delicate stream]

hehe

[tardy badger]

The USB hub chip is $10 a piece though 🥲

[delicate stream]

out of stock

[tardy badger]

It’s a 1-4 hub

[delicate stream]

USB 3+?

[tardy badger]

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/TUSB8042ARGCT/10435124

It can

But the CM4 only supports 2.0

[delicate stream]

hmm

Maybe you should just get a $4 4-port 2.0 hub and pull the controller, lol

[tardy badger]

Lol 😂

[delicate stream]

Free money

[tardy badger]

Cheap USB hubs scare me

[delicate stream]

Lol

[tardy badger]

The $20-$30 hubs I have get really hot lol

I couldn’t imagine a cheap $4 one

[delicate stream]

I've never had an issue with them getting hot

[tardy badger]

Mine has an aluminum enclosure so it probably feels hot because it’s wicking it away

[keen arrow]

I think it's probably the powered ones

[delicate stream]

Powered ones always get toasty

[tardy badger]

It’s USB-C

[delicate stream]

JDDZ, great brand

[keen arrow]

oh I have a similar one but it's by anker

[urban arrow]

Hey guys, is PT (seen "him" I guess mentioned many times)... Is that Mr LadyAda?

[tardy badger]

Right ? Lol

[tardy badger]

Yea

[delicate stream]

yes

My KAKDSOIP hub gets warm when charging my MacBook Pros

Hand warmer

[urban arrow]

Thanks. I love both of them (LadyAda too) and been doing my best to keep the baby fed and happy. My poor credit card.

[keen arrow]

I just never use the hub to charge my macbook tbh

[delicate stream]

It's just so convenient

[tardy badger]

KAKDSOIP, such a well renowned brand

[keen arrow]

I just use it for usb-a suff

[delicate stream]

Indeed

[tardy badger]

I have two hubs

[delicate stream]

I love 1-wire solutions

Network, USB A, USB C, SD card

[tardy badger]

An AUKEY flush mount one that has power pass through

And this JDDZ one

[keen arrow]

I have this one actually https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/7186FdwqISL._AC_SX679_.jpg

[delicate stream]

I have one like that

[keen arrow]

But I only use it for usba stuff

[delicate stream]

There are only a handful of actual hub brands, just white labels XD

[keen arrow]

pretty much

[tardy badger]

White Label stuff is so prolific on amazon

[delicate stream]

I have 3 identical ones with different Amazon WIGUEPM names

[tardy badger]

My favorite part is getting the email 5 minutes after it’s been delivered asking how I like it

[delicate stream]

https://youtu.be/4UrqlMfwUC4

[delicate stream]

I just cut myself on a piece of pizza

[tardy badger]

https://tenor.com/view/what-did-you-say-gif-10681718

[delicate stream]

The crust is very crisp

[spice moss]

https://tenor.com/view/the-smurfs-smurfette-oh-my-smurf-omg-oh-my-gosh-gif-22136376

[delicate stream]

lol

[glossy knoll]

Are you sure you're eating pizza and not sheet metal?

Easy mistake to make

[delicate stream]

Pretty sure, it has cheese and sauce

[glossy knoll]

Sure seems like pizza, huh

[delicate stream]

Greasy and crunchy XD

Y'know, I just realized... you could say this slice is a... pizza cutter

[tardy badger]

https://tenor.com/view/rimshot-pun-joke-ba-dum-tss-drum-gif-15808941

[delicate stream]

hehehehe

[tardy badger]

I tell ya, I wish I had a rich uncle

Or a rich grandpa I could just be like “hi, you love me and I need help” lol

My family tree unfortunately grows along the wrong side of the river

[delicate stream]

I just have my grandpa who's given me $20 a month forever

And all my cousins

[tardy badger]

My grandpa would send $75 every December foe years

To all me an my cousins

[delicate stream]

nice

[tardy badger]

Until my cousins and aunts/uncles stopped appreciating it

[delicate stream]

oof...

[tardy badger]

My parents always told us not to expect it; that if it came to be thankful

I grew up as a military brat so we didn’t have a ton of money

[delicate stream]

I grew up being unsure how long we'd be surviving on leftovers

[tardy badger]

But now I have bad spending habits that o learned from my parents 😬

The, we have some money let’s go spend it on fun stuff

[delicate stream]

CUPCAKE TIME

[tardy badger]

But I’m definitely much better about it than I used to be now that I know what it looks like.

[delicate stream]

I'm trying to save up

[tardy badger]

I contribute to my 401(k)

Like $125 a paycheck

My company matches that

[delicate stream]

I'm trying to do investments and set money in savings

[tardy badger]

We spent our tax return on paying off a tax debt from NC thanks the the company I work for not filing NC taxes for me 🫠

And then spent $600 for a day at Lego land for my kids, and put $500 in a separate account to pay for those hotels and gas.

We’ll probably spend a little bit on a credit card to cover the rest but it’s mostly paid for

[delicate stream]

I want to save up to buy a house

By my current calculations, I'll be able to afford a small home in about 2873 for a smol $8.4 trillion

[tardy badger]

Hehe.. same

[crystal ore]

Yeah, houses seem to be increasing in price faster than you can save...

[delicate stream]

Also inflation, weeee.... oh wait, no, we're just lazy and not working hard enough

[tardy badger]

If I contribute to my 401(k) for another 10 years I can borrow against it and buy a 2 bed house

[delicate stream]

2 bed house... a bunk bed with a tent over it

[tardy badger]

Basically

Under a bridge in a homeless camp no less

[delicate stream]

Fancy

[tardy badger]

If it rains hard enough, it becomes water front property

[delicate stream]

Super fancy

[tardy badger]

And if it floods, boom I have a boat

[delicate stream]

My crazy aunt had the brilliant idea to buy an old trailer house up in the mountains on about an acre of land for $10k, and then put another like $10k into renovating it... So she has no mortgage or rent, barely any property taxes, smol utilities... suddenly my crazy aunt doesn't seem so crazy

[tardy badger]

Honestly, that’s a pretty smart idea

Especially if you’re by yourself

[delicate stream]

Exactly. I mean, she’s still crazy, but that was legit genius

And she said she’d have it go to me if anything happens to her, so… that’s an asset. Altho my cousin/her son who’s living with her now would continue living there

[tardy badger]

Win-ish?

[delicate stream]

Yyyeah…

No matter what I’d have somewhere to retreat if need be

[dusty citrus]

Actually in the countryside you can get some cheap broken houses
But to renew them, legally, you might spent kidneys, thanks to the long category of professional lobbist leechers

Uh sorta ninjed

[delicate stream]

A robot haiku about LadyAda: Her mind, a spark bright, Limor Fried, queen of circuits, Adafruit's founder.

[keen arrow]

I finally got MQTT working on the openmv!!!

[tardy badger]

Adafruit packageeeeee

Hello Raspberry Pi Boi

[thick wind]

Woah 3A is more compact than I remembered

[tardy badger]

Yeah, I thought they were bigger for some reason

[ebon dew]

The dual header makes sense when you've got so many outputs that you need the entirety of the other 3 sides.

[spark egret]

quick question, I have seen videos where people encode a NFC tag with a phone... So why would I want a PN532 NFC/RFID controller breakout board to program the Micro NFC/RFID Transponder - NTAG203 13.56MHz

Is it for those who dont have phones with this capability?

TY <3

[ebon dew]

I didn't know phones could program rfid tags. Read yes, write? didn't know that.

[spark egret]

this is in regards to iphone newer than gen 7

[late fulcrum]

The PN532 is useful when you want to work with NFC tags with microcontrollers and the like

[glossy knoll]

I think Android phones can write to NTAGs, if you can write to NTAGs with iOS at all it's probably pretty limited

And iOS only reads "records" from NTAGs, not arbitrary data. AFAIK you can't read an amiibo, for example, with iOS

[spark egret]

All I would want to do for the time being is putting a https address on it.

[ebon dew]

I thought most tag encoders could work with multiple different tags, it's kind of a specialty piece of equipment. Allowing people to write NFC from their phones is dangerous and a bad idea to release into the public space as an app. I could see that being easily abused.

[spark egret]

@late fulcrum What functionality is provided when a NFC has a microcontroller?

[glossy knoll]

You could probably do it using an Android phone, though you may have to write an app to do it unless there's something generic. PN532 can do it for sure

[spark egret]

@ebon dew I believe once you encode data on a NFC you can then also lock the NFC from being changed?

[ebon dew]

I suppose most NFC's that make it to the commercial space are not rewritable though, right?

ah ok that makes it a little better. so the DIY route is a little more use at your own risk.

[glossy knoll]

You can, yes- this is what Nintendo does with some of the memory on amiibos

Most NTAGs are rewritable unless you flip certain bits to make various pages not writable

You can also read those bits to determine if the pages are writable

[ebon dew]

I can see it for car key transponders but building it into a video game console to prevent piracy is just ughh more proprietary closed ecosystem shennigans.

https://tenor.com/view/seth-meyers-myers-ehh-maybe-gif-22478163

gotta weigh the good with the bad for proprietary stuff

[late fulcrum]

Whatever you want, basically. For example, you could make an NFC controlled entry system, where the PN532 sends the NFC data to a microcontroller that looks up the data in a table, and if it's there, it actuates a solenoid to unlock the door.

[spark egret]

ahhh okay and im guessing the PN532 has a microcontroller?

[late fulcrum]

No, the PN532 is a peripheral. You can hook it to a microcontroller so that the microcontroller and read and write NFC tags

[spark egret]

any idea if there is a feather with microcontrollers? Also ty so much for everyone that has assisted with answers so far <3

[late fulcrum]

A Feather is a microcontroller

[spark egret]

ahh okay. I wonder why they didnt use one for the demo on their website

[ebon dew]

Usually when displayed with a microcontroller that's the one they recommend using with it. Some images might be a little old depending on the product ID#.

[spark egret]

lol product id is 364 hahaha so super old im guessing

[ebon dew]

The product # kind of helps to date when something was released by Adafruit as their numbering scheme is purely sequential.

Doesn't mean it doesn't work, it's just from a different time frame and could likely be used with newer microcontrollers like the feather without issue as they all use the same protocols... however Arduino's were 5V logic level then and Feathers are 3.3V, keep that in mind.

[late fulcrum]

That picture shows an Arduino, which is also a microcontroller

[spark egret]

@ebon dew ahh oaky good to know. This is on their page

"The PN532 is also very flexible, you can use 3.3V TTL UART at any baud rate, I2C or SPI to communicate with it. This chip is also strongly supported by libnfc, simply plug in an FTDI cable and use the FTDI serial port device to communicate - this lets you do NFC dev using any Linux/Mac/Windows computer! We also include onboard power LED, 3.3V regulator and an FTDI header so you can plug in an FTDI friend or FTDI cable and use with libnfc."

[ebon dew]

Yup then you can definitely use it with any feather that has UART capability which is most if not all of them but I can't say for absolute certainty every feather has easy to access UART.

[spark egret]

Well it looks like I am going to get the PN532 so I can have it for a future project with a feather. TY so much everyone!!!

[ebon dew]

Check the pinout diagrams for any feather you look at and ensure it has the features you want.

If you prefer the Arduino pin layout there's a new Metro M7 being released this week. 500mhz 😉

[spark egret]

ugg I am such a hardware newb. I know a little bit but not a lot. I am more of a coder. @ebon dew If you have a moment do you mind if I hop in general chat so it can be faster to communicate and maybe help me figure out what microcontroller / feather might be best for me?

[ebon dew]

You can run Arduino or Circuit Python on most feathers by the way. The language you choose to work with isn't necessarily related to the form factor.

Sure just layout what you need here. Something like that is good to do in general so others can chime in with suggestions too. What I might recommended might be different from what someone else recommends.

[spark egret]

but as for like pinouts and UART and all that I have no idea how that all correlates. I know about positive and negative and ground pins.

[ebon dew]

Since the Arduino Uno, microcontrollers have become hundreds of times faster. If you want to work with TTL though you don't necessarily need the latest and greatest board.

[frigid tiger]

Did you know you can UART an iphone

[spark egret]

I have an elegoo uno R3 that I used for school to blink lights and change sequences based on if a button was pushed but that was like 3 years ago and I have forgotten pretty much all of that stuff.

Would the New arduino you mentioned have any features that the feathers may be missing?

[late fulcrum]

You can connect a USB-serial converter to most modern phones

[ebon dew]

didn't know that, neat.

Last time I used a TTL was on an Uno and that was probably 5 years ago, it's been a while.

Shortly after the whole CH FTDI driver debacle.

[spark egret]

what debacle?

[frigid tiger]

Bricking knockoffs I think

[ebon dew]

https://hackaday.com/2016/02/01/ftdi-drivers-break-fake-chips-again/

about 7-8 years ago now, sounds about right.

I think it was mostly aimed at the fake Arduino Nano's that were flooding the market.

It kinda threw everything using FTDI stuff into a tailspin.

That's when board makers decided to find a native USB solution instead and it was kind of the first big step in a really neat journey for all microcontrollers. A catalyst.

[frigid tiger]

for the best

[ebon dew]

Absolutely.

[spark egret]

jesus that would be nuts and irk me if one of my devices got bricked. Like how am I supposed to verify I didnt get a knock off chip. So I guess that eliminates TTL? Also idk what TTL stands for but I am assuming it is used to communicate between devices?

[ebon dew]

Gotta understand the brief history lesson before deciding to jump into getting a device that might depend on FTDI drivers.

[spark egret]

ya I have no idea on any of this stuff

[late fulcrum]

TTL stands for transistor-transistor logic, which is actually fairly obsolete. Even the Arduino uses more modern CMOS. But it's often used as shorthand for 5V logic or even digital logic in general (even 3.3V). It's also used as a (confusing) shorthand for asynchronous serial communication using logic level (as opposed to RS-232 levels).

[ebon dew]

Because you might be tempted to get a cheap microcontroller which has one of those fake FTDI chips, they still exist, they're still out there.

[late fulcrum]

Some people also refer to UART, which stands for "universal asynchronous receiver/transmitter", which is the hardware that is used to communicate using an asynchronous serial data stream.

[spark egret]

ill pass on the fake stuff if I know its fake. I value privacy / security and that is completely out with window with knock offs IMO

[ebon dew]

one of the nice things about Adafruit is you know what you're getting, from a reputable electronics company, that will support you if you have an issue.

[spark egret]

so it looks like th PN532 can use 3.3 UART, I2C and SPI. Mind breaking down the differences?

it also comes with a 4050 level shifter chip which I dont know what would be used for or even does

[late fulcrum]

They're all serial protocols. UART is a misnomer for asynchronous serial. I2C is a synchronous serial protocol that also uses 2 wires, with pull-up resistors. SPI is another synchronous serial protocol that uses 3 wires and is much faster.

[ebon dew]

some programmers at the time were 5v only, from a time when 5v logic was more prevalent, so you have to read the fine print. i've never used that board or that logic shifter. it's probably a 5v to 3.3v logic shifter.

Since it's 3.3v logic it was actually very forward thinking, we have the luxury of hindsight today though.

[spark egret]

have any of you used LoRa?

[crystal ore]

Yep, it's pretty cool.

[spark egret]

So I just need to get 2 of the same LoRa feathers and they can communicate with each other? So say I had one Lora with another sensor for time of flight and then 2nd Lora would have a screen.

If the first LoRa distance sensor got tripped it could send a message to the 2nd LoRa and result in the screen displaying text or something?

[crystal ore]

Yep, the basic protocol is all peer-to-peer, so if they are on the same channel they can talk directly.

[spark egret]

sweet. I would love to make a sorta security system using LoRa. Do you have any recommendations for which would be best for improving the distance?

I dont think I would need to transfer a lot of data, so I want to optimize distance because it would used at a camping festival. Basically it would guard my tent and if a sensor was tripped I would be notified. Cell phone signal is usually crap due to the amount of people clogging up the towers so I thought this would would better as it is radio?

[crystal ore]

LoRa has a number of config parameters that let you trade off speed for distance, so if you're not sending much data you can crank those up. Beyond that, the choice of antenna can matter too.

[spark egret]

@crystal ore I see there is a 433MHz and a 915MHz LoRa. I am assuming both can transmit the same distance but the 915 does so faster??? Why would anyone want to 433?

[late fulcrum]

433 will give better distance than 915

[spark egret]

Gotcha 433 it is then!

[ebon dew]

Also depends on your countries laws of the open frequencies.

433 is meant for Europe as there are some restrictions for that band in the US.

915 is meant for USA

generally speaking

I'm using LORA right now actually to transmit message back and forth. You can actually send full paragraphs of ascii text with them. They're not limited to 1's and 0's.

[spark egret]

gotcha, I see some product labeled radiofruit that is not LoRa? I am assuming those dont have as much range as LoRa?

[ebon dew]

Also technically the RFM69 & RFM95 aren't LORA as I think LORA is a standard. You can use it with LORA but you're not forced to.

[spark egret]

LORA is better though correct?

[ebon dew]

depends on what you want to do, a DIY security system just for you is probably not something you want to put on the LORA network unless you want remote monitoring of it.

I haven't actually used any LORA network yet. Just short range RFM95 stuff.

[late fulcrum]

I think the RFM95/96 are the LoRa capable ones, the RFM69 doesn't support that modulation scheme

And yes, LoRa stands for "long range" and uses clever modulation to achieve longer distance connectivity.

[spark egret]

No I just want basically if then statement to execute.

If perimeter = broken
Then send message

2nd device listening

message received
perimeter = broken
then light up screen

ya I see Adafruit LoRa Radio FeatherWing - RFM95W 433 MHz - RadioFruit

[ebon dew]

if you're in the US go with the 915mhz, just ensures you're not going to have the FCC knocking on your door.

[late fulcrum]

Yeah, those LoRa feathers are handy

[ebon dew]

depends how far you want to send the message, line of sight is a factor, you need good line of sight. there is only very basic scattering in there.

[spark egret]

so hypothetically a user was in the US how would they even be able to find them if the device was not on all the time? Do you have to register the LORA?

[ebon dew]

no

if you want to use it with a LORA network yes

[spark egret]

oof there would definitely be trees and other things in the way just no solid buildings.

[late fulcrum]

I just use them point to point, so I didn't need to register it.

[spark egret]

maybe I miss understood how LORA works. I didnt know there was some network. I thought it would just basically be like a radio screaming out to its partner with an encrypted message

[ebon dew]

you can create your own local network using as many devices as you want. you need a minimum of 2 transceivers. technically just the 2 is a local network.

but you can add as many nodes into the mix as you want

LORA is not encrypted, it has CRC but no encryption. if you want encryption you must build that yourself. at least with the adafruit circuit python library anyway.

you have nodes and specify the node to communicate with but it's still all open air communication.

great for mailboxes and stuff like that, the thing you're trying to do is right in line with its intended purpose which is basically anything YOU want it to do.

[keen arrow]

You can always use MQTT instead if you have wifi access

[spark egret]

I think the case mentioned earlier would be point to point. Going from camp, to on person.

No wifi possible.

[keen arrow]

How far is the distance?

You can always make an AP

[spark egret]

AP?

I see RFM95CW 915MHz LoRa Module says this

These packet radios are simpler than WiFi or BLE, you dont have to associate, pair, scan, or worry about connections. All you do is send data whenever you like, and any other modules tuned to that same frequency (and, with the same encryption key) will receive. The receiver can then send a reply back. The modules do packetization, error correction and can also auto-retransmit so its not like you have worry about everything but less power is wasted on maintaining a link or pairing.

[keen arrow]

access point but I want to know how far you are trying to do

I've used LoRa for many years for many things

[spark egret]

Not sure on how far it would need to go but my guess would be max 5 miles or 8 kilometers

[keen arrow]

Lora should be able to do that but I'd recommend you mount it higher up on a tree or something so you get a longer los

And if you want to make it even longer you can use a directional receiver antenna

They basically enable you to receiver from longer distances but only allow for a small area of basically where the antenna is pointing

[spark egret]

ya sounds like that would be best. Any idea how I could get a signal say from ground level or inside a tent to then jump to the LoRa ontop of tent or tall poll? Or would that just need like 3 units to then jump from one to the next?

[keen arrow]

I would recommend an antenna bigger than the one that adafruit sells for that range

[ebon dew]

I've only used it a few times and have yet to get something into full time usage, getting close though.

Sounds like landshark is the right person to ask. That's great stuff.

[spark egret]

def use a directional antenna

[keen arrow]

you can make a relay node pretty easily tbh basically just code it to send out whatever it receives

I probably have relay code setting around my computer somewhere if you need it

[ebon dew]

Oh I was going to try to depend on just the small antenna that comes with it. Any idea on the effective range of that?

[spark egret]

are there any specific products that you think would be best for ensuring signal can travel the distance?

so many different Lora modules and non Lora modules to choose from.

[ebon dew]

https://www.adafruit.com/product/3340 this is the antenna i'm using

[keen arrow]

I've tested it around an apartment complex but it's probably less than 2k ft

[keen arrow]

this is probably better than what I used

[spark egret]

I want to strap this to it lmfao

[keen arrow]

That's how you'd get like 16mi tbh

But those are a few hundred dollars vs like 3-4 nodes

[ebon dew]

that's one heck of a nice antenna.

[keen arrow]

I was using this https://www.adafruit.com/product/1859

[spark egret]

looks like I just found that antenna for 69 23

[keen arrow]

Those got like 1300ft for me

[ebon dew]

wish i would have gotten that one because trying to stuff that long antenna into a mailbox is awkward.

[spark egret]

ya for that distance it would be over kill

[ebon dew]

might end up drilling a hole out of the back and externally mount the antenna.

[spark egret]

@keen arrow any Lora feathers you would suggest ?

[keen arrow]

or just put your stuff in a waterproof container on the mailbox

[ebon dew]

1200 to 2000 ft is a respectable distance for a basic antenna especially for all the things you could use it for.

[keen arrow]

https://www.adafruit.com/product/3231 this wing if you already have a feather

[spark egret]

I have zero products so far

[ebon dew]

if you're looking for something more advanced there's some LORA stuff on Tindie (electronics marketplace).

and Lectronz

[keen arrow]

one second

[ebon dew]

I think Arturo has some really neat lora stuff. He built one with a blackberry keypad to use as a messenger. Think he might have discontinued those specific ones though.

[spark egret]

oh cool I had no idea about those places

[keen arrow]

I actually made something similar too

[frigid tiger]

How is the tactile feedback on those blackberry keypads

[ebon dew]

I usually stick with Adafruit products because the support is excellent. They have diagrams, schematics, tutorials, and most importantly libraries. There are disadvantages to going with a custom board from an independent maker. However you are supporting potentially the next big maker in the space so it's always good to keep your options open.

[keen arrow]

https://d112y698adiu2z.cloudfront.net/photos/production/software_photos/001/671/728/datas/original.jpg

The node on the left just relays it

https://github.com/bwolfram1/FreeCommsSH2021/blob/main/RelayNode.py

[spark egret]

is Arturo a person or website?

[keen arrow]

@spark egret he's a person

[ebon dew]

That is very similar yes. Arturo build a PCB with the lora antenna, display, and blackberry keypad all in one. Good thing is it's simple to hit the ground running, bad thing is no modularity. That's a design decision though which is never easy.

[keen arrow]

@spark egret look up solderparty

[ebon dew]

yup that's him. i'm more familiar with his name now than the company.

[keen arrow]

https://www.tindie.com/stores/arturo182/items/

But he doesn't have any lora specific stuff

[ebon dew]

Is he the one that came up with the stamp idea to use the pins to hold the castellated pads?

Really neat idea.

[keen arrow]

I would highly suggest you just start with adafruit stuff so you can experiment

[ebon dew]

SolderParty does have their own discord with good support too.

can't say that about every company though

[keen arrow]

The support is really only for arduino

[spark egret]

darn that looks sick but also more functionality that I need and could cause errors

[ebon dew]

yeah start simple, get some experience first

just coding the sensors to do what you want isn't exactly a trivial experience either if you haven't touched any microcontrollers for a while.

[spark egret]

so it looks like jumping back to a lora feather.

[keen arrow]

Ya that's why I think you should get this https://www.adafruit.com/product/3178

Get two of those

maybe 3 if you can afford it

[ebon dew]

Lady Ada recently teased an RP2040 LORA feather. Will probably be coming out this month or next month.

[keen arrow]

and these https://www.adafruit.com/product/3340

[spark egret]

what is special about RP2040 LORA?

[keen arrow]

space inside is bigger

[spark egret]

or I guess what is functionality gain of the 2040

what do you mean shark?

[ebon dew]

Different manufacturer. Atmel makes the M0 and Raspberry Pi makes the RP2040.

It doesn't run raspbian or anything like that it's just a really solid MCU.

[keen arrow]

M0 has 256K of flash storage

[ebon dew]

SAMD's are hard to get so it's more of a point of availability and widespread adoption.

No idea how much RAM the RP2040 will have if it's external, generally in the MB's range instead of KB's.

[spark egret]

so a 2040 Lora would have more ease of use and functionality than the M0?

[keen arrow]

RP2040 has 8 MB SPI FLASH

[ebon dew]

is that built in or an external flash?

[spark egret]

that would be nice for lots of logic, the memory increase that is.

[keen arrow]

@ebon dew external I believe

[ebon dew]

i always get SPI and QSPI mixed up for which is internal/external.

[spark egret]

What is SAMD's

[keen arrow]

@spark egret the m0 chip

[ebon dew]

SAMD is the chip family from Atmel, the Arduino Uno is an Atmel chip

[keen arrow]

But the biggest difference that you will see is that you can do things like have an LCD screen or oled screen with something like an M4 or RP2040 so if you want one in the future

[ebon dew]

SAMD's are a bit on the low end by today's standards, since the new ESP32-S2's from Espressif came out and the RP2040's and Pico W's.

[spark egret]

ahh okay. Well it is sounding like the rp2040 lora is going to be a giant leap in improvement and I should hold off on that one.

[keen arrow]

Also, keep in mind that these boards generally have no wifi or ble

[spark egret]

ya I would probably want to rip those off and trash them.

[ebon dew]

Honestly it should be a nice improvement but there's nothing wrong with the M0 for your purposes. Right tool for the right job and the M0 is more than capable for your purposes.

[keen arrow]

I just want to make sure you know the limitation first before you buy it.

I wish I did lol

[spark egret]

What limitations have you found

[keen arrow]

Just the screen thing

it cant hold a frame buffer or whatever it's called

[ebon dew]

I don't think the RP2040 LORA will have wifi either. If you want wifi you'll need to get an Airlift Featherwing. I have a bunch of airlifts, they work great on practically any feather.

[spark egret]

screen thing? I see they currently have one with an oled

[keen arrow]

It can't use an LCD

aka TFT

because for those it uses a frame buffer

[ebon dew]

yes the M0 is underpowered for use with a TFT

you'd want an M4 for that

[spark egret]

nope no wifi or BLE. If a device does not need a feature then do not include it. Just another attack vector or source of errors.

[keen arrow]

not if you don't connect anything to it

[ebon dew]

which is the SAMD51 but the SAMD21 & 51 are in the same boat for availability, chip shortage.

[keen arrow]

I'm pretty positive that an esp32 with no ssid is just as good as having nothing

if that makes sense

These boards aren't constantly online like your computer or server

[ebon dew]

Yup, they typically have one job.

[keen arrow]

I just like the power of the esp32 (240mhz) and the storage is nice too

[spark egret]

just because you dont connect to it doesnt prevent others from connecting to it. Again not trying to go on a mini rant. Its just dont have a need or want for those features and by not having them it also lowers the cost. So win win in my books to exclude wifi and BLE from lora

[keen arrow]

but it'll likely be overpowered for a simple lora tx

So just get the m0 lora feather. It does everything you need

But do know that lora is open and can theoretically receive anything transmitted over the lora band

[ebon dew]

yup, and you can add the rp2040 lora nodes later too. they'll be compatible as long as you choose one for the same frequency you use. 😉

by getting the M0 you'll get a head start on learning LORA by the time the RP2040's come out.

[spark egret]

ya I meant I am not going to be sending any sensitive information. I could also just garble the message and have it be decoded on the receiver lol.

[ebon dew]

well i should really say RFM95 instead of lora but the terms are used so interchangeably.

[spark egret]

think the M0 might be discounted when the 2040 comes out?

[ebon dew]

adding basic substitution encryption is very easy. i don't think there's a library for it but the ideas on simple encryptions are easy enough for anyone to do.

[spark egret]

If able I can on coding as much from the ground up.

i plan on coding***

[ebon dew]

I wouldn't count on it. Adafruit doesn't usually drop prices on things just because a new model comes out. A tool is a tool. As we've shown the M0 is still more than adequate and in some cases might still be way overkill for your purpose. That doesn't make it less valuable just because a new model comes out.

[spark egret]

agreed and understood. I am just new to ada and not sure how they operate is all.

[ebon dew]

The way Adafruit does pricing is a little different than most. It helps fend off the obsolescence. Because they're the people that design the thing they want the thing to be as useful for as long as possible.

You'll get discounts in bulk and there's always a limited time 10% off coupon to be had if you regularly watch their Youtube videos.

Since I got messaging working on my RFM's I've been having a lot of fun watching them blast messages back and forth to each other.

They're a lot of fun to play with and super easy to code. The basic RFM demo code works very well right out of the box.

[wanton thistle]

How do I find out what SAMD chips the arduino core supports?

[spark egret]

@keen arrow @ebon dew looks like 433 is allowed.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/15.231

[main orbit]

How is mcmaster carr selling 4mm-4mm shaft couplers for $150?!!?!?!?!

I'm going insane

[keen arrow]

it's not general purpose in the US

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/15.240

(a) Operation under the provisions of this section is restricted to devices that use radio frequency energy to identify the contents of commercial shipping containers. Operations must be limited to commercial and industrial areas such as ports, rail terminals and warehouses. Two-way operation is permitted to interrogate and to load data into devices. Devices operated pursuant to the provisions of this section shall not be used for voice communications.

https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/293639/north-american-regulations-on-433mhz-radio#:~:text=Well%2C 433 MHz is in,more powerfil than those modules this says you can technically but there may be a lot of interference

There is a lot of regulations around this so it just seems safer to use the 915mhz band

[keen arrow]

look up spiral cut couplers

[spark egret]

@ebon dew where did you see the tease of the rp2040 lora? I see they have them as individual units but not combined just yet

[tardy badger]

It was on the last desk of ladyada I believe

[spark egret]

@tardy badger sorry im a newb here, what is "last desk"? Is that some live stream video or something she does?

[ebon dew]

Starts at 1:03:44 here. https://www.youtube.com/live/MQ3SK8U-t6Y?feature=share

[tardy badger]

Desk of LadyAda is a Sunday live show that Ladyada does at random hacker hours

Usually around or after 9pm eastern time

[ebon dew]

Starts at 6:20 in the video. https://www.youtube.com/live/MJDYLaLlHQ0?feature=share

[spark egret]

sweet stuff thanks for the link!

Also ty again for all the Q&A earlier, I learned a lot <3

[ebon dew]

👍 Welcome. You’ll find plenty of helpful people here for almost anything electronic related from Cube satellite’s and programming to 3D printing and PCB design. This place is pretty amazing.

[spice moss]

good capture dragon to spacestation

[delicate stream]

I hope my rocket launch is successful when it happens

[tardy badger]

Mouser this morning: “just letting you know the timeframe on those CM4 is still October 2nd”

[delicate stream]

lol, quick updates

[tardy badger]

I can’t wait for October

😬

[delicate stream]

But you must... sadly it won't come early

[tardy badger]

I just need to have fun, time flies when you’re having fun

I love when you need to work overtime but the work is pretty light so you’re trying to figure out ways to make it last and be productive lol

[delicate stream]

reduces typing speed from 90WPM to 45WPM

[tardy badger]

More like.. 15WPM 💀

[proud cosmos]

can someone help me with this? so i would like to maybe see if its possible and safe to solder on the lipo directly to this feather? reason is, my spave is really tight and this connector adds more width than i can have. and it will bend it quite bad at a 90 going down. i would have to really bend it down to make it fit

i wished it was facing this way somehow

[tardy badger]

The BAT pin can be soldered to.

Red to BAT black to GND pin

[proud cosmos]

sorry im new to ada stuff. could you link or tell me what i neeed

[tardy badger]

Look on your board, do you see a hole labeled BAT?

The red wire of the battery can be soldered there

[proud cosmos]

AH! yes!

[tardy badger]

The black wire would be soldered to the hole marked GND

[proud cosmos]

dude thank you!

so my next and final quetion. how long or where could i possible get a estimate on how long this will last on a 400mah batt?

the ada fruit one

i could test it by leaving it on and seeing, but maybe there is a calc or something

[tardy badger]

That’s going to depend on how long the screen is on, what other things on the board are running, if you’re using deep sleep, etc..

[proud cosmos]

it will be just a meme scrolling, nothing too too fancy. if it sleeps the only way to wake up is button presses>

?

[tardy badger]

The ESP32 can get down to uA sleep current, so it’s possible to get 20 or more hours out of it

You can set it to restart every so many seconds

Like every 60 seconds

[proud cosmos]

ah man thank you so much! sorry im asking very noob stuff

[tardy badger]

Everyone starts from somewhere 🙂

[proud cosmos]

thank you. last one i promise while i have some folks here active

[ancient rivet]

could use this to solder on a pig tail, instead of soldering battery directly:
https://www.adafruit.com/product/3814

[proud cosmos]

thank you! yes getting some now

[tardy badger]

Good suggestion so you can change out the battery

[proud cosmos]

this is very useful because eventually it is aproduct i want to make

hency why my footprint i want it small

[tardy badger]

Understandable:)

I design stuff for right spaces and battery power 🙂

[proud cosmos]

so the buttons. front ones, they are tiny. i guess i would have to engineer something to press those say if i have a cover over it. the material is too thick, so i would need like a pin to push a button, any solution other than DIY to make thos buttons better?

[tardy badger]

I made inset buttons that I 3D printed

[proud cosmos]

oh man! what is this> i want to make is as small as possible with a screen

[proud cosmos]

ah! ok. i hav ea cnc so ill can make small buttons to match maybe. they would be small

[tardy badger]

This should give an idea

[proud cosmos]

this is beautiful! ill see what little buttons i can make. i was thinking a mag lid, and to pop the cover off. but this is great

[delicate stream]

One finger taking a sip of coffee between each keystroke???

[tardy badger]

Exactly

[delicate stream]

I can type 20-25WPM with one hand XD

[tardy badger]

Lol

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/mio-jim-carrey-type-fast-gif-7216156

[lost geode]

Is there a neopixel library online I can look at

I wanna try out others codes and edit them for my project

[cyan salmon]

Is there any soldering irons on ADAFRUIT

O there is

[tardy badger]

Making sure things are usable is hard work 😅

Currently trying to get an unstable build of IceStudio with the IcyBlue feather in it. It’s a process, that’s for sure

[ebon dew]

why would you intentionally want an unstable build?

[tardy badger]

i call it unstable because it's not part of an offical release

mostly trying to test to make sure it works

[ebon dew]

as long as it has some new feature you need and doesn't fry the fpga 🙂

[lost geode]

Also check this

[ebon dew]

@lost geode Post in show and tell https://discord.com/channels/327254708534116352/334905778857050125

Amazing build so far. Georgeous!

[lost geode]

Ah okeh

[ebon dew]

They cut all the 10% coupons this week. Even the one from JP's workshop yesterday has already expired. 😦

Guess I'll have to wait until wednesday?

[tardy badger]

prolly

I never get to use the coupons because i'm broke most of the time lol

[ebon dew]

https://tenor.com/view/eyes-excited-angry-toddler-mad-gif-16677320

Well I had a sudden need to order a new board.

I usually wait all week and then checkout during JP's ppotw but since they're already expired I'm probably not doing that from now on if they decide to go this route. I'll just wait for wednesdays.

Like.. that cycle used to be very convenient and enjoyable.

[fierce prawn]

Is making a security key or buying one better

[late fulcrum]

I was able to assemble a U2F token myself, but then realized I needed to run a DOS-only program to initialize it. So it sits in a box, unused.

[fierce prawn]

I found a software named opensk that flashes nrf52850

[late fulcrum]

Huh. I hadn't seen any security keys based on that chip. The last time I used a Nordic chip (nRF8001), it too needed a DOS-only program to generate the fuse map, after which I stopped using Nordic chips.

[fierce prawn]

Oh yeah I need a Linux VM for that

[late fulcrum]

You can run DOS apps in a Linux VM?

[tardy badger]

me: tries to build an example
tools: "we need an old version of readline"

[fierce prawn]

They have a lot of git command and sh files

[dusty citrus]

this https://www.simcom.com/product/SIM800C.html doe not have an integrated mcu right?

[frigid tiger]

Are there costs savings to flashing your own security chip

[crystal ore]

I would guess it does have its own processor, but they probably don't let you run your own code on it.

[fierce prawn]

No

[tardy badger]

Lol… I broke python working properly on my Mac. Time for a clean install.

[late fulcrum]

I've done that. Less often since I started using virtual environments most of the time, but still...

[tardy badger]

Yeah, I’m getting a weird issue trying to build some examples for the IcyBlue feather.. missing encodings module

I moved things around and I don’t remember how they go back lol

And no Time Machine backup either 😬

Basically all my files are on iCloud so I should be okay. I think

Going to back things up to my NAS as well to be safe

[late fulcrum]

Annoyingly, I've been unable to get my Mac to even see my new NAS

[tardy badger]

Even mapping a network drive?

Is it like a Buffalo systems one?

[dusty citrus]

outside of oracle, what gives a free vps?

[keen arrow]

Who doesn't?

DigitalOcean, Google Cloud Platform, IBM cloud, AWS, Linode...

List goes on

[blissful roost]

I haz free VPS at work. 😛

...sadly, I can't host anything to the outside world on it, but.. ehh.

[dusty citrus]

I might be wrong, but as I see they are mostly credit thing, or limited in some way (like aws after 12 months if I remember correctly?) meanwhile oracle

which I can't use because I think I got flaggered as being a bot

[keen arrow]

try digitalocean

https://www.digitalocean.com/pricing

App platform is free

https://cloud.google.com/free

[worldly solar]

Nothing makes me feel like a caveman more than hammering some of the pins down before soldering

[keen arrow]

https://aws.amazon.com/free/?all-free-tier.sort-by=item.additionalFields.SortRank&all-free-tier.sort-order=asc&awsf.Free Tier Types=*all&awsf.Free Tier Categories=*all

[static flare]

I'd love to live in a train and have a workshop car, or at the least a workshop van

[late fulcrum]

It doesn't even show up as a host. I did notice that Apple for some bonkers reason downgraded from AFP to SMB for its network drives.

[delicate stream]

might be because you revealed your knowledge that they leave them active all week

[ebon dew]

https://tenor.com/view/obviously-a-mistake-saturday-night-live-weekend-update-made-a-mistake-somethings-wrong-gif-20523229

[delicate stream]

RIP in pieces

[tardy badger]

Reese’s pieces?

[delicate stream]

No, they’ll kill me

[tardy badger]

Peanuts?

[delicate stream]

Poiiiiison

[tardy badger]

Allergy poison?

[delicate stream]

Yiss

[tardy badger]

Boo, curse your allergies

[delicate stream]

Indeed

[tardy badger]

They deprive you of deliciousness

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/nah-im-good-tessa-sanders-fbi-most-wanted-im-fine-im-feeling-good-gif-25928547

[tardy badger]

Do you have any issues with some gluten free stuff like things with xantham gum

[delicate stream]

Nope, I’m good with everything else, aside from a mild lemon and lime allergy

[tardy badger]

When I worked at a country club, we had to be careful with people who had ground nut allergies because xanthan gum can trigger ground but allergies

Lemon & lime allergies 🤔

[late fulcrum]

Dat typo, tho

[delicate stream]

Ground but

Fun fact: peanuts are not nuts

Or butts

[late fulcrum]

Or peas.

[delicate stream]

They’re closer to peas

[tardy badger]

They’re legumes

[delicate stream]

that was MY LINE

[tardy badger]

Lol

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/stolen-line-robin-w-illiams-gif-5495312

Hmmm… socket, or direct solder?

[whole jacinth]

is there a solid ground plane right under the antenna if you mount directly to the board?

[delicate stream]

There is a ground for the regular Pico’s debug

OH NO I SOLDERED HALF THE RESISTORS BACKWARDS

[whole jacinth]

yeah that looks like a solid enough ground plane to interfere with the antenna

[delicate stream]

Socket it is then

I need to stop assembling late at night

[static flare]

late at night right now is the only time i can assemble

[late fulcrum]

I like to socket them anyway, for easy re-use/replacement/debugging

[static flare]

same

[delicate stream]

Same… but LATE late late is how I end up with backwards resistors

9 out of 16 backwards…

Oop… tried to post SpongeBob screaming “soiled it” but the URL had a naughty word… bad GIF maker, bad!

[static flare]

Resistors aren't directional tho

Unless it's for the aesthetics

[delicate stream]

Entirely aesthetics

Thankfully I can salvage by swapping one resistor so half are one way and half are the other way and meet in the middle

[static flare]

Haha fair

[delicate stream]

Dumb brain dumb

Red socket or blue socket… hmmm….

[delicate stream]

Bluuuue

[urban arrow]

Yesterday I was soldering up a Feather Tripler, and using the unused thru-holes to solder into Feather USB/Gnd to hook up external power. Already had done this OK on another one. So, get done, no power. I'm looking it over and over (I'm stupid) until I saw where I had NOT soldered the wire to the pad that's CONNECTED already thru a trace on the USB pad on Tripler. Duh. That's what I get for hurrying. So soldered across the pads to reach USB in. Works now.

[delicate stream]

Soldering while hurrying or sleep deprived or both is a recipe for disaster XD

[urban arrow]

BTW - go to strore. Milk $4.00. Let's see. Do I want milk, or another Pico for $4, that will last me for years??? I'll drink water.

[delicate stream]

Lucky… milk is $5.15 here

But I agree, I’ll drink water

Still need some milk tho, lol

[urban arrow]

Yes just a drop or 2 for my morning cereal... then back to programming

[delicate stream]

Lol. Gotta have it for my Kraft mac’n’cheese

[spice moss]

https://tenor.com/view/ben-franklin-glasses-gif-22056787

[delicate stream]

I built a pair of those once!

[static flare]

oh? what's it from?

[spice moss]

the glasses are from national treasure

[wooden schooner]

This was such a weird moment in Spongebob. "Soiled it" is not a real idiom, right?

They're pointing to how uncomfortable it is to be in the other end of someone over-apologizing but he's being even weirder

[tardy badger]

Refilled for Oak Technology Holdings, LLC

Making things real again

[steady dove]

👋 @delicate stream

[crystal ore]

"Holdings"? Heh heh, nice.

[worn stump]

So confession: I can’t solder for crap. What’s the best way to learn to do it “right” ?

[keen arrow]

try the arduino make an uno or whatever it's called

Basically the best way to do it is to do it

[tardy badger]

Keep the door open for the future 🙂

[thick wind]

I could link as many articles as I can find, but nothing beats practical experience, in my experience.

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/kanokari-anime-wave-sumi-sakurasawa-gif-26341955

I lost my solder

[thick wind]

Once you know the basics of applying heat where you want your solder to flow, the rest is just doing it haha

[delicate stream]

That’s actually a thing people say

[keen arrow]

Something like this @worn stump https://store-usa.arduino.cc/collections/new-products/products/make-your-uno-kit

[delicate stream]

Practice 40 hours a day. There are inexpensive kits you can get on eBay like this clock that are pretty easy to put together; other random things for like $2-5 each that if you screw it up, it’s not a big loss. SparkFun also sells scrap boards in bulk, you can just practice soldering wires and dead components onto them

[worn stump]

I agree but I’m always worried about ruining expensive components. Joining two wires isn’t an issue but mounting things to a board, I just get nervous I’m going to ruin the board. What are some cheaper components to start with?

[keen arrow]

Check out Amazon

[worn stump]

Thank you! This is my issue lol $$$

[delicate stream]

Same XD the kits are also just fun

[keen arrow]

@worn stump Search Learn to Solder on Amazon

[delicate stream]

Oh, yeah, a lot of the solder kits are called “suites”, so searching “solder suite” or something along those lines can give more hits

[tardy badger]

Oh yeah Emma makes great kits

[delicate stream]

I want to make kits for people to make

[tardy badger]

https://learntosolderkits.com/

Emma makes a lot of different educational kits for learning soldering

[delicate stream]

Those are nice. A little pricey for what they are, but nice

[tardy badger]

Well, small businesses gotta make money 😅

She employs herself and like 2 others?

In California no less

[delicate stream]

Yeah, understandable, lol. Hard to compete with big companies in China that spit things out

[tardy badger]

She started it as a side hustle and took the leap in 2021/2022

[delicate stream]

Here’s that clock, I enjoyed it https://www.ebay.com/itm/144667885515?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=qwanfGCeQ7i&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=_oEK4uOGRgy&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

[tardy badger]

I did one of those oscilloscope kits but I’m terrified to power it up 😅

[delicate stream]

Do it outside, lol

… still trying to figure out how I lost my solder

[tardy badger]

Like I’m sure it works great, and I’m confident in my soldering abilities. It just doesn’t specify the power input

And I don’t know where my USB to barrel cable went 🤔

[delicate stream]

This clock says 5-12v on it, 6-12v in the documentation, lol

[keen arrow]

https://www.adafruit.com/product/89 things like this are on adafruit

[delicate stream]

I’m sitting here and had my solder in hand, then put it down to type something… now it’s gone?

[keen arrow]

Yes that's how it goes

[tardy badger]

Same thing happens to me lol

[delicate stream]

Ohhhh adds to cart

[delicate stream]

It’s gremlins!

[keen arrow]

heck

[delicate stream]

Dang Dyno

[tardy badger]

places tweezers down
1 minute later…
“Where the heck did they go???”

[keen arrow]

I can't post another link yet

[delicate stream]

FOUND IT

[keen arrow]

Adafruit product 184

[delicate stream]

A tissue tried eating it on the floor

[keen arrow]

124 too

[delicate stream]

This is the good stuff. Easy to do, good practice, and useful

[static flare]

I need to think of a name for my tech stuff, but I don't think we have LLCs here?

[keen arrow]

1526 if you want to solder like 25 transistors

[tardy badger]

You probably have Limited Partnerships as a similar structure

[delicate stream]

This is in my wishlist

I’ll get it eventually

[keen arrow]

You can do SP @tardy badger

[static flare]

I see my name in that link 👀

[keen arrow]

I technically have an SP

[delicate stream]

I know, I saw it and thought you were watching me

[static flare]

https://tenor.com/view/mike-wazowski-watchingyou-gif-5352035

[worn stump]

I love this!

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/panic-anime-shookt-shocked-gif-10583115

[worn stump]

Mind gremlins! They steal your thoughts, concentration, and good moods

[keen arrow]

@worn stump Look at this too if you are willing to spend a bit more https://www.adafruit.com/product/1526

The components can be easily replaced if you mess up

Also, I HIGHLY recommend solder wick

[static flare]

Proprietary Limited Company over here, apparently

[keen arrow]

https://www.adafruit.com/product/149

[worn stump]

Where is here?

[keen arrow]

Something like that

[static flare]

Australia!

[delicate stream]

Generally every country has something along the lines of an LLC

[delicate stream]

I’m surprised it isn’t a CLL

[static flare]

h e y

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/girl-laugh-anime-rire-hehehe-gif-13190370

[worn stump]

Messing with a 555 is on my wishlist which is infinite ofc 🤣

[frigid tiger]

Ya every country has a scheme for preventing yourself from going bankrupt due to bad business decisions

[delicate stream]

*almost

[worn stump]

Thank y’all so much!!!
This is my favorite thing about discords. Google is a firehose. I prefer qualified concise answers ☺️

[urban arrow]

My recurring problem is I have 2 pair of reading glasses, medium and strong. Must use both for this hobby/soldering. So lay down 1 or both, and 30 secs later, can't find 'em... Prolly in another room, for crying out loud, that I don't even recall going in there... My work space is nowhere near my wife, good thing, as she can't hear me shout "where's my glasses" all day long.

[static flare]

my wife and i had that issue today since i last used the tweesers

[frigid tiger]

I want to carve out my eyes and replace them electronic eyes already

[tardy badger]

I have to wear my glasses all the time so I always know where they are hahaha

[static flare]

the thought of that terrifies me tbh, the worst I'd want is a RFID chip in the web of my hand, and my CGM, but other than that I'd kinda prefer wearables instead

[delicate stream]

I only want electronic eyes if my organic ones die

[tardy badger]

I want hazel eyes so I can feel what Kelly Clarkson felt all those years ago

[delicate stream]

Just get colored contacts, lol

[tardy badger]

Ew no

Contacts making contact with my eyes is a huge sensory no no for me lol

[delicate stream]

Lol… you don’t feel then when they’re in, normally

[tardy badger]

You don’t realize the pain of the thought of things touching my eyes

I can’t do it

[static flare]

i used to have purple ones

[delicate stream]

I wish prescription costume lenses didn’t cost a bajillion dollars and only last a relatively short period

[static flare]

I'm lucky I only need reading glasses haha

[static flare]

But that was... 3.5 years ago? June 2019

[delicate stream]

I’m effectively blind without correction XD can’t see clearly more than about 5 inches from my face

[static flare]

I'm farsighted, so the opposite

(which makes sense that I'd only need reading glasses)

[delicate stream]

Lol, lucky

[late fulcrum]

Yeah, I'm really nearsighted too, along with a big helping of astigmatism.

[delicate stream]

I have no conventional depth perception — I had a “software issue” that kept me from seeing out of my left eye for the most part for ages. It’s still kinda useless, but not as bad XD

[late fulcrum]

Heh, I have the hearing equivalent: "auditory processing disorder", which makes me perceive things out of order.

People keep suggesting I get hearing aids, which are no help for such things.

[gusty torrent]

I recently had an IOL and my close-up work is SO much better afterwards (with work glasses of course)

The Lasik I had in 2011 was monovision, which wrecked my ability to do close work.

But the ability to function across the range of distances was worth it at the time (I was dreadfully nearsighted before)

[late fulcrum]

I currently do that by having several pairs of glasses for different tasks

[gusty torrent]

After the IOL though my overall function was better than after the lasik.

I just use a pair of 1.6x magnification glasses for close work like soldering or painting miniatures.

[static flare]

Ultimately I probably will want to wear glasses with clipped on addons like lights, magnifying glasses, maybe even a HUD if I can build it

[late fulcrum]

I found an eye doctor I like, who said "I'll just hang this card on this beam, you move it to each distance you want to have, and I'll write you a prescription for each one". After we were done with that, she remarked "you're very particular about your vision, and I even tried seeing if your preferences were repeatable, and they were, to a degree I rarely come across!"

[static flare]

On the note of glasses, I have too many glasses oml

especially since i get tested every couple of years and the prescription changes every time

[late fulcrum]

My eye doctor suggested I hang on to my old glasses as spares, as my astigmatism doesn't really change much, just the focal length, so my old "craft glasses" are my new reading glasses, and my old reading glasses are my new computer glasses. But yeah, I too have too many.

[static flare]

I also have an astigmatism

[urban arrow]

Been nearsighted (blind) since I was 10 or 12. One trick (advantage??): if I REALLY have to see something close up, don't use any lenses/glasses at all, and I can count the MOLECULES ha ha from 3 inches away.

[solar kindle]

Might consider buying one of these and tethering it to your soldering iron. 😄

[late fulcrum]

I do have some magnifiers of various kinds, but I find the custom-made very close-in glasses are more convenient. They have almost no spherical component (my natural focus is very close), but just the cylindrical one to correct for the astigmatism.

[solar kindle]

I've been wearing these things (off-the-shelf progressives) for a while now. Weirdly, more comfortable than the prescription progressives I got. https://sightlinereaders.com/

[proud cosmos]

does anyone have a site where i can buy small button i guess extensions that go over the reverse feather? i need to punch this thru metal, not plastic, and its sorta thick. so extensions of some type will work

[late fulcrum]

I'm not sure what extensions you mean or what you're getting at with "punch through metal".

[proud cosmos]

one sec

my metal top is too thick

so i need to cnc holes for buttuns, but i would like to find like small buttons

[late fulcrum]

You could use ordinary female headers as extensions. How small are you looking for? Maybe an inline switch like this would fit in a groove along a header, but you'd probably want some sort of button positioned on top of it. https://media.digikey.com/photos/E-Switch Photos/TL1107BF130WQ.jpg

[proud cosmos]

i guess there is no solution from adafruit, not sure why they dont make like extensions? because these buttons are tiny

[proud cosmos]

the smaller the better

[late fulcrum]

They do make stuff like this, but perhaps I'm not understanding what you mean by "extensions" https://www.adafruit.com/product/2886

[glossy knoll]

Do you mean like a plastic dowel that makes the button “head” longer?

[proud cosmos]

ok the buttons on top of the reverse feather, are tiny. i need to punch the buttons thru so i can hit the buttons from the top with the lid i posted above. if i cut holes for the buttons, i would have to roll around with a tooth pic to press the buttons on top with lid

[proud cosmos]

this!

[glossy knoll]

I’m not aware of any extensions, but the usual method is to have a larger button piece that sits in your casing and pushes the smaller one-similar to how buttons on a game controller are designed

[proud cosmos]

yes im not sure where to start looking for this

or what they are called

my lid is metal

[glossy knoll]

I’m not sure, maybe search “captive button” or something like that?

Here’s a site that describes how they make them: https://www.spikenzielabs.com/blog/how-we-make-it-floating-captive-buttons/

[proud cosmos]

ok perfect ill take a look, not sure why adafruit wouldnt have this? i know there is so many options for this. but like these buttons are tiny.

[glossy knoll]

I think you’d usually have to design those yourself to fit your case

Another example: https://robotpishop.com/amp/plastic-project-enclosure-case-with-buttons.html

It’s going to depend on your case thickness and material too; usually the visible “button” is a single piece and not a button + shaft extension

[proud cosmos]

ok this makes sense! thank you!

[glossy knoll]

No prob, excited to see what you come up with for a solution!

[proud cosmos]

thank you!, i might just machine it out ot Titanium, since the case is titanium

[glossy knoll]

Whoa, that’s pretty awesome! Must take a beefy CNC to mill it

[tardy badger]

Time to do some counting

[static flare]

:D One!

[wanton thistle]

anyone ever find themselves ogling a microcontrollers knowing full well what you have does the job? Im that person whos looking at STM32 stuff thinking "well, maybe its time to switch..."

meanwhile, I now have 3 to 6 pieces of PIC micro's I know I'll use eventually

Conversely "Well, I should expand my horizons and learn how to program in Arduino"

I am a fickle person 👀

[tardy badger]

FPGA are so fun 🙂

Also peep the prototype from before I decided to add SPI flash

[wanton thistle]

even your birds celebrated

"oooooooh ah ha ha"

[tardy badger]

Lol Mickey Mouse clubhouse and my kids in the background lol

[wanton thistle]

oh my god lol

I need to go touch grass then lol

[tardy badger]

@delicate stream lookie 😄

[glossy knoll]

Yes, with all the ESP8266 boards I have. “But the ESP32 and Pico W…”

[wanton thistle]

I was even looking into the ESP32 and the newest Pico! I think we just want something new and shiny

[glossy knoll]

Having lots of I/O is really nice too

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/chika-fujiwara-spinning-anime-twirl-happy-gif-14830000

[tardy badger]

It’s so satisfying

[delicate stream]

it does a thing!

https://tenor.com/view/jim-carrey-its-alive-ace-ventura-pet-detective-gif-3447515

[tardy badger]

More blinky

My kids fighting in the background lol

Sneezing too 😅

[delicate stream]

Hehe

[tardy badger]

Weird part of writing the flash is you have to power flush the board afterwards

[ebon dew]

Thats awesome skerr! FPGA does a thing!

https://tenor.com/view/congrats-minions-congratulations-clap-gif-4115631

[tardy badger]

yup! and it's done with this simple example 🙂 https://github.com/skerr92/ice5lp4k_examples/blob/master/leds/leds.v

just make build && make prog_flash and a quick power flush after uploading and bob's your uncle!

granted, you gotta get the tools setup which takes ~5 minutes

and if you're on a mac you have to go through and tell your security settings that it's okay if they run lol

but it's not terribly hard to get setup

i've got to figure out the steps on windows so I can add those instructions to the repo

[ebon dew]

People who use a microcontroller for the first time think getting to blink is daunting without good tutorials. Easy is a highly subjective term.

[tardy badger]

sure, I try to not use "easy"

i try to use "not terribly hard" because it still maintains that there might be some difficulty 🙂

My goal is to figure out all the edge cases so I can have those documented right up front

[glossy knoll]

I’m still convinced that a big reason Arduino succeeded was ease of toolchain setup, so that’s awesome!

[tardy badger]

removing that barrier was huge for Arduino

just being able to plug in a board and program it made it so much easier to get started

There is a platform for the iCE40 FPGA like what i'm working on that is a visual tool, drag and drop kind of programming. I'm working to get that setup too.

[ebon dew]

Absolutely. The integrated IDE with bootloader and libraries was far better than most chip manufacturers proprietary software.

It would be nice if Adafruit does some similar someday with libraries, maybe circup integration with the new online editor.

[tardy badger]

someone mentioned a few weeks ago about that, or something like that for using i2c devices

[glossy knoll]

Oh yeah, especially the Eclipse-based stuff shudder

[ebon dew]

As my first time ever using a microcontroller i found it to be a really easy experience. The included examples from a drop down was super useful.

[tardy badger]

just plug in an i2c device, it scans and pulls all the libraries for that device but scanning, checking device ID, and whatnot.

[glossy knoll]

Same- that was my intro as well. The lack of debugger was admittedly rough, but otherwise it was so accessible

[ebon dew]

Makecode visual tool is pretty easy to use too.

It would be neat to see a visualizer of how code gets executed between files, functions, and libraries.

kind of like a breadcrumb of functions

[tardy badger]

debuggers are nice because you can step through everything if you want.

[ebon dew]

drag and drop functions sounds nice

[tardy badger]

but they admittedly are not intuitive to use for beginners

[ebon dew]

want something to count the time? drag and drop this datetime function and connect it to your code.py etc..

[tardy badger]

if someone made a visual application for using them, it would be greatly game changing for people understanding debugging

[ebon dew]

if done in big enough chunks. yeah some parts of makecode become unintuitive the deeper you go but i suppose that's true of any language you really dive into.

[delicate stream]

Everything is easy if you’re good at following instructions, have good instructions, and everything goes right :P

[ebon dew]

true lol

[tardy badger]

my problem is my brain skips steps

[ebon dew]

everything is easy if you know what you're doing

[delicate stream]

Who knows what they’re doing tho

[ebon dew]

not me

[tardy badger]

read the first like 6 and my brains like "yeah, I got this" and then an hour later i'm like "why isn't it working"

i got back to step 7 and it all makes sense

[delicate stream]

LadyAda, PT, maybe 3 other people?

[tardy badger]

I know what I'm doing now with setting up these examples xD

[ebon dew]

they're running a huge business too though.

[tardy badger]

but yesterday, I was like O_O when I broke python from working properly on my mac

[delicate stream]

Lol

[late fulcrum]

SparcWorks was kind of line that.

[tardy badger]

I finally upgraded to Ventura 13.2.1, tried one other way and things finally worked hahaha

[ebon dew]

foamyguy broke his pylint today and had the same kind of reaction lol

he somehow reformatted pylint with itself, apparently it will allow that.

[tardy badger]

lol

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/monkey-computer-not-working-computer-broken-computer-problems-computer-issues-gif-12674712

^ us

[ebon dew]

https://tenor.com/view/antman-luis-michael-pena-we-can-handle-it-professionals-gif-5458861

[delicate stream]

https://tenor.com/view/marvel-marvel-cinematic-universe-ant-man-paul-rudd-gif-14012986

[tardy badger]

https://tenor.com/view/quantumania-antman-imax-kang-modok-gif-27386447

[wanton thistle]

I dont need a RP pico but I want one lol.

[crystal ore]

They're kind of cheap enough you don't need an excuse, heh heh.

[delicate stream]

Get a W instead! Wifiiiiii

[ebon dew]

🥧🐮

[wanton thistle]

ESP32-S3 😄 (I think thats the latest-theres so many!!)

[ebon dew]

Latest but far from stable yet. If you want stable wifi go with the s2.

[dusty citrus]

And yet again something in my windows has broken, it's a waste of time

[gusty torrent]

And if you want cheap with wifi you have c3, but those aren't exactly 100% stable either.

Dev boards for $1.89

And chips under $1 in reel quantity

[blissful roost]

I was considering getting a C3, but as it's a mere 32b MCU that doesn't run Linux, I decided against it.

[wanton thistle]

hmmm good to know

[blissful roost]

I went for the Ox64 instead, so I'm just waiting on development work for the device support I need.

[lapis dirge]

I find that if I have a piece of hardware on hand I'll usually find a project to put it in. I just ordered an Arduino Giga R1 (should be here Monday ..... yea!) and I'm on the email notification list for the Adafruit Metro M7, both use the STM32. I'm excited.

[crystal ore]

I'm impressed the Giga is available so quickly after being announced.

[lapis dirge]

Check out how this person did the buttons on a Node32. There is a slight bump on both sides of the cutout to depress the button and give the user some tactile feedback as to where to push. Very simple and yet very effective. https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4125952

[tardy badger]

I have no idea what I’d do with one, but it looks cool

[lapis dirge]

Yea, And I thought it would have to ship from Europe but for a US delivery it shipped from New Jersey. And shipping was as low as $1.60.

I bought it the same day it announced.

[lapis dirge]

I have a complete 1.6L supercharged Mini Cooper engine. Bought it as a spare engine for my Mini when it was a race only car. But due to car prices rising and my daughter blowing up her car I had to start daily driving the Mini. So now I have an engine to "play" with. So I was thinking of using the Giga as a replacement for an Arduino Mega in a Speeduino engine management system.

[tardy badger]

Oh fascinating

[lapis dirge]

The Mini engine is a good candidate to "play" with because it isn't a very complicated engine. No variable timing, single overhead cam, fuel injected ...... all of which means the sensor package is basic, simple spark timing and fuel injector control. My friend Matt and I are getting ready to start building a "replacement" for the Mini Cooper Race Car ... An older Honda Civic. That Civic will be getting a newer, higher performance Japanese import engine. The new engine has dual overhead cams, dual cam profiles on both the intake and exhaust cams and variable cam timing on both cams. And of course fuel injection. The sensor package is a nightmare and trying to adjust the cam profile, timing, fire the plugs and inject the fuel all at the proper time is probably going to require the processing of a Giga, but I think we are going to go with an over the counter solution for the race car.

[static flare]

Howdy y'all

[static flare]

If I were to want to design a footprint that I could SMD a Pico W to, in order to not interfere with the antenna, what would you recommend? I'll probably end up not putting any SWD header stuff down, mostly because I want it to be able to use both, but other than that?

[late fulcrum]

I'd probably either add a keepout area under the antenna, or arrange for the Pico to stick out over the edge of the board.

[static flare]

Probably a keepout/cutout then? Cause I wanna make a macropad (because I just realised the cost would be more effective to make my own as I have the switches, the sockets, the screen, the encoder, and the Pico W already)

[late fulcrum]

Good point, a cutout would work too.

[late fulcrum]

Wow, I didn't know Speeduino existed. Maybe time to dust off the '04 Chrysler and punt its silly cam sensor problems to the curb.

[cyan salmon]

where would you find high speed and torque brushless motor

[tardy badger]

Old drills probably

Could look up drill motors

[cyan salmon]

i was thinking scooter motor

[tardy badger]

Probably works too

[cyan salmon]

my goal is i have an old cart like this

this is something i found on donedeal but

its like this and im gonna put a motor onto it

its finna be good

[tardy badger]

https://www.voromotors.com/products/1800w-dualtron-eagle-pro-electric-scooter-motor

Get a huge battery pack

Rip your arms off accelerating lol

[cyan salmon]

good

[cyan salmon]

its only 12v

[tardy badger]

Means you need a 150Ah battery for 1h of use

Get a 300-500Ah 12V battery and that’s hours of fun

[cyan salmon]

what about 2-3h use

yea

[tardy badger]

12V would be easier to power as many batteries are 12V

[cyan salmon]

yea

what would i use for throttle

[tardy badger]

Just need a protection circuit for over discharge and charging.

Use a speed controller

[cyan salmon]

on ada?

[tardy badger]

I don’t think they’d have what you need for that power rating

[cyan salmon]

fair

https://www.adafruit.com/product/3739

bro something like this would be cool

[tardy badger]

This is where 48V motors are useful because they require 1/4 the current needed for the same power rating

[cyan salmon]

link a good one

see main issue would be torque and second would be speed

[tardy badger]

Mophorn 1800W Electric Brushless DC Motor Kit - 48V 4500rpm Brushless Motor with 33A Speed Controller and Throttle Grip Kit for Go Karts E-Bike Electric Throttle Motorcycle Scooter https://a.co/d/10ZyDkM

This isn’t a bad kit, probably would work for what you’re doing

[thick wind]

All that’s left is to source a 48V battery?

[tardy badger]

And charge controller

But yeah

LiFePO4 batteries probably would source enough current

https://www.renogy.com/12v-100ah-lithium-iron-phosphate-battery-w-bluetooth/?gclid=CjwKCAiAmJGgBhAZEiwA1JZolquAJBqs9_XXkWJw0DxyZlgSCwGjIqKJIUsjBL3H514xi8ofYHXhyRoCODIQAvD_BwE

1hrs of continuous use

[late fulcrum]

This? https://www.allelectronics.com/item/dcm-2460/24-vdc-brushless-motor-600-watt/1.html

The built-in controller is a nice bonus

[cyan salmon]

i need more torque and speed

[glossy knoll]

That's a pricey battery!

[tardy badger]

LiFePO4 usually are

But they are very safe, so I’m told lol

Much safer than packs of 18650s 🙂

[glossy knoll]

For sure

[late fulcrum]

Maybe something like this? https://www.cubcadet.com/en_US/electrical/48v-electric-deck-motor/724P04909.html

[glossy knoll]

It kinda sounds like an electric golf cart or gokart motor is what you need?

[cyan salmon]

prolly

i mean golf cart go kart

i was thinking for 30+ mph and good torque

[lapis dirge]

Well if you are hanging out on this discord server and you have any interest in cars at all, the Speeduino platform is right up your alley!

[lusty fossil]

I use golf carts every day. They are not anywhere near 30 mph. Go kart is a better bet

[cyan salmon]

yea

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIi5nA4ZNyM

WOAH

[late fulcrum]

A quick web search finds the maker https://www.qsmotor.com/product/3000w-bicycle-motor/

[cyan salmon]

lil too powerful

i feel like the kart would fall apart

[late fulcrum]

The site shows a range of motors in varying torque/speed ranges, from 800W to 16kW

[wispy heron]

How about electric bike wheels & batteries? Bicycle motors can be pretty beefy, and lots of battery options. I run most of my gadgetry off of 36v bike batteries. Many e-bikes have a governor on the controller to prevent the bike from going faster than 20mph as they would class it as a motor vehicle and not a bicycle and thus need plates, but for areas that don’t have those legal restrictions you can just disable the governor. Grin is my preferred source for e-bike parts, but it’s been a few years since I got parts from them so I won’t promise anything. Endless sphere is another great forum to check out with regards to e-bikes and other sorts of evehicles. https://ebikes.ca/product-info/grin-products/all-axle-hub-motor.html