GZCLP 2.0

[haughty gorge]

need help with re-programming

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench press T2
Lat Pulldown T3
Hack Squat T3
Incline Dumbbell T3
Bicep curl machine T3

Day 2:

OHP T1
Deadlift T2
Seated Cable Row T3
T3
T3
T3

Day 3:

Bench press T1
Squat T2
Pull Ups T3
Incline Dumbbell T3
Leg Extension T3
T3

Day 4:

Deadlift T1
OHP T2
T-row machine T3
T3
T3
Overhead Cable Triceps T3

[static palm]

do the default recommended exercises for gzclp

[haughty gorge]

T3 Exercises to add:

Shoulders: 3x dumbbell lateral raises, 1x rear delt fly

Chest: 2x incline dumbbell, dips, and pec dec machine

Legs: Hack squat, leg extension ✅

Back: Lat pulldown, pull ups, t-row chest supported machine, seatred cable row ✅

Biceps: preacher curl machine, ez bar

Triceps: overhead cable, barbell skull crushers

Forearms: barbell wrist curl, hammer curl

Sensei's @static palm @regal ruin

[static palm]

do rows and pulldowns, lateral raises, a bicep movement and a tricep movement

row or pulldown every workout, and then one or two of others, alternating so you’re doing it 3x every 2 weeks

[haughty gorge]

huh

that still leaves chest

[static palm]

what do you think this is for

[haughty gorge]

i mean my T3 chest exercises

[static palm]

yes

you dont need them

[haughty gorge]

what do you meaaaaaaaaaan i dont need them?!?!?

[haughty gorge]

Eminn is already jacked

i still need to get jacked

[static palm]

and he got there by doing 3-whatever exercises lol

idk what you're expecting

the answer isnt going to change

and the advice isnt really going to change

either follow it or dont

if you choose to do something dumb and unnecessary then thats on you

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[haughty gorge]

3 exercises per workout or 3 T3 exercises per workout?

[static palm]

he didnt follow gzclp but i think honestly he was doing 4-7 exercises total per workout

and 7 was... overkill

i did follow gzclp, and i was doing 5-6 exercises at most per workout

like... you're asking for advice fam, what are you expecting to get lol

[regal ruin]

you can do that with the base gzclp

time and effort

and as a beginner you will benefit from less tbqh

[haughty gorge]

its just that... I want that aesthetic V-taper look man

within ~2 years

[static palm]

really dumb of you to leave out rows and pulldowns then

good thing i suggested you put it in

[haughty gorge]

i have rows?

seated cable row and t-row chest supported

lat pulldown and pull ups for pulldowns

[static palm]

why is it crossed out then

why are you… ok lol

[haughty gorge]

those are the exercises ive already added

i put a checkmark behind them

lol

[static palm]

do this

specifically this

thats what i would do

it’ll get you to your goals

run only that and the base t1 and t2s for 5 months

thats what i would do and what i would suggest you do

[haughty gorge]

spread out over 4 days?

or do you mean do all of these each day?

[static palm]

.

[haughty gorge]

sorry i dont understand what you mean

row or pulldown is clear

but what do you mean with one of the two others

[static palm]

• do rows OR pulldowns each workout
• do 1-2 more exercises per workout day
• for those 1-2, pick ONE lateral raise, ONE bicep movement, ONE tricep movement

make sure you do lat raises, biceps, triceps at least 3x every 2 weeks

that means every other workout you should be doing the same set of t3s

no other T3s, no other added exercises

no added T2s or T1s

[haughty gorge]

im starting to understand

T1
T2
T3 row or pull
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

[static palm]

yes, but decide at the start which one goes where

so one day you will have one exercise

the other day you will have the other two exercises

[haughty gorge]

i see i see

this removes all of my current T3 leg and chest exercises

I can do without T3 leg exercises but not without T3 chest exercises

T1
T2
T3 row or pull
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 chest exercise

[regal ruin]

bit much innit

[haughty gorge]

6 exercise

[static palm]

i literally just told you what to do

[static palm]

i also specified this

[haughty gorge]

and im gonna do that 🫡 + add ONE T3 chest

[static palm]

dumb!

[haughty gorge]

whyyyy

[static palm]

because it is

[haughty gorge]

i need to

[regal ruin]

protip
t3 pull movement
t3 compliment to the t1

that's it that's the routine

[static palm]

ok then you dont care as much about your goals

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[haughty gorge]

what

no

yes i do

[static palm]

i think you think that you doing what you think is right is better

its not better

its worse

so you can do whatever you want

i told you what you SHOULD do to reach your goal as quickly as possible

[haughty gorge]

no i m gonna do what youre telling me to do + add a little bit of salt

[haughty gorge]

how can I not do T3 chest exercises?

im already doing 6 exercises anyway

[static palm]

specifically NOT doing what i told you to do

bc i specifically told you that you shouldn’t add more

[haughty gorge]

but chest is important

i dont understand

[static palm]

.

you dont need to understand and both emiin and i have explained it like 10 times

the answer isnt going to change

[haughty gorge]

this wont be enough for me

[static palm]

for you physically it will be

do whatever you want then, and stop asking for advice if you’re not gonna listen or follow it

if you know what’s best then why even ask

[haughty gorge]

i have done the vanila GLZCP program and didnt see much change to my physique. Only when i added specific T3 excersises i started to notice a difference

[static palm]

[picture of ohp]

[static palm]

probably your diet could have been improved and you didnt run it for very long

[regal ruin]

over how much time

[static palm]

2-3 months i bet

[haughty gorge]

12 weeks

[static palm]

1.5 without changing anything

[haughty gorge]

one full run

[static palm]

that’s about when you would start to see changes

[regal ruin]

yeah you will barely see shit in that time

[static palm]

even with a good diet

[haughty gorge]

im currently on my 3rd run

2nd run started last september, i added more specific T3 exercises begin october

[static palm]

body changes are slow even with a good routine, especially if you dont have a diet locked in

[haughty gorge]

3rd run 2nd week i think

[haughty gorge]

how much (upper) chest does OHP work

[static palm]

all of it, you need your chest to lift the weight

[haughty gorge]

i genuinly dont understand why its bad for me to add 1 T3 chest exercise? Especially when its a muscle group I really want to focus on

[static palm]

lets boil it down to this: what are you expecting to get out of this convo

[haughty gorge]

enlightment and guidance

and testosterone

[static palm]

you can do what you want. You have a goal and a routine, i and emiin told you what our opinions are based on our experience doing it ourselves and what other people have done

there’s your guidance

your enlightenment is “dont do as much as you want to do”

there’s nothing else and nothing else you’re asking for

what you want to do will either slow your progress or not make it faster. So that’s all

[haughty gorge]

wait please dont get mad

[regal ruin]

this is all i did during my gzclp run

went well

[static palm]

there’s literally nothing else to say

[haughty gorge]

I need to understand WHY

so I dont feel like im missing out

[static palm]

because it wont

[haughty gorge]

i dont want to look back 2 years from now and regret not doing something

[regal ruin]

for a beginner, there is more value in performing better, with focused, priority movements

less is more in your scenario

[static palm]

there are like 10 reasons why and none of them are that important

you dont need to know how a car works to drive it and knowing how it works doesnt help

basically, theres 0 reason in your case for your goals to add more than what was suggested, and adding more the way you want to wont help

thats “why” you shouldnt add more

A: because it doesnt help you reach your goals faster and might make it worse

eventually, by doing, you might figure out why. If you dont, it doesn’t matter

[haughty gorge]

so ill be removing all of my T3 leg and chest exercises; leg extension, leg press, incline db and pec dec

for legs i dont mind but for chest...

[static palm]

you’ll be doing specifically what i suggested and nothing more

ignore what you had before

[regal ruin]

ya got multiple t1s and t2s

[haughty gorge]

ill ignore it but I feel really uncomfortable doing chest so little

[regal ruin]

they're getting work

[static palm]

ok then bench heavier

and ohp heavier

also, willful ignorance rule

[regal ruin]

the t2 bench will do a lot

and ohp

[static palm]

you’re not doing “a little chest” you’re doing a pretty good amount of chest lol

[haughty gorge]

which of the following T3 movements are complimentary to T1 Squat, T1 Bench, T1 OHP, and T1 DL?

-Lat pulldown
-Seated cable row
-Pull ups
-T-row chest supported machine

-db lateral raises

-bicep preacher curl machine
-Bicep EZ bar
-Hammer curls

-Overhead Cable Triceps
-Barbell Skullcrushes

[regal ruin]

give it more thought than zero

[haughty gorge]

Squat: everything?

Bench: Triceps

OHP: db later

DL: Back

[regal ruin]

squat would be quads, dl would be hamstrings

[haughty gorge]

i have no t3 leg movements so i can basically do anything (?)

[regal ruin]

leg extension, leg curl are basic, common movements

[haughty gorge]

nvm you miunderstood

1 sec

[static palm]

fwiw the reason why i suggested my thing specifically is bc you wanted a v taper

extra shoulder isos and arm work matter more for that than leg or whatever, which might compliment your t1s more

[haughty gorge]

this is why im confused

so why cant i do T3 chest exercises

i understand and dont mind dropping t3 legs

[regal ruin]

What's funny is this is ending up exactly like your decisions in october

[static palm]

leg or chest*

[haughty gorge]

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 row or pull
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 row or pull
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 row or pull
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 row or pull
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

imma fill this in

[static palm]

perfect, but on either 1/3 or 2/4 it’ll be one exercise

i would do 1 T3 on days 2 and 4 personally

[haughty gorge]

why is that

[static palm]

DLs are tiring

[haughty gorge]

you mean instead of ONE T3 row or pull and TWO T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

you do ONE T3 row or pull and ONE T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep

[static palm]

yes

[static palm]

i did say this up here

[haughty gorge]

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 db lateral raises
T3 barbell Skullcrushes

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Bicep EZ bar

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 lateral raise or bicep or tricep
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Hammer curls

---

so for day 1 and 3 OR day 2 and 4 remove ONE T3

[static palm]

yes, also pick ONE bicep exercise and ONE tricep exercise

do the same one on both days

[static palm]

thats also what i said up here

cmon man

make it easier to be helped

[haughty gorge]

damn

[static palm]

you clearly didnt watch enough RP videos, he more or less says the same thing multiple times

[haughty gorge]

i have watched tons of tier list videos

hours of contemplating what movements to use

only for me not to use them

anyway im almost done i think

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 db lateral raises

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Preacher machine curl

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 db later raise

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Preacher machine curl

im so freaking confused. Where do i put my Overhead Cable Triceps

[haughty gorge]

Preacher machine curl & Overhead Cable Triceps

im doing something wrong

[static palm]

you watched the wrong videos then, and tier lists barely matter

[static palm]

day 1 and 3

[haughty gorge]

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Preacher machine curl

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 db later raise
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Preacher machine curl

[static palm]

wrong

[haughty gorge]

i need to remove db lateral raises 1 time

[static palm]

2 times

[haughty gorge]

i want to hit them 3 times a week

[static palm]

..

[haughty gorge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t_BkXF3XBc

[static palm]

irrelevant video

[haughty gorge]

huh

[static palm]

im not gonna repeat the same thing again lol

clearly you have learned nothing because you refuse to learn

i would love to be proven wrong

good luck.

[haughty gorge]

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Preacher machine curl

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises
T3 Preacher machine curl

[static palm]

wow, still wrong

actually crazy

[haughty gorge]

i have but im mentally tired rn so its harder to do simple things

[haughty gorge]

step by step im not giving up

[static palm]

then go rest, come back rested, and do it right

you’re wasting your time and also mine

[haughty gorge]

fine, see you tomorrow

good night

[haughty gorge]

aesthetic, lean body shredded v-taper body

[static palm]

sure whatever lmao

go to sleep

aesthetics depends on genetics, “lean” and shredded depends on your diet (and you wont be shredded 100% of the time), and the v taper can be built w a good routine and good exercise selection

[regal ruin]

i mean, all of that is effort and timee

and low bf

really don't need to micromanage the routine

[haughty gorge]

• do rows OR pulldowns each workout
  *do 1-2 more exercises per workout day
  for those 1-2, pick ONE lateral raise, ONE bicep movement, ONE tricep movement
  make sure you do lat raises, biceps, triceps at least 3x every 2 weeks
  that means every other workout you should be doing the same set of t3s

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises

i think i finally got it right

[static palm]

yes

[haughty gorge]

Can I superset my preacher curl with hammer curls ? Just ONE time

[regal ruin]

useless to do

they're the same movement for your biceps

[haughty gorge]

Don’t hammer curls target the brachialis

[regal ruin]

not differently enough to do both in the same routine, or superset them

[haughty gorge]

@regal ruin have I paired the right T3 exercises with my T1s

[regal ruin]

i'd trust 13's judgement

[haughty gorge]

I trust him

[haughty gorge]

I like this program

But I still have a few questions :happy:

[haughty gorge]

I genuinely don’t understand why it’s bad to add an extra 3-6 sets of T3 chest

Right now I’m doing incline db, and pec flys and was planning on adding dips but now you’re telling me to ditch them all. Do you understand why this makes me insecure?

I can add them to day 2 and 4 where I only have 4 exercises

[regal ruin]

beginner adaptations are better with less work, as your work capacity is much less at this point

good effort with better recovery will serve you better

[haughty gorge]

I’m already doing 5-6 exercises right now

I’m not a super beginner I’m a novice

[regal ruin]

recovery also includes adaptations and strength increases, not just the ability to perform sets

the demands of gzclp, if T1 and T2 are done correctly, are quite high

[haughty gorge]

@static palm sir can you look at the two pics above

Why are you okay with me doing 4 different back movements?

[regal ruin]

there are multiple muscles in the back

there is 1 side delt

[haughty gorge]

Lat pulldown, Seated cable row, Pull ups, and T-row machine mostly target lats right?

#beginner-zone message this is what i mean with T-row machine btw

[regal ruin]

lot going on back there

those are not all primary lat movement

rows will emphasize rhomboids, traps, rear delts more

vertical and horizontal pulling will have different emphasis on different portions of the back

as they are compound movements with multiple joints, they benefit from different angles

the side delt, being a single muscle and lat raises being a single joint movement

there's no reason to hit them multiple times to multiple angles

tldr: you are comparing apples to oranges

I will yet again tell you to calm down, stop thinking so hard, and stick to the basics

[haughty gorge]

understood

just asking out of curiousity

[haughty gorge]

all my doubts have been cleared except for one:

**The Chest **

[haughty gorge]

i dont think adding incline db and/or dips is gonna mess up with my recovery

https://outlift.com/overhead-press-for-size

"The overhead press does work the upper chest, but it doesn’t always do a great job of it. For instance, the flat barbell bench press works our upper chest twice as hard (study). To build a bigger upper chest, then, you may want to include some incline or close-grip bench pressing."

[regal ruin]

yet again - you already have t1 and t2 bench, *and t1/t2 ohp

[haughty gorge]

"Furthermore, if you want to develop a big chest, then it's those upper pectoral muscles that you need to grow in size."

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/8lLfiSbJ7n8

[regal ruin]

why do you keep purposefully forgetting you already have exercises

you're being ignorant

[haughty gorge]

Because i feel like im not hitting my upper chest enough with OHP

[regal ruin]

that's why bench exists

[haughty gorge]

i dont think i feel my upper chest at all tbh

[regal ruin]

the pec is one muscle

[haughty gorge]

but i want to emphasize the upper chest

the upper pec

[regal ruin]

its one muscle

[haughty gorge]

i want to emphasize the upper part of this one muscle

[regal ruin]

its not like the triceps where there's 3 of them

pec major is

one

muscle

properly executed bench press will work it fine

[haughty gorge]

okay then tell me this

why does incline press exist then

why do all these people do incline pressing

[regal ruin]

because people like doing this at different angles

"why does X exist" is a very meaningless question

"because its different"

that's it

some people prefer one over the other

or can execute one better than the other

I don't do any incline pressing for instance, I don't enjoy the movement

not gonna comment or follow in this chat any further; we've given you advice and recommended just...working hard and sticking to it

not much else to say

[haughty gorge]

im not arguing im asking to clear my concious

you cant blame me for asking ive been bombarded with 'incline pressing is better than flat/incline pressing works upper pecs more

and its not even from random people, litteraly from science guys and elite body builders

ALRIGHTTTTT

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises

---

this is my new routine starting next week

@static palm sensei what about abs and cardio? I was doing abs 2x a week

[static palm]

you use your abs in many compound movements that are already in gzclp

can do cardio whenever you want, i would do on non strength days if you have some specific thing, or as far away from strength training as you can

[static palm]

can blame you for asking the same question multiple times

[haughty gorge]

but do the compound movements work the abs enough that they become shredded

when i get to low bodyfat ofc

[static palm]

more or less, and considering where you are rn yes

[haughty gorge]

what kind of range of motion do I have to do for OHP to target the upper chest
how low do i have to go?

[haughty gorge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfEJwyPTzeM

this video basically explains what you guys said

[static palm]

full rom

as low as you can with your elbows under the bar

[static palm]

lots of jeff nippard and RP videos say this also

[haughty gorge]

Should I be leaning back?

[static palm]

not really

[haughty gorge]

btw im doing the 4th day in the same week

mon wo fri sa

[static palm]

no

reread how you're supposed to do the routine

[haughty gorge]

What?

Im doing the 4 day variant of gzclp

[static palm]

the 4 day variant of gzclp is 3x/wk big guy

[haughty gorge]

Hmmm

This cycle I was doing 3x lifting and 2x cardio

Before that I was doing 4x a week lifting but the vanilla version of GZCLP

[haughty gorge]

what im basically trying to say is that im already used to doing 4 days (sort of)

[static palm]

continue doing this

the original gzcl article about gzclp should say something about “make sure you have at least one day of rest between fullbody days” which means you’d be doing the routine every other day

[haughty gorge]

hmmm

something aint right

[static palm]

?

[haughty gorge]

i dont think the math is mathing

[haughty gorge]

I wont be doing lateral raises 3x every 2 weeks if I do the 4th day the next week

4-5 days between lateral raises

[static palm]

you do the 4th day, then the 2nd day that friday

write it out on a piece of paper

so you'd have lateral raises once on weds of the first week, then monday and friday of the next week

thats 3x/2wk

[haughty gorge]

Day 1:

Squat T1
Bench Press T2
T3 Lat pulldown
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 2:

OHP T1
DL T2
T3 Seated cable row
T3 db lateral raises

Day 3:

Bench Press T1
Squat T2
T3 Pull ups
T3 Preacher machine curl
T3 Overhead Cable Triceps

Day 4:

DL T1
OHP T2
T3 T-row machine
T3 db lateral raises

my side delts dont need 4-5 days to rest

they're the most important muscle for the v-taper look

[haughty gorge]

and what if i miss one day?

only the last set of all exercises should be to failure right?

Should I also do drop sets?

[static palm]

dont miss a day

why would you do drop sets

[stable edge]

Bro strayed from proven routine and step-by-step ended back up on it. Us moment

[haughty gorge]

sometimes I have to travel so i miss a day

[haughty gorge]

https://leangains.com/fuckarounditis/

[static palm]

then push it all back by a day that week? is this a real question

[haughty gorge]

@static palm will my current routine (with a good diet) get me a shredded v-taper physique?

[static palm]

probably yeah

[static palm]

emiin literally said this right below