#Belle's folly competes with other melee weapons too soon

216 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

untold sage
#

You need a merely 51 slayer and 45 sailing to go get this weapon. 70 smith to repair and 65 attack to equip it.
It boosts a higher attack accuracy and strength stat opposed to the (imbued with tentacle) whip.
You need 87 slayer for that and 75 attack to wield it.

On top of that you also seem to get defensive bonusses, except against crush.

The only thing is that it attacks 1 tick slower, which does make a difference, haven't ran the calcs but doesn't it come rather close for something that requires so little to obtain.
On top of that it doesn't Degrade or Break as far as i can see?

Don't you think the requirements are a bit low for such a weapon?
I personally think they are.

manic cypress
#

[[zombie axe]]

clear raftBOT
untold sage
#

I guess t hat's the way its going, this also just requires a bunch of entry quests.
Just curious of the iconic things arent becoming obsolete because of these.

#

Okay wow, look at osmumtens fang and then at that thing

#

102 str bonus vs 103.

No, ill stay with my opinion, this thing is fucking overtuned despite osmumtens having a passive effect.

manic cypress
#

You are accounting for the 5t speed right?

untold sage
#

Theyre both 5 tick

manic cypress
#

Its less strong than Zombie Axe, just for stab instead of slash/crush

untold sage
#

Im talking to the comparison of it to osmumtens.
Its literally almost a fang

It just doesnt have the passive or spec

manic cypress
#

And the passive is what makes Fang good, its deliberately not as much str because it has a minimum hit, and double roll of hit

untold sage
#

same max hit, and you can actually gear against defensive bonusses properly now.

I think ill stay with my opinion that it boosts too much dps for such a low req

#

Its literally a gigantic leap up from a hasta... and you get that from GWD bosses

#

+75 str bonus to +102
And more attack accuracy too.
Only defense bonus it lacks vs hasta is the crush

and hasta/spear is 70 atk+

#

And yes hasta is 4t and this one 5 ticks, but run the calcs. im almost certain it beats it out of the ballpark in anywhere you'd want to use it

#

Im curious how it actually compares DPS wise against ghrazi's.

It should never, ever ever come close imo but im afraid it gets closer than they expected.

long kite
#

150 invo baba

image.png
untold sage
#

thanks for running thecalc

long kite
#

its not in the same universe as fang and still worse than hasta. But im fine with it being close to hasta, they have made GWD less relevant in the past years and im all for it, that content was BiS for 10+ years and frankly sucks

untold sage
#

I dont like the GWD meta either, but it still requires you to either show skill, a bunch of gear or party up whereas this doesn't.

So for the sake of argument, its rather easy to obtain.

manic cypress
#

Two pics (on sand crabs)
First is just weapon at max stats, no other equips,Second is max

image.png image.png
long kite
untold sage
#

I wouldnt be opposed as to locking the boss behind a higher slayer level.

Given it is still entry level equipment i do feel like 70+ slayer at a minimum, more 75+ ish would be absolutely fine.

the Zaxe is an argument long passed, i wont discuss it but i do have the same feelings towards it.

If i look at your dps in max, it does come too close imho to the end game stuff were offered.
This bossis weaker than scurrious apparantly.

manic cypress
#

Its equivalent to zaxe, not really a problem

untold sage
#

And given the history, is it no longer a thing that 'stab' weapons are in a way more 'useful' than slash ones too?

I remember them being somewhat weaker always for the reason that monster defenses often favored them, where this comes really close to its slash equivalent aswel.

I vaguely remember that sentiment.

#

Nope, im still not convinced it belongs in a 100+ strength bonus bracket.
I think it belongs below it around 90-96 at max
Especially with the defense bonus AND the gigantic accuracy bonus plus the sentiment which still holds truth written above.

I get the sentiment of adding more mid-tier weapons.
But this makes it so you can just waltz into stuff like corporeal beast and ToA and probably alot more things. (way too soon)

Which with a lower strength bonus you still can, but it just isn't as close as to someone who has obtained an item through more difficult means. (And in my opinion from if you actually had to earn it yourself, which runescape does have a tendency to balance around. It makes it so you dont have to 'earn' your place anymore but rather part-take in a trivial grind and off you go to the big leagues.)

untold sage
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This thing, if it is comparable to a zaxe will cost no more than 5m, probably 2m; given that a fang is currently 18m.

Thats just too much, a stab weapon is too useful.

So it doesnt make sense for either perspectives.

This was my RS talk, any quesstions

long kite
untold sage
#

Not really, only if You're naked. But put on some gear and take in account what the next grind which would be zamorak ( probably skipped) would take in comparison to what this is.

I foresee it will be get this stick, enter toa immediately with subpar gear, get a fang and be endgame ready

#

Youll be 60 slayer 45 sailing 70 smithing and be wearing raid equipment on an iron. Thats whack.

long kite
#

i did not do those calcs naked

untold sage
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given easier capes also give more stab bonusses etc.
Youll be wearing ardy cloak 3 barrows top and bottom, some fancy boots, barrows gloves and be toa ready almost
I dont think im wrong here.

long kite
#

fang was 30% better than folly in average early/midgame ironman gear and stats

untold sage
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Fang is from a raid that takes half an hour
You make the jump from a 51 slayer boss to the fang with this weapon.

that aint it, i said i understand the mid tier weapon sentiment but this is too generous.

Its not like those players are forever stuck on those levels.
But having to earn it is part of runescape

long kite
#

you can do that already with the new jewel from toa. zammy hasta is also free af to get since scobow method

untold sage
#

You still need to finish toa to get the jewels.

#

a scorching bow requires 77 ranged and for you to farm tormented demons for their synapses.
Which requires while guthix sleeps

You're comparing apples with pears here.

long kite
#

you can do low invo toa in literal rags, you dont need zammy hasta or even this rapier to get the jewel.

are 80 stats unreasonable to start toa? whatnow? you can easily do wgs and farm tds with moons gear

untold sage
#

We will see how it plays out but i think i already see how its going to go down.

#

also that equipment requires 75 stats not 65.

  • it takes a full on dungeon to get a chance at an item, with bosses that are considered more difficult than scurrious, whereas this gryphon after watching gnomonkey test it.

Doesn't

So therefore my argument t hat you obtain it too early for too little, and gives you access to things you haven't even come close to earning, will stand.

#

And another thing, that jewel is only For toa no? What about the rest of the game?

And to counter your rags argument, What rags do you think you would need to do the gryphon? Full mithril? Come on man.

long kite
#

where would you use this weapon in your opinion besides very early toa

untold sage
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Anything weaker to stab than to slash

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So corp is the big one, mole, kbd, dagganoths, dragons, lizardmen

I dont know the entire database out of my head but theres some examples.

And does it Beat the jewelled partisan or par it or is it weaker? the 80 attack requirement weapon that you need to complete the raid for first a multitude of times, sometimes if you're unlucky not sure if changed over a 100 times

urban roost
#

This weapon fills the stab gap perfectly. Prior to it there was d sword (lol) - hasta - rapier - fang.

Let's irons actually have a good stab weapon with a similar time to obtain as zombie axe.

untold sage
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It will still be good at 90-96 strength bonus ellie jae, it gaps too much

long kite
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It is weaker than the keris.

Lets not pretend anyone would do corp with this weapon. Mole and kbd are utterly irrelevant bosses, both for iron and mains. Dragons people use magic on before dragonbane weapons. Nobody melees lizards. Nobody does DKS besides rex for berserker ring either? Not one of these examples is relevant i feel like.

One usecase for folly is very early very low invo ToA until you get either the jewel or fang which i think is absolutely fine because you could do that with a zaxe too, it was just a bit slower. Or a zammy hasta if you bothered with getting a synapse. The actual good usecase and i think the one Jagex intended is as a stab weapon for moons since there is just nothing currently in the game that fills that niche

urban roost
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Your request is outside of the reality of how bad the stab reward space is

untold sage
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You dont need that stab weapon at 51 slayer.
Its simply too soon.

urban roost
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I did 300's with a hasta pre toa nerf and it was awful. This is needed.

The slayer req could be removed i agree

long kite
#

you do for moons, now we have one. very cool 👍

long kite
untold sage
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Its lower dps than hasta, its not supposed to be the upgrade from a hasta.
Which i found reassuring, but it is still too strong for a 51 slayer 65 atk weapon.

It needs imho a higher req OR its stats adjusted

urban roost
long kite
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i see

urban roost
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Hasta will remain as an upgrade for dhl or a good crush alt. Hasta doesn't need to be good at 2 styles

untold sage
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Here come the downvotes, thanks for setting the stage

But i will stand firmly that you obtain it too soon for what you are going to use it for.

urban roost
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You argued against everyones common sense points without acknowledging truth

long kite
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i mean i explained why i dont think it breaks any progression. no example you gave convinced me otherwise

urban roost
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I don't think the weapon should be gate kept especially when the stab space is hard to get into

untold sage
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Fine if you guys feel that 51 slayer and 45 sailing is justified for this, from a piss-easy boss you can beat in nothing pretty much, lets agree to disagree.

I dont know runescape like that.

urban roost
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Have you tried to do content on an iron with the current stab options?

untold sage
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Not saying it cant exist, where do you read thhis?

#

You cant level to 70 slayer without a stab weapon on an iron? its that hard?
Youd have to skip or block dragons, thats it. thats literally all.

long kite
urban roost
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People voted on the weapon also. I think a better angle would be adjusting spec/ adding to the weapon maybe a kit for it

untold sage
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Its fine to change the direction, but 40's and 50's arent stats representing what you need for those places.

and i will not be swayed.

same as i show up with base 70 stats in combat to enter whatever.

Go earn it.

urban roost
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Slayer is trash and slow on an iron. I think 50 is fine as a "something to work towards"

untold sage
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Let me fetch my perfect example, my ex's account.

urban roost
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Also lvl 50 is when you start getting ok slayer monsters

manic cypress
untold sage
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Never played RS, did everything like an iron, even earned hher Bond in f2p because she was that type.

got that slayer level in 1 bonds time.

You dont need to have everything handed to you for free, its an MMO a very grindy one at that, its always been.

Im not opposed to lowering the entry a little for some items, such as stab weapons.. but this is rediculously fast to get

The fun was always the ride along the way, not the endgame content. only for some.

manic cypress
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Ok? I dont see how the fact that its quick to get to 50s stats is relevant

cold jasper
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I honestly thought it was going to have the same problems I have with the zombie axe, but I did some DPS calcs and the stats are actually pretty well-balanced. It still loses to the likes of a Zamorakian hasta for stab, so it's pretty much a weapon solely catered to Moons or early ToA

urban roost
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I don't think this weapon is "fast" for mid game

untold sage
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Its relevant because its implied that 51 slayer is a grind worthy of such a weapon.

urban roost
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I have a feeling the slayer is to stop bots

untold sage
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Oh hell, thats a non-argument if you know anything about botting.

Those people have plenty of scripts that you can just turn on and it will do slayer for you till you feel fit.

manic cypress
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You also realize that its not going to be that quick to obtain when the boss has an actual fight behind it

untold sage
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The boss is weaker and easier than scurrious according to gnomonkey.
So.. a fight, not really.

manic cypress
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According to Gnomonkey... Ok

untold sage
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According to him testing the damage and tanking it and seeing the 0's it hits on you in piss-low gear. Yes.

manic cypress
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Regardless of the fight, its still going to be a grind, which is perfectly fine for a midgame weapon.

urban roost
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At the end of the day this weapon was voted into the game by the people - provides a great entry point for stab - isn't too powerful.

Gear progression matters. The alternative is while guthix sleeps - synapse + obtain high fletching - sco bow + lightbearer - zammy ☠️

untold sage
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Yes so you go from while guthix sleeps - synapse + obtain high fletching - sco bow + lightbearer - zammy

To 51 slayer and 45 sailing, into fighting a non-contest boss.

Yes seems like a reasonable jump /s

urban roost
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That's because the space needs the adjust

cold jasper
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Really even if it has 0 mechanics it's harder to get than a Zombie axe. I think the Zombie axe is overtuned from where it comes from, but I don't think we really see that issue with this weapon given its slightly lower stats and the fact that stab actually kinda does need intermediate weapons

untold sage
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I dont think the slash gap was that hard for irons, yes you had to grind it but you do get with t he zaxe a powerful weapon that makes alot of things just obsolete.

Do you even get a d-scim anymore?

And on top of that, its a slash weapon, completely different argument from stab

as pointed out before.

manic cypress
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Yes? Why wouldnt you

#

Also how does slash/stab/crush matter that much to you? They are all used pretty interchangably throughout the early-midgame, and then later on you need all 3

untold sage
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Because to enter the endgame content, you need to specialise in things.

Giving you a valid option at 50 stats or lower makes it, and this is my opinion.
Too easy.

#

To put it in perspective.

51 is 111.945 exp.

Lv 70 is 737k exp.

its basically Free

manic cypress
#

You still need 65 att to equip it, and you can get the [[arkan blade]] from a similar quest which only requires 60 att even

clear raftBOT
untold sage
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ah yes the arkans blad e +64 str +55 atk acc

Really comparable to this thing, its also a slash weapon originally.

manic cypress
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Ah yes of course

image.png
untold sage
manic cypress
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This is if I put it on stab. Its better dps with good gear, and still comparable with less

image.png
untold sage
#

Show the gear.

And if that is the same gear you compared the other gear with, Yes its night and day.

manic cypress
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All your complaints hinge around the high stats, but you are forgetting the 5t speed

untold sage
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Im not.

manic cypress
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It wins naked, but even in basic midgame gear, arkan blade (60 att req, on stab) wins

image.png image.png
untold sage
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Listen, we can argue all day.

I still think it needs to get higher obtain requirements than the 51 slayer given what you can do with it.

Sand crabs also have no defense, so you could put on a slash weapon and pretend you're winning every time as wel.

#

So for the sake of this argument, being that it will be your entry level at ToA

Put it against baba

manic cypress
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You had the chance to vote against it months ago when they polled, and sure, heres Baba 150

image.png
untold sage
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Ah yes my one vote would've changed it all, my voice would've been heard.

manic cypress
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More than complaining after its released

untold sage
manic cypress
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From a higher req quest/boss btw

untold sage
#

Again, its free, no matter what you say.

Its free as fuck

urban roost
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I didn't want sailing in the game but here we are. Adapt, give feedback to make it better and enjoy the ride

untold sage
long kite
urban roost
#

We can complain all we want but it's how you do it/ are you going to be constructive about it

untold sage
urban roost
#

Midgame is subjective. You can ask many people and they'll have different definitions of what that is

long kite
#

there should be a somewhat accessible stab weapon to start moons with in the game, now there is one

untold sage
untold sage
urban roost
untold sage
long kite
urban roost
untold sage
urban roost
untold sage
#

According to others you can just 'do it in rags' which you can now do, Even harder!

urban roost
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That's up to the individual then. We as a community should be open to change and empowering gear progression especially where it is needed

untold sage
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Its whatever man, its clear that you guys side with the sentiment of getting items that in my eyes are overly accessible to content you shouldn'teven be dreaming of yet.

Nothing to do with gatekeeping, but more so with having to earn it.

And i guess my point of earning lies further in teh future than others are willing to put in.

urban roost
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I'm all for having to earn gear. This just feels like a space that isn't ready for that nor should be too hard to obtain as the entry point

#

Means the devs have room to push better rewards in the end game space if the gaps are filled prior

untold sage
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51 slayer isn't an achievement.
Hell you cant even use Broad bolts at that point yet.
You arent even allowed to fight a Jelly and just unlocked Bloodvelds.

But somehow it justifies a weapon capable of slaying strong bosses.

#

I think we've discussed it all at this point, lets jsut agree to disagree.

manic cypress
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If you want to "earn gear" then play ironman, if you are a main, then you can buy the item you want from the GE after getting gp for it

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No one really uses the zammy hasta anymore, and thats fine tbh, not every random item NEEDS to stay 100% relevant in the midgame

untold sage
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Sir, i just spent all my energy explaining that for an ironman you get a giant boost, suddenly. for barely any requirements,.

long kite
untold sage
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LMAO

#

Does that take into account every bot banned before they hit 30 in stats or whatever, seems rather unfeasable.

I can fetch my account from when i was 12 and it as that stats, better ones even.
(on rs3 now)

#

Ive had an ex, not even that interested in runescape play for less than 2 months with earning a bond herself with 75 range 74 mage 63 crafting 53 herb 70 cook 66 FM and 71 woodcvutting and 45 RC for example.

that statistic, is absolute bullshit!

#

57 crafting aswel, thats a COMPLETE casual, as casual as you can get.

#

Full time job, boyfriend in the weekends. Played for a little before going to bed.

Sorry, but nah
And i bet you know nobody that actually represents these stats that will say 'i actively play this game to the point where i care'

#

that was the end for me, sorry. im laughing my ass of now

long kite
#

You can make fun of it but thats the reality. Most players in every game are more casual than the average discord user can ever comprehend. This statistic looks similar to ones in WoW or LoL and your reaction is the same i have seen over there, absolute disbelief and denial that these players are who make up our games. The fact that we are even talking about this game in a specific discord makes us part of the sub 1% of players. Ridicule doesnt change the reality 🙂

This weapon being in the game hurts literally nobody. It is one addition in a now long line of updates to make the early/mid game more accessible. The literal worst thing that could happen with this weapon is that 0.01% of the playerbase that are extremely good at the game send low invo ToAs 10 hours earlier than they would have without it. I really could not care less.

But i dont think either of us will be convinced so i gonna leave it at that, if the arguments by multiple people havent convinced you so far nothing will

untold sage
#

#1 your statistic takes in account every account created and played for only a brief moment of time drastically lowering the actual results that matter
#2 you've all dismantled eachoters argument over teh course of this discussion wether you realise it or not, this does mean you agree to a certain extend to what i've been saying. just different parts feel sensitive to others, but its a fact that the argument seems valid in all eyes, just in different ways
#3 its the same circlejerk as te previous post hopping on eachothers bandwagon despite the given fact above.

#

and a good day to you too.

long kite
#
  1. that is a jagex statistic and was of every active account. yes there are bots in there but this didnt take into account every single bot banned at lvl 1
  2. people can have different reasons for disagreeing with you and different opinions on other pieces of content. wild concept i know
  3. if that makes you feel better. See the replies in the mentioned post, maybe people just dont like your "suggestion". We have provided infinitely more facts than you have, we even had to provide all the calcs because you couldnt be bothered putting effort into your post and just complained. I have zero affiliation with Grendallord or ellie jae, we all just disliked the suggestion for some similar and some different reasons. If thats a circle jerk in your book idk how you handle any actual human interaction irl

Good day and good luck with your suggestion!

untold sage
#

Not liking the way i speak VS the actual message is a different thing, im assertive, overly and i know that. Thats just who i am and im not going to change that for the sake of a discord argument being more liked. (first downvote on which you all jumped on the bandwagon for)

You've all accepted either 1 2 or 3 as a thing that bothers you and said the other two are something you 'dont care for' or whatever.

I just look at the bigger picture.

But, as mentioned before, you will see.

And for the bots/ players / average statistic.
You have to weigh up 200m of EXP (or 1m or 13mil, whatever you want to make of it )VS someone who hasnt played with 50k of exp in the same skill.

You really think thats a fair statistic or draws a good average?
Its a joke, you can't deny that.
Those people, and you will hate me saying this; will not have a formulated opinion about anything.
But their vote weighs the same, and so does their statistic.

And to address you snidy remark on the last sentence, I do great in real life, because you wouldn't be holding up such bullshit.

cold jasper
#

Confused what the requirement you're concerned about it? I keep seeing you mention lvl 70, but the Belle's folly still requires 70 smithing just like the Zombie axe. For the record I do think the zaxe was a mistake and the niche didn't really exist that they tried to fill. But I do think that gap exists for stab, and if anything the Belle's folly has higher reqs than alternatives, and is better-balanced stat-wise

untold sage
#

imo that gap existed for a reason.
Its so you couldn't bridge over to an elysian grind or later a ToA grind

outer hollow
#

yeah i agree with etube. z axe was op for its point in progression and so is this thing but you can't be mad at one w/o the other

untold sage
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Were ''mad'' at both, its just one wont be changed and this one can still be considered, for the impact its going to have.

a good slash weapon was always your basic.
A good stab weapon opens up many more doors, that shouldn't open just yet.

thats the idea of giving monsters defense bonusses, and how it has worked in the past.

The thing that 'justifies' it for many is the release of perilous moons, but i think its overtuned for that purpose.

Its a raid entry level weapon at best, and that is for me too soon, it should be 'somewhat' challenging to obtain, not absolutely trivial.

tough river
#

while zaxe is mainly a iron weapon, its fairy good but not overpowered, this is just a stab version of it

urban roost
#

How long on average would it take an iron from fresh acc to gain the stats, get the drop and make this weapon?

manic cypress
#

Probably longer than it would take to get Zaxe imo, slayer takes a while longer to train (and the boss to kill), than hunter and smithing + bursting zombies

urban roost
#

Also it's locked behind a slayer boss

manic cypress
#

Do you need a task to kill it, or can you fight it as long as you are 51 slayer?

outer hollow
#

rax style

manic cypress
#

Oh yeah, its only on task, so that means this weapon is doubly locked behind a long slayer grind, now their complaints are even more unfounded

river junco
#

An easier to obtain stab weapon is extremely needed and this new wep still has less DPS. It barely competes with any relevant melee weapons. Stats for melee weapons can be widely variable based on the gear but even with a good setup you aren't beating weapons that are higher requirement.
You say tentacle whip but try wearing a serp helm and defender with a tentacle whip and oathplate. You won't be seeing better dps with similar setups and belle's folly.

gentle heath
#

M getting bodied non stop with proof, facts and even dps calcs.
His response is admitting that nothing will change his mind.

If nothing will change your mind then this is not a suggestion to improve the game but just you venting.

The only thing you succeeded doing was making me think the bells folly needs a buff since it's comparable /weaker then a sword you get for free after a quest. No grind or rng required

twin wave
#

But the reduced strength bonus compared to like Noxious does compensate the increased hit chance passive

untold sage
urban roost
#

you are, you've just been presented with lots of context on why this weapon fits a gap without listening

untold sage
#

Ive listened and i have a different opinion, is that so hard to grasp?

urban roost
#

you haven't

untold sage
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Because i dont agree? Sorry but you sound as daft as you make me out to be.

urban roost
#

your suggestion is a failed one and out of reality of the communities sentiment

untold sage
#

Im against ayaks too, zaxe too. Nobody has been proven me that it isnt overtuned for what you said and nobody has proven to me that it isnt a perfectly fine weapon to start toas with

urban roost
#

f suggestion

untold sage
#

Ellie you sound like a 12 year old throwing a hissy fit. Please grow up.

urban roost
#

that's on you

#

so many have presented valid reasons on why it's a great addition. if you can't accept that then what is the point fo this "suggestion

untold sage
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No, it isnt. Im allowed my opinion and dont have to conform to yours if i dont see it the same way

urban roost
#

then you have not considered you suggestion may not be in line with the dev implementation and personal bias

untold sage
#

Its a suggestion and not a command. Are you going to stay this stupid or not?

urban roost
#

argue all you want. insulting others gets you nowhere and is anti what this place is about

untold sage
#

Because theres a block for a reason, you're just throwing a hissy fit right now because you cant accept not everyone has the same wish.

And you are doing the exact same.

urban roost
#

assume all you want.

untold sage
#

Bye Ellie

urban roost
#

everyone meaning you. your post is redundent 🙂

untold sage
#

Ellie, read this when you are mature. You're just throwing a hissy fit.

urban roost
#

read the main reason this is here. you've gatekept, not been open to who this is for and not taken anything others have said as "maybe this could be good for the game.

untold sage
#

According to you you're not allowed to have a discussion, just stay quiet.

And stop being toxic 😉

urban roost
untold sage
#

Go for it, youre the one telling me essentially to shut up, im telling you to shut up with your telling me to shut up.

urban roost
untold sage
#

Just wait 🙂 you're not the mod.

urban roost
#

you contradict constantly. take this as someone that has so much game knowledge and understanding of what's good for the game/ unreasonable. I'm one of the ones that give constructive feedback. I don't need to be a mod

untold sage
#

Take this from a 30 year old. You need to respect others opinions and stop telling them to not have opinions even if you don't agree. Just say you dont agree and move on.

urban roost
untold sage
#

Yikes, dont know what went wrong than

urban roost
#

again attacking and insulting others is redundant

untold sage
#

Perhaps drop the argument than?

gentle heath
urban roost
#

no 🙂

untold sage
gentle heath
#

Also, if someone is being rude in your mind
they are probably just rude
but if everyone is...then its probably you

untold sage
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Alright Nils, telling me i got bodied. Not rude! Nope. Stick to the topic and stop bashing me perhaps? What has all this chatter been good for?

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And who started it? Mustve been me right? Grow up.

urban roost
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proving the weapons has enough reqs to make it semi hard to egt - fills a gap and will help in the mid game

tidal remnant
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Alrighty

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Let’s stop with the hostility and the throwing insults.

untold sage
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Feel free to close the thread since people aren't talking about it anymore but rather discussing wether they think im allowed an opinion or not

tidal remnant
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These suggestions are always met with criticism, let’s not make crappy comments towards those with opposing opinions.

untold sage
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Nice toxic emoji dropping too. Bery mature

urban roost
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you'll find people are very open to giving constuctive feedback and ideas when there's potential and the op is open to eharing ideas and having a converstion

gentle heath
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^very much so

untold sage
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You're allowed a discussion, nothing got heated till you started bashing. Follow the mods rules please

urban roost
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many of my suggestions have been good conversations and even added to/ adjusted my original idea

untold sage
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And you were allowed to have it but im allowed to disagree

urban roost
tidal remnant
untold sage
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Thanks.

gentle heath
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M, you have been toxic the whole convo before I joined