Lev 99 Alch spell

[warm barn]

purposing a level 99 Alch spell that would alch bulk noted items, like 5-10 items per cast. If it alchs 5 items it would use up 5 nature and 25 fire runes but only give the usual single cast xp. this would allow players who don't care about xp to quickly alch items in their loot tab. and save their fingers a bit of clicking.

[heavy hull]

Community rather let bots sell it to the store

[safe kestrel]

I think this is a great idea, any requirements necessary would be okay with me. Teh Gow makes an amazing point. Put the power back in the players hands and let us alch items instead of letting the bots sell it to the store. @grand flint lets make it happen!

👍🏿

[faint anchor]

No. The amount of extra inflation this would cause would be absolutely nuts.

[safe kestrel]

bots are just selling the items to the general stores at high alch price already

[warm barn]

@faint anchor how would it cause inflation? the items are already in the game

[faint anchor]

You're adding an easier way to directly turn items into cash at extremely fast rates. That's literally what causes inflation, adding money to the economy.

And Loud, yeah, that sucks, but the answer is still 'no'. When there's a problem causing inflation, the solution is never going to be 'make inflation easier'.

Not to mention on top of that, Loud, it's not as big of a problem as it seems because there's already a mechanic by which the items drop in sell price at shops for each item you've already sold to the shop, and it takes like 5 minutes for the item to go away afterwards.

[warm barn]

then add it behind some end of game wall. a grand master quest, diary cape perk, something.

[faint anchor]

No. The answer is still no. Whatever hoops they'd need to jump through to do it, you'd still get bots doing it, and even if they didn't, it would still be an absolutely untenable increase in how fast gold flows into the game.

[torn mauve]

Bots are the ones alching items currently, this would let them alch 5x as much 24/7, since they are all 99+ mage already

[heavy hull]

Stay in school is my advice to you 🙂

So basically you say, high alch x5 is a big no no, but the fact the bots jump worlds and sell 25-125 items in the same speed thats 100% better?

[faint anchor]

One of the major contributing factors to the build up to World War 2 was inflation, which was caused because the government was printing out obscene amounts of money in an economic crisis. People literally used bricks of money to play with because they were worth more as kindling or as playthings than to be used to actually buy anything.

This suggestion just puts the ability to print out loads of useless money into the hands of the players. It's a terrible idea.

[faint anchor]

And get off of your high horse. No, I don't like that bots are selling items to shops, but it's genuinely not as big of a problem as you think it is, because - again - the sell price goes down as the number of items go in stock goes up. If you think it's that big of a problem, anyway, the answer isn't 'let's make it ten times easier and faster'.

[heavy hull]

You can literally already set menu swap to sell one, set a key to switch world and just spam away selling. Is this the optimal way to go around high alching items for gp?

[faint anchor]

The fact that you can do that provides no reason - at all - to support a high alch spell that lets you alchemize items five times faster.

[heavy hull]

Are you thick? Or were your mom just unlucky.

You alch slower than shop selling even at x5 alchs, why let bots rule the alchemy market?????

[warm barn]

lets not be insulting here. all

[faint anchor]

Then make a suggestion to restrict reselling stuff to shops or lower the price resold for to low alch prices, man. This isn't relevant.

[warm barn]

we can have a friendly debate.

[heavy hull]

Hes just fucking with us 😂 i see it now, my bad for falling for the troll

[safe kestrel]

I'd like to remind you that the United States of America (back to back World War champions btw) took the power of 5 bombs(high alch) and put them into a 1 bomb(power alch) cast to defeat Japan (bots/inflation). What you fail to realize is these items are turning into gold regardless of the method, or if it's a real player or a bot. A power alch (nuclear bomb) would expedite the process for the real players, instead of putting money into the bots (Japan) hands by selling them on the grand exchange because alching 1 by 1 is a chore.

[warm barn]

^

[safe kestrel]

Also I am british.

[faint anchor]

The problem with that is that giving real players a power alch gives bots a power alch, too. There's literally nothing that would stop them from abusing the same system you want to benefit from, the buying power of GP plummets, and now everything costs way more because alchemizing items en masse still adds an insane amount of money to the economy and messes with prices of absolutely everything.

[warm barn]

we're never going to stop the bots..... so why should real players have to suffer? why do i have to cramp the hell out of my finger when they get to just bot away?

[faint anchor]

And you should take peoples' arguments in good faith. I believe that you genuinely support this idea, and you calling me stupid for refusing to support the idea is absolutely uncalled for.

[safe kestrel]

Anyone who doesn't support this has to be a botter themselves and must be banned

[faint anchor]

Here's the thing, man- adding a 5x alch spell isn't going to solve anything for you. If you add an option to 5x alch things, you'll still spend forever alchemizing stuff trying to grind up a profit because everyone else will be doing that, too, and your personal purchasing power will stay where it is.

[warm barn]

im not buying things. i just wanna quickly alch the items in my loot tab.

[faint anchor]

Well, sorry. This spell would be way overpowered at first, and after a week - or a month, or however long - would run absolute roughshod over the economy. No.

[safe kestrel]

Verified "alch clan" bot farm owner @faint anchor

[faint anchor]

Are you being for real right now?

[warm barn]

what if the spell was added to the Explorer ring 4, with limited alchs per day?

[calm bronze]

wild how people cant handle someone disagreeing with them lol

[faint anchor]

That...would be more workable, imo. Right now, at least for me, the explorer ring's free alchemy function is kind of useless, so at least adding it as a way to get rid of things faster would work out okay. I still don't think I'd support it but it's a better idea.

[safe kestrel]

agreed thatds is out of control

[heavy hull]

Its not that i can’t accept your diffrrnt opinion, it’s the fact that your argument is so poorly thought off. You say no to a x5 alch and then say, just go to store and sell 25-125 items in the same time i would have done 3-4 alchs. A x5 would still be less than store jumping.

You then argue to restrict shop selling 😂 as if ” you either alch it yourself or sell it for nothing to bots” so we can keep prices up(?)

We should improve the game, not make it worse.

Your solution is basically, keep it in bank and no coin enter the market. Great idea bud.

[faint anchor]

Because you pointed out that bots control the economy, you say they're doing it by world-hopping and selling to shops, so focus on that, not on 'how about we make it easier to pump the economy full of gold'.

If this was implemented, we'd see the effects of rapid inflation in basically no time. Gold gets significantly easier to produce, so more people can buy more expensive stuff for about a day, but to compensate for that happening, the expensive stuff gets even more expensive to compensate for the value of gold dropping. By how much would the price increase? I don't know, but it would still be bad.

Frankly- my solution is to just do whatever you can do with it right now and not add this. Spend the time to alchemize it if you want - one of the reasons some items are profitable to alchemize at all is because it takes time, which not everyone wants to spend - or just sell it on the G.E.

[heavy hull]

Your argument is that players keep alchs because they can’t alch? What about ge? Sell it to bots?

Would be absolute no difference.

[faint anchor]

There would be, because again, bots are still buying up a lot of crap and alchemizing it, so adding this would just make that gold injection faster and worse for the economy. Nothing stops the bots from abusing this, and it will only make the economy worse.

[heavy hull]

Bots already alch everything, where would the diffrence be?

[faint anchor]

They would be doing it 5x-10x faster. That is the entire suggestion.

[heavy hull]

X5 faster, yes. Why would that matter? There wouldn’t be more items coming in, the gold difference would be 0

[faint anchor]

There might not be a larger number of items coming in (until the bot farms are set up to mass produce alch-able items specifically to support poweralch prices), but those items still need to be alchemized, and I'm pretty certain that even for where we are right now, we're nowhere near the point of 'every single item sold on the GE is being alchemized'.

[heavy hull]

If this was true, why wouldn’t they do it today and just shop scape it? Save the rune cost.(they don’t alch, they sell to shops, but we say alching)

Why would anyone buy a yew longbow? If not to sell at a store.

[faint anchor]

Y'know, I don't know. Still doesn't fix that this isn't a good idea. The fact that there's a different abusable tactic doesn't mean we should add another.

[heavy hull]

The diffrence here is, with a x5 i could alch at agility training & steal work from the bots. But you seem very pro botting

[faint anchor]

You can still normal alch at agility training right now. Nobody's stopping you. Stop accusing me of botting to try and twist me into supporting this.

[heavy hull]

Doesn’t change the fact i can only alch agility 20% and have to go shop selling the rest.

But you are so obviously supporting bots profits here? Im not twisting you into anything but to wake up and see how your arguments fall flat.

You have bots that sell in store at 5-10 items per alch i can do as a player. A player sells to bots because alching takes too long to alch up.

We want to change it so i as a player can alch items just as fast as shopselling, thus less bots get to make gp.

[faint anchor]

If it's such a fast, useful, powerful method, what's stopping you from shopselling and competing with the bots that way? That's the only way you can actually compete with bots doing this; there's a limited number of worlds, so a limited number of shops, so a limited number of bots can continuously profit from shopselling, but if we added 5x alch, then that's an unlimited method of generating gold that's not tied to shop stocks.

I keep telling you, man, the answer to the bot problem isn't 'make it easier for people do the things bots do'.

[heavy hull]

Theres like 100’s of worlds, at least 3 ge stores, 25 items per. Thats like(?) 22,500 items a minute being sold. Not to mention special shops etc.

You keep telling me how to make the game worse, i should go shopscape. Why can i not alch at the same speed i could shop scape?

Selling at stores aint enough good gp, thats why bots do it. Natures is a cost that you have to pay for alchemy.. that makes economic better

[faint anchor]

Because having bots who shopscape is bad for the game, and bad for the economy. We're trying to get rid of them, not make the problem worse.

Here's the future options we have:
5x alch is worse than shopscaping: Players and at least a large number of bots on their own mass-alch items until the profit you get from poweralch is within single-unit GPs for every item. Only bots can feasibly power-alch stuff for a profit, and so it becomes a bot-only activity.
5x alch is equal to shopscape: Bots swap to 5x alch only. The problem continues that bots still do the majority of alching.
5x alch is better than shopscaping: Same as above, except it happens slightly faster.

[wispy rampart]

They definitely alch. You can see at least a few alch bots at the GE on just about any random (non-total) world

Also I fail to see how they can sell at a shop faster, when it takes me about the same time to hop worlds+ interact (longer, even) as it does to alch an item

[frosty sand]

You can see all the alching bots at the GE

who do you think alchs all the alchables in the game?

[wispy rampart]

Me, during my herb runs

[frosty sand]

bots farm the supplies either through the skills/bosses and dumps them in the ge for gold. Another set of bots use those supplies to fletch, craft, and smith. Alch bots come in and make new gold 🙂

[severe dock]

Not adding something to the game because bots will abuse it is a bad argument

[wispy rampart]

Agreed. Not adding something to the game that might cause insane inflation is a good argument tho

[severe dock]

Add a cooldown so it's the same as normal high alch for the amount you do in one action and it's 👌🏼

[frosty sand]

inflation doesnt work the same in runescape

tons of items and supplies are rock bottom prices and gold keeps increasing

[heavy hull]

If you have a set amount of items coming into the game, you won’t be able to alch more items just because you alch’d them 5x as fast……

[wispy rampart]

You’re ignoring the point he made earlier about how more bot farms works be set up to produce alch items if it’s suddenly 5x the profit per hour

[heavy hull]

You ignore the point where they can already sell at a higher speed than a x5 could be made. The profit would not be x5 as the price of alch items would rise, and you would be making the same, if not alittle bit more due to the fact as all items are sold out quicker....

[wispy rampart]

No, I specifically ask about how that works in this thread because that is not my experience.

[safe kestrel]

THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 💯

[upbeat zodiac]

Im all for a mass alch at the loss of potential xp.
Look at scar... we dump gp on that for more runes vs less xp.

[clear current]

I'd like to see high alch become 3t after some kind of unlock (low alch is 3t btw). Personally wouldnt mind multi alch as I have about 200m in alchs chilling for when/if a change comes about but idk if it's healthy for the main economy

[frosty sand]

bots already do the alching

[faint anchor]

Honestly, I'd be more okay with an unlockable upgrade to Low Alchemy at, like, level 75 magic that allows you to 'mass alch' items using low alchemy, probably at an even steeper rate - like, 25% of the item's value, instead of 40% for normal low alchemy. It's still more profitable to alchemize items at High Alchemy, but for people sitting on massive stacks of alchemizable items they can't otherwise get rid of, it expedites the process. You save time, and lose money.

[clear current]

Rather sell to shops at that point. Plus alching being a 0 time activity you don't save time and lose money

[faint anchor]

Big shrug. I'm not supporting any variation of this idea that allows people to do high alchemy but at 5x speed.

[uncut crow]

Hard to agree with this one tbh, mainly bc the speedup.

https://discord.com/channels/324132423636090880/1371782601613770882

This one has an alternative approach to essentially achieve the same goal but in a better/less risky way imo.

tldr; autoalch (i.e. que up 10 alches, similar to bolt enchanting).

This could mean less clicking for a user, and has room for some tradeoffs in implementation, like maybe a tick-delay (meaning manual alching would be faster, but auto would be more chill).

[ornate wolf]

Inflation is what you call it when the value of the dollar goes down, nit what you call it when there are just more dollars.

Inflation happens because in real life, money isnt actually Worth anything- we just say it is and thats that. But in Runescape, one gp will ALWAYS be worth EXACTLY on gp. No matter how many gp there aren, the shops will still sell items for the same prices. The rune shop isnt going to up the price of air runes to 400gp because there are more coins in the world- and THATS what Inflation is.

[ornate wolf]

"Bots are already alching"
And time is meaningless to bots. It doesnt matter if they alch 1x or 5x or 100x, they will alch everything they intend to alch and the amount of added gp will be exactly the same. Not doing something to help players because it will enable bots to do what they already do... isnt very good reasoning.

[faint anchor]

That would be true if it weren't for the fact that the G.E. does not depend solely on shop prices. Unfortunately, it does, and 1 gp today is not worth 1 gp yesterday, or one year ago, etc. Just look at RS3 if you need a better example of how inflation can and does impact Runescape's economy.

The increase of total gold available does decrease the value of each gp, in large part because if you want to buy a large amount of something or a boss drop - say, magic logs, dragon bones, a zamorak spear, a scythe, some herbs - that does depend on the Grand Exchange, because those items are not sold in shops. If you want it, you either find it yourself or buy it off another player.

Even when you can buy an item off of a shop for much cheaper, that only does so much to actually stabilize the price of each item. For example, a spade is worth 135 gp on the GE, but the most expensive it gets at a shop is 4 coins.

If you're playing an ironman, inflation does not exist, but most people play accounts that can trade on the G.E., and since the G.E. is impacted by the availability of gold in the game and how easy or hard it is to gather it, then you are impacted by inflation.

[swift jacinth]

I would immediately say no...BUT we could make it 2 item alch instead of 1 i think that might be ok....frankly there are soo many botters at the moment in game that the argument of inflation and economy is kinda irrelevant.

[sharp osprey]

I wouldn't hate the option to continue alching the same stack at a slower speed automatically, i'd rather afk alch my slayer loot for the day that just dump it all on the ge for the bots to alch instead.
Alch'ing like 100 of 10 different items just takes way too long for something that needs to be done actively, it never feels worth it tbh

like I get that it's runescape, the whole game is about grindy clicking, but clicking in the same spot constantly for hours feels so bad and the arthritis is going to suck so bad, so any amount of QoL to reduce this style of spam clicking gameplay would be so nice.
I feel like we've seen this improve in other areas of the game with newer content, like stealing valuables in varlmore for example

[wispy rampart]

Alching while questing is p underrated imo. Birdhouse/herb runs are also good for alching. Most agility, obvi. But having a slower, AFK-ish option would be nice for a lot of players